A woman is a female human who is at least old enough to marry and have children. They are the part of mankind that can give birth (or once could). A woman is the most beautiful thing God has created. As beautiful as the stars and the hills are, a woman is more beautiful still.
Men and women do not completely understand each other. Some think they understand the opposite sex, but they are only fooling themselves. As a man I can only tell you the part I understand.
When I was younger, before I got married and had children, I thought that men and women were pretty much the same, the only difference being their bodies. This was the latest thinking at the time. But now that I am older, what an ancient book says makes far more sense: God created man and woman separately but made them to be together, to become one flesh, to be two sides of a greater whole. Like day and night, land and sea, the sun and moon.
So while women are clearly human, they are not just men with a different body. Far from it. They have a different nature, they are different in mind and spirit. They think differently, act differently and like different things.
When a woman from Sumatra meets a woman from Jamaica, do they talk about the war? No, they talk about shoes. I have seen it for myself.
Some think it is just a matter of how children are brought up – boys are brought up one way, girls another. But it is not as simple as that.
For example, my wife has made it a point never to give our boys play guns. Did that stop them? Did that make them into peaceful, gentle creatures? No: they made sticks into guns. But can you imagine girls doing that on their own? Anywhere in the world?
Unlike most men, most women like to shop, they want flowers and for you to not to forget their birthday. Sex is important, but love more so. They want to be loved and they want to be wanted. Most think they are fat and ugly and are always trying to lose weight and look beautiful. They are far more interested in fashion, food, health and good manners than men are. They are more vain yet tend to be more religious. They talk way more than men.
Their point of view is not in their head but in their heart – something I am always forgetting to my cost. Their feelings are more easily hurt.
Compared to men, most women are not much interested in war, machines, ball games or the news.
In my experience, women do not work together as well as men do. Men are pack animals, women are not.
That is the truth as I see it. It will not please everyone. I wish someone had been straight with me and told me these things when I was much younger. You certainly will not find them in the Wikipedia.
See also:
- The Wikipedia article on woman – never once says anything about beauty or shopping! It has a picture of a naked woman to make us better people by curing us of our medieval shame.
- political correctness
- black women
- white women
- Jamaica
- Wikipedia
- How a man looks at a woman
- The ten most beautiful women in the world
What a beautiful and poetic description!
I can easily say that i found myself in it.
Such an article must have been write by a men, who really loves women for what they are, and not for whatt they seem to be.
*applause* lol
I love this article and every article of this blog…mature reflexion^^
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Thanks.
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I agree. Women are a very special gift from God and need to be appreciated!
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I love the picture at the top, I always find women in niquabs (even though her forehead is show)ing mysterious… It makes me thinnk “What do you look like?” Lol.
Anway back to the matter at hand… A lovely article, I just dont understand why it is that love women soooooo much… U pour alot of time and effort into these articles, why not write a novel and make some money out of it?
Keep up the interesting work though.
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I love that picture too. It fits the article too: women are beautiful and yet a mystery.
Good suggestion about money: that I currently make no money from writing limits the amount of time I can spend at it.
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“For example, my wife has made it a point never to give our boys play guns. Did that stop them? Did that make them into peaceful, gentle creatures? No: they made sticks into guns. But can you imagine girls doing that on their own? Anywhere in the world?”
My female cousin and I used to tape together spoons into guns — on our own.
This is a well-thought-out and eloquent piece, but that part bothered me a little. I realize that most of this is generalization, but girls (mostly prepubescent ones; the war-games seem to disappear after puberty) can be just as aggressive in terms of their pretending as boys can.
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I love them, I really do. But when you have a mug(face) like mine, women avoid you like the plague.
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“In my experience, women do not work together as well as men do. Men are pack animals, women are not.”
This is true. I hated my last job with a passion: it was 98% women and b*tchiness. The job I held before that was more than 80% men and I loved it. I had 10 big brothers I could talk computers and gaming with, as well as everyday politics.
I adore fashion and I love talking about it with other women, but only on a limited basis and usually with maybe one or two at a time. Any more in a group and it’s like that old adage…two become friends, three (always) leaves one out.
But shoes…two women from opposites ends of the world can talk about shoes happily and not understand a single word the other says.
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For example, my wife has made it a point never to give our boys play guns. Did that stop them? Did that make them into peaceful, gentle creatures? No: they made sticks into guns. But can you imagine girls doing that on their own? Anywhere in the world?
Snort. As if boys need their parents to give them guns to get the message, loud and clear, that that’s what society wants them to do.
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But shoes…two women from opposites ends of the world can talk about shoes happily and not understand a single word the other says.
This is supposedly biological, is it? What about those many cultures in which people wear no shoes?
Seriously: you guys are heavily universalizing your particulars when you say stuff like this.
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men are stupid
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jk
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I’m using a stereotype, I know. Mea culpa.
Should I preface my statement and say it applies to only to those women with access to television and with an interest in fashion? Even those really tomboyish types like me?
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@ Thaddeus
Now you have me thinking about this more. Maybe shoes wouldn’t be the item to use, but what else is there that is universal across all cultures that women have in common?
