Bill O’Reilly (1949- ) was a racist blowhard who had appeared on Fox News on US television night after night for the past 21 years, from 1996 to 2017.
O’Reilly had four million viewers, the most for any US cable news show – at least till the last month or so when Rachel Maddow on MSNBC started pushing the Russiagate story hard.
An O’Reilly Racism Sampler:
On Sylvia’s in Harlem:
“all the people up there are tremendously respectful … I couldn’t get over the fact that there was no difference between Sylvia’s restaurant and any other restaurant in New York City. I mean, it was exactly the same, even though it’s run by blacks, primarily black patronship.”
On why Trump will not be able to bring down Black unemployment:
“Many of them are ill-educated and have tattoos on their foreheads and I hate to be generalized about it, but it’s true.”
On Trayvon Martin’s death:
“it wasn’t based on skin color … he was wearing a hoodie and he looked a certain way. And that way is how ‘gangstas’ look. And, therefore, he got attention.”
His advice to Martin Luther King III, son of a famous civil rights leader:
“Don’t abandon your children. Don’t get pregnant at 14. Don’t allow your neighborhoods to deteriorate into free-fire zones. That’s what the African-American community should have on their T-shirts.”
On the slaves who built the White House:
“Slaves that worked there were well-fed and had decent lodgings provided by the government”
When talking about the border patrol:
“We’d save lives because Mexican wetbacks, whatever you want to call them, the coyotes, they’re not going to do what they’re doing now, so people aren’t going to die in the desert.”
On his use of the slur “wetback”:
“It was not meant to disparage people in any way.”
On immigration, speaking to John McCain:
“Do you understand what the New York Times wants, and the far left want? They want to break down the white, Christian, male power structure – of which you’re part, and so am I. And they want to bring in millions of foreign nationals to basically break down the structure that we have. In that regard, Pat Buchanan is right. So I say that you’ve got to cap it with a number.”
On the nature of Asian Americans:
“Asian people are not liberal, you know, by nature. They’re usually more industrious and hard-working.”
On his and Fox News’s racism:
“I don’t know any racists. I don’t know anybody, on either black or white people, who don’t like, like our staff here is integrated, and my assistant is black, she’s been with me for 25 years. I just never see this.”
Tropes: He was big on Black pathologies and the Black-on-Black crime argument.
Advertisers were fine with this stuff. It was not till the past few weeks when sexual harassment allegations came out that advertisers pulled their ads, advertisers like Advil, Reddi Whip, Hyundai, BMW, Mercedes-Benz, Jenny Craig, Ancestry.com, Liberty Mutual, Allstate and dozens of others. He was fired April 19th 2017.
– Abagond, 2017.
Sources: mainly Media Matters, Raw Story, Salon, Axios.
See also:
- US cable news
- Republican Bubble
- Guide to Trump
- Trump’s sex scandal – another racist who did not get into trouble till he was sunk in a sex scandal, since overshadowed by:
- Russiagate
- Bill Cosby – yet another alleged sexual predator who talked down to Black people about their lack of “values”
- tropes
- Trayvon Martin
- John McCain
602
It’s hard to think of anything nice to say about this man.
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These comments are not racist Mister. Your skin is too thin. Rascism is behavior that materially harms a person. These comments might be considered “bad manners” or perhaps insensitive but they are not so-called “Rascist.” Frankly, the comments are true. Blacks would do well to heed what he is suggesting.
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“Blacks would do well to heed what he is suggesting. – Yogibreeze
Yes massa, yes massa! Massa, you want me to saddle up the horse or shine your shoes?
You are spewing patrilineal garbage. But I understand, people like you’d do almost anything to maintain this ungodly structure, commonly referred to white supremacy. People like you, your days are numbered, therefore, have fun in these Last Days. Get the EFF outta here!
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It’s hard to think of anything nice to say about this man.
How about “you’re fired”?
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He obviously suffered from the Irish man’s curse!
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Uhh, again, I happen to be a proud 59 year old Black man and have supported and helped to move Black issues forward all my life and have with great difficulty myself greatly advanced in spite of the so-called White patrilineal power structure. I need no lecture on fascism and prejudice in America. If you’d open your mind and engage critical thinking you’d see the essence and wisdom of my comments. O’Reilly is vulgar dinosaur with largely antiquated views from a sad bye-gone era. Good riddance to them both. But respecting the instant views about most Blacks his comments are dead-on.
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” I need no lecture on fascism and prejudice in America. If you’d open your mind and engage critical thinking you’d see the essence and wisdom of my comments. ” – Yogibreeze
WHAT?, “the essence and wisdom.” I’ll respond more in depth later.
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Typo: rascism
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Found this little gem in my local library:
Sweet Jesus, I Hate Bill O’Reilly by Joseph Minton Amann
Written waaay back in 2009. I read it sometime in 2010. It was hilarious (and kinda scary.)
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@Yogibreeze,
on second thought, your comments are too uncritical to respond to, so therefore, I wish you well in supporting the likes of such a despicable person as Bill O’Reilly!
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Uhh. Who said I support O’Reilly? I don’t. I view him as a boorish rude dinosaur from an out-dated sad bye-gone ol’ boy era. But his comments were wise albeit perhaps in-artful. If one takes O’Reilly out of the equation and critically weighs the comments with an open mind the wisdom thereof is easier to see.
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^Says the one who constantly derails threads.
Anyway, evidently the white supremacists are cleansing ranks.
Roger Ailes, Milo Yiannopoulos, Tomi Lahren, and now Bill O’Racist. I wonder who’s next?
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@resw said
Anyway, evidently the white supremacists are cleansing ranks.
Roger Ailes, Milo Yiannopoulos, Tomi Lahren, and now Bill O’Racist. I wonder who’s next?
I was intrigued about the fact that someone with a Greek sounding name was associated with white supremacy. I had never heard of this guy and was even more surprised that he was from the UK originally. He sounds like he is pretty E’ffed up! Full of contradictions. If I didn’t know better I would say he was a wannabe middle class agitating attention seeker. Apparently his fathers partner is non white and Milo himself has a black boyfriend and calls himself a ‘coal burner’ which he says he gets from his dad. I had not heard of this term of phrase either! Also his views on sexual abuse – smh but this guy is being paid to give lecutres!!! FFS
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racism? still okay. sexual harassment. no longer cool post cosby.
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That’s an interesting and keen insight.
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Bill,
See ya, wouldn’t wanna be ya.
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Also, what is he talking about black people with tattoos on their foreheads? I’ve known lots of black people, have lived in a primarily black area, and been in institutionalized environments with troubled people (including many troubled black people), and I hardly ever saw visible tattoos, much less tattoos on their foreheads.
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I guess calling a fellow FoxNews employee “hot chocolate” along with the withdrawal of advertisers was the last straw.
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@Omnipresent
“I was intrigued about the fact that someone with a Greek sounding name was associated with white supremacy…Full of contradictions.”
Milo is an attention whore and white supremacists love Greeks because they are supposedly the “fathers” of “western civilisation” so he was easily accepted to the ranks.
And it’s not as if white supremacy has a problem with Milo’s paedophilia (or Bill O’Racist’s maltreatment of women), as Greek/western culture is rooted in it. They simply want the outward appearance of moral superiority, so they seized on Milo’s comments as an opportunity to get rid of someone who increasingly dresses effeminately, has publicly declared his thing for black guys, publicly disavowed white nationalists, and who white supremacists therefore increasingly saw as a walking “contradiction”.
The message they’re sending is loud and clear: keep your contrary beliefs and sexual escapades under wraps or you will be axed.
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He will stay winning and just find another platform to spew his racism and misogyny and just practice his regular a**holery. Funny they had no problems with his racist rhetoric but when the white women were being sexually harassed it was an issue all the sudden. But Fake News got tired of shelling out those millions of dollars. I bet the orange monkey Drump has a job for him in the White House.
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@Mary Burrell
“Funny they had no problems with his racist rhetoric but when the white women were being sexually harassed it was an issue all the sudden…I bet the orange monkey Drump has a job for him in the White House.”
So true.
I think he will just find another platform, too.
