Note: Commenting on this post is closed. You can comment on the repost.
I have written many posts about relationships between black women and white men in America. It used to be a big topic on this blog. Of all the different things I have written about, it was the first to catch fire and get over 300 comments. At one point it seemed like half my commenters were in such relationships. My views have changed over time, so there is some confusion about where I stand.
My current views: Here is my current thinking. If it is different than something I said in an earlier post, that just means my opinion has changed:
- There is nothing wrong with such relationships, but black women can go into them for the wrong reasons, like internalized racism. The Black Women’s Empowerment movement (BWE), for example, presents white men as saving black women from black men. That is internalized racism straight-up, all the way.
- Black women do not secretly desire white men. Not any more than I secretly desire white women. Some of them might, of course, but probably not most of them. I do not remember ever saying otherwise. There is nothing to support the idea of a common secret desire other than a white racist worldview or black male insecurity. Other than the BWE sorts, I do not hear black women going on and on about how wonderful white men are. Not even close. Even those who are in such relationships seem more defensive than anything else.
- Why there are not many black women with white men in America: because most black women do not want to be with white men. It is women who do the choosing, especially when it comes to race and particularly since most men are dogs. Further, as shown in studies on Chinese American women, most women marry men like those they grew up among. Most black women grow up in black neighbourhoods, so based just on that alone you would expect most black women to be with black men.
- Racialized beauty standards. I have written about this at length. Not just because American beauty standards are at odds with my own, but because it is a part of White American racism, a big subject on this blog. But, yes, in writing about it, black women can come off seeming like they are in a meat market and found wanting, which is demeaning, I agree. I do talk about white men not seeming to want black women, but I do that not to put down black women, but rather to point out the racism of white men. Because black women are, first and foremost, women it seems strange to me for so many white men to seem like they feel no attraction for them – unless, of course, you assume they are looking at the world through a racist lens.
Thanks (I think) to commenter Peanut for suggesting this post.
– Abagond, 2013.
See also:
What about white women with black men?
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@ Vagabond Abscond
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You got it wrong, abagond. Men do the choosing when it comes to relationships. Black women are still considered the bottom of the barrel in this society. Women are only as faithful as their options allow them. Most black women have no choice but to stick with black men. A lot of black women would like to date out but are not given the opportunity.
Black men have the luxury of dating and marry whoever they want. Not so much with black women. Interracial dating between black men and women of other races is VERY common in my area. Lots of women that are not black seem to desire black men—the love is mutual. The same can’t be said for men of other races desiring black women.
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Black men definitely have it easier in this society. Being a black woman in this society is the worst thing you could be. I see it everyday while I’m out: men and women of all races in relationships while the black women are left walking alone, in groups with other black females, or with their out of wedlock babies. Black American women are still the most single/lonely women in the world.
Men choose women, not the other way around and unfortunately society greatly influences the perceived desirability of a woman. Black women are last and are often overlooked no matter how attractive, accomplished, kind, etc. because they are still black and that’s all many people can see.
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OK:
I take it you are talking from a U.S perspective. If you venture outside of America, then you will see many examples to the contrary.
From what I have seen on this blog, there seems to be something really negative ingrained in American society towards Black women but I can assure you that the ROtW does NOT follow suit.
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OK:
Men choose women, not the other way around and unfortunately society greatly influences the perceived desirability of a woman
I disagree strongly here – it is not so cut and dried. Whilst men might be more proactive in making the first move, there has to be mutual interest or else you will rarely proceed past the preliminaries.
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@ Abagond Thanks. Have your ideas changed on BM w/ WW since that post? Do you think there is anything wrong with those relationships?
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Omnipresent, definitely.
Also, I’d say black men and white women have more opportunity for initiating romantic interactions. White women feel less threatened coming into black spaces.
White guys are afraid of black guys and typically anywhere there are black women there will be black men.
When I was in college, at any party thrown by black people there would be a significant presence of white girls.
Most interactions between black women and white men occur in white spaces, in the workplace or in the classroom, where interaction is largely controlled and romantic interaction is discouraged.
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Omnipresent, I see what you’re saying but I stand by what I said: men choose. If a woman receives little interest from men—i’m talking real relationships, not just sex—then she has few options/choices. A man must pursue (choose) the woman first. Then, she either accepts or rejects but the women must first be given the opportunity (chosen) to do this.
I’ve read that black women are desired more by men of all races in other parts of the world. I was very surprised to read about Chinese men MARRYING black women in Africa and Jamaica.
I think, in America at least, it is easy for a black woman to find a man to simply have sex but extremely difficult to find a man willing to have a serious relationship and marry. White woman as we all know aren’t perfect virgins, but they are considered desirable in this society; therefore, they have no problem finding a man that’s willing to settle down and marry them. I’ve seen white trash easily get married while the “thin, attractive, kind, intelligent” black woman still struggled to get chosen by a man because she’s BLACK and that’s all people can see.
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Solesearch said:
“Also, I’d say black men and white women have more opportunity for initiating romantic interactions. White women feel less threatened coming into black spaces.
White guys are afraid of black guys and typically anywhere there are black women there will be black men.”
I’ve noticed this, too. Could it be that white women are less racist than white men? Women are less racist than men and care less about what other people think of their partners than men in general?? I’ve seen white women move to the ghetto to be with their black spouses. I’ve never seen a white man do this. Like I said, the attraction is mutual.
Black men have an easier time dating/marrying interracially because women of other races desire them also. I think the lack of opportunity for white men and black women to form romantic relationships is an excuse. If a man is really interested in a woman he will find a way to be with her. I often see black men pursue women of other races aggressively. They will purposely skip over black women just to get to a non white woman. They make it known that they like and prefer that nonblack woman. I know black men that live in predominantly black areas and still end up with nonblack women. Black men have lots of negative stereotypes too but it doesn’t stop nonblack women from liking them. The attraction is mutual.
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solesearch:
White women feel less threatened coming into black spaces.
I mostly agree but I bet that this is not a common perception. I have only browsed past posts on this blog and it is full of white men and the occassional (if it is to be believed) white women who seem to say that they dont feel ‘safe’ going into predominantly black environments. However, one of the answers must be what you assert above. I certainly notice it here in the U.K perhaps ‘desire’ overrides everything else in this instance.
OK:
Where I live there are many IR relationships, and this is what is classed as a pretty rural town though not too far from the capital. I am not saying that everyone is open to the same things where I live but, it sounds like it is far more likely/frequent/common an occurrence than in the U.S.
Both:
Of the couples I know in relationships of this kind, they met in more ‘social’ settings such as school or clubbing or through mutual friends. It sounds like there is a slight class/social issue that comes to across when you guys talk about black women meeting white men for instance.
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Most black women prefer black men but I don’t think black men feel the same. I think black men in general are open to all races of women and don’t strictly prefer black women. Many black men perfer any woman that’s not black, too.
Interracial relationships between black men and other women are common. The statistics tend to only count marriages but I bet if nonmarriage relationships were counted too the numbers would be HIGH—-I’m willing to bet almost 50% of black men are/have been in/have children from interracial relationships.
I think black women’s strong preference for black men is due to lack of options. If black women had as many options as black men the preference for black men wouldn’t be as strong.
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Perhaps, white women feel more comfortable going to predominantly black environments than white men because they feel as if black men will protect them? White men on the other hand are men and may feel as if they can’t hold their own in an all black environment??? I’m just speculating. I’ve noticed that white men seem to be more uncomfortable in all black environments, too.
I think black men’s stereotype of being aggressive works in their favor when it comes to attracting other races of women.
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OK:
I think black women’s strong preference for black men is due to lack of options. If black women had as many options as black men the preference for black men wouldn’t be as strong.
I think you are going to p*ss people off if you keep making sweeping statements like this, particularly as it is not clear whether you are speaking from personal experience or just as an observer who does not come under either category.
We have already established that this seems to be something that is prevalent mainly in the U.S. It would be less antagonistic in this instance to state this I think.
That being said, when I refer to relationships, I am talking about ‘common law’ partners in addition to those who are married. I do think that there are probably more black men with white women, even just in Europe. What I will say is that the reverse of this is definately on the rise.
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Mr. Abagond, the correct answer is: “Interracial relationships are nonsense that should be discouraged no matter what color the genders in question are. Miscegenation stinks.”
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Just curious, who all else lives in an inner city all black neighborhood?
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futurodellanazione:
Mr. Abagond, the correct answer is: “Interracial relationships are nonsense that should be discouraged no matter what color the genders in question are. Miscegenation stinks.”
No, in your specific case, the correct answer is ‘incest stinks’ it breeds ignorance and stupidity.
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Interesting commentary thus far. Just adding a different perspective. From my experience growing up in a predominantly white suburbs, there was NO WAY I was going to marry a white man. Not living under my father’s household, lol. I mean my parents marriage was rocky at times- still married now 38yrs now. So for me, it was having a living example of what a marriage looked like. And not what was on the boob tube.:-)
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Omnipresent, I’m talking about US experience. I’ve read that things are better for black women in othe parts of the world. I like reading others’ views.
I think it’s easy for all women to find someone that simpy wants to have sex with them. What separates the romantically undesirable women from the desirable women is the ease of getting a man to be in a serious relationship/marriage with them. Unfortunately, society dictates a lot of women’s perceived desirably. Yes, black women can get sex and booty calls but to actually find a man that wants to “put a ring on it”, stick around and raise a family, and be monogamous will be extremely difficult because in American society black women are considered undesirable and simply aren’t worth it.
I personally know white women that have had children out of wedlock and their men ended of marrying them. This didn’t happen to the black women that I know. A white (actually any woman that isn’t black) woman is considered more desirable in this society so she is free to make mistakes, sleep around a bit and many men would still want to be with her. Not the same for black women.
A nonblack woman can be grossly overweight, frumpy, homely, etc. and still have men wanting to be with her. A black woman must stay fit, dress well, etc. and still won’t be perceived as desirable as a white women. People only see BLACK. I know some amazing black women that are struggling in the dating realm. Then, I see trashy white women that are doing all of the “wrong” things ( sleeping around, out of wedlock children, multiple divorces, lack class, obese) still easily get a man.
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I think those black women interracial blogs give black women false hope and unrealistic expectations. I think black women should be taught to find a man, regardless of race, that treats her well and wants to be with her.
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Ok, I wouldn’t say white women are less racist. Women are just less confrontational than men.White women are less fearful of being attacked by black women. And their gender shields them from being attacked by the “black male brute”.
As for white women moving to the ghetto with their black male spouses, I’d have to say this is effect of white women meeting black men in black spaces. She probably was from a white ghetto herself.
Black women who are marrying white men aren’t living in ghettoes to begin with.
Lack of opportunity isn’t an excuse. It’s a just another reason. It would only be an excuse if I didn’t mention white men’s racism as a cause of the lack of opportunity.
If a man is really interested in a woman he will find a way to be with her.
But I am talking about initiating interest between a man and a woman. Once a man becomes interested in a woman, he MAY disregard all perceived barriers in pursuit. It depends on the type of person he is.
That is because of internalized racism, so you shouldn’t expect(nor want) white men to exhibit the same behavior.
Again, a reason for that is because white women aren’t as afraid to be black spaces.
Negative stereotypes stop a lot of white women from not liking black men. Like Peanut said, there are way more white people than black people. There only need be a small fraction of white women who like black men and aren’t afraid to pursue them in black spaces for that perception to spread.
Only a small percentage of white women marry black men. They marry men of other races at higher rates.
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Damn OK–you’re racist as hell towards Black women.
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I think people have to remember that their “experiences” or “what they see” is not data nor does this limited view present an accurate picture of who marries who and why…
According to the latest U.S, Census the overwhelming majority of Black men who marry do so with Black women. Less than a measly 9% of Black men in America have a wife who is not Black. Fact.
But why don’t white people ever talk about why their divorce rate is over 50%…
Why don’t they ever talk about the increase of white men going to lands like Thailand, Cambodia, and to lesser extents Brazil to purchase wives (if white women are so high on the desirability list)….
It takes two consenting adults to decide if they should enter into a relationship–anything else would be force (e.g. sexual coercion, or rape)…
I do not believe white women are any less threatened by Blacks than white men–at least the history of their behavior and even now does not support such a flawed, misguided assumption…
I have had Black friend girls, and this has happened to me–be harassed on the job by white women–who in many cases are not even a supervisor or superior…
I talked to Trojan Pam on her blog some days back and to answer this question of white women being the IDEAL mate of Black men–one has to wonder why white women are the group who are advancing rapidly in corporate America, while Black men are the group that is disappearing????
The plain and simple of the matter is that America is an Anti-Black Female, Anti-Black Male, and Anti-Black Children society–any one using interracial sexual relations between Black people and white as a measurement of social progress need to run–not walk–to get their heads examined..
In no way am i directing my comments to any particular person on this thread.
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There larger presence in black spaces supports it.
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*Their
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No! Not Bria!! Noooooooooo!!!!! 😦
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But the constant mistreatment of Black people by white women does not…
Did you know that the MOST likely person to sit on a jury is a white woman?
So when Black men are accused of something– his “fate” tends to rest in her hands…
Affirmative Action (in which MANY in this society falsely believes benefit Black people) is MOSTLY enjoyed by white women–yet they (white women) do not come to the defense of Black people when we are wrongfully accused of “getting over on the system”…
Just because a few white women INVADE, INTRUDE or HANG out in Black clubs, organizations, or neighborhoods DOES not mean she loves Black folk or will admit to her benefiting from a system that mistreats the same Black folks she hangs with..
Again let me make it crystal clear, I am in no way attacking anyone’s views here, so with that said you and i Solesearch will have to agree to disagree.
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Hum. The only comment I would make is “does one really need to “have a position” on other people’s lives ?
But at the same time “race” being a political topic with deep social impact I *guess* one can *express an opinion*.
A “position” ? Not sure what exactly you mean by it.
And like Omnipresent, I think this really a take from a US perspective which would make most people outside the US raise their eyebrows (but not roll their eyes).
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Well you wouldn’t know it from my life experience that Black women are the least desirable. Me and my gal pals have always gotten attention where ever we go – from white guys, Asian guys, Black guys, whoever kinda guys. And not the catcalling or ick sort of attention, but that kind of attention you know exactly what I’m talking about.
I’ve traveled to many places around the world, Africa, Europe, UK, Greece, France wherever and gotten the same kind of attention. In our safe spaces here on the net Black women have already discussed, shared and talked over what America would like to think is happening with Black women vs the actual reality. Most of us know what time it is, and ignore any who wish to perpetuate that kind of fantasy.
As for BW/WM thing well whatever floats your boat. I believe that you must first know yourself before you can begin to share yourself. I’ve always had my pick as I mentioned, and I’ve had relationships with the rainbow. But if I was ever to choose a white guy to hitch up with: It wouldn’t be an American white male, that much I do know.
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phoebeprunelle, you’re turning the conversation into something it is not. We are talking about specifically about interracial marriage.
More white women feel more comfortable in black spaces than white men. That is what I’m talking about.
I wish we could just agree to argue about the same thing.
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Question. why isn’t the devil settled on the best part of the planet Earth?
Answer. Because the Earth belongs to the Original Man…….. et al
As a citizen of the Nation of Gods and Earths I don’t advocate interracial relationships because it is an abomination against history and the natural order of things. But that’s my cee and the cee of my household. If folks want to get in bed with the oppressor more power to them, but I don’t want to hear about it when that snake bites you in the ass. Because when snakes are allowed to live they sting.
Peace
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Projection is one hella of a drug lol. I am around all races of men I’m an air force brat so I see different races and cultures of people. I like black men and afro latino men. It’s not a matter of if I could or couldn’t get a white man I’ve never been attracted to them and don’t want to have kids with white men, I’m attracted to black men ,and women learn what a man is supposed to be like from the example their father and uncles set. I can honestly say my dad and uncle are great men, fathers, and husbands, so I see them and that is what I want a man to be. Black women do have options but I guess ppl want to make it like we don’t and that we’d jump ship at the first chance we get, smh projection much. Men and women are different its natural for men to want to be with different women and create a child with a beautiful woman regardless of race. For women its a little different, we are more picky when it comes to this because we are the ones who will be stuck with a child and have to deal with people’s ignorance if we have a biracial child. I would choose a black man over a white man anyday not because I can’t get a white man, but because black men are unique they have features that nobody else has, they are the original man why would I want a copy? They don’t need to tan, I love their deep dark eyes, their thick lips, their kinky hair,their strength, and most importantly their ambition, love, and personality. Sorry if I don’t fit into the box u trying to put me[colorstruck box] I genuinely love myself and since black men would be a mirror image to me I love black men.
Brown skin, you know I love your brown skin
I cant tell where yours begins, I cant tell where mine ends
Brown skin, up against my brown skin
Need some every now and then~ India arie
*drops mic, lights fade out*
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phoebeprunelle:
Why don’t they ever talk about the increase of white men going to lands like Thailand, Cambodia, and to lesser extents Brazil to purchase wives (if white women are so high on the desirability list)….
I agree that this mix of IR couples is fast becoming more common too.
I have seen a couple of blogs on here suggest that when a black woman is with a white man, the man is usually ‘nerdy’ or ‘geeky’ and certainly not commonly attractive. I could be biased but this is not evident from what I have seen. These type of men, the ones that are described on this blog as often being coupled with black women are usually the type associated with being with East Asian women where the stigma is that they cant get a regular woman so they have to get a ‘mail order bride’. Also with this, there are a lot of really old men – those probably that might be seen to be ‘past their best’ with much younger seeming women from these countries. Very ‘generic’ observations that only skim the surface for sure but this is what I have witnessed in the U.K.
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Awake BW, not trying to be funny but are you married? Did you recieve any proposals? I’ve never understood women that claim they attract and have dated a lot of men but still aren’t married.
If a person is not married they’re single. A man that wants to marry a woman, spend the rest of his life with her, and stay around and raise his children is expressing one of the ultimate signs of love. With a simple boyfriend girlfriend relationship it’s easy to leave. There is no commitment.
Marriage has so many benefits. This is where black women lose. Having a child out of wedlock is a very poor choice. Black women are often left alone doing everything (child rearing, work, etc.) by themselves.
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having some context, it’s hard for me to come up with a ‘policy statement,’ although i’m getting over that type of motive…
for me? part of it is admittedly the taboo, i don’t know how the girl thinks, probably she’s squirming inside going to white ‘pubs’ and whatnot, you know, once you get her out of town… the sideways looks and stuff, ah man, at my wedding dinner, my friend annie came all the way from los angeles to we were i think in ocean city maryland, and she was the only black person there, and her food was cold, it was mortifying, the waitress was like resentful, and my god we had like 30 people at the damn table so don’t tell me there was a rhyme or reason, so i’m not denying or minimizing anything here…
there are so many opinions, maintain your circumspection people!
i note (substantially) that class and the whole subculture is studious ignored here, that’s fine and all, but that, compared to posts like the career black woman who is never home, eh it’s water seeks water, there’s someone out there for everyone! dating sucks, period.
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and ok, please be advised that is the most ignorant post i’ve read here in about 6 weeks
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No i am not. And i assume that if Abagond deems my comments off-topic then he could just delete them…
Yes i was addressing the issue that a few white women with Black men “couldn’t possibly be as racist as white” (as many here asserted)…all i did was give evidence that that is not the case…nor has it ever been,
But then if you go back to my original second comment i gave the stats on who marries who..therefore people can plainly see that if Black men are overwhelmingly married to Black women, then Black women are overwhelming choosing them as well.
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This question is for anyone that can answer, not just Awake BW (not trying to be rude or put you in the spotlight, really):
“…. Did you recieve any proposals? I’ve never understood women that claim they attract and have dated a lot of men but still aren’t married.”
How does a woman person date/attract so many people and still end up alone—-especially alone raising children? No one proposed? A woman that is desirable will recieve proposals and will never have to be alone raising children.
I’m asking this because I hear a lot of black women claiming to attract so many men but they are still single.
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And to jump on my comments when OK’s comments are vile, Anti-Black woman and the likes is just beyond me..
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@mstoogood
Love that song! Yep totally agree with your commentary.
@phoebeprunelle- because you have great points to debate. An the Anti-Black woman spiel is so trite and so stereotypical it’s not much to debate.
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I’m a black woman that prefers white men and dated white men exclusively. I’ve been married over a decade to my husband, who is white. We’re not even the only WM/BW married couple in our circle of friends. It’s pretty common in our neck of the woods.
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What about black women and Arab men? Does this same analysis apply? Do you consider that a BW + WM? I know that the definitions in this country have been all over the place but technically according to the census Arabs are considered white. Just curious
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phoebeprunelle, I took your initial comment as a response to my comment about white women feeling more comfortable in black spaces not as a response to OK’s question.
My bad.
I also replied to OK saying that didn’t mean white women were less racist but they experience theirs differently and express it differently.
I didn’t jump on your comment. I replied. The same way I replied to OK.
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Ok, Abagond, that seems like a fair statement on your part…as maybe the person on this blog who has been interracialy dating longer than anyone on here, I cant help but look at some of the statements bizzarrely, and, the person who said things arnt exactly what they are making it out to be, is on the money…I dont really beleive what the media sais, statistics can be twisted anyway someone wants to and if a person wants to be open,and they have done the minimum to be in shape and well groomed, there are people out there for anyone and everyone….the way the American media has treated black beauty, is it any wonder that there is so much confusion in the media?
But like films, media is not real life…you just get out in real life and find out the deal…for each individual…not what statistics say is happening….
I dont pay any attention what people say, if I was single, Id have no trouble being able to hook up with a black American woman…because I know how to treat her well and like the beautiful woman she is…and Brazil ls even more open..I think black women in Brazil hook up with white men from outside the country , easiar than black men, if they arnt celebrities, and then its the opisite…Black women in Brazil have no problem showing openess and affection to white men and conveying to them that they are available…for the common black man in Brazil,I see social and class stigmas that are probably racial underneath
I would feel uncomfortable with a black women if she felt the need to cut down black men…I grew up with black men, many were my role models in life and still are, I could never be with a black woman to convey something to black men…and I also wont stand for being intimidated by any race about who I can date, and have had to face static from all sides since the mid 60’s about interracial dating , so I have a real thick skin, and wont take bs, and dont realy wilt in the face of ridiculous statements about interracial dating
Yeah, the color contrast is so special, like pepermint and chocalate, what a combination,
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Tobey
What about black women and Arab men? Does this same analysis apply? Do you consider that a BW + WM? I know that the definitions in this country have been all over the place but technically according to the census Arabs are considered white. Just curious
In a word NO! – no way no how, in the part of the world where I come from.
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@ Cornlia
“Position” was too strong for what I meant. I changed it to “views”. Thanks. I also changed the intro so it is clearer why I wrote this. It comes out of comments Peanut made on the BWE thread.
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Right, and lifelearner too. I stand corrected.
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You have the right idea, Peanut….you are open, but you have sound fundimentals
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@ peanut
Thanks for giving me credit lol.
yea and I get tired of it too. They flip flop one minute they say we are with black men because we can’t get white men, then the next if it is a black woman with a white man they say she with him because no black man wanted her[whoopi Goldberg].
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I love your post and respect your opinion. I feel you have a keen insight on things I am not well versed in. But, I just want to say my life experience is very different on this subject. I have a good friend, white male, who is married to a wonderful woman, black female, and he certainly is not her white savior! She saves his butt from stupid decisions all the time. My youngest daughter, a white woman, has been with her boyfriend, a black man, for some time now. Their relationship is the same as the one I had with my late husband for 24 years. It has the same ups and downs, stresses and unique issues that my wife of 4 years and I deal with on a regular basis. I believe if a relationship is built on love and respect, the only thing that keeps you apart are the obstacles you yourself create. Not theories, studies, other people’s experiences or opinions.
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Ok. You’ll be disappointed from this comment, but I have been proposed to by men who were non-black. I’m not huge on marriage, so I denied the proposal. So, don’t assume just because a black woman is single, that it is not by choice.
Also, either you are a very bitter white woman or black man who takes pleasure in the “perceived” disadvantages of black women.
Black men don’t have it so easy in the dating pool either. It’s just that they are more open and acceptable in dating. Black women are more choosy. If they date white, most often the man is professional. Ease up on black women.
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hereuntilgone, thank you
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Thanks Abagond. (btz, did u get my email ? Maybe I should have posted in the open thread ?)
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Omnipresent , what did you mean in your reply quoting Tobey ?
“No” to what ?
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Peanut, “arab men”…
it depends by who. it depends on how they see themselves. (The Census does classify them as “white”, because it helps to blow “white” numbers, I guess)
“black arab” “afro-arab” … wo wo wo I’m not sure the people concerned would see it the way you do.
I’ve never heard an ethnic Arab (people who consider their ancestry as descending from the Arabs of Arabia who conquered north Africa) say that he/she is “a person of color”. Never ever.
Maybe they do that once they become Americans. About 7 to 15% of the French population today (yes, yes) is ethnic Arab or from North Africa -Berbers- (imagine these numbers in the US, I wonder how they would cope with that… the majority of them being Muslims), I have friends, colleagues, students and wait, maybe family members who are “Arabs” and I’ve never heard one say that. They say they are “Arabic” and are often proud of it. Period.
It seems from your comment (which I don’t criticize, I’m just commenting) that the gate to Amerikkka has multiple doors with the “color” (meaning “race”) written on top…
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Serenity said this (and other things)
“an abomination against history and the natural order of things” ! (rien que ça ! ben dis donc !)
I have heard and read that somewhere else before (Gobineau, Hitler, the list is long). These people also have this God-like vision of themselves. They worship Arian gods.
Sometimes the oppressed become the oppressor. But don’t realize it.
I have also had a few conversations with people like Serenity, who call themselves “Gods and Earths”. Most conversations were nice and informative. But one of them told me that people were wrong to eat pork. (it’s kindof a mixture of Islam and something else it seems). I told her there are peoples around the world for whom pork is the central diet, like the Tschang people of Cameroon. Then she told me they are wrong and devilish, and she knows better than them.
And another one left her “God” and settled in an African country. She said: “I will be the Queen here”…
I don’t like people who have arrested racial agendas, whoever they are. They always end up trying to impose their views on others.
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For those who wonder about the “mixity” of marriages in France involving “Arabs” (people from the Maghreb – meaning the West in Arabic, the same word as Morocco- called “Maghrébins” in France), who “play a role similar to “blacks” in the racist game, here are numbers:
“Selon l’Insee, 16 % des nouveau-nés entre 2006 et 2008 ont au moins un grand-parent originaire du Maghreb. La moitié sont nés de couple mixtes”.
“According to INSEE, 16% of the French newborns between 2006 and 2008 have at least one grand-parent whose origins are in the Maghreb. Half were born to mixed couples.”
Source: http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immigration_en_France#Immigration_maghr.C3.A9bine
Since “race” is not a reference that is used to classify in France (it is actually forbidden by law to do so), there may be statistics for couples including people of African origin and French with no African origin (so-called “black” and “white” in the US Census and habits). They would imply looking for the geographic origin of people, and including French west Indians.
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Cornlia
Omnipresent , what did you mean in your reply quoting Tobey ?
“No” to what ?
I meant NO – in the part of the world where I am from, Arab and black women would NOT be classed as BW/WM relationship. They are classed as ‘foreign’/other and generally, they are classed swarthy and other derogatory terms but definately not white.
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Thanks Omnipresent.
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I am ABSOLUTELY shocked Abigond, I thought you were fully CODIFIED, I mean I realyze we as a group of people are not all myopic monoliths but I mistakenly thought we were on the same page with some very basic issues like Racism, what it is and how it affects all non white people on the globe. You said “There is nothing wrong with such relationships,” meaning interacial relationship between black women and white men. This shows that you are extremely still confused about racism. There is a huge movement right now to promote interacial relations and same sex relationship specifically within our communities. Did you ever wonder WHY ??? Not very codified at all. We are all victims and as such each of us still carry the residue of confusion of White Supremacy but damn Abagond ….. Soneone with your intellect is still drinking the koolaid of Mistah Charlie, smdh !!!
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The (white) mainstream media has caused the DESIRE on the part of black people to be with anyone BUT another black person to KEEP blacks from UNIFYING and surviving what is coming in this society
Movies like “The Purge” are more than just entertainment, they are a WARNING to black people of what could happen within an increasingly unstable economy as whites are PREPPED to blame black people VIA President Obama for all that AILS them
check out the website and you’ll see that this movie may be MORE than a movie.
http://www.newfoundersamerica.org/
Unfortunately, many black males and females are so busy blaming and WARRING with each other — a dynamic that began during slavery — that we can’t see the white forest for all the white trees we are happily sexing.
Since we live under a system of white supremacy, NO black person ever chooses a white person. White people do ALL the choosing, and that is as true for white males as it is for white females.
They are ALWAYS the most powerful person in that black/white unions. Yes, I know, we like to see sexing whites as “racial progress” but the reality is while black people have been separating from each other, we have collectively lost almost 80 percent of all the so-called civil rights gains made over the last FORTY YEARS.
Even during the harshest segregation, black males and females had enough common sense to know we NEEDED EACH OTHER. Now, we are so quick to dismiss each other since “I don’t have to date blacks. I can date or marry a white person.”
But the reality is MOST (over 92%) of white people MARRY OTHER WHITE PEOPLE and the group whites are LEAST LIKELY to marry are BLACK PEOPLE.
so there really aren’t that many whites who –other than sexing and romping in the sheets with us — are really all that interested in blacks. Maybe, while we still have time, black males and females need to come together to understand HOW our relationships and respect for each other were destroyed DURING 400 years of slavery and HOW our families never recovered.
I tried to explain that in two our books “The Interracial Con Game” and “Black Love is a Revolutionary Act”
(Abagond, I hope you don’t mind me posting this hear, if you do please delete the above line)
One last thing to leave here
From what I understand, Jews just prior to World War II had the highest incident of marriage with Germans – and these unions were considered “interracial” because Jews were NOT CONSIDERED WHITE by the real whites: Germans. Jews aka SEMITES was equivalent to being MULATTOES (so-called mixed race) people.
A Jewish psychologist (can’t remember his name) said afterwards that the reason the Jews did not react to the IMMINENT threat (the concentration camps and mass slaughter) was they lacked the SELF-RESPECT to realize they were NOT GERMANS
and believed the (white) Germans wouldn’t harm them because “we’re Germans, too”
and you can see the SAME MENTALITY and GROSS WHITE MIS-IDENTIFICATION of many blacks today who are in as MUCH denial as the Jews were prior to being marched into concentration camps.
I’m sure many will disagree with me, and that’s cool. I said my piece,
now, I”m moving on…
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Nope, i don’t disagree at all.
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I love BLACK MEN.(drops mike, steps down off soapbox).
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Right on Trojan pam
That website looks crazy, I noticed a lot of the movies are about the white house getting destroyed and the world collapse, its definitely not a coincidence.
Back on topic a lot of the interracial stuff isn’t love, ppl can disagree, but lets be honest now white ppl have been sleeping with blacks but that’s not the same as being in a marriage or lasting relationship. even during world war 2 black men were sleeping with white german women but they weren’t staying together they would leave the country and not talk to those women ever again and there is a documentary about the biracial german kids who were sent to orphanages called brown babies.
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Bows to Trojan Pam. (CLAPS HANDS)
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The question “How many proposals have you gotten?” is just bizarre to say the least. Honestly, how many relationships in the average person’s lifetime are serious enough to bring about a marriage proposal and how many men are just tripping over their own feet to get married? Not to mention it sends the idea that “no marriage = no desirability”, which is nonsense for a number of reasons, but lets just run with that for a second. It doesn’t even take into account there people who don’t want marriage and *gasp* some of them are female!. Also, I’m around quite a bit of military people and no shortage of black wives here, some are with brown men, Asian men, white men, most are with black men.
And I don’t think black men have it easier on the relationship scene. The well hung stereotype might net them some sex but the other stereotypes and good old fashion colorism seems to slam doors in their faces when it comes to actual relationships(even those of a professional capacity).
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@ phoebeprunelle, mary, and mstoogood4yall
I agree, sex between whites is nothing new (look at all the different colors and English, Scottish and Irish names from those of us who descended from slaves, like King, Smith, Harris, Washington, etc)
if you look at the movies that come out of Hollywood and on TV they show black males and females either
1. fighting each other (for Colored Girls Who have Considered Suicide)
2. Overcoming the odds in spite of each other (the blind side, Precious, the movie with Will Smith who played a homeless father — where’s the black mother)
3. dysfunctional parents and sub-human beings (Precious where a black mother asked her daughter for oral sex ????)
4. The black female as the White Man’s Whore aka sex plaything (MOST Halle Berry movies AFTER she won the Academy award for portraying a white man’s whore in Monster’s Ball)
5. OR in loving relationships with WHITE PEOPLE
There is a reason for this imagery, the kind that makes black people suspicious of each other, and hostile toward each other
To DRIVE US APART so we will not protect or respect each other when the TIME COMES for Black Unity
to make US sexually available to white people who have NEVER stopped “playing” with our bodies EVEN WHILE PRACTICING RACISM/ WHITE SUPREMACY on us
Most black females, if they are HONEST, usually look back on their “relationships” with white males (the MAJORITY of which do not end in marriage)
and have serious regrets and shame because they realize — after the FACT — that they were used sexually, much in the SAME way that their female ancestors were used only now they don’t have to physically force us
and many black males — after all was said and DONE, look back and realize there were MANY times where the white female they were with was practicing racism but they were either too confused or in too much denial to SEE it.
I have received dozens of emails (while writing my books) from black males who tell all kinds of stories about the racist white females they lived with, had children with, or married
and from black females as well, in fact this black female, Reneathia Tate, wrote a book called, “Pieces of a puzzle : the one thing Black females will not talk about”
where she interviewed black females and white males who had been with white males and black females and what discovered that most of the black females she talked to admitted to being ashamed of their sexual contacts with white males because they realized these white males were racist.
Without making this post any longer, we have to start asking the right questions.
Why is the white mainstream media working OVERTIME to drive us apart? Why do we see a “Cheerios’ commercial with a BM and a WW taking care of a child together,
but we almost NEVER see a commercial with a black male and black female taking care of their black children?
Why are nearly all the black children in TV commercials have a white parent (aka a so-called “biracial” child?)
why does the media seemed DETERMINED to keep us apart? and how does the white supremacy system benefit from it?
we need to stop looking at “entertainment” as harmless and start seeing it for what it is
WHITE SUPREMACY PROPAGANDA and PROGRAMMING
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TrojanPam.
That is certainly not the impression a foreigner gets from pictures of couples in this US of A where every other couple pictured or filmed is “racially unified”.
It was even shocking to my children who asked: “do people have to look like brothers and sisters to get married here ?”
Then they attended American school and understood what’s going on.
It is not that simple. It is much deeper and subtle that the “mainstream media”. Because the mainstream media wants to maintain the “racial” statu quo.
I don’t see why “blacks” could not “unify” even if they are individually in couples “out of their race” (da*n how I hate that expression, it just sounds SOOO ridiculous, but I want to be understood).
Wasn’t Cheick Anta Diop a unifier ? 0—0
Or maybe I didn’t understand what you were referring to TrojanPam. What did you mean by the “mainstream media”. What type of “media” in the sense of “material” used to promote what you say it promotes ?
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I think I got it from your next comment.
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Now I have read the end of your last comment, TrojanPam, and I must say we don’t watch the same TV channels… Where the heck have you seen those ? I have never seen any that shows the persons you describe.
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@ PEANUT
I remember that review with LaSalle, and included it on the book I did on interracial relationships within a white supremacy society
Let’s see how HONEST (black) people can be for a sec by HONESTLY answering one question:
When a white person walks into the room and/or engages you in conversation, do you find yourself (and/or other black people)
are suddenly on your/our BEST BEHAVIOR, being very pleasant, helpful, and agreeable, using words with more syllables and trying to impress them that you are a “certain kind of (quality) intelligent black person?
This question is for black males and females only (please)
If the answer to the above is a partial OR full-blown YES for either yourself OR other black people, what are the chances that we ALSO treat whites than blacks when we are in relationships with them?
And WHY do we think this is happening IF NOT FOR OUR SLAVE PROGRAMMING OVER A 400 year period that taught us to put white people on a pedestal and to look down on other black people?
If you’re not familiar with the Stockholm Syndrome, Google it
this syndrome provides some insight into why the OPPRESSED treat their OPPRESSORS better than they treat their FELLOW OPPRESSED COMRADES
it’s the same dynamic that happens in a concentration camp or a prison where the prisoners fight with each other to curry FAVOR with the guards and the warden
WHO HOLD THE POWER OF LIFE AND DEATH OVER THEM
this will explain a lot about the reasons and behaviors of black people in so-called “interracial” relationships with whites and why most of these relationships are TACKY at best
why? because they are based on LYING to ourselves and each other about why we would choose a person who represents our oppression and the oppression of our own people
past and present
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Peanut,
there is a difference between marriage and sexual “relationships” and reproduction. huge huge difference
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TrojanPam, I think what you pointed to in one of your comments (where you mention the Jews in Germany) is the hypocrisy of the Nation State, which at the same time claimed national unity but built itself on “race” (it is the case of the US and France with differences and similarities)
Which doesn’t mean, of course, that sticking to one’s “race” to build a people will function either… It *may* seem “natural” to some (who express it this way), but the only problem is that “race” is as much a construction as the Nation State is… It is not “natural”, not more than the nation concept.
As a matter of fact, both are ideologies developed by the same exact people, the “elite” (self-proclaimed) the European peoples (who never asked to be called white, but were brought in the system like everyone else for the benefit of a few who are still reaping the fruit, big time, today).
They really designed their thing very well, either way, we are trapped.
Unless we decide to drop both. And look elsewhere for ideas.
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Oh! Got Damn!!! Not my girl Bria……….
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@ Cornlia
I disagree, the same SUBMISSION dynamic is present whenever a white and a black person are in the same bed — and often in the same room.
White people may pretend that isn’t the case, but let them get into a conflict with a black person and they expect to come out ON TOP, and usually expect that black person to give in and let them have their way
Abagond did a blog on the MANIPULATIVE techniques of white females called “White Women’s Tears”
and this dynamic is very powerful in manipulating black males who do not know they are dealing with a white female who knows EXACTLY what she is doing
that’s why I believe so many white females PURSUE (and capture) black and non-white males
because they are often the ONLY males they can dominate and feel superior to,
to the extent that a toothless, obese, crazy white female can still feel like a Fay Wray in the bed with King Kong and still feel beautiful because of her whiteness and his non-whiteness
in other words, she is in the DRIVER’S seat, and has a male she can dominate and feel superior to AND feel like she is beautiful
something that is MUCH MORE difficult to do with a white male who knows he is in a DOMINANT position over white females AND who has the pick of white females in terms of looks and intelligence if he is qualified to get them
and in that case, lesser “quality” white females can use the RACISM DOMINANCE DYNAMIC to get a better quality black or non-white male even if they are NOT quality females.
the same can be true for white males choosing a black or non-white female
it is POWER and CONTROL and a lust for black flesh that drives most white females to seek black males
and has nothing to do with seeing them as “equal” to whites
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@ Cornlia
who said, “TrojanPam, I think what you pointed to in one of your comments (where you mention the Jews in Germany) is the hypocrisy of the Nation State, which at the same time claimed national unity but built itself on “race” (it is the case of the US and France with differences and similarities)”
—-
SAY WHAT?
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@ Cornlia
you don’t have to watch the same “channels” or TV programs to see there is literally NOTHING on TV but white supremacy
where whites are the “NORM” and everyone else must fit their round, non-white bodies into square white holes (so to speak)
the white standard of beauty is the same whether you are watching TV in the UK, in France, in Sweden, in Mexico, in Canada, in the U.S.
or in a HUT in the jungles of Guatemala
the IMAGERY of white is the STANDARD for the rest of the world is present.
that WHITE PEOPLE are the Harry Potters, most of the Disney and super-hero characters, and most of the people who have INVENTED or DISCOVERED everything worth inventing and discovering
even to the SICKENING extent of showing white people as the MASTERS of the African continent telling the TV audience what animals are “thinking” (?) and showing the African people who have SUCCESSFULLY EXISTED on that continent for THOUSANDS OF YEARS before the first white man stepped foot on African soil
and making those of us who do not know any better
that the IGNORANT African man knows LESS about his own continent that the white man great adventurer who is talking into the mike of the TV camera
that’s what I mean — and I’d bet my brand new laptop that you’ve seen this and KNOW exactly what I’m talking about
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TrojanPam you need to read stuff on the link between the idea of race and the formation of Nation States.
My advice would be Mahmood Mamdani.
I see you know “white” women very well.
I’m delighted to learn that as a “lesser quality white woman” I “pursued and captured” my husband because I was “toothless and crazy” and wanted to “dominate” him.
He will be happy to know he’s been blind all this time.
“Joke” aside (I know you’re very serious TrojanPam but I am too), don’t you think your generalizations are verging on the crazy side of things ?
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TrojanPam, I actually agree with a lot of things you’re saying (most)
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Obviously a hot topic here… It got more comments than your last three posts combined in a short period.
My only opinion is I have a similar opinion as Abagond on relationships the other way around . (bm/ww). I’m totally cool with it unless it is for the wrong reasons, which happens on both sides in that scenario.
In this scenario (bw/wm) I think it is pretty rare for the white man to have the wrong reasons. When he does it , it is usually on choice alone, and although he might be rebelling some racism in his own family, I think that it’s rare that he is (getting back) at someone which sometimes happens with white women. jmo.
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What is interesting is how many black people — who lives are SEVERELY impacted by racism/white supremacy on a DAILY basis (whether they recognize it or not)
seem to think in that ENVIRONMENT that they can still have “race-neutral” relationships and marriages and that they are making “free choices” despite having a lack of true freedom
and that, folks, is the MAGIC OF WHITE SUPREMACY
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@ Hung @ Kushite
I felt the same way.
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But I have to question this, TrojanPam:
what are your sources ?
just prior to WWII ?
Where the “interracial marriages” happening in the Ghettoes ? Or where people hiding in the countryside ?
Prior to WWII was THE CLIMAX of anti-semitism in Germany and the rest of Europe. It was the rise of Hitler to power !
It had already started in the late 1890s (and before) and was certainly not encouraging people to enter such marriages.
You base your subsequent analysis and comparison on this claim, and that is *a little* problematic.
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@ Peanut
“The reality is MOST Black women prefer Black men, MOST of us. The BWE black women are a minority, in fact I have NEVER met a Black woman OFFLINE who prefers white men. Have I met Black women who are “open,” to white men yes, but I have NEVER met one Black woman who ONLY dates white men or thinks they’re BETTER partners than Black men offline…NEVER.”—I agree. White men for most black women that I know are second choice.
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@Peanut
“and I also agree that marrying/sexing between white folks and black folks is NOT sign of racial progress cuz that’s always been going on so people who think that really are delusional”
yeah it has but at least it’s if its not a little more accepted, there is a wider dialogue?
@trojanpam
“I disagree, the same SUBMISSION dynamic is present whenever a white and a black person are in the same bed — and often in the same room”
most people ostensibly bed other people due to some type of attraction? or financial arrangement to be cynical, but that’s not my point…
every and I mean every single one of the black women i have dated or been in a relationship with (imagine that, it’s happened!) has been strong, outspoken and stuck to her priniciples for the most part.
I agree there may be a reflexive diminutive dynamic to some degree, i have noticed this, it manifests sometimes, i have seen, when people don’t know you (meaning me) as a white person, you get this ‘are you a cop’ thing for a while, and then people see you live there and that does go away once people get to know you, or hey, you have some cultural competence. i mean i have been in front of customers and litterally caught myself ‘dry-washing’ my hands, i think this happens to a lot of different people and also has a lot to do with set and setting, it is also sometimes, curiously enough, known as courtesy and can be extended in either direction.
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@dave sometimes i wonder, white people in the form of my parents, schoolmates, etc etc had the first crack at me…
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In the ABC drama Scandal. The actor who portrays Kerry Washington’s lover is just not appealing to me. The interracial thing doesn’t bother me. It’s just the actor is just so unappealing to me. I guess power makes a man sexy. But that guy is just not sexy to me. In the Tyler Perry soap opera The Haves And Have Not’s. Again actress Tika Sumpter is a scheming jezebel stereotype. Blackmailing the wealthy Politian. Tyler Perry just appeals to the lowest common denominator.
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@ Ok
I have to disagree with several things you have said. First of all we live in 2013 so women can and do initiate interest if they are interested. The idea that interest rests solely on the male is a bit ridiculous. I dated and was engaged to a white man through an initiation that began with me. The truth of the matter is if one party does not step up then one will never know where it can lead to. Most women do want the man to initiate but it does not always need to happen that way.
“Black women are often left alone doing everything (child rearing, work, etc.) by themselves.”—According to who? You and your area? Where I live most black men are in there kids lives (black girlfriends or wives). A few years ago I may have actually agreed with you on this but in recent I have to disagree.
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I have been asked out twice by white men. I have one particular funny incident where when I was on public transportation. This one white guy would put a Jet or Ebony magazine with a Hershey’s candy bar wrapped in gift wrapping paper and these cards. Whatever holiday it was he had a card with the magazines and Hershey bars. He was so creepy looking and I didn’t know how to say I was not interested. He looked like Woody Allen. Another guy asked me out and he was very eclectic and funny but he smelled funny. I just couldn’t get into it. If the guy is not educated about black culture and I have to school him about everything that could be a problem. I just prefer a black man. We have much in common and we just groove well together. That’s just for me.
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@OK; I am so offended at your description of Black Women. You are so wrong. All you did was describe us as negative stereotypes. You are very misinformed about Black women. You are just wrong on so many levels. Shame on you.
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@ OK
Let me break this down from my experience. I have dated quite a few many (mainly black). I was proposed to by one of the white males I was dating and the other always hinted towards it before I made it clear on my plans. Of the white guys I dated I was never really attracted to them. I dated them because I could in a world where I was told I could or should not. I did not accept marriage or any deeper relationship because I could not land it but rather because I did not want it with them. They lacked the safety and security I felt I could get with a black man. So I would not be quick to mistake not wanting with not able to get.
Being proposed to or married does not dictate the desirability of a woman. Marriage can be dissolved just the same as common law or regular relationship. One just requires more paperwork.
@ mary burrell
I think it is the power thing for him because I do find him attractive.
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@ OK; We black women are not these pathetic sad sack creatures you described in your comments. I know I’m not one. Hell a lot of black women if they are single are single by choice. A lot of us like being single. Marriage and children is not for everyone. Did you even think of that? Honestly you have a very narrow minded view of black women. Shaking My Head.
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Sharina (and all)
your comment here makes it even more difficult for me (a French person) to understand what “dating” is.
Why would you “date” someone if you are not attracted to them, if there is nothing in particular between you ?
What exactly is “a date” ? I’m addressing everyone here.
Ever since I lived in the US I can’t understand what it is.
A market ? A way to pick someone ? Are dates boyfriends and girlfriends or are those something else ?
This is totally strange (and even weird I would say, by the cultural distance) territory for me. (And I venture to guess for most French people)
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@mary burrell
That’s funny. I can recall back in my college days, having a white male that would “talk to me” I thought he was just friendly. My friends thought otherwise. He reminded me of the Terminator. I never took it serious because I knew what I wanted in a mate, and being able to use the same comb was a criteria, lol. 😀
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Well , according to the code racism/white supremacy is designed to be confusing, it is a big part of how they rule the universe. Having said that you only mention to being french, Are you white or non white because national identity can be extremely confusing. That is WHERE I would start first. Oh and the Racist White supremacy DECIDES if you be white or non white. Just a tip…..
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@ Cornlia
“Why would you “date” someone if you are not attracted to them, if there is nothing in particular between you ? “–It started out as a friendly joke. After which he asked me out and we started going out (dating or seeing each other). Things moved very fast with him and I did not know how to politely break it off. When I say attracted I think it would have been better to say not enough to want to be with him for more than friends. He was cute just not the type to get me hot in the pants.
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dating in america is both a courtship ritual and a vetting process somewhere in between a ‘one-night stand’ and ‘long term relationship’ wherein the two participants are known as ‘playing the field’ or ‘exploring their options.’ the american female tends to get a lot of free dinners, movies, and other gifts and travel expenses at the behest of the american male, while both are free to see other people and take time off to ‘have some space.’ this is not for the faint of heart or the jealous type.
dating can lead to ‘going steady’, if carried out for a long enough time, whereby the two actors are not, let’s say living together, in many cases, but have a somewhat enhanced view of expectations and a pretension towards monogomy. this can lead back into universally recognized territory, such as engagement and marriage.
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dates are not boyfriend/girlfriend, also not to be confused with ‘date’ ie liasion with a sex worker, it is a rather fungible term, indeed
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but, of course, you can still go out on a date with your girlfriend, or wife even!
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@ v8driver
“dates are not boyfriend/girlfriend”—I always took it as the person you are going out with. A boyfriend or girlfriend. Thanks for the clarification.
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And at the first sign of anger the first word utter from white individual’s mouth will be the dreaded N word. Trust and Believe. That’s another reason I would not date a white man.
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@ Cornlia. Dating, seeing that individual on a social level. Maybe marriage is considered maybe not. But you do things with said individual. Going out to dinner, movies, or just spending time with that individual you have something in common with. I hope this makes sense.
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My two cents
1) Peanut, I must say I disagree. I have never had a problem getting sex. I am reformed from my former ways and no longer seek premarital encounters, but when I was a bit more worldly, getting sex wasn’t some painful obstacle for me. Women outnumber men by 2:1. By sheer numbers, men have a very easy time getting sex from women because there are just more women out there.
Also, I don’t agree with the assumption that men are always offering sex therefore women can easily get it. I have several male friends who have turned down sex from women, even beautiful ones. Sad to say I was pretty much ho fo sho back when I wasn’t seeking God, so I never turned down sex. But I know of men who have.
2) I don’t have a problem with interracial dating. I do have a problem with people who do it because they dislike their own people. That to me is foolish. I do prefer my beautiful Black queens, but of the six women I have dated, only two were not Black (one was White, one was half White/Mexican). Honestly, interracial dating for me has been a tremendous headache. Both times, the fathers were racist. Soft racism to my face, overt racism to their daughters when I was not present (but they’d always relay it to me).
One area where I do agree with Peanut is that I hate the fact that the media always makes it seem like the best option for Blacks is to date non-Blacks. They poison our community with those kinds of lies. Black women are made to feel that a White man will be more loyal. Black men are made to feel that White women will be more of a partner and cooperative. Meanwhile, fools eat that up and wonder why they are alone while over 95% of White people choose to be with another White person.
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@lifelearner; Yeah, I agree about the comb thing. LoL.
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Thanks for the “date” explanations everyone. Particularly V8, I think you pretty much covered the aspects I was not sure/confused about.
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@OK. Actually yes, since you asked: I have received numerous serious marriage proposals. I thought I qualified what kind of attention I was getting from the rainbow coalition – including white men – who throughout my entire life have been very interested in me and women who look like me.
Needless to say, but apparently I have to say it anyway: I can actually tell the difference between a man after one thing, and a man who’s interested in me as a person. I’m not interested in revealing my age at this time, but lets just say I have somewhere in the ballpark of a quarter of a century of relationship experience under my belt. Years of being choosy about who I share my life with, not running around dating whoever winks at me.
However, I have never been interested in marriage despite seeing a wonderful example of my parent’s marriage – they are still hitched to this very day – I have my own reasons for that, and if mentioned, would take this thread off topic anyway. Feel free to contact me on my blog and ask away if you wish.
I can’t speak for all Black women, but my life experience which continues to this day, and the experiences of my close friends, also Black women, have been contrary to what has been bandied about in society, the media etc. You may accept that information, or you may ignore it.
Loving, healthy and respectful relationships be they BW/WM or otherwise are beautiful. A life full of love, support, respect and equality from those who you choose to share your life with is always a wonderful thing. If you’ve experienced those things as I have, then you know of what I speak.
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C.Andrews. Yeah I know who decides. But I also decide what I am (some here will say that’s my “privilege”, which it is, but I’d rather it wasn’t).
When I entered the US 20 something years ago, I learnt I was supposed to call myself white, and to my utter amazement, even “Caucasian”. Which made me laugh a lot first. And then prompted me to learn why the heck I should call myself things that I knew where not me.
But anyway, why did you want to know ? (It always sounds like *the* ritual over here… Always makes me smile a little, though I know how serious it is.)
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I don’t know about others but when I say “white men don’t find black women attractive” I mean it in the same way Abagond mentions, they dont’ because they are racist and that black women almost don’t exist to them inregards to that.
As Abagond himself as said; a beautiful black woman can walk by a white man and he might not react to her at all.
The lack of attraction isn’t that black women are ugly its taught white men are socially programmed not to view them as potential dates. To the extent that they don’t even have to think about it, it just is.
That being said; I would agree with what others have said about the reason black women aren’t in more interracial relationships is because they don’t choose to be in them.
After all; even when factoring in racism cutting down the numbers; white people in tthe US are still a notably larger group.
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@Peanut
Well; being drunk would help to break down social programming.
There will be white men who are attracted to black women and express it, maybe they grew up around them, maybe they just like them but whatever the reason they are going to exist.
That being said; as I get older I have to question if they truly lack attraction or just don’t show it due to social programming.
Mainly because my information here is based on personal experience from spending much of my youth on up in the south. But not long ago it came out that the southern states highest “search term” were for black women.
The only reason I still give some thought to the non-attracted racism/sociological reinforcement aspect is because it mirrors my own experiences for much of my life.
I should point out that whatever the truth is; there are still notably more people attracted to black women than are open about it.
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What wrong way Peanut ? They sound fine in the conversation and with the topic to me…
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@ peanut.
A drunk white man groped u oh hell no. I woulda kicked his arse, lol
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“you don’t notice because you’re not a Black woman lol…you’re not around when it happens BLack women are”
True and a lot of them do and say racist stuff to black women when black men aren’t around. They do hit on black women when no black men are around.
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I noticed in every article that abagond, posts. The comments always seem to come down to black men and woman, DEFENDING THEMSELVES!
who are these white people, we feel a need to justify and explain ourselves for their, approval if you will. Some may say, its not approval, I’m just saying is all..
When you really get down to the niddy gritty, it really is approval, being everyone seems to want to convince and prove to white people, who aren’t this and that and we are this and that.
I’ve said this many times in my posts in my short time on abagond’s blog and I’ll say it again on this one.
We need to stop, trying to seek acceptance, approval and validation from white people.
We need to concentrate on trying to educate young black children and teenagers, not spending the majority of our time and energy, trying to convince white people of their racism, which they know of but just refuse to admit to us.
I know, i get it….abagond wants to talk about black people in the context of white supremacy.
We can do that and we can also talk about each other in the context of the black community, take a little time off from talking about our oppressors and talk about positive and even some negative things about us, among ourselves.
TALK TO ME, YOUR BROTHER!! I’M RIGHT HERE!!!! <——
I NEED MY SISTAS AND BROTHAS, THEY DON'T WANT OR NEED YOU, I NEED YOU!
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@ Peanut. I’ve had white men hit on me numerous times. I had a white man making eyes at me afew weeks ago. We were at lunch and he was at a table with his friends. I smiled at the attention and that was it. I’m married and the attention is nice, so I responded a little. Anyway I’ve dated two white guys in the past. One was serious, lasted a few years and the other was just a couple of dates. He wanted sex only I could tell, especially after he told me he had a “big dick” and wanted me so bad. Ugh turn off. So the “big dick” was supposed to make me swoon ? I avoided him at work for a year after that.
I see non-black men checking me out. They do find us attractive, not all but there are a lot of them that are interested. Some are wary of us turning them down, some worry what their family and friends would think. But I have seen a lot more BW/WM together everywhere.
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Hey Peanut, lemme see what you talkin’ about, willis…
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@ Peanut, that guy in the YouTube video you posted, was a very poor example.
I mean, the brotha was barely coherent. He was ranting if anything, post someone with a more, intellectual take on the subject.
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@ sondis, I agree with everything you said. I like you am sick of trying to validate myself to white people and get their approval. We don’t need valiation from them. We shouldn’t care what they think at all. We just need to have discourse about our isssues as they pertain to us.
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mary burrell:
And at the first sign of anger the first word utter from white individual’s mouth will be the dreaded N word. Trust and Believe. That’s another reason I would not date a white man.
Is that your experience? My wife has told me horror stories of people she grew up with who witnessed their white women saying this about the black men.
In my experience, a minority of white men with black women (the ones who have a ‘different’ agenda like to gain a good street ‘rep’) will try to take the most commonly associated but negative traits of black men and ‘act up’, almost as if they have the right to do that because they are with a black woman. It is pitiful to witness.
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@Omnipresent; I have had white people use that pejorative term . I know they (whites) are conditioned to use that word. It is ingrained in their psyches.
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@ Omnipresent; My male cousin is married to a white woman and she uses racial slurs. She bought him a tee shirt with a raccoon eating a slice of watermelon. I was so taken aback seeing this. That is one reason I wouldn’t date out. I just feel whites have a perceived why of thinking about black people.
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*perceived way of thinking * Typos in above comments.
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@peanut
“When Black people go to parties, we have alcohol and stuff, but that’s not the main focus of the event, we’re more into dancing and “club dancing,” and everything, it seems like at the white parties the main focus was getting drunk. I never understood that, perhaps it’s a cultural difference”
yeah … that’s accurate
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@mary burrell
“And at the first sign of anger the first word utter from white individual’s mouth will be the dreaded N word. Trust and Believe. That’s another reason I would not date a white man.”
not neccessarily!
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Lets face it, if anyone wants to date interracialy, you are going against the grain.it is not an open freindly world. I mean the whole world. You think I trust Europe , with soccar fans yelling racist epiphits and throwing bannanas on the feild? I heard a German guy say some racist things to a white woman married to a black guy….In Brazil, lots of people assume Im with a prostitute when Im with my wife….
Look at some of the attitudes on here….they are a joke, loaded with obscesion on the subject, ridiculous on some of the assumtions……I am in stitches at some of the hang ups I see rolling….I mean seriously oppisite of my whole life experiance
All , and I mean all the black women I have dated were strong independent women , who didnt hate black men, who didnt have issues in black society, and would be happy to get in the face of the people making some of the statements here with their psycho sexual political agenda babble , and, straighten them out about their personal motives for dating me. How I respect those black women, for just acting on their attraction. We werent dating to prove a point to the world, it was pure attraction , and not letting society from all sides dictate to us how we ar supposed to act. But, make no mistake, dating interracialy , is against the grain, expect flak to come out from underneath slimy rocks from all sides….a lot of people are just plain uptight and hung up about it
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BR:
You think I trust Europe , with soccar fans yelling racist epiphits and throwing bannanas on the feild? I heard a German guy say some racist things to a white woman married to a black guy….In Brazil, lots of people assume Im with a prostitute when Im with my wife….
I dont know what you mean about trusting Europe. I dont think anything has been said about it not being racist – that would be totally untrue. My OH has half her family in the U.S and they compare/contrast experiences and it seems that while some things are the same, some things are different too. It becomes irrelevant in the grand scheme of things though, racism is poisonous however it is demonstrated.
Yes, the football side of things is bad and always has been. The current footballers are raising issues continually so the league have no choice but to address this issue. Football has a lot of talent – many of it black, so they have no choice but to deal with it.
Of course, Germany has a long history of racism/separatism in one form or another so unfortunately it is not a surprise to hear this however, my OH has said many of her friends (black women) have gone to Germany and have been pleasantly surprised at how welcome they have been made to feel and also, how they have been pursued as objects of desire from German men.
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omnipresent, I made that statement to point out that these attitudes against interracial dating are not only the USA
Also, only because you are refferencing your relationship, Im not clear if you are an interracial couple? I dont mean that to pry, but, it seems you are mentioning your mate, and Im not sure who is who in the referance…I can understand if you dont want to clarify that, but if you could, I would get your referance
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BR:
omnipresent, I made that statement to point out that these attitudes against interracial dating are not only the USA
Maybe I am being a bit thick but I am not sure what the point of that is, particularly as I in my own way which may or may not be clear, acknowledge that there is still racism and certain stigmas. The only difference I have pointed out here is that Interracial relationships seem to be more common in Europe and that the attitudes that exist about how black females are received in the U.S are not so overt. That is obviously NOT to say that there are not people who think like this and it doesnt necessarily follow that there is more or less racism. It just doesnt seem as prevalant as in the U.K.
I dont know what you mean by who is in the reference when I refer to my OH – regardless, when I give the examples, I do state the race of the people that she refers to for example many of her friends (black women) have gone to Germany and have been pleasantly surprised at how welcome they have been made to feel and also, how they have been pursued as objects of desire from German men.
I am in NO way trying to say that her examples give a FULL and comprehensive picture, that would not be right. Oftentimes with statistics, you only get a partial story but sometimes with personal experiences can come enlightenment in that you can get to the nitty gritty of the human psyche (though sometimes not 🙂 )
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BR:
Also, when you said this
In Brazil, lots of people assume Im with a prostitute when Im with my wife….
I assume it was to demonstrate ugly stereotypical views about black women?
Sorry but I look at this from another angle. You already said that you were in your 60’s on the ‘porn’ thread. I gather your wife is black and I know black women often keep their youthful looks way past women of other races. It might be fair to presume in some of the cases that perhaps people were wondering what your wife was doing with someone who ‘appeared’ to be older than she was and then they incorrectly assume their must be some financial benefit on her part. Of course it is not at all nice that your wife felt insulted but perhaps it is less about her and more about you and who you are/how you look that contributed towards this – just a thought.
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@peanut, I think this be a more approriate video to view and as a black women I know this video sadly is pretty accurate, just one of the sic side effect of racism/white supremacist. Check it out !!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q-zQpbrsxJg
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BR:
By the way, in response to this Also, only because you are refferencing your relationship, Im not clear if you are an interracial couple?
It is good that you ask as hopefully it means that my comments are coming across objectively. I will say that my interest and desire to address some of the negative comments about black women do come from personal knowledge of the extreme opposite.
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Omnipresent, in Brazil, it is a stereotype that black Brazilian women with white foreigners are prostitutes…my wife is a dancer and does look a lot younger than me..but,that doesnt account for the prejucice notion that floats around. Where I am thick skinned and really would just as soon as walk towards people who give us the stink stares and anyone with narrow minded veiws on interracial relationships and say “fuk you” , she is very sensitive and for 28 years is not comfortable just going out anywhere and being subjected to low leval abuse…she knows the kind of attitudes that float in her country
Ok, so you dont want to divulge what you mean, I dont even know what “OH” means…the only reason it matters to me is it seems relevant to what your “OH” is talking about…but really…it doesnt mean anything to me if you dont want to share it….
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@ V-4
“I should point out that whatever the truth is; there are still notably more people attracted to black women than are open about it.”—I agree.
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BR:
OH means Other Half.
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@ C. Andrews, eh it’s hard for me to guage what to think about that video, since it has sotomayer’s ‘watermark’ all over it, i would surmise that he produced or was some way involved with the production of the video, ie so it has the cast of ‘agit-prop’ to some degree to me? You can see the girls identifying the camera in a few segments, so obviously there is some awareness of the unreality of the whole thing?
secondly, all the guy’s doing is getting numbers, with some extremely corny pickup lines. i’m not addressing the propriety in a racial sense of those things he said, he would probably run the risk of getting his butt kicked badly in most urban settings, especially cruising around the same area like that.
And, as previously discussed, it is more of a ‘black guy ice-breaking style’ rather than that of most white guys, to just walk up to a girl and ask for her number, like before even asking for a name? Certainly not my style, but life does seem to pass quickly past the age of 40… maybe some cultural appropriation is not bad, but I would certainly not lick a girl and stuff, i’m surprised he didn’t get his arm broken! or going immediately hot and heavy into ‘ooh you’re so black and like chocolate’ and all that, that was kinda creepy, no question.
seems to me he is in some type of resort or ‘spring break’ town and i think this hardly can reflect life ‘on the regular’
“hey what’s your name, do you live around here, can i get your number, maybe we can get something to eat?”
works pretty well so far…
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oops switched from wp to fb wrong button
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That white guy is some gay russian guy who goes around doing pranks and trying to show how easy it is to get guys to go out with you, girls to kiss you or for women to prostitute themselves.
It also kind of seems to fall under the pick up artist angle of “brazen is best” that they often tout.
Essentially that being a creep is more effective for getting dates than being sensitive.
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@ C.Andrews:
what does this video, supposedly prove?
Peanut posted a YouTube video about a black man, ranting about black women, sleeping with and having babies by white men, then becoming pro-black, only after getting treated like trash by white men.
His whole premise was, don’t come crawling back to us, ( black men ) when you find out, what we knew all along, the white man, doesn’t want you, ( meaning want to marry or have your children in masses ).
Yeah, of course white men want to have sex with a black woman but what does that prove?
Black women were raped by their slave masters and by white men, during Jim crow, does that mean they loved black women and want to marry them?, of course not.
When black men, say white men don’t want black women, this is what we mean, not because black women aren’t beautiful or not desirable, its because white men look at our beautiful black women like a slave whore from back in slavery.
I think most of the anger and hostility, comes from this, when black men get angry, when seeing a black woman with a white man.
Just because a very small percentage of white men, will marry and have children with a black woman, doesn’t mean white men, love black women.
These interracial websites, do give black women, false hopes in thinking, white men want them in a real way , not just a fantasy or experiment. I believe that the majority of white men that seek black women on interracial sites and in society, look at black women in this way.
The very small percent of white men that marry black women, is an exception and not the rule. The powers that be, want black people to think, we are getting more equal, simply because we are having sex with them.
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@Thomas Conlon, yes, I too am no fan of sotomayer but when I watched the video it really struck a chord within my life. I am a black female, my daughters and most of my freinds are black females. I consider myself to be an observant somewhat intelligent person and I know whether it be admitted or not we as a people have been raised to think white man’s ice is colder adn white man’s sugar is sweeter than anybody elses. So a lot of black women that re still confused is super duper thrilled to have one iota of attention from a white man. Those same corny pick up lines that this white dude used the average black dude would be quickly kicked to the curb unless he is extremely handsond and or rich. Bottom line is after living under this system of racism/white supremacy for over 500 years we are seriously confused and this video is but a mirror of that confusion, just sayin……..
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@Sondis, this video supposedly proves a lot of things, mainly the effects of racism/white supremacy in the area of SEX. It also illustrates a mental condition called the Stockholm Syndrome aka the Battered person Syndrome whereby an victim becomes the stauchest defender of their abusers, I think you get the drift, you sure cant go wrong when you start followin the logic instead of drinkin the koolaid !!!
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@C.Andrews
ok
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C.Andrews:
I agree that black people in America, suffer from Stockholm Syndrome.
Black people worship white people in this country, its a philological condition like any other.
Self education of oneself is the only, remedy for this condition.
When you come to this realization as a black person in America, you are set free, so to speak of this mental condition.
I, as a black man can admit, that we are sick as a people, living in a hostile environment with white people that hate us for 100’s of years, has taken its toll on our psyche.
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Correction:
” its a psychological condition”
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You left out one other ingredient that may remedy us victim’e condition- that is the study of racism/white supremacy , I mean to truly study every apect of this issue and HOW it affect us in all areas human activities then developing a code as outlined and suggested by Mr.NellyFuller. Once your eyes are open to the truth of our existence only then can we consructively move forward and start dismantling this unjust system. We can no longer krink their koolaid and fall for okey doke like their new agenda of promoting interacial dating(see cheerios new commercial) and same sex relations, anything that will weaken and lower our number…. They even got Abagond confused on the issue of interacial relationship so you can see the depth of their(racist aka white supremacist) effects on us victims, even the most intellectual of us…….
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@Peanut, Lawdy have mercy on me ,Your statement makes me wanna holler an throw my hands up in the air to the white blue eyed jesus and I dont even go to church anymore lol !!! I sure do wish I could have my rose colored glasses back on so I can be in ignorant bliss like the vast majority of us victims. If that’s ALL you get from this video then it must be BECAUSE you fail to understand racism/white supremacy and HOW it affects us all nine area of human activites which includes Entertainment, Education, Economics,Law Labor, Politics, Religion, SEx and War If I missed an area please let me know…..
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I’an Afro Carribean woman who grew up in Canada and Europe. I came from a upper middle class neighborhood in Canada. My siblings and I did well, in school, got good jobs and were model teenagers. No drinking, no swearing, never touched drugs, family orientated, but I can safely say, we always got approached many times by dysfunctional White people for dating.They also didn’t want to work and expected us to support them. My experience wasn’t unique. I met many Black women in Canada who were married to white men who were happy to not work, some smoked drugs because they felt it was OK in our culture, they didn’t lift a finger in the house either while telling their Black wives how lucky they were to have a white man.
As a result, my brother and sisters and didn’t date. When we got the chance, we moved to a more culturally mixed area where we got to meet more ethnic people that had no secret agenda.
In Europe, I found that Black women dated Black, White and other races as people were more integrated without being use as cash cows or sex objects by any race. Many black men here also date White women very freely. You will see TV or ads with Bm/Ww without anyone batting an eyelid.
The Black men here also come from countries where Black is the majority, like the Caribbean and Africa, so darker skinned Black women can get a date here or marry any race. Many Black men and White men here are used to natural hair, beautiful African features that is despised in America. There have been White royalty that have married Black women. I believe in Austria and Liechenstein, Princess Angela and Countess Von hasburg.
So, I didn’t care for North American White men but here in Europe, it’s OK as they don’t have an agenda
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C.Andrews, you got to be kidding, that is South Beach, Ocean Dr. ,some of the finest black women in America can be found in South Beach, and,women come from all over America and let their freak out in South Beach, they dress in bikinis they would never wear at home, all kinds of women will come up and talk to men, South Beach is differant from any place else in America…South Beach is fantastic !!
You know,its really strange to me , the people who want to tell black men and women to not date white people..they bring in cliched thinking, talk aboiut 400 years of slavery, and you know, I absolutly think the legacy of slavery is extremly relevant in all the countries that brought slaves over from Africa , but, when it comes to dating or building relationships, it shouldnt be a factor, what should be a factor is if the white person indicates some kind of racist attitude…something everyone here is very in tune to
But, what perplexes me is, the people that say no black people should date white people, are just eliminating a lot of incredible black people from their agenda….there are a lot of top leval black people who, if they arnt in a relationship with a white person, are keeping their options open and willing to date someone of any race if that person can show some good qualities and that they could care for the person dating them…they are isolating themselves off from people who could bring incredible recources to the table of the struggle…there is no black monolith of how to think on this…if not dating white people is what it takes for some people to get through a racist society, then more power to them, but,
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(strange computor problems that dont let me finnins a post)
but, they are seperating great people from their cause, a whole lot of great black people arnt going along with an agenda that sais they shouldnt date white people
so feel fee to fight your struggle from where you are, ill be happy to fight the struggle from where I am, and, Im in great , really great company
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This called SHOWCASING, allowing a so called elite small number of black people to succed in certain endeavors so that racism can no longer be used as in excuse for the shortcomings of the masses. most Europeans do not marry their black concubines, die to wanting to keep the lineage “pure”. Prince Albert of Manoco cones to mind and I am sure there are many others. If we study their tactics we will no longer be deceived by their “SHOWCASING” we will be able to see right thru it. I hope I live long enough to see this day come. Please remember that racism is GLOBAL…..
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C.Andrews, you dont know enough interracial relationships to make the kinds of catagorising statements you do…its bogus…oh you got all these pshycho babble terms and examples, but, the real truth is, a lot of interracial relationships are going on between two people who care about each other, and, these isolated stereotypes that people keep refferring to are not the norm
Do you have any divorce statistics of interracial couples? If things were even a fraction as bad as people are making them, interracial mairadges would have skyrocket numbers of divorces…
its just cutting off a huge amount of black people from all walks of life , all backgrounds , who are keeping their options open and just wouldnt even think about entertatining the thought of simply not dating a race of people…they wouldnt buy into that agenda…they know racism, they hate it as much as anyone here, they fight it as hard as anyone here, but they wont buy into an agenda that sais they shouldnt date white people…
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B. R, You be right about some of the issues you have raised but one issue is irrefutable all the mixing in the world has NOT put a dent in racism, not even a small microscopic pinhole. It has not helped the non white people at all on the whole…I could be wrong but I do not EVER remeber this huge media blitz promoting interacial relationship and from what I know of past situations COLLECTIVELY it does not mean us black victims a hill of beans. I got some more psychobabble bs for yer, write this down and google it- POPULATION TAILORING’ It aint nothing new , the Mistah Charlies been doing this for centuries, usually they rape the women of the non white countries they defeat and after a few generations they dont be as black anymore then depending on how they feel those people can now be classified as whit . They did this with the Irish, Italians and the JEWS to name a few but I guess that just be some psychbabble bs to you…….
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SONDIS
“TALK TO ME, YOUR BROTHER!! I’M RIGHT HERE!!!! <——
I NEED MY SISTAS AND BROTHAS, THEY DON'T WANT OR NEED YOU, I NEED YOU!"
********
!!!!!!!!!!
Ding, ding, ding, ding, DING!
Slip, duck, weave, bob — jab, jab, left cross, right hook! POW!!!
The Ref raises Sondis' right arm in victory as he KNOCKS OUT his pale opponent with a devastating blow to the side of his head at the bell in the fight's final round. The contender didn't see what hit him!
_______
I hear you LOUD & CLEAR brother Sondis! Loud and clear. Some of us need each other!
All of us need — something. Organization? I think so!
We're NOT organized, and we should be. Else we're spinning our wheels going NOWHERE.
But keep fighting the good fight, on as many fronts as possible, no matter what may or may not ….. And THANKS for saying the truth. You NEED us (and the inverse) we NEED you!
That's the code.
We'd be well if we stick to it!
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@Peanut
I absolutely agree with you that the majority of Black women desire to be with Black men. Most people tend to date and marry someone from their same background so why would Black women be any different? If a Black woman states her preference for Black men, she is lying or narrowminded. At least that’s what people have told me. Just last night I was speaking with an older (sixtysomething) sister in Christ about how I prefer Black men from culture and that I don’t really find white men attractive. She told me that I had some racism/prejudice in my heart and that I needed to pray about it. I was completely taken aback. I never said anything about hating white men or wanting to take away their civil liberties, but she concluded that I was being “racist” towards them because I prefer Black men (which is what I am) and don’t want to date or marry a white man. SMDH.
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This woman in Christ must have some confusion in her heart, first of all NO non white person of any gender can possibly be RACIST. Maybe prejudiced. We cannot be recist because we do not have any POWER whatsoever to have any kind of IMPACT on white lives. We blacks are in charge of NOTHING. We dont have the power to deny whites housing, how to spend they money , how to worship etc.,prjudce is a much better choice of words. We all have some prejudices, for exaple I prefer chocolat cake or vanilla cke bit I luv me some vanilla ice cream over all other flavors. Each one teach one . If you had known you could have gently corrected her. Believe me Mistah Charlie and Miss Becky KNOWS who the racist are – we be the ones confused….
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Matari:
Thanks for the acknowledgement.
I just don’t understand, why the white people on this blog, that actually sympathize and agree that white supremacy is rampant in America, are always challenging and questioning us, therefore we as black people are always on the defensive.
Why don’t these same white people, take it to the white racist blogs, instead of on this blog?
Its white people they need to convince of their racist mindset, not black people as we already know.
Its the same old white supremacy at work, even the white people that agree with everything we say on this blog, even they are guilty of participating in white supremacy, being they feel we need them to validate our revelation of racism.
The fact that they are here and not on white racist blogs, saying the things they say on here, is a tell tale sign, that their agenda isn’t to bring what we are saying to light to other racist white people.
Their agenda is a white-self serving at best, so they can feel good about themselves for being on a left wing, liberal blog site, sharing common cause with Negros and Negresses but benefiting from the same system, that oppresses and discriminates against us.
I’m not going to bother to name those, who i am speaking of, they know who they are…..
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I’ve been checking out some of the posts and I’m left with a troubling thought
Let me start by saying I understand the NEED on the part of many black females to be validated as DESIRABLE women
given our 500 YEARS of systematic degradation in this system. All our lives we were (and still are) ridiculed for our hair, skin and bodies (even while white females risk their LIVES to have our skin, breasts, butts, and lips via surgery and suntanning)
we’ve been told ALL OUR LIVES that we weren’t attractive, or desirable or marriage-worthy and unfortunately, some of our HARSHEST CRITICS have been the same (black) males we gave birth to, raised, loved, supported and educated
all due the black males BRAIN-TRASHING under the system of white supremacy AND the FACT that the same imagery created by white male/female slave-owners to JUSTIFY the raping and oppression of black females has POISONED black male and female relationships to this day
and so many black males STILL carry that image of the black female as “Jezebel” (a white man’s whore) after watching black female slaves being raped for over 400 years by a white male who called them “bitches” — NOW a common term for black females BY black people (!)
(it is a lot deeper than that but it would be too long a post)
I understand that after spending our young formative years as young black girls, then young ladies and now grown women, that the damage that has been done to our self-esteem has NEVER had a chance to heal.
And that is compounded by the almost FANATICAL OBSESSION of many black males to have what the white man has — a white woman,
or at the least anything (or anyone ) who doesn’t look “too black” (due to their OWN self-hatred issues)
So the black female is told to just SUCK IT UP when she says she is hurt because of all the degradation and ridicule heaped upon her
and so most of us suffer in silence OR take it out on OTHER black females — “She think she something!”
I say all that to say — I UNDERSTAND why this dialogue is taking place AND why so many black females on this thread are trying to prove that “white men find me desirable” —
because the white male is the BEARER AND CREATOR of the STANDARDS for female beauty in a white male dominated, white supremacy system
That being said,
what is most disturbing to me is that in the midst of dozens of black schools closing,
pending legislation to “round up” 18,000 black male “gang-bangers” in Chicago and lock them up without charging them with a crime,
and poor blacks in rural america are literally BEGGING to pick crops (out of economic desperation,
all BYPRODUCTS of racism/white supremacy
AND
movies like “The Purge” that CLEARLY show a clear intention on the part of powerful white people to devastate large numbers of black people in America by creating films that bear a remarkable resemblance to
a MODERN DAY “BIRTH OF A NATION”
(check out the site http://www.newfoundersamerica.org/ — and you’ll see that this “movie” is more than just “entertainment” )
and movies like “The Help” and “The Butler” showing a RETURN to the good ole days when blacks “knew our place”
and in the midst of all this that we are bragging about dating white males OR any white people at all (who are more than likely racist)
shows a distressing LACK of understanding of the gravity of our problems in this nation and an unwillingness to take them (or anything else) seriously.
Like Dr. Kambon often says:
“Black people are very serious about not being serious”
If I have offended anyone, let me apologize in advance.
And before there is any misunderstanding, I’m not saying the post should NOT have been created
I’m talking about the “comfort” AKA the “soothing lotion” of white validation that is apparent by thinking (and trying to convince others AND ourselves)
that white males find black females attractive
with that, I’ll get out of the way and let the fun continue
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ha ha nobody nor nothing is gonna stop me dating black girls
“more bounce to the ounce”
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yeah south beach a real fun place lol
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Peanut
Catching up with today’s comments and saw this.
Peanut, make it “International students” and you get the picture for us too. I was amazed at how “white” Americans were basically allowed to do whatever they wanted on campus, spent their time drinking (keg after keg), pissing all over the place, telling you they (fraternities and sororities) were the “elite” of the nation and had NO conversation (don’t know nothing about the world and things, anything) and DIDN’T know how to have fun (like dance and chat).
After a while, basically all the International students ended up in international parties: it was difficult for all of us, no exception for African students, to interact and be invited to African-American parties too, but not for the reasons above. I don’t know what the reasons were. To me the campus looked pretty much segregated when I arrived (1988 in South Carolina) (it shocked me a lot)
That is what I have been trying to explain all this time when I say that you can’t look at “race” as a “natural” determinant. It is definitely a social one.
it must be really difficult sometimes for “mixed” couples to cope with all the antagonism…
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^^or a cultural determinant, as you pointed to Peanut.
other people labelled as “white” do not have the same culture as “white” Americans. There American-born children do.
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@ all the black females reading this post
check out the post two posts before mine and read v8driver’s post
“more bounce to the ounce”
that’s how much they respect black females (and PLEASE, for your own sake, don’t LIE to yourself and tell yourself that this is a compliment!)
All someone (like me) has to do is just prick and irritate the SURFACE of all this “white male admiration”
and you will find a degrading SEXUAL STEREOTYPE lurking underneath
that is remarkably similar to the types of things white males said about black females when it was considered A RITE OF PASSAGE starting with slavery
for a white male to have sex with (rape) a black female to “become a man”
this is what I mean by NOT understanding racism and how it functions
and NOT understanding that sex between blacks and whites is a MAINSTAY of white supremacy and always HAS BEEN
a white person having sex with a black person DOES NOT MEAN that white person is NOT a racist
in fact, the most RACIST white people often SEEK sex with black people
Now, READ that disrespectful comment “more bounce to the ounce’ again
and then write the sentence below
on the blackboard at least one hundred times:
sex and racism go HAND in HAND
sex and racism go HAND IN HAND
sex and racism go HAND IN HAND
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@ sondis
“Why don’t these same white people, take it to the white racist blogs, instead of on this blog?”—Not sure if this answers your question but I believe it is because they believe racism exist because of us. That we are the racist ones. I just have to treat them like I treat other delusional people. LOL
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@ Peanut
Same here!
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A@ Trojan Pam, You done said a mouthful !!!! i can not wrap my brain around any non white person that know and understan even the funamentals of slavery and oppression especially in the area of sex would advocate “There is nothing wrong with such relationships, but black women can go into them for the wrong reasons, like internalized racism. The Black Women’s Empowerment movement (BWE), for example, presents white men as saving black women from black men. That is internalized racism straight-up, all the way.” what the heck does this statement mean Abagond ?? i am clearly confused by your statement and nobody even asking you for clarification…..
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I agree 100% TrojanPam’s comment, and I would suggest that commenters check out the book “Pieces of A Puzzle” by Reneathia Tate. She interviews Black women and White men who have had sexual relations, and the different experiences of both groups were so telling.
Whereas White men enjoyed going on sexual escapades with Black women,who they had ZERO intention of marrying or having children with, many Black women admitted to feeling used and being mistreated by White males they had sex with. In fact, Ms. Tate wanted to write about Black male and Black female sexual relationships but had to change her topic because so many White men commented to her ad in the newspaper.
I also find it interesting that a lot of social scientists are so interested in hearing White people’s views on interracial marriage, but never their views on interracial sex. Some of the same people who wouldn’t dare marry Blacks will have sex with them (Thomas Jefferson, Strom Thurmond, etc.)
Sex should be a form of bonding, communication, and intimacy between two people who are equal, never about manipulation and harm.
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So why all this fuss about black women being brain washed and self-hating and not loyal to the race when black men date out twice as much as they do?
Wouldn’t that mean black men are at least twice as self-hating, brainwashed and betraying the race as black women?
It seems strange that there is all this talk about getting black women to love themselves and stay loyal to the race but it hardly seems to come up inregards to black men dating out…..
Actually; while yes racist people have sex with the people they are racist against, the hardcore racists don’t look at black people as sexual entities.
I remember hearing about a slaver that was bemoaning the fact that he was still a virgin into his thirties, but if he had wanted to he could have forced himself on any of the slaves. He was just so racist it didn’t occur to him to think of them as people on any level, they were property to him and that was it.
And of course; a lot of guys are sexist anyways, especially racist guys, so to them you being black is just another way of you being inferior to them, like you being a woman.
As for why they don’t go to white power type blogs, probably because those guys in a lot of ways are just racist trolls, engaging them is exactly what they want.
They thrive on the conflict. That and tend to be dumb asses who have an extremely hard time seeing anything from someone elses view, your serious racist tend to be incredibly biased that way…..though ironically enough in my experience seriously racist people are also more likely to agree that racism exists in the world, so yeah…..
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@ C. Andrews and Ms. J
Also note that v8driver said , “…black GIRLS…”
NOT black women or even females
that may seem like a harmless word choice but keep in mind that white people often refer to black people –regardless of AGE — as black
boys and girls
and I remember a black woman who used to clean white people’s houses as a domestic back in the late 50s or 60s who talked about white males calling her a “girl” even though she was well past her 30s
WORDS ARE IMPORTANT
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@ C. Andrews
I think people from different races CAN have a healthy love relationship. It is possible. BUT, like anything else, you can do it for the wrong reasons. In this case the big danger is internalized racism – that you think too little of blacks and too much of whites. A black woman who is whitewashed or who puts down black men should NOT go with white men. She has issues that such a relationship would only make worse. Also, there is a good chance that she is not in love but is seeking (white) validation, at least, if not status, material wealth and so on. My opinion. Everyone has to do what they think is best for them.
I do like what Sondis said. Black people need each other. They are in America ALONE. White people, 95% of them at least, are NOT their friends. And, like Trojan Pam said, the fact that a white man dates black women hardly means he is not racist. It is NOWHERE near that simple.
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@ V-4
You are absolutely right about Black men. Many see no problem in stating their preferences for White – and other non-Black women – instead of Black women. But this is the cause of our oppression for over hundreds of years. I don’t think Black men and women would see Whites as the beauty standard if they hadn’t beat this into our heads generation after generation.
For example, many Indian nations – like the Tolowa nation – had almost no instances of rape among their people until they came into contact with the Europeans (Derrick Jensen, The Culture of Make Believe). It’s clear that many of the thoughts, speaks, and actions that non-White people have are not natural and need to be changed for the betterment of the planet. Black love is a revolutionary act in times like these, so Black division is a win-win situation for White men and women.
Strom Thurmond was one of the most hard-core segregationists in this country, but he had a child with a Black female. Thomas Jefferson also wrote that Blacks were inferior to Whites in his “Notes On The State of Virginia” book as one of our nation’s leaders, but he still had kids with his slave.
I think we need to be very careful in assuming that Whites who do sleep with Blacks are not less racist than those who don’t. The White people who believe in White supremacy and practice racism against Non-Whites literally ROFL because it’s one of their deceptive tricks. I bet if Pochahontas could foresee what her marriage to John Smith would lead to, she would not have married that man.
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It gets called out, but i do understand your logic here. Abagond mentioned the BWE crowd and how internalized racism drives them to white men, but he has never said anything about the BWE’s male counterparts called BMV (Black Men Vent) who are all over the place talking about how white women are “better” than Black women..
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So to summarize the viewpoint on black/white relationships:
White men see black women as sexual objects.
Black men see white women as trophies.
I’ve seen talk on here about black women viewing white men as a type of validation in a kind of round about way. I don’t think it has been stated explicitly.
But I don’t recall talk of white women viewing black men as sexual objects. Black men are the most sexualized of males.
If this is true, why isn’t it mentioned? Why is there no push to convince black men that white women only see them as sexual objects?
Gender dynamics I guess.
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Satanforce did however write a post exposing the bulls**t racist and sexist lies told by both groups (BWE &BMV)…
and
Although he sometimes confuses me with his commentary on the subject (especially on another self-described BMV blog Laurelton Queens)
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@ Solesearch
I think one reason for this could be that many people – both Black and White – tend to empathize with the White female. She’s the victim of sexism and White men who historically barred her from having sex with Black men (while nothing is said about Black women’s rights against White male abuse).
So yes, I think gender dynamics are at play, and is something that can’t be ignored. White women have been the main beneficiaries of Affirmative Action, are often the primary caretakers of White male and female children, and have much power in the workplace. Racism cannot exist with her cooperation with the White male, so she should also be called out about her objectification of Black men.
Great comment!
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@Solesearch,
To answer your question, i think in large part it is because in the Black communities of the world, the talk and analysis of racism is traditionally focused on white male racism…
Very few programs and documentaries solely focus on the racism experienced by both Black men and women BY white females…it is as if after years and years of lynching Blacks because of white females, they (white females) suddenly became non racist..
MANY Black men that i know personally believe that white females are less racist than white men even though they prefer to date exclusively in the Black community…
Because to talk about white female racism is taboo and makes Black women look “jealous” and “psychotic” and “overly sensitive”, many of us have allowed white females the privilege to come into our private spaces and cause insurmountable discord, disharmony and confusion…
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@ Solesearch
I tried to explain the NEED behind the white validation of white males TO black females
I agree that white females view black males as sexual objects.
What is the most common stereotype about black males (other than being criminally-inclined?
big, black studs with big black penises
here’s an excerpt from an article
——————
“A White Woman Explains Why She Prefers Black Men”
http://nypress.com/a-white-woman-explains-why-she-prefers-black-men/
“…white women and black men who choose one another because of our racial differences. They resent our taking their men. Black men are two and a half times more likely to marry a white woman than a black woman is to marry a white man.
Black women can point to that statistic in justifying their wrath. But in truth, black sisters, we’re after the sex, not the ring and these guys aren’t the marrying kind anyway.”
The woman who goes after black men is a variant of sex journalist Susie Bright’s “white b*tch in heat,” a woman who puts sex first even though women aren’t supposed to do that.
According to one school of thought, white women turn to black men when their sex drives kick into higher gear and their social inhibitions recede into the rear view mirror. It’s a “yes, baby, now I’m ready for you” reaction.”
—————————-
unfortunately, far too many black males think it is a compliment to be a sex object of white females, forgetting that MOST aren’t interested in marrying a black male (too much evidence that supports this)
and when it comes to maintaiining white supremacy, their “sex drive” doesn’t stop them from clutching their purses in an elevator with a black male wearing a business suit,
or stops them from convicting a black male with no evidence as SHE sits on the jury
or stops them from ACQUITTING four white policeman who just pumped 60 bullets into the body of an unarmed AND deceased black male
or stops them from NOT hiring OR promoting black males as more and more white females move up the corporate ladder — which, by the way white females are occupying more and more positions of power WITH the POWER to hire and fire and promote BLACK MALES
but they aren’t doing that
they’re just lurking around black nightclubs, and bars, and even parks and forest preserves to get some of that “yes, baby, now I’m ready for you” ACTION
which leads me to ask this question —
when it comes to seeking and defending sex with white people
what the H are black people thinking?
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If I had to guess a couple reasons for why it gets focused on black women so often more than black men is this.
Dating out gives black men more options in life, options they don’t want black women to have….why?
Because; in their own way, black men may also be using the racial ladder to boost their own ability to get women.
If BW are relegated to just one segment of the population, instead of the other 87% than they kind of have to accept what they get.
And BM want to keep ahold of their property, black men dating out doesn’t threaten their resources (ability to get women) but black women dating out does.
So basically; they don’t want BW to expand their potential dates so they don’t have to try as hard to get women and they don’t want “their” women dating someone else.
Kind of how racist white guys can date out of the race but then will get in an uproar when white women do it.
It has to do more with sexism and maintaining control more than loyalty to race.
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ALSO
the statement
“According to one school of thought, white women turn to black men when their sex drives kick into higher gear and their social inhibitions recede into the rear view mirror. It’s a “yes, baby, now I’m ready for you” reaction.”
I have tried to make COUNTLESS black males understand that one of the MAJOR appeals of black males TO white females is they CAN drop all their “inhibitions”
in other words, they can let it all hang out and have sex on the first date, at first site or even at the drop of the hat OR panties
why?
Because a black male CANNOT damage a white female’s reputation. She KNOWS your word OR opinions about her CARRY NO WEIGHT and therefore she doesn’t CARE what you think after the action is over
Whereas with white males, she’s a little more circumspect, a little more wary about her “reputation” because if white males start calling her a tramp her reputation AMONG HER WHITE PEERS can cause her harm as in attracting a mate, or a good job, or affect her standing within that white community
SHE CARES WHAT OTHER (WHITE) PEOPLE THINK
she does NOT care what black males (or females) think
that’s why the white female is FREER to “hang out” with black people because our CASTE ranks below hers AND she knows we will cater to her and make her “feel at home”
and if black males are honest, they have seen this dynamic with white females being FREER and LOOSER around black males than with white males
so, it is NO COMPLIMENT at all to black males
in fact, it’s highly insulting to know YOU are CATERING to a suspected RACIST who thinks you are beneath her racially AND socially
Just remember that one line in that white female’s article:
” But in truth, black sisters, we’re after the sex, not the ring and these guys aren’t the marrying kind anyway.””
that’s why I keep emphasizing that SEX and RACISM often go hand in hand
and our LACK of understanding usually puts us on the LOSING END, winding up more confused and in search of MORE white validation
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Another aspect of sexism might be this; they might view sex as “using/degrading the women”….therefore its not a problem when they have sex out of the race.
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@ Peanut,
You make very interesting points. I’ll say that when I learned more about racism/white supremacy, White males were less attractive to me. Mind you, I was literally enamored with White male celebrities, wanted to have some mixed babies, and fantasized about having a multiracial family of my own. But something inside of me always felt that something was wrong with interracial relationships in this racist culture even when I had those thoughts.
So people can definitely change if they choose to. But being honest with oneself about the condition you’re in will almost force you to change. That’s why even Whites flee from conversations about race. If they own up to what they do in plain sight, it’s going to clear to the whole world that they’re the problem and will have to stop on this race nonsense.
I think Black people can do the world a great service by doing so too; let’s make that the prime focus of black culture: self love, self respect, and the revelation of truth no matter where we are or who we’re around.
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@ Trojan Pam
great comments keep em coming. And also its weird how they called black men and women boys and girls, but when its a young black person killed even when they are underage they call them a man or woman and make it like they are a grown person, look how they did trayvon martin, calling him a man and saying look how big he was. But if its a white person that is In their 20’s that has done something they still call them a kid and say oh they didn’t know any better.
@ Solesearch
“If this is true, why isn’t it mentioned? Why is there no push to convince black men that white women only see them as sexual objects?”
Black women have been telling black men that they are viewed as sex objects and vice versa, but we sometimes don’t listen to each other until something happens. During jim crow one of the rules was that u couldn’t talk about a white woman, so this is probably why ppl stray from that issue. Also women pick up on sexism better than men it seems, the only time men pick up on it is when its directed at a female or a female relative, they hardly recognize it when its directed at them. Just look how a man will act if another man hugs his girl and he will be lookin like wtf, but if its another woman that does that to him he sees it as being friendly.
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@ peanut
Yea a lot of it is internalized racism. Just look at how some black men will date every race of woman except a black woman and say things like black women have attitude and that is why i’m not with them. BUt when their non black wife or girlfriend does something to them and has attitude with them they dismiss it and say she is being feisty. Perfect example is ochostinko, he thought having evelyn would be better than a black woman and put her on a pedestal and see what happened, He has a domestic violence charge but I bet he won’t stereotype all Latinas as being that way, no he will dismiss it as an isolated incident. But when they are with a black woman and she does something like that they will say fk it i’m done with black women they all crazy.
I stay away from those self hating coons.
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@ mstoogood4yall
that’s an interesting point,
we’re ‘boys’ and ‘girls’ except when we are accused of a crime and even a 12 year old black BOY might be charged and tried as an “adult’
never thought about it that way before
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@ Peanut
Right, I would say the MAIN reason some black people seek or want white partners is that white validation, that white person saying,
“Yes, I am human. I must be human and worthwhile if a white person wants me.”
and I have seen the same thing, a black male (famous or not) will marry one white female after another but will never stereotype white females but will say,
“they’re individuals, I can’t judge all white females by the one or two or three or ten I didn’t get along with” lol
Also, someone asked about the white/black divorce rate, when I was doing research for one of my books I discovered that the black male/white female divorce rate was higher than
white male/white female
black female/black male
black female/white male
I suspect it’s because a lot of black male/white females get married at a younger age than black female/white male AND at some point the white female gets tired of being in an “interracial marriage” OR dealing with the handicaps of a black male (in a white society) once the “rebellion” and the thrill of “you and me against the world, black man” wears off
I have actually heard this reason for a break-up — once from a black male who was married to one, and the other from the black father of a black male whose white female wife said, he didn’t make enough money although both were college graduates)
And I suspect that eventually some black males chafe under the domination of the more powerful white female and conflict ensues
whereas the black females I know personally who are married to white males seem more able to accept and even welcome his more powerful position as a white male in a white-male dominated society
and feel more secure, safer, and after all, ALL black people are used to white males dominating us so maybe, the black female has an easier time dealing with being more submissive to him
just my two cents
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@Trojan Pam,
Another side of the black male/white female higher divorce i think is because Black men begin to realize that his “loving” white wife is in fact racist and has no intention of raising his Brown children to understand Blackness or value it..
Mother is the first teacher of a child, the nurturer and the passer on of culture–white women are ONLY going to impart white values, ideas and mannerism on to her brown children–i think many Black men will become disillusioned with this…
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Anybody else notice how some ppl will have the bar set high when they date within their race and have certain standards that need to be met but when they date a white person they lower their standards? For instance, some black ppl will say I want someone who is educated, fit, can cook, clean, and is family oriented, but then when some of them date a white person they can’t do half of those things . I look at it as 2 things, either they are color struck as hell, or 2 they feel like oh I expect better from my own race but a white person I will lower it for because they probably can’t do that so they baby them. Reminds me of that episode of everybody hates chris where he had a black teacher that expected him to do better and failed him when he got a decent grade, while not caring what the white students did and passing them.
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Oh baby…now we’re cookin with Pam! not crisco oil but Pam, TrojanPam to be exact! ^_^
mstoogood4yall, i see you sista…i got my eye on you girl, my good eye at that! 😉
Peanut, you should open a black college, the way you schoolin’ a brotha!
@ : o O ) >
The sistas is taken ova yo blog, abagond!!!!! @ : o D ) >
The Black women empowerment, THE SEQUAL!!!!
*sticks afro pick in hair and raises fist in air…..
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Another aspect to take into the divorce rates is this; say what you will about black women they shoot from the hip.
White women, especially the southern variety put a lot more emotional and social manipulation into how they interact with you.
And if you go into that thinking white women are some kind of pure, innocent angels who you can push around and dominate with no problem, than you go into that totally unprepared just for the kind of havoc, duplicitnous and conflict a white women can bring out.
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^Continued from above…
Also, Black women age slower than white women. Dermatologist have concluded that white women look on average a decade older than Black women of the same age. A white woman will usually (not in all cases) begin to look older than the Black man she is with even though they could be the same age…
I know several Black men who were once married to white women and have divorced and are now married to younger Black women…
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@ sondis
i confess, I have always had a HUGE CRUSH on these two FINE black brothers who had the courage to make a statement and risk their careers by raising their fists at the Olympics.
(( heart beating, pulse racing ))
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@ phoebeprunelle
I have heard from many black males who have had children with white females that they often turn their children against them and want to raise them as white — an impossibility unless that child can PASS for white
of course, I’m not saying the black men are always blameless OR that the white female is always the villiain but I know black males who say this has happened to them or to a male relative
You’re right, the MOTHER is the values transferer to the child and the child is usually more loyal to the mother’s side which makes it especially problematic when a white female is left to raise a child who will be classified as “black” but who identifies are “white”
nothing but a HUGE MESS in the making
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TrojanPam:
There was no risk, they KNEW their careers would be over.
I’m sure they thought about it and came to the conclusion that their careers were not as important as their black people.
what a sacrifice!! They did suffer as they were immediately banned from the games, couldn’t find employment and received all kinds of hate mail and death threats from racist white people.
The thing is this, they were subject to all those things, even BEFORE THE ACT OF THE SALUTE!
Think about that for a second, Pammy 🙂
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@ sondis
come to think of it, where are the brothers? have they gone into hiding?
or have they left the building due to a lack of interest?
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@ Trojan pam
I also think the higher divorce rates between bm/ww is because white women are used to being taken care of and having a man make more or very close to how much she makes. it seems white men and Asian men are the only ones who can out earn a white woman and some women don’t like being the breadwinners and look at their man as being emasculated when he isn’t. And a lot of them get married young and are naïve and think I can deal with all the stares, comments, and racism, only to realize they were wrong.
@ phoebeprunelle
Obama and tiger woods comes to mind when talking about non black women raising them and taking on the ideas and thinking of their mothers race. And distancing themselves from their black side. Yea I see a lot of black men on youtube saying that is the main reason they won’t marry white women.
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@ sondis
Rofl don’t have ur one good eye pop outta your head. Anyway that vid of those strong brothas putting their fist in the air was amazing,I wonder what they woulda did if they won. dam what happened to borhas and sistahs like this. we need to get back to the black power movement lol. Say it loud i’m black and i’m proud. *fluffs imaginary afro*
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@ Peanut
understood
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mstoogood4yall:
Its all good, my one good eye is all good!
TrojanPam:
Check this documentary out about the salute:
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@ sondis
who said, “They did suffer as they were immediately banned from the games, couldn’t find employment and received all kinds of hate mail and death threats from racist white people.
The thing is this, they were subject to all those things, even BEFORE THE ACT OF THE SALUTE!”
That’s a great point. it’s not like they were treated correctly before the salute.
(I still have a huge crush on them)
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@ sondis
thanks for the video, will check it out
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@ mstoogood4yall
who said, “And a lot of them get married young and are naïve and think I can deal with all the stares, comments, and racism, only to realize they were wrong.”
I believe that is one reason so many marriages and relationships between blacks and whites break up
white people get tired of carrying around all that black “baggage”
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this is a good facebook page all about interracial relationships gone bad. {https://www.facebook.com/tragicarrangements}
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https://www.facebook.com/tragicarrangements
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Yes, you are so correct. I have noticed that black children as young a 8 or 9 yrs are often referred to as men and women when a crime has been commited whether they be the victim or not. I have often wondered why. I do not mean girls being referred to as young ladies, they are refeered to as women- not ladies at all, sme with our boys, I understand my mother used to call my sons young men as a term of endearment but these are no terms of endearment by Mistah Charlies. They aim to take our children’s childhood away and see them as grown and fresh…. on the opposite end of the spectrum they call our seniors as old as 80 or 90 yrs old girls and boys !!! Racism is deep …..
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Yeah a lot of white ppl can’t stand to be in our shoes, I remember that experiment on oprah where they had the blue eyed ppl getting mistreated and even when they told them it was an experiment they walked out and were mad. More proof that they can not deal with what we have to go through or would be going crazy
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Proximity Breeds Contempt.
All I can say is that if black American women want to date and marry other “races” without guilt, stigma, or negative feedback….then leave US of America
European men date and marry black women with no fear because they don’t have the social stigma and hang-ups like white American men — they are not cowards (like white American men) who have to wait to get “buzzed” or be alone with no prying eyes, before they approach black women….
Interracial dating / marriage is not a “cure” for racism…everyone has their racial hang-ups, depending on what country you’re from.
every country has some sort of issue — whether its dealing with people marrying outside of their ethnic groups, religion, class or race — we’ve all been indoctrinated by our environment / culture.
For those of us who have lived in America and in other Countries, the difference in Attitudes towards interracial dating is very sharp and obvious.
even though there is obvious racism in UK & Europe, as bad as the Europeans can be, I’ve never seen them go in deep with the same nasty, vitriolic attitude that comes from Americans… and both black and white American society are guilty of keeping the sh’t going… it’s not just one-sided.
America’s mantra is to “separate” everyone into categories/ boxes; whereas in other country(s) the mantra is to “blend” but push the African or non-white side into the closet… so no, there are no “bed of roses” anywhere for African-descended or minority people.
but who wants to deal with society and stigma when you’re just trying to find someone to love or be with.
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We need to choose our WORDS more carefully, there is NO way that a non white person can be racist under this current system of white supremacy . We are in charge of NOTHING and have NO power to do and or enact laws that affect white people collectively. Not only is this true in America but it is TRUE gLOBALLY. We need to stop spreading these untruths that blacks and other non white can be reacist, prejudiced- YES, Racist- NO WAY …. sorry Peanut but you still be a little confused on RACISM, what it is and how it affects us but you are in large number of other confused victims too…… I still be learning myself so when you know better you do better….
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Under the cURRENT system of white Supremacy that is GLOBAL interracial relationships are akin to child abuse because whites and non whites are not on equal footing in society. A good example would be the warden having sex and falling in love with a prisoner in jail. That is wrong because the warden has the upper hand. Another example is a doctor carrying on an affair with his patient and a student haveing sex with a teacher even in college when the student may be of age. When rasicm is eliminated then people should be able mix and sex whomever they wish, everone will be on equal footing. I’m just saying………Until that TIME it is not right
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“C.Andrews,
We are in charge of NOTHING and have NO power to do and or enact laws that affect white people collectively. Not only is this true in America but it is TRUE gLOBALLY.
Under the cURRENT system of white Supremacy that is GLOBAL interracial relationships are akin to child abuse because whites and non whites are not on equal footing in society”
Linda says,
Bold-Faced lie! and utter Bullsh’t!
You need to move to a black majority country, where you will find confident black people who are in control of their country and governments….then maybe you can start shrugging off your “shackles” and realize that America is not the world.
if you are black American….PLEASE only speak for yourself and your black American countrymen….do not speak for the rest of the black/brown people in the world because you CANNOT speak for us….our ancestors might have ridden the same ships but our destinies took different paths.
Our ancestors fought wars and shed white blood so that black people could be physically free from white domination
It will be a cold-day in H’ll for any black person from the Haiti, Jamaica, Any black/brown majority Caribbean country or Africa to act or say that white people are Better than us or have control over us
our governments might be making bad choices and policies but the decisions are still being made by them – black people.
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@ Linda
We’ll just have to agree to disagree
White supremacy is a GLOBAL SYSTEM of WHITE DOMINATION, and that includes Haiti, which has been punished by white supremacists since they ejected Europeans from Haiti — which is one reason it is such a poor country AND why it was literally under siege after the earthquake by white people.
That also includes Jamaica, the Caribbean nations, much of Africa, Japan, Iraq, Mexico, Canada, North America, Latin America, South Africa, much of the so-called Middle East, etc.
is under white domination
It is sometimes difficult for non-white people to accept, that white domination is RULING this planet, but unfortunately, it’s true — in my opinion and the evidence supports this
because no matter where you go non-white and black people are being dominated by white people, and white standards of beauty and white media entertainment
AND no matter where you go, non-white and black people are being mistreated.
Racism is NOT a U.S. import or export, It is a worldwide infection.
again, we can agree to disagree
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True; even in the US there are black politicians, black principals and business leaders, aren’t a few of the billionaires who own wal-mart african-americans?
Especially in areas where its an black majority.
To say black people have no power is pretty much what I was talking about in the white paternalism thread when people say black people are helpless and can’t do anything on this blog.
I would call it racism against black people except it seems to be black people thinking it.
Hell as a group black people in america have more wealth and influence than nations in europe.
At the very least; culturally african-americans have been one of the largest driving forces there is.
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And I can testify myself to all the anti-Blackness I’ve witnessed – and was even subject to – in my Caribbean family. Countless relatives have been shocked that I’m so dark-skinned while others have said they’re not pretty enough because they don’t have straight noses. But despite the mistreatment my relatives faced from my WHITE great-grandmother, her whiteness is fascinating to many of my family members.
Even if a country has predominantly Black people, many still have problems with being Black and would rather embrace Whiteness.
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Black people globally have been affected by European/western ideology for sure, and the current global Free markets are run by white people (even though non-white countries like India and China are changing the game)
but on a national scale, black majority countries are running their own show and these countries have white minorities that live there and are affected by laws and rules made by black people…. They either assimilate or they leave.
The Haitians invaded and freed the slaves in Dominican Republic and ruled the Dominican Republic for a time…Haiti became the world’s first independent black republic and the second independent nation in the Western Hemisphere
maybe for some people that doesn’t count because now they are a poor country or are you only concerned about black minorities making rules and laws for white majority populations?
Haiti’s current white minority:
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TrojanPam,
Yes, we will have to agree to disagree because my experience has been hella different than yours…. I was raised to believe that black people can do anything and that no white person is better than me…
I only hear black Americans speak as though they are dominated by white People and can’t do any better because of x,y, and z.
What you speak about is internalized white/European concepts of beauty.. I agree, colourism affects us all…
that is a far cry from saying that black people globally feeling as though they are second-class and second best and not equal to whites…that, to me, is a black American hang-up and
until you have lived a black majority country, you CANNOT speak for black non-Americans.
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@ V-4
Having a “powerful” position or title does NOT equate to being “powerful”
EVERY black politician, principal, business “leader” and even billionaire is ACCOUNTABLE to a more powerful white person.
including our first black president Obama who is NOT in charge, but in fact, is UNDER the control of the powerful white people who EDUCATED, VETTED, NOMINATED, AND FINANCED HIM
Which makes THEM his BOSSES
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@ Linda
if you go all over the world you will see the SAME DYNAMIC of RACISM against non-white people by white people
sorry, racism is NOT a black American hangup
but we can agree to disagree
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TrojanPam:
That would be, Congress. 🙂
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TrojanPam:
I agree that, racism is not a black American hangup, its the same all over the world.
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Obama is in charge as much as any single person can be in charge, the argument your using could be applied to power and authority in general, making it so no one as has any power or authority which is clearly not accurate.
It still shows that there are indeed powerful and influential black people and other PoC in the US.
Its a fact of life, black americans have wealth, economic and political influence that the majority of the world lacks in comaprison.
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@ sondis
from Australia, to New Zealand, to South AFRICA ( a black majority country) where black South Africans RIOTED against slave wages working MINES owned by WHITE PEOPLE
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Once again, bullsh’t… I have been around the world, I have lived on 3 continents ..
You will not see the same Dynamic of racism everywhere you go … it manifests itself differently in different countries.
I am not rolling with this low self-esteem BS about black people being weak and not able to make an impact in the world.
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Linda:
wrong once again….going for a 3rd time, being wrong?
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@ V-4
If you understand how POWER is gained, we know that NO ONE GIVES UP POWER VOLUNTARILY — and for anyone to believe that Obama was given POWER by the SAME WHITE POWERFUL PEOPLE that PUT him in power,
that is not LOGICAL
To think that he is SUDDENLY the BOSS of the SAME POWERFUL WHITE PEOPLE who EDUCATED HIM, VETTED HIM, NOMINATED HIM, and FINANCED HIM
and now they are TAKING their marching orders from him is NOT LOGICAL
That is NOT the real world
and the PROOF that he does NOT have real power is the LEVEL of DISRESPECT he gets from white people LESS Powerful than he is,
like the Federal judge who said Obama’s mother had sex with a dog and that judge wasn’t punished
or the Governor of Arizona, Jan Brewer who wagged her finger in his face in full view of TV Cameras and President Obama just stood there and smiled
and that FACT that he had to APOLOGIZE to a lowly white male civil servant COP after saying the police behaved “stupidly” for arresting Harvard professor Gates in his own home
speaks VOLUMES as to what REAL POWER looks like
and it DOESN’T look like that
Powerful people GET RESPECT because they are feared by those who are LESS POWERFUL – point blank PERIOD
there is NO way Cheney or Geo Bush would allow a federal judge to say their mothers had sex with dogs and that judge would still be sitting on the bench the next day
I know black people want to believe so badly in this “first black” situation that frankly, has done a D thing for black people
being racial progress but it is time to take off the blinders and PUT ON THE THINKING CAPS
No ONE in POWER hands over power to a less powerful person
NO ONE
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and how am I wrong Sondis? Neither you or TPam have said anything to prove me wrong.
you can sit up and say anything want but neither of you have given a Concrete example of how racism in a foreign black or white majority country is EXACTLY the same as racism in America.
Prove to me that this low-self esteem, black mentality that black people are weak is Global and not just a black American hang-up.
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@ Linda
you can say BS until the COWS come home but that won’t change a thing, including the reality of a global white supremacy system
acknowledging TRUTH has nothing to do with “low self-esteem”
IN FACT, telling ourselves the TRUTH is a sign of “high self-esteem”
or at least an attempt to build some
to lie to ourselves is the highest form of SELF-DISRESPECT
and while you disagree, the OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE of white people controlling the majority of black and non-white nations is evident to those who understand the dynamics of what they are looking at
have a good night
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Linda:
TrojanPam just laid it all out, you just refuse to believe it. So just leave it alone and move on…the world isn’t going to come to an end, just because you don’t agree with US.
I can care less if you agree or not. you seem to care, very much that we disagree with you.
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and Sondis, if TPam said that “sh’t smells like perfume” you would agree…
you still haven’t told me anything but you are attempting to tell me about myself… which you can keep to yourself.
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“TrojanPam
to lie to ourselves is the highest form of SELF-DISRESPECT”
Linda says,
I totally agree with this statement but your take on world views of “blackness” and how racism relates to “all black” people is not universal.
all you have done is repeatedly state that there is “global white supremacy” which I would say, “yes, of the free market and financial system” but it seems to me that this brush is being applied too liberally
black Americans are not “nations” and you can’t compare the black American experience with black countries who are operating and dealing with white supremacy in the international arena… apples and oranges.
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Linda:
“Sondis, if TPam said that “sh’t smells like perfume” you would agree… ”
I would expect for someone like you, to say something so classless.
You’re cussing and swearing at me and TrojanPam, i guess this is what happens, when you reveal the truth, some people just can’t maintain, their composure.
“you are attempting to tell me about myself… which you can keep to yourself.”
How am i telling you about yourself?
I simply disagreed what you, how is that, telling you about yourself?
Taking things personal, during a debate is a sign of weakness.
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@ Linda
it is too late to debate any further but let me be clear
I NEVER said black people in America had the same experiences as blacks outside america
THAT was your comparison
what I said was the GLOBAL SYSTEM OF WHITE SUPREMACY functions the same way all over the world
black people are mistreated in Europe, in the UK, in Russia, in Sweden, in Australia, New Zealand, South Africa, Jamaica, etc. ANYWHERE white people are present — and in many cases the BRAIN-TRASHING of blacks by white supremacy has resulted in many blacks mistreating other blacks simply for being black
I don’t know where you’ve traveled, but my money says you’ve experienced this ‘mistreatment’ where you were treated at least some or part of the time differently than white people
and if you disagree, so be it
have a good nite
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Where did I swear at you Sondis? I was’t trying to me “right” — I was stating my views.
You can call me “classless” or “weak” all day — could care less but you came to me first with your facety-ness
“Sondis@ wrong once again….going for a 3rd time, being wrong?”
was that sentence called for? You were not trying to have a discussion or debate with me, Sondis …. because that sentence was how you first engaged me.
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V-4,
“I would call it racism against black people except it seems to be black people thinking it.”
Black people are often racist against black people. That statement is definitely racist.
Also, I agree with your statement on why black men say nothing about their sexual objectification by white women.
Unless black men reject sexism, I don’t know if black men and black women can truly be allies.
You, phoebe, msgood, and Pam broke the situation down quite well.
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“TrojanPam,
black people are mistreated in Europe, in the UK, in Russia, in Sweden, in Australia, New Zealand, South Africa, Jamaica, etc. ANYWHERE white people are present — and in many cases the BRAIN-TRASHING of blacks by white supremacy has resulted in many blacks mistreating other blacks simply for being black”
Linda says,
I do hear what you are saying, TPam…. which is that the lasting legacy of white Supremacy still affects black people globally because black/brown people still retain and are indoctrinated by the white/European ideology… I agree with that — most non-white people who were in contact with whites/Europeans escaped that legacy
but you are speaking of “internalized racism” by black people and comparing it to active racism that is being practiced by white people in white majority countries to me, are 2 different animals…. there are no white people in Jamaica with the power to disenfranchise black people in Jamaica.
and yes, I have dealt with prejudice in UK and Europe but once again, different animal than in US…
My statements were in response to C.Andrews statement about black people “globally” being weak, without power and no agency to make decisions for ourselves or decisions that impact white people.
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TrojanPam, not one black woman I have ever had a relationship with has ever done it to be validated by a white man…this is the Freud/Fannon/Femininst activist rheteroic you are buying into…basicly a western concept…psycho analysis…Ill say it again, not one black woman Ive been with or been around ever went with white men for validation
Wow go back in history and analise relationships going down today by those standards…you are only talking about certain kinds of people..again, those concepts dont aply to even half of interracial relationships..
Again, Ill fully agree the legacy of slavery is carrying over into today, seeping into institutions and especialy relfected in media, something owned by a few people, a few people sit and make the desicians that go out to all of us…it isnt reality ..you bring in one interview from a white woman as though that is the norm….
but , people getting together is a one on one personal desician and everyone brings what they have personaly to the table . Sure there are plenty of prejudice white men that bring their prejudice to the table, but, everyone will reveal who they are and people have to be perceptive to pick up the signs…yes, be perceptive…and I never said interracial relationships cure racism, I would never say that, but, I say if people psyche themselves out by pulling out the Freud/FannonFeminist activisim part that hates men, and , superimpose past mentalities as though they play out full force today, they are digging their own hole to lie in…and, hey, by all means, Im not telling you to change your mind, feel free to think anyway you want, just dont think you speak for all black women..fighting racism is one thing, convincing black women or men they are seeking validation from white people by sleeping with them is just psyche 101, and it just doesnt play out in reality….like I said, I rarely have known a black women who got into a relationship with a white person to validate themselves…these pshycho analysis sound really lame to me…but go fight your fight in your space, Im fighting against racism in my space, especialy for the people I love in my life, not to apease you or be accepted by you…I dont need to be accepted by you to validate my fight against racism…and, the space Im in , that does accept interracial relationships , has a huge amount of incredible black people involved..a huge amount, and , people are saying black people need each other, but they are cutting so many black people out with the interracial relationship critique that it is painful to watch
Its really painful to watch people recycling political agendas that didnt work back in the late 60’s, telling people who they were suposed to date and not,it just brings horrible inner conflict you see on the BWE thread, it didnt work, yet here is the rhetoric rycycled again, just bringing in confusion and re criticism
Look at the title in the thread, as a white person who always interracial dated, I have every right to be in here debating this topic…racism , white racism , and the damage it has done, is all our problem…you can disucss it alone, but in the end,we dont solve it without all of us participating
Yeah, those of you who dont like interracial dating, and need to beleive in that to get through the day against white racism, by all means go in your corner and fight your good fight…and Ill fight the good fight in my corner with a lot of good companay…and get the fuk out of South Beach..you arnt ready for it
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This should be:
“I agree with that — most non-white people who were in contact with whites/Europeans did not escaped that legacy”
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I had posted a video of her in the UK
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Strange enough I swore that I didn’t like White men but when I entered a dating website and posted my picture, mostly White men messaged me and said that they were interested in me. I don’t know why. Should I change my mind on them? I usually prefer Black men and Latinos but I don’t know these days.
I hardly see White American guys date Black American women but I have seen many European and foreign White males date Black women though. Because of the lack of seeing White American men with Black women, I feel like they dislike Black women. Who knows.
Black women and White men have such a complicated relationship in this country, it almost makes me glad that my family didn’t originate from this country.
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There is a lot of regurgitating late 60’s Civil Rights Movement rhetoric on here without really going back and analysing which political agendas really work and which ones should be jetisoned, because all they did was sow inner conflict and the conflict carries over into today.
Ive asked many times on here about the bashing of Louis Armstrong and tap dancing , by some black activist rhetoric from that time, and I never can get an answer…people dont know about it or even have thought about it….I always knew that it was wrong , but I also knew that in the bigger scheme of fighting white racism, the truth would have to take a back seat until someone like Wynton Marsalis came along to educate people to the truth…tap dancing has never recovered
And, mandates about dating were thrown out back then, that were unnatural, created conflict, and hasnt been resolved up until now…these mandates are always weaved in with very true concerns about racism , to make it look like they are part of the real problems
Look at that South Beach video…how do you know those women are going to sleep with that guy? Maybe they just going to pump him for questions about where the action is…maybe they are just going to play the guy…Ocean Beach ( I saw the Mango Club in the background), is wild, people flock there to get away from stiff rhetoric and mores to get their freak on in South Beach, they are looking for action, woman are bold and brazen, what goes down in South Beach stays in South Beach, I have seen some of the tightest sexy dresses wrapped around some of the finest booty you could imagine, walking on Ocean Drive…maybe those women perceived the guys accent and thought he was European, or Cuban, and wasnt a white American to them…
Then you got the guy coming on afterwards saying “you black women signed an oath of loyalty…”….what oath of loyalty? that superimposed rhetoric from the late 60’s, that people are conflicting on about over on the BWE thread? That rhetoric that should have been jetisoned because it was flawed and has only brought conflict and misunderstanding? I can tell you for sure that rhetoric has done nothing to stop racism or prepare to defend against it..it only represents an area to wallow in while much more important things to address are neglected, like culture assasination.
And to the notion that a white person in an interracial relationship is coming in here for some kind of acceptance is ridiculous…I come on this thread to point out the flaws in the rhetoric, because otherwise, a lot of wrong stereotype notions would just go rolling with no real balance…these notions deserve to be challanged…to think this is some kind of picnic playing patty cake , asking to be liked and accepted, is just ludicriss
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Even though “Racism” more or less operates in similar ways around the world, as far as white/lighter people de-valuing black or darker skin people — it has different effects and manifests itself differently.
Black people do not experience “racism” the EXACT same way around the world… yes, there is racism in the UK and Europe, but as black/brown people from the Caribbean or Africa, the struggle is different because we know that we are “foreigners” and we know where we are coming from and that we have a “homeland” to go back to —
the black American struggle is that you are treated like foreigners in your own country and you have no homeland to go back to — America is your home … and you all view the world through your American “lenses”
but what most of you don’t realize, is that when you leave the Unite States
as Americans, you share the same “white privilege” or “western privilege” that white Americans do.
you receive different treatment than the “local” black /brown population of the country you are visiting or living in — regardless if you are in Europe or in a black/brown majority country.
as Americans, people assume that you have money and they will treat you better and with more respect. As foreigners, you might get better jobs or higher pay than the black or brown “locals” with similar education.
and the reverse is true, some people might dislike you and try to harm you because you are black and American — they are jealous and believe that you have money and “privileges” that they don’t have –because you are American.
Your “American” Nationality alone will set you apart and place you in a different “monetary and racial class status” — depending on the country you are in… you can become “brown or white” due to your “white western privilege” — in some countries in Africa, you are called “white” because you a foreigner from America.
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Wow, ThanX Legion… but I don’t know about the “respectful” part… I do have my moments when I am being a rude snot…but I do try my best to maintain decorum 🙂
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@Peanut
I guess we’ll have to agree to disagree on the matter of who can get sex the easiest. If anything, the middle-ground seems to suggest that sex seems to be given freely from both sexes. Meanwhile, everyone is speaking in stereotypes that seem to not even remotely reflect the reality that you or myself have experienced.
As for calling Black women queens, it’s the same reason why I always make it a point to make an encouraging statement when I see a Black woman with natural hair; society diminishes your worth. I’m no captain save-a-ho, but I do value Black women. My mother was abused by my father, and rather than pick-up that torch (the most likely of outcomes statistically speaking), I went the opposite direction.
It genuinely angers me when I see things like a study that claims that Black women are scientifically the least attractive of all women. When Black women are told that their natural hair is “unprofessional” when in a braided style, and made to feel shamed, that gets me heated.
But why should Black women have to wait for White society to validate them? I’ll validate a Black woman any time of the day. Of course, the better circumstance is Black women validating themselves rather than waiting for anyone else to do so. In the mean time though, I personally obligate myself to let Black women know that they are appreciated and valued.
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@ Legion (and Cornlia)
Since you asked so respectfully here’s one of my sources regarding the high rate of “interracial marriages” by Jews prior to being marched into concentration camps
“By the 1930’s, 60% of all German Jewish marriages were interracial. In his book, “Hitler’s Jewish Soldiers” Brian Rigg states that 155,000 Nazi soldiers had Jewish blood, including some generals.”
the book: “Christopher Story, author of “The New Underworld Order”
@ Linda,
come on on, you used profanity several times to address me and another poster’s response.
all you have to do is go back and read your own posts
of course, that’s your prerogative to do so
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Wow, something going on here!
One I thought that most black men and women married each other. I could be wrong I didn’t go and research the data here.
Two I think history speaks for itself when you look at the fact that given to chance white men didn’t pass up black women proof look at all of the different shades of black people in places like america, brazil, and spain. This is usually due to white men making babies with black women. Reason, politics, history aside if, black women weren’t attractive how do you explain all these black people with some white blood in them? They are not all white women black man mixing. That is more recent I think yet, someone can come along with some data to show other wise, but I don’t think so cause of the nature of slavery when whites were doing it and all around the world. White men took prizes and one was sexing the women. I always thought of prizes as something that you wanted. Hey but, I could be wrong now.
Three black men are not the property of black women and black women are not the property of black men. So, both groups will do as they see fit yet, are made and produced by unions with each other. I think the black man vs. black woman thing is way over played and that black women for whatever reason are finding what they want and or need with black men so they don’t date out much. I don’t see a lot of black women complaining about not getting action from other men. It seems they want their own. However, like all things change is the only real guarentee. So, black women may open themselves up to out dating more, but this may take more time as women have often been guarded about these things due to social stressor, history and well desire. There is a reson it is called number 2 choice. If, number one is not avalible then you might go with number 2 wich for black women just looking at this board may be anyman not necessary a white man.
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@TrojanPam you’ve just cited from Brian Rigg, an internet conspiracy theorist who claims that most of the leading Nazis were, in fact, Jews. Apart from the grossly offensive anti-Semitism of this claim, how can you rely upon such an unreliable source for your information?
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Peanut stay away from white beasts. I am a black man married to a black woman . Never desired a white woman. Why would I want something inferior?
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Yes, everywhere in the Americas that had slaves, has their own dynamic and parameters about the racism going on and how its dealt with.
Of course , there are some basic fundimentals that happen, and those are what should be addressed, but, when the parts of a political agenda that are weak and not based on sound reality, like putting down interracial relationships, in the backdrop of another country, if the foundation of the agenda is weak, it will wilt when super imposed over that other country
In Brazil, harping on the evils of interracial dating will just bang the people doing the harpings heads against the wall, and they could have their head handed to them on a platter
It just doesnt play out in Brazil, it looks foolish…beleive me, I have read the lament of various disgruntled black American activists down in Brazil, who just cant understand the black Brazilian women and their high numbers who date white foreigners…they walk around with a headache, trying to pound their square peg into a round hole…and it just proves what a weak agenda it is and certainly is a weak political agenda, because it doesnt play out the way its suposed to
Its like recycling garbage that should have been taken out a long time ago…fine if the people doing it need it to face white racism in America, but it is really only a self fullfilling prophecy…these people arnt going to date white people
Other people can think for themselves and are doing quite fine, and dont think interacial relationships are negative based on watching Jerry Springer
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@TrojanPam
“More bounce to the ounce” well with abagond’s posts about booty etc., I am sorry you feel that this is degrading and misogynistic, i prefer dark complected black women, about 5’2″ and the body style is different of a white woman. that is not a debateble point. and it seems black women maybe dance better in general? it is my preferences in a mate/companion/lover and that is not going to change. honestly i’m getting sick of the whole ‘agenda’ of gene pool dilution etc, grafting onto dominant features all that crap, i need to let it roll how i feel and hey like i said there’s someone out there for everyone. i just feel now this whole cheerios debacle and media impetus is adding a whole annoyance factor and it is the corporate thing glomming on to my trip ‘piggybackin off my thing’ and an offshoot of the ‘gay rights movement’ from some fundamental mainstream leftwing liberal view. and if you think i have an agenda or whatever that is projecting and personalizing.
that’s racist because i’m attracted to black women? now i’ve heard everything, yo.
have a great day!
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and in all seriousness that was a snap response to matari’s ding ding ding
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(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dkFpiZQm8xQ)
More Bounce To The Ounce – Zapp (1980)
i didn’t write this song
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Look, people who are repelled at the thought of a touch from a white person because they remind them of 400 years of slavery and being raped, should definitly not get into an interracial relationship
For the people who have a natural preferance for their own race, no one is suggesting you feel any differant
But, the truth is, the really low drek that is being pseudo psycho analysed about black people who date interracialy, is hilarious, except it is an insult to a lot of black people…and is devisive…many black women I had relationships with, were very talented women…very in control of their lives..to listen to the pop psycholoy analysis and put downs , from people who are only regurgitating political agendas that were not well put together from the first place anyway,just plain suks the mop
And, I dont see a real handle on what was going down back then in the Civil Rights Movement back then…a lot of black activists who put out those kinds of agendas, didnt hang around in the black communities…they left them high and dry..after they pursuaded everyone to kick white people out of the movement..
I mean, in the long run, who was more valuable to the struggle, Eldredge Cleaver, Huey Newton or Jim Brown?
How come no one can address the Louis Armstrong, tap dance issues I raise? I mean no one excpet Abagond gave it a small shot
People now a days are filled to the gills with political activist rhetoric, but, are culturaly empty…cetainly culturaly ignorant..it comes out all the time on here
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@Trojan Pam,
I think it is very easy to use the terms “anti-Semetic when uncomfortable truths are exposed…
Anti-Semitism just like racism is creating laws and public policy that discriminates against people based on color..
True anti-Semitism were the laws created by white Germans that
Forbade Jews to use typewrites, ride bicycles, become employed in public sectors such as teach in government ran schools, work as doctors or dentist in state run hospitals and prevented them to work as judges and lawyers…
the laws also forbade them to sit for university exams…
So nothing Trojan Pam has done is anti-Semetic
Also TPam, in regards to interracial marriages between Jews and white Germans, one has to wonder why it was even banned at all…
Historically, any time marriage was high between non-whites and whites, the whites found a way to outlaw it. In prewar Germany this was called the Nuremberg Laws.
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@Trojan Pam and all who is interested:
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B.R., I want to thank you for taking the time to educate us ignorant negroes on our Afro diasporic culture(which consists of us shaking our naked butts) and for helping us comprehend the true meaning of our experiences. Instead of viewing them through the out-dated perspective of the ill-fated civil rights movement.
Without your comments, we wouldn’t know anything about ourselves. So thank you.