I do have to ask though, give me a few cultures that do not use shoes at this time. The reason behind it cannot be lack of money. We women are a prideful lot, if we have access to money and can afford to(after children are fed and house is taken care of), we will adorn ourselves, shoes, clothes, jewelry.
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This is one of those posts I don’t agree with. I do believe men and women are pretty much the same. The biggest difference, besides biology, is upbringing. I know all the cultures have different “strategies” and rules on raising boys and girls. Still, I don’t think men and women have that different brains or way of thinking.
My experience says some of these generalizations are true. Especially the one about women not working together as well as men do.
I never understood shoes obsession. Never. I admit I am a tomboy, and I know nothing about fashion, but to me, shoes are something that you wear so you don’t walk barefoot outside. They should be comfortable. End of story. I honestly don’t understand what’s so interesting about shoes, or what’s there to talk about.
Ok, I know, shoes- that’s just one example, doesn’t mean anything. But seriously, I don’t think that’s something that makes women sooooo different. And I don’t think men and women are so different that they’re unable to understand each other. I am not into that “mystery” thing (women/men are mystery, they make world go round…) That’s not the way I see it.
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I played soccer (traveling team) and football with the boys, high school field hockey with the girls (and danger has no home like the field of a female field hockey team), ran track (my coach was Carl Lewis’s mom, from the 1984 Olympics, and she thought I was good enough to compete!) and maintained my own horse (ugh- stables!) until we had to sell him when I was 16. I was a tomboy with a capital T, who just happened to like fashion.
But then I am weird like that. I know it and I’ve passed it onto my daughter who is the same.
I also talk too much, sorry.
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Once again not a queer friendly post, you ought to go read up. All the heteronormativity, gender-binarism, gender stereotypes and cissexism are really starting to rub me the wrong way. I encourage you to get better acquainted with language and ideas that are queer friendly.
not a fan of this post.
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Her
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Nothin’ make a man feel better than a woman. Queen with a crown…
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A song about some things to do with a woman…
Babies
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My Little Girl (or woman of the world.)
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Woman in love
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Cactus is a song about a convict whose been away for a long while. His longing for his woman appears to be reaching a psychological breaking point.
Sitting here wishing on a cement floor
Just wishing that I had just something you wore
Bloody your hands on a cactus tree
Wipe it on your dress and send it to me
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*who’s
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Bulanik posted (in the Open Thread):
Nothing as eye-catching as a nice butt in a neon yellow cat suit!(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6gAME56uXWo)
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Legion said:
@ Bulanik
That catsuit project is amazing. People playing it cool but wanting to snap pics and going ahead and snapping pics. The coolest people are the ones that just come up to her and say they like the suit; the meat packing district video is like this.
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Bulanik responded:
@ Legion
If someone looks good, and it’s not intrusive to do it, then what’s wrong with letting them know they look nice and then leaving them be?!
Many of those reactions to that lady were uncalled-for. But it tells you a lot, doesn’t it…
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@ Bulanik
What’s hitting me is the cliche of “humans are social creatures.” People know this is a psychological fact but maybe don’t always see it as starkly as in these catsuit videos. Yes, some of the reactions were not cool, some unpleasant, but all of it fascinating. I guess some of those people just put the woman into “other” or object status. But again, I love the really social people who were free with letting her in on their appreciation.
But that woman is not an “other”, she’s a woman.
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Bulanik, I thought your link and our convo thus far should be in a permanent home. This was what I found; no art threads as far as I can see.
Your initial link is in moderation that started everything is temporarily in moderation.
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*Your initial link, that started everything, is in moderation.
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Legion, generally now — it might be no bad thing to have art threads.
Art is in so many areas of life…
I thought “Blade Runner” was getting there, and “Breaking Bad” seemed to have stirred emotions in the author.
The Bible, as literature, perhaps as well. Dance, too.
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As I was searching for an appropriate thread for your link, I became aware of the art that is prominent on the site: writing.
But that’s not what I or you had in mind, of course.
Blade Runner? You mean those threads on the future that was/wasn’t?
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Writing is an art. But there are others, other arts.
To me, art can be writing, films, tv — as well as what we generally class as art.
That definition seems quite narrow here…
Not the future that wasn’t, I mean the film.
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Oh, okay. Yes, Blade Runner feels impressionistic like modernized Debussey. The soundtrack has a lot to do with that but the movie is quite something too.
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Wow, I never thought of it as impressionistic, Legion. Not visually at least. Musically yes, the music could be described as Impressionistic — so suggestive of rainy nights and gloom. I didn’t know that impressionism described music, but I follow you.
I didn’t think of Claude Debussy either, when I was listening to the Blade Runner film, more, the musical sound of Java, for the subtle tones: (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ZAumC4JP3o)
To me the visual of Blade Runner is Jean Giraud.
http://visualmelt.com/Moebius
*******************************************************************************************
Yet, the overarching feel and the sound, of the film, yes, Debussy — you’re right. 😀
That electronic, ambient background theme music DOES sound like modernized version of Debussy’s “Claire de lune”. I just compared.
Also remember, the highest point of the film is the moment of poetry when Ray Batty dies in the rain, which led me to think of the the poem, title “Claire de lune” (“Moonlight”), written by Paul Verlaine, and as Verlaine and Debussy were turn-of-the-century contemporaries.