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From what I’ve seen of Milo he struck me as more of a deliberate contrarian than anything else. I first heard of him during the Leslie Jones fiasco and I’m not 100% he was completely to blame. I think someone had apparently impersonated Jones and was saying things like “gas gays” which riled up his followers to attack her. As for Bill O, I haven’t paid attention to him in ages so his firing caught me by surprise. I’m guessing that someone like him has too many connections to fail to land on his feet.
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resw said:
They simply want the outward appearance of moral superiority, so they seized on Milo’s comments as an opportunity to get rid of someone who increasingly dresses effeminately, has publicly declared his thing for black guys, publicly disavowed white nationalists, and who white supremacists therefore increasingly saw as a walking “contradiction”.
Yes, sounds like this would be an embarrassment to them being as he is choosing to live and state his opinions so publicly!
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@Yogibreeze
“If one takes O’Reilly out of the equation and critically weighs the comments with an open mind the wisdom thereof is easier to see.”
Which comments about Black people by Bill O’Reilly do you find wise?
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Resw said,
“The message they’re sending is loud and clear: keep your contrary beliefs and sexual escapades under wraps or you will be axed.”
Who is “they” exactly ? Are you referring to the mostly conservative right wing MSM ? Fox ?
The Alt Right isn’t conservative, is much younger, an obsessed with “free speech” or the right to racist and vumgar. Milo hasn’t lost any popularity rather it’s growing.
Alt Right people don’t watch fox news.
I don’t think you can collectivise Supremacy within a singular demographic; it transcends conservatives, liberals, fascist ect.
O’Reilly was fired because his sponsors bailed. It wasn’t because Fox cares about the private sexual escapades of their hosts. It was about money.
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Resw said,
“The message they’re sending is loud and clear: keep your contrary beliefs and sexual escapades under wraps or you will be axed.”
Who is “they” exactly ? Are you referring to the mostly conservative right wing MSM ? Fox ?
The Alt Right isn’t conservative, is much younger, an obsessed with “free speech” or the right to racist and vumgar. Milo hasn’t lost any popularity rather it’s growing.
Alt Right people don’t watch fox news.
I don’t think you can collectivise Supremacy within a singular demographic; it transcends conservatives, liberals, fascist ect.
O’Reilly was fired because his sponsors bailed. It wasn’t because Fox cares about the private sexual escapades of their hosts. It was about money.
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Edit: the right to be racist and vulgar
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I love just how people like Milo and O’Reilly expose the fact that white supremacists are not that different from ISIS. I guess white terrorists are more acceptable.
“Yes, he killed so many babies by blowing up the hospital but at least he was white and not ISIS, those brown skinned misogynistic Muzlims whom we sometimes call white when it suits us”
“Yes, he is a reprehensible groper in chief of women, but at least he speaks the truth to those black lazy brutes; black on black crime!!!”
” Yes, he believes old men should “groom” 13 year old boys but at least he is fighting for freedom of racist speech in universities: Look at him, he is a white sassy homosexual, his whiteness makes him an angel and right!!!”
Goodness.
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He and Imus can go back to AM radio!
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That was off topic and really unnecessary. Let’s keep this focused on his politics.
It’s totally on the topic as it may explain this clown’s pathology.
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@michaeljonbarker
“Who is “they” exactly ?”
People who make the key decisions at the US white supremacist media outlets.
“The Alt Right isn’t conservative”
In fact, I never used the term “Alt Right” or “conservative” in any of my comments on this thread. Nor did/do I make any comparison.
But so-called “conservative” leaders have embraced the “Alt Right” for years until the last few months when they first started a concerted effort to distance themselves. CPAC did invite Milo Yiannopoulos to speak before he made his controversial comments, didn’t it?
“Alt Right people don’t watch fox news”
Says who?
“I don’t think you can collectivise Supremacy within a singular demographic”
And no one did that.
“It wasn’t because Fox cares about the private sexual escapades of their hosts. ”
I have doubts you actually read what I wrote (or understood it). Who said Fox “cares” about anything? But obviously Fox, as well as its advertisers, didn’t care because they let it go on for over a decade before they took any action.
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I laughed when you called him a blowhard. It’s not your usual style, but it’s true.
I can’t stand Fox News, but I’m tired of TV news in general. I felt like NBC was supporting Hillary over Bernie, such as when they kept showing superdelegate counts before they were confirmed – and that’s supposed to be the most progressive station! I like The Young Turks and the Boston Globe (and the Lowell Sun for local news, but nobody outside of my area knows what that is).
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what is it with people named bill? bill Clinton. bill cosby. bill oreilly.
know anybody named bill? don’t trust em.
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“…I’m tired of TV news in general”
Ditto.
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@villagewriter
“I guess white terrorists are more acceptable.”
Sad but true. In the US, they are not called “terrorists”. They are referred to as mentally ill or “troubled individuals”.
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@ Afrofem
True… unless they’re Muslim!
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All i can say is ha ha
And finally some slight acountability
The racist bas….terd…
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@Scribh
Because of time constraints, I rarely look at Colbert or Oliver. I grew tired of the whole Daily Show universe some time ago. I’m attracted to situations where people actually do things and not just talk about them. I understand the importance of satire to educate and relieve tension, but action is paramount.
I think people with a left/progressive orientation expect right/authoritarians to wither away if they are laughed at in public. In truth, rightwing types could care less what we think. They just keep organizing and meeting their objectives. We should do the same.
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@Resw
I think both ideologies on the left and right see themselves as “morally superior”. LOM’s statements show his idiological blinders.
I don’t think white supremacy is cleaning house consciously. O’Reilly was let go because sponsors don’t like controversy. Similarly Milo is controversial thus limiting where he can speak.
You said, “But so-called “conservative” leaders have embraced the “Alt Right” for years until the last few months when they first started a concerted effort to distance themselves.”
The Alt right is neo nationalism which is different from traditional Republican/conservatism. It is relatively new in the U.S. and hasn’t been around “for years”.
It is a resistance to global liberalism particularly “free trade” and immigration. It sees “national” culture as threatened by foreign “values” and influence. Race is tied to a national identity and a strong federal framework is seen as need to protect this imagined national identity/culture.
This is what will replace traditional conservatism and pull from former liberals.
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New York Times is outrageously stilted toward the left. It’s as bad as CNN. You need to train and open your mind.
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@An Scríbhneoir Gael-Mheiriceánach
no such animal exists.
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@michaeljonbarker
“O’Reilly was let go because sponsors don’t like controversy. ”
That’s your opinion. As I said, this stuff has been around for over a decade. It’s old news. Sponsors had every opportunity to distance themselves from O’Reilly “controversy”, such as when this story broke way back in 2004: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A7578-2004Oct28.html
And haven’t his racist comments generated “controversy” too over the years? So clearly if your theory were correct, these sponsors would not have waited until 2017 to pull their ads.
“The Alt right is neo nationalism which is different from traditional Republican/conservatism. ”
Who said “Alt Right” was “traditional Republican/conservatism” whatever that’s supposed to mean? But didn’t a “neo-nationalist” just win the Republican nomination and become President?
“It is relatively new in the U.S. and hasn’t been around “for years”.”
In fact, yes, it has been around “for years”, if 7 years is more than a year. So find a better way to be pedantic.
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The dominoes continue to fall: Hannity has now been accused of sexual harassment.
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Alt Right started as an internet movement. Conservative “leaders” never heard of Spencer until Spencer’s base began to grow in early 2016.
“And haven’t his racist comments generated “controversy” too over the years?”
Stuff white people say isn’t racist unless it involves the “N” word.
“Who said “Alt Right” was “traditional Republican/conservatism” whatever that’s supposed to mean? ”
The Alt Right isn’t socially conservative. Republicans pushed hard for free trade agreements and with Bill Clinton’s help, shipped manufacturing over seas. Republicans traditionally were soft on immigration and “pro life”. The Alt Right is opposed strongly to “free trade” and immigration and think black and brown people should get as many abortions as possible.