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But it’s interesting to me that White people aren’t being openly encouraged to date/marry outside of their race like Black people are. I have yet to see an “Interracial Dating Guide for White Men/Women” being plastered all over the news. But for some strange reason, Black men and women are being told to leave “subpar” Black folks for “great” White partners. Wow.
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@ adeen
White men would be the ones to message u especially if u look young. Also a lot of ppl go on dating websites and look for hookups and will message ppl they wouldn’t have the confidence to approach in life. There are black dating websites. when its black men dating online some usually go for other races of women because they look at it as they can see black in life all the time, whereas other races they do not.
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@ ms j
I noticed it too, go to a black website and its an interracial ad, go to a white website and its hair ads. They show us these images so that we will assume white ppl want us and then we approach them, so they don’t have to approach us and get shut down. They want us to initiate this stuff because they know when we do something it becomes a trend, so since they can’t make us do it they will dam sure try to persuade us to. This is why they will say biracial babies look cute but when u ask them about black or white babies they say the white babies are cute too, and are silent on black babies. they want us to see ourselves as ugly and mixed, light skinned ppl as beautiful. Then u will have some lost brothas and sistah who buy into it and want biracial kids.
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I’m a white man. I’ve seen beautiful white women and beautiful black women. I’ve also seen ugly white women and ugly black women. That’s just looking at the outsides. Some of the most beautiful people inside (where it counts) are not “eye candy”, I haven’t read all your posts on this subject, so my personal feelings may be redundant, but I would not date or marry a black woman because of the cultural obstacles and prejudices that would surround us. Marriage is hard enough, and way too high a percentage of couples get divorced, to knowingly made a tough situation nearly impossible right from the start.
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@mstoogood4yall
I couldn’t say it any better myself!!
Look at all the serious issues black people face because of racism, but all they find time to broadcast ad infinitum is whether or not Black people are going out on dates. Plus, it’s common knowledge that most White people have no interest in being married to and having children with Black people; they might want sex, but not lifelong commitment. When they do marry us, we have to end up accepting their reality and downplaying our own. If the relationship ends in divorce, they usually end up taking most of the Black ex’s money and often the children.
I find it interesting that the interracial marriage rate between Blacks and Whites is so low (about 1%), but it’s such a hot topic in our community. That’s says something.
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@ peanut
What u planning lol. let me know what u find.
@ ms j they show us this stuff so we argue amongst ourselves all the while avoiding our real issues. This happened when I was on truths blog, it was a discussion about hair and it turned into one commenter disrespecting women with weave and some of us going at it, when the real issue was why do we give our money to other races and feel the need to change our appearance. Its all a ploy to keep us distracted and divided instead of focusing our energy on healing so we can be united.
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“TrojanPam
@ Linda,
come on on, you used profanity several times to address me and another poster’s response.”
Linda says,
I never cursed “at” you or Sondis …I did use profanity in my comments to you but I was not cursing at you….Either way, I apologize to you if I offended you.
Also, I am not interested in being “Right” — because what I say is just my views and my perspective — just like you and everyone else have their subjective perspective mixed with factual observations.
I like to see all sides to situation because Nothing happens in a vacuum…No one here is really saying anything that has not been said before by past generations … and because of that insight, a lot of changes have been made for black people in the US and abroad.
TPam, you say many things that are insightful and your “words of wisdom” are probably needed to re-focus the younger generation but
as I mentioned, my comments were not really even directed to you but to the general feeling of pessimism that seems to creep into the comments lately.
I am hearing more of “what is wrong with black people” but I am not hearing anyone talk about the “what is Right” and the progress that has been made….
For those of us who grew up in the 60’s and 70’s, we see how the world is a different place now– and I also see how the younger generation is pissing on these gains in the pursuit of “self”
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Continued…..
We focus on little stuff like interracial, weave, light skin vs dark skin, all the while avoiding the major stuff like our neighborhoods being destroyed by drugs, violence, gangs, and schools closing, and our need to support and build black businesses. The media puts all this stuff in our face because they know they’ll get a reaction, just look at this post it has 300+ comments in 2 days, yet posts about our history and what we need to do get less than this in the same amount of time. I don’t want to see our ppl hurt but some have to learn the hard way on their own. Do I think we should be with whites? at this time not really especially here in amerikkka and the way a lot of them talk about us or treat us ain’t right. But to each his own.
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@ all the precious black ladies reading this post
there is at TRICK that the “pick-up artist” community (meaning men give other men tips on how to “pick up” women”)
that has been very successful among many black females in the U.S., Africa and abroad DUE to the relentless white mainstream media BASHING of black females like the Psychology Today article penned, “Why are black females the least attractive?”
This is an excerpt from the book, “The Beauty Con Game” which is a quote by Josh Wickett on the pick-up technique called “framing”
—-
Framing: Creating Easy Sexual Access
“Every week there’s a new study or article that says black women are inferior. Here’s the deal.
They have a name for it in the PUA community, it’s called ‘framing.’
PUA stands for pick-up artists.By constantly advertising the idea that black women are at the bottom of the sexual attractiveness heap and saying nobody wants them, they become MUCH easier to get because they feel “lucky” that anyone wants them. This is really a strategy designed to produce easy sexual access to black women for white males.
I once moved into a group house years ago and it took almost six months before it finally hit me that the black female and white male were f*cking. They
were so good at keeping it discrete (the white male’s choice, no doubt).
If a white male wants to have sex with a black female she should FORCE him to be VISIBLE WITH HER.
That means public displays of affection, meeting white mom and dad. Otherwise, she is being treated like a prostitute.” J.W. — black male blogger, 45
—
By NO means am I saying all or most black females fit into any one category, but there is no point in denying that the white media is attempting (and to a degree SUCCEEDING) in doing a HEAD JOB on black females in an attempt to trash our self-esteem. We’ve all seen one negative article after another about black females and HIV, how we can’t find a husband, how we are the least attractive, how big our butts are, etc.
AND
keep in mind that comment that V8driver made earlier
“more bounce to the ounce”
and I bet had a black male said that about white females in general OR his sister or daughter, he’d take that as an INSULT
wake up, black queens, before you even THINK about becoming a white man’s w**re — like we were FORCED to be during slavery
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@ v8 driver who said,
“v8driver
@TrojanPam
“More bounce to the ounce” well with abagond’s posts about booty etc., I am
that’s racist because i’m attracted to black women? now i’ve heard everything, yo.have a great day!
—
ME: white males being SEXUALLY ATTRACTED to black females is nothing new. I think all the different complexions of blacks who descended from slavery is a testimony to the white male’s LUST for black females — even while he is practicing racism/white supremacy.
I think it is up to the black ladies to determine whether your inappropriate for a white male reference to black females having “more bounce to the ounce” was typical of the type of disrespect shown by white males toward black females.
As a younger black female, I have had white male STRANGERS put their hand on my butt and once, while getting a chiropractic treatment from a white male intern, he called in some of his white male buddy interns to take a look at my butt while I was lying — UNAWARE– on my stomach.
so I KNOW all about all the great RESPECT shown by white males when it comes to the bodies and sexuality of black females
I watched an attractive, educated black female friend go from one white male to the other, they would take her out to dinner and ‘act nice” and after maybe, 3 or 4 or maybe 5 or 6 “dates” that would be the END of her
and NONE of them took her seriously and it used to PAIN me to see how clueless she was, that these white males were USING her but that was her choice. Nothing I could do about it
BUT that same “admiration” is often a mask for racist white males to USE black females SEXUALLY and the FACT is MOST of these so-called WHITE MALE ADMIRERS would not even consider marrying one of us and having children with us
that’s why you don’t see that many black females with children who have a white male for a parent as in the reverse. And I’m sure a certain of the black females having abortions were impregnated by white males but due to him being white, a lot of black females are too intimidated to take him to court for support OR to let anyone know they were SEXUALLY USED by a white male and do not want to bear (or birth) the EVIDENCE
(oh yes, sisters have a LOT of secrets when it comes to sex with white males)
that is why many white males WAIT until they are PAST the typical child-rearing age and have already HAD their children with a white female to come our way —
haven’t you noticed that ladies, that most of the white males that hit on you are often past the age of 45 or older?
And EVERY white male over the age of 21 KNOWS what I’m talking about when it comes to what the AVERAGE white male THINKS of black females, so you acting all innocent of what I’m really saying just won’t fly here.
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Far as i am concerned, a white man or woman, messaging or emailing a black man or woman on a dating site, means absolutely nothing!
So what, they contact us in a impersonal way on the down low and always want to meet us at a hotel, when they happen to be on a “business trip”
We as black people are simply, play toys for white people.
when they are not stepping on our neck in some way shape or form, they are having sex with us.
I feel my black women are more vulnerable to this from white men, than black men are from white women, being most black men ( not all because i am not one of them ) with screw any female they can.
Black women, being women, want more than just sex. They want marriage and commitment, this is what white men use to lure the black woman.
I think most black women, look at how white men, marry and take care of their white women and think the white man, will extend this to her, this is where she is so wrong, its a fallacy that a lot of black women, find out after the fact.
I also feel, that most black women, compare white men to black men and use a white man as a measuring tool and say, “white men are more of a catch, then black men, being white men are more educated, earn more money and came from money” so i will date only white men. That is very unfair in my opinion, simply because of the white supremacist dynamic, that exists.
Black women, should not hold up a white man and say, look at the white man, why can’t black men be more like them in terms of education,money,status ect… I think i need not, explain why this is so wrong in so many ways.
They look at the house with the white Pickett fence, the two cars, the dog and cat and say, i want that for me. which is fine for a black woman or any woman to want for that matter.
The fact that white men, will marry a white woman, have white children, get a divorce and then all of a sudden, want a black woman?? That’s suspect to me…
I mean, i can see if a white woman or white man, actually had children with a black person, they get a little lead way and i wouldn’t question their motives as much but most have white children, so there is no way to tell, if they have a hidden, agenda.
White men, know the racism that black people and other people of color, go through, do you think for a new york minute, that he would want that for any of his children? Hell to the no!!
He wants white children, not black children that will be cursed under, white supremacy!
So white men dangle promises of marriage, children and being taken care of in from of black women.
Most black women, ( Not all but most ) fall for the bait, then when the black women, puts pressure on the white man after they’ve been dating for a year or more, the white man bails on the black woman!
Then guess what happens? The next time that black woman sees him, he’s with a white woman! Then the black woman, realizes that she was just a negro bed wench, all along.
Again, i am not saying all black women but most of them, fall for the kooliad and think white men are so much more, moral than black men.
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@ peanut
Lol craigslist, that site if full of perverts, can’t wait to see what u write.
@ pam
Thaks for the post, yes I noticed that as well, they did a study saying we had the highest self esteem and they can’t have us getting uppity on them. No they gotta put us in our place and tell us we ugly. Its the same tactic customers and abusers use. Some customers will point out flaws in a product to try to talk to price down and get a deal.Abusers will tell their victim that they are worthless and nobody will want them. Or cults use that tactic as well to keep ppl by saying the outside world is worse than this, here u are safe. I know my worth because my dad,uncle, and mother instilled in me who I am and my worth. Sadly I know some black females don’t have that, so they feel the need to twerk or do other degrading things for attention, validation, and affection. It is important for us to know our history and that there were black queens who ruled and there were important black women all throughout history. When we don’t know our worth we let others tell us our value and what to do for their approval. That is a slippery slope in this white supremacist society.
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TrojanPam,
I wrote a comment to you earlier but its in moderation – but I basically stated “that I was Not directing any insults to you, so I apologize if you felt offended” – that was not my intention.
phoebeprunelle,
“asa lama lakum” … after watching the video that you posted, I now know where this rhetoric about “Global White Supremecy” is coming from … I find some things that Minister Louis Farrakhan says interesting as well.
I guess this new, modern day mantra is suppose to unite black and non-white people to fight against their internalized “European indoctrination, inversed racism, colourism, and the general mindf’ck that affects all black/brown society” — we’ve been down this road before in the 60’s and 70’s but from some of the comments I am reading, I guess it doesn’t hurt to continue to inspire.
I’m for whatever it takes for people to find “self-realization” – that’s only one aspect of the battle that black/brown people face – but we are all in different stages of self awareness and actualization…it’s not one size fits all.
But as far as white /European people having the ability to affect, disenfranchise, and control the policy and fiscal lives of black/brown people around the world…things have and continue to change –
they game has already changed… for good or bad, The Chinese are now the Global policy makers who are affecting global change for white and non-white people and those white boys in that video know this…what people can say whatever they like to themselves if it helps them sleep better at night.
the “New World Order” is not in favour of white people and that is what the white Racist Fear and are all screaming about … they already know which way the wind is blowing.
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@ Ms. J and mstoogood4yall
absolutely, there is no “interracial dating” ads on sites and magazines, etc that cater to white people, I suspect, because white people DON’T WANT TO SEE THAT S.
when they have a taste for a little “black stuff” they know where to go:
to a black website or dating site
otherwise, that message that “IR is better” is not designed for them. Most of them aren’t interested in marrying us anyway, so what would be the point?
However they do want BLACK MALES and FEMALES to want them, and to divide and conquer ourselves so the system of white supremacy can continue to function EFFICIENTLY and SMOOTHLY
because ANY black male or female who is lying in bed with a white person is AUTOMATICALLY NEUTRALIZED in the fight for black liberation because even they don’t believe in it
and will spend a great deal of their time and energy defending their CHOICE of a white partner — all of which often leads to a SPLIT PERSONALITY along so-called “racial” lines
where the black person will start BLAMING other black people for being the victims of racism and for the bad things that white people do to them
“If only those (other) n***gers” would act right, white people wouldn’t treat ME so bad”
and they will often wind up more anti-black and black-self-hating
and what could benefit the system of white supremacy more than that?
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@ all the black ladies
ALSO
ever notice how in all the TV shows that a pretty black female will be sexually pursuing a not so attractive white male as though it’s black females who are lusting after white males than the other way around?
because white males pursuing black females GOES AGAINST THE WHITE MALE CONDUCT CODE
where he is NOT supposed to OPENLY acknowledge the black female as equally sexually attractive as white females.
I have experienced AND witnessed this dynamic where a white male will either be SNEAKING PEEKS at me or another black female OR will pretend he doesn’t see that we’re females at all OR will sometimes become hostile in the presence of an attractive female like that goes against his programming
that white is always superior
and then some of those same white males will find a way to sneak up to you at a convention or someplace else to see if you will “visit them in their room” or some other such nonsense.
come on ladies, we’ve ALL experienced the sneaky racist white male on the prowl….
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@ phoebeprunelle
thanks for posting the video
@ abagond
thanks for putting up with all my posts!
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@ sondis
Yeah some black women and men are lost when it comes to this, they stereotype their own. They stereotype white men and women as being the better option and the black man and woman as being the wrong option. I was on a blog about black men not marrying until later in life and I understand it. It takes black men longer to accumulate wealth than white men so some black women will look at it as white men are the better option. men want to be fianacially stable before they enter into a marriage and white men have the upper hand in this area. It don’t matter to me how long it takes a man to get to where he is going so long as he knows where he’s going and has the ambition to get there. Tyler perry movie about a black woman sleeping with a married white man and thinking he was going to leave his wife for her was funny to me. I know a lot of white men view us as toys and can’t stand how they always refer to us as some chocolate this like we a dam candy bar. What do ppl do with candy bars and what are they for? candy bars are to satisfy a sweet tooth ,after that u throw away the wrapper and that’s the end. ITs the same way with black women they use some to satisfy their urge then after that they are thrown away.
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@ wordynerdygirl
@TrojanPam you’ve just cited from Brian Rigg, an internet conspiracy theorist who claims that most of the leading Nazis were, in fact, Jews. Apart from the grossly offensive anti-Semitism of this claim, how can you rely upon such an unreliable source for your information?
—
I have read this over many years from NUMEROUS SOURCES, one of which came from a black male I consider my GURU who has confirmed that
1. Semites were mulattos (mixed race) and were NOT considered white by white Germans
2. Jews are targeted NOT because of religion, they were targeted for the same reason Gypsies, blacks, and other non-whites were targeted in Germany: BECAUSE THEY WERE NOT WHITE
3. There were JEWS involved in the slaughter of (other) Jews during Nazi Germany reign of terror
You are FREE to disagree (or not) but that old TRICK of calling someone “anti-semitism” to shut them up (OR to hide the TRUTH about Jewish collaborators during the Hitler regime)
JUST WON’T WORK
I don’t CARE about those labels, all I care about is the TRUTH and what is the most LOGICAL answers available according to those who have NO AX (or “victimization”) to GRIND.
there have been MANY, MANY, MANY LIES told about the Nazi era and how some Jews that participated in it FOR PROFIT
calling people (like me) “anti-Semitic” doesn’t change ONE thing.
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Yes Maam !!!!!!! You are DEAD Right !!!!!
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mstoogood4yall:
^5 @ what you said to compliment my point… I hear ya sista….
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@ Trojan pam
I said the same thing on another post. That they always show us in shows pursuing white ppl when in real life its the other way around they are the ones initiating things and we either reject or accept. They want to show us as the bad guy like look this black woman threw herself at this poor married white man he had no chance. They want to show us as not being worthy of being approached by men, other shows they show the women being pursued by the man. They are slyly trying to say we are masculine and proposition the man.
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@ wordynerdygirl
FYI — the BOOK I quoted was written by “Christopher Story,
who is the author of “The New Underworld Order”
IT IS YOU — who attached “Brian Rigg” — an “internet conspiracy theorist” to my post which NEVER MENTIONED him
Which to me seems somewhat deceptive attempt to “shame me”
UNLESS you have PROOF that Brian Rigg is somehow connected to “Christopher Story” as a PSEUDONYM
I will assume we should agree to disagree
(without any name-calling or personal accusations, please)
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@ mstoogood4yall
absolutely, the black female is ALWAYS shown as the sexual aggressor of the poor hapless white male in most TV shows where a pretty black actress is shown
when IN REALITY, it is the WHITE MALE who initiates the sexual encounter
I believe they do this for three reasons
1. To REINFORCE the CENTURIES-OLD REPUTATION as the “hot-blooded, black female Jezebel (w**re) who could NOT be raped because she always wanted “it” — meaning the white male slave-owners were NOT sociopathic SERIAL RAPISTS OF BLACK FEMALES –
and that includes the “Father” of our country — George Washington
(keep in mind that 90% of the people in the U.S. with the last name “Washington” are black — where did we get that name from???)
and it includes Thomas Jefferson who was a SERIAL RAPIST and RAPED Sally Hemmings, a black female slave — but the white “his-storians” painted it as a CONSENSUAL “romantic” relationship”
how in the H is that possible when he kept her as a SLAVE? what choice does a SLAVE have to say yes or no to her “master’s” sexual overtures of RAPE?
how freaking ridiculous AND racist to paint her Victimization as a “romance”
2. to maintain the WHITE MALE CONDUCT CODE that no white male should EVER put a black or non-white female above a white female and in those instances where he slips off his superior “pedestal” and actually engages in sexual intercourse with a non-white female
let it be understood that it was NOT his idea and he just had a weak moment like any man would when presented with free and easy NOOKY
3. to further alienate the black male as he watches the SHAMELESS black female throw herself at the white male — once again confirming in the disgusted black male’s MIND
that the black female is exactly what the white male has been calling her for hundreds of years
a white man’s w**re” (just add an “h” and an “o” and you spell out the word
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@ sondis
who said: “We as black people are simply, play toys for white people. when they are not stepping on our neck in some way shape or form, they are having sex with us.”
AMEN
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TrojanPam:
AMEN sista!
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@ Linda
We all get a little passionate when defending our opinions. Thanks for acknowledging it
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@ phoebeprunelle — who said, “I think it is very easy to use the terms “anti-Semetic when uncomfortable truths are exposed…Anti-Semitism just like racism is creating laws and public policy that discriminates against people based on color.. True anti-Semitism were the laws created by white Germans that
Forbade Jews to use typewrites, ride bicycles, become employed in public sectors such as teach in government ran schools, work as doctors or dentist in state run hospitals and prevented them to work as judges and lawyers…the laws also forbade them to sit for university exams…
So nothing Trojan Pam has done is anti-Semetic
—
ABSOLUTELY — it is a SHAMING mechanism to quiet ALL DISCOURSE and discussion that someone doesn’t like.
I also agree with your description of how so-called ‘anti-semitism’ was practiced in Germany. I have done NONE of those things, I simply VOICED my opinion.
Let the record of WHAT the German Nazis really were against. I don’t think you’ll see much about “religion”
of course, I could be incorrect about that point, but the MAIN goal was to eliminate NON-whites aka ‘racially impure” people.
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@ Legion who said, “There’s a time for “rudeness” and a time to keep from being “rude”.* We’re adults and you have to decide when it needs to be done.
—
Please educate me as to when it’s appropriate (or even necessary) to be “rude” to another posting who is simply posting their opinion that you disagree with — and that poster has not been rude to you
and what that has to do with being “an adult”
(frankly, admitting to being rude and offering an apology was more adult — in my opinion)
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@ Pam
And I know it really messes with black men’s minds when shows like scandal come on and some black women will defend it when the black men try to point out the stereotypes in it. White men will sleep with non white women but u will never hear them say they are better, yet some black ppl will say a white person is better when they date out. And also when a white man says something about black womens bodies or how they are sexually some black women take it as a compliment. I remember reading an article about a white rapper or something saying black women give better head than white women, and some black women were co signing that bs. Some are so starved for attention that when a man degrades them they feel like wow he notices me. Notice whenever a white person says what they like about black men or black women its always physical and they say things like I like their chocolate skin, their lips, etc. I don’t like being compared to chocolate by them because 1 chocolate is not a necessity 2 ppl can live without chocolate 3 ppl like chocolate to satisfy a sweet tooth and don’t eat it everyday.4 Chocolate is a WANT not a need.
Water is a need and ppl need it to survive. Its the same with white men wanting black women its usually to satisfy a sweet tooth and view us not as a necessity but as extra, replaceable. They don’t really end up marrying a black woman, and aren’t around her everyday just when they want her. They treat white women like water, they need her not just want her, and treat her as such by marrying her and being around her.
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@ sondis
I have also noticed that older White males will marry a middle-aged Black female long AFTER he’s had his White wife, children, and grandchildren. So even if they have a Black partner towards the end of their life, one can assume that their wealth will stay in the White community. In contrast, the White female will have children with a Black man who she’ll most likely divorce, take his money, and raise their non-White children who may end up White-identified.
@ Peanut
I get messages from White males all the time too on my online dating profile, but I just ignore what they send me. I just have a feeling that they wouldn’t approach me out in public, but they feel safe doing it on the Internet because other Whites aren’t watching. Even when I liked White men in the past, I knew deep down that they would never approach me, and that it would probably work against my interest if I approached them. I don’t even think most Black people would approach Whites to pursue these relationships. And I suspect that the White person would ignore them if they did.
To All Black Women:
I would caution us to be careful in assuming European men are less “prejudiced” or “racist” than White-American men. I think it’s common knowledge by now that White-Americans came from Europe in the first place. Also, the Europeans have their share of non-White foreigners who they openly despise. A lot of these men could presumably be in support of the mistreatment meted out to African and Middle Eastern immigrants in their countries because of the widespread fear of “multiculturalism” across the EU. So while the European male may not understand certain nuisances of race that we have in the States, they still have White privileges over POC both in and out of their countries. Otherwise, Western nations wouldn’t be so powerful like they are now after colonizing people and resources who are now running back to the West for help.
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@ B. R. — who said, “not one black woman I have ever had a relationship with has ever done it to be validated by a white man…this is the Freud/Fannon/Femininst activist rheteroic you are buying into…basicly a western concept…psycho analysis…Ill say it again, not one black woman Ive been with or been around ever went with white men for validation.”
—
first of all,
I think it is VERY telling that you – as a white male — think you can SPEAK for what is in the heart and mind of a black female and feel comfortable enough to actually post it
Also, those black females who are seeking white male validation don’t always know that’s what they’re doing. Many black people are confused about racism, how it is practiced BY white people – especially in the bedroom — and that they are often ACTING out of a Brainwashing that has been perpetrated on them all their lives
secondly
I am NOT speaking out of some white female “Freud/Fannon/Feminist/ Activist/Rhetoric
(whew, that was a bucketful of words) because I don’t even know what that is
it really astounds me when someone I’ve NEVER met, tries to tell me what my frame of reference is based on some literature written by a white person — that FRANKLY, I don’t even buy into
I am not an admirer of Freud, seeing that he was a COKE HEAD and I have personally NEVER met a black female that wanted to sleep with her father OR a black male that secretly longed for his mother
I suspect that pathology is a EUROPEAN one, like many others
so please either agree or disagree and present YOUR point of view, do NOT attempt to present MINE for ME. I am NOT a white female, and I am NOT a feminist.
I am a person who practices — to the best of my ability — COUNTER-RACISM and my goal is to help other victims of white supremacy ANALYZE and UNDERSTAND how this system functions AND how white people practice it
BOTH IN AND OUT OF THE BEDROOM
That is MY FRAME of reference — and you got that DIRECTLY FROM ME.
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@ mstoogood4yall
I agree with your last post and that goes back to what Josh Wickett called
“Framing”
destroying the self-esteem of your potential target (a female) — in this case, a black female
by making her feel undesirable
and then she will be MORE open to a man’s advances when he pays attentiion to her or flatters her
in our case the white media worked OVERTIME to convince black females that black males didn’t want us — even though the VAST MAJORITY of black males date and marry black females
and due to this and other social factors this set the STAGE — along with the white media (that OWNS the biggest and most popular “black” websites — plastered them with articles and ads about dating “white men”
and NOT understanding racism/white supremacy in its most refined forms
many black females FELL FOR THE CON GAME of thinking ALL these white males were out there JUST DYING to MEET, MIX, MINGLE and MARRY US
NOT
they have always been highly motivated to SEX us and some may even take us out on a date or two or three and call us “my black girlfriend”
but MOST — including the ONES POSTING ON THIS BLOG
will probably NEVER MARRY A BLACK FEMALE OR VOLUNTARILY HAVE CHILDREN WITH US
THAT is the REALITY we should keep in mind
I don’t say any of this to CONDEMN black females or black females who date non-black males
I would say to them, white males aren’t the only option, there are other non-white males you should consider FIRST
before engaging in sex with the same people who BENEFIT and PRACTICE WHITE SUPREMACY AND WILL PRACTICE ON YOUR CHILDREN AND THEIR CHILDREN AND THEIR CHILDREN
that’s what I’m saying
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Ms. J:
Good point to compliment mine. I’ve said this before also…
You normally see older white men and women, that are over weight, look old and unattractive and therefore, not caring too much about what society thinks about them, being with a black person.
When they were younger, they wouldn’t have been caught dead with a black person but in old age, they don’t have as many options as they did in their youth and their own white people don’t want them anymore.
The black people are normally, one to two times, younger than they are.
I rarely see a young, attractive, rich white male or woman, with a black person, being they are at a stage in their life, where being scene with a black person, will hurt their stature and job prospects .
So when i tell you, when it comes to white people, dating black people, there is ALWAYS an agenda, either way you slice it and dice it.
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@ Sondis and Ms. J. I concur with those statements as well.
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TrojanPam:
whew! girl you are on a cinnamon roll, today! ^_^
*takes a bite out of cinnamon roll
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@ Sondis and Ms J. And a black woman should never be flattered by that. It’s is really offensive.
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Mary burrel, i acknowledge the fact, that you concur. *_*
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mary burrell:
indeed it is, offensive but its all apart of our sickness of being, brainwashed for so long.
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@ B. R. who said, “Look, people who are repelled at the thought of a touch from a white person because they remind them of 400 years of slavery and being raped, should definitly not get into an interracial relationship.”
—
That is NOT the main point. HAD racism/white supremacy ENDED with the (false) emancipation of African slaves in the U.S., we would probably NOT be having this conversation
the REALITY is — that whites CONTINUED IT AFTER THAT AND CONTINUE IT TO THIS DAY
Slavery is the GENESIS of racist oppression for blacks in America so to NOT mention it is the same as asking JEWS not to talk about the HOLOCAUST (which they do continually) when talking about anti-semitism in Germany
It is a historical FACT and a FOUNDATION for today’s racism in the U.S.
and the DAMAGE that was done over a 400 year period — like a kind of Stockholm Syndrome carried out OVER a 500 year period — including 100 years AFTER SLAVERY of racist oppression by whites
has created the KIND OF CONFUSED BLACK MINDS that would LAY DOWN WITH THE SAME PEOPLE WHO OPPRESSED THEIR ANCESTORS FOR 400 YEARS
and are STILL OPPRESSING black people today and call that
“black progress”
that is the point of talking about slavery
to start at the beginning of BLACK PSYCHOLOGICAL DEVASTATION
not just to hold a 400 year old “grudge”
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@Mr J,
There is a blog called Blackgirlinberlin.com where a young Black lady who lives in Germany talks about how white European men mistake well-dressed, attractive Black women for prostitutes all the time.. (WTH!)
I am not saying that ALL white European men who approach Black women are like this–but i hear the horror stories coming from Brothers and Sisters living in european countries…
One Brother i talked to was like many German women tried to get with him and he had a relationship with several, but he said they were just like the German men towards Black women–they see you as a sexual other and will make comments like “I want to f a Black man tonight” (WTH!) or “is it true that Black women are wild in bed?” (that question he says came from a German woman he was dating!!!???)
@Linda,
lol, i think the white guy in the video did not want his face showing because he felt he was “betraying” himself by telling what he knows.
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@ phoebeprunelle
I have received so many emails and personal stories from black males AND females who have been VICTIMIZED and DECEIVED by having sex with whites.
there’s a fascinating (and sickeningly sad) article called
“Meet the Mandingos”
http://www.details.com/sex-relationships/sex-and-other-releases/200703/meet-the-mandingos
I would strongly SUGGEST all black males read this and see how SEX is used by racist whites to degrade and dehumanize black people
in this article, the Victims are black males and when you read their comments it is easy to understand the LEVEL of psychological damage that exists to allow someone who DESPISES YOU — to USE your precious body while PRACTICING RACISM on you
which is why I tell black males all the time, a white female treating you like a “black stud” (a sex toy and inanimate, unfeeling, less than human object)
IS NOT A COMPLIMENT
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@ sondis
I guess I had my blacka vitamins today!
I appreciate your commentary as well — and those of all the others who are trying to help other Victims understand that RACISM and SEX go hand in hand
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TrojanPam:
On a lighter note, are you going to watch the spurs and heat in game 2 of the NBA finals, tonight on ABC?, if so, who are you rooting for? @ : o O ) >
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@Adeen
If you feel comfortable dating white guys go ahead, if the potential for conflict and stress doesn’t seem worth it, than don’t.
If you think they are just using you, don’t, unless you just want to use them in return.
If you think the only reason you might want to date white men is due to internalized racism, than it would be advaisable not to date out then as well.
@white supremecy
The problem with the ideas around white supremecy always assume things are done while being thought out or planned and not more often as a result of generalized bias.
If you work under the assumption the writers of the TV shows actually think black women are more masculine and are racist, exactly how would they write black men and women?
It wouldn’t require an intention to frame them as desperate or anything like that. It simply requires bias and racism.
White Supremecy people seem to have the same kind of thought process for the government and groups in control that conspiracy people do, and they give them way too much credit and competency to be honest.
Do white people come off as that smart, controlled and well planned to you? Because they don’t to me and I am one.
I’m not saying there isn’t bigotry, racism, bias or laws and aspects of the government set up to hassle PoC more than white people, because well obviously there are.
There’s also another problem with this mode of thought, the powerful never give away power.
Generally true but then how do you explain the gains of civil and legal rights, black politicians, the increase of black wealth, black billionaires etc….?
Money is power, politics is power, if black people are as helpless as you say, than how have they made these gains?
I mean the powerful didn’t give it to them, but at the same time they are “helpless” it seems like a paradox to me.
The powerful even having to play along with the idea of a black president is a huge drop and loss in power.
@Trojanpam
Obama doesn’t get the respect he deserves from his contemparies but he still has power that is innate to his position.
Before he had to think about getting re-elected, but now that he doesn’t how many people have made comments this term?
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@ sondis
hope you read the Meet the Mandingos’ article and share it with other black males and females
AND
on a lighter note, no, I’m not into televised sports,
I’d rather watch some black men sweat on the court up close and personal in real time!
(( rubbing hands together in anticipation ))
and with that, I think I have said all I have to say and so will give everyone a break from my opinions
and get back to my own blog and the novel I’m working on
(it’s so much fun to make stuff up and not have some eagle-eyed poster like Cornlia and Legion and B.R. ask me for sources — just joking 🙂
have a good evening, everyone
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@ V-4
I’ll respond and then I’m going to enjoy the rest of my evening
You said, “Obama doesn’t get the respect he deserves from his contemparies but he still has power that is innate to his position. Before he had to think about getting re-elected, but now that he doesn’t how many people have made comments this term?”
—
In my opinion, there is NO INNATE POWER to a “title”
the people who GIVE someone that TITLE are the ones with all the power — and the POWER to take it away
Obama is simply signing the bills put in front of him — the same as Geo Bush, Jr. did.
He does NOT write the bills, he doesn’t even write his own speeches,
He does NOT control the banks (who got all the money they wanted WITHOUT being accountable for how and where it was spent)
He did NOT write the so-called “Obamacare” bill, the Health care industry wrote it AND “donated” over $100 million to the pasage of it
(what does that tell you?)
Obama’s inner circle are some of the same BANKSTERS from the Clinton administration
including former Federal reserve presidents and Goldman Sachs kingpins
President Obama DID NOT
nominate himself
vette himself
employ himself
finance himself
or (s)elect himself
The people who did all the above CONTROL the White House
and if you doubt that, digest this
EVERY SINGLE PIECE OF LEGISLATION THAT THE BUSH ADMINISTRATION PASSED THAT WAS UP FOR RENEWAL WAS EITHER RENEWED OR EXPANDED DURING THE OBAMA ADMINISTRATION
NO WHITE PERSON in the political arena fears President Obama OR his wife
that is why a federal judge said his momma had sex with a dog
and why the Governor of Arizona (Jan Brewer) wagged her finger in his face and all he could do was grin
and why he had to PERSONALLY CALL a lowly white male cop civil servant and APOLOGIZE on NATIONAL TV for criticizing the police
and why a white male Senator (forgot his name) stood up in the Senate and pointed a finger at President Obama and said
“You lie!”
and why a Congressman said First Lady Michelle “had a big butt”
and on and on and on and on and on
When people have REAL POWER (that they TOOK from those who have it)
people FEAR them because they know there will be CONSEQUENCES if they displease or cross them
NO ONE IS AFRAID OF OBAMA
THAT IS NOT WHAT REAL POWER LOOKS LIKE
And those who do not understand that, I suggest they study more about history and power and how people really get it
it will NOT resemble the farce and dog and pony show called “U.S. elections”
have a good evening
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@ V-4
I forgot to include
regarding “black” politicians and “rich blacks”
it is easy to see that they are STILL being victimized by racism and racists
and most black politicians are being systematically REMOVED from office, and at one time ALL Congressmen under indictment OR being investigated were BLACK — despite black congressmen and women constituting less than 10 percent of the total
how does that happen that only black congressmen and women are under indictment in one of the most corrupt government bodies in the world?
regarding “rich blacks’
all of them got their RICHES from white people
for example, Oprah Winfrey got her show from white people, her sponsors were white companies and the people who decided her show would become syndicated — making her rich — were white people
at any given time, Oprah, had to have the PERMISSION of powerful white people to become RICH
therefore, MONEY is NOT POWER
but all POWERFUL PEOPLE HAVE MONEY
it’s the people who SIGN Michael Jordan’s CHECK that have the real money
it’s the people who PUT ON the OPRAH SHOW that have the real money and power
and the main purpose of “black showcasing” — showing large numbers of blacks making money
is to FOOL the OPPRESSED BLACK MASSES that racism is going away and these “rich blacks” are proof
it’s all about DECEPTION
plus the FACT that talented black people make their white bosses and benefactors a lot of money, more money than those “rich blacks” will ever make in ten lifetimes
I’ve done my best to explain and now I’m gone
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Peanut, I think that you might be a little naïve with that “black men prefer black women” line. Black women (not all) tend to praise black men and like to think of us a community but that is not the case. Black women love black men waaaaay more than black men love black women. Yes it is painful but it is the truth whether you want to accept it or not. I live on a street with three black men married or living with white women. There was a bw/wm couple that lived on my street but they moved to an even more affluent area. The bm/ww couples have black men that are not that desirable. Now we can go back and forth about how black men feel about black women. You must live in the hood. If you go anywhere outside of the hood, you see nothing but bm/ww couples everywhere you go. Black women keep their heads in the sand but if you really want to know how black men feel…..follow the money trail…drops mike and walks away…..
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@ sondis
I live in san Antonio these ppl don’t play when it comes to the spurs they will run someone off the road or beat someone up if u go against them. I don’t care who wins but the game is on almost every tv in my house lol.
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@TrojanPam
All that really confirms is that the Presidents support the elite, in that position he was no weaker or better than the other Presidents.
Just lately someone tried to heckle Michelle Obama and she put them in their place.
And just having to play along with the idea that a PoC can be President is a severe drop in power to the white surpremecy.
For that matter; those in power tried to get rid of him the second election via the southern strategy and failed.
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wow, Peanut doesn’t live in the hood if u follow her blog you’d know she grew up in a predominately white area. Its crazy when ppl come in here stereotyping ppl just because of the different views they have.
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mstoogood4yall:
Whew, good thing i’m rooting for the spurs and I’m on the east coast! I should be rooting for the heat but i don’t care about that. ^_^
Enjoy the game!
TrojanPam:
Enjoy your break, you deserve it! ^_^
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@Tara, you do know that according to the latest U.S. Census (2012), this year’s hasn’t come out yet,
Over 90% of Black men who are married have Black wives..
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@TrojanPam
Money is power; it allows lawyers to be paid, doctors, schools to be funded, organizations and causes to be funded, media to be created…in a capitialistic society such as the US, money is the embodiment of power.
It all comes back to what I was saying; if black people are helpless and power doesn’t give away power….than how was the gain in civil, economic and legal rights possible, why does the white supremecy have to “pretend” to the world that a black man is their boss, thats a huge loss of face for a powerful organization of that matter.
Why do white supremecy organizations now “have” to allow PoC into them?
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Most of the men I have dated have been non-Black. In fact, when I have joined dating sites, I get far more responses from White men than Black. However, this may be due to my skin color. Also, White men in Europe tend to enjoy dating Black women, unlike the rednecks here in the USA. OK keeps going on and on about how Black men have it easier when they actually do not. Asian women sure don’t want them, only White women who have mostly been rejected by White men. I certainly would not give a Black man the time of day.
Besides, Abagond – why do YOU keep harping on White Men/Black Women when it is Black men who chase after White women like the desperate dogs they are?
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that’s an easy question to answer !!! Money is NOT Power because the white supremacist MAKES the money, determine the WORTH of such money and DIRECT the flow of such money GLOBALLY. Second, when the shit about to hit the fan that when they finally decide to have a black POTUS, make no mistake, President is the SMOKING GUN. Mr. Obama bout to take the heat for all the ills of the white supremacy, Cant you feel it ????
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WTF !!! I thought Peanut was a dude, I am confused ??? So MANY Postings on this volatile topic I am having trouble keeping up with who is saying what, Oh Lawd forgive me….
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EXCELLENT Resonse Pam, I couldn’t have said it any better. You laid it on the line. If people stil;l want to equate power with money concerning non white people- well it be because they FAIL to understand racism, what it is and HOW it works !!!
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@ c.andrews
came back (had a weak moment)
regarding power, I explained it the best I can that MONEY and POWER are NOT synonymous
another example
are the little people who have say, ten million invested in the stock market
BUT the people with the REAL POWER can make that market CRASH and turn ten million into ten thousand
Now, that is POWER
they did it during the Great Depression and they can and will do it again
There are so many examples that prove that MONEY and POWER are different
but I’m not spending my entire evening trying to convince anyone of the difference
it is what it is
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@c.andrews
And the white supremecists that makes and determines the value of money, determines money to have a lot of value, more so than anything else.
Having more money means having more resources, by default it means having access to resources and power unavailable to them before.
A black person that is a billionaire, even if he doesn’t have the power of a white billionaire is still one of the most powerful people on the face of the planet.
Or do you think a black billionaire leads the same life as a middle class black person and has no greater power than them?
Obama is “the” single most powerful individual on the face of the planet.
You also failed to address the other questions I put forth.
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@TrojanPam
Can a black person do more with ten grand than they can ten million?
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@ Tara
The only thing you said that I can remotely agree on is it depends on where you live and frankly you are naive to believe living in the ghetto is the only place you will see black men black women couples. My uncle is a well off black male who owns his own business and white is a phd holding business woman herself. In fact I know many like him. In the supposed ghetto on the other hand I constantly see white men and black women or black men and white women.
@ Paranormal Skeptic
“Asian women sure don’t want them, only White women who have mostly been rejected by White men.”—I think it would help if you better research this notion before writing about something you know little or nothing about. It is easy to make comments based on your experience and I will respect your experience, but to make an assumption on the majority based on your experience is just ignorant.
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correction wife*
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And I agree with whoever said the the matching is usually the goofy white guy and black woman.
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well let us follow logic, a black billionaire may have more tangible items than a middle class or poor black but you cannot equate that with TRUE power. sadly in the end all mistah Charlie see is you a shiftless negro no matter how much money you have. Take Oprah Winfrey, when she was in London she was denied admittance to their top store Herrod until a few calls were made to explain she was a special negress, During Hurricane Katrina did it strike you as odd that not a single rich powerful black could hire planes to clear the people out of there, maybe all the people could not be saved but i never saw any blacks having the power to make the government act with justice. You said “Obama is “the” single most powerful individual on the face of the planet.” You have got to be kidding is all i have to say and I dont know what your other question is but in the end Power and Money are not synonomous under the sys tem of white supremacy and if you still think it is then you have drunk too much koolaid…….
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Maybe you can watch this here video and tell me that you still think blacks with money have power, the black guy in the video could have very well been Obama’s son for all these people knew, check out how he was treated….http://www.upworthy.com/know-anyone-that-thinks-racial-profiling-is-exaggerated-watch-this-and-tell-me-when-your-jaw-drops-2?g=4&c=bl3
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Why is it some women hate to be disrespected by men but will blatantly diss men and call them animals and dogs? some may act like it but some women act like a u know what as well. Or ppl who stereotype all black men and women as being desperate, ignoring the fact that white men and women have been the ones chasing after us and are the ones who make these images and put it in front of us. Black ppl aren’t the ones making all these interracial shows and movies portraying us as the chaser. Who is desperate and chasing who ?when it is not blacks that own all these dating websites or media.
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@c.andrews
And would a middle class black person have the leverage to get those calls made?
No; the middle class black person wouldn’t have the power to do so.
That illustrates my point exactly, money, wealth and position can get black people into places that the lack of would keep them out.
Having more money doesn’t just mean more material possesions it means more social power.
A black person with ten million can “do” more than one with ten “grand”.
The black elite didn’t hire planes to ship people out because they didn’t care too.
As single individuals go; its true, no one person in existance has more power than Obama does right now.
Your equating not having as much power as you would like or perfer or not getting as much as whites would in a similiar scenario as “lacking” power.
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@c.andrews
That video doesn’t change my mind about this debate but it certainly points out the iffyness of crime statistics.
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@ sondis
Maybe next time the spurs can do something lol. The heat was straight dunking on yall.
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You be dead wrong on this, listen up , do you recall when a good friend of Obama’s Henry Louis Gates got arrested in his own home cause He was fumbling with the keys to his door and a white neighbor called the popo of a possible break in?? Louis Gates is a wealthy esteemed black scholar at Harvard University in case you need reminding. Do you know what happened next- he was arrested and treated like a common nigga by this racist suspect cop. Of course after Profeesor Gates was taken thru hell all charges were dropped. Obama made a very simple statement to the effect it was idiotic to lock a person up after it was clearly identified they were the legal homeowner. Mistah Charlie made sure Obama ate his words. The police started bad mouthing Obama and caused such a media ruckus that Obama finally apologized to the white srresting officer and invited him and Prferrsor Gates to the whitehouse for a beer !!!the Officer NEVER apologized for locking up a homeowner in they own house….What about that white woman Jan govenor of Arizona I believe wagging her finger in Obama’s face with impunity and the judge who circulated vicious email about Obama mama having sex with dogs and lastly , the consitution still say we blacks are only 3/5 human. Come again with that ish that blacks with money have power…….
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mstoogood4yall:
The heat did, what they are suppose to do at home, win! They actually was suppose to win, the first game.
I knew they would win tonight, now its the spurs turn to have home court. ^_^
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Yeah we’ll see next week. Its anybodys game, last spurs game tony did great with that last shot fell down got back up and made a three at the last second.
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Awwww Lawdy, you be one of them real hardheadz, , Yiu in some deep denial, Imma leave it alone……
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mstoogood4yall:
Tony Parker, didn’t make a 3, it was a 2 pointer.
The spurs proved, they can beat the heat on their home court, now its the heat’s turn to prove they can beat the spurs at home.
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@ sondis
Rofl, u right. I know something wrong with me when I can’t see it was a 2 pointer and not a 3, maybe ur one good eye is better than my 2 ok eyes
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mstoogood4yall:
lmfao @ my one good eye is better. ^_^
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I don’t care who wins, either way it will be a hella a game
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I don’t care so much, either. I just have to root for a team for me to get into it.
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sondis what u think about the new header on this blog. I can’t tell if that person trying to whisper in her ear is a man or a woman lol. But she lookin like ninja please, I don’t have time for this, he/she lookin like hey lil momma lemme me whisper in your ear tell you something that u might like to hear[ in my ying yang twins voice} lol
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First off, that’s a female whispering in that sistas’s ear. I can tell by the slender neck and her profile of the right of her face.
I think she is schoolin the sista on how to stay away from the white man, sexually. ^_^
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^ lmbao
Yeah she probably is but that woman ain’t having it she lookin like *sigh* I don’t wanna hear this black stuff right now
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@ sondis
dangit u beat me again with ur one good eye I thought it was a woman but sometimes u never know.
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mstoogood4yall:
lol yeah, whoever that sistas is, she whispering too, if fine as wine, too.!
I’d holla fo a dolla… ^_^
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@ peanut
I think she gone now, she need to bring her stereotyping arse back in here and pic up that mic she dropped lol
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@ sondis
You always hollering fo a dolla,
Here take this cyber dollar and buy something for urself
*hands over a crisp dollar bill* DOn’t spend it all in one place
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mstoogood4yall:
LMFAO! *takes dolla and folds it in half, sticks it in my pocket. ^_^
You hookin a brotha up, sista!
A brotha in need, is a friend indeed…. 😀
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^ hahahaha
Don’t go wastin that good dolla on mcdonalds or a strip club ok.
Sondis what is ur zodiac sign
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mstoogood4yall:
I’m a Capricorn…
what’s yours?
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I’m a pisces
My dad is a Capricorn too,,,,,
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A whole page in my email box…
Time to delete some “off topic”, Abagond ! 😉
You guys just make me laugh (in a kind manner) sometimes !
(You can delete that one too, Abagond, kind of irrelevant too)
Er, maybe not. Here is a brief remark on all this. All I can gather from this is that America(ns) love judging other people without knowing them. Really. So much “I know you I know who you are just by looking at you”. It’s all over the place here. From all sides. Both sides sound so much the same it’s very interesting. Good stuff for sociologists and psychologists.
It’s not better in other ways in Europe. But not that one. It can be tiresome. I’m gone, stuff to pack.
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mstoogood4yall:
My father is Pisces, too. ^_^
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Refusing to see white men as potential boyfriends or husbands isn’t going to prevent you from being objectified and abused. Plenty of this goes on in same race relationships.
Using the same logic you could say black women shouldn’t date black men. Or women shouldn’t date men at all. Or nobody should date no one.
Your best bet is to see people as individuals and not a race. That’s why you don’t just jump in the sack with someone, if you are looking for more than sex. Get to know them and their intentions will become apparent.
There’s always a risk that other person is going to turn out to be a loser. But the possibility of finding love is worth the risk.
The idea that I was supposed to say to my husband, “I really like you and think we have an amazing connection that I’ve never felt before, but I’m gonna have to pass so that I can wait on a black man to show up and sweep me off my feet.”, is pretty ridiculous.
Part of the reason there is a focus on telling black women to date out is because there just aren’t enough black men. With prison and the significant amount of black men who date out there just isn’t enough of them. I didn’t include homosexuality because the rates of homosexuality are probably similar for black women.
If part of the reason is that black men are dating out, I don’t believe it nefarious to suggest black women be open to it as well.
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Awesome, lol team pisces.
I kinda hope the spurs win so I won’t have to cook my brother dinner if the heat wins.lol
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Peanut wtf.
I thought u already did with ur emailing and what not. lol I can’t have ur leftovers.
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mstoogood4yall:
LMFAO!! nice one, caught Peanut with a cross hook with that come back! hahah
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^ lol now she silent awkward
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@ Cornlia
I am not saying this to be rude but I really just need to point something out to you.
“All I can gather from this is that America(ns) love judging other people without knowing them.”— See this statement you made. A prime example of you judging people without really knowing them. You are quick to make such statements and are equally as quick to ignore when you do some of the things you make statements on as if what you are doing has some what become Superior to others.
Granted I don’t usually go on the defense for American culture but I also am no fan of hypocritical statements. Again I am not saying it to be rude or shame you but rather to point out something.
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If I am wrong or took it the wrong way then I apologize in advance but to me you come off that way at times.
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@ mstoogood4yall
“@ peanut
I think she gone now, she need to bring her stereotyping arse back in here and pic up that mic she dropped lol”—ROFL
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@ Solesearch
“Your best bet is to see people as individuals and not a race.”—I agree with that. On one end I can see where some are coming from but when it comes down to it…..I had to ask myself…wait for that black man or open myself up to find love where it may come?
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I am not saying this out of void, Sharina.
M husband and my children have been living in the US for two years now and have come to the same conclusion in each their environment. My husband at work (very difficult to navigate the hypocrisy, much more than in France) and my kids are amazed at the level of judgment and attempt at putting people in boxes at school.
I don’t really understand what it is that you’re telling me you are “pointing to”. I know the US, I used to live here and I live here again. It was actually very interesting to see the US from some time ago and again now. When you are older you have another perspective on things. When I left the US to France the first time, I had another, very critical take on my own country and culture. I will again, when I go back.
This American attitude that consist in judging others that way is also part of the Protestant attitude that consists in wanting to know everything about people.
It’s visible in American houses: you can see almost everything inside (first, there are no hedges and very few barriers or fences. There is not much personality in the architecture. They all look the same – people also adopt extremely uniformed attitudes, in behavior, clothing, hairdoes, etc, but it varies depending on the regions). As a matter of fact, it looks as if you are supposed to be able to look and see what’s inside houses, and decide on whether it’s in accordance with the standards on not.
Same thing with people. Other people scrutinize you and want to be able to classify and label you.
I’m not reproaching it to anyone, I’m just saying this is what I and the rest of my family noticed (my kids quite shocked about it -like these kids in school telling others “nobody likes you” 0___0) and other non-Americans too. It’s noticeable on the net too. People want to know what “group” you belong to, so they can decide on whether what you’re saying is in accordance with it or not. And then decide that you have a problem because you don’t want to belong where you “should”.
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One thing I find strange is how people will call someone attracted to black women as someone with a fetish. Well; someone not themselves black anyways.
So its unnatural or wrong somehow to be attracted towards black women?
And what about people’s “white fetish” how often do you see that called out?
I mean most people don’t think about it that way; but if your only attracted to white women isn’t that a fetish?
I mean you may have a preference for red hair but most people don’t “only” date women with red hair and can find women with other hair colors attractive as well.
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@Trojan Pam you copied pasted your reference (which is a direct, unattributed quote) from http://www.savethemales.ca/002030.html – an extreme conspiracy theorist blog. Nowhere in Story’s book does he claim that 30% of the Nazi military were Jews.
I did get one thing wrong – the author of the website is a guy called Makow.
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@abagond back on topic: as part of an interracial couple myself (hubby is Asian) I think intermarriage between the races is fantastic.
Agree with some of the other commenters though that it’s weird if someone has a track record of never dating their own race. I think my husband (for example) would have found it strange if I’d only Asian guys before him, and vice-versa.
If you’re only picking people from a different race to date, then it seems to demonstrate that you (a) have a fetish (yuck) or (b) dislike something about yourself/your family.
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I don’t find it all that strange seeing as how many people are taught to place no value on blackness from a very early age, preferring it is not normal (white) and means you must be somehow defective.
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The reasons could be cultural or social, not just psychological. For example, if you grow up as the only Asian in your high school, there might not be any choice to date someone else.
And even when that person goes to university, because of a lack of social experience with others more similar to them racially, they might not date them because they don’t socialize with them for cultural reasons.
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TrojanPam, your frame of referance is coming from Freud/Fannon and you dont even know it…you arnt bringing any original thinking, you are just reiterating things that have been written and said, probably before you were born, loaded with your western “intellectual” education…
I can tell you I knew those women pesonaly , its you who are presuming to be able to psycho analyse them without even knowing them, I find that to be hilarious…I know how talented some of these women were, how together they were in their head, how much they werent trying to get any validation from me on their part, but were equal partners in everything we did, in the desician making , of daily life, in being supportive of each other
And some of these women , that I didnt branch out into a long term relationship, were in total control of what they were doing, and why they were having sex with me…some were out of my league and I was just a passing fancy..left like a melting blob of jelly wondering what hit him…marked for life
You cant try to paint me as someone who doesnt recognise the damages the legacy of slavery has had wherever slaves were brought, I have spoken about it quite often on here…I just dont tie it in with personal choices in peoples sexual lives…people are going to bring their personal hangups into any relationship..you are ignoring the huge amount of interacial relationships that are based on mutual respect and understanding and nurturing each other and their kids if they have them…There are pleny of white men in interracial relationships that do understand racism and the obsticles their black mate has to face…what a one sided narrow minded look at the situation if you ignore that
You are so on the money about a lot of things , your blind spot about interracial dating is like a little peice of rotten bacteria on a spectacular dinner plate
About 400 years, Christians burned people at the stake, and their agendas were behind some of the horrible things in the Bush administration, does that mean I shouldnt date a Christian woman? Islamic fundimentalists hate America and are suicide slaughtering people right now , does that mean I cant fall in love with an Islamic woman? Im all for breaking down the legacy of slavery and how it plays out in society today, but not going into the bedrooms of mutualy consenting adults, where their desicians for getting together are none of my business
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ahhh Solesearch, I didnt miss your little comment way back up there,you dont have to hide behind other black people, who you think Im implying superiority over, , I can speak person to person with you, and,Im in no way patronising anyone, implying I know more than anyone,
Understanding the tragectory of Afro diasporic culture in the Americas, understanding first and formost that these cultures were attemted to be destroyed at first, understanding that these Afro diasporic cultures were harrassed, discriminated against , and banned, many times tied in with “over sexualised, or apealing to bestial tendencies”, understanding that these cultures went on to become the foundations and building blocks of the cultures they were brought to, understanding this in the context of racism and how it affects today…is basic 101 fundimental knowledge
Either you know that incredible Afro diasporic cultures, like samba, jazz, capoeira, lambada, etc were banned and discriminated against, especialy based on stiff sexual religious moral grounds tied in with fundimental racism , or you dont
Cultural racism is at the heart of every discussion about the media we ever had. Cultural racism is at the heart of any emotion a person could feel that something in everyday life seems to be negating who they really are at heart, and that they have to feel some kind of inferiority because of that
Unfortunatly, everyone is extremly politicly aware these days, can bring to the table a litany of political agendas that were forged decades ago, but , there is very little ability to relate to the history of black Afro diasporic culture…otherwise, you would see, things like passisats with their naked backsides , and baile funk, are black Afro diasporic cultures that are building blocs of the cultural foundations of Brazil…instead, you go putting the moral Christian outlook of sex and shame of the body over very valid outlits of Afro diasporic expresion…
on another note, did I see you say you are married to a white guy? If yes, I asure you we could find many points of agreement on some of these issues…
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@ B.R.
This hardly means she is wrong.
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B.R., how am I hiding?
Where do I begin with you? There is so much that could be said.
Black culture consists of a lot more than dance. The civil rights movement, the political agendas that were forged decades ago, is just as much part of Black culture and history as baile funk, samba, and popping and locking. I don’t think I would be out of line by saying those political agendas are even more important than those dances because without them black people would have no power to protect those cultural traditions. Black people aren’t going to gain equality with a break dancing contest.
The fact that you can’t see black culture as anything more than a few dances is disturbing.
From previous comments, I understand that you are/were some type of dance promoter? Either way, I get that you are heavily invested in Afro-brazilian dance and that this might be the reason you come at every issue from that perspective. Like if you have a hammer, you’ll treat everything like a nail. Or maybe you felt so attacked in that booty dancing thread that you can’t let it go.
Black people are more than dancing. African culture is more than dancing. Dancing is not the end all, be all of African culture.
You seem to lament the pushing out of black women from Afro-brazilian dances and white women taking over.
Who is putting these events together? Who is profiting the most from these dances? If white women are taking over the performances, I’d bet white men are also taking over the organization and money. Do you also lament that? Or as long as black people are the face of these dances, it doesn’t matter that the power structure behind it is being dominated by whites?
Your points about culture appropriation and the de-valuing of African cultures are very valid, but the fact that you dismiss other aspect of African culture, as nothing more than out-dated political agendas, makes you sound hypocritical and racist.
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All I have to say is that the comments on this post really show the power POC can obtain by refusing to have sex with White people. No matter how logical we are in explaining the harm this has on non-White people, many of the White commenters seem to be so offended by the conclusions the POC on this post have come to on this topic. I bet you that they’re not on White pride websites calling out other Whites for referring to Blacks as “Jungle Bunnies”, “Mandingos”, etc. They themselves may even know full well that some of their closest friends, family, could be arguably racist whether or not they have sexual relationships with Black people. But for us to respond logically by not having sex with Whites bothers them more. How fascinating!!
So I declare that the sex strike needs to start NOW. Women in other countries have done so when their men mistreated them, and it worked. Sex strikes were also successful in the ancient Greek story called “Lysistrata”. So Non-White people should start their own sex strike to put this race problem on serious hold.
What do other Non-White commenters think?
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Abagond, I just said TrojanPam set up a spectacular plate, I said she is weaving in veiws of interracial sex with many other things that are very true…I do disagree with the Fannon/ Freud agenda…you may not, I do…as a matter of fact I find a lot of Swiss cheese holes in it
Solesearch, you have no idea..you think Im only reffering to dance…these political agendas are ignoring black culture..and in some cases like with Louis Armstrong and tap dancing, some of these agendas roll right over it
No one here can speak to the Loius Armstrong incident, it was well documented on the Ken Burns jazz docu..but, people here cant seem to deal with it….do you really want to talk about black American culture? How deep downt the rabbit hole do you want to go? Can you hum a Monk tune?
I dont get your point about comercialisation? The art of baile funk comes from the favelas, in its most raw form, same with the passistas,
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Solesearch, I also said I am aware that the political agendas against Armstrong and tap were part of a much bigger picture that was more important, yeah, it wasnt worth making a big deal of it back then to interupt the flow of progress, but , in reflection, it is very worth looking back and seeing the wrong direction of the bad agendas…telling people who they can have sex with and cant is total bs..a bad agenda and needs to be called out
Really, Im laughing at these notions, and the people promoting it are just dividing black people up…and are going to fail miserably , because it aint going to happen….interracial sex is here to stay…and its going to get bigger and bigger, anyone who doesnt like it, go suk on a lemon
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Ms J, the title sais “my veiws on relationships between black women and white men” that is me…you want to talk behind my back about me? Are you a coward? If you dont have the guts to have a person to person conversation about a subject that is about me, what kind of conversation is that?A lame one
Get some courage and buck up and talk to me face to face
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The problem is look at the damage these bs agendas do to black people..just look at the BWE thread…this agenda, has caused more inner strife and conflict than anything good…it doesnt stop racism at all, not one little crumbs worth…its grade a bs in a very stank form…feel free to wallow in it and join 400 years of white racists who started it…there is plenty of incredible company where I stand..plenty of great people from all walks of life who wont cop to this agenda…this is not a black monolithical straight up agreement…this is a small amount of people , putting out agendas that only will eliminate people from their cause and leave them out on a dry stiff limb with less and less people there to support them
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@ Cornlia
You do realized you made a generalized statement on Americans right? You did not say this is my experience with Americans you have met. So basic you judge people as well, which is OK if you choose to but I was pointing out that you do. So how can you take a stance on something when you are doing it yourself? How can you scrutinize a culture from doing it but not notice when you do it? You wrote a long paragraph trying to justify why you judge and criticizes no less. It is to just say you make judgements just like the “Americans” you are complaining about.
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@ BR
I don’t need to engage in name-calling or criticism of anybody, so you can stay there behind your computer screen getting upset at what I said. It shows that I’m doing the right thing by resisting the many forms of oppression towards people like myself.
Let justice be the law of the land. Not racism/deception/violence.
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B.R., should I tap dance too? What does it matter if I can hum a Monk tune or not? What does that prove exactly?
I freaking hate jazz music. It is my least favorite of all American music.
White people aren’t ignoring jazz music. They love it. You love it. We don’t need you as an ambassador trying to explain us to us. You should really read Abagond’s post on white paternalism.
The fact is you keep trying to reduce black cultures to music and using your historical knowledge of it to invalidate the experience of actual black people in the modern world. We are on a post about interracial dating and you’re talking about tap dancing.
I don’t care about how many jazz songs you can sing or how many times you can make you butt cheeks bounce, you are not Black. And you don’t get to tell black people what is relevant about our lives and cultures.
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@Sharina,
In a nutshell, the French and other Europeans are oh so “refined” in their treatment of Black people and other non-whites…
That is they treat PoC sooooo much better than the Americans so much so that the French banned Muslim women from wearing the hijab in public…
There are very few Black people on French television…
France has a very high Black unemployment rate just like America does…
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6317799.stm,
but in ALL fairness Sharina, i will let you be the judge of whether France is just as racists towards its Black citizens as America. You are capable of reading, analyzing, and drawing your own conclusions…
In Germany, the small population of Afro-Germans (mostly the product of African men and German women) are constantly subjected to routine police traffic stops, friskings and even beatings….
So yea…white men and women who sleep with Blacks are definitely not racist.
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What race problem? Most white people aren’t sleeping with black people so they probably wouldn’t care. Why do you think people who engage in interracial dating would agree to this sex strike? They don’t see it as a problem, you do.
How do you see this helping your ambiguously termed “race problem”?
I can interpret this idea as being anything, but ridiculous.
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*can’t
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Solesearch , jazz is black American culture and history…now get it straight, I didnt say black American history is jazz, Im saying jazz is the story of black American culture and it is a transceparent window into the reality of racism and culture assasination…you dont have to like jazz to understand that..just because you dont like jazz makes it irrelevent? You have to be kidding..
the point about the great art of tap dancing is, in the Civil Rights Movement in the late 60’s, it was one of the agendas…it got stepped on and rolled over…like with Louis Armstrong…like how interracial dating was dealt with..agian this isnt monolithic black thinking…that is how Im tying it in..not like you are supposed to know tap dancing…personaly, I dont care if you never investigate black Afro diasporic culture at all, but all you can do is lead it back to late 60’s political agendas…you cant seem to tie in how Afro diasporic cultures in the Americas are the history of how racism was used to dissmiss , bury and destroy these cutlures but instead they became building blocks of those cultures
You are dissmissing jazz, tap dancing..go right agead and be my guest…I dont care if people dont listen or like jazz, that isnt the point….even if white people like jazz, most of it dont understand this history or how deeply it speaks to its African roots..
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@ solesearch
If race and sex isn’t a problem at hand, then why are there over 400 comments on this post but much less on other Abagond posts? Sex between Whites and Non-Whites is clearly a controversial issue. Otherwise, we wouldn’t be discussing it over and and over again.
POC have to do something, even if simple, to resist their oppression. Either that or wave the White flag of surrender. That’s just my opinion.
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Also, my comment wasn’t addressed to any particular group of Non-White people. Oh course a person who’s been in a relationship with a White person wouldn’t see it from my perspective – especially if they’re White-identified. But those who know better should do better no matter who they are.
We need to have self-respect for our bodies and not lay down with anyone who complies with our mistreatment or degredation. Sex is an intimate and powerful act.
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The Black Civil Rights Movement, was one of the most extrordinary movements in American history…incredible things came out of it , that contribute to 70 percent black Americans as being middle class….
But, out of political movements, can also come agendas that can stick and the bad ones can do great damage and hang around for long periods of time, Slavery, communism, Naziism, Jim Crow, capitalism, all have negative aspects that carry over into today….
Saying Armstrong was and uncle tom, tap dancing was shu cking and jiving for the white man and notions of who can sleep with who, are the bilige water from that great movement…yet some people want to drink it today
These political agendas that are good that come into today are like skeletons that now need to be filled in with what today is about…black American culture was not addressed in the political movement, there is nothing wrong with looking at the past and the wrongs done….It isnt me, its Wynton Marsalis who showed us how that was wrong that was done to Armstrong..you pass it on me like a patronising white man….what a hang up…I dont care if you dont want to learn about your culture, I dont want to learn about German classical music, that doesnt mean either are less valid for that
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Ms J, you think you are upsetting me? Im laughing at you..Ive been interracialy dating since the mid 60’s, if you dont like interracial dating, Im right here laughing at you
You think 400 posts means its a good healty discusion? Wrong, its a very unhealthy discusion that isnt going to affect racism one bit…the horrible things people are saying is because it is a political bilge water agenda that shouldnt even be on the table….the fact the confusion comes down even into today with so much force means it is a mandate that was not healthy or natural that devides people and pushes confrontation..its a negative discusion that wont go anywhere and wont pursuade anyone.
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@ Ms J
“If race and sex isn’t a problem at hand, then why are there over 400 comments on this post but much less on other Abagond posts?”—Actually the Trayvon martin posts got more. just sayin
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@ B.R.
Hey, I’m not telling you what to do. You behavior has been the sport of White men for centuries. And regardless of whatever you call it (Interracial dating, mixed race dating, etc.), it’s always going to be an act of aggression against the Black person you’ve been sexually involved with. But you probably don’t care because you don’t have to ever be Black or live in the life of your Black partners. And that’s why our people either suffer in silence or end up harboring resentment towards other Black people after entering into these relationships.
And I think this discussion may actually turn things around in regards to this race problem. The more truth that’s put out there will mean the more potential to have justice on this planet. But people who are anti-justice will get mad, of course.
Enjoy the rest of your day.
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And I will agree with B.R. in while it is 400 plus comments some are not what I would consider healthy.
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“And I will agree with B.R. in while it is 400 plus comments some are not what I would consider healthy.”
Truth. And many more are just plain ignorant.
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B.R., your comments paint you as a patronizing white man.
There are numerous other condescending comments I could post.
If you would stick to your point, instead of descending into patronizing commentary on how black people are so ignorant of their own culture, you wouldn’t have to worry about being viewed as a racist.
You might even gain some allies. I’m obviously not against interracial marriage.
The flaw I see in your point is that interracial dating/marriage is not black culture. Preserving black cultures and interracial marriage could easily be seen as opposite agendas, if you view black culture as some stagnant never changing thing.
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“phoebeprunelle @Sharina,
In a nutshell, the French and other Europeans are oh so “refined” in their treatment of Black people and other non-whites”
Linda says,
After perusing all these comments, I have yet to see anyone here say that
1. There is No racism in Europe
or
2. That interracial dating or marriage will Stop racism.
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Ms. J, I didn’t say there wasn’t any problem. I just want to force you to say what the problem instead of using the very vague phrase “race problem” which could refer to a number of things.
How can my interracial relationship be a problem for you? It has nothing to do with you. If you don’t participate in them then what is it to you?
If the true problem is sexual objectification of black women, then why are you not suggesting a sex strike against black men or just men in general.
I just don’t find most people’s concerns about black women to be genuine.
What is this sex strike supposed to accomplish?
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Hmm yeah it was a joke.
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@Ms. J,
I responded to your inquiry over Trojan Pam’s blog under the purge movie thread.
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Linda:
Linda says,
After perusing all these comments, I have yet to see anyone here say that
1. There is No racism in Europe
True. In fact, in a response to B.R I said:
….I dont know what you mean about trusting Europe. I dont think anything has been said about it not being racist – that would be totally untrue
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Solesearch, you can be born black and experiance all the racism you are talking about, you can have these experiances and me being white will never know deep inside what you are going through
But you can be born black and not know black culture…most Americans dont know their own culture, most Brazilians dont know there own culture. You have to immerse yourself in culture to get it..not pop culture…you can think Im on the outside , but, I dont think Wynton Marsalis is on the outside of understanding European classical music since he plays in symphonies
You can be surrounded by the culture of your generation and have no idea of the origins and histoyr, and you have proved you dont know about black Afro diasporic cultures and their tragectories and histories and what happened to them because of racism
What you think is patronising is just telling you the facts that you didnt take the time to learn
there is no patronising here, I never tried to tell people what culture they are supposed to be practicing, but Im happy to pass the information I have humbly been blessed to receive from immersing myself in black Afro diasporic cultures
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Ms j, “it’s always going to be an act of aggression against the Black person you’ve been sexually involved with. But you probably don’t care because you don’t have to ever be Black or live in the life of your Black partners. And that’s why our people either suffer in silence or end up harboring resentment towards other Black people after entering into these relationships. ”
Ms J, its called being sensitive to your partner…it is about caring…in my case, its much more than just being with “black partners”..but that doesnt matter to you…and if you see sex by all white people with black people as aggesion, yes, you definitly should never have interracial relations …and dont go to South Beach, you might faint…actualy Ill be there thursday on tour heading for New York, watching the Heat on TV
I see what everyone is saying about the parts of black awareness that are very important are things that work on self esteem, dealing with the racist media, where cultural assasination is in constant blare , it seems that is one powerful fonte of where people can start getting messages about who and what is worthy and racist overtones, and you certainly wont be exposed to the depth of black American culture .
Black culture is like buried treasure, you have to dig for it, and, its not that it cures racism, its that it enriches your life…Solesearch, you mentioned white people likeing jazz (actualy jazz is revered and respected as a very profund culture all over the world) .As I said , most of them arnt going to tie it into black American history , or the link to their origins, but, they enrich their lives listening to it. I would never say black people are supposed to listen to jazz, but I will say that they could enrich their lives, and , have so much more to gain than white people exactly because of the cultural tie ins…same with tap dancing. By the way, its odd debating you here about this, Im actualy in agreement about what you would say about the title of this thread
But, to take the skeleton of the political framework that was left by the Civil Ri ghts Movement , and surround it with the bilge water of saying who people should or shouldnt sleep with, instead of putting firm meat to fill it out, like how to organise in the comunity, and, how to bring self esteem, ushering in true beauty standards, fighting for laws and vigilance on the police, many of the great subjects that Abagond does bring in and everyone discusses, …well its purplexing..just go over to the BWE thread to see even more painful fall out from this political agenda…this isnt nes to me, Ive watched this debate going on for decades now
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By the way ,let me clarify what Im saying so people dont mix it up
Im not saying interracial relationships helps or makes you aware of black culture or cures racism
I brought up tap dancing and Armstrong to point to political agendas from the 60’s, that are like the mandates of who coul have sex with who , and that these discusions are up to the hilt in these political agendas, but in th case of rolling over Armstrong and tap dancing , these agendas roll over culture
that was my point…culture has nothing to do with interracial dating, its the weak political agendas…THAT CAME OUT OF A VERY POWERFUL RICH MOVEMENT..and these agendas ought to be examinied (hey , which we are doing)
Solesearch, there are a lot of elbows being thrown under the boards, both the bootie thread and this one are very much a part of my life, and a lot of negative things were said about both…I am coming back strong…I agologise if some of what I said is coming off rude to you, but I asure you i am not patronising you, but I will challenge you, and , with these two subjects, there is no middle ground for me..there is no comprimise…but no one on here should think Im questioning their quest for self awareness and peeling back the layers of racism
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B.R.,
A buried treasure? Really. Only a white person would view it like this. My culture isn’t buried. It is alive and well and being created everyday. I’m not any less culturally black because I’d rather read Octavia Butler and listen to Lupe Fiasco instead of booty dancing and listening to Jazz music.
Those things are also black culture. You see black culture as something dead and archaic.
Black culture(s) expresses itself in a wide variety of forms and has a long history and a bright future. There is no way anyone could know all there is to know about it.
You’re just an old version of a “wigger”, thinking you’re blacker than me because you can repeat a bunch of lil wayne lyrics. It is still racist.
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@ c.andrews
that is how the game is played
black people can wear ourselves OUT giving RATIONAL and REALISTIC and FACTUAL information and examples
and whites will wear us out coming back with all kinds of statements, protesting and pretending to be “innocent” of how racism works
and THAT is a form of racism
NOT telling the truth to the victims and trying to confuse and deceive them
and that is why I refuse to explain again the difference between “power” and “money” to V-4 or any white person that basically asks the same questions over and over
It’s a GAME I’ve seen before and I’m not playing it
I believe ALL white people know that black people having money doesn’t give them the kinds of “white privileges” (power) that even a poor white person has
just more cash to buy more junk we don’t need
white people KNOW this is true and if they don’t someone should take their white privilege ID card asap
moving on…
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@ V-4
and just so you don’t think I’m talking to you via third person, read my previous response to c. andrews regarding your post to me about power VS money
You can agree or disagree, that’s your prerogative. It won’t change what I know to be true.
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@ wordynerdygirl who said:
“@Trojan Pam you copied pasted your reference (which is a direct, unattributed quote) from http://www.savethemales.ca/002030.html – an extreme conspiracy theorist blog. Nowhere in Story’s book does he claim that 30% of the Nazi military were Jews. I did get one thing wrong – the author of the website is a guy called Makow.”
—
I LOVE it when white people demonstrate their ARROGANCE with black people (like me)
First of all, you are INCORRECT about my source.
I DID NOT COPY OR PASTE my reference from that website you mentioned. I have NEVER even heard of that website but in your ARROGANCE, you (like other white posters on this thread and others)
believe you can — in complete confidence — tell me (a black person) what my reference is, what source I used, what I think, why I think it, that I can’t think (for myself)
and what I ate for breakfast (I’m still waiting to hear that one)
Case in point, you remind me of B.R. who said
““TrojanPam, your frame of referance is coming from Freud/Fannon and you dont even know it…you arnt bringing any original thinking, you are just reiterating things that have been written and said, probably before you were born, loaded with your western “intellectual” education…”
—
JUST buckets and buckets of words SIGNIFYING NOTHING
B.R. never met me, but he already knows how I think and what I think and how I don’t think for myself and that my “thinking” came from “western” (white) intellectuals
White people AND THEIR ARROGANCE is a GREAT ILLUSTRATION for black people of what white racism looks like a refined form.
No, they don’t use the “N” word but underneath the words they use is a PATRONIZING, SUPERIOR and CONTEMPTUOUS tone
aka WHITE SUPREMACIST MINDSET
which goes as follows:
“Look, Negro, I know what you think and why you think, where you got that thought from, because I’m pretty doggone sure, Negro, that you didn’t think it up for yourself,”
and so UNLIKE a WHITE PERSON, I don’t have the RIGHT OR THE ABILITY to think for myself OR voice my OWN OPINION because as I have been so often reminded,
“I don’t have an original thought, cause “I’m loaded with western (white) thinking”
And even though there are hundreds of references out there in the vastness of cyberspace, you, wordynerdgirl — in all your SUPERIOR WHITE WISDOM –
TOLD (not asked) ME where I got the quote from (even though you were WRONG)
AND to top it off YOU said with UTTER CONFIDENCE that “Nowhere in Story’s book does he claim that 30% of the Nazi military were Jews.”
and YOU KNEW that without even reading the book (I bet) or HAVING a copy of the book and definitely without KNOWING if I HAVE A COPY OF THE BOOK
but being of a SUPERIOR WHITE MIND you felt you could say it
and get away with it
FYI —
No, I will NOT give you the reference I used. You might not believe me and I will not debate that with you.
NOR do I have to prove ANYTHING to a superior WHITE PERSON who already knows it all anyway
I’ll just let YOU SPEND YOUR MONEY ON A COPY and then you’ll know for sure whether it’s in the book (it IS)
I just LOVE IT WHEN WHITE PEOPLE PROVIDE A BETTER DEMONSTRATION OF WHITE SUPREMACY THAN I EVER COULD
so the Black Victims can SEE for themselves how INGRAINED this White Supremacy BELIEF SYSTEM is in the brain computers of white people, so much so that it HAPPENS AUTOMATICALLY
And MY GOAL is to help other black people UNDERSTAND that there is NOTHING we can do to convince them that we are EQUALLY HUMAN (and sometimes just as smarter and occasionally a lot smarter)
so we should STOP trying
THANKS A BUNCH, for making my CASE for me, wordynerdygirl and B.R.
(I really mean that)
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PLEASE PUT ALL YOUTUBE LINKS IN PARENTHESES!
This thread is already well past the 300 comment mark and could well reach two to three times that.
Thank you.
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@ rollingwriter
I deleted your comment. It was way off topic.
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@ solesearch
that’s exactly what I addressed in my last post
that old great white father and mother complex where they know what blacks are, how we feel and what we think better than we do
it’s no different that it was for our parents and grandparents back in the day
the same old white arrogance
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@ oogenhand
I deleted two of your comments. All comments must be in English.
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@TrojanPam
For whatever reason, you want to believe black people lack any power or free agency in the world.
And your dedicated to that, no matter what I say, your just going to disagree.
Money means more than just material goods, it means social services and general resources as well.
You yourself have to admit that a black person can do more with ten million than they can do with ten grand.
But at the end of the day none of this will change the truth, black people have to deal with racism but that also doesn’t change the truth that money, wealth, and position give people advantages in life, they can send their kids to better colleges, get better doctors, medicine, have better jobs, live in better neighborhoods etc….so on and so forth.
Money doesn’t just get you better goods, it gets you a better life and expands the capacity to “do” period.
And while we obviously aren’t going to come to an agreement, you completely avoided answering the other questions.
You can deny that black people with more money don’t have more privileges than poor black people and thats your desired reality, I can’t change that.
Which brings up another question you keep saying “junk” why the assumption that black people are going to make poor decisions with their money? Maybe they will buy new cars/parts/computers/any wide variety of items that can have a serious life impacting nature?
And what about the nature of sexism? Why is it okay for black men to oppress and degrade black women?
Over on Peanuts blog there is a documentary about Black Men going to Brazil; where they mention about how women should know their place, make their meals, put straws in their drinks and be more submissive to their men they didn’t want to frame it as submissive but thats what they were saying.
I mean; its not really being said don’t let people oppress and degrade you its being said “only” let black men oppress and degrade you.
One of the things that gets brought on this board is intersection; what difference to black women does it make if they go from bad relationships with one kind of men to another how has it made their lives better?
I mean why suggest to black women to do the sex lock down, black men at a “minimum” date at least twice as many white people as black women wouldn’t it be more effective if they were the ones to iniate this course of action?
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@ V-4
I’m responding because you are perhaps unintentionally distorting what I said and saying I said things I never said for example:
“You can deny that black people with more money don’t have more privileges than poor black people.”
I never said that.
What I said was IN a white supremacy society, black people may have MONEY but they do NOT have real POWER.
Having money allows you to BUY more things and go more places than a person with less (and that’s true for non-whites and non-whites)
But MONEY alone does NOT necessarily give you the POWER to CHANGE those things you don’t like or STOP you from being a victim of injustice AKA racism
with all the money Bill Cosby had, he did NOT have the power to buy NBC
with all the money Wesley Snipes had he did NOT have the power to change the FELONY CONVICTION OR PRISON SENTENCE for a misdemeanor tax offense —
and the white males he was associated with WHO DID THE SAME THING, who HAD LESS MONEY AND FAME than Wesley Snipes
DID NOT GET CHARGED OR GO TO JAIL BUT WERE ALLOWED TO PAY WHAT THEY OWED
and there are too many examples, STARTING WITH THE TOTAL DISRESPECT THE BLACK MALE MILLIONAIRE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES AND HIS BLACK WIFE GET FROM WHITE PEOPLE WITH A LOT LESS MONEY — EVERY DAY OF THE WEEK
I will admit i have NO PATIENCE for all white people who PRETEND NOT TO KNOW THAT THERE IS A HUGE DIFFERENCE between the way white people VS black people are treated
— regardless of how much money that black person has because EVERY WHITE PERSON OVER THE AGE OF 21 KNOW BETTERS
We will just have to agree to disagree. I will not respond to any more comments from you to me on this point
and if you want to post something I allegedly said, please post the QUOTE of what I said.
Thank you.
.
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@TrojanPam
Another question; hasn’t historically speaking one of the biggest uses of racism been to seperate the poor and common peoples of the world via race so as to help the elite maintain their hold on society and its resources?
The whole Francis Bacon Rebellion thing.
If so; and breaking up the races and keeping them apart from one another has been one of the main goals of racists, than aren’t you doing “exactly” what the White Supremecists Global Organization wants by saying that the races shouldn’t have relations with one another?
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@TrojanPam
Your the one who says that black people lacked power to change society or their enviroment.
From the beginning my argument has been that more money means “more” power, not that it was the same as white people in those scenarios.
With more money you can buy things, go to more places , start up organizations, improve the life of your family and friends etc…
Whether on a personal or group level it is still more powerful and that is something a white supremecists organization wants on no level whatsoever
You said it did not but now your saying that; no they do have more power just not as much as white people, so apparently you agree with me.
At no point did I deny the disrespect or to the president or racism against black people but at the same time, Obama is still a very powerful person.
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@Legion
Wutt??? Did i miss something? Who said that? LMBO
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Here goes again, I dont know if moderator deleted my post about interacila relationship being akin to child abuse or at best immoral under the current system of White Supremacy. I guess nobody wnats too touch that SMOKIN GUN !!! I used another anology to illustrate the point of a warden having a sexual relationship with a prisoner or a teacher having relations with their student even if such student is over 18 and lastly a doctor having sexual relations with a patient. All these are the same as a white person who is way more powerful having sexual realtions with a non white person under this current system of white supremacy. sometimes they try to hide behind marraige-Non white people collectively are treated like idiot children under this society. Why not devote all your time to dismantling this system so all people will be uNIVERSAL and on equal footing. I hope Abagond approve this post because it is very constructive and those naysayers that disagree are looking through rose colored glasses indeed !!!
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Pres Obama has no real power to affect meaningful change for his people, just check out his commencemrnt speech to Morehouse, It was degrading , it had the smell of Mistah Charlie aka White Supremacist written ALL over it… Under this society you can be a black trillionaire walking down any urban street on the globe and you may be mistreated and or abused just based on your skin color and nothing else by a white person, you may or may not get a little relief if they find out you got some money, sometimes that makes it even worse on you- they may brand you an uppity arrogant nigger- so sad but TRUE….Oh I forgot, look what the Mexicans did to malcome X grandson- to them he was just a nigger and he died in Mexico as just a nigger, you think if he had more money the would not have callously taken his life?????? Think again….
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@ V-4
who said: “@TrojanPam — hasn’t historically speaking one of the biggest uses of racism been to seperate the poor and common peoples of the world via race so as to help the elite maintain their hold on society and its resources?”
—
ME: the WHITE elite already control most of the world and its resources — even when it (falsely) appears that non-whites are in charge, case in point, SOUTH AFRICA, JAPAN, MEXICO, etc.
Whites created the FALSE concept of ‘RACE” in order to practice racism — SO, other than geography, whites and non-whites are already separated in terms of access to opportunities and privileges and “rights” — and as hard as black people have BEGGED, PLEADED, CRIED AND DIED IN EVERY WHITE MAN’S WAR SINCE THE BEGINNING OF THIS (STOLEN) NATION
NOTHING HAS WORKED TO MAKE WHITE PEOPLE STOP PRACTICING RACISM
AND at some point, like NOW, some of us have said
ENOUGH!
AND the best thing for black people to get WHOLE and SANE again is to STOP SLEEPING WITH OUR TORMENTORS and OPPRESSORS
and that is EXACTLY what the White Supremacists DON’T want us to do
That is their BIGGEST FEAR, that black males and females will STOP SEEKING WHITE VALIDATION IN AND OUT OF THE BEDROOM
and will START TO HEAL OURSELVES and we can’t do that by having sex with white people –who COLLECTIVELY — are STILL WAGING WAR AGAINST US
which is why THE WHITE SUPREMACIST MEDIA that owns and controls every MAJOR black website (that’s power) and every TV STATION and MOVIE STUDIO is promoting sex with white people for black people
LIKE NORTH GOING FORTY
because they KNOW that SINGLE ACT — SEX– will KEEP US PSYCHOLOGICALLY SICK AND SEEKING WHITE VALIDATION and DIVIDED FROM EACH OTHER
Instead of BLACK MALES AND FEMALES UNITED TO FIGHT THE WHITE SUPREMACY SYSTEM THAT IS KEEPING US OPPRESSED.
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@ V-4
As I said before
I will NOT respond to your comments on the subject of power,
so I suggest you move on to either another poster OR to another topic
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@ Legion
WOW. You just put it all out there didn’t you. LOL
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Well said Trojan Pam !!!! as my mama used to tell me when all was said and done, Nuff Said…… you summed it up pretty well and covered ALL your bases!!!!!
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“If the true problem is sexual objectification of black women, then why are you not suggesting a sex strike against black men or just men in general.
I just don’t find most people’s concerns about black women to be genuine.”
Thank you, Solesearch.
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@ Legion
you’re right, she did not SAY I was an anti-semite
BUT she did say the following:
“Apart from the grossly offensive anti-Semitism of this claim, how can you rely upon such an unreliable source for your information?”
There are TWO THINGS wrong with her statement
#1 — I did NOT rely on any “Brian Riggs” because I do NOT know who he is — and her ASSUMPTION that SHE KNOWS what I’m reading — without ASKING ME, is a problem.
#2 — I posted what I posted because I BELIEVE THIS “CLAIM” IS TRUE and have believed it LONG before I found Abagond’s post
so it was logical (in my opinion) to take it one step further to assume that me (and anyone else) believing it was true makes me (and anyone else)
ALSO guilty of being
“…grossly offensive anti-Semitism…”
Of course, you can disagree with my logic, that’s your prerogative
—
what I find highly suspect — and SO totally EXPECTED, Legion
(for reasons I won’t go into)
is how you are defending her statements and saying I’m “smearing” her
so let me post some of your recent comments like:
(to me) “So Pam, what’s your source? You don’t have one, do you?”
(to Linda) “There’s a time for “rudeness” and a time to keep from being “rude”.* We’re adults and you have to decide when it needs to be done.”
It’s obvious to me at least that you (seem to) have “issues” (with me)
and that’s fine, it’s COOL, really because I’m not here to win a popularity contest
I’m trying to share information and post my opinions
but, please, let’s dialogue (or not) absent all the moral outrage
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@ Legion
once again the sarcasm and all the emotion
instead of HONEST dialogue
which I think reflects a heck of a lot MORE on you
than on anything I could ever say
(but who am I to spoil anyone’s fun?)
carry on…
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@ Legion
apologizing to WHOM for WHAT?
I would strongly SUGGEST you get control of yourself
you’re revealing FAR too much about yourself
(and your ill intentions)
if you find my postings so objectionable
you always have the OPTION to put me on IGNORE
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@ c. andrews
this is cyberspace (isn’t it?)
NOT the United Nations, or a Miss Manners class or a boxing ring
so I’ll do my best to confine my comments to the TOPIC AT HAND
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@TrojanPam
Before the civil rights movements black people had much stronger family units and dated out much less.
If anything doesn’t that suggest that keeping to themselves does more to limit their access to resources and legal/civil rights?
And why should the White Supremecists fear black women not wanting to date out; even when they didn’t they just raped them.
And yet; whites do pull back on racism, a war to end slavery, the vicil rights movements, they started making legal consequences for raping black women back in the mid-1960’s, affirmative action, at the very least having to suffer the loss of face and pretend a black man is their boss, the world isn’t what it could or should be but it is improvingv, racism is losing power if only far more slowly than would be preferred.
Yes the white elite control much of the resources of the world and one of the methods they do so is via racism to keep the common man seperate by race.
And doesn’t Cornia; a foreign woman say the opposite that it seems like people have to practically be brother and sister in the US for them to be married on tv?
@c.andrews
If Malcom X’s grandson had been a billionaire more than likely he would have been hanging out with a different crowd and still alive today.
I maybe wrong but I suspect the death by violent means rate is probably notably lower for the super rich than it is for anyone else.
So you are honestly referring to black people as infantile and idiot-children?
White people aren’t superior to black people; relationships that include marriage usually invovle adults, white people get treated better and as a group have more power but individually middle class and down don’t really have a huger power difference between them and black people aside from their being more of them but again thats group vs individual.
Here’s a question about Obama, considering that Presidents seem to represent the elite the most, how well have the black super elite been doing? I know the elite in general is doing great economically while the rest of the country is in a depression so hows it going for them?
As for why I don’t work at dismantling oppresion; one I’m a coward when it comes down to it, two I have no power to affect change, three I have no ideas for what could really do it that we aren’t already practicing on some level.
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WTF !!!! All I did was agree with your postings concerning POWER, SEX, and MONEY, that be the TOPIC AT HAND. This posting above sounds like a TROLL, You aint gonna divide and conquer on this issue because I still AGREE with you, Money dont =POWER and Non whites SEXING Whites do not =counter racism
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@ c. andrews
that’s why it’s important to understand racism/white supremacy AND how it is practiced and used to CONFUSE and SHAME the victims out of CLARITY
we also have to be careful NOT to get drawn into pointless and negative dialoguing that drains our emotional and mental resources
I’m working on doing a better job of that
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@TrojanPam
“By the 1930′s, 60% of all German Jewish marriages were interracial. In his book, “Hitler’s Jewish Soldiers” Brian Rigg states that 155,000 Nazi soldiers had Jewish blood, including some generals.”
the book: “Christopher Story, author of “The New Underworld Order”
Your source seems to specifically cite Brian Rigg there.
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@c.andrews
What aspect of my post came off as trollish?
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Also what about the sexism angle again?
It is after all a white “Male” supremecy, should I be celebite and never in a relationship at all until the world is cured of its ills?
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that’s all right, please disregard that posting, I apologize for referring to you as a possible troll. I am getting confused as to who is responding to whom in these posting. I think I will bow out of this thread -too many people posting at the same time…. sorry if I offended anyone
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@ V-4
I stand corrected. Thanks for clearing that up.
.
However, she was NOT correct to say I copied and pasted it from the website she named. I never heard of that website.
She might be right that Brian Rigg is a so-called “anti-Semetic” but her saying it does NOT make it so. She would do better to give me HER SOURCES that prove he is one
the same way I”m being asked to VALIDATE my opinions.
Frankly, I have found that ANYONE who disagrees with the “history” we’ve been fed by Hollywood about the Holocaust is automatically labeled “anti-semitic” — and I have a problem with that.
I was gave one my sources because I was asked to give a source.
Riggs is not the only one who believes that Jews participated and financially benefited from the Holocaust.
And I don’t find it hard to believe that a Jewish (non-white) minority may have desired marriage with the (white) German majority
that is what oppressed minorities do
they seek to assimilate
so It is NOT outside the realm of possibility that there were many Jews marrying whites before the Nazi hammer came down on them
I don’t see that as “anti-Semitic” and those who do
well, that’s THEIR problem, not mine
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@ c. andrews
I thought you were referring to the poster (Legion) who was posting to me not V-4
We all make mistakes especially when a lot of people are posting and we’re trying to remember who said what.
I made a mistake earlier, and V-4 politely corrected me,
I’ve enjoyed your commentary so please don’t be discouraged.
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@ c.andrews
It just dawned on me that you might have thought my post about cyberspace and Miss Manners was aimed at you
It was definitely NOT.
I was referring to the tongue-lashing that Legion was giving me earlier
sorry if I made it appear that way
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@ TrojanPam, will do, this is certainly constructive brain excercising- following these postings. It is amazing I only got confused a few times but watch out when I really get a handle on following these mega postings, lol !!!!!
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@ c. andrews
Whew, I’m glad I caught it because it definitely was not directed at you. 🙂
I posted a quote from a book as a source and was so busy defending myself that I forgot his name was mentioned!
(( shaking head at myself ))
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I@TrojanPam I jUST knew that you were not posting at me, I thought someone may have been a Troll using your name or something cause I know it be a LOT of HATERS on some of these postings. From now on I will refer by name in the postings directly . But I sure am glad I have not offended you……
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@ c. andrews
likewise
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@peanut
Far as the first article goes; thats a pretty messed up situation, she doesn’t want to leave him but she’s tried explaining how she feels about racial slurs and she is uncomfortable with there use at a minimum.
Should just tell him if he doesn’t stop she’ll leave him but I doubt that will happen.
As for the “negro bed wench” video; I could guess maybe part of that is the idea that you could get someone to break their “moral” values out of desire for them.
Possibly easy sex; they call up some dude, get what they want out of him and go on with their life, no fuss no muss.
And last but not least; internalized racism.
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The pro-black counter racists on this thread will some day, I hope, realize that misogynoir (hatred of black women) wrapped in Kente cloth is still just misogynoir. Keep talking and waving the Willie Lynch Letter around and black women will continue the slow exit from the black community. The Achillies heel of pro-black/counter racist thought is the refusal to address the depth of the contempt for black women in the hearts and souls of contemporary black men. How many more ass whiippings, rapes, verbal denigration do you expect black women to suffer in silence in the name of black unity? If black women are starting to consider dating white men (this shocks me just as much as it does some of you) this should be a red flag that even the long suffering loyal to a fault black woman has a limit on the amount of abuse and emotional neglect she can withstand. Yes some BW in IRR have issues with internalized racism and anti-blackness and others have realized that black men are not a “safe harbor” and have become narcissists in their dealings with black women. I don’t care how many layers of Kente cloth pro-black counter racists wrap their misogynoir in; it’s still misogynoir.
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@Legion thanks for clarifying what my post meant. You’re absolutely right: I was (rightly) questioning the source, not making an ad hominem attack.
@TrojanPam To claim that the Jewish people engaged in the mass-killing of their own people is not only erroneous, it is outrageously offensive. That is what the source you quoted from is claiming (i.e. by saying that 30% of the Nazi force were Jews).
In your additional posts you have made other worrisome statements. You said, for example:
“Frankly, I have found that ANYONE who disagrees with the “history” we’ve been fed by Hollywood about the Holocaust is automatically labeled “anti-semitic” — and I have a problem with that.”
What do you mean by disputing the history? Are you denying the Holocaust? There are millions of descendants of those who died, as well as still living survivors who would take issue with that.
I’m not sure where your nearest Holocaust museum is but if you take the time to visit you will be able to witness the historical evidence of what the Nazis did. I suggest that this is a more reliable, authoritative source that an internet conspiracy site.
I’m not arguing with you for the sake of arguing or to negate the validity of your arguments about the barriers erected by white supremacy. I was just quite shocked when I read some of the statements about Jewish people which you made in this post.
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@ wordynerdygirl who said: “You’re absolutely right: I was (rightly) questioning the source, not making an ad hominem attack.”
ME: No, you were doing MORE than that. You told me that I copied and pasted the info from a source that WAS NOT CORRECT instead of ASKING me.
Also.
I do NOT find my claim or the claims of many individuals that Jews participated in the mass killing THE SAME WAY that many white people will say that Africans participated in the SLAVE trade — and a small number did.
When there is MONEY to be made, people will OFTEN act against their so=called GROUP to make a profit or to get rid of a defeated enemy
And I will state this AGAIN because I believe it is TRUE:
“Frankly, I have found that ANYONE who disagrees with the “history” we’ve been fed by Hollywood about the Holocaust is automatically labeled “anti-semitic” — and I have a problem with that.”
Because Hollywood does NOT tell the TRUTH ABOUT ANYTHING — especially black people SO it is NOT difficult to believe that the PEOPLE who CONTROL HOLLYWOOD (and I think you know who I mean)
would paint their OWN HIS-STORY in the MOST FLATTERING and SYMPATHETIC LIGHT — WHICH THEY DO and will NEVER LET US FORGET IT
I never said the Holocaust didn’t happen (this is exactly what I mean, all the OVER -EXAGGERATION of going from me saying Jews participated to me NOW saying the Holocaust never happened to stop people from talking at all
This GROSS Victim attitude whenever someone questions a SINGLE DETAIL of that HISTORY is what I have a problem with
while the SAME PEOPLE via the media make a MOCKERY of BLACK VICTIMIZATION AND BLACK PEOPLE
please, I am not guilty one here
I ALSO believe — KNOW — that the GREATEST HOLOCAUST IN MODERN HUMAN HISTORY WAS THE AFRICAN HOLOCAUST where OVER 100 MILLION AFRICANS DIED DURING THE TRANSATLANTIC SLAVE TRADE.
A Museum created by the same people who CONTROL their HISTORY and how the story is told
DOESN’T PROVE ANYTHING BEYOND A REASONABLE DOUBT
That doesn’t mean that anything outside that “museum” is incorrect
Please, don’t be shocked. We’re all just posting our opinions
I posted mine. and I’m sure this isn’t the first time you read comments like mine so I’m surprised that you’re shocked.
ALSO, since I posted my sources, why don’t you post a few of yours that prove your position? That would be more convincing than just saying I’m incorrect.
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@TrojanPam here are links to just a few of the tens of thousands of peer reviewed articles dealing with the historical evidence for the Holocaust:
http://www.jstor.org/stable/3791968
http://www.jstor.org/stable/40179711
http://www.jstor.org/stable/3791988
http://www.jstor.org/stable/3791271
http://www.jstor.org/stable/1042574
The first link is very relevant as it discusses the reason why some people so readily accept the claims made by Holocaust deniers despite the wealth of primary historical evidence to the contrary.
The reason why I recommended visiting a Holocaust museum is because you will be able to witness primary sources of evidence there, for example photographs of mass graves filled with the bodies of the Jewish people who were massacred, correspondence between Nazi leaders etc.
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look, i find your blog insightful and provocative, but this post was just kind of stupid. you completely contradicted yourself— you said that many black women do not find white men attractive because they grew up around black men— not because they are racist. but then you say that if a white man doesn’t find a black woman attractive, they are racist? what if they just grew up around whites and they find other whites more attractive?
i don’t understand your logic here, i think you need to think through this some more. as good as you are about pointing out kneejerk reactions that society has indoctrinated us with, you’ve got a few of those same reactions yourself— and i think you need to recognize that fact and neutralize those preconceived notions if you’re going to continue to be an important blogger on this topic especially.
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by the way, LOL i know my post isn’t going to get read— with all the morons on here it’s kind of hard to communicate through the static.
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Pray tell what is INTERNALIZED RACISM, is it the opposite of EXTERNALIZED RACISM, ????? words are EXTREMELY important and using them CORRECTLYespecially in these days and times are even more important. Before I rush to judgement and think these words are of no importance to non white people I will wait to get yours response….. but it be sounding like buckets and buckets of words, could be wrong though
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@ Daniel Bryant
I expect most white women to wind up with white men because of where most of them grew up. What I did NOT expect is the way MANY white men seem to feel, zero attraction towards even great-looking black women. After all, black women are still women and white men are still men, so you expect basic biology to apply.
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peanut, in regards to that article, while I do find it strange and disgusting, I’m not shocked. Well, I might be a little shocked because its the first time I’ve heard of this happening in bw/wm relationships.
I’ve heard of using racist language in bed between ww/bm as a way to enhance the sex because it plays on the taboo nature( white women arent supposed to sleep with animalistic, inferior black men) of the sex.
I get the impression that it is just as enjoyable for the bm as the ww.
I can’t comprehend how being degraded would be enjoyable especially not by someone I love during the most vulnerable of acts, but obviously some people find it enjoyable.
Donald Glover, a black comedian talking about it:
(http://youtube.com/watch?v=Pjr1LJTrzIg)
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@Abagond,
Who said:
But really Abagond is that the truth…not just for white men but for other men as well as like Alchemist said above, it is men (Black, white and to a lesser extent Asian ones) who are mostly on the internet and other media outlests engaging in character assassination of Black women…i was always taught that if you didn’t like someone, you didn’t pay attention to them?
Maybe i am misinterpreting what you are saying?
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Awwww man Abagond, you sound soooo pitiful and pathetic,you said ” What I did NOT expect is the way MANY white men seem to feel, zero attraction towards even great-looking black women.” I guess this may have ‘internalized racism” written all over it. Now we have one of our most educated finest (I assume you to be a black male but could be wrong) loathing the appeareance of white men not lusting after they own Black women. white people are supreme because they do a job on our pitiful pathetic fragile psyche. It will be ok Abagond, plenty of white men still be secretly lusting after us black women. Hope that makes you feel better, smdh……Let me play the devil’s advocate for a sec, let us say that 25% or more of white males feels a lot of attraction towards black females , would that make us more valuable in your eyes, in other words would a black male feel more self esteem if he knows his women are sexually attractive to the dominate people( white) ???
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@ Daniel Bryant
I always find it quite telling that some of the most ignorant individuals seems to be the ones that are quick to call others morons and ignore the complete moronic behavior they display. But don’t mind me. Carry on.
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I think some people throw internalized racism around like it is confetti. “you don’t agree with me…..your white or suffering from internalized racism.” “You married outside your race….internalized racism.” etc. Done with my rant for today.
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@ phoebeprunelle
“i was always taught that if you didn’t like someone, you didn’t pay attention to them?”—I was taught that as well which makes you wonder. I always consider those types to be men scorned.
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lets not lump African American women with the rest of black women now huge huge difference and if you call anyone who is black (say Barbados for example) African American that’s an insult to the 100th degree.
I’m white and male and have dated a TON of black women mostly from the islands or off South America and have had incredible relationships with them and most are drawn to white men like myself.
FYI go ask a black guy what their ultimate prize is and he will tell you a white woman and I’m talking about not even attractive white women I would give two looks at.
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I see the summer time trolls are here in full force stereotyping everyone smh
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@Solesearch
I know that you were responding to B.R., but i am curious to know what you mean by it?
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DKB, the only people I’ve encountered who think all black people are African-American are white people. They don’t understand that you have to be American to be African-American.
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phoebe, I’m not sure what you are confused about?
I meant marrying outside of our race isn’t a cultural practice. People do it but it’s not traditional or expected.
If you believe black culture can only take influences from black people and can’t adapt in response to non-African influences then black culture can’t exist in an integrated society, let alone one where interracial relationships are common.
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@Solesearch,
Ok, now i see your point.
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@ Legion
I won’t deny what he has pointed out but his stance of deciding to call others morons just made him ignorant. I know you know as well as I do that some times how you approach a person will determine their wiliness to listen to you. now while I do not agree with some commenters in here I will not presume them to be a moron just because of it. It is as if he is stating that I can’t debate so I will just get the personal attacks out because I excel at calling names like a child.
Childish would be the best word for the second comment.
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@ mstoogood4yall
You know it! It is funny though that many of them don’t realize that black youth are from black islander families. It also amazes me how quick they are to conclude that the 5 black women they met are the definition of all black women. LOL.
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@ Phoebe
I do not understand what you are asking.
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continued
@ Legion
I also consider what he did a form of disrespect and if you lack respect for someone then they will shut you off to. Now I will not say he is not forgivable in his comments because I have forgiven eco (who was a pain with all the stats tell me so bs) but we will see or not.
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@ C. Andrews
Of course not. I have a mind of my own. I know what I think.
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@ DKB
“FYI go ask a black guy what their ultimate prize is and he will tell you a white woman and I’m talking about not even attractive white women I would give two looks at.”—Considering I have 4 uncles I decided to ask this very question (mainly because I was on the phone with one of them when this response appeared). To him a white woman is not the ultimate prize. I know you are in shock and disbelief, but contrary to what some white men want to believe not all black men consider white women some ultimate prize. From my standpoint (in which my uncle agrees) to view someone as a prize is not respecting them but rather seeing them as a winning object to be used and thrown away when it’s value diminishes. You can work hard to get it but once you get it does it possess any deep meaning for you? or is it just to say to the world…”look what I got.”
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@ Peanut
“it’s liek we can’t have any value all on our own because society tells people that we’re ugly and at the bottom of the totem pole…society doesn’t value us, so some Black men do not value us unless we have the white stamp of approval…it’s sad and it is pathetic for the men who do this…”
Even in cases where women do find white men that value them, then black men get mad like we are at fault here. D*mn if you do and d*mn if you don’t.
But can you really call individuals who do this men. They sure want to play men but I would not give them that title. There is value and black women because if there was not then it would not be so much fuss over them. People would not be trying to use science and other nonsense to prove we are not attractive if we were of no value.
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@ Peanut, in America , the constitutions still stands and it says we are only 3/5 human, always remember that because Mistah Charlie(aka White supremacy) sure aint gonna forget. They even make movies like the Planet of the Apes about this. They treat us like shit and at the end of the day because of the Stockholme Syndrome we all suffer at varying degrees we still look for validation, are still confused about should we sex them or not and most of all HURT when they dont want to PLAY with us…… No other group of non white people go around in such a pitiful state trying to push they women off and begging for they women to get sexed by white people like we do. It is sick pathetic appalling and trifling the way we continue to beg for acceptance . Abagond can kinda dress it up a little and make it more palatable for the psyche but it all comes down to ANTI – BLACKNESS……..
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I live in Phoenix, Arizona (- originally lived in New York) but I was surprised to see so many black women and white men relationships! I think Mother Nature is doing some major DNA dabbling…
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2peanut, this phenomena with black women being hated on is not odd when you take off the rose colores lenses and REALLY look at the situation. Please read the U.S Constitution and see if an ammendment was added to say slaves or black people would from now on be considered 100 % HUMAN. If you or any scholars know where I can find this in the Constitution speak up now or hold your peace. white people barely consider us to be human, this is why they treat us like no other race on the planet has ever been treated. Bestiality is wrong or immoral but plenty of white males and females for that matter do have sex with their dogs, still does not make it right though. We are on the level of their dogs/pets. It is the business of WHITE SUPREMACY and once you really understand how that business work you will no longer think that is just odd. It will become crystal clear to you once you look at the world without your rose colored gasses on. Can you handle it though ????
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Isn’t this conversation going in circles with a lot of commonplace/platitudes and even more stereotypes ? (I’m just wondering, I’ll have tens of pages to delete in my email box now, and didn’t learn much… No need to reply unless you really feel like it)
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@Peanut, each one teach one and join the fight to counter racism !!! I feel you on this. As Fanny Lou Hammer said ” I am tires of being tired”…. get codified and let it spread like wildfire !!!!!
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Peanut, then why not use the appropriate words and use “racists” (R) and “white supremacists” (WS) if that is who you are talking about ?
I think your experience is interesting to read as a perspective on American social relationships (which seems kinda complicated and often rely on supposing the other might be this or that, or think this or that, or not think at all… must be tiring, for sure). You are open and clear on what you think and to the point.
I would take the following the other way around (and I know what some here think about that, but frankly…):
“if you don’t do the stuff i’m talking about, then i’m not talking about you as a white person.”
I’d rather say, a person who doesn’t have the “white” mindset doesn’t do the stuff you’re talking about. Because you have to have a “white” mindset/ be racist to do them.
And I was talking about “circles” simply because we have a lot of examples, but not many solutions to better social relationships. And I think (but you know it’s my opinion, and I am a minority in an American setting) it’s because “race” rules. So I’m repeating myself too.
Just one more thing: seems like Malls are the secure place for what Americans call “interracial” couples (which the French will call “mixte”, pronounced “mixed”). That’s where I see most of them where I live now (upstate NY).
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Legion I reacted to your comment in my reply to Peanut. I think.
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Cornlia, yes, it is mostly the same stuff over and over.
White men aren’t dating black women, because they are racist, even though, racism doesn’t stop white men from being in relationships with black women for sex, so black women should go on a sex strike against white men, who they never wanted to have sex with, to….hurt white men….so they can’t have sex with women they don’t want either.
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@ wordynerdygirl
Thank you for the links
However, the problem is how does one determine WHOSE source is the TRUTH?
I respect your right to defend your position (and your people, if you are a Jew)
but I believe MY sources are closer to the truth than the SANITIZED VERSION found in Hollywood productions
I posted the source from the Internet because that is the ONLY source I could give over the Internet but my MOST RELIABLE SOURCE is a very learned historian that I know personally who has given me a TON of information over the years —
ALL of which have turned out to be correct even when I thought he was wrong — but I have yet to find a single time when he did not correctly predict what will happen in the world political stage
AND always based that opinion on giving a historical RUNDOWN of WHY it will happen
Those are the KINDS of sources I have the most faith in, NOT a website on-line, but again those are the ONLY sources I can provide on-line.
I believe it is LOGICAL that is NO group of people are all connected to the same umbilical cord and that NO GROUP OF PEOPLE all think or act the same
there are JEWS who are ANTI-SEMITIC, who have worked against the Jewish masses and non-Jewish masses — and are still DOING so today
just like there are BLACKS who are ANTI-BLACK who are being used against the black masses (by the white supremacists)
So, given the HUGE ACCUMULATION of WEALTH by Jews over the last seventy or so years, I would say there is a STRONG POSSIBILITY that there were some who PARTICIPATED in and PROFITED from the Jewish Holocaust.
that is LOGICAL — in my opinion — based on the OUTCOME
I’m sure there were ‘white’ GERMANS who had Jewish ancestry who sided with the NAZIS because they were the winning team at the time
just like there are WHITES who have Black ancestry, who are passing for white because that’s the most privileged team in town
People do what people do what people do
I DO NOT buy into the Hollywood CELLULOID VERSION of JEWS as this loyal and courageous and brilliant MONOLITH that would NEVER, EVER betray another person classified as Jewish like the rest of us COMMON, non-Jewish folks
I just ain’t buying it.
FYI — If I spend any time studying a HOLOCAUST, it will be the AFRICAN HOLOCAUST, which ECLIPSES every single KNOWN Holocaust in modern human history — being that OVER ONE HUNDRED MILLION AFRICANS DIED over a FOUR HUNDRED YEAR PERIOD.
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@ abagond who said:
“What I did NOT expect is the way MANY white men seem to feel, zero attraction towards even great-looking black women. After all, black women are still women and white men are still men, so you expect basic biology to apply.”
—
I’ve noticed AND have experienced (too many times to count!) that same DYNAMIC of white male behavior — and believe it is due to the
WHITE MALE CONDUCT CODE
that says that white males should NEVER uplift a non-white female over a white female by paying more attention to non-white females than white females and since she is a non-white person, it is NECESSARY to treat her as though she is inferior AKA ‘not desirable’
I have seen MANY white males take this to the extreme by PRETENDING a black female (sometimes ME) is not even in the room
UNTIL THE OTHER WHITE PEOPLE ARE GONE OR ARE NOT LOOKING
I have had white males wait until a party or event is over and then will approach me with some slimy proposition — OBVIOUSLY an attempt to “go there” NOW that the other white people he was with are
NOWHERE (IN SIGHT)
and white males will do this when they are in groups, and will approach a single black female OR two black females
ESPECIALLY WHEN INTOXICATED
which means they were PROBABLY EYE-BALLING HER ALL ALONG
I believe many white males do this because other white people will CHASTISE a white male who ventures too far from the CODE. It is alright to BEND the code (have sex with a black female in secret)
BUT NOT alright to BREAK THE CODE
by treating a black female as though she is EQUAL to a white one
I have seen it happen — again, many times
I have watched countless white males PRETEND that they don’t find a black female is attractive (especially if she is noticeably “black-looking”) and will frown and fidget and sometimes even act hostile toward her
because being attracted to her GOES AGAINST HIS WHITE SUPREMACIST CONDUCT CODE
I actually list part of the code in one of my books and found it a source of recreation to watch it play out LIVE and IN PERSON
And I bet MOST of the black ladies on this thread can recount NUMEROUS instances where white males ignore OUR FEMININITY OR will sneak around and try to “hook up” when no white people are looking or listening
ESPECIALLY WHITE FEMALES
which is where the black male falls seriously behind because he has NO CONDUCT CODE that allows him to PEACEFULLY CO-EXIST with
AND GET THE COOPERATION of black females by making sure that WE KNOW THAT WE COME FIRST OVER ALL OTHER NON-BLACK FEMALES
and that is why there is SO MUCH RANCOR because many black males do JUST THE OPPOSITE
but the NON-BLACK FEMALES AHEAD OF THE BLACK FEMALE
Not knowing that CONDUCT CODE is how the white male keeps the loyalty of the white female
EVEN WHEN SHE SHARES HER BED WITH A BLACK OR NON-WHITE MALE
(Brothers, you need a BLACK MALE CONDUCT CODE ASAP!)
AND this LYING and PRETENDING by most whites males (because only a small percentage of white males OPENLY deal with or MARRY black females, but a TON more have had SEX with black females — including some of the white male posters on this thread (I bet)
is an ABNORMAL mindset that causes other problems (rage, violence, homosexuality)
because NO NORMAL HETEROSEXUAL MAN is so hung up on a female’s skin color that he does NOT notice she has a vagina and breasts
White supremacy is a MENTAL ILLNESS and that behavior I described above is just ONE manifestation of it
in my opinion
(sorry about the long post, but I have noticed this behavior since I was in my early 20s!)
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Inregards to expressing attraction to other races; no one really says anything at all.
I guess racist white guys are like; fine that just means more white women for me, the only ones I’ve ever seen act negatively towards it have actually been middle aged and up white women.
With young white women it almost seems to net you some “bonus points” with them.
With the other races of non white/black women, nothing seems to provoke a reaction at all, in my experience anyways.
Which mays it that muych more unsettling really that the “conduct code” is so strong, if no ones saying that out loud and no one is directly punishing anyone for it than how is it both known and reinforced?
It should be said; this is based on my experience of being open about attraction, not about relationships in anyway.
Inregards to personal experience with the whole “non-attraction to black women” thing, I didn’t start feeling any attraction for black women until I worked with one and after that I started noticing black women.
Which was kind of strange ; it was like having my brain reformated to some extent, it was like all these attractive women appeared out of nowhere but you know they had been there the whole time.
So then I started thinking; well why didn’t I notice them before and the only thing I could come up with was racism, and if you had asked before I turned thirty I would have said I wasn’t racist.
Am I saying all men who don’t notice black women are racist to the point they have submerged those emotions and trained themselves not even to react with out even thinking about?
No, the search terms in the southern states certainly seems to go against that idea but at a few of them are.
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You know…I’m just sick of this entire debate. Statistically, 95% of Black men marry Black women. A new study was put out just yesterday, stating that Black men have a higher desire to be in a committed relationship than Black women do (51% vs ~37%).
The mixed signals make it clear to me that people are drawing upon a bunch of pop culture imagery and taking it for truth, or at best, are taking a few anecdotal experiences and generalizing them on an alarming scale.
Black women and Black men are battling one another as if we are enemies, all the while, no one bothers to ask who has put the notion in our heads that we don’t love and respect one another?
We need to stop listening to all of these lies coming from OUTSIDE of our community. We are getting into a fight because of what other people are telling us about ourselves. It’s the very definition of stupidity.
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@ Lwanda Magere
“You know…I’m just sick of this entire debate.”—Which is why i will be making today my last posting to thread.
“The mixed signals make it clear to me that people are drawing upon a bunch of pop culture imagery and taking it for truth, or at best, are taking a few anecdotal experiences and generalizing them on an alarming scale.”—This is a common problem in most threads but yes I have noticed this.
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It is getting exhausting if I must say so myself. We need to move on to something else. Just my opinion.
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@ Peanut
LOL. Photos like that make me wish I was single again.
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@ Peanut
Sorry got caught up in that video you posted.
Music was better back then. Also the abundance of black tv shows and movies (I miss those days). As for contradictions, I think you have a lot of feelings and thoughts about the subject which can lead to contradictions at times. I think you should just learn as the experiences come. Nothing wrong with a few contradictions here and there.
I can’t be certain why white women still hate black women even when they date black men, but it could be some insecurity. I have heard white women say that the black guy chose them because of this or that. For example wanted a woman that was good with money or liked to travel the world. White women know he has one time to meet a black woman that fits that and she might be put on the back burner. Of course this is just speculation and this does not apply to all.
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@ Peanut
I know you didn’t address your question to me, but thanks for posting that pic!
I have noticed the huge change in black music, where black males used to sing about loving black women and having their hearts break and now thanks to the total takeover over of black music by white corporations they have programmed an entire generation of black males and females to see themselves as dawgs and b**ches and hos and n**gas and bootys
I think this was done deliberately to drive a wedge between us and make us turn against each other. I’ve heard some rappers who say they try to put out positive rap that they can’t get their music played
I think a lot of black females feel battered and beaten up (I know I do)
nd I hope I didn’t do that in my posts OR make any black females think I was implying black females weren’t attractive. I think we are beautiful because we come in so many different shades of beautiful black, mocha, chocolate and lemon and have so many wonderful features — lips, body shapes, skin, hair, eyes —
there is so much NATURAL BEAUTY in us that I have NEVER seen elsewhere that can’t be duplicated even by the best plastic surgeons in the world — and they have tried their best to give white females what we have naturally
I think that is why black females are being attacked by white mainstream media to maintain the white female at the top of the beauty pedestal
I also have noticed a great deal of hostility from white females toward black females — especially if the black female is attractive and/or has a nice body.
Anyway, before I go on too long, the only reason I’ve posted as much as i have is to caution my beautiful black sisters to be careful with your precious bodies and not to allow ourselves to be used by anyone who does NOT see us as fully human
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Dam someone is thirsty lol. Shoot peanut there are some fine navy men that go to this pool I go to for water aeorobics at an army base. One of them looked at me, this happened months ago but I still picture his face in my mind, lol. Yes we are going backwards as far as seeing black love or black cartoons. I’m a 90’s baby so I at least got to see black shows like the proud family, the cosby show, good times, famous jet Jackson, static shock, and little bill lol. Nowadays its really no shows for black kids to watch that shows them in a positive light or as superheroes.
As for white women hating black women when they are dating black men, proves that whites are still racist regardless if they are sleeping/married/dating a black person.some of it is them being insecure the other part is them being racist and stereotyping black ppl. They think oh I gotta be rude to black women so they won’t steal my man, in their mind they believe the jezebel and breeder stereotype, whether they admit it or not. If they didn’t subconsciously believe it they wouldn’t feel the need to hold onto their man tightly and steer him away from other black ppl. They think, they are both black I feel left out, and they may screw each other because they are sexual beasts,, yes its up to me to stop it. rofl
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someone is thirsty lol. Peanut the pool I go to for water aerobics at an army base has some fine navy men there. One fine brotha looked at me this happened months ago and I still picture his face.*sigh*. Music isn’t what it used to be neither are the shows. I’m a 90’s baby so I saw some good black shows like the proud family,that’s so rave, the cosby show, static shock, the famous jet Jackson,etc. These kids nowadays don’t have black cartoons and superheroes I feel sorry for em. As for the white women hating black women when they date black men just proves that whites can still be racist even when they have a black spouse,dating,or sexn a black person. I think its a lot of insecurity and the other part is they are racist. They think I have to keep my man away from black women because they believe the jezebel and breeder stereotypes.They think I gotta steer my man away from black women or they may screw each other,because they are sexual beasts and will do anything. They may also feel left out like omg they are both black. Its the same thing they say when they have a black female friend and they set her up on a blind date with a random black guy. Then when their black friend asks why did u set me up with him we have nothing in common their response is but he’s black. They think our only requirement for a mate is to be the same color smh.
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Sorry for the double post my computer is acting dum u can delete the first one abagond
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@ Peanut
It is perfectly ok to have contradictory feelings. Its part of being human. You might feel one way about something and next week feel differently about the same thing. The way our society is set up, especially these days, everything must fit into its nice neat little box. Which is probably why we worry when we start to notice that we are actually unboxed and don’t easily fit into many of the molds society sets up for us.
Humanity and being a human being is messy and contradictory. Embrace allathat and keep it moving. Relationships between people, of any kind and of any racial mix are also messy, complex and contradictory. Not easily defined, or expressed which is what makes posts and subsequent comment threads like this very interesting.
You are human, Peanut, and you are awesome and unboxed and I wouldn’t have it any other way.
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@ pam
I never heard of lemon colored sistas only caramel lol. learn something new everyday
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@Peanut
1) Black men and Black women will generally understand one another better, because we tend to share a similar experience/world view. I made the mistake of dating a White woman and the relationships could never just be about us. Race always came into play at some point. Even simple things like wearing a durag to help set waves in my hair became a huge issue because of the general ignorance that Whites have when it comes to the more nuanced elements of Black culture. There is a great comfort I have in being with a Black woman. I imagine Black women feel similarly about being with us.
2) White women have been lied to: the media tells them that they are the most beautiful women and that they are the standard to be aspired to. So while a White woman feels affirmed when a Black man desires her, she feels threatened when a Black woman challenges that perception. As for why White men hate both equally? Because White men occupy a position of power and tend to be disapproving of everyone that is not a White heterosexual male.
@ TrojanPam
Stop listening to top 40. I used to complain about how much music has changed until I decided to change my listening habits. It is true that top 40 music has seen a tremendous level of degradation in terms of the quality and the lyrical content. However, in the internet age, it is incredibly simple to discover positive music that carries the torch of yesteryear.
I suggest you give a listen to Brian Owens, Choklate, Jose James, Lelah Hathaway, Zo! etc. There is a tendency to assume that this generation has no good music. That simply isn’t true. Good music simply isn’t on the agenda of the powers that be. So go seek out good music from independent sources. Relying on commercial enterprise to properly represent anyone or anything is like waiting for the end of partisan politics.
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“Je retire ce que j’ai dit” = let me withdraw what I said previously.
This is a very interesting conversation for someone who wants to understand how American society functions.
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@ Peanut
I hope I didn’t cause your “arrrrghghg!!!!!”
(( wiping sweat off forehead ))
I blame the system that has poisoned us against each other.
I think it is SO easy to forget all the wonderful black males that we’ve known — wonderful but not perfect —
and the men who have loved us and raised us and fixed that flat tire when we called
or came by and looked at our furnace or water heater or car when we were ready to throw up our hands and give up
or who held us and told us things would be alright if we just hung in there
I know black men who are raising their children as single parents
I know black men who supported their black wives as they went through 18 months of breast cancer chemo
I know black men who went to jobs where they were dogged out just to bring money home (my father was one) and he NEVER once let us go hungry or homeless or without presents at XMAS time
I know black males who have co-signed and bought black females vehicles because they couldn’t afford one on their own
I know black males who showed up and helped me drain the water out of my crawlspace
I know black males who drove 500 miles to help a stranded black female friend or sister or mother
I know so many GREAT THINGS ordinary and average black males have done for me and for black females
And we black females need to OWN up to what we have done to them
we have hurt and betrayed some of the black males who tried to love us,
None of us are perfect, we are people who have been damaged by four hundred years of slavery AND 100 years of post-slavery and our relationships have never healed or recovered from that experience — and are STILL dealing with the racism that keeps black males from fully functioning as MEN and which keeps us from developing as the women we could be.
I DO NOT to blame black males (although I get frustrated too) because they did NOT create the system of racism/white supremacy that is waging war on all of us, and closing our black schools and trying to lock up our children for a science project gone wrong and who are about (I fear) to let George Zimmerman go free after MURDERING Trayvon Martin
THAT IS THE REAL PROBLEM: RACISM/WHITE SUPREMACY
That’s why — even though I’m sure everyone is sick of me by now — I keep emphasizing UNITY between black males and black females EVEN THOUGH I completely understand why so many black females are looking elsewhere for love.
that being said, my feeling is I DO NOT WANT to reward the same (white) people who COLLECTIVELY have CAUSED THE DIVIDE between black males and females AND who will NOT allow us to EXIST IN PEACE with them.
And if we AGREE (and maybe we don’t) that the MAJOR problem all black people face is RACISM (in every aspect of our lives)
I don’t see how we can DEFEAT racism without coming together as a BLACK UNITED COMMUNITY, because all the sex in the world with white people hasn’t SOLVED a single problem for us
and in fact, it seems that the more of that we do,
the worse off we seem to be as a people who think they don’t need each other
I will always take whatever LOVE, MONEY, TIME, and heart to a black man because that is the ONLY way I will ever feel like I’m “home”
with a white male — no matter how nice he appears to be — I will never feel “at home” or that he understands my struggles as a black person in a racist system OR that he really cares
of course, that’s my opinion
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@ Lwanda Magere
Actually, I never listened to that music.
Just commenting on how fall in quality our “black” music has fallen — especially for black people under 35
I mostly listen to the oldies (like the 60s and 70s music) and some jazz
thanks for the music suggestions, I will check them out
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@ TrojanPam
“That’s why — even though I’m sure everyone is sick of me by now”—No. I will admit that you did come off as a bit hostile at first and I was turned off by that (especially the looking for white approval rhetoric) but that does not negate the truth in what you were saying. I just hate seeing us as black folks fight and argue with each other. some things I don’t agree with and maybe because I don’t understand the way you presented it but I am fine with agreeing to disagree on those issues. 🙂
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@ Trojan pam
I appreciate ums pam I love ur posts and just finished lesson one in ur bootcamp. Don’t go anywhere i’m not sick of u, you bring a good perspective to these discussions.
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I appreciate u lol typo
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@ Sharina
Thanks for sharing your honest feelings.
I’m still a work in progress and will try to consider what you said in the future
I agree, I hate to see us fight each other as much as I hate to reward those who started the fight in the first place
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@ Trojanpam
“I agree, I hate to see us fight each other as much as I hate to reward those who started the fight in the first place”–I know the feeling and I understand that when people jump at you then you have to jump back. In those instances I would not ask you to apologize or change.
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@TrojanPam
You’re so on point! The black man and woman need each other. We may have our differences but we need to come together if we want to defeat racism. We can’t do it as individuals. It will never work. It has to be a collective effort. The media does everything it can to divide us. All the negative images of sistas in the media make me sick! But I know the black woman is the original woman on the planet. She is to be honored and respected. And there is nothing the vile demonic media can do to make me turn my back on black women. I know she is my natural mate which is why I have no interest in white women. And we have to stand against the interracial propaganda.
We have to do everything we can to restore the black family. And first black men need to stand up as leaders of their community. The true image of the black woman needs to be restored as well. It’s going to be a long hard road. But I have faith in my people that they will wake up. We must do this for the sake of our children. We have no other option. Thank you for your contribution Pam. I always appreciate your posts. I can tell you truly love your people. And you don’t bite your tongue. Others may not like it but that shows your devotion to truth. Even if it hurts the feelings of others. But if we want to beat this Beast(system) we have to speak honestly. You’re on the right course. Stay on your conter-racist grind. Peace.
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@ mstoogood4yall
thank you ma’am
it’s good to hear the PROS and the CONS because I know when I get on a roll
watch out! 🙂
I just feel so passionately about healing the HURT between the black male and female and I know that the white media via its portrayal of our relationships as horrible and unhealthy and the PUSH toward being with white people makes me concerned for our future in an increasingly racist and hostile society
the movie, “The Purge” is a big red flag as to the changing MOOD of white america collectively
and I fear these words might come back to haunt us if we do NOT pay attention to the laws being passed and the black schools being closed and how two Illinois senators wanted to lock up 18,000 black males without charging them with a crime (!)
in the midst of all that is going on to black people, I think it is UNWISE to separate ourselves even further than we already are
that is my major point and I’ll end on that note.
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@ Sharina
Yes, and I have to be careful not to be too “preachy”
I think I have that tendency and who wants someone preaching at them as though they know it all?
I can understand how my “message” can get lost in my sometimes flawed delivery
Just know that I want the best for all of you and that I want black females to get all the love they deserve
I just DO NOT WANT to see our bodies used as sexual toilets the same way our ancestors were used
because a LOT of that is going on and a LOT of black females are being quietly devastated by having sex with racists
and that is the one thing MOST of us will never talk about
so I thought, let’s talk about it RIGHT here where we can be honest and without shame or fear
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I just realized that only about 20 people contributed to this 500+ comment thread. Not a lot of diversity of thought.
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I don’t think ww can hate bw women while dating bm and not hate bm…just doesn’t seem logical.
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Someone, earlier in this thread, made a comment, (and im paraphrasing for the sake of being concise) that one should not judge an interracial relationship through the prism of the history of white/black relations(ie: slavery, jim crow), but by the behavior of the white individual. According to the poster this behavior should be easy to gauge, because the individual who who posted the comment, asserts that he, and most other people on this thread, have a heightened awareness of white racism.
Whats interesting, from my observation anyway, is that almost everyone posting on this thread misses a glaring irony. Which is that this entire thread is not only racist against whites, but is racist against whites in the same exact way that whites are blamed for being racist against people posting on this thread.
Every complaint loged against white behavior towards black men/women, is reiterated and amplified tenfold by the people commenting. For example, whites are referred to in blanketed generalizations, they are demonized (fairly or unfairly), objectified, sexualized, ect.
I’m not sure if people posting on here are just unaware of the glaring hypocrisy, or worse yet, aware of it and apathetic to it. Almost no one posting here can claim any moral or ethical high ground to the people who de-individualize, demonize, objectify and sexualize them. I mean in all honesty what is the point of all the pontification?
Does this kind of self victimizing, blame game, support group actually make anyones life better?
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Well, although I haven’t commented at all, I’ve followed and done tons of head nodding, eye rolling and the infamous “smh”
And then I thought that sometimes, the best vehicle for hard lessons black folks face are done this way:
(http://youtu.be/h8gP9GX2udI)
😉
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@Sugarkiss
I agree however it is best that Black women date their own Black men despite Black men’s flaws unless they found a nice White guy to settle down with. Most White men aren’t out for Black women’s interests except sexually experiment with us and that has been proven time and time again. The same can be said about many Black men too.