The words of one may have inspired the music of the other:
Your soul is a chosen landscape
Where charming masqueraders and bergamaskers go
Playing the lute and dancing and almost
Sad beneath their fanciful disguises…..
(^^from Wiki’s translation of the poem.)
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Legion, remarks are in moderation.
This is a fine idea of yours.
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That art. I like it … a lot.
The music, yes the tones (bell sounding tones) are pleasant.
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Competitive Societies Are Happy If the Women Are Less Competitive Than the Men
Evert Van de Vliert and
Onne Janssen1
+ Author Affiliations
University of Groningen
Abstract
Societies are less happy to the extent that their members are more competitive. A 42-nation regression study, based on aggregated indicators of female competitiveness, male competitiveness, four components of happiness, and national development restricts this negative cultural link between overall competitiveness and average happiness to certain countries. A more competitive society is less happy only if its members deviate from the stereotype that women are less competitive than men. A populace is least happy if both genders are highly competitive.
http://ccr.sagepub.com/content/36/4/321.abstract
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Open Question to the women who comment on the blog:
What traits/qualities are essential for you to consider a man as marriage material?
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Legion
I think it’s the same kinda thing men would want
For me it was. . .
*Same faith/religion
*Chemistry
*Enough in common, or differences that don’t make it impossible for us to make a life together
*Silly/funny/easy going
*Somewhat conservative, traditional values
*Humility
*No racism or misogyny
*Compassionate/Good hearted
*Attractive
*High s-x drive and good/adventurous in bed
That’s it really.
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Bows before Kiwi. . . which, ironically, could be seen as reinforcing gender roles.
@Legion
I saw that study a while back, I find it really disappointing. Would this be the pattern if other minorities were given the equality to be competitive also? I saw this documentary called “Missrepresentation” on netflicks not too long ago about how far away America is from achieving the equality it thinks it has, for women. It made for some uncomfortable viewing.
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He must bring home a humongous pay check, anything else, looks, personality, are extras. Oh, he must be breathing and coherent.
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@ Ebony
* easy going
How so? It’s a little vague.
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@Legion
For example: I’m not particularly confrontational; I don’t mind debating, and everyone argues from time to time, but I couldn’t deal with the immature mindset where we can’t just agree to disagree.
I guess easy going/laid back would be a better way to define such a quality.
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@ Ebony
* silly
You didn’t just say ‘funny’ but you also said ‘silly’. I guess you mean not overly serious? Even a little quirky? Or do you just mean, able to have fun and be fun?
Not to worry, I won’t question you about every point. 🙂
I’m just vague on some of what you might mean, that’s all.
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That’s okay, I shall try to elaborate.
I wouldn’t mind quirky, but when I said “silly” I meant being able to be “goofy,” and have a giggle. I think that’s what they called it in the States when I was there, “goofy.”
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Anyone else?
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“He must bring home a humongous pay check, anything else, looks, personality, are extras. Oh, he must be breathing and coherent.”
_ _ _
LOL. What a great philosophy! My downfall has long been my preference for a really great looking man who is also personable, intelligent, learned, confident and gainfully employed.
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Excellent comment, Kiwi!
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@Legion: Someone like you. Hehe.
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^ Mary, you rascal! 😀
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How ’bout a real list Mary? 🙂
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@ Pay it Forward
I suppose the following quality would fit under “learned” but I’ve a sense you dig a well spoken man who has an excellent grasp of good grammer.
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… among other things, of course.
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Someone who likes to travel, and someone that likes the theater and movies, and someone who can make me laugh, and someone who gets my quirkiness. Someone that loves music and reading, that is a really good kisser.
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@ Legion: Someone who can cook who can introduce me to new epicuriean delights. And just someone that is fun. I need to laugh. I added this to the above comments. ^^^^^^^^^
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Hmm, “really good kisser” means slow as honey, with mixes of force and light butterfly kisses. Am I right?
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@ Legion: Oh Yeah, He has to have good hygyne and good oral hygene and clean shaven, and nice teeth.
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@ Legion: Yeah, that’s would be about right.
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My orthodontist once complemented me on my awesome teeth–go me!
* Clean shaven
I just shaved off my beard because of work complications. I had ever grown one before but over the last few months I grew one to try it out. I tell you, I have never been so drop dead handsome as when I had my beard. It’s a good look for a black man: inky darkness against brown or tawny skin. Don’t count the bearded brothers out Mary!
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* i hate the good boy Gap/Obama look! –Yuck!–
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@ Legion like beards just not the duck dynasty nasty unkempt kind, Nice trim beards are attractive.
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Generalizations about men and women are ok as long as they don’t descend into stereotypes. I get along great with the women at my job. We work together very well. We don’t talk about shoes very much– I really don’t care about shoes. I’m not into shopping or fashion. The woman I’m closest to at my job is really into sports. I care more about literature and art.
My point of view is fairly balanced between my head and my heart. I don’t think with my emotions! I’m married to a man who doesn’t care anything about sports and who would feel very hurt if I forgot his birthday, or our anniversary.