One one hand there is an overarching supremacy within society that is the default of Western Civilization. On the other hand what originally was left/right, Republican/Democrat, is splintering into a third faction, Alt Rights neo nationalism, and I think it is this third faction that will eventually replace what I referred to as ” traditional conservatism” up thread..
So O’Reilly is out and maybe others, but it was Fox that laid the fertile field that allowed the Alt Rights ideas to take root. This old white gaurd of “conservatism” is what’s on the way out, not the white supremacy of the Alt Right.
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@An Scríbhneoir Gael-Mheiriceánach
no such animal exists.
https://www.blackagendareport.com/cynthia-mckinney-peace
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@michaeljonbarker
“Alt Right started as an internet movement.”
If you want to be technical, it started in a “think tank” but I don’t know how that relates to Bill O’Reilly or anything I’ve said.
“Stuff white people say isn’t racist unless it involves the “N” word.”
Since you used the word “controversy”, my point was that he’s said many racist things that have generated widespread “controversy”, including the recent Maxine Waters comments, whether “white people” believe those things to be racist or not.
So “controversy” cannot be the reason the advertisers pulled their ads.
However, if your point is that the advertisers only cares about “controversy” when it’s offensive to “white people”, then you might be right.
“The Alt Right isn’t socially conservative”
Again, who said it was? I’m well aware of the differences between the various political factions of the US white supremacist system, on the right AND THE LEFT.
“This old white gaurd of “conservatism” is what’s on the way out, not the white supremacy of the Alt Right.”
That’s your opinion, and mine is “white supremacists are cleansing ranks,” and that includes people in the alt right, like Milo Yiannopoulos.
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Blacks and others are confused about what Racism is. It’s not making statements that sound mea irrespective of how boorish or vulgar the statements might be. It is when statements or attitudes turn into behavior, e.g., denial of a job based on race; denial of housing based on race; denial of opportunity based on race and so forth. That is, material detrimental acts based on race. Same applies to sexism. This doesn’t mean people in the workforce – especially in the workforce – should be free to render hurtful, vulgar, mean spirited, etc, comments about anyone else (for any reason), and those who do so should be disciplined and/or terminated. But please don’t mistake improper decorum for vile racism as the implications of doing so are themselves equally detrimental to the victimized group…
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@Yogibreeze
” It is when statements or attitudes turn into behavior”
I understand your opinion, but I believe racism also includes public denigration of blacks by other groups (and their black lackeys), particularly within the historical context of public denigration of blacks in the US.
And in a white supremacist system, public denigration of blacks via the mainstream media is “material[ly] detrimental” and has real effects on the minds of people, especially young children.
That said, I do agree that most blacks are too focused on merely offensive statements as opposed to the racist actions taken both by people who say racist things and people who do not, like many Democrats and “progressives” including the Clintons and Sanders.
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Correction: the Clintons do say racist things but just not in the most recent election cycle.
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Yes. I can see your point as well. I do believe the public denigration of Blacks as a group is painful. I simply believe one should not give power to an adversary. As long as the adversary does not cause physucal injury or real material damage then ignore him and simply see his comments as being simply rude, vulgar and so for and move on. Let your adversary destroy or at least damage his own soul and life. People who focus on being rude and brutish and vulgar tend to harm themselves. Meanwhile you focus on advancing: buy a gas station, but an investment property, go to school to learn heating and air conditioning and then start a business, go to college for something gainful like nursing or one of the so-called “S.T.E.M.” majors and not for sociology or political science or communications or the other crap majors Blacks tend to flock to – and then can’t get a job after graduation (note immigrants stuck to the so-called S.T.E.M. majors and within a short time after grafuation they flourish)…you get the point. That id, while the jackesses are making fun of people with their rude comments just stay focused on advancing. Just ignore them. They’re just a little gnat. Words are words; sticks and stones may break my bones….; if the words translate in behavior or material damage that’s another story. Otherwise just single-mindedly focus on getting ahead and ignore everything else.
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@Yogibreeze
“I simply believe one should not give power to an adversary.”
There we also agree, but I’m afraid that doesn’t change how blacks are treated by the dominant majority, many of whom are racist.
Since the majority controls the laws and most resources in the economy, and the majority accepts the public denigration of blacks, then the majority both consciously and subconsciously acts accordingly, i.e., they also denigrate, but worse, they legislate, adjudicate and discriminate against blacks in all areas of the economy.
Yes, blacks can “just ignore them” but that won’t do anything about all the whites, who control the laws and the economy.
So I think it’s very beneficial for blacks (and other groups) when Bill O’Reilly and all the other racists in the media think twice about publicly denigrating blacks.
“Meanwhile you focus on advancing: buy a gas station…”
There we agree, again.
But realistically, many blacks in the US have to be adjudicated by or get a job or loan from a non-black at least once in their lives.
And there’s ample evidence to suggest that blacks receive harsher sentences for the same crimes (or no crimes at all), and those who are as qualified or more qualified than their white counterparts are more likely to be passed up for a job or loan.
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Your points are solid and compelling. it is super to chat with someone of your high intelligence and clarity of thought. The experience of Blacks in this country has been a pitiful shame since pretty much the beginning (I am Black). What a tragedy. Frankly, I think Marcus Garvey had the right idea but unfortunately we couldn’t get out of here. Another huge, huge, huge missed opportunity was after Abraham Lincoln was shot and was replaced by then Vice President Johnson. He was a known vicious racist and crook. In fact his own party impeached him but he remained in office. Among the many awful things he did – especially to Blacks – was to veto Lincoln’s plan to grant 40 acres and a mule to every freed slave. Can you imagine the boost that would have provided!! I suspect the freed slaves would have combined forces and pooled their lands and that could have grown into something substantial and could have had positive ramifications for a long time. Instead, racist Johnson left the freed slaves with absolutely nothing and did all manner of vile things to hurt the freed slaves. His actions and all of th combined racist acts of the government and society of that time trail down to Black communities even today. What a terrible, terrible time our people have suffered in this country. I guess I net out with the conclusion and expectation that I as a Black man will NEVER be treated fully fairly and justly in this country (nor Blacks as a group). This is how I have thought since childhood. This is why I believe the focus has to be on outperforming other groups in terms of economic development. I thinks that the only reliable peace we will get in this country. I have alwasy felt that we have to “think like immigrants.” I look at out cousins the Indians who the WHite majority around the world call “sand-niggers.” They don’t care about anything but economic performance. I don’t know where you are located but where I am in Upstate New York they own pretty much every gas station and convenience store and Dunkin Donuts, etc. The then take that month and send their next generation to professional schools – and only the professional schools that will lead to wealth: MD, DDS, Engineering, Computer Science and so forth. They ignore the Liberal Arts. The “Anglo-sphere” globally pretty much has disdain for us and others of color but Black Americans catch a particularly vile type of hell. I don’t see any other way out but economics….
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@resw
Like.
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@Yogibreeze
May I ask why you need to reiterate in every post you are a black man? I think one post was enough to get the idea, but one rule of thumb for me is that if it becomes a talking point in every post you make then the idea of you actually being a black man rubs off.
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@ Sharina
Hmm!
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Uhh. I don’t do so in every post. And actually I was previously thought to be White and laughingly a White Supremacist until I rebutted that with my ethnic and sociopolitical identity. And you are not the only one who reads the string. The particular person to whom I especially directed my comment was unfamiliar with me. Seperately, please give us all the benefit of your thinking on the particular substantive point under discussion. Thanks.
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Yogibreeze
There was only 1 person on 1 thread who thought you were white and he never mentioned it again. The person you directed the post to did not ask your race or assume it. So it was a pointless to point it out yet again.
Resw pretty much summed up my thinking on the particular discussion. I see no need to rinse and repeat an already eloquently made point.
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@ Yogibreeze
Right. Because this is the type of thing a proud Black man says:
SMH
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@Solitare
That comment was just dripping with pride!
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@ Afrofem
I kept thinking I’d seen him post something virulently racist a few weeks ago, but I couldn’t remember where it was.
Thankfully Abagond let that one through as a pet lizard comment! Otherwise he might have pulled off the black sock puppet act much longer.