I am not totally against Black women dating White men as long as he respects her and he is the right guy for her. Personally for me, I could never date or marry a White guy, ever. I care way too much for the state of my race to do that.
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So the talking about music on this thread got me thinking about the video vixens and what have you and it occured to me.
Since the primary consumers of rap music are white people, white males even, doesn’t that mean the primary viewers of rap videos will also be white males?
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@ Adeen,
I completely agree with you, I posted that because of the satirical element. The Wayan Brothers have been known (even before Dave Chapelle) to be skilled at turning the mirror inwards on Blacks and making us really think about the stereotypes that we fight daily and how what we DO doesn’t always match what we SAID.
The movie is completely satire and sums up every single Black 90s film that blacks made and was popular then.
And that super pro Black man that secretly (and openly) worship white women exists. That is the irony of the scene and reason I posted the clip. Pam broke it down as well as Peanut and others, the torture it can be to fight the negative images of us black women and then having to raise our children to love themselves when they see NO ONE, especially black men in love with each other on TV, music or most anywhere else main stream these days.
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@Sugarkiss:
You wrong for posting that video! LMFAO!
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@ V-4
The sheer absence of black love and deep, meaningful positive relationships on mainstream TV does the same type of damage that seeing the video would do. It reinforces the non existence of Black women as respectful and desirable, loveable humans. It’s toxic.
Listening to these garbage rap songs can be done over and over and over, the lyrics settling themselves in the subconscious of white males–to the point that they don’t even realize they aren’t doing us any favors by treating us and adopting AAVE and all that phony attempts at “connecting” is belittling, NOT REAL LIFE and very disrespectful, to say the least.
The system in motion works on all levels. Today’s rap videos are more likely to get a young white boy’s azz kicked or laughed at. Those attempts at “othering” black culture really does not help anybody learn anything of substance. Because beneath the surface, the hard facts about our Black American ‘subculture’ has everything to do with all the things named here and almost everywhere else black folks congregate– and white ppl DO NOT WANT TO TALK ABOUT ANYTHING THAT HAS TO DO WITH REAL HISTORY and MISEDUCATION of said history–those aren’t the feel good answers they want us to tell them.
They just want to learn the Electric slide and the Wobble…just. Whatever.
That is my reality and why we get so up in arms when white ppl start crying over being “soo misunderstood” and “I just want black ppl to know I’m not racist…”etc.
It’s just so much more to it that that. Read and re-read about comments. The answers are 100s of years old and even the most intellectual, “well read” white person would attempt to touch our past with a 100ft pole.
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@ Sondis,
I love the Wayans and that movie!! I was smiling the whole time I cut and pasted the link! Those days were golden for our commercial creativity 😀
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My sista, you ain’t lying! Oh, i so miss those days, too! ^_^
On another note…
Sugarkiss,
You and my other black sistas and brothas have got to leave these white folks be…stop going back and forth with these white people, they don’t want to see how we suffer in a sympathetic way.
White folks come on abagond’s blog to just fuss and fight with us, challege us at every turn.
why you think i never get into much of a debate with them on this blog? I see them trying to pull me in like they do everyone else on this blog but i refuse.
I come here to talk to my beautiful black people, not fight with racist white people.
I’ll talk about white folks but I’ll be damned if I’m going try to talk to them as to get them to understand our plight and how its not equal under this white supremacist, society we live in.
I know white folks don’t care, don’t want to know and don’t want to listen to reason, so i don’t bother trying to convince them of anything.
Now i see my sistas be laying down the knowledge on these racist white people and i love it but that knowledge could be told to our young black brothas and sistas that are in danger of having, white racist like the ones you are fussing with, make their life miserable.
I say, we should talk to each other, not white folks that don’t want to talk to us but talk, AT US!
We could be laughing and joking around with each other about the good old times, from the 80’s and 90’s. Instead, we fuss with racist white folks….
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@Sugarkiss
In talking about the videoes I wasn’t talking about culture or fads.
I was talking about how it was mentioned that black women get portrayed as undesireable but that the mass consumption by white males of erotic imagery of black women via rap videos would be an indication that they are pretty strongly desired.
Also are there any studies on black couples and how many are healthy or not; beacause otherwise doesn’t everything potentially fall under confirmation bias?
I mean we got one person saying most couples with BW are interracial and another saying that US tv seems like to be marriee they practically have to be brother and sister.
That aside wouldn’t a prevalence of INTR-ccouples be saying that black people are potential relationship?
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@Peanut, I feel you. I hope this will be my last posting on this subject if my comment ever see the day of light,lol… It reminds me of what Nelly Fuller said about black peoplw-“we love to be SERIOUS about SILLY matters and yet get very SILLY about SERIOUS matters. I think as a moderator Abagond promotes this cause mOST of my posting were never even published but some very silly insane trivial postings were not only highlighted but it generated a lot of even sillier responses. it is very depressing. I dont know how old Abagond is but now I start to wonder if he be over 18 yrs old. I could be wrong but I dont know what else to make of such folly and foolishness…..
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t@Temple, that figures- most cONSTRUCTIVE posters comments probably never saw the light of day…..
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@ C. Andrews
What in the world are you talking about? I have not deleted a single one of your comments on this thread. Not one.
On this thread the only comments I deleted were:
1. At the direction of the commenter (Sharina)
2. Requested edits to fix spelling, delete a line, etc (B.R., Legion)
3. A duplicate (Linda)
4. Not in English (oogenhand)
5. Way off topic (rollingwriter)
6. The usual spam
Everyone has been allowed to comment AT LENGTH.
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@Sondis
”You and my other black sistas and brothas have got to leave these white folks be…stop going back and forth with these white people, they don’t want to see how we suffer in a sympathetic way.”
Exactly I agree with you, that is why I have never dated a White male before and probably never will because I love my race way too much to do that. If I dated a White guy, I would be branded a sellout and I would never want to sellout my race. I am so sick of White trolls coming on here and trying to distract us from the issues that matter to Blacks.
Most Black women like me are better off with Brothas and if you want to debate me on this, then go ahead but the truth is most people are better off dating and marrying their own kind.
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@ Sondis,
Amen Brother!!! Black people don’t need to prove to Whites that they’re suffering from racism because they know but don’t care. If the oppposite were true, I don’t think that racism would continue to last all these hundreds of years. Us trying to prove our worth to them is like a prisoner begging their guard to let them out of jail and be free forever. WE are going to have to burn midnight oil trying to figure out how to overcome this problem. They’re going to do whatever regardless of what we tell them.
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@ Sondis
Amen Brother!!!
Black people should stop trying to prove to White people that they are being mistreated. Many of them know what is happening to us but just don’t care. If the opposite were true, I don’t think that racism would have lasted so long. It’s like a prisoner trying to convince the guard to let them out of the jail cell and be free forever; that is virtually IMPOSSIBLE.
I think Black people should just try to do the best they can as an individual to solve race-related issues that effect them in their immediate lives, but for a larger goal of justice. I think the reason why Whites have been so successful at playing this color-based game is because they work as united, but independent, individuals. They don’t need a White leader to tell them how to treat Black people day in and day out because they have their own code for getting the job done. So I suggest that Black people need a have code so that things can work out in our favor. We have waited long enough for change, which is possible, but will take a lot of serious work on our part.
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@ Ms. J you said enuff !!!! You hit the nail on the head !!! We need a code, we need it badly . That be the only thing that may work in the longterm to counter tihis racism ish …….
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I like Sondis. Seems like a good natured guy.
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@ c.andrews
That’s what I think too. Do you ever notice how White people use the same, cliche terms and views to talk about race? It doesn’t matter if they’re 21, a Texan, or a gay person; they ALL know to speak about the matter in such a way that the truth will not be openly revealed.
Their behavior is also similar. I notice that they’re rarely get too close to you as a Black person unless they just want to have sex and be gone. I’ve also been in situations where White males AND females will talk nice to you one-on-one but act as if you don’t exist when around their White peers. Even so-called “Jews” do it too. So we need to start getting on one accord as Black people and stop pretending that just one or two are the problem. Even if they call you their “friend”, they understand that their relationship with you is not as genuine as it could be because they’re in a powerful position.
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Commenting on the original post:
1. I’m pretty certain many people of whatever ethnicity go into relationships for the wrong reasons. This is not specific to black women who date nonblack men. Also, at least 90% of black americans & other blacks suffer from internalized racism. Colorism is so ingrained in blacks that, much like whites & racism, it’s just how things are.
2. Agree, black women do not secretly desire white men. Just like other women, black women desire men of character…and it’s not a secret. And some of those men are not black.
It’s closer to the truth to say that black women with white men are often forced to defend their relationship by confrontational black folk who have no right to an opinion about said relationship.
3. I think this is a moot point because nothing is static. All of the numbers are changing as we speak/type/comment here. Unemployment numbers just changed, the housing numbers just changed, Facebook stock just went down again. The number of interracial marriages across the board increased according to the 2010 Census. The numbers may decrease or increase in the next Census. Everything changes.
4. Beauty standards are racialised and, in general, every group follows the standard.
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Ms J
Is it really like that ? If it is, then I totally understand your reactions (I’m talking of what other people commenting also express). I’m amazed to see how bad it still is. it is sickening.
But at the same time (sorry if I insist for the other commenters who have read me already), what you are describing is what I would consider as “white American” behavior. “They” (generalization, they are not all like that, but most are) have very superficial relationships that are -almost- always “interested”. We chatted about that with my husband yesterday (we are French nationals and he is of African origin, I am classified as “white” in the US), he said it is very annoying at work (he works in an American firm in the US right now) because he never knows what to think of people’s behavior. They seems “warm” when they need you and then you don’t exist anymore if they are done with you. And then they come back with a changed attitude. Every other international co-worker says they feel the same, Italian, Indian, Spanish or else. It has nothing to do with people’s color (in his workplace) but it is just the way they behave. As a student 20 years ago in the South I had noticed the exact same thing. I was amazed at how you could talk with someone one evening and then the next morning they say “hi” and walk away. You’re like, “wth? where has the whole conversation from yesterday gone ?” I remember standing in the middle of an alley on campus after such an instance. It was really weird. I never was able to know if it was the same with African-Americans because it was difficult to socialize with them, the campus was very divided and international students were even more remote from the rest. I took Afro-American History classes but I don’t remember having a fellow student trying to hang with me. I had very interesting conversations with the teacher however. Relationships with Africans were the same as any other international student too (very warm and a lot of parties, with little drinking and a lot of fun and dance).
So my take on this is it may be due to racism, the fact that they constantly had to keep a distance all these years, they have learnt to be like that and even with changes they have retained the same attitudes. I think racism has shaped most of what happens here. In France it’s different because most of the racist attitudes occurred in the colonies/so-called territories. Which doesn’t mean racism isn’t prevalent. It is, but the French population itself is divided in racists and non-racists, a lot of them will not let racist attitudes prevail. They will react when something happens. And racists will be more openly racist than contemporary Americans.
If you saw French kids and youth behave with each other (all origins together) you would be amazed. They sit on each other’s laps (though not boys on boys’ !) and touch a lot, kiss both cheeks every morning, hold each other, etc. Here it’s forbidden to touch in school !!!! I don’t know what they think they are teaching pre-adolescents and adolescents with such restrictions here… They need to touch (and there is NOTHING sexual in that). I’m pretty sure it’s the same in many countries.
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@ Ms. J
I find that the greatest issue is that White America has preached assimilation, which Black America mistook as being synonymous with inclusion. We keep waiting for Whites to accept us. We seek their validation. The truth is, no matter what we do, we do not meet White society’s criteria for inclusion. At best, we can be tolerated (and you’ll notice that White diversity dialog always preaches tolerance, not acceptance), but never truly a part of their society.
Our hair can’t be straightened enough. Our patterns of speech, not spoken with a neutral enough inflection. We allow them to impose their standards of beauty and culture, and we are always the ones suffering for it. We abandon our own people and our own ways, and the end result is as it has always been throughout history: Whiteness never receives you, and your own fail to recognize you.
Just read up on the Bureau of Indian Affairs and the number of Native American boarding schools that they created. They were academies for assimilation in which the children of the tribes were forced to abandon their names, language and culture in exchange for White ways and culture. What wound up happening? These children were often rejected by White society upon graduation (leading to impoverishment and suicide), and those that attempted to return to their tribes could no longer function in that culture because they no longer understood it. Whites have been doing this literally for hundreds of years. Yet here we are falling for it in the 21st century.
It is nothing short of sad to see Black women go on about how White men just adore them. It is saddening to see Black men think that a White woman is some kind of ultimate sign of success or acceptance. Time for us to stop worrying about White people liking and loving us. Time for us to start loving ourselves.
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@Lwanda
Blacks shouldn’t assimilate into a culture that hates us and degrades us endlessly. We should try to solve our own problems in the Black Community and learn to love ourselves as a race of people. I think the part of the reason for the internalized racism in our culture is lack of knowledge of self. When White slave masters took us as slaves, our culture, language and ways were taken from us. If we don’t know where we came from, we sure wouldn’t know where we are going.
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@ sondis
BrAVO. I agree, f what others think or say all that matters is us. The spurs owned the heat last nighr what. lol
@Beautywoc
I saw him first lol naw ,He’s peanuts man ……………jk, lol. If u want a chance with him give him a dolla he likes those.
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@ Lwanda and Adeen
*Two snaps*
I couldn’t say your ideas any better.
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@ Peanut
I agree, the black female image has been greatly demeaned since slavery but more recently seems to have intensified over the last 15 years, from rap video h*os to monster mothers (Precious) to white male’s w**ores (Monster’s Ball, and most TV shows showing BW chasing WM for sex)
the black female AS a white man’s w*ore images started during slavery to JUSTIFY RAPING US and BLAMING US for the rapes (instead of the serial white male rapists)
And many white male shock jocks use us as punching bags to the DELIGHT of their white audiences (who, if you caught them after listening, they would SWEAR up and down, “Oh no, I’m not a racist!”)
Keep in mind that some of this behavior may be LATENT HOMOSEXUALITY because no NORMAL heterosexual male spends ANY time talking about women he does not find attractive. However, females AND males who are competing for PENISES may view black females as “competition.”
No joke
I had the same experiences. I remember years ago placing a personal ad as a joke and SPECIFIED a black male and about HALF of the responses I got were from white males, one saying he wanted to drink my bath water and other sexually blatant references
WHILE the black males NEVER mentioned sex in their responses and to me, that said a LOT about how white males REALLY view black females, from their ARROGANCE to assume they could ignore what I wanted in order to DO what they wanted to me — and their responses often showed a perverted nature and intent towards me.
Peanut, the overall INTENT is to BREAK US DOWN and destroy our collective self-esteem so we can’t raise psychologically healthy BLACK children and to make us vulnerable to the SEXUAL wants of white males.
I mentioned in an earlier post this technique is called “framing.” I hope you’ll take the time to read it
And those black males who demean us are males who have drank the poison of SELF-HATRED and ANTI-BLACKNESS that is FORCE FED all of us in a white supremacy society. No black male can despise black females WITHOUT despising himself — because he CAME from a black female.
And if black females were “nothing” why would the white media have to spend so much time, money and energy to PROVE it? Why are black females’ physical features some of the most REQUESTED features on the white female’s plastic surgery “wish list?”
Like bigger breasts, butts, lips and a ‘darker skin?”
Come on now… somebody’s running a CON GAME on us.
I hope you’ll read the book, “The Beauty Con Game” which breaks down exactly what is happening and how “beauty” (or a lack of it) is used to practice white supremacy and to destroy black psychological health.
Plus, the book offers many practical solutions to counter the assault on our black self-esteem
Take care and stay strong, Sis!
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@ sondis
who said; “Now i see my sistas be laying down the knowledge on these racist white people and i love it but that knowledge could be told to our young black brothas and sistas that are in danger of having, white racist like the ones you are fussing with, make their life miserable.”
—
I agree, and that’s the only reason I’ve been posting in the hopes that young black males and females might read my posts and the posts of other black people who are trying to share constructive info and personal experiences.
You never know who will read what you write OR if you have planted a seed or at least have given food for thought
This is NOT about dialoguing with or proving anything to white people (we can’t) but reading some of their responses (which are often patronizing at est and racist at worst)
can say MORE about what racism is they we could in twenty posts on it
I really enjoyed dialoguing with you and some of the other posters and I’m pretty much done here
so I’m moving on
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@ Beautywoc:
Hey, thanks for the compliment, i like you too. *looks at your ring finger
@ : o l ) >
@ mstoogood4yall:
haha there is nothing between me and Peanut, She don’t want me, I’m too old!
Yeah, the spurs, chewed their ass up! @ > : o O ) >
@ Ms. J:
Very good compliment to my point! @ : o D ) >
@ Adeen:
That’s the ticket my beautiful black sista! The thing is, you preferring and loving black men, has nothing to do with hating white folks, its about you as a black woman, wanting a man that will see you as a woman to commit too and stand up for, if anyone attacks you in any way.
Most whites do not come in defense of their black partners, they simply escort themselves and you out of the situation, so they don’t have to be seen by their white peers, defending a black person.
Yeah, black men do use black woman for sex but doesn’t every race of people do that?
Yes but its different coming from a white person, simply because of the power structure, that exists between black and white people.
Black men, using black women for sex is a issue within itself and has nothing to do with white supremacy, per say . I just hate when white people, always try to comment on that, like they are even concerned about black women to begin with, its only used against us in debates and arguments, “black men use black women, why aren’t you saying anything about that?”
Fist off, that is none of your concern, (not to mention, your so called concern, isn’t genuine. ) That is a issue that needs to be addressed and discussed within the BLACK COMMUNITY, amongst ourselves.
When we talk to one another about the issues that effect us, its coming from LOVE most of the time, its judgmental and condescending, coming from white people and not from love.
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TrojanPam:
I understand what you’re saying, Sista!
I like dialoging with you, too. @ : o / ) >
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@ sondis
hope you’ll check out my site and consider taking part in the Counter Racism Boot Camp
@ abagond — I hope it’s ok to mention it here
Until next time!
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@ Trojan Pam
Regular commenters can plug their own websites. I do not consider that spam.
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@Sondis
Well said and my reasons for preferring Black men is that I believe that I have more common with them and could relate to them culturally. I can’t get that with a White guy. Second of all, while some Black men may bash Black women, I believe that MOST White men don’t respect Black women as a woman but see her as a Black sex object to use when they want to. Most White guys in this country don’t want a serious relationship with a Black woman, they want to experiment with them. With a Black guy, I could be seen as a woman and then my race because he knows how it is like to struggle as a Black person in a racist society. Last but not least, I want to preserve my race and keep it alive. I fear that the Black population will go down in America because of all the race mixing that Black men and some Black women are doing. I don’t desire mixed race children with diluted blood.
Most of all, I believe that most people are better off dating inside their race unless they found someone outside of their race that they can connect with. I don’t see why the media is all of sudden promoting interracial relationships? Me, like most Black women in America, don’t desire White men as sexual partners at all.
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@ abagond
Thanks for letting me know!
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@ sondis
Lol its ok there is someone out there who would want an old wise man like u, unfortunately peanut isn’t one of them, but beauty woc is still in the running[ I think if she ain’t married] lmbao.
I agree with ur points about how ppl act so concerned for us and our issues when really they are deflecting. I wish they’d also stop jumping in and agreeing with other black ppl when they are speaking to us about our issues, and feel the need to add their 2 cents about what’s wrong with our community. We know the issues let us handle it, u take ur funky arse somewhere and handle ur issues. They love acting like they trying to help us when really all they doing is pointing out flaws with no solutions. Reminds me of a married couple in counseling pointing fingers at each other then when one is talking about what they do wrong the other one is jumping in and saying yeah and tell them what else u did. Then when the discussion turns to what they did wrong they silent *crickets*
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@ sondis (and all)
here’s the link to the Boot Camp
http://racismws.com/counter-racism-101/
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@ Adeen
Sistah they’ve been planning this interracial agenda way before, its just now coming out. Before this they were having single black women on the news and saying they need a man, and they were saying black men are locked up or down low and all that stuff. Then they were doing studies on black women and saying we are ugly.Then they started showing black men with white women and all these biracial ppl in Hollywood that they were praising and calling beautiful and playing the roles of black ppl. After that this stuff happens now we see all these interracial ads, commercials, etc. They always 2 steps ahead.
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@Mstoogood
Thanks for the clarification, I was always wondering and you answered my questions.
Plus has anyone wondered how White men see Black women? Personally I think they see us Black women as sex objects to use just like their rapist ancestors. Anyone think otherwise?
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Adeen:
Plus has anyone wondered how White men see Black women? Personally I think they see us Black women as sex objects to use just like their rapist ancestors. Anyone think otherwise?
Yes, i agree what you about this. Its the same with white women, they look at black men in the same way.
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@ mstoogood, Adeen & sondis
Check out this clip from a 2012 TV Show “Franklin and Bash” (about a law firm) to see how sexually attractive black females are always portrayed as being the sexual pursuers of white males
the first black female you see in the clip, her sexuality and attractiveness is completely ignored by all the males
but at 1.41 (video counter)
you’ll see a very attractive black female go after the least attractive white male and throw herself at him.
They have sex right at the party (her idea) even though she is obviously out of place at that party AND is of a higher rank than the white male
( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kADVAe9Zv9c )
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TrojanPam:
Yeah, noticed two things in this clip:
The black women, being arrested! ( criminalizing )
Then the black woman, throwing herself at an average looking and dorky white man. ( Jezebel )
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Mr. Nelly pretty much summed up interacial relationships in this interesting clip http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PUFjytudEug
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@ Trojan pam
That show looks lame. It appears she is the only black person on that show[token black] and yes they had to go and make her be the jezebel and sapphire. I tell ya they always show dark skinned women as being the jezebel, mammy, or sapphire.
Adeen
No they haven’t really changed their views on how they see black women since way back in the day. we are still just a fling to them, if we weren’t then they’d approach us regardless if other ppl are around and not just on the internet. Only ppl looking for sex will go around someone when nobody else is around or approach them after dark. The freaks come out at night and the trolls come out in the day. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JLYC7ltxOrk
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@ sondis
I agree
I have noticed this trend for the last several years and how they almost NEVER show a black female/black male relationship in any TV shows UNLESS
it’s a BUFFOONISH black sitcom
and even then, the black female is usually light-skinned with long hair — if the black male is showing her any love and respect
if she is brown or dark-skinned she is either man-less OR the butt of ANTI-BLACKNESS jokes
Make no mistake, these shows are NOT ‘black shows’ , they have black performers but the CONTENT must be approved and revised by the white people in charge
I used to dialogue with a black female writer in Hollywood and she told a lot of similar stories about how racist the TV industry and Hollywood were
one time she was in a meeting with another black female and a white male said they had to find more ways to put black males with white males in TV shows and she said, the white male was looking RIGHT at her and the other black female when he said it
this kind of coupling of black males and females with white people has been in the planning for a long time
NOTHING would make me happier than more and more black people to understand what we are looking at WHENEVER we watch television OR go to a movie created by Hollywood
with ABSOLUTELY NO EXCEPTIONS, I can almost guarantee
that we are looking at SOME FORM of white supremacy — even if it appears that none is taking place
and once you learn to RECOGNIZE IT, you will realize you are seeing it EVERYWHERE
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CORRECTION:
“one time she was in a meeting with another black female and a white male said they had to find more ways to put black males with white females in TV shows and she said, the white male was looking RIGHT at her and the other black female when he said it
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@ Peanut
Be careful what you ask for!
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@Sondis, Trojam and Mstoogood
Thanks for the responses and White women also see Black men as sex objects not relationship material. I know most White guys see us as sex objects because I am always approached on the internet by them. Very few Whites guys actually want to start an relationship with a Black woman regardless of the social stigma and the color of her skin.
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@Peanut
I get scared when middle aged White males approach me on the internet. To me, they are the most dangerous! I have also gotten some degrading comments from White males too and girl, let me tell you, ignore them!
It is rare that Black men approach me on the internet like that. Usually I get responses from well spoken Black males not pedophiles. I wonder why?
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@ Peanut
who asked: “Why was he looking at the black females?”
That’s a good question. I would have a better idea had I been there but the impression I got from the black female writer was he was simply practicing racism
I believe it might have been his way of letting the two black females KNOW their feelings didn’t matter AND maybe, he got a kick of looking at their faces when he said.
I believe that white male KNEW how sensitive black females are about the black male/white female issue and he enjoyed knowing they couldn’t do or say anything to stop those white people from practicing racism
she ALSO said a couple of other things that stuck with me.
“Some black actors have to almost threaten to quit a show or movie in order to get a black actress cast as their love interest. (Eriq LaSalle, Russell Hornsby, etc.)
Otherwise, white women are usually the first and only choice by white men who really hate black men, but envy the alleged sexual prowess of black men.
Although latinas are second choice many times, white men (and white women) prefer to see white women with black men.
I think they hate the fact that they enjoy watching black men and white women together and exact revenge against black men because of this sexual fetish.
Unless they have a little bit of clout, a black writer/producer takes a risk to suggest casting a black actress darker than Halle Berry who isn’t Gabrielle Union or Sanaa Lathan. I’m relaying what I know to be true from my own personal experiences.”
—-
the above is a DIRECT quote in an email she sent me. That’s why SEX AND RACISM GO HAND IN HAND in a white supremacy system — and white people OFTEN enjoy sexually sewering blacks and non-whites EVEN when they HATE them and are practicing RACISM against them
There’s an old saying: who you LIE down with, you get up with in the morning
and that’s a question more black males and females NEED to start asking ourselves BEFORE we become sexually involved with ANYONE, but especially a racist.
because I believe ONE of the reasons many black people are becoming more psychologically ILL and more ANTI-BLACK (which is the same thing as becoming ANTI-SELF)
is directly LINKED to our voluntary increase in having sex with the same people who COLLECTIVELY are oppressing us
that is a recipe for PSYCHOLOGICAL ANNIHILATION
just my opinion, of course
Thanks for getting a copy of ‘The Beauty Con Game!’
Peanut, I really think it will bring some more clarity to why you are feeling the way you feel — which under the circumstances of WAR
is a NATURAL way to feel when you are constantly being attacked
there is NOTHING wrong with the way you feel, I believe there are many black females who feel the same way (i know I do)
If you have any comments or questions, you can send me an email from the website
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@ c. andrews
Mr. Fuller breaks down racism/white supremacy like no other
Listening to him greatly reduced my sensitivity to hearing the truth instead of ducking and dodging some info because it didn’t make me feel good or it wasn’t what I wanted to hear
that’s why I prefer hard core information as long as it is LOGICAL and TRUTHFUL
and I have found that it has made me less “sensitive” to having my feelings hurt by my mistreatment under the system of white supremacy
because I AM NOT the PROBLEM, there is nothing WRONG with me,
there is something wrong with people who MISTREAT other people just because their skin is a different color
and I NO longer blame myself (or other black people) for what a racist or racists are doing to me.
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Hip Hop, The Hidden Hand, and the Degradation of Black Masculinity
by Lenon Honor
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7vmJLIscyUE)
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@ mstoogood4yall
Sister, you sure said a mouthful! That had to be one of the lamest shows I’ve ever seen. I was doing some research for a project I was working on and I borrowed the DVD from the library
after I saw that sex scene, I couldn’t watch another second. Just glad I didn’t pay to rent it!
what bothers me the most is all the black people who are soaking in that message because they do NOT see the inherent degradation not just of black females BUT of black males
because what are they really saying?
Not just that the black female is a white man’s w*hore
they are ALSO saying to the black male that the white man can take your black woman, play with her body, and toss her back in the water and go fishing for another one (black female)
and there is nothing you can do about it, black boy
just like it was in the good ole days
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Yeah, this is the second time I’m posting here after stating that I would no longer comment, but (too bad for my haters lol) I have a question which, from what I can surmise, has not been adequately addressed — that question being: if Black men and women (my apologies, but I hate that usage of ‘males’ and ‘females’ in place of Black men and women) have no attraction for members of their own race, wouldn’t it be preferable that these people pursue individuals of a race for whom they do hold an attraction?
My personal belief is that if any given Black man has ZERO attraction for Black women (of any shade /appearance), or if he outright despises us, I DO NOT want to find such a person – for the simple reason that someone has put a guilt trip on him into staying within his ‘race’ – running behind me in pursuit of a relationship. That mess is NOT going to work. He will most definitely show his hatred for the fact that I am Black eventually, which in turn would cause me to be much more cautious and suspicious in dealing with Black men on a general level.
I am a firm believer that Black men… and Black people… who worship at the altar of whiteness / non-Blackness should hook up with the true objects of their desire and leave Blacks out of their machinations.
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@ Peanut
One you understand WHY something is happening, it becomes LESS personal because you realize it’s NO reflection on your value as a person
but all part of the STRATEGY of those who attack you
the mistake I see many black people make (and I’m included) is trying to match the FAKE TV world we are shown with black people being accepted by white people
and the REAL world we live in where we are being attacked from every angle
I think it’s MORE important to be LOGICAL-MINDED than to be OPEN-MINDED.
we don’t have to be “open” to anything or anyone that is trying to harm us
If you don’t want to date white males for whatever reason DON”T LET ANYONE or ANYTHING — especially a website or some IR ad — make you think you’re doing something wrong
White people make that choice all the time not to date non-whites and no one is beating them up about it.
Even black people have the same right to make the same choices
(and white people have so much more power than we do it’s easy to feel coerced or pressured like you’re supposed to please them and give in to them but I strongly suggest AVOIDING anyone who makes you feel like their feelings are more important than yours
do what feels RIGHT for you
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@ peanut
Don’t let this stuff get to you. Let me know when u do that post on that experiment u did. i’m sure it will be interesting. Don’t forget who u are and ur value, that is what they want, to destroy our self esteem and break us like they do horses. Ur are special, beautiful, and worthy of being treated like a queen not an escort.
@ trojan pam
Thanks for breaking that down. You are right about ppl sleeping with racist whites. I saw a vid of a black man on youtube saying how when he was younger he was with a white woman and then she started talking bad about black women, he said he broke it off after that. {http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=px7GrrYe_50}
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He starts talking about his relationships at 5:30 mark
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@ peanut great vid
Here’s another one
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cg–5iiN4MY)
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Is self hate the cause of iRR: for black men and Latinas?
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vmLEE9i2CSI)
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@Peanut
Well; its already known men are dogs, they hit up on everybody.
As has already been stated in this post; the reason less black women are in interracial relationships than anyone else is because they don’t want to pdate out of the race not because men aren’t asking them out.
@TrojanPam
7-9 out of 10 marriages are ended by women; working on assumptions that stat can be applied to general relationships wouldn’t that mean most of the time its the women ended the relationship with the man? That being so why is it assumed the black woman isn’t equally using the white man as well?
That combined with your statement about white men using black women and there is nothing black men can do about it kind of implies that men of a race own the women of that race; and that sex is degrading to women.
And people mention the power dynamic but in most relations in the US that involves genders there will be a power dynamic that favors the male top that off with being white and there is no one a white male could have a relationship with with; unless they go gay or celebate.
Also if white males don’t regard black women as partners and just use them for sex; how come the most stable marriages with black women and white men?
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Something else to think about with black peoples superior psychological stability and confidence as compared to white people couldn’t it be argued that they are taking advantage of white people by going out with a group so prone to be psychologically damaged?
@Cornelia
You’ve mentioned to be “white” on census’s before; are you of arabic descendency?
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@V-4
It was me that said that White men see Black women as sex objects because they do. Most of them do but then they call us ugly and bash us in public. I have seen and witness it.
” Also if white males don’t regard black women as partners and just use them for sex; how come the most stable marriages with black women and white men?”
Very few White men in this country respect Black women enough to date or marry them. And where did you get that information from? Honestly, I would date an Asian male or Latino male before I would ever date a White guy! I would never date a White guy even if I was the last woman on this earth!
No self respecting Black woman would date a White male especially in America, no way! I love my race, no swirling with White guys for me!
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@ V-4
Of course, black women “belong” to black men, just like black men “belong” to black women
by BELONGING that means that the people are BOUND together by a COMMON heritage, culture and history. That is why in South America a few years ago when a coal mine collapsed on some miners, the town people came out in FULL FORCE to save those miners
Why? because they BELONGED to each other. That doesn’t mean LITERALLY as property but in the “it takes a village” sense of belonging.
And who KNOWS and PRACTICES that concept better than white people, who used to (and still do) punish black males for messing with “their white women”
All a white female has to do is WHISPER in some white man’s or white woman’s ear — “that black male over there raped me.”
and WHITE PEOPLE WILL COME OUT IN FULL FORCE and regardless of any evidence or NOT, that black male is going to JAIL — if he isn’t killed first.
And that is the ATTITUDE I’m ADVOCATING for black males and females during a time of WAR BEING WAGED AGAINST US
where we are being PURGED out of the workforce and into prison, where our black children are being PURGED out of the schools by white people closing them and making them inferior to white schools
We cannot afford — as a people — to INDULGE in all that “war against the sexes” nonsense that white people regularly engage in — even while they are STILL UNITED in practicing white supremacy — both white male AND female standing together to maintain their system
I’ call that “belonging to each other”
And that UNITY is what was STOLEN from us during slavery
THE ABILITY TO BELONG TO EACH OTHER
and we need to do everything HUMANLY POSSIBLE to get back what was stolen from us
—
as far as black female/white male marriages, three things come to mind:
#1 — there aren’t that many marriages like that, less than any other white/non-white combination
#2 — they usually happen at later ages when both parties are financially stable and more mature (as far as age) AND usually AFTER the white male has already had his CHILDREN with a white female (hmm)
#3 — black females are MORE likely to SUBMIT to the white male than we are to the black male BECAUSE he is in the most DOMINANT position in the society and we are USED to being dominated by him
I’m going by my own experiences with the black females in my extended family when I say this
even when the black female has a strong personality, they are almost ALWAYS very white-identified and often very anti-black and often have issues and resentments toward black males going back to a father figure. (like in my family)
I believe that is an ESSENTIAL PART in whether a marriage between a black female and a white male last is her WILLINGNESS to SUBMIT TO WHITE SUPREMACY
— even if she wears dreadlocks, and a Kente cloth, if you watch her over a period of time and listen to what she says you will probably find some strong white identification going on
whereas a black female (like me) who talks about white supremacy and is NOT interested in being submissive to white people any more than I’m forced to be
would be a constant THORN in a white man’s side and definitely NOT marriage material to him — which is as it should be
Every single black female I have met who has been in a long-term relationship or marriage with a white male is very much in denial about racism, is very white identified and says a lot of negative things about other black people
which — to me — is a form of mental illness
of course, other people might have different experiences, I’m just speaking from my own.
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@Trojam
Well said.
”We cannot afford — as a people — to INDULGE in all that “war against the sexes” nonsense that white people regularly engage in — even while they are STILL UNITED in practicing white supremacy — both white male AND female standing together to maintain their system ”
This is why I get so sad when I see Black men bashing Black women and vice versa. Many Black men who put Black women down have self hate issues and issues with their skin color. Or they had bad experiences with Black women.
And for the Black women who date White men, most of them are self haters and are sellouts. Trust me! 90% of the Black women I have seen date White men including a cousin of mine don’t love themselves and wish to be White. Or want light skin kids with so called ”good hair”. Same goes for the Black men(especially) who date White women and non Black women.
Blacks need to love each other and stick together.
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@ peanut
He is white. Here is his comment from this thread:
“Inregards to personal experience with the whole “non-attraction to black women” thing, I didn’t start feeling any attraction for black women until I worked with one and after that I started noticing black women.
Which was kind of strange ; it was like having my brain reformated to some extent, it was like all these attractive women appeared out of nowhere but you know they had been there the whole time.
So then I started thinking; well why didn’t I notice them before and the only thing I could come up with was racism, and if you had asked before I turned thirty I would have said I wasn’t racist.”
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mstoogood4yall:
“He is white” I could have told you that, without reading his statement.
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@ Sondis
Alright smarty pants, what else does ur one good eye see. Peanut was asking, I had to just make sure I had evidence lol so he can’t lie. I know he was white based on his name
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Attention, ever wanted to know how to tell if a commenter is white well stay tuned.
1. they try to compare black issues to whites or minimize what issues we face
2. they say things about how we are better off here in America and that we should be grateful for slavery or we’d be in a mud hutt somewhere
3. they say things like if u have money u will not have to deal with things and pull urselves up by ur bootstraps
4. they say African americans
5.they post goofy statistics and make broad generalizations
6. when we talk about black love,unity or being together they say it is anti white, reverse racism, or put up some stats or statements saying black ppl with a white partner are happier and have a healthier relationship than a non interracial one
7. they try to make black men/ women look bad while uplifting themselves
8. their username has a letter and number combo, have a name like noname, I don’t know my name, Ineedtocomeup with a name.or name themselves john doe, jane doe or something with the word D@ck. or any other long arse name they can think of
9. they use mock ebonics
10. go check out the how to tell if a commenter is white post
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mstoogood4yall:
where are you from? you seem like you could be from Australia or the UK, either one of those people, spell “ass” like “arse” lol
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@ sondis
Ur one good eye is failing I said I;m from san Antonio tx, I used arse because I thought the word ass was a moded word I see that it isn’t now
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its weird that the word ass isn’t moderated but the word b@y is
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oh, right….the moderation. Must have been using my bad eye—> *_o
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” Black women are last and are often overlooked no matter how attractive, accomplished, kind, etc. because they are still black and that’s all many people can see.”
No matter how accomplished and kind? Yes.
But NOT no matter how attractive.
Attractive black women are never without a man if they want one.
Black American women have a lot of confidence, I would say over-confidence, in their looks. They call obesity as “curvy” and think they are sexy being fat.
The problem with Black American women is their obesity levels are off the charts and if they lost weight they could get more men.
A good figure with a cute face will always have a man if she wants one.
The question is: where are those women?
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black women are not owned by black men and vice versa. We choose to be with each other. black men don’t own us true, but they still feel like they are to protect us [at least the conscious ones do]. Just like any man feels like they are to protect their race of women, because that person looks like their mother, sister, or cousin so they feel the need to protect. If u attack a latino woman best believe the latino men will come to her defense even if they don’t know her or are married to her. WHy? because they look at it as if that were my female relative i’d want someone to stand up for her.
“couldn’t it be argued that they are taking advantage of white people by going out with a group so prone to be psychologically damaged?”
Rofl. this I guess would be reason enough for why I wouldn’t go out with a white person.
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@ Why
They right here
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-EG-nGJl1I)
Here;
http://beautifulfitblackwomen.tumblr.com
And here
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kq1HnakX5C8)
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@Fiamma, first of all I want to address the use of the words “male” and “Female” as opposed to “Men” and “Women”. Somepeople, of which I agree, believe that under this system of White Supremacy technically black adults are treated as “children”, this is why traditionally we were referred to as gals and boys well into our 90’s !!!! we do not have the POWER to govern ourselves and make REAL decisions for ourselves, The RWS give us a few choices and hoodwink us into believing we made decisions all by ourselves. To all the unbelievers there is such a thing as “White Priviledge” and along with that comes the bonus of truly being a MAN and or Woman and truly deciding for yourselves what is best for you. We as a people aint nowhere close to that but everyday in my own way I try to counter racism so one day my future generations will be able to stand tall and Men and Women and be able to protect and nurture their family. It is quite painful to admit this but it is TRUE and the first step toward solving this ish of racism is admitting the TRUTH. Lastly under this current system of racism, all interacial sexing does is weaken us and keep us from uniting with each other and goin forward. . I am using logic and my rose colored glasses have been removed …. Thank you
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Well I guess one can learn something new every day. I aint never hear tell of a TEXAN using the word “arse” in place of “ass” which I though of as coming from the UK or somewhere else. People dont realyze oftentimes they choice of words is a dead giveaway of their cultural background…..
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@Why…
You do know that since white women are the largest group of women in the U.S.–there are more obese white women than there are Black, non-white Hispanic, and Asian women, yet i do not see anyone chastising them…
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@ Adeen
I have noticed the same thing, even among my female family members who have “jumped ship” — one in particular, used to watch a ton of TV, didn’t socialize much with blacks at a young age, and thought white people walked on water. Why? Because of the BOOB TUBE that was filled with positive white images, white people being the beauty standard and almost NO blacks in really positive roles (this was in the 60s)
so all she saw were white people for the most part and that’s the BRAIN DISEASE that a lot of very white identified black people were infected with
including myself, the only difference is I realized something was wrong with me and the way i thought and she doesn’t or she’s afraid to analyze her own thought processes
but every one in a while the black females in my family have unintentionally REVEALED that something was wrong about choosing “whiteness” and one older female who has been married to a white male for over 30 years almost secretly told me
“Don’t do it.” but she never explained why and I never asked because I was young and really wasn’t interested in the reason at the time. Now, I wish I had asked.
I don’t think it meant he was mistreating her I think it meant that there are so many things that go along with that most blacks who are married to whites
JUST WILL NOT TALK ABOUT
Another black female married to a white male doctor is a friend of my sister and she told my sister she is so unhappy. Again, she has the material things she wants but she is still unhappy. My sister thinks she’d rather be with a black man and with her own people and once again, she didn’t go into details with my sister, and like my female relatives,
SHE JUST WILL NOT TALK ABOUT IT
(so this will not be ridiculously long, I’ll continue on the next post. I already feel kinda ridiculous because I’m still posting 🙂
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@why
We all know the benefits of a healthy lifestyle. The standard BMI and weight guidelines are based off of the white body type. So they set the standard. So of course more black women would be “obese”. We come in all sizes, novelty idea. 🙄
@Fiamma
I couldn’t agree with you more. Sad state of affairs when someone hates themself for having deeper melanin than other people. Low self esteem is truly a problem.
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To finish my point
I think a lot of black people feel they must be loyal to that white person they are sleeping with because in a system like this you are almost forced to CHOOSE SIDES
You cannot straddle the racism fence and if you try, you will more than likely be impaled on the stakes.
and so when you are with a white person — who more than LIKELY has some racist tendencies regarding other blacks (aka is a racist/white supremacist or a racist suspect)
then to GET ALONG with him or her you will have to choose their SIDE and I have seen COUNTLESS black males and females SIDE with that white partner over their own people .
For example, having the same opinions about poor black people, or some other topic where racial lines are drawn.and taking the white “side”
And out of the white males my female relatives have married NOT A SINGLE ONE HAS ANY BLACK FRIENDS, ESPECIALLY NO BLACK MALE FRIENDS
and those white males are ALL UNCOMFORTABLE around black males UNLESS they are too old and settled to be a SEXUAL THREAT.
I find that VERY TELLING that these “color blind” white males are with black females but most do NOT socialize with any black people and by default their black wives also have mostly white friends.
THAT TO ME SPEAKS VOLUMES about the mentality and gross white identification if that black female who will probably be quick to tell you,,
“Oh no, I’m not with him because he’s white. His color didn’t matter to me.”
And if black females don’t want to limit ourselves to black males what about other non-white males, like brown, yellow, and red?
While I choose to stay with black males — that’s MY choice because I know that’s where MY heart is (as frustrating as that might be sometimes)
I think it would be MORE MENTALLY HEALTHY to choose a man of color, at least you’d be dealing with another non-white person who understands what it means to NOT BE WHITE in a society/system that is mistreating you
instead of REWARDING a white person who is ALREADY BENEFITING from your mistreatment (!)
And your children with that non-white male will NOT have to “choose sides”
because BELIEVE ME , they will have to decide if they are more white or more black identified, meaning they will lean toward one side or the other EVEN if white people still say they are NOT WHITE
and you have NEVER seen such a MESS as a black person with a white parent wishing and trying to be WHITE — and being rejected by whites because they are NOT WHITE.
because you can’t be white and non-white at the same time, and white people will LET you KNOW that is a FACT
and God forbid, your BLACK SON has a WHITE FATHER who does NOT relate well to BLACK MALES — talk about a real mess on your hands
and I’m speaking from PERSONAL experience because that white father CANNOT teach a black boy how to navigate the world as a BLACK MAN and I have seen these black boys in my family who do NOT want to be black people and how they have struggled and mostly failed in life out of their confusion and confused identity.
AND more than likely that white father is NOT going to tell his black son the truth about the DIFFERENCE between his (white) world and his son’s (black) world — I know the black boys in my family don’t seem to understand the difference and I suspect racism was not discussed in those households to any serious extent
all the male children in my family with a white father are very confused and VERY white identified and DO NOT associate with black people, especially black females
EVEN though their mothers are black females.
I suspect most of the white males who father black children eventually wind up abandoning them anyway — at least that has been MY experience.(I’m not saying all)
How many times have any of you ever seen a white male out in public with his non-white children playing all or taking them to the toy store or sitting in the doctor’s office while they get their exam or a white male sticking around long enough to be a GRANDFATHER of some black offspring?
Not saying it doesn’t happen, but I only know of one case, and his daughter with a black female married a white male so his grandchildren look like WHITE children — and I suspect he would NOT be comfortable had his daughter married a black man and his grandchildren had looked like black children.
Again, this has been MY experience and maybe some of you have seen otherwise but what I have seen has been similar to what Lenny Kravitz’s (son of a white male /black female) has experienced with his white father
( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4h_amGEmIPg )
(sorry about the long post but I have a lot to say on this topic, which is why I wrote a book about it )
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I am shocked by the number of intelligent black women who believe that just because a white man wants to f*ck them, he must also be interested in a serious relationship and marriage. White men have been f*cking black women for 400 years. It is sad how many black women mistake a white man’s sexual lust for long term romantic interest. All of this nonsense about black women being loyal to black men is garbage. Let’s stop confusing loyalty with lack of options. There are millions of black women who would jump at the chance to be married to a handsome and successful white man. The obsession black women have with the tv show Scandal tells you everything you need to know. A show where a young educated sister plays the role of the white man’s sexual plaything.
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It is impossible for a white man to hate black men but love a black woman. Anyone who believes otherwise is fooling themselves.
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@ Why
who said, “No matter how accomplished and kind? Yes.
But NOT no matter how attractive.
Attractive black women are never without a man if they want one.
—
are you an attractive black female? If not, how do you know?
There are many “attractive” women of all ethnicities who are alone. There are beautiful females who have been celibate for years. Being alone doesn’t mean you can’t have sex, it means you have not found someone you think you can have a satisfying relationship with
And as far as obese black females here’s an excerpt from the book, The Beauty Con Game’
—-
MYTH #8: Black women are more obese than non-black women
False. Hispanic women have a higher obesity rate than black or white
females:
“When percent body fat was used, the obesity rate was highest in
Hispanic women (69.1%) and the rates were similar in white (58.7%)
and black women (60.4%).”
(SOURCE: http://journals.lww.com/greenjournal/Fulltext/2010/05000/Accuracy_of_Current_Body_Mass_Index_Obesity.17.aspx
(The American College of Obstretricians And Gynecologists)
***
A 2011 REUTERS HEALTH STUDY BY THE PENNINGTON BIOMEDICAL RESEARCH CENTER
“..a BMI (Body Mass Indexes) of 30 or higher is linked to more cases
of high cholesterol, diabetes and high blood pressure. But Katzmarzyk
found that the cut-off does not seem to hold true for black women.
While there was no racial difference for men, Katzmarzyk showed that, for
black women, the risk didn’t increase until they reached a BMI of 33.
For example, for a 5’5” tall woman, the statistical risk for disease would
increase at 180 pounds if she was white but at 198 pounds if she was
black.
A black woman can be healthy with a bigger waistline as well,
according to the study. Dr. Katamarzyk thought a possible reason for
the contrast might be the difference in the way body fat i
(end of excerpt)
————————-
The reason there is a PERCEPTION that black females are the MOST OBESE is the WHITE MEDIA deliberately CREATED that perception and that’s why you SELDOM see an overweight white female on a TV show or in a TV commercial because the white media doesn’t showcase them like they do black females
another factor in OBESITY is poverty, because poor black people don’t have the means or the access to a lot of fresh fruits and vegetables and have a tendency to eat cheap, filling and fattening foods
and I guarantee you, if you go around poor white folks, you will see a TON — and I mean that literally and figuratively — of OBESE white females
but I’d rather be a little overweight (and curvy) than look like I just walked out of a concentration camp with my rib bones showing because I just threw up my lunch in the ladies room OR
because I’m using drugs and popping pills to keep from gaining weight and then the next thing you know I’m INFERTILE because I’ve destroyed my body and health from being ANOREXIC AND BULIMIC
just my two cents
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(Correction in the book excerpt)
“A black woman can be healthy with a bigger waistline as well,
according to the study. Dr. Katamarzyk thought a possible reason for
the contrast might be the difference in the way body fat is distributed in
women among the races.” (2011)
http://caloriecount.about.com/study-shows-black-women-canhealthy-
b493869
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@ Fiamma
who said: “I am a firm believer that Black men… and Black people… who worship at the altar of whiteness / non-Blackness should hook up with the true objects of their desire and leave Blacks out of their machinations.”
I totally agree, let white people have them, they will only make another black person miserable and as sick minded as they are
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@ Why
I forgot to address the rest of your comment and what it sounded like (to me) that you were implying when you said:
“A good figure with a cute face will always have a man if she wants one. The question is: where are those women?”
Rather than comment, could you explain what you meant by that?
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@Trojan Pam,
Thanks for giving the correct stats on female obesity.
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It is impossible for a white man to hate black men but love a black woman.
Yes it is. Nor is it logical for a white woman to love Black men but despise Black women.
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@ phoebeprunelle
You’re welcome. And I included my SOURCES for those who want to check for themselves.
So much that has been said about black females is a LIE
and what’s interesting is despite all the MISSILES thrown at our self-esteem many of us still manage to be confident and proud — much of it in self-defense
but the bottom line is NOBODY pays this much attention to JUNK
if we were really all that inferior to the white female why not
JUST IGNORE US?
Why put all this time and energy into bashing us? UNLESS we’re a threat to white people — and white females in particular?
All white the “superior” white female is getting breast and butt and lip implants and curly perms, and killing herself under the tanning lamp or laying on the beach
AND breaking her neck to have “brown babies” with black males?
come on, who’s kidding whom?
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@TrojanPam
I know you mean well but some of you comments echo Tommy Sotomayor. In nutshell any a black woman that is dating a WM will read your comments and hear the same charges of “your’e just filled with self-hatred” and ” you’re a negro bed wench”. The reality on the ground for most young dark skinned black females looks like the picture in this link:
http://www.theebonytower.com/post/42914960341/interracial-dating-among-black-men-a-black-womans
You forgot to mention in your comments about WM abandoning biracial children, not properly mentoring young biracial males and using BW are sexual toilets that black males have mastered these three things. You can wave the Willie Lynch Letter around all you want. As you do that more and more black women will limp across the color line in search of something better than the brutal black dating scene. In the black community a woman’s skin color and hair texture/length are social capital. The ugly truth is that the misogyny of everyday black life is a key factor behind the decision of some black females to date non-black men. Pro-black/counter racists are under the delusion that you can sweep the abuse that black women suffer at the hands of the “brothas” under the rug.
“Black Women’s Blueprint Launches “Truth Commission” to Address Sexual Violence in the Black Community”
http://www.clutchmagonline.com/2013/06/black-womens-blueprint-launches-truth-commission-to-address-sexual-violence-in-the-black-community/
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@ V
who said: “I am shocked by the number of intelligent black women who believe that just because a white man wants to f*ck them, he must also be interested in a serious relationship and marriage. White men have been f*cking black women for 400 years. It is sad how many black women mistake a white man’s sexual lust for long term romantic interest.”
—
I agree that there is a lot of confusion BUT that is DUE to the SYSTEMATIC BRAINWASHING of all black and non-white people under the system of white supremacy — all by DESIGN
Rather than BLAME the Victims of white supremacy, I BLAME a system made up of white people who have systematically worked to destroy black self-esteem and to DRIVE black males and females apart since the beginning of slavery.
I disagree, there is a LOT of loyalty by black females the same way other non-white groups and white people feel a sense of loyalty to their OWN kind. That is simply HUMAN BEHAVIOR to have MORE of an attachment to your family and those who LOOK LIKE YOU.
Of course, in a white supremacy system, non-whites have limited options due to their MANUFACTURED INFERIORITY and INFERIOR STATUS.
Asian males, for example, are always complaining about the way their masculinity is marginalized and generally non-existent in movies and in TV shows — and the Asian female who has been BRAINWASHED to think white males are the BOMB, is suffering from the same COMPLEX that many black males suffer from
ERRONEOUS INFORMATIONAL OVERLOAD aka WHITE SUPREMACY BRAIN TRASHING
Of course, black females have other options. I know black females who have married Hispanics and Asians. In fact, someone did an entire blog on the surprisingly high numbers of black females married to Asian males all around the world.
And there were many marriages between Chinese immigrants and black females during the late 1800s and early 1900s due in part to the white supremacists NOT allowing Chinese men to bring over Chinese females.
Again, the LIMITATIONS are those IMPOSED by racist white people. NOT by the attractiveness or alleged “unattractveness” of non-white people in general (by white people) .
—
when you said: “when you said, “there are millions of black women who would jump at the chance to be married to a handsome and successful white man. The obsession black women have with the tv show Scandal tells you everything you need to know.”
Again, I disagree, I’m not OBSESSED with Scandal, I refuse to watch that kind of racist propaganda — and I’m sure there are plenty of black females who for one reason or another do not watch it
MOST black females — in my experience — PREFER BLACK MALES. Yes, there are some who are curious about white males as would anyone be curious about a group of people who have been blown up LARGER THAN LIFE and who have been (falsely) portrayed as “superior” males.
but MOST black females do NOT want to marry white males — in my experience and opinion. I know I do not and NEVER WOULD
the show “Scandal” is just another missile aimed at the black female mind to encourage us to allow white males to sexually sewer our bodies — as they have done for hundreds of years — by constantly showing the black male REJECTING us for the white female and showing the white male saying,
“come on over here, black girl, and let me play with your body”
and yes, there is a TON of confusion and a great deal of longing on the part of the IMAGE DEPRIVED black female to be seen as a sexually desirable person — like ALL women want to be seen
we are so STARVED for it that even being the sexual object of desire by a white male is better than NOTHING
cause the white supremacist MEDIA has made it almost impossible to see the black female as being desirable to damn near anyone – including the black male
but at the end of the day, if you find ANY ONE of those devoted black female viewers being given a CHOICE between a fine brown or dark skinned black male holding a wedding ring on a bended knee
and a white male with blond hair and blue eyes, reasonably attractive, holding a wedding ring on bended knee
And they were both making about the same money
and you asked the MAJORITY of black females to pick one?
I can almost GUARANTEE YOU that the MAJORITY are going to choose
THE BLACK MALE
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@ Legion
You bring to mind that great Glenn Close line in the movie “Fatal Attraction”
“I will NOT be ignored”
in any case, since you are literally BEGGING for my attention…
(( he’s chomping at the bit– oh, lemme at her, lemme at her! ))
AND since you DO NOT PAY my salary, no, I am not going to go find a page in the book about something that was discussed TWO DAYS ago
If you’re that interested in knowing, I suggest you buy a copy and find out for yourself
I am ALSO not going to be DISRUPTIVE on Abagond’s blog by engaging in some personal spat with you. If that’s your deal, you will have to carry on ALONE
Now, I’ve got two questions for you
# 1 — are you a white male?
# 2 — are you Jewish?
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@ mstoogood4yall
I agree, whites often give themselves away by the TONE they use when dialoguing with their “inferiors’
and by the things they say, always trying to DISTRACT attention away from RACISM by making it appear that
Sexism, Classicism, Communism, Socialism and so-called “anti-homosexual-ism”
is a bigger problem than racism/white supremacy
or they make underhanded CODED statements implying , for example, that black females are unattractive or that black males fit one stereotype or another
AND sometimes, they will come on black websites and PROVOKE FLAME WARS between black males and females by throwing out some ugly comment posing as a black male
and the bullets will start to fly! I used to see that a LOT on blackvoices.com
which is why I stopped going there years ago — definitely a white supremacist stronghold totally infiltrated by (white) “agent/provocateurs” working for God knows who.
One thing I have discovered since I started understanding racism/white supremacy is the DEPTHS OF DISLIKE that white people, collectively, have for black and non-white people.
And that there ar not enough HOOPS on the PLANET for us to jump thru that will change that
And that we be better SERVED educating ourselves about the SYSTEM of white supremacy so we can COME together and protect and support each other because at the end of the day,
I don’t care WHO you’re laying down with, all black people will have is EACH OTHER
AND in the coming days, we will find out just how important and critical that is
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@ Peanut
“we’re being fed this subconscious stuff about how we need to date white men…but no one ever tells white men to date black women…why is that?”
Because the goal isn’t to promote avenues of love for Black women. The goal is to destroy black relationships and thus reduce our numbers. This is nothing new. Research the history of Family Planning and eugenics here in the U.S.A. They promote things like abortion in the hopes of dwindling our numbers through propaganda rather than through force. Haven’t you ever noticed that whenever Black women are told to date outside of their ethnicity, that the recommendation is to always look for a White lover, rather than simply any non-Black male?
Don’t you ever pay attention to the language that Whites use when speaking of Black women? In White discourse, Black woman are always referred to as being “pretty for being Black” rather than simply being a pretty woman. That is your clue that the average White man couldn’t care less. Black women will most often occupy that long standing position of being a Sallie Hemings. Just a receptacle of sexual release. But you shouldn’t feel exhausted by it. Between myself and several other Black men in this discussion, you can at least take comfort in knowing that Black men do love you as a Black woman. Give a listen to this. I hope it cheers you up.
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qjqTiQhOgU8)
@Why
For the record, Black women are strong women, but don’t overplay that stereotype. By always promoting the Black woman as being some sort of fierce figure, it denies them their right to being emotionally vulnerable because they internalize that as being a sign of weakness. Black women are forced into so many masculine roles that it has created an unhealthy psychiatric state. They are still women. That doesn’t mean they are weak, but lets not use language that forces them to be relentless and unmoved by hardship. Black women are as sensitive as they are strong.
Also, just because our women don’t look like twiggy doesn’t mean they are obese. I am a modestly muscled male and I am constantly told I am obese by medical standards. News flash: BMIs are designed for White society. Black people do not have the same body type as White people. Could you imagine if Whites were measured by the health standards of the Japanese? You would all be obese. So don’t come here with your poison and backhanded compliments. A fit beautiful Black woman would never go without a man? Black women in general don’t have to go without a man unless they choose to. And they most certainly don’t need the false adoration of a White man.
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@ Peanut
who said: “I think white women who hate black women, yet are married to Black men have issues to…and the worst thing is some insecure Black men gas up the white woman’s head who bashes the Black woman…it’s just a mess.”
—
Peanut, that’s why I believe RACISM and SEX often go hand in hand. Whites have always lusted after black people sexually, we saw that all throughout slavery — and it happens to ALL non-white people all over the planet where whites will sex them on one hand and ENSLAVE and OPPRESS us on the other hand. The two are WEAPONS of destruction and confusion
remember that old saying,
“keep your friends close, and your enemies closer?”
Well, what keeps you closer than SEXUAL INTERCOURSE?
White people ALSO know that non-white people DO NOT understand what is happening and so they take advantage of that, like an adult would take advantage of a child. No, I’m not saying, black people are immature or stupid, I’m saying we DO NOT UNDERSTAND HOW WHITE PEOPLE PRACTICE RACISM
but they understand how they do it
and sex is one of the MAJOR ways they DO it.
And many white females FEAR black females taking away any attention from them AND they fear that if left alone with a black female, THEIR black male will REGAIN HIS SANITY and GO BACK WHERE HE BELONGS.
the same is true of white males who are with black females and a black male comes around. I have seen that same dynamic of suspicion and hostility
Black males who feed into that madness as a white female demeans black females are MENTALLY ILL and CONFUSED and do NOT understand that she is also practicing RACISM on him and hopes she can make HIM SICKER so she can hold on to him and control him
because if she despises black females THEN she ALSO despises the FRUIT of that WOMB: the black male
and that black male before breeding with a white female needs to seriously ask himself:
If I have a female CHILD with that white female who doesn’t like black females, what kind of ROLE MODEL COULD SHE BE? How can she truly love her daughter when she dislikes what her daughter will be?
The same is true for a white male who dislikes black males (or black people in general)
who has a black child with a black female
what kind of ROLE MODEL can he be that will teach that black child of his to love his or her blackness?
come on now….we have to start THINKING things through and STOP letting the media or the FAKE IMAGES of interracial bliss confuse us
how many positive things have we seen when it comes to blacks and whites having sex together?
—
I’m soooo glad you are reading the book and that it has helped you!
(you just made my day, Peanut!)
and I hope you’ll check out the other books — and re-read The Beauty Con Game and share it with others because you and I are trying to UNDO a lifetime of damage to our self-esteem and one reading or one book or one conversation is a good start but it will probably not be enough
if you have any questions just send me an email at my website
btw, I read the beauty con gam. I read most of it…it was very helpful and a lot of stuff I didn’t know.
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@Peanut- I remember that racist propaganda piece “8 Reasons To Date a White Man” that was published on a black women’s blog a few yeas ago. It was cosigned by thousands of black women. Only a handful objected to its fundamental premise that white men are inherently superior to black men. Black women are starting new interracial dating blogs every day. They are also writing books and articles about how to get a white man every day. In August, a new book titled “Why Every Black Woman Should Marry A Jewish Man” is being released. It was written by a sister who views black men as genetically inferior. Where are the “conscious” young black women to speak up on behalf of their sons, brothers and nephews? I have a feeling that you represent an older generation of black women who don’t view white men as some type of magical unicorn. Today, there is an entire generation of “educated” young black women who won’t even consider dating a brother no matter how decent or handsome. Anyone who believes young black women are obsessed with Scandal because of its great writing and acting is hopelessly naive. Or stupid!
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@ Trojan Pam
The majority of us Black, white and non-white alike have no real idea how pathological this hatred is so deeply embedded in the core white ruling class elites of this world!
For example: The Rockefellers, Rothschilds etc…etc…
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@V
Scandal is such a stupid show! I could never watch it and I don’t support relationships between Black women and White men at all nor do I support Black men and White women relationships. Second of all, I am a Black woman of the younger generation and I love Black men. I don’t like White men like that and don’t desire them as sexual partners. Not all Black women of my generation worship White men and like thugs like Lil Wayne and Chief Keef. I am sorry you feel like that Black women don’t love Black men anymore. Sad to say, it is the other way around for me with many Black men on Youtube bashing Black women and praising non Black women. How do you feel about that because I don’t like it!
I love my race and want unity not discord. No, I am not anti White people but anti White supremacy.
@Trojan Pam
Your examples really told me that I was right. Most Black women are really better off dating and marrying their own Black men.
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I’ll throw and interesting twist out there.. It was always said that black men are the forbidden fruit to white girls and women; and that is why when the floodgates of acceptance opened, flocks of white girls starting dating and marrying black men. That is one of many reasons I’ve heard by these amateur sociologists on Youtube and the blogosphere.
Well now it seems that black men out there (and black parents) are “putting the cuffs” on black girls and women and giving them trouble when they choose a white partner. Maybe that is backfiring on you. Maybe these white men and boys are now the “Forbidden Fruit”. Irony pops his head again.
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“You do know that since white women are the largest group of women in the U.S.–there are more obese white women than there are Black, non-white Hispanic, and Asian women, yet i do not see anyone chastising them…”
Uh, yes you do! Its called “fat shaming” and it is a thing!
True that MBI were originally calculated per white body types, but now they are not and they have increased the default setting. (Though what about East Asians who have the opposite body type of both white and black peeps?)
And mind you, I am not talking about “thick” here but rather MORBIDLY OBESE women who call themselves “thick” and “curvy” and “a few extra pounds” and “more to love”.
Yes, there are some extremely beautiful black women in the US. And yes there would be A LOT more if they lost weight and let their hair grow natural.
But hey, “keep doin’ you”.
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@Dave- White women became forbidden fruit because the penalty for a black man even looking at a white woman was death. At no time in history has a white man been murdered for having sex with a black woman. White men have always enjoyed unlimited access to the bodies of black women. Around the globe. During slavery white men raped and sodomized black women and black girls with impunity. Quite often, the black man was forced to watch as his wife and daughters were sexually abused. When these rapes resulted in pregnancy and mixed race children, the black man was forced to pretend that he didn’t know who the father was. The notion that black women would now see white men as forbidden fruit after what her female ancestors had to endure is beyond sick.
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“The notion that black women would now see white men as forbidden fruit after what her female ancestors had to endure is beyond sick.”
In the day-to-day nobody is thinking about “what my female ancestors had to endure.” when they see a white man they find attractive.
Thus far in USA society it is still seen as at least odd or something different, from both black and white people, to see a BW/WM interracial pair.
Some families have even out right told their black daughters, sisters, cousins NOT to date white men.
So yeah, there is still a social taboo to some extent and what is taboo is often translated as “forbidden fruit” in the minds of the young.
Do you!
Date whoever you want!
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Not all black women of this generation fall into the colorstruck box, just like not all black men of this generation do. We don’t control the media so guess who is putting all these images out there showing us as being in a lot of interracial relationships when really we not. If u get ur views from tv you’d think white ppl are gods, black ppl love average or ugly white ppl, and that there are a lot of gay ppl. We know none of these things are as high as the tv makes us to believe so why continue to believe it. Also just by having more beautiful black women doesn’t mean she will have QUALITY choices of men maybe more quantity. Halle berry comes to mind when I think about a beautiful woman with a lot of choices but always with wrong men. Yes an overweight person may not be very attractive but sometimes some of the fit people are conceited and ugly on the inside. Weight can change, an attitude and entitled spoiled personality is harder to change. I would date a chubby man if he was nice, because I know weight can be changed and if I cook healthy meals for him, then the weight will come off.
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@ Legion
If you want to be BOSS (bully) of a blog you should seriously consider getting your own
I shouldn’t have to repeat myself (since I thought I was clear)
but here goes: If the book is that important to you (two or three days after the fact ) buy yourself a copy and read it and then you can let us all know what it said
since you ignored my questions I’ll just take it as a confirmation
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@ mstoogood4yall
regardless of whether black people are colorstruck, or self-hating, or confused, or white books telling black females to “date” (sex) white or Jewish (same thing, might as well say “white”) males or watch too much “Scandal”
the problem IS and always has been:
white people
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correction:
“…or write books…”
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@ Kwamla
who said; “The majority of us Black, white and non-white alike have no real idea how pathological this hatred is so deeply embedded in the core white ruling class elites of this world! For example: The Rockefellers, Rothschilds etc…etc…”
—
I agree wholeheartedly, and nothing has changed. This white supremacy sociopathic and psychopathic behavior is a WORLDWIDE DYNAMIC wherever non-white people exist
Like pilot-less drones that drop bombs on men women and children of color.
I watched how whites behaved after the earthquake in Haiti which was VERY SIMILAR to the way they behaved after Hurricane Katrina in 2005.
I watched on TV how white people would fly over the heads of the Haitians and drop food, letting it crash on the ground like they were feeding ANIMALS
and how during Hurricane Katrina, I knew of a lady who lived there and I listened to her RECORDED TESTIMONY that a friend recorded AFTER she was evacuated to Houston, TX
and she told stories that would CURL your hair
like the helicopters that would fly over their heads while they were stranded on rooftops and the white men in those almost EMPTY helicopters would pass by them LAUGHING AND WAVING at them
and how the white troops were pointing guns at black children while they were IMPRISONED inside the stadium and not allowed to leave
and how black people’s bodies were allowed to rot for days in the water
BUT during the Tsunami in Thailand the U.S. response was IMMEDIATE, they sent helicopters, planes, ships, PACKED full of supplies etc
but when it came to black people — so-called “citizens” who has lost lives fighting white men’s wars and paying taxes and contributing FOUR HUNDRED YEARS of FREE LABOR plus another HUNDRED-PLUS YEARS of being UNDERPAID for our labor and contributions
were called “refugees” and treated worse than dogs and cats had they been stranded on rooftops
and THAT should have been a WAKE-UP CALL for EVERY BLACK PERSON IN THE U.S.
instead of black males and females fighting over the “right” to date white people (sic)
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@ Kwamla
We should be careful not to restrict this to white elites
if the white COLLECTIVE was not on board with racism/white supremacy, the elites couldn’t maintain a GLOBAL system
the white “foot soldiers” — the average, ordinary white person who ALSO practices racism — is the FUEL in the elite white supremacy engine
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@Why,
Hmmmm, where i live work and go to school, i see on AVERAGE way more slender Black women than i do obese. I see more Black women in relationships with quality men than i do single, and lonely Black women.
I wonder what that says about me and these dozens of Black women since you suggested
Hey do you!
?
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@ v
I haven’t read those kinds of blogs(I know they exist) and I couldn’t even sit through an episode of ‘Scandal'(I still don’t know what it’s about lol, I blame Kerry Washington and Netflix for making me click it!). I can hazard a guess that anyone smart enough to know why all that pro-white dating propaganda is hogwash is also smart enough to not argue with the people promoting it.
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@Legion,
Ok, you got me. I guess in matters of the “heart” you cannot really describe why you feel the way you feel towards a certain person. Like for instance, when i was a teenager, i used to like Black guys who were into skateboarding and that particular culture, although i was the polar opposite (dresses, conservative slacks)… yeah, that wasn’t quite logical.
I guess though it puzzles me that some people will form a relationship with a person outside of their group, but have a strong dislike for others of that same group.
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@Why- “(black women) aren’t thinking about what their female ancestors had to endure when they see an attractive white man.” Your comment is a textbook example of systematic brainwashing. Genocide no longer matters. Rape no longer matters. History no longer matters. All that matters is assimilation into the dominant race. Sad.
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@ Fiamma: Hey, It’s good to hear from you. I hope you are back to stay.
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v
“@Why- “(black women) aren’t thinking about what their female ancestors had to endure when they see an attractive white man.” Your comment is a textbook example of systematic brainwashing. Genocide no longer matters. Rape no longer matters. History no longer matters. All that matters is assimilation into the dominant race. Sad.”
Oh puh-lese. Get off your self-righteous high horse.
You mean to tell me a black person need to resist their natural feelings of attraction or love for someone because of history?
That’s nonsense.
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Loving v. Virginia 1967. When love strikes the heart it goes past the skin.
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Phoebe, “Hmmmm, where i live work and go to school, i see on AVERAGE way more slender Black women than i do obese. I see more Black women in relationships with quality men than i do single, and lonely Black women.”
Of course. Most of the slender and good looking hetero Black women I know have a man, usually a quality one too.
The slender and good looking lesbians are usually also paired with a quality woman.
Obese people need to work on themselves to get healthy and stop insisting that the rest of us find them attractive.
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@ doris jean 23: Dang Nabit, dorisjean23 you beat me to it. I will also add that Alfre Woodard is married to a fairly handsome white gentleman. And has a beautiful daughter. It appears to be a successful union. I saw a PBS special about the Lovings on last Memorial Day. They seemed happy with one another even back then when it was outlawed.
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Scandal just makes my eyes glaze over. I can’t focus on this show. I want tgo be in the loop,but I just can’t get with it. Same with Tyler Perry’s The Haves and The Have Not’s. That is just a bad script and subpar acting. The interracial dynamic doesn’t bother me. They just bore me.
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Vanessa William’s character in Ugly Betty was fun. Wilhemina Slater always had white lovers on that show. I loved Ugly Betty.
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Have you guys, watched the Cheerios commercial of the interracial couple, a white women and black man with a bi-racial child? It stirred all kinds of controversy.
What’s your take on the subject?
( http://youtu.be/KZT-qf3N7o4 )
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I got hooked on Ugly Betty too. Vanessa was working that villaness role with finesse.
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@ Sondis: Good evening Brother. You know I think it rattled a lot of white men. It mostly was white men reacting negatively. Like it or not people just need to get used to the idea that interracial families just like gay couples with children are a family dynamic in society.
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“Have you guys, watched the Cheerios commercial of the interracial couple, a white women and black man with a bi-racial child? It stirred all kinds of controversy. ”
Haven’t seen the commercial but what’s the so called ” controversy”?
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@ Sondis: that was a cute commercial. Oh they’ll get used to it, like they get used to everything else. The haters are a dying breed and they’re kids ain’t having it.
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What really would cause an uproar in my opinion would be a gay couple with their kids eating cereal.
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LOL, you got an eye on the future for sure.
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@dorisjean23 LOL. I think I do too. LOL.
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dorisjean23:
It was cute but there was a agenda, to promote interracial relationships.
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True, sondis – they must’ve done their marketing homework and saw dollar signs.
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And the movie Something new. One of my best friends dates only white men. So we went to see that film some years ago. This is just a preference for her. She wants all the accoutrements of living well. And she says that white men can get her where she’s going. I just except her and her choices. I don’t agree with her, but these are her personal choices. I am surprised that she chose me as a friend because she is so not into black culture. But we are friends and I except her as she is. It kind of bothers me that she is like this but this is her life her choices.
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She is an educated professional and I guess these are the men she sees in her environment. I am the opposite of her and she doesn’t judge me for what I don’t have or haven’t accomplished. But we are the best of friends.
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While it’s great to see that many Black people on this blog understand the attacks on the Black relationship, those of my generation (The Millenials) are really buying into the idea that more interracial relationships will result in racial harmony. Many think mixed babies need to be born so that nobody can detect racial differences and mistreat others (that’s been proven to be FALSE in Latin America, South Africa, etc.). I’ve even had to give up relationships with young Black males who harbored fantasies of having mixed children; one liked a Facebook page promoting Interracial Dating WHILE we were together.
I keep hearing Black people say that White females/males are easier to deal with, and I’m confused. I thought interracial couples were on the receiving end of threats, unwelcome stares from people in public, and even outright rejection mainly from the White family. White females who only date Black men have told me personally that other White people chastise them in a variety of ways for being involved with their Black partners; I can only imagine the damage being done to the Black person in the relationship.
What do you think it will take for Black youth to understand the effects interracial dating/sex/marriage has on Black people?
I saw a video made by a biracial male with a Black father/ White mother, and I thought it was so thought-provoking on the topic.
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x959sSQ-oUY)
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I hear you. A lot of women from various backgrounds use men to open doors for them -whether for fortune or fame or a better lifestyle. Like white women who marry black athletes because they are making major dollars.
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Ms. J, I really think we are seeing the last generation of bigotry against interracial couples and their children. No less than 20% of babies born in US today are mixed race of some type or another. That number is only going to increase.
People who grew up during segregation are either dead or will be dead within a decade. They, along with some of their children (who are also old people), are the only people I meet with negative attitudes toward interracial mating, and not even all or most of them.
Things are changing. Fast.
I’m assuming we are all young or middle aged on this blog. That means most of us will be alive to observe this nation 40 years from now.
By then, the population will contain A LOT of mixed people and it won’t even be a matter of discussion.
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@ Ms J
Thanks for posting that VIDEO!
This is exactly what the children of my family members who married white people AND especially the black females who married white males and had “black” sons
who are all having problems with their blackness and are so white identified they have ZERO interest in black people
and would never go near a black female romantically even though their mothers are BLACK
a sad sad situation
and all those who only focus on “I don’t care about color” or “all people are the same” and “Love is color-blind”
need to give themselves a SERIOUS WAKE-UP CALL especially if you’re going to want children
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“and would never go near a black female romantically even though their mothers are BLACK ”
I find this reasoning to be slightly incestuous in concept. Why should a man or woman seek to find his or her parents in their sexual mate?
For those of you against interracial coupling, you are free to form a relationship with “your own” men/women and form families. What’s stopping you from doing that?
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@Why- You are living in fantasy land. This idea of a post-racial utopia where everyone is “beige” is a fantasy indulged in by many self-hating black people. People who would love nothing more than to erase blackness from future generations. Black people are the only ones who view genetic extinction as racial progress. We are the only ones who feel that mixing with whites improves us and our offspring. So much self hate masquerading as a desire for racial harmony. Racism is in the DNA of this country. It was built on a foundation of genocide, mass rape and systemic racism.. You will never accept this reality because you are too eager to escape what you see in the mirror.
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@ TrojanPam,
You’re absolutely right. The children from these relationships are stuck between two very unequal sides and have to struggle to find their place. But they themselves have to ultimately pick a side. I know biracial people who are White-identified and only want to be around Whites, and those who are Black-identified and completely oppose interracial relationships. There really is no middle ground like people are trying to make it out to be. You are either going to side with your White side or your Black side.
I do think that “White-identified” biracial people are still treated as non-whites, but I see a growing number of them marrying into the White community. In fact, a Penn State anthropologist named Patrick D. Shriver found that 25% percent of White Americans (about 50 million) had Black ancestry. So this whole thing about a “Browner America” is nonsense. These children eventually produce offspring with either a “pure” White or Black person. Even with Asian/White and White/Hispanic people, many of whom marry Whites.
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^As solesearch said earlier, Black culture has a bright future…
I also wouldn’t be so quick to think that Why? is a Black person.
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@All
Actually I fear this type of post racial utopia that many Americans Black and White dream of. This type of America throws the topic of racism under the rug and embraces multiculturalism to the point of Blacks assimilating into this racist society and intermarrying with Caucasians to the point that Blackness will be erased from our future generations. I fear that the Black population in the country will go down because of rapid interracial marriage and relationships producing confused mixed kids with diluted blood.
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Again, what is stopping YOU from marrying and raising a family with a black man or woman?
Just like the White Nationalists who who claim white people are a minority on this planet and will be so in the USA shortly (true) due to some “Marxist-Feminist-Jewish conspiracy”…. well, the solution is to get busy making babies!
But yet, none of the people who rant and rail about this on the internet are doing that!
What gives?
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” Black culture has a bright future”
Who in the world said this? The Black culture in the USA is just another segment of the Eurocentric culture of AmeriKKKlan. Remember Blacks don’t know where we came from and our language, culture and traditions was taken away from us when our ancestors were captured and enslaved. And honestly I doubt our culture has a bright future. Unless Blacks learn our history and who we really are, love ourselves, help build our community and don’t intermarry with Whites, we are doomed. With the rising Hispanic population and mixed race population, things wouldn’t get better for our race anytime soon.
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@ Adeen
But do you think that “Post-racial America” will really be just be a myth? Although many are being led to believe that it’s true, I don’t think “Post-racial America” will exist if racism/White supremacy is the problem. White people have historically given the non-white people of this world the illusion of inclusion until they attack them with great force. The clearest example of that was Thanksgiving. Whites had dinner with the Native Americans before slaughtering them.
I just wonder what’s going to happen to Black people when they realize that the idea was simply false. Especially young people. A lot of them are going to go into these professional job settings and will not be well-equipped to handle the racism I hear is really bad in the working world.
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Not saying this situation is the NORM but in my experience it’s pretty common
where a black person and a white person have children together and as soon as the break up occurs, RACISM or racial conflict usually rears its ugly head and the poor non-white child gets the short end of the deal
especially when that non-white child is being raised by racist or unfit white parent or put into a white family that has NO black friends OR dislikes black people.
so many black people are having children with white people WITHOUT thinking beyond the moment OR the desire to have “whiter” looking children
(please excuse the title of the video)
( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bmhvebpQ39o )
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@Mary Burrell- Any black person, man or woman, who claims to have no physical or sexual attraction to members of their own race has DEEP psychological issues. The notion that this is simply a “preference” is bullsh*t.
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@Adeen,
Black culture expands the U.S. reaching ALL parts of the globe, so yes–i definitely agree that Black culture has a long, bright future ahead.
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@Ms. J
That is what I mean. Most young Blacks my age act like racism is over when it isn’t. Even my little brother thinks that way! This post racial utopia is definitely a myth! I have seen racism increase because of the election of President Obama back in 2009 and the re election of Obama in 2013.
@Peanut
”But it just irks me to no end when people pretend that a race mixing utopia will solve racism, it won’t…ending white supremacy is the only thing that will solve racism”
Exactly, that is what I mean. This whole stupid post racial crap will not solve the issue of racism in AmeriKKKlan. Ending the system of White supremacy will and you are right on that.
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@ Trojan pam
That vid is crazy, I would’ve loved to seen them on judge judy lol. In all seriousness that woman is wrong to be keeping that child from her father. That man is even willing to pay child support and would put himself on it, but her selfish ass just wants to keep the child from him to the point she won’t take child support. I never heard of a woman doing that usually its they want the child support but not the man or vice versa, but this woman wants neither. That poor child will grow up with a racist mother and her racist boyfriend. It is very important for ppl to be in a long term relationship before they have kids. Its amazing how she wants to keep the child from him and that child won’t get to know her black side of the family and grow up white identified. Its the same thing they did to the native americans, had the kids taken from their family and culture so that the whites could reprogram them to be like whites then disrespect them because they don’t look the part. It is the same thing these white women are doing by not allowing the black father into their child’s life, erasing their culture and who they are, but they will never be accepted by whites because they don’t look the part, all they can do is act the part.
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“Don’t assume you know what goes through every Black woman’s head. I know a lot of Black women who wont’ get with white males and a primary reason is because they can’t get over the fact that “our grandmothers were raped by them,”
That’s just silly. He did not “rape” her grandmothers. Them? You mean his ancestors? You have no way of knowing if his ancestors raped anyone or got raped by anybody themselves. Jesus flippin’ christ.
“But it just irks me to no end when people pretend that a race mixing utopia will solve racism, it won’t…ending white supremacy is the only thing that will solve racism.”
Well, if there’s less white people being born (via interracial couples reproducing) then there will be less “white surpremacy”.
But it will not end racism. I’ve been all over the world and have met racists everywhere, many whom never even met a white person in their entire life.
My conclusion is that racism to some extent is natural. The idea that one’s own ethno-culture is normal and natural while perceiving others to be, well, “the other” – and finding them strange.
That’s why so many cultures around the world still arrange marriages. And do they arrange marriages between members of different ethno-cultures? Nope.
Anyone who thinks people should only marry “their own kind” is a racist.
And I don’t think that’s bad necessarily, but I don’t get all hot-n-bothered over racism. I have been too many places and have seen too much racial consciousness to be under the impression that racism is something unnatural.
Its natural. I understand it. But I myself do not subscribe to any racist “marry your own” concept.
For those that do, they should get busy and marry their own!
Have black babies!
What is stopping you?
I don’t get it.
Your prime reproductive years are ticking away and you are not yet married to a quality man. What’s going on?
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@Trojan Pam
There should be no doubt that the hatred of anything African/Black pathology runs so very deeply within the identifying wealthy families of white elites that nothing short of total annihilation of this culture of people would seem to extinguish it.
This also extends itself to the “Ashkenazi Jews” who were primarily responsible for the establishment of the state of Israel and comprise the central families of these Rothschild and Rockefeller ruling elites. These groups have an even more intense hatred which would manifest, if allowed, in the global de-population of Black and non-white peoples.
That such “sick” and pathological mindsets get transmitted down through the different classes of the collectively identifying majority white community there should be no doubt again. Your account of the treatment of African-Americans during “Katrina” perfectly illustrates this warped mentality in action.
Having said this…Its the majority of white people who have been “programmed” in this way Just like the majority of white people who have been “programmed” to accept inferior wealth status when compared to the grotesquely rich status of the 1% of wealthy white elites.
Some white people may choose to acknowledge their programming and some may not. Equally some may also be beyond such a consideration as choice altogether!
Fundamentally, at the core of such a choice is one of Spirituality. The type of being one prefers to be. EVERYONE, everyone of us has the ability to essentially make that choice..
Its this decision of what type of person we are electing to be which ultimately transmits and reflects itself in ANY type of relationship we have with someone.
Clearly, anyone (Black or white) with a belief in equality and justice for SOME, but not ALL PEOPLE, (consciously or otherwise) will ultimately form “tainted” or “defective” relationships irrespective of the Black or white counterpart chosen..
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@mstoogood4yall
Thank you for the link!! I have seen numerous White women post images and Facebook status about their biracial children online in order to make fun of their child’s Black side. It’s something that I find disgusting, and what’s worse is that the child has no defense against this. Yet those are the type of people who should be running to in droves. Smh
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I meant to say “we” instead of “who” in my last comment. Sorry for the typo.
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@ mstoogood4yall
When I was writing the book on so-called “interracial” relationships, the reason I called it “The Interracial Con Game” is white people OFTEN have hidden agendas when they hook up with black people that many, maybe MOST black people are TOTALLY unaware of.
(like that black male with a white parent in the video you posted)
Yes, I know we like to think we are the “black” exception to the rule when we are with a white person (and I say this sarcastically only because we do not seem to be able to learn from our experiences with white people OR from the experiences OTHER black people have had with white people)
But the FACT is there are MANY white females who are having babies VOLUNTARILY with black males that DO NOT WANT these black males around for the LONG TERM and do NOT want to marry.them.
You might wonder why any woman would feel that way, but there is a PATHOLOGY in a person or a people that seek SEXUAL CONTACT with the same people they despise.
That alone is NOT normal behavior, so taking THAT into consideration, there are OTHER PATHOLOGIES and TWISTED THINKING that go along with it. Like I’ve said before — RACE AND SEX GO HAND IN HAND
I would STRONGLY suggest those who haven’t done so, to check out Dr. Frances Cress Welsing on YouTube, and that might give some insight into the desire on the part of white people to PRODUCE COLOR, since MELANIN is a LIFE- FORCE they clearly lack (which is often evident in the paleness of their skin and eyes
— AND explains why they will RISK THEIR LIVES to sit in the SUN and get SOME COLOR — and MIGHT explain why the infertility of whites GLOBALLY is on the rise –
AND might explain WHY they are rapidly seeking — on both a CONSCIOUS and UNCONSCIOUS level — to REPRODUCE with the most MELANATED people on the planet —
Black/African people.
And DO NOT let any white people dissuade you from checking her out (I’m sure some might try on this thread). Listen to her and then JUDGE for yourself. Because the LAST thing whites want us to do is FIGURE THEM OUT
Black people — collectively — SELDOM look below the surface of things or try to LOGICALLY analyze the behavior of people, especially white people,
we have a TENDENCY to just see the surface of things. For example, a white person smiles at us, we think, “Hmm, that’s a friendly white person, they must not be prejudiced because they’re always smiling at me.”
We don’t go DEEP often enough and ask WHY is that person always smiling at me to see if there might be another reason because black people are NOT good at hiding our emotions. When we dislike something or someone WE SHOW IT — even when showing it blows our hand and exposes too much information.
In my opinion, white people are not like that, As a group, they have mastered the ability to HIDE their true intentions and feelings and so many black people do NOT see what is behind the SEXUAL behavior of white people towards us.
(continued on next post)
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(continued from last post)
@ mstoogood4yall
All that being said, when I was doing the book, I heard from many black males all over the planet, — in the UK, in Russia, in France, etc (and I put their stories in my book)
who had had children with white females and many told a SIMILAR story as the black male in this video.on that TV court show
That the white female — after the “relationship” had ended DID NOT WANT THEM IN THEIR ‘BLACK’ CHILD’S LIFE,
I heard from black males who said she wanted to raise that child as a “WHITE” child, and felt like that child — who she KNOWS will NOT be treated as a white person — was NOT a “black” child and should not be raised to think they were ‘black.”
The white females — according to these black males — were often forced out of their child’s life by the white females who often went BACK to the white community — and white males — to raise that (poor) black child in a HOSTILE, black-hating environment.
Remember how President Obama spoke about his white grandmother “not liking black men?”
I listened to a video of a black male with a white mother who talked about how he had been treated “differently” than the kids she had with a white male — and how his OWN WHITE MOTHER would tell him, “Stop acting like a n*gger”
It’s not hard to imagine that a white person who produces a child with a black person and DOES NOT LIKE BLACK PEOPLE IN GENERAL is going to NEGATIVELY AFFECT that black child’s DEVELOPMENT and SELF-ESTEEM. and produce ANTI-BLACKNESS in that child’s mind
i could mention one black male in particular with a white mother who had a HORRIFIC childhood — and whose name you would immediately recognize, but I don’t want to start no S on this thread. (excuse my almost French)
plus this would be OFF-TOPIC, but if anyone wants to know who I mean just send me an email at my site.
It doesn’t take much imagination to understand you are creating a PANDORA’s BOX when a black person produces a child with a white person IN a white supremacy society when that white person MIGHT BE a racist.
And that black people (and some white people) are sticking their HEADS in a DESERT of DENIAL about this and PRETENDING that this is NOT a problem
because “race doesn’t matter, only that I love him or her” when RACISM CLEARLY and NEGATIVELY IMPACTS the lives of EVERY SINGLE BLACK PERSON ON THIS THREAD — that, to me, is a HUGE problem.
However, people are going to do what they do,
and they NEED or CRAVE a white person in their lives or in their beds,and ignore all the warning signs that would indicate that MIGHT NOT be the best or most sensible choice they could make IF they want to eliminate racism from the planet so their CHILDREN won’t have to live under this same oppression
then I say, “Go for it!”
You do YOU
All I ask is DON’T complain about it later to OTHER black Victims of racism, go complain to white people about your problems with that white person you share your bed with
like that black female did when she called Dr. Laura complaining about her “wonderful three year marriage” to a white male who didn’t defend her when his family and friends made “racist” cracks
( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hAD-PipXGwA )
Because some of us will be too busy trying to fight and survive our racist oppression to listen to your problems
I never heard of a woman doing that usually its they want the child support but not the man or vice versa, but this woman wants neither. That poor child will grow up with a racist mother and her racist boyfriend. It is very important for ppl to be in a long term relationship before they have kids. Its amazing how she wants to keep the child from him and that child won’t get to know her black side of the family and grow up white identified. Its the same thing they did to the native americans, had the kids taken from their family and culture so that the whites could reprogram them to be like whites then disrespect them because they don’t look the part. It is the same thing these white women are doing by not allowing the black father into their child’s life, erasing their culture and who they are, but they will never be accepted by whites because they don’t look the part, all they can do is act the part.
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correction
please excuse the paragraph beneath:
“Because some of us will be too busy trying to fight and survive our racist oppression to listen to your problems”
I had copied that text from mstoogood4yall’s post to me)
sorry about the sloppiness
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@ TrojanPam
Perhaps the fascination that white people have for biracial children is indeed a sign of something more insidious. An older Black female told me that in her all-white area, white grandparents of biracial children call them all kinds of racial slurs out in public; these children look at her with utter shame as a result.
And I’ve always wondered why a White person would have children with a Black person before running back to have kids with a White person. MTV had a show called True Life, which showed a biracial female who pretended to be Hispanic. Her white mother broke up with her black father when she was a child, had two more white children, and allowed her daughter to deny her black side. It was really tragic. That young female felt so out of place.
Nobody can decide who their parents are, but I’ll have to say that I’m glad that I have two Black parents. It’s not easy to deal with racism, of course, but at least I’m not confused about who I am as a person. But a lot of non-white children with white parents are being deliberately confused by their white parent. White people were right to say “Think of the children” all this time.
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@ Kwamla
A very insightful post and I agree with much of what you said.
I’m not sure we’re on the same page regarding the “white majority” but I feel this pathology of racism goes DEEPER than programming although that’s a large part of it
I suspect is is GENETIC in origin, and perhaps due, in part, to Dr. Welsing’s theory about “FEAR of white genetic annihilation”
because even before the system of white supremacy became a “system” and even before the white elites had expanded their reach or even before there was a unified “white collective” or “white majority”
wherever white people encountered non-white people they became aggressive and hostile, and this is EVIDENT in their history and is UNDENIABLE
and there was a Newsweek cover story that asked, “Is Your Baby A Racist” which indicated there might be an INSTINCTIVE dislike towards non-white people starting as early as INFANCY
I do NOT think black people who SEEK to end the system of racism/white supremacy can AFFORD to let some whites “off the hook” so to speak if that “leniency” is due to some emotional or sexual involvement with a white person
In my experience, this tendency is STRONG among those black people who are engaging in sexual intercourse with white people while at the SAME time are talking “black revolutionary/counter-racism” talk
which is a CONTRADICTION of any real intention to end the system of white supremacy and shows a TON of confusion about how it functions
It is akin to trying to PUT OUT A FIRE in your house by SETTING YOURSELF ON FIRE
(not directing any of the above at you personally, this is just something that I’ve noticed among highly confused “black” counter-racists)
I advise any black person seeking to END racism to NOT even consider the “spirituality” of white people
BUT seek to FIND our own TRUE spirituality (and reject our slave religiions)
so we can analyze and understand how the system functions in ALL its many faces and find REALISTIC and SANE strategies to end this problem once and for all.
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@ Ms. J
who said: “An older Black female told me that in her all-white area, white grandparents of biracial children call them all kinds of racial slurs out in public; these children look at her with utter shame as a result.”
—
I’ve heard stories like this — remember, President Obama’s grandmother didn’t like black males–according to him. How did he know that? BECAUSE OF THINGS SHE SAID to him OR in his presence.
come on now…
This is why I become impatient (even if I shouldn’t) because black AND white people are playing this “nut role” acting like this is something BRAND NEW when it is as OLD AS DIRT, whites having sex (and babies) with white people
White people KNOW how so-called “bi-racial” people are treated. I know how my relatives who fit that category are treated by white people and HOW confused they still are to this DAY about where they “fit in”
And black people KNOW they are not solving ANY problems OR creating any “racial harmony or progress” by doing what our ANCESTORS WERE FORCED TO DO: reproduce with whites
so, why all this fascination NOW above having sex with white people? While we are still suffering under white oppression (and racism is going back to the old days and we don’t see that our INCORRECT behavior as Victims is part of the reason?
I believe a lot of this breeding is due to the RISING INFERTILITY of whites and their attempt to RESTORE their genetics with more MELANATED people — who DO NOT HAVE A PROBLEM WITH FERTILITY
unless they have “undergone” some medical “procedure” that rendered them sterile
and that is STILL HAPPENING to women of color, that whites are sterilizing them usually without their consent. There was a case of a black female in her 30s who went into the hospital for a minor procedure and came out with her reproductive insides GONE and this happened in 2008 (!) NOT 40 years ago.
According to a study I read, the FERTILITY rate of African females in “developing” countries was EIGHT — meaning the average African female had the capability (and in all likelihood would be able) to have EIGHT CHILDREN
while the FERTILITY RATE for white females in Eastern Europe was ONE –meaning on average that was all the children she would be able to have in her lifetime
There was another article (which I quoted in my book) that said if the rate of infertility among whites in Europe continued, that in countries like Italy, for example, that most children would not have a sibling
Now, anyone can Google “white infertility” so I’m not providing any sources
My point of bringing this up is THERE is always a REASON why people do what they do
White people — in particular, white females — aren’t having all these brown babies out of love for black males — while they are STILL practicing racism/white supremacy on these black males and their offspring AND black and non-white people in general ALL the same time
come on now
(will continue this though on next post)
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I suggest people check out this article:
http://www.forharriet.com/2013/03/your-children-will-see-color-and-theres.html
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(continued from previous post)
There is something much more INSIDIOUS at work here and I’m not saying this is the case every single time whites and blacks come together
BUT there does seem to be a TREND toward this AND in the increase of whites adopting and/or STEALING black children
case in point, Madonna was acccused of STEALING that African child from his parents BY the African parents themselves, who essentially acccused her of tricking them into giving up their African child
Why would all these white people, especially white females SUDDENLY want to adopt black babies WHILE still practicing white supremacy on black and non-white people?
I believe it is happening for two main reasons:
1. this is what white people do: They dominate non-white people and take or covet whatever non-white people have and CLAIM it as their OWN.
Google “Stolen Generations” — This is about how whites in Australia FORCIBLY took (stole) over 100,000 children from the Aboriginal people. and if you read the heartbreaking stories of those children who are now adults who were taken from their parents, you will see a PATTERN of PATHOLOGY and BEHAVIOR on the part of white people.
To TAKE what belongs to someone who is NON-WHITE and claim it as their OWN
This is the ULTIMATE OPPRESSION — taking a people’s CHILDREN while at the same time everyone reading this KNOWS that a rich black person would have a devil of a time adopting a white child because white people KNOW their CHILDREN are their GREATEST RESOURCE and those children will determine whether their SYSTEM survives because —
Only an insane person or a people destined for self-genocide
thinks it is “alright” for their ENEMIES to raise and train their children.
2. for the reasons in my previous post: to RESTORE failing white genetics by breeding with black/non-white people whose have NOT
3. to create more ADVOCATES (allies) for white supremacy because the white population is SHRINKING and they will need more NON-WHITE to advance their cause of continued white domination.
That means that a black child RAISED by whites — in particular white females — will be LOYAL to that white side and will fight against black people even when this negatively affects him or herself
Adopting black children and raising to be ANTi-BLACK also accomplishes the same thing
black and non-white people who will fight on the white side FOR RACISM even while they are VICTIMS of that same said RACISM
And the story of Haiti’s revolution bears this out, that the BLACK (dark-skinned Haitians discovered that their “half-white” brothers and sisters took the side of whites against them even though they own black family members were being oppressed.
which is why the black Haitians had to kill so many of them
and what black people are UNWITTINGLY doing in many instances is BREEDING our own enemies,
having children who will NOT look like us in many instances, who will seek to be with whites and breed that “blackness” out of them, so by the 2nd or 3rd generation, our OWN blackness will have disappeared (which is part of the INTENT to encourage us to DO IT)
We may have children who will often resent and/or feel superior to their BLACK SIDE because of the pressures of living in a society that says white is superior and black is inferior
I know that is true of my black female relative’s daughter with a white male who LOOKS DOWN ON HER BLACK MOTHER (who spoiled her rotten because she didn’t look ‘black”)
and this daughter actually told me that she HATED her mother and told her MOTHER that she HATED her color
and to this DAY doesn’t not maintain much contact except when she needs something and this daughter married a white female (huh?) and changed her last name to that white female’s name
and nearly all of the children in my family side who have a white parent are WHITE-IDENTIFIED and do NOT have much to do with other black people outside of their black parent and a few black family members
that is my experience but may not be those of everyone
Another black female I know who produced a child with a white male and spoiled her daughter (saying she was “too cute” to punish) her daughter is running amok, and has NO respect for her mother or for other black people
No, I am not saying this is MOST or ALL the time, I’m saying that we are literally producing PANDORA BOXES in our own black families that might explode on us one day
I’m saying black people need to understand the history of non-whites having sex with white people
and THINK before you LEAP into bed with anyone BEFORE not AFTER you do it
again, people will do what they will do
I’m just providing some FOOD for thought
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i see than many of you would rather a black woman be a cat-toting spinster than to be happy in their relationships with men of any race.
if black men can scour the globe mating with women of other races, then why can’t the black woman be afforded the same thing?
sorry, but black men are not attracted to their own race of women and yet ya’ll find the time to trash black women who find love outside the black race.
GTFOHWTBS
life is too short…and fuck trying to uphold some false shit like ‘black men and black women need to be together.’ there’s not even enough black mn to go around!
i’ll stick with white guys, thank u…stay mad.
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The latest and greatest in the “I got me a black baby” contest/strategy
ever notice most of the black babies white females are adopting are
BLACK BOYS
that is SIGNIFICANT on many different levels
( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2mIzm0mP8a0&feature=player_embedded )
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“Why would all these white people, especially white females SUDDENLY want to adopt black babies”
And from foreign countries? There are so many AMERICAN children right here, right now, that need to be adopted.
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Peanut: “I never said that I was against Black people and white people intermarrying, having mixed kids or whatever…what I am against is the idea that “intermarriage,” or “mixing,” will end racism. I think that’s a foolish idea and a stupid and delusional reason to get into an interracial relationship. ”
As is the idea that “ending white supremacy will end racism” is a foolish, stupid and delusional idea.
“who says that racism is natural?”
I do.
“whose thinking is that?
Mine.
When people from India arrange the marriages of their adult children you think they do it across racial lines? Pfft! They arrange their marriages to other Indians. Not just other Indians but Indians from the same area of India. Not just that but Indians who are from the same area AND members of the same religion. Not just that, but Indians that are same area, same religion, same language, same caste, same socio-economic status.
This is common throughout indigenous cultures world wide.
That, is racism.
And casteism.
And religionism.
And languageism.
And regionalism.
And classism.
Remember I don’t think “racism” in and of itself is a bad thing. It is due to racism, strong identification with one’s own ethno-culture, that we still see a wide diversity of ethno-cultures on our planet today.
I don’t say to people who only want to marry within their race or ethno-culture “don’t do it”. I say “do it!”
But many of them aren’t.
They just want to complain about others who are not doing it and tell them to do it!
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@ Peanut
If you have the link, please share it
I believe this is all part of the “strategy” to REDUCE the power of the black WOMB–which white people KNOW is the KEY to black FERTILITY
AND because the mother is the one who INSTILLS the values in the children and the one who the child is MOST loyal to
so these black baby boys will be INSTILLED with the values of white supremacy and will be LOYAL to their white mother’s side
this is a strategy used throughout the centuries of whites TAKING non-white children and training them to be ADVOCATES for white supremacy
and I would NOT be surprised if these white female actresses are being TOLD to do it since they are so high-profile and serve as role models for other whites females — and for black people to believe
“Oh, look at those good white people taking our black children!”
which is a WAY of also saying
“Look at those pathetic black ADULTS who are unfit to be parents and we whites, once again, have to save these inferior and immoral people from themselves by taking their children from them (like we did with those black and inferior Australian Aboriginals”
(time to open your EYES, people)
ALSO, I believe black females are LESS LIKELY to turn our backs COMPLETELY on our own kind and that males — who are guided MORE by EGO than by loyalty to anyone OR anything — are more “adaptable” to being loyal to the (white) cause — as we have seen countless times
I’m not saying black females are superior, I’m saying females in general have MORE of a tendency to sacrifice for the common good than males do and that’s true of ALL females
just my observation and opinion
that is why the BLACK FEMALE is so maligned and so demeaned to DISCOURAGE black males from breeding with us and creating more of that hated “blackness” — which in reality is the MOST POWERFUL ABOUT US
our MELANIN — but we have been so brainwashed by white supremacy we see it as JUST the opposite
I also believe that checkmating the BLACK KING by allowing white females to raise him — also GUARANTEES victory for white supremacy because rendering males POWERLESS and SELF-HATING and SEEKING WHITENESS
is the best way to NEUTRALIZE THE BLACK MALE
even the Bible talks about “killing the boys” in order to conquer the entire population
only instead of just killing black males PHYSICALLY, white supremacists seek to KILL HIM psychologically, morally, spiritually AND SEXUALLY
that’s why black male homosexuality is REWARDED and why they force black male entertainers to wear DRESSES and WIGS and LIPSTICK
and why black male homosexuals are the ONLY homosexuals on TV that have a show being DRAG “QUEENS” in makeup, wigs and high heels on a new show called “Fashion Queens”
and why black males are the ONLY ones who are punished for being “homophobic” like Tim Hardaway, Isaiah Washington, Kobe Bryant and so many others who were either FIRED or FINED for making so-called “homophobic” comments
the MALE is the KEY to destroying a group of people, hence the chess game where once you CHECKMATE THE KING — game OVER
where the (black) QUEEN is the most powerful piece and helps to PROTECT the KING but once you PUSH HER OFF THE GAME BOARD
(like they have done by making black females INVISIBLE and/or UNDESIRABLE in TV commercials, TV shows, and movies and in real-life romantic relationships with REAL LIVE BLACK MALES
then the KING’S most POWERFUL ALLY leaves him completely VULNERABLE to being captured and CHECKMATED
this is the CHESS GAME Dr. Welsing talks about (go to YouTube and do a search for Dr. Welsing and Chess Game)
where the OBJECTIVE is to CHECKMATE THE BLACK KING
and adopting (coveting/stealing) these black baby boys are only PART of the strategy used by white people who are practicing white supremacy and who want to keep their system of white domination and privilege going for as long as UNHUMANLY possible
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@ SheilaG
Actually had you read what they said you would know that is not it, but it does not suprise me that people still believe that white is the only other choice of race in the dating pool.
“if black men can scour the globe mating with women of other races, then why can’t the black woman be afforded the same thing?”–Another quote that indicates you are not paying attention (if you are not going to pay attention then why comment).
“sorry, but black men are not attracted to their own race of women and yet ya’ll find the time to trash black women who find love outside the black race.”—Really. That is funny considering the stats that one individual quotes (not that into stats myself but hey) and not to mention that most of my own relatives are married and happy with their black women. To top t hat off some black men actually spoke on this (bet you thought it was all women) Correct me if I am wrong but does a person not have to be attracted to that type of individual in order to consider marrying them?
Sounds more like you are mad (must be the internalized racism and self-hate rhetoric) Oh well.
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And I promised I would not comment, but really couldn’t help that.
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@ Peanut
one last thing (probably not, but here goes)
IF what I’m saying is incorrect aka “garbage”
try to imagine two things:
1. rich black people being allowed to adopt white babies and children
2. black females being allowed to raise thousands of white baby boys from infancy
Then ask yourself WHAT would be the OVERALL reaction by white people to the two scenarios above?
Joy?
or
RAGE?
your ANSWER will be all the PROOF you need as to whether what I just said is more likely than NOT to be true
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@ Trojan pam
Yea a lot of ppl like Obama have daddy issues and that affects how they view the world. Obama is white identified, we always hear him talk about how his dad wasn’t around but we don’t hear him talk about how his mother left him with his racist grandparents. it was a different time and black male white female relationships were taboo, still today it is we can see that by looking at the comments on the controversial cheerios commercial. ppl talk about his wife and he says nothing, but I bet if someone said something about his mother he’d be pissed.
@ ms j
Good link, kim k is delusional. She thinks she can raise her baby to be color blind, maybe that is why ppl are saying keep kanye outta the picture because he’d tell his child how it really is. They try to kick the black man out so they can brainwash the child into believing their lies and not be prepared to face this society. Imo by ppl saying im going to raise my biracial child to not see color is racist. Why? because they are basically saying if my child don’t see race they won’t see or deal with racism. In their mind if black ppl don’t talk about it, then it won’t exist. As if we are the ones making things up and they don’t want us to report it. how can u report a crime that u don’t know exists? Answer u can’t, that is what they are trying to do with this color blind bs, change what the victim sees instead of trying to change how racist see other ppl.
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“just because racism happens doesn’t make it natural.
we can agree to disagree”
We an agree to disagree, sure. But let me explain why I think its natural.
It evolved naturally in early humans. Here’s how.
Early humans were born to parents in tribal communities that did not travel far beyond the area they were settled or semi-settled in.
These humans saw a reflection of themselves in their parents, their families, the wider tribe. Associations and connections regarding personal identity were made.
These people married other people with the tribe or at most, people from other tribes in the same geographical area.
If people and when people from far off geographical areas migrated in and did not look anything like them; such as different hair texture, different skin color and different facial features, those people would not inter-marry with them.
This is the way it was in early human society and still is in tribal regions today.
Identify with one’s own ethno-culture is natural. And it is racism.
The problem is why assign malevolence to the world “racism” when racism does not necessarily contain malevolence.
People who say, I would only ever marry another black person, or another white person, or another Indian, etc. are racists.
And that is just fine.
But they cannot expect others to feel the same, or make us feel the same.
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OK then what would you call it?
People who will not marry, or even date, often not even associate in a social context, outside of their race – what is that if not racism?
What is arranging the marriage of you child to a person from another race, if not racism?
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@ peanut
“why is it that people need to not see color to see you as an equal”
It is the same reason why they need laws and land deeds to recognize anything. When they took the land from native americans they did so because they thought they didn’t own anything since it wasn’t written down, It is a shame when ppl need things written or drawn out for them to treat others halfway decent. by them not seeing color it erases white guilt, and makes them not recognize white supremacy. If there is no color then white supremacy wouldn’t exist ,but by them trying to not see color ,white supremacy still exists but they don’t see it. Just because u hear no evil or see no evil doesn’t mean it is gone, it only means u choose not to recognize it. It is the same reason they try to erase slavery from history books, to try to erase what ppl see, because they can’t erase what happened.
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Sharina:
I’m far from mad, LOL! I’m actually very happy with my life and the men I choose to have in my world, regardless of the color of their skin..
And kill the noise about ‘you believe that white men are better.’ I grew up around white people all my life and I don’t find anything remotely impressive about them or any other race to have them be put on a pedestal. I include black men in this too.
They’re like everybody else in my book; one no better than the other.
Picking apart my statement makes you look desperate for anything to look like you’re right.
Epic fail on your part…
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“a belief or doctrine that inherent differences among the various human races determine cultural or individual achievement, usually involving the idea that one’s own race is superior and has the right to rule others. ”
I would say this is common and natural: “a belief or doctrine that inherent differences among the various human races determine cultural or individual achievement,”
If not individual achievement, definitely cultural. That is why everyone is proud of their culture!
The last line, which you choose to give importance to, is problematic. And it is why I am opposed to Islam and Christianity, for though they are not races, they are universal new world order concepts that believe their order is superior and has the right to convert and rule over others.
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@SheilaG
I feel the same way about White men. I grew up around White people and I don’t believe that White men are better than Black men. White men aren’t much different from Black men: many of them get women pregnant and don’t take responsibility to become a parent, many of them go to jail and don’t go to college either. The only difference between White and Black men is different skin color and White males have more privileges in this racist society.
Please everybody, stop putting White men on the pedestal! Some White male might read our posts and think that we are thinking of them as if we desire them. No, majority of Black women in AmeriKKKlan don’t desire White males and it includes me. Us Black women don’t desire them as mates because we know their nature.
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And White males aren’t much different from their White male ancestors. I always think that a Black woman who is dating a White man is either delusional or self hating. Most of all, White males don’t act much different from men of other races but the media likes to think that they are. As a result many Whitewashed Hispanics and Asian women date White men because they think they are better than their own race of men. As well as a small amount of Oreo, self hating and delusional Black women.
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@ SheilaG
who said: “i see than many of you would rather a black woman be a cat-toting spinster than to be happy in their relationships with men of any race.”
—
I’m sorry you got that impression. That’s not what I want, I want to see black females get the love and respect we deserve,
don’t forget I’m a black female and I definitely, completely understand where you’re coming from
I went through a lot of changes with black males and even went through a period in my 20s where I was very angry about the way I was treated. and how they seemed to value non-black females MORE than black females
so, I know where you’re coming from, believe that!
I struggle with some of my own opinions even today because I know many black females UNDERSTANDABLY are disappointed in black males — and believe that black males don’t want us anymore and the pain is like a KNIFE in the black female’s HEART
when we see the SHAMELESS way some BM have elevated non-black females above their own
from the rich and successful black males to the average and ordinary black males who — without regard for the feelings of black females — will FLAUNT their white female at any and every BLACK event,
and who will make a fuss over her at a BLACK nightclub or party, and the kicker is half the time she is someone that white males wouldn’t look at TWICE — even if she was the last female on earth (sic)
Frantz Fanon wrote about this MENTAL AFFLICTION of many black males to be with a white female — and I learned over the years three things:
1. It wasn’t about that particular white female, it was about having A white female
2. The black male in question who goes from white female to white female has a MENTAL ILLNESS — not a preference — and the FACT that most BM who ONLY date WF wind up having serial relationships
going from WF to the next WF means these black males DO NOT GET ALONG WITH WHITE FEMALES any better than they get along with us
3. If a black male is so MENTALLY ILL that he MUST have a white female at all costs (can you spell OJ Simpson?) even while he is being victimized by racism,
black females should LET HIM GO gladly and send him ON HIS WAY. We are better off without him, all he would do is make us MISERABLE and as insane as he is
As the years passed, I realized the underneath ALL THIS BLACK MALE AND FEMALE DYSFUNCTION was the system of white supremacy that had POISONED us against each other starting from the days of slavery
and I started BLAMING the people who really deserved the blame — NOT black males or black females but
white people
I posted as much as I did — neglecting my own work — because I don’t want to see my black sisters being USED the same way our FEMALE ANCESTORS were used by white males who do NOT have a sincere interest in black females — which I believe are the MAJORITY
I don’t want black females HURT by anyone and
seeing that less than 9% of all white people marry non-white people and so the CHANCES that a black female will wind up with a white husband who is a decent man are VERY SLIM
and my fear is at the end of the day that black female may look back at the parade of white males she has slept with and realize she was USED and sexually sewered by RACISTS
that’s what I’m against, NOT against black females finding love
I’m against black people working AGAINST our own racial oppression by REWARDING white people with our bodies for practicing racism against us instead of standing together to WORK AGAINST this system of oppression.
IF a black female wants to look date non-black males why does it have to be a white male?
why not a Hispanic or Asian or a man of color?
I believe because that is what the TV/white media is encouraging us to do
for a very good reason.
to reinforce the IMAGE of the black female as a WM’s w*hore
take care
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@ Why
I had to address your post when you defined racism as Indians marrying Indians from the same area, same religion, same language, same caste, same socio-economic status.
that is NOT RACISM, that is a CASTE SYSTEM
Here’s my definition of RACISM which is SYNONYMOUS with WHITE SUPREMACY taken from one of my books. and why I call it racism/white supremacy
definition of both terms separately
White Supremacy — a social, economic, and political system based on
the belief that whites are superior to non-whites.
Racism — the systematic discrimination (the denial of rights and benefi ts)
by whites against non-whites in all areas of human activity: (1) economics,
(2) education, (3) entertainment, (4) labor, (5) law, (6) politics, (7) religion,
(8) sex, and (9) war. (the Behavior).
Racism requires SYSTEMS and POWER and to practice RACISM, one group must have more MORE POWER than another group.
Since whites control ALL the major areas of human activity in America — and much of the world including housing, education, health, entertainment, economics, politics, law, and religion — it is accurate to defi ne all “racism” as “white supremacy.”
White people are the only group in America with the POWER to discriminate (deprive or punish other ethnic groups),
If anyone disagrees with this premise and believes that blacks can be racist, he or she should be able to answer the following question:
Name one thing that black people – as a group — have stopped white
people – as a group — from doing that they had a RIGHT to do? For
example, denying them the right to work, own a home, live in a certain
area, get a fair trial, an education, or use any public facility.
—
I’m sure you’ll disagree but using the correct terms (words) is very important to reduce confusion FOR the Victims of Racism
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@ Mstoogood4yall
Yea a lot of ppl like Obama have daddy issues and that affects how they view the world. Obama is white identified, we always hear him talk about how his dad wasn’t around but we don’t hear him talk about how his mother left him with his racist grandparents.
RIGHT, that is the story the media doesn’t want to tell, the message they want to send out is
“look at that lousy black father and that great white mother and she created the “first” black president almost all by herself without the help of that no-good black male!”
when his mother hardly raised him either AND there are other details that might curl your hair but i’ll leave that for another time and another post.
Actually, a federal judge said (last year, I believe) said Obama’s mother has sex with a dog and that’s how he was born — and Obama never said a word about it because he CAN’T. (Google it)
In reality, President Obama is NOT going to say ANYTHING that is considered “UPPITY” to white people because he knows his place
and is FORCED to smile even when Jan Brewer, the white female Governor of Arizona wagged her finger in his face in full view of TV cameras — but as a NON-WHITE MALE in a white supremacy system, he cannot afford to show anger TOWARD white people
AND
Black males in corporate america will TELL you this, that if they are too aggressive or show any anger that they will be called “an angry black male” and will make white people uncomfortable, maybe to the extent that he will lose his job
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@ SheilaG
In your need to try to quickly prove something to me you missed a very important key bit of information.
1. I did not ask you or mention anything about your life. You don’t need to prove that to me but you were quick to bring it up. hmmm
2. “You believe that white men are better.” I never said this but I am sorry you misinterpreted what I said to mean that. Not once did I say or indicate one was better or that you felt that way. hmm again
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@ Peanut
Unfortunately, child abuse is far from rare and is VERY common among families BUT when you combine that abuse with WHITE SUPREMACY, you have a very potent mix which usually spells disaster for that non-white child in a home where the people are RACISTS who do NOT like black people in general.
of course, harming black children is DELIBERATE
how can black people doubt that?
let’s take a look at the short version of the list of things whites do to harm black children
creating inferior black schools
closing black schools and building more juvenile prisons
closing black schools and forcing black children to cross gang territory
putting black parents in jail for ten years for an ounce of crack
a nine-year old black girl shot by police and nothing is done to the police
a eight year old black boy expelled from school for saying to another little boy that a teacher was “cute”
charging a black high school female student with a female for a science project gone bad
and let’s not forget Trayvon Martin who was TESTED FOR DRUGS after he was murdered by Zimmerman who WASN’T tested for drugs or arrested until weeks later
come on now, we have got to stop telling ourselves that RACISTS ARE IGNORANT and they don’t mean any harm to our children. We KNOW that is NOT true
they are NOT IGNORANT, they know EXACTLY WHAT THEY ARE DOING to non-white people
it is BLACK PEOPLE who are IGNORANT
about RACISM and the way it is practiced
if you really want to understand racism/white supremacy, I strongly suggest you YouTube
Neely Fuller and listen to what he is saying
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correction
“charging a black high school female student with a FELONY for a science project gone bad.”
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@ Why?
“Ms. J, I really think we are seeing the last generation of bigotry against interracial couples and their children. No less than 20% of babies born in US today are mixed race of some type or another. That number is only going to increase.”
That is absolutely not true. This generation is as racist as ever. The transition from overt to covert racism doesn’t mean that racism has disappeared. How it is applied has simply changed. In fact, I’d argue that modern racism is even worse, because where as overt racism was in plain sight, covert racism creates a space for the denial of culpability of any racist action.
White people are in no rush to have interracial children. Have you not read all of the rhetoric coming from White conservatives? They seem to think that a silent genocide is being committed against them because of multi-culturalism/diversity.
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9gmuGFwlHsA)
And if that one doesn’t let you know where White people stand, how about this video about a White Student Union designed to promote the interests of culture of Whites?
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJ_MHp8iqtQ)
Those are YOUNG White faces, not the old generation. Also, how do you think racism stays live? The previous generation teaches it to the new generation. This isn’t like starving out a species so they go extinct. Racism thrives because like all powerful ideologies, it thrives so long as one person believes.
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@ Adeen
This is the thing Adeen, there is not just white and black men in the world. It is like people get stuck on that being the only two choices and it is not. There are Asian men and Hispanic men in this world and women need to leave options open. Love can be found in any race (I will not deny it), but regardless of what you as a woman decide it needs to be for the right reasons.
“Please everybody, stop putting White men on the pedestal!”—I really don’t think anyone is (I could be wrong).
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@ TrojanPam
I did not want to quote the your whole comment, but thank you. (standing in front of computer and applauding). Between you and peanut you guys have been hammering in many of my thoughts and feelings on a lot of different matters.
@ SheilaG
And before I forget
“Picking apart my statement makes you look desperate for anything to look like you’re right.”—Actually I was quite right and it was an epic success. Mainly because you attempted to argue or dispute something I did not say. As a suggestion if something I said is unclear it is better to ask for clarification rather than comment thinking i said something else and just being wrong. 🙂
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@ Peanut
I feel you on your last comment but if I may offer a correction?
(of course, you are free to disagree)
black people cannot practice any form of racism, neither external or internal
racism was CREATED by white people WHO created the different so-called “races”
the black, the brown, the red, the yellow, and the white
so they could separate white people from all the non-white people AKA “people of color” — another term created by white people
non-white people NEVER EVER called themselves black and brown and yellow and red “people” or “races”
we would NAME ourselves based on culture and/or location
that being said, the concept of “RACE” were created by white people so they could practice RACE-ISM
Only white people have the POWER and SYSTEMS and INSTITUTIONS to DISCRIMINATE AGAINST NON-WHITES
that is the definition of RACISM AKA RACE-ISM
So, a VICTIM of racism — Terrance Howard — can’t practice racism against himself BECAUSE he has no systems or institutions of power
but he can be SELF-HATING and mistreat himself
but most of this SELF-HATRED is due to the SYSTEM OF WHITE SUPREMACY that teaches ALL non-white people that they are inferior to white
from cradle to grave
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@ Sharina
thank you
(( blushing ))
I hope you guys will consider signing up for the Counter Racism Boot Camp course — which is free
all you need to sign up is an email address and the DESIRE to get those mental muscles into tip top shape
http://racismws.com/counter-racism-101/
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This blog is ADDICTIVE ! 🙂
@ Peanut
here’s another example of how (some) white people feel about black children
“Just when we think we’ve heard it all in terms of racists remarks and actions, along comes the story of a white airline passenger who not only told the mother of a crying child to “shut that nigger baby up,” but then proceeded to allegedly slap the 19-month-old baby across the face.”
http://www.eurweb.com/2013/02/shut-that-nigger-baby-up-says-white-airline-passenger-then-slaps-child/
—-
there are black children with a white parent who have GRANDFATHERS like this — and I have heard many stories — from some of my family members — as to how “cold” their white side of the family can be
There are NO BOUNDARIES that racism respects
NOT age (babies or the elderly)
NOT sex
NOT infirmity
NOTHING matters but the color of someone’s skin
that is the MAIN FACTOR in deciding WHO will be mistreated
—
@ Sharina
Thanks for dropping by!
—
OK, I’m done for the day (I hope )
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A few months back I had a conversation with my Chinese friend in regards to dating. We were talking about Korean fashion etc. and she says to me….why didn’t you marry an Asian? When she said this I was actually floored. I did not have a response and the truth of the matter is I had never considered dating an Asian male. It was not that I did not find them attractive, but they were not a consideration. When V-4 made the comment about not being attracted to black women until he worked with one (i could be phrasing it wrong) It really made me think has society programed us to not see an option other than our own and white?
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in v-4 case it is different of course, but speaking from a non-white perspective.
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@Sharina
I was trying to say that White males aren’t much different from other races of men. Honestly I don’t mind dating a Hispanic or Asian male IF I run out of options of Black males but anything is better than dating a White male.
”It really made me think has society programed us to not see an option other than our own and white?”
Same here. I wonder why society programs us that way?
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And I wonder if it is true that other races of men don’t like us Black women? I keep on hearing that all the time. I have never dated outside of my race though
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@ Adeen
Not at all, I know black females who are married to Hispanic and Asian males and males from India
we have to understand that ALL non-white males have been BRAIN-WASHED to think white is superior
and there are Asian, Hispanic, and other non-white males who have watched TV and movies as young children and been BRAIN-TRASHED to believe in the white beauty standard
and they want a white female so they can feel equal to the white male who dominates them under the system of white supremacy
It really has NOTHING to do with white females or with them being prettier but it’s about what they REPRESENT to low-self-esteemed non-white male who has been damaged by white supremacy from cradle to grave
and so when non-white males react NEGATIVELY to black females they are looking through the PRISM of white supremacy that says the darker you are the less attractive you are, especially if you are female
Someone did a blog on all the Chinese men who are married to black women so don’t FALL FOR THE HYPE
Black females are some of the most BEAUTIFUL FEMALES in the world and we must NOT fall for the LIE that we are NOT beautiful, sexy, and desirable
but UNDERSTAND that we are UNDER the system of white supremacy that BY NECESSITY must make non-whites inferior to whites
Our book, The Beauty Con Game will explain the reasons why black females are the most DEMONIZED and DEGRADED FEMALES on the planet
and it has NOTHING to do with black females being “unattractive”
especially when so many white females are GOING UNDER THE KNIFE to have bigger breasts, butts, lips and DYING from skin color to have more “color”
come on,
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@ Trojan pam
Yea, he has been groomed to be silent. When he said if I had a son he’d look like trayvon and ppl attacked him he got silent real quick. This is why they attack his wife for standing up for herself when she handled that heckler. They were pissed that a black person didn’t give in and were comparing the way she handled the situation to the way her husband does, and basically saying she should’ve handled it like that. But its ok for Obama to have some black men kicked out when they were asking him questions about what he’d do for the black community, but its not ok if he or his wife gets a white heckler kicked out. But at the same time I don’t want to make excuses for them, and be like some of the blind black ppl who keep saying give him time, he can’t address us or he’d be impeached. I don’t respect most famous black ppl because they sell outs and will say all kinds of things stereotyping us or not speaking on issues that affects us.
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@ Sharina
that’s what I’m saying also that black females can date non-black, non-white males, instead of thinking they can only choose between a black male or a white male
I think we think this way because the MEDIA is PROGRAMMING US to think there are all these white males who want us so we will make ourselves SEXUALLY ACCESSIBLE to white males
most of WHO will NEVER EVER MARRY A BLACK FEMALE OR SEEK TO HAVE CHILDREN WITH HER
this is ALL about CONTINUING THE LEGACY OF SLAVERY where the white male had FREE sexual access to black females
and it is being DONE to REINFORCE the LIE of the “black Jezebel” aka the “white man’s w*hore” was wasn’t raped during slavery because you CAN’T RAPE A W*HORE
It’s about ERASING the LEGACY of SLAVERY and the SERIAL RAPISTS that founded this country and the ones who followed
it’s about WHITE SUPREMACY and CONTINUING TO VICTIMIZE THE VICTIMS
Earlier in this thread, a white male who said he “dates” black females (V8Driver) made a telling comment when he said about black females that we had
“…more bounce to the ounce”
and when I called him on it, he slowly disappeared — and I do NOT think there has been ONE WHITE MALE ON THIS THREAD who said they wanted to OR would marry a black female
but there were plenty who said they DATED (sexed) black females
black females MUST BE VERY CAREFUL about the PSYCHOLOGICAL danger we put ourselves in by allowing ourselves to be used SEXUALLY
the SAME way our female ancestors were used — only they didn’t have a CHOICE
WE DO
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@ Adeen
“but anything is better than dating a White male. “—-I use to have a list of characteristics and features (I can be shallow. LOL) that I found attractive in a male (race not required) and if he did not met them then I could not date him. One thing i found that even if a white male had these features I still was not attracted enough to them to see a deeper future or meaning with them.
My thought process (and excuse me if I offend anyone) was yea he would make a decent lay but not really marriage type (so odd coming from a woman).
I am not going to deny the attractiveness of some white men because there are some fine white men, but I am not going to bypass my desires to just have one. This is not to say said white man can not meet the needs of some other black sista because he may be able to, but as for me and my needs no, so I get what you mean by wanting a black man. It is something that feels right.
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I am not saying hold out for a black man or take what you get as long as he is black. He still has to fit the bill in compatibility.
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Yes adeen
Other races of men do find black women attractive. I wouldn’t mind dating a latino especially an afro latino male. I don’t know if i’d date Asian men because they may become the new oppressors, they open up businesses in black neighborhoods, and are going to Africa and opening businesses and not putting money back into the African economy but taking it back home.
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Of course Peanut any time u can email me
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Peanut i’ll email u hold on
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ALright peanut I just left a comment at ur blog. And I tried to email u is it the same email it was the last time?
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Sharina:
Looks like I got you shook!
Again, I do not find any race of man better than the other. If I have a connection with said man, then so be it. I don’t have to put any race on a pedestal to do that.
Somehow you fail to get the gist of that.
Not my problem…Again, EPIC FAIL.
Run along, please. Your desperation in trying to put me in my place is quite humorous at this point….g’nite.
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@ SheilaG
And what makes you believe I am shook (I am quite long-winded)?
“Again, I do not find any race of man better than the other. If I have a connection with said man, then so be it. I don’t have to put any race on a pedestal to do that.”—And once again I never said you said this or felt this way. You misunderstood, but instead of asking for clarification you would rather keep telling me I meant or said one thing than to just own up to being wrong. You do realize that in itself is an act of desperation? Trying way too hard to put words in my mouth.
My post was not meant to put you in your place but was meant to point out where you were wrong, but instead of disputing that what I said was somehow incorrect you resorted to putting words in my mouth and name calling. Wow…and my post are suppose to be the epic fail (another thing you say that I will be taking with a grain of salt). 🙂
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@Mstoogood
I love Latino men and would love to date one if I run out of options of Black men. Especially if he is Afro Latino. In fact, since I am of Jamaican descent, I find myself having more in common with Caribbean Blacks and Afro Latinos than regular Black American men.
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Im just amazed people can be drinking this bilge water and not be gagging
Its really interesting, we all are in agreement most black people dont want to be with white people, yet, look at this obsecion going on here
I mean, seriously, putting huge amounts of focus on whether black people have sex with white people or not will have absolutly zero affect on on racism in society…it will have zero affect on the real problems black people have to face in a racist society…its just 100 percent obsecion in its most juicy enviable jealous form, about sex
TrojanPam, you know how to talk a lot but not listen, Ive been married twice to black women, I raised my bi racial son and have his back and he has mine, he helps to take care of me in a world where most children engage in long distance love with their parents because they cant stand to be next to them.
every single stereotype you have worked hard to perpetuate on here , was never in my relatioships with black women, and, i know there are posters on here in bi racial relationships who are nurturing each other and raising families
People are hiding behind the white boogey slave owner rapist stereotype, that is so bogus, millions of black Brazilian women have been through slavery and huge racism in their society and they just dont have this hung up obsecion with interracial sex with white men, they are more advanced and not stuck in that muck.