Men and women have been proven by recent studies to use about the same number of words every day. There are actually greater variations within each sex than there are between the sexes.
I think men and women can understand one another fairly well if they remember that we are both first of all humans. Women are not mysterious half-human creatures. We want love, but so do men. Wanting love is human. So is wanting respect.
I believe what you said about God creating men and women to complement one another, but I have come to reject the idea that the Bible teaches gender hierarchy. God did not create men to lead and women to follow. We were meant to walk together side by side.
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@ Legion
The other ladies have already covered most of the essential traits for a good husband. Mine is a bit of a cliched laundry list but here goes:
1. He should be funny. This doesn’t mean that he’s the kind of guy who continually makes wisecracks, just that I find his jokes funny and laugh at them. I like laughing and I think most other women do too.
2. He should be kind. By this I don’t mean ‘nice’ in terms of knowing when to say please and thank you although this is obviously a good thing too! But more importantly he should be the kind of person who has genuine compassion for other people. Someone who gives other people help when they need it even if he doesn’t particularly like them. Someone who doesn’t enjoy hurting or talking nastily about other people.
3. He should be family minded and should respect women. This is cliched but the way a guy treats and talks about the women in his family/friendship circle is the key to his character.
4. He should be adventurous. I think Ebonymonroe or one of the other ladies already covered this off. To me, adventurous means that he likes doing new things, whether that is going camping in the bush for a weekend, travelling to a completely new country or trying one of my cooking experiments.
5. He should be intelligent. This means that he should care about getting an education both in an academic and non-academic sense. Someone who reads a lot and thinks about what he reads.
6. He should be fit. Doesn’t mean the guy should look like anything like a movie star but he should care about his overall health. That really sounds shallow but being healthy and exercising often is important to me. Luckily my hubby enjoys it too. In a less shallow sense it means he’ll probably live longer so we have a good chance of growing old together!
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@ Legion
… and i have to steal one more from Ebonymonroe. CHEMISTRY! That’s absolutely essential – otherwise what you have is a really good platonic friendship 🙂
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Cool! Thanks Wordy.
Nah, number 6 doesn’t sound shallow at all.
I consider fitness important too, but even if I were to cast fitness aside (only for argument’s sake), I’m still very much into a woman’s looks (not just her looks though), I don’t feel shallow about that.
You made a critical point about the chemistry thing, very critical.
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I’m gonna add a decent sized penis to the list. Not like a ridiculous Lexington Steel or Mandingo one (if that’s their names . . . haven’t watched porn in years), but not a tiny one either. I prefer a decent sized sack also; not basketballs, but not n!pple nu+$ either. I do prefer a pretty penis, and if I’m going to be playing with just that one until my dying day, I’d want it to be appealing.
Abagond, are you going to do a post on “men?”
So let’s get your list Legion.
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I forgot,; a wealthy older man with a severe heart problem.
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@ Legion — the person has to make you feel something electrical.
That chemistry is not always predictable, like a look or some such. It can happen in a matter of seconds. It could be the confidence of a person. Something distinct, but still hard to pin down… There are inner qualities and their physical characteristics. Those combinations.
*
Kindness, absolutely. Same religion? — NO WAY! 😀
The ability to be selfless and truly give and surrender oneself — judgmental, misogynist men — and women — are so off-putting.
The willingness to nurture and listen can be awesome.
(I am always impressed by “maternal” qualities in a man. Emotional maturity.)
It’s quite sexy if a man knows his power, but uses restraint.
The ability to see another person, not just what they can do for you or what you can get from them — that’s more than ‘nice’.
Wordy mentioned funny. There are people who aren’t obviously funny or have any ability to tell jokes, but they have no idea how silly and endearing they are, all the same. That can make up for witty banter. Or starched-shirt grammar!
Ha,
Sometimes humour is in the eyes.
I like beards. Not ZZ Top/Taliban types, but not stubble either. Not too “manicured” and overdone. Oh, no — that means an over-elaborate beauty-routine in front of the mirror. And I don’t like a man whose face-care regime is more involved than mine. But I like very well-scrubbed, though.
Penis size? Omg. lol!
Well, he’s got to have one! I always check out the lunch-box even if I wouldn’t normally talk about it!!!
I get Ebony’s point about the aesthetics of a penis and testicles, but what good is having a pretty penis the size of an aubergine if the owner hasn’t much of a clue how to use it…? A little can go along way as there are all kinds of skills and talents and attitudes that are great to have or acquire, that can make up for natural endowments. And not all women like the feel of “big” or get the greatest pleasures from the use of that organ.
Masterful SWAG, passion and sublime flair, can go way, way further.
As it goes, handsome always works for me. I am partial to masculine eye candy. I know it’s somewhat superficial, but I enjoy male beauty and feasting my eyes on it, and a man who likes to look good is a pleasure to me.
I like a man who takes care of his person and wears nice clothes. Remember how the character played by Brad Pitt dressed in “Fight Club”, or Wesley Snips beautifully cut jackets in “One Night Stand”? Hmmm.