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@Solitaire
This was Yogibreeze’s last clincher for me:
In fact, Lincoln was trying to find a way to ship freed American slaves to Africa like the British did when they abolished legal slavery. They just took a chunk of Liberia, re-named it Sierra Leone and dumped their ex-slaves there.
Forty acres and a mule were was just a rumor, never a plan.
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@ Afrofem
Yep, good catch.
If I recall correctly, Sherman’s army picked up a large following of escaped slaves and began settling them in colonies on confiscated territory like Edisto Island, but 1) that wasn’t 40 acres and a mule for every soul and 2) it all got undone by politicians after the war ended.
I also noticed Yogibreeze was quick to hold up East Indians as an example that black folks should emulate while still managing to call them sand-n*ggers. That seemed odd.
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Correct.
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Afrofem and solitaire
Great catch!!!
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My point being we can’t be too sensitive. It’s harmful for the soul and our general well being. I must say I respect your tenacity.
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^^^^^^Is that you Donald?
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@ Yogibreeze
“My point being we can’t be too sensitive. It’s harmful for the soul and our general well being.”
No, it’s comments like this one of yours that are harmful to the soul:
“N*ggers were in fact one of the later groups to be civilized, and most still aren’t.”
I bet you just love to say sh*t like that and then when people object, blame them for being too sensitive. Get them coming and going, don’t you?
Tell you what, I don’t need to know what color you are to know that you’re barely civilized because you can’t hardly manage to comment here without saying something rude, uncouth, and vulgar.
How stupid are you to post a comment like that and then less than a month later try to pass yourself off as “a proud Black man”???
Not that we needed that comment to expose you because Sharina, Blakksage, Afrofem, Abagond, et alia were already onto you from your pitiful blathering on this thread.
Black sock puppets: Don’t try this at home, kids!! You’ll be caught out every time.
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Hi Solataire,
I gave you a “like” for you overall Rejoinder but I wanted to point out that your usage of “can’t” in the first sentence of your third paragraph is substandard English. So too, you should review your use of the term “et alia” in your sixth paragraph and include a comma after alia. You may wish to consider using “et al” to save space in these small comment boxes. Et al is the more common usage.
Yogibreeze
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@ Yogibreeze
“your usage of “can’t” in the first sentence of your third paragraph is substandard English.”
No, it’s dialect. But I reckon I can’t hardly expect a Yankee like you to understand.
“Et al is the more common usage.”
You forgot the period after al. If you abbreviate alia, you should always put a period at the end.
You also managed to mispell my user name, which is a normal spelling of a normal word frequently found on computer desktops.
“You may wish to consider using “et al” to save space in these small comment boxes.”
You may wish to consider refraining from commenting to save space in your small cranium.
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@ Solitaire
“You may wish to consider refraining from commenting to save space in your small cranium.”
Good one! LOL.
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ROFL!!!
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Not bad. Lol. But my skull is actually sort of large. Say, I am curious of your view respecting Trump’s use of force against Syria. Please share if you would. Thanks.
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The only thing I’m curious about is when you’re going to leave, troll.
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@ ASG-M
1) As opposed to an intelligent and subtle troll like you who pretends to be an anti-racist ally and then stabs people in the back.
2) I care as much about your hurt feelings as you did about Taotesan’s.
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LOM/ASG-M
I wonder if you felt that bern…..ROFL
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Now, now. Watch your manners. I know it’s difficult but do try to calm your savage passions and operate more on the level of dispassionate reason.
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^^^bs artist….is that not gro Jo’s slang? Just like a white person. Steal and then degrade the very people you tale from
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I wonder if you felt that bern…..ROFL
Preparation H should soothe the bern!
Having fun Yogi?
@sharinair:
He doesn’t see colour! As a white man, you must listen to him and Yogi too!
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Bernie Sanders’ heart seems to be in the right place but in many instances his suggested methods of achieving progress are off the wall, e.g., take over the big banks…..ridiculous.
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What do you expect from commies?
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Exactly. This guy is off the wall. The big banks and corporations and so forth are largely what provide the profits that grow our mutual funds, 401K’s, etc., and that provide home loans and so fourth. To dismantle them would be like screwing around with the engine in a well functioning car. That’s crazy. Yes – they definitely should be reasonably regulated to prevent abuses on consumers but don’t harm or destroy them. That would be crazy.
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Dam those commies Yogi!
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Well worded but on this we disagree.
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@ ASG-M
You didn’t even cross my mind.
1) Yogibreeze said he was from upstate New York.
2) Yogibreeze criticized my use of southern dialect.
Therefore: I called Yogibreeze a Yankee.
But how typical of you as a white man to think everything is about you.
You’re not the only racist Yankee in the world, or even on this thread. Deal with it.
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@”But how typical of you as a white man to think everything is about you.
You’re not the only racist Yankee in the world, or even on this thread. Deal with it.”
+1000. How funny that Bill O’Reilly is also a racist Yankee who Fox employees describe as “self-centered”.
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“How funny that Bill O’Reilly is also a racist Yankee who Fox employees describe as ‘self-centered”.”
Don’t forget Irish.
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“Solitaire’s next racist troll move.”—-Any other words the truth that you don’t like to hear?
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In not any*
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@ ASG-M
How exactly is it a racist troll move? You know d@mn well I’m part Irish and proud of it.
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@ ASG-M
“He has done so much damage to the American political scene”
And you have done so much damage to Abagond’s blog.
My god, you and Bill O’Reilly have so much in common! Wonder what other similarities await to be uncovered.
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@ ASG-M
If only you defended people of color with the same fervor.
Instead of, you know, telling them to commit unnatural acts with the corpse of a white supremacist dictator.
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LOM/ASG-M
If only you had half the brain you pretend you have. Her use of Irish, at least what I got from it, was to point out the racist similarities that you have him have. You always claim that the racist are conservative, southern, and of English heritage. Funny that bill is a northerner and Irish. The very group whose racism you ignore. You and Bill are birds of a feather.
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@ Sharina
“You always claim that the racist are conservative, southern, and of English heritage. Funny that bill is a northerner and Irish. The very group whose racism you ignore. You and Bill are birds of a feather.”
Bingo!
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@ ASG-M
Fenian social democrats can still be self-centered hypocritical racists. (gasp!)
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@ ASG-M
I see you don’t handle cognitive dissonance well.
Being in a gracious mood, I’ll give you a brownie point for quoting Yeats (although that’s, like, the most over-used Yeats quote ever).
What rough beast, indeed!
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Folks, do you really care if a colour blind white supremacist thinks you’re racist? As for O’reilly, he is a POS whatever his political slant or ethnicity.
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I’ve written a lot about Bill O’Reilly in recent months, and all I can say is that the sexual allegations against him shows what a colossal hypocrite he is. He loves to point the finger at other races, but he, according to news reports, is in NO moral position to lecture anyone about anything. He has been accused of domestic violence at least once, and he’s been outed as a serial sexual harasser. So, if anything, O’Reilly just revealed himself as a clear definition of an a-hole.
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I’m surprised Yogibreeze would even persist after being outed the way he (?) was. And it’s times like these that I’m glad the commenting system doesn’t allow for front-end editing, because we all know that comment would have been ninja-edited sooner or later.
Here’s some friendly advice (though Lord knows you don’t deserve it) that’ll help you save what’s left of your face: retire your current username, stop posting for the next month or two and then come back under a new username and with a slightly different shtick. At least then we can respect your hustle, as you’d be making a genuine effort instead of being supremely lazy with your sockpuppetry.
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Now, now, be mindful of your manners.
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@”Being in a gracious mood, I’ll give you a brownie point for quoting Yeats”
He didn’t quote anyone.
“It is called plagiarism. It is hardly a new rule.” – abagond
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And if Memory serves me correct….plagiarism=banned.
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What Yeats said was:
http://www.potw.org/archive/potw351.html
What ASGM said is original with him as far as I can tell.
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Get a grip. It’s a online forum designed for short quick thoughts and comments and intellectual stimulation. He received no monetary or material benefit for quoting Yeats without attribution. So what. Let him be.