Ive been piled in a car by huge white linebackers at my highschool in the 60`s for dating black women, and told to `stay with my own kind`, and, black men threw fire crackers when im walking on the street with my black date and passed in a car trying to threaten physical intimidation, all back in the mid 60`s, I was there when the black activists in the Civil Rights Movement put out their agendas about getting white people out of the movement (the real bottom line crux of how the dating ban thing started) and when the `oath ` was put out there about not having sex with white people, as well as the agenda agains tap dancing and Louis Armstrong, and that bilge water needs to be left right back there
You see, Abagond, the problem with Fanon is he analyses one black women and that becomes the template for all black women who have sex with white men….how utterly absurd…
I stood up to that bs back then and I sure am ridiculing it now…and laughing really hard at the stereotypes being continuted up into 2013 today
Im sure advising any black person who thinks of dating a white person to have their antennas up and look for the signs, Im sure agreeing plenty of racism exists now and the legacy of slavery does have huge ramifications in our societies today that brought slaves from Africa
But telling all black people they shouldnt have sex with white people is a deviding agenda that is impossible to think it can happen, and only alianates so many incredible black people who know they dont beleive in a creepy agenda like that, and actualy is giving advice that will backfire in the multicultural direction the USA is going in now…it sure isnt black and white now
To all the people having interracial sex, enjoying it and in families and nurturing each other and to the people who arnt but are open to it…this thread is a very real look at the type of attitudes that are out there…to be sure its not an open freindly world waiting out there, those of you in longer relationships already know this. people are actualy walking around in 2013 , thinking these things, tying it in with their political agendas , and the people who are black saying it are just holding hands with the white racists who have perpetuated this from the beginning
Im glad to not be a part of it…Im so humbly blessed to be in a multi racial , multi cultural world, every day has something special in it in this world, we learn so much from each other. Those of us in interracial relationships arnt advising the rest of the world to date interracialy, we arnt saying something is wrong if you want to stay with your `race`, but , it seems peoples obsecions are playing out with the people who dont want to have sex interracialy
I can only tell you, these discusions only make me wake up each day with more love and dedication to my family , and the understanding there are people out there who hate us only because of the way we look…I dont care how much of a political agenda they want to hide their obsecion behind
Other than that , Im in South Beach right now, waiting for the Heat to put it away, and there are more drop dead, tight dress wearing , fine black women per square foot than I can count…it is amazing, and , various interracial couples walking around…just stay away from South Beach, interracial sex haters would just choke on their bilge water trying to deal with it
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@ Adeen
I’m of Jamaican descent too, and I feel like I have more in common with Caribbean men as well. lol
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@Peanut,
Oh No, et tu (you too ) Peanut have jumped on the interacial relationship bandwagon that “All things being equal, I think it’s fine”. I guess this goes to prove the depths of our psychosis as a group of people. You go on to say “but all things aren’t equal and the media and society in general is very loathsome toward Black people and that is something that people need to be aware of. ”
I think deep down inside you know that under thisa current system it is NOT fine to be in an interacial relationship because of how we are STILL treated as a people and this will further weaken us collectively and I think you understand all too well that THIS is the reason it is being heavily pushed on us at this time of our existence. I think deep deep deep down inside you know this……
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Oh for the love of Pete… Are we still arguing over the validity on interracial relationships?? What is this the 1970s?
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@Peanut, I really honestly believe you know deep deep down inside why blacks are targeted to mix interacially. It is the same readon that blacks are NOT encouraged or allowed to adopt white babies but it is STRONGLY encouraged for whites to adopt all the non white babies they can. I think deep down inside you know the reason WHY this is so. I know, I feel you- it is quite painful to admit……
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@ King: Ha! Ha! That’s funny.
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^ I’m ’bout to dust off my freakin’ dashiki and pull out the cake-cutter! The issue of the day is, can people with different pigmentation date!
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I didn’t mean you Peanut, I was referring more to c.andrews comments (among others).
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@ peanut
great article that was. It’s great when ppl are able to try to get someone to understand them without getting into a screaming match. Kudos to this woman for acknowledging her privilege and trying to educate another person about their privilege as well.
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@ Peanut
“I’ve actually been doing some thinking and I actually think it really doesn’t matter if more Black women date interracially and here is why, I always forget this, but Black women outnumber Black men…so by default some Black women who want partners will have to go outside the race…So I actually think that it really does less harm when Black women date out interracially.
As long as she’s not doing it for self-hating reasons and she is exercising common sense. It really doesn’t matter as much numerically because there is an abundance of us”—Applause
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Agreed. I just don’t think that people can live their personal romantic lives waiting for the great societal equality that is never going to happen perfectly. As long as you’re not dating (or marrying) out of self hatred, or race worship, I say go for what’s real with a person of any race who loves you back!
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Would anyone care to venture to answer this question- why are white supremacist PUSHING this interacial sewing thing now and why does it seem to be aimed at non whites mostly ??Is is even remotely possible that the children created through all this interacial sexing will be turned against the black males and females they come from causing much anti-blackness and even though they will not be accepted as white they will be used against us in our quest to counter racism??? . Does anyone think this may be a REMOTE possibility??? Why or why not. Just curious…..
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I hear you Peanut and I understand and agree with you on the point that telling people not to do something- there will always be those that will anyhow but something must be done to counter this spread of interacial sexing because it is being heavily pushed by the white supremacist for a reason that does NOT bode well for us blacks. I think about the Chinese people, very very few cCinese date outside of their race, they even put up a physical barrier(Great Wall of China) to keep the Aryans(White people) out and now their numbers are astronomical that it really is moot in their culture this issue of interacial dating.Us bacak folks in the US- we dont have this luxury…. just my opinion
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@ B.R.
I don’t care if a white person marries or dates are breeds with a black person. That is NO PROOF that white person is not a racist.
We disagree and so let’s leave it at that.
Black people need only ask themselves ONE QUESTION
Why is the WHITE MAINSTREAM MEDIA spending so much time and money encouraging ONLY black people (not Asians, not Hispanics, not whites) to date OUTSIDE their ethnic group AND
discouraging black people to date, marry and love other black males and females?
Why would it matter WHO black people dated?
UNLESS NOT dating each other benefited the SYSTEM OF WHITE SUPREMACY?
We have TWO CHOICES facing us
Either we are going to STRIVE to become THINKING, LOGICAL people who CARE about our own survival so we can duplicate the success of ALL OTHER ETHNIC GROUPS WHO STICK TOGETHER?
OR we can CONTINUE to be a TOTALLY DEPENDENT, EASILY FOOLED, UNABLE TO LEAD SELF, EASILY MANIPULATED AND GREATLY EXPLOITED BLACK POPULATION that relies on EVERYONE ELSE — including Arabs and Koreans and Indians who JUST GOT OFF THE BOAT
The choice is OURS.
Since I have said all I could possibly say,
I’m DONE.
take care
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Characterizing whites as inherently ‘evil’ (down to the genetic level even), demonizing mixed race people (according to some here I am ‘half evil’, as I myself am genetically ‘mixed race’, no matter how it’s sliced and diced — and regardless to the racial labels given to my parents at birth) and campaigning for Blacks to “stay with their own” will have an effect on the psyche of some Blacks, but certainly not all — it’s much too late for that. Even during the US Jim Crow era folks were sneaking across the color line for sex…there has always been some degree of mixing when different peoples crossed paths and opportunity for sex between them presented it self.
Now that interracial unions are a bit more ‘visible’ — especially wrt to Black men and white women — then they’ve ever been in US history, the attempt to indoctrinate Blacks (especially certain Black men who may see the right to choose their own mate as not being open to discussion) against interracial unions will probably fall on deaf ears for the most part.
To my mind Black American cohesiveness, to the degree with which we did have it, was due to a combination of the One Drop rule, anti-miscegenation laws, segregation and the common belief among non-Blacks that Blacks aren’t truly “human” (a belief which still persists…and the actual thought system that underlies white outrage over the interracial Cheerios commercial… outrage which rarely rears its ugly head when Asian women are paired with white men onscreen…. and the same belief behind the ‘cats & dogs’ analogy and the “what about the children?” fake concern that pops up in regards to romantic unions between Blacks & whites): we could not easily breed our way out of Blackness, not in the same way that many other descendants of slaves did in neighboring countries, anyway, so, the only thing left for us was to actually stand up for ourselves and to fight for our rights as a group.
It is clear, however, that gradual acceptance of interracial unions (meaning B&w unions…no other type is truly seen as ‘interracial’ in the US) over the last 30 years, and of mixed race children as being mixed, rather than ‘Black and only Black’, will definitely affect the continuing struggle for the equal rights of those who identify as ‘Black and only Black’ in this country. From what I’m seeing, though, the floodgates are open and there really is no turning back in this regard….
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@ c.andrews
I personally don’t consider white and black the only form of interracial sexing or dating though. People get so hung up on it as if it is. Is any of that possible…yea it is, but so are purple people eaters.
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@ TrojanPam
“Why is the WHITE MAINSTREAM MEDIA spending so much time and money encouraging ONLY black people (not Asians, not Hispanics, not whites) to date OUTSIDE their ethnic group “—I would say the effort is not to date outside their ethnic group, but to date white. Media is big on white/black coupling yes, but I rarely see them focus on other couplings like Asian/black or Hispanic/black
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@ peanut
I think ms Kathleen is a lovely woman and her comments are on point, and thought provoking
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@ sharina
Yes I don’t understand it either. they act like white ppl are the only other option for us. really that is bs. Idk maybe they don’t want us to be with other races of ppl only them because then they’d feel left out. They are afraid of what would happen if the blacks, brown, reds and yellows united. So they push themselves because surely we would want the “standard” of beauty on our arm, and not some other inferiors. That would cancel out the whole thing if we got with other so called inferior ppl, no we need to be with the superior ppl so our kids look closer to the standard.
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Peanut:
That Discrimination expose is not good at all for judging people for racist, tendencies.
White people are less likely to discriminate against a minority, when other minorities are around.
I also don’t see how you can put a minority in a position, to discriminate against another minority.
Real life situation, no white person would ever say, what those white actors were saying, around other people of color.
I saw how the white blonde girl was back peddling and making excuses, not to mention her, “giggling and laughing” about the “Pedro” name the white guy gave the Hispanic singer. She showed her true colors, ( no pun intended ).
White people say those things, when their around other white people and 99.9% of the time, none of them stand up and speak against any racial discrimination, even if they don’t agree with it!
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@ Sharina
since you directly addressed me, I’ll respond
these IR ads are NOT aimed at white people, they are NOT placed on sites that mostly cater to whites.
There is NO demand by white people for books telling them to date black people.
White people DON’T WANT TO hear that mess,
when they want to “be with” a black person they know where to go
— a black website, at a black club, or anywhere black people are
there’s ANOTHER HUGE DIFFERENCE
there are NO websites, books, movies, TV shows or articles DISCOURAGING white people from dating or marrying other white people
IN FACT
MOST movies and TV shows and books aimed at white people
CELEBRATE AND PUBLICIZE WHITE ON WHITE LOVE AND MARRIAGE AND BABIES
But it is JUST the opposite for black people
The question is WHY?
That’s what I want us to think about
and ask ourselves why that doesn’t make us SUPER suspicious
It’s not about whether I’m right or wrong– you don’t have to agree with me
I respect your right to disagree
I want us to be LOGICAL so we can see the difference between the NEGATIVE messages black males and females get about black on black love
VS the positive messages we are getting about black on white love (aka SEX)
while white people are getting a TON of messages ENCOURAGING white on white love
(just check out the trailers for new romantic movies that are NOT comedies and you’ll see that 99-100% are about WHITE ON WHITE LOVE)
You don’t have to believe me OR agree with me (and I’m addressing this to all the black people on this thread)
I’m just encouraging ALL to FOLLOW THE LOGiC of why ONLY black males and females are being encouraged via the WHITE MEDIA to DIVIDE OURSELVES
take care
I’m moving on
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Please link us to where White supremacists are pushing miscegenation ANYwhere on the entire internet? Just provide us a few links to where this is being pushed by White Supremacists please.
-I will not be surprised if you completely ignore this request.-
By percentage, very few Chinese ever get out of China, but when they do…
http://www.chinasmack.com/2011/pictures/chinese-men-with-black-women-african-wives.html
The Great Wall of China was NOT built to keep out Aryan (White people,) it was built to keep out a successive range of northern invaders including the Mongols, the Turkics, and several other nomadic tribes out of the areas we today call Mongolia and Manchuria.
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@ sondis
Amen brotha, and did u see that ass whoopin the heat dished out lol, jk, but dwade was doing the dam thing
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Peanut:
Yeah, i know that as i watched the same thing you did. what i am saying is that, in real life, a white person wouldn’t have said those things, knowing a person of color is present.
White people are not like the actors in real life, where they show their racism freely out in the open.
I just didn’t think it was a genuine way to see how white people feel about blacks and other people of color, when nobody is looking.
Case in point…
(http://youtu.be/LyCH_EGrUvM)
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@Trojam
That is why I discourage intermarriage between Blacks and Whites. Our history together is horrible and most Whites in America are racist.
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Notice in the video, how dramatized these black teenagers are at this point. I guess the producers are fine with doing these kinds of , “exposes” on black people but not white people.
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Whites do make racist remarks in the presence of minorities who aren’t the targets of their racism (or so they think, anyway). It’s certainly been done in my presence (I don’t appear all that ‘Black’ to some people, but there’s no way I look white either).
I’ve also heard Indians and Chinese (who also, evidently, didn’t view me as being Black) make casual anti-Black comments right in front of me.
Being *somewhat* racially ambiguous makes one privy to such things. The white-appearing members of my family, including my mother, are even better witnesses to this than I am….
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@ sondis
I noticed in the show what would u do they have the black males dressed with baggy jeans and a big t shirt, while the white males have clothes that fit them. when they do these experiments I would like them to have the black kids not overexaggerate things and play to stereotypes. But show us with clothes that fit and not have any of the stereotypical things. that way white ppl can’t try to rationalize it and use the anything but racism argument and say see he was dressed a certain way and that is why they reacted like that with him and had a different reaction with the white guy.
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@TrojanPam
“The question is WHY?”–This is actually a question I frequently ask, because honestly I feel that even with a mix of white and black children they will still get the negro treatment.
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Mstoogood4yall:
That isn’t necessary, clothes isn’t the real reason, white people are racist toward black people, they just use that as an excuse, when someone is challenging them on their racist stereotypes .
I remember after the trevon martin killing, Geraldo revera, made the dumbest remark that it was the, “hoodie” that kill trevon martin and if black and Latinos would stop wearing, hoodies, people wouldn’t think they are criminals.
He later back peddled and apologized for his remark but he said what the majority of white people think.
When a white teenager wears a hoodie, he’s just trying to keep warm, black or Latino, they’re about to commit a crime!
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and TrojanPam…I think we agree more than you might think. Of course there are things here and there that we don’t agree on but that is cool. 🙂
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@ Fiamma and King
Nice to have you two back!
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^ yeah I know its not the clothes. but some can’t see that and I guess im wasting my time trying to convince them otherwise. And I saw a newsclip on hln where the newswoman was interviewing Nicole simpsons’s sister and she said the martins are going to have to prepare for a not guilty verdict the same way u did. i’m paraphrasing here’s the clip (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=411ycOHB_0k&lc=KZ2iJmf3D-F1o49OH6Q9UXZyS81_mO7NUFOgki46qF8)
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@ Peanut
if black people are being PURGED from:
the workforce (black unemployment rates are HIGHER overall than those of illegal immigrants who can barely speak English — regardless of education OR experience)
the school system, aka Chicago closing almost 50 black schools and systematically firing a lot of black teachers, Philadelphia closing 23 schools, most of them black, and NYC closing mostly black schools (come on, now)
the prison system incarcerating more and more black people and FARMING OUT THEIR LABOR AT 90 CENTS AN HOUR TO CORPORATIONS.
In the Louisiana State Prison (named “Angola” after an African nation (??? what does that tell you?) black male prisoners are PICKING COTTON on the SAME LAND OUR SLAVE ANCESTORS PICKED COTTON)
And in Chicago, both U.S. Senators from Illinois want to “round up” ALL the black males attached to the Gangster Disciplines and put them in PRISON without being charged with a crime (??!?)
from the CITIES like Chicago, NYC, Detroit, New Orleans, D.C, etc via “gentrification: AKA racial dislocation where thousands of black people are being TAXED out, SCARED out, UNEMPLOYED out, and just driven out of areas that we have lived in for DECADES
and movies like “The Purge” aka a MODERN DAY Birth of a Nation, where a dark-skinned young black male is being chased by a mob of bloodthirsty whites — and they call this “entertainment?”
While Universal Studios created a website for the “PURGE” that looks like an EXTREME Right wing POLITICAL MOVEMENT
http://www.newfoundersamerica.org/
while immigrants from other countries get ViSAs to work and black people CAN”T get work and still need a “Voting Rights Act” that has to be renewed in order to guarantee our “right” to vote?
after black people have been forced to work FOR FREE FOR FOUR HUNDRED YEARS and helped to build this nation with our slave AND underpaid labor on chain gangs, factories,
and FOUGHT AND DIED IN EVERY WHITE MAN’S WAR EVER FOUGHT
and yet, we still don’t see that WAR is still being waged against our population?
and NOW in the form of DIVIDING AND CONQUERING THE BLACK MALE AND FEMALE by slandering and demeaning BLACK ON BLACK LOVE and telling us it is in our best interest to sex white people
The SAME media that LIED on Trayvon Martin and thousands of black victims of racism
and SUDDENLY black people trust what the MEDIA tells us to do?
I really don’t understand how an OPPRESSED PEOPLE are so trusting of the MEDIA that we allow ‘it” to give us
I am repeating myself in the hopes that some of this will SINK IN
instead of the DECEPTIVE MESSAGES from some posters who are trying to convince us to IGNORE all the warning signs that there are POWERFUL (WHITE) PEOPLE
who want the black male and black female to BE DIVIDED and AT WAR with each other
now, it is UP TO EACH ONE OF YOU to come to your OWN conclusions as to WHY
relationship advice
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@ sondis,
I remember that fool saying that, i’m not blaming it on what ppl wear, i’m just saying they use it as an excuse. I just wish for these experiments they’d eliminate that excuse just once so they have to look at the cold hard truth,that it is not the clothes but the person judging them based on their skin color that is the problem. just watch any what would u do vid on youtube and the top comments are usually saying if the white and black guy were dressed the same then it could’ve been a different reaction. Then again what difference does it make they will still pick it apart and say it was something else besides his race that caused ppl to react the way they did.
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correction:
I really don’t understand how an OPPRESSED PEOPLE are so trusting of the MEDIA that we allow ‘it” to give us “relationship advice” (?)
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@ Peanut
Yes, this is one of the articles I’ve read
and in my neck of the woods (Chicago area) they are using prisoners to do work that poor people (especially black people) used to do for a living
We have to STOP letting the TV and the MOVIES showing all this post-racial “harmony” fool us into thinking things are BETTER for black people than they are
and I suspect that TV/movies have a GREAT deal to do with the level of confusion AND white-identification that is present among today’s black population
Because black children supposedly watch MORE TV than any other single demographic group in the nation
AND it SHOWS by the UNREALISTIC ideas most of us had about the real world as we grow up (including me)
and WHY so many young black people are DEVASTATED and DEMORALIZED when they come face to face with real life RACISM
because the REAL WORLD was totally different than the “made up world” they saw on TV and in the movies
when black people allow the MEDIA and the TV to convince us that interracial “bliss” is superior to loving other black people (WHICH INCREASES OUR ABILITY TO LOVE OUR BLACK SELVES)
which is what the white supremacists DON’T WANT US TO DO AND THAT IS LOVE OURSELVES
AND we listen to the MEDIA (that has done NOTHING but lie to us AND on us)
and we allow the MEDIA to drive us away from the black males and females who look like their mothers and fathers and brothers and sisters and cousins and aunts and uncles and ALL the black people who loved us
by whispering in our ears that THOSE BLACK PEOPLE (n**gers)
aren’t good enough for you
and to seek sex and “love” from white people who COLLECTIVELY have demonstrated so hatred for black people
that is a VERY DANGEROUS mentality for a people who are suffering from a continuous ONSLAUGHT of racism
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@ Sharina
All we have to do is to look at the children white slave-owners had after raping black females. MOST remained slaves.
Look at South Africa where the white supremacists divided non-whites into
“coloreds” and “blacks”
where BOTH groups were seen as inferior to whites
but the “coloreds” weren’t treated as brutally as blacks
and you can see that RIGHT here in the U.S., the UK, Europe, etc.
yet, some of us think we are creating a better breed of “black” that will be accepted by whites TOTALLY IGNORING all the HISTORY that says otherwise (?)
Look at President Obama, a man that the MEDIA pumped up as this “black hero” who has the TITLE of President and look how he’s treated.
Is this the kind of racial “improvements” black people are looking for?
The MINORITY always rules the MAJORITY — so it doesn’t matter how many “coloreds” we produce with white people,
the bottom line is
WHITE IS RIGHT and NON-RIGHT is NOT RIGHT in a white supremacy socieity
and no amount of singing and holding hands and saying “we are the world, we are the children” has changed a thing
even as Michael Jackson was singing “We are the World” and “It doesn’t matter if you’re black or white”
he was still being mistreated because he was NOT white
And even blacks with a white parent will TELL you
they are STILL BEING MISTREATED because they are NOT WHITE
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@TrojanPam, and to add one more fact , thse mixed race offspring are not only mistreated and abused but they are used AGAINST non white people especially those classified as black. They are trained to become Anti-Black and further confuse us to our own detriment. These are but a few more reasons to hold off on interacial sexing until racism can be eradicated because we are breeding babies that will become morbidly anti-black……
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Thank you, Sharina
I’m kind of shy but I’m staying come what may this time 🙂
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@ c. andrews
I agree,
This is an excerpt from an article supposedly written by a white female supremacist back in 1972, which I cannot verify but it sounds like the mindset of the white supremacists KNOW that RACISM and SEX go hand in hand — and who know that black people — on average DO NOT believe OR understand that
————————–
“Now we come to the importance of bi-racial children for the White Supremacy Project. First, lighter babies are produced. The children of black males and white females will be educated to hate blacks.
They will be raised in all-white settings. The children will date and sex whites. Finally, these children will marry and have kids with whites. Their offspring will turn white.
It is possible for black males to have sex with white females and have no impact on the white population. When the kids of interracial unions are raised by whites, the numbers will be regained.
The end result is the white population increases, the black population decreases. From the black male perspective, interracial sex is a form of racial
suicide.”
— White Female Supremacist (Der Kosmonaut, 1972)
——————————–
and from my own experiences, I have found that black people raised by white people or with a white parent in the home are VERY LIKELY to want to marry white people and this has happened in MY family and the offspring of that black person (with a white parent) AND a white person
are children who can PASS FOR WHITE
which means black people are essentially COMMITTING GENETIC SUICIDE and breeding children and grandchildren who may ONE DAY oppress other black people
that’s ONE H of a legacy to leave behind
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@ c. andrews
here’s a quote I can verify from Chancellor Williams, one of the great black historians:
——————
“The melting pot of the races began around the northern perimeter. The end result was always the same:
The Blacks were pushed to the bottom of the social, economic and political ladder whenever the Asians (meaning whites) and their mulatto offspring gained control.
This scheme of weakening the Blacks by turning their half-white brothers against them cannot be overemphasized because it began in the early times and it became the universal practice of whites, and is still one of the cornerstones in the edifice of white power…”
— Chancellor Williams, “Destruction of Black Civilization — Chapter II: Ethiopia’s
Oldest Daughter: Egypt. pg. 61.”
—————–
and that is WHY the “mis-educational system” does NOT teach black children an accurate OR complete version of black history
because they KNOW if we KNEW our HISTORY, we would NOT be so apt to REPEAT IT
even the Bible says a people perish for a LACK OF KNOWLEDGE
it’s time to GET serious and learn about OUR past so we can understand WHAT we see in the presence so will have a better chance of having a better FUTURE
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@ Peanut,
I think that makes sense — and this is why I’ve written about the WHITE MALE CODE OF CONDUCT in a white supremacy society because it’s REAL
and if you know what you are LOOKING at you will see MOST white males follow it to a “T” with some variations
for example, it’s understood among white males collectively that a white male can SEX a non-white female BUT it’s another thing entirely for him to MARRY HER and HAVE CHILDREN WITH HER
and I work with a young white male who was so sheltered by a single mother who didn’t have much contact with other children growing up
AND so he didn’t know the “white conduct code” as well as he should have
(although he DID know that being “white” meant he got special treatment”)
and he wound up involved with this black female at work and I noticed that the other white guys shunned him — even before the involvement because he was always “breaking” the code
but when he got this young lady pregnant, he was a total outcast
I have seen white males who are “too friendly” with black people or with black females get a REPRIMAND from other white people (i could tell you some stories!) and that’s when I started noticing that whites put peer pressure on each other to FOLLOW THE WHITE CODE.
if you know what you are looking at, you see that CONDUCT CODE at work all the time
—
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@ Peanut
here’s an article in the NY Times from 1910 called:
“Elimination of the Negro: The Black Woman White Man Genocide- NY Times 1910”
More PROOF that RACISM AND SEX GO HAND IN HAND — and — that there is NOTHING NEW under the sun
those who KNOW and RESPECT their HISTORY will do their damnedest NOT to repeat it
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“Would anyone care to venture to answer this question- why are white supremacist PUSHING this interracial sewing thing now…”
– – –
What? Lawd hep me! The white supremacists who haunt these types of blogs are usually foursquare against ‘race-mixing’, as they often refer to it, and are much more likely to blend in with the chorus of Black voices which DECRIES, rather than ‘pushes’, B/w interracial couplings! ;D
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@ Peanut
Interesting theory. Kind of reminds me of the Jewish culture. The Jewish bloodline was passed down by the mother. *Correct me if I’m wrong, I think I’ve read that somewhere.*
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c Andrews said
“Would anyone care to venture to answer this question- why are white supremacist PUSHING this interacial sewing thing now and why does it seem to be aimed at non whites mostly ??Is is even remotely possible that the children created through all this interacial sexing will be turned against the black males and females they come from causing much anti-blackness and even though they will not be accepted as white they will be used against us in our quest to counter racism??? . Does anyone think this may be a REMOTE possibility??? Why or why not. Just curious…”
I haven’t been able to read the whole thread but read a quote from a “white supremacist woman” you posted I think. Did you post others ?
I think that “real” white supremacists (actively racist whites, not passively accepting their privilege “whites”) are a very small minority and I wonder if it is a good idea to look at their vision of things as really having a strong impact. Don’t give them more power than they have. They scare a lot “whites” away too. BUT they do have an impact because it is racism that is taught to most “white” children in “codes” as several of you referred too earlier in the thread (TrojanPam in particular) whithout the; being AWARE of it. It’s the NORMAL (Abagond would say DEFAULT) for them. Not being racist (white minded) in a racist society is ABnormal.
Many “mixed race” Americans during American history have been the leading FIGHTERS against White Supremacy… So I imagine it just depends on how they decide they will position themselves in the society, if they will accept the privileges that come with lighter skins or not.
A few examples (people who would not have been considered as “black” in other countries?societies than the US because of their appearance (which probably also helped them have an impact): WEB DuBois, Billie Holiday, Langston hughes, one the first NAACP leaders (can’t remember his name)… There are many other examples.
So I don’t think the white supremacist you quote is right, she probably wishes she was.
What you are saying though, can be probably verified in individuals but it can not be viewed as generalitym I think,
That is the problem with white supremacy, it is very difficult to fight because it has so many facettes.
You could also say, for instance, that “blacks” who use the n-word are against the quest to counter racism. But THEY are not “mixed race”…
And likewise “whites” who adopt “black” cultural codes (like dreadlocks) may think they are acting against racism, but are in fact not doing much, and maybe sometimes worse than by being themselves.
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@ Fiamma
There are many faces to white supremacy, that is why it is so EASY to fool the Victims
All white supremacists don’t wear HOODs and burn crosses, or drag black people behind pick up trucks
A white supremacist is ANY white person who practices RACISM against non-whites and can be a soccer mom, a schoolteacher or a U.S. senator
the MOST REFINED and SMARTEST white supremacists know how to FOOL their non-white victims by making them think they aren’t. racists and they know the POWER of using SEX to deceive and disarm their Victims
and this SEX as a weapon has played out on EVERY continent on the planet where non-white populations have been almost WIPED OUT by having sex with the white invaders from Australia, to New Zealand to North America where
so-called “Native Americans” who once numbered in the tens of millions are now less than 1% of the U.S. population and a population that has one of the highest rates of so-called interracial relationships with whites
now that’s some SERIOUS GENOCIDE and SELF-GENOCIDE
Of course, you don’t have to believe ME or agree with me, that’s fine
the HISTORY and the EVIDENCE speaks for itself
and if anyone can honestly say they don’t see the BIAS in the media AGAINST black people loving other black people
or HOW black male/female relationships are always portrayed NEGATIVELY in the media, TV and movies (unless it’s a buffoonery comedy)
then I don’t know what to tell you
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@ Cornlia
who said: “I think that “real” white supremacists (actively racist whites, not passively accepting their privilege “whites”) are a very small minority and I wonder if it is a good idea to look at their vision of things as really having a strong impact.”‘
—
I disagree, disagree, disagree
there is NO WAY white supremacist are a minority when EVERYWHERE WHITE PEOPLE GO THEY HAVE THE SAME BEHAVIOR TOWARD NON-WHITES
everywhere
and WHITE PEOPLE are VERY AWARE and not the LEAST BIT IGNORANT about racism AND how to practice it
which is WHY SO MANY ARE SO GOOD AT IT
and this is why — excuse my bluntness — black people MUST BE very careful when it comes to white people talking about racism
because MOST will try to downplay it or pretend that it “scares them” ALL WHILE GLADLY TAKING ADVANTAGE OF ALL THE WHITE PRIVILEGES IT BESTOWS ON THEM
and IF those white privileges ever even APPEAR to be diminished in ANY sense,
like so-called affirmative action
whites will come SCREAMING OUT OF THE WOODWORK crying
“Not fair, not fair, that’s reverse discrimination!”
Sorry, Cornlia, I ain’t BUYING it
WHITE PEOPLE KNOW EXACTLY WHAT THEY ARE DOING AND PLAN TO KEEP ON DOING IT (PRACTICING RACISM) UNTIL GOD OR NATURE OR FED UP NON-WHITE PEOPLE PUT AN END TO IT
and you can see the RUMBLINGS of ALL the above happening as we speak
the UNIVERSE IS SICK OF RACISM and is moving in various ways to
ELIMINATE THE SOURCE OF THE PROBLEM
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Thinking about I have known one or two examples of “white women” who were having kids with “black men” because they thought they would have “cute babies”…(that was in Europe) as if the babies would remain babies for ever…
One of the most irresponsible behavior I have encountered personally… Having children like you buy dolls… I wonder how these kids are doing now…
I have also known “white women” who dated and had sexual relationships with “black men” just basically to “try what it’s like” (I don’t maybe they thought it “tastes” or “smells” different ?), They were my fellow students and I “discovered” them then. It really shocked me. I didn’t know someone could so openly use others as objects like that. I realized racism expressed itself also that way. At the same time they did that, they also stated openly that they “would never marry a “black”” (apparently there was some cultural incompatibility, these “black men” were not “good enough” somehow.
This didn’t give me much incentive to continue to be friends with them, I was disgusted by this behavior. Am still thinking about it 20 some years later.
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@ Peanut
Don’t forget that there’s Black men from other countries who may be looking to date/marry Black women. The Black males that I’ve talked to from outside of the US only wanted to be with a Black woman and had their lives on track. It was like a breath of fresh air for me, lol!!
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@ Peanut
I hear you loud and clear. It’s not an easy road to navigate, trying to explain to black people — in particular, black females — the PITFALLS of dealing with whites in a white supremacy system
which is why I think it’s a BIG mistake to overlook the OTHER men of color and ONLY focus on white males as the only other option
I want black females to find LOVE but i don’t want to see them USED in their quest for it
I agree, that so many confused black males are “dating out” and I try to relay the same information that I’ve given here
and I have talked to many afterwards who NOW understand the reasons they were with white females had LITTLE to do with her being a “superior” woman
but MORE to do with what her WHITENESS represented in a white supremacy society
and many now have “seen the light” and she is a black female
which is why I work so hard to share information and then it is up to the individual to decide for themselves WHAT makes more sense than NOT
because I can’t force anyone to do anything and wouldn’t even try
but I will — without SHAME — share what I have learned the HARD WAY with other black victims of racism
well, have to work tomorrow
good nite!
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TrojanPam,
I want to be clear that I absolutely do not downplay racism/white supremacy.
I think our societies (US / France) were built on it and thrive by it.
What I was saying was “just” that there are active, openly racist people and the majority who play by the rules because they benefit fro; them and don’t question them for that very reason.
I am not sure at all that many of them are so aware. They are under control too, and are shocked when another “white” person points to their racism. They don’t believe they are racist and are often sincere in that belief. That is one reason it is so hard to teach them because they don’t think they have something to learn.
At the same time, I DO understand what you are saying and you know better than me what the real impact is.
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“When I was in brazil and I would see these mixed kids every where that I’d go and I’d see just as many Black women with white men as the reverse, that opened my mind too. When I came back from Brazil, I felt like I had, ironically, warmed up to white men a bit just from spending time with white American men on the trip. it was like a different world when we were away from the US…but as soon as I came back to the US, I saw vast differences and it brought me back to reality so to speak…”
When you come back to US and ONLINE especially. I tell you the online world can really stress one out.
@ Trojan Pam & Sharina:
“Why is the WHITE MAINSTREAM MEDIA spending so much time and money encouraging ONLY black people (not Asians, not Hispanics, not whites) to date OUTSIDE their ethnic group “—I would say the effort is not to date outside their ethnic group, but to date white. Media is big on white/black coupling yes, but I rarely see them focus on other couplings like Asian/black or Hispanic/black”
You are seeing it from your perspective. Meanwhile some white people are saying “why is media spending so much time and money encouraging ONLY WHITE people to date outside their ethnic group”. In fact, that is major theme on a few of their blogs.
As far as the Hispanic/Black thing, I’ve noticed that sort of inter-coupling MORE than white/black and for a number of years now. I guess that was considered “safer” for a while to portray than white/black. A sort of launching pad to segue into portraying white/black couples.
But don’t you think the media portrayals represent the demographic shifts and relationship patterns in this country? I do.
I see A LOT more interracial couples now than I did growing up. A lot more mixed kids. So to portray only black-black, white-white, and latino-latino couples on TV would not be an accurate portrayal.
Interracial coupling is a reality.
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@ Peanut
one more thing (again) lol
I would like to suggest an experiment for all
the next time you see a commercial with a black male in it, see if you see any black females
the next time you see a black adult and a child in a commercial, see if that child is so-called “bi-racial”
the next time you see a movie or TV show with a black male in it, see if he has a black wife or lover or any lover at all
the next time you see a black female in a movie or TV show, see if she has a black man, or black husband, or any man at all
the next time you see an attractive black female see if she is dark or light-skinned
the next time you see a dark skinned black female on TV or in a movie, see if she is obese
the next time you see a smart, and attractive black female in a TV show or movie, see if she is chasing a white male for sex OR saying how “fine” he is
the next time you see a black male and female together in a TV commercial, movie, or TV show and it is NOT a comedy see how FOUL and UGLY their interaction is
Like throwing a baby out of window in “For Colored Girls”
or raping a black female in “Precious”
and you will see there is a SYSTEMATIC EFFORT TO DESTROY THE LOVE BETWEEN THE BLACK MALE AND BLACK FEMALE by the white supremacist media
and only a BLIND black person couldn’t see it
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“…one the first NAACP leaders (can’t remember his name)…”
—
Walter White
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@Trojam Pam
The media has brainwashed many Blacks to hate themselves and value Whites and non Blacks over themselves, I have had a Black man tell me that the only reason he loved White girls was because of the images in the media showing White women as the epitome of beauty and superior to all races of women. However he woke up and realized that he was only hating himself when he preferred White women over Black women and learned to love Black women.
@All
The media is promoting interracial romances between us and non Blacks as a way to cause strife and hatred in our communities and make us date outside of our race. And then we produce these confused mixed kids with diluted blood and weird curly hair who don’t want to be connected to their Blackness. In other words, they want to reduce the population of Blacks in this country because they hate us and want us to fail,. The Jewish media is always two steps ahead of us! Always remember that!
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Like throwing a baby out of window in “For Colored Girls”
or raping a black female in “Precious”
and you will see there is a SYSTEMATIC EFFORT TO DESTROY THE LOVE BETWEEN THE BLACK MALE AND BLACK FEMALE by the white supremacist media
and only a BLIND black person couldn’t see it
___________________________
For Colored Girls was written by a black person (the self proclaimed “back feminist” Ntozake Shange), adapted to film by a black person (Tyler Perry), and pimped by a black person (Oprah). Same with Precious.
They could all argue that had they not been allowed to “express their creativity” with these works, then part of the “black narrative” would be lost. They they did not “have a voice”.
And black people turned up in droves to see both of these films.
The only way to stop black people from portraying other black people as sociopaths in their “art” is to vote with your dollars.
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@ Adeen
I have heard the same thing from many black males AFTER they woke up from their white supremacy-induced NIGHTMARE
and I’m afraid that black females may be wholesale going down that same treacherous road
wanting to date someone white because they’re white OR because of what black males are doing
I think it’s pretty obvious that something FOUL is going on in the media
regarding black on black relationships
like I said in that list above, all you have to do is turn on the TUBE, and slip in a DVD or change the channel
and you will see EXACTLY WHAT I’M TALKING ABOUT
AND anyone who can’t see it DOESN”T WANT TO SEE IT
but the one thing they can’t say
is they weren’t told
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@ Why
the POINT is those films or movies would NOT have seen the LIGHT OF DAY had white people NOT put them on the Big screen
because NOT a single black person– including Tyler Perry–has the POWER to control what movies show up at the Cineplex or make it into the video stores
white people control all the distribution channels of entertainment be it music, movies, TV, or sports
and what white people in Hollywood LOVE to do is show black dysfunction
and that is why they CHOOSE the films and TV shows they want US to see
of course, the books and movies were written by black people SUFFERING from their psychological TRAUMA under the system of white supremacy and the damage that came from black males and females being pitted against each other
just like people in a concentration camp being impacted by their oppression,
black males and females often STRIKE OUT at each other the way rats trapped in a cage will BITE each other
but at the ROOT CORE of that dysfunction is
WHITE SUPREMACY
AND AT THE ROOT CORE of displaying black people in TV and movies as DYSYFUNCTIONAL and IMMORAL people
is white supremacist media
PERIOD
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I dont understand either how an oppressed people give the media controlled RWS power over ALL thoughts. I am guessin it is the Stockholme Syndrome, which we have a very bad collective case of……
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There are many excellent black films made in the U.S., and in Africa, showing black people as fully HUMAN that will NEVER be played on the big screen
because they DO NOT portray black people the way the white people in power want us to be SEEN
as CARICATURES not CHARACTERS
either the black man as the white people’s savior./hero/rescuer aka the “good black (like Denzel and Morgan Freeman) who are always putting their lives on the line for white people but SELDOM if ever rescuing black women and children
the criminal black male,, Charlie slick with a lot of slang and cool talk and a cool walk
the Jezebel black female who is always on the hunt for some “white meat”
the Fat, and sassy dark-skinned black female who is either a MAMMY or a MONSTER but always MANLESS and UNLOVED
and the FOOLISH black male (always dark-skinned) with the mental maturity of a 12 year old boy
and so on and so on and so on ad nauseaum
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@ peanut
“and stop fixating on white people and just broaden your horizon to all people. that means black people, Asian people, eskimos, indian people, native americans, latinos, arabs etc…”
Ooh and i’d like to add somoan men as well, polomalu is fine he is married to a black woman.
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In regards to this whole interracial debate, I’m going to be one of those people who just won’t agree with it as long as racism is the monumental problem that it is. I used to dream of marrying a white man myself until I heard Trojan Pam break down the politics of interracial relationships on a talk show. I also had this epiphany last year in college. While reading Michelle Alexander’s “The New Jim Crow”, this thought went through my mind: “How could I possibly date a White male when I’ve read how many throughout the years are systemically locking up Black men?” Even Sergeant Willie Pete said he couldn’t imagine sitting in a White man’s house on Christmas laughing and so forth when he reflected on the racism that White males subjected him to.
In my journey to understand racism, I’ve realized that the last thing I should be doing is to sleep with/mate with the same group of people who have consistently mistreated my people and other people of color worldwide. Nobody forced me to come to this place, I decided to do so myself. And I’m not looking back. I think this would help us gain some sanity about the type of people we’re dealing with and begin to start loving ourselves again like we did thousands of years prior to white supremacy.
I mean, would any of you here take a “radical” environmental activist seriously if you found out that they were married to the CEO of say BP Oil or Exxon? Do you think Germans would have taken Adolf Hitler seriously if he was married to a Jewish woman, had children with her, and treated her as a queen?
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@King, I fooled cha, didnt I !!! I will respond to your request for proof of RWS heavily promoting this interacial ish. Here are a few example of CURRENT media blitz trying to shove this biracial is cute down our throats, watch this newest one :
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kYofm5d5Xdw) .
Here is another one :
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwHJ8D-IJoQ).
I am going to throw one more at cha for good measure:
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z6GVy-v8NQ4)
John boener daughter marrying Rasta and Sen Macain son just married a black women , you can google that for yourself. These are NO coincidence.
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@ ms j
“I mean, would any of you here take a “radical” environmental activist seriously if you found out that they were married to the CEO of say BP Oil or Exxon? Do you think Germans would have taken Adolf Hitler seriously if he was married to a Jewish woman, had children with her, and treated her as a queen?”
I want to take a pic and put this on a t shirt and a banner lol.
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” I also had this epiphany last year in college. While reading Michelle Alexander’s “The New Jim Crow”, this thought went through my mind: “How could I possibly date a White male when I’ve read how many throughout the years are systemically locking up Black men?”
Right. But the man you would date would not have “systemically locked up black men”.
Take people at the individual level.
And truth be told, unless you are already coupled, if you want to be in a relationship or marriage with a man, you might have to cast your net farther than just black men. That means not just white men, or even that it has to include white men, but like like Mstoogood4yall says above, expand your horizons to include all types of different men. Because the reality is that there just aren’t enough black men to go around for all the black women in the population.
And this becomes especially true when women desire “assortive mating” or a mate from their own educational and socio-economic level. And then factoring in all the women who want a mate from a HIGHER level than she.
Women have to cast their nets far and wide sometimes in order to catch just one damn fish.
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I was in my early teens when I started realising the media was nothing but a hype machine and the agenda of a relativly small group of people..and the biggest prostitute on the market , ready to sell itself to the people who can pay the price…Its not that I dont watch the media, I do, but, I see through it, and know I have to go looking for real in depth expresion of people…
The media is all relative, come to Brazil and see how the media really discriminates against black people , i mean more blatently than the USA
I just dont get these notions about the evils of interracial sex…people drag out one white supremist with one kook theory about breeding interracial babies, and then you got the Klan that wouldnt let my son near them…I mean there is no one monolithic plot to encourage sex with white people…I just saw this Cheerios comercial, I mean what is the big deal?
Im sure not saying the interracial sex world is free of racism,people will bring their baggage to any relationship…it doesnt cure racism…but implying its the 400 years of slavery , with the master rapist manifesting with each white touch, that any touch of a white man to a black woman is aggresion …I mean this is fantacy land…and there is a gigantic insult to any black person who has been in interracial sex relations or who is open minded to it…I dont care what anyone wants to say about white people, Ill pile on white racism also…but, demeaning and insulting and putting down any black people who happen to be in interracial sexual relations , is only a deviding tactic , causes strained feelings when they arnt really welcome to unifying against the real racism , and continues rifts and inner conflicts
Sure , its absolutly valuable to look at white peoples motives and intentions , based on their miserable past dealing with slavery , its very valuable to have an antenna up, to look for signs, to understand cultural differances , its very valuable to have the correct defenses in place as one goes through daily life, but, just issueing a mandate about dont have sex with white people , just drives it into a mud pit, where all that is going down is spinning of wheels
Its not like very similar problems that come up in interracial relationships dont happen in same race relationships..in all my relationships with black women, color became the least important issue…except when dealing with the racism my mate would have to deal with, and then we are locked against it
But, there have always been white people in the USA who faught against slavery and racism , who knew it was wrong, its always been there
I cant beleive the restraints and ignorance of how business works on this thread and how people are belittling black people who are wheeling and dealing in the business world
First, although its extremly desirable to have allies close to you in business, more often than not, you have to do business with, and negociate with people you do not like, even hate…if you dont want to negociate or do business with people you dont like, you actualy will end up working for them in the long run, punching a clock for them…making it seem like these black business people have seperated from the black pack and are over on the white side is a serious smear and misrepresentation of how busieness goes down…seeing how black business people have gained power and control of their lives, against odds of a system that wasnt set up for them, is nothing but incredible…sluffing them off as uncle toms is really bs…some may be, most are not…
The reason for more integrated sexual unions these days is really because of lots of integrated school systems and how people start interacting on a daily basis and where most people do stick to their own race, plenty of people start seeing through false barriors society had set up, and see connections and the ones who dont march to lock step mandates will make hookups…some will fail , some will be nurturing
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Black internal racism, is certainly a subject that I cant speak about from experiancing it first hand…but, dealing with self esteem issues is a universal human emotion….its funny, whites may be the racists in power , but, it doesnt cure their self esteem issues
It seems to me that, what many ancient and modern practices pass on is, where you do have to understand and self analyse what is going on inside oneself, and especialy based on outside signals coming from all sides, that push these feelings of self esteem even harder, is, after analysing what is happening inside about it, the secret is to `let go` and not dwell on it….dwelling on it and over analysing is exactly what has to be confronted…the roof brain has to be shut down to not bring in the constant put downs that the brain is telling the person…Im talking about internal racism , not the defences needed to face daily racism …shutting down the roof brain from the constant barrage, but, knowing the realities in place in society, and how to have a good solid antenna up, is the way to deal with self esteem issues…and, very valuable is cultural education and knowledge…culture may not cure all self esteem issues, but it is a life line, and can fill the inner being up with pride and self love of ones origins that make racism look foolish
Its obvious, this thread and the BWE thread are abnormal obcessed discusions , throwing out mandates, insults, provocations, confrontations…just going through the mud (and Im not talking about the good information put forth here of the history of racism and how whites can be racist and how the society and media push racist agendas)….this isnt the way to progress…its wallowing in the bilge water of an incredible movement , the Black Civil Rights Movement, that on the one hand is a testament to human struggle and overcoming unbeleivable obsticles, and on the other, like any great political struggle, had side agendas that really go nowhere
Its very good to talk about the defences a black person needs in a racist society, but, what two consenting adults do in bed together, is really no one elses business
I say its great each person on here will make their own desician about how they feel about interracial dating, but, putting out mandates, strange conspiricy theories, conflicting descriptions (white people are pushing for people to have sex from them, white people dont want to have sex with black women etc), constantly becoming The National Enquiry Celebrity Gossip About Interracial Issues , well, we are just going to stay stuck in the mud
and, no matter how people want to make this a black discusion, sorry, the title totaly implicates me and this makes it our discusion
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@ why
Peanut said expand ur horizions I just copied it and added somoan men lol, just giving credit where it is due.*runs away*
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How can it work. As a black woman in my 30’s, I have rarely been in a situation with white men who were ever non-racist. The vast majority of white men I meet have racial issues and hate, primarily aimed at Blacks and Black women. Heck, I would say a large percentage of White men prefer, for whatever reason, to aim their hate and aggression AT Black women.
I see these articles and blogs and see bw/wm couples around town but I don’t see how it fits with the reality that most white men are anti-black and wish no one wanted black women, even black men.
Although Hispanics and Asians are often racist (because they aren’t treated as bad, and buy into white supremacy), I often relate more to Latino and other men. They are able to accept black women’s features, accept us as individuals, etc. Also, I’ve met more Hispanic and Asian men who often “like” or at least are “open” to black women.
It appears to work between so many black men and white women. At least it appears to work better but as a black woman, I don’t have experiences where I meet a down to earth white male who does not hate blacks in some form or fashion. That’s just the way society (their society ) shapes them.
I think white women and black men are able to couple up more simply because, although many white women are just as racist as a large percentage of white men, you have your share that are able to be a bit more open-minded.
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I want to say something to those claiming that “black women have it bad in the dating market” because I feel that it’s false. We have to remember that white society is anti-black in general. Growing up in a Hispanic area and dealing with Asians I never felt “unwanted” or like things were lop-sided at all. In fact, there were always hispanic/black couples composed of black women and hispanic men and I always and still do get hit on by Latin men or get attention and even Asian men ( from east asian like Chinese and Japanese to East Indian men).
I only started “being told” I was supposedly “unwanted” when I got in a white environment where WHITE men would walk around and give off vibes that they didn’t want black women to be seen as attractive and would weird out if you caught them checking you out.
Feeling “unwanted” is just a part of the race issue in america in terms of White society. If you check out Caribbean, Hispanic and other cultures you will find that there are many black women/Asian, non-black Latino, and OTHER type of combinations that have very long successful relationships.
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@ Gina
I would agree with you on all of your comments.
But I do have a question to ask you. Do you feel as if news reports about Kim Kardashian and Kanye West’s relationship work to fuel the idea that Black women are unwanted. I mean, Kanye was largely known for speaking out again White racism all these years, but now he’s had a child with someone who clearly benefits from being a White. I also find it ironic that he’s so race conscious but has a child with a woman who says their daughter will be raised “colorblind”.
I just feel like many young people in my generation are used to seeing just celebrity interracial couples rather than black celebrity couples. And you know how much attention our people pay to celebrities!
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I Ms. J I know what you are getting at. In terms of Kanye and Kim. They are an odd couple to me (b/c they’ve had a child before marriage, look oddly matched, etc) but I like the Kardashians, especially as they appear very black-friendly. The other one married a black guy, and Kim appears to like Black men and be black-friendly which I have no problem with. I watched their show and like all sisters and the family.
I get what you are getting at though and I’ve noticed that the media focuses on and highlights black men/other women relationships and I and some other black women have come to the conclusion that it’s glaringly obvious that they want to promote a notion that black women are un-wanted. I say this because quite a few white male celebrities are married to black women yet we NEVER see them in the media as often as we will see a black male/white woman couple. Secondly, the vast majority of black male celebs are married to or with a black woman and have black kids but the small percentage of black celeb men who do marry out are HIGHLIGHTED in the media. Especially in terms of sports stars. Most are with black women and have black kids but you will only see them with their ‘mate’ if the mate is white.
I think it’s important that we have our black media, black magazines, events, etc to show the truth. It’s odd but I believe white MEN in particular like to believe it themselves. It’s a part of “white supremacy” for them to believe black men all want their white women rather than black women. White women too carry this notion however, I have faced it more vehemently with white men.
I am not saying every single white person or white male is bad and I’m not denying racism exists among Hispanics and Asians but we are discussing WHITE racism and the white media and the large percentage who adhere to a practice of thinking and treatment of black people, for whatever sick reason.
I believe the White media does not care for black women being seen as wanted but would rather promote a notion that black women are un-wanted and black men ALL or by-and -large prefer white women and that’s far from true.
Some of us black women get our panties in a bunch (when we see black men with another race of women ) because of the history of this country and how we struggle but the truth is that black men more so often than not CHOOSE black women, just like other races choose their own race of women. They have done this in the face of a society that has tried to get them to see us as ugly and not want us. They have done this although society tells them it’s “scary” and against white supremacy to like us, marry us, date us, desire us, find us attractive, etc.
I don’t think them showing IR marriages more than same-race will make any change with us though, as I think WE know, that like other races, we relate more to each other ( male and female) and WE know that by and large when we go out there are many places we can go to see black couples!
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@ Peanut
Yeah, I feel the way as you!! Like I said, Kanye has caught a lot of hell from White folks for calling the President a racist and “stealing” Taylor Swift’s 15 minutes of fame. But all the news reports about he and Kim’s baby are so positive. Everyone’s like, “Aww, congrats to the new dad!!” It’s really fascinating to me, honestly.
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Interesting Peanut. I was thinking the same thing. Why is the media making such a big deal about Kim Kardashian having her baby? When i saw it was top news on several news sites, I was like “wth….?” Who really cares THAT much about her?
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@ Peanut and Gina
So would you both agree that had Kanye West and Gabrielle Union had a daughter together, that it wouldn’t be all over the news?
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I also find it interesting that on Father’s Day weekend, a White mother has received all of this attention for having a child with a Black man. I thought Black men were “deadbeat” dads like the media would have many believe.
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haha Ms. J, I absolutely agree! Atleast that’s what we’ve seen of the media. They like to give all the attention in terms of black men and dating only when it’s with a white woman/latina.
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@Adeen
For the stats of divorce rates
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1741-3729.2008.00491.x/full
@TrojanPam
Yeah; but black guys don’t seem to look at it the same way you do as a community thing, they seem to look at it like most men do, have no problem dating out and believe the women of their race (whether that be white, black asian etc…) should be subservient to them.
As for culture and heritage, black and white people of the US do share a common culture, history and heritage.
One of the things that’s been mentioned is the gender wars, and that the fact that apparently white women hire less black men, but white women also hire “more” black women. That would indicate less race and more they are just hiring the gender they feel more comfortable around.
Also; couldn’t the Purge be argued to be a negative representation of Right Wing/Conservative politics and voters? Maybe its anti-Right Wing Propaganda?
@Sharina
No; that’s pretty much accurate, until I worked with a black female I didn’t even register them inregards to dating or even general sexual attraction.
Basically yeah; society has us intensely programmed for who to date and who not to date and it does that without ever blatantly saying a word or even punishing the “transgressions” against the race so to speak.
One thing that surprised me was asian men having harder times getting dates and women with Indian (non-native) descent were less desired as well, especially since that’s one that is literally never even mentioned or hinted at all whatsoever.
@mstoogood4yall
Why would I lie about my race?
And while I was making that statement about white psychological problems as a joke; it is true, black people have both greater confidence in their esthetics and are notably less prone to psychological disorders than white people.
@phoebeprunelle
Of course they can; they don’t hate them because they are black, they hate them because they look at them as competition and have low self-esteem.
@V
Actually yeah; White Men have been murdered for dating/marrying black women, as recently within thel ast few years actually.
@Peanut
Your right; as their numbers increase eventually mixed race people will become their own “group” as for rejecting black people, look at how black people reacted to Zoe Saldanna playing Nina Simone, black people have already rejected mixed race people and they (the mixed races) know it.
Your also right mixing won’t end racism, its like in various South American places you just have mixed people calling themselves white and existing in the same or similar status’s that white people used to or still do there.
One thing that does get brought up though is this; there isn’t enough black men to go around for “all” black women, some are going to have to date out, interestingly enough I think the numbers that date out correspond roughly to the numbers of black women that would be without a man if they didn’t date out.
As for Kim K; remembering she’s a mixed arabic sort, that’s not really white, it could be why white society is okay with her marrying a black guy and why her family dates out so much, they know they aren’t white.
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@ ms j
kanye and gabrielle oh no. She is with dwade and I think they are very beautiful together. As for kanye and kim Rofl. Its crazy how ppl were saying keep kanye away from the baby when she was pregnant, I haven’t seen the comments since she gave birth. It was funny that I read kim was worried she’d still be married to kris when she gave birth, but I guess still being married and knocked up by another man isn’t as wrong to her.
A part of me is like why do ppl who are against racism and into their culture jumping into bed with these ppl or marrying them, contradiction. Then the other part of me is like well they are still great even though they are a contradiction like kanye, maya angelou, henry louise gates, etc. Me personally I couldn’t do it, because as ms j said nobody would take an enviornmental activist serious if she was married to the ceo of an oil company.
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Fiamma,
Glad to see you have returned to the party 🙂
I am also surprised to see this thread going strong. As another “browning” from the “yard” .. reading these comments has been interesting.
I find his whole thing about the media pushing “race mixing” on black people” as very strange, indeed….it seems the black younger generation is Forgetting just where they are coming from.
For those of us “non-millenials”…if you wanted to see black people on TV in the USA (on a regular basis), you had to watch Fat Albert, Good Times, What’s Happening, and Soul Train … all you saw as black families or black love interests… there was a big backlash when Star Trek had an “almost” love scene between Captain Kirk and Uhuru..
I have a black American girlfriend who worked/s for a casting agency; I remember how back in the 90’s, she used to complain how hard it was to convince advertising agency’s and TV producers to even send black people on castings that were targeted to white Audiences and wanted an “American” look.. they would call and practically curse her out for including black people but she argued that black people DO represent the American look
… In the UK, they showed interracial couples without a problem but in the US, Interracial scenes or couples were not even allowed to see the light of day
….black people in the US have Come a LONG way in the media
Thanks to black writers and producers who have pushed Hard to have their voices heard (no matter who pays and distributes it)
The older generation of black Americans never used to have a voice; they fought so that They and future generations can have a Voice and Choices
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@Ms J
Actually when it comes to men involved in their childrens lives, especially inregards to being divorced black men are the most involved of the various races.
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@ v-4
“as for rejecting black people, look at how black people reacted to Zoe Saldanna playing Nina Simone, black people have already rejected mixed race people and they (the mixed races) know it.”
look at how latino ppl reacted to Jennifer lopez playing selena. Black ppl have almost always welcomed mixed race ppl because of the one drop rule. We did not reject zoe we just don’t like her playing a role she looks nothing like. Look how many black ppl fell into accepting Obama who is biracial as black, he turned his back on us and doesn’t acknowledge the black community only in a condescending tone. So excuse some of us if we are not as welcoming as we once were, when someone keeps stabbing u in the back u can’t ignore it. Mixed race ppl are sometimes rejected by black ppl true, but they’ve always been rejected by white ppl. Some of us are weary of biracials because of the history. ppl like j edgar hoover passed for white to get ahead and went against black ppl.
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@ Mstoogood4yall
You should see the comments on Twitter about this child. People are bashing the little girl already. Here is what went viral on Twitter; “Kim Kardashian is now famous for black people coming in her *you know what* AND out of her *you know what*.”
Just type in the key words “kim kardashian” “black” and see what comes up.
Even though some people think that her family embraces blackness, I actually think that their black relatives are kind of tokenized. Who would’ve cared about Lamar Odom if he wasn’t married to Khloe? I don’t recall seeing his children on “Keeping Up with the Kardashians” and their yearly family portraits, but Khloe is the wife of their father. Kanye’s not even in the family pictures. And with Kim saying that her child will be raised to be colorblind, I’m not so sure that they embrace Blackness. Colorblindness is not the reality for our people. I wouldn’t be shocked if Kanye’s grandkids end up being White if that’s how the child will be raised. But I could be wrong.
And yes, too many of our Black intellectuals live a double standard. But perhaps the contradiction is what keeps them in limelight. Otherwise, they would not even be mentioned at all. You either cave into the White standard or live an obscure life.
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^ yeah its is ridiculous to me how ppl want to attack this child, that is low. But then again im not surpised these ppl attack the presidents kids too so of course they’d go after an entertainers kid. kim trying to raise that child colorblind, lol, that is probably why ppl were saying keep kanye away because they don’t want him enlightening the child to the harsh realities of amerikkka. Goodluck with the colorblind bs ppl, it won’t work because if u tell ur child the history about slavery, jim crow, and the black activists killed, how then can they look at things the same. They can’t which is why these ppl are trying to take slavery outta history books all the more reason for parents to teach their kids themselves or supplement what they learn in school.
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@ Ms. J
who said: “I used to dream of marrying a white man myself…”
—
Ms J, I think a lot of little non-white girls feel that way because nearly ALL the men we saw on TV and in movies who did anything worth doing, or were heroes, and brave and strong and sexy and exciting were WHITE MEN
I wrote a short story for my first book, Trojan Horse: Death of a Dark Nation”
and the story was called “Legend of the Purple People.” The purple people were the most powerful people and traded places with whites today, and the white people were in the same position blacks are in today
here’s an excerpt from the story, “Legend of the Purple People”
—–
“The PURPLE PEOPLE owned and controlled all the banks (and the money), the schools and universities, the businesses, the criminal justice system, and the government.
Despite being in a supremely superior position, the PURPLE PEOPLE never missed an opportunity to tell the white people how inferior white
people were. The PURPLE PEOPLE even had white statues on their lawns with exaggerated white features, like bulging blue eyes and thin lips that stretched from ear to ear.
PURPLE PEOPLE claimed the white people were too stupid to learn, but just to make sure they stayed stupid, the PURPLE PEOPLE created a separate and unequal school system that was inferior to the PURPLE schools. The white schools were in horrible condition; with leaking roofs, lead paint, broken desks, and the outdated schoolbooks discarded by the better-educated PURPLE CHILDREN.
The teachers who couldn’t cut it in the PURPLE schools were sent to the
white schools where no one would know the difference. Since the PURPLE
PEOPLE had a superior education, naturally they got most of good jobs, while the whites took the menial jobs, or had no jobs at all.
In the morning, the commuter trains from the PURPLE suburbs would pass
through the white neighborhoods. The PURPLE PEOPLE on the train would
shake their heads and say, it didn’t make sense for people to live like animals.
Of course, PURPLE PEOPLE never said it when white people were around.
The white women were horrible and overweight from eating cheap junk
food since fresh fruits and vegetables were too expensive. The men were worse, always standing on street corners and drinking out of paper bags, and blaming the PURPLE MAN for all their problems. Even the movies and television were depressing because white people were always playing fools or criminals.
If only, white parents lamented aloud, they hadn’t been born with such ugly
white skin, blond hair, and blue eyes, their lives, and their children’s lives
would have been much easier.
White women began using green dye on their blonde hair so they would
look more PURPLE and less white. They bought makeup that would turn
their pale pink skin a deep purple and green lipstick to wear on their lips.
They wore purple contacts to hide their blue eyes then swore they weren’t wearing any. Upon seeing the white people strutting proudly in their new get-ups, the PURPLE PEOPLE would chuckle, shake their heads, and say under their breath, “Isn’t it sad to be white? No matter how hard they try, they’ll never be as good as PURPLE PEOPLE.”
The white women suffered the most because white men thought PURPLE
WOMEN were the absolute sex bomb. The PURPLE WOMEN loved to sneak into the white community to get some of that big, white, you-know-what that the white men were more than happy to give them.
The white man’s self-esteem was so battered and bruised, he didn’t feel
much like a man, so he decided the easiest (and safest) way to be equal to the PURPLE MAN was to find any PURPLE WOMAN who would have him, so he could be less white and be more acceptable (more purple).
Unfortunately, the people who suffered most were the white women who were left to pick up the pieces and raise their children alone, while the demoralized and frightened white man sought validation in a pair of PURPLE arms.
The poor white woman hid her hurt and bewilderment behind a wall of hostility because she was too proud to admit her own men thought she was inferior. White women didn’t know what to do or where to turn. They had tried looking as PURPLE as they could, but the white men wanted the REAL THING.
More and more white women turned to religion. They prayed every night to the framed picture of the PURPLE SAVIOR above their empty beds and asked Him to wake the white man up and tell him to come back home where he belonged.
—————-
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@ Ms J
(CONTINUED)
I left out part of the story so this post wouldn’t be any longer, but I think you get the point.
IT’S NOT ABOUT WHITE OR PURPLE BEING SUPERIOR, IT’S ABOUT THEM CREATING THE PERCEPTION THAT THEY ARE SUPERIOR AND THE OTHER PEOPLE ARE INFERIOR
That’s what white supremacy is about, CREATING ARTIFICIAL CONDITIONS (such as showing black females as “unattractive” or black males as “clowns and buffoons” to give the (FALSE) APPEARANCE of INFERIORITY
that’s what white supremacy IS, a FALSENESS, a MANUFACTURED NON-REALITY, A MATRIX, — the WIZARD OF OZ
that’s why so many black and non-white people “LONG” for a white person and will go from one white person to another AND NEVER LEARNING that their REASONS for being with them in the first place is WRONG-HEADED
Like the white people in the story above we have been MADE to feel inferior by living UNDER INFERIOR CONDITIONS and being PUT IN AN INFERIOR POSITION
it has NOTHING to do with being inferior BUT our REACTION to this LIE must CHANGE if we ever hope to SPARE OUR CHILDREN FROM THE SAME PAIN that we have experienced.
—
like you said, Ms J, if SOMEONE is waging WAR on you and your family and your children, and your REACTION is to pursue, date, chase, love, mate, marry, sex, and BREED with that ‘someone”
then you should EXPECT YOUR MISTREATMENT TO CONTINUE (IT WILL)
This has NOTHING to do with hating all white people, I do NOT hate ANYONE, i HATE the BEHAVIOR and I HATE INJUSTICE and CRUELTY and HARMING OTHER PEOPLE FOR NO REASON OTHER THAN SKIN COLOR OR HEIGHT OR WEIGHT OR HAIR TEXTURE
this is about UNDERSTANDING WHITE SUPREMACY and UNDERSTANDING that RACISM is a GLOBAL problem that is practiced by the majority of white people
How do I know this is true? I FOLLOW THE LOGIC
and LOGIC tells me that there is NO WAY NINE PERCENT OF THE WORLD’S POPULATION COULD CONTROL THE OTHER NINETY-ONE PERCENT
unless the MAJORITY of that NINE PERCENT were supporting and participating and helping and teaching their children
TO MAINTAIN THAT WHITE SUPREMACY SYSTEM
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@ Gina
who said, “I only started “being told” I was supposedly “unwanted” when I got in a white environment where WHITE men would walk around and give off vibes that they didn’t want black women to be seen as attractive and would weird out if you caught them checking you out.”
—
AMEN, sister, I have experienced AND witnessed this all my life, watching white males PRETEND not to notice black females or their racism being so INGRAINED and important to them, that they had actually LEARNED not to find black females attractive
I met a white male years ago when I was out of town in a training class for my job and he said he had never been attracted to a black female YET was in my face while I was there.
He said his mother didn’t like black people and I SAID,
“Like, who really cares what your mother likes”
and you should have seen his face change! I wasn’t as outspoken then and I am now, but the comment just popped out because I wondered what the H he thought I should feel?
Like “bad” because his mother was a racist?
I believe there are TWO main reasons some white males “ignore” black females
1. THE WHITE CONDUCT CODE that basically instructs white males that they are SUPERIOR to all people of color, and they should NEVER uplift a non-white female over a white one. Because they COME from a white female and HER SOCIAL POSITION GUARANTEES THEIRS.
It has LITTLE to do with “LOVING” or respecting the white female. It’s about MAINTAINING THE ILLUSION OF WHITE SUPERIORITY, because it should be OBVIOUS that there is a WAR between the white male and white female so let’s not be fooled by all these TV images of blissful white romance
please
2. Due the Roman-Grecian ORIGINS of today’s European culture, there is a STRONG UNDERCURRENT OF HOMOSEXUALITY among Europeans, especially males, and I have come to the CONCLUSION that part of the “hostility’ toward black females is a strange kind of JEALOUSY, similar to the sexual JEALOUSY toward the black male
where black male SEXUALITY is a source of fascination AND hatred among white people, especially white males
what I mean is IT IS NOT NORMAL FOR ANY HETEROSEXUAL MALE TO NOT NOTICE THAT A FEMALE OF ANY COLOR HAS A VAGINA
and if he can DO that, perhaps he is one of a number who is SECRETLY more interested in PENISES than VAGINAS.
It is ALSO VERY TELLING that ANY ALLEGEDLY ‘HETEROSEXUAL’ MALE OF ANY COLOR to spend a GREAT DEAL OF TIME DEGRADING (BLACK) FEMALES THAT HE IS NOT ATTRACTED TO
Normal males IGNORE females they don’t find attractive, but many white males spend a great deal of time ON-LINE and in the MEDIA, (like Don Imus, and so many other white ‘shock jocks’ ) talking BAD about black females
ALMOST THE WAY A JEALOUS FEMALE WOULD DO ABOUT ANOTHER FEMALE RIVAL
just my two or four cents!
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@ Trojan Pam
That was DEEP!! It’s stories like yours that really show how our conditions in this society were CREATED rather than just a natural part of life.
And like I said before, “Would any of you here take a “radical” environmental activist seriously if you found out that they were married to the CEO of say BP Oil or Exxon? Do you think Germans would have taken Adolf Hitler seriously if he was married to a Jewish woman, had children with her, and treated her as a queen while talking about Aryan racial purity at the same time?”
We have so much work to do as a people.
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@ Ms J, Peanut, Gina
very interesting observations, ladies!
I’m on the same page, the media DELIBERATELY focuses on black people, especially black males, who have white spouses and I’d include Kanye West
(who I think is in a FAKE relationship with Kim K, I believe, because he was in so much HOT WATER with powerful white people, that he allowed himself to be used to promote white supremacy or there would be God knows what consequences
the IRS
the end of career
a threat to his physical safety
who knows?
I never underestimate the powerful white people who control this system, they will do AND HAVE DONE things that we would find hard to believe even if we saw it with our OWN EYES
Anytime there is a PATTERN there is a PURPOSE
NOTHING happens OVER and OVER and OVER again by COINCIDENCE, it is ALWAYS BY DESIGN
I’m applaud all of you (and those I failed to mention) for SEEING with your OWN EYES instead of letting the media PROGRAM you to see what they want you to see AND think what they want you to think
something STINKS BIG-TIME in the mainstream media image of black people and of black/white relationships VS black/black relationships
and once you understand HOW racism/white supremacy FUNCTIONS in all it’s many faces
you will begin to SEE RIGHT THROUGH THE CON
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You have just said it TrojanPam. two very good points! At my job now there are two black females and a few black men and I tell you, the white men want to DOWN us two black women more so than they want to do with the black men. It’s like they want us to be and most importantly FEEL maligned, alone, etc. I only experience this with white men/women.
This is why we as black people need to discuss this insanity we have to deal with.
I can’t fully respond right now but you have touched on something I have talked to other black women about recently, and that is the strange “jealous” vibe white men often show black women. Someone complimented a black female at my job a while back and I tell you the white guy we work with gave a JEALOUS, yes, JEALOUS look towards her!
I have also mentioned that I have faced more jealousy when I looked well put together from white MEN oftentimes, than white WOMEN.
I have to take this in and come back b/c it’s a weird and crazy phenomenon I have seen, dealt with and wondered about for quite some time.
—————————–
RE:
2. Due the Roman-Grecian ORIGINS of today’s European culture, there is a STRONG UNDERCURRENT OF HOMOSEXUALITY among Europeans, especially males, and I have come to the CONCLUSION that part of the “hostility’ toward black females is a strange kind of JEALOUSY, similar to the sexual JEALOUSY toward the black male
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@ Ms J
I thought the point of that story was SO BASIC that even a CHILD could understand it
When you asked the question: “Do you think Germans would have taken Adolf Hitler seriously if he was married to a Jewish woman, had children with her, and treated her as a queen while talking about Aryan racial purity at the same time?”
—
The LOGICAL ANSWER, of course, is H no. IT is a CONTRADICTION to talk “black” and sleep “white” and ANYONE who is doing it should be IMMEDIATELY DISREGARDED AND AVOIDED in case their PSYCHOLOGICAL CONTAMINATION is CONTAGIOUS
That’s why few black people take Harry Belafonte seriously when he talks about racism even though I think he means well
I would NEVER follow a black person who was in a so-called IR relationship when it came to finding ways to eradicate racism
NO FREAKING WAY
because they can’t even eliminate their OWN confusion, how the heck can they tell me how to eliminate mine?
I give an example similar to yours frequently when I talk to people about IR
and that is
imagine you are a Palestinian freedom fighter and your people are being devastated by the more powerful, American tax dollar FUNDED Israeli army and your mother and father have been killed by a bomb and your children are being terrified and devastated
and then one of your comrades comes home with an Israeli bride, saying, “Love is color blind, guys.”
What would OR should those freedom fighters do about a so-called freedom fighter who thinks it is appropriate to bring an Israeli woman HOME in the MIDDLE OF A WAR where your PEOPLE ARE BEING DEVASTATED
In addition, 70 percent of Palestinian females are SINGLE because so many of their men have been killed and some “freedom fighter” brings home an Israeli bride
and tries to convince the other freedom fighters AND those SINGLE Palestinian females that he is just “exercising his right to free choice”
Yeah, you know what they would do with him..
and you’re right, we have so much work to do as a people.
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@ Gina
You DONE opened a BIG CAN of worms, girlfriend!
I talk about his “phenomenon” at LENGTH in my book. AND I have watched this strange vibe for years, never really understanding it UNTIL I started understanding more about white supremacy and the GREEK ORIGINS of whtie culture — which is HOMOSEXUALLY ORIENTED
(no, I did not say all whites are homosexuals BUT i bet any that read this KNOW what I’m talking about)
There’s an article I posted earlier in this thread called, “Meet the Mandingos” == if you Google it you’ll find it
where white husbands would arrange “parties” for single black males to have SEX with their white wives in front of them, and I know COUNTLESS black males who said they have been approached by white males who wanted them to have sex with their wives, I even saw a VIDEO someone sent me where this straight-up backwoods-looking white male was VIDEOTAPING his white wife giving a dark-skinned (you know they got to brown or dark males) black male ORAL SEX and then having sex with him
and the white male FILMING it was coaching her and saying, “yeah, that’s right sit on it…etc., etc,
and then I looked back on all the many instances of black males being sodomized while in police custody and a white Chicago detective, Burge, who systematically tortured black males while in police custody and guess what?
it usually involved MESSING WITH THEIR GENITALS and shocking them or sticking something in their rectums (sic)
and then the Penn State scandal where the little 10 year old black boy was RAPED in the shower by Jerry Sandusky, a white male, and how most of the boys raped were black. This white male came on the internet radio program, the C.O.W.S, he had written a book about it and he said most of the boys were black AND that Penn State was just the TIP of the iceberg when it came to this kind of activity
and then my Guru — who owns an IT company and has many white females for clients told me that the white females were always hitting on him even after he told them he was a happily married man and being that he is a very personable person who people love to talk to, he told me this which opened my eyes even WIDER
He said that some (didn’t say all) of the white females who owned or worked at the companies he serviced said, “But our men are all gay.”
I say all that to SAY, YES, some white males behave toward black females the SAME WAY A JEALOUS FEMALE RIVAL WOULD BEHAVE
and I believe that ANY MAN who wants to see another man SEX HIS WIFE is WISHING HE WAS THE ONE GETTING THAT SEXUAL POUNDING WITH THAT PENIS,
as opposed to a HETEROSEXUAL MAN whose fantasy involving THREE PEOPLE would MOST LIKELY BE
two females and HIMSELF
NOT HIM videotaping OR watching a black male (he despises) having sex with HIS white wife
that equals = TWO MEN AND A FEMALE
AND the preoccupation with BLACK MALE GENETALIA to the EXTENT of CASTRATING BLACK MALES’ PENISES AND KEEPING THEM FOR ‘SOUVENIRS’
SPEAKS VOLUMES
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@ Gina
there’s one MORE LITMUS TEST that I apply to ALL the stereotypes that whites have created about blacks
for example, how the white media via Oprah Winfrey made the DOWN-LOW phenomenon LARGELY a black male phenomenon
and what I have found is WHATEVER whites collectively say about blacks is something they KNOW IS TRUE ABOUT THEM
for example, saying Indians “scalped” white settlers — when IN REALITY, it was the white man who started “scalping” Indians because he got PAID for each scalp
and when whites call us “monkeys” and “apes” and say we descended from them, the smartest white people KNOW AFRICANS WERE THE FIRST MEN AND WOMEN ON THE PLANET
and did NOT descend from “apes” or “monkeys” or any animal AT ALL
however, more recently, white scientists have ADMITTED that whites are a HYBRID between MAN (African man) and NEANDERTHAL — which is a sort of ape-like half-humanoid (not being funny, just don’t know what to call it
Think about this
who describes themselves in the following manner?
“he went “ape”
“you act like a Neanderthal:”
“stop acting like a cave man”
Black and non-white people NEVER use these kinds of phrases but white people do. Even the TV cartoon, the Flintstones wasn’t about non-whites
I recently heard Judge Judy tell a white male defendant, “Stop acting like a Neanderthal” and my mouth fell open
I was like, wow, there is it again, this Neanderthal reference
I’m not posting this to poke fun, I’m trying to encourage other black people to FOLLOW THE LOGIC
what is true IS TRUE and the TRUTH will set you FREE from the LIE
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@ Gina
One word: WOW. I really wonder why those white men are so jealous of you. Perhaps it could be latent homosexuality. I know a Black female who writes about issues pertaining to Black relationships, and she was sharing with us how White males message her daily about wanting to have sex with black MEN. They’ll offer a profile of themselves – may of whom say that they’re straight – but they want to be dominated sexually by Black men. Now if White men are so superior, why do they fantasize about being dominated sexually by Black men????
@ Trojan Pam
You know, I used to get angry inside when I saw a Black male with a White female, even BW/WM couples on occasion, but now I see the Black partner as a victim hands-down. Yesterday I read a book called “Mixed Coupes”, and I wanted to cry when I read how the White-in-laws mistreated their Black-in-laws. One white female was literally angry at herself for addressing her Black son-in-law by his first name. In contrast, no Black families objected to these unions, and Black nationalist relatives of the Black person thought highly of their White-in-law.
Now why should our people be persuaded to marry into families who see us as less than dirt?
We live in such an anti-Black culture, so it causes us to do many things that make absolutely no sense. These black partners were upset about these instances, but they still were able to tolerate it. I highly doubt they would tolerate the same treatment from a spouse who was black.
I don’t even think IR relationships between Palestinians and Israelis are even a topic of discussion over there. There is just so much tension among both groups that it would be seen as an act of insanity for them to come together when both sides are at war. And that’s why I think Blacks and Whites are uneasy about the same thing here. Because even if we try to pretend like there we’re in a post-racial society, we all know that there’s a serious problem between both groups. And trying to create relationships that ignore that reality will not work.
I just wish that I lived in a world where I saw other black people as genuinely human and worthy of giving and receive love like I do with white people. This would heal Black relationships everywhere.
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@ Ms J
who said: “Now why should our people be persuaded to marry into families who see us as less than dirt?”
yes, it is a form of confusion, and denial, a need for white validation and a recipe for mental illness
I have watched many of these “IR” unions create permanent rifts in black families,
for example, the white person’s side of the family usually has NO interest in getting to know the black side of the family and only TOLERATES them on occasions where their attendance is mandatory
like the wedding
and they might tolerate the black son or daughter in law and his or her parents but that “welcome” is seldom extended to any other black family members
(yes, I’m talking about my extended family)
where the black side of the family is more open and more accepting in general, I think, because black people are used to white people invading our “territory” and so we learn to adapt to whatever is thrown our way
One of my younger female relatives (who is the product of a black mother and a white father) told me once when we were alone that her white relatives were so different from her black ones and I asked her what she meant and she said when she visits the black people, even people that she is not related to will kiss her and hug her
but when she visits her “white side” they are standoffish and cool toward her
Unfortunately, she is very white-identified and has only so far been interested in white males and has not married Her sister is married to a white male and all their children look white and are being RAISED as white people and will pass as white
and when I look at it, my black female relative’s family is DISCONNECTED from her black side INSTEAD of building a STRONG EXTENDED FAMILY
which is one of my MAJOR beefs and that the DISSOLUTION of the extended black family that sometimes happens when we marry “out” and our elders KNEW the value of the extended black family where aunts and uncles and grandmothers and grandfathers were ESSENTIAL in raising black children and teaching them RESPECT
there were NO latchkey kids when we had generational houses and families and even our NEIGHBORS helped to raise each other’s children
that’s why that African proverb said:
It takes a VILLAGE to raise a child (properly)
and we lost them during integration and assimilation and urbanization ‘
and we can see the effect it has had on black children
and this IR “thing” is just ONE MORE NAIL in the black family coffin
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@ Trojan pam
I said a similar thing on heartsie’s blog, when they were discussing if that Asian man who said black women are ugly was right. I said that they are feminized to be doing studies about which woman is hot and which is not. men are supposed to want to be with beautiful women regardless of race, if a man likes a certain feature then they will pursue a woman that has those features regardless of race. That is why black men are seen as attractive and they are viewed as more masculine because they date different races of women if they are attracted to her. It is white men who if u ask what do u like physically about a woman and they may say thin, tall,etc. if u show them a woman like that who is not Asian or white they reject it and then go on about facial features and the distance from eyes to ears. If u ask a black man they might say curvy, full lips, big bottom. If u show them a woman who looks like that whether she black, white,latino, etc they will say she is attractive. That is the way human nature is supposed to be,but a lot of white ppl go against nature to uphold their white supremacy.
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@ Trojan Pam
IR created a generational rift in my family as well. My great-grandmother was White and had my “half-black” grandfather, but she HATED my dark-skinned Black grandmother. However, she favored the spouses of her other children, many of whom married light-skinned people. Even those she died in the 1960s, colorism can be problematic in our family at times. Some relatives have asked my mother why I am so dark. But her whiteness is praised despite everyone knowing that she was no good.
And other non-white people have been literally wiped out upon being forced to have sex with whites. Those who don’t believe me should look it up.
Perhaps that’s why colorism is so insidious in our community. When you have a group of people who are family but don’t look alike, there’s gonna be tension when some are seen as better than others. I think that’s why Whites can be so unified despite their internal tension. They look very similar to each other and understand that they can only carry on their legacy by having children who look like them. You can’t have a White “race” without having White people.
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@ Why
who said “And black people turned up in droves to see both of these films. The only way to stop black people from portraying other black people as sociopaths in their “art” is to vote with your dollars.
—
I overlooked this part of your response and I wholeheartedly agree
as a sign of SELF-RESPECT, black people must start voting against films like Precious and Monster’s Ball and The Help and The Butler and all movies and tV shows that show our HUMANITY as DEFORMED
it’s time to VOTE with our dollars and stop rewarding racist films and TV shows and music that calls us B*tches and “h*os” and “n*ggas”
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I’m trying to put the pieces together of why white men castrated black men and took their penis for a souveneir and raped black women. I know it was to scare ppl and create fear but I feel like it is something more to it. Maybe they were jealous of black men because of their manhood and his woman. Maybe by lynching and castrating black men it was their way of eliminating competition and possessing his manhood. a souveneir was their way of possessing the manhood they envied but weren’t born with. if some black men date white women as a way to feel like a white man then it wouldn’t be a stretch to think by castrating black men and raping black women was their way of feeling like a black man. we have feminine and masculine energy, so by castrating black men that takes away their masculinity and raping black women took away femininity, they took possession of both maybe they felt like they lacked it. The thing I wonder is what did they do with the black mans manhood after they took it, did they hang it up somewhere as a trophy, did their wife know about it, or was it their secret, did they pleasure themselves with it. what straight man does that to another man, we see it happening today, I see vids of white males hitting each other in the nuts and such.
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Some IR marriages work. Some do not. I don’t think anyone can make generalized statements about IR marriage based on anecdotes. Whether a marriage works or not is really only the concern of the two people involved. I couldn’t care less who people marry or for what reasons. If the people are married for the “wrong” reasons that’s their cross to bear, not mine.
People have always married or otherwise committed to each other under far worse circumstances than currently exist in the US. There were German women married to Jews during WW2; blacks and whites living together or married during slavery/segregation and yes there are even a few Jews and Palestinians married today. The personal is most definitely not always the political. It is quite possible for a person to have a disdain for a group yet make exceptions for an individual member of that group. People belong to themselves first and foremost, not the community.
Just because someone marries or dates interracially doesn’t make them anti-racist. The reverse is also true. Just because someone has a preference for their own race’s looks doesn’t make them racist. People do things for a myriad of reasons that aren’t necessarily easily reduced to “self-hate” or “self-love” or “racism”. AFAIK Robert DeNiro has only been married to or had children with black women. Does that mean he hates white women, hates his whiteness or has been brainwashed. I don’t think so. People like what they like.
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To Peanut, TrojanPam, Gina, MsToogood4yall, et. al,
A sista scholar has done research on the hateful attitudes of white men toward Black women. Her name is Brittany C. Slatton. Here’s an excerpt from the still unpublished book, Mythologizing Black Women:
A Body That Does Not Compare
How White Men Define Black Female Beauty in the Era of Colorblindness
By BRITTANY C. SLATTON
“Just the term ‘black women’ conjures up thoughts of an overweight, dark-skinned, loud, poorly educated person with gold teeth yelling at somebody in public. I hope that doesn’t make me racist but honestly that’s the 1st thing I think of.”- Lee, middle class white male in his 30’s, from Florida
[1] In this quote Lee provides a highly racialized, gendered, and classed view of black women. Lee is a middle class white male with no black female friends, rare interactions with black families growing up, and who states his interactions with black women only consist of work-related experiences. Yet, he expresses strong negative views of black women as unattractive and uneducated as the first thoughts that come to his mind. This quote by Lee and several other white male respondents in this essay dispute notions that only a few highly identifiable, old, deep-south bigots hold strong deep seated racialized views of black women. These expressions by white male respondents are indicative of the consistent exclusion of black women as relationship partners by white men, and representative of a powerful mental processing at play that goes beyond the limited language of stereotype.
[2] Census data reveals that black women have the lowest interracial marriage rate of all women except white women and the interracial marriage rate of black women and white men has modestly increased from 1% in 1970 to 4.1% in 2000 (Lee and Edmonston 2005). Research also shows that black women are overwhelmingly excluded as interracial dating partners, with one study showing that white men excluded black women as dating options at 93% (Feliciano, Robnett, and Komaie 2008). Census data and interracial dating studies show a longstanding persistent trend of black women as an excluded heterosexual relationship partner for white men (and other men of color) (Quian and Litcher 2007; Phua and Koffman 2003; Yancey 2007). These trends exist in a society that today prides itself on colorblindness. Current research studies on interracial marriage decisions and the current hegemonic race discourse often leads one to believe that racism exists only within the hearts of a few bigots and that race encompasses a greatly diminished role in interracial relationship decisions (Rosenfeld 2005; Yancey and Yancey 1998). Quantitative polls that measure racial attitudes of whites today show a marked decrease in racial hostilities, however, these polls do not account for the complexities of frontstage and backstage racism, whereby whites manipulate racial performances for the settings that they are in (Picca and Feagin 2007). Research by Pica and Feagin (2007) shows that when in frontstage settings around people of color or in social settings where racism is politically incorrect, whites are more likely to engage in racial performances of colorblindness, however, when in backstage settings around other whites, these same whites are likely to express or engage racially discriminatory thoughts and behaviors.
[3] To understand the phenomenon of black women’s consistent exclusion as relationship partners for white men, a critical theoretical assessment must be undertaken that debunks notions of colorblindness and imperatively places race, intersected with gender, and class as the focal point. Hence, this essay critically examines the integral role of race, gender, and class in the consistent exclusion of black women as relationship partners for white men. Historically, dominant and influential white men have constructed black female bodies in raced, gendered, and classed terms. This construction of black female bodies has been that of sexual licentiousness, natural immorality, disease, animalism, prostitution, and masculinity; the opposite of hegemonic, white, femininity (Collins 2005; Hammonds 1997; Jones and Shorter-Gooden 2003; St. Jean and Feagin 1998). Black women, in the past and today, are considered everything that a white woman is not in terms of beauty, sexual morality, femininity, and womanhood. This global overarching construction of black female bodies has persisted throughout society through pervasive raced, sexed, and classed dominant narratives and visual discourses, including controlling images or myths, such as the jezebel, sapphire, matriarch, mammy, and modern mammy. The construction of black female bodies and the classed and gendered construction of whites (as well as other racial groups) have come to represent hegemonic edifices. Due to elite white men’s power to construct and control reality in such a way that it best maintains white domination and power and the general subordination of other groups, whites have effectively framed the ways in which everyday whites and people in general come to know, see, and understand black women (and society in general) in raced, gendered, and classed ways. This long standing historically constructed “knowledge” of black women has become embedded in the deep frame of many contemporary white men. A deep frame represents our deep world view and mental infrastructure of our mind (Lakoff 2006), which consists of cognition, knowledge, emotions (Feagin 2009), and discourse used to make sense of our everyday world. The social construction of black female bodies as the abject opposite of white women is an integral component of the deep frame of whites (as well as people of color), along with other racialized, gendered, and classed elements. This is the knowledge base that informs contemporary white men’s perceptions of black women.
[4] I critically examined the deep frame of contemporary white men utilizing open-ended, online self-administered questionnaires. One hundred and thirty-four white males, ranging from the age of 18 to over 50 and representing 38 states, completed this in-depth online questionnaire. Forty-four percent of the respondents represent the Southern region, 20% the Northeast, 24% the Midwest, and 12% the Western region. Respondents tended to be educated and middle class as 42% of respondents possess some college education, 30% a bachelor’s degree, and over 48% of respondents are middle class.
[5] A central aspect of this study was to ensure that white men would share their honest and open thoughts about black women. Due to the framework of this study, including the sensitive subject area, the research technique best called for the use of online open-ended questionnaires as opposed to the traditional qualitative technique of face-to-face interviews or the use of phone interviews. By using a self-administered online questionnaire, I am able to eliminate the bias that I cause as a black female researcher asking white men questions on their views of black women in a face-to-face format. Respondents may be more likely to “exhibit social desirability bias,” or to provide responses that they believe are socially desirable as opposed to their honest thoughts, if interviewed by myself or even other researchers. Research shows that discussing sensitive subjects, such as race, drug abuse, or sexual behavior could lead to socially desirable responses, however, removing the interviewer and using self-administered questionnaires lessons the likelihood of this social desirability bias (Kellner 2004; Sudman and Bradburn 1982). In light of the United States racial history and present and the ideological shift towards “colorblindness,” white male respondents may be unlikely to disclose strong racial views, thoughts, or behaviors in a face-to-face interview with a black female researcher. White male respondents may also be unwilling to share their honest racial thoughts with a white male interviewer that they perceive as having dissimilar views. In short, most people in society, particularly whites, do not want to be perceived as racists. The internet; however, acts as a backstage setting, allowing white men privacy to reveal their deep frame of black women, including emotions, thoughts, and perceptions, without fear of reprimand.
FINDINGS
DISCOURSE OF RACIAL COMPARISONS: MEETING THE NORMATIVE WHITE STANDARD
[6] Entrenched within the deep frame is the construction of whites and blacks as abject hierarchical polarities, with whites afforded positive imagery and blacks negative. Moreover, embedded within the deep frame is the normalization of whiteness, or the white norm. Crenshaw (1995:115) states that the white norm is an “unspoken form as a statement of the positive social norm, legitimating the continuing domination of those who do not meet it.” Whiteness, as it functions to wield power and maintain domination, is made invisible and is deracialized because it has been solidly built into the definition of what normality is in society. Whites have essentially “‘coloniz[ed]’ the definition of normal” (Haymes 1995:111) and have explicated difference, or opposition to this norm, as blackness. According to Foucault (1977) normalization is an instrument of power and plays a role in classification and hierarchization. Thus, the normative standard of whiteness continually inscribes white as the ideal entity, as innate superiority, and maintains white privileges and domination, yet in a more tacit fashion than in the Jim Crow era.
[7] The social construction of whiteness as normality, as the obligatory standard, is central to how whites have framed society in racialized, gendered, and classed ways. The ways in which many whites see, understand, and analyze society and the people in it is rooted in an understanding and interpretation of society as defined by whites. Thus, white men’s deep frame understanding of beauty, skin color, body features, facial features, and culture is from a perspective that is white defined and that privileges what whites have characterized as the epitome of beauty, desirability, and rightness.
[8] In this essay, I analyze the dominant discourse of whiteness as normality that white male respondents expressed in this study. Several white male respondents’ placed certain facial and body features as the most desirable attributes; however, these attributes often have a white norm. The white male respondents employed what I refer to as a discourse of racial comparisons. When sharing their thoughts on black women as attractive or as possible partners, they compared black women dyadically to the white normative standard embedded in their deep frame, and judged black women’s beauty based on their ability or inability to meet this standard. Those black women most capable of meeting the white norm―in body, facial features, skin color, hair and culture―were often considered the most desirable by respondents, whereas black women unable to meet these comparison standards were perceived as less desirable. Some respondents reprimanded black women to strive for this norm, while certain others viewed black women as genetically incapable of meeting the white standard. The white norm was expressed explicitly by some respondents at times, such as white male respondents’ expressing an interest in those black women who “act white” or “look white.” Whereas in other responses, whiteness as normality was unspoken or tacit; for example, black women’s bodies or features were described as abnormal. In analyzing and interpreting the responses and in understanding the dyadic and hierarchical nature of how western thought has been constructed, it is readily clear that what goes unspoken as normal is whiteness.
[9] In most occasions, when white male respondents engaged in a discourse of racial comparison, they used a white woman standard embedded in their deep frame. However, at times Latina and Asian American women were used to represent this norm as well, as these groups are seen as being closer to the white standard than blacks. Research shows that often Latinos/Latinas and Asian Americans are placed, by whites, above blacks and closer to whites along the raced, gendered, and classed white-to-black continuum (Feagin 2000). According to Bonilla-Silva (2004), certain Latina/Latinos and Asian Americans are afforded by whites an honorary white status, as they are seen as having certain attributes that fall in line with white norms. However, this classification is tenuous and always subject to change. It is important to note, that embedded in the deep frame of many whites is not only the knowledge domain of white superiority to blacks, but also that other racial groups of color, including Latina/Latinos, Asian Americans, and Native Americans, are superior to blacks. Ultimately, whites place blacks the furthest away from the white ideal.
ATTRACTION TO “BROWN-SKINNED WHITE WOMEN”
10] Around 54% of white male respondents described themselves as physically attracted to black women, while 46% described themselves as either rarely attracted to black women or not attracted to black women at all. Interestingly, respondents from the southern region described themselves as attracted or rarely attracted to black women at virtually the same percentage (55% and 45% respectively) as the overall research sample. It is important to note, that while southern respondents were attracted to black women at a similar rate as other regions, respondents from certain southern states, such as Texas and Tennessee, were generally more likely to engage in racially inflammatory language and less likely to use colorblind discourse. This finding is representative of the historical differences in racial discourse and interactions across regions.
[11] Those respondents that described themselves as rarely attracted or having no physical attraction to black women were most likely to define that lack of attraction to black women in the following language: “coarse” or “nappy” hair; “black” facial features, “big lips” and “wide noses”; dark skin; and “larger” and “disproportionate” body shapes. Those respondents that described themselves as attracted to black women stated that they were most attracted to black women’s eyes, lips, and skin tone. However, some of the respondents that described themselves as attracted to black women stated that they were not attracted to black women with kinky hair, wide noses, and large body shapes, and some had preferences for black women with light skin and straight hair. While there were some respondents that attempted to use “colorblind” language in describing physical attraction to black women, stating they found the same things physically attractive in black women as they did in white women and/or that they “see no color” when it comes to physical attraction or interest in women, it is important to critically analyze this. As the research discussed earlier shows, black women are overwhelmingly excluded as dating and marriage options by white men; thus, despite the profession by some white men of “colorblindness,” the material reality shows that something else is in play.
[12] Respondents that found black women unattractive or that were rarely attracted to black women, and even some of those that found black women attractive, rooted that opinion in those traits defined as “black” traits, such as dark skin, kinky hair texture, and full facial features. Even those respondents that described themselves as attracted to black women limited that attraction to those black women with more “white” facial features and hair texture, thus invoking a discourse of racial comparison in which whiteness is the standard black women’s beauty is judged against. Gilbert, a lower middle class Coloradoan in his 30s, described himself as attracted to black women, but a particular type: “I am attracted to black women that fit my ideal petite body type, and ones who are lighter skinned.” His expression of being attracted to black women who are of a lighter skin color elicits the long-heralded notion that black is only beautiful when it is synonymous with a multiracial identity. Dillon, an upper middle class Texan over 50, was more direct, stating, “I do find some black [women] attractive, but they tend to have more white physical features and are polished (good grooming, dress, athletic, professional). Alicia Keys comes to mind.” Dillon specifically stated that possession of “white” features are what he believes make black women attractive, and like many other respondents, offered Alicia Keys, who is multiracial black and white, as the ideal black woman.
[13] Ross, a middle class white male in his 40s, also from Texas, offered a similar standard of attraction to black women.
Sexual attraction for me is a combination of physical and personal attributes. If I find a ‘black’ woman attractive, it is because their hair type and facial features are more representative of the [C]aucasian race. If that aspect is attractive, then their speech and intelligence level would have to be more representative of that found more prevalent in other races (such as [C]aucasian or [A]sian – i.e.: anthropological mongoloids.
This respondent, like many others, viewed black women who have “white” physical traits as the only black women he is attracted to. His response echoes a long historical message that only black women who look like “white women” can truly be attractive. Thus, he causally made the connection between whiteness and beauty. Furthermore, he makes a causal connection between whiteness and intelligence. Despite admitting to having no close black female friends and few personal interactions with black women, outside of work and church acquaintances, he places whites and Asian Americans as naturally more intelligent than blacks, with his assumption that intelligence is not as prevalent in blacks.
[14] These respondents espoused white traits in black women as more beautiful, thus alluding to a multiracial black woman as the most desirable. Indeed, there has been a long history of presenting black women with a multiracial background of white ancestry, formerly referred to as the derogatory term mulatto, as the ideal black women. During slavery, mulattos and quadroons, the products of nonconsensual sexual relations between enslaved black women and white slave owners (as well as overseers), were heavily sought after and paid handsomely for by white slave masters. According to one slave trader, he would not sell a mulatto child while she was young because he believed she could be of much greater worth to him when older, as a “fancy piece”: “She was a beauty – a picture – a doll – one of the regular bloods – none of your thick-lipped, bullet-headed, cotton-picking niggers…” (Northup1855:87). Although both multiracial and all black women were enslaved and divested of rights, by this quote it is clear that there was a distinction between the “beauty” and “worth” of blacks who were imbued with a white racial background versus the perceived “ugliness” of those blacks who were not.
[15] Maxine Leeds Craig (2002) in her work Ain’t I A Beauty Queen: Black Women, Beauty, and the Politics of Race traces the long historical trend of offering multiracial women up as the “ideal type” black women. For example, in the early 1900s, the ideal black woman was of Egyptian type. According to the New York Age, this woman was defined as having:
A well balanced and symmetrical head, full slender neck, the features clear cut, with the appearance of being chiseled rather than cast;…a fine Negro nose with a trace of the Egyptian and a slight aquiline curve; the mouth fairly small but well proportioned and a slightly pointed, round, firm chin…the marvelously fine curving eyelash of which the Negro race can be justly proud (Pp.49-50).
Craig (2002:49) notes that this “ideal” black woman in the description above is of “mixed racial heritage” and although hair type and skin color were not explicitly stated, the desire for long hair and light skin was “so firmly established” that it “went without saying.” But most important here is that this quote is representative of the continuous use of multi-racial women as the “ideal representative” of the entire black race. This is an aesthetic that is unachievable for most black women yet is supposed to be a symbol of her “finest expression” (Craig 2002:49), that of a white racial heritage.
[16] Davis, a lower middle class white male from Idaho and in his 20s, extended this notion of the multiracial black woman. He described what he believes an attractive black woman to be:
There are some black women who are attractive. And they aren’t full black. The only black women I find attractive are a mix of black and [E]uropean, black and [L]atino, or black and [A]sian. They end up with the tan complexion, and hair that doesn’t look frizzled or like a brillo pad.
Davis cited the racial hierarchy in his comments, ranking attraction as first Europeans, then Latinos, and then Asian Americans. Davis classified only mixed-race black women as attractive. Another respondent, Brock, a lower middle class Nebraskan in his 30s, also categorized mixing with other racial groups, besides whites, as ideal. This respondent, who claimed to have many personal interactions with black women, including sexual relationships, stated that “attractive black women tend to be slender with straighter hair and [A]sian-esque features…” For both Davis and Brock, “blackness” must always be “watered down” with other racial groups in order for a black woman to be considered remotely attractive. Consider here the deep frame by which the white normative standard is so firmly entrenched, as black women are only beautiful based on their ability to look like “brown white women” or to appear least black as possible. This reflects the placement of black women at the bottom of the race and gender hierarchy in the deep frame of many whites (as well as some people of color).
THE MORE “BLACK” THE MORE MASCULINE
[17] Whites have constructed black features, including body shape, facial features, and hair, as the dyadic opposite of white features, a central component of the deep frame. Dating back to early European travelers in various African nations, whites have defined what they perceived as black features in negative terms. Because femininity is heavily rooted in women’s physical body, what is defined as a beautiful body becomes the mark of femininity, and what is defined as a beautiful body is rooted in a white woman norm (Collins 2005). The construction of black or too-black features as being “ugly” most significantly affects black women because being black, or as close to the spectrum of (white-defined) blackness as possible, effectively locks black women outside of the definition of beauty, and thus outside of the confines of hegemonic femininity. This construction of beauty is firmly grounded in the racialized and gendered deep frame that whites (and many people of color) see, understand, and make interpretations from. Despite what many may perceive as changes in the overarching notions of beauty, meaning the acceptance of some black women, such as Beyonce, as beauty icons, these changes are often surface level and have not uprooted the deep notions of black beauty as “at best less beautiful and at worst, ugly” (Collins 2005:194) in the minds of whites (and some people of color). Thus, when asked about physical and sexual attraction to black women, their deep frame which places the “blackness” of black women outside of hegemonic beauty and femininity surfaced for many white male respondents. Consider Bob, a middle class respondent from Missouri over the age of 50. He stated:
I think black women’s features are too extreme; they are too dark, and they usually are much too large for my tastes. The black women I have know[n] are very aggressive and have terrible attitudes…The only black women I have found even marginally attractive are smaller, lighter-skinned black women with nice rear ends. ala Beyonce.
In contrast, Bob stated that he is most attracted to white women: “I think that white women’s features are softer, yet more defined. I just think they are more attractive than women of other races.” He described white women as “intelligent, beautiful and confident,” in contrast he described black women, in several sections of his questionnaire, as “very fat” and “very black” and attributed a host of other negative characteristics to them, such as “bad attitude,” despite admittedly having very limited personal interactions and experiences with black women.
[18] James, an older, college-educated respondent from Arkansas, who has had some personal experiences with black women, echoed Bob. When asked about his attraction to black women, he stated the following: “Do not find attractive – facial features, hair, skin. Occasionally a black woman whose black features are less prominent will be attractive, but rarely. Most of the black women I find attractive…are of mixed ethnicity and appear more white than black.” For James, as with many white male respondents, the less “black” black women look, the more attractive they become. Levi, a white male in his 20s from Tennessee explained what he finds unattractive about black women:
…I’m not attracted to dark skin. Not attracted to the stereotypical hair or sometimes greasy looking hair and skin that i have seen enough on black women to associate with them. i wouldnt like it on other races either, but i tend not to notice it on them. [S]ome ethnic hairstyles [I] do not find flattering. [B]ut to each their own maybe some other guy finds it attractive.
Levi, who has had rare personal interactions with black women, expressed that he is also not attracted to features associated with blackness, including skin color and hair. He noted that he tends to specifically notice this on black women and not other racial groups, which is not necessarily surprising as there tends to be a preoccupation among whites with blacks, more so than with other racial and ethnic groups. Throughout his questionnaire, he noted that friends and family would not be “thrilled” with him dating black women and that he feels social pressure from friends to not date black women, stating that this is not out of hate on his friends’ behalf but “mostly out of fear of being a pariah in the white community…” When asked what would need to change for more white men to marry black women, he stated, “Social pressure can dissipate, but being attracted to black women can’t change.” Thus, he seems to provide as a fact that although social pressure from friends and family may quell down, white men will generally never be attracted to black women, particularly black women with black traits. The important thing to realize here is that often what white men view as attractive and unattractive is rooted in how society has been socially constructed in racialized, gendered, and classed terms, a construction that privileges whites and makes it seem generally natural that blackness, such as black facial features, dark skin, or hair texture, is unattractive.
[19] Another respondent, Dan, an older, working-class male from the Midwest plainly articulated one of the most racialized and gendered components of the construction of black female bodies when he expressed, “I tend to read African features as somewhat masculine. The ‘blacker’ the person, the less femininity I tend to see.” Whereas the other respondents alluded to black or too-black features as being a negative “extreme” that incites unattractiveness, Dan articulated that perceived unattractiveness as a sign of masculinity. Dan’s assertion of black features on black women as masculine is rooted in the deeply racialized and gendered framing of society in which embodied in the construction of the black female body is the firm denial of black women from hegemonic femininity, beauty, and womanhood. As is evident in Dan’s quote, he operates out of the dominant discourse relevant to the overarching deep frame that inscribes black women as masculinized.
[20] A recent study by Goff, Thomas, and Jackson (2008) that analyzes how personal perception of attractiveness is affected by intersecting gender and racial identities, finds expansive data that reveals how whites (and other racial groups) connect blackness with masculinity. In this study, a large sample of college students, predominantly white (82%) and male (72%), were shown several head shots of black women, black men, white women, and white men for a period of five seconds and then asked to judge the pictures in terms of perceived masculinity, femininity, and attractiveness, among other factors. Important findings of the study are that the predominantly white participants perceived black faces as more masculine than white faces, that participants had greater accuracy in guessing the gender of black men as opposed to black women, and white women as opposed to black women, and that participants perceived black men as slightly more attractive than white men and white women as more attractive than black women. Thus, the participants’ perceived of black women (in the pictures) as being men and of black women as less attractive than both black men and white women. The authors show the historical construction of blackness as masculine, as both black men and women were perceived as more masculine than white women and men, and black women were rated as “less attractive” based on their perceived masculinity according to the respondents. This study shows how deeply the notion of black women as masculine is `rooted in the racialized and gendered deep frame of whites. According to Lakoff (2006), the frame is often used unconsciously, without people knowing it. The notion of blackness (black woman) as masculine is deeply ingrained in the white mind, via their deep frame; thus, for the respondent Dan, “blackness” or the “blacker” a person is, automatically activated his deep frame that tells him exactly what blackness is defined to be―masculine―irrespective of or respective to gender.
[21] It is also important to note that the construction of black female bodies as the opposite of femininity, in the deep frame, was not just for the purposes of defining the black female body as masculine for the economic benefit of slavery, because the “strong” bodies of black women could work the fields and bear children. Black female bodies were also constructed as the opposite of femininity so that black women would not be a legitimate source of competition for white women, because as masculine, a black woman is not a worthy and legitimate partner for a white man (or even a black man, for that matter). She can be desired behind closed doors by white men or experience rare circumstances of outward affection by white men, but in an open and legitimate sense, she is not an acknowledged body of competition to white women because she has been constructed as a body that does not compare.
The Black Sexual Body
[22] Black women’s physical and sexual body parts, particularly the buttocks and vagina, were a subject of complex thoughts among white male participants. As with facial features white men engaged a discourse of racial comparison, whereby a white standard was directly or indirectly expressed in their thoughts on physical and sexual attraction to black women. White men’s discourse on black women’s buttocks represented the buttocks as simultaneously a site of sexual/physical attraction and a site of condemnation. Drake, who is in his 20s and resides in Nevada, discussed his attraction for black women with a larger buttock:
I am sexually attracted to most all women, but black women have a certain ‘exotic’ look to them, and I like that. Specifically, I really love black women with bubble butts and nice legs, and who are fit.
This respondent, who was currently dating a black woman at the time of the study, described himself as mostly attracted to non-white women, stating that he is “…attracted to black and Latina women. They have beautiful skin and eyes. I also love that they have a generally fuller figure and more voluptuous. I like a nice bubble butt.” Drake defined black women as “exotic,” which may play a role in increasing or exciting his attraction level to black women, with black women’s buttocks being the height of that perceived exoticness. Black women’s “butts,” historically, have been an integral component in defining black women as an “exotic,” sexual body. Another respondent, Doug, a white male in his 20s who resides in Vermont, stated, “…I like big butts. In high school I read (and looked at) King magazine, which is like Maxim but for a black audience, and all the models have really big butts.”
[23] Black women’s butts have long been a “sign” of white-defined black sexuality, with the “protruding” black butt representing “primitive,” “raw,” “uncivilized” and “heightened” sexuality (Collins 2005; hooks 1992), one that was historically denigrated and pathologized. In today’s commodity culture, the black butt has been re-commoditized and is now popularized and more acceptable in mainstream white society. White men in contemporary times can now more openly express their desire for full, black butts, and those white women (as well as women of other racial and ethnic groups) who do not possess a full behind can now attempt to recreate or emulate black women’s butts through special clothing, fat injections, and other types of “booty-enhancing” techniques. Clothing companies financially capitalize on this new desire for the protruding black butt. Victoria Secret’s creation of “uplift” jeans, which include a “built-in back panel” that “lifts” the buttocks up “from the inside, yet is completely invisible from the outside” (Victoria’s Secret 2008: 28), is an example of this economic end. Thus, black women’s butts have entered mainstream white society as more acceptable, have been appropriated by whites as a symbol of “beauty,” and represent (as in the past) an economically rewarding commodity, one that white women and white men can now openly claim as desirable.
[24] Nonetheless, the desirability of black women’s butts comes with exceptions and stipulations, as so defined by whites, as we shall see with the respondents of this study. Not all white men have accepted the beauty of the black butt; for some it is too visible a sign or a reminder of blackness. Additionally, there are stipulations for black women’s butts. In order to be acceptable, the butt must be white-defined proportional; if not, it can be considered pathological, as it was during the days of Saartjie Baartman. Consider Morris, a middle class male in his 40s who resides in New Jersey; he stated, “Black women tend to have larger hips and butts, which is often a turn-off for me. I like a girl’s ass but not a big one. Sorry. I know lots of guys do.” While Morris was considerably tame in his response, others were not. Jean, a college-educated respondent in his 40s residing in Delaware, described black women’s butts as “[h]uge, sloppy asses.” Another respondent, 20-year-old Quincy, an Ohioan, described his aversion to black women’s butts in this way: “Ghetto booty, no thank you.”
[25] Several white males expressed similar views by characterizing black women’s butt’s, “curves,” and bodies as being out of proportion and indicating that they find black women with “disproportionate” butts and shapes unattractive. Raymond, a 40-year-old respondent from Louisiana, stated that “[s]ome black women have excellent figures that are well proportioned, but not most.” Jay, a North Carolinian in his 20s, expressed that he finds “…most things about black women attractive, except for…a disproportionate ‘rear end.’” Similarly, James, mentioned earlier in the section during the discussion of white traits, declared that what he finds unattractive about black women, along with facial features, hair and skin texture, is that black women’s “rear ends are too large and out of proportion.” Providing his take on a proportional buttocks and black women, Nelson, a middle class male in his 20s from Idaho, shared what he ideally looks for in women:
White in ethnicity, tan in complexion. Between 5’3 and 5’7 105 to 140 lbs. Hair color isn’t really that important, although blonde is preferable. Breast and ass should be well proportioned to the rest of the body. Long hair is good. And blue or green or grey eyes.
When asked if he could find his ideal woman in black women, he stated:
…I have yet to meet a black woman who is well proportioned and has a good personality. And for the most part, they don’t have blue green or grey eyes.
He later stated that “Beyonce has an ass that is well proportioned to the rest of her body. Alicia Keys is very petite with gorgeous eyes. That is about as far as it goes with me being sexually attracted to black women.” Similarly, Wallace, another respondent from Delaware, who is college educated, middle class and in his 40s, described himself as rarely attracted to black women, stating, “I think some normal weight black wom[e]n have nice above average breast and plump butts that [are] nice. Most black wom[e]n have fat butts and are ugly.”
[26] Black women’s butts have been constructed as a site of sexual attraction, as noted earlier, because the protruding size emphasizes sexual licentiousness, yet at the same time a spectacle and pathology. Thus, while on the one hand several white males find the “black butt” as attractive, both physically and sexually, others see it as a pathologized and racialized spectacle. Consider, for example, the white males’ descriptors of black women’s butts as too “fat,” “sloppy,” “ghetto,” and disproportionate. The historical creation of the “disease” steatopygia by white scientists, who analyzed the bodies and shapes of Saartjie Baartman and other African women, was used to define the “unnatural,” “protrusion” and “disproportionate” shape of the black buttocks as pathological, primitive, and sexually deviant (Gilman 1985). In this same vein today, the treatment of black women’s butts as disproportionate, by white male respondents, has a direct connection to the historical construction of black women’s butts as the bane of pathology by European scientists in the 1800s.
[27] Likewise, when black women’s genitalia were mentioned by white male respondents, it was most always described as appearing unnatural and deformed. Zack, who is in 20s and resides in the state of Nebraska, stated that he is not sexually attracted to a “[p]ink vagina but dark skin around.” Consider also Walter, a Coloradoan in his 30s, who provided a similar discourse: “[I] think their vagina is just not right looking, the black lips and the pink inside is just a total turn off.” Walter expressed not only his lack of attraction to black women’s vaginas but also the notion that the vagina of black women is “just not right looking,” essentially implying that the genitalia of black women is defected and abnormal. Extending this thought, Bob, a respondent mentioned earlier, who had an aversion to black women and described them as “very fat” and “very black,” stated, “…I do not like to see black women naked because of their dark breast[s] and the black vagina area looks disgusting.” Here again, black women’s sexual body parts are described as a site of repulsiveness, rooted in the notion of their perceived deformity.
[28] As with the buttocks, black women’s vaginas have long been a site of pathology, from a historical perspective. Along with the buttocks, it has been used to oppressively demark black women as primitive and as “evidence” that black women are innately inferior to whites. For example, the “Hottentot Apron” of Saartjie Baartman, which was a “hypertrophy” of the labia, caused by “manipulation of the genitalia,” was “diagnosed” by early European scientists of the 1800s as a symbol of primitiveness and disease (Gilman 1985:85). In the same vein of pathologizing black women through the genitalia, Edward Turnipseed in 1868 made the argument that the black woman’s hymen “is not in the entrance to the vagina, as in the white woman, but from one-and-a-half to two inches from its entrance in the interior.” Due to this believed “anatomical mark” of difference, Turnipseed deduced that “this may be one of the anatomical marks of the non-unity of the races” (Gilman 1985:89); hence, Turnipseed deduced that black women are not even the same species as whites. Although the demarcation of difference and pathology regarding black women’s genitalia may have changed over time from shape and formation in the 1800s to “color scheme” in 2010, it remains the same that black women’s vaginas are constructed dyadically to the genitalia of whites. Thus, white men’s deep frame of black women’s bodies consistently and continually frames anything akin to blackness as a deformity and pathology; while whiteness goes unquestioned as the normative standard.
OPPOSITIONAL DISCOURSE: BLACK WOMEN AS THE STANDARD
[29] In most instances, when a discourse of comparison was used by white male respondents, white women were the norm, or the standard, that black women were compared and judged against—their ability, or in most instances their inability, to meet this standard. In rarer circumstances, when a discourse of comparison was used by white males, black women were the standard, not white women, nor the achievement of a particular aesthetic akin to white women, such as fair skin, straight hair and aquiline features. Those respondents who engaged this oppositional discourse throughout the entirety of their questionnaire were more likely to have long-term dating relationships with black women, many personal interactions with them, and to choose black women or Latina women as the women they are most attracted to. For example, Reginald, a North Carolinian in his 20s, stated the following:
Some things about trying to fit in to the “mold”. I find that a black woman that accepts her beauty as a black woman, embracing her skin, hair, and form, is much more attractive than a black woman that tries to be a mass produced [B]eyonce. Women in the mainstream that are more appealing to me are singers [E]rykah badu and [I]ndia [A]rie, not the [B]eyonce prototypes. Black woman that learn to work with the incredible tools they have are much more attractive.
He went on to state, when asked about his physical attraction to black women:
…body shape, skin tone, physical strength and beauty. [T]hey project beauty and strength more than white women, whom [I] feel, project more indecisiveness and immaturity with decisions.
Reginald, who described himself as most attracted to Latina women and who had been dating a black woman for the last three years, said that he finds black women and the various attributes of black women more attractive than white women. For most other white male respondents, black women who were considered beautiful (and the only black women a few respondents found even “remotely attractive”) were the well-known singers Beyonce and Alicia Keys. Both Beyonce and Alicia Keys possess a white normative aesthetic; Beyonce has a light brown complexion and wears her hair long, straightened and blonde, while Alicia Keys, who is multi-racial with a white mother and black father, boasts the aesthetics of fair skin, long, naturally wavy hair, and aquiline features. Beyonce and Alicia Keys are placed in the mainstream media as two of the few representatives of “black beauty” (although they represent a multi-racial beauty), and one that black women should strive for. Reginald commented that he recognizes this particular “prototype” presented often in the mainstream media, yet in contrast to most other respondents, he appreciates black women who embrace their natural beauty and who do not manipulate it to appease white ideals. Similarly, Luke, a lower middle class Tennessean in his 30s, shared his views on black women’s beauty. When asked if he could find his ideal woman in black women, he stated:
Absolutely. African traits are some of the “best” in my book. I like black women, mixed heritage or not, who prefer locks, braids, or short hair to artificially straight hair. Also, full lips and dark skin are blessings to be proud of. I have to be honest here and say that women of African ancestry are often not lacking in the hips and “booty” either as many from other background sometimes are a bit….
When asked about what he finds physically attractive about black women, he said:
Do not: Like unnaturally straitened hair…. Do: Like very dark skin. Like kinky hair. LOVE locks on black women. Love African features such as full lips, strong frame, and beautiful dark eyes that pierce the soul.
Luke, who also described Latina women as the women he is most attracted to, stated that he has had many personal interactions with black women, including having several black female friends and dating two black women. He, too, said that he views black women’s natural beauty as preferable to manufactured beauty that meets the normative societal standard. He noted that black women should be proud of their natural features, commenting later in his questionnaire that black women should love themselves more. Unfortunately, accepting black beauty, for black women, is a difficult feat in a society subsumed by European beauty standards.
[30 It is important to make a critical note here, however. Although only a small number of respondents considered black features, hair textures and styles as the most beautiful, this could be another form of exotification. In this sense, black women may only be beautiful in terms of how “different” or “ethnic” they appear and the “exotic” contrast that they can provide to whiteness. However, by analyzing the entirety of these respondents’ questionnaires, it is hard to decipher if this was the case, as both Reginald and Luke do describe themselves as dating black women, being open to marrying black women, and surmising that it is likely that they will marry a black woman or a woman with “African ancestry” at some point in their lives.
[31] Outside of providing an oppositional discourse of comparison, there were also a few respondents that engaged impartial language throughout the entirety of their questionnaire and seemed to be genuinely open to black women and women of all racial backgrounds and did not uphold any particular standard of beauty, whether European or black. Larry, a working class white male in his 20s from Oklahoma, responded this way:
Black wom[e]n are unique in the fact that they are black women, but human is human. Attractiveness for me is not about race, but it is about personality and values. Be proud to be a black woman, but don’t think that it makes you more or less attractive, to some it may be this way but to some it is not this way.
Larry stated that, although he had rare interactions with blacks growing up and lived in neighborhoods with only a few black families, he has had many personal interactions with black women since adulthood and has dated one black woman, despite his family’s disapproval of the relationship. In terms of the interracial relationship he was in, he shared that his “…family is mostly racist, so sadly it was not taken well, but I let them know quick they were going to have to accept it.” He noted “less racism” as one of the factors needing to change in order for more white men and black women to marry.
CONCLUSION
[32] In this essay, the primary focus was to analyze, interpret, and problematize white male respondents’ physical and sexual attraction to black women. The analysis reveals how white male respondents view black women’s bodies from their racialized, gendered, and classed deep frame. For many of the respondents, it is simply common sense, or fact, that white women are more attractive than black women, that straight hair is better than “kinky” hair, that light or white skin is preferable to dark, that aquiline features are preferable to full, flat or wide features, and that black butts and body shapes are disproportionate. This essay also shows the complexity of the beauty standard. In contemporary society, fuller lips and fuller behinds are now more acceptable, and, in some instances, are considered beautiful. Despite this complexity, whites, through appropriation and commodification, can control which features of the “other” will be considered beautiful and more acceptable, yet never with fear that it will elevate the black woman’s beauty above their own. Of central importance is that the data in this essay illustrates how old notions of black women, constructed by the racialized observations and interpretations of early 16th and 17th century European travelers, scientists, and writers, are consistent elements in the deep frame or commonsense world view of white men today. Although a minority of respondents expressed an attraction to black women who were not “brown skinned white women” capable of meeting the white normative standard, this is atypical, as the integral power of the deep frame of white men often disciplines their thoughts, perceptions, emotions, and behaviors and thus disciplines what they define as beautiful.
APPENDIX
Questionnaire Guide
Thoughts and Opinions on Relationships with Black Women
Demographic Questions
Gender
Race
Highest level of education completed
Current household income
Job
Employment or school status
Religion
Ever been Engaged
Marital status
State
Age
Experiences with Black Community and Black Women
What is the racial makup of the neighborhoods you have lived in?
Growing up, how often did your family interact with black families?
Since adulthood, how many close black female friends do you have?
What type of personal interactions have you had with black women? Please explain
Attraction
The women that you are most attracted to are of which racial/ethnic group?
What do you find physically attractive about this racial/ethnic group?
What personality traits do you find attractive about the women of this racial/ethnic group?
Please describe your ideal woman in terms of personality and physical beauty:
Do you think you can easily find the traits of your ideal woman in black women? Please Explain
Attraction Continued:
Are you physically attracted to black women?
Please describe what you do or do not find physically attractive about black women?
Are you sexually attracted to black women?
Please describe what you do or do not find sexually attractive about black women?
Would you feel intimidated to approach a black woman you were attracted to? Please explain why or why not
Traits
Do you think there are any traits that predominantly represent black women? If yes, please explain
Do you think black women are more sexual than women of other racial groups? Please explain
Please share any thoughts or opinions about black women that you have not already shared:
Racial Traits
Do you think it is necessary for black women to have a strong racial identity today (Racial Identity: meaning strong connection to an African American heritage)? Please explain why or why not
Do you think you would be romantically interested in a black woman that had a strong racial identity? Please explain why or why not
Dating
Under what circumstances would you date black women? Please explain
Has anyone ever discouraged you from dating black women? If yes Please explain whom
Have you ever dated black women?
Dating No
What type of relationship would you be most likely to seek with a black woman?
For example: no relationship, short term dating, sexual relationship, long term relationship, other
Would You date Black Women?
If Yes: Do you think it is likely that you will date a black woman in your lifetime
If No: Please share why you would not date black women
Dating Yes
How many black woman have you dated?
For example: no relationship, short term dating, sexual relationship, long term relationship, other
What type of romantic relationships have you mostly had with black women?
For example: short term dating, sexual relationship, long term dating, long term dating that could lead to marriage, etc.
What type of romantic relationship would you like to have with black women?
For example: short term dating, sexual relationship, long term dating, long term dating that could lead to marriage
How did your family respond to you dating black women?
How did you meet the black woman(en) you have dated?
What were some of the traits that have interested you in the black woman(en) you have dated?
Have you ever been engaged to a black woman?
Have you ever been or are you currently married to a black woman?
Marriage-yes
How did you meet? Please Explain
How did your family respond to the marriage? Please Explain
Do you feel your marriage is accepted by society? Please Explain
Marriage
Would you marry a black woman?
If YES: Do you think it is likely that you will marry a black woman in your lifetime?
If NO: Please share why you would not marry a black woman:
Intermarriage
The intermarriage rate between black women and white men is very low. Why do you think the intermarriage rate is low between black women and white men?
What would discourage you from forming romantic relationships with black women? Please explain
What would need to change for more white men to marry black women?
WORKS CITED
Bonilla-Silva, Eduardo. 2004. “From Bi-Racial to Tri-Racial: Towards a New System of Racial Stratification in the USA.” Ethnic and Racial Studies. 27:931-950.
Collins, Patricia H. 2005. Black Sexual Politics: African Americans, Gender, and the New Racism. New York: Routledge.
Craig, Maxine L. 2002. Ain’t I a Beauty Queen?: Black Women, Beauty, and the Politics of Race. New York: Oxford University Press.
Crenshaw, Kimberle. 1995. “Race, Reform, and Retrenchment: Transformation and Legitimation in Antidiscrimination Law.” Pp. 103-126 in Critical Race Theory,edited by K. Crenshaw, N. Gotanda, G. Peller, and K. Thomas. New York: The New Press.
Davis, Kingsley. 1941. “Intermarriage in Caste Society.” American Anthropologist43:376-395.
Feagin, Joe R. 2000. Racist America: Roots, Current Realities, and Future Reparations. New York: Routledge.
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Hammonds, Evelyn M. 1997. “Toward a Genealogy of Black Female Sexuality: The Problematic of Silence.” Pp. 170-182 in Feminist Genealogies, Colonial Legacies, Democratic Futures, edited by M. Jacqui Alexander and C. Mohanty. New York: Routledge.
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Contributor’s Note
BRITTANY C. SLATTON earned her PhD from Texas A&M University, College Station, and is currently Assistant Professor of Sociology at Texas Southern University. Her work examines the intersection of race, gender, class, and sexuality. Currently, she is working on an interdisciplinary study on the intersectionality of masculinity and sexuality among men of color.
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Here’s the link to her research at:
http://www.genders.org/g56/g56_slatton.html
And, this gem here:
http://www.genders.org/g56/g56_slatton.html
Trigger Warning: The dissertation contains vulgar, hateful language from white men.
She must have been brave to do such research on the hateful attitudes of white men toward us Sistas.
Steph
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Has anyone noticed that Natural Black women are being pushed towards interracial relationships as well?
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@ phoebeprunelle
Yes I have.
What are your thoughts on this?
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@ Ms. J
I have thoughts about its symbolism
(and i may offend some Black ladies who wear their hair permed–believe me my intention is not to do so)…
I think that that Black women being natural is the way into the future…i see so MANY Black women returning to Blackness by understanding, demonstrating and teaching other Black women about natural hair care, styling, adornments and even the “old” ways of wearing head scarves (e.g. turbans and the likes!)…
what i am getting is that these are MOSTLY educated (college degrees), middle-class, and young (early 20s-40s) Black women…
I do believe that “A nation can rise no higher than its women”, so if Black women are returning “back” to that in which we came–naturally–in time– the Black men will follow suit–unless of course the media creates a diversion that “tells” Black women that the ONLY men who desire them naturally or will be more willing to accept her naturalness are non-Black men–particularly white men…
Do you follow me?
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@ phoebeprunelle
Yes, I have, too. A black male mentioned that on the COWS program
I think there are white males who want the “real thing” meaning, someone who looks authentically “black” — just like many white females prefer dark-skinned black males over light skinned black males
there are white people who have Black fetishes — which, for the RACIST white male and RACIST white female, it’s a form of BESTIALITY — which is why KING KONG movies have been such a hit that they have been made several times
I’m waiting for the sequel,
King Kong Meets Sex in the City
Another reason, which we talked about on C.O.W.S. program, was the INTENT of white supremacy as a SYSTEM is to neutralize ANY ATTEMPT by its victims to “find” themselves
the blond-weave-wearing black female has already been “captured” but the black female who wears her hair natural MAY be attempting to RESTORE herself to her ORIGINAL STATE
and what better way to SABOTAGE and NEUTRALIZE that potential RE-AWAKENING than to put her in the bed with a white male?
i don’t care what anyone says — what I have found is black females who have long-term relationships and/or marriages with white males almost ALWAYS become more SELF-HATING, more ANTI-BLACK, more WHITE-IDENTIFIED, and more CONFUSED
I have NOT seen ONE exception out of the women I have known.
NOT ONE
and they also GO DEEP IN DENIAL and often AVOID doing any serious thinking about racism/white supremacy and in my family, they are definitely being mistreated by racists but it’s like they CAN’T talk about it because they KNOW they have already MADE THEIR BEDS WITH A WHITE MAN IN IT
AND
possibly think that complaining about racism while married to a white person is too much of a CONTRADICTION
i find that black males don’t seem to have a problem complaining about racists or racism or racist white females EVEN WHILE MARRIED TO A WHITE FEMALE
which tells me that their CONFUSION is SO PROFOUND that they can’t even SEE or HEAR HOW (off the wall) they sound to complain about white people while they have a white female in their bed every night (!)
Unfortunately, many black females who wear their beautiful hair natural (I love the texture of healthy black hair!!) have found that some (not all) black males STiLL gravitate toward their longer and straighter haired sisters or toward non-black females
while white males sometimes find natural hair “exotic” (sic)
what can you do?
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@ phoebeprunelle
who said: “I do believe that “A nation can rise no higher than its women”, so if Black women are returning “back” to that in which we came–naturally–in time– the Black men will follow suit–unless of course the media creates a diversion that “tells” Black women that the ONLY men who desire them naturally or will be more willing to accept her naturalness are non-Black men–particularly white men,”
—
that was a very insightful analysis and one I agree with wholeheartedly
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@ Stephanie Baldwin
thanks for the links, I will add them to my collection
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@ all
I thought I’d share this since it crossed my mind
Author Otis Lawrence Graham, a black male who wrote the book, “Our Kind of People” — about the black elite
And he wrote “Member of the Club” where he posed as a black waiter in elite white social circles and exposed the racism that was an everyday event
both are definitely worth a read!
he said in one of his books, that more and more black males were bringing their white wives to these black organizational meetings where they were discussing black social issues and solutions
and the white female invariably would say something like,
“Why does it always have to be about this black stuff?”
THAT”S why I would NEVER align myself politically or socially with black people who engage in IR — I don’t dislike them, they in my family — but i keep it JUST on a need to know basis
I do NOT discuss any relevant social or “black” issues with them NOR do I seek their ADVICE because it is too tainted with CONFUSION and WHITE IDENTIFICATION
and I could NOT see allowing some black male (or black female) to introduce such a DISRUPTIVE element or person into a black social/political environment where black people are trying to solve problems that will help us progress and survive
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@ phoebeprunelle
Oh yes, I agree. I switch between my natural hair and braids, but I love to see so many Black women embracing the hair that the Creator gave to us. We can’t buy it at the store, but it is valuable and unique to us as a people.
I notice that a lot of Black women who are college educated do have difficulty finding Black males who can bring the same credentials to the relationship. At my college, most of the Black women I was friends with remained single their ENTIRE college years. I’m at an all-White college, so I’ve basically written off dating. There’s very few of us here, and most of the Black men who do date usually want to be with White women.
So I do feel like some of these women will end up with non-black men in effect. White men usually go for those type of Black women so long as they don’t about racism too much. And I’ve even been told by a Black woman in California that I would probably end up with a Mexican man before a Black men over there. I think the same could also be said for Black men. Some of our most talented are going to be transferred right back into the White community, as we’ve seen with celebrities.