Men with depth of knowledge about things always fascinate. Even if what they know would be classed as “obscure stuff”. I don’t mind that — in fact, I consider it necessary! In my teenage years I was around a lot of very, very smart and creative men who appreciated the intelligence and knowledge of others. These individuals seemed to always be learning or reading, but were NEVER afraid to say what they didn’t know, or forever reluctant and mean in the giving genuine praise to others.
They weren’t “threatened” by that…
And nor were they perfect, believing the could look down on others.
Everything didn’t have to be a pissing contest.
So, I suppose having intellectual respect for a man is a big deal.
A man can hold my attention with his mind because he knows about things.
There’s a lot to be said for the relentlessly interesting and surprising…
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Kiwi
100% agree.
There are a few books about this subject, but probably the earliest I recall, was by Dale Spender. This (excellent) book talked about “semantic derogation” — the way men control the world through language and rely on shutting women down, sometimes directly by men, sometimes through the controlling aggression of other women, and often by the “inner voice” that polices their own psyches.
The book came out in the early 1980s: “Man Made Language”.
I remember a chapter discussing the phallus-y (lol) that women talk more than men, and the author concluding that that only seems so if you compare women’s speech to SILENCE.
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@ Legion: I do want the man to be gainfully employed. BMW. Black Man Working.
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@Bulanik: Glad you are back. Your commentary was missed.
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Bulanik,
“There are a few books about this subject, but probably the earliest I recall, was by Dale Spender. This (excellent) book talked about “semantic derogation” — the way men control the world through language and rely on shutting women down, sometimes directly by men, sometimes through the controlling aggression of other women, and often by the “inner voice” that polices their own psyches.
The book came out in the early 1980s: “Man Made Language”.”
Sounds like a good read.
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@ Kiwi
Bulanik can speak for herself, of course, but asking for a comment deletion is pretty final, I think, at least on the part of the person doing the asking. I just asked for most of my comments to be deleted; such requests aren’t made on a whim, they’re made because the requester unequivocally wishes for their comments to be deleted. Full stop. Anyway, comment restoration may be impossible on Abagond’s end after some passage of time; it’s already been awhile.
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Solesearch, how about it? Quintessential husband traits/qualities.
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@ Kiwi, there are some (old) discussions that don’t flow so clearly.
I am not sure what to say about that.
It was my belief that Abagond, at the time, didn’t mind one jot if there was silence from me because he did not value what came out of my head, my learning and work and life. Perhaps being a woman — hard-to-place, a European, a mixed race kind of Asian black Jew made me supremely easy to resent/ignore/sh*t on. Abagond didn’t believed I deserved any respect, or see me as genuine or worthy of a dialogue, or possibly a person.
That was the message to me.
He judged me. Disliked and took sides against me, over and over.
I felt he did not care whether my entries were deleted or not.
Now, I doubt any of it can be re-instated.
It’s the past. I don’t think about it now.
The blog is still an excellent read.
I think I’ll always respect the blog and its owner.
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@ Solesearch, it’s an excellent book. It talks about naming God, humankind, and what it is to be the norm, rather than the deviant. It talks about the language of sex, and violence, especially rape and domestic violence.
I’d read it again.
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Bulanik: I will look for this book it sounds like something I would read.
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@ Ebonymonroe
So let’s get your list Legion.
Let’s see:
• they are named after a Turkish village.
• they know everything and anything
• they may yet win Miss America but may have to revoke E.U. citizenship to do so.
• they have the most gracious patience for a knucklehead who flirts with them over the internet 😀
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Sounds like a very good read.
When I mention “a decent sized man,” I don’t mean someone the size of a cucumber, just not 2 1/2 inches, nor 9 inches . . . just just right. And yes, he must know how to at least use it, as there extras can be taught. (Don’t worry, will be up the aisle soon, but for now, the years of celibacy are beginning to cause problems.)
Wait a second . . . are the fellas not going to participate by gracing us with their lists?
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Bulanik, Im going to check it out.
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@mary, it’s a book that had a profound affect on my understanding of the way things worked and still do. It’s easy to read, unlike most books!
Dr Spender is a good writer.
Dr Spender would have much to say about this, for example, from the thread “What I have learned from Orwell and Peters”, where Abagond says:
{my emphases}
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@ Kiwi
“Yikes”? What do you mean “yikes”?
Anyway, Abagond has not carried out the deletion yet. Why did I make the request? ‘Out with the old’ is the best I can tell you. Not all my comments will be deleted.
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“Wait a second . . . are the fellas not going to participate by gracing us with their lists?”
I never had a list really. I just stumbled along.
When I was young I was a player. Later in life I began to appreciate women.
I was whipped daily by my mother until I was to big to beat. That scarred me in ways that I wasn’t aware of and am sure was one of the reasons I didn’t want a relationship.
The woman of my life today is the best thing that ever happened to me. To list why she is the way she is some how would seem to take away her beauty and magic. It’s like having a jewel and not wishing to share it.
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@ Ebonymonroe
Wait a second . . . are the fellas not going to participate by gracing us with their lists?
Kiwi! You heard Ebony, get cracking.
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I was whipped daily by my mother until I was to big to beat.
Wow, dude, you too? Geez, is bad childhoods what turns us into Anarchists?