The one and only…
Yogibreeze
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@”What Yeats said was:
“Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,”
http://www.potw.org/archive/potw351.html
What ASGM said is original with him as far as I can tell.”
Except the part where lord of mirkwood said “Things fall apart, the center cannot hold”
But then again, plagiarizers protect each other, don’t they abagond? https://abagond.wordpress.com/2017/03/30/poll-original-ideas/
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@Yogibreeze
Plagiarism does not require that you receive any monetary gain to engage in it. If you take work from someone else without proper credit it is still plagiarism. Even if you reword it slightly, because it is not your original thought.
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I agree that is the legal standard but context and intent play a role in reaching a conclusion in the common world.
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@Yogibreeze
In that case the context and intent in which he used it was to plagiarize. LOM is known for taking quotes from others to appear smart.
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@ Sharina
As much as I would like to see ASG-M banned, brief literary quotations like what he did aren’t generally considered plagarism.
Abagond could choose to consider it plagarism for his own comment policy, but if he made it retroactive, he’d have to ban a lot of people, including me.
We would no longer be able to write comments like:
• “well, you know what they say about the best-laid plans of mice and men” without specifically citing Robert Burns
• “Trump knows a hawk from a handsaw” without specifically citing Shakespeare
•”early to bed, early to rise” without specifically citing Ben Franklin
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@ Mack Lyons
“I’m surprised Yogibreeze would even persist after being outed the way he (?) was.”
Yogibreeze is obviously not the brightest troll under the bridge.
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@ ASG-M
If it became a retroactive ban, I’d have to be banned for saying “what rough beast” in my reply to your “things fall apart”.
Perhaps Chinua Achebe should have all his literary prizes revoked for using Yeats’ “things fall apart” as the title of one of his novels?
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@Solitaire
I would agree with that except many of the examples you presented no one really even uses and the last examples is common saying. He chooses quotes he believes are unfamiliar to most. Put his own twist on them and passes them off. Knowing good well the idea never came from him. That is plagiarism.
http://www.plagiarism.org/plagiarism-101/what-is-plagiarism/
“To present as new and original an idea or product derived from an existing source”
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Excellent comment. Compelling
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@ Sharina
I’ve seen the Shakespeare quote (“tell a hawk from a handsaw”) on Abagond’s blog more than once. If I knew how to search comments, I could find examples.
Pretty sure I’ve used “the best-laid plans” here somewhere myself.
There are a lot of common sayings that come straight from Poor Richard’s Almanac, Shakespeare, and the Bible. If you want, I will try to find you a list online later today.
The Yeats quote is used often enough in popular culture that I immediately recognized it and also ribbed ASG-M about choosing the most over-used Yeats reference ever.
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@ Yogibreeze
If you’re not going to betake yourself back under the bridge from whence you came, could you please at least have the courtesy to make it clear what comments you’re referring to or responding to? This is not the first time on this very thread that it’s been unclear.
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Solitaire
No need to find them, because my point is….its plagiarism. The common form of it.
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@ Sharina
Google “things fall apart Trump Yeats” and you’ll see how widely the quote has been used just in the past year. There are even some news stories about how often Yeats’ “things fall apart” has been used in news stories in conjunction with Trump.
So, no, I don’t agree that in this case LOM was using an obscure quote that he hoped no one would recognize and that he could pass off as his own.
He did possibly do it to make himself appear intelligent and well-read, but that would mean he assumed at least some people would catch the allusion and say, “Ah, he is familiar with the works of Yeats.”
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Solitaire
I get how widely the quote is used. I said “He chooses quotes he believes are unfamiliar to most.” He thinks they are unfamiliar to most. Meaning he thinks that people in here are dumb. Which he has repeated made very clear on quite a few posts. It was not in reference to how common the quote is or is not. However, a COMMON practice among plagerisers none the less..
“I don’t agree “—Great, but I’m not debating whether you agree or not. I am pointing out that it is plagiarism. Plain and simple. He doesn’t think people in here are smart enough to recognise which is why, again, he was okay with it and the changes he made to it.
“that would mean he assumed at least some people would catch the allusion and say, “Ah, he is familiar with the works of Yeats.””—No, LOM constantly looks to come off as an intellectual with original thought. Read his blog and get the idea. By taking that quote and changing it he assumed that it would appear as if the changes made him original.
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@ Sharina
“He thinks that people in here are dumb. Which he has repeated made very clear on quite a few posts.”
As an overall point, I agree with you here.
“I am pointing out that it is plagiarism. Plain and simple. He doesn’t think people in here are smart enough to recognise which is why, again, he was okay with it and the changes he made to it.”
This is where we differ. I don’t think his comment would make any sense if he was trying to pass it off as all his own words instead of as his paraphrasing a famous poem. It would just sound stupid and weird. Which is why I don’t think he was trying to pass it off as entirely his own words and therefore why I don’t think it was plagarizing.
Should I be banned because I responded to him by writing:
What rough beast, indeed!
Instead of:
“What rough beast” (William Yeats, “The Second Coming), indeed!
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@ ASG-M
Like you have any room to talk, the number of threads you’ve turned into Irish history, Bernie Sanders, or economic discrimination as the root of racism.
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@Solitaire
“This is where we differ.”—You have made that clear and I personally and not going by what you think. I am going by what he did, does, and will continue to do.
“I don’t think his comment would make any sense if he was trying to pass it off as all his own words instead of as his paraphrasing a famous poem.”—It may not makes sense to you, but I am not debating what makes sense to you. The debate is A) he plagiarized and B) Why he plagiarized and c) his usage of what universities find as the most common form of plagiarism. If you need sources I put one above but you can read the one I have below.
http://www.ithenticate.com/press/survey-reveals-most-serious-common-types-of-plagiarism-research
“hould I be banned because I responded to him by writing”—If you engage in it then yes. I have seen commenters banned for it in the past. Granted they were repeat offenders but offenders none the less. They mixed rewording, paraphrasing, and direct copy and eventually got the boot. Yet not a single credit to the source.
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ASGM/LOM
“2018 Merriam-Webster definition for “thread derailer” is going to look like “n: resw and sharinalr”—That is your basic response for anyone that puts heat on exactly the bs you do and get away with. Of course I could return to repeatedly pointing out the similarities between you and Bill.
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ASGM
You have no idea how plagiarism works. You were trying to pass it off as your own the moment presented it with no credit to the source. You only now choose to present the location because of the flak.
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In practice this is how I determine if a comment is plagiarized: I cut and paste about 20 words of the suspected comment into Google and see what pops up. If I find the same or almost the same wording from a source that does not seem to be the commenter himself, I count it as plagiarism.
In this present case, the full quote appears nowhere else. Not plagiarism.
Ordinarily I would not check a phrase as short as “Things fall apart, the center cannot hold”, but even when I do, there are over 30,000 hits, which makes it seem like common English wording. Over half of those hits say nothing about Yeats, the Wall Street Journal among them. The phrase is almost proverbial in English.
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@abagond
I respect your practice of determining, but realistically it is plagiarism despite how you have chosen to determine it.
The idea that Solitaire caught it and he later admits to getting it from Yeats indicates that he knowingly got it from him and then changed the words. It was not his original thought or idea and he admits that later after getting caught.
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however, its your show so….
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@ Sharina
“Of course I could return to repeatedly pointing out the similarities between you and Bill.”
Oooh, let’s do that!
Here’s one: ASG-M and Bill O’Reilly are both (to use Abagond’s word) blowhards.
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@ ASGM
Solitaire and sharina hardly strike me as trolls, not even borderline ones. From what I have seen, Solitaire is the best friend you got here: she seems to understand your point of view AND what is wrong with it AND will tell you about it. Telling you home truths is not trolling, as unpleasant as it may be.
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@”I respect your practice of determining, but realistically it is plagiarism despite how you have chosen to determine it.”
+1000. As we can see, it’s just another of many exceptions to the rule abagond grants to scribh aka lord of mirkwood and their other white colleagues.
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@ ASG-M
It’s no secret. I told you on the open thread that the only reason we ever developed a pleasant and cordial relationship is I decided to forge one to see if I could get through to you that way. It didn’t work.