In other instances, I’ve noticed that Black males from outside of the US prefer sisters with natural hair. And they really want to have a Black family with a female who’s got a good head on their shoulders. These men are also very accomplished financially and career-wise.
Overall, I just think that this whole notion that Black women are unattractive is just a myth. If we’re so unattractive and unappealing, then WHY does the media have to keep saying it over and over. It would just be obvious.
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@ phoebeprunelle
Yes I have noticed, the same way they try to push dark skinned women and men into interracial relationships, we hear the comments of some dark skinned women saying, with white men they don’t care if im dark it don’t make a difference to them they date dark or light skinned. . i’m transitioning to natural,and have noticed a lot more sistas doing so and am happy. imo the black men that don’t accept it are not black men i’d want anyway, and i’d know they are asleep and have self hate. it seems a lot of black men who do love natural hair are conscious black men and educated. I also notice non black hair product manufacturerers are now trying to market to natural black women. If we can buy from black businesses who make organic hair products for us then I think that is one way to win against the non blacks who make products for our hair and add all kinds of things to it. Yes it is time we as women do what we feel is right and if the men follow suit then good, if not then we see what kind of men we are dealing with.
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Alot of black men prefer (black) women with natural hair. I also see alot of couples where the woman is black and man is latino or asian or other where the woman has natural hair.
I also have never been in a situation where there were educated black women and black men were not present.
I say, date who you want. I find Latino and Asian men attractive but don’t relate to white men as the vast majority I find have “issues” and I don’t want to deal with that.
Also, dating white will more than likely mean having to be around white people for a lot of time and I have found that’s not for me. Life is too short to deal with drama, hate and so forth after work hours so most likely I will never date a white male.
The black woman/white male couples I have actually taken the time to pay attention to in public I notice the white male seems to have the same attitude as any ole white male. Even subtle things I don’t want to deal with.
Tie that with the fact that most men primarily are about sex and that many black women that go with white men end up being cheated on and divorce and I don’t get why some push us to be open to white men.
On another note, can anyone tell me why so many of our black men go with chubby/fat or other undesirable white women?
Two days ago I was at the mall and noticed this large women and what I recall is that as she closed her car door, her arms were massive and shaking ( cellulite) although she looked young. I get inside the store and a black man is behind her with his arms around her. I had to say to myself “dear god, why does this seem to be a pattern”?
I know, I know. It’s none of my business but I had to wonder. The white men I have found attractive in the past, well NONE of them have been fat. If I had a son I would want him to go with someone, well not what I see some black men go after when it comes to white women.
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The question though is WHY do White men and white people want black women to feel unwanted and maligned? That’s the question. Some have said to me that white men want black women to feel like ” no one wants us, but anyone can have us” and that they wish they could BREAK us!
hmmmm
RE:
Overall, I just think that this whole notion that Black women are unattractive is just a myth. If we’re so unattractive and unappealing, then WHY does the media have to keep saying it over and over. It would just be obvious.
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Trojan Pam writes:
“…however, more recently, white scientists have ADMITTED that whites are a HYBRID between MAN (African man) and NEANDERTHAL — which is a sort of ape-like half-humanoid (not being funny, just don’t know what to call it…”
– – –
‘Homo neanderthalensis’ — a subspecies of Homo sapiens…but certainly not “apelike half-humanoids”.
Chances are if any given person’s early ancestors wandered ancient Eurasia, then they too probably carry a small percentage of Neanderthal genes (and possibly Denosivan DNA also) In other words, it’s not only whites who are part Neanderthal, but also Asians (from all points), Indigenous Americans and individuals of mixed racial heritage, which includes many, if not most, New World ‘Blacks’.
It is only unmixed indigenous Africans whose early ancestors NEVER left Africa who are believed to be non-carriers of Neanderthal and Denosivan DNA (it’s theorized that no only did a number of early Homo sapiens sapiens leave Africa, some returned. These early returnees, if I recall correctly, may well have returned with a number of genetic mutations in tow, which in turn may account for some percentage of the variety of ‘indigenous’ African physical types we see today).
An autosomal DNA test will reveal the presence (or lack) of Neanderthal DNA in one’s genome, for those who want to be sure they are truly Neanderthal-free.
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Shady_Grady’s last post on the subject pretty much summarizes my feelings regarding interracial relationships.
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Hey, Linda! Thanks for the welcome back. I did miss my old internet hang out spot 🙂
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@ gina
I think a lot of it is colorstruck mentality, they are so happy to have a white woman on their arm even if she is unattractive. But I have also seen some black men with overweight women of all races. There are some men who are chubby chasers, but there are also some men who want a higher quality black woman but will lower their standards to be with a lower quality white woman. Sometimes it is hard to tell if they are chubby chasers or have self hate and just want any white woman.
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Here’s a perspective from Blaque Swan via RacismReview regarding Black women/White men:
Blaque Swan, previously No1KState says:
April 18, 2011 at 3:08 pm
@ ThirtyNine – You’re one of my favorite RR commenters, and I really appreciate your having my back of sorts with the “straw man” issue and all. So I’ll relate some personal knowledge, and maybe that’ll help?
Are black women willing to date white men? I can say unequivicolly, yes. Is that the preference? Unequivicolly, no. Have you seen the movie SOMETHING NEW with Sanaa Lathan and Simon Baker? They get at the reasons behind our hesitance very well. Since white man are the primary perpetrators of the US’s racist patriarchy, white men by and large are still viewed with suspicion. The way black woman conjures up all those negatives images for white men, as mentioned in the post, so does “white man” conjure up negative images for us. Don’t get me wrong, when it comes to a white male coworker or boss or salesman or cop, we can judge each guy on his own merits. But a white guy as a romantic partner? Uh, yeah, we don’t care to actually sleep with, or to put it better, we don’t care to bring that home with us. It’s one thing to put up with racialized sexism and sexualized racism outside our homes, but to actually bring that in the house? where we expect the most comfort and freedom? It’s not a brick wall, but it is a major mental hurdle to climb.
Also, there’s what we know of white men as it relates to dating and black women. One, you don’t find us marriage material; two, when white men do date us, it’s either as an exotic adventure or a sexual one, due to our being stereotyped as hyper-sexual. We really don’t expect to be “hit on” by a white guy. So they may have not realized you were seriously interested in dating.
And that’s assuming you didn’t approach them with some lame line like, “Did it hurt when you fell from heaven?”
Keep in mind, time, place, and day plays a part, too. Did you approach these women after five on a work day? When they’re still stressed from work and here comes the “coworker/boss/salesperson/cop” white man you represent who just pissed them off not a couple hours ago? Or, was it earlier in the day on the weekend when they were still in a morning time, “new day” mood? Were you out in Vanilla City, or did you meet them on their on turf? Besides, there’re times when women just don’t want to be hit on, and that’s all women.
Your lack of success has nothing to do with you personally. I actually think your race does play a part because of the meaning white skin carries with it. Whereas white men have limited experience with black women, we have tons of experience with you, the majority of which is not good. Even at it’s best, white skin still represents mainstream culture, a culture that negatively judges black culture, black women. Again, why bring judgment that “home?” “Home” is where I can speak black English. Will dating a white man change that?
So, it’s not that your race puts you off the team, so to speak, just farther down the bench. You’re in the “Big Dance,” just probably a really, very high seed. But mind you now, VCU and Butler were seeded 13 and 11 respectively, and they made it to the Final Four.
I hope that helps. If you’re interested, I have some other advice on meeting a black woman. I just didn’t want to make this comment twice as long as it already
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@ Fiamma: Welcome Back.
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Correction:
The is term is actually ‘DenISOvan’ and NOT ‘DenOSIvan’.
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Thank you Mary 🙂
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@ Fiamma
who said: ‘Homo neanderthalensis’ — a subspecies of Homo sapiens…but certainly not “apelike half-humanoids”.
—
You may be right, but one thing is clear to me, that there is DEFINITELY some intrinsic differences between “black” and “white people” that genetics ALONE cannot account for
Our natures are different, and that is EVIDENT by our collective behavior.
Nature has a strange way of differentiating humanity. For example, even though U.S. blacks certainly have a mixture of racial heritage, there still seems to be some tendency to LEAN in one direction VS another..
Just like in our bodies, even though a black person has a MIXTURE, the buttocks of black people — even light skinned black people — have a distinct shape that is generally NOT present in white people.
I believe that there are whites who may be less removed from their Neanderthal beginnings and some who are more removed based on how their ethnic “mix”
That being said, I believe NATURE may have a genetic CUT-OFF when it comes to TRANSFERRING CERTAIN so-called racial “traits” which may also determine a predisposition toward a certain mentality AND spirituality
because there is MORE than just skin color differences between blacks and whites and that is VERY MUCH A DIFFERENT SPIRITUAL MAKE-UP
So, having a MIXTURE alone does NOT explain the OBVIOUS differences between blacks collectively and whites collectively — in my opinion
The scientists who released this report on Europeans being a ‘hybrid’ — to my knowledge — did NOT acknowledging finding any Neanderthal genetic “traits” in Africans OR blacks. Maybe, that was part of their research that was not included in the report or the National Geographical special
Also, being a “hybrid” may explain the current dilemma of increasing white infertility rate AND that in most european countries the death rate is HIGHER than the birth rate
because hybrids eventually die out if they do not find a way to replenish their genetics
Of course we can disagree, as we certainly do when it comes to IR relationships for black people in a white supremacy system where we are being victimized by racism
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@ peanut
Good job on ur experiment, it shows what ppl on here have been saying about white men saying we are ugly via the media but will be trying to get with us on the down low. Craigslist has crazy ads, and white men make ads lookin for black men to have sex with as well, its all around disgusting. Black men and women are viewed as sex objects to these ppl. That is good u got less replies from black men imo it shows that they are not as sex crazed as everyone tries to make them out to be and not look at black women as just flings. I think men when on the internet will try to hook up with women who are not of their race and use them,but will court a woman of their race offline and look for long term relationship. it is just wrong to me that some ppl think it is ok to use someone just as long as it isn’t someone who looks like their mother, sister, etc.
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The divorce rates in the USA are high. However one demographic of couple has amongst the lowest divorce rates here;
Black wife-White husband
Contrast that to another demographic that has amongst the highest divorce rate;
White wife-Black husband
Any thoughts on why? I have a few but wanted to hear what others might think could be contributing factors.
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Trojan Pam, “however, more recently, white scientists have ADMITTED that whites are a HYBRID between MAN (African man) and NEANDERTHAL — which is a sort of ape-like half-humanoid (not being funny, just don’t know what to call it”
Not quite. More recently it has been “discovered” that ALL humans, excepting a small group of Sub-Saharan Africans are descendents of Neanderthal.
The people who are not would have to have no admixture with Neanderthal in their DNA for millenia, and their are only a few groups of Sub-Saharan Africans who have not.
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^ Are you saying that Sub-Saharan Africans are genetically inferior!!!!!???
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TrojanPam,
To clarify my previous post on Neanderthal DNA:
On a group level, it is only those present day UNMIXED Blacks / Africans whose Homo sapiens ancestors never left Africa who are the ones said to have no Neanderthal ancestry. [I’m not so sure that not carrying a particular gene is necessarily always an indicator that one has zero percentage of any given ancestry.]
So, if a given person is Black, and even “looks fully Black” (whatever that might mean), but happens to carry non-African derived genes (…from that Scots-Irish great grandma or ‘Blackfoot’ great-great-grandpa, perhaps? Regardless of whether it’s known or unknown ancestry, it really doesn’t matter), then there is a chance that he/she also carries Neanderthal DNA from that non-Black ancestor: we can like this fact or not like it, but, as far as I’m concerned, it is what it is.
[It was in part from the Nat Geo literature included with my autosomal DNA (aDNA) test kit, and also from info on their website, that I learned of the Neanderthal genes carried in Asians and Native Americans; I already knew this to be the case with Europeans / whites… and, realistically, with the mixed race descendants of whites.]
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Mstoogood4yall: “Peanut said expand ur horizions I just copied it and added somoan men lol”
Samoan men are hot but there are not nearly enough of them in this country. We all have to pick from the available pool.
Interesting theory about White mens’ obsession with Black male sexuality. I have long noticed it (on the internet at least), and have concluded the same.
Some of these racist white bloggers seethe with jealousy over seeing a white woman with a black man in public. One blogger said he even loses sleep over it when he sees it. But the jealousy they are seething with is not the kind assumes it to be.
Maybe Black men give off powerful pheromones or something that cause the latent homosexuality in these white guys to manifest and they don’t know how to deal with it or process it so they lash it in other ways.
I imagine if I were a “heterosexual” guy but saw a man who triggered same-sex attraction in me that was never triggered before, I’d be pretty surprised, shocked and taken aback myself.
I mean how would you deal with that?
There is a bizarre fascination with black male sexuality.
Its like the stereotype of the Black Male fits with their stereotype of the Alpha Male and comprises everything they love and hate about an alpha male.
They are attracted and repulsed at the same time.
Envy and admiration at the same time.
They want to be him and DO him, at the same time!
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King:
“Are you saying that Sub-Saharan Africans are genetically inferior!!!!!???”
No.
And that you would assume that betrays your lack of scientific knowledge.
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@mstoogood4yall
I have don’t know how the latin population reacted to JLO playing Selena, whether it was negative or positive.
And why was she rejected for acting a part that she doesn’t look much like? Because she wasn’t black, or perhaps I should say black enough.
You are right; its not like Biracials have been particularly loyal in the past, though some one did mention most of the big civil rights leaders were apparently biracial so maybe its a mixed bag there.
But at the end of the day; the mixed race know that they aren’t truly accepted, that black people and other PoC only accept them because they feel like they have to.
@TrojanPam
In the Palestine scenario…..I have no idea on one hand I could see them not being too happy, on the other hand he’s brought his bride into a literal war zone, if there was no true emotion there she wouldn’t be
risking her life just by being there and if she helps him out I suppose they would be willing to take any helping hand.
Technically speaking; we all descended from primates of one kind or another, at least thats the current theory.
And its all non-pure blood black people, technically only the purest of black people lack neanderthal DNA, asians, whites, mixed blacks etc….they all have it, so basically 95% of all humans at this point
probably more.
Interesting; from a racist perspective…..in King Kong, King Kong would represent black men and he gets killed by white men for daring to “date out”, actually it kind of works for symbolism, white men go
to an island of technologically more primitive people, kidnap an “individual” from there to force him to exist as a sideshow and perform tricks for them, essentially they enslave him, he ultimately breaks free and enacts his revenge while at the same time taking a “white woman”.
Did King Kong at the time represent some subconscious white fear? Was it tapping into the “Black Brute” stereotype?
Black and white people aren’t as different as you think; its one of the common things I’ve seen on the internet that black and white americans all act the same….to foreigners there is little or no difference between us.
There’s even a book that puts out the theory that a lot of the problems in the black community can be traced to interacting with the “rednecks” so to speak back in the day, kind of like how natives picked up raping
from white people more or less.
Birth rates drop as technology/economy goes up; white people reproduce less now than they did in the 1800’s for two basic reasons, economically well off and we have more to do.
@Ms J
One of the things that got mentioned was Terrance Howard apparently being drawn to racist white females due to self-hatred.
Perhaps thats whats happening here, for whatever reason its the racism itself that might be whats drawing some of these PoC to these specific white people.
Like people who go from one abusive relationship to another, there’s something that keeps drawing them to abusive people, something they find attractive about that.
Probably self-hatred of one kind or another.
I could definately see why non-black men would be attracted to natural black women, at least from a personal perspective I usually assume they have a better sense of self-esteem
than black women without natural hair.
@Gina
It does seem to be a thing w/black men who date out; honestly I think its some kind of self-hate, which is on some level sadly ironic, because overweight women are for some bizarre reason
“more” likely to be racist.
And then factoring in that black men are statistically considered the best looking of the male groups out of the races, in their own self-hatred they date the very people who would be less likely
to want to date them or respect them as human. Don’t know if its purely their self-esteem leading to them asking out women they think would be more likely to accept them or if on some subconscious
level they recognize the racism in these women and actually seek them out.
One of the things I always find weird though is; if black women hate themselves and thats why the date out what does it say about all the other races of women? I mean black women are the “most” loyal
to their race out of all women in the US.
Does that mean all the other races women hate themselves more? Of course, factoring what I said earlier about white people being more likely to have lower sense of esthetics and more likely to have pyschological
problems…..that might actually be true.
Thinking about it; black men are kind of like asian women, both are considered to basically be at the top of the totem pole for looks as a group but both seem to have serious issues about dating down with white people.
@Peanut
I suspect the media hype might be more for white women, than directed towards black women, that it helps placate them and make them not have to worry about black women as potential rivals so those shows
are something they watch and so more of those shows get made.
@Why?
Earlier I put forth the idea; that one of the reasons why this happened is because say what you will about them, black women shoot from the hip, you’ll find out what the problem is early
on and hopefully it will get dealt with, so it won’t continue the plague the relationship further on down the years creating a lot more potential stress.
White women, particularly from the more traditionally southern variety do “way, waaay” more emotional/social manipulation, they rarely tend to straight up be aggressive or ever accept
the possibility they could be in the wrong or guilty of anything, its brutally hard for them to accept criticism of anykind, ever heard of the concept of “white women’s tears” thats not just something
they do when they get act in a racist manner and get called out on it, its for many of them literally a way of life.
And if you go into a relationship thinking that white women are pure, innocent, submissive creatures who you can easily dominate, you are completely and totally unprepared for the havoc and head games
that they can and “WILL” play on you.
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Fiamma, forget diasporic Africans, most Africans in Africa itself have “Neanderthal genes”. The only ones that do not are those few whose first human ancestors never mixed with neanderthals and who to this day have not mixed with humans who also have the neanderthal genes.
They would have evolved from Homo-habilis straight to Homo-sapien in a shorter time without leaving Sub-Saharan Africa. (no mix with neanderthal).
There was another group that did leave SS Africa though, like you mention.
Of those who did not leave – those who have still not left to this day and have not mated with outside groups, would be the minority of SS Africans alive today without neanderthal genes.
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OK Homo-habilis to Homo-Erectus to Homo-Sapian in SS Africa.
During the Homo-Erectus stage a group of Homo-Erectus migrated out of Africa while another group did not.
The Homo-Erectus in SS Africa then evolved to Homo-Sapian in Africa.
The Homo-Erectus that left Africa evolved into Homo-Sapians also but somehow met up with the less evolved Neanderthal and mated somehow.
OK where did the Neanderthal come from?!
Funny, I was just watching a documentary last week about this and now I can’t find it.
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@ All
Neanderthal genes are off topic here. I will delete any further comments about it here. Please continue the discussion here:
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@TrojanPam wow, glad you found your crusade.
I’ll be over here, chillin with my friends, have a nice day.
@Peanut, CL personals might as well be called the prostiution classifieds, I wouldn’t consider it anywhere near representative of ‘normal people’ looking for ‘normal dates/relationships’
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@ Why
If you have thoughts or a suggestion about something just say it. You always wait for others to say what they think so you can simply decide if you agree or disagree with it.
Secondly Samoan men my not be many in the USA but who says one has to limit themselves to dating in the US? For that matter living in it or marrying in it?
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From laromana:
OK says,
Omnipresent, I see what you’re saying but I stand by what I said: men choose. If a woman receives little interest from men—i’m talking real relationships, not just sex—then she has few options/choices. A man must pursue (choose) the woman first. Then, she either accepts or rejects but the women must first be given the opportunity (chosen) to do this.
I’ve read that black women are desired more by men of all races in other parts of the world. I was very surprised to read about Chinese men MARRYING black women in Africa and Jamaica.
I think, in America at least, it is easy for a black woman to find a man to simply have sex but extremely difficult to find a man willing to have a serious relationship and marry. White woman as we all know aren’t perfect virgins, but they are considered desirable in this society; therefore, they have no problem finding a man that’s willing to settle down and marry them. I’ve seen white trash easily get married while the “thin, attractive, kind, intelligent” black woman still struggled to get chosen by a man because she’s BLACK and that’s all people can see.
laromana says,
OK,
Thanks for clearly stating the dyanmics of BW HATE culture in America.
Although many may try to deny it, the fact is that ALL American men areBRAINWASHED to hate BW SOLELY because they’re Black.
MOST American men CHOOSE to go along with this BRAINWASHED ANTI-BW mindset (eg. by ONLY rejecting BW for serious dating and/or marriage) but SOME CHOOSE to reject it (eg. by being open to serious dating and/or marriage to BW).
OK is 100% correct in stating that “white trash easily get married while the thin, attractive, kind, intelligent black woman still struggles to get chosen by a man because she’s BLACK and that’s all people can see.”
I/many BW in America like me, have experienced the unfairness/injustice of this brand of BW HATE culture and the many negative effects it has on our relationship lives.
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@Laromana,
LOL!
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you can cut the sexual tension on this thread and BWE with a knife…wow, is it getting hot in here
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@phoebeprunelle
I co-sign that and add a ROFL
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You know it is a wonder that any black women are married considering that “ALL American men areBRAINWASHED to hate BW SOLELY because they’re Black”—LOL!!
With that line of thinking I am guessing these women won’t be getting married anytime soon. Ties right into abagond’s My secret desire for white women post.
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@ B. R.
Hey! Thought they might have ran you off. LOL
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@ laromana
(not sure if we just respond this way or not)
You would not have a relationship to speak of if all American men hated black women. There would be no black families or even interracial families to speak of if all American men hated black women. Can a person hate something, marry it, have kids with it, and grow old with it? Not in my book.
Secondly part of the reason why some black women struggle with a finding a man is this idea they have planted in their head (courtesy of racist society) is because they want to believe that all men desire want white women. This type of toxic thinking is what damages the ability to seek or even put ones self out their to find a valuable relationship.
“Although many may try to deny it, the fact is that ALL American men areBRAINWASHED to hate BW SOLELY because they’re Black. “—The fact is you don’t know all American men or all men for that matter. Sorry
Thirdly why in heck are we in 2013 and women are still waiting on a man to make the first move? Do you realize some men are very shy and fear rejection? But while you are waiting on him to jump on your good looks some fearless female comes up and makes him hers.
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Peanut,
I love those dancing videos. They’re beautiful.
As for white politicians obsessing over First Lady’s body, particularly the booty and arms, they’re resentful of the fact that a Black woman is occupying the White House and that we’re taking our rightful place in American society instead of the familiar stereotypes of Black women white men created and maintain along with their female counterparts. Both white men and women are resentful of Michelle Obama. I wish they get a life and leave us alone.
Stephanie B.
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Its odd because Michelle Obama is the first relatively young, fit and attractive First Lady we’ve had in a while but I’ve seen some white racist websites saying she’s the most unattractive and “fat”. Fat? What?
Her figure is almost perfect.
They hold Jackie Kennedy up as some sort of First Lady beauty queen. Excuse me but she may have had “great style” for that era, but her raw materials were not “pretty”.
Oh, and you wouldn’t believe they even hold up Laura Bush as an attractive first lady, more attractive than Hillary Clinton. What!?!?
Hillary was quite cute when she was young (years before she became first lady) but even as first lady she looked alright for her age.
But they bash her looks too.
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Oh they are certainly jealous over how well the Obamas are aging. Rush looked 60 at 40 and now they are 60 looking 80. This is why white racists always bash PoC’s looks with stuff like “skin the color of shit”. They know their shelf life expires at 30 while shit-skinned folk have a shelf life at least twice that long, often more.
That’s why they keep having to insist over and over that they are the best looking peeps. They figure is they say it often enough, everyone will go blind and start to believe it!
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Tell me,
Why do mainstream media insist on us dating white men? Ironically, they never put white men on national TV declaring their love for Black women. Not one white man write books encouraging white men to date/marry/have families with Black women. That’s what I find contradictory.
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I don’t have a tv or radio but I have been clued into some media happenings over the years but the internet told me about some radio jockey calling black female basketball players nappy headed hos.
I don’t want happened after that but I know if I were a parent of one of the girls I would rally all the other parents to collectively sue him for defamation of character.
Imagine being a parent, proud of your baby girl and her dedication to her athletic craft. Instilling values of not only hard work in her but also strength of character and most probably teaching her ethics around sexuality and valuing herself as a human being – hearing your daughter being called a whore on national radio!
No offense to sex workers, but in this culture “ho” doesn’t refer to sex workers but its an insult meant to devalue a woman’ worth, put her firmly in her place as sex object, as well as “woman of loose morals/questionable character”.
What if some of these young women were religious virgins?
I mean, the thing I’m trying to get at here is that American mainstream popular culture is so low class, degraded and downright inhumane that a man old enough to be the grand-father of these basketball players, and who should be seeing them as like his grand-daughters, bestowing his blessings and good wishes on them for success and happiness, as well as setting an example of what proper behavior is – as a “RESPECTABLE ELDER” is actually behaving like some low life 16 year old tramp-pimp, sexualizing his grand-daughters, and exposing the ears of the radio listeners (some of who may be children) to the shit that passes for “thoughts” in his mind.
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@ stephanie
Idk i guess they want us to make the first move, i notice this country is becoming more female dominated. U have men saying women should ask men out, and women are becoming breadwinners, and some men are saying women should pay for dinner,etc. Add to that the stereotype that black women are masculine and of course they’d put these images out showing black women as being the masculine one and going after a white man.instead of the man pursuing the woman. Even in animals it is the male who approaches the female and she accepts or rejects, even the insects where the female is dominate and will kill the male, the male is the one that makes the first move. people are going against nature.
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Sharina, Im on the road, Ive been on Ocean Dr , South Beach Miami, at the Mango club and the Cleavlander , admiring the booties of women of all shapes sizes and color….Micheles booty looks like it could create sexual tension from where Im standing…
It really smells like musky pungent, juicy sex on this thread now..all this taboo , ban sex talk just stimulates the desire , so many posts, so much discision
….you all are just being dificult now , but, whoa, underneath all the bluster is some real sexual tension…psycho analyse that
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@ peanut
Those vids of black women and men dancing are hot and sexy lol. the birthday sex vid was steamy but those sheets up to the window kinda threw off the vibe lol
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Stephanie Baldwin,
why do you all keep insisting that mainstream media wants to push black women into dating white men?
is it because the white-owned media is Finally willing to show interracial couples on TV and movies (after all these years of Only showing black couples together and barely showing black people in any positive format)
I thought the goal of the black writers and other black people in the Entertainment industry was to have Hollywood and advertising agencies finally show the “real America” — such as interracial couples, positive black families, educated black people.
I only see black women talking about “dating out” and making a lot a noise about it.
If anything, it’s black women pushing this “agenda” and using the media as a vehicle — aimed at their target market– which is other black women.
Media platforms only care about making money — they’ll show and support whatever makes them the most money– and black Americans must be OK and co-sign with what the media is showing becaue
they continue to watch Negative black TV shows like “Basketball Wives” and “RHW of Atlanta” and other shows that do black women NO favours — and these “real” black woman sign up for and get paid for keeping these Negative images of black women alive and well.
but I guess if the white Media took a stand, said “forget the money” and refused to promote these “black” shows (supported and pushed by black people), then this problem would go away
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Peanut, I don’t find the first video “sensual” or “provacative”. I find it downright vulgar.
Looks like those “dancers” are teenagers too.
Where the hell are their parents?
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Peanut, Im on the road and cant look at the youtubes in a cyber cafe without earphones…just saw the first one…love it…those are trained dancers , doing great lifts and spins…ballet and modern dance can have movements and bodies rolling all over each other…i love trained dancers…they arnt afraid to do cheorographies that are provacative…but, the average person cant do them
Yeah, when a lot of people start screaming loudly about not wanting to have sex with a type of person…underneath…the sexual tension just builds…Im very patient…
good point Linda
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BR,
Bienvenido a Miami 🙂 toma un Mojito for me.
Nice to see someone enjoying the good weather and the beach bars .. try not get a whiplash
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Funny how no matter how you shift it or where you take it, the kids of interracial
relationships of Afro diasporic descent, just get thrown to the meat grinder…Ive seen so much misinformation jerked around
There is something so special about actualy having a child from two races, black and white…you learn so much about mixture, about how genes can come together…you have automatic insights other people have to study or guess about…if i chose to have more kids with my wife, the variations could be tremendous with all kinds of shades and colors
Its really a wonderful unique experiance, Im humbly blessed and lucky to have had it and raised my son….and, its good to see how much misinformation , misunderstanding and plain hate that goes down about them..Ive seen enough to make me vomit..Ill be happy to pass the information on to my son…who by the way is seriously invested in Afro diasporic culture
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ahhh Linda, I love it here!!…I will be recording at Lennie Kravitz studio July 1 , (after a run to New York for a gig )with some really great Miami musicians I saw playing at the Dolphin Mall….
Go Heat (?)
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From laromana:
Yes, black women can get sex and booty calls but to actually find a man that wants to “put a ring on it”, stick around and raise a family, and be monogamous will be extremely difficult because in American society black women are considered undesirable and simply aren’t worth it. I personally know white women that have had children out of wedlock and their men ended of marrying them. This didn’t happen to the black women that I know. A white (actually any woman that isn’t black) woman is considered more desirable in this society so she is free to make mistakes, sleep around a bit and many men would still want to be with her. Not the same for black women.
A nonblack woman can be grossly overweight, frumpy, homely, etc. and still have men wanting to be with her. A black woman must stay fit, dress well, etc. and still won’t be perceived as desirable as a white women. People only see BLACK. I know some amazing black women that are struggling in the dating realm. Then, I see trashy white women that are doing all of the “wrong” things ( sleeping around, out of wedlock children, multiple divorces, lack class, obese) still easily get a man.
Most black women prefer black men but I don’t think black men feel the same. I think black men in general are open to all races of women and don’t strictly prefer black women. Many black men perfer any woman that’s not black, too.
Interracial relationships between black men and other women are common. The statistics tend to only count marriages but I bet if nonmarriage relationships were counted too the numbers would be HIGH—-I’m willing to bet almost 50% of black men are/have been in/have children from interracial relationships.
I think (SOME) black women’s strong preference for black men is due to lack of options. If black women had as many options as black men the preference for black men wouldn’t be as strong.
laromana,
phoebeprunelle/Sharina,,
Maybe instead of trying to DENY the FACTS of the BW HATE culture IN AMERICA I/OK have stated in our comments, INVENT things we DIDN’T SAY or pretend that what BW IN AMERICA are facing is a “laughing matter”, you should spend more time reading/understanding what we ACTUALLY said.
In my comments I clearly stated that :
-ALL American men are BRAINWASHED to hate BW SOLELY because they’re Black.
-MOST American men CHOOSE to go along with this BRAINWASHED ANTI-BW mindset (eg. by ONLY rejecting BW for serious dating and/or marriage).
-SOME American men CHOOSE to reject this ANTI-BW mindset (eg. by being open to serious dating and/or marriage to BW)”.
Neither OK/I EVER specified that BW should ONLY pursue ANY ONE race of men in relationships or claimed that BW/any woman should “wait for men to pursue them”.
I believe BW should ONLY be in relationships with QUALITY men of ANYrace who will treat them with love, dignity, and respect.
I also believe that being aware of how the BW HATE culture works in America helps BW NOT BLAME THEMSELVES for the negative way MOST American men view/treat them.
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Peanut writes:
” I don’t make the first move and probably never will. 2013 or 1913, I don’t do it.”
– – –
I myself tend to be shy, and I don’t do that either …not intentionally, anyway, as, sometimes, making “the first move” can be something as simple as either appearing to look a *little too long* at a man, or smiling at him when he looks your way.
I’ve had the occasional experience out and about of men approaching me because they either thought that I had been watching them or because they had misconstrued a smile from me as being a come on.
On one occasion I had actually been looking at a sign posted on a wall nearby where this one white guy was standing when this same guy looks up and sees me seemingly “checking him out”. Well, catching a glimpse of him as his mouth drops open and he looks directly at me with a joyous look of surprise on his face lol, I realize what has just happened and I quickly leave the scene before he has the chance to gather himself together and make an approach. And, no, he wasn’t some ugly dork, as has been said about WM who are open to dating WoC, but an attractive man who appeared to be a bit younger than myself. I left the scene because a.) I was already in a relationship, and 2.) because I mostly have made it my policy to avoid becoming involved with American white men (he might not have been American, but both his general appearance and his body language struck me as being particularly “American”).
[During my past visits to Europe, the Caribbean and to Israel, the locals could often (but not always) discern that I was a visitor from the US not only by looking at my clothing, but also by watching my body language…so, there is something to that.]
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I don’t get bothered by black women or white men who are in relationships with one another. It’s their business
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@ Peanut
I get that some women don’t want to be the aggressor and approach the man, but what I meant by that statement is that just because a man does not does not mean he just does not find you desirable. There could be other reasons and not all of them center around you being black.
@ laromana
what facts are there to deny? What Have I denied other than the fact that you don’t even know all or most men in America to make such an ignorant statement. I don’t deny that their are men that hate black women because yes they exist but to say it is a culture or even that most follow it is just ridiculous on so many levels.
It is hard to put words in a person’s mouth when I can simply quote it, but since you are confused in regards to what I am saying to you vs what I blieve you are saying then I will label it for you.
The idea that all men desire white women (something I am saying to you) is toxic thinking. Toxic because they don’t really to the extreme that people want to believe. This kind of mental thinking is also something that is damage to black women because they are not willing to approach or be open to relationships if they think they will be rejected on the sole premise they are black.
“Neither OK/I EVER specified that BW should ONLY pursue ANY ONE race of men in relationships claimed that BW/any woman should “wait for men to pursue them”. —Nor do I remember saying you did, but since you are cosigning and speaking for OK you may want to read what the individual said aside from what you are decideing to quote. Ok stated that men choose and is advocating that if a man does not approach and choose you that you are not desirable (paraphrasing). That is hoggwash because if a man does not approach you does not mean you are not desirable. So many reason could be the reason said man decides not to approach or pursue.
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@ B. R.
I am guessing you are a booty man. LOL. Enjoy.
As for the sexual tension….I am married so I should not even remotely be saying anything about sex with another man, but if I was single I would certainly not care what color a man is as long as he can make my toes curl. LOL!
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@Laromana,
I was actually laughing at the bit you said about “white trash” getting married–not at your reasoning…as i think there is some truth to that…
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excuse me I stand corrected as the idea is that marriage = desirability and not men approaching you = desirability. My mistake.
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@ Fiamma
I am guessing that was quite awkward for the guy. LOL He got his hopes up and you disappeared.
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@ Peanut
No biggy. I think adding a little sex talk cuts the tension in here.
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I will say this and then I will go in my corner and “possibly” not say anything.
Women are the mother of men. As women we will raise and teach our children on a much more hands on stance than men. I think there is fear that blacks being together will have black children and the rise in numbers in the black community is something white supremacy may want to avoid.
If a white woman raises a mixed child she may (not saying this is 100% certain) raise the child to live in that white racist bubble. Naive to the issues of society and “color-blind.” Where as black women will raise that child to be aware of society and some unfair advantages they may experience. The child will probably be more exposed to the black side of the family and see or experience issues through black eyes. just a thought.
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Yeah, Sharina, I do feel for men in that context…I sometimes think that if I had been born male, I would probably die a lonely virgin since I can’t imagine ever approaching anyone for a date.
I really do hate shooting down a guy who might have had to work up his nerves just to approach me, while at the same time dating any and every guy who does approach is certainly out of the question. So, in turning a man down, I do make an effort to be kind, but in that particular situation I figured making myself scarce was the best option, as that guy had alread assumed – erroneously – that I was interested in him….
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Peanut:
Kim Kardashian comes to mind. ^_^
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@ Sondis: Hey, how are you this evening?
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From laromana:
LAROMANA COMMENT:
You know it is a wonder that any black women are married considering that “ALL American men are BRAINWASHED to hate BW SOLELY because they’re Black”
SHARINA RESPONSE:
-With that line of thinking I am guessing these women won’t be getting married anytime soon. Ties right into abagond’s My secret desire for white women post.
-You would not have a relationship to speak of if all American men hated black women. There would be no black families or even interracial families to speak of if all American men hated black women. Can a person hate something, marry it, have kids with it, and grow old with it? Not in my book.
Secondly part of the reason why some black women struggle with a finding a man is this idea they have planted in their head (courtesy of racist society) is because they want to believe that all men desire want white women. This type of toxic thinking is what damages the ability to seek or even put ones self out their to find a valuable relationship.
laromana says,
Sharina,
Your comments have NOTHING to do with what I or OK ACTUALLY said.
In our comments we describe the BW HATE culture in America that hasBRAINWASHED ALL American men into believing BW aren’t GOOD ENOUGH to seriously date and/or marry.
I NEVER claimed, like you do, that BW believe this about themselves.
I also stated that, though MOST American men go along with this mindset, SOMEAmerican men reject it.
My comments never drew your WRONG conclusion that “these women won’t be getting married anytime soon” or that “all men desire want white women”
OBVIOUSLY, the American men who reject BW HATE culture are establishing serious dating and/or dating relationships with BW
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@ Peanut
Great point on the Black women having a child of wedlock with a White male.
White men also painted us as whores and Jezebels but never seemed to have time to critique themselves on their mistreatment of us.
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@ laromana
I am speaking to you not Ok at the moment so what he or she said is not of any concern to me unless he/she would like to address me, but in all honesty if you are going to cosign then please actually read what he or she said instead of insisting I am in the wrong for bringing it up and disagreeing with it. We can agree to disagree and what I take from your post or his is what I take from it. Does not mean I am wrong in that but rather I see if differently.
“In our comments we describe the BW HATE culture in America that hasBRAINWASHED ALL American men into believing BW aren’t GOOD ENOUGH to seriously date and/or marry.”—I asked you a question to this i will rephrase it. What proof do you have that all American men are brainwashed to believe this? Do you know all American men? Have you done a study on all American men? It is a simple question.
“I also stated that, though MOST American men go along with this mindset, SOMEAmerican men reject it.
My comments never drew your WRONG conclusion that ”these women won’t be getting married anytime soon” or that “all men desire want white women””—Back to the same thing I said earlier if most follow this said thought pattern then most black women should not be married or dating because you don’t marry or date someone you hate do you? (notice the question mark please and I have asked you several question you keep bypassing). As for my statement of “all men desire want white women” It is not a conclusion I drew from your post, but from OK’s post. Mainly because of comments centered around black women are the bottom of the barrel and it is easy for white women to get men etc. I suggest you read the post done by Abagond on “My secret desire for white women” and you will see what I mean by this. It is toxic thinking by individuals to believe that all men (typically black men) desire white women at a high rate.
“OBVIOUSLY, the American men who reject BW HATE culture are establishing serious dating and/or dating relationships with BW”—True but how can you know whether this amount counts for most or some seeing as you do not have any personal encounters with all or even most American men?
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mary burrell:
Hey there…I’m doing alright. Just looking around the blog, trying to see what’s everyone talking about. ^_^
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Peanut: “this was years ago and it was a grown man and a grown woman”
Um. I think you must’ve accidently posted the wrong url then, coz what I saw was 2 dudes and a girl doing some nasty stuff. And they were skinny and looked young.
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Guys already date out, matgazines don’t need to encourage them, its already kind of a thing. As compared to black women, all other races of women also date out more.
Also what could Maxam do as a pro-date black women issue that wouldn’t be decried as racist right off the bat?
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@Peanut
Well; Maxam’s not really a “dating” mag, but it may have had a focus on black ladies before as models.
I think it even had Michelle Obama in the Hot 100 list.
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@ Peanut
The J Smoov video, if that is what you are talking about, was suggestive, like you said. It is not something I would show my mother, for example. But if I thought it was over the line I would have deleted it. You said it was suggestive, so those who clicked on the link already know that going in.
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@ Why
I deleted your comment on Lenon Honor. It seemed off topic to me.
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The amount of time black people spend thinking and writing about dating white people is sooooo embarrassing. You will NEVER see Maxim, FHM, GQ, Esquire, Cosmopolitan or Glamour write an article encouraging it’s readers to date and mate with black people. I truly believe 99% of black people are hopelessly brainwashed.
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Peanut, I did say that I agreed with much of what TrojanPam said, but she,and some other people are making blatent statements that black people should not have sex with white people,and there have been really smearing statements and psycho analysis of black people who do have sex with white people
That doesnt leave much room , does it? Sorry,there is no middle ground or comprimise with me…which isnt saying black people shouldnt have huge defences up about white peoples intentions…but as far as consenting adults making desicians for themselves in the bedroom,there is no middle ground with me
Id much prefer to discuss jazz with TrojanPam , the last thing Id like to be doing is arguing with black American women about this…but,if they start insulting and pseudo psycho analyse every black woman that went out with me,labeling and catagorising them, well,no,we are going to battle,because these were wonderful strong,independent women who didnt hate black men and werent sleeping with me to validate themselves
Im just passing through the states, but, I read the jornals and try to keep up, I dont see what you are talking about at all about selling white men to minorities…I dont see the underlying evil in the cheerios comercial yet
I keep trying to bring it back exactyly where this agenda started , because I was there, i saw it go down, I asked who people really think is more relevant to the struggle, Cleaver,Newton or Brown…I try to point out other very small agendas that came out of the great Civil Rights Movement that were not benificial in the long run and I think that agenda of who people can date is one of them also
Christians burned people at the stake,does that mean I dont go out with a Christian person (Im from a wasp background but severly reject organised religion),same with a Muslim person…yes its a racist society with huge problems from the legacy of slavery, but,tell people who they can sleep with? And Im sure not trying to sell interracial sex to anyone, and, I fully think a lot of white people are jerks…but, these attitudes are strange, I already know I have to deal with the white racists…but, my wife or any or the wonderful women I have been with in the past ,subjected to this kind of raking over the coals from people who are in the same boat of discrimination ?
I would never argue that black children are not discriminated and thrown under the bus, but I am refferring to direct atitudes in the agendas I see on this blog all the time that absolutly anialate and alianate mixed race Afro descendent children in a very strange and perplexing mannor…my point is not who is suffering more,its why are people regecting people who receive the same discrimination and rejection in society that they do? This didnt happen before..ok in some places you had colorism,but, not everywhere, and mixed race kids were very accepted in the black community….of course withing the paramaters that anyone who is differant would be accepted…but it wasnt the issue it is today
Peanut,you arnt really reading what I am saying or you would know I never questioned black people putting up defences to deal with white society, I just wont accept mandates and agendas that try to tell people who they can have sex with or not
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“I just wont accept mandates and agendas that try to tell people who they can have sex with or not.”
Ha! Good luck with that. For some people here that is the very core of their worldview.
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@ J
“I truly believe 99% of black people are hopelessly brainwashed.”—Atleast you said believe instead of know with certainty or give off some indication you did.
@ B.R. and Shady_Grady
Is anything people say in here going to change who a person chooses to have sex with? If it does then some people are just easily influenced.
@ B.R.
While I will agree that not all black people who sleep with white people are experiencing self-hate or internalized racism, I have noticed that some actually do. The fact that some do I can agree with Trojanpam on the ones that do. I met a grandmother who had two grandchildren. One of the kids has a black father and the other a white father. She treats the one with the white father better than the other, but both fathers are deadbeat dads. Both men come around long enough to have sex with this woman’s daughters but neither of them are talking marriage or moving them into a house and providing for their children. The daughter with the white man even carries and acts as if she is some how better because her baby daddy is white.
Now I agree with you because if two adults want to have sex then who am I to tell them they are wrong. They can do this even if they are suffering some mental issues or are perfectly sane according to what society considers sane. What others do will not affect with I do and vice versa.
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I agree with J in that none of those magazines will showcase an article telling people to date or mate with black people. Then again it does not matter because I don’t read any of those magazines. Anyway I found this and I was really touched by it.
http://inmyhair.blogspot.com/2008/09/few-reasons-why-i-married-black-woman.html
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@ peanut
“also samoan men for you mstoogood
🙂 ”
Oooh thank you,lol and i’ll add Puerto rican men. and native men http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mdimsosYpn1qa9oemo1_250.jpg
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Mstoogood4yall:
why you going on and on about all these handsome men on this thread? you know darn well, they “Nachoman!” LMFAO!
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@ sondis
U jealous?
fine i’ll post some beautiful women too here u go. http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lq3b61gZNi1qdacf0o1_500.jpg
*wipe that drool off* passes cyber tissue
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@ peanut
THis one is for you enjoy lol https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/p480x480/548456_435765886452225_269997741_n.jpg
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Mstoogood4yall:
Jealous? nah…but i was starved for attention. -_-
Oh my, oh my my my…..@ that picture you posted. I’d grovel at her feet @ : o O ) >
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this is what the sexual tension on this thread looks like lol
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Mstoogood4yall:
Does that black couple, represent me and you? @ : o D ) >
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@ sondis lol
Naw, i like this one better . tyson beckford fine and so is this woman he with
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mstoogood4yall:
Meh, she’s alright i guess, the last picture of the black woman you posted, looked better in my opinion.
Tyson is a very handsome man, just don’t let him smile, he shops at the gap! lmaoo!
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@ peanut
Yea I see ur questions, he must be in hiding lol. I knew u would love that man with the basket, that darn basket need to move can’t it see its in the way rofl photbombing mf basket
@ sondis
Yeah the first woman is more beautiful, natural beauty is stunning
“just don’t let him smile, he shops at the gap!” You wrong for this lmbao.
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@ peanut
THis is a lesson that black folks what we say can and will be used against us and other black folks.smh. Its crazy to me that black ppl throw each other under the bus, I don’t see anybody else doing this sheit. Heck even when white folks go on shooting sprees their friends, neighbors,and family will say oh he was such a good person he wouldn’t hurt anybody. Black ppl be like I knew that person was bad and they should’ve locked him up sooner. THe key is to have a better poker face. If more black ppl don’t realize that words are a powerful thing we are doomed. If u have black ppl going around saying black women are bad mothers, then don’t be surprised if they start sterilizing black women again and justify it by quoting another black person. Same thing for the black men, if some black ppl say yall are thugs they take it as truth. PPl gotta realize that when it comes to our issues whites either try to downplay it or use black faces for it [abortion, crime,etc] and use other black ppl to cosign with them. When black ppl give their opinion on racism they discredit us and say we don’t know what we talking about, but when we talk about issues in our community or coon they take that coons word as the gospel and say see they said it so it must be true.
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wow this thread has more comments than the open thread and in less time.
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^ u really mad huh using a lot of ! and caps. {goes into hulk mode]
I HATE IT TOO, SOME OF THE b@@H @SS M#@@ WHO COSIGN WITH IT ARE BEYOND HELP YET WILL BE THE SAME DUMMYS WHO WANT BLACK WOMEN TO MARCH WITH THEM WHEN THEY GET MISTREATED OR FACE RACISM. F THE DOUBLE STANDARD. JUST LIKE CALLING OUT RACISM IS IMPORTANT CALLING OUT STUPIDITY AND DISRESPECT IS IMPORTANT TOO. IF U DON’T STAND UP THEY THINK U AGREE WITH THEM. THIS IS WHY WHENEVER I SEE NEGATIVE COMMENTS ABOUT BLACK MEN I SAY SOMETHING SO THEY KNOW IM IN THEIR CORNER AND THE PPL MAKING THOSE STEREOTYPES KNOW I DON’T AGREE WITH THEM.
Sometimes I do feel black women and men need time apart to heal by ourselves then come together and heal our community together as one. a community CANNOT exist without UNITY. it seems we are too busy trying to see who can hurt the other more instead of trying to build each other up. we get hate from everybody else and it sucks getting hate from ppl who look like u. doggone shame
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Yowza! That Samoan guy with the luscious, long, dark, curly hair! The problem with guys who look that good is they know it. And also they tend not to be intellectuals, to say the least.
Kind of like the stereotype of the “dumb blonde” but in reverse.
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“would u say this has been an emotional thread for you mstoogood?”
Lol yea u can tell by the all caps rages I had on here AND CONTINUE TO HAVE. and the amount of comments I posted. it just sucks seeing too many black ppl tearin each other down and then the darn vultures aka media circling us and telling us to date white and our problems will disappear, yeah the only thing disappearing is blackness and unity. anyway i’m happy to be getting a new laptop sometime this month,this one is about to fall apart lol I wore this thing out . I dream of leaving this country some day and being around positive ppl who look like me and have some of the same dreams and ambitions. sometimes I feel like this country is draining and is always trying to promote bad and unnatural things.
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@ why
lol, that is why I like kinda average lookin men, kinda shy men, or men who once had body issues[fat] because they tend to be nicer and not as cocky. but these men are good to look at. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=22h_rCaMW-o) the man at 5 seconds is fine
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@ why
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=22h_rCaMW-o)
The man in this vid is fine his name is pretty sly. he the one with the two braids omg.
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Peanut
U deserve a break, I hope u write about ur next adventure abroad. maybe u can find a man *wink* shoot and find me one too while u there lol.
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http://api.ning.com/files/to50592nIFiMCPC2VEy7ROhb7QZfbm9esZe*TF8v8hXuVIIS74qH5EEd95vxGfEVFD4Zv-w2AMeBwK-wAQzmUspwhH2qZjos/beautiful.bmp
mmmmmm my my my my my { johnny gill voice}
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more eye candy
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@Peanut.
What was the question you asked? Kind of hard to read through so many comments.
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why
here is another fine man http://hellyeahsendhilramamurthy.tumblr.com/post/46997748096
ok im done lol
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By the way, this whole “black woman hate” thing is a recent thing in the media and I blame youtube. Never before I’ve had heard this things til the internet gave every Tommy Sotamayor and every Sgt. Willie Penis a platform.
But, truth must be told, like other Americans, Black folk have really let themselves go. So we are seeing in the daily public and reality tv and youtube, an ever increasing amount of Black folk looking and acting fowl (as are other Americans).
“the age old stereotype about black women being the worst mothers, yet Black women cared and breast fed white children”
Yes. But this is in the past. Now, like I said, there is an increasing number of American parents, including many black ones, acting in neglectful, irresponsible and even violent ways toward their children.
And lets not get into the whole “baby daddy/baby mama drama” nonsense.
By the way Abagond, Lenon Honor’s video is relevant to this conversation so if you still have it somewhere in your system maybe if you would be so kind to post it now or on the “Open Topic”.
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peanut
yes all the above men would be nice lol. I wouldn’t mind finding a man overseas or from another culture. Maybe abagond busy or something.
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why I’m not on any of these, lists? @ : o ( ) >
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@Peanut
I’m not a big fan of Tommy Sotomayer. I think he purposely highlights only negative videos about black women. He never does anything to uplift his people. I personally think he’s an agent for the government. I don’t trust anyone(male or female) that makes a living off highlighting destructive behavior. He makes it seems like 90% of black women are loud,ghetto,overbearing and materialistic. Nothing could be further from the truth. I’m more of a nationalist do I think we should be uplifting our women. And the positive brothers should be speaking out against the black men who disrespect and degrade our sistas. Bi understand your frustration Peanut. I know it’s hard seeing the negative portrayal of black women. But just believe there many brothers who aren’t buying the negative hype. I hate seeing all the stereotypical roles the media promotes day in and day out. I know these steretypes don’t represent the true essence of black women. I want you and the other sistas on this blog to know that we do love and support you. We may not agree on everything but we should always respect each other. We don’t have to have the same opinion to have the same intention. I just want whatever is best for my people. And black men can’t do this alone— we need the support of sistas. But we as black men must stand up as leaders and be there when sistas need us most. When black women are in pain–I’m in pain. We must come together if we want to move forward as a people.
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@ Peanut
I honestly feel like the gloves are gonna come off when President Obama is out of office. I hope I’m wrong, but I don’t think the situation is going to be better for Black people when he leaves. There’s a lot of angry people out here.
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We get it, most Black women in America don’t like White American men and honestly I don’t blame them. I am a proud Black woman of Jamaican descent and I want to marry a Jamaican or Latino when I reach the age of settling down. Besides I have more in common with them than ”African American” men.
And White guys,( I am not a fan of them and will never date one,) always show interest in me though. I hate it when people tell me that they see me dating or marrying a White guy in the future just because I don’t act like the stereotypical Black girl.
Anyways my advice is to date who you want to date regardless of race but everyone has their preferences though.
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@Peanut
I am also saddened by the anti Black culture in this country too. It is the main reason that I am single these days, trust me.
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*Black women
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@Peanut
The Black boy I liked last year in Sophomore Year said he didn’t like Black girls. I was crushed because I really liked him. And he is so cute too but he is dating a Puerto Rican girl right now. Even Black men are falling for the anti Black woman nonsense in the media and Pop culture. It makes me sad. It is like MANY Black men are siding with the Jewish Zionist media in tearing Black women.
What did we do to get so much hatred?
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@ Peanut and Adeen
Ladies, I agree. Anti-blackness is rising, and many of our own are being used to promote it. But little do they realize that it’s going to get them too. I think that this interracial dating movement will come to a screeching halt if racism gets worse (I think it is). It’s no accident that our people are not shown as sexually intimate, smart, and down-to-earth in the media.
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Yeah it is gonna get worse when Obama leave office, they usually put a black face on things when it goes wrong or think of the magical negro stereotype thinking he will fix it . u know they angry, and blame us for getting Obama elected and I’ve been seeing more comments about why are all the white countries being invaded etc. I’ve been seeing a lot more racist things and even the news is being more subliminally racist. did yall see cnn had a coolio song playing it had the n word in it when they showed a clip of an elderly black woman driving
(http://hellyeahsendhilramamurthy.tumblr.com/post/46997748096)
@ sondis
its ok you’ll be on a list someday. I nominate thee for best smile lol
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oops posted wrong link here it is
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_OfjgRevk8)
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I posted wrong link my other comment in moderation that had the real link *ugh*
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Mstoogood4yall:
awww thanks ^_^
Lets see your smile, post a pic of yourself.
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“WHY did we have a billboard saying that the most dangerous place for an African-american is the womb ”
Missed that one. But could it have been a pro-black message? Like saying “Black women: don’t abort because we need/want more black people in the population?”
Oh, and does anyone know whatever happened to that youtuber “Thugtician”?
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darn all my comments in moderation, GRRR
Sondis
lol my camera is dead I gotta charge it
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Mstoogood4yall:
ummm hmmm…sure.. 0_o
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@ why I know he is that why I posted it
Sondis
I might find one of my pics from a couple months ago and post it while my camera charge.
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@Mstoogood, Peanut and Ms. J
I think that Black men will still continue to date outside of their race for years to come. I fear that the Black population will dwindle in this country because of the Black men dating out so much.
I do believe that we will have a White president after Obama because America can’t take another Black president. Look at how rude and disrespectful Whites have shown themselves to be towards Obama and his family. They can’t handle us in any position of power.
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Scrolling up through the pics I see I’m not the only woman her who likes men with long hair.
I see the pic of Nerissa Iving. Isn’t she married to some famous “conscious” rapper? I read a facebook update of hers asking her female readership what they thought of “co-wifing” and though “Uh-oh. Her man is probably hinting at the idea already so he can have multiple women while he’s touring or something.” I don’t think they live together.
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@Sondis
You are one handsome, Brotha, sir!
But I think things will get worse for Blacks. The future for Blacks in this country looks rather grim if you think about it: too much race mixing and high unemployment. Maybe even Whites might go as far as bringing back a more subtle system of Jim Crow to restrict our freedoms. Who knows but I know things will get worse for Blacks before they get better.
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@Peanut
”Black men will still be facing the same issues and let’s see if the white, Asian, non-black Latinas and whoever else rallies together for Black men’s cause…let’s see if they march with them the way Black women do and continue to do….”
Most non Black women don’t give a damn about Black men and only date them for superficial reasons like they have a big **** and other crap. Some of them do look beyond race and date the person. However most non Black women prefer their own men and Black men should realize that.
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sondis
the spurs doing they thing right now
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@ why
Jason momoa
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bernardo braga
mmmm
http://www.tumblr.com/tagged/bernardo%20braga
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This fine man from git fresh group
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Jason and Bernardo look white, or should I say “of European descent”.
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There’s this unattractive B-list Hollywood actress, forget her name but she usually in unusual films. I was surprised to find she is married to a super fine bi or tri-racial man who is a folk musician I think. Anyone here know who I’m talking about?
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From what I recall reading, Jason Momoa is part white and part Hawaiian.
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I read Jason momoan is part native American and bernardo is Brazilian
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On his father’s side, Momoa is part native Hawaiian AND part Native American [as well as German & Irish] according to this excerpt from his Wikipedia entry:
“An only child, Momoa was born in Honolulu, Hawaii, the son of Coni, a photographer, and Joseph Momoa, a painter.[4] He was raised in Norwalk, Iowa, by his mother.[5] His father is of Native Hawaiian descent, while his mother is of German, Irish, and Native American ancestry.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jason_Momoa
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“bernardo is Brazilian”
Brazilian is the nationality, like “American”. It says nothing about his ethnicity.
I’m betting both Jason and Bernardo are of European descent.
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OK the unattractive b-list Hollywood actress is Laura Dern and her handsome mixed race hubby (now ex?) is Ben Harper.
http://perezhilton.com/tag/ben_harper
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Correction:
Jason Momoa’s Native American, German and Irish heritage is through his mother; his father is of Native Hawaiian descent.
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Who is Tommy Sotomayor?
The only time I see this name is on this blog. Same thing with Sgt Willie Pete, or whoever. I used to perused all kinds of Black-oriented sites when I first started on the internet. After getting a stomach churning overdose of BW bashing from many of them, I made a point not to spend time on sites where that was a frequent membership pastime. To this day, I refrain from seeking out / viewing such material.
In all honesty, the only time I’m exposed to the BW bashing / racio-misogyny nowadays, is when it makes its semiannual visit to this blog in the form of the usual cast of characters who rarely post unless a Bash-a-Black-Woman carnival is underway….
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fiamma I didn’t know who he was until recently. his vids are on youtube. look him up at ur own risk. He bashes black women in his vids and blames black women. don’t watch if u don’t want to get upset. I don’t really watch those kinds of vids I like watching positive ones like truewise7, kemetprince1 they are positive brothas with beautiful spirits
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Thank you for the response, Mstoogood4yall. I’ll certainly be sure to avoid anything having to do with Tommy Sotomayor from now on!
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Tommy Sotomayor is an ugly Black man who bashes Black women on Youtube because he can’t get a Black woman. I would ignore the likes of him.
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@ peanut
yeah music aint what it used to be especially hip hop
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=biuuD2HIyzM)
@Sondis
that game was crazy, ppl who went to see it got their money’s worth. last second 3 pointer by the heat.
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@ Peanut
“STOP BEING IN DENIAL AND WAKE UP!”—I guess this is a sign I need to get out more. LOL. I really honestly only see it online.
@ Adeen
That is my feelings about this guy. I saw his attack on Jill Scott and it screamed weak azz man. I don’t know if it self hate or a hate for black women period. He seems to be highly upset by rejection from black women which makes me wonder about that.
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” I saw his attack on Jill Scott and it screamed weak azz man. I don’t know if it self hate or a hate for black women period. He seems to be highly upset by rejection from black women which makes me wonder about that.”
Did Jill Scott reject him?
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peanut, i don’t get it. what went down between TS and JS?
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@Peanut
Not really; White men already date out, its something that’s even been mentioned in one of Abagonds earlier posts, men, white men included, are basically dogs and go out with anybody they feel attracted to.
White Men and Black Women simply aren’t in the same scenarios, aside from the fact white men, men in general really, don’t have “dating magazines” or anything that really deals with that aspect of life.
We have magazines like Maxim that basically are a soft core version of playboy, that will include ladies of color from time to time.
Men also have by and large substantially lower standards than women do, its like that Black Men in Brazil documentary on your blog, the woman who made 100 grand wanted a husband who at least made 70 grand and had a comparable amount of education, while a man wouldn’t “mind” those things he wouldn’t have to have those things if she had a good personality and was reasonably attractive.
So the “need” so to speak; to date out is less from that perspective, which interestingly enough even so men on average still date out a couple times or so more than women do.
The reason a magazine like that will never exist for men, is because the need simply doesn’t exist for one to be there.
White men already date out; no one has to suggest it too us.
And to some extent that’s even true comparing black women to the other races of women, most other races of women date out more than black women, so those few women who would be without a man if they didn’t date out already are, the need to date out of the race is already being taken care of.
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Deleted comments by Why and Adeen about Bollywood as off topic.
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You’re all pretty wrong about this. I personally prefer white men. I never felt very attracted o Asian,Latino or black men, and I’m black and hispanica. I never looked for a saviour in any color, I always sought love and commitment I don’t believe any black woman looks for a saviour in a white man either. I’m simply just more attracted to some white men. I don’t prefer shorter,heavier men, I prefer taller,Atheist, liberal funny,romantic white men. That’s not to say, there are no tall,atheist,funny, black men. It’s just white men make me feel…… horny. Bottom line is some white who I feel attracted toguys make me wet! I don’t mean to be unlady like it’s just I have my sexual preferences. Some white guys prefer dark skin. Does that mean they have deep psychological issues? I think not! It just means darker women turn them on! Whenever I dated white guys before I was married, I noticed many black men who were haters. Well I apologize because when i was single and horny, I looked for white guys to date. I am married. My first husband and current husband are white!
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@ Peanut
1. I admit I would like my sons to marry black women, but far more important than that is that their marriages are good and happy.
2. No.
3. IN GENERAL blacks are better off with other blacks, or at least another person of colour. BUT no one lives their life in general. You have to deal with people as individuals. As I said in the post, the danger dating out is internalized racism, which could lead you into it for the wrong reasons, for reasons other than love. Those who bash blacks of the opposite sex, like Sgt Willie Pete and the BWE crew, are a case in point.
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@ Peanut
Do you want to do a guest post on Tommy Sotomayor? My door is open. You know where to email me.
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From laromana:
Peanut says,
“and with all of the stuff that I’ve said I STILL think that Black women should remain open to other races of men. I think Black women should look at Black men, Asian men, Latino Men, white men and all men as long as they are not racist and as long as the Black woman isn’t carrying self-hate, then I don’t see a problem with it…because frankly there are A SURPLUS of Black American women, so it’s not a big deal if some Black women date non-Black men and Black men aren’t worried about holding down the Black community in droves or they wouldn’t be dating out at more than twice the rate of Black women…”
oh I also can’t forget other ethnicities of Black men like Afro-latinos, Jamaicans, Haitians (Abagond , afro-arabs and also samoan men for you mstoogood
Laromana says,
I totally agree with you that BW should remain open to forming relationships ofmutual respect with quality men of any race who aren’t racist towards BW.
I also believe that BW don’t owe anyone an apology/justification for who they choose to love, date and/or marry.
Like any other human being on the planet, they are free to love, date, and/or marry whoever they want.
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@ Kiwi
It was LAROMANA who said that. She cannot leave comments on this blog for some strange reason, so she emails them to me and I post them. She is the one who uses burgundy letters..
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@ Peanut
I agree with you on the interracial trend. If Black people – and especially Black men – were so “loved” by everybody, then why isn’t there a big effort to end these issues: mass incarceration, unequal education, police brutality? None of these non-black people who say they love blacks seem to care about these problems disproportionately affect us.
And with the White population declining, I think there’s going to be serious backlash against Black people.
I used to think that President Obama’s presidency symbolized a change in the times, but now I believe that it’s just a catalyst to push race relations backwards. Now I see why many White Conservatives said let’s take back America. Maybe it’s a sign of a 21st Century Reconstruction Age:
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@ Why?
It was as simple as her stating she would not do his show and his mother would be ashamed (by something he said on his show). He blew up at her like a psycho. Called her all out her name.
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@ Why?
It is on youtube
@ Delores
“You’re all pretty wrong about this.”—What part was wrong? Are you attracted to some white men or white men? I am a bit confused on that part.
Anyway if you were presented with three men (white, Asian, Black) making the same amount of income, ready to commit, personality and physically what you are looking for which would you choose?
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@ Kiwi
“Some of them are so full of themselves and will proudly proclaim how much better they are because they can “upgrade themselves to white men””—I have seen this with black women and it is simple a form of self-hate to me.
@Peanut
Do the guest post. I would like to see your take and responses in regards to TS.
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Peanut,
Why do you (and several other posters) keep saying that the white media is pushing interracial marriage / relationship on black women/ people?
I mostly see black women advocating interracial dating/marriage. Even though their articles are posted in the white-owned magazines, it is still black women that are pushing it and the magazines are publishing.
these TV shows that are pushing interracial romances have black writers that are advocating for these unions because they believe that white America doesn’t want to accept that these relationships exist.
In the past, they used to cut out black spouses or dates of prominent white people… It’s only recently that they are willing to “show” interracial couples.
White publications and media will advocate anything that is popular and makes them money.
I am truly trying to see this POV but I don’t see white writers pushing interracial relationships, I see black people doing this… Maybe I am reading different articles than everyone else.
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“Peanut,
white writers DISALLOW functional black relationships to exist on TV, if someone submits a proposal for a non-degrading portrayal of a Black couple it get scrapped, if someone submits a proposal for an interracial black relationships, it gets approved…that’s racist.”
Linda says,
Wouldn’t you say it is being pushed to Black people because black people themselves have shown that they are open to interracial relationships. The white media is not doing this in a vacuum.
I mentioned earlier that I have a girlfriend who is a casting agent. People like her and others in the industry have been trying for years to have TV and movies represent black people in positive roles.. it’s been a fight. but These same industry people also have pushed for interracial screen time, (not just in romantic relationships) because of the racism that has always existed that kept black actors out of prominent and positive roles.
TV media makes money by the amount of people viewing these shows… and the numbers unfortunately show that these negative TV shows that have dysfunctional black people/relationships receive High viewing rates by black people — such as the episode with Ayanla and DMX
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@ Adeen:
Thank you for the compliment my beautiful black woman. ^_^
I would like to be able to compliment my beautiful sistas, my queens posts pictures of beautiful black people but not of yourselves.
I know we as black people are used to being ashamed of our blackness, living in a white supremacist society, that rejects us when we celibate our own, natural beauty. I.E. Going natural with our hair and style of dress.
This is our community, don’t be ashamed as you will not be judged here, if your body is curvaceous, voluptuous or slim, you will be celebrated here.
If you have blue black dark skin, dark brown skin,light brown skin, light skin, you will not be judged here, natural hair you say? you will not be judged here, you will be celebrated.
Seeing these pictures of beautiful black people is a wonderful thing but i want to gaze upon a every day black woman type of woman, not a model.
So come out my beautiful black women, post a picture of yourselves so i can return some of the compliments I’ve been, receiving. ^_^
I’m curious as to what the people i choose to call my brothas and sistas, look like, there’s nothing wrong with that, right? @ : o D ) >
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Following shows created by black people:
Negative / dysfunctional relationships
Basketball wives created by Shaunie O’Neal
Love and Hip Hop created by Mona Scott-Young
Positive / functional
Girlfriends, The Game, Mara Brock Akil (she also wrote on Moesha, South Central, and The Jamie Foxx Show)
show featuring black actress in a lead role and in interracial relationship (new trend never done before)
Scandal created by Shonda Rhimes
Hawthorne created by John Masius (who is white)
other shows with positive black families
Good Times created by Eric Monte and Mike Evans
What’s Happening by Eric Monte
The Cosby Show by Bill Cosby
Fresh Prince by Andy Borowitz (white but with black co-writer)
My Wife and Kids by Damon Wayans
A lot of black people in the industry have been and continue to push for change but if black people prefer to support “negative” shows over positive ones — why would the media ignore where the money is to be made.
I think those of us who want more positive shows and relationships shown are being outnumbered by black people who support the negativity.
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“Peanut,
there is NO NEED to push interracial relationships as if they’re superior while simultaneously DISALLOWING positive portrayals of black relationships”
Linda says,
well, I guess it comes down to perception and how “seeing” interracial couples is interpreted by the viewer because I have yet to hear anyone on these TV shows or movies say “Interracial” relationships are better but I’ve read articles by black women saying this
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“Peanut,
all I want is fair representation, not Basketball Wives, not Precious, not The Help, not Red Tails…but fair representation that shows Black people in functional relationships for once”
Linda says,
I agree… I feel as if all the gains the older generation made are being lost by a younger generation that is out “to get theirs” and make money and not protecting the gains.
Not sure why things are slipping backwards, but like you, I don’t like it either.
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Linda:
“and the numbers unfortunately show that these negative TV shows that have dysfunctional black people/relationships receive High viewing rates by black people — such as the episode with Ayanla and DMX”
You’re misinterpreting the reason, why black people are watching these shows.
Black people are grossly unrepresented in TV,movies media ect.. So when we see ANYTHING with black people in it, we gravitate to it, simply because we are staved for anything that has our likeness.
I don’t spend a single dime on any movie i watch, because I’m so damn tired of watching, pasty white people on TV.
I actually watched superman, last night. ( didn’t pay to see it ) i guess Lawrence Fishburne and the black general are the two token black men in this high budget movie.
I guess even an alien from another world ( superman ), can’t escape the effect of white supremacy, he never saves a black person.
I refuse to support white Hollywood and neither should any of you, being they don’t represent you in any serious way.
Let me give you an analogy.
when a dog hasn’t had food for a whole day and you give it bones with no meat on it, he’s going to eat that bone, regardless of the fact that it has no meat.
I’m not comparing black people to dog by the way, its just an analogy.
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Peanut
@ sondis,
no poetry?
I don’t understand the question. ^_^
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I hear you Sondis and agree. I don’t go to the movies anymore either…I couldn’t bring myself to see Precious (because it WAS written by a black man) I can’t support black people who feed into the negativity.
For someone like myself (coming from the generation where you really Didn’t see black people in the media) — there are more black people now than ever before on TV and in other media…. and it was a tough fight for the black industry insiders.
That’s why I felt excited about Tyler Perry because Spike Lee was all by himself and John Singleton (but I didn’t like the gangster type movies he was hyping up)
Trust me, I realize the fight is far from over but being “hungry” doesn’t excuse eating arsenic instead of a something nutritious.
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Well, curiosity got the better of me and I just viewed a few of Tommy Sotomayor’s YouTube videos.
@ Peanut,
I too would be interested in reading and responding to a guest article written by you regarding your concerns with Tommy Sotomayor.
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I do read Kola Boof — I like her even though sometimes she is off the chain and says contradictory things (such as not seeing mixed people as really black but she advocates black women getting with white men)
I’ve posted a few of her articles… Abagond gave her a post.
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Peanut:
Thank you, friend. ^_^ It just comes out when i write something that i am passionate about. I never seem to make it a point to write in a poetic fashion, it comes out naturally.
I know of Tommy sotomyor, I’ve watched a few of his videos on YouTube.
The black man is a mess, he has self hatred in the worse way, so i just ignore em and don’t watch his YouTube channel anymore.
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not sure who Tommy Sotomayor is…. and I don’t really like this whole BWE vs black men thing because it’s divisive and too me, a bunch of personal and individual views that don’t represent the majority of black people.
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@ peanut
“every other woman who was there in an romantic sense was non-black…”
wow, are u a friend of his? and how many non black women were there, im confused was it some sort of dating thing? that is nasty if all those non black women were dating him lol
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@ sondis
“So come out my beautiful black women, post a picture of yourselves so i can return some of the compliments I’ve been, receiving. ^_^
I’m curious as to what the people i choose to call my brothas and sistas, look like, there’s nothing wrong with that, right? @ : o D ) >”
ok *gets camera*
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“Peanut @ Kola Boof has said time again that Black women need to start raising our children, whether they are Black or mixed to value Blackness, that is what she advocates. So I don’t really think she is contradicting anything”
Linda says,
I agree that anyone with African blood should value their black African heritage and put it on par with their rest of their genetics…
I don’t see black Americans as being the representatives of what is “blackness” because so much of the African has been lost in black American culture; whereas, in the Caribbean and South America, we’ve retained a good deal more “African” in our culture.
but I’ve run across “Afrocentric” black people in the US who believe that race mixing is a “no-no” because it dilutes the “black” race and they hold up afro-Caribbeans/ Latinos and Latin American people as an example of “when race-mixing goes wrong”
So, if to be “black” is to be “as pure as possible”, then how can Kola’s view that black women dating white men be OK?
As Kola said:
and about black women dating out:
Black Women Need to Start “Swirling Into Reality” Says Kola Boof
http://www.beyondblackwhite.com/swirling-review-by-womanist-kola-boof/
There is no way to reconcile these words — so to me, she contradicts herself. I do understand the mindset and reasoning behind why she feels that black women should have dating options open but to me, it still represents conflicting views regardless of her rationale.
Don’t get me wrong, think it’s possible to date /marry interracially and also learn about and love your African heritage at the same time because to me, that is what being “black” as a diaspora African descendant represents… knowing your African heritage and loving yourself and being proud of your African heritage.
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and to be fair to Kola Boof, she does call it like she sees it…
the one thing she and I both agree on is that the American “one-drop rule” is BS
Kola:
She also makes the following statement which I disagree with:
Mixed-race people that experience racism can see and love Africa the same as “authentic” black people — we’re all affected by internalized racism and colourism and we all have to work to remove the same Eurocentric blinders.
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@ j
“The amount of time black people spend thinking and writing about dating white people is sooooo embarrassing. You will NEVER see Maxim, FHM, GQ, Esquire, Cosmopolitan or Glamour write an article encouraging it’s readers to date and mate with black people. I truly believe 99% of black people are hopelessly brainwashed.”
Absolutely agree. It is incredibly embarrassing that there are many of us Blacks who spend so much time writing/encouraging dating outside one’s race on blogs/websites. Just pathetic, so desperate to seek acceptance from other races (most of the planet looks down/despises Blacks lets be honest here),
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@ Ellis and J
It is indeed an embarrassment!! Smh
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@ Mstoogood4yall:
I knew it! i knew you were a beautiful black woman! Nice smile! @ : o D ) >
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Yes, mstoogood4yall has a sweet face and a nice smile. She’s quite wise for her age too!
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[…] My position on relationships between black women and white men […]
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@ sondis & fiamma
*blushes* aw thanks, I guess I get it from my momma. she is in her late 40s and ppl think we are twins or sisters lol. Black don’t crack.
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^ whats so funny peanut ?
I wanna laugh too
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[…] Black men have an easier time dating/marrying interracially because women of other races desire them also. I think the lack of opportunity for white men and black women to form romantic relationships is an excuse. […]
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@My views on relationships between Black women and White men
Well said plus White men dating Black women suffer from a stigma. White women with blond hair, blue eyes and thin bodies are the epitome of beauty and dating a Black woman is going against that standard of ”beauty”(I digest because I believe there is other forms of beauty besides blond hair and blue eyes). Plus since most Black women don’t like or desire White men and turn them down(I know I will never date a White guy because I believe no guy would ever find me worthy of a relationship especially a White guy….sad to say but true). I can list more reasons but I am not going to right now.
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[…] Because black women are, first and foremost, women it seems strange to me for so many white men to seem like they feel no attraction for them – unless, of course, you assume they are looking at the world through a racist … […]
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@Sondis
Thanks. Should I post pictures of myself looking like a model or regular person? Most of my pictures are me looking like a model lol!
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Post whatever picture you choose, Adeen. ^_^
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@My views on relationship between Black women and White men
White men don’t actively pursue Black women in America. It is rare that they do in this country. Many of them don’t want to have a serious relationship with us but they would sleep with a Black woman if they find her sexually attractive. And I am guessing the rest are not really attracted to Black women in that way.
It is rare to find a White man who would look beyond a Black woman’s race and color and accept her for who she is. That is the truth.
Look, I already have enough Black men who don’t accept me for who I am and I don’t need validation from a White guy to prove my beauty. And that is why I would never date a White guy as well as for cultural reasons. I write this however in reality I find it strange when White guys show interest in me but I know it is never genuinely only for sexual reasons.
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@Peanut
I am glad you pointed that out as well because many Black men don’t accept or love me either. I am too thin, short or dark for their tastes. Many of them not all. I already deal with crap from Black men. I know White men wouldn’t be any different either.
If I do date outside my race(I am almost at the point where I am sick of the disrespect I get from Many Black men), I wouldn’t date Whites. I would date Latinos and Asians.
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what happened to your picture, Adeen? I can’t click on it to see it.
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@Peanut
You aren’t angry or bitter, you were just expressing how you feel. I can relate to how you feel, trust me! That is why I have stayed single and will always be single forever, I could never see a guy ever being interested in dating me. However I don’t think you should give up because you will find a nice man, one day. Trust me, you will find someone and he could be from another race too.
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@Peanut
You are right. Thanks but I don’t find myself beautiful, only average. At school guys don’t pay attention to me only random White guys and I don’t like it. I felt ugly my whole junior year and I don’t know why.
Peanut, you will find someone. Don’t stress out.
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Adeen Danica Mckenzie:
where did your picture go? I wasn’t able to click on it.
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@Peanut, people are as “loyal” as their options. Nobody has any sort of obligation to be with someone they don’t want to be with because the community thinks it’s a good idea. This demand is always thrown at black men who date non-black women by black women who themselves date or dream of dating non-black men. It makes no sense. It’s like criticizing the personal romantic choices of Michael Jordan or Tiger Woods while ignoring or cheering on those of Kerry Washington or Halle Berry. Hypocrisy.
As has been pointed out repeatedly on this post and several others most black men who marry, date or have children do so with black women. Those who don’t are in a distinct minority, always have been and probably always will be. Contrary to some folks paranoia most white women do not, have not and probably will never consider most black men as their best option. I have never understood the mindset that is worried about who other people are sleeping with. This isn’t peculiar to black women of course, they just seem to be quite vocal about it but every group does it and it’s wrong. People belong to themselves, not the “community”.
You keep talking about a surplus of black women. Well not every black woman is marriageable material. Many just aren’t. So the “surplus” may not be as huge as you think. And since black women, like other women, tend towards hypergamy, they are probably overlooking quite a few black men.That’s fine. People need to pursue their own interests. I just don’t think that speaking of black men as if they are some sort of natural resource to which black women have rights of first refusal is very helpful.
As has been said on a different blog, a black woman, heck ANY woman who can’t find a man needs to work on her appearance and lower her standards. It really is that simple. Ultimately things work themselves out for most people. Freaking out over stats around dating or marriage doesn’t help an individual.
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@ Peanut
If you want to write a response to this post, I will guest post it. It would, however, require you to sum up all thoughts in 500 words and put you in the hot seat.
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@ Peanut
I understand ur frustration, and I do hope u do the response post. Both men and women aren’t what they used to be, roles are being reversed and I think that is where some of the chaos is coming from. There are some black men who are disrespectful to black women. I see it on youtube and such, it does get tiring to see ppl talking about some of the crazy black women then trying to say we are all like that. Ppl need to understand, not all black women act like that, and its like where do young good black women like us fit in? One minute they say we are ghetto the next its we’re too uppity and need to know our place.
You are not a bitter black woman, just because we vent sometimes doesn’t make us bitter. it is natural to get angry and its good to get it out. It seems like black women are told to be strong, don’t cry, don’t talk about ur feelings, put others first . We are not superwomen, we get burnout too. yes men like our fathers are hard to find especially with this generation and the coming ones. TO be fair women aren’t what they used to be either,some think they deserve a man just because they have a degree but they don’t know how to be a wife. but there are some of us who are those things can cook, clean, etc. Nobody understands us but us. Black men don’t know what its like to be us but there are some who are willing to try to understand. yes black men are on a pedestal right now but that will not last, trends last a little while. when a house is being remodeled they tear out the old walls and build new ones, this is what we need to tear down the hurt, pain, and insecurity. And build new ones with love, respect, and peace. I know u may be feeling like why do we have to work on ourselves what about them. well we are the most hurt right now and need to retreat for a time to get ourselves together and come back stronger than before. the men can either get with the program or get lost, in the end we are the choosers, the nurtures, the birthers, don’t let anybody try to diminish ur worth or ur womanhood.
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@ adeen
You are not ugly, even if I can’t click on ur pic to enlarge it I can tell you are beautiful. So what if ur skinny shoot im the opposite, ppl are going to say things regardless. If ur too skinny they say u are ugly if ur too big they say u are ugly, not all of us fit into the thick curvy category. even women that do are teased about it [serena Williams]. The most important thing is loving urself where u are right now, I could lose a few pounds but I love myself where I am and am choosing to enjoy my journey to where I want/need to be. The beautiful and frustrating thing about life is find urself and being comfortable with who u are. As far as the guys not paying attention don’t worry about them, they young and playing games, u don’t need that. There will be a man that will find u attractive,then u will need some pepper spray lol.
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Adeen Danica Mckenzie:
Are you the same person as Adeen?
I asked you twice about your picture and you ignored me. Maybe you are a different person, that’s why you’re not responding to me questions?
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@Peanut
Don’t get discouraged. You shouldn’t freak out against this interracial dating crap. Personally I am not for interracial dating between Black people and White people but you should realize that most people prefer their own kind. Don’t let this get to you. You will find someone who will love you for you and it could be from another race. Or a Black man. You never know. Plus you should realize that you are a beautiful Black woman and develop confidence in yourself.
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@Sondis
I am the same person. Adeen Danica Mckenzie is my facebook name. Sorry, I will change my profile picture on Facebook soon to a more updated one.
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Adeen:
Oh, there you go…thought you were ignoring me for a second.
Its just that the picture is non-click-able and i can’t even make your face out, being the picture is too small and i can’t click on it to enlarge it. ^_^
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@Sondis
I updated my profile picture. I hope this picture of big enough for you to click on it 🙂
http://i2.wp.com/graph.facebook.com/100001891870322/picture?q=type%3Dlarge%26_md5%3D3bd5276648fdb3ce89088f49157ce174&resize=48%2C48
This is the picture.
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Adeen:
Nope, no dice with that picture either.
Its alright, you don’t have to keep messing with it on my account. I just can’t see you as its too small. I don’t see how anyone else was able to see you but i couldn’t it. lol
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@ sondis
lol I can’t really see either but I can tell she is beautiful. Anyway my computer screen is about to break away from my laptop and the screen Is turning green lol.
halle berry is biracial so I don’t see her dating a white man as dating out because she is half white.
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@Peanut:
“Women of color in america have grown up within a symphony of anger,
at being silenced, at being unchosen, at knowing that when we survive,
it is in spite of a world that takes for granted our lack of humanness, and which hates our very existence outside of its service.
And I say symphony rather than cacophony because we have had to learn to orchestrate those furies so that they do not tear us apart.
We have had to learn to move through them and use them for strength and force and insight within our daily lives.
Those of us who did not learn this difficult lesson did not survive.
And part of my anger is always libation for my fallen sisters.”
— —Audre Lorde, “Uses of Anger”
Godspeed as you learn to orchestrate the furies my sister. You are truly and deeply loved. I don’t want to have to pour a libation for you and count you amongst the fallen.
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@Sondis and Mstoogood4yall
Great replies and thanks for calling me beautiful, Mstoogood4yall. But Halle Berry is considered Black but society despite being biracial.
This is more like it, Sondis. I hope you could see this one.
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I also don’t care who tiger woods is with either. But tiger woods and halle berry are different. tiger woods only dates white women and he is black and Asian, so he dates neither race he is mixed with. Halle berry dates black and white men, she is black and white, she does date men who race she is mixed with, so that is comparing apples to oranges. As far as Kerry Washington and Michael Jordan, I don’t care just as long as they don’t bash their race. if they have then f them. I really don’t watch any movies so I didn’t know who Kerry Washington was until ppl were talking about django and she was in it. No I don’t watch that dumb show scandal,never will.
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@ adeen
lol the pic says unavailable, anyway no thanks needed, u are beautiful I don’t lie.
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@Mstoogood4yall
I don’t watch Scandal because it is a stupid and unnecessary show. Most Black women and Black men were made for each other. Like I said before, I don’t support interracial unions between Blacks and Whites, I believe people are better off dating within their own race especially us Black people.
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Re: Kola Boof, Linda said,
“There is no way to reconcile these words — so to me, she contradicts herself. I do understand the mindset and reasoning behind why she feels that black women should have dating options open but to me, it still represents conflicting views regardless of her rationale.”
Well because then white people wouldn’t be getting whiter, they’d be getting browner.
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Mstoogood4yall:
Adeen is correct.
In America, if you’re half black, half white, you’re considered black.
So Hallie berry is black by white society standards.
We didn’t create this, “one drop rule” we just go by it, being we have no choice. We are what they say we are, regardless what we say.
White people love to point out that a black person is half white, when it suits them, President obama is a perfect example.
When white people refer to average everyday bi-racial person, they call them black but if that bi-racial person is someone of great importance and famous, then they wanna claim that black person and all of a sudden, that black person, becomes, “bi-racial” or “half white/half black”
Its all bull in my book…
Far as halle berry, i never saw her with a black man, far as a relationship. can someone post a name or article or photo of Hallie Barry, being in a relationship with a black man, please?
I’ve always seen her with a white man, she even had a child by a white ma and guess what?, he’s not with her anymore.
Still think white men are better than black men in terms of staying with the mother of their children?
The only reason that white man, married Hallie berry was because of her fame and she was half white. That white man, wouldn’t have look at Hallie if she was a full black woman, let alone with she wasn’t famous.
@ Adeen, mstogood is right, that picture says, “unavailable”
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Peanut said,
“I just saw the sexiest black man at the pool…he had a chiseled stomach, nice Hershey chocolate skin, a very handsome/masculine face, nice brown eyes, strong shoulders…I wonder if he dates black women…there’s a 95% chance that he does…according to some”
Well, did you smile at him or otherwise indicate interest? I know you won’t approach and initialize first. But you MUST indicate interest in some way so a man knows he’s in the clear if he approaches you.
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@Peanut of course you don’t think it’s comparable because you are a black woman. =)
It’s exactly the same process by which white men try to keep all the white women for themselves while still seeking to maximize their own choices. Black men men do the same as do white women, asian men, hispanic men, hispanic women, EVERYBODY. It’s a human hypocrisy. It’s not one that bothers me all that much but people ought to recognize it.
No, I disagree. Some of the BWE crowd are exactly as full of hatred for black men as any Stormfront member. They will tell you so too. Anyone who is constantly attacking the opposite gender of their own race has issues in my opinion.
You keep mentioning “loyalty” but only seem to want to apply that to black men. I mentioned Berry and Washington (and that could be a much longer list) because they simply do not get the negative interest or disdain from the black community (esp black women) for their personal romantic choices that similarly situated black men do. People don’t by and large primarily decide who to sleep with,date and marry out of loyalty, though that may be a part of the consideration. They try to get the best person they can get, given their own attractiveness and desires. It’s always been that way. It always will be that way.
As far as differing dating interracial dating/marriage ratios between black men and black women I don’t see how it’s black men’s fault that non-black women are slightly more open to dating/marrying black men than non-black men are to doing so with black women. This is a relatively recent phenomenon from what I can see and may have something to do with removal of Jim Crow. But in any event as reviews of any dating site or Census stats show IR dating/marriage between blacks and non-blacks and between blacks and whites is still extremely low. The overwhelming majority of blacks are dating/marrying/reproducing with other black people. This focus on whites is a red herring.
People are telling white women to lower their standards and work on their attractiveness all the time. The decline of marriage has started to hit whites noticeably.There are more than a few books, blogs, and websites aimed at whites that are also discussing marriage strikes, women waiting too long to marry, men and women avoiding marriage, white men seeking wives in Europe or Asia, women earning six figures only looking for men earning more and so on.The only difference is that these discussions tend not to be racialized as much. Other than that they can become just as agitated.
No matter who you are, man or woman, black, white, other, if you are not finding the mate you want, you need to work on yourself first. Because you are not entitled to anyone. You also have 100% control of yourself so it’s much easier to make changes. Like I wrote before things work out one way or the other for most people. Folks just need to stop worrying about other people’s choices.
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@Sondis
She did date a few Black men but they were biracial like her though. I have never seen her with a full Black man before either yet Black men rave about her as if she is the best thing to walk on two legs. SMH.
White men aren’t better than Black men and vice versa. You are right that White men only date her for her fame and being half White. If she wasn’t famous, I doubt Black men would be interested in her either.
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@ sondis
Halle was married to eric benet. Yes biracials are viewed as being black, but do u think halle’s daughter should be called black when she has a white father and a biracial mother, that would make her more white than anything. I think halle falls into the category of thinking one race of men will act right instead of lookin at her self. I still think she might be crazy, everything that glitters aint gold. She has daddy issues her father left when she was young and that is probably why she don’t really date black men but thinks white men will stick around. she was raised by her white mother same as Obama, and they both have daddy issues and aren’t neutral when it comes to dealing with black men. They think white ppl are better, because they didn’t have black ppl raise them.
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@ The Alchemist
Great quote from Audre Lorde.
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@mstoogood…I hear you, sis, but not all biracial people are viewed as black. What about folks who can “pass” for white or something besides black? And to me, Halle’s daughter can’t pass for white. She doesn’t look black but she doesn’t really look white either. And Halle is biracial, but she is darker than her daughter.
I also don’t agree with the claim that Obama and Halle think white people are better. Halle would not publicly identify herself as black if this were true. She would most likely try to distance herself from Black folks. There are plenty of mixed people raised by white mothers who embrace both sides of their heritage. If Obama felt that white people were better, he wouldn’t have married a sista…let alone a dark-skinned sista like Michelle.
Now as to Halle’s love life, I think it is safe to say that she does a poor job of picking ’em. Most of the men she has been involved with have not been good to her. And she seems to be somewhat unstable. She has been with everyone from midnight-black Wesley Snipes to her white baby-daddy, but her relationships don’t seem to work out. I don’t think race is a factor when it comes to her choice in men…I think she has “daddy issues” like you said, though, and THAT is probably why she has problems in general.
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@Adeen…she used to be heavily involved with Wesley Snipes at one point. It has even been speculated that he was abusive to her, which is why she has only 80% of the hearing in one of her ears. So I wouldn’t say that she has never been with a Black man before. I see what you’re saying, though.
To me, Halle is beautiful but a bit over-hyped. She has long been considered the poster girl for a beautiful black/biracial actress in Hollywood, as well as America. I think some people are followers and this is why they see her as the end-all, be-all. She is beautiful but when a person is constantly pushed to the masses, some folks can’t think for themselves. Like for instance, the latest Miss Alabama and girlfriend of football star AJ McCarron…her name is Katherine Webb. Sports announcers made a big deal about her looks and then a whole bunch of average Joes started doing the same. It’s just something that spreads like wildfire.
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Peanut, you said you are on the verge of a nervous breakdown. Your life is negatively effected by your concern for the hate you perceive people have of black women. I think this is all exacerberated by the internet, or even mostly caused by the internet. I’ve noticed that people who spend a large chunk of their time reading negative things and then repeating those negative things on the internet are unhappy.
You are young. You have your whole life ahead of you and there is a big wide world of positivity out there for you to explore. May I be so bold as to suggest you get off the internet and get out there and start living!
Negativity breeds negativity and positivity breeds positivity.
Set your mental meter to a positive default. Screen information and media for positivity only. Surround yourself with beauty and happy content.
You attract what you are. So if you are positive, you will attract only positive people into your life. The negative people will not be attracted to you. And if they are, after a while your totally opposite world view will not jive with theirs and you will drift apart.
Its a metaphysical teaching that we attract what we are.
I also recommend meditation classes.
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^ yes I know not all biracials are viewed as black . paula pattons son could pass for white.
http://eurweb.zippykid.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/paulajulian.jpgla
Ok Obama and halle may not think white ppl are better, but Obama does act more sympathetic towards them, and condescending towards black men.
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Personally, I have no problem with interracial relationships as long as there is no self-hate involved and no bashing of one’s own race. I know a few Black men who date WW and Latinas, which isn’t a problem, except that these men bash BW and they allow their non-black partners to do the same.
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In all likelihood since she did not mention black men, the writer is talking of white men. But marriage is just not the deal it used to be for men, across racial lines. Black men are just a bit ahead of white men in recognizing this. Until marriage changes somewhat I think people of all races will struggle to find a new equilibrium.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/helen-smith/8-reasons-men-dont-want-t_b_3467778.html
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“Same with OJ Simpson, he married a waitress ,Tiger Woods married a Nanny, so that’s bull sh*t that you said right there…Black men GO DOWN when they date outside the race all of the time…”
These are celebrities. Its not uncommon for celebrities to “go down” quite a bit, but when it comes to regular folk, assortive mating is the norm.
White trash Tammy from the trailer park is not going to marry a black executive. The black executive will marry a woman within the same socio-economic class as he, or at least the very minimum middle class. She might not be quite as educated and accomplished as he (since women usually want men who are more accomplished than they) but she won’t be too far behind.
White trash Tammy is usually paired with Pookie from da’ hood. Pookie might look better because he has a muscular physique whereas Tammy might be sloppy and pushing 200 pounds, but socio-economically they are more or less “equals.”
Also, a European nanny may be an intellectual or socio-economic equal to Tiger Woods. From what I understand, he comes from a middle class background. Northern European nannies do too. They often take a job as an “au pair” as a way to see the world after college.
Also from what I gather, a waitress is not really out of OJ’s legue who doesn’t come across as all that intellectually gifted.
Remember, star athletes often come from broken backgrounds (don’t know about him) and are far from being Einsteins.
I know several local artists and intellectuals who buss tables by night because they don’t want to sell out their craft, so don’t sell waitressing short.
I think what we need to look at is: are these people on more or less the same intellectual plane? And you will find that most people who marry are.
It is very hard for super smart people to tolerate for long the company of those they perceive as being dumb.
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@mstoogood…true about Paula’s son, but you never know how he could turn out as he gets older. His hair texture might change or something.
I’m curious as to why you think Obama is more sympathetic to white people and condescending to Black men, though. I’ve never heard a Black man say this before. Can you give me an example? I’m genuinely curious.
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Cinnamondiva, Obama apparantly gave a fathers’ day address a few years ago to a crowd of black people about how black men need to start parenting up and taking more responsibility for their children, and how black women have had to hold the fort down in absense of responsible men. Some black men took offense to this.
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Or maybe it was a Mothers Day address. In any case, it happened. ^^^
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“how come white male celebrities don’t “marry down,” when they date Black women then…??? why is it just black men with white women???”
Many people have argued that’s exactly what Robert De Nero did!
But again, how exactly have either OJ or Tiger “married down”?
Tigers wife was arguably better looking than he. Who knows? Maybe she was intellectually more agile as well. There’s nothing to indicate her family was of lesser status than his, is there?
From what I’ve read its an equal match, some could, and do, argue he pushed above his weight in the looks department.
And exactly who are intellectually challenged athletes supposed to marry? Harvard professors?
Just because someone gets famous using their body doesn’t mean they are particularly brilliant in the mind.
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Peanut, obviously Barkley, Tiger Woods ,Michael Jordan, etc chose to be with the women they’re with for whatever reason they did. I don’t know them and I don’t think you do either. I don’t care about who they’re sleeping with. The same is true of Halle Berry, Thandie Newton, Bria Myles, etc. They all made their individual choices. Again, that’s their business. I couldn’t really care less. It doesn’t impact my life. Saying that Elin Nordegren is low status is indeed your right (though it’s an incorrect statement btw) but it shows that you don’t completely understand what might attract a man to a woman. Status is just nowhere near as important to men as it is to women.
My only issue is why do you and others find it convenient to bash black men who marry or date interracially while not doing the same for black women. Freedom for me but not for thee. It’s bs no matter which group does it whether it’s white men, black men, white women whoever. It’s hypocritical.
Again, (1) most black male celebrities are dating, married to or living with black women and (2) none of them are married to you. So why are you so obsessed with who other people are with? I just don’t understand.
Abagond already did a post on BWE with tons of links. I stand by what I wrote. Many of those women , by their own statements have a bone deep contempt for black men that is as intense as any white racist’s. You can go back to Abagond’s post and read what they have to say yourself. Or you can go here and see the vitriol and personal attacks which a simple question engendered.
http://www.theurbanpolitico.com/2013/05/whataboutourdaughterscom-does.html
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“Nordegren was born in Stockholm, Sweden. Her mother, Barbro Holmberg, is a politician and the former Swedish migration and asylum policy minister, and the current Governor of Gävleborg County. Her father, Thomas Nordegren, is a radio journalist who served as a bureau chief in Washington, D.C.”
Tiger clearly married UP.
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“White trash Tammy from the trailer park is not going to marry a black executive” Rofl.
@ cinnamondiva
Obama is always talking about his absent father, but we never hear him talk about how his mother left him with his racist grandparents. when he talks to whites he is a pushover, he let that white woman put her finger in his face and he smile. Then when he gave that speech at the morehouse college he was telling them no excuses and such. That was a type of speech imo he should give to black men who are not going to college and are not doing things with themselves,not men who are taking responsibility and doing what they gotta do and obviously aren’t making excuses because they graduated.
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@ cinnamondiva
Okay but I find Halle beautiful but not the most beautiful. But she is a beauty. And I have a different view on interracial relationships than you do.
@Peanut
” I am disappointed in the behavior of some Black men and that’s it.”
Same here. Black American men are the only ethnic group of men who bash and put down their women openly without remorse. This doesn’t go to all Black men. I know very nice Black men. Sad to say but the worst experiences I had with guys happened to be Black men and I am a Black woman saying this! I don’t want to date a White guy either(Something I could never in a million years do unless I was high or blind).
You should try Black men from other cultures? In fact, only part of my culture is American and my other cultural heritage is West Indian(Jamaican).
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” Black American men are the only ethnic group of men who bash and put down their women openly without remorse.”
So you’re not familiar with “The Manosphere” yet, are you?
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@Peanut, stop listening to that ugly, lonely Tommy Sotomayor. I am sure that he is angry, and alone that no Black woman with common sense would want him. That is why this loser has nothing better to do than to put down Black women and list all of their flaws.
Honestly he had some good videos but most of his videos are absolute garbage. You don’t need to listen to negative men like Tommy Sotomayor.
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.”..but not all biracial people are viewed as black. What about folks who can “pass” for white or something besides black?”
– – –
Yes, when it come to categorizing the race or ethnicity of an individual, people tend to go by their own visual perception. If the person looks white to them, he will is regarded as being such — at least until it is learned that he is considered to be of some other race / ethnicity.
I’ve have many family members who appear to be unmixed whites, and they are / were typically taken to be whites by most people they meet It is mostly only on paper that these relatives are/ were viewed as being ‘Black’ by US society.
And while I myself do not appear ‘white’, I am frequently mistaken for being non-Black. Even some Blacks I’ve meet treated me disdainfully until they learned that I’m actually a Black American like they are, and not a member of the X, Y or Z race / ethnic group which they hated with such a passion….
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@WHY
I have never seen another ethnic group of men put down their own women so badly and prefer other races of women the way that Black American men do. That is the truth! Plus look at how frustrated Peanut is with her posting. No wonder she is insecure because she always hears Black men putting down Black women and uplifting White, Latinas and Asian women. How do you think it makes young, Black women like her feel?
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No, I don’t hate Black American men at all but I had to point it out that they always put down their women. And sad to say but many Black women fit into the negative stereotypical roles that Black men hate in a Black woman. Our culture is negative and not in the least but uplifting. And we, as Black people, man and woman need to take responsibility for what goes on in the Black Community, good and bad.
@Why
And I wouldn’t be shocked if you were a Black man who preferred White women.
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Adeen:
You hate me as a black man, my beautiful black sista? @ : o ( ) >
LOL joking… its all good, ima keep on professing my love for all you sistas on this blog! ^_^
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@ Sondis: I love you too Brother.
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@ adeen
I don’t think why is a man, she replied that she liked the mens pics I posted.
@sondis
We love u too *blows kiss*
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sondis I dedicate this song to you
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kp77h9YB_eU)
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@Sondis
I don’t hate Black men. I JUST hate the Black men who bash and put down Black women.
You love Black women and I do like you as a person. And Black men who love Black women.
I hope you get the memo.
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I hate Black men/mixed race Black men like Tiger Woods, Taye Diggs, OJ Simpson, etc who date outside of their race and put down Black women and uplift White women. Those are the type of Black men I hate!!
Sondis and the men in my family are the Black men who need and deserve respect because these are the Black men who love and respect Black women.
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I have a questions to ask you all here. We all know that before any official relationship starts, one person has to approach another.
a. In the case of the interracial relationship, who do you think does the approaching first? The Black person or the White person?
b. Do you think it is more socially acceptable for the Black person to approach the White person, or the White person to approach the Black person? Why?
c. Do you think that approaching someone outside of your race is done overtly or covertly? Like can a Black man just walk up to a White woman and say, “I just think you’re so beautiful. Can we go out on a date?”. Or would subtle flirting be more common?
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@Peanut
Now I see where you are coming from but please stop watching Tommy Selloutmayor! He is ugly, lonely and is not happy with himself so he picks on Blacks women and their flaws. Be happy and brave! I know you will be one day.
@Mrs. J
A) It depends but in the case of a White woman and Black male, the Black male usually approaches the White girl.
B) I think it is more acceptable for the Black person to approach the White person because in the media, they are promoting this interracial agenda where Blacks date outside of their race. For Blacks being with Whites is a step up for them since Whiteness is seen as privileged, perfect and all things good. It is not very acceptable for a White person to openly like or even approach a Black person since it is seen as dating and marrying down if they go with a Black person. Blackness is seen as bad, evil and dirty in society and marrying one is seen as marrying down.
C) Most of the time especially with White women and Black men, it is done overtly. Last year, I have seen the Black guy relentlessly go after the White girl until the point that they were holding hands by the last couple of class periods. I have seen subtle flirting too but it is rare.
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@Sondis
I don’t ever mean to offend you. NO, I DON’T hate Black men and never have. If I hated Black men, I would hate myself! No way.
Honestly I had bad experiences with MANY Black men but they don’t represent all Black men.
You seem like a cool and chilled, Brotha. My apologies to you and all good Black men out there. .
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mary burrell:
Hey you! whatcha been up too?
Adeen:
aww shucks, I’m shy now that you blew me a kiss. ^_^
It’s cool Adeen, i was just teasing you a little, no need to apologize as you haven’t said anything, offensive.
Mstoogood4yall:
Now look what ya done did, i’d done shed a tear. *_^
I just want to reveal to the black women on this blog, that i love black women so much, that it hurts me deep inside, when a black woman, says she prefers a white man. I think a lot of black woman, think black men don’t care when we see this but it does hurt.
I know some black men have different reasons for the pain but for me, its not hate for the white man that is with the black woman, its more so for the past and present.
I just can’t help but to feel hurt, knowing that white man, really doesn’t love her, want her or would marry her. The same treatment the black woman has gotten back in slavery and during Jim crow, still goes on today.
That is what makes me hurt….
Ms. J
“I have a questions to ask you all here. We all know that before any official relationship starts, one person has to approach another.”
a. In the case of the interracial relationship, who do you think does the approaching first? The Black person or the White person?
White person as they are the most, conceited people on earth.
b. Do you think it is more socially acceptable for the Black person to approach the White person, or the White person to approach the Black person? either way isn’t “socially” acceptable.
Why? Because of the racial construct this white supremacist society is built on.
c. Do you think that approaching someone outside of your race is done overtly or covertly?
I think its covert for the most part, because of the reasons i pointed out, above.
Like can a Black man just walk up to a White woman and say, “I just think you’re so beautiful.
I’m sure this crosses all color lines. some men, of any race, struggle with approaching a woman and being direct in complimenting their beauty and at the same time, asking them out. Its the fear of rejection.
Can we go out on a date?”. Or would subtle flirting be more common?
I think internet dating has created an avenue for white and black people to contact, one another on the down low. I think its not healthy and keeps both parties, disingenuous about the motives of the relationship.
I think this comes down to the individual, if the man is confident in approaching a white woman in a public settings with other white people and black people around.
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“I hate Black men/mixed race Black men like Tiger Woods, Taye Diggs, OJ Simpson, etc who date outside of their race and put down Black women and uplift White women. ”
Well, I’d hardly say OJ “uplifted” his wife!
“I have never seen another ethnic group of men put down their own women so badly and prefer other races of women the way that Black American men do. That is the truth!”
The Manosphere is all about putting down white western women and either “going your own way” by becoming celibate, or ex-patting to Asia to get a “feminine Asian wife” or Latin America to get a “feminine Latina” while “watching Rome burn” which is their euphemism for watching Western Civilization and its mutant child “Feminism” fall.
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@misstoogood4yall: That was sweet of you to dedicate that to Brother Sondis.
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@ sondis
you are a very beautiful person, inside and out. I know it is hurtful when someone says they prefer white over black. The ones that say those things are messed up and need the most healing. Both black men and women have done and said some hurtful things to the point where some of us who try to be positive start to think maybe most of them do feel that way. It’s crazy that good black men and women can’t seem to find each other and end up lonely or settle for whoever. The negative black ppl are being heard over us positive ones. They spew their hate and create division to the point where we look at each other as suspects. I love seeing black men and women in healthy relationships with each other it is a beautiful thing. It hurts knowing that ppl who have the same values, love, and respect as of my parents generation are not as prevalent today. So just for me seeing some positive black men and women motivates me and makes me happy.
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“you keep derailing the overall issue which is inequality and sexism, interracial bashing is just a byproduct of that…you can’t even at least TRY to understand where some people are coming from on this blog.”
Where did I say anything about “interracial bashing”.
Also on another thread I explained to V-4 that while I myself do not exclude any “race” from my net of potential mates, I can understand why some people do – precisely because of things like you mention above “being on the same page” culturally.
Adeen insists that only Black men bash their own women to the extent they do. That is clearly not true and I am simply pointing that out to her.
Don’t know where “interracial bashing” comes into play in your mind.
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@ peanut
Its ok don’t give ppl the time of day who try to diminish ur hurt or how u feel. I notice a lot of ppl come on here and try to compare white men/ white women issues to black men/ black woman issues. IT IS NOT THE SAME. white men have been stepping out on white women, but they still have white women on a pedestal. Yall ain’t been dethroned yet, when that happens then maybe u can complain. I don’t see how white men saying they like Asian women more than white women matters, why? because Asian women aren’t taking over white magazines and saying white women look like this or praising white women who look close to Asian or giving Asian women movie roles in place of white women. Black women have to deal with that plus not being seen as beautiful just because of our skin. The ones that do get praise are usually light skin or closer to white beauty standards. So white women complaining about white men. lol, then you’d really lose it if they started making songs about Asian women and saying they are better, but I have yet to hear of such a song.
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“because you were the one Why who said I was “bashing,” black men when I was not, don’t pretend you didn’t say that. you said I was bashing black men in interracial relationships”
What? Where on earth did I say that? Quote me!
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@Why
Thanks for telling me but White male and White women problems aren’t as bad on scale as Black problems. Whites still have more privileges than Blacks. Blacks are on the bottom of the totem pole when it comes to dating and marriage and it isn’t right that Black men walk out on Black women. White issues aren’t like Black issues so that is a bad comparison
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@Sondis
I wouldn’t date a White man, don’t worry. I don’t like them very much, well the ones in America anyways plus they think they are the best thing to walk on two legs. I couldn’t date a man I don’t have nothing in common with culturally. Plus most Black women are better off dating Black men. I know I am.
And you are such a sweetheart. I know some Black men like you too and you are handsome too.
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@Mstoogood4yall
Well said. Black and White issues are not the same. Whites still have it easier than Blacks!
@Peanut
I am sick of Black men bashing Black women and Black women bashing Black men. When will our race of people ever stick together?
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@ peanut
Naw I think shady grady is a black man, I think why is a white woman. I don’t think black men will be trying to say white women’s struggles with white men are the same as black women’s struggles. She talks like wordynerdygirl, trying to compare white issues to blacks.
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@Peanut
Yes I know I am right lol 🙂 Plus I think Why and Shady Gray are either White women or Black men. Who knows? Both of them don’t understand our struggle as Black women to be accepted and respected in this racist society. My mother wore a shirt saying that the hardest job in the world is to be a Black woman. And I will always remember that shirt to this day because of the struggle that is ahead of me as a Black woman in AmeriKKKlan.
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I know why is a woman at least because she was going on about how fine those men were whose pics I posted.
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Adeen:
You’re not missing out on anything, trust me. Because to white men, black women are nothing more than, “food things”, like chocolate.
Black women are nothing more than a fetish, that white men desire and only have the courage to approach black women, when their 40 and over old and gray, had their white children and divorced their white wives.
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I think Why is a White woman because she spoke about feminism. White women are the ones who started the feminist movement because of the issues they had with their own White males being overprotective etc.
Personally I can give a rat’s ass about White women and their problems. They shouldn’t be complaining, they have the world at their feet. Whatever problem they have, they can go to White men to fix them. Plus most of them I came in contact with think that they are better than Black women. Then again, I am not impressed with them and never will be.
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@Sondis
How do you know all of this? I maybe young but I see some White guys in my generation date Black women but I know what you are saying is true.
I don’t date White men because the racist Southern town I live in most of the White guys there are either racists, rednecks or both. Plus many of them think that they are the best thing to walk on two legs.
And when a White guy approaches me and flirts with me in my town, 99% of time I know it is for sex not for a serious relationship.
I wouldn’t date a White male ever. I can’t relate to him culturally, he has no swag and his dick is small.
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I cant remember where i read this but …”Why is it every time someone’s attracted to a non white women its considered a fetish, but only logical if its a white women” cuz the media pushes ww as the norm for women…(not hating, just observing)
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Never even heard of T. Sotamayor? and from what has been discussed here don’t care to know much about him.
Came across this touching marriage proposal. Here it is
(http://hw-mobile.worldstarhiphop.com/u/vid/2013/05/01/propoalspduideydgehwdfewdewfdewedw_mobile.mp4)
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@ lifelearner
Aw that was so beautiful. its good to see a good proposal, it looked like the whole neighborhood was there lol
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Heat won…but Im in New York..ready to fire up our show
Peanut…you are going to do fine…one thing I can tell you…I will never judge how you want to define your sexuality….it is your choice..your choice to find out for yourself and I will never judge your choice
And Im all for black women finding their way in this racist world…what ever it takes….
Sharina, yes, of course there are situations that have these problems , where the individual has suffered something in their life that makes a certain dynamic play out, but , there are so many complex differant things that could define a persons sexuality…that is each person`s unique trajectory, like a fingerprint or dna imprint…our sexual developement..The problem is when people start taking one definition and aplying it to everyone…I have no problem with people defining what are the bad and racist behaviours of white people to look out for, I just dont see taking any black person who dates a white person and trying to make it out like there is something wrong with that….
Adeen…you are pretty
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lifelearner:
That video doesn’t play, says file corrupt. says “video can’t play, because the file is corrupt”
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Peanut:
I haven’t seen the inkwell is so long, love and basketball also.
maybe I’ll run a search on the old jail broken, apple TV to see if i can find them to watch over the weekend. ^_^
I also watched, “Hollywood shuffle” on my apple TV last night. its still funny after all these years! @ : o D ) >
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@Peanut
Well said. I don’t have much White women as friends or trust them much less. Sad to say but most White women I come in contact think that they are better than Black women or they can’t relate to our experience.
There is only a few that I trust but the rest of them, no way. And I wouldn’t even date a White man…A big NO NO for me.
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”Sometimes I fantasize about being married in the 1970s era and romanticize my life as a woman married to a Black panther. They should make a movie about that”
Same here. I would love to find an Afrocentrist man to date who loves Black women, himself and his culture.
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@ sondis
It works for me it opens on my windows media player.
Anyway if u can’t see it i’ll tell u
black man with white gloves gets out of black Cadillac with his beautiful black gf, her whole family is there. R Kelly song comes on, then he starts dancing in the street. then he gets down on one knee and proposes, she starts crying, then Bruno mars song I think I wanna marry you comes on then her family starts cheering. They embrace then the vid ends
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Have some thoughts on Tommy Sotomayor but will save them as commentary for Peanut’s guest blog article. I wont bother looking up Sgt Willie Pete though; don’t know why but even his name makes me want to disregard anything he might have to say.
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I am more with Marcus Garvey’s philosophy of moving out of this country. America has done more damage to Blacks than anything else. We helped build this country but we are endlessly oppressed, mocked, ridiculed in this country of bigots and racists.
I know I want to move out of this country when I get older. Besides my family didn’t originate from this country at all and aren’t African Americans but they are Blacks,
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@Peanut
I plan on being a journalist too. I know you definitely need a break from racist American culture. I even think moving to a more racially tolerant country would be better for you.
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Peanut:
Malcolm broke it down…
“Sometimes I fantasize about being married in the 1970s era and romanticize my life as a woman married to a Black panther. They should make a movie about that.”
I can be your, black Panther! Can ya dig it?
*sticks afro pick in his hair with a black fist on the handle
*puts on leather pants and blazer…
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@Peanut
Same here. When I want to settle down to get married, I want a Black man who loves his race and wants to uplift Black women and help his race progress in this racist society. I know it is hard to find Black men who love themselves and their women and care about their race. That is the type of man I want to marry when I reach the age I want to settle down.
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@ Peanut
You will find it (your life partner). I know it happened to me when I least expected it. I love reading your commentary, it’s full of all things that is lovely about us AA women. Don’t ever squelch your voice/writing. Continue on.
@ Sondis- you might need to just google it. Here’s a good tagline to find it. “best proposal ever-miming to girlfriend”
@toogood- I know right! They had the little kids, Aunt Bookie and dem, lol 😉 Love how they were surrounded by family/friends. That was truly special.
@all-love these particular AA movies- The Wood, The Best Man, Brown Sugar, Love Jones, Love and Basketball, The Drumline (they don’t make it like that anymore *sigh*)
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I’ve been meaning to post this well researched article on this whole subject by a female African friend of mine for a while…
Here it is:
http://yoknyamdabale.wordpress.com/2013/06/13/interracial-relationships-the-delusion-of-a-post-racial-world/
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@Fiamma and Peanut,
There is MUCH backlash going on with Tommy Sotomayor. He has deeply offended Black Youtubers (mostly Black men)..
If you want i can post a video in the Open Thread that highlights this?
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http://madamenoire.com/127941/hollywood-interracial-marriages-that-are-hanging-tough/3/
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@ sondis
“*sticks afro pick in his hair with a black fist on the handle
*puts on leather pants and blazer…”
lol, sondis work it *whistle* those leather pants look good on u, look like a rockstar..*puts $5 in leather pants*
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^ someone’s feeling flirty… O.o
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ooh I can’t stand madamenoire website. Its so annoying to have to click through all those darn pages to see anything. I don’t really like any black gossip websites they all pretty much have issues or sold out. bossip is always talking about light skinned women, madamenoire is always talking about white men, and mediatakeout has viruses like crazy and crashed my computer.
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@ torontogirl
Lol u caught me.
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@ kwamla
Great link. yes interracial relationships doesn’t mean we live in a post racial society. I find it interesting that ppl say if everyone mixed then we wouldn’t have racism. Its like they want everyone to be the same, because they can’t accept differences. even a commenter on here said something about that. I just think its a shame some ppl feel the only way to get rid of racism is to have everyone be the same instead of just accepting ppl with their differences. smh
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@ Ms Good
Excellent comment. It is like saying the way to end anti-Semitism is to get rid of Jews.
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Yes…Mstoogood4yall…I agree… Accepting difference is at the heart of racism.
Celebrating, valuing and appreciating diversity has to be at the core any authentic relationship.
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“I don’t have an issue with Black men dating interracially for the thousandth time, I have an issue with Black men who are brainwashed and self-hating period…and I believe and it is very evident that there are MORE Black men in interracial relationships for these reasons than Black women. It is very evident to me and you can dress it up all you want…and it’s not about ME…it’s about BLACK WOMEN, my group in general.
I am NOT happy when INJUSTICE and discrimination and sexism is being leveled at MY GROUP…and I’ll speak up about it.
Elin Nordegen may not be “low status,” but one thing is for sure, if she were a Black au pair of the same status, I’m pretty certain that Tiger wouldn’t have looked twice at her…so don’t derail with that.
WHITENESS DOES BRING STATUS for Black men, WE ALL KNOW IT…so stop pretending.”
@Peanut No it is NOT evident that more black men in interracial relationships are self-hating or brainwashed. That is your interpretation but from what what you’ve stated I think that you feel that any black man in an interracial relationship falls under those descriptions. Some do, some don’t. Unless you either know the people personally or have done some exhaustive social research it seems a bit presumptuous to say there are more black men in IR for bad reasons. IR couples are like anyone else. Some are together for good reasons, some for not so good. Either way, not my concern.
Unsurprisingly on this board I rarely if ever see anyone question if a black woman in a IR relationship is brainwashed or self-hating. Funny that.
You’re still missing my point. Status, however you care to define it, is way down the list of what is important to men. Nordegren is an attractive woman who has looks that Tiger obviously preferred. Her economic or social status, while higher than you may have thought, was almost certainly not what originally attracted Tiger or made him get married to her. Yes Tiger Woods apparently has a strong preference for Caucasian women. So what? That neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg.
Your true issue appears to be that there are more BM married to WW than there are WM married to BW. Again, so what? How does that impact your life and what makes it any of your business? For the 5011th time, most Black American men and women show a pretty strong social and sexual preference for each other. For those who choose a different path that’s their cross to bear. The issues that SOME Black women have around marriage or other LTR don’t have much to do with IR relationships.
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“When we start seeing more black female versions of tommy Sotomayor, Srgtwilliepete, Albert Haynesworth, Chad Ochostinko, Slim Thug, then maybe I’ll concern myself with Black women more…and finally Black women date out less than Black men any way and there is already and over-supply of Black women as I said A THOUSAND TIMES…so it DOSE NOT impact the Black community the same way it does with Black men, it does not.
I’m not going to focus my attention on Black women as much when they’re not even bashing Black men at the same level that Black men are bashing Black women and they’re not even dating out that much to begin with…I think throwing in exceptions like Kerry Washington is just a tactic to derail the discussion…when I think most of us in here, know there is double standard…maybe you don’t want to see it though because you benefit from it in some way”
Apparently you did not read the BWE post which Abagond did? There are PLENTY of black female versions of the above people you mentioned. They exist and seem to be increasing. So there’s that.
Again, there is no rule that if 7% of black men marry non black women than 7% of black women get to marry non black men. Sorry but that’s life. Everyone in the US is going to pursue their own romantic/social/sexual happiness as best they know how. If 20% of Black women were marrying non Black men while only 10% of Black men were marrying non-black women do you REALLY think black women as a group would see that as a horrible problem? Of course not. Women don’t care in today’s world when short men or poor men complain about unfair standards of attractiveness. People have to adapt to what other people want and/or find someone who wants them as they are. We all deal with this in some fashion or another.
Again, most people find someone they want in life but there are no guarantees. My advice to anyone who can’t get the kind of person they think they deserve is to work on themselves and lower their standards. Man, woman, black, white-your romantic success starts with you.
Worrying about what other people are doing is a sure route to bitterness and frustration.
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@Shady Gray
Most Black men who date interracially hate themselves or have been brainwashed by the media. This goes for majority of the time. Not all. Divorce rates are very high in this country but White women and Black men dating interracially has one of the highest divorce rates. Wonder why? Most Black men and White women marry for the wrong reasons!
And the White woman Black men relationships that work out and truly love each other is far in between.
Most Black men are better off dating and marrying their own Black women! When will you guys realize that?
I know my little brother will get a surprise of his life when he finds out that White women aren’t perfect like the media says they are.
P.S. Peanut is not bitter and frustrated. In fact, I could understand where she is coming from because MANY Black men bash their own women to uplift and praise White women and women of other nationalities.
And the Black men who love and respect Black women these days are hard to find indeed.
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Not trying to be funny–but you must have skipped over Trojan Pam’s comments?
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”No it is NOT evident that more black men in interracial relationships are self-hating or brainwashed”
There is a lot of evidence! Self hating idiots like Tommy Sotomayor and other Black men who date interracially put Black women down and praise White women and non Black women over their own Black women. I have seen it numerous of times. In fact, I knew this very dark skin Black guy say he didn’t like his skin color and guess what, he is dating a Latina! What a coincidence, huh? Not. Most Black men who date interracially are either self hating, brainwashed by the media. Others reasons include bad experiences with Black women, Mommy issues or they are on the down low.
As for Black women who date White men and other races of men, well Most of them are either brainwashed and self hating as well.
When will Black people see the beauty of their own race and stop dating out?
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phoebeprunelle:
“Not trying to be funny–but you must have skipped over Trojan Pam’s comments?”
LMFAO!
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I will know that interracial relationships are really about love when Black people stop saying, “I’m dating/married to a White person because BLACK….”.
I almost never hear White people say that. And we’re the only people who spend so much time posting anti-Black videos online. It’s truly a disgrace. We need to be trying to find solutions to critical problems affecting our people.
It’s so interesting how the minority of White people who end up being with us causes so much conflict. Very interesting. But it’s to be expected, sadly.
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@Peanut
I agree with you. That is why I said MOST not all Black men who date interracially are brainwashed by the media or self hating. Shady Gray is one of these men, trust me. That is why many of these Black men in interracial relationships bash Black women and praise White women and non Black women above all. These men have issues, Peanut not you.
Most White women Black men relationships are not genuine and are not out of love. Hence the high divorce rate among this interracial pairing. Most Black men date them because they have a fetish for White women and just date the girl because she is White and has a higher privileged status than they are. Most White women date Black men because of the stereotype that they have bigger dicks. Also because they have daddy issues and were rejected by White men for being thicker than their standards.
There are good Black men like Sondis out there who doesn’t degrade women regardless of race but there are hard to find.
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The few Black male White women pairing I found genuine were Heidi Klum and Seal’s. They really seemed to love each other and I was sad to hear about their divorce. As well as a few others I can’t name right now.
Most Black men belong with Black women. Most Black women belong with Black men. Most White women belong with White men. Most White men belong with White women. Most Latino men belong with Latinas. Most Latinas belong with Latino men. Most Asian men belong with Asian women. Most Asian women belong with Asian men.
Personally I don’t like this whole colorblind, post racial utopia crap that the media pushes. Most people prefer to be with their own race excluding Black men. I know I prefer to be with my own race of men. Plus most of these so called interracial relationships rarely work out at the end.
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Adeen,
c’mere n gemme hug my beautiful black woman.——> \o/
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Abagond:
what happened to your “CeCe Peniston: Keep on Walkin’” post? its gone..
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Peanut:
Very interesting read on the Asian woman’s blog. Just put black men and women in place of her and you get the same, experiences.
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@Sondis
Thanks. Love hearing from you.
@Peanut
Many Asian women have been brainwashed to think that marrying White men is the best thing when they are better off with an Asian man. L
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Like I said before I don’t like this colorblind, post racial interracial dating crap that the media pushes and people fall for it.
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“…If 20% of Black women were marrying non Black men while only 10% of Black men were marrying non-black women do you REALLY think black women as a group would see that as a horrible problem?”
– – –
No, not as a group; but, my guess is that a sizeable percentage of the group would have a strongly negative opinion about it. Black American women are, from my own experience, the only women who become visibly upset and who actively campaign against the women of ‘their’ group ‘dating out’. Most men, in general, do not police the men of their race in such a way; and this type of policing also seems to be uncommon amongst non-Black women as well (with the exception being the outspoken racialist types).
And, no, I do not buy the whole political and/or historical ‘massa-raped-your-great=grandmother’ rationales which are usually put forth as reasons for BW, in particular, to eschew relationships across racial lines (meaning, not just with whites, but with anyone who is NOT Black). I’ve seen far too many apolitical and “couldn’t-give-a-sh-t about-history” Black women snarl their upper lip and suck their teeth when confronted with the image of a BW in a romantic relationship with a non-Black man (I can sort of understand this behavior from men…but from straight women toward other straight women?! Come on now).
And, also, regarding the whole supposed concern for the Black Community (much moreso than the individual Black person), there is definitely more to this BW policing / soul patrol phenomenon than just an insistence BW be the glue to keep an already badly tattered and falling-apart-at-the-seams, so-called ‘community’ together….
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@Peanut
If you do want to date outside of your race, date a Latino male. Only if you do. Their culture is similar to ours. Or a Southwest Asian. Only if you want to date outside.
I know you are tired of the Black women bashing Black men seem to engage in. I know I am too.
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@ fiamma
Yea I don’t really understand either when some women bash other women for dating out. I think it’s fine to state ur opinion then move on. Imo its less competition. As far as the massa raped ur great grandma is concerned, well for some it is true, but at the same time I see how some black ppl use it as a scare tactic. Its funny to me how some black men will say that but have amnesia when it comes to what white women have done to black men like have them lynched by lying on them, and having sex with them then getting them lynched to avoid suspicion. The craziest one I heard was the white witch of rose hall, she had sex with black men then had them lynched so she didn’t get caught, and she poisoned her white husbands. But yes ppl can hurry up and say how bad white men are but are silent on what white women have done.
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What a post! Abagond, this has to be your most commented on, or in your top 3 post mane.
While I can appreciate beauty and brains in any group, I have never had a dream of waking up to a white man first thing in the morning. I have no problem dating or marrying someone who is not Black, but not white. I like pigmentation in the skin, so I would always go for someone who is brown.
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peanut
trying to explain what life is like for us black women to some men is just as hard as trying to explain racism to white ppl, its tiring and futile. I just talk to the ones who try to understand and actually listen instead of trying to change my mind or put words in my mouth. it seems when we bring up complaints we are told to hush and go away and stop being sensitive, when its someone else everyone is supposed to care. EXCUSE ME IF I FORGOT TO GIVE A FLUCK.
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Black in Latin America Brazil: A Racial Paradise?:
http://video.pbs.org/video/1906000944/
watching this right now, very interesting….very interesting indeed.
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sondis I saw that episode it was good, the Dominican republic one was interesting
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Mstoogood4yall:
I think i could pass for Dominican or even Portuguese, what do you think?
@ : o l ) >
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^ rofl maybe, and u could pass as being henry Louis gates a younger version. I could pass for being black and proud lol
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the crazy thing peanut is that black men feel the same way about whites trying to hush them when they try to speak on things. with us black women its like we get told to hush from whites and from some black men. smh when the oppressed become the oppressor.
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Idk a lot of black men confuse me. one minute they say we need to step to the side then the next minute they say we need to step up and lead the way. I have no problem submitting to a good man, but will not to a man who is in peter pan state which is how a lot of young ones are lookin for a woman to take care of them the way their momma did. hate to say it but some black men nowadays are becoming feminized and I do think a lot of it is from the single mothers who didn’t have a man to teach her son to be a man. I saw something about a new trend is black men wearing skirts, wtf. reminds me of an episode of boondocks where Riley’s fave rapper was gay and had a clothing line.
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^ yes they are supposed to be but a lot of them have been silenced. it is crazy how ppl say black women are masculine, well maybe because when u tell black women to be strong, put everyone first, and don’t let ppl know u are sad or hurt, those are things men are supposed to do not women. we have had our roles reversed. my dad has been telling me since I was in kindergarten that if anybody hurts me he’s going to jail lol. it seems a lot of black women don’t have that protection so a lot are trying to protect themselves and may come off as masculine or rude. but at the same time some women take on more than they should.
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@Sondis
I watched all the documentaries like the ones you posted and I was shocked by the blatant racism the Latino culture has against Blacks.
@Mstoogood and Peanut
Black men who bash Black women hate themselves.
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Adeen:
The documentary I posted wasn’t about Latinos. It’s about Brazilian whites and African brazilians. So the white brazilians are racist towards the black population, no different than America.
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@Sondis
However Brazil is still apart of Latin America despite speaking Portugese. Did you watch the documentary about Cuba, Dominican Republic and Haiti?
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Investigation of Mr. Queens has revealed certain………peculiarities that have forced me to renounce any affiliation with him. And sadly, he has proclaimed himself to be a nerd.
http://mrlaureltonqueens.com/2012/12/25/off-black-mary-jane-redefining-the-black-male-nerd-the-steve-urkel-story-when-will-these-bdwe-black-women-learn-when-we-have-sex-they-dont-fuss-or-fight-new-diss-to-jamila/#comment-20243
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[…] source […]
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“Sometimes I fantasize about being married in the 1970s era and romanticize my life as a woman married to a Black panther. They should make a movie about that.”
That you pictured your husband as a Black Panther and not yourself betrays the extent to which you have internalized sexism.
Unless of course you are a man fantasizing that you are a woman married to a man, in which case that betrays something else.
😉
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wtf. its funny how ppl want to pick apart someone else’s little statement that really doesn’t matter, but ignore or minimize the comments that talk about the real issue. I fantasize about being with a fine firefighter, so what. men sometimes fantasize about being with another woman so what. there were women on here calling men dogs *crickets*, now that is sexist.
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@Why
Good points but I disagree. She is imagining what she wants in a husband and honestly I don’t blame her.
@ALL
There is this website I have been visiting in over a year and people regularly make rude comments regarding Blacks, minorities, Muslims etc, I have experienced so much racism on that site, Sodahead, it is unreal. I am thinking of leaving this site for good.
Should I?
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^ yes leave that site alone, I don’t go to stormfront or any other racist website because it is depressing, draining, and a time waster. Just go to websites that uplift ppl instead of bringing us down. what u see and hear gets into ur subconscious mind which is why I am picky when it comes to what music I listen to and what shows I watch.
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“There is this website I have been visiting in over a year and people regularly make rude comments regarding Blacks, minorities, Muslims etc,”
Islam is just as problematic as Christianity. Both are competing with each other for world domination.
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@Mstoogood4yall
I will leave soon, I decided. Most of the White commenters on there are racist, ignorant and rednecks and give me very rude responses.
I come on here because I love this blog site and love telling others on here about my experience of being a young, Black woman coming of age in this racist society.
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Hey hey hey! I got something to say….What’s going on my beautiful black people??? @ : o D ) >
I just finished grubbin on some Boston Market food. Check it….
I had Half chicken, white meat ( no pun intended ) also a rack of BBQ Ribs.