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@ mary
This is really going too far! These kind of impossibly high standards are unreasonable!!! Give a brotha’ a chance!
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@ Ebonymonroe
Serious moment:
I’m hesitant to say, for reasons that are somewhat similar to Barker’s.
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Good brother King, always the voice of reason when people get all outlandish. LOL!
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Well King, how about stepping up with your list for Ebony? Yeah, I know:
“Hypocrisy is a crime which walks invisible, save to God alone.” You can sue me some other time.
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“Wow, dude, you too? Geez, is bad childhoods what turns us into Anarchists?”
I don’t know. It led me to question authority. It wasn’t until later in life that I understood what empathy meant. Child abuse creates social pathetic behavior. Some grow up to kill people and others make themselves immune to feelings. When your getting beaten as a child you learn about control. How long can you endure pain without breaking down.
I haven’t though about this for a long time. Their are things you want to forget.
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Thank you, Legion.
I mean… who else would be willing to speak up for the musky minority?
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Alright, I” make a list… but no deodorant.
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Legion,
“Solesearch, how about it? Quintessential husband traits/qualities.”
Let’s see.
1. He has to be intelligent, somewhat bookish. He should own books.
2. Not vulgar
3. A good person: Non-violent, giving, forgiving
4. Not sexist
5. Taller than I am
6. A christian, but not overly religious.
7. Non-smoker
8. handsome
9. Not fat
10. He can’t have had a lot of sexual partners. I don’t have a specific number, but he can’t be promiscuous.
11. A good listener
12. financially stable
I think that’s about it.
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@ Abagond
That’s funny that you mentioned the toy guns scenario. My boys have done the same thing. One thing I’ve notice of my girl that is different from her big bros is she is much more advanced re: milestones of development. She does things now @ 18mths that my boys were doing around 2 or 3yrs old. I got the baby books to prove it. Ha!
@Bulanik
I’m going to find the book you mentioned, sounds intriguing.
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@ Solesearch
These lists are very interesting and I’m going to give them some thought over time. Your list sounds like you prefer a guy who is slightly more introverted, slightly less extroverted; correct interpretation by me?
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@ Jon Barker
I haven’t though about this for a long time. Their are things you want to forget.
Your right that it affects you in a number of ways you’re not aware of. I absolutely felt compelled to peel away the layers of my childhood; I’m glad I did even though it was extremely unpleasant to do so. After a number of years of psychological/emotional excavation I’m finally finished.
—————————————————
Remembering vs. Forgetting
It’s up to the person. Remembering and properly processing is a good survival technique that we humans have. But forgetting is a useful technique to. The individual has to decide which one is appropriate. I decided there were things I needed to remember.
There is an absolutely tour de force neuroscience book called The Compassionate Brain by Gerald Hüther. In it, the author’s ambition was to write a users manual for the brain. He covers the effects (on the brain) of bad experiences, like parent to child violence. He covers the good and bad and how one can go about mending the brain (and the emotions), if one pulled a short straw with getting handed bad experiences as a kid. Like I say, excellent book, you may want to check it out.
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I thought deletions were reversible.
I’m guessing about it Kiwi; Abagond knows for sure.
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OK, Shortest List Ever:
Attractive: This can mean a lot of things. I personally find a lot of different “types” attractive, who look nothing like one another, and many wouldn’t fall within what is often termed, “traditional beauty.” Being healthy is definitely part of it, but also it’s just amazing when a woman somehow finds her own kind of beauty in who she is. She knows what colors accentuate her skin tone, knows what hair styles work on her, knows what makeup to wear or knows not to wear it, depending.
Smart: Oh, how sexy is smart! Sure, it makes for better conversations, of course—you can talk together about more than the Kardashians and Miley Cyrus. But beyond that, it truly is the prerequisite for the ‘dance of minds’ that makes romance romantic.
The thing about romance is the nuance, cleverness, innuendo, allusion. But especially the playful repartee—the tease, the wink, the smile. The smarter the woman, the more full and amazing the communication can be. Flirting with a smart woman is like broadband DSL compared to 28.8 dial-up modem.
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Legion,
” Your list sounds like you prefer a guy who is slightly more introverted, slightly less extroverted; correct interpretation by me?”
Hmm, maybe so…I really just prefer my husband. He is the most introverted guy I’ve dated and the only one who had me considering marriage. You’re probably right.
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@ Bulanik
Hmm, it’s as though your comment was in moderation. Well, I’m off to read it now.
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B, I like it, I like it very much!
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I don’t know why I said: “is bad childhoods…”
I should’ve said: “are bad childhoods…”
I made other errors above but I felt compelled to point out/correct the worst one.
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@ Legion, carry on! This part-Turkish commenter always smiles when you do your flirt thing 😀
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^ 😀
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@ Ebonymonroe
Bu, sure, Miss Ebony, I know what you mean. 😀
I think what made me reflect on this aspect of male attractiveness some while back, was experiences of attraction to women who were highly “masculine”.
I don’t mean my own curiosity, merely. I mean attractive men who were…women.
There are women who don’t fit into the heterosexual mold of what a woman should look like, sound and act like, and are more men in a female body.
If comfortable with who they are, there are some who ooze masculinity. By that I don’t mean Lesbian — that definition seems too narrow and closed down.