I told you on the open thread that I was washing my hands of you, but I find that I’m unable to ignore your more egregious remarks. The better metaphor may be, I’ve taken my gloves back off.
When speaking about me vis-a-vis you on the Jeff Sessions thread, Herneith quipped that everyone needs a hobby. It feels to me more like a grim and thankless duty. Do not think for a second I enjoy this. But it needs to be done.
You need to either wake the f*ck up or go away and stop bothering these good folks.
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@Solitaire
Bill and ASGM are oddly naive to their racism.
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ASGM
Underhanded? Oh no honey. My attacks are straightforward.
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@sharinalr
“Bill and ASGM are oddly naive to their racism”
Besides that and a host of other similarities we already mentioned, they both:
once said they’d move to Ireland if someone they didn’t like got elected
use the “it’s not race, it’s economics/class” argument
have denied they benefit from white privilege.
are against reparations for blacks
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*telling “unpleasant” truths about about your own statements…and the candidate you supported and Trump, Russia, RT, etc.
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“I’ve fallen victim to similar trollish behavior”
Extra heavy LOL!!!
resw, the “fallen victim”? Too funny.
Thanks for the mid-day humor!
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^Good example of another troll and his/her trollish behavior that continues.
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resw as the victim of trolls: is that you new narrative? Is this your trash can maneuver?
The most contentious person on this forum complains and labels another commenter a “troll”.
Hilarious!
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lol scrib is going to end up like she who cannot be named!
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@Afrofem
“resw as the victim of trolls: is that you new narrative?”
Truth hurts doesn’t it? Everyone can see what you’re doing. Yes, it’s trollish behavior. Just like the dozens of times you and your white racist colleauges trolled me about your asinine speculations about my personal identity. All because I spoke truths you people didn’t want to hear.
@”Roger Ailes, Milo Yiannopoulos, Tomi Lahren, and now Bill O’Racist. I wonder who’s next?”
It’s Bill Shine…let’s see if Hannity is next.
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@v8driver
“lol scrib is going to end up like she who cannot be named!”—Exactly!!!
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@ ASG-M
“Is there a reason my replies to Solitaire keep disappearing?”
Because there’s a god in heaven.
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@ Sharina
Bill O’Reilly and ASG-M are both smugly satisfied with their world views.
Their world views do differ in some points but they are both firmly convinced of their absolute veracity and both stubbornly refuse to consider their blind spots.
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@Solitaire
“Because there’s a god in heaven”—I literally spit my drink out laughing at this. ROFL…
As an educator I would expect LOM/ASG-M to be more open minded. I often wonder how someone so obsessed with history can have so many blind spots.
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@ Sharina
I hope your keyboard’s okay.
“As an educator I would expect LOM/ASG-M to be more open minded. I often wonder how someone so obsessed with history can have so many blind spots.”
It’s bizarre, isn’t it? He uses his knowledge of history to reinforce his blind spots.
Also, he is obsessed with the Civil War but knows next to nothing about other important events that happened during the 19th century. So while it’s correct he’s obsessed with history, it’s not in the same broad and encompassing way that many avid historians are.
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@ ASG-M
“If you want me to change my worldview in a certain way, if you want me to adopt any specific viewpoints, put up or shut up.”
I want you to stop attacking people the way you did Taotesan and Fan.
I want you to be more respectful of the life experiences of people of color and stop telling them how they should think about their own experiences.
I want you to listen more and talk less.
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Resw said,
“All because I spoke truths you people didn’t want to hear”
Nope. It’s not your content, it is your disrespect. And your inablity to tell the difference between an opinion and a perceived agenda.
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Enough already. Question: Is Hannity next. Should he be?
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@scrib perceptibility?
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@ An Scríbhneoir Gael-Mheiriceánach
Comment deleted for talking about she who shall not be named.
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@ michaeljonbarker
Not just disrespect. It is also the petty evasion, denial, deflection and disruption. That is magnified by his/her hiding behind proxy servers.
This sentence reveals a lot about resw:
“All because I spoke truths you people didn’t want to hear…”
Sounds just like the racist drivel White Supremacist trolls and Trump supporters have written on this forum for years. “You people” indeed.
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Said almost every troll I ever banned, instead of simply:
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Wow abagond wasnt that like 3-4 years ago? Sheesh! She really got to you huh
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@ ASG-M
I just saw your restored comment to me upthread.
I want you to understand something. That comment you made about Hawai’i on the Jeff Sessions thread — had it been four months ago, I still would have objected to it for the same reason. I would have been nicer. I would have spoonfed you. But I still would have called you out on it.
About concentrating on people like Yogibreeze instead of “fellow” liberals/progressives: Abso-f*cking-lutely not. A true progressive should be willing and eager to learn and grow in their progessiveness. A true progresive would welcome constructive criticism.
You have been told multiple times by multiple people that you need to take several seats and put on your learning cap. You were being told this before I ever started commenting. Your response to this has typically been either denial or lashing out in anger.
As an intelligent person, perhaps you should consider: If that many people from that many different walks of life (and indeed from many different parts of the world) are telling you the same thing about your behavior, they may actually be onto something.
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Solitaire:
As an intelligent person, perhaps you should consider: If that many people from that many different walks of life (and indeed from many different parts of the world) are telling you the same thing about your behavior, they may actually be onto something.
I remember some time ago I raised with you your need to intervene and explain on behalf of LoM. I couldn’t understand it as I believed that you too were intelligent and that you were giving him unnecessary cover for his foolishness.
Point is LoM knows good and well what he is doing and how he is coming across – HE JUST DOESNT CARE. His primary purpose for being on this forum is to bring attention to things that matter to him. That has ALWAYS been his agenda. It is just that some commenters realised this quicker than others.
Honestly? All anyone know has to do is copy and paste any previous comment they have already said to LoM because its all been said.
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Folks, trying to ‘dialogue’ with this guy is like farting in a wind tunnel, don’t bother. He is the obverse of the conservative white supremacist, he is a liberal one. it’s a waste of time and brain energy.
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Unless of course you want to be entertained.
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I said,
“O’Reilly was let go because sponsors don’t like controversy. ”
Resw eesponded ,
“That’s your opinion. As I said, this stuff has been around for over a decade. It’s old news. Sponsors had every opportunity to distance themselves from O’Reilly “controversy”, such as when this story broke way back in 2004:”
The difference between now and back in 2004 is that only one media outlet reported on the story (msnbc) so there was no run on the bank.
Fast forward today and the New York Times reported the story which then got quickly picked up by the rest of the MSM.
Corperate advertisizers began to drop from that pricy Fox time slot because O’Reilly had become damaged goods. What these corperate sponsors were doing was pulling there time slots so that they could renegotiate better air time rates since the golden calf had fallen from grace.
It wasnt because “people who make the key decisions at the US white supremacist media outlets” “are cleansing ranks” or that there was some moral out rage behind the sponsors decision in pulling there advertising dollars.
It was because corperate sponsors saw an opportunity to renegotiate the 100 of millions of dollars that Fox generated from selling O’Reilly time slots.
The corperate advertisizers are back behind Carson but they are paying nothing near what they were for O’Reilly. Viewership dropped 30% when O’Reilly left but that still is millions of viewers that corperate advertisers look for.
It was the market that fired O’Reilly.
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@ resw
Comment deleted for making a personal remark about Solitaire.
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LoM
Really! The thread you referred to became centred around you and you are upset, that’s a real shocker lmao!
One of the most conceited posters on this blog is irritated that I derailed a thread by making it about something other than what the conversation was about by ‘stirring the pot’. I say to that commenter – pot, kettle, black!
Now you are trying to act like I am a cyberbully! That is laughable.
What I am is a lurker and occasional commenter, who gets frustrated seeing you continually making every post about you. I think essentially you have a brain but you chose not to engage it when it doesn’t suit your agenda and for most of these posts, they don’t fit the niche of what personally interests you. You chose the posts you comment on carefully but they are simply a device to enable you to get a foothold and get the commentary going more in the way that you want it to so that it comes back to you and something relating to you.
BUSTED!!!!