I got 4 sides. garlic spinach, mashed tatters n gravy…wild rice,Mac n cheese and a order of 6 pieces corn bread. Can ya dig it? @ : o O ) >
I’ma wash it down with lemonade and for desert, Entenmann’s Iced Lemon cake. mmmm mmmm yummy now that’s good eating ^_^
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^ dang sondis u making me hungry, u forever eating a boston market lol poor thing must not have anybody to cook for u.. I do love their cornbread but their green beans taste nasty to me.
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Mstoogood4yall:
Boston Market is the unofficial, restaurant for single bachelors…aka lonely ass men. @ : o O ) >
I’m not a fan of their green beans so much, i almost never get them.
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well sondis at least u eating at a somewhat healthy place instead of other fast foods that are fried and filled with slime.lol. I only ate boston market once, I like homemade food better especially gumbo, bbq ribs. mm, ok I need to go eat now lol. *grabs milk n oreos*
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For those of you who wince at seeing interracial couples together, let me give you a tip and warn you up front…dont go to South Beach…because some of the couples i saw were drop dead gorgous together…I guess there are a lot of good looking people in South Beach coming from all over…I mean it will be like a masochist with the pain just searing inside and , it would be bad for your health
Just reading this thread…well, it just made me hyper aware of the interracial couples….all this talk just makes me look harder at interracial couples
then I go into the bathroom and look in the mirror…realising I broke the mold as a participant in interracial relationships..and I got obcessed thinking about this discusion and myself….
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PlEASE STOP speaking on behalf of black women. You are not the representative of all or “most” Black American women. I prefer white men. They are less aggressive, threatening and appreviate intellectual conversation. Your posts seem to reflect your assumption that nearly all black women are are black christians and have the black church/groupthink mentality. As a modestly dressed non-Christian woman thrown into the “black” category i observed most black men as offensive, uneducated, cult and jail inclined and disrespectful.
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I prefer black men as they are less racist, open minded, strong, beautiful, and amazing. As a modestly dressed southern black woman HAPPY to be thrown in the black category , I observed most white men are racist, disrespectful, redneck, and try to get ppl to ignore their white privilege.
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I hope the black men leave you alone too. More for the rest of us! You can have those pasty faced fools (with the exception of Steve Reevs types of course). Get a life!
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Mstoogood4yall:
I hope you know, that “Blackmanleaveusalone” is not a real black woman. No black woman would say anything that extreme about her own race.
Blackmanleaveusalone is a white man or woman, that is posing as a black woman, it happens on this blog and others like it all the time.
Blackmanleaveusalone, you failed miserably at trying to troll.
Now, where was i? oh, i love my beautiful black people! ^_^
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@ Misstoogood4yall & Sondis: I wondered if she was a troll or from the BWE movement. And if she wants to date white men good for her, more for the rest of us. But I am thinking she is more than anything a troll. I feel when we respond to these trolls that’s just what they want a reaction. May I suggest that in the future just ignore them.
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mary burrell:
Yeah, that’s essentially what i did by dismissing, “Blackmanleaveusalone” as a supposed black woman. I knew that person wasn’t who they claim to be but an imposter.
So yeah, i agree with ignoring them or calling them out, when they pretend to be a person of color.
I know a sock puppet when i see one…
On another note, what you been up to, Mary Burrell? up to your usual monkey business? ^_^
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@ Sondis: I have been in my kitchen trying out recipes in my new Paula Deen cookbook, with my Paula Deen pots and pans.LOL!!!! Speaking of cooking you need somebody to cook for you. You spend way too much time at Boston Market. Although I like Boston Market too. I love the cornbread and the the chicken, creamed spinach. Let’s not derail the thread.
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mary burrell:
Oh come now, there’s nothing wrong with black people, talking to each other. ^_^
I’m sure abagond doesn’t mind us black folk, talking about our daily lives…
Maybe a thread should be created for off topic/ general discussions.
I would like to talk to my black people without fear of abagond, raining terror on my post with his all mighty powers, “thread deleted” for being off topic!
NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! @ : o O ) >
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^ rofl
sondis you are in luck there is such a thread where we can discuss off topic things. Introducing the OPEN THREAD. *cue music* lol. Yes sondis I knew that heifer was a troll, just the name alone told me that. Trolls always have long names without spaces in between words smh. I don’t respond directly to these types, I just throw a lil shade their way lol. I just don’t want ppl to think im a hypocrite, by telling ppl to call things out and I myself don’t do it. BUt if I see they are a major troll I stop responding which is what i’m doing with why and mr pigglewiggle.
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@Sondis
Wrong again. Just because someone doesnt believe in groupthink and blind loyalty and retaons her own opinion doesn’t make her a troll. EVERY DAy I cannot go to the bank, fast food reataurant dollar store or the mall–in the suburbs without some nasty disrespectful negro saying something in appropriate. Any time you get a protective order from the court because a black man stalks you for months because you ignire him and finally had your last straw when this STRANGER tries to touch you; you’d be tired of them too. Foul mouth negative, inappropriate, “clowing” trying to “holla” and “slide up next to strangers” is repulsive to any decent woman with standards and who is religious, highly eduated and well read. Their indecency has been experienced and witnessed by most black women but are afraid to admit it for fear of being deemed “a traitor” or “Uncle Tom” because you demand respect. I don’t care, I choose to maintain my standards and be happy. I will not sacrifice these morals for no one, especially just because we may share the same hue and historically designated a race. That’s simply irrational. So no, Peanut STILL does not speak for most or all black people. that’s called reasoning.
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That’s kind of true tho peanut, you can’t say every black girl prefers black men naturally, we’re not all raised in the same neighbourhood. We can like guys from other races and still be loyal to our own…
Also at another site http://www.notyourgirlfriday.wordpress.com, another ww was trying to derail the topic, with her “all women go though this” femininism and that TV is bad for all women…and another commenter mentioned that most TV Shows were made by ww, same with tv stations. So is it really, wm who are insulting bw or is it ww? It makes sense tho…why they work so hard to make bw be seen as undesirable, but they didn’t get to Asian women quick enough…
Also it makes sense why they always like to flick their hair (even though my hair was long), and get so upset when they see guys giving us attention…I’m not American btw, so I don’t know how it is there. In Toronto (Canada) everyone just mixes up freely, so I’ve never felt this loyalty/traitor thing just as long as you don’t insult yourself and your race…however where I live now its mostly Asians and idk how racist they are till I went to public school for a year…they love to say the n word and racist stuff…they love talking about us! They’re more racist than whites, very openly racist, even when you walk in the street the kids will stare at you.(Same with older white women, nowadays) They think they can’t be racist because they’re not white.
@Peanut I can relate to all your experiences, it’s actually insane (I’m 16 and still in school, I’ve tried all the things you have too) at one point when I was very small my brother used to make fun of me and say I wasn’t really black and I’d end up dating a nerdy white guy. I always felt like I didn’t fit in from seeing all the bw on tv with lots of sass and attitude.(and the dumb strong bw stereotype I’m soo sensitive, I think you said you were too) So what did I do? I’d swear I’d only date black guys(my first crush was blonde lol), but most of the guys were middle eastern/Asian so I went for an Indian Brazilian guy… (and tried to ignore wm even thiugh i still some were cute) but really it’s so stupid, why should I be lonely just because I’m waiting for a black guy when all the men around me aren’t (I’ve liked guys from other races, guys from other races liked me, idc)…not all white guys are racist, they’re just ignorant, you can’t expect them to know what it’s like being black. It’s like someone asking you about a place you’ve never been, all you know about it is what you see on TV. You may stereotype ppl without noticing it, I really think if Americans would blend more (Drake, a Canadian rapper, says its really segregated down there) there wouldn’t be so many stereotypes cuz u would see each other as individuals…instead of thinking cuz there of another race you won’t be able to relate to them, cuz that’s stereotyping them too. You’re more than just color of your skin, or even your “culture” you’re complex! 🙂
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Hi TorontoGirl, what type of Asians are you talking about? East Asians like Chinese, Japanese, etc or South Asians like Indians, Bengalis’s and the like?
I know exactly what you mean about the flipping of the hair too. I think many of them do it to say “hey, we have straight, long hair, black women don’t”! I think many Latina women (many of them who consider themselves white if they are lighter colored) caught on and like to do the same thing.
I also don’t think anything is really wrong with IR dating. I think we as black women though can be a little sensitive to it when a black man does it because of our history in this country, heck hemisphere, heck world with white oppression/degradation. I have dated Latino, Indian men and found other races attractive and would not want anyone to get in my business if and when I am dating someone of another race.
I am just saying though that as for white men, i don’t know why it’s so discussed with us as black women, when we know white men in general are by and large anti-black and are responsible ( not every single one, but a large percentage) for a system that has left us struggling, fighting oppression everywhere we turn ( from housing to education to jobs) and wherever we are.
In everyday life, I don’t relate to or with white men.
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@Blackmanleaveusalone
I prefer Black men because they are less aggressive, less racist and I can relate to them culturally. You don’t speak for most Black American women either but most of us prefer Black men. Most of us don’t even like White men or consider options for dating or marrying. And you know that too!
@Toronto and Gina Torres
I am 17 and still in school. It is nice you left a comment on this blog since I love it. I can relate to you as well. I am waiting for a Black man as well but most of them are IR dating in my age group and leaving Black women like us behind. Don’t worry, you will find a guy one day who loves you for you and he might not even be Black. Keep on doing what you are doing.
@Sondis
Blackmanleaveusalone is either crazy or self hating. Most Black women(as well as me as a Black woman) in America don’t like White men at all. She is one of the few exceptions. I would just give her a snappy reply or ignore her.
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Lol @Gina I go to an international school now, and its the Latinas especially who do this (do these racists all go to the same racism school, peanut too!)…I straightened my hair (even though I don’t like too), and it was thick and long. But I’m not american so we have different history most of the black ppl I know are Jamaican or Ethiopian/Kenyan/Eritrean so they’re first or 3rd generation Canadians. But everyone blends here, without losing our own cultures…I think you should come here! :)) most of these Asians are Chinese/Sri Lankan/Indian or Pakistanian (how do u spell that?) the white guys r probably the least racist to me, but the Asians think they can say whatever they want because they’re a minority but there stereotypes aren’t as negative as ours. It can get annoying when they don’t realize I wasn’t raised up as an AA so I don’t much about the culture, or soul food…My parents are Nigerian and have their own culture and values…Except what I see on TV, idk much so I won’t generalize…but I don’t get it when AA men say bw don’t do enough for them and that they have attitude, that’s not what I see! I hate the attitude thing every time I disagree with smth. they want to use that stereotype on a bw.
Thanks for replying btw! :))
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“the white guys r probably the least racist to me, but the Asians think they can say whatever they want because they’re a minority”
Modern, white, western cultures are the ones that have received politically correct programming. Indeed, they invented it. Asian cultures have not. Therefore don’t be surprised if you encounter more racist attitudes amongst Asians than Whites.
Once political correctness reaches their shores and cultures, you will find them biting their tongues more, until after a few generations the racism will have been completely programmed out of them.
They will have then gotten to the point where politically correct liberal white westerners are today, which I think is a good thing.
Not all programming is bad. Programming to not be a racist is a good thing.
Asians just have gotten the memo yet. As their generations stay on here in the West, they will.
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@Adeen: Nope just tired, well read and internationally traveled. The mere fact that you stoop to name calling (especialy for someone to caim to be so pro black love) for someone to be strong enough to speak their own and different opinion just shows the lack of intellect and maturity you truly possess. This is why I don’t deal with most Black women, inability to maintain civil discourse without resorting to “high school” bantering.
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I made my last comment said what I needed to say. Except this just another place that discusses the nee for black unity and the need to respect each other ut only if your opinion aligns with the poster. I leave you with this thought: nothing great ecer arose without critical thinking, detractors and varying opinions–these are what we call atiables in determining solutions. It’s obvious this site is a “club” for certain women. Good luck.
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@ Torontogirl
“I hate the attitude thing every time I disagree with smth. they want to use that stereotype on a bw.”
Yes that is what some do. I can’t stand it either, its like we are not allowed to have our own views. And the most annoying thing is when they say something rude then when we respond they say typical black woman being angry or having attitude. Yet they don’t like it when ppl are rude to them and try to say they are acting like a stereotype. If we don’t smile ppl think we have attitude.
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Jorbia is that u lol
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@ Mstoogoo4yall, Did see what I was talking about.
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^ yep rofl being condescending and being like I don’t deal with black americans blah blah blah. i’m smarter, richer, and better than u. I pitty the black American fool,etc. yep that is how they sound
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@ Mstoogood4yall, So I wasn’t wrong in my assessment of her?
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Blackmanleaveusalone
@Adeen: Nope just tired, well read and internationally traveled. The mere fact that you stoop to name calling (especialy for someone to caim to be so pro black love) for someone to be strong enough to speak their own and different opinion just shows the lack of intellect and maturity you truly possess. This is why I don’t deal with most Black women, inability to maintain civil discourse without resorting to “high school” bantering.
___________________________________________________________
Adeen IS in fact a teenager, so cut her some slack.
Other than that, I’m new here and don’t know your history but the best way to discourage dysfunction is to not even give it the time of day and pour all of your energy and focus into that which is healthy and functionable.
That is why Tommy Sotomayor would be more effective in “improving (dysfunctional) Black women” if instead of feeding their attention cookie monster, he instead showered praise on functional Black women who do not have children out of wedlock and who comport themselves as responsible wives and mothers rather than dead beat single baby mamas out on the hunt for yet another man.
Those dead beat baby mamas actually GAIN from all the publicity he’s giving them.
If nothing else, it feeds their already huge egos.
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@ mary
no u weren’t wrong I remember the bwe thread and I think It was u or somebody that said they’d need a better looking white guy than the one pictured, and she said something about u American black women always focus on the physical where other black women are they care more about the inside. Yes she did sound condescending and holier than thou. I think we can learn from each other but she kinda sounded to me like we black americans are ignorant and need to just see others perspective. I do think it is good to observe and take others point of view but they need to be respectful as well.
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@Mstoogood4yall EXACTLY! My brother used the attitude on the thing on me I was young, made me more of a pushover…nowadays I PURPOSELY give him attitude…he’s always being rude to me and trying to get on my nerves then is surprised when I’m not too happy bout it or cry. Like willow smith sang “they puncture me and then wonder why I bleed” definitely applies to bw! Btw, I’m a Pisces too (I’ve been reading all the comments and finally got tired and decided to join In! 🙂
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@ Mstoogood4yall, Yeah, that was me. That individual in the photo I just could not get with if I had to go that way.LOL!!!!!
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Well hello fellow pisces lol. Yea it is sad when some black men are oppressed and become the oppressor. treating others the way u want to be treated is very important. Sadly some will be ok with saying these things about black women having attitude and things, but are not ok when whites or others say they are threatening, thugs, etc.
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@ mary
Yeah ikr he was homeless looking, im not a 10 but I would want a man who is at least a 5 that dude was ………. uh….. not a dang 5 that’s for sure lol
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@Blackmanleaveusalone
I am actually a teenager. Can’t you read? I posted the comment that I was 17. And White America doesn’t see you any different than the stereotypical Black woman even if you travel and well educated. I know this because I am well behaved in school and get good grades yet Caucasians still stereotype me and demean me.
IF you mess up(I doubt it since you seem well adjusted into society) and your White savior leaves you, then you will know that White America sees you.
I am just being honest and I saw it happen to Tiger Woods.
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@Blackmanleaveusalone, Reading is so fundamental, Adeen is a teenager. She did mention this in her comments.
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Adeen, whatcha doing girl? ^_^
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@Sondis
Nothing much. My younger siblings get on my nerves, always getting into my business and touching my things. I don’t like them much, especially my younger sister. It would be nice if I could move in with my uncle. He lives in NYC and there is more opportunities for me to be a journalist there. I hate where I live, which is in the middle of nowhere since there is mostly Whites and rednecks around here. I regret moving from NYC so much! I want to go back.
What should I do? I will be eighteen in three months.
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@Serenity Are you nuts? Consumked drugs or alchool recently? Those things can affect your brain.
Has not this thing of Original man\woman. the original humans (homo sapiems) aren’t the today’s homo sapiens sapiens (moder humans (africans included).
Whites aren’t interessed in some regions of Earth not because is the place of the original man. It’s simply they are desinteressed. Get real facts not your afrocentric illusions, you and your eurocentric friends needs rfeally be banished from Earth!!!!
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@Blackmanleaveusalone
Another thing, your comments does support my notion that you are self hating.
”As a modestly dressed non-Christian woman thrown into the “black” category i observed most black men as offensive, uneducated, cult and jail inclined and disrespectful.”
You could have said that you prefer to date White males without putting down Black men. That is self hate right there! You were created from a Black male’s sperm yet you put him down? White men are just like men of other races: some are good and some are bad. Stop uplifting the White man and putting your own Black men down.
” I prefer white men. They are less aggressive, threatening and appreciate intellectual conversation.”
This comment as well. White men aren’t less aggressive or threatening by Black men, yet again, another lie you swallowed up by the media.
I am only 17 years old and I can smell a self hating Black person from miles away. Yes, you are a self hating Black woman. White America will never seen you any differently from a stereotypical hood rat. They see all Blacks as N words whether or not they are educated or not.
And I am actually a good student in school and I have no kids or a boyfriend. Yet I am still stereotyped by Whites.
Yes I maybe 17 but I am for my race.
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@ Blackmanleaveusalone
“So no, Peanut STILL does not speak for most or all black people. that’s called reasoning.”–I have to ask you where peanut even claimed to be speaking for all black women? If I am not mistaken she made it clear that it was her opinion and hers alone, so I think you just have your panties in a bunch over her comment.
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@ Adeen
I have found lately that it is much easier to spot self-hating women than I thought possible. It is like they give themselves away.
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@Sharina
I have had some bad experiences with Black men but I don’t hate them. After all, it was the Black man’s sperm that made me.
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Peanut
@Adeen,
exactly what keeps me grounded is thinking about the Black men in my life who have been there for me, supported me and loved me and above all a Black man gave me life…
when I see all of the bashing and negativity from black men directed at black women, I can look at the black men in my life and that’s how I KNOW that it is NOT all black men who behave this way and I know exactly the type of [black] man that I desire because I have my father, who I adore, to model that after.
my father used to sing to me when I was a baby, he would sing the temptations and he came to school and brought me a giant teddy bear and a cake for my birthday and I think about those moments and the love he showed me and I have fond memories of black men…because of him.
______________________
This is why I’m against out of wedlock births and divorce.
Little girls and little boys need their daddies as much as their mommies.
Families should remain in tact and in love. They should teach their children through example what is a functional, loving marriage.
Its natural for the “in love” feeling and romance to fade. Then the marriage enters into the comfort zone, which for many modern people translates as boredom and stagnation.
This is the family building phase.
Stick it out. Work on recreating those loving feelings through doing romantic things for your spouse. You were in love with at some point in your love, you can fall in love with them again.
Modern people give up way too early.
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This thread has become really very long and somewhat exhausting.
Through the pages one can see a distinct sense of despair voiced by Black American women.
It seems that the American Civil Rights movement of the 20th century eased the relationships between Blacks and Whites in the USA opening the way to more interracial dating and love but unluckily not in a balanced way: Black men and White women got a larger piece of the cake and Black women less. And White men? Apparently they found other grass fields to graze.
As it appears, the idea of White superiority (or White norm) remains one of the basic operating principles of American society and it castigates Black womanhood more than anything else.
Black womanhood is being an object of systematic defamation.
This is sad, really very sad.
I’m a black African male and at this very moment I would like to embrace my Black American sisters/cousins and tell them some words of comfort – paraphrasing former President Bill Clinton – “I feel your pain”.
To Peanut:
You are a very young woman and you have almost your entire life yet to live. Do not let negativity take your soul. There is a world of opportunities out there. Yes, opportunities for love too. First try to be loyal to yourself and then, only then, to others. Be realistic too. All too often women dream of the wonderful Prince that will come to their rescue, to love them, and this is right, but then they put many expectations and restrictions on the very definition of what kind of Prince should be theirs. This can lead to nowhere. Men are human too and they will display all kind of positive attributes side by side with negative ones. To pick up the right partner is an art. And it requires luck too. This is true for everyone. Here I remember a friend of mine who once concedes to me that in searching for a woman (to marry) he would preferentially choose one who was not so beautiful because he thought that in choosing that way he could avoid later the high risk of being cheated! One can dispute his reasoning (are beautiful women really more willing to cheat?), for sure, but at least it shows that he tried to be as realistic as he could to strike a balance between looks and (prospective) loyalty in his future partner.
You have already been in a foreign country (Brazil) and you saw a society which lives by a different set of social norms and rules. This is normal. Different countries have a different social fabric too. In Brazil, women of colour are openly praised and race-mixing is generalized. But the concept of White superiority remains valid. It is the racial caste-like system that operates throughout all Latin America countries. But as an extra space of possibilities to find a partner it should be tried if you manage to go there again.
The Caribbean would be an interesting space to explore too because there, at least, the concept of White superiority is less visible compared to other places in the Americas. And certainly the negativity associated with Black femininity, if existent, is minimal.
As an African I would suggest you to open further your horizons and think in visiting Africa – the Motherland of your distant ancestors – and consider the prospects for love there too. Despite all of the problems that the continent is going through, Black African women live there always with the assurance of being truly appreciated as “objects of desire” and potential (or real) wives, like women in each other corner of the planet, as it should be. And being you an American woman you could enjoy the bonus of being object of more interest and respect in your interactions with the locals (and with expatriates too, including Whites from every nationalities!).
I suspect that you probably, like other Americans – especially Black Americans –, do not have Africa under your radar, when it comes to visit or work temporarily in foreign countries, but I recommend that you review and refine your knowledge about the continent and its people. You’ll probably find many pleasant surprises. In Africa there is a growing number of educated young people – surely hundreds of thousands of university graduates who could be potential “marriage material” and would be more than happy in marrying a Black American woman. Some White European females have already followed that path and married African men either in Europe or in Africa. Why a Black American woman could not do the same? Think about that.
By the way: there are quite a lot of Black African students in USA universities, aren’t there? Why not to look at them as one possibility?
With the mismatch in the marriage market existing currently in the Black American community I think that this is a possibility to deserve some attention. But I digress…
As an illustration of social interactions in Africa let me show you…
… some pictures taken in the city of Lagos (Nigeria, West Africa); look at the joy and confidence of African women on the catwalk: http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1423468&page=50
… and some others taken in the city of Maputo (Mozambique, Southeast Africa); a world that is closer to racial equality between Blacks, Whites and Mulattos:
http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1586156&page=3
These are social interactions that develop in an environment where the spectre of White superiority was already exorcised and Blacks and Whites are comfortable to engage even in intimate relationships freer from feelings of superiority/inferiority. It’s similar to Brazil but without the caste-like system of race relations. There, you would not mind that much to date even a White man because you would not have a reason to.
(NEXT – some reflections on TrojanPam ideas)
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Speaking of Brazil, have you seen the documentary…
“Frustrated: Black American Men in Brazil”?
Its on youtube. You can search for it since video links here get comments stuck in mod.
One thing to note is how these Brazilian women are like, “Why do American women not want their husbands to come down here and party with us? They can also come and we will show them a good time too!”
So, I wonder how these Brazilian women would feel if their husbands were flying up to the US in order to “party” and “have a good time” with American women?
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But Peanut, you do realize your father is from a whole different generation, as long with the boys you grew up with…you can’t keep waiting for another copy of your father, as if he can’t be find in any other color. I’m just saying this because you shouldn’t waste your life like that…I didn’t know race was that serious in the U.S, they weren’t kidding on TV when they keep showing that “nothin’ but a black man” bw, I’m sure not all wp are that racist just ignorant…and so it seems the BM are the racist ones today…you see what’s on TV, you’ve heard what ppl say in your own life…”it’s a new day!” (Jennifer Hudson voice) racism hasn’t stopped BM from dating out, and REMEMBER MOST TV SHOWS TODAY ARE CREATED BY WW, so IT’S ULTIMATELY WW WHOARE CREATING THE IMAGE OF BW AS UNDESIRABLE NOT WM. THEY JUST WATCH TOO MUCH TV!
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@ why
“You were in love with at some point in your love, you can fall in love with them again”–You assume too much about marriage and why people get into them. Not all people marry for love which is probably the reason why they don’t last long. Some people marry into the idea of love or for someone to fulfill something in their life. Not love.
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Parents aren’t the sole teachers of children, especially TV, that get a lot of what they learn from the TV…and there parents not even know what’s happening…I’ve seen people raised on good families fall down trying to follow their peers…but it depends how much freedom the parent gives the child
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But on another note why I agree that having a daddy in the child’s life is more important than some people give credit to. My parents were divorced and my father was in and out, but i was blessed with amazing uncles that acted in place of my father when he was not their. Plus my father was always there before my parents divorced.
I also believe that for those that do not have a daddy. A good strong and caring male figure has amazing results as well.
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@ Torontogirl
I disagree with tv as I watch a lot of it growing up and I never strayed into doing deviant things. I do agree with peers. The company you keep can greatly affect the choices you make and it will not matter if you have one parent or two parent because it can affect a person all the same.
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@Sharina
I don’t watch much TV and I am not influenced by it much at all. However I never had my father in my home but my uncle was a good influence though and was very nice. I don’t see him around much anymore.
Mostly I am disappointed in the men in my life though.
@Why
”You were in love with at some point in your love, you can fall in love with them again.”
Yes I did love a guy only to break my heart and say that he now preferred White and Latina women. SMH. I will never forget that!
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Sharina qouted me and then replied;
“You were in love with at some point in your love, you can fall in love with them again”–You assume too much about marriage and why people get into them. Not all people marry for love which is probably the reason why they don’t last long. Some people marry into the idea of love or for someone to fulfill something in their life. Not love.”
Adeen quoted me and added;
”You were in love with at some point in your love, you can fall in love with them again.”
Yes I did love a guy only to break my heart and say that he now preferred White and Latina women. SMH. I will never forget that!”
____
This is why honestly, I don’t put a lot of faith in “love”. At least the so-called “love” of the modern world which is often nothing more than sexual attraction.
I put faith in family, tradition and duty.
I have seen many couples from traditional cultures who have had their marriages arranged by their families. Of course they had final veto power, but the families selected a group of suitable prospective mates and they chose amongst them.
Were they “in love” when they married? Many were not. Do they love each other today? Yes.
That love is based on something deeper than modern romantic love.
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@Why
I see and well said. Is that why marriages are failing today or part of the reason…lack of genuine love for your partner? And rushing into the marriage before actually getting to know the person first.
Yes, you are right to put faith in God, family and friends.
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What is the poster “munu aka Bantu” talking about? I don’t relate to or want a white male. Black women are not “left out” or “rejected” in any way. In fact, some of us date latino’s and others and many of us on a real level realize black men-white women relationships say nothing about us as black women. Heck, 99% of the black men I’ve ever seen dating iR I KNOW I wouldn’t even consider!
I have seen black women/white men couples. I don’t know how they do it, but it is happening.
I’m so sick of this vibe being thrown out that black women are somehow less than merely because white men are not by and large into dating black women. Who says we are even interested in white men or find them attractive?
Especially given how this society operates and how so many white men behave, black women cannot see them as protectors, husbands or boyfriends by and large. It’s just simply not a reality.
They have a white supremacist sick mindset. I don’t like to hang out with them, let alone ever think about dating one!
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Peanut, I’m reading your blog about it now and this stands out;
“Also, what some Black American men don’t understand is what they perceive as being lauded and praised for being a Black American man in Brazil, is no different than the way Black American women are treated abroad either. When I was in Brazil with another Black American woman, we’d be walking down the street and if someone heard us speaking English ( they couldn’t tell we were American unless we opened our mouths) people would come up to us and say “americana, americana!” Plenty of people approached us, we were treated very nicely by both men and women.
And, I kid you not when I tell you this…
when my girlfriend (who is also Black American) and I were walking to the beach and we ran into this Black Brazilian guy who spoke English, he said to us “Black American women are very beautiful and exotic.” The first thing that popped into my mind was “damn that’s the EXACT same thing that Black American men say about Black Brazilian women.”
____
The Manosphere, both the Black and White branch, keeps “Threatening” US women that “we are going to leave the US, you will not get our tax money any longer, and we are going to get us some beautiful, feminine foreign women who know how to treat a man!”
OK fellas! Can we get a specific time and date on your departure so we can celebrate?
What these men don’t realize is that American women have been ex-patting and dating and/or marrying foreign men for decades now, as well as dating and/or marrying immigrant men right here in the States, but we are not creating entire blogs or youtube documentaries about it in an attempt to “threaten” American men into acting how we want them to.
We are quietly and happily getting on with our relationships.
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@ why
True.
Another thing is that divorce was shunned too so even if a couple hated each other they would not gwt it. I have also looked at it as women had power throufh marriage in the past and marriage was seen as a benefit. Today marriage is not seen as beneficial. Not worth it.
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@All
Listen to Gina, she is right. Just because most Black American women don’t see most White American men as potential partners as husbands, boyfriends doesn’t make us Black women undesirable. The truth in the matter is a lot of White guys don’t mind dating a Black woman but because of the stereotypes and negative stigma, they don’t date us. Or hide their feelings. And many of them are quite aware that we prefer Black men is another reason they might back off. There is many other reasons too that I wouldn’t get into.
Plus when a White male does like a Black woman, most of them it is sort like a fetish sexual attraction sort of way. A White man could never love a Black woman the way a Black man, who loves himself and his race, loves a Black woman.
And due to my strong convictions and belief system on this topic, I choose not to date White American men. One day, I want to have beautiful, Black children with a handsome Black husband who loves himself, his race, has a sweet personality, likes my Jamaican heritage and food and most of all loves me. I don’t wish to have confused mixed children who don’t know which race they belong to or have no loyalty to the Black race at all. I don’t want a White husband either because there will be too much negative stigma for me and I don’t desire White males as husbands or even boyfriends.
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That’s the one thing I have problem with dating outside of the race I don’t want to have mixed kids, idk how to do their hair…it’s different from mine, and Do they get sunburns etc? Also I don’t want to deal with identity crisis or kids who want to be full white…I’ve never had to deal with my identity and I don’t frikken care…also I feel like by having biracial kids I’m somehow promoting white supremacy and the white race. The sad thing is I’m surrounded by ppl outside of my race and I don’t believe in this race loyalty nonsense, “nothing but a black man” cuz in Canada we don’t segregate like that everyone mixes up…and we all celebrate our heritage freely, and no I don’t believe every guy likes a black girl has a fetish? What’s wrong with finding black girls attractive? Must be an American thing?! How come when guys find white girls attractive it isn’t a fetish it’s just normal…and even though we all know these guys stereotype the ww there with as easy, slutty and pretty all over the world there known as loose, isn’t that a fetish?
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@Torontgirl
America is much different from Canada. It is not common for American White males to date Black women. And from what I observed most of the time when White American men do like Black women, it is for fetish reasons. MOST of the time.. I was talking about White American guys not guys in general. Whenever I am dressed up pretty White guys flirt with me for sex not for a relationship.
And many Black men have a fetish for White girls. Most Black men prefer Black woman to date and marry.
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Wait a minute, with so many races in the world from Indian to Asian to Hispanic sub-groups, it’s a bit naive to believe you have to only go with a black man! Nothing wrong with preferring to date intra-racial however you’d be surprised how great and how well you could relate to other men of color.
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@Gina
I am only against dating White American men. I don’t know about European White men though. I don’t mind Hispanic or Asian men.
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Same thing with black guys who marry white girls, they do it mostly because they want mixed kids and higher status. Same thing with white guys who date Asian girls, that hasn’t stopped them…they date white guys with power and what has done for them…now there seen as desirable before they were seen as Asian monkeys and that wasn’t too long ago. Canada and the us both have a history of slavery and discrimination, if you refuse to mix or even talk…how is it going to change? In fact I don’t think you really want it too. You said the guys around you date white or light girls, you should do the same! You are worthy, you’re desirable…even they’re using you, so the black guys are also using them…I’ve seen these relationships I know what the guys say to them, these we have no self respect…and guys who date of their race are always accused of wanting sex it’s not just bw…
Maybe there’s something I don’t understand here, you should really come to Toronto, the US seems like a Nazi country compared to here
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*these ww–not we
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@Toronotgirl
I don’t date White American men. I am not against Blacks dating Hispanics or Asians. I am very attracted to Hispanic men. I would love to come to Toronto though and travel outside of America. I don’t know about European White guys or White guys outside of America.
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Guess I changed my mind about White guys. I have decided to be open to all races now. You were right, Torontogirl.
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What made you change your mind? Anyway I was thinking about what you said, and to tell you the truth a lot of the white guys I know are mixed (part Asian or black) or there from South America. So maybe that’s why…idk, good luck tho!
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What is with always defining interracial couples as someone always having an ulterior motive? The constant stereotyping of why people date interracialy would be funny except its kind of ominous
With the backdrop of reading this thread about interracial couples, and doing a tour in the USA right now, its amazing how I am extra scrutinising interracial couples, its like a rodex inside my head running all the pseudo psychoanalysis I see on here…wow, at Laguardia airport I saw the most absolutly beautiful slender with perky booty , very dark woman with a very big muscular white guy, another beautiful light skinned black girl on the plane passing through Chicago with a white guy, South Beach, forget about it, one good looking black guy had a stunning white girl with a tremendous body on his arm…
I just kept looking and looking, scrutinising and scrutinising, psycho analysing and psycho analysing and suddenly, I saw me and my family in a mirror walking down the airport…I stopped dead in my tracks…looked and scrutinised and psychoanalysed…and let the rodex roll,….until, the superfucial judger in me , going bananas reading this thread while on this tour, banged against the real essence of my family…and all of a sudden, the real essence in my started singing:
`kiss my @ss, kiss my ass 3 4/ kiss my @ss kiss my @ss 3 4` now sing it with me `kiss my ass , kiss my @ss 3 4/ kiss my@ss kiss my @ss 3 4`
with a chorus over the top kind of like white line fever but jam the words in:
`interracial sexual obsession` ` kiss my @ass kiss my @ass 3 4`
and it was amazing, the judger part of me, the scrutiniser, just got flushed down the toilet , out in the sewage cesspool where it belongs…whew
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@B.R.
There is nothing wrong with Black women dating out but if she has to belittle or slander Black men in the process, then she is a sellout.
Dating out doesn’t make you a sellout.
Dating out AND slandering and belittling your own people in the process of dating out and not caring for the issues of Black people makes you a sellout in my eyes.
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yCzl0NKSRR0)
This is one of the few Tommy Sotomayor videos that make sense and is accurate right on the dot. Megan Vaughn is a brainwashed sellout who has sex for money and belittles and puts down her own Black men for validation. Plus she doesn’t care to help the Black Community either.
You seem like a nice guy:) B.R.
P.S. I changed my mind on IR dating, I’m open to it, thanks to Torontogirl and Gina however my area is a very small, racist town full of rednecks and racist Whites. Like Black men do, Black women have a right to expand our options of men.
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Plus I haven’t told anyone this but for this past month before this thread even came up, I have started writing a story about a Black female and White male romance. It is much more complicated than this topic because she gets pregnant as a high school senior and his father doesn’t approve of her because she is Black. Her family doesn’t approve of him because he is White. The girl wants to keep the child but the boy is not interested though. He has to choose what is the decision in this situation.
I thought about it before writing it and now I am on Chapter Four of the story and I still find the story cringe worthy to say the least. I plan on being an author one day.
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^ good for u adeen. I think u will be a good author, im more into some sci fi or action stuff. so the romance stuff ain’t for me lol
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Adeen, I totaly agree…I didnt want to participate much on the BWE thread, because I dont want to apear to be taking sides and bash black men in any way
Ive said this before, black men were great role models for me growing up and still are, I would never bash black men..I have too much respect for them, and black women equaly..beleive me, black women have also been great role models for me and I have learned so much from them also..
It gives me no pleasure to see conflicts of these natures deviding people
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B.R True. I am sick of both Black women and Black men bashing each other. What is the point of it? Makes no sense. Plus I didn’t participate in the BWE thread much either because I didn’t want to sound like I am biased against Black men as well. I am not but some of the Black men in my life aren’t so great. I still love Black men though
@Mstoogood4yall
I am not into Romance stories either, I like action stories and mysteries. The story is cringe worthy because of how unique it is with White guy dating Black woman and impregnating her. That rarely happens in this country. Plus I am not a big fan of romance novels so this is going to be a tough one to write!
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Abagond, sorry for the mistake. I commented on another article on WordPress.
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and used another name. AMK is still Adeen.
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` I am not but some of the Black men in my life aren’t so great. I still love Black men though`
For sure, Adeen, and these are just individuals….they dont represent black men, they may be dead beats who just happen to be black
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Torontogirl
I actually agree with your post and I am 17.
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@ Toronotgirl
At first I was not going to respond to any of your post because i figured you were young and naive, but at this point I am going to say something and hopefully avoid saying anything further to you.
STOP! PREACHING TO PEOPLE. especially if you are a young girl thinking you can school grown women n just because your parents are Nigerian and you live in Canada. You make good points but you have also came out with some of the most ignorant comments.
Just because you attend an international school does not mean you are the know all for a group of people that spans not only from your school and area to damn near everywhere in the world. This statement “it’s cuz they can’t get wm, I know this bcuz I go to an intl school and the Mexican girls tend to be very loose, loud, and etc. ” comes to mind when I say this. How do you know what they can or can not get? If they are loose or not loose.
“y are you the ones worried about what wm are doing to BM?”—Not all are worried about it. I personally am not worked about what any man is doing other than my husband ( and that includes wm, am, etc.).
On the topic of Kanye he dated Amber rose who if I am not mistaken is mixed, but it goes back to my original point…who cares.
My third cousin in married to a white woman. They are in love and frankly they have had family gatherings that include both families. Maybe the ones you are around feel that way (they think they’re better than you, because you’re from a bw, and they’re from a wm. and no one really thinks BM are that sexy unless they can’t get a WM) don’t try to assume that all people feel this way.
Here is my advice to you…Expand your horizons. It is obvious you are indeed very young and need to experience a lot more than what you have in order to get a better view of then world and the people in it.
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Continued
“how BM can date women that caused death of many of their own kind, remember LYNCHINGS?!”—I remember it but I am sure (I hate to be saying this) none of those women were alive and a participant in that then. Not to mention trying to paint women with the innocent brush is naive. Black men and women have hurt each other. To put blame on one is just wrong on so many ways. Each group dates out so I personally don’t see the big deal. Some are self-hating and need to have a lighter woman and some just fall in love.
I can’t be mad at a black man for either because some of the black men I have seen lately that date out…those ww can have them because they did black women a service. I know of three ww/bm relationships (of the few I have encountered) where the white women is taking care of the black man.
It is better to have worthy black men and women get with black people than have to deal with a psychotic self-hatter on your arm who might decided to pour bleach in your tub and your kids tub to fix you.
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@Sharina
You have good points but weren’t you being a little bit, harsh on her? Yes I am around her age and I admit that I am naïve, insecure and know that I need to get out more and explore the world. I have a lot to improve on myself. You do have good points but you may have come off as being harsh to her. And I have nothing against you by the way.
Interracial dating is okay as long as the Black man or Black woman in the relationship isn’t putting down the opposite gender in their race. Then that’s self hate. I was against IR dating but I credit Torontogirl for opening me up to IR dating.
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@ Adeen
I was harsh to her. Not going to say I wasn’t and not going to make an excuse for it.
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@ Adeen
And understand that i don’t have anything againt torontogirl, but those type of preach statements is why I, in the beginning, did not listen to Trojanpam. She made some good points too and i agreed with her on some things too, but her approach just turned me off to anything she was saying. On top of that i take issues when people assume that what they know in life is an image of the entire world. I know you have nothing against me and don’t think I have anything against you either, but I am just saying.
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i don’t understand why ppl act like they gotta get their preacher voice on when they talk to black ppl.[in my preacher voice] I got something to tell ya *gasp* when i woke up this morning *gasp* i said i had me some oatmeal with the turkey bacon*gasp* isn’t the lord good* i mean dang we don’t spend all our time in church lol. shoot even obama does it, talk to me not at me. converse with me don’t yell at me.
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@Torontogirl,
I wish I was as smart as you are when I was a teen. Grab the mic, step up to the pulpit, and preach.
You seem to have a good grasp of the black American tradition of asking black women to sacrifice ourselves on the altar of black male empowerment. Black masculinity is constructed in such a way that it is dependent on black female subordination. The idea of black male emasculation was crammed into the conscious of most Americans by the now debunked Moynihan Report. Non-black men can get their patriarchy fix through business, educational achievement, political power, etc. Black American men only have sports and the romantic marketplace. This is why their rate of infidelity is twice that of white men and four times that of Asian men. The end result is misery for black men, black women, and black children. When black women do not submit to their authority we are viewed as intentionally oppressing them. In the minds of many of them black women are their greatest threat and their true oppressors. This is why Black women are about 6% to 7 % of the population but make up 22% of the domestic violence homicides. Black women that end up in the emergency rooms of American hospitals have injuries that are more severe than battered white women. The black American community is being held hostage by the “Black Male Remasculation and Empowerment Project”. There is nothing in black America that won’t be thrown on the altar to make this project a success.
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I just wanted to post this link to add to the earlier discussion in this thread about the status and desirability of Black women. http://wearethe15percent.com/
It was a response to the Cheerios commercial. This interracial couple created a site to highlight their family, and for others to post pictures of their mixed families. Lovely to see all the combinations!
But what I wanted to note was my totally unscientific skimming of the families, I noticed pretty equal numbers of BW/WM and BM/WW on that site. Which flies against all the propaganda that Black woman are so undesired and on the bottom of the dating totem pole and all that other nonsense.
Choosing who you wish to spend your life with, who you love, and who you want to raise children with could be a big indicator towards attractiveness and who wants who. If we are so icky, why on a website that highlights people who choose love across racial lines are things roughly 50/50? If we are to believe the hype and the propaganda, that website would have shown a very different reality.
Not theories, not media hype, not numbers on a graph, but living, breathing, real alive families. I was never raised to think that I wasn’t the cat’s meow. Heck my given name translates to Precious Gift from God. It was news to me and Black female friends to see all this bashing, and articles and statistics, when as we traveled the pathways of our lives, we weren’t seeing any of it.
Black women are absolutely beautiful. I am making that statement because I’ve seen between the lines on some responders here that they are internalizing the lies that try to keep us down and tell us otherwise. Black women are absolutely beautiful. Believe it.
If you are not seeing that, or getting the responses you’d like if you are out there in the dating world: switch your dating pool. Broaden your horizons. Flip the script. If you prefer Black men, as most of us Black women do, there are all kinds of Black men out there. That nummy chocolate hue comes from every corner of the planet, so put on your explorers cap and see what you can find.
Black women are absolutely beautiful.
Of particular topical note to the subject matter of this post, I found it very interesting that George Lucas, who could be said to have his pick of anyone, chose to marry a beautiful Black woman this past weekend.
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@ Awake BW
*APPLAUSE*
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But honestly I have to agree with her, she wasn’t trying to preach but why is everything bw did this bw don’t do this? When most of the people IR dating are BM, and I’m tired of bw going around saying BW don’t want anything but BM…it’s rude because you can’t speak for everyone and don’t know other people…I’m just saying BW should be able to do what they want. Honestly, this is pretty much unfair to me…
But anyone abagond plz delete my last BIG comment, I was actually joking about the HS thing, and thought it was kind of funny…I guess no one got the joke…lol…(awkward silence)
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@Awake BW, I love your response and yes us Black women are beautiful.
The lies of the media has brainwashed many including myself. Now I am trying to unbrainwash myself and love me for me. I am glad you showed me the link about many BW/WM relationships . Yes I believe that many White guys like Black women but are afraid to say so because of the stigma that surrounds them dating us. Or their family and friends don’t approve. Or the Black woman doesn’t like him back for whatever reasons. And there are some Black women who like White makes too but don’t say so as well fearing that they will be branded a sellout.
I am definitely going to start thinking of myself as beautiful and desirable from now on however no man will ever tell me what to do regardless of race!
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“But what I wanted to note was my totally unscientific skimming of the families, I noticed pretty equal numbers of BW/WM and BM/WW on that site. Which flies against all the propaganda that Black woman are so undesired and on the bottom of the dating totem pole and all that other nonsense. ”
Where is that propaganda? Other than Sotomayor and a few others like him on youtube, I’ve never heard it. There are literally thousands of youtube videos of BW/WM and BW/non-BM interracial couples on youtube.
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Why,
There’s plenty of it on the web. A Google search using specific words will turn up lots of results
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“y are you the ones worried about what wm are doing to BM?”—Not all are worried about it. I personally am not worked about what any man is doing other than my husband ( and that includes wm, am, etc.).
On the topic of Kanye he dated Amber rose who if I am not mistaken is mixed, but it goes back to my original point…who cares.`
Good points , Sharina, and good points Awake BW, black women truly are beautuful…Adeen never lose how you feel now about yourself
Torontogirl, you are young so I dont want to sound harsh on you in any way, but, I just notice a lot of stereotypes rolling on this thread and a lot of references to celebrities..I call this `National Enquiry Interrracial Celebrity Gossip `…
Im really happy to see people busting the statistics myths on here. Most black people are gravitating towards each other, and, there are plenty or healthy interracial relationships also
For sure, I do think its important to recognise the bad intentions of white people that might aproach a black person for a date….for sure, antennas should be up to perceive racism, but, there are so many complex reasons why people get together, and then break up…
I even saw a report here in the USA , where it sais there is a trend from all men that some are shying away from mairraidge, so, trying to say that is one group of men based on race is not true
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@ Adeen
You are absolutely beautiful.
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I was replying to the people on the thread that kept saying that they didn’t want to date WM because of how they treat BM and the inequality etc.
And the gossip part was for the person who mentioned the Kardashian, and mixed isn’t black. But I don’t know maybe its different in countries. Canada is more cultural than racial, so maybe I shouldn’t be talking. Sorry to all of you!
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@ torontogirl
You don’t have to apologize for stating ur opinion. Yes in america it is very different than canada, i saw the documentary bowling for columbine and it was interesting how canada has less murders than the us but have the same violent video games, violent movies, guns, etc.
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A mixed person can be as black as they want to be. Doesn’t mean they should be considered less black because they have lighter skin. I was not saying dont have an opinion. ..I was saying dont assume your opinion is how it is every where. If your account was hacked then my comment was not directed at you. Also not to preach. People will listen to you without you having to give them step by step on the correct way to live their lives according to you.
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Isn’t that what everyone else is doing, giving their opinion, saying things like “I can’t believe a bw would date a wm after how they killed BM and put them in prison” look at half of the last comments here! I’m just trying to say you should be able to do what you want! No offense, but that’s the preaching I’m reading on this thread…”Don’t date WM their evil” but anywho, it doesn’t matter, I just didn’t want ppl to feel bad about dating outside of the race…even though most athletes and musicians are married to BW, anyway! I’m not American, as I said before…and their other races apart from black and white…Asians, middle Easterns, mixed race etc.
Also it’s possible for a guy to date mixed race and not like BW, I’ve seen this…but anyway, I love Kanye, and I think he’s happy, idk…whatever! You don’t have to watch gossip news to see Kim and Kanye, they’re EVERYWHERE! Lol
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Only 1/3 of Canada are really Canadian, Canadians that came for the old world…lots of us are immigrant children, from 1st to 4th generation…
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I didnt give a thumbs up to those preachy comments either. They all turn people off. In fact I do believe I told someone just that not same words though. The key word here is people should date who they want. Not date out because someone tells them to nor stick to their own race because someone tells them to. It is a choice and no amount of preaching from either side is going to make them negate their choice.
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What does you not being an American have to do with anything? Even if you were your experience will not be an indication of how it is everywhere.
In regards to white and black not being the only race. I already said that several post ahead of yours so I am not sure what gave you the idea that I thought they were the only two choices. In fact several women mentioned it and even posted some nice pictures to boot.
“Also it’s possible for a guy to date mixed race and not like BW, I’ve seen this”—Another something I already knew, but go ahead and tell me what else you believe I am unaware of.
“You don’t have to watch gossip news to see Kim and Kanye, they’re EVERYWHERE! Lol”—They could be right in front of me and I still would not care.
The things I quoted here are yet again another good example of you preaching. Like I said you don’t have to preach to be heard. You can share your thoughts and idea without trying to school on how it is.
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Torontogirl, please dont feel like you shouldnt post, I didnt mean to focus on you specificly, I always find discusions about interracial relationships to get a little unreal if they start using celebrities as some example of what is right or wrong about interracial relationships…its too easy to take their personable foibles and make it seem like that is the template for behaviour…
You are right, we are just giving opinions here..your are as valuable as anyone elses
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Yeah, I still am not getting why Kim and Kanye are being so celebrated by the media.
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Can anyone give me pointers on how to deal with an environment full of white men who believe black women should be maligned and feel unwanted?
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dam kerry washington’s husband is fine.
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Thanks Peanut! Seriously, sometimes it gets to me and other black women notice it but we can’t talk openly about it on the job or directly where whites are. Ever since I’ve been around Whites, white men in particular give off this vibe that they are angry when black women are being wanted. It’s the strangest thing to me b/c I could not imagine Black men doing that to white women. I also know we black women don’t care about which white person is dating which. But I find along with racism, white men do different things to different genders of black people, and one is that with black women they act like we should be walking around feeling like sh#t 24/7. Some have said they are mad that we are not attracted to them by and large but to be honest, how can we be. Mostly they are out to hurt our race and us for whatever sick reason, so it’s hard to even consider them as heads of our households/potential mates.
Plus if their own White, East Asian and Hispanic women want white men, why do they care who black women are dating, who is into/wants black women?
But thanks for your advice though, I guess that’s the only way I can deal with it. Focus on myself.
I have never felt “undesired” though that’s why I don’t get this vibe and can’t understand why MEN would want a woman to feel unwanted. To me it’s like White men wish black women were unwanted/un-desired and are angry when a black man shows interest in a black woman, or when they see a black couple or when a black woman is in a couple with anyone.
Obviously, there is an agenda given the media never likes to show white men/black women couples, although I see them in everyday life, but will always have a black man/white woman couple or two spotlighted in the media almost everyday.
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@Gina
Us Black women are beautiful. Don’t listen to the media or ignorant men who think otherwise. We age the best and stay looking sexy even into our fifties and sixties.
@Peanut
Black love is alive and well. Don’t listen to the media’s hype that most Black men want and prefer White women. Truth is most Black men love and prefer Black women despite the media and many colorstruck Black men like Tommy Selloutayor putting down Black women.
95% of Black men are married to Black women in AmeriKKKlan.
Only about 5.5 % of Black men are married to White women.
Only 45%-49% of Black women are actually single not 70% like the media says.
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I am not ever going to listen to the media’s lies again about Black people because I found most of it to be not true and biased against us to promote and uplift White supremacy.
I am so glad that Kerry Washington married that man. He is sexy and she is lucky to have him.
Now I have this Black guy wanting to ask me out on a date but he is older than me. I told you Black love is alive and well! The media is full of lies,
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Plus many White guys in this country like Black women but there is a stigma that about dating Black women that I can’t fully explain because I am tired and it is late.
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Adeen, why do you keep saying that? Most White guys or men or boys are RACIST and ANTI-BLACK! We are not interested in dating them at all!
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@Peanut
Girl, keep your head up. This is from a Sista to another Sista, It may seem like most young, Black males in our generation want and prefer White women and non Black women but they will come around. They will recognize a beautiful and spirited Black woman like you.
I will try to keep my head up and love me for me.
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@Gina
If you hate White men so much, date inside your race. Not all White men are racist and anti Black. MANY are though. I admit White men aren’t my top choice in men but there is good and bad in all races. You didn’t have to yell at me!
I prefer Black men myself but I don’t hate White men at all.
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Actually, it’s most White men who are hateful. I don’t know who you really are behind your computer but most black women are not able to see white men as dating material because most have anti-black issues. That’s the honest fact. There are black, latino ( yummy) , and other races of men out there.
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Another thing. Gina, I never said that Black women were interested in dating White men. Most Black women I know don’t like White men or see them as potential partners.
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Appears you may be a troll! Most Black men are with Black women, young and old. Maybe you need to move.
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@Gina
I am a Black woman of 18 who prefers Black men like you do. White women are just as hateful as their White male counterparts, trust me. I went through hell with White girls at my schools, giving me dirty looks and talking crap about me behind my back.
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I am not a troll. I have been commenting on here for over a year. So hurt right now.
I am a young, Black woman who prefer Black males.
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@ gina
Adeen is not a troll she posted a pic of herself. she is a young black woman, again she is not a troll. If u read her earlier comments in this thread she was gung ho about black men and against white men but has changed her mind. SHe is now open to different races of men not just black men and not just white men.Most women on this thread have said there are other options besides white men and i and other women posted pics of afro latinos, idians, and somoans. Nobody posted a pic of a white man.
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@ adeen
don’t let her get to u sis, im here.
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@Mstoogood4yall
Thank you very much. I think she is the troll. I have never seen Gina commented on here before and from what I see, she hates me. She always contradicts my comments and always hates on me for no reason.
I don’t have much Black female friends because this is how they treat me at all.
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I don’t want to argue or see other black people argue on here or do personal attacks. If u attack a young woman like that, that is a shame. She is learning, we all are that is why we are here, to converse, debate, and learn. WE deal with enough put downs, and accusations in life, this is supposed to be a safe haven. yes adeen flip flops sometimes but that is part of growing up, is changing your mind, opinions, and trying different things, there is nothing wrong with that. I view everybody here that is respectful, kind, young and old, awake, conscious black people as my brother and sister. so i don’t want to see us fight, i want to see solutions and ideas without personal attacks.
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Adeen sometimes its people who come to websites to attack people they think they can get away with attacking. I don’t think it is right, and would not attack someone who i think is asleep, or is learning . I believe in telling that person your opinion and having a healthy debate. I ignore those types of people who just take one word or sentence and go and create some lies or put words in my mouth. SOme people u can tell them what u mean and find it was just a misunderstanding, others just do it to feel better and no matter what u say they disagree. or find little things to pick apart.
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@Mstoogood4yall
Well said and us putting each other down is why we don’t stick together as a race of people.
From reading Gina’s posts, she comes off as hateful, mad and angry.
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Mstoogood4yall
You have a good point however I don’t see why she likes to attack me for? What did I do to her besides reply back to her.
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I’m merely posting on the topic. It’s hard for Black women and White men to be compatible because of white supremacy and the psychotic-ness of racism which makes it so that a large percentage of white men are very aggressive and hateful towards Black women. Latino and Asian are better alternatives for those of us who are open to dating other races which I think more of us are.
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@ gina
yes i do think men of color are a better option. adeen, myself, and others have said that its not just white men which is what the media pushes we all see it. THey act like black women are just supposed to be with white men if we decide to date out. I myself am attracted to afro latinos and indian men. some asian men as well, white men aren’t for me, but to each his own. I had someone question me about why i don’t like white men and it was annoying. I don’t attack people who say they want to date whites, no i don’t agree with it, but i can’t change their mind and all i can do is worry about who i choose to spend my time with.
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I think you are right but I have to wonder, if black men are not supposed to want black women and black women are supposed to be single, then what is supposed to happen to us? They want to malign us so they can abuse us? What kind of abuse are they envisioning?
Along the same lines, if Black people are not supposed to like or love each other and other races are not supposed to like or love blacks, where does that leave blacks?
I have to go further and ask this, if they really don’t want us to get jobs, when we do they harass us, if we also are not supposed to couple up and have families, then what is supposed to happen to us?
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@Gina, Mstoogood4yall and Peanut
I agree that Latina and Asian women are better alternatives for White men to date when dating out because there isn’t a stigma around dating them as it is with a Black woman. Plus it is more likely that a White male would find them attractive based on their skin color, features etc.
You see the history between Black women and White men in this country is terrible. White males slave owners raped their Black female slaves to produce more slaves NOT because they loved them, which they didn’t. This and because many if not most Black women aren’t attracted to White men physically or can’t relate to them on an emotional or cultural level.
Why should we date White males if many of us Black women can’t relate to them on an emotional or cultural level?
@Gina
I am not a troll.
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Ms gina
I think they want us to be isolated from others so we won’t team up and unleash some whoop ass lol.. seriously though blacks and Indians teamed up and kicked the army’s behind during the Gullah wars. They want us to be alone so they can pick us off one by one with no allies. They want us gone, if they didn’t then they wouldn’t have destroyed black wallstreet and then entice blacks to be dependent and destroyed black businesses. If we have no hospitals, schools, etc we are looking to them for help and education and they can deny us and have denied us. They want things back to the way slavery was, where black women were really unprotected and easy prey. THis is why they don’t educate black youth to their full potential, they didn’t want smart slaves just dumbed down workers who didn’t ask questions. THey want the youth to be dumbed down not ask questions and get sucked into a life of crime and feed the private prisons. They don’t like to see black couples because that means they will have kids and those kids will grow up in a functioning household where they are see black love and want that. And where the kids know better and do better. They want the black kids to grow up In single parent households because they know that mother is working and its easier to trick one parent versus to 2 parents. two heads are better than one. A father protects and provides, so that child will have more resources for education and sports. They try to get rid of the man first. Then after that they try to trick the woman into all kinds of things like giving her child medicine because they say the child is acting up, when the child could just be bored with the classes because they are gifted ,but they don’t want u to know that. They want us to stay in dysfunction which is why there are trolls that come on here and stir things up when we are on to some tangible solutions. They know who we are and what we are capable of ,some of us just don’t know it yet and they want to prevent us from figuring that out and getting back to our fullest potential.
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That’s a sick mindset. How can any group behaving like that and holding those beliefs really consider themselves superior? Nothing is superior about that. But we have to think of this honestly! If we are, in their eyes, not supposed to be loved, love each other, get jobs, get into colleges, get housing where we want, then what do they really want for us?
Why are Indians and Asians and Hispanics allowed to love each other in friendships and families, but the average, typical white get’s offended and enraged when a black male even finds his own black woman attractive or a black woman finds a black man attractive.
In terms of “They want things back to the way slavery was, where black women were really unprotected and easy prey. “, why is this necessary? I mean I am not into white men so definitely don’t want to envision or sexually prey on one. I mean we have to think seriously what it is they want from us since they want black women to be maligned and unloved!
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It is White men with power who run the media and portray Black women as ugly, fat and undesirable in the media. And many Black men get brainwashed by the media to think White women are the standard of beauty and refuse to date Black women. Same with many White men too. They want us to be alone, single and isolated.
”I mean we have to think seriously what it is they want from us since they want black women to be maligned and unloved!”
Same here.
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Gina:
It’s called sour grapes…
if we are, in their eyes, not supposed to be loved, love each other, get jobs, get into colleges, get housing where we want, then what do they really want for us?
To never be in a situation where we could possibly dominate them–as this is their greatest fear. But i think the question that matters the most and is relevant is what is it that Black people want ourselves?
They (usually white women) also become “threatened” when Black women form close, functional friendships with one another although they themselves never bother to include Black women in their carpools, luncheons etc. at work and at school…(sour grapes again, no?)
When blackpeoplemeet.com started up a few years ago–guess who was up in arms about it crying foul? White women, because they claimed that it limited their chances of connecting with a Black man online and that the site was discriminatory.
I have come to the conclusion that they (white people) are truly psychotic.
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Yeah, Gina? Well, dont go to Brazil, you might have a shock attack, because huge numbers of black women there have no filters about dating white men, and would be angry at anyone suggesting differently…
Black activists from america who go to Brazil get headaches at seeing how frequent black women hook up with white men, they just cant handle it
And stay away from South Beach, it might make you wretch on your premise about black women not wanting to date white men,, just passing through there , i feel if I was single, I would have no problem hooking up with a black women
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@phoebeprunelle
dominate them? Aren’t we like all groups and peoples, merely trying to live our lives? The only group that has tried to “dominate” whereever they go is whites. Not even in Africa do Africans try to dominate over whites, so that fear placed upon blacks alone , and not Hispanics or Asians or others, doesn’t make much sense and is not based in any form of reality.
Maybe, like other things, it’s used as an EXCUSE to hate and oppress. I don’t think blacks or unique or stronger than any other group, but it’s just that whites have decided to focus on us.
Honestly, if White men and women by and large don’t believe that we should be loved, love each other, have friendships with each other, etc, and also don’t really want us to have jobs, be educated, etc, all I can think is that they want us as a race to be dead which , yes to me, spells PSYCHOTIC and EVIL!
Can you imagine giving a hoot when it comes to white people dating, if they date each other or not, who does and who doesn’t like white men/women? That’s insane. It’s normal and natural, particularly for two Philippinos to find they relate most to each other, or two mixed-race Puerto ricans or two whites from Russia. The fact that in some peoples minds two black people hooking up seems un-normal or they feel they need to fight that ( because yes many of us black women have witnessed white men trying to get black men to not like or go with black women), says to me that yes, they are MENTALLY ILL, particularly considering the 500+ years of oppression AROUND THE WORLD they have put us through.
Did anyone get to see the serious “Blacks in Latin America” , it was awesome however disturbing that from Cuba to Brazil, white supremacy/black oppression was rife in all those nations and people have to struggle through it.
INSANE!
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Adeen and Torontogirl ,as two very young black women, I want you to know that I would support any desician you make in your life about your preferance in men…and if you changed your mind, I would support your desician to change your mind…
See, that is what Brazilian black women have taught me, they are in the struggle against racism as much as any black women anywhere, but, they just arnt hung up about who they want to date…they dont go looking over each others shoulders to criticise and psycho analise who they should be having sex with…they may be behind the USA on some issues as far as racism, but , they are advanced on other issues…I respect them very muchOh yeah, and I respect how South Beach is rolling (Adeen, you ought to take a trip to Oceon Dr on South Beach, it cant be too far from you in florida , they really know how to roll there, it is so mixed it is dizzying…beautiful people of all races and sexes, just mashing together…squares and uptights…just stay away…you wont like it)
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@B.R.
Thank you very much but I would love to visit South Beach though. I would love to get away from America but I don’t which country is less racist and more racially tolerant than this country?
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@Adeen you’re so beautiful! (I checked ur fb page) and about the wm thing…I really looked at it and realized most of the ones I know are actually MIXED like half Filipino or black or Indian etc…it’s true whenever I go to a mall like yesterday the wm act so arrogant lol. Maybe cuz minorities have taken over Toronto. I also know why WP are always picking at our hair now …I went into this mall you see bw with curly hair, small braids, box braids, straightened hair etc. and all the WW have the same mousy hair in a ponytail. I don’t know why ppl worry about BW straightening their hair, when WW don’t even have straight hair (trust me I lived with some, thank God for the hair he gave you!). And so many of them don’t take care of their hair, you can tell! (Not all just some)
@Gina Also remember most of the writers of the shows you watch are WW, so they’re also trying hard to make you look undesirable…I was just talking about the plastic smile WP give to black ppl with my mom…such arrogance, eh?
P.S last time I swear you said you were 17, did ur birthday just pass? Lol
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And b.r. You don’t have to apologize twice, it was the Sharina commenter who scared me…and Adeen do you have a lot of africans in your area or no?
I was talking with my family and we were talking about how the Chinese took over our local grocery store and replaced it. I was upset because the ppl there don’t know too much English but I must admit its much better than the original one. They even have a place to buy sushi, and the whole WokExpress lol. Why don’t African countries do that? We assimilate too easily and try to be accepted by whites, why don’t we start our own industries, I mean we have the money 🙂 and Nigeria, where I’m originally from, is the second largest black population in the world, yet we don’t plan like that…what do people think about this? There’s so many Chinese going to Africa now too, I think they’re trying to take over the world lol! If we could stop fighting within eachother we could work this out! 🙂 colorism is stupid, I was watching the BET runaways, when I hit me, there’s no difference, were all BLACK :))
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*What do you PEOPLE think about this?
-Sorry
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@TorontoGirl
I live in Florida in the United States. No, my area is mostly White and I hate Ocala so much. I used to live in New York before moving to Florida. I plan on going back to NYC after I graduate from high school.
And this Gina is not the same Gina Torres you commented before. This is a different Gina.
Yes I do agree that us Black people should build their own businesses and hire their own people to work in their business. Whites prefer to hire their own people before they hire a Black person. I do find it sad that the Chinese are coming to Africa to take it over. We should work together as a race of people so that we aren’t conquered.
You family is Nigerian? Cool. My family is Jamaican.
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Awesome! My closest cousin (the one I’m closest too) is half Jamaican, it’s always been me and the Jamaicans (or Trinidadians) in school, Whenever there was another black person. My brother is dating one right now…There’s a lot of Asians in Jamaica though too, at least in my school there like half of the Jamaicans lol. You should really visit Toronto!! :)) and I love Florida, that’s sad! WP are definitely very arrogant that’s what I how most other races complain about…that’s why I don’t get why Chinese and Latino women chase them so much, they date them, but the WM are still racist.
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@Torontogirl
I agree with you 100%. I have never dated a White guy in my area before and I don’t plan to. Most of the White guys in my area are racist, redneck and think that they are better. In my area, Latina and Asian girls chase after White men as if they are the cream of the crop. SMH.
I would love to visit Toronto one day.
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Plus Florida is not a bad place Where I live isn’t the nicest or most tolerant of Black people, that is all.
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That’s where they get their ego from. These Mexican girls were doing a survey at dinner time (boarding school) about which guys did women like the most and most of them picked Russians. I’m not going to lie the Russians are hot, and they’re surprisingly more open to bw, then american white men…I wonder why…what do you think? I personally picked middle eastern, idk why, maybe cuz that’s what I grew up around. It’s funny when you’re surrounded by all these races that you seem to end up going for the ones you grew up around, even if its not your own race…I think I need help on that, I’ve never limited myself to BM most likely because I wasn’t raised around much but the ones in my family…ever since this one Pakistani guy liked me, I started seeing them as more attractive, I totally ignored them b4 unknowingly
And trust me, it’s worse for the Indians. I went to an Indian/Chinese school and none of the Indian girls had bf except for two very light skinned ones, the only 2 white girls had bfs and Chinese girls…they were also meaner to the Indian girls and I didn’t even realize this until I left and actually thought about it…it’s funny because they were very nice to me (the guys), maybe that’s why every lunch when I sat with the girls they would say racist things about black ppl…hmmm
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@TorontoGirl
European men are usually more open to us Black women than American White men because they isn’t a stigma attached to dating Black women in Europe like it is in America.
I don’t mind dating a European White man at all as long as he has a good personality but I wouldn’t date a White guy from my area though.
Nothing is wrong with dating outside of your race as long as you don’t put down your own race.
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Do you have a Facebook? How is Canada like?
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@Peanut
There is nothing offensive about Blackpeoplemeet. How come people think it is wrong for Black people to love each other and stick together? Anyone answer my question?
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I do Adeen wait I’m coming
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https://www.facebook.com/MsCuriousity?ref=tn_tnmn
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I’m open to any man that treats me well, but I’d have to say that white men (especially really white and blonde) aren’t usually on my radar. Don’t get me wrong, I can appreciate a good looking man regardless of race (Chris Hemsworth, Gabriel Aubrey) but I just don’t really see myself with a white guy.
I grew up in a mostly white and Latino school and I absolutely hated the way some white guys just automatically thought a black girl was just dying to be with them and has to tell them they are not into black women. I had a guy say that to me and I was no where near interested in him lol! Do they think every woman wants them or something? Maybe I am just naturally too flirty? So, I am mostly not attracted to white guys but I would be with a man that loved me for me and treated me well regardless of race.
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Torontogirl…I think Adeen looks great also..speaking as a married adult…I think things will open up for her when she leaves where she is at…I noticed, just a little north of south Beach , and it changes fast, from string bikinis (sometimes) to diapers…
Please dont take this wrong, but, Sharina makes great points ..Im not sure the misunderstanding, but she has been on point on this subject
I love Nigeria…I have been looking at so many youtubes of Nigerian dancing and drumming, the bell parts on “ogene” are unbeleivable ,and some are the roots of jazz swing beat
I read some mind blowing information about the Igbo and the Igbo language, and, how it is one of the most ancient languages that has root words in Egyption, Hebrew, Indian from India, and English among many other languages
Im very sad at the Christian/ Muslim conflicts
Thank you for your insights on Canada, which other posters from this blog have verified with their experiances also
Hey, there are a lot of boring draggy white guys, I dont like Nascar, mooning, and lighting farts either…but some white guys have a cool surf culture, invented by brown skin Hawaians…Adeen, go to Coco beach and look for Kelly Slater..I wish I could see him surf again
I love hearing you both think of men from all over the world…and I love hearing you both admire black men…black men have been role models for me..and still are
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@ torontogirl
My comments were not meant to scare you and as I have stated before …If someone hacked your account then it was meant for them. It’s nothing personal.
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I agree with you Sharina, you just seemed a lil angry I was replying another commenter who brought up Kim K and Kanye, I forgot who the persons screens name was so I just wrote generally. I was trying to defend bw who wanted to date outside, by saying that most people dating out of the race anyway aren’t even bw so what’s the deal? Not saying this to you btw. I agree with everything you said, I don’t like gossip either but I was replying someone else. :))
@B.r I’m actually Yoruba, a lot of people in the Caribbean come from that tribe, patois kinda reminds me of pidgin English (Nigerian modified English) I don’t live there but when I was visiting, I used to go to this grocery story owned by this Lebanese man. And guess what? He ended up being a supplier for terrorist bombs. Yeah I hate the religious wars! everyone should just go their own way, live and let live, y’know! In fact my old house, that we sold ended up being bombers who bombed the hotel we were in just a week after we had left…and we were even supposed to stay an extra week…(that was the Hilton in England) it’s crazy. Did you hear about the Egyptian president?
Btw why do american WM say that Egyptians aren’t black, same thing with Ethiopians, Eritreans etc? I could easily say the Greeks aren’t white, same with Portugese and Jewish etc.?
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Then I apologize for coming off as angry. 🙂
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@Torontogirl
You look so beautiful in your picture. I would like to add you on Facebook but I don’t know how. Can you send me a friend request?
Nice talking to you.
@Sharina
I am glad you apologized and I knew you didn’t mean to come off as angry.
@B.R.
I do want to leave Ocala so badly. I want to go back to NYC. I feel like it is holding me back staying here.
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I can’t find your Facebook page anymore, can u send a link? sorry for the late reply
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Yes I will, thank you. https://www.facebook.com/adeen.mckenzie
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It is indeed a psychoticness Peanut in terms of the behavior of people like that. I could never find a korean dating website or russian or hispanic dating website to be racist or feel offended by it, What we know is that to people who are racist, blacks are not supposed to have anything, be wanted, be liked, have a job, get educated and the like.
sites like blackpeoplemeet.com, black magazines, etc are absolutely needed. It’s not all whites who feel like the ones who are against blacks having anything, because I recall some years ago, there were some European females I was walking to the store with while on a college campus and I purchased a black magazine, and they were like “wow, yes those magazines are needed” and thought it was cool.
So it’s not every single white/white-oriented person, but yes, too many have these mental issues.
I also noticed the “anything but black” ads on match.com and elsewhere. I mean every single box checked off but black, which I believe sends an obvious message of a society they are living in and cultivating. I personally am not open to all groups, but i also am not against any one particular group either.
I have also noticed that white women whom aren’t even interested in black men, sometimes will try to cock-block a black woman, so to say. Sorry to use that term but that’s the best way I can put it. but heck, even many white men try to cock-block black women as well.
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That’s funny TorontoGirl, because where I live there are many East Africans like Ethiopians and Eritreans and when you ask “what are you guys mixed with?” they look at you like you are stupid. They say to me there was never any mixture in their history and they are just “black”.
East Indians are said to be caucasion too which I have to disagree with because especially with their hair covered up (wearing a hat or other) , you could mistake them for a black person. Many have full lips, and the like. Heck the average east indian female looks more like a Halle Berry or maybe a Latino, not a white woman at all. Same for indian men.
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Hi Jess,
I find I don’t like being in white environments that much, which is another reason I am not seriously considering white men. I find I am most comfortable in diverse areas, mostly black, immigrant, Hispanics or east Asians or a mixture of that. I never have any problems, deal with any issues in these environments, never made to feel bad about being a black woman or being black and I could go on and on.
I don’t know how some black men and women do it- date white and live a white lifestyle because after a while to me, I don’t find myself happy with the attitudes around me.
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I agree Gina. It’s actually rude, who made them the definer of what is black or not. Imagine I said south Europeans weren’t white, and referred to them as the sub-Danube(a river) there much darker in skin tone, a lot of Greek football players have thicker lips and wavy hair…I mean Africa is the mot diverse continent in the world. The name Africa doesn’t even come from any Africans, it came from the Europeans…the countries (53 i believe) are not even close like that, that’s why I laugh now when people keep saying “Africans” like they’re a group of similar minded people. Lol, and Even Egyptians and middle Easterns have the same “nappy” hair as we do (and its really SOFT! 😛 )…can I claim them too? Lol jk
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[…] My views on relationships between black women and white men […]
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Gina and Torontogirl,
Caucasians over the centuries added categories of people to their race such as Arabs, East Asians etc to prove the so called ”dominance” of the White race. In actually they aren’t apart of the White race. The White race is actually 8% worldwide and shrinking due to low birth rates and high death rates.
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Plus most Black women don’t date White men in America because in reality most of us don’t have any reason to. Most White men in America show Black women everyday that they don’t desire us as romantic partners or even as friends. Plus there are way too much cultural differences to consider here as well. Or maybe they stay away from us based on stereotypes?
And from my observations and experiences MOST Black women in America don’t like White men in that way or think of White males as potential romantic partners.
I am not against interracial marriage at all as a Black woman but I am trying to be realistic.
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Adeen,
I don’t know about you, but from my vantage-point, I have no issue getting hit on and asked out by white men.
I think the problem with many bw who haven’t been around white people is that they tend to be either very intimidated by white men or they automatically put them on a pedestal when they show interest.
And you cannot speak for MOST black women in America, just like you cannot speak for ALL black women period.
I like white men, I date white men, I am attracted to white men, but they’re not gods nor are they better than other races of men. Once you treat them as such and stop over-thinking bw/wm IRs then it becomes more clear.
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@Moodscope
A few White males show interest in me even more interest in me than Black males. I am open to all races but my area is not a nice place at all to date interracially. It is a small, Southern town full of rednecks and hillbillies who have very warped mindset of Blacks and minorities.
I wasn’t overthinking IR, I was basing my logical based on observations. MOST Black women I KNOW don’t like White males like that.
Why are you always challenging my opinions?
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Because you type in absolutes and you tend to flip-flop a lot. And in a tone that is self-defeating, imo.
I’m one to give an opposing point of view from time to time, so I apologize to you deeply if you feel like I’m challenging you.
I’m on your side, believe me.
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@Moodscope
It is okay. Thanks. I am still young(18) and trying to learn but I am not there yet. I wish I had more life experience though to comment on this accurately. Now I see your point.
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Adeen:
Just want to say hello, my beautiful black sista! ^_^
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@Sondis
Hello. Nice to hear from you. How are you?
@Peanut
Yes it would be much more fitting to discuss it here. I feel the hostility many of White males have towards us. I don’t see why. The funny thing about it is many of them actually desire us Black women but are frustrated. Frustrated that MANY Black women wouldn’t date them.
I don’t mind dating a White male as long as he isn’t from my area(My area is full of racists and rednecks. I wouldn’t date a White male from my area.) and is a nice person.
What do you think, Peanut?
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Or maybe many of them hate Black women as well. Who knows?
Read this article
(http://www.racismreview.com/blog/2011/04/16/white-mens-hostility-to-black-women-a-deeper-look/)
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Did you hear about the black women recently who was raped and killed by 4 black men (in the military) along with her husband the sgt. Who just happened to be white. They don’t care about bw issues, like when she gets raped or becomes a teen mom or faces abuse or has to listen to black teen boys insult her but when she dates white guys…they want to call her sell out. No offense, but look at how much attention ppl will pay if a black man gets killed by a white person but what about all the black women who suffer abuse verbally/non-verbally from BM. And have to pretend to be stronger than they are to protect themselves, but then men will complain she’s acting somehow. But if she’s quiet, passive or even hesitant (like me) they’ll say she’s acting white or is stuck-up. They say they want black women to wear natural hair, I have long hair, but most of the guys hitting on me were white or mixed…I’ve never been raised around more than two black men at a time…don’t limit yourself! That ish was beyond crazy…be happy, don’t wait! Try to find a non-white, non-black guy…they’re the best! :)) I’ve always liked gotten a long with middle eastern, North African guys also east/west african guys are the hottest! And they all have tightly curled hair like me!
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@ TorontoGirl
What you said is the sad truth. What you just mentioned and what happened on the other thread really makes me wonder why I make so much effort to defend black men. I guess I have to always remember the good ones. They don’t deserve the shame that the bad ones put them through.
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@Toronto girl
I am not limiting myself. Peanut and I were discussing a problem that we face in America. I am open to all races.
@Sharina
I wonder the same thing. I wonder why I still love Black men when most Black men my age are with light skin or White women.
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@ torontogirl
i don’t think i’ve heard that story. i was trying to look for it and i saw an even disturbing story that happened in 2005, THis young black woman joined the army and was raped and killed in iraq after 6 weeks, and the army said it was a suicide and didn’t want to investigate. But her family knew it wasn’t and saw the autopsy report. her name was lavena johnson she was only 19 the same age as me. It is so sad that i never hear about these stories, and i know there are even more disturbing untold stories about black women whose lives were cut short and nobody cares to find who done it. Black women have been taken advantage of from everybody, including our own community. We need to start looking out for ourselves and each other.
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There still are good ones, most of the BM I know parents are from Africa and the Caribbean, and they LOVE black women. And they’re very nice to me, they don’t even seem to like white women too much even my own brother says that when ww cut their hair short they look like boys etc.
I never had to deal too much with the light skin vs dark skin, thing cuz we all know we’ll be seen as black. I have heard my brother say he doesn’t like black girls twice though, and seems to go with biracials. We never saw his girlfriends until he start dating mixed girls. Now everyone’s darks skin bcuz of the sun so I just laugh…(I’ve been yellow, I’ve been brown, I’ve been white, I’ve been black)
I mean you have so much to choose from west africans,east africans, North Africans, afro-Latinas etc.
I don’t have anything against them, it’s more the westernized ones, you have to watch out for.
Also you’d think the NAACP or smth would talk about this, but it’s always BM. It’s really sad, and I think it’s going to get worse in Canada, with the next generation…a lot of these guys get their light skinned preference all love rap music etc.
now I know why my parents cancelled BET and I hated my brother listening to Lil’ Wayne
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I feel like everywhere I go as a Black woman, I am never safe. Somewhere and somehow someone has to disrespect and malign me or Black women in general.
Has anyone ever wondered why people in our community march for Black boys and aim at protecting them but do nothing when Black women are hurt or killed?
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@Sharina…I know, that’s why I love Kendrick Lamar but that’s how they all start out and then they change on you…Kanye West, Wale etc.
I’m trying not to get too attached, so I don’t listen to the music at all anymore, ever since I heard 2Chainz I knew it was over…and we were finally making progress!
Even Drake still hangs around racist BM even if he doesn’t say anything.
Have you also realized that a lot of BM rappers complain that their positive songs don’t get played on the radio, yet when it’s white rapper he’s always saying something positive ex. Eminem (even though he’s violent lyrics), macklemore, classified…
It’s like they only want positive music if its a white guy…either that or someone’s lying…
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@ Adeen
They do so because just look at who the so called black leaders are. black men, so until we as black women step up and and have our own advocates we will not be heard. This is why some black women left the civil rights movement to join the feminists. They were not being heard, then when they left they still weren’t being heard. We need an organization just for us for our own unique experiences that nobody else has or cares to understand. More and more of us are getting fed up with being taken for granted and unappreciated and being disrespected. My hope is when we hit the point where we can’t take it anymore we band together and be one heck of a force. Black women unite
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Isn’t that what BWE sites are about? The ones that abagond claims are all about worshipping white men? One site I love going to is notyourgirlfriday.wordpress.com and muslimbushido.blogspot.com…it talks about bw’s unique experience facing both sexism and racism in the black community…it’s really interesting stuff, and it doesn’t generalize, she always make sure to say *some*. How do u put uplinks on here?
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So true, TorontoGirl!
I don’t believe that BWE is worse than the poisonous vitriol that the black male centric blogs tend to lash out at black women.
Hell, if you add up all the videos from bitchy black males and the blogs they get on, they’re FAR MORE THREATENING THAN ANY BWE SITE OUT THERE!
And you have Abagond who says they’re ‘harmless compared to BWE’.
FOH!
I followed muslim Bushido’s forever and i even copped her book, which is very insightful and a great read.
Sistren, we are on our own. No race of man is coming to the rescue, You can believe that silent ‘good black men’ like your beloved Abagond will have your back, but look how he sided with them just as convenient and easy as pie.
We’re behind enemy lines everywhere we go, so get in where you can fit in.
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Well another week at work and I guess it’s not ALL white men but a large percentage are focused on black women. There’s on that often brings up single moms and single women and which I think he want’s to apply to black women/wish on black women. There are black men on the team however, we black females are expected to still feel “shunned”. I couldn’t imagine black men doing this to white women in any type of environment and black men most likely never would. I have to say that I find the same white men who are uncomfortable around black men are the same ones who think black women should walk around feeling ugly/unwanted even though black men are around. Most of the black women are my company are married/coupled up, so how that feeling among white men still is so prevalent is weird to me.
Like they want to believe you as a black woman are alone, unwanted and feel ugly/unwanted. Is it just racism being played out differently with us? It’s so weird to me.
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I completely agree with this article esp the last part. White men look at black women through racist lens; whether they realize it or not. I’m an extremely attractive black woman (creole mix) and I know from experience as I’ve dated many well off white men who want nothing more than to get me into the sack void of long term commitments though I can say the same for many black men. The difference is this: the black men I’ve been involved with do not want to commit bc most prefer and have done so, to marry or commit to something other than black. The well off white men want a woman that came from privilege, perhaps an Ivy grad, Pamela Anderson look a like to wed bc number one, they don’t want black children and number two, they have a certain status to maintain before their colleagues and social environment. I’m certain of this. They want to keep you as a mistress only. I’d rather die alone and childless. The white women they marry get all the damn benefits; the house, the car, the lifestyle. I’m never having children and because of who I was born will probably never get married. I’m done.
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White women are extremely racist and many hate on attractive black women. My first year as a registered nurse I worked day shift for a very short time period because most of the doctors including white, black, Indian, etc would stare at me, flirt or make excuses to come converse with me. These white women proceeded to treat me like a Hebrew slave; there was such HATE that I can not even begin to describe. Ever since, I’ve worked night shift to avoid seeing docs and keep to myself but even having done that because I’m attractive I get hated on and mistreated by white women the most and then Korean women second. Women, ESP white women hate intelligent attractive black women therefore I’m certain they see us a a threat. They know I could take their men in a heartbeat. I’ve worked for countless hospitals and it’s the same s@&$. White men lust after black women and these white pop tarts know this, that’s why that can’t stand an attractive black woman. You wouldn’t believe the hatred I’ve endured throughout my career. Most hospitals I’ve left have been the result of the bullying I receive from white women. White women in general HATE attractive black women; PERIOD. I know this from experience!!!!
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The games is changing, as we all well know:
http://wearethe15percent.com/
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Vashti, what you say is absolutely the truth. In fact, my own mother, God rest her told me from the time I was a teenager that white women hate intelligent, attractive black women. Why wouldn’t they? The propaganda is that white women are the Bentley’s of the female gender, top shelf and the most beautiful. The very existence of a good looking, well-proportioned and well-spoken black women demonstrates that the propaganda is a lie.
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“Vashti
I completely agree with this article esp the last part. White men look at black women through racist lens; whether they realize it or not. I’m an extremely attractive black woman (creole mix) and I know from experience as I’ve dated many well off white men who want nothing more than to get me into the sack void of long term commitments though I can say the same for many black men. The difference is this: the black men I’ve been involved with do not want to commit bc most prefer and have done so, to marry or commit to something other than black. The well off white men want a woman that came from privilege, perhaps an Ivy grad, Pamela Anderson look a like to wed bc number one, they don’t want black children and number two, they have a certain status to maintain before their colleagues and social environment. I’m certain of this. They want to keep you as a mistress only. I’d rather die alone and childless. The white women they marry get all the damn benefits; the house, the car, the lifestyle. I’m never having children and because of who I was born will probably never get married. I’m done.”
You hit the nail on the head with this statement.
However, you are a anomaly in the sense, that the majority of black women, do not and will not admit to what you just said, they are in denial that white men, look at them as “N3gro bed wenches” and nothing more.
The majority of black women that “date” or have “sex” with white men, have to go into it with a “color-blind” way as to not feel ashamed or guilty for laying down in the white man bed, so they convince themselves by adopting the white man’s ideology of, “love is color blind”, “i only see color”, “I don’t see you as a black woman, i see you as a woman”.
The fact that the white man has to reject your race in order to accept you, says everything you need to know about his intentions toward you, sexual and nothing more. The same is true for white men, towards black men.
I am proud to be black, its not something for white people to dismiss in order for them to feel comfortable around me.
Black women find out the hard way, after thinking the white man will treat her the same as he treats his white women, when the white man is ready to settle down and have his,”white children” and wants to get married, he breaks up with the black woman (his n3gro bed wench)then finds a white women to marry and have his children with. The next time that black woman sees that same white man, she dated for years, he’s married to a white woman, then the black woman finally realizes that she was nothing more than a N3gro bed wench, all along.
Some black women wake up and never date a white man again and return to dating and loving black men but that’s only if they see it for what the relationship with that white man truly was.
There is a lot of black women, that are still in denial about how white men view them and will say thing like, “black men do the same thing, using black women for sex” as to make it equal or on the same level, this is part of the denial by black women, to make it a point to not be able to differentiate between a white man, looking at her as not fully human, a “N” word and a black man that happens to be a womanizer.
There is something else that is being purposely, overlooked by these type of black women ( color-blindness in an attempt to transcend their blackness ) is the 100’s of years of white men, raping black women and the black women’s young female children, during slavery and Jim crow.
These are the black women that will keep coming back to the white man, because they refuse to accept that white men see them as n3gro bed wenches, they believed the white men that told them, “they only see a human or a woman, not a black woman”
These black woman are totally whitewashed and after having a taste of the white woman’s world of eating at the masters table, don’t want to go back to eating scrapes in the ghetto and dating the field n3gro ( the black man)
Yes, these black women have the slave mentality of the masters n3gro bed wench, she would eat at the masters table and taste the choice cuts of beef and nutritious vegetables, while the field N3gros and N3gresses , eats the fat and gristle, that’s left over from the white man’s feast.
The black woman’s task is not only to be in the white man’s bed, she is also tasked with snitching on the black man and other field N3grows.
You see that going on today as it did back in slavery, these sellout black women cry, “YOUR NOT GOING TO MESS IT UP FOR THE REST OF US!” These black Republican conservative black women and even some Liberal Democrats that are married to white men, would shout.
The majority, if not all of white men, will have sex with a black woman or any other woman if she is attractive and has a nice body for that matter but won’t have children with or marry a black woman.
White men know what black people go through in America, simply because they are the ones that apply the oppression, therefore they don’t want any children from their loins, going through what they put other black people through, they want their children to have the white privilege that they have, not the curse of discrimination that black people have.
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“Vashti
White women are extremely racist and many hate on attractive black women. My first year as a registered nurse I worked day shift for a very short time period because most of the doctors including white, black, Indian, etc would stare at me, flirt or make excuses to come converse with me. These white women proceeded to treat me like a Hebrew slave; there was such HATE that I can not even begin to describe. Ever since, I’ve worked night shift to avoid seeing docs and keep to myself but even having done that because I’m attractive I get hated on and mistreated by white women the most and then Korean women second. Women, ESP white women hate intelligent attractive black women therefore I’m certain they see us a a threat. They know I could take their men in a heartbeat. I’ve worked for countless hospitals and it’s the same s@&$. White men lust after black women and these white pop tarts know this, that’s why that can’t stand an attractive black woman. You wouldn’t believe the hatred I’ve endured throughout my career. Most hospitals I’ve left have been the result of the bullying I receive from white women. White women in general HATE attractive black women; PERIOD. I know this from experience!!!!”
Once again, you hit the nail on the head.
I have experienced this very thing but on the opposite as a black man from white men.
Every black man knows, white men are intimidated by them in every way. I’ve been told by a decent amount of women in my life time, that i am a attractive black man. I notice the way white men come at me in how they talk to me and how they go out of their way to not deal with me if they don’t have too.
When i was looking for work, i would interview with only white men, sometime they double team me and there is a white women but almost exclusively white men.
They see a intelligent, attractive black man that goes against everything they think about black men, being they criminalize black men and have preconceived racist stereotypical views about all black men.
I’ve been passes up for many jobs that i have applied for in the IT field ( This field is dominated by white men ) then again, what field is dominated by white men? But i digress…..
This is why you see more black women in Corporate America, than black men, because white men are not intimidated by black women, like they are toward black men. In fact, its the complete opposite in terms of why white men, hire black women. Its no secret ( not to black women anyway ) that white men, want to have sex with them, so if a company has to hire more black people for, “diversity purposes” 9 times out of 10, that white man is going to hire a black woman and not a black man.
The fact that a white man thinks he might or may have a chance at having sex with a black woman, that he might not otherwise have the chance, being he lives in an all white neighborhood and he’s always wondered, what it would be like to have sex with a black woman, is enough for him to hire her over a black man and even if he NEVER gets a chance to have sexy with said black woman, he is content with watching her big black booty as she walks away from him, every day.
There is also something else going on that the majority of black women are unaware of in terms of an agenda.
The white man can’t lynch black men any longer, so he lynches the black man, financially. So the black man can’t look attractive to his white women, being white women love money just like any other woman. So the white man keeps the black man from getting jobs with high paying salaries or any job at all.
The white man, also does not want the black man to be financially stable and therefore look good in the eyes of his own woman, ( The black woman) so he can have the black woman all to himself. The white man is greedy! He wants our black woman for himself and his own white women.
The white man doesn’t want the black man to be able to support his family, so then he has no choice but to turn to illegal activities to make money to provide for his family, then the black man gets arrested and has a criminal record as a result and can’t find a job that pays a decent wage.
Then as a result of that, the black woman turns to the white man as a white savior, she is vulnerable to the white man deception as he whispers in the black woman’s ear, black men don’t want you, they want white women.
This is the desired result that the white man has been putting in to practice, even since he lost, unlimited access to black women’s bodies.
He’s found a formula that kills 1 millions birds with one stone and this is just one example of house he can destroy the black man and black woman while f*cuking her in his bed at the same time.
I am not taking anything away from my black women that have attended college for higher education for themselves, i am not saying black women haven’t gotten to where they are through hard work and merit.
I am just trying to put things in perspective on how black men are targeted far worse in American society, being shot by police, being targets of the prison system and black women claiming that having a vagina and being black is somehow worse than being a black man is false on so many levels.
Black women are left alone to pursue their education and go about their daily lives, the most black women have to worry about from white men are being sexually objectified and used for sexual exploits and occasional racism from white men.
The majority of hostility that black women receive are from white women, which are not the majority power holders but have power in their own right as white women and use it against black women.
Black men on the other hand, have to deal with the full power of the white man within the justice system and law enforcement, black women are not the target of law enforcement or the justice system, black men are.
Do black women get caught up in the justice system? of coarse they do but the majority are black men.
Having a vagina in this society isn’t as bad as it once was. The CEO of Xerox is a black woman. The Ceo of yahoo is a white woman.
Having a vagina has its perks and having a penis has its perks but ONLY IF YOU’RE A WHITE MAN WITH A WHITE PENIS!
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“therefore they don’t want any children from their loins, going through what they put other black people through, they want their children to have the white privilege that they have, not the curse of discrimination that black people have.”
Yes this is true, this is why they would disown any kids they had by black women during jim crow and slavery. Back then they weren’t held accountable for raping black women or not taking care of their kids. Now that there are legal repercussions and black women can put them on child support they don’t risk it. They know they gotta keep that money in the white community. The ones I see that do marry black women are usually older and have been married to a white woman and had white kids then divorced. So even if they did, the money would go to the white woman and kids, a lot them don’t have kids with black women when they are remarried. The black women that are foolish enough to fall for it and say i’m a woman first are lost as he11. because we are black women not women black, that makes no sense. Even the word black comes before the word woman, the only time u see woman come first is when the word woman is by itself. Another commenter and I were discussing this and how the black women that do get with white man benefit from his white privilege and more than likely will not care about other black people. And will view them as beneath and not care about the black schools closing as their kids more than likely go to a majority white school and will be unaffected. I do think some of them would be like the white women married to the slave master, who won’t care who suffers as long as their lifestyle is kept up.
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mstoogood4yall:
True blue, that’s the sellout N3gress you’re talking about.:
(http://youtu.be/50TSuOoxUv0) Here is Deneen Borelli a perfect sellout black woman that has taken on her white husband, white ideology.
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oh my goodness, this woman arrrrgghhghgh. this thing was saying it wasn’t about race it was a crime between two minorities, really (insert expletive). Her husband look more like her lawyer, they don’t look like a couple. good the naacp didn’t take their money, glad they didn’t let them speak, they must think they can buy their way into it to talk all condescending to black ppl. really so the naacp is moving the clock back and not say the whites who are trying to keep a bus stop from being built because they don’t want blacks and minorities around their neighborhood, or the cops who kill unarmed black ppl. ok delusional mo#@@ B#@@ A@@
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mstoogood4yall:
Yep, David Webb is the black male sellout equivalent of this black woman, we got it on both sides, black men and woman are selling out just so they can enjoy life in the house with the master and look down on all the house N3gros in the field.
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u know they only allow white washed black on their networks and things. just like the mayor mia love, we know dam well Utah is mostly white and they would not hire a black person that wasn’t whitewashed. I mean dam the town only has .60% black.
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idk if u saw this sondis, but this is the next sellout http://newsone.com/2636250/byron-thomas-confederate-flag/
U know they only give airtime to crazy acting black ppl or the whitewashed A@@ licking one. They love the ones who talk about pulling yourselves up by ur bootstraps. I always think of hermain cain when talking about whitewashed ppl, he just looks crazy. I forgot what thread I was on but peanut posted an article about the white ppl related to booker t Washington, and the white woman that wrote it was saying ppl whine and that they should pull themselves up by their bootstraps the way booker t did. They love the blacks that keep their head down and don’t say anything.
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mstoogood4yall:
Thanks for the link, i didn’t see this one! ^_^
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@ sondis
girl I understand. the attractive black women thing. I think every race of woman fear and hate an intelligent, beautiful , black woman. I wish abagond could write on this topic. black beauty the envied. I think they envy me. and big part of it is because I’m black.
my comment
a lot of the comments here have good points.good topic by the way. but I’m just tired of some of us black people who always seeking acceptance about who we are. (especially dark skin black women). be proud of what you got. you have beautiful black women. every men knows when they feast there eyes upon beauty. speaking from my personal experience. white men are no different when it comes to beauty. some may want to wife you some don’t. some may be racist and only look at you as a piece of meat. some of them you just don’t do it for them. they prefer their own. some prefer another race than their own etc.
BLACK MEN DO THAT TOO
I agree black women are at the bottom of the barrel in American society. but a myth can’t drown out reality. as bob Marley said only a foolish dog laugh at a flying bird. all black women are not drop dead gorgeous( all white women ain’t gorgeous either). all black women don’t live in the same places etc. so we all aren’t going to have the same luck or experience.
I’m just asking some of you commenters. if you underrate yourself that’s fine. a white man isn’t nothing significant to have. but a good man is. stop underrating black women because a lot of us are beautiful and we are worthy of any man love,( stop underrating black men too cause my man is beautiful.) beautiful black woman can pull any man from any race if we desire that. are you kidding black women gorgeous sexual, strength,everything that’s good,queens.
at the end of the day its a individual that make their choices.
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“BLackgal
@ sondis
girl I understand. the attractive black women thing. I think every race of woman fear and hate an intelligent, beautiful , black woman. I wish abagond could write on this topic. black beauty the envied. I think they envy me. and big part of it is because I’m black.”
I’m not a girl, i am a man, hence my picture in my avatar. I believe you meant to refer to Vashti. ^_^
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Black women are not at the bottom of ANYTHING in American society and beyond…
that is a huge myth and lie.
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@Phoebeprunelle
Girl, I have your back on this one. Black women are NOT on the bottom of the barrel. That is a lie made up by Black men who don’t want us to date out and racists who believe Black women are undesirable. Don’t listen to crap people say about us.
Many men of different races like Black women.
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what I miss.. oh sondis is a girl how didn’t I not know this. wtf. omg I guess im a lesbian.
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@Vashti
”White women are extremely racist and many hate on attractive black women.”
Exactly. I always try to look nice and present myself well yet the White women are so mean at my school and give me rude looks. I also agree that they are intimidated by beautiful and intelligent Black women.
Plus why does everyone suggest Black women date White men when their single or their relationships with Black men don’t work out? There are other races of men in the world to date, you know. Honestly I like Black, Latino, Indian, Arab and Middle Eastern men. They are full of culture, very attractive and just sexy!
Sorry White men are not my cup of tea for various reasons and much of it is based on attraction. There are very few White men that I find attractive. I also don’t like Chinese, Japanese and Korean men and don’t find them attractive. I do find other races of men especially Black men more attractive than they are.
As a young, Black woman of 18, I am glad I finally figured out who I am truly attracted to!
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mstoogood4yall
“what I miss.. oh sondis is a girl how didn’t I not know this. wtf. omg I guess im a lesbian.”
LMFAO! You’re tripp’n now sista! ^_^
Adeen:
What’s happening with you is an awakening by re-programming of yourself, through researching your culture and truly seeing and understanding white supremacy.
We as black people are programmed from toddlers by the white media and yes, even our own parents teach us white supremacy, just like they were programmed. Its up to the individual black person to be strong minded and to brake free, from the white supremacist, mind set black people have in this country.
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^ I maybe trippin a little, maybe she got u confused with someone else’s picture. U know its some women with short haircuts and perfect eyebrows and beautiful eyes that look like u, I can see how that mistake was made rofl.
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“The majority of black women that “date” or have “sex” with white men, have to go into it with a “color-blind” way as to not feel ashamed or guilty for laying down in the white man bed, so they convince themselves by adopting the white man’s ideology of, “love is color blind”, “i only see color”, “I don’t see you as a black woman, i see you as a woman”.”
in my practicly 50 years of dating interracialy , I have never met a black women that thinks like that…they sure never felt guilty..they knew what they were doing
and didnt hate black men at all…not one black women I ever dated ever put down black men…ever..
as far as black women not being attracted to white men, I never had a problem and never will..basicly , I know how to treat a black woman with respect
I see so many misconceptions conveyed by many commenters on here about interracial dating…some people are obscessed with it..they even bring it up on threads that have nothing to do with that subject…at least this thread directly has to deal with that…
people in interracial relationships, you see what kind of feelings people really have about interracial relationships ? Its good to know the various sentiments floating around from all sides…it might as well be the klan..I sure never let this kind of resentment and hate stop me…and my hat is off to all the wonderful black women that dated me in my life, especialy back when it was seriously against the grain…but, it looks like it hasnt gotten very far along based on the comments I see from some people
It doesnt matter, you will never stop it…your sons and daughters are going to interracialy date…suk on that
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@Sondis,
Is it not true also that Black men toy around with white women and then he meets a Black woman that is everything he “thinks” completes him, dumps the white woman he has been playing with and the next time that white woman sees him–he’s married to a Black woman and she has the benefits (e.g. child, car, house)? Because i know quite a few white women who can attest to this.
There may be some Black women that date/marry white men who express disdain for Black men, but i think because there are so FEW Black women with white men that depending on their location, income and education levels would not give a darn about wasting time slandering Black men (that she is not with romantically anyway or doesn’t even know personally).
There are NOT more Black women working in corporations, educational institutions or any other professional setting than Black men because white people feel more “comfortable” with Black females. Black people seriously need to lay off that lie. In fact, very few Blacks can be considered “yuppies” and the Black women that are in corporations, universities, schools, hospitals or where ever they are, are there because they have meet the requirements to be granted the credentials to be there. In most instances it takes YEARS. I received numerous rejection letters from schools that i applied to work at until almost after a semester of getting certified did i get a job offer. Meanwhile, all the white students that graduated with me got positions in no time.
I’m sure MOST Black people–if they are honest– have dealt with same gendered racism from whites. These are not unique situations to Black men or Black women–they just are what they are.
If certain Black men and Black women marry white people i do not blame them b/c i don’t know their situation or experiences. Were they raised in all white communities, particularly the suburbs where very few Black families live? Are they students or working in places like Utah,Colorado, Wisconsin, Idaho, etc. where there are very few opportunities to meet a sizable amount of Black people of the opposite sex who would be available for dates?
Black women, in general, do not worship at the alter of white manhood. The sexually healthy ones realize that white men are men just like any other man and she can have children with them and build a life with them, however, i would say that the overwhelming majority of Black women would prefer to date, marry and have children with Black men. There seems to be only a small sampling of Black women who profess a preference for white men. That is evident in the fact that 95% of Black women that are married are to Black men.
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Actually both white men and white women serve on hiring committees…
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”Actually both white men and white women serve on hiring committees”
What do you mean? I am a young person so I need more explaining on this one.
Honestly I will never date a White man because it is like supporting White supremacy. And I am against the White supremacy and racism that runs rampant in America and in the media. It is Whites who control the media and society and reinforce this mantra: White is right everyday of the hour. And Whites support and run this system of institutionalized racism, so why should I date and support a race of people who oppresses my race of people?
I wouldn’t.
Second of all, I find very few White males attractive. I like my man with some color and not pale skin with blue veins showing through! Plus they bald early and age so fast. Plus most of them look old after a certain age.
On average, I find Black men, Latino men and Middle Eastern/Arabs much more attractive than White men except Chinese, Japanese and Korean men. Chinese, Korean and Japanese men are on the bottom of my list of men as well as White American men.
Third, as a Black woman of Jamaican descent, I can’t connect with a White American man culturally. My culture is Jamaican and American since I was born in America but my parents came from Jamaica. We value family, God and education. White American men value work, money and sex.
How can I connect with that?
Last but not last, I find many if not most White American men racist, small minded and they think that they are the best thing to walk on earth. I can’t deal with that. I don’t like their mentality that all women of the world find them attractive. I just don’t get it.
I am not against dating out at all. I would date any race but White American men.
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“[T]he Black women that are in corporations, universities, schools, hospitals or where ever they are, are there because they have meet the requirements to be granted the credentials to be there.”
___
Thank you.
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Peanut , I would support any choice you make , and I would support your change of mind , also …
Adeen , I support your choice also , I just don’t think anyone should judge a black woman if they chose to date outside their race, Peanut , you are so right , it is an individule thing , and most black women are with black men
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@Peanut
I am open to dating out as long as he is NOT a White American man. Other races of men are more attractive than White men except for Chinese and Japanese men. They are on the bottom of my food chain with White American men. I like Black, Latino, Middle Eastern and Arab men and I will stick to that. Much of my aversion to dating White men is because most of them are unappealing and racist and if I dated a White man, I would be inherently supporting White supremacy and racism.
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@Peanut
Same here. I am quiet and shy in school and the Black guys think I am stuck up and act White. Many people think that I will marry a White American man and that is far from the truth.
Most White American men are racist, unappealing, lack the cultural values I am looking for and not as attractive as Black men, Latino men or Middle Eastern men. Good luck if you want to find a White American man who isn’t racist, aggressive, violent, unappealing, etc.
For now, I am sticking to Black men and other men who are not White. They are more attractive, appealing, more cultural values and not as racist, aggressive and violent as White American men.
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@Peanut
Why date White American men? There are other races of men in the world that I would rather date than White American men. Honestly I can relate to your feelings because none of my encounters with Black men went anywhere either or ended nicely out . However I will not date White American men.
And as a Black women of Jamaican descent, I feel like we have no allies either in the Westernized world. I don’t think Black American men value or respect their women either. I would rather date an Jamaican man as an descendant of Jamaicans since most Jamaican men I know love and respect Black woman.
If I did date out, I would date Latino men or Arab men because I find them attractive and they have good cultural values. No White American men for me!
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You aren’t confused , Peanut , you got it right , wait for the right individual who will appreciate you…don’t pay attention to the media…there are plenty of great black men out there….actually, I read a report that said all American men are shying away from mairedge …so , you have to have patience for the right guy , and, we all make mistakes out here in the dating game
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@Peanut:
“not all white men are racist…John Brown wasn’t racist…surely there must be some white men out there who are modern day John Browns…”
It’s reassuring to see you say that. I think a lot of POC feel tempted to write off every last white person as an incurable case. That’s understandable, but I know there are many decent, anti-racist people amongst us.
Abagond asserts that pretty much everyone is racist. Well, that may be true to an extent, but in some people the desire to fight their prejudices can feel as strong or stronger than those prejudices themselves. And there are white people who are pretty damned plain in their stand against bigotry in others as well as in themselves. Not everyone hates black people, women and gay people. Some people hate that hatred instead.
From what I read here, a$$holes are the majority – or at least are the ones who make their feelings most obvious. I hate that. Why should I almost feel that I need to apologise for what they do?
I guess it’s more natural and comfortable for haters to express their idiocy than it is for decent people to walk up to a stranger and offer a hand to shake.
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@peanut
The good never gets the praise it deserves. I was recently forwarded a beautiful proposal video. It was a black man proposing to his black queen.
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Yes and I will be honest when I say I stopped because a majority of things are purely negative on t hem. You have to go in circles and back to find the positive on them.
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@Peanut
I didn’t say all White American men were racist. I said MOST! Most of them that I came in contact with are racist, aggressive, rude, small minded etc.
I prefer Latino men or Asian men in IR relationships but I hardly see them around either.
I have had a few White American guys like me but I never liked them back. I will never date one.
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And to be honest (just did the search). I saw more men of other ethnicity praising love for black women than the black man.
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I did the youtube search and I did see a lot of vids talking bad about black women, but the ones that were positive had only a couple hundred. I don’t usually purposefully go and type in negative searches, I did not click on any of those vids. I also notice the ones that do make the vids talking negative about black men usually hide their faces, have some crazy username, use the n word excessively,etc. So to put it mildy they are not “men” i’d want to bring home to my parents anyway, so what they say don’t really hold much weight for me. The men that do love black women and especially the ones that love natural black women are usually educated, have both parents, and show their faces in their vids and sometimes their girlfriend or wife. And don’t curse in their vids. Those are men I would want to bring home to my parents, minus the ones having a girlfriend or wife rofl.
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I love my beautiful black women!
c’mere mstoogood4yall, gemme hug—> \o/
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Hey brotha *cyberhug*
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There was no need to begin that passage with “sorry”. What you say is fair enough, and I think it’s good to know what you like. Don’t feel that you should apologise for your preferences.
That said, attraction is important in forming early impressions but it can be trumped by factors that only become clear with time. It’s quite possible to gradually become attracted to a person who is not, physically, the type who normally catches one’s eye.
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@Sharina, Peanut etc
Yes I noticed non Black men praising our beauty but how come it is them? I rarely see Black men praise Black women’s beauty anymore. A few Black men still do but not enough. How come non Black men do praise our beauty more these days?
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@Peanut
I grew up around White people and I never found White men that attractive, however I completely agree with your comment especially the one about some Black men being out of touch with their history. I don’t know why the younger generation of Black men are out of touch with their history. I am apart of the younger generation and all I see is a lack of Black pride and love among many Black men in their late teens and early twenties.
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To be honest.
I don’t see much Youtube videos of white men praising white women either.
Usually when it is “Why I love (insert race) women, it is usually a man of a different race, who explains his preference, no matter how shallow that preference is.
I wouldn’t recommend going to these videos. I don’t feel that they are good for one’s health or sanity. There are more positive things out there.
If you live in predom white areas, that may be a problem as well. Most of the BM I know are married or dating BW.
Obviously, it will be different for every person based on their experience. It is sad that some BM despise BW.
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@Vashti,
Odd, I have never experienced jealousy based on being a black woman ( from white women) or seen white women specifically target attractive black women. I do know White women are racist however I find it’s racism period. Some black women have said that they have experienced white women thinking all men should want them yet I have never experienced this. I have only experienced anti-black women particular jealousy from Hispanic women when I lived around them and white men as well. I can’t say I’ve ever experienced jealousy or seen it when a black women is getting male attention. On the job though, for advancement, yes. they tend to be jealous and hateful in that regard.
You saying you will never get married and also always be single as well is weird to me. Why are you relying on white men for marriage and a family? That’s so strange. What about latino? I see plenty of bi-racial black women/light skinned black women with Latino men and the relationships work out well. How about black men or arab or other?
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Sondis, I have seen that and it sounds so creepy, evil and strange. Racism is such a sickness. I will say this though that white men do not want to have sex with black women and in my experiences many times white men will be able to accept a black man faster than he can a black woman. What we have discussed on this board is how white men in particular want black women to feel/be shunned and feel/be unwanted. I have found in diverse settings white men try to get latino, other white men and especially black men to not be interested in a black woman/women. I have and other black women have witnessed this ourselves. In corporate america and on college campuses, it tends to be white men trying to demonize and marginalize black women. Their sick behavior and mentality is that black women should not want or be able to lean on black men and black men should not want black women. Where does that leave black women? Something some of us are trying to figure out. I see black couples all the time and black women with latino and other races of men so white peoples sick, twisted behavior is not working at all!
Many of us have also talked about how hard white men try to “break” black women! It hasn’t worked but in many situations white men try hard to try to get a black woman to feel unwanted, ugly, shunned and on the bottom. It’s as if they can’t understand given the racial dynamics of the this country how we have even an ounce of self-esteem and that we shouldn’t. they are truly SICK!
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@Peanut:
Thanks for your reply. I have frequently been impressed by how open people are here when sharing their personal thoughts and feelings – not just on race issues.
Exposure to other races is clearly a major factor in the development of our likes and dislikes. My youth was spent mostly around Luton in England where there is a large and diverse immigrant population from India, Africa, Pakistan, Bangladesh, the West Indies and various European countries. Since 9/11 there has been some anti-Muslim feeling amongst the more gullible whites – those who swallow tabloid and fascist lies most easily – but in general the various people get along very well. We have one of Europes largest inter-community carnivals.
Like you I find individuals of all ethnicities attractive. White people have great variety of skin tone, hair and eye colour etc. Dark skin is beautiful. Before I got fat I used to envy black friends the way dark skin showed off muscle definition – somehow equivalent development isn’t so conspicuous under paler skin. It used to frustrate the hell out of me, LOL. I must also say that I find very dark black women with strong African features very striking and frequently attractive. Race is not a like/dislike factor for me, but more a wow-look-at-all-these-different-beautiful-women thing.
I must also say that the exercise is purely an academic one. I am completely in love with my wife, with whom I will spend my remaing days if I am lucky. My occasional appreciation of other ladies is purely aesthetic, not a practical exercise!
I am very glad I spent my formative years around so many different kinds of people. It’s been fun.
I understand what you’re saying. Despite the difficult history that must have fed into into it, that must be a powerful thing. Actually, I say I understand, but only so far as I can imagine. That bond is something that the majority of white people haven’t needed to develop, so what I can imagine is, no doubt, inadequate.
Thank you for the conversation. 🙂
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I believe that Lewis Latimer put it well in his poem for his wedding entitled
“Ebon Venus”. Mr. Latimer was no dummy.
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I believe Sir Nose once had his booty successfully removed… but that was long before your time, Peanut. A long time ago in a form of music that has long since disappeared.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/P-Funk_mythology#Parliament
Psychoalphadiscobetabioaquadoloop!
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wow that is crazy peanut, yeah a lot of white guys are breast men. it is black and latino men who love curves and booty. sheoot if u wanna trade u can have my flat ase and I take urs then u can get that guy rofl. Idk why white guys call black women cute, imo cute is to describe kids. I use the word fine, sexy,beautiful when I describe a grown person, cute is what I use to describe my little cousins lol. Maybe its the same reason they’d call black men and women girl and b. y, even when they were grown, they think we not on their level. I will say this, I was cute when I was a baby on up to about 7, after that 12-16 pretty, 18 on up is beautiful.
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(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zBVNOrV0Pr4)
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I guess i feel more comfortable with being called cute…
My husband always describes me as such.
“pretty”, “beautiful”, “hot”, are too pretentious for someone like me. Cute sounds more earthy because it is inclusive, but to each his or her own.
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@ phoebe
well that is fine for u, I don’t get called cute, the women that I see get called cute are usually short and petite, i’m neither of those. Put it this way, a poodle or a terrier is cute but a great dane or bull mastiff I don’t hear being called cute rofl.
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peanut
yeah don’t change for anyone, I had some guy try to message me on ps3 today asking if im a male or female, im like wtf my name has ms in the front for a reason smh. then when I told him a female he wanted to friend me I blocked his ass. its some thirsty sobs out there. another time a guy asked what I looked like I told him black and he never messaged me again, then another guy asked and I said missy Elliot, he never messaged me again either. lmbao, I got repellent for these creeps.
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mstoogood4yall:
What’s your PS3’s PSN ID ?
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@ sondis
its Mstoogood4yal rofl
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Mstoogood4yall
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which games do you play online?
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I think missy Elliot is cool, I wish I could dance like her. my dad said she related on his mothers side of the family. yes they really trip when I say black, I only met two black guys on there that were decent, but the one I had a crush on was married young, but his wife looked beautiful so I wasn’t too mad lol. I lost his username though, haven’t talked to him since..
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assasins creed 3, call of duty black ops 1, and mw3.
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and occasionally gta 4
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mstoogood4yall:
I have Call of duty Modern warfare for PS3 . I have a xbox360 that i have most of my games on. I play Call of duty: black ops II on my 360 every now and again.
I pre-ordered the PS4 off Amazon.com can’t wait for that. ^_^
I wouldn’t have guessed you were a gamer, though. @ : o O ) >
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Peanut
the next time they ask what I look like i’ll say black and proud lol, then they really would hurry up and block me then rofl.
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^ oh I had an xbox but had the red ring of death lol, I sold it off, and my brother gave me a ps3. I like ps4 better because a lot of stuff is free. and I like red dead redemption as well I wish they would make a second one, it was the only western game that was good. Ps4 looks nice, the graphics are going to be killer, eventually we’ll have to get a ps4 since they are going to start making most of the best games for ps4 and not ps3. I want to play the new battlefield and watchdogs game. Oh and I have battlefield 3 for ps3, I love it online imo its better than cod, oops I shouldn’t say that, the cod die hard fans will come after me *hides* seriously cod is kinda like iphone, they upgrade one or a couple things and call it better than the previous one and ppl go and buy it smh.
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lol @ cod fan boys ^_^ I’ll see you on PS3 sometime. I’ll have to buy a few of those games you have used.
morpheous is my PSN ID by the way. ^_^
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^ lol ok morpheous I look forward to seeing u online sometime. http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20090501203243/matrix/images/9/9b/Morpheus1.jpg
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the thing that annoys me about the ps franchise is they always trying to make the system slim, and take some of the good stuff out to make it smaller. the s4 and xbox 1 kinda look alike, they both have a shiny look on one side and a matte look on the other, they kinda look like rubix cube or like its about to transform lol.
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what u up to peanut, I see ur post on brown children is blowing up I think it is the most commented on thread now lol.
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yeah ok so maybe it ain’t blowing up as it is mostly comments from me, br, adeen, and Torontogirl rofl, but it does have a good amount of comments.
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Peanut , for me , saying a woman is cute , it is a sign of attraction, if I use it , it is meant as a compliment. Of course , if she doesn’t like it , I won’t say it…
I think red hair goes really well next to black or brown skin…
I definitely can not relate to a man that doesn’t like booty….I actually like breasts that aren’t so big…
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I havent read all of the numerous comments on this thread but I agree with B.R in what he says
Peanut , for me , saying a woman is cute , it is a sign of attraction, if I use it , it is meant as a compliment. Of course , if she doesn’t like it , I won’t say it…
I had a look at the you tube clip of dating in the dark – the guy has mixed feelings which are written all over his face. He is not ready to date a black woman and the fact that this has to be said now suggests that even if he does in the future there will always be issues – unless a major ephiphany happens and from what I am reading on this blog, it is unlikely.
But who cares – obviously I dont have the eye of the females on this blog but his looks are ten a penny. There are plenty of other men around the world who would have their eyes out on stalks to be confronted by this beauty regardless of their skin colour.
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Maybe it’s a British thing, but that just seems rude and shallow to me. Or maybe I’m just old.
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^Yea, we know British guys, black, asian, white alike like them some good ‘ole bum
:p.
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Omnipresent:
“I had a look at the you tube clip of dating in the dark – the guy has mixed feelings which are written all over his face. He is not ready to date a black woman and the fact that this has to be said now suggests that even if he does in the future there will always be issues – unless a major epiphany happens and from what I am reading on this blog, it is unlikely.”
That white man named kyle, saying about the black woman, “Randi”. He said he “never dated a black girl” its obvious that he wasn’t interested and all his coming out and hugging and embracing her was all for show, being he would have look, ten times more racist than he already did by making that statement about “never dating a black girl” and saying she looked, “older than she actually was, “two years older” by the way.
So then he is seen, kissing this black woman in the car, yet he proclaims to never have dated a black girl.
Gee, he doesn’t seem to be as uncomfortable kissing her but the idea of, “dating” a black girl is more scary than kissing a black girl.
I’ve seen this movie before, many times over. This black woman only dates whites guys, indicated by her claim in the show, “my ex looks just like him”.
This white man’s Negro bed wench will be just what this white man sees her as, an experiment to satisfy his sexual curiosity of having sex with a black woman. His claim that he has never dated a black girl, sealed her fate as the white man’s Negro bed wench.
She seeks this role by only dating white men, so i don’t feel sorry for her one bit. I see her getting used and abused, then throw away like trash, when this white man is done with her body, i give it 2 weeks and he’s done with her.
I am willing to wager, that they are not together any longer….
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“do white men not feel comfortable calling black women pretty?”
Where have you been? Most of them have issues like that. Not every single one but too large of a percentage of them do. Why are so focused on white men though? How about Latino or even Asian or Black or mixed black/other?
No offense, but life is too short to puit yourself out there to be hurt by people who generally have hate issues going on, go with whom you have the best experiences with and relate most with.
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“Gina
“do white men not feel comfortable calling black women pretty?”
Where have you been? Most of them have issues like that. Not every single one but too large of a percentage of them do. Why are so focused on white men though? How about Latino or even Asian or Black or mixed black/other?
No offense, but life is too short to puit yourself out there to be hurt by people who generally have hate issues going on, go with whom you have the best experiences with and relate most with.”
I agree with you 100% 9 times out of 10, you’ll get that white man that isn’t interested in any serious commitment or sees you as someone to marry and introduce you to his friends and family and parents.
Its a losing battle if you ask me, its white washing through supremacy, when black women have to try to figure out, if a white man is into them and have to risk being a Negro bed wench.
Its white supremacist, programming and white washing of black women from the white media and society that makes them feel, they should always give white men a chance…a chance to be a white man’s negro bed wench.
Are their some white men that would marry and have children with a black woman? Yes, of coarse but a very small % and far in between and there is a very small chance or none that any given black women will come in contact with a white man, that really would look at them seriously in the way of possibly marrying them and having a baby with them, regardless of what their family or society things about it, opposed to being looked at as just an sexual experiment or fetish.
Most white men are not willing to give up their white privilege for a black woman, because essentially, that is what they are doing, when they are seen in a marriage with a black woman by white society.
I would say this to black women who are “open” to dating white men. Chances are, that you will run into MANY white men that only see you as a Negro bed wench, before you find a white men that doesn’t see you, a black woman as something to overcome or settle for, if they can’t find that one white woman.
P.S. Please, don’t go there will the old deflection, “but black men look at black women as sexual objects too, its no different than a white man doing it”
You know good and well, what the difference is, so spare me this crap, not to mention, this thread is ABOUT BLACK WOMEN AND WHITE MEN, so why bring up black men to excuse white men for looking at black women as Negro bed wenches?
Please, keep my comments in the perspective, which reflect the topic of the thread, I’m so tired of black women, throwing the black men angle into the fray, when discussing black women and white men, pathologies.
Just because i point out a black woman’s pathology, doesn’t mean i have to point out a black man’s at the same time, one pathology doesn’t make the other any less true but one doesn’t have anything to do with the other, when expressing my thoughts on the subject of black women’s pathologies.
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Sondis:
I’ve seen this movie before, many times over. This black woman only dates whites guys, indicated by her claim in the show, “my ex looks just like him”.
Looking at the whole of this particular thread and the prolific comments from some of the females on here about the experiences of IR attraction from WM to BW, how is it that that females like Randi, would expose themselves, on national television no less with no qualms at all? Somewhere, this negativity hasnt filtered through to her.
She briefly mentions being afraid of getting hurt but does not say that it is to do with any worries about IR dating on his part. In fact, she is bold enought to stand on the balcony still to wait for him!
From his initial reaction I do think it will all end in tears. One of the amusing things in that clip was how he tried to style out being stunned by saying the thought she looked ‘old’. *SMH*
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@phoebeprunelle
LOL, well, quite a few do. 😀
@Sondis
I may just be dumb/naive, but again I wonder if this is a UK/US culture difference… I honestly don’t think that most white Brits are even really aware of the concept of white privilege. Don’t get me wrong, it 100% exists, but it’s not a phrase I hear UK POC use as they do in the USA, and I think most white Brits have probably never heard it.
As in the USA, white UK men who would partner long-term with black ladies are probably a minority, but I don’t think it’s because they calculate that such a relationship would exclude them from advancement or position. I think some are afraid of the attention of racists, and some are too weak to face ridicule by narrow minded “friends”. Even more than that, though, I think it is down to simple, insular, semi-/subconscious racism. In the UK, though, I don’t think most worry about how they are seen by (non-overtly racist) mainstream society.
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“Omnipresent
Sondis:
I’ve seen this movie before, many times over. This black woman only dates whites guys, indicated by her claim in the show, “my ex looks just like him”.
Looking at the whole of this particular thread and the prolific comments from some of the females on here about the experiences of IR attraction from WM to BW, how is it that that females like Randi, would expose themselves, on national television no less with no qualms at all? Somewhere, this negativity hasn’t filtered through to her.
She briefly mentions being afraid of getting hurt but does not say that it is to do with any worries about IR dating on his part. In fact, she is bold enough to stand on the balcony still to wait for him!
From his initial reaction I do think it will all end in tears. One of the amusing things in that clip was how he tried to style out being stunned by saying the thought she looked ‘old’. *SMH*”
“She briefly mentions being afraid of getting hurt but does not say that it is to do with any worries about IR dating on his part. In fact, she is bold enough to stand on the balcony still to wait for him!”
Why would she mention it? she’s on national TV!
She would make an ass out of herself by admitting to being afraid of being rejected by white men for being a black woman, it would go against, sell out black women’s “color-blind” thinking and denial about them being black, isn’t an issue when white men look at them, its wishful thinking and delusional at best.
“how is it that that females like Randi, would expose themselves, on national television no less with no qualms at all? Somewhere, this negativity hasn’t filtered through to her.”
First, you need to understand that this is all about 15 minutes of fame, a black woman would gladly be the “black token” on a TV dating show, such as this and be the odd woman out, just for those 15 minutes.
Perfect example, the only black person on George Zimmerman’s defense team, the black woman. She joined the team for 15 minutes of fame to further her career, dispute the fact that he killed a boy that just turned 17, she wasn’t concerned about if he was a racist or not.
There goes your motive for putting herself in a possible, humiliating situation.
“She briefly mentions being afraid of getting hurt but does not say that it is to do with any worries about IR dating on his part. In fact, she is bold enough to stand on the balcony still to wait for him!”
She had no choice, the ball wasn’t in her court, she had to wait on the balcony to see if he, ( A white man, chooses her, not the other way around ) which is typical, because white people choose black people, black people don’t choose white people. The ball is always in their court, wither they want to date a black person, via white supremacy.
“From his initial reaction I do think it will all end in tears. One of the amusing things in that clip was how he tried to style out being stunned by saying the thought she looked ‘old’. *SMH*”
”
He was caught off, so he had to say something, that didn’t come off, racially bias, so he threw out an age difference, that in actuality was only 2 years!
Again, it was all for show, his initial response said it all, he hasn’t dated a black women before, because he isn’t interested in black women.
He had sex with her and dumped her, case closed….
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Buddhuu:
As in the USA, white UK men who would partner long-term with black ladies are probably a minority, but I don’t think it’s because they calculate that such a relationship would exclude them from advancement or position. I think some are afraid of the attention of racists, and some are too weak to face ridicule by narrow minded “friends”. Even more than that, though, I think it is down to simple, insular, semi-/subconscious racism. In the UK, though, I don’t think most worry about how they are seen by (non-overtly racist) mainstream society.
I appreciate your comments and they are valid but just to inform you, abagond always gears his articles in America, not the UK or any other country.
So its save to assume, when someone on his blog is commenting, its from an American perspective from someone who lives and experiences these social issues in America. I can’t speak on things that happen in the UK, being i’ve never been there and i don’t live there.
Again, i am glad that you can give an perspective from another country, it gives me an idea of how social issues about race, play out in another parts of the world.
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Sondis, honestly, when it comes to IRR, Black men in the U.S. should be the last group complaining…
i will let you figure out why.
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@ peanut
Bahahah, that dude looks like nick lachey and lance bass had a baby. he keep going on about oh she older than me, more like u mean blacker than u. the light came on the first thing he saw was her black skin. how da heck did that beautiful woman violet get with that guy. and that woman malanie, is goofy, how she gonna reject a guy that imo is more on her level she no ten, yet she knocks a guy that is a 5 or 6 like her smh.
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I wouldn’t have gone on there either. black ppl need to stop going on reality shows period. Unless it is a classy one and no crazy ppl who start drama. but then it wouldn’t last long if it was classy smh. if im going on a dating show sheit, I wanna choose the guys, line up and let me see ya rofl.
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phoebeprunelle:
Your statement has no bearing on what i said and in the context in which i said it. its frivolous at best and take away from the point i was trying to make.
“Sondis, honestly, when it comes to IRR, Black men in the U.S. should be the last group complaining…
i will let you figure out why.”
who are these black men in this thread, that are complaining that you are referring too? your comment is completely out of place and unwarranted.
This is exactly what i was talking about, whenever a black man, point out some black woman’s pathologies, some black women on this blog, get butt hurt and become defensive, i see it constantly and its really childish as if a black woman, can’t own up to some of their pathologies.
I’ve seen numerous black women on this blog, across many threads, bash some black men about their pathologies, yet don’t mention theirs at all. That makes sense to me, being their pointing out some black men’s pathologies and not black women’s.
I never saw a black man on this blog, get defensive when black women point out, some black men’s pathologies, i am one of them and you want to know why?
BECAUSE I AM NOT THAT BLACK MAN, so it doesn’t bother me one bit, i actually always agree with what is said about SOME black men but most NOT ALL black women on this blog, never agree with what is said about black women’s issues and instead, get defensive and are quick to point out, what black men do is response!
I Love my black women, i don’t really feel i should have to say that on this blog as a self-proclaim lover of black women but it seems as though i have too, because a lot of black women on this blog get so damn offended if i talk about their gender, its sad and really needs to be rid of if we as black men and woman, are to work on healthy relationships, between one another.
There several black women who loves to do this all the time, i won’t mention names, they know who they are and they need to stop and learn to take some criticism of their own gender, from the opposite gender and not take it so damn personally.
You are one of these women..
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oh snap.
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Oh, certainly. The US-centric nature of Abagond’s blog has been clear since I started reading here. It’s still of great interest to me (partly because there’s a lot of cultural cross-pollination between our countries – especially, IMO from the US to the UK), and I find myself comparing how things are there to how they are here. Sometimes it takes a while to understand some of the stuff I read as it is so different from what I see here. That’s the perspective my comments come from.
Apologies if that sometimes makes my stuff seem a bit irrelevant/off-topic.
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Buddhuu
As in the USA, white UK men who would partner long-term with black ladies are probably a minority, but I don’t think it’s because they calculate that such a relationship would exclude them from advancement or position.
I disagree entirely. I see examples of this every single day and a stronger emergence of this from the younger generation too.
In the more rural parts of the UK then I agree that you are less likely to see this mix, but those areas themselves lack diversity. If you go to any of the big cities, London, Manchester, Liverpool, and even the areas that are not out in the sticks, you will find this. Even areas like Hayes, Slough, Harrow follow suit with bigger cities.
‘I think some are afraid of the attention of racists, and some are too weak to face ridicule by narrow minded “friends”. Even more than that, though, I think it is down to simple, insular, semi-/subconscious racism’ I wonder if this is your own personal fear that you have revealed here.
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Since very FEW Black women actually marry white men–like 5% –it DOES come across as though you are angry about something…
Why are you so concerned with what ONLY 5% of Black women are doing? And even out of that 5%, i doubt that many of them have a disdain for Black men.
I keep asking this question: what of Black women that live in ALL white places such as Utah, Colorado, Oregon, Idaho? Are they supposed to go “manless” b/c some Black men get “butt hurt” (using your words) that white men were the best option for her due to a lack of plentiful single Black men where she lives? Because i can guarantee you, in those places i mentioned, the Black men are mostly with white women simply because there is more of them than Black women.
Most Black women don’t have “pathologies” when it comes to white men. That’s very obvious as i will keep pointing to the 5% figure.
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Thanks for telling ME about MYSELF–wtf???
Most Black women don’t have a problem with constructive criticism–it is why we have seen a boom in the wearing of natural hair in the last decade.