So, when I said:
A little can go along way as there are all kinds of skills and talents and attitudes that are great to have or acquire, that can make up for natural endowments. And not all women like the feel of “big” or get the greatest pleasures from the use of that organ… …it was because:
1. I remembered these individuals, and,
2. there are men in male bodies are also have these attractive masculine qualities.
Congratulations with that up-the-aisle prospect!
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@ Kiwi
It’s not a bother to me. I am not “precious” about things — I had, and have, far more going on in the my life than internet or this one blog-site. What’s more there are many commenters here that really make me think and I learn from them.
So I see nothing wrong about talking about; it had crossed your mind, so why not? There was no petty foolishness, no put-down in your remarks.
I can appreciate that.
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@ soulsearch and Ebony, you both mentioned religion, having similar religions as part of your list.
Similar religion has been something I have avoided in my life. I never really thought about it much; religion wasn’t important, spirit was greater.
By that I do not mean to say that religious values are not important or that it is somehow unusual. This is not what I am saying. On the contrary: shared religion can be a bonding and most enduring element in the love between 2 people. People don’t have to have that many things in common, as long as they have values as a foundation.
What I mean, I believe, is that I tend to reject what I feel is too much institutional orthodoxy and cultural sameness.
This might be so because my parents were of different faiths, and their parents, in turn, were from different traditions, and that I was converted to Catholicism when I was youngster, and remember it.
Perhaps that has made me emotionally “distant” about faith requirement in a partner? A man with strong faith never fails to impress me, nonetheless. Strong faith gives one strength and often, it seems, humility.
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@ King
Ah, beauty. Loving that everyday aesthetic… 😀
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@ Legion
That book sounds major. Maybe I should get a copy and read it?
Some while ago, I cultivated the art of forgetting because I remembered stuff too well. I had been taught to memorize, seeing stuff so well in my head. It was good knowing how to forget, but now that I am a bit older, I want to remember better.
The attitude I take to remembering and forgetting is to treat the material we process just like digestion: the body will absorb the goodness it ingests and will eliminate the waste and toxins. It should be the same with experiences — separate what does us good to hold onto and let go of what doesn’t.
Would Hüther advocate something like that?
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Generally speaking, comment deletion becomes permanent after 30 days. I still have most of the comments I deleted since early December, but only a handful from before then.
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i had a pretty nice list of ‘requirements’ pof.com style that i had posted to my fb timeline, but it got deleted somehow, abagond is not the only one that finds my style a bit much!
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@Bulanik
I feel similarly regarding religion vs. faith, but, because it’s an absolute requirement in my faith, it’s imperative. The whole “you must not be unequally yoked thing.”
I’m not 100% sure what you mean in regards to masculine women. Although I assume you’re talking about femininity in men and masculinity in women being alluring. I agree, if you look at someone like Gia Carangi, (who was considered a female James Dean), or a man like Prince, who has always flirted with femininity and androgyny, and the response of men, with the former, a women with the latter, it’s clear that our perceptions of femininity and masculinity and who’s bodies they belong in, are very much just taught, but not set in our instincts and overall makeup as men and women.
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@MJB
I’m so sorry to hear that. They say we not only learn of the opposite sex from our parents, but that we also often tend to seek out partners like our parents, if the example is unhealthy, it can be something we have to work to break away from.
I have always gone for the brooding, tortured type, because of my father, who I also became like, in many ways, (along with my mum’s bubbly nature.) But I had to learn to reject subconsciously seeking out distant men who are impossible to please, which I also took from my father’s example, who would provide for me the excuse for no long term commitment.
I just learned the other day that men usually subconsciously s-xualize their mothers, by association of first contact with love and womanhood, and instinctually set out to seek the same qualities of their mothers. It goes without saying that a bad example would cause one to do the opposite and avoid intimacy with women.
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Will Abagond be skipping the list?
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Legion’s cheating!
I’m with King on how basic the list needs to be. I think it’s difficult condensing human beings into lists. Everyone has a different way of thinking, different forms of intelligence, different interests, different kinds of beauty, so it’s difficult to bring the ideal makeup of a person down to a few essential bullet points.
I’m gonna agree with Solesearch on something, though, he can’t have a ridiculous body count. I don’t want it to be where every other woman I meet has already had my partner. I don’t like that.
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Bulanik, I believe it would cause too much conflict for me to be married to a non-christian. I believe in being “equally yoked” as much as possible.
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Bulanik,
“I mean attractive men who were…women.
There are women who don’t fit into the heterosexual mold of what a woman should look like, sound and act like, and are more men in a female body.”
Are you speaking of transgender people?
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@ Ebonymonroe
Perhaps I should have cut it more directly: I am talking about transgender.
I don’t like the word “transgender”, so I didn’t use it. In fact, I avoid, if possible.
Sometimes describing the person or experience is more accurate than using a word that may be loaded with meaning and connotations that don’t fit.
*
When you said:
I have to admit I wan not totally sure of what you mean.
(Now and again I have a thick as 2 short planks moment, and this is one of those times! lol!)