And I never poked at you for being British, by the way, since I haven’t got any agenda against the people of Britain. You, on the other hand, couldn’t even let a Diaspora Irishman be at peace.
Btw, I did not poke fun at you for being Irish. I mocked you for having what I will now call the Rachel Dolezal complex where you want to be perceived as other than what you are. I have a friend who is identified as black but has at least 2 white Irish grandparents – do you think he will be able to ‘decide’ to change how he is perceived cos he decides on a whim that he wants to? That’s a certain privilege you have that others don’t and don’t you forget it!!!!
Neat, by the way, how your antics on that thread were able to deflect from the behavior of your fellow troll, resw.
Also, it is not your place to position other commenters with each other. Our writing styles are totally different and although I have enjoyed brief exchanges with resw and I admire some of his/her commentary we are not in cahoots with each other as you have tried to suggest.
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@Omnipresent
Exactly!! The thread was centered on him because he made it about him.
“I am not Jewish, nor particularly enamored of Zionism or Israel, so I don’t have a really personal connection to the Holocaust of the sort that makes me speak with passion about what the Irish have been through.”
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@michaeljonbarker
“The difference between now and back in 2004 is that only one media outlet reported on the story (msnbc) so there was no run on the bank.”
False. I already posted a link to a Washington Post article, and it was widely reported by CBS and even Fox News posted an AP article on its website (in 2004): http://www.foxnews.com/story/2004/10/29/oreilly-says-reached-settlement.html
“Corperate advertisizers began to drop from that pricy Fox time slot because O’Reilly had become damaged goods.”
Again, your opinion. No facts. As I said, he has been mired in controversy for over a decade and advertisers had every opportunity to pull out. So your excuse that they only pulled out now because they don’t like “controversy” has not been substantiated by you.
“Nope. It’s not your content, it is your disrespect.”
Thanks for admitting that your white group trolls me.
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@Afrofem
““You people” indeed..”
Yes “you people” as in the white racist trolls and you, a suspected black sock puppet according to abagond:
“Use a name that seems “black” or “African”, like “Trinidad African” or “Naija Girl”.” or like Afrofem
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Sharina: Exactly!! The thread was centered on him because he made it about him.
This LoM puts the blinkers on when it suits him. Also, the comments about the ‘I’ word should not have acted as a derailment on that thread, they were just aside comments. So how the hell he could attribute this to all kinds of b0llock$ including his dishonest statement about insulting Ireland which is made up melodrama, I don’t know!
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“I can find plenty of things to talk about other than the Irish, but you and resw and sharinalr and all the others are going to have to meet me halfway.”
When you keep my name out of your mouth, stop derailing threads with talk of the Irish, stop derailing threads to talk about your egotistic self, stop derailing threads to correct people’s typos and grammar, then I’ll have nothing to say to you.
So f@ck your white tears. You’re not a victim, you’ve demonstrated that you’re an evil racist white Irish supremacist troll since the first day you started commenting on this site. I’m glad Omnipresent made your soft a$s cry. You deserve it.
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LoM
I am not a cyberbully. Lets get that damn straight. I believe that the term bully is used too freely in this day and age. I grew up in an age where political correctness and the nanny state were yet to rear their heads and my go$h, if you were subjected to bullying you knew about it!!
Initially by addressing you, I wanted to understand more about you and your belief that you had much in common with PoC. I raised questions with you and when these were not answered in a way I found satisfactory I admit they became harder and were challenging. But, I believe that if you feel such a kinship to PoC and any other subjugated groups in the ways you claim to, responding to them and giving real life context should not be such a stretch for you.
My identity is not negotiable. This is the root of my problem with you – why I think your behaviors are those of a bully.
I gave an example of earlier about a mate of mine who has clear Irish lineage. I can bring it even closer to a family member who is Black, 3rd generation born in UK but is still referred to as West Indian! I repeat you have some privilege mate but I will now caveat that with the fact that you did not create the social and inequal construct of race however, when I see you time and time and time again pass over the inequalities and injustices that others are facing here and now when I KNOW you are perfectly capable of putting forward great commentary in defence of this, it riles and frustrates me.
There was a time during the second half of last year (2016) when you consistently harassed me, and it was about my identity.
Whilst it may have felt like I was continually on your case I don’t think this is an accurate perception. I don’t comment all that often to keep up a persistent vigil however, I concede that when I did comment to you it might have been quite intense.
You were trying to get me to take on an identity that I didn’t believe in. You mocked me about it and came up with dog whistles (particularly “the I-word” and the usage of “the Emerald Isle”) to make it not just about me, but about Ireland and the Irish in general. You were aggressive and then told me that it was my fault, that I was doing it to myself. You told me I did not have the right to decide who I was. Even now, you use terms like “white Irish” just to taunt me
I do not use white Irish to taunt you. It sounds to me that I have been to Ireland more and consorted more with Irish people than you ever have so there is a reason why I distinguish which has less to do with you and more to do with my own experiences – I will leave that there.
I haven’t tried to gloss over my response however, I wonder in this instance you can put your narcissism aside and realise that actually, I am not entirely trying to be a $hit to you and appreciate that originally, I was trying to understand where you are coming from. I admit I lack patience though and Man to man I you could handle this but from your comment it seems that I come across way too strong which is regrettable.
Finally I did NOT try force you to take on an identity that you didn’t believe in – I simply challenged how you were trying to re-brand yourself. Anyway, you do what you do -keep on trucking.
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LoM
There was a film made in the 90s called The Commitments about a Dublin based Irish soul band. One of the characters said “The Irish are the blacks of Europe and Dubliners are the Blacks of Ireland so say it once and say it loud, I’m black and I’m proud” – I got it at the time.
Abagond – please let me know if my commentary is bordering on bullying.
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@LOM
“I can find plenty of things to talk about other than the Irish, but you and resw and sharinalr and all the others are going to have to meet me halfway”—Are you slow? Why should I meet you halfway on a topic I don’t bring up? YOU are the psycho that makes it about YOU, then get mad when people put YOU on blast.
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@resw
“So f@ck your white tears. You’re not a victim, you’ve demonstrated that you’re an evil racist white Irish supremacist troll since the first day you started commenting on this site. I’m glad Omnipresent made your soft a$s cry. You deserve it.”–Now that was absolutely amazing.
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@Omnipresent
I am most certain that he is delusional at this point. I wonder if he knows what is real vs what he makes up in his mind.
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LoM
I am patently aware that xenophobia in the UK extends to the irish diaspora however, I will also say that this is primarily for those who are Irish born and have an accent but primarily to those who are Travellers or Gypsies. The latter are particularly treated like carrion even by Irish 2nd or 3rd generations.
I think that the Commitments film with the soul music was a way of showing appreciation to the R&B artists of the 50s and 60s which was appreciated by many. To make it about an Irish music versus American music misses the point. It just further reinforced their perception that they were the blacks of Europe I suspect.
I still say that 2nd or 3rd generations Irish are not encumbered in the way that other people of the diaspora are because essentially they are accepted as white however its probably fair to say that if they wear their Irish heritage on their sleeves they may be subject to some prejudice or in rare cases hostility.
I can understand why the Irish of a certain generation in the UK feel an affinity with West Indian migrants, “no blacks no Irish no dogs”.
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Abagond – please let me know if my commentary is bordering on bullying.
I admire your restraint!
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@ Omnipresent
“I remember some time ago I raised with you your need to intervene and explain on behalf of LoM. I couldn’t understand it as I believed that you too were intelligent and that you were giving him unnecessary cover for his foolishness.”
I remember that. At the time, I thought what I was doing was the opposite of covering — that I was exposing him before he could jump in with one of his typical BS defenses. Nevertheless, I gave serious thought to what you said because obviously it wasn’t coming across to you (and possibly others) the way I intended. Since then I have tried to take your advice.
If LOM is entirely cognizant of what he’s doing, if he’s a troll 100% all the way through, what do we do?
We could try the starvation technique, but it would have to be a complete and utter shunning by everyone to work. No more calling him out when he says something racist, no more swipes at him when he brings up the Emerald Isle off topic, no more answering any questions of his no matter how innocuous, no more friendly/neutral exchanges with him about books, movies, or cuisine on the Open Thread.