I would encourage you to not worry about those few Black women with white men because you can’t do anything to change it. Every single Black person in this world is not going to marry another Black person, but the majority of Black marriage will be between TWO Black people.
Speculating on whether or not a Black woman is a white man’s “bed-wench” b/c she is married to one is over the top for someone who loves Black women.
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phoebeprunelle:
“Since very FEW Black women actually marry white men–like 5% –it DOES come across as though you are angry about something…”
So you projected this onto me and assumed, that i was angry to fit your agenda.
We all know, that you make an ass out of yourself, when you assume.
“Why are you so concerned with what ONLY 5% of Black women are doing? And even out of that 5%, i doubt that many of them have a disdain for Black men.”
I am not so much concerned about black women with white men, than i was just making a point about how some black women are looked at as Negro bed wenches by white men and how some are fine, for filling this role.
“And even out of that 5%, i doubt that many of them have a disdain for Black men.”
Quote one sentence of me, saying anything remotely close to me saying, that these black woman, that date white men, have a disdain for black men!
There you go again, you’re projecting these statements, NOWHERE DID I SAY THIS!
“I keep asking this question: what of Black women that live in ALL white places such as Utah, Colorado, Oregon, Idaho? Are they supposed to go “manless” b/c some Black men get “butt hurt” (using your words) that white men were the best option for her due to a lack of plentiful single Black men where she lives?”
WHO SAID THIS? I didn’t, it obvious that you have an ax to grind about this whole thing.
I wasn’t even talking about black women, should not date white men, because black men will be butt hurt. Again, another projection to backup your agenda.
Its obvious that you date white men, therefore you are offended by my statements and take them personally and get butt hurt, which is ridiculous because i don’t say all black women, yet you still take it personal.
“Most Black women don’t have “pathologies” when it comes to white men. That’s very obvious as i will keep pointing to the 5% figure.” You say this as to say what???
So this means my statements are less true, simply because the figure is 5%? that makes no sense whatsoever.
My observations about some black women in regard to dating white men, are no more or less, true than black men’s pathologies for dating white women, just because the figure is slightly higher for black men, dating white women, doesn’t make my statements false.
“Thanks for telling ME about MYSELF–wtf???”
Talk about a hypocrite, you were the first out the gate in assuming i was, “angry” about some black women, dating white men.
“Most Black women don’t have a problem with constructive criticism–it is why we have seen a boom in the wearing of natural hair in the last decade.”
First off, what the hell does a black woman, wearing natural hair have to do with, accepting constructive criticism??? absolutely nothing! again, your ability to not be able to connect with the context at hand is remarkable.
“I would encourage you to not worry about those few Black women with white men because you can’t do anything to change it. Every single Black person in this world is not going to marry another Black person, but the majority of Black marriage will be between TWO Black people. ”
Again, this is not my objective but you sure have made it a point to make that projection onto me and my statements.
“Speculating on whether or not a Black woman is a white man’s “bed-wench” b/c she is married to one is over the top for someone who loves Black women.”
again, you twist and contort my words to fit your agenda.
I never once referred to a black woman, who is MARRIED to a white man, a Negro bed wench.
That reference is only applied by me to black women, whom ONLY date white men and i refer to white men as looking upon black women as Negro bed wenches, if they never have any intentions of marrying and having children with a black woman.
Hence the white man in that dating TV show, who claimed to have NEVER dated a black woman, yet he had no problem, kissing and groping her in the car on camera, that says to me that he looks at her as a Negro bed wench, meaning she is nothing to take seriously and only to have sex with and dump in the trash, when he’s done and ready to be in a “REAL” relationship and marry a white woman.
This is a classic case of a white man, looking at a black woman as a Negro bed wench and a black woman, willing to be a Negro bed wench.
She constantly chooses to put herself in unfavorable situations in which, she could be viewed in this manner by white men, so i feel no pity for her, when she eventually got dumped by this white man.
My purpose for being on this blog is very clear, i am not here to play games with my black people, if i see shuckin n jivin for the white man and white people, I’m going to call you out on it.
I take black men’s pathologies, thrown out by black women on this blog day in and day out and i don’t whine and cry like a baby, because I’m butt hurt, i take it like a man and chalk it up to tough love from my Sistas!!
So if you can’t take criticisms about black women by a black man, get the hell off this blog and find another one!
I don’t care if you date white men or not, i will not curb my opinions just because your feeling are hurt, either accept it has constructive criticism and don’t take it personal or get ready for some more, because refuse to not call out, sellouts! House Negros! House Negresses! if this is you, the YES, I’M TALKING TO YOU!
If this isn’t you, then you have no reason to get BUTT HURT!
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Or i could be happily married to a Black man–which i am.
It’s obvious you read nothing i said above.
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I read everything you said above, which had absolutely nothing to do with what i said in my talking points but you felt a strong urge to twist and project your agenda, where it never applied.
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I pointed out your reasoning about “negro-bed wenches” and simply asked, what is it to you or anyone else? Two consenting adults can do what they please…
And besides that, i think its a myth that Black women are into serving as white men’s “bed wenches”…
Using the tv show Scandal and a few blogs written by bat s*** crazy Black women is short sighted.
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There were Negro bed wenches back and slavery and there are Negro bed wenches, today.
Just because black women now have a choice if they sleep with a white man, doesn’t make a difference if its in the context of the scenario that i laid out as an example.
Yes, scandal is a perfect example of a Negro bed wench, that is the only reason why, a major Television Network like ABC, would green light a show by a black woman, it fits perfectly with the Negro bed wench mentality that white men seek out and sends a message to black women, this type of relationship, ( The negro bed wench ) is the only acceptable relationship that i white man will offer a black woman.
There are a lot of “scandal” type of relationship that are going on, between black women and white men, than actually marriages, between the two.
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Hmm… assuming we live in the same UK…
You may have a point with the “younger generation” thing. I’m in my 50s and may be a little out of touch on that front.
I NOW live in a rural area, but it’s literally 5 mins from Luton where I lived and worked for decades. A more racially diverse town/city you’d be hard pressed to find. I was a T&GWU shop steward in the Vauxhall plant there for 16 years. I’d estimate that 60% of my workload was racially orientated in that role. 5 mins the other way is Hitchin with a very large South Asian (especially Sikh) community and plenty of black West Indian people.
You try to paint me as uninformed. Your last piece of speculation seems to hint at an accusation of racism. I know white people are supposed to rear up at that, so at least you’ve got me to conform to that stereotype (which is based on truth, BTW).
I have had romantic relationships with black ladies and Indian ladies as well as white. My step children are white/Afro-Caribbean mixed race.
My own personal fear? You assume a lot about someone you don’t know.
You are welcome to hold different views to mine, but don’t assume that you know me or the communities in which I am embedded.
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I see something else entirely– a major network show finally placing a Black woman (who is not overweight, angry or a maid) as the ingenue. Regardless of her sexual relationships with any man, i think the world his watching and waiting and excited about the visibility of Black women…
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I’m not surprised…it’s what human being do.
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“I see something else entirely– a major network show finally placing a Black woman (who is not overweight, angry or a maid) as the ingenue. Regardless of her sexual relationships with any man, i think the world his watching and waiting and excited about the visibility of Black women…”
Yeah, YOU would ignore and bypass the white supremacy in that show, to stand by your white color-blind, ideology.
“I’m not surprised…it’s what human being do.”
NO, we are talking about black women and white men, not human beings, nice try to generalize everything i just said in a white, color-blind way. You’re obviously a white-washed, white identified, black woman.
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I’ve never watched scandal, as I would rather a show with a positive black woman doing something great and not a show about a black woman sleeping with a married man. I just don’t see why they can’t show black women as being balanced, either we are jezebels, mistresses, or mammy. I rarely see shows showing us as mothers, wives, and professionals. I don’t want scraps, black ppl should stop accepting scraps I see it time and time again. when a show like the bible came on some black ppl were like oh that is good they show a black Samson, like really, why not want to see a black jesus and black adam and eve. too many have been conditioned to accept what is going on and the little mentions we get here and there.
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mstoogood4yall:
“I’ve never watched scandal, as I would rather a show with a positive black woman doing something great and not a show about a black woman sleeping with a married man. I just don’t see why they can’t show black women as being balanced, either we are jezebels, mistresses, or mammy. I rarely see shows showing us as mothers, wives, and professionals. I don’t want scraps, black ppl should stop accepting scraps I see it time and time again. when a show like the bible came on some black ppl were like oh that is good they show a black Samson, like really, why not want to see a black jesus and black adam and eve. too many have been conditioned to accept what is going on and the little mentions we get here and there”
This is exactly what i am talking about, i just don’t understand how some black women can stand by such a degrading role but as you said, black women and men have been programmed to accept any image or role that are placed, upon us by white people.
I do not and will not support such tripe and offensive roles for black men or women, period!
anyone who accepts such roles are accepting white supremacy and don’t want to stand up against it, when they see it or choose to ignore it, when its plain as the eye can see.
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^ yeah sondis
some black men and women accept it because they think they are to be grateful and not complain. others do so because that is how they feel. i didn’t watch the show bible either but I did see an article about it and how it feeds into the stereotype that black men are brutes and lust after white women. I don’t support any of that filth, but some do as they want to get with a white man or white woman and give it the thumbs up. We are only good enough to play their roles they create for us, and even some black ppl cough *tyler perry & oprah* cough. put us in roles that are feeding into stereotypes. I’m sick of all of it and am sick of black Hollywood as well. burn Hollywood burn
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mstoogood4yall:
The show could have been just as good, had they not gave her the role of a cheating, low down, home wrecking black woman.
This is what perpetuates the stereotype of black women, can’t be trusted around white women’s husbands as the Jezebel.
You would think a professional, educated black women like pope could find a SINGLE BLACK MAN! and even that pissed me off, i watched it for the first time, because A BLACK WOMAN suggested it as she knew i love all thing, black. So i watched a few and i was automatically turned off by the whole thing of her, being a Negro bed wench.
what really got my blood boiling is when she rebuffed a PROFESSIONAL BLACK MAN THAT WAS ACTUALLY ON HER LEVEL FAR AS INCOME AND STATUS, THAT SHE WAS ONCE INVOLVED WITH, THAT HAPPENED TO BE A MEMBER OF CONGRESS FOR A MARRIED WHITE MAN? WTF??
I WAS DONE AFTER THAT! THAT TOLD ME EVERYTHING I NEEDED TO KNOW ABOUT THAT SHOW, SCANDAL!
IT WAS OBVIOUS THAT THIS SHOW ARE HELL BENT ON SHOWING BLACK MEN AND WOMEN, UNABLE TO COME TOGETHER IN A HEALTHY RELATIONSHIP!
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So Black women and white men are not humans 0_o?
Once again, thanks for telling ME about MYSELF
.
.
.
w.t.f?
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it seems we are the only ppl who allow this mess and applaud it. Italians were offended by jersey shore and they did not want them going to Italy. arabs were offended by the coca cola commercial showing an arab as a camel jockey. We allow this mess and say oh that is good, at least they put a black person in it. we are like some abused wife, who goes back to her husband and is like well at least he didn’t knock me unconscious this time. Ms pam was even talking about how we are conditioned to buy stuff that doesn’t even market to us or have any black ppl in the commercials. Because we have learned our place and know to shut up and buy their products regardless if we are represented or not. How can we demand change and respect when we have too many that are like oh no its fine the way it is, we don’t need to change things, be grateful. if it weren’t for our ancestors demanding and fighting for change and not accepting scraps we would be nowhere. The bus boycott would not have happened if blacks were like well u know we should ride the bus and be grateful for any day they don’t throw us off the bus.
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mstoogood4yall:
That is how we need to be, when black people watch garbage like that, it seems a signal to these white networks, that we like to see ourselves, portrayed in stereotypical roles.
Like basketball wives of Atlanta for instance, i can’t tell you how many black women i know of that love to watch that garbage, despite them KNOWING its bad for their image. they actually acknowledge it to me!
They claims, “its a guilty pleasure” and they knows its only for entertainment, yeah but that don’t make it any less, damaging to their image! black little girls, also watch that garbage and they think, this is the way to act as an “professional adult” being these women are not poor or hood rats but they sure as hell, act like it!
This is not good for little black girls to see such crap.
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@Buddhuu, perhaps i am wrong, but isn’t what you just described been happening for THOUSANDS of years now?
Reading some of these comments would make one think that ALL Black women on this planet will be with a Black man–which is highly unrealistic.
I believe in “live and let live”…there’s a commentator by the name of EyeswideOpen on another blog and i mean right about now, his philosophy of doing just that sounds more and more sane compared to a lot of others’ on this thread right now.
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mstoogood4yall:
it seems we are the only ppl who allow this mess and applaud it. Italians were offended by jersey shore and they did not want them going to Italy. arabs were offended by the coca cola commercial showing an arab as a camel jockey. We allow this mess and say oh that is good, at least they put a black person in it. we are like some abused wife, who goes back to her husband and is like well at least he didn’t knock me unconscious this time. Ms pam was even talking about how we are conditioned to buy stuff that doesn’t even market to us or have any black ppl in the commercials. Because we have learned our place and know to shut up and buy their products regardless if we are represented or not. How can we demand change and respect when we have too many that are like oh no its fine the way it is, we don’t need to change things, be grateful. if it weren’t for our ancestors demanding and fighting for change and not accepting scraps we would be nowhere. The bus boycott would not have happened if blacks were like well u know we should ride the bus and be grateful for any day they don’t throw us off the bus.
Bravo sista! you hit it right on with this statement!
unfortunately, lots of blacks in America have this very mindset and that is why we are not going to make as many changes as we would like as a people. we have to get to where were was in the civil rights movement, if we are going to make any changes.
We want to be represented in TV shows with dignified roles, yet we watch and therefore, condone all the stereotypical roles they give us, you can’t have it both ways! Not black people anyway, only white people can have that both ways!
Then we as blacks, want to have products that represent us but yet we don’t demand it at all, we just buy anything that isn’t even meant for us, like you said!
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sondis
yep I hear some black women complain about it on black gossip websites yet they stay watching. i’ll admit I watched a little of it before I awoke, but even then I stopped watching when that woman tammi came on there and was ready to whoop jennifers as for not knowing what a food stamp looked like. I was done with it after that. black ppl do need to stop watching this mess as we know when we give something the seal of approval everybody try to copy it and thinks its ok. just like with the movie bamboozled that ms mary told me to watch. the whites started being comfortable with it when they saw the black audience started laughing. that is why when some blacks use the n word whites want to use it. we make everything cool, and sometimes we forget that image of us on tv is broadcast to the world. that is why we have Africans and Caribbean blacks who assume all of us black americans are like that, because the tv tells them what we are supposedly like. These negative images don’t just affect how we look at ourselves but it affects how others see us too. That is what we all must understand this mess we approve here in America travels and influences blacks in other countries. SO of course whites would want to broadcast this mess to the masses and influence them to start acting like the crazies on tel lie vision
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“So Black women and white men are not humans 0_o?
Once again, thanks for telling ME about MYSELF”
its obviously you ran out of rhetoric, you just stopped trying and gave up with this pathetic of a comment.
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mstoogood4yall:
I couldn’t agree more sista! ^_^
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Quote one time where i have resulted in name calling and ad hominems b/c you didn’t agree with something i said. Yet reading your rebuttals to me are filled with baseless assumptions, name-calling and the like.
No i haven’ t run out of “rhetoric” i just think its pointless to keep debating (which should be done in a healthy way) with someone who is only gracious to commentators he agrees with but verbally abusive to those he doesn’t.
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“Quote one time where i have resulted in name calling and ad hominems b/c you didn’t agree with something i said. Yet reading your rebuttals to me are filled with baseless assumptions, name-calling and the like”
Yet again, you’re a hypocrite. You came out of the gate, making assumptions about me, being angry about black women, dating white men, which was false.
ad-hominids galore came from you, so please, spare me with the black pot, calling the kettle black.
I never called you, “names”. My assessment of you, being white identified and white washed black woman, isn’t name calling.
“No i haven’ t run out of “rhetoric” i just think its pointless to keep debating (which should be done in a healthy way) with someone who is only gracious to commentators he agrees with but verbally abusive to those he doesn’t.”
You say its pointless yet you have continued to respond to every single post i make in response to you, being a hypocrite once again.
You claim what should be done in a healthy way but yet, don’t practice what you preach, nothing you have said to me has been in a healthy way.
You start a debate and when you’re loosing it, you blame the person who is winning the debate. spare me….
I am not only gracious to those who, agree with me. It just so happens, that there was a particular aspect of what i was saying, someone else happened to agree with me and i acknowledged it.
I can go on as long as you want too, next…..
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Go back and read my comment–i said you “seemed” angry. That’s different from saying you “are” angry and it wasn’t an unfair conclusion to reach based on your commentary about Black women being “bed-wenches”…btw i left that comment open hoping you would jump in to clear up the fogginess about what you truly meant because anybody reading your comments could be lead to believe you have a disdain for Black women who have sex with/date/marry white men (maybe that is not what you meant).
Let’s get something clear; i don’t come on threads to win a contest. I see debating as a healthy way to learn and consider different viewpoints that i wouldn’t have necessarily thought of. My original comment to you had nothing in it anyone could interpret as offensive. Because Black women are the LEAST likely of groups to enter into an IRR, i simply don’t see what all the fuss is about. I even left that comment open in the sense that i said “groups of people”…
Besides that, human beings are going to do what human beings doing and that is screw each other like rabbits regardless of skin color (this occurring is as old as dirt). Better for me to accept that than to make my existence miserable by worrying about what others who don’t share my bed do.
And telling someone whom you do not know personally that they are “white-identified” is an ad hominem.
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“Go back and read my comment–i said you “seemed” angry. That’s different from saying you “are” angry and it wasn’t an unfair conclusion to reach based on your commentary about Black women being “bed-wenches””
Its wasn’t unfair to YOU and you only, to reach that conclusion, simply because you didn’t like the, negro bed wench, comment.
Also, i see how you like to twist my words, i never call black woman, Negro bed wenches.
I call black women who only date white men, Negro bed wenches and sell outs, there is a big difference. I can care less if you like the term or not, i am not here to worry about hurting your feelings.
I don’t like any black woman or black man, that sells out their own race and only wants to be around, white folks.
“btw i left that comment open hoping you would jump in to clear up the fogginess about what you truly meant because anybody reading your comments could be lead to believe you have a disdain for Black women who have sex with/date/marry white men (maybe that is not what you meant). ”
Again, that is you projecting, ONLY YOU, not anybody reading my comments, i made it perfectly clear, what i have disdain for in terms of black men and women, you’re the only one who interprets it the way you want to be, interpreted.
“Let’s get something clear; i don’t come on threads to win a contest.”
You definitely fooled me on this…
“Because Black women are the LEAST likely of groups to enter into an IRR, i simply don’t see what all the fuss is about. I even left that comment open in the sense that i said “groups of people.”
This is neither here or there, its completely irrelevant to the point i initially made, its nothing more than a derailing tactic. Have fun with keep throwing that useless factoid out several times you have already done.
“Besides that, human beings are going to do what human beings doing and that is screw each other like rabbits regardless of skin color (this occurring is as old as dirt).”
Another useless, irrelevant comment that again, has nothing to do with my statements or comments, its baseless and adds nothing to your argument, whatsoever.
“And telling someone whom you do not know personally that they are “white-identified” is an ad hominem.”
Telling someone whom you don’t know personally, that they’re angry about black women, only dating white man, isn’t? an ad hominem ?
You can play word games and claim to have meant, “it seemed you were angry” instead of, “you are angry” but it didn’t work and you failed, miserably.
I am willing you bet, that you’re lying about being married to a black man, there is no way that a black women would fight tooth and nail about black women, dating white men.
So instead of conceding to dating white men, you rather lie about being married to a black man.
Its alright, I’ll keep your secret….wait i forgot we are talking on a blog that has 100’s of members. lol
NEXT….
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Guys, lets keep civil, chill >.<
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phoebe and sondis
I appreciate both of ur commentary, and I don’t want to see another bulanik br thing going down. I see both points u are trying to make. from what I gather sondis was saying some white men see black women as bed wenches or sex objects not for serious commitment. and phoebe what I gather u saying is that why worry about that small percent of women who are. I agree with both, I can’t control the black men or black women who date white ppl and are ok with being the mandingo or bed wench without the commitment from their white parnter. both are degrading but some ppl are ok with being looked at as just a piece of meat that goes for both black men and black women. But it is up to parents and that individual to have enough self esteem and self respect to walk away and decide if that is what they want or not. I know sondis doesn’t dislike black women, he is one of the few men that come on here and comment on every thread not just the black women thread, like some ppl do like piggle wiggle. I know not every black person will end up with another black person and that is ok, I just don’t want to see either be reduced to some object, as we have been objectified enough. I think both black men and black women don’t like to see each other be objectified by whites. I know peanut and I have talked about how we hate seeing black men being portrayed as mandingos when they are more than that they are fathers, husbands, etc. I see black men don’t like to see black women portrayed as bed wenches because they see us as mothers, wives,etc. I think its just we don’t like seeing each other be disrespected by whites but at the same time, we have to accept that not all will see they are being used and some may even enjoy it for whatever reason. I don’t see where anybody has said they have an issue with interracial marriages, as marriage is a commitment a thing where u say this person I am with and not ashamed of being with.
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I would fight tooth and nail for any person to be happy with whomever they want to be with. Because i understand what that’s like. You can doubt all you want to about who i’m married to but that doesn’t change the fact that he is Black and much older than me (i know all about the stares and people telling me and him that it won’t work)…which is why i say “live and let live”…
The truth is Sondis, you can’t do anything about it. Not liking them for their decisions won’t change their minds about their decisions–in fact it will make them dig their heels in more to prove a point. Just like older women who had a problem with my relationship know that their disapproval won’t change the fact that a few older men prefer younger women.
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“The truth is Sondis, you can’t do anything about it. Not liking them for their decisions won’t change their minds about their decisions–in fact it will make them dig their heels in more to prove a point. Just like older women who had a problem with my relationship know that their disapproval won’t change the fact that a few older men prefer younger women. ”
There you go again, making everything i say about your projections. I am not concerned with changing anyone’s mind.
So if i say i don’t like racist white people, to you that means i am trying to change their minds, you make no kind of sense, whatsoever.
“No it isn’t because by me saying “you seem” or it “comes across” actually leaves plenty of room for you to clear up misconceptions that people may have.”
again, i already pointed out that this is just a word game, that you are playing, its not valid in any sense.
“And i also asked you to consider some of the reasons why some Black women and even some Black men only seem to date whites. If you take all of the reasons why into account (location, upbringing, opportunities, etc.) it would be very hard to come to the conclusion of calling them “sellouts” and bed-wenches” when you don’t have the whole story.”
This is pure theory and of coarse, you are presenting this scenario to fit your agenda. its so easy to just say it comes down to location,upbringing and opportunities. Its an excuse at best and a pitiful one at best.
If you choose to only date a white person as a black man or woman and not a black person, you’re a sell out, plain and simple. You can throw all that location,upbringing crap up all you want, its all just a defection, tactic.
Next….
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Msgood, you are going to have to point out to me where i have said anything that anybody could take offense to. Re-read my comments to Sondis because i don’t think you could find it.
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@Mstoogood4yall
@Sondis
I agree with that Scandal statement, I remember everyone and their grandma were talking about it. “Gurl, you gotta watch it”, “Gurl, did you see so and so fighting with whatever?” The way they were ranting on about it, I was like. “I’m gonna see it” and since the main character was some top notch black lawyer/something, I thought “Great, black women are moving up in the acting biz”. WRONG. As soon as I saw that trailer with her making out with the white guy about to do the nasty….DONE. My god, how played out is it already? I am SOOOOO tired of that cliché. I wouldn’t doubt it, no one and I mean NO ONE would’ve watched that mess and it went super banana’s, if it didn’t include the interracial bit in it.
Ugh, and then black women are eating it up, because in this make believe drama, finally a white guy has a “attraction” for us. *eye roll* Not trying to dog white guys out(This for Hollywood, not to you guys), but geez show something else for a change and just like you said Sondis, that show just completely demolishes black love. I think Tyler Perry is also making another drama with…you guessed it. A “successful black woman caught up in the lies/passion of a white man”. How can a black man sit there and create a story that doesn’t even promote himself? SMH.
Honestly, I love interracial love(If my people are happy, so am I), but I’m getting sick and tired of seeing this same pattern whenever it’s a “black” show . And it’s not just in the mainstream media. Even on independent shows on youtube created by black people(Shout out) they’re getting hit with it as well. Both black men and women!
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Drosera:
I’m glad you saw what i was trying to say, i really hate that mentality that some black people have.
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^ yes. I don’t care, I just want equal representation, that is all. I want equal representation of black love, white, latino, asian, interracial, but its not its all white and interracial. Just like I want to see equal representation of women black, Asian, latino, biracial, and white. but they mostly show white and biracial. It is annoying to have some family members or friends who are asleep and want u to watch some show full of stereotypes, I can’t stand any of it. yes and if it wasn’t interracial u right hardly anybody would’ve watched and that also goes for kanye and kim if he had a baby with his previous girlfriend nobody would care. And black women have been conditioned to see white men as some sort of validation. just look at Disney princess movies all white princes, no black princes ever. tyler perry show is the haves and have nots, I have not seen it but read some reviews and ppl said its a rip off of scandal lol smh.
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and I guess tyler though he could out do scandal since he has a black woman white man and on top of that a white man black man couple.
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LMFAO mstoogood4yall
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oh yes sondis they are using ppl that look like us to spread their agenda even further.
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so tyler though oh whats more scandalicious than scandal oh I’ve got it ghetto gaggers and thug hunter put together = a hot ass mess.
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Part II to my post
I remember watching a independent black comedy on youtube that shown a black woman “Jay” going through her life as being a awkward black girl and her chronicles with romance, And Funny enough that was the show, “Awkward Black Girl”. It was perfect, finally a black girl just like me, dark skin, natural and most importantly socially awkward because she neither fit in the black world and neither in the white. I liked in the series she had a long term crush on a black character name “Jay” and throught-out the series she tries to muster up the courage to say how she feels about “black” Jay. The series was going great UNTIL “White” Jay shown up. Mind you this is still a independent film, so sometimes the creator will ask commenters opinions about the show. This time, the opinion was who should be Jay’s love interest since she’s in the love Triangle and without a second “Pick white jay,” “Yeah, keep white jay.He’s so cute” “OMG<3 white jay". Suddenly there's floods…hoards of black women all crying.. screaming for the creator to keep the vanilla colored man and only a thimble of support for "black jay". Even though I was all in for "Swirl" crowd at the time, even I was kinda getting taken aback by how some of the women were acting and only a few people pointed out the women's obsession.
This black male character was there from the beginning with Jay, they flirted, mingled and actually had a connection! But the females were all willing to throw it all away, because the white guy came in at the right time and now he's the "Knight in shining Armor". At that's when it hit me. Why are we fighting so hard to keep this man? I know that during this time black women were getting HAMMERED and I mean hammered by black/white men for everything online! I know our faces were in the mud, shoot we were practically facedown on mud while other races were walking on our backs, but we had this one unfiltered non-mainstream opportunity to show black love…and black women practically X'd out black love in favor to some strange man, because "He finds us cute".
In the end, the audience got what they wanted and so "White" Jay was the boyfriend. I tried to stay and watch a couple of episodes(Which I did) But I was far to too steamed on how the women were acting. I felt kinda sad, because it was like dang "That felt like me (Black Jay)".
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Some of the rage being aimed at Black women is due to the fact that women are seen as having a sexual advantage that allows them to cozy up to powerful (heterosexual) men in a way that men cannot. Now, it is obvious that not all women have this ability, and of the ones who do, not all take advantage of it. This perceived ability, though, can abd will still be used by men people who feel that they are at a disadvantage and need a convenient excuse for their setbacks and / or failures. Personal shortcomings never come to mind; blame always lies elsewhere — and Black women certainly make easier targets than do powerful white males.
This whole thing reminds me of a TV documentary I saw a while back concerning sex during WWII, or something like that. It seems that wherever military men landed during that era, they’d seek out sexual companionship with local women and girls. In some of the locales the people were very poor and the only way the soldiers could entice girls to have sex with them was to pay them outright. The girls would then take the money they’d earned and go back to their villages to buy clothes and other items. Well, guess who it was that didn’t like that particular setup?! The young men of the village; and it was not because they were jealous and wanted the girls for themselves, but because they were envious and wanted the soldier’s money for themselves. However, unlike the girls, they had nothing the soldiers were willing to pay for and became angry with the girls (but not the soldiers) over the situation.
Obviously most Black women are not trading sex with powerful men for money or for jobs (they have their education and other credentials for that purpose), but the perception of women having that as an advantage can always be used as a weapon against them when / if someone (men or even other women) needs an excuse for their own failures in life.
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@Mstoogood4yall.
THANK YOU!
I want some men of color in interacials, if not then just put some black men in there then!
Gurl, I also said the same thing about Kayne/Kim and also about Jay/Beyoncé, no offense but when did mainstream white media care about a hiphop and R&B artist having a black child too? I smell phony-ness *side-eye*
@Sondis
Yep!
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I liked “Awkward Black Girl” in how the main character was not a stereotypical black person. But once she went for White Jay I lost interest. His cute rays did not work on me and I found it kind of nauseating after a point.
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@Peanut
Yes! Perfectly explained. But I was so mad though, I understand how the women felt. Shoot, I felt the same way. Running off with some white guy and forgetting my problems(lol), but black jay was sooo sweet and cute *sad eyes*.
But I’m at least happy that around the same time for me, I was getting into the “conscious” crowd. So lil by lil I was seeing the truth. I think that web series was the thing that broke the spell for me, That and a youtuber that professed his love for black women when all that hooplah “I can’t stand blk wmn” crowd was going on. I just wanted at least ONE black man to tell us something special, that we do matter and we need each other… And it did happen. It felt nice, that while there were these bitter jerks ranking us down to the bone. Videos after videos, blogs after blogs, pics after pics. This one black man, still held his ground for us.That’s when I realized we still had value and I didn’t want to give up or lose hope in black love. Cheesy, but it meant something special to me. lol
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I still would love to be in a interracial relationship, but I want me so ethnic men. lol I always had that white guy “faze” when I was in middle/highschool, I would love to be swoon over heels with a Latino,Afro-latino or Asian man. Now I do like some white guys, but my taste have changed over time and I like tochange it up, I would like to atleast meet some foreign European men and now just talking about it. OMG foreign black men!<3 Shoot, Foreign men all together ❤ ❤
I don't know what the future may hold for me, but I hope atleast my future child will be proud of their background no matter if they're black/bi-racial.
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@Peanut
True, just like my mother said. “Sometimes when a man loves you, he can either make you feel beautiful or feel like s@# and wanna roll over and die”.
My dude was AvenueRants,(Lifted my spirits) he kept it 100 with black men and women, I just got mad he kept getting banned and finally left b/c the “black conscious” group were getting too harsh/critical. SMH
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Drosera:
@ : o O ) >
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drosera
I liked awkward black girl too, but after she chose white jay over that fine brotha she always wanted to be with I kinda lost interest. And hbo Is supposed to have series kinda based on made by the creator of awkard black girl, I just hope they don’t whitewash it smh. I could relate to jay especially when she first met cici and was like dam does this girl live in the hallway and was trying to avoid eye contact, I was like that is so me. I also think the nerd that liked her was fine too.
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my fave black male youtubers are truewise7 (love him) and kemetprince1. peanut I do think some of these ppl are paid to troll, especially the ones who only comment on certain topics like interracial and black women but never comment on the important issues. *cough piggle wiggle *cough* excuse me.
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bhahaha
sondis this for u
http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=avenuerants&view=detail&mid=4738A8815E89615E90FD4738A8815E89615E90FD&first=21&FORM=NVPFVR
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mstoogood4yall:
lmfao @ that YouTube cartoon! The black guy in the cartoon, even says, “negro bed wench” like i do! LMFAO!
Thanks for the link, i hope every black woman that watches that garbage, seems that cartoon clip! HHAHAHA
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ikr the part when they flipped the script and had Obama with a white mistress, she all he11 no we gonna shut this down that woman is a h0. bahaha. igotta watch that again
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Oh yeah, I just wanted to say one thing atleast about that show. I did have a crush on that FINE bi-racial guy(The nerdy one that slept with jay). and a lil for the mouse- voiced dude. lol
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the nerdy guy and mouse voice were fine. and the guy she rejected, I was like wtf, its not like she didn’t have suitable black men around her white jay was the only white guy in the show and she chose him. I would’ve chose the guy she rejected or the mouse voice guy.
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@mstoogood4yall
Same here….Please. She didn’t know what she had infront of her, that man would have been my husband that day. lol
@Sondis
lol, what kind of emoticon is that? XD
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Drosera:
It’s a smiley fave with a surprised look on sit face.
@ : o O ) >. First you see his curly hair @ then his eyes : then his nose o and his wide open mouth O then his chin ) and lastly his Adam’s apple >
LMFAO! ^_^
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@ Sondis @ Phoebe
Ms Good said:
I agree. Please leave each other alone until further notice. Do not address each other or make personal remarks about the other.
Thank you.
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@Sondis
lol, you are a crazy character
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No problem.
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@Fiamma– that sums it up perfectly.
Especially with the show Scandal. Yet people forget that Washington’s character on the show is as powerful as her love interest if not more powerful because she was the reason he was elected as president. She herself is a political giant–the former white house communications director. In short–her character is no Sally Hemmings.
There is no imbalance of power between her and her love interest, but the sexism that is rampant towards Black women will have one to believe that that show is ALL about her being with a white man and not about her having a career, and leadership. Besides that, the show is still in its early stages and i will bet that as the storyline continues, Washington’s character will likely end up having a serious romance with someone else entirely.
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sondis I don’t know what that disfigured smiley face is. I thought it was mr potato head or something. I thought the )> was a goatee rofl with it close together it look like a bird beak. (*)> Quack quack
/ /
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“mstoogood4yall:
yep I hear some black women complain about it on black gossip websites yet they stay watching. i’ll admit I watched a little of it before I awoke, but even then I stopped watching when that woman tammi came on there and was ready to whoop jennifers as for not knowing what a food stamp looked like.
I was done with it after that. black ppl do need to stop watching this mess as we know when we give something the seal of approval everybody try to copy it and thinks its ok. just like with the movie bamboozled that ms mary told me to watch. the whites started being comfortable with it when they saw the black audience started laughing.
That is why when some blacks use the n word whites want to use it. we make everything cool, and sometimes we forget that image of us on tv is broadcast to the world.
That is why we have Africans and Caribbean blacks who assume all of us black americans are like that, because the tv tells them what we are supposedly like.
These negative images don’t just affect how we look at ourselves but it affects how others see us too. That is what we all must understand this mess we approve here in America travels and influences blacks in other countries. SO of course whites would want to broadcast this mess to the masses and influence them to start acting like the crazies on tel lie vision”
There are lots of black women, that justify this role for the sole purpose of seeing a woman that looks like them on Television with a white man.
Black women have been, programmed and white washed to believe that the white man is the most romantic,the hero in every movie, that will save the black woman.
Nobody ever talks about this, black women only talk about how black men seem to worship, white women.
The fact that black women, choose to ignore the white supremacist dynamic that exists between the black woman and white man in that TV show scandal, reveals that black women are white washed and programmed, via white supremacy, no different than black men.
There isn’t an equal of power between her ( A black woman ) and he ( The president of the united states ( A white man ).
That’s preposterous to even suggest. Hell, even an average white person isn’t equal to an average black person, via white supremacy but a white president is equal to a black female that worked on his election campaign?
Now she’s a fixer upper of scandals for white people and that makes her equal to a white male president? Ridiculous….
The white man did the same thing regarding black women and white men, during slavery by trying to romanticize, the relationship between their female slaves and their young underage children.
Today, black women are fighting tooth and nail to justify a show that depicts a black woman as a home wrecker, a mistress, a deceiver and liar, being she lies to everyone she comes across as to cover up her affair with this white man.
This is white supremacy at its best….
Trojan Pam is even more of a radical, when it comes to black women, dating white men but when she speaks on it on this blog, i don’t see a peep from any black women about it, soon as a black man speaks on it in the least, here come the black feminists out of the wood work, hows that for a double standard?
“TrojanPam
The (white) mainstream media has caused the DESIRE on the part of black people to be with anyone BUT another black person to KEEP blacks from UNIFYING and surviving what is coming in this society
Movies like “The Purge” are more than just entertainment, they are a WARNING to black people of what could happen within an increasingly unstable economy as whites are PREPPED to blame black people VIA President Obama for all that AILS them
check out the website and you’ll see that this movie may be MORE than a movie.
http://www.newfoundersamerica.org/
Unfortunately, many black males and females are so busy blaming and WARRING with each other — a dynamic that began during slavery — that we can’t see the white forest for all the white trees we are happily sexing.
Since we live under a system of white supremacy, NO black person ever chooses a white person. White people do ALL the choosing, and that is as true for white males as it is for white females.
They are ALWAYS the most powerful person in that black/white unions. Yes, I know, we like to see sexing whites as “racial progress” but the reality is while black people have been separating from each other, we have collectively lost almost 80 percent of all the so-called civil rights gains made over the last FORTY YEARS.
Even during the harshest segregation, black males and females had enough common sense to know we NEEDED EACH OTHER. Now, we are so quick to dismiss each other since “I don’t have to date blacks. I can date or marry a white person.”
But the reality is MOST (over 92%) of white people MARRY OTHER WHITE PEOPLE and the group whites are LEAST LIKELY to marry are BLACK PEOPLE.
so there really aren’t that many whites who –other than sexing and romping in the sheets with us — are really all that interested in blacks. Maybe, while we still have time, black males and females need to come together to understand HOW our relationships and respect for each other were destroyed DURING 400 years of slavery and HOW our families never recovered.
I tried to explain that in two our books “The Interracial Con Game” and “Black Love is a Revolutionary Act”
(Abagond, I hope you don’t mind me posting this hear, if you do please delete the above line)
One last thing to leave here
From what I understand, Jews just prior to World War II had the highest incident of marriage with Germans – and these unions were considered “interracial” because Jews were NOT CONSIDERED WHITE by the real whites: Germans. Jews aka SEMITES was equivalent to being MULATTOES (so-called mixed race) people.
A Jewish psychologist (can’t remember his name) said afterwards that the reason the Jews did not react to the IMMINENT threat (the concentration camps and mass slaughter) was they lacked the SELF-RESPECT to realize they were NOT GERMANS
and believed the (white) Germans wouldn’t harm them because “we’re Germans, too”
and you can see the SAME MENTALITY and GROSS WHITE MIS-IDENTIFICATION of many blacks today who are in as MUCH denial as the Jews were prior to being marched into concentration camps.
I’m sure many will disagree with me, and that’s cool. I said my piece,
now, I”m moving on…”
abagond, i am not making any personal remarks about or address her, i am simply quoting her remarks to prove a point.
This is her response to TrojanPam, which is basically the same thing i was saying but in a more extreme form.
“phoebeprunelle
I’m sure many will disagree with me, and that’s cool. I said my piece,
Nope, i don’t disagree at all.”
This comment was in this very thread, all i had to go was go up and there it was….
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“Black women have been, programmed and white washed to believe that the white man is the most romantic,the hero in every movie, that will save the black woman.
Nobody ever talks about this, black women only talk about how black men seem to worship, white women.”
yes i agree, and i and other female commenters have said that they start with the dam disney movies programming us to see nothing but white princes. black ppl should be able to talk to each other about what our issues are with each other, but it seems whenever that happens its always drama. I know there will be a time when all the bs issues we have colorism, sexism, whitewashing, anti blackness,etc will have to be addressed and solved, i just want it to be a respectful and constructive discussion. But i won’t hold my breath for that. The only thing we must never forget is all this stems from the root which is white supremacy. kill the root and the weed dies, chop the top of the weed off and it grows back. yes both black women and black men have been programmed to accept certain roles and be grateful for it. Black women have been whitewashed to accept the jezebel mistress role and think that is the power they have to offer. black men have been whitewashed to accept the mandingo role and think that is all the power they have to offer. we don’t have power through what is between our legs but what is in our heads and hearts. slavery was to break us physically, spirtually, and emotionally. It worked, now we are broken and because we are lost spiritually, emotionally, fianacially, we think the only thing we have left and own is our bodies yet some give that away too. we’ve all been tricked. black women have been tricked into thinking white men are the ultimate men and need validation that we are a woman from them, black men have been tricked into thinking white women are the ultimate prize and need one to feel validated as a man in a white mans world. We are so sick that we give everything to our oppressor/enemy to control. our money, our kids, our magazines, etc. Of course there are whitewashed blacks, that won’t stop or minimize until we create our own media and STOP selling it to whites who use it to whitewash us and create divide. And stop cosinging our own destruction and degrading. i used to watch madea and all that garbage, then when i awoke i was like wow, this mess is used to make fun of black women, yet we support our own ridicule and bullying and think its entertainment?
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part 2
and finally, the hypocritcal black ppl need to stop as well. I’ve seen too many ppl that were not interested in the black person and would not date them ,yet as soon as that person gets a white partner they giving them the side eye. or the ones who were like oh yeah when black men were being shown with white women but mad when black women were shown with white men. Or the black women who are like oh yeah when it is black women and white men but oh he11 no when its black men and white women. either u for it or u against it.And when it is black ppl with different interests that aren’t so called black[rock, hiking,biking,rock climbing etc] then some ppl will ignore them and not give them the time of day and call them white. Yet we don’t like to be looked at as a monolith by others so why do it to each other. I try to hear and understand both sides, and there are things both black men and black women could improve upon. Both need to work on communicating effectively, and be able to talk to each other about things. I don’t see that happening correctly now so i do feel black men and black women should not talk about each others issues. i do feel like black women should discuss our issues and work on them together and black men discuss and work on theirs, as the im going to give u criticism for what u black men or what u black women are doing is not working. i do respect some brothas criticism the ones who are respectful and don’t play the blame game. I don’t respect the ones who bash black women and only comment on threads about black women or interracial but don’t comment on the other threads about history,injustice ,etc.
and idk why the interracial has so many comments and so much strong emotions from ppl. If it is a small percent doing it then what are we worried about? i think some are worried that it will spread to the younger generation and we end up like the uk or brazil and be swirling everywhere lol. but the best way to combat that is black empowerment through self love, education, and respect for each other. If there was less anti black within our community there would be less swirling. If u have black ppl that are afraid of being darker and tell their kids they will get dark if they stay in the sun too long, what message is that sending? black is ugly dark is bad, u need to have kids with good hair and light skin. Even the ones that don’t do that i see swoon over someone with so called good hair, what message is that sending to the kids with thicker hair? When are we going to practice what we preach, we contradict too much how can we say black is beautiful yet get crazy over kids with light skin, might as well say light is beautiful. I bet alot of the black ppl in interracial have had some anti black in their life whether from family, peers, or whatever. all im saying is if we can get rid of the anti black and colorism in our communities there would be less feeling the need to be validated by a white person.
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@Sondis
@Mstoogood4yall
*Standing Ovation*
*_*
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Another thing I would like to say about this whole “interracial” thing is, some black people are starting to have their noses in the air.
I’ve noticed that some black women that are all for “swirling”(Ugh, starting to hate that term) are thinking their better than other black women, because they can “pull a non-black men”. Same as black men. And another thing that is ticking me off, (Thank you mstoogood4yall for speaking on it) these SELF-HATING interacials that will sit here with their non-black spouse, be all smiles, BUT when they see you with a non-black person as well. “Uh-uh, you can’t do that”. Like really? Then some of them trying to come off with this “I’m educated and handle my business” type of talk, while waving their degrees in our faces(When we talk about fixing the black community) as if WE don’t have that. Ugh, the snooty-ness.
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Drosera, Mstoogood4yall:
Thanks for acknowledging the words in which i speak. sometimes truth hurts, coming from a man of the same race, that some black women have been hurt by, so the black man hating phase is enacted.
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Drosera
“Another thing I would like to say about this whole “interracial” thing is, some black people are starting to have their noses in the air.
I’ve noticed that some black women that are all for “swirling”(Ugh, starting to hate that term) are thinking their better than other black women, because they can “pull a non-black men”. Same as black men. And another thing that is ticking me off, (Thank you mstoogood4yall for speaking on it) these SELF-HATING interracial that will sit here with their non-black spouse, be all smiles, BUT when they see you with a non-black person as well. “Uh-uh, you can’t do that”. Like really? Then some of them trying to come off with this “I’m educated and handle my business” type of talk, while waving their degrees in our faces(When we talk about fixing the black community) as if WE don’t have that. Ugh, the snooty-ness.”
I don’t like this, either.
I notice this with black women and black men, education and being affluent, tends to change black people, being we don’t normally have this experience, growing up.
When we attain some sort of stature and success, it goes to some black people’s heads. This is when they get to be, “uppity Negros” and look down on other black people that are not as fortunate as them. aka black conservative republicans.
It takes a certain kind of black person to maintain their blackness and still have love for themselves, their people and the struggle.
I had a conversation with a black woman, just the other day and i asked her if she thought for one second, that slave masters that owned black female slaves, raped them and their underage daughters, loved them. she paused and didn’t answer, immediately.
She said, “well…maybe in some situations”
WTF? How white washed and white identified is that?
The fact that white men owned black female slaves, didn’t even see them as human but animals, shows they didn’t love them and proves that just because white men, “sleep with black woman” Today, doesn’t mean NOTHING, being they sleep with black women back in slavery, despite not even thinking of them as human being.
This is just to put in perspective, how white men, sleeping with black women, doesn’t prove the supposed love for black women by white men in today’s society. All it proves is sex is color blind, not love and the majority of white men see black women as play things to screw and throw away in the trash, when they are done. I will not stand idly by and allow, the white media to push this agenda via white supremacy and use my beautiful black Sistas!
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Buddhu:
You are welcome to hold different views to mine, but don’t assume that you know me or the communities in which I am embedded.
You are right, I dont know you. I can only go by what you said on here which is a poor reflection of reality in my experience. BTW, re the racism slant, if the cap dont fit, dont wear it.
I NOW live in a rural area, but it’s literally 5 mins from Luton where I lived and worked for decades. A more racially diverse town/city you’d be hard pressed to find. I was a T&GWU shop steward in the Vauxhall plant there for 16 years. I’d estimate that 60% of my workload was racially orientated in that role. 5 mins the other way is Hitchin with a very large South Asian (especially Sikh) community and plenty of black West Indian people.
I am truly surprised about Luton but, I dont know that area well myself but have a lot of friends who originally came from there so I have to trust that you are being honest. Now, I am not saying that the scales are massive but, they way you present it, the situation is the same in the U.K as in the U.S and I would disagree with that.
Hmm… assuming we live in the same UK…
!!!!! Why – because I dont agree with you?
I have had romantic relationships with black ladies and Indian ladies as well as white. My step children are white/Afro-Caribbean mixed race
There are white men who actively seek black women only to feel that they had the right to engage in racial banter publicly and to the discomfort of their partner – not sure what your comment above is supposed to prove. My partner also tells me about witnessing young children from IR relationships watching whilst their white parent (in the examples she gave female) verbally abusing the black men with racist taunts – can you see how what you have said here does not necessarily excuse a potentially prejudiced mindset?
You may have a point with the “younger generation” thing. I’m in my 50s and may be a little out of touch on that front.
I would say that it is possible that there is a generation gap and if you start to look at people in their mid 40’s downards (my generation) you would see a difference. My parents generation now (late 60’s) the only examples I have seen tend to be black men white women and certainly not on the scale that is seen now.
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@Omnipresent:
Not suposed to prove anything, just to illustrate that I don’t exist in a white bubble of isolation. You, on the other hand have told me nothing about yourself, so I have no idea who has piped up and started talking to me.
I also have no idea what you’re saying with the white-men-seeking-black-women-to-feel-that blah blah etc. I’m sure that happens, but what’s that got to do with anything I have said? Are you, again, implying something about me – someone about whom you know nothing?
I have no idea what you’re talking about.
I’m still kind of unclear on what points you’re making and what you’re trying to say, but please don’t bother clarifying on my account. My observations weren’t directed at you, and from what you’ve said so far you seem to be someone seeking confrontation for no good reason with a person you don’t know anything about. I’m not playing and have no interest in conversing with you further.
Thanks. Have a good evening.
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@ drosera & sondis
yes some do think they are better when they have a degree or live in a certain neighborhood. when reality they are a job loss and a couple paychecks away from struggling.
“This is just to put in perspective, how white men, sleeping with black women, doesn’t prove the supposed love for black women by white men in today’s society. All it proves is sex is color blind, not love and the majority of white men see black women as play things to screw and throw away in the trash, when they are done. I will not stand idly by and allow, the white media to push this agenda via white supremacy and use my beautiful black Sistas!”
yes sex is supposedly colorblind. And I don’t like the media using black people and pushing their agenda either. At the same time black men and black women have to stand up for ourselves. I don’t think its that effective for black men to be like scandal is sick take it off air, whereas if black women said that it would be more effective as it is us they are targeting with that goofy show. same for us black women we can’t be trying to fight the mandingo stereotype for black men they have to do that themselves. what we do need to do together is fight white supremacy.
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@ sondis
“Thanks for acknowledging the words in which i speak. sometimes truth hurts, coming from a man of the same race, that some black women have been hurt by, so the black man hating phase is enacted”
yes, some do. its crazy how when people are hurt they go to an extreme to not be hurt again. i respect u, brothawolf, and kushite prince, as u all are consistent in what u say and talk about both wrongs black men and black women have done. The only thing i don’t like seeing from some commenters is sympathy for one gender but not the other. but those are usually the trolls and they hate being called that. Like piggle wiggle was excusing some mens behavior while attacking womens behavior. I just don’t like the hypocritical ones that thumbs up bad behavior from one and disown the other. if u against ppl hoin themselves out and degrading themselves then be against it all, not just when it comes to one.
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@Sondis
@Mstoogood4yall
I agree from both sides, we do need to speak for ourselves.
Honestly, after all these years black sexuality is still some sort of “intriguing” thing when it comes to White America. Shows like Scandal, bash-fest webs/blogs and these desperate interracialist shows this. I mean think about it, why is when we talk about these issues, it mostly has to come to that one thing. Our bodies seems to be the most used/talked about thing all the time. There is something in black males and females, that make us get the most attention with this topic.
Talking about it now, make me wanna go and do research on it more. I use to hear black conscious folks talk about it, but I didn’t REALLY HEAR what they said (If you get what I mean). It’s one of those things that have a lot of history, behind it. A powerful thing actually.
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yes Drosera I notice it too. a lot obsess over our bodies. they always asking how are black ppl so fast, and talk about black mens privates. they used to castrate black men and lynch them they’ve been intrigued by us, I forgot the black womans name that was put on display for her large behind. abagond did a post on her. of course they talk about our bodies as this country was built by our ancestors bodies. From the auction block, to ota benga, to now where they ask to touch ppls hair they’ve been curious about us. Our sexuality is a huge thing to them for whatever reason.
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Dang, I wished my behind had read the old comments from the beginning. >:/ SMH
@TrojanPam
@Ms J: I don’t know if you’re out there, but thank you! All the way down to the T. This is what I meant
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Buddhuu:
Omnipresent:My partner also tells me about witnessing young children from IR relationships watching whilst their white parent (in the examples she gave female) verbally abusing the black men with racist taunts – can you see how what you have said here does not necessarily excuse a potentially prejudiced mindset?
Buddhuu: I have no idea what you’re talking about…..I’m still kind of unclear on what points you’re making and what you’re trying to say, but please don’t bother clarifying on my account.
I know that I am not the most clearest of writers on here but I thought I got across what I was trying to say. If I stated that one of the women told her male child he was just like his ‘black b@stard father’ perhaps it might put the comment in to context – but never mind, I know you are uninterested.
I am at a loss to see how what I said was confrontational – it just didnt back up what you were saying but fair enough I wont address you any more. Peace.
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Drosera:
“Dang, I wished my behind had read the old comments from the beginning. >:/ SMH
@TrojanPam
@Ms J: I don’t know if you’re out there, but thank you! All the way down to the T. This is what I meant”
Why are you thanking and what was it, that you meant? please share your thoughts. ^_^
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peanut
that is why I said black men have to demand to take that mess off air as it is targeted at them but then idk who watches those shows the most. it could be black women and white women that watched ochocinco mess. I think women watch reality shows more than men. The hip hop vids smh, I don’t know who the heck watches that hot mess. if white males buy the music the most then I know they probably watch it the most. I bet for them seeing black men with white and non black women is like their mandingo fantasy. And usually the white feminists will show up and get the degrading rappers taken down like they did to rick ross, but they leave robin thicke alone since he not talking about them. smh, I think all the rappers that degrade black women should be taken off as well. If white women wanna be degraded in hip hop vids that ain;t my problem. as for the interracial conspiracy when they started targeting black women, well I notice it too. Those would be the men that were cheering for black men and non black women, yet get upset at black women with non black men, those are usually the unbalanced and possessive type. Or it could be some who didn’t see what was going on and how it felt until they saw the things being targeted at black women then they think oh so is this how they felt when they saw black men with non black women, I understand now. There was a male commenter on truths blog that said something along those lines.
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some are just plain possessive, those would be the men who don’t like or want to date that woman, yet get upset seeing her with another race of men. Then there are some who are single and are like dang I wish I had her, instead of that guy. Then some feel like black women are supposed to be the saviors of the race as the saying u get the woman u get the children. commenter tyrone on truths blog breaks it down much better.
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@Peanut
Did you mean me? Ok, I’ll try to do a better quote.
Also that is very true, but I guess in black men views it shows what type of white men they use for the media. Like in Scandal/Have’s & Have’s Not. It’s always these type of “Politician/business” type of white men, than it is like a “Robin thicke” type of white men. Same can be said about black men, most of the white women that are with black men in these reality/tv shows that get the most attention are like”Coco/Kim Kardashian” types, not “Paris Hilton/Taylor Swift” But I agree, most black men will scream for them to take Down Ghetto gaggers (Puke,I do want it down) BUT won’t have the same passions when it comes to these “interracial” films portraying these mandigo fetish in black men as well. But regardless, you are still right. Still in all, both sides need to be checked.
Ugh, my brain sometimes get tangled into “what-is-what” these days @~@ Especially these discussions, I don’t like to over analyze my own self. lol
@Sondis
Oh I was thanking TrojanPam, because she explains basically what I was saying, black sexuality in the eyes of whites. Like how most older white men/women seek sex from blacks when they are old compared to when they are young. One thing she did say which was true was how these men especially will seek out black men to have intercourse with their white wives(cuckold, I think it’s called) Now it’s not a big deal, but it’s still weird in most cases they won’t look for another buff white male or Hispanic/Asian/middle eastern. Nope,they choose/want black men(Dark skin at that/Prevalent in pornography), strange isn’t it? Same as older white men flying out of the country for sex in mostly Asian countries. Another thing I would like to remind everyone it’s not just black sexuality, but Asians as well are kept in the mouths in whites 24/7 when it comes to their sexuality. “Jungle Fever/Yellow Fever”.
Notice, that whenever there is a discussion about interracial dating when it’s specific about black/Asian(Doesn’t matter female or male). The genitals of black and Asian men seem to be the most talked about. I mean think about it, what grown man will sit here and try to over-analyze ANOTHER MAN’S genital?! If you’re a confident man, genitals should NEVER be put in your mouths, heck if you were a woman saying the same exact thing, women would think you’re some kind of weirdo. Think about that folks.
Just something to ponder about, now I’m not saying EVERY single white male/female are out there doing this, but one should atleast wonder why the focus seems to be on these subjects.
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I want this blog too O.O*Nosy*
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u know truthbetolds blog diary of a negress,
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Part II added to @Peanut
There is also this “Tainted” thing going on with it comes to either white/men that date dark skin black people. Like, I remember before I saw one posting of a white prosititute saying she was asked by white men if she “Had black clients” even though she was a hooker, they still wanted to know and wouldn’t want to conduct business if she did.Vice versa from white males, but they don’t really speak on it.
But here is a pic, that I’m talking about. Notice she’s emphasizing on what type of “black” woman.(Scroll to down to the pic)
http://ratchetmess.tumblr.com/post/58099605861/white-people#disqus_thread
Those that are more “Ethnic”, seems to be EXTREMLY fascinating when it comes to dating. Not saying other minorities don’t do this, but there aren’t large cases compared to whites.
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heres one of his comments
“Always! Sistas, it’s not about Becky, You’re the leading actress in the movie we call “Life.” All that i have ever been told about whitewomen on this planet has been a bold face lie…Everything! I’m not lost anymore, i know how the game is played. The powers that be want me and other blackmen to forsake you, this is the reason why blackwomen are hated on so much by whitemen, whitewomen, coonish blackmen, and so forth. They can’t defeat blackwomen in and of themselves. The greatest enemy of black womanhood is self-hatred within blackmen. This harsh truth sistas need to comprehend. As you stated, in the company and protection of sincere blackmen, a blackwoman can be as black and beautiful as she wants to be…Haters Be Damned! ”
Blessings
Ty
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here’ another good comment by tyrone, u can go to the double standard thread peanut it talks about what u asking.
“The loyalty of blackwomen has contributed to the problem of disloyalty by blackmen. In other words, most blackmen in the US have never been scared to the point of crapping in their pants. In the psyche of blackmen, a lot of us could and have played the field to suit our own sexual needs because we wrongly assumed that blackwomen would always endure our bulls**t. Truth be told, the black female/white/moc dynamic has always been the greatest fear of blackmen…those in IR relationships and not. Sistas need to know the ugly truth about us, in relation to this issue. As is noted, blackmen have very high opinions of themselves. We feel that any and all colors of women should and must worship at our feet, regardless of color and ethnicity…God Complex. Many blackmen see no harm in creating black life within the wombs of other women, besides, the babies are black, Right?…Color Complex. Remaking the planet in our own image…Global Complex. Blackmen target white females to exact revenge against white males, don’t believe the hype. So-called latinas and middle-eastern women are middle-ground women…basically, whitewomen who have the phenotype of blackwomen. Asian women are new to the game, they’re fresh fish so to speak. Why do blackmen lust white over colored? Non-black women that have brown skin are viewed as black females in the minds of blackmen. Naturally, if a blackman is sexually attracted to blackwomen, he will have an attraction to other sun-kissed women as well(phenotype). Again, lusting after white females is an indirect way to slap back at white males, so, lusting after other WoC does not have the same political bent. This being said, hooking native-american and asian women is not as easy as it seems on the surface. All non-african men don’t want blackmen lusting after their women, Why? As is the case with Becky, they might not stop said behavior. Right now in Japan, globe-trotting and military blackmen are loving life. Meanwhile, Japanese men are helpless to stop it from taking place. On the flip side, if blackwomen decided to sleep with asian men en masse…The Planet Would Detonate…literally and figuratively. All blackmen know that sistas can hurt us 10x more by engaging in IR relationships, Why?…Bloodlines. In reality, blackwomen create another group of black children without the aid of blackmen…Spanish blackwomen have been doing this for decades. However, the downside to this dynamic, is that, it destroys black manhood. Which is why blackmen don’t want sistas having babies with other men. This issue doesn’t affect biracial females on either side, only the males. If a blackwoman has a child with a whiteman, his mixed son will look like him facially and physically despite the color. He may view himself as black, but, if he doesn’t look the part, blackmen will reject him. Well, his daddy ain’t black, he ain’t black…Hood Politics! Mulatto females look how they look…curly brown hair, chestnut eyes, wide nose, full lips, caramel to lemon complexion, etc. A lot of sistas wonder why we look sideways at them for being with other men?…Genetics Whitemen are paler, Asian men are shorter. Brothas are worried about how the male babies will come out, this is what we don’t wanna talk about. We want to stay at the top of the totem pole, intellectually, physically, and sexually. Another point, blackmen may be able to produce black children with white females…The Problem? Whitewomen have no clue in raising a black child, which cancels out blackness. Her black son clings to his white mother, thus, he loves whitewomen. This is the trap that whitewomen have laid for blackmen…knowingly or unknowingly. I see a lot of brothas with ugly or fat whitewomen…Can’t Explain It. Despite sexual supremacy on the planet, blackmen still get the short end of the stick…athletes and entertainers included. Seal is the only blackman that actually hooked a “10″ white female, excluding Kim K. Blackmen wanted Kim K in the worst way, if she had hooked up with another man, it would have been a loss for black manhood…The Streets!!!”
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@ Drosera
they do have a fetish for Asian women, brothawolf did a post about a racist song made about Asian women heres the link http://brothawolf.wordpress.com/2013/08/12/video-asian-girlz-and-all-things-wrong-with-it/
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@Mstoogood4yall
Thank you for the statements and the link.
I guess I have another awesome BlogSpot to add *Adds to checklist*
If anyone knows of any good black/multinational blogs spots, please let me know, because I love me some info 🙂
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@ drosera
trojanpam website is http://racismws.com/2013/08/11/if-this-white-female-had-concealed-carry-would-she-have-used-her-gun/
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peanuts blog http://blacknotwhitedippedinchocolate.wordpress.com/
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and ther are many others, abagond has a links section here it is.https://abagond.wordpress.com/some-links/
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Some blogs of commenters:
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@Peanut, Scandal shouldn’t be taken off the air no more than reality shows that have the combination of relationships that you just described.
The truth is at this point (whether i like it personally or not), BOTH are a part of the Black narrative/experience. And besides that, i am thoroughly convinced at this point that dozens upon dozens of Black people have wanted these depictions for awhile now–not only would people be fighting the whites to get these shows “removed” but also Black people (and i don’t see the ones who want it relenting to the desires of those who oppose it).
At this point i’m not really concerned about it–Black people who prefer white partners are the least of the majority of Black people’s worries who are going to marry/procreate in the Black communities anyway and i am especially not knocking a show like Scandal (although i don’t even watch it regularly) that is perhaps much more healthier than Basketball Wives and Real Housewives of Atlanta..
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mstoogood4yall:
@ sondis
“Thanks for acknowledging the words in which i speak. sometimes truth hurts, coming from a man of the same race, that some black women have been hurt by, so the black man hating phase is enacted”
yes, some do. its crazy how when people are hurt they go to an extreme to not be hurt again. i respect u, brothawolf, and kushite prince, as u all are consistent in what u say and talk about both wrongs black men and black women have done. The only thing i don’t like seeing from some commenters is sympathy for one gender but not the other. but those are usually the trolls and they hate being called that. Like piggle wiggle was excusing some mens behavior while attacking womens behavior. I just don’t like the hypocritical ones that thumbs up bad behavior from one and disown the other. if u against ppl hoin themselves out and degrading themselves then be against it all, not just when it comes to one.”
Yes, i know of these types of black women and black men, who only seem to point out the other genders issues but not their own, it happens a lot from a lot of black women on this blog.
I, on the other hand, am not one of them, being i liberally call out black men that are sellouts, house Negros, black men who beat and treat their black women like trash and prostitutes on a normal basis on this blog.
When i do this, i NEVER saw one black man, get defensive and retaliate by pointing out black women’s pathologies.
It never fails, a black man says anything remotely negative about a black woman on this blog ( as if black women are perfect ) that’s when you start seeing the, “black men treat black women like crap” chants.
Yet, a black woman like, “TrojanPam” can say anything and everything, regarding black women and white men and don’t come under any scrutiny in form of attacks from a few black women on this blog.
Its a hypocritical, double standard and it needs to stop.
You’re preaching to the wrong choir, i don’t need a history lessen on how, “some” black men treat black women.
“Some” black women on this blog, always expect for me to always mention a negative aspect of a black man, right after mentioning a negative aspect about a black woman, as if all the bad things that some black women do to black men, can’t stand alone on itself and therefore, black women never owe up to it by acknowledging it but instead, the defenses spring right up and some black women on this blog, go into black man, hating attack mode!
Just because i point out one negative about a black woman, doesn’t make a black man’s any less true or false, so i don’t know why some black women on this blog, continue to take everything a black man says about some black women, personally.
I have every right to comment on the dynamic between black women and white men, just as black women have the right to comment on the dynamic, between black men and white women, without being attacked!
I acknowledge my genders faults as its important to black women, that good black men that want and love black women, see how some of us don’t want and treat, black women. Its all part of the healing process and it needs to take place if there is any, coming together of black men and black women.
When you don’t owe up to your genders faults but get defensive over them, you only come across as a bitter, mad black woman that’s been hurt by a black man and you’ll sole purpose for being on this blog is to attack black men, whenever the opportunity presents itself.
Me,Brothawolf, kushite prince, abagond to name a few and i’m sorry if i left out any other brothas, are not the enemy as we support our black Sistas in dating black women, defending black women and at times, calling out “some” black women for the wrong things they do to their brothas.
I think i earned that right to constructively criticize black women, when need be, being black women is whom i exclusively chose to date.
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“why should scandal be taken off the air, take off all the hip hop videos and reality tv shows with black men and white women/non-black women first.”
First off, NOBODY said it should be taken off the air.
This is derailing, being everyone who was talking about the show was saying how the dynamic between the black woman and white man was degrading to black women, not chanting for it to be taken off the air.
The relationship has ” powerful white man, has a less powerful black woman as a Negro bed wench” as a mistress, written all over it.
This is what the people that were speaking on it, was referring too, NOT calling for it to be taken off the air.
This is NOTHING for a black woman to be PROUD of but some black women stand by degrading of black women show Scandal, while other black women, hate it and with GOOD reason.
White washing of some black women are blinded and don’t and choose to see, the white supremacy in that show.
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The I am white washed. LOL
I like scandal and it is a hell of a lot better than basketball wives and Real Housewives of Atlanta (unless I am seeking to dumb myself down).
I personally like Scandal. I like that it was written by a black female. I like that it portrays a real life black female fixer (minus the drama). I like t hat Kerry Washington’s character is in the power position that she is in.
Some out there see her as the white mans wh*re, but she has made the decision not to be with him a few times throughout the show (he was leaving his wife for her). I guess it is what it is.
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I can’t say I’m a huge Scandal fan, but I’ve watched it a handful of times, because I’m kind of a Kerry Washington fan.
I was thinking the same thing Sondis said on a couple of occasions while watching: Here’s another story of a beautiful intelligent Black woman throwing herself at an arrogant, unavailable White man to be loved, when he really ain’t all that into her and just using her for sex.
Like Sharina, I do like the idea of supporting (on-screen and off-screen) Black talent whenever possible as long as the projects try to demonstrate taste, and don’t rely much or at all on negative racial stereotypes.
I realize in Hollyweird, there won’t ever be much if any productions that don’t portray Blacks and other non-White characters as walking stereotypes and in some sort of degrading position.
The powers that be who control what gets aired get way too much of a kick out of it. It’s essential in keeping the masses in check with the “White is Right” dogma that upholds society’s white supremacy mindset.
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what black man on this entire thread has said, they go to scrip clubs, where black women are degraded???
Here’s another derailment, they just keeping coming….
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Peanut:
There you go, making assumptions on top of derailing the topic at hand with things that have nothing to do with the subject matter.
Now you’re saying i seem mad at you?
Quote one sentence that i directed at you, that “seemed angry at you”
I’ll wait….
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“what black man on this entire thread has said, they go to scrip clubs, where black women are degraded???
Here’s another derailment, they just keeping coming….”
You took this as me being angry at you?
I had no idea, asking you to point out, the black men that made a statement about them going to strip bars, translates into anger towards you.
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“I am not gonna castigate other Black women for doing the same thing that Black men do.”
– – –
“What’s sauce for the gander is sauce for the goose” ( to put a bit of a twist on an old saying ).
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^ bhabah
I never heard that saying before fiamma, its the remix on an oldie lol.
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“I don’t think its that effective for black men to be like scandal is sick take it off air, whereas if black women said that it would be more effective as it is us they are targeting with that goofy show”
I did not say it should be taken off I just said it would be more effective IF black women wanted it taken off the air that black women speak out about it and not black men as they are not targeted with this show. I don’t support scandal, basketball wives, love and hip hop,etc. But that is my choice, I choose not to watch as I see the stereotypes, I can’t stop others from watching it, as we all have free will. I just want a balance, whites get shows that show them in a negative light, honey boo boo, jersey shore, teen mom, etc. BUt they have shows to balance it out, and people are around them all the time to know those stereotypes aren’t true.
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Mstoogood,
It’s a similar saying as to the more recognizable “what’s good for the goose (the female of the species) is good for the gander (the male of the species)”. Meaning that if Black men get a pass for dating out — and in greater numbers to boot –, then so should Black women. Or, conversely, if Black women are condemned for dating “out”, then Black — who date “out” in greater numbers — deserve condemnation also. In other words, “what’s sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander.”
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“never fails, a black man says anything remotely negative about a black woman on this blog ( as if black women are perfect ) that’s when you start seeing the, “black men treat black women like crap” chants.
Yet, a black woman like, “TrojanPam” can say anything and everything, regarding black women and white men and don’t come under any scrutiny in form of attacks from a few black women on this blog.”
SOndis I understand ur frustration, im not saying u angry just saying I understand the annoyance. this is why I think it is better to hear certain things from a woman to another woman, and from a man to another man. As if it comes from one gender to the other, I have seen both get defensive, I;m not just talking about on this blog but on others as well. When me and some other female commenters tried to correct a man on truthbetolds blog about his tone not just toward black women but the asleep black ppl as well, and he was attacking them and calling them trash and all kinds of names, it was ineffective. It was ineffective because we were women trying to call out a man, so he thought we were trying to attack him when all we were saying was don’t be calling them names as that is not going to get them to see the light but make them feel even more alienated. ANyway another male commenter Tyrone tried to correct him and I guess it worked for a little while but he eventually started doing it again and got banned. I want to hear both comments and criticism from both sides without either feeling they have to shut up. But at some point if one way isn’t working another way needs to be tried. I see communication between black men and black women is messed up, this is why I feel like we need to go back to the drawing board and see how to correct that. As I said yesterday I respect u and other awake males critics as I know its not coming from a place of hate.
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Ok Fiamma I see, lol. yes that is what I was saying, I get tired of the hypocrites that pat each other on the back for dating out or doing something yet diss the other that does the same. I think that is some of the sexism coming through, just like how men can sleep with a high number of women and not be disrespected and then think he deserves a dam near virgin woman lol. while a woman that kinda does the same is called all kinds of names and not deserving of love. BUt I do see that changing a bit at least for white women anyway, like snooki, kim, coco,etc.
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Mstoogood,
Is Snooki white? Her brown skin tone is darker than my own and she actually looks like (according to her skin tone, facial features, height and body type) an indigenous South American (AkA, “an Indian”). She’s gone on record as stating that she is actually a ‘Chilean’ who was adopted into an Italian American family.
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Nope. In fact I would say she is quite a power player in the whole situation.
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In fact from the season finale her father is the only one that appears more powerful than she.
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Name-calling and ad hominens (attacking the person rather than his argument) are sometimes used to manipulate others into conforming to a set a rules put in place by the person who does the attacking. The usage of terms such as “sellout”, “slave” and “Negro bed wench” are thinly veiled attempts to manipulate and control the behavior of others…to get them into line, so to speak, with threats of ostracism if they don’t follow suit.
I have seen commenters here and elsewhere who have stated their desire to “date out”, but who then go on to say that they would refrain from doing so because they fear being labeled a “sellout” by other Blacks.
I myself in the past have used the term “Uncle Tom” to describe any Black person who is so bold as to clearly state his beliefs in the superiority of whites over Blacks. My apologies but dating whites is NOT a clear statement of a belief white superiority, as it is not at all uncommon for people to date and mate with individuals whom they feel are beneath them.
If anyone truly feels it is wrong to date outside his race, then he personally should not date out of his race, while at the same time leaving it to others to decide for themselves, as it is a personal decision, as well as a judgment call, which he need to restrict to himself.
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@ fiamma
oh did not know that, without makeup she is lighter though. let me change it to say non black women that are loose get wifed up
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*ad hominems
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@Fiamma
This 100%.
I have noticed this too and this is not for black-and-white relationships, but when it comes to black love, it’s like a fight fest in there. I kid you not, each time I notice when a black male says something negative about a black female, another black man will come in correct/speak to the man about his negativity about black women and all of a sudden the rest of the group of men will chatise the mess outta the man for being a “Capt save hoe,” “Take your cape off”, “Moist” and etc. Until the man gives in or the group will silence him all together because they’re speaking the “truth”. Same can be said about females, but they are mostly obvious when they try to use the same tactic with words like “Thugs” “DL” “Self-hating”.
@All the commenters
I understand everyone’s frustration, no one is wrong when it comes to the shows like Scandal and etc., but we at least have to be realistic. All together none of these shows are good. A lot of times when black people go for the “Okie-dokie” they’ll mostly use these excuses(Even I’m guilty of this)
1.Lack of actors- Contrary to what the rest of the world believe, there is still a lack of black actors. The only time we see “black” actors if they’re mixed or have a demeaning role.(Token, Church goer, Jezebel, Thug, etc) We know the roles suck for black actors, so much so we’ll just go with it, because it’s “better than nothing”.
2.Acting skills-We like to use this when there is obvious stereotypes in the movie/sitcom role. “Well, I don’t see him/her as a….” “You have to ignore all that”. Yes, it is good to see if one of us is up there on screen, but let’s not b.s as to what is about. Acting skills/script won’t shield us from demeaning roles.
3.What about(Insert gender) that do it?-There is no contest, we all get it(Negativity) at the end of the day. We’re still black, nothings gonna change our representation.
Take these same excuses and apply them to every minority and gender and you’ll get the same results. Also like I said again, in my other comment, why is is that when a minority is in a interracial relationship it has to be white? Why not other minorities? Let’s be real, we’re quick to throw them a role in our movies with no complications, but with you, you have to sell your body/soul just to get the same decency.
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I don’t have any excuses. I just simply like the show. Other things are just a plus for me.
My issue is that people are taking issues with a show and are saying they never watched it. How can someone take issues with a show they never watched? At this point for me if I am white washed for enjoying it then so be it.
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But if others don’t like the show (whatever reasons they have) then more power to them. Nothing I am going to say will change their minds and I don’t aim to.
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I love Scandal. The show isn’t about black women. It’s about Olivia Pope.
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After seeing so many Black men online mention “Scandal” as if accusing every Black woman in the world of having a hand in its creation, I watched one episode of the show on Netflix. And, I agree, it’s not about Black women; it’s about the life and career of one woman, its creator, Olivia Pope.
So, if the show “Scandal” somehow manages to besmirch the reputation of all Black woman, even though it’s about only one Black woman, then so does the phrase “Negro bed wench”, regardless as to how few Black women are being targeted by its use. It’s no different than saying not all Black people are nggrs, so, if you happen to be Black, dont get upset if I make constant use of that word in your presence.
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This reminds me so much of a post Ic0n did a couple of years ago on her blog “Thoughts on Black Femininity”
In it–she was saying that some Black men (and some Black women) are a-okay with the everyday offensive images of Black women on BET, King, Smooth, XL and Black Men Magazine (always shows Black women bent over in the skimpiest of attire)
but the same ones who support such images of Black women will swear that Vogue and Elle magazine– that usually features Black women in classy, elegant and ladylike editorials– these Black women are too “skinny” and “dark” and are “white-identified” and use these Black women as an example of our inherent “inferiority” by saying things likes “Well the world just isn’t comfortable with Black women who look like that”–translation (the only acceptable interpretation of Black womanhood is those plastered on mainstream Black magazines aimed at men).
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@Sharina
No one is calling you white washed.
Me? I just don’t like the show, it may be good(Fantastic, even), but like I said before. I’m tired of the cliché. I just want something different for a change and I wrote those example’s on my post because I see this all the time when people defend stereotypical shows (Bad girls club, Love & Hip-hop, Anything Tyler Perry makes)It’s just…..why can’t anyone come up with something good for a black shows/character? Everything has to be a gimmick to make someone watch nowadays.(Ooooh a white guy,)
You may be right, people are not giving this show a chance JUST because it has a white character in it. You might even say that whenever there is a non-black character with a black woman, people jump up all the time and cry some sort of “conspiracy”.(lol) THAT I do agree on, I do get VERY annoyed that when a black woman is in a interracial relationship a lot of men/women(mostly men) will use the “what about the future of black children?” “They don’t love you.” or my fav “Your still a n@#$ in their eyes”. to make us “wake up”, but when it’s in reverse…….*crickets*. These played out shaming tactics I DO notice(Which are annoying)
Maybe I am overanalyzing and reading too much into the show, but it’s sometimes they always have sort of message in these type of films that makes me not want to watch. Like the one film with the interracial couple that was being attacked by that black cop(I forgot the name, but it had Samuel L Jackson in it)It’s just so frustrating, it’s so much load on my back sometimes, it’s just aggravating. I just wish they had shows like Girlfriends, that was like the only black show around 2000 and wasn’t 100 years old(Cosby,Goodtimes,) and had REAL relate-able black women in it. *Sigh* Why did the writers strike had to happen? 😦
I just wanna jump in a time machine sometimes and bask in the good old days. Fresh Prince, Living Color, Sister-sister,The Proud Family, Martin, etc. *tear* lol 90’s kid
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@Phoebephuelle
Oh I use to hate those magazines, I use to call them “Booty” magazine(lmao) because they always seem to use that as a ploy to make the men look in them….pervs lol (jk). Especially in the back, it would have the typical guy stuff(Like Abagond said) Booze, car hook ups, jewelry, “intimates” films/products. Still it was interesting, one in a awhile they did interviews with rappers and stuff. So sometimes it wasn’t bad, just always wondered why guys kept buying those mags. I was nosy lol
Funny, when I first discovered Bria I had WISHED so much that someone would spot her and put her in those fancy magazines to showcase her beauty instead of her booty. Sadly, you know those type of features she had would make those stuffy snooty nose snobs faint, lol.
I use to hate she would do those nasty XXL mags for men to gawk at her, but atleast I can say she atleasted showcased the beauty in black women.
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Honestly the 90’s and early 00’s was like the last-LAST “Hip hip hooray” for black love. After that, everything went downhill from there. Well thinking about it now, that’s when everything (Movies/Shows/Music) all together went down the same. Everything stinks now *Sigh* lol
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@ peanut
ok i’ll check it out
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@ Peanut
You have not offended me. I am just not answering as many comments as I would like.
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Peanut
well, i’m mistaken then sondis.
Alright then….
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@ Drosera
Thank you for understanding. It is not that I am saying people have called me whitewashed but that seems to be the mindset when you don’t see the white racist propaganda in certain shows.
“Like the one film with the interracial couple that was being attacked by that black cop(I forgot the name, but it had Samuel L Jackson in it)It’s just so frustrating, it’s so much load on my back sometimes, it’s just aggravating”—I know what you are talking about and for the record…hated that movie. It just made me angry after watching it.
So basicly you grew up on the tv shows I loved and adored. They don’t make them like they use to. My cousin mentioned something interesting to me a few months ago. She stated she read somewhere that networks use black tv shows to get ratings and recognition and later drops them and cancel them even though their ratings are not low. Refusing to pay the long time actors what they are worth.I will need to find out where she read that so I can get more detail on this.
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@ Drosera
yea the 90s were good, im a 90s baby as well lol. Its crazy the theme songs for shows back then are better than the mess on the radio now. Yes that movie lake view terrace, was goofy to me as well. The message I got from it was look at this bitter angry black man, getting mad that his wife was having an affair with white guy and now the neighbors are an interracial couple and he mad. It was a part in the movie where he was saying something about oh yall think u can take whatever u want. And would go to whatever lengths to keep them apart, they were trying to make the black man as racist. and paint the white guy as being the poor victim.
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If you ever want a little dose of truth, you might start with Wikipedia’s page titled: Interracial Marriage in the United States. I’ll just post a short quote from it if nobody minds.
“White wife/Black husband marriages show twice the divorce rate of White wife/White husband couples by the 10th year of marriage, whereas Black wife/White husband marriages are 44% less likely to end in divorce than White wife/White husband couples over the same period.”
First reaction, WOW!!!. Initial realization, is that a bm/ww marriage is 94% more likely to end in divorce than a wm/bw marriage. Hell of a thing, Makes one wonder. Of course, those are statistics I’m citing and I think we’ve pretty well established our commonly held belief on this blog, that statistics, especially those that don’t conform to our deeply held myths, really aren’t to be trusted. Lol. Sorry ladies just ribbing you a little.
But seriously, if you want to enhance your chances, especially if you’re a black woman, of having a long happy and loving marriage, with a member of the opposite sex, you might seriously consider dropping your hankie in front of a white boy and see if he picks it up. As a white male with a lot of experience at being a white male, I can attest to the fact that we are great and I highly recommend us. Okay, nite all.
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i love white people or Spanish people Haitian those people i love them i even go out with white guy sometime it kind an weird see us but i love him tho
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@All
And has anyone thought that Black love is a threat to White supremacy? I think so. That is why Black couples loving each other is not shown on TV because it breaks down the shackles of White supremacy. The purpose of White supremacy and the system was to divide Black people based on skin color and status and conquer them emotionally and psychologically.
Black love is basically Black people loving themselves and each other. That is why I love Black love. Nothing is wrong with interracial love either
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Has anyone ever thought that we should just get past looking at the color. Go for it if someone’s kind, good looking, honest and fun. If you do that it doesn’t matter a row of beans what other people think. Folks on this blog are just tying themselves in knots about race.
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Sharina-
1. Yes it is is a fact, according to the moral code of most educated, civilized human beings.I suppose we could all be relativists or racists, then we could attack that idea as subjective, but I’d rather have virtue on my side.
2. People who are opposed to interracial dating belong in Nazi Germany or 1940s Mississippi, not a free, multiracial society with a multiracial frame.
3. My character, like my intellect, is clearly of the highest caliber. When I mentioned my mother’s basement and penis size, I was mocking your shaming “man up” nonsense, not projecting. I’m glad to clarify that for you.
and how could you know if I was “projecting” without seeing my location or my penis size? Do you want to take a peak?
Let’s leave each other’s person out of these discussiosn ok? Do me that solid please. Let’s stick to the facts.
You can walk into any university, government building, and most churches in this country and 99% of the people inside would be horrified at the thought of prohibiting interracial relationships. That kind of thinking belongs in the 19th century.
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@asplund what does your gf think of you posting here do you discuss it with her?
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@Asplund
1. Please take the time to define on this board the definition of fact and opinion then reread what you said and realize how utterly ridiculous you sound. If you still hold on to this then you need to provide proof to solidify it as a fact.
2. I am glad you have that opinion. Your point is what?
3. “My character, like my intellect, is clearly of the highest caliber. When I mentioned my mother’s basement and penis size, I was mocking your shaming “man up” nonsense, not projecting. I’m glad to clarify that for you.”—That is great, but you clearly you do not know when you are projecting. Let me enlighten you on something. The mere fact that you are telling me what I think of you without even clearly knowing (joke or not) is a sign of projection. As for shaming…that is what you are doing. Shaming is an attempt to make someone feel less because they do not agree with what you do. Thus the constant throwing in how intelligent you think you are and how intelligent or civilized people agree with you. People do this in hopes that it will make the other party back down for fear or shame of being viewed as dumb or stupid. Not working here on me buddy.
“and how could you know if I was “projecting” without seeing my location or my penis size? Do you want to take a peak?”—You are clearly projecting because you are making statements in regards to things I did not bring or nor care about. I never mentioned your penis..you did. Inadequate much?
“Let’s stick to the facts.”—When can when you actually present some. So far it is opinions or more ramblings of your inadequacy. While laughter is good for the soul…this is clearly overkill.
“You can walk into any university, government building, and most churches in this country and 99% of the people inside would be horrified at the thought of prohibiting interracial relationships”—-You are now diving further into opinions and claiming them as fact. You will now have to provide proof to your 99% claim. How much do you want to bet that you will start deflecting and projecting?
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@ Asplund
And you can talk integrity when you actually get some. You have engaged in nothing more than bs debating tactics (if you can even call it that). You had nothing a long time ago and trying to pretend as if you did is sad.
Then you are in the act of continuously trying (way to hard I might add) to prove your manhood. Why? I don’t care what type of man you are because I don’t have to stoop to the level of accepting you for anything.
Again if you want to debate then debate, but if you make bs claims and can’t back it up I can promise you I will get in your azz all day everyday. Oh and I have asked for proof of said claims on the “My views on relationships between black women and white men” thread. You are so busy over here deflecting that you can’t even respond to what I said.
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I believe everyone deserve a chance to find love, but I just prefer black women not because of any sterotype or anything it is just what I am attracted too, I’m not shutting out other ethnicities but just my preferrence. We should all stop being shallow and get people a chance, you can’t tell if someone is right for you just by how they look, they could possibly be the one for you and you just too blind to see it because they probably have a flaw or something. We all have flaws no one is perfect. You can be picky and lonely for a long time and willing to experience and learn from the people you meet and give a chance. I believe we are all human beings doesn’t matter what color you are, you can date who ever you choose but don’t give up on people because you had a bad experience.
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@ Asplund
“Zero portions of my syllogism came from anyone’s opinion. I’m going off of universal ethical laws- laws acknowledged by the U.N. and U.S. Supreme Court.”—So then provide these laws that say people opposed to interracial marriages are bigots or some scientific research that proves this to be true. Put a link in here or something. You are trying to tie your opinion into a fact or legal matter. There is a difference here and it is almost sad that you don’t see it.
An opinion is defined as a belief or judgment that rests on grounds insufficient to produce complete certainty.
Your argument is about as logical as me saying Americans are bigots and that is a fact. Then trying to use an example of a few to prove it as a fact or in your case claim that “laws acknowledged by the U.N. and U.S. Supreme Court.”
Another thing you need to realize is acknowledging something does not make it a fact. You would have to go into the minds of all people against interracial marriages and prove their reasoning to be based on bigotry.
“You gotta deal with the substance I’m bringing. “—You are not bringing any. You have an ego that is not allowing you to see how flawed you are in your supposed reasoning is. Here are two claims you made and the two I am asking you to prove with links or something other than what you believe. If you can’t then you should not have made such a claim.
“You can walk into any university, government building, and most churches in this country and 99% of the people inside would be horrified at the thought of prohibiting interracial relationships”—Yours words. Prove it. As well as proof of your premise to be a fact.
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@Asplund
“Loving vs. Virginia, 1967. The U.S. Supreme Court ruled that laws forbidding interracial relationships violated the constitutional rights of Americans, because such laws discriminated on the basis of race. “—This does not prove your premise. Explain to me how a law about not being able to marriage due to basis of race has to do with people who are against interracial marriages are bigots. Show me a link or quote from the ruling that sayings your premise. Even still….a legal opinion is just that….an opinion (I know…I was so wrong for allowing you to believe you had even a slight of something). Had you been a better debater you would have though and not relied on a legal case to try and prove some elusive fact.
“Not really, as opposing interracial marriages is a form of discrimination, which is itself sufficient to determine that bigotry exists.”—Wrong again. Not all individuals against it actually stand in the way of it, so another epic fail here. One that once again breaks on your claim of People against interracial marriages are bigots, so it goes back to my point of you would never know if they are that if you can’t read minds or they decided to tell you.
“Sharina show me someone in public life who has come out and advocated against interracial marriages. How many can you find in mainstream society?”—This is not proof or a link to what you have claimed, but I will humor your dwindling attempt. I know quite a few and the reason being is because frankly they prefer their own and fee they will have stronger ties to their culture that way. Actually what several in here think.
“I found you an example. You refused to acknowledge it and tried to act like my including it was some out of the blue red herring, when in reality I was trying to demonstrate this very point.”—Demonstrations are still a matter of opinions. What you should have done was provided conclusive evidence to support it as a fact. Something you still have not done. None of those laws even remotely stated your premise as a fact
“The judge in Louisiana was denounced almost universally as a bigot, just like everyone else in the public eye who promotes discriminatory thinking,.”—Then you need to provide universal opinion of him. Survey or such that concludes that everyone in the world agreed with this. Good luck finding evidence to a supposed opinion.
“I’ve laid out a pretty solid case here. After all, there’s a reason anti-racist activists suffered to bring down racist laws.”—You laid out a failing case that is getting worse.
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@Sharina
Did you know that prior to the Civil Rights Movement, most biracial children in the United States came from Black women White male sexual illasions? It was mostly the White male who would go out and seek a Black woman to rape or sleep with. And many times these Black women had babies for these White men.
“Not really, as opposing interracial marriages is a form of discrimination, which is itself sufficient to determine that bigotry exists.”—
Who wrote this sentence? I am a Black woman I don’t believe any Black person should date or marry a White person. White people are our oppressors and enemies and there is no use to date or marry one. They will continue to mistreat and oppress us. How does that make me a bigot for thinking so?
Did you hear about his racist, Texas redneck say he would never date a Black woman even if she was Halle Berry? He said he would date any race of women but Black and he believed that Black people looked like gorillas and apes. He also didn’t believe Blacks and Whites should race mix either.
Honestly I am glad to hear the real reason why White American men don’t date us Black women. It is because MOST White American males are racist and look down on Black people. Besides I will never plan to or date a White American male anyways; Never. I love being a Black woman and don’t want to date any man who looks down on the Black race.
This man is just saying what most White American males think of us anyways. If we Black females date out, we should date other non White minority groups.
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@Adeen
Asplund made that comment in the comment policy, but I brought it here as to not go off topic in that thread.
He naively believes that anyone who is against interracial marriages is a bigot and thus has been trying (with fail) to prove this opinion of his is a fact.
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The likelihood of him coming here to address it as slim because I believe he went to comment policy so he would have less individuals witnessing his embarrassment.
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@Sharina
That sucks that he doesn’t want to debate with me on why I oppose Black women White male relationships as a Black woman living in this country. I would have given him my input on why Black females like me shouldn’t ever see White men as the ”Great White Hope”. As a Black woman, I refuse to see a White American man as a potential dating partner.
White American males aren’t any different from Black American males especially on their mindset about dating and marrying women; they just are of a different race and ethnicity, that is it.
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@Adeen
Oh he will attempt to debate it, but his debate will be on his opinion (which he claims to be fact).
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@Sharina
LOL That is his own opinion. My opinion is my opinion. As a Black woman, I don’t see why people think I am racist and a bigot for not wanting to be with a White male? I don’t find them attractive, most of them are racist and they look down on Black people. And my family is from the Caribbean and I can’t culturally relate to a White American male. Plus There is nothing for me to like about White American males except the sexy ones I see on TV or Hollyweird red carpet premieres on TV.
I would date Black, Latino and other Asian racial groups though.
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Adeen:
Keep on, keeping on….
Don’t let these white people or BLACK PEOPLE, shame you into feeling guilty for not wanting to date the white man.
(http://youtu.be/4rtNB_ORuw0)
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@ Sondis
I actually agree with that. No one should be shamed into liking something they don’t regardless of how they feel.
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@Sondis
Thanks for the encouragement. I am against all Black and White people mixing whether it be dating, sexing and marrying. Thus I will never consider dating, sexing or marrying a White male. And I believe Blacks and Whites dating and intermarrying is detrimental to the Black Community.
However I am not against any type of other interracial pairings besides White and Blacks. I don’t mind dating a Latino or Asian male but never a White guy.
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Hello, I’m an Spanish blogger, first of all I want to apologize for my poor English.
I really don’t know if most black women in the US don’t feel the desire to meet and marry white men. But there is a remarkable fact: black women – white men couple have half the divorce rate of white – white couples, and black – black couples are more likely to divorce than any other kind of couple. I suppose this means than black women are happier with white men.
In Spain black women from Cuba, Dominican Republic, Venezuela and Brazil are intensely desired for Spanish men (we don’t have some mental issues of bigotry in my country), and for other white men from the rest of Europe (British, German, Scandinavian, Romanian, Italian, Polish etc). That’s a fact. This women don’t need to search for black men in order to find happiness. That’s another fact.
Greetings from Europe to all of you!!
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I stumbled upon this page today and read through a lot of the threads, not all of them, but have some things to add that I hadn’t seen above. For the record I am a white male, married to a mixed white/native woman, 28, just a hair shy of my masters degree but working in an industrial plant because of our wonderful economy, and come from a working class rural family.
One thing I would say from my background is that there is no shortage of white men who would be interested in dating a black woman. I say dating because regardless of a woman’s race, we (I would suspect men of all races) generally go out looking for tail and a girlfriend when we are younger, and then as the relationship matures or alternatively, we do, marriage becomes something we are interested in later, particularly when we can actually afford it and are sick of the instability of being single. It gets hard to keep up a house by yourself when you get older and start putting in 55 hour weeks in a factory. One of the problems with approaching a black woman, before she even has the chance to say yes or no, is that black men in a shop or in a working class town, maybe related, maybe friends, maybe just bystanders with an opinion, often bitterly resist seeing this in front of them. I have known many white men like myself who after approaching a black woman and hitting on her a little at work, feeling out the situation as it were, who would be noticed by other black men working in the area and later be approached by them for a friendly chat about their views on interracial relationships. The short of it is that they find BM/WW to be just fine, but the reverse is somehow a horrible encroachment on their territory (whether they are even on good terms with the woman or not, ridiculous). They don’t really come with this alone, there are always a few friends to help with the implied or direct threat. This sometimes happens with a woman’s family too if you are talking outside of work, particularly the ones in their 20’s with brothers, cousins, whatnot. No one wants to fight those kind of odds, it just isn’t worth it. In truth you could go into a lot of Michigan’s cities and point to a street on the map where on one side you are fine to walk and on the other it would be pretty unsafe to go if you were not black or local.
I did not serve, but many of my friends did. This attitude seems to have at least some analog in the military as well where there is a lot of integration.
In contrast, and this I understand isn’t always the case, we GENERALLY don’t have those sort of barriers to BM/WW in our communities a few idiots not withstanding. Those with outdated attitudes usually just clam up and accept that the change has come, try to make the best of it, etc.
It’s not that white men don’t want to see what black women have to offer, far from it, but I think there must be some awareness that a lot of your men take what feels like a guard dog/property view towards the idea of a white man courting a black woman. I’m not saying it doesn’t happen the other way, but I sure don’t see it or hear of it very often. Again I’d also stress this is from a working class factory sort of viewpoint, maybe office families are different.
I could write more on this and I might, but this is enough for now. It’s early in the morning and hopefully I haven’t written anything in a way that confuses what I mean heh.
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Bill:
One of the problems with approaching a black woman, before she even has the chance to say yes or no, is that black men in a shop or in a working class town, maybe related, maybe friends, maybe just bystanders with an opinion, often bitterly resist seeing this in front of them. I have known many white men like myself who after approaching a black woman and hitting on her a little at work, feeling out the situation as it were, who would be noticed by other black men working in the area and later be approached by them for a friendly chat about their views on interracial relationships. The short of it is that they find BM/WW to be just fine, but the reverse is somehow a horrible encroachment on their territory (whether they are even on good terms with the woman or not, ridiculous). They don’t really come with this alone, there are always a few friends to help with the implied or direct threat. This sometimes happens with a woman’s family too if you are talking outside of work, particularly the ones in their 20′s with brothers, cousins, whatnot. No one wants to fight those kind of odds, it just isn’t worth it. In truth you could go into a lot of Michigan’s cities and point to a street on the map where on one side you are fine to walk and on the other it would be pretty unsafe to go if you were not black or local.
I would have to determine how genuine and deep your interest was if this put you off. Black men warn you off ‘whether they are even on good terms with the women or not’ – what is this, are black women ‘property’ now? Something that people can put dibs on whether they are genuinely interested or not?
These are not reasons why white men do not pursue black women, these are excuses and cr@p ones at that. I’m not saying that in isolation, these things cannot and do not happen, but from what you have shown above, this part of your comment bothers me
This sometimes happens with a woman’s family too if you are talking outside of work, particularly the ones in their 20′s with brothers, cousins, whatnot. No one wants to fight those kind of odds, it just isn’t worth it. In truth you could go into a lot of Michigan’s cities and point to a street on the map where on one side you are fine to walk and on the other it would be pretty unsafe to go if you were not black or local.
What it suggests to me is that access to black women is not entirely blocked by black men – it is your thought and attitutdes about black men that prevent you from pursuing or being successful in courting black women.
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something you gonna have to learn to deal with
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know what, i have been in a lot of short to long-term relationships, dating style, a little bit more even with several (read: many) black women, and it’s not really until this latest one, which has blown up in a flaming ball of gasoline, metaphorically speaking, that all the available options of opposition to the cause that may have been circling other ones in the past came to bear, jealousy of the neighborhood and some anti-white sentiment there and its spill over effect (as dudes were talkin to her and women were talkin to me), the pall of white behavior in the past, these last two were unbelievably enough, able to be discused between me and my ex-partner, and poverty, addiction, and many other issues, but i will still keep my preferences first in my mind, i will not turn tail and run away, and i will seek to improve myself and find an environment that is safe and happy for me and my next one, and know what, i’m not thirsty, i can wait and find someone better
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@V8Driver
You can date whoever you want to. If you prefer Black females, more power to you!
Honestly as a young, Black female, I have met more White men who liked Black females than Black males. When I dress up nicely, it is usually White or Latino males who want to approach me or wink at me. Black males usually reject me or say I am too dark and ugly for their tastes. They go for the light skin, mixed or non Black women. I usually get better reception from White men and other races of men yet I never went for them before.
Now I am sitting there in reject, reflecting on all my dating choices. All I ever wanted was a nice Black man to love me. I never saw him come ever. Whenever a non Black male came, I moved away from him. I was under the false illusion that a Black woman should wait for a Black man and that all White men were bad. But it is not the case.
I didn’t write this for any pity but to reflect on my dating choices and my actions as well. Thus I will open my options to other races of men.
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it’s a little wierd but i will say ‘she’s a little light-skinned for me’, you know, if she is
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@adeen i had been thinking about possibly dating a white or latina woman, maybe you’re right to not limit it, i had one light-skinned black girl i met off pof tell me she found that a potential problem with her that i would ‘limit myself’ to black women, but eh, i probably won’t change from that. at this point it’s a little bit more than skin color
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@v8driver
I see where you are coming from but you have your preferences. However I don’t think you are limiting yourself the way I limited my options to Black men for years. You just date Black women because it is your preference.
But these days, I am widening my options
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@adeen yeah i am somewhat experienced what is that skittles commercial say lol jk…
Ah well its nice to have some faith restored in humanity, just when i need it most.
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Ah gawd im goin home again well hope do spring eternal.
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Peanut:
@adeen,
i thought you only liked black men, what has brought this change so suddenly because unless i’m confusing you with someone else…
My 2 pence worth but from the posts that I have seen of Adeen in the past, she is very young. Not much older than my kid. To think in absolutes at that age is to be expected but it cannot and will not hold true for the way they think throughout their lives. It doesnt feel like that long ago I was of a ‘set’ mindset myself but, I had not experienced much of life either and all I had to draw on were my own experiences and what my peers were telling me. This is something that I see a lot in Adeens posts.
Young people these days have a world of opportunity open to them and, with travel readily available, they dont fortunately just have to read it in books, hear it from others or browse it online.
The key to real enlightenment is to broaden your horizons, be prepared to be wrong and keep a keen and open mind.
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“The key to real enlightenment is to broaden your horizons, be prepared to be wrong and keep a keen and open mind.”—-Very well said. Though I can attest to the fact that sometimes it is hard to accept being wrong. 🙂
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@ Peanut
I understand. It makes me think of how some people say “no one likes blacks.” It is one of those eye roll moments. Black women are still getting married to black men so that point becomes a bit moot.
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sharina:
Omnipresent said“The key to real enlightenment is to broaden your horizons, be prepared to be wrong and keep a keen and open mind.
Sharina said:”—-Very well said. Though I can attest to the fact that sometimes it is hard to accept being wrong
Same here lol :-). It is a common and frequent flaw in many of us but I guess the wise among us will always self reflect and try to figure things out – even if we dont give credit to where it is due. Sometimes we come to the same conclusion still but at other times, we take things on board and learn something new.
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“Why there are not many black women with white men in America: because most black women do not want to be with white men. ”
The main reason is much more simple: because there are less changes for black women to really meet white men (and wm meet bw). If they have lived their childhood in totally different areas with different schools, different churches, different places during their free time then clearly how could they easily can even think about such kind of relationship.
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Peanut: “White men are a much larger group than Black women. ”
Only in your American life but not globally. Probably less than 4% of all black people are African Americans. I have just checked the latest figures of population younger than 15 y old both in Africa and Europe and got these results (2014 mid year):
Africa: 455 million (over 360 million from Sub Saharan Africa)
Europe: 116 million (+ 40 million N-American “whites” + 30 million S-American whites)
Then there are also some 40 million blacks younger than 15 y old living in both American continents and in Europe.
Near in future we are living in a world where there are about 4-5 times more blacks than whites. This will change a lot of picture of interracial dating and marriage.
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I’m a (non-american) black woman and from my personal experience many white men are attracted to black women (more than they’d like to admit) but most white men (like +90%) do not view black women as serious potential mates because most of them are not brave enough to stand up against their judgemental, prejudicial peers.
Some white men may also think they don’t have a chance with you so they won’t approach you or will expect you to make the first move; and it doesn’t have anything to do with alleged shyness, it’s more about protecting their fragile egos because being rejected by a black woman (supposedly the bottom of the totem pole) would be the WORST thing that could possibly ever happen to them. Being rejected by non-black women is fine though.
Most white men are not comfortable with admitting their attraction to black women publicly and they will reject a black woman openly solely because society portrays black women as the least desirable (shallow much?).
As a result, when their close friends are not around and you’re unlucky enough to be there, they will express their repressed desires in the most astonishing ways:
-They will follow you and spank your butt or touch your boobs to show you they’re “interested”.
-They will feed you alcohol at parties so that they can get more easily into your pants.
-They will slam you against the wall and rip off your clothes when alone with you at other people’s place.
-They will invite you home even though you just met them 5 minutes ago at a professional meeting.
-They will attempt to kiss you and cuddle with you the first day you tutor them.
And then, they’ll barely acknowledge your existence in public and of course, they will be quick to tell the whole world about how they don’t find black women attractive.
*It’s worth noting that when those things happened, I wasn’t dressed like a slut or encouraged them to act in such a way; I was dressed sexy (not vulgar) for parties at best.
**It’s also worth noting that these white men were from both Europe and the US; they were ALL educated and some were even Phd students.
If you’re a black woman into white men you really need to be mentally prepared because you’ll come across a lot of bullsh*t.
The black men (that they LOVE to stereotype as brutes), asian men and hispanic men I’ve known NEVER treated me like that.
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@ Kiwi: Like I said in my earlier post, most white men won’t acknowledge black women’s existence in public because they’re not comfortable with admitting their attraction to black women publicly as they’re supposedly at the bottom.
I don’t think most of the white men that were attracted to me would have checked me out in the street. They just operate differently wiith black women because they see black before they see the women.
I can’t tell you anything about white men looking at Asian women because I usually don’t look at men checking out other women.
But from my personal experience, I can tell you some of them stared at me more than once when I consider myself to be average.
So it would make sense that some of these men at some point would have checked out a very attractive black woman.
I’m from Europe and the most attention I had from white men was when I lived in the US and yet, European white men are much more open-minded about dating black women in general.
Now, for white men’s attraction to asian women, once again it’s more about protecting their fragile egos. Asian women are closer to white in appearance (thus more socially acceptable) and they are stereotyped to LOVE them (unlike loyal black women) so it’s the best of both worlds in their mind.
Besides, asian women CAN produce light-skinned babies in a white supremacist society so how can it get any better than that when dating/marrying interracially?
I don’t want to be rude here, just honest.
The reason asian women are also their preference in interracial dating is because of asian women’s stereotypes.
White men go on about feminism and stereotypes as if all white women are like that. They aren’t though. They stereotype black women for stereotypes too as if that’s reality too, And it’s not.
They don’t actually KNOW other types of women and they’re usually afraid to or they won’t admit their attraction.
Asian women are the only women stereotyped as non-threatening to these insecure men.
The ideas that asian women are nicer, submissive and that asian men are unattractive make those white guys have more confidence with asian women, but less confidence with black women because they make them feel more insecure.
Indeed, white men often believe they are better than asian men but they can feel they won’t measure up to black men’s alleged sexual prowesses.
This is part of why MANY won’t go with white women that had sex with black guys in their past.
For the umpteenth time, it’s more about protecting their fragile egos than not being into black women. History (as slavery showed their true nature)says otherwise and my personal experience too.
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@ Kiwi: You’re welcome, I’m glad you got my point of view.
I’ll even go further as I also noticed that the two female pornstars Jenna Jameson and Tira Patrick made millions in the industry by refusing (openly) to sleep with black men. These women created their wealth out of white men’s insecurities and fragile egos.
And for the Asian men that had similar experiences to mine I must say I’m not surprised.
You see how white women go after and date black men openly? It’s because they (black men) are portrayed as attractive and manly.
However, most white women won’t advertise their attraction to Asian men if they happen to be attracted to them because Asian men (like black women) are supposed to be at the bottom in terms of attractiveness.
So they’ll ignore them because they are cowardly and don’t want to take the risk of being judged and mocked by their white peers.
They will save the appearances to the detriment of their own happiness – yes, white people are generally that shallow so I’m not surprised at all by these Asian men’s experiences.
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Kiwi,
“A factoid I like to point out to people who are fixated on white male racism is that white women are much less likely to date other races than white men, evidence that white women are more racist than white men. ”
How does that make them more racist? Dating someone of another race doesn’t mean you’re less racist, especially in the case of men since they already see themselves as superior to their wives/gf due to sexism. Adding race to the equation reinforces the power dynamic.
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@ Solesearch: You are right about the fact that dating interracially doesn’t a person less racist, especially after the Donald Sterling case.
Nonetheless, Kiwi is totally right about white women being more racist than white men.
Indeed, white women their sexuality and non-threatening stature as a powerful weapon to express their racism whilst pretending to be innocent of all evil acts.
Kiwi said: “sexism against white women by white men be damned.” and he’s right, once again.
White women never having to own up to their own racism,are fiercely protected by the very system that oppresses them.
Most people focus on white men as the epitome of “superiority” but we overlook the fact that white men were birthed, raised, groomed and taught by white women. Behind every racist white,man, lies the woman responsible for the man.
That’s why white women are perhaps more racist than any white man and it may also show in the fact that they are the least likely to date out.
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This is the last time Im posting here…only because the thread takes too long to come up because of too many comments…if I try to linc the thread up it takes too long, if I try to comment it tskes double long…it needs a new branch
Stereotype much , Deborah? One that stands out the most is that white men are attracted to Asian women because they are lighter, so , more acceptable in white society…? Really, this whole notion that a white man looks for a lighter poc , so they will sweep them into white society and be accepted is total hog wash…I dont care what notions you got from the Sterling case, that sob wasnt marrying or having kids with his poc girlfreind..
What in gods name makes you think when my bi racial son walks out the door , he is somehow more accepted in society, than if both his parents were poc?
What makes you think my interracial family gets some kind of pass in a white world? Since you are so keen on giving your anecdotal experiance , let me share with you , in my anecdotal experiance , there is no pass in white society, or poc society for my interracial family, only scrutiny from all sides, and clichêd stereotypes…so much so that we accept and take for granted that we are isolated
Kiwi, Ill answer your open thread comment to me here, since that thread doesnt come up in recent comments, but , I cant keep commenting here it takes too long…I never denied there are plenty of white men with screwed up attitudes towards Asians…its like comments from racist whites in Florida , in the Miami herald who hate Cubans…and Cubans are the best thing to hit Florida , yet these chumps have to write their racist crud…so what does it mean? There are some cowards who hide behind computor screens and vent bs…like its a hostile white mind feild for Cubans in Miami, when in reality, its a whole differant situation on the ground…Cubans have a huge daily vibrant space in Miami…and these racists can only sit in the correr and suk on it
Seriously , have you ever stopped to think about what the over all impresion of Asian Americam women on this blog is being depicted? If people read this blog and formulate an opinion of Asian American women from the impresions given, they are just going to think Asian American women are shallow, colorised, gold digging, self hating opportunists who despise Asian men
I dont beleive that for a minute…I can halfway understand your male frustration , tied into your dating situation, but , that the women on here let you get away with it , is mind boggling and speaks volumes to the shallow depth of much discusion on here about interacial relationships
The discusion of interacial relationships on this otherwise important blog about racism , is a disapointment
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Deborah,
“Most people focus on white men as the epitome of “superiority” but we overlook the fact that white men were birthed, raised, groomed and taught by white women. Behind every racist white,man, lies the woman responsible for the man.
That’s why white women are perhaps more racist than any white man and it may also show in the fact that they are the least likely to date out.”
White men were groomed, raised, and taught by white men, white women, and…black women. Behind every racist white man and woman is a racist society. Women aren’t responsible for men. Sexism always baffles me: Men have power, women have responsibilities.
None of this is evidence that white women are more racist than white men. It’s evidence that sexism affects how they wield racism.
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@Kiwi
That is the impression I often got from my Asian female friends. That marrying white was a status thing.
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It’s certainly worth considering.
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@Deborah,
I agree with MOST of what you have contributed from your first post onwards.
White men have ALWAYS been attracted to Black women and girls. I used to deny this, but looking at history, my own personal experiences and that of my Black women friends says otherwise. This is part of the reason why uncouth, unladylike white women can be hostile to attractive Black women in the workplace, school, and other places where daily social interactions take place.
But people will say that white men do not see Black women as desirable marriage partners because one of the least common of IR marriage pairings is that of BW/wm. We all know the answer as to why. MOST Black women PREFER Black men. Nothing more, nothing less.
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@ B. R.: Asian women are more socially acceptable not only because of their light skin, but because they are stereotyped to be attractive. Black men are more socially accepted and are seen as cool for the very same reason.
Being lighter gives Asian the “good” stereotypes such as being ultra-feminine and exotic so yes, they are way more likely to get a pass in the white world than ANY other women of color.
By the way, speaking of the Donald Sterling case, he told his half-black girlfriend: “You’re supposed to be a delicated WHITE woman or a delicate LATINA woman.” And that sentence alone speaks VOLUMES about white men looking for lighter women of color.
He obviously wasn’t trying to start a family with her but he didn’t even want to acknowledge her African ancestry so he overlooked her being half-black and he could do so because she’s light-skinned.
When your bi-racial son walks out the door, (white) society will NEVER treat him like a criminal, especially if he has visible European ancestry.
He will NEVER be followed while shopping at a store. He will be more trusted. He will be stereotyped as being smart and thus, he will even be granted the “honorary white” status.
Indeed, your son will be more accepted in society than any kid with visible African ancestry because of the stereotypes (assuming you’re white) your peers created and maintain.
And you cannot blame me for that feigning not to understand why Asians – stereotyped as the model minority – are more likely to get a pass in the white world.
People of color are far more accepting of white people than the opposite because of the “white is right” propaganda shoved down the world’s throat 365/24/7.
My white brother-in-law didn’t want to have anything to do with our half-black niece the first years of her life calling her a n*gress. He’s more accepting now. And I doubt it went that far with your family-in-law calling your son a cr*cker.
It would be way worse if one of you was black and you know it.
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Deborah (Im trying to deal with the delay of this thread)
Im curious why you would make a comment about what my son has experianced , when , in reality the exact oppisite happened…he has been followed by security various times in his life…and interestingly, in new york, shopping in an Asian store with his mother, he was hit with the scene from the Wayons movie about being followed and commanded to buy
My point about a mixed couple with a bi racial Asian white child would be, with so much talk about actual white racism against Asians, their child will be perecível as Asian and be subgected to these biases..When photos of celebrities are shown here and described as part white part Asian, I woudnt know the differance..it doesnt show up to me…that child will get discriminated against as Asian…its amazing people think bi racial kids with a white side get specialty treatment…they actualy get static from all sides..this is the reality
Again your anecdotal evidence about your brother in law , as looked on as a white point of view, did not happen in my family, who have never taken that attitude with my son…
There is so much steryotyping and anecdotal pegging people going on , its just boggling
Kiwi, I have no doubt you have seen certain things go down, and have seen your family up close, but, this blog has done a disservice to Asian American women…id at least like to hear your aunts version of their personal lives, since I feel I know them personaly from all your telling on them
I dont think you can make these huge generalising statements about Asian American women..there are too many to assume that that is the way they are…Asian women never gave off any extra signals of availability in my experiances in new york and chicago…
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BR:
Really, this whole notion that a white man looks for a lighter poc , so they will sweep them into white society and be accepted is total hog wash…I dont care what notions you got from the Sterling case, that sob wasnt marrying or having kids with his poc girlfreind..
I agree with BR a bit here. Of the inter racial couples that I have seen, there is not a large amount of them that are with lighter/fairer skinned poc. In fact, many are with medium to darker complected people. In other parts of the country this will probably vary. somewhere that has more mixed race people will probably have different percentages I guess.
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I think both B.R. and Deborah have a valid point.
On one hand the “model” minority stereotype DOES play a role in white men choosing Asian women as their WOC drug of choice, and it also explains why East Asian women are comfortable enough with thinking white men are dabomb.com. But notice, white men overwhelming choose East Asian women as opposed to the Browner ones from Cambodia, Laos, Thailand, etc…because having a baby with these women would most likely produce children who have a high tinge of brown and could not readily “pass” in white circles undetected.
But, B.R. has rightfully observed that there are white men that have Black wives who tend to be dark brown in complexion and many times have Natural hair. I think this is partly due to those white men resolving in their minds that they truly want what they would consider “authentic” as opposed to an Anglicized Black woman, much like white women almost NEVER marry lighter complexioned or biracial Black men.
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@ B. R.: Half-white/half-Asian kids may experience racism but it usually doesn’t compare to what half-white/half-black kids experience because of the complicated past and history of white people and black people in this country.
You’re saying my anecdotical experiences don’t reflect reality and don’t hold some truth? So why your experiences would be any more credible than mine then?
By the way, your son being followed a few times doesn’t negate the fact that in this society, being half-white/half-Asian (or half anything else for that matter) is still better than being half-white/half-black.
Am I the one who invented stereotypes about blacks and Asians setting whites as the norm? This is funny though, it reminds me of white people crying about reverse racism when race was their very idea.
You talk as if I was relying on my personal experiences alone to prove my point when it’s not true. You’re the one who do that just for the sake of discrediting my point.
Is it part of my anecdotical experience too if Asians are stereotyped as the model minority and are considered better than so-called lazy blacks?
Also, is it part of my personal experience if you look at Brazilian history, American history, Carribean history, sub-saharan African history and realize that white men wanting to get into the pants of black women was not a rare occurrence?
You try to discredit me based on my personal experience when they are only examples (and not arguments) to illustrate facts.
It’s time you start to give credit where it’s due.
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A white man who prefers black women will probably like dark skin the most, but white men who are insecure and racist would probably only go for light skinned black women if they had the guts to go for black women at all.
Of course, as a ls black woman, I find men of all colors attracted to me, so it’s all relative.
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phoebeprunelle:
But, B.R. has rightfully observed that there are white men that have Black wives who tend to be dark brown in complexion and many times have Natural hair. I think this is partly due to those white men resolving in their minds that they truly want what they would consider “authentic” as opposed to an Anglicized Black woman, much like white women almost NEVER marry lighter complexioned or biracial Black men
I should have made it clearer. This is the inter racial couples that I was talking about wm and bw.
Jess:
A white man who prefers black women will probably like dark skin the most, but white men who are insecure and racist would probably only go for light skinned black women if they had the guts to go for black women at all.
I dont know how right that comment is but I do wonder if those people that are not as comfortable dating out might go for someone who either is light/fair skinned or perhaps behaves in a way that is seen as not ‘typical’ of how black people act because they feel they can relate to them more. just thinking out loud really. Eiether way, it is a recipe for disaster.
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@ Omnipresent
yes, that is exactly what I mean. Usually white men that I meet that only goes for ls black women have a racist issue, think that only ls is attractive. A white man that actually likes black women or does not care would probably date a woman of any color but might prefer darker skin. Not necessarily but probably so.
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Jess
What is Is?
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@Omnipresent
LS short for light skinned
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My father was from Haiti (black) and my mom is from mexico (white) I am mix, They got married and lived in NYC and they used to get criticized by different races. this issue only affects and matters to people living in the states. Inow live in mexico and my boyfriend is mexican and he love my skin tone and I´m not LS, I’m like my father.
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hmm..This article as been dormant long enough…time to inject some life into it…
“NBW”!!! there…that should do it….. -_-
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Kiwi:
“How do you feel about the black-white interracial disparity? I am referring to the fact that far more black men are dating or marrying whites than black women are.”
I would question any statistics, that prove this to be true. The only reason why black women, accuse black men of sleeping with and marrying white women, than they are is because, black men are in the spot like more than black women.
I am speaking to Actors, athletes, hip hop and R&B artists ect.. Black men are front and center, so when they marry or date white women, its thrust into the spot light and the media has a field day.
I can only name a few famous black women that are married too, white men.
That’s not because black women, aren’t dating, marrying them. Its because black women are not in the spot light as much as black men. Its the normal black women that are not famous, that are dating, marrying white men.
That is why it seems that black men are dating, marrying white women, more than black women are marrying/ dating white men.
I have been on a interracial dating site before and i saw 100’s and 1000’s of black women, looking for and only white men.
So i don’t trust stats, only my own eyes and evidence i can see for myself.
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Yeah, I’m aware if the Asian female to white men, disparity. Asian men have it worse than any other man.
At least you have the , model minority status, that gives you a white pass, whereas black men do not.
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^
that pass doesn’t seem to extend to include dating and marrying white women. Obviously, they are still not seen as “white”.
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@B.R.
*shocked face*
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That model minority status thing isn’t really for getting a white pass. It’s for being an obedient servant in a system and guess who wants to remain head of the system?
At least that’s my take on model minority status. It’s also a finger wag at all other non-whites: “Be like these Asians, you scallywags!!!!”
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Legion:
“That model minority status thing isn’t really for getting a white pass. It’s for being an obedient servant in a system and guess who wants to remain head of the system?
At least that’s my take on model minority status. It’s also a finger wag at all other non-whites: “Be like these Asians, you scallywags!!!!”
I agree…
Asians are seen as passive, when it comes to fighting against oppression from white people.
Blacks on the other hand, are the poster children for civil rights.
We are outspoken and constantly fighting white people at every turn.
This is why we are despised by whites, more than any other minority group, being we always are applying resistance to further our goal for equality and extermination of white supremacy why white people.
Other minority races are just now getting up to speed to our level of activism, after piggy backing on the struggle of blacks for so long.
I didn’t see any Asians, Latinos, Indians being bitten by dogs, hosed down with water, being beat up and killed by police in those news clips from the 60’s civil rights movement.
I am not saying other minority races haven’t suffered at the hands of white people but it needs to be said and acknowledged that black people have been at the forefront of civil rights and have paid the price as a result, more than any other minority group.
Our position in society in 2014 is at the bottom for a reasons, pointed out above.
The Asian race is 2nd to that of whites for reasons, pointed out above.
The race that resists white supremacy the least, fairs better than the race that resists white supremacy the most! See how that works?
Time waits for no man….
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@ Sondis
I’d say that it’s also a matter of maximum phenotypical dissimilarity. Whites and Blacks are on the opposite ends of the scales of human variation, and so in order to create preference for the White look, it is necessary to create the opposite of preference for the Black look.
If thin noses are beautiful then broad noses must be ugly.
If straight light-colored hair is beautiful then dark curly hair must be ugly.
If thin lips are beautiful then full lips must be ugly.
If pale skin is beautiful then dark skin must be ugly.
You can’t have one without the other. Blacks are the Yin to the White Yang. So although I totally agree with you and Legion, I also strongly suspect that even in the absence of behavior, Whites would have still despised Blacks. In their quest to be superior, logic demanded it. Then the other races could be vaulted based on how many traits they who with White people. Light skin and straight hair goes a long way to making you a more valued subordinate.
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^ “based on how many traits they who with White people”
(correction
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King:
“^ “based on how many traits they who with White people”
(correction”
lol @ the correction needs a correction. ^_^
Did you mean, “based on how many traits they HAVE with White people”?
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I didn’t see any Asians, Latinos, Indians being bitten by dogs, hosed down with water, being beat up and killed by police in those news clips from the 60′s civil rights movement.
Sondis, I totally get your broader point, it isn’t lost on me. As a side note though, I always wonder about the media images of the 60’s. They are largely a construction by a corporate media, serving power interests that are contrary to much of the public. It’s useful, for propaganda purposes, to depict blacks as isolated in their struggles. It came as a surprise to me that some Black Panthers were Asian American. (referring to an individual that Abagond was potentially going to do a post on for Asian-Pacific American Heritage month)
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Last point:
It’s important to talk to elders who were around during the 60’s. What has come down from the media just can’t be trusted. Trusting the media on the 60’s is like watching Hollywood films for accurate and respectful portrayls of non-whites or things non-American.
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Sondis,
I know that I responded to you before in the past, and you found it too difficult to acknowledge or believe or accept, but Asians, Latinos and American Indians have fought very hard for civil rights also, in some cases (e.g., court challenges), even pioneering certain civil rights battle methods decades ahead of blacks. The African-American civil rights movement also took cues from both domestic civil rights movements made by other groups, as well as groups overseas. The black civil rights movement did not arise out of thin air.
Of course, all have directly or indirectly benefited from the 1950s-1960s black civil rights movement (the Civil Rights act, FHA, etc.), but to say it was only blacks fighting for civil rights, whether peacefully or violently, and other groups only piggybacked on blacks, blots out many parts of the picture of US history. Selectively believing that is not much different from whites selectively believing the bootstrap myth or the alien invasion scares.
As Legion mentioned, the Model Minority status is not about getting a white pass. Not at all. It’s about getting tidbits and crumbs by obeying a system set up by the people on top.
Asians historically have not been as passive as you imagine, but have fought very determinedly for their own civil rights, some of which has benefited other Americans including blacks. But admittedly, the Model Minority stereotype has been internalized by many of them so that they actually believe it. This is especially true of the children of Brain drain immigrants who grew up post-Model Minority and post- Vincent Chin.
In the summer of 1941, Japanese-Americans were watching their kids play baseball, decorating their homes, enjoying 4th of July picnics in their communities, etc. A year later 120,000 were imprisoned behind barbed wire. It can turn on a dime. Believing in the Model Minority myth is something modern day people do at their own peril.
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King
Agreed
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Legion:
Sondis, I totally get your broader point, it isn’t lost on me. As a side note though, I always wonder about the media images of the 60′s. They are largely a construction by a corporate media, serving power interests that are contrary to much of the public. It’s useful, for propaganda purposes, to depict blacks as isolated in their struggles. It came as a surprise to me that some Black Panthers were Asian American. (referring to an individual that Abagond was potentially going to do a post on for Asian-Pacific American Heritage month)
Sorry Legion, i am not giving a pass to Asian Americans in this regard. If Asian Americans wanted to visible in the civil rights movement and therefore, align themselves with the plight of African Americans, they could have by marching along side blacks.
The fact is that Asian Americans choose to not have common cause with the black struggle in an attempt to not challenge white supremacy, so they went along to get along and since then, have been reaping the benefits for their compliance and obedience by not questioning or challenging white supremacy.
I would go as far to say that even now, in 2014 i don’t see much in the way of any kind of push from the Asian American community to fight white supremacy.
Asians like their place they have been put in by white people, what reason they have to change or challenge it?
It only cost them their culture and souls……
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@Legion,
The NAACP was set up in 1909. They first starting using the courts to enforce their civil rights in the 1910s, which did not gain full steam until 1930s-1950s. Asian-Americans were already very active using the courts to enforce civil rights since the 1870s.
One reason for this was perhaps that they had been barred from citizenship and from voting. During reconstruction, newly freed slaves thought they suddenly had civil rights. Then they got drawn into passivity by people like Booker T. But obviously, by the 1890s, they had been largely eroded away. It wasn’t until the NAACP got active that civil rights battles specifically for blacks took a leap forward.
Of course, some of those court case victories benefited other people besides blacks (e.g., overturning racial restrictive covenants).
As Abagond pointed out, the 1950s- early 1960s was made lily white by design. All non-black non-white groups had been largely marginalized by that time.
Selectively remembering only civil rights action by blacks makes one believe certain things. Loving v. Virginia (1967) was the Supreme court case that invalidated anti-miscegenation laws, but Naim v. Naim (1955) ruled that Virginia could annul the marriage between a Chinese-American man and a white woman. Brown v. Board was not the first case that overturned school segregation or laws that denied education to school age children. We can find cases all the way back to Tape v. Hurley (1885). Lum v. Rice (1927) was one that failed.
The Immigration and Naturalization act of 1965 was easily as big a civil rights victory as the Civil Rights act of 1964 — WHO were the ones fighting for that? Was it blacks?
Asian American activism seems to have turned a bit more passive in the past 20-25 years (after the resurgence in the mid-late 1980s in the Model Minority stereotype), but we still see signs of civil rights activism. One can even note the Hapa Activism fights for the right to choose one’s racial identity in 2000.
And fighting for Mexican-American studies, the use of various languages, or immigration reform is also about civil rights. Just because not many blacks are fighting for certain civil rights doesn’t mean that there are not people fighting for them.
And even LBGT legal battles is about civil rights.
We shouldn’t only be calling certain things as fights for civil rights, and ignore others. Every treaty that each Native American tribe signed was for their “rights” as well as the violent and bloody skirmishes or “wars” that they sometimes led to. Nat turner’s rebellion or even back to Bacon’s rebellion was about fighting for civil rights.
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i’m never gonna stop dating black women, and i’m proud i have half a clue that it can be a mutual respect
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@ Sondis
Sorry Legion, i am not giving a pass to Asian Americans in this regard.
I’ll keep it brief since we are veering off topic.
You are right they don’t deserve a pass, as a group, in going along with the race structure in America. But I was not encouraging you to give them such a pass. What I was more trying to convey was that we (universal we) need to have a care that we don’t accept propaganda hook, line and sinker. We need to be aware of those struggles and those allies that were once known but have since been covered over and forgotten. Jefe made some good points above about this. It pleases an enemy if his opponent believes he has less resources and support than is actually the case.
What I’m saying is a bit of a parallel to not allowing the popular propaganda to reduce MLK to just the few soundbites of the speech where he says, “I have a dream”. Our “memories” of the past are not wholly our own, we need to be cautious of that and take proper corrective measures against that manipulation.
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sondis
Asians are seen as passive, when it comes to fighting against oppression from white people.
Nope. Asians are seen as rational. Ready to apply themselves to the task of not only measuring up, but of out-performing whites in many ways.
There are so many Asian high school students with top grades and top SAT scores that every Ivy League university could fill its entire freshmen class with just Asians. However, for the sake of “diversity”, schools admit some kids because they’re white, black, brown, whatever.
Blacks on the other hand, are the poster children for civil rights.
We are outspoken and constantly fighting white people at every turn.
Right. Not outperforming in school. Just fighting. That’s why the Ivy League schools add 200 bonus points to the SAT scores of black applicants.
This is why we are despised by whites, more than any other minority group, being we always are applying resistance to further our goal for equality and extermination of white supremacy why white people.
Yeah. Sure. The kind of “equality” you seem to favor is the kind that would mandate a required percentage of white players on NBA teams. To be fair — in your terms — the figure would have to be at least 50 percent.
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@ B.R.
Deleted a comment of yours fir moderated language.
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King wrote:
“I’d say that it’s also a matter of maximum phenotypical dissimilarity. Whites and Blacks are on the opposite ends of the scales of human variation, and so in order to create preference for the White look, it is necessary to create the opposite of preference for the Black look.”
_ _ _
Excellent.
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hmm..This article as been dormant long enough…time to inject some life into it…
Sondis you rascal!
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Herneith:
Sondis you rascal!
* snickers like Muttley from the Hanna-Barbera cartoons. ^_^
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Peanut
hey sondis
if I got pregnant by a white man would you think of me as a sellout?
Well, considering what you know about white men and how they, truly feel about black women.
Also the fact that you’re no longer brainwashed and deprogrammed yourself from the white supremacist mindset that you have had all you life, along with every other black person in America.
Yes, i would call you a sell out if you had a baby by a white man. There’s no turning back, once the truth has been revealed. if you still date a white man, knowing what you know about them, you’d be doing it out of blatant ignorance.
To some black women, who date white men, ignorance is bliss…. *_*.
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Peanut,
did you know that african immigrants out graduate asians and white? http://www.examiner.com/article/african-immigrants-out-graduate-american-caucasians-and-asians
If you were to read the article with some understanding, you would realize the writer is a person, who, to be kind, is not too bright.
Only someone with zero grasp of basic logic and zero grasp of basic statistics would believe the article is anything but a non-sequitur.
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Peanut:
“so you wouldn’t be friends with me just because i had a child with a white man?” I never said such a thing. I would just call it as i see it, being friends is neither here, nor there.
“what if it just happened by accident?”
Pfft…accident my ass…. -_-
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Sondis has been duped by the Model Minority Stereotype, doing exactly what whites wanted when they invented the stereotype in the first place. Sad.
Asians don’t get a pass. But as Kiwi pointed out above, whites have been teaching Asian-Americans that blacks don’t get a pass. It seems that the only ones getting a pass are whites for all the evil that was done. Sad.
I have some more to say, but I will put it on the other thread as this is veering off topic.
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Yes , Abagond , you were correct at deleting my comment that expresses my total disgust at anti interracial drek directed at white men in relationships with black women…
Because I have nothing but expletive derivatives towards this crap that tries to pass as some warped dogmad rhetorical political agenda…that can kiss my rear end
It would be my absolute pleasure to get in the face , in real life , of the sobs plying this drek , and really tell them exactly how I feel
Gtf out of peoples personal sex life desicians ….its nobodies business but the two consenting adults….take the political agenda and put it where it could be of use…at least get it out of your rear ends , its blocking your thought transmisions
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peanut
how’s that for non-sequitur, chum?
Okay. I’ll explain it to you. The claim made in the article is equivalent to stating that black basketball players in the NBA are better basketball players than 99.9 percent of ALL white basketball players born in the US.
Obviously you don’t understand how the data was parsed to create the outcome the foolish writer wanted.
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@ peanut
Whether I thought of you as a sellout would depend in your motives.
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absolutly catagoricly not, Peanut , you would not be a sell out…its your personal desician and nobody elses business
there are people of all “races” who want to make other people uncomfortable about their personal dating and sex choices..they think if they say it loud enough and long enough, it will make someone get nervous about it…
its all a joke to me..me being white , i am suposed to be in the group that doesnt hook up statisticly with black women…
like because of that statistic that could affect my chances to hook up with a black woman..
what a crock..i never would have a problem hooking up with a black woman (im not saying every black woman , im just saying being able to hook up), first because i can convey the respect i have , right up front…and how i would be concerned for what she has to go through in this world..and that she would have my emotional support about facing it
you dont get the person you want to hook up with by looking at statistics
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1st off. copy and paste the link to a post, where i said ONLY black women are sell outs, not black men in the scenarios above. if you can do that, i would close my account on abagond’s blog and move over to Trojan pam’s or blackamericaweb’s blog.
2nd You’re the same person that was saying how you don’t trust white men and how they’re two faced and racist, towards black women and men.
Going as far as to say you’d never be in a relationship with a white man.
Now you’re flipp’n the script and doing a 180 on the whole, interracial dating issue.
Had you said this at the very beginning, i wouldn’t have came to the conclusion that you’d come off as a certified sell out.
I have spoken on and about, black women and BLACK MEN, being sell outs to their own race. I mean sell out in every sense of the word and not just solely a black person, that dates or have a child with a white person.
You’re very good at putting words in my mouth, peanut. you really need to stop doing that.
I also noticed, whenever a black man speaks about a black woman, why does he always have to mention a black man in the same sentence and breathe, without black women getting so offended, then quickly followed up with, “black men do it too” or what about black men?” and last but not limited too, “it’s not fair for you to hold black women to this standard”
For a lot of black women on this blog, if a black man omits other black men, when speaking on and about black women, means ONLY black women fit the pathology, doesn’t matter that the speaker is talking about black women.
Longs you throw in black men at the same time, black women will be put at ease.
Yet, I’ve read many comments from black women on several posts on abagond’s blog and when they are speaking on black men’s pathologies, there is NEVER a mention of black women. Not one black man, complains by saying, “it is not fair for you to hold black men to this standard”.
Peanut, i really don’t bother talking to you as much as i used to anymore, because you always seem to veer on the topic of black men and their pathologies, despite the topic not being about black men, SUCH AS THIS ONE!
You constantly whine about black men all the time. You come across as seemly trying to bring up black men in every single article. its way too obvious. if you don’t like black men, date another race and be done with it.
I for one am tired of your whining about black men, every chance you get on abagond’s blog. The topic could be about little black girls, selling girl scout cookies and you’d find some way to bring up black men in a negative light.
You’re defensive, when there’s nothing to be defensive about! stop drinking the feminist kool aid and calm down!
You’re the one, that asked for my opinion. I answer you by giving an honest opinion and in response, you get defensive and accuse me of only applying my assessment to black women, which i have not done.
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Peanut:
Fair enough…. apology accepted. ^_^
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It seems some arguments are worth having
“Per perturbatio adveho verum.”
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Kiwi:
How do Asian men cope with this issue of their women, not wanting them?
Does this result in lots of Asian men, becoming homosexuals?
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*whee*
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it’s really interesting to have been here for a while and to see a group dynamic
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i follow kola boof and read everything fb lets me see
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hi peanut
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i go on these black woman white man groups/lists/whatever on fb eh… sick of pof i got a few on deck and aint no type of thirsty
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still, in spite of all that, know what i mean
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🙂
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ok, i need about $3500 in the next 5 weeks or im pretty much goin to jail but other than that!!!
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workin out that dbr thing you know nothing new so much 🙂
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I hate how ppl apply their preconceived reasons for why a man or woman of one race would date someone belonging to another race. Just give them the benefit of the doubt! Everyone doesn’t hate themselves or have some creepy “fetish” just because they are attracted to a person. Framing the conversation of IR relationships like this makes it seem as if it is so unnatural, that there must be some strange reason why someone would love someone of another race.
There is nothing wrong with relationships between people of different races. We are all free or should at least be working towards our freedom.
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Peanut, there are some posters here who are married to White guys. I can’t see how your reputation is ruined. Abagond said it best… it’s all about the motivation. If you love somebody of any other race, that’s cool. I think the objections only come if you see it as some kind of social stepping stone (which you don’t seem to).
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Obviously you don’t understand how the data was parsed to create the outcome the foolish writer wanted.
What’s this got to do with the topic? If you want to hook up with a black woman just say so! Are you related to no_slappz?
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Peanut, of course you respect black men , and, would love to date a good black man…you have never implied anything differant
what ever choice you make in dating is the right one for you
of course you can e mail me
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Peanut, if I may.
I don’t think interracial equals sellout but the reason one would enter that type of relationship would. I’ll never generalize BW because they’re far too big of a group to do so and I’ve had the privilege of having them support me throughout my life and as such, respect will always be given. Therefore, and I think I speak for a lot of BM on this, its extremely discouraging to go online and see these BW interracialists & feminists bash BM for sport as if we created white supremacy and all the issues that ensued from it. We’re the prime targets of white supremacy since men typically lead & if BM ever got right subsequently our entire communities would.
You linked to the study yourself which showed that African Immigrants are the most highly educated group of people in America and heads up, the numbers are very similar in the UK & Canada as well. That’s 3 nations that all practice their own particular brand of white supremacy where the African still comes out on top. Don’t think white supremacy doesn’t notice this, they know what the African truly is and thus they try to keep the numbers of them limited and the African Americans who are too far removed from their original culture stuck in a rut.
When BW ignore all of this just to holler online that WM are better than us, they come across as divorced from reality & self hating. They’ll talk about the way white supremacy affects BW (Euro-centric beauty standards, stereotypes about attitude & being promiscuous etc) But then in the same breath treat all the ways that white supremacy affects BM (employment discrimination, black boys being pushed out of the public school system) as if its our fault or like it doesn’t exist at all & we’re jus making excuses.
And all of this, just to say you want to date a white man? Just go ahead & do it, its 2014, there are interracial pairings of all kinds in most major cities & no one minus a loud minority are going to give you any kind of flack. Just please don’t act as if that higher quality of living said WM can give you is any proof of them being better than us. It isn’t, its simply proof of them being the biggest beneficiary of white supremacy which now filters down to you. BW blaming BM for the problems of the black community is like blaming someone who was born in the Matrix for the existence of it.
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@Peanut
I am talking about when it comes to judging other people for their relationship decisions, especially when there is no proof of them doing so for ill motivations. Though, I do understand all the complexities of entering an IR relationship. For example, I am hesitant to enter one because I am afraid of having me a lil baby Rafael Trujillo. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rafael_Trujillo
Imagine how horrible it would be to have a child who runs away from their connection to blackness and hates/looks down upon their African ancestry. Even worse, imagine having white grandchildren who care nothing of fighting for racial equality! That scares me and it is really unfortunate bc the pool of black women that I find “dateable” is honestly quite small.
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Does this result in lots of Asian men, becoming homosexuals?
Jesus Sondis! Only prison fuks with men’s minds that much.
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@ peanut
I still like you. I do not think I ever said black women who date or marry out are sellouts. My thing is that sometimes people get into those things for the wrong reasons, like the BWE sorts.
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If a black person enters a IR relationship/marriage and hates other black people, just remember, that biracial child will pick up on anti-blackness/self-hatred of the black parent. Don’t be surprised if that child wants nothing to do with black people.
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@ Herneith
I do not think sb is a past troll. Never have I had a commenter this painfully and smugly ignorant.
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“Jesus Sondis!”
_ _ _
Nahh.
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A:
“When BW ignore all of this just to holler online that WM are better than us, they come across as divorced from reality & self hating. They’ll talk about the way white supremacy affects BW (Euro-centric beauty standards, stereotypes about attitude & being promiscuous etc) But then in the same breath treat all the ways that white supremacy affects BM (employment discrimination, black boys being pushed out of the public school system) as if its our fault or like it doesn’t exist at all & we’re jus making excuses.”
“And all of this, just to say you want to date a white man? Just go ahead & do it, its 2014, there are interracial pairings of all kinds in most major cities & no one minus a loud minority are going to give you any kind of flack. Just please don’t act as if that higher quality of living said WM can give you is any proof of them being better than us. It isn’t, its simply proof of them being the biggest beneficiary of white supremacy which now filters down to you. BW blaming BM for the problems of the black community is like blaming someone who was born in the Matrix for the existence of it.”
This is very profound and true in every sense.
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Yes. The prison system fosters what is referred to as “situational homosexuality”. Most previously heterosexual individuals, though, are said to return to their given orientation after leaving prison. Some, of course, do go forward as homosexuals from that point on — this supposedly applies mostly to repeat offenders.
Unimprisoned, heterosexual Asian American men are generally free to pursue romantic alliances with non-Asian woman if they wish.
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Unimprisoned, heterosexual Asian American men are generally free to pursue romantic alliances with non-Asian woman if they wish.
Gee Pif, I know you keep it on the straight and narrow with your comments but that’s gotta be the least rousing endorsement of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness that I’ve ever heard.
(I still dig you though. 🙂 )
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Hey, wait a minute!! Whatchu ‘talking’ ’bout Willis??? Why would you assume that a White man can automatically provide a higher quality of living??
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^ Actually it depends.
If the black (Asian) hates other blacks (Asians), but his (her) in-laws hates the black (Asian) person and is ashamed of the biracial children, it could get a lot more complicated.
If the biracial child wants (at least in the beginning) nothing to do with blacks (Asians), but his non-black (non-Asian) grandparents and relatives want nothing to do with the child, how do you perceive the result?
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Peanut , people who incert political agendas as to who you should and shouldnt date , have the dry brittle crackle of someone who sounds like they need to get laid….
Why dont you pick an activity you can do in a black neighborhood…like a dance class
Or follow some black jazz musicians at a club…go up to the sax player , and tell him his solo was extremly meaningful to you that set , and how it touched you , he will probably say something like ” you should have seen my solo on the first set, it was better…” ..but he will be eating out of your hand
Or better , say it to the trombone player , but dont be daunted if he has a pizza delivery sign on his car , bone players dont get as much work , but they will be more loyal than sax players , who are the stars…
Or go see a live funk band and talk to the bass player on the break…they are the real engine in a funk band but stay in the background…any of these black musicians would love attention from a black woman…
Gees , I am just amazed at the shaft Asian women are given on this blog…they are stereotyped more than any other group on this whole blog , with amazingly no one to come in to defend them from the obvious pegging them as one way
Thanks to this bamboozling , ive perked up much more to how interesting Asian women really are….to get this kind of shaft on here, must mean they have something on the ball…for sure it seems they can see through two dolts
Gosh , the last people I would listen to for dating advice are a bunch of horny politicly agendised cyber blips …..boring
Most women arnt deciding to hook up with white men for financial security and acceptance in some kind of inner white circle…first off , that so called inner white circle is a crock, in reality , an interracial couple whomhave a family , are stepping into their own world , where they stand as much chance of exclusions and regections and being stigmatised in all worlds, than being accepted
Most women are looking for a man that can just show genuine interest in them and who can see them for who they are
Im glad people qualified this thing about bi racial children and how they feel about their non white roots (once again, Im not making the white half the issue here, Im just answering the people who are) , my bi racial son is more in touch with his Afro diasporic cultural roots than the so called self identified Afro descendant cyber blips on this blog….
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@Kiwi
I don’t know many Asians but I do constantly hear about Asian women and their high level of interracial marriage/relationships with WM. You stated that many Asian women bash Asian men on their way out, just curious, what are the reasons they typically give if any?
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I hear you Peanut, but actions speak louder than words. For the last 40 years there’s been an absolute jihad against BM in the form of novels, talk shows, television shows, movies, blogs & videos of BW bashing BM under the guise of “entertainment” Many of those BM who grew up hearing nothing but they were no good n*ggas their entire life based on nothing other than stereotypes & myths retreated to the internet & made blogs & youtube channels expressing their hate in response.
They, just as the BW that came before them were wrong but theirs a huge difference between an attack & a response, (think back to the analogy I made about the Matrix in my 1st comment) It’s like the moment white supremacist media gave them a microphone every BW offered the chance gladly took the opportunity to dish dirt on us. Notice that when there’s a talk show or tv special where the topic is black relationships you only have BW, WW & WM speaking about it?
Don’t you find it a bit odd that one half of the subject, BM, are never invited into the discussion at all and that whites who by definition have no place in black relationships would be? It would only make sense that we would have a presence but we don’t. It’s just a group of BW piling on BM until the show is over. That’s because the discussion was never meant to be one, it was only meant to be a propaganda hit piece against BM.
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@ King
Lol I just meant on average. Due to the unfair head start and ensuing privileges given to them, generally speaking the white mans ice is always colder.
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@ Kiwi
Still looking for more education so bear with me. Are these women Southeast, East Asian or a good mix of both? I ask because all of the Asians I grew up with and in my area are SE Asian and I’ve never, I mean ever seen one with a white man. Due to the income and education disparity between E Asians & SE Asians many SE Asians live alongside equally poor blacks & Hispanics so on the off chance you see an Asian women with a non-Asian man he’s one of those races, not white.
Again I speak carefully as not to stereotype because I can only speak based on my limited experience but the feeling I always got was that they were like one big family, but unlike the reason you’ve given where Asian women have said Asian men are like their brothers, the SE Asians seem to mean it more in a “I’ve got your back” sense and continually support one another. Do you think the difference could ultimately be the difference in culture based on the differing regions of Asia they come from?
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Kiwi,
This isn’t true. Most Asian females date Asian guys. However, there are lots who only date white guys for the bogus reasons you listed. Here are all the reasons they date out:
asianmancure .com/asian_female_white_male_couples_understanding_the_pairing.php
Racist media is part of the problem for Asian men, but many are also their own worst enemy. Asian men need to improve themselves and go from there.
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Kiwi, why are you over complicating this whole, Asian women, white men thing?
Its as simple as this…Asian women are WHITE WASHED! No need to further dissect their motives.
Self hate in wanting to have children with a white man, to breed out their Asian eyes, much like white washed black women, want to have children with a white man to breed out their Nappy hair and dark skin.
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Legion,
Yeah, I know that comment was a bit on the clinical side with regards to my choice of phrasing, but it’s what came to my mind and I simply went with it.
[Oh, and the sentiments are mutual 😉 ]
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I, myself, have never defended Asian women’s dating choices as I’ve never actually felt they need defending. Asian women, as individuals, seem to date the men of their own choosing come what may and without very much need for apology to or permission from third parties / strangers.
I’ve said on here before that I, an independent adult, would NOT seek permission or advice from my own blood kin as to which type of (consenting adult) I should or should not date; I certainly will not seek this kind of permission or advice from strangers–and most especially not from anonymous internet personalities (or even from supposedly known ones, such as “Kola Boof”).
To this end Asian women are free to date whomever they please as far as I am concerned; however, and it shouldn’t need to be said, but the right to bash Asian men (or any others for that matter) is never part of the bargain.
I must say though that If Asian Americans (or Black Americans) wish to keep each other from dating / marrying out, then that sort of indoctrination, in most cases, needs to be initiated when an individual is school age.
To assume that all people will simply navigate to others of their own ethnicity or race when they reach their reproductive years, and then going nearly ballistic when they don’t do as expected, simply doesn’t make sense.
Each Asian woman, Black woman, and Black man is his or her OWN person and as such can date /marry or NOT date / marry whomever they please. In the meanwhile naysayers might consider tending to their own lives only and allow other adults to do the same.
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Excellent commentary , Pay it Forward….
This sterotyping and bashing of Asian American women , lumping them all in one catagory , one mentality , one behavior , is creepy …
You just put it so well , Pay it Forward
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@Kiwi
sondis asked: “How do Asian men cope with this issue of their women, not wanting them?”
Your answer was:
“I’m not sure…. Most Asian men still get married, maybe at a higher rate than white men.
The problem for me is not getting dates …. The problem that affects me is the racial contempt that whitewashed Asian women in my everday life have for me, especially those with white romantic partners.”
I understand your point. I always have, in sincerity, because:
1. your writing is so clear, and,
2. your reasoning has never wavered from the above.
To my mind, your comments echo what Abagond says about black women, which is:
Abagond doesn’t mean all black women. His meaning is crystal clear, and perfectly reasonable.
Come to think of it, whenever you have discussed this subject, I’ve NEVER got the impression that you oppose the personal, romantic choices of complete strangers on the internet, or would seek — I don’t know how though! — to dictate anyone’s private life. That would be bloody absurd.
As far as I can gather, there’s nothing you’ve said that could be construed as being against IRRs in principle, or anti-mixed race people, etc.
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Kiwi, also, I always notice you say “in my life”, or “X” particular relative, or whatever.
You don’t seem to generalise.
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Bulanik! You Rascal…where ya been hiding all this time? ^_^
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…busy, Mr S!
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Bulanik:
“…busy, Mr S!”
Mr S, eh? what am i, a villain or something? @ : o O ) >
*STROKES HIS BLACK CAT
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@ Sondis
Thank you, but I would strongly urge you not to use the term “ch*nky eyes”
It’s derogatory & I cringed a little reading your comment that stated it. As possibly the most oppressed group in this country with records to back it up we as blacks hate it when people use racist or insensitive language to describe us.
Lets set an example and not do the same to anyone else, even if we weren’t in the position we were in, its never ok to use language like that. Hope I didn’t come across as preachy but it’s a term I notice a lot of people throw around without thought & I know we’re all better than that.
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Lol! No, not THAT. 😀
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^the above comment in response to Sondis.
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@ A
Sondis corrected that comment.
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Heh Bulanik, just messin witcha! ^_^
A:
Yeah, what abagond said above. I saw that it was moderated and edited as such.
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@ Sondis
My apologies. I just remembered reading it a while back and didn’t check to see if it had been removed.
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A
“My apologies. I just remembered reading it a while back and didn’t check to see if it had been removed.”
Fair enough… ^_^
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<blockquoteThat scares me and it is really unfortunate bc the pool of black women that I find “dateable” is honestly quite small.
Besides anecdotal evidence, and quite frankly your individual opinion, what other proof do you have of there being a small selection of “dateable” Black women?
I wonder why with so many Black women commenting here how comments like these get overlooked?
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Legion:
Sondis:
Does this result in lots of Asian men, becoming homosexuals?
“Jesus Sondis! Only prison fuks with men’s minds that much.”
well….i honestly wanted to know as Asian women are more likely to date white men, than their own men, than any other ethnic group. With those number so high, i would think Asian men might resort to drastic measures, if you catch my drift. *_*
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Peanut:
“can i say something dirty, abagond?”
Feelin’ freaky, eh Peanut? *_0
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@ Peanut
When did Oprah or any of those other daytime talk show hosts of the 90’s have respectable BM on when they were talking about black relationships? It was only BW & foolish BM who “dogged” them or no BM at all. What about the tv specials where they have groups of BW talk about how difficult it is to find a decent BM because most of us supposedly aren’t on their level as they put it. I see no equivalent on television or in media to that whatsoever. These are programs that have millions of viewers, the bloggers & vloggers who bash BW don’t have anywhere near the audience. Not to mention their are just as many blogs & youtube accounts ran by BW that spit equal amounts of venom at BM, thus the online realm is a wash.
You’re gonna compare a psycho like Eldrige Cleaver to regular everyday common BM? I would have to call that a false equivalence & seeing as his acts were done at the height of rampant misogyny in America, a culture which doesn’t exist to the same extent due to feminism & civil rights I would say that he’s even further removed from the BM of today who again grew up listening & watching to television shows with BW all but saying BM were the worst creatures to ever walk this earth, some of those women being their own mothers. He ran rampant during the 1970’s many young BM of today weren’t even born then. They grew up under completely different societal rules regarding women and as such men of his nature were then, and are now a minority.
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To c.andrews
“well let us follow logic, a black billionaire may have more tangible items than a middle class or poor black but you cannot equate that with TRUE power. sadly in the end all mistah Charlie see is you a shiftless negro no matter how much money you have. Take Oprah Winfrey, when she was in London she was denied admittance to their top store Herrod until a few calls were made to explain she was a special negress”
I know this is a rather old post but I had to respond to this as it is one of the funniest things I have read in a while. C. Andrews, you are living in fantasy land and have allowed your Neely Fuller race conspiracy theories to lead you into making a very foolish statement.
For a start the shop is called Harrods. Herod was the name of a number of Biblical era Jewish kings, one of whom cut off the head of John the Baptist.
When you say ‘their’ top store it implies that London or the UK has some say in how the place is run. Beyond the rules and regulations that govern all such enterprises Harrods is totally independent. It has also been owned by Arabs for a number of years now, first by the Fayed brothers who bought it in 1985 and now the Qataris since 2010.
If you imagine that Harrods runs an openly racist door policy that regulates how many ‘negroes’ and ‘negresses’ it lets in you are sadly mistaken. There is no such policy. If there were it would be all over the headlines. It would cause an outrage if it was even suspected. If you actually go inside you will see that 90% of those who shop there are foreigners, large numbers of whom are brown skinned.
I have been to Harrods many times, although like most locals I view it as a something for tourists and prefer to go to Liberty or Fortnum myself. The food hall is a treasure though and I often take foreign friends or family around as most visitors to London want to see it. Although it has a certain magnificence and opulence I find it rather vulgar and it has an unfortunate record with animal rights issues.
I have never been turned away from the shop although I am a dark skinned black man. The last time I was there was a couple of months ago, to look at the exhibition of Faberge. Far from being turned away or receiving a cold shoulder I found the staff extremely polite and helpful, bending over backwards to tell me where to find all the exhibits which were split over two departments and talking to me about the history of the objects.
Harrods is notorious for having a strict dress code policy, turning away anyone in tracksuits, people who are too sweaty or shoppers with dodgy haircuts. I don’t think race plays any factor in those decisions; most people being turned away are white.
Also where did you find this story about Harrods and Oprah? I can find no information on any attempted refusal.
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Ally
“Also where did you find this story about Harrods and Oprah? I can find no information on any attempted refusal.”
I think that c.andrews meant the Oprah’s episode in Zurich, not in London.
(http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/tv/news/oprah-winfrey-victim-of-racism-in-switzerland-billionaire-told-she-cant-afford-expensive-handbag-at-exclusive-zurich-store-8753660.html)
But, anyway, s/he can explain him(her)self better about this apparent mistake.
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I wondered if that was the case, though there was also some incident of a vaguely similar nature at the Hermes store in Paris. I haven’t read many details but apparently there was some issue over late night shopping. Perhaps she was thinking of that.
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“Self hate in wanting to have children with a white man, to breed out their Asian eyes, much like white washed black women, want to have children with a white man to breed out their Nappy hair and dark skin.”
What the hell?! Why would you assume this? My bf is white and I am black and we are CHILDFREE! So what is our motive now you ignorant SOB?
My motives in seeking my partner are and were that I intend to spend my life with ONE life partner, and as such that person needs to be as personally compatible and of the highest calibre character (read: trustworthy) as possible. We would also need to have compatible values (to give an example, he would need to also be chidlfree).
“To assume that all people will simply navigate to others of their own ethnicity or race when they reach their reproductive years, and then going nearly ballistic when they don’t do as expected, simply doesn’t make sense.
Each Asian woman, Black woman, and Black man is his or her OWN person and as such can date /marry or NOT date / marry whomever they please. In the meanwhile naysayers might consider tending to their own lives only and allow other adults to do the same.”
This.
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“When BW ignore all of this just to holler online that WM are better than us, they come across as divorced from reality & self hating. They’ll talk about the way white supremacy affects BW (Euro-centric beauty standards, stereotypes about attitude & being promiscuous etc) But then in the same breath treat all the ways that white supremacy affects BM (employment discrimination, black boys being pushed out of the public school system) as if its our fault or like it doesn’t exist at all & we’re jus making excuses.
And all of this, just to say you want to date a white man? Just go ahead & do it, its 2014, there are interracial pairings of all kinds in most major cities & no one minus a loud minority are going to give you any kind of flack. Just please don’t act as if that higher quality of living said WM can give you is any proof of them being better than us. It isn’t, its simply proof of them being the biggest beneficiary of white supremacy which now filters down to you. BW blaming BM for the problems of the black community is like blaming someone who was born in the Matrix for the existence of it.”
So black men having the highest marital infidelity rate out of all races is not their fault too? To be honest, that is the only thing that would scare me away from dating black men, the stats on prison populations and the like wouldn’t scare me because I wouldn’t be dating a man who was involved in crime anyways and I don’t necessarily have anything against blue collar men who haven’t been to college as long as they were hardworking, but black men having the highest *self-reported* infidelity rate would make me wary of dating them, compared to Asian or white men, because I want a man who is, if nothing else, faithful. The AA culture which glamourizes infidelity and misogyny didn’t make them look appealing to me either, when I was single and dating. Just being honest. By the way I’m Canadian. But I know several black guys, many of them are great but they all listen to rap music and that puts me off of them, I really don’t like rap music. I don’t mind r&b but a guy who listens to a lot of rap music is a turnoff.
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Stumbledonthis
While I don’t agree with all the quotes you stated, I still would like to engage in some points you made. For starters please provide a link that claims black men as the biggest cheaters. I doubt any real cheater would admit to it so I find that statement unbelievable.
Secondly why does it need to be said or matter what a turn on is or is not for you. You dating right? Then there is no need for potentials to have information on how to get your attention.
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@sharina – Sure, here are a few different places I’ve read it.
http://anepigone.blogspot.ca/2009/05/black-asian-men-most-least-likely-to_08.html?m=1, http://www.nytimes.com/books/99/02/14/reviews/990214.14fonert.html
Also, I may be coupled now but obviously there was a point in time during which I was dating and seeking a partner and I am expressing what my relationship criteria were at that time. This entire thread is in fact over 2000 opinions from people on black women in relationships with white men and people expressing their views on the reasons for relationships like mine forming and existing in the first place; the name of the article is “my view on relationships between black women and white men” so I can only conclude that the reasoning behind you making such a pointless statement is a thinly-veiled attempt to censor those views that you don’t like and/or to deflect from those of us in such relationships being able to actually share those reasons and their experiences openly rather than just sit here and let people such as yourself speculate without adding any personal input. Nice attempt at deflection, though.
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@Peanut – Sorry if I came off kind of defensive. I guess I just didn’t understand the purpose of saying that like, “who cares what your preferences were, you’re in a relationship, or are you looking around?” If she had come out and said what you said and been more direct I doubt I would have had a problem with that.
I guess my post was just resisting the notion that black men are the natural partners of all black woman and any black woman who is not partnered with a black man hates themselves or black men. That was not the case for me. I don’t hold any animosity towards black men as a group but I wasn’t particularly attracted to them on a physical level (although there are definitely some black guys who are very good-looking) but more importantly I had not, since high school, met a black guy who I connected with on that personal level that sparks romantic relationships. It was more cultural than anything. The one time (in high school) I did meet a black guy who was “my type” he was actually more interested in dating white women, but his friend, who was white, did give me a chance (it was a short-lived high school romance but that’s beside the point).
I feel like with women who date white men or have a cultural preference for a scene that is predominantly white, it gets overanalyzed. My childhood friend is biracial (but looks more black) and both she and her sister have married black men. She told me once that she likes men with “big lips” and couldn’t date a man with thin lips. I have another friend who is white and was born in Australia and she is so, SO happy to live in North America now because of all the black guys she now has access to lol… she says she likes them because they have “swag” and I know she has a physical preference for men with darker skin, the darkest European man she is willing to date now that she lives somewhere multicultural and has choice is a Southern Mediterranean, and he would need to have swag too, no rocker types. Now, they can say these things and no one ever questions it, in fact people celebrate it and I am one of them. I have never told my friends they are wrong for their type. But women like me are acutely aware that our preferences are not “politically correct” and we can’t be open about what WE like for fear of being called self-hating.
Anyway, that’s my two cents.
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StumbledOnThis
Peanut is correct as my statement was not meant to be rude, but your need to project your feelings on me is plainly ridiculous. This old saying goes a long way and I feel inclined to repeat. When you assume you make an ass out of U and me. On to business.
Both sources have stats, but do not show where and how they came up with said data. Notice how the blog provides a link for me to view the marriage rates but conveniently leaves out the same link that gives insight to those cheaters statistics? Do you have something a bit more? Plus it states “Those who have never been married are excluded from the cheating figure.” So I gather the data is only for married cheaters and not cheaters in general.
“so I can only conclude that the reasoning behind you making such a pointless statement is a thinly-veiled attempt to censor those views that you don’t like and/or to deflect from those of us in such relationships being able to actually share those reasons and their experiences openly rather than just sit here and let people such as yourself speculate without adding any personal input. Nice attempt at deflection, though.”—Well sorry to burst yet another bubble today but your conclusion would be WRONG. Secondly, not all of US think alike (those in interracial relationships) so it is a cop out to pull the ole “silence us” bs every time someone says boo. Don’t assume what the person on the other end of words is or is not in just because they have a few words that don’t go with the apparent majority. Thirdly you brought up your preferences, so how is it deflecting because I responded to it? Sure it would be deflecting if I start making excuses or changing to something else out of the blue. Me responding to what you brought up….no.
“who cares what your preferences were, you’re in a relationship, or are you looking around?”—-Wow! Putting words in my mouth. Really?! Haven’t had that happen in a while, but let me quote what I actually said.
“why does it need to be said or matter what a turn on is or is not for you. You dating right? Then there is no need for potentials to have information on how to get your attention.” Can be found here: https://abagond.wordpress.com/2013/06/07/my-position-on-relationships-between-black-women-and-white-men/#comment-246196
So the problem you have is one you made up.
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“Both sources have stats, but do not show where and how they came up with said data.”
They’re not the the only sources; the General Social Survey lists the same thing: http://www.hookingupsmart.com/2013/07/24/relationshipstrategies/the-definitive-survey-of-infidelity-in-marriage-and-relationships/, http://anepigone.blogspot.ca/2010/03/infidelity-rates-by-ethnicity.html.
Also, http://www.nydailynews.com/opinion/black-women-justifiably-bitter-bleak-relationship-picture-african-american-females-article-1.953496 and NYTimes and NYDailyNews are pretty credible sources too, imo.
“Thirdly you brought up your preferences, so how is it deflecting because I responded to it? Sure it would be deflecting if I start making excuses or changing to something else out of the blue. Me responding to what you brought up….no.” Asking me **why** I am bothering to share my opinion or preferences is the exact same thing as discouraging me from sharing them.
“Wow! Putting words in my mouth.” It’s called paraphrasing, deducing the essence of what is being said. “why does it need to be said or matter what a turn on is or is not for you. You dating right? Then there is no need for potentials to have information on how to get your attention.” ….and this further validates my point.
I can see that you’re not quite intellectually astute enough to understand the implications of what you are saying, as opposed to being intentionally rude or malicious, so that being the case there is no need to split hairs anymore over the reason as to why you are rude or trying to censor. I don’t think you can help it.
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@Sharina – Waiting to get my longer comment approved. Here is one source of the data:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3517175/
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@ Stumbledonthis
Thank you for slightly more detailed sources.
The first one I am going to kick out because it gives all this information on men vs women cheating and then the writing comes to the conclusion (not even sure how) that “Blacks, executives and managers, and Southerners were most likely to report extramarital affairs to the 40-year-old survey, the oldest continuous source of data on American behavior.” Then it goes right back to talking about men vs women cheating. It does not provide me with A) a sample size nor doe sit provide me with b) a detail on how she came to that reporting. She goes in full detail and % on how she came to male vs female, but managed to dismiss this detail when race, occupation, and location became involved. Your second link is another blog post with no credible location to a detailed look of how this individual got those numbers or came up with that stat. Your third link is about black women being bitter which is completely irrelevant. Your last source was perfect and much more credible, but it does not seem to draw the conclusion that black men cheat more.
“Asking me **why** I am bothering to share my opinion or preferences is the exact same thing as discouraging me from sharing them.”—If asking a person why is discouraging then we should fire teachers, professors, and perhaps even job interviewers because why is more of a way of understanding or getting to know a person and not a discouraging tool. If you are discouraged then it maybe you putting up walls that just are practically unnecessary.
“It’s called paraphrasing, deducing the essence of what is being said. “—It’s also called projecting. As you were placing your own hostilities onto me when that it not what I said or meant. The way you paraphrased it says it all. 🙂
“and this further validates my point.”—What point? That I simply asked you a question that you proceeded to view as mean and rude? If anything it validates my point that you A) are making an issue out of nothing and B) are projecting and c) apparently have issue with people asking you questions.
“I can see that you’re not quite intellectually astute enough to understand the implications of what you are saying, as opposed to being intentionally rude or malicious, so that being the case there is no need to split hairs anymore over the reason as to why you are rude or trying to censor. I don’t think you can help it.”—Well considering that you decided to call names first it is an apparent sign of someone who lost the debate/discussion and/or It also is a sign that you are apparently more upset than me who you have been trying to claim is such since I first responded to you. The truth of the matter is there is no implications in that statement that requires some intellectually astute understanding. It was a simple question that, for the life of me, has you paranoid. That is not my problem that is yours. You can call me all the names in the book if you think it will make you feel better or make you smarter or make you more astute in some way, but bottom line is you have a wall of paranoia surrounding you that is making you view any type of question or thought that you do not agree with as attacking you in some way. There might be medication for that.
PS the only way to censor a person is to delete there post, which I don’t have the authority to do. Challenging your post is not censoring. It is challenging. Apparently censoring is the new word for “I can’t handle something.” So the false accusation of censoring is used to insult a person. *shrugs*
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So I repeat this again, but I would also like to add a good moto I go by.
“So the problem you have is one you made up.”
“When you assume you make and ass out of U and ME.”
http://thedailylove.com/when-you-assume-you-make-an-ass-out-of-me-and-you-give-it-up/
I recommend you watch the video. 🙂
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make an ass out of U and ME* correction
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“Your last source was perfect and much more credible, but it does not seem to draw the conclusion that black men cheat more.”
Not sure how you concluded this as 4 unique studies are referenced in the ncbi link and they all state the same thing.
““why does it need to be said or matter what a turn on is or is not for you. You dating right? Then there is no need for potentials to have information on how to get your attention.” OK. In your world, this question and statement are demonstratively NOT rude nor confrontational. This speaks volumes I think about the vastly differential way in which we experience the world and also pretty stark differences in the ways that we were raised.
But to each their own. You have yourself a good day and I don’t wish to continue the matter further.
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@Peanut
I think “A” is Adonis. He is a psychopath that stalks black women on Twitter. He’s threatened them with rape and murder.
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@ stumbledonthis
“Not sure how you concluded this as 4 unique studies are referenced in the ncbi link and they all state the same thing.”—Like I said that source is perfect, but the results of the study does not conclude anything along the lines of black men being more likely. It says minority respondents, but that could include Hispanics, blacks, or even what is considered other.
“OK. In your world, this question and statement are demonstratively NOT rude nor confrontational.”—Sorry but peanut did not seem to take it that way either, so that is a clear sign that this is only in your mind. I actually find it odd that you actually do not see anything wrong with not only your hostility over the phrase, but also what you decided to conclude the meaning is? Do you not notice that for a statement you claimed to show me as being rude that I have yet to follow up with any rude or mean sayings or insults towards you? The only one doing such is you? That is a clear sign of the level of projection that you have going on here. Not only did you “Paraphrase” my statement to mean something mean and rude, but you went on to be mean and rude.
Furthermore I think it is a great injustice to let this slide so easily: “It’s called paraphrasing, deducing the essence of what is being said.” Paraphrasing is restating something using your own words. What you did was not paraphrase my statement but rewrite it into a meaning that basically coincide with what you viewed it as or believed it to me. You were incorrect yet again, but I have a source to better help you avoid such inaccuracies. http://examples.yourdictionary.com/examples-of-paraphrasing.html
Also the undertone of your post, to me, was not to display your preference, but to bash black men which is mainly why I asked why. To see what point you were making and what you were getting at. I generally ask questions with the purpose of understanding and when a person becomes defensive it tells me all I need to know about them and their so called points. I don’t agree with black women bashing and generalization nor do I agree with black men bashing and generalization.
Lastly, you don’t know anything about me or how I was raised. So to bring that up is just another petty insult that, IMO, is used to attempt at discrediting my stance or what I am saying. It doesn’t. But what it does in turn is say a heck of a lot more about you than it does me. 🙂
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The Alchemist
Yes. “A” is adonis. He came on a few months back to announce to abagond that he will be going by “A”.
“He is a psychopath that stalks black women on Twitter. He’s threatened them with rape and murder.”—*Shakes head*
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“Like I said that source is perfect, but the results of the study” Which study? There were 4. Allen’s research is very specific on the exact percentage difference in incidence of infidelity among AA’s in particular: http://www.sagepub.com/hillhsstudy/articles/Chapter10_Article%2001.pdf, to give one example. Amato and Rogers’ work as well as Wiederman’s also makes specific reference to AA males, although in the latter example the sample size is admittedly quite small. I have to assume that you’re either being deliberately disengenous or else are too lazy to fact-check what you are attempting to discredit by actually referencing the studies you claim do not contain this information.
“Also the undertone of your post, to me, was not to display your preference, but to bash black men which is mainly why I asked why. To see what point you were making and what you were getting at. I generally ask questions with the purpose of understanding and when a person becomes defensive it tells me all I need to know about them and their so called points.” So now all of a sudden you DO have an awareness of undertone and implication and you are assessing my motives in posting, just as I was assessing yours. To this I say, http://thedailylove.com/when-you-assume-you-make-an-ass-out-of-me-and-you-give-it-up/. <——– This passive aggressive act of yours that I am imitating there because it's applicable to you is indeed rude and condescending. Guess what? If you're rude, uncouth and condescending towards me, you can expect the exact same treatment in return.
I am glad, however, to have finally gotten some honesty out of you. Yes, you were extremely rude with your initial post. You can choose to repeatedly deny that because you're a coward, but it's a fact. With this latest post, you concede that the reason for your initial rude and hostile post is that you personally felt that I was "bashing" black men and this was a reaction of defensiveness. Your perception in my view is not valid. I didn't say that all black men listen to misogynistic rap music, I said the black men I have personally encountered listen to rap music, and this is a turn off for me. Even if I had said that all black men listen to rap music and celebrate the culture promoted on BET which isn't actually what I said, it *still* would not have qualified as "black men bashing" because whether you think rap music is good or bad is an inherently subjective evaluation based on personal preferences. What it comes down to in the end is that you were eager to jump down's someone's throat because their statement left a bad feeling in your mouth, which is fine, but the larger problem to me is that you did not even have the balls to admit that that is what you were doing. Pretending that your post was all sunshine and roses and not meant to incite antagonism shows a profound lack of character.
"Lastly, you don’t know anything about me or how I was raised." Based on what I've seen so far, I am going to guess it was the ghetto.
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Kiwi
I believe he was very nice to men in general, but I could tell from some of his comments here he was a little crazy.
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@ Stumbledonthis
“I have to assume that you’re either being deliberately disengenous or else are too lazy to fact-check what you are attempting to discredit by actually referencing the studies you claim do not contain this information.”—Assuming is what has you in the situation you are in now. How is it working out other than showing you as insecure in your stance. Considering you made the claim I would expect you to prove it. Just as if I said women are xyz then I would need to prove it, but because I have done some research on the matter I have not found anything other than opinion pieces. As to the source you presented it is much better but with a small sample size it does not solidify a need for generalizing black males. It also say nothing about Asian males or Hispanic males. Just white and black in comparison of infidelity.
“So now all of a sudden you DO have an awareness of undertone and implication and you are assessing my motives in posting, just as I was assessing yours. “—You assumed what I understood and what I did not. Your fault not mine. Though the difference in my “assessing” I actually asked clarification questions rather than jumping to a big conclusion and going off the handle. You on the other hand just jumped off the handle and have been since. I am still waiting for clarification which isn’t going very far.
“This passive aggressive act of yours that I am imitating there because it’s applicable to you is indeed rude and condescending. Guess what? If you’re rude, uncouth and condescending towards me, you can expect the exact same treatment in return.”—I actually have the right to be rude at this point (which I have yet to be so far). You have done nothing but assume and make insults from the jump. If I got real dirty and started to call you names then it would be justified in full. Anyway….what passive aggressive behavior? If I want to be direct in anything I do then I will, but at this point I really don’t see it as necessary. So I am guessing this is more projection?
“I am glad, however, to have finally gotten some honesty out of you. Yes, you were extremely rude with your initial post. You can choose to repeatedly deny that because you’re a coward, but it’s a fact”—-a fact is something that exists and is part of reality. So far this rudeness you speak of is all in your head and not some point of fact. You can argue and scream and go on and on about it, but it does not change the actually “fact” that you seem to be the only one that took it that way.
“With this latest post, you concede that the reason for your initial rude and hostile post is that you personally felt that I was “bashing” black men and this was a reaction of defensiveness.”—In order for me to concede I would have to admit that it is true or valid. I can only admit that something is true and valid if you said that was the reason for me responding. So far you claimed I tried to silence you, I was deflecting, or I was being rude. None of which were true and none of which would say I conceded to your delusions and yes, this is at a point of delusion.
“Your perception in my view is not valid. I didn’t say that all black men listen to misogynistic rap music, I said the black men I have personally encountered listen to rap music, and this is a turn off for me.”—Which is why I asked questions. Remember you’re angry I asked you questions not what I said was my conclusion from your post. This is also deflecting because had I not made that statement you would still be trying to grasp on to the “I am being rude” idea. I never said you said all black men and I also never gave you detail about what I considered a bashing of black men. So your explanation of rap music is a sidebar.
“What it comes down to in the end is that you were eager to jump down’s someone’s throat because their statement left a bad feeling in your mouth, which is fine, but the larger problem to me is that you did not even have the balls to admit that that is what you were doing. Pretending that your post was all sunshine and roses and not meant to incite antagonism shows a profound lack of character.”—Well so far your assessment skills of me are poor at best. If I wanted to jump down your throat I could think of several things you said that would serve as better points. Beside your petty insults are a sign of your own insecurities, so while you are analyzing me you are revealing you.
“ Based on what I’ve seen so far, I am going to guess it was the ghetto.”—I am sure you wish. Perhaps if I had then you might be able to make yourself look better, but I was raised in a middle class family with a two parent home. My father worked his way up to middle class so it was not always as such. Anything else you want to guess about my life and be wrong about? At this point I am amused. 🙂
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Kiwi
I will also say this. He was a bit crazy on here but I can honestly say I did not expect him to go that far out at all.
@ The Alchemist
Is he going by “A” or “Adonis” on twitter?
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“Considering you made the claim I would expect you to prove it. Just as if I said women are xyz then I would need to prove it, but because I have done some research on the matter I have not found anything other than opinion pieces. As to the source you presented it is much better but with a small sample size it does not solidify a need for generalizing black males. It also say nothing about Asian males or Hispanic males. Just white and black in comparison of infidelity.”
This is indicative of your dishonesty, low IQ, illiteracy, or possibly all 3.
Link 1 which you claimed, “is a perfect source” which nevertheless “does not conclude anything along the lines of black men being more likely. It says minority respondents, but that could include Hispanics, blacks, or even what is considered other” actually explicitly states: “African Americans and Hispanics registering higher rates of EMS than Whites.” Link 2 does have controls, and whether you acknowledge it or not, a 33% to 57% greater differential is significant, statistically and otherwise. Nevertheless, we are now coming onto 5 or 6 unique sources, data points and studies, many of which are from credible and esteemed sources which you nevertheless dismiss as uniformly insufficient to base an opinion on. That is certainly your prerogative and you’re entitled to your opinion.
“If I want to be direct in anything I do then I will, but at this point I really don’t see it as necessary.” No, because you prefer long-winded passive-aggressive rants to forthright and direct conversation. How nice it must be to be unburdened with full-time employment.
“actually “fact” Do you mean actual fact?
“This is also deflecting because had I not made that statement you would still be trying to grasp on to the “I am being rude” idea. I never said you said all black men and I also never gave you detail about what I considered a bashing of black men. So your explanation of rap music is a sidebar.” OK so then your point is that you were being deliberately disagreeable for vague reasons which you are continuing to not state… because this would be an admission that you are arguing just to argue, which you obviously love to do, if your latest long-winded rant is any indication.
You enjoy doing that. I can see from your 100+ posts where you react defensively in favour of black men to multiple users that you certainly have the time. I, on the other hand, do not.
“Which is why i will be making today my last posting to thread.” You said this in July of 2013. And yet, here you are. It’s a shame you don’t have better hobbies than jumping down people’s throats for no reason.
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@ Stumbledonthis
“link 1 which you claimed, “is a perfect source” which nevertheless “does not conclude anything along the lines of black men being more likely.”—I never said anything about link 1 being perfect as from the sources you provided this is your link 1 (http://anepigone.blogspot.ca/2009/05/black-asian-men-most-least-likely-to_08.html?m=1). I would suppose you are refering to link 6 (the one I considered perfect) as you have provided quite a few. And because I can admit when I am wrong. I did not see that statement upon inital view of the document, but I also did not see any percentages. “Link 2 does have controls, and whether you acknowledge it or not, a 33% to 57% “—You mean link 7. I never said anything was wrong with it. I will simply repeat what I said “ As to the source you presented it is much better but with a small sample size it does not solidify a need for generalizing black male.”
“many of which are from credible and esteemed sources which you nevertheless dismiss as uniformly insufficient to base an opinion on. That is certainly your prerogative and you’re entitled to your opinion.”—Actually only two of them came from credible sources. The others did not have the criteria to make credible.
“No, because you prefer long-winded passive-aggressive rants to forthright and direct conversation. How nice it must be to be unburdened with full-time employment.”—-And you prefer to use words you have no clear understanding of or actually define you instead of me. Besides I told you once that if I decided to be an a** at some point then I am fully justified. For starters passive-aggressive. This carries a few meaning but some common ones appear to be doing something to p*ss someone off or to annoy or hurt someone verbally with put downs or avoid direct confirtation. I have not done that but I can surely think of a few quotes I can pull from you that has. As to me not working full-time, I have been blessed to me a homemaker and stay at home mom. I sense that insecurity I was talking about surfacing again. Then there is rant. A rant is to talk passionately or in a wild and loud way. If you claim me to be passive-aggressive then do explain to me how I can also be ranting? I would have to be more passionate and wild and loud.
“actually “fact” Do you mean actual fact?”—Yes, that is what I mean. Is this one of your acts of passive-aggressive behavior you like to project on me?
“OK so then your point is that you were being deliberately disagreeable for vague reasons which you are continuing to not state… because this would be an admission that you are arguing just to argue, which you obviously love to do, if your latest long-winded rant is any indication.”—No, that is your point. This assumption like the others would be wrong. I only really challenged you on thing in your post and the remainder was a question to determine your stance or what you meant by it etc. The remainder of this began with you here: https://abagond.wordpress.com/2013/06/07/my-position-on-relationships-between-black-women-and-white-men/#comment-246213
You are the one that apparently enjoys arguing as you were the one that flew off the handle and became defensive and confrentational. Should I sit and let you speak to me in such a manner without defending myself especially when what you say is false?
“You enjoy doing that. I can see from your 100+ posts where you react defensively in favour of black men to multiple users that you certainly have the time. I, on the other hand, do not.”—Apparently you do because you took the time to read my multitude of posts. Secondly this is where I can repeat your statement above “This is indicative of your dishonesty, low IQ, illiteracy, or possibly all 3” Most of my arguments in here have been in favor of black women. I will direct you to this one : https://abagond.wordpress.com/2013/06/07/my-position-on-relationships-between-black-women-and-white-men/#comment-173990
“You said this in July of 2013. And yet, here you are. It’s a shame you don’t have better hobbies than jumping down people’s throats for no reason.”—What’s a shame is that you went on cyber-stalk mode. Again with the insecurities. 🙂
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Comment in moderation for too many links but I have to get this by:
“You said this in July of 2013. And yet, here you are. It’s a shame you don’t have better hobbies than jumping down people’s throats for no reason.”—What’s a shame is that you went on cyber-stalk mode. Again with the insecurities. 🙂
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correction confrontation
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Look Sharina, it’s not my responsibility to assuage your cognitive dissonance. If you don’t feel that the National Science Foundation’s General Social Survey, for instance, is a credible source, you are welcome to pay for the complete published draft and scrutinize the data yourself; they have several with large sample sizes and after all, there are many to critique; they release one every few years like a census. At the end of the day, it’s your life and your future to gamble with, not mine, and you are entitled to your opinions.
As for the rest of your rants, I will admit that I can no longer be bothered to read through all of your longwinded nonsense and get through them, I am actually completely bored with it now so god help any man who ends up with you regardless of race rofl.
You have yourself a nice day/week/month until the next person blows on by you choose to argue with like you’ve done all 100+ times before on this thread.
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@Stimbledonthis
Now that I have taken the time to look over the source more I will address it. I will represent your claim as it was stated here: “black men having the highest *self-reported* infidelity rate would make me wary of dating them, compared to Asian or white men”
1. “African Americans and Hispanics registering higher rates of EMS than Whites “—This is actually a quote from another source titled Intrapersonal, Interpersonal, and Contextual Factors in Engaging in and Responding to Extramarital Involvement. It is not the direct findings of the report itself. As the report does not appear to make any real findings on race.
The bigger issue here is you are using self-reporting data to generalize black men. Self-reported data can not really be used to come to such a conclusion because it bases it’s information solely on how much a person is willing to tell you. If black men decided to be honest and white men decided to lie then you would still have the idea that black men are more likely to cheat. “These numbers likely underestimate rates of EMI because some individuals refuse to disclose such sensitive information; in addition, because these samples include younger cohorts who have not yet but may eventually engage in EMI, they likely underestimate lifetime prevalence.” Is quoted from Intrapersonal, Interpersonal, and Contextual Factors inEngaging in and Responding to Extramarital Involvement. Wiederman actually found no difference between black and white men in regards to who cheats more only that black men were more likely than white to report (http://www.mindingthemind.com/reprints/EMS.pdf). So my inevideable point in this is using self-reported data of any kind to come to a conclusion that black men cheat more is about the same as me using self-reported data to determine that black women are the least attractive. Also you didn’t really dispute what “A” said you only really contributed to the ongoing problem with some black men and some black women who date out. Playing the blame game and bashing/generalizing. The way I see it if you are not interested in black men then there is really no need to bash them just as if a black men is not interested in dating black women there is no need to bash them. I find that most men and women who do this are simply looking for a sense of approval on why they date white. Black men are no good, purple unicorns, but white men etc. It only reveals their insecurities to the world.
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@ Stumbledonthis
“Look Sharina, it’s not my responsibility to assuage your cognitive dissonance etc. “—When did I say it was your responsibility? If you are going to argue a point dealing with stats then the least it can be is something credible and not a list of blogs with stats and no link on how those stats got to be. Any real sensible person would tell you that but considering you spent a day seeking out information about me on a blog tells me that I am just not talking to a sensible person. Besides that you can completely cut the bull. You made a claim that was only half supported. Asian was never mentioned in either report simply because sample size was too small for both.
“As for the rest of your rants, I will admit that I can no longer be bothered to read through all of your longwinded nonsense and get through them, I am actually completely bored with it now so god help any man who ends up with you regardless of race rofl.”—There is that insecurity of yours again. So bitter. Isn’t it a shame that I am married and have been for years. All your assumptions and none of them amounted to anything but showing you as a jealous female. Toodles. 🙂
“You have yourself a nice day/week/month until the next person blows on by you choose to argue with like you’ve done all 100+ times before on this thread.”—Awww the cyber stalker knows how many comments I made and her insecurities made her read all of them so she can see what I say to others, but wasn’t your original claim that I only argue in favor of black men. Another abandoned assumption that had no proof? Too bad the 100+ argument is a false assumption too. To think you recently claimed you did not have the time yet took the time to do something so….desperate. You have a nice day/week/month reading my comments. Perhaps you will be starting on other blog posts soon.
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The information cited by Susan Walsh and Audacious Epigone comes courtesy of the National Science Foundation’s GSS which is highly esteemed as far as statistics go. If you doubt that those sources correctly referenced the GSS, once again, you are welcome to download one of the publications and review it yourself. I myself am satisfied with the sources. The GSS data just so happens to mirror the data found in other studies and surveys. As you yourself have quoted, my actual statement was, “black men having the highest *self-reported* infidelity rate would make me wary of dating them, compared to Asian or white men.” This statement is quite obviously inherently subjective. I am not advising others not to date them, I am saying that I myself would be wary based on that, but in reality it is based on a combination of anecdote, observation AND the hard data coming which is self-reported by black men themselves (they also report a larger number of sexual partners than other races and engaging in sexual intercourse earlier, but I’m sure they’re just being honest here and other races of men are lying and underreporting the number of women they’ve had sexual relations with. That seems really likely, knowing what we do about male psychology).
“The bigger issue here is you are using self-reporting data to generalize black men.” No, the bigger issue is that in your efforts to impose intellectual and sexual communism you will jump down the throat of anyone who expresses a sentiment that you don’t like. I was stating my personal and valid apprehensions. Your immediate rudeness and patronization which you still deny were nothing but thinly-veiled attempts at censorship.
“Playing the blame game and bashing/generalizing.” Please see previous. This is actually a problem with your own perception of my comment and a problem with your own need to censor and be hyerconfrontational. You should really address that, perhaps with a professional.
“you only really contributed to the ongoing problem with some black men and some black women who date out.” In addition to it not being my responsibility to assuage your cognitive dissonance concerning the previous data and the reality of infidelity risk, it is ALSO not my responsibility to improve the image of black women who date out. I really don’t care what you think or what others think of women like myself. So judge away.
“Asian was never mentioned in either report simply because sample size was too small for both.” This is again not true for the National Science Foundation’s GSS which routinely interviews thousands of Americans and has been doing so since the mid 1970’s. You are welcome to look for any of the previous reports as it is public information.
“Awww the cyber stalker knows how many comments I made” If you hit ctrl + find (F) and search “sharina” your name appears in the comment thread hundreds of times. It really does not require excessive effort to detect, but given your limited grasp of sociology, grammar and presumably computers as well I can’t say I’m shocked that you were not aware of this.
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Look sharina, I get it. In all likelihood, you married a black man and are highly insecure at any suggestions that he may be cheating on you, given that 1/3rd of married black men (and as you yourself pointed out, possibly higher) are cheating on their spouses. That was your choice. You need to stop projecting your legitimate terror onto me simply because I vocalized it.
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@ Stumbledonthis
“If you doubt that those sources correctly referenced the GSS, once again, you are welcome to download one of the publications and review it yourself.”—Those blog sites would or should have a link to those same publications if they were indeed credible. It does not automatically make a site credible just because it puts in the post a possibly credible source. Because of such vital information those sites are not credible. The credibility is a matter of mere opinion and if you are satisfied then so be it, but I am not and you trying to tell me how credible they are will not change my opinion.
“This statement is quite obviously inherently subjective. I am not advising others not to date them, I am saying that I myself would be wary based on that, but in reality it is based on a combination of anecdote, observation AND the hard data coming which is self-reported by black men themselves (they also report a larger number of sexual partners than other races and engaging in sexual intercourse earlier, but I’m sure they’re just being honest here and other races of men are lying and underreporting the number of women they’ve had sexual relations with. That seems really likely, knowing what we do about male psychology)”—Nor did I say or give the impression that you were advising them. My example of black men being honest and white men lying is actually the way that information could also be interpreted. It is not to say that is the way it is or what it is. Self-reported is not hard data. Even in many of your sources it voices the error in that data.
“No, the bigger issue is that in your efforts to impose intellectual and sexual communism you will jump down the throat of anyone who expresses a sentiment that you don’t like. I was stating my personal and valid apprehensions. Your immediate rudeness and patronization which you still deny were nothing but thinly-veiled attempts at censorship.”—I didn’t know asking for stats and questions constitutes jumping down someone’s throat. I truly thought the purpose of a forum was to discuss. Your information was challenged rather than let bare as if there was no flawed thinking to it. It was not censorship as that would again require that your information be deleted or not let pass. As far as I can see all that you had to say has been allowed to be showed. So do explain how that equals censorship? And if my memory serves me you were actually jumping down the throat of someone who had a view different from yours. Now weren’t you? So your hypocrisy is a bit funny here.
“Please see previous. This is actually a problem with your own perception of my comment and a problem with your own need to censor and be hyerconfrontational. You should really address that, perhaps with a professional.”—Actually that is a problem with your perception because this is what you said in response to “A” “So black men having the highest marital infidelity rate out of all races is not their fault too? “ This is basically you using your self-reported stats to present black men as a problem because of them. So either you forgot your wording or you just are projecting again. So with you living in Canada how much experience do you have with African American black men? Remember you said “I myself would be wary based on that, but in reality it is based on a combination of anecdote, observation AND the hard data coming which is self-reported by black men themselves.” The data is actually only reported by African American men not black men as a whole. So it does not change my conclusion above not one bit so far.
“In addition to it not being my responsibility to assuage your cognitive dissonance concerning the previous data and the reality of infidelity risk, it is ALSO not my responsibility to improve the image of black women who date out. I really don’t care what you think or what others think of women like myself. So judge away.”—Didn’t say it was, but doesn’t really change what you are actually doing now does it? Plus if you didn’t care you wouldn’t be on the what post now? But it becomes strange when you project yourself onto others claiming it is them and then show hypocrisy by jumping on a poster you don’t agree with and getting upset when a person responds with a question. If that’s who you are then ok, but projection is just ridiculous.
“This is again not true for the National Science Foundation’s GSS which routinely interviews thousands of Americans and has been doing so since the mid 1970’s. You are welcome to look for any of the previous reports as it is public information.”—It may or may not be true, but as I said it was not mentioned in either of the reports you presented and a blog posting is not a presented report.
“your name appears in the comment thread hundreds of times. It really does not require excessive effort to detect, but given your limited grasp of sociology, grammar and presumably computers as well I can’t say I’m shocked that you were not aware of this.”—Yes, but it requires a consorted effort on the part of the individual to even fathom searching a persons name, counting the amount of comments posted, excluding those that mentioned my name to come up with a number of times I posted, and reading the comments (as you did quote one). I found this quote for you as it really sums up your desperate attempts to insult.
“For someone who has found the wrong outlet for their stress, insulting others gives them comfort for their own imperfections, makes them feel powerful, and helps them to feel better about themselves.”
Carry on then.
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StumbledOnThis
“Look sharina, I get it. In all likelihood, you married a black man and are highly insecure at any suggestions that he may be cheating on you, given that 1/3rd of married black men (and as you yourself pointed out, possibly higher) are cheating on their spouses. That was your choice. You need to stop projecting your legitimate terror onto me simply because I vocalized it.”—-I am sorry that your assumptions aren’t hitting a thing today. Perhaps in other debates you actually use these assumptions as a means to win them. It is almost sad how insecure you are right now. Look, hoping, wishing for me to be any of the things you say just so boost your self-esteem an inch.
I am not married not a black man. My husband is Hispanic dear. Sorry to burst your bubble.
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Correction looking, to not so, I am not married to a black man.
Mexican if you need details. I just don’t use flimsy data to generalize.
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“The credibility is a matter of mere opinion and if you are satisfied then so be it, but I am not and you trying to tell me how credible they are will not change my opinion.” So you have already been invited to download one of the many GSS reports from years past since you are the one not satisfied with the credibility of the GSS. No one is stopping you from doing so.
“I didn’t know asking for stats and questions constitutes jumping down someone’s throat. I truly thought the purpose of a forum was to discuss.” Yep, so implying that I must be looking around because why else would I need to verbalize what did or did not turn me off when single was both tactful and necessary, and also relevant to asking for the source of the stats. You keep denying that you were rude; you keep revealing the “working class” roots of your mannerisms if that is indeed how you were raised to perceive tactfulness.
“And if my memory serves me you were actually jumping down the throat of someone who had a view different from yours.” Yep, and I didn’t see you questioning that statement, revealing your bias, which I’m sure you will deny as well because you are incapable of being genuine.
“So with you living in Canada how much experience do you have with African American black men?” Plenty, I have a considerable amount of family that lives in the US, in New York, in North Carolina and in Florida. I wasn’t aware that you knew me? Thanks for the heads up! What’s your name? When did we meet?
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“Look, hoping, wishing for me to be any of the things you say just so boost your self-esteem an inch.”
Sorry, why do I need you to boost my self-esteem exactly? You are the one who is super defensive about anyone making a comment with even the slightest whiff of criticism of black women AND men because your own delicate self-esteem and self-image is completely dependent on what people think of your race as a collective. You’ve had the exact same argument with me as you have Paranormal and others a year ago. One year you’ve been here policing people’s comments and warning them “not to generalize.” Honestly, you need to get a life because it’s quite pathetic.
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@ Stumbledonthis
“So you have already been invited to download one of the many GSS reports from years past since you are the one not satisfied with the credibility of the GSS. No one is stopping you from doing so.”—I have not been invited to download anything. I am just searching to find the GSS report so I can determine how credible it is. I never said you were stopping me. So what is your problem?
“Yep, so implying that I must be looking around because why else would I need to verbalize what did or did not turn me off when single was both tactful and necessary, and also relevant to asking for the source of the stats.”—That is your perception of things which has so far gone so far off the mark about me that it has lost it’s humor. The point was to find out what point you were making simple as that and the stats were just some other information I wanted to know. Reason why they are labeled first and second.
“You keep denying that you were rude; you keep revealing the “working class” roots of your mannerisms if that is indeed how you were raised to perceive tactfulness.”—I know it was not rude. You keep trying to play into this mind reading thing which is making you come off as psycho. Quotes from dailylove : Mind reading: “When you project onto another other person what you think they are thinking and why they did what they did.” Or “Preconceived ideas: This is where you have already made up in your mind who and what someone is and how that person will respond ahead of time. You then already feel reactive, even though nothing has happened yet.”
“Yep, and I didn’t see you questioning that statement, revealing your bias, which I’m sure you will deny as well because you are incapable of being genuine.”—Actually me and “A” or “Adonis” had gotten into a huge argument on a similar thread about the same darn thing. So I wouldn’t be so quick to make yet another assumption with no basis. I will post the thread so you can read for yourself. I can deny things that are just flat out lies. You can push it if you wish but you are just sounding like a loon. I will post the thread it was on as proof.
“Plenty, I have a considerable amount of family that lives in the US, in New York, in North Carolina and in Florida. I wasn’t aware that you knew me? Thanks for the heads up! What’s your name? When did we meet?”—I didn’t say I did which is why that question mark is in place. Plus unless you have a lapse of memory or your anger has allowed you to forget things. I am certain that you posted just that in your first response or second one.
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“Nor did I say or give the impression that you were advising them. My example of black men being honest and white men lying is actually the way that information could also be interpreted.” Yes, I see you picked up on the obvious sarcasm, being the genius that you evidently are. My point is that as likely as it is that white men are lying about extramarital sex partners and black men are telling the truth there, it would have to be equally likely that black men are telling the truth about the age of first sex and the overall number of sex partners and white men are lying and underreporting there as well. That is another area in which black men take the lead. When it comes to self-reporting, both in ways that men would be ashamed (infidelity) AND ways in which most men would brag (promiscuity), black men report more. It’s just a fact. Perhaps you can go cry about it some more.
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@StumbledOnThis
“Sorry, why do I need you to boost my self-esteem exactly?”—-Well you tell me. You are the one that is so invested in name calling and insults. Not to mention your inaccurrate assumptions. Why would a person need to make assumptions of that caliber if they are not looking to try to make themselves look better?
“You are the one who is super defensive about anyone making a comment with even the slightest whiff of criticism of black women AND men because your own delicate self-esteem and self-image is completely dependent on what people think of your race as a collective. “—I sense contradiction. Did you not too long ago accuse me of not defending or being defensive or challenge critism of black women and favor black men. More psycho-analyzing for your self-esteem. I have my own harsh analysis for my race or individuals that share my race, so once again. WRONG.
“You’ve had the exact same argument with me as you have Paranormal and others a year ago. One year you’ve been here policing people’s comments and warning them “not to generalize.” Honestly, you need to get a life because it’s quite pathetic.”—-And you don’t call this cyberstalking? So obsessed with finding some dirt. Still isn’t really going to make you or your argument any better. My disagreement with Paranormal was not the exact same thing as mine with you. This is unhealthy. I mean really.
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“My disagreement with Paranormal was not the exact same thing as mine with you. This is unhealthy. I mean really.” But your patronizing and irritating rhetoric was identical which is more evidence that it’s a character flaw of yours that you should address professionally.
“This is unhealthy. I mean really.” I agree, so with that being said, let’s move on and not continue. I know that you are incapable of letting this thread go (you already demonstrated this by saying you would a year ago and continue to stalk/jump all over anyone here who said anything that left a bitter taste in your troubled mouth), and I know you’re definitely incapable of being the bigger person as your long-winded permarants show, so I’ll go ahead and do it and bow out here.
You have yourself a nice day and don’t lose any sleep while your husband creeps.
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StumbledOnThis
“But your patronizing and irritating rhetoric was identical which is more evidence that it’s a character flaw of yours that you should address professionally.”—That is your perception dear and again not really healthy. Plus it has become apparent that you just cycle through words to see which one fits. Let me know when you find one that actually does describe me, so far you are describing you. 🙂
“I agree, so with that being said, let’s move on and not continue. I know that you are incapable of letting this thread go (you already demonstrated this by saying you would a year ago and continue to stalk/jump all over anyone here who said anything that left a bitter taste in your troubled mouth), and I know you’re definitely incapable of being the bigger person as your long-winded permarants show, so I’ll go ahead and do it and bow out here.”—Well isn’t that the pot calling the kettle black considering a few threads up you claimed you were not going to comment anyone. Besides my comment to you was the first in a year so your point. I would not be so quick to call anyone stalking considering you proudly displayed this crazy tactic.
“You have yourself a nice day and don’t lose any sleep while your husband creeps.”—I have no worries about that, but I tell you what. You imagine it happening so you can boost that self-esteem of yours. 😉
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@stumbledonthis
“Yes, I see you picked up on the obvious sarcasm, being the genius that you evidently are. My point is that as likely as it is that white men are lying about extramarital sex partners and black men are telling the truth there, it would have to be equally likely that black men are telling the truth about the age of first sex and the overall number of sex partners and white men are lying and underreporting there as well. That is another area in which black men take the lead. When it comes to self-reporting, both in ways that men would be ashamed (infidelity) AND ways in which most men would brag (promiscuity), black men report more. It’s just a fact. Perhaps you can go cry about it some more.“ —I doubt I would cry about it, but you can wish (fragile self-esteem and insecurities and all). Besides I did quote this ““Wiederman actually found no difference between black and white men in regards to who cheats more only that black men were more likely than white to report.” In short any other man will cheat just the same, but not report it just the same.”
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““Wiederman actually found no difference between black and white men in regards to who cheats more only that black men were more likely than white to report.”” This statement makes no logical sense. Did you even think about it before posting it? If you’re talking about self-reported data, if there is a difference in the self-reporting, there is a difference in the incidence of occurrence. We are taking people at their word if we are to trust that the reports have any credibility at all. How would Wiederman have found an “actual difference,” following people around and spying on them?
Infidelity is consistently listed as a top reason for divorce across all races. Towards that end and in accordance with the self-reported infidelity data, black couples divorce most (despite marrying later which usually correlates with lower incidence of divorce), white couples divorce a little less, and Asian couples divorce less than whites.
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In addition, the number of prior sexual partners is positively correlated with future infidelity cross-racially, and just as black men self-report highest infidelity numbers, they also consistently report earlier sexual intercourse and a greater overall number of sexual partners. Once again, having more sexual partners is positively associated with infidelity.
The main point is this; you can jump on people, which you’ve done not just towards me but others, for “generalizing” by pointing out that black men have higher infidelity rates, but that won’t change the fact that it’s true. Nor will it change the perception, especially as they themselves contribute to it by making these reports and celebrating infidelity in mainstream hip hop music.
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@stumbledonthis
Who said anything about Weiderman following people around or spying on them? To quote him verbatium “After I corrected the probability value, there were not differences between white and black men, or white and black women with regard to lifetime incidences of EMS. However black men were more likely than white men to report having engaged in EMS during the past year and the same ethnic difference were found in women.” Like I said. Those very reports you used support this data which is how I found it.
“Infidelity is consistently listed as a top reason for divorce across all races. Towards that end and in accordance with the self-reported infidelity data, black couples divorce most (despite marrying later which usually correlates with lower incidence of divorce), white couples divorce a little less, and Asian couples divorce less than whites.”—Not disputing that.
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StumbledOnThis
“The main point is this; you can jump on people, which you’ve done not just towards me but others, for “generalizing” by pointing out that black men have higher infidelity rates, but that won’t change the fact that it’s true.”—-Trying to find other posts to confirm your delusions doesn’t make it true here. You assumed I was jumping on you for questioning you and sought out posts to see if that was the same with others. Which you really were only searching for confirmation bias because you ignored and didn’t care to seek out any other posts of mine contrary to your beliefs. When I did point out a mistake in your thinking you just tried to find another word or another way to describe it (ie I get into arguments favoring black men only to later say I get into arguments over black men and black women). Do you not see a problem with that? If it’s true it’s true if it’s not it’s not but self-reporting hold how much weight? Not much when it relies on people being honest. it is what it is. I don’t understand why you are trying to hit home with it’s truth. Are black men still not dating and marrying etc?
You then decided to project onto me what you basically did. Which was jump on someone for generalizing black women that date white men. I don’t believe that he said is true but if I did, then why does the kettle call the pot black? Would it have been better if he jumped out and pointed it out? Perhaps if you had not looked at it with the view of me being upset then you would realize I actually was not. Instead you have convinced yourself that that is what I must be and using other post to confirm what you believe. That is your deal.
Bottom line is you can’t be mad at something you are willing to do to someone else. If it was acceptable for you, then it is acceptable for others to do it to you if they choose. I took a different route and it was still perceived as something else. *shrugs*
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wow that audacious epigone blog seems like the font from which all stat-touting trolls draw sustenance
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V8
Hey! Staying out of trouble?
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🙂 depends on who you ask i reckon
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Hi everybody, I’m an Italian man decided to send a message which will describe my personality. Long ago there were transmitted values, and at that time people felt it more consideration. Nowadays, the observance of these principles has started a process of decay. This consideration of the values is not only vital in personal relationships between men and women, but also towards present and future society, which learns and will learns our behaviour patterns. All this means that the more time passes, the less importance has the lives of others. A couple must have a very strong faith in order to address all the problems that life delivers, so it is necessary that each other are offset by a fidelity that is based precisely on the concepts above.
My main characteristic is focused on being God-loving, for this reason i’m very reliable in relationships. Nobody is perfect, but this particular side makes safer a person who is interested to become a part of my life.
I am willing to start something special that will lead to the development of a more solid bond. I’m available to relocate everywhere because for me geographical distance is purely a matter of jumping on a plane and next second virtual world became reality.
I like to spend time with friends, reading, psychology, science, learn new languages and other activities in order to develop the brainpower, running and especially teach the bible to casual people i meet either on the web or in the real life. It’s all. If you want to know more about me, don’t hesitate to contact me. Sincerely, Marco.
Whatsapp: +447937463555
Viber: +393409282577
skype: testifi87
email: testify2087@gmail.com
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My main characteristic is focused on being God-loving, for this reason i’m very reliable in relationships
That’s wonderful, but how are you in the sack?
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The dynamic between White American men and Black American woman is very dynamically rigid. It isn’t very common for me to see a White American man hold hands with a Black American woman everyday. When I do see these couplings, I stand back and watch in awe.
There are many reasons why more White American men and Black American women don’t date and marry one another. Some of these reasons are cultural differences, history between White American men and Black American women, societal pressures, double standards when it comes to Black American males and Black American women and lack of exposure to Black people(in the case of White American man). There are many more reasons that I didn’t talk about but these are the ones I can think of right now.
Honestly, I am open to the idea of dating a White American man regardless of the fact that so many of them tend to be closed off to the idea of dating a Black woman.
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unless we’re mad at each other at the time, my wife and i typically hold hands walking around and show pda (normal)
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WOWWWWWWWW. WOWOWOWOWOWOW. What a disgusting person you are. Keep your shit opinions to yourself. Because at the end if the day these happy couples do not give a shit about what YOU think.
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@abagond did you ever date out?
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@Adam:
You obviously do or you wouldn’t be commenting.
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I’m a black woman and I grew up in an all white neighborhood I think Black men are gross!! Hahahahahahha
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@ Lizzie
Probably because you are Whitewashed.
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lol i don’t find “all” white women gross, i just dated/married black for a while now, i’m ‘white plus.’ the size 2 black woman has ruined many a female’s body for me i must admit.
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@ Kiwi
You can have a “preference for” without necessarily thinking the unpreferred are “gross”.
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To say that I disagree would be a massive understatement. Your comment is so subjective it’s not funny. Asian women and white men couples have a very high average household income, it’s actually higher than white men/white women by nearly 10 grand. You’re saying this is solely because of the earnings and educational attainment of the women and the men are all rejects? Yeah, no.
The men Asian women are marrying are those they’re in school with. It doesn’t mean they’re repulsed by Asian men, but proximity and a common cultural value system (for instance, egalitarianism, the woman working as well) DOES create attraction.
I myself am a black woman who tends to be more attracted to the average white guy than the average black guy. That doesn’t mean that all black guys “utterly repulsive” in my eyes. It DOES, however, mean that what YOU may see as “bottom-of-the-pile” I may find attractive. Your own bias AGAINST white men means that unless they are exceptional physically, you think they’re unattractive (and perhaps you also have a bias against nonwhite women wherein you think that they are less attractive than white women in all cases, so that if a white guy “has” to “settle for” one, he necessarily must be unattractive in some respect himself). Your viewpoint on white men is subjective. Just because you find the average white man unattractive, doesn’t mean I or an Asian woman dating one has to. Your viewpoint isn’t fact, it’s opinion.
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@StumbledOnThis
I like the clarity of your arguments.
In my West Coast city, the White male/Asian American Female couples are hardly “bottom of the pile”. Generally, both are attractive, well educated and successful. There are also plenty of Asian American/Asian American pairings that fit the same description.
Perhaps it is different in other parts of the country.
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Kiwi,
Looking for your guest post. Is it in the pipeline?
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@Kiwi – Perhaps you could explain to me what’s so “rank” about being stereotyped as a traditionalist and wanting to be a provider? Yes, that’s my general perception of Asian men. That’s not necessarily a bad thing and for many women that’s actually a very desireable things. It just depends on what you want. Some women are career-oriented and some women want to be stay-at-home moms, at least for the early years. There is no value judgement inherent in either lifestyle choice; they’re just different.
Furthermore, you can’t discard the proximity matter. Yes, Asian men go to school with Asian women as well. And consequently, lots of Asian men are IN relationships with Asian women. The remainder are (largely, though not exclusively) in relationships with white men. This makes perfect sense since these are the two biggest demographics on most campuses. So if an Asian woman doesn’t automatically disqualify a good 60% or more of the student body from romantic consideration, that makes her a racial or literal gold-digger?
Riiiiiight. You seem more and more radical, jealous, resentful and bat$hit crazy with each post.
Yes, an Asian woman (or black woman, for that matter) who grew up primarily around white folks may be seen to be “whitewashed” in the sense of their cultural leanings, and that is what we call “natural,” to have cultural preferences that mirror your earliest and most normative life experiences. I guess by your logic these women should just go ahead and ignore the men they’re probably going to have the most in common with and only go for the ones who share similar features because otherwise they’re emasculating those men who share similar features? I bet you don’t even see any irony in the absurdity of such an expectation.
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I actually do have a problem with negative stereotypes. For instance, I’m not comfortable with you doing your all to personally validate the stereotype of the angry black woman and I wish you’d gain some self-awareness as to how masculine and needlessly aggressive you come across (but perhaps you ARE a man; that hasn’t been clarified to me).
There is in fact a difference between a negative stereotype, and a generalized statement about a culture. For one thing, the latter can be essentially neutral, and dependent on your own personal preferences. Torontonians have been described alternately as very polite but personally detached. That can be a positive to some people and a negative to others who perceive that as being cold or, at worst, “boring.” To say that the culture in the Middle East in the most religious regions (such as Saudi Arabia) is highly misogynistic is not a stereotype, it’s an accurate assessment of the general culture in those regions. It’s not hateful as a Saudi who rejects the culture and emigrates to the West because they crave a more liberal culture should be treated as a Westerner, and not as a Saudi. I don’t believe in condemning people for their skin colour. However, I’m also not so disengenuous and full of crap that I’m going to say that all cultures have the exact same ideals simply because all people inherently have the same value regardless of their skin colour or what culture their ancestors may have identified with (or been subjugated under). Furthermore, I’ve already stipulated that I am quite amenable to Asian men in a romantic sense, at least hypothetically. I would not be opposed to a cute Asian guy asking me out and going out with him, not by any means. In the real world, things like parents, educational backgrounds and social class, and simply having the same friends (the meet-cute) can keep people apart. You can’t date those you rarely encounter, like it or not.
Not all black men are criminals and that is CLEARLY a problematic statement to even imply, even accusingly. It’s just not appropriate. Check yourself. Having said that, you don’t have to think that black men are criminals to be more attracted to white men, on average, than black men, on average. Nor do random Asian women have to explain to you why they may be dating their particular partner. Asian men SHOULD date whomever they want to, as well. If they feel more inhibited in doing so than their female counterparts (perhaps out of some misplaced sense of racial loyalty, I doubt it’s because of a genuine lack of attraction to other races on aggregate but one never knows) then they should abandon that mentality. That’s my personal opinion. Ultimately, they too can date whomever they want to and naysayers, crazy and militant as you are, can continue your march to obsoleteness.
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@Kiwi
I find it fascinating that in your rage and frustration over Asian women’s interracial dating and marriage choices you come to this site and lash out at Black women.
Black women face tremendous pressures and losses that you cannot begin to fathom:
1. Black women are the least likely to marry or stay married in this country. That level of loneliness is difficult to bear.
2. Black women are forced to shoulder responsibilities that other women don’t have to think about, like spending hard earned dollars bailing male relatives out of jail. No wonder many Black women have a negative financial net worth.
3. Black women are routinely insulted by males and females of other ethnic groups who claim we are ugly, fat, loud, masculine, stupid, immoral and lazy. Some Black men join in the hurling of invectives against Black women to cover their own shortcomings.
Kiwi, no group of women are your designated punching bags. No group of women belong to you. No group of women are required to live their lives to please you. You are responsible for controlling your own emotions. You are responsible for your relationships or the lack of them.
Anger corrodes the vessel.
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yeah dude what is the type of white guy that asian chicks go for?
just out of curiosity
kiwi is a dude im pretty sure
my wife demands me to represent it’s unacepptable to let dumb ppl at work say the n word etc so you know maybe it’s a intimacy thing or whatever wit kiwi
im not sure why irr’s bother him so much or don’t care to speculate like? i can guess
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you really have to be totally open and honest and patient and listen to everything they say in a irr
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@Kiwi – I live in a large Canadian city in which a majority of Asian males are not native-born, but are statistically immigrants to this country. Like it or not, there ARE measurable cultural differences that exist. Perhaps that is not the case with Asian-American men, I’m not sure. But I do have to emphasize again, that’s not a value judgment of Asian males as a whole. Do I hold “stereotypes” about Asian men? Yes, perhaps I do, as I’m only human. However, most of these “stereotypes” would be perceived as POSITIVE, and the others are neutral and do not imply a value judgement either way (again, to a woman who aspires to have a large family, how is a loyal and hardworking man who will provide for her if she chooses to stay home for several years inherently a bad thing? I still don’t understand, sorry).
I am not wholly convinced that Asian men do in fact have any problems in the dating arena. I think those they have are probably either overblown or self-inflicted. My only experience in dating Asian men date back to high school and college. I’ve had two, and in the first one, I had a crush on an Asian guy who lived in my neighbourhood, but he never expressed any romantic interest in me or pursued anything. Several years ago he married an Asian girl. Well, good for him. As I don’t believe in sexual communism, if he chose to not date non-Asian girls or simply wasn’t attracted to me, that’s his prerogative. I have always dated and would only want to date men who ARE attracted to me, and I’m rather unapologetic about that.
It’s no one else’s responsibility to assuage any “loneliness” a person of ANY race may feel with romantic interest and their own genitals. I mean, really – what an absurd concept.
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Asked and answered
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@v8driver
Your comments can be so pithy and funny 😊!
What answer did you pull from this?
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@afrofem thanks 🙂
Since you asked…
Originally i thought kiwi was hating bc he was having a hard time with relationships in general but then this whole thing with the measuring tape… idk
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@v8driver
Good observation. The measuring tape is no true measure of a man. To me what make a man a man is what is in his heart and what is in his head. Everything else is just fluff.
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@Kiwi
My comment:
is specifically about your personal responsibility to exercise self control. Constant fury over not having the relationship of your dreams is not a place of power. It is possible that your excessive anger is repelling the very people you wish to attract into your life.
To me, you have two stark choices:
1. Continue to dwell in this well of anger and never find satisfaction
or
2. Find a way to climb out of this well, cultivate love and respect and grow into the highest version of yourself.
I live in a part of the country where Asian-Americans of all ethnicities outnumber African Americans nearly 3 to 1. I see examples of strong, sexy, stylish and successful Asian American men everyday. I see Asian American men as men, just like I see African American men as men, first and foremost.
What matters most is how you see yourself.
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You clearly lack the ability to see the blatant and hideously ugly hypocrisy of what you are implying. So, let me get this straight, according to you, if a black male is a criminal, it’s not because of his race or who his parents are, however, if a Eurasian man engages in criminal behaviour (which I’d be willign to bet that statistically he is not even all that likely to do), it IS because of his race and who his parents are? ARE YOU FREAKING KIDDING ME? So 15 people are harmed by Eurasian men going off the rails and ALL interracial couplings involving an Asian woman are to be ostracized? And you think this is reasonable behaviour?
Your bitterness and jealousy at the Asian women interracially marrying has so consumed you that you now lack any sense of self-awareness.
Please see a clinical psychiatrist.
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@Kiwi
I am curious?
What event (or series of events) in your life triggered such strong negative feelings about Asian-American women dating and marrying White men?
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You’re a hypocrite, plain and simple. You can’t talk about how dehumanizing ALL stereotypes are, good AND bad, in what breath, and then turn around and stereotype millions of couples as all being racist and black-hating in the very next breath. Your agenda (and your jealousy) is plainly obvious to anyone who can read. You need psychiatric help.
I’ve been on the receiving end of accusatory comments about my preference before, and it was also very hurtful because it was coming from a friend (albeit one who hadn’t known me for more than 3 years). He had made the assumption that I had never dated a nonwhite man before. How shocking it must have been recently when I introduced him to my half-Goan friend (and former date), who has much darker skin than myself. He happened to fit into what attracts me quite well when I was in my early 20’s; not overweight, great taste in music (we both prefer indie rock and actual instruments in our music), he used to skateboard, he used to have cool hair, and he had a Caucasian phenotype. I never said that skin colour was the main attraction. I’ve dated darker-skinned Caucasian men before (mostly from the Middle East) and encountered issues when it came time to envision a longer-term future together, mostly borne from religion. My preference came to be white guys from liberal families simply because those families were far more likely to be secular and religion wouldn’t be a hugely divisive issue or impediment. MOST people’s preferences are derived from a combination of physical attraction and personal experience. Including Asian women. Knowing this, OF COURSE I empathize with them when some psychotically jealous and neurotic nut thinks he can make sweeping generalizations about all of these couples like you’ve figured out the seemingly seedy motivation behind every single one. I mean really, how arrogant are you?!
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Bottom line: you’re an Asian guy on a blog by and for BLACK PEOPLE and THEIR relationships trying to hijack and derail the conversation to how Asian women should only be dating Asian men. You are as transparent as Seran wrap. You’re not fooling anybody. You need to take your misdirected anger and racial Napolean complex to somewhere where people care. Bottom line: your relentless attempts to get people to get out their pitchforks and join you in villifying all Asian woman/white man couples as sinister is just plain sad and pathetic.
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You don’t believe in racial stereotyping? What do you call saying that ALL Asian women with white men hate black people and Asian men, being broadminded? Are you seriously this dumb and lacking in self-awareness?
You’re here trying to convince us that we should all go on an Asian woman witchhunt because clearly you are having difficulty securing the women of YOUR preference. I suppose we’re all supposed to ignore the fact that IRL you have likely never checked for a black woman in your entire life. I have had crushes on Asian men before (mostly in my late teens and early 20’s). I have even gone so far as to hit on them in a club – a PUBLIC PLACE. I stopped going after them as well because it’s only common sense to go where you are wanted and appreciated and not waste time and effort on prospects that are unlikely to go anywhere. Like I said, most preferences are borne of a combination of physical attraction and personal experience. Most Asian men do not show any interest in black women, and when they do, it’s usually only sexual interest with not much substance behind it. You have not shown yourself to be any exception, you are only here because of the mere MENTION of the words “Chinese American women.” YOU ARE DEMONSTRATING YOUR OWN RACIAL BIAS – IT’S CLEARLY FOR ASIAN WOMEN, you goddamn hypocrite. You do not actually give two $hits about black people. You are disgustingly self-interested and if I were an Asian woman whose preference is interracial reading this, I would honestly be thinking to myself, “Yep,… that’s why.”
If embarrassing yourself and the men of your race is your objective, have at it. You’re doing a good job emasculating Asian men there. Good job!
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Asian men do not have a sexual market problem, nor a dating problem. They have a “I only date Asian women, or maaaaaybe white, if my mommy will let me” problem. That’s YOUR PROBLEM to solve. I don’t give a damn if you’re lonely pining after the only women you even notice on this planet. That’s your own goddamn problem, and if some Asian woman does not want to date you, well, apart from being smart, that is her right. Get over it and get a life you loon.
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you went right to the eliot roger thread i was trying to remember his name, thanks dude
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Well, Abagond is entitled to her (her? his?) opinion. I can understand if you’ve grown up in a certain time in a certain segment of America how you might feel that way. So while I don’t condone the statement, I don’t condemn it either, and I can sympathize with it to an extent. None of us is a blank slate, we are all to some degree a product of our own subjective experiences. In my subjective experience I was raised willingly by a white man – my stepfather – who adopted me, raised me as his own, and now in his retirement does missionary work, going to Kenya to feed orphaned children, some of whom are dying of AIDS. He devotes a huge chunk of his disposable income to these almost 200 children even though it’s not his responsibility. He’s lamented with so much regret his own cultural ignorance in working with a brilliant Japanese young man and how he may have unwittingly sabotaged it by simply not being familiar with the cultural norms there when he was working as a CEO earlier in his career, before his retirement. I’ve grown up in a country and particularly in a city as well where racial tensions have not been as high as they have been in southern states, the racial history is not as fraught. I’ve seen intersectionality at work firsthand, so I know it’s not as simple as “whites bad, PoC always good,” I know how colourism and lookism and sexism and ageism can combine to produce privilege in sometimes unexpected places and have been the beneficiary of it. I understand that we must be vigilant against stereotypes; I also know that it’s hard to build a life with someone when you don’t share a common mother tongue, you don’t share the same religion, you don’t share the same interests in media (music, movies, hobbies, etc.). So yes, I have cultural preferences, and I make no apologies for it. I live in a city that is over 50% immigrants. Many of my friends are immigrants. I do see cultural nuances, and like it or not, THEY DO EXIST.
I think if you got your head out of your ass, you may someday be able to say at least one thing that is not blatantly hypocritical or disengenuous. But that would require a certain intellectual honesty and self-awareness that I doubt you are even capable of.
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from a liberal family that’s a laugh
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pretty sure abagond’s a dude
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@kiwi your statement was to say that all white men with Asian women are ugly and unwanted. Yes, I replied to that laughably bitter comment. How on earth do you think you have any leg to stand in self-pitying after stating that? As your FIRST COMMENT HERE! Your self-interest is actually hilarious to me, and I find you amusing. This is the primary reason I keep engaging you. If I were ever to be told by an Asian woman that angry little Asian men get very jealous and bitter and say abusive things and think that’s how you secure the loyalty and affection of women, my knee-jerk reaction would have been the exact same – to defend them (i.e. men like YOU) from such a hateful remark. And yet, here you are, ATTEMPTING to emulate a stereotype ; the abusive, angry little self-emasculating Asian man with a chip on his shoulder that “his” women are rejecting him in favour of white men! It’s pure comedy!
Please, do go on!
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@I stated that my preference was for white men from a liberal family; the men themselves have to be secular. That is a qualifier right there, not even including others. How does that equate to all people of the same race sharing the same culture? Do you have trouble with reading in English? I can be more forgiving if English is also not YOUR OWN mother tongue.
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he still didnt answer what type of white guy supposedly is draining the asian women away from him
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try to find a more mixed community kiwi!
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i think it’s time for me to get back on my own blog i have my own domain for the business now sheesh and at least our relationship has freedom and trust
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smh like i coulda had a v8 kiwi why don’t you date a black woman
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Although some people have pretty skeevy reasons for dating interracially, it is ultimately none of my or anyone else’s business. On another note, I find conversations about relationships to be too heterocentric. I don’t care whether men think I’m attractive or not as I have no desire to be with a man anyway. I also wonder if same sex marriages will be counted in these statistics now that it is legal.
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You simply have no idea what you are talking about. My stepfather has 2 white daughters from his 1st marriage. One of them married her Asian high school sweetheart. When she announced the engagement, his parents tried to disown her fiance – for marrying a white girl!! My father had to sit them down and ask them pointedly if losing some standing in their (Korean) community was really more important to them than losing their own son, never knowing their own grandchild. All this while he wasn’t exactly thrilled about the engagement himself, because he wanted her to finish university before getting married. He has a half-Asian grandchild. Can you imagine if he’d tried to marry black? They probably wouldn’t have even sat down and had the conversation with him ffs! This is him with his biological daughters and his Eurasian grandchild: http://postimg.org/image/se2kopm5v/My experiences from within my own family and in attempting to date Asian men myself when I was younger tells me that they are actually MORE RACIST than white people, at least towards blacks (but… it depends on the ethnicity. Chinese-Canadians tend to be very insular. Ditto with Korean-Canadians. Japanese-Canadians and Phillippino-Canadians are more open-minded). They are also more racist when it comes to hiring; I saw a non-Asian working at a Chinese restaurant once and literally did a double-take.
Here you are expecting us to lament your plight and your alleged loneliness, but I would put money on the fact that like many Asian men buckling under community pressure, you ONLY date Asian women, you’ve NEVER dated a black woman, and further, you never WOULD. Your problem, then, is self-imposed. I don’t give a f*** about your loneliness.
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Oh, for goodness’ sake. Here is the link: http://postimg.org/image/se2kopm5v/.
And no, you’re not ‘just telling it like it is.’ Doing so would mean making an admission that you only really care about portrayals of Asian men, East Asian women’s willingness to date you, and you really don’t give a crap about anyone else; you certainly don’t care about women with darker skin tones!
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@kiwi that’s not fair putting all that extra stuff on stumbled this goes back to the other thread i can’t find it atm, you don’t have to tr–h your own race to date out even if your own family don’t understand/condone it! i know.
kiwi, date a white girl, it really don’t matter
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Kiwi… you assert ”So what? Plenty of racist White men have crushes on Asian women and Black women, including men who’ve posted on this blog. It doesn’t change the fact that you are racist.”
Can I just say how much I love you..
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Kiwi there ya go you got a date right ther
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@Pumpkin
Loved your even headed words of wisdom!
I have personally talked to Asian American women who given me their perspective on why they marry White or Black men. So far, Kiwi has not convinced me that their perspective is out of bounds.
I’m not sure where Kiwi is based, but on the West Coast there are lots of lovely, educated and available Asian American women who are interested in Asian American men. I see young mono-racial Asian couples everyday.
So many Black men are snatched by the Prison Industrial complex from young ages and in such large numbers that Black women face a daunting numbers game in finding dating and marriage partners. To me, that is the real reason for gender disparity in the Black community. Not Black women’s alleged “ugliness” or “bad temper”—just sheer numbers of Black men who are out of circulation. Black men locked away because of the New Jim Crow system.
That is not true for Asian American men; there are a wealth of women of all ethnicitiies and races available to a man with his skin privilege (i.e. not Black). But Kiwi will never find his desired relationship while sitting at a keyboard railing against women who are not interested in him.
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@v8driver
Economical and on the mark with your words, as usual!
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@ StumbledOnThis: Comments deleted for use of moderated language.
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@ Kiwi
Thank you for your detailed and civil response in https://abagond.wordpress.com/2013/06/07/my-position-on-relationships-between-black-women-and-white-men/#comment-310064
I will read the material and get back to you.
You said,
I agree that the individuals in these couples would probably never date or marry anyone Black. From what I’ve read in this thread, you wouldn’t either. You are more like the couples you rail against than you care to admit. Like v8driver said, “… kiwi why don’t you date a black woman[?]” Now that would really be unthinkable wouldn’t it?
What most Black people defend is the right of anyone to marry the person of their choice. Even many (certainly not all) Black women who have a hard time finding suitable Black men would defend this choice. We know what it means to have few, if any choices and be pushed to the margins. This is a sensitive subject for Black women and therefore, not a position taken lightly.
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Yeah, I don’t see anyone whining here about their dating prospects more than kiwi. If anything, I said on this thread ghat thanks to intersectionality I have been the beneficiary of privilege.
Yep, I’m my experience, Asian-Canadians are more racist than white-Ccanadians, particularly the immigrants from other countries. Excuse me for not constantly going on about men who, in my experience, never wanted to seriously date me and would never bring me home to meet the fam because grandma walks around with an umbrella covering her face in the summertime to avoid getting darker. Even if that’s my experience, not sure how that equates to all black women being racist and not sure how saying that all black women are racist because of the handful you’ve encountered who date white men is not, in itself, a racist statement. We’re dealing with king hypocrite though, so remember that it’s only other people who are ever capable of being racist if they make a generalized statement based on their own experience. It’s not racist when he does it.
Honestly, it’s becoming more and more obvious why this man will die alone. It’s not because of his race. His personality is defective. I’m quite certain that a man this psychotically jealous, paranoid and angry simply must have a small wiener, a sort of penile Napoleon complex. That’s not because of his race either.
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Kiwi,
Do a guest post. It could be similar to this one. Put your points together and direct it to the general readership. That is more constructive than attacking individuals for their personal opinions. I am sure Abagond would put it up.
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Your exact words were, ” it became clear to me early on that Black women themselves are racist.” But you didn’t mean ALL. and I guess we’re supposed to take your word for it now because you seem like such a nice and open minded guy? LMFAO. There is a reason no women of any race like you. You are not a good person. Now if you’ll excuse me, I have to go spend time on this lovely Sunday morning with my significant other who is now cooking us breakfast. Some of us can manage to have people stand our presence. You wouldn’t understand.
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To be fair, the Asian female / Asian male outdating issue is not simply a “Kiwi” issue. In recent Asian-American history this has not be “a social problem” it has been “THE social problem” that has been front and center on Asian blogs and discussion websites. In places like The Fighting 44s, 8 Asians, Angry Asian Man, Model Minority, and the earlier years of BigWOWO, this issue has been the third rail of social dysfunction within the Asian community.
At the most severe points of this phenomenon, the outdating percentages among Asian young women were 30% to 40%! This is FAR, FAR, HIGHER than any other race including Black to White. Not only that, but many Asian women (online and elsewhere) openly expressed a singular preference for White men only and a non-attraction to their own Asian men. So, take someone like the great fool Tommy Sotomayor and imagine that 40% of Black men held his views.
Not only that, but these views become more common and more strongly held among Asian women who were second generation or who grew up in the U.S. or who were highly exposed to Western media. It became clear that there was a connection to the disparity between how Whites and non-Whites (including Asian men) were portrayed in Western media and society. On the other hand, Asian women were sexualized and idealized as compliant, obedient but exotic sex slaves to White men. They were not sexualized with the exact same stereotypes and Black women were, but it is a familiar pattern.
So there was eventually an outcry from Asian men in particular, and a counter push from Asian women which divided the Asian-American community for decades and still has strong reverberations today. By many accounts the pendulum is slowly winging back in the Asian community. There has been quite a bit of “calling out” and bringing attention to this issue. It’s no longer as easily acceptable for Asian women to slip comfortably into the White stereotypes while stating how they “would never date an Asian guy.” But that’s not to say that such people don’t still exist.
I say all of that by way of history to the present. There is no doubt that was (and in some cases still is) going in in Asian-American society was racism. It was a full-fledged admitted preference for White men and a disdain for Asian men…. and Hispanic men, and Middle-eastern men, and Black men etc. It was a Whites only club. So, what Kiwi is talking about is a “real thing” and is racism. There isn’t some “other perspective” that can explain this, andy more that there was some other perspective that could explain why Jim Crow was not really based on racism.
But to be sure, no one could or can ever simply look at a White male/Asian female relationship and call it “racist.” If you don’t know the people, or their motivations, of course, you cannot know what motivates their attraction. It’s not about pointing out individual people and their individual stories, unless they people involved clearly subscribe to the racist views that have been demonstrated and pointed out.
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Yeah, based on what I have seen here, this hothead would definitely be an emotionally abusive partner to any woman, so I’m just thankful that he hasn’t been had any success in tormenting a woman in a long-term relationship. I have had emotionally abusive partners and they demonstrate all of the same traits. Bad men do come in all colours, one can never forget that.
Boolean complex over here is so indignant (read: jealous) that I’m unapologetic about my preference for my significant other and all of the traits that he encompasses, but I’m just gonna keep on being unapologetic about it. Why? Because my first post harkened to the fact that I have friends – both black and white – whose preference is for black men, and I celebrate it. Two mixed race sisters I grew up with both married black men like their fathers, and it’s seen as totally natural. I want to marry a white man like MY father, the wonderful man who raised me since I was 18 months, and that’s seen as racist. Well, I reject that double standard. I am going to celebrate what I like, just as I celebrate and congratulate my friends for what THEY like (including the white woman friend whose boyfriend of 8 years is Asian). And I’m not going to let anyone’s sour grapes change how I feel.
People like what they like. Sometimes it’s a chicken or egg situation, where you don’t even know or remember if the preference was always there or got entrenched after you fell in love with someone who had those traits and just had an overwhelmingly positive experience (this is the case with my significant other. He was always a breast man; now he’s an a$$ man, thanks to me). At the end of the day, I don’t support sexual communism. Sex is intensely personal. Marry who you’re attracted to. You only get to have sex with one person for the rest of your life, and that’s exactly what it is – YOUR life.
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@King
I’m glad you added your opinion to the discussion. It helped shine a light on the source of Kiwi’s frustration.
@ Kiwi
Kiwi, What bothers me most about your comments are the personal attacks and general vitriol. To me, anger and passion are okay, they are a part of life. I’ve been there and still have to live with it everyday. An angry tone is also understandable. I have no pretensions to being a “tone cop”.
Stumbledonthis and and you trading insults is something I attribute to obvious youth and inexperience. Some of her comments were just as distasteful as yours.
I envison the comments section of Abagond’s blog as an open air salon or sidewalk cafe. People come, people go. Some stop for a meal, some just want a quick drink. I’ve personally learn quite a bit from Abagond and the savvy crowd of commenters. I don’t always agree with their conclusions, but they always make me think—they provide mental food.
Since Abagond has chosen not to fence off this cafe/salon, there are also a fair amount of drive by bigots who take great delight in yelling virtual obscenities at the assembled patrons of this gathering. This mirrors what I have experienced throughout my life as an African American woman: White people becoming anxious and hostile when Black people gather to talk amongst themselves. I understand this as a holdover from slavery.
Kiwi, you have chosen to participate in a heavily Black space. Not only are there Black people here from North America, but there is an international Black presence, too. There are also plenty of people from other ethnicities and nationalities who frequent this space.
When you choose to engage in name calling instead of reasoned arguments that refute other people’s opinions, it is like someone in the cafe flinging cups, plates of food and overturning tables because they don’t like what other diners are eating. Abagond has an excellent post on argument:
Calling Black people, “racists” is actually pretty laughable…and infuriating. Black people in America, Europe, the Caribbean and Africa are living in a time that could be a precursor to genocide. Asian outgroup dating and marriage issues pale in comparison. Railing about outmarriage versus the continued existence of Black bodies and communities—which do you think is more important to Black people? You may ignore Abagond’s big red numbers tallying unarmed Black people killed and the posts that put a name and a face to the fallen, but I don’t. I’m aware that there are hundreds more beyond that number.
I hope you can find a way to transform your rage and passion into a force that produces light. Right now it is just like a raging forest fire that threatens to consume you.
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@Kiwi
I appreciated your clear-eyed response. You are right, I am fallible. I make my share of mistakes and experience failures. I consider myself in constant learning mode. When I take my last breath, there will still be more to learn.
I am curious? Please define what the term “racism” means to you. We may be operating with different definitions.
To me, the term has been intentionally muddied by White Supremacists so that it no longer applies exclusively to them. Other groups, such as the Palestineans and the Scots have also misused the term to make a point about people they struggle against.
I want to clearly know what you mean.
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Kiwi old buddy, I see you’re having a hard time here? Didn’t I already solve your Asian woman problem? Buy a ticket to China, get in touch with the matchmaker of your parents’ village and find yourself a wife. It worked for a Chinese acquaintance of mine. The girl was really beautiful.
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Kiwi, the way you keep throwing the Black mugger argument around, I have to ask, were you recently mugged by a black guy?
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My god, poor Kiwi, he’s finally getting his azz handed to him. Why am I not surprised?
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I know it’s wrong but I’m enjoying it.
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The first question is do they both speak either Chinese or English to the degree that communication would be easy and free between them. The second question is whether or not they share the same culture to the extent where they can ‘get’ and understand where the other one is coming from. We often take for granted a common culture—allusions to sports teams, commercials, movies, music, books we all read in high school, etc.
Just because their family lineage come from roughly the same geography doesn’t mean that they are in the same place culturally speaking… any more than if I went to Africa and found the the village of my ancestors that I would naturally fall in love with a woman who was raised there. It’s not impossible, but the odds are that we would see the world differently and may even speak in very different languages.
And finally, solving Kiwi’s personal dating dilemma does not mean that the depictions of Asian males in media (or lack of depictions) is in any way solved. Beyond Kiwi, the problem of White supremacy still exists in regard to the primary cause of the problem.
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“The first question is do they both speak either Chinese or English to the degree that communication would be easy and free between them.”
The fact that she couldn’t understand what he’s saying would be a huge advantage for him, as his exchanges with the ladies on this topic show, the more they understand him, the less they like him.
“The second question is whether or not they share the same culture to the extent where they can ‘get’ and understand where the other one is coming from.”
You misunderstood the nature of my advice, it’s not meant for him to find his “soulmate”, but a wife. Being a married man with children will keep him busy and off this and other blogs, writing nonsense. She gets an immediate improvement in standard of living. They both achieve their goal of perpetuating the Chinese race, something which is dear to his heart. I’m not proposing anything radical here, it has worked for millions in China and the rest of the world for millennia.
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“And finally, solving Kiwi’s personal dating dilemma does not mean that the depictions of Asian males in media (or lack of depictions) is in any way solved. Beyond Kiwi, the problem of White supremacy still exists in regard to the primary cause of the problem.”
Sorry, I don’t have a solution for how white people, i.e., the media, see him and others like him. If he’s not going after white women, what difference does it make how white people, i.e., the media, depict him? Abagond showed that 78% of Asian women don’t go for White guys, why fixate on the remaining 22%? Why neglect China, where that ratio is likely 99.999999%?
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Actually, she my be living better than most Americans… depending on who she is, and where Kiwi’s parents may come from.
Also when and where did Kiwi state that his goal was to “perpetuate the Chinese race?”
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“Actually, she my be living better than most Americans… depending on who she is, and where Kiwi’s parents may come from.”
Doubtful, “Simply calculating the GDP concludes that China will catch up economically to the United States in the year 2024. When taking into account population growth and GDP per capita, the data tells a different story as it will take China 31 years to catch up to the United States in 2041.” (http://www.uschina.usc.edu/article@usct?measuring_living_standards_with_gdp_per_capita_18543.aspx)
“Also when and where did Kiwi state that his goal was to “perpetuate the Chinese race?””
An inference based on his anxieties about interracial dating and fear of extermination, should China and the USA go to war.
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National GDP is not a predictor of individual wealth.
That seems a slender thread for such an general inference about a person.
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” on Mon 29 Feb 2016 at 02:23:37
King
National GDP is not a predictor of individual wealth.
“An inference based on his anxieties about interracial dating and fear of extermination, should China and the USA go to war.”
That seems a slender thread for such an general inference about a person.”
You asked and I answered. Since you found my answers unsatisfactory I can’t help you, so move on.
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Fool.
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Now we can move on.
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Nice manners you have. I take my time to converse with you like an adult and you act like a spoiled brat. “Now we can move on.” There’s more than one of you?
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Oh… I’m sorry. I didn’t realize you were attempting to converse like an adult.
So what was your reason again for assuming that if any Chinese girl married Kiwi that she would have to be better of financially? Something about the entire GDP of China as compared to that of United States I believe… was that not it?
And Kiwi and some Chinese girl have this goal of “perpetuating the Chinese race?” What was your adult reasoning for this again? I seem to have forgotten.
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In a comment above I stated my position regarding the main topic of this thread:
(https://abagond.wordpress.com/2013/06/07/my-position-on-relationships-between-black-women-and-white-men/#comment-177629)
The last comments speculate a lot about positions of the poster Kiwi regarding a similar issue of Asian women/White men pairings.
Regarding dating in general and interracial dating and/or marrying in particular I want to say a few things:
* Life is short and options available to each of us are not infinite; please go after the person (man or woman) of your preference whatever the race, group or nationality; do not bow to group pressures of any sort, but make rational decisions about your life;
* (This is the standard advice people give to men who say not be able to have the woman of their dreams, or even simply be able to get laid) Do not obsess of a woman who don’t want or like you; there are many others out there who certainly would appreciate your companionship and be happy to be with you; these are the women you should focus on; maybe the same is true with the genders reversed; so Asian American men should forget about those Asian American women who explicitly show a preference for White men; forget them and focus on other women, Asian American or not who would like to be with you; the same for Black women who feel that some Black men show explicit preference for White women; forget them, there are many others men, Black or not who would like to be your sweetheart;
* If many Asian American women show preferences for White men, this is their right, but again, each of them should try to make rational decisions about their own lives (only they can do that); every choice has consequences; as an Asian American woman, for example, are you ready to contemplate the possibility of your male Eurasian offspring (product of your decision of marry a White man) being torn apart between two worlds and unable to fit in any of them, like in the sagas of Daniel Holtzclaw and Elliot Rodger? Are you ready? If yes, it’;s OK, go ahead! If not, think twice!
* Dating and marrying are affected by the overall racism that is everywhere in some societies; don’t be foolish to forget the general social environment where you live, but also don’t bow to pressures not to marry a person of another race if this happens to be your preference or luck;
* There is a large world out there; if you don’t find a partner in your social environment, think about searching elsewhere, in another city, or in another country or even in another (sub-)continent; I think, for example, that many Asian American men and also Black American women, could find easily an appropriate partner in Latin America; want a beautiful White (Latina?) female? Go to the South of the Rio Grande; there are plenty of opportunities there; recently I was invited to a prenuptial party where a Dutch guy, who confessed to me to have difficulties in “understanding” Dutch women – he is White -, found its sweetheart in Maputo, in the person of a Latina expatriate; love in first sight!;
* I’m not sure why some posters assume that Kiwi has, personally, difficulties in his relationships; I assumed (and assume) that he is trying to bring to this forum relevant social issues facing the people of USA, not necessarily his personal affairs; maybe I’m wrong but this is what thought; only he can explain…; I think, anyway, that Kiwi‘s contributions, as well as jefe‘s contributions, in this blog, are important, because they help everybody to see how racial issues unfold in a different location – the boundary between White and Asian American; it’s good to know how similar issues are dealt with by others;
* few thoughts, humm… time to end!
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I do agree that many of the Asian American women who date and marry white men are with losers who have control issues and other emotional problems and my guess is that these losers stalk and study their prey in order to form the relationship. But the bigger question to me is why the Asian American women date and marry these creeps( many of them are creeps, just not all, 🙂
Asian American women have very high rates of depression and suicide and probably also low self esteem and that would explain how and why these relationships form. It would also explain, at least to me, why the children of these unions have such a hard time.
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“I am curious? Please define what the term “racism” means to you. We may be operating with different definitions.
To me, the term has been intentionally muddied by White Supremacists so that it no longer applies exclusively to them. Other groups, such as the Palestineans and the Scots have also misused the term to make a point about people they struggle against.”
.
Of course the words “racist” and “racism” have been so loosely defined of late that it no longer applies exclusively to the people it should be exclusively assigned to. So, in effect, anyone can supposedly qualify as a racist. Even the victims of racists, and racism.
Since English is an ever evolving and changing language, shaped by white supremacists/racists who seek to camouflage or hide their oppressive whiteness, my definition of racism is:
Having the systemic power to define another group’s fate and/or destiny on a systemic level.
In today’s upside-down and confusing English vernacular, people often refer to words like “prejudice,” “discrimination,” “bias,” and “preference,” as racism. They have made all of the above words, and their meanings as words that are synonymous with “racist” or racism when they are NOT.
If racism/racist is what everyone NOWADAYS (including the DICTIONARY) THINKS it means, then the word has been effectively rendered utterly meaningless – and useless. That’s pretty much what the white-supremacists want. No word or words that plainly or clearly depicts what they’re about.
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@ Fan
That definition is closest to mine. Most Black people think of “racism” in terms of systems and power. That is because Black people live and die according to the dictates other people’s systems and the power to affect their lives.
White people and their allies tend to use the term to describe behavior and beliefs they don’t agree with or that threaten their sense of place in the color caste system of this country.
I would add to your original point with the observation that those who support those systems, though they may not be White themselves, support anti-Black racism.
The constant and casual use of the term “racism” and “racist” to describe
“… the victims of racists, and racism” is often a way to derail discussions and silence criticism that may be too close for comfort….or when a person is on shaky ground in an argument.
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The problem is that this definition is made up. It appears in no English-speaking dictionary anywhere. Unless I am mistaken… But please, if I am wrong, can anyone show me the dictionary where that comes from?
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Genius, all definitions are made up. You don’t find this one in a dictionary if it hasn’t gained currency to place it there.
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No dummy. Definitions are not “made up.” They demonstrate a consensus of opinion on what words mean in any language. Are you really arguing that English dictionaries cannot be relied upon to give the meanings of English words?
Wake up and smell the stink of your own puerile hypocrisy. If it was a White person making the same argument in order to excuse himself with some made up definition then you would be laughing him out of the room. The same as I am now doing to you, grojo.
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@munubantu
Thank you. It is good to see a situation through different eyes.
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Kiwi, in my opinion, you can’t just make up your own definitions. The sky is not the ground and the ground is not the sky. Once every special interest thinks that any word can simply be defined in a way that excludes themselves then words no longer have any meaning. We might as well all be speaking gibberish if we can’t agree on what english words mean. Now, sometimes there is more than one definition to a word… but when you accept a definition that is not even on the list AT ALL as you own primary definition, then something is wrong
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On the subject of dictionary definitions, I found this infographic to be a useful tool:
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“They demonstrate a consensus of opinion on what words mean in any language.” Prior to that somebody had to invent said definitions. “Wake up and smell the stink of your own puerile hypocrisy.” Each one of these words was invented i.e. made up. You could say the same thing using French or Chinese and they would still be made up by the speakers of these languages.
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@ Afrofem.
Yikes! That’s long, but thoughtful. However, it’s still just saying what we all know, that dictionaries present a consensus of opinion on what words mean in a given language So if you want to learn French, then you consult a book that tells you what French words mean.
Now once you go beyond that, of course you can get into nuances—what is behind meanings, how things aren’t always straightforward. All of that is legitimate.
BUT defining racism ONLY as a “system”—while ignoring that most english-speakers refer to the term as a belief that people’s actions are defined by their appearance, or as a prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against someone of a different race based on the belief that one’s own race is superior—seems to narrow the definition rather than expand it.
It’s basically saying that Black people can’t be racist because they redefined what racism means among themselves.
I have no objection to including the “systematic” and “power” components of racism into it’s definitions. But I cannot accept simply using these as the ONLY definitions of racism so that only CERTAIN people can be racist.
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gro jo, words are “invented” but definitions and language “evolve.” I can say “Gwagwag” and insist that it is a word that means beautiful. But since it is just my own private word that I “invented” it is not language. It has no acceptance or broad usage. It cannot be used to effectively communicate with other people. Very young children and mental patients do this all the time. Nobody thinks that because all words were invented that this is a legitimate replacement for English or Farsi.
I can’t just tell people hey… at one point someone made up the word “beauty” so my word is just as legitimate!!! The fact is that “beauty” worked it’s way, through long process of evolution, into the english lexicon. It’s not the “making it up” part that is relevant. The important part is has it been accepted and used?
Beauty has Gwagwag hasn’t.
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Like you’re saying something that I hadn’t already said? Admit it, you’re an a__hole with aggression issues.
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@Kiwi
LOL! Ben Carson will ally with anyone who will stuff his pockets with dollar bills! He will say any number of ridiculous things to keep that cash flowing.
Black people and White people rarely ally against anyone because anti-Black bias is the glue that holds White people and their allies together. Without that shared bias they would quickly become balkanized and start to fight one another.
Asian Americans of all ethnicities are often White America’s most loyal allies. They are happy to be used as ethnic wedges because at least they are “not Black” and at the bottom of the social structure. While I have witnessed Asian Americans dealing with some ugliness with Euro-Americans, for the most part their privilege insulates them from the worst this country metes out.
As far as I’m concerned, you can continue to call me a “racist” because I don’t agree with your positions. I have a pretty clear understanding of the facets of my personality, including my beliefs, behaviors and attitudes. I know that I am not free of bias or prejudice. I don’t feel superior or inferior to anyone else on this planet. I have learned to see each person as a complex being with strengths, frailties, genius and profound ignorance.
I hope that you actually grow as the years pass and not simply age. Your passion and anger can someday be your greatest asset or your greatest liability. Good luck.
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Not really. I admit don’t like you personally, because you’re basically a dummy, and you think that your’e about 3 times smarter than you really are. You can barely answer questions without reverting to the tired old trick of trying to ‘sound superior’… all by way avoiding the very questions you were asked. Do you think nobody notices that?
I don’t go after everybody. In fact, I don’t go after most people. But I just cannot abide an idiot with an attitude. Capisce?
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@ Afrofem
Here’s a dialog I had with another person, at another time, on another thread:
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~********~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
BTW, when exactly did Black people cross over from being victims of racism, to becoming actual racists?
Was it during the Black Codes era, or during the commission of Sun-Down Towns?
Might it be that Black people became racists as a result of being BOMBED (1921) in Tulsa, Oklahoma?
Maybe it was just after the Rosewood *cleansing* in 1923 where Black people were pretty much massacred?
Perchance it was it in the midst of the Jim Crow era???
No, not then? … how about during the NEW Jim Crow era with the recent increase in the caging of Black/Brown bodies at inordinate rates that far exceeds the white incarceration for the same crimes? It should be called the New Slavery as white owned corporations/industries profit greatly from this virtual theft of labor – and increased congressional districts!
Could it have been when Blacks were getting all those so-called quotas (that made many angry white people come up with silly phrases such as “reverse racism”) like Affirmative Action which mostly benefited WHITE people??
Do tell. I’ve always been interested in learning about when, where and how, exactly, (according to others) BLACK people became racists!
********************
taotesan
@ Fan…
“BTW, when exactly did Black people cross over from being victims of racism, to becoming actual racists?”
I have not yet researched the year when the dictionary definitions of racism had changed. Post Civil Rights era in the USA? The white lexicographers in their power, have changed the one word that describes white historical and contemporary hatred of the other and at the same stroke, exonerate themselves, whilst charging the victims of their racism of hatred. This genius move on their part has shifted the blame on to the victim.
———
Obama bombing Middle Eastern women and children does not make the typical victim of racism a racist. Being a murderer and ally with with white people doesn’t necessarily make one a racist.
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Other definitions or ways of seeing racism I agree with:
Matari’s definition of racism:
“When, or if, Black people begin chaining, shipping, enslaving, selling, lynching, raping, oppressing, exploiting, shooting, jailing, whipping, maiming, torturing, evangelizing, robbing, stereotyping, bullying, bombing, segregating, building highways and thruways to dislocate businesses, communities and neighborhoods; creating SUN-DOWN towns, experimenting on, discriminating against, prohibiting, murdering, holding back/controlling in every imaginable way while HATING WHITE PEOPLE en mass via de jure and de facto racism for HUNDREDS of years, then and only then can calling Black people racists make sense.”
Kwamla’s (another commenter) theory/definition re racism states (more or less) that it is impossible for more than one group – at a time – to wield power over another. “In America whites (as a group) have power over Blacks. If two groups have the SAME POWER to oppress and marginalize another group, the original root meaning of RACISM would be rendered meaningless, or could not be applied in this equal power construct.”
Herneith, another long standing commenter here has asserted, more or less:
“A Black person making a so-called racist comment/action is in reality nothing more than a reaction to racism. Reacting to racism is NOT racism.”
————————————————–
If a victim of child molestation REACTED to his/her molestation by harming (or offending) his/her molester, would you accuse the molester’s victim of being a child molester?
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Fan’s explanation of how he sees things helps to explain why there is a disconnect in the understanding of the meaning of racism. For him, and some of the others, it is seen purely in the framework of white supremacy, where one group (the perpetrator) is pitted against the other (ie, THE victim).
Notice how the last “THE” is in capital letters.
However, it is very limited in concept by being fixed into the constraints of the model. Any phenomenon which is not described by the model is either forced to fit into the model, or just simply ignored.
If a victim of child molestation reacts to his molester directly (eg, in defense or pointing the finger back at him), then most would not say the victim is a child molester also.
HOWEVER,
if that victim goes on to molest other children, then yes, the victim becomes a child molester himself. or if the victim takes it out on other people in a different form (eg, to his/her wife or husband) almost as a surrogate to the original molester, then he is directing his pent-up rage at someone else, making that person a victim, and an indirect victim of his original molestation.
If that were indeed the appropriate analogy used to explain racism in terms of black victims in a white supremacist society, then the very same analogy is useful to illustrate how blacks in such society go on to become racists themselves, or direct their racism towards 3rd party surrogates (who become victimized by their racism).
The disparity in the concept of racism explains a lot and also makes me more aware of what to make of it when I see it. In such a conceptual framework, it not only explains why whites are blind to their own racism in a white supremacist society, it also explains why certain victims (eg, blacks) are blind to the racism that they learn and absorb and perform in such society.
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King wrote: ” on Tue 1 Mar 2016 at 06:20:43
King
Not really. I admit don’t like you personally, because you’re basically a dummy, and you think that your’e(sic) about 3 times smarter than you really are. You can barely answer questions without reverting to the tired old trick of trying to ‘sound superior’… all by way avoiding the very questions you were asked. Do you think nobody notices that?
I don’t go after everybody. In fact, I don’t go after most people. But I just cannot abide an idiot with an attitude. Capisce?”
So now you’re Italian? When did I fail to answer your questions? If you didn’t like my answers, I don’t see why that’s my problem? Talking about smart, I don’t know if I’m or not, but I see from your confusion about the spelling of the contraction of “you are” that you’re not the one fit to seat in judgement of my intelligence. Got it?
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Um, nice try!
“if that victim goes on to molest other children, then yes, the victim becomes a child molester himself. or if the victim takes it out on other people in a different form (eg, to his/her wife or husband) almost as a surrogate to the original molester, then he is directing his pent-up rage at someone else, making that person a victim, and an indirect victim of his original molestation. ”
.
“The disparity in the concept of racism explains a lot and also makes me more aware of what to make of it when I see it. In such a conceptual framework, it not only explains why whites are blind to their own racism in a white supremacist society, it also explains why certain victims (eg, blacks) are blind to the racism that they learn and absorb and perform in such society.”
You rally very hard (and without success!) on the molestation aspect. It is as if you missed the other aspects of what system/individual racism is – and isn’t.
“A Black person making a so-called racist comment/action is in reality nothing more than a reaction to racism. Reacting to racism is NOT racism.”
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namely what Kwamla pointed out
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Just to clarify my points from last night. I believe that what Black activists often say about racism has a big kernel of truth in it. That is that racism is MUCH more effective and dangerous when wielded by the people in a society who hold sway over its institutions, its economy, and it’s conventions. Therefore (for example) in the U.S. White racism effects all non-White minorities to a much greater extent than does (for example) Black racism against Whites, on a societal level. With greater social privilege comes greater social responsibility.
However, in my opinion, racism should not depend for it’s definition on what the person looks like who espouses it. The definition for racism should apply equally to ANYBODY who believes that people are controlled by the way they look, or that people of a certain look are superior or inferior to people of another look.
Dictionaries define words, Encylopedias go into greater detail, history, and nuance. If you read about racism in an encyclopedia it will include MANY aspects of racism, including the power dynamic. However, the encyclopedia will not cross out every other definition and say that the power dynamic is the only important factor in defining racism and that no other definition is important.
Activists make a good point that Black racism (on a societal level) is usually not the same as White racism, in that it is very often reactionary to the broad application of White racism worldwide. However, that doesn’t mean that, even if it is reactionary, it cannot be called racism, according to the primary definition. There can be differences of practice within the phenomenon of racism.
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Fan, I fully GET those aspects 100%. Did not miss the point at all.
Seems like you missed some points, though.
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My assertions are based upon what the words “racism” and “racist” ORIGINALLY/historically meant when they entered into Amerika’s lexicon prior to the Civil Rights and (bogus–>) Political Correctness eras.
Plainly said:
Racism is WHITE supremacy. WHITE supremacy is racism.
Racism is not this MORPHED or watered down version (interchangeable with words like: prejudice, bias, hatred, preference, discrimination) found in recent WHITE Supremacist’s dictionaries or handbooks that is now GLIBLY poured upon the heads of victims of racism, rather than themselves.
Unlike some of you here, I get that LOUD and CLEAR. I have not missed their tricks. Neither has Mr. Neely Fuller Jr, or Dr. Frances Cress Welsing among many others
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The definition of racism is a neat trick on the part of the Europeans who, pun intended, are the ones who make up these definitions for the most part. I prefer to use the term white supremacy which has permeated the globe for the past hundreds of years. If you meet a ‘racist’ racialized person, they are usually reacting to white supremacy be it through blatant ignorant stereotyping or, internalizing the effects of white supremacy and inflicting this self-f loathing (conscious or not), on others.
The racialized person has been suffering white supremacy’s effect in some shape or the other. The question is, can they wake up? Can they separate the wheat from the chaff when it comes to everyday life? It is nice to come to a blog and debate what ‘racism’ is but how many have attempted to counter it in the real world? How about discussing this, ways of countering white supremacy, rather than debating the white man’s definition? I’ll admit it can be entertaining to have these discussions but that’s all it is, entertaining.
I take great pleasure in the ‘real world’ going after these white supremacist a**holes at every opportunity. I do not give a sh*t as to procuring their acceptance or lack thereof. My bottom line when dealing with white supremacists is thus; ‘if you want the ‘privilege’ of discriminating, debasing all the negative things you love to do in order to maintain your unwarranted power, well you will have to pay for that ‘privilege’’. Pay they have. There is nothing more comical than using the tools THEY have put in place to do so. The only time they ‘change’ or cede a little ‘power’ is when they have to fork out money either large amounts or cumulatively. They then begin to ‘change’ albeit at a snail’s pace until another upheaval occurs. Actually, it is hilariously predictable.
Oh and lastly, don’t empower these white supremacist and their self-loathing minions by getting upset. Ever hear the old adage laughter is a great panacea? Or something to that effect, well, it is true. When they see you p*ssed off and downcast, they are happy because you ain’t.
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if we read Fan’s statement
What are we supposed to make of Chris Rock’s sick jokes with the 3 young kids on stage? Followed shortly by the zinger by Sacha Cohen.
Was that racist? or not?
What is this talk about “diversity”?
I noticed long ago that some of the commenters have imbibed the white supremacy cocktail for so long that they are actually brainwashed to believe, even perpetuate its tenets. Chris Rock should not have been that blind. But lo and behold.
@Herneith
for some of the commenters here on this blog, it appears not.
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Fan, I will have been educated and stand corrected if you can give me that source. To what original documents are you referring to for this ORIGINAL and HISTORICAL definition? All I’m asking for is the origin and the history, if there was a previous definition to racism. Where do you get it from and how is it documented?
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“All I’m asking for is the origin and the history, if there was a previous definition to racism. Where do you get it from and how is it documented?”
.
It can be found somewhere on Racismreview.com.
That’s where I found it.
From what I can recall,sociology Professor Joe Feagin substantiates the origin and original use of those R words in one of his posts and.or comments on that site. I believe Feagin said that the word “racism” was first coined by a German scholar to describe what was being done systemically to oppress and marginalize Jewish people by so-called white people or Nazis.
You can verify the origin/root of the word with Prof Feagin, or perhaps with his colleagues or students.
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@Fan
Thank you for daylighting those comments from Matari, Kwamla and Herneith.
I wish I could say I was surprised by the endless semantic games, definition arguments and plain old fashioned name calling this discussion has provoked. We live in an age of heavy propaganda, lack of accountability by those at the top and pervasive cruelty. If the people at the top are able to openly harm others and get away with it why wouldn’t those attitudes and behaviors seep down into the general population?
I recently re-read George Orwell’s 1984. One overriding theme in the book was the constant manipulation of words and language.
WAR IS PEACE.
FREEDOM IS SLAVERY.
IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH.
These slogans were used incessantly as part of a program to enslave and control the minds of the population in the book. If you can get people to simultaneously close their minds and believe in an alternate reality, they are capable of doing anything, and I do mean anything you demand of them. Nothing is too low or too illogical.
Over the past decades, rightwing media and corporate media pushed a highly successful campaign to convince White Americans that they, not the people they oppress on a daily basis are, “victims” of anti-White racism.
http://now.tufts.edu/news-releases/whites-believe-they-are-victims-racism-more-o
Sikivu Hutchinson, wrote a 2014 piece entitled, White Wealth & the Cult of White Victimhood in which she discussed the ridiculous lengths Whites have descended to convince themselves that they are victims of Black people and others:
According to this narrative, Black people who face bullets, tasers, food deserts, ramshackle schools, ejection from hospitals, daily micro aggressions and intergenerational trauma (from the pain our parents and grandparents endured) are also bigoted bullies who oppress Whites and other non-Black people with our “racist” words and actions.
I used to get upset with all of this unfounded criticism. Now I understand it as a tactic to silence and dismiss legitimate Black concerns. After all, if you can keep Black people on the defensive with imagined “Black racism”,
they are less likely to call you out on your White Supremacist attitudes and actions.
A neat trick indeed.
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@Hernieth
LOL! So true. I love your spirit!
I’m taking your advice, Madame Afro-Canadienne.
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Thank you Fan for the general reference. I have been unable to find that passage on the origins of the word racism so far, but I’ll keep searching around on the site.
In any case, the word seems to predates the Nazi’s, as the Oxford English Dictionary first attributes utterance of the word racism to a man named Richard Henry Pratt in 1902.
Many have attributed the word to a transliteration by Leon Trotsky in 1927 (which is incorrect). But we are really only talking about the modern form of the word. Actually, “racialism” (1871) and “racialist” (1917) were already used to connote the same meaning much earlier. So the etymology of the word was gradual and evolved from older but similar sounding words.
What I am looking for is something that says that “Racism” meant ‘only White people against other races.’ Not just when it was first used, but proof that it was used with exclusive intent to White people. It would really take that to make the case.
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Blacks have the right to criticize other races, both White and non-White. But when it comes to other races criticizing Blacks, their grievances should be dismissed or downplayed because Blacks cannot be racist.
What are you doing about this? Not everyone subscribes to this, so who is stereotyping here? The views and comments on this blog form but a miniscule element of society at large. As for Asians and blacks working together against white supremacy, I have seen this in the ‘real world’. The press tends to obscure this. The only time you read about this is when there is dissension between two racialized groups. ‘Awake’ racialized people know what ‘day it is’ believe me. They realize the dissension sown by white supremacy serves as an effective tool in the proverbial divide and conquer meme. I have never read of Asians publicly criticizing ‘Blacks’ here in Canada. If anything, they tend to stand together on common issues such as carding and racial discrimination. I can’t comment on the States per se.
There are blatantly ignorant people among racialized people. Are they racist? No, just ignorant. This is a vestige of worldwide colonization, slavery, a revenant if you will that lingers like a bad stench. You need to go after white supremacist and their minions, not other racialized people. You are playing right into the White supremacist hands, employing the same divide and conquer ideals. With that being said, I will confess, I am ignorant as well in many things but I try to divest myself of my ignorance as much as I can. Try it. Anyone pretending to all-encompassing knowledge is full of fecal matter. Stop obsessing over these Asian women who only date white men. Do you really want what YOU see as some white man’s self-loathing cast-off?
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@ Herneith
Like.
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@taotesan
I just re-read a comment of yours embedded in Fan’s comment:
Well said.
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This comment thread is closed due to length. Please continue to the repost:
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