I will assume you are a Christian and that when you say “unyoked” you mean that you could not seriously commit to a non-believer. But I am unsure in which form of Christianity it is imperative to only be with another of the same faith?
I perfectly understand if you don’t wish to discuss your faith here, but I only seek clarity.
If I have understood you correctly, then my opinion is that 2 Christians may marry but not be on the same wavelength spiritually. People can mature at different speeds. A couple of examples — a more general one:
-I have a good friend who wanted to end our friendship the closer she “came to God” because I wanted no part in her religious practice. She only wanted to surround herself with those on her page. Later, she reconsidered that (rigid) stance. And something more specific to man+woman relationships:
-I can think of the mixed-faith marriages that I have seen at close hand, which not only worked well but were particularly happy. I even recall that one of the guys started out saying he had wanted to find “a good Muslim girl” at the start and ended up with a Christian woman that he (and his family) had initially judged as an inferior choice! She constantly floored him with the maturity of her spirituality, and devotion. It broke down his irrationality.
Also, there are occasions when one partner influences the other and leads by example. I know of 2 couples like this. Both the men drank heavily and were pretty Godless, pretty much. Over time, it was noticed that their ways changed for the better.
I don’t know, Ebonymonroe, human nature often defies the criteria we start out with.
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@Bulanik
I’ve never met anyone from the transgender community before. Thank-you for explaining.
I definitely think people from different faiths can be successful in romantic relationships. But, being that I am very genuine in my faith and take it seriously, as the foundation of my life, I do live by the concept of following the Bible as having the final say, and it clearly states that a Christian must not marry to anyone outside of the faith. I don’t interpret this to expand to (for example) a Charismatic Christian and a Pentecostal Christian.
Although I wouldn’t be able to marry a Catholic, because of the saint worship (eg Mary.) But, with that said, having a genuine faith walk vs. a religion you list on a census paper, would be necessary.
I have dated outside of my faith in the past, however.
I don’t apply this to friendships as that is not stated in the Bible.
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my list,
black, female, dark-complected
between 5’2″-5’8″
weighs less than 180 lbs
must not use hard narcotics excepting only occassionally
must not be a habitual drunkard
must have no glaring mental health issues
must have no violent felony convictions
must not message tom’s friends for intimate encounters during the relationship
must not be married
must not be separated
must be employed
must have some college education
should be able to operate a manual transmission
should have a southern accent (i passed on this one)
fb deleted this post, there were ancillary posts, ie my friends commented on this but mr facebook ate it!
i always loved that concept of ‘equally yoked’
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with regards to your opposite sex parent as a ‘prototype’ psychologically speaking or archetypically speaking or something like that, i always had the idea that my ‘compass’ or something was broken and i don’t know why i picked the hard case, alpha females, race not an issue!
my brothers wife is a uh ‘handful’ as well, lol
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@ Leigon. I’ll check out “The Compassionate Brain.”
v8driver said “must not use hard narcotics excepting only occasionally”
That’s funny.
Ebonymonroe said “I just learned the other day that men usually subconsciously s-xualize their mothers, by association of first contact with love and womanhood, and instinctually set out to seek the same qualities of their mothers.”
My first relationships were dysfunctional and violent and matched how I was raised. I had very little self esteem and no confidence. I had a drug problem which sent me to rehab and it was their that I learned about my demons and that child abuse wasn’t normal. I was able to turn my life around in my late twenty’s.
I think that how a man is raised directly effects how he treats women.
I learned how to love from raising my children. I learned how to be intimate from the wife I have now. I think intimacy is the most important thing in a relationship. If you can maintain that then your relationship will last the rest of your life.
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@MJB sounds familiar to me!
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I just learned the other day that men usually subconsciously s-xualize their mothers, by association of first contact with love and womanhood, and instinctually set out to seek the same qualities of their mothers.”
_ _ _
The Oedipus complex. I never put much stock in that so many of the young guys and adult men that I know seem to pursue and end up with women whom, to me at least, are nothing like their mother.
The analogous term for girls is the ‘Electra complex’.
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@ Bulanik
It should be the same with experiences — separate what does us good to hold onto and let go of what doesn’t.
Would Hüther advocate something like that?
Yes, he would. The basis of the book is that the brain is changable, the term many of you would have heard is the term: plastic. Our brains change, given the way in which they are used. So someone who busts out jazz chords at the piano for hours at a time will end up with neural connections that are different from someone who pulls the wings off of house flies for hours at a time. This adaptability of our brains is a gift or a curse.
—————————————————-
We have to be very cautious. Very cautious.
separate what does us good to hold onto and let go of what doesn’t.
It’s not that easy. Why is it not that easy? Because a lot of the neural wiring that we do has a significant emotional component to it. You can not just undo neural wiring at the drop of a hat, it takes time to undo wiring. It takes time to give up unhealthy emotional reactions. Because these things take time, one needs to have important motivating reasons to stay the course with undoing a set of emotional reactions, adopting new emotional reactions which simultaneously rewire the neural networks.
^ So some of that is kind of “the curse” part.
——————————————————
I said, “We have to be cautious.” Well, maybe what I said is bullshit. Sometimes we should be cautious and sometimes you should not be cautious, sometimes you should give your emotions