Because he keeps managing to weasel his way back in. Time and time again he’s said horrible things that have gotten everyone furious at him, and then he goes away for awhile and then comes back acting like it all never happened, like a little puppy who’s so eager to see everyone here again and wants to be accepted and loved. He’s done it over and over and over again.
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Solitaire: Time and time again he’s said horrible things that have gotten everyone furious at him, and then he goes away for awhile and then comes back acting like it all never happened, like a little puppy who’s so eager to see everyone here again and wants to be accepted and loved. He’s done it over and over and over again.
You will no doubt have read my comments to LoM above. I havent seen the horrible things that you allude to here but I have seen rising frustration and tension in the interactions between LoM and other commenters. My beef with LoM was that I felt that he hijacked and derailed threads deliberately but also, I couldnt understand the affinity he felt he had with PoC. I lost patience with it all and in my commentary to him seems to have cut deep – I was surprised. I didn’t think what was said penetrated let alone what I, a sometime commenter said.
If LOM is entirely cognizant of what he’s doing, if he’s a troll 100% all the way through, what do we do?
I don’t know but if LoM’s most recent response is anything to go by, I think he may seek to remind people he is a thinking, feeling individual at the other end of the screen. But I hope LoM can see these words (which have hopefully been emboldened) and use them as a mirror to realise that these words go everywhich way for the multiple commenters that post on this forum too.
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Correction * I don’t know but if LoM’s most recent response is anything to go by, I think his intention is to remind people he is a thinking, feeling individual at the other end of the screen
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@ Omnipresent
“I lost patience with it all and in my commentary to him seems to have cut deep – I was surprised.”
I’m not entirely convinced he’s being sincere. I think he’s tugging on your heartstrings for having made him cry, while once again positioning himself as the oppressed Irish martyr.
He certainly didn’t give a sh*t about how badly he hurt Taotesan, and what he said to her was far more cutting than anything I’ve ever seen you say to him.
“I don’t know but if LoM’s most recent response is anything to go by, I think he may seek to remind people he is a thinking, feeling individual at the other end of the screen. But I hope LoM can see these words (which have hopefully been emboldened) and use them as a mirror to realise that these words go everywhich way for the multiple commenters that post on this forum too.”
You know, now that you bring this up, I’m not sure he sees any of the rest of us as thinking, feeling individuals behind the screen.
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Solitaire: I’m not entirely convinced he’s being sincere. I think he’s tugging on your heartstrings for having made him cry,
I’m not heartless and I don’t suffer fools gladly either. My primary concern was coming across as a cyberbully. I have kids still at an impressionable age and I try to always put commentary on line that I would not worry about them seeing and actually try to set a reasonably decent example.
I had thought we were having an equal spat but his comment changed that. I can only go by what he has said but if it was just to disarm me then that is a bit of a weasel stunt.
Solitaire said You know, now that you bring this up, I’m not sure he sees any of the rest of us as thinking, feeling individuals behind the screen.
READ THIS LOM AND PERHAPS PROVE SOLITAIRE AND ANYONE ELSE WRONG – THE CHOICE IS YOURS…
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LoM: Awaiting your marching orders.
Nah mate, no orders from me. As I said above how you move forward with this, the choice is yours. My advice? Make it the right choice!
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@ Omnipresent
I understand your concerns, but I repeat that nothing you have said to LOM is anywhere as ugly as things he himself has said to others here. If anyone is the bully, it’s him.
I can’t prove his insincerity except that it’s a gut feeling based on past events.
The same with this:
“I never imagined when I woke up that I’d go to bed counting Omnipresent as an online friend”
He might be sincere. But he might be triangulating. He tends to triangulate posters against each other. He will make quick shifts from holding one person as an enemey to holding them as a friend when it serves his purposes, and vice versa.
This may well be more tugging at your heartstrings. I’ve fallen for it before, as have others.
Look how quickly he’s moved you from a cyberbully who made him weep to an online friend whose marching orders he awaits. He’s practically said he’ll do what you tell him — isn’t that a stunningly swift reversal?
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Note: I cross-posted with Omnipresent’s comment directly above my last; I hadn’t seen it when I wrote mine.
Also:
enemy
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Solitaire: Look how quickly he’s moved you from a cyberbully who made him weep to an online friend whose marching orders he awaits. He’s practically said he’ll do what you tell him — isn’t that a stunningly swift reversal?
Its pretty pointless anyone counting on me for continued support. As I said I am a sometime commenter. I dip in and out and that is as much to do with my lifestyle as it is now wanting to find myself hooked to the internet!
When I said I am not heartless it doesn’t mean that in this situation it has struck a chord in my heart or that I have ‘fallen’ for anything (we blokes don’t do that lol). It just means that I have decided to pause, take stock and see what happens.
Besides, it seems that LoM still feels an affinity with you despite your current comments to him…. LoM Said: I am well aware of the good-faith commenters – the “thinking, feeling individuals ” – here. Afrofem, Michael Jon Barker, and of course the proprietor, Abagond, come to mind. Solitaire half the time…
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@ Omnipresent
“When I said I am not heartless it doesn’t mean that in this situation it has struck a chord in my heart or that I have ‘fallen’ for anything (we blokes don’t do that lol). It just means that I have decided to pause, take stock and see what happens.”
Fair enough.
“Besides, it seems that LoM still feels an affinity with you despite your current comments to him….”
Oh god, no. Not that. Anything but that.
I don’t want him to feel an affinity with me. I want him to either take several seats or take his hat and go home.
“LoM Said: I am well aware of the good-faith commenters – the “thinking, feeling individuals ” – here. Afrofem, Michael Jon Barker, and of course the proprietor, Abagond, come to mind. Solitaire half the time…”
Since you don’t hang out here steadily, you may have missed the uproar a little while ago when LOM used similar wording about the same people and myself to imply that three other commenters were stupid.
This is a big part of why I don’t want him to feel any affinity for me. He uses his lists of “good-faith” posters in bad ways: manipulation, trriangulation, indirect insults, etc.
Note that he equated “thinking, feeling individuals” with those who post in “good faith.” Note that he excluded a bunch of people from that list: Mary Burrell, Brothawolf, Mack Lyons, Sharina, etc. All of whom demonstrably post in good faith, all of whom demonstrably are thinking feeling individuals, all of whom have taken him to task for his racism.
Omnipresent, I may be wrong but I believe your appeal to him was to see everyone here as a thinking feeling individual. Note that he immediately qualified that as only applying to a very few people.
Apparently I am only a thinking feeling individual HALF the time in his eyes, and the other half I am NOT.
And quite obviously he never once saw Taotesan as a thinking feeling individual who he may well have brought to tears in front of her computer screen.
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@Solitaire
You pretty much summed up what he is doing perfectly. He has no desire to reflect on anything anyone tells him. Everything is an attack.
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@scrib AYE LADDIE lol
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Solitaire: Omnipresent, I may be wrong but I believe your appeal to him was to see everyone here as a thinking feeling individual. Note that he immediately qualified that as only applying to a very few people.
I think no matter what, there are individuals on here like yourself who having interacted with LoM on the daily, are wise to how he operates.
And quite obviously he never once saw Taotesan as a thinking feeling individual who he may well have brought to tears in front of her computer screen.
!
As I said before, at this stage for me, I will recline and take stock. But from what you have said above, it is pretty effed up to cry wolf if you have done the very same thing to someone else! That also might reinfornce the cognitive dissonance that is suspected. In that case commenters have to decide how much they can withstand interacting with such a commenter.
Peace Solitaire
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My primary concern was coming across as a cyberbully.
Don’t worry about what this anal aperture thinks. Most have him pegged!
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Herneith: Don’t worry about what this anal aperture thinks. Most have him pegged!
You are the 3rd person to say something so it looks like LoM needs to shape up or ship out then!
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You are the 3rd person to say something so it looks like LoM needs to shape up or ship out then!
That’s putting it politely. If it weren’t for the comment policy, people would just use obscenities on him.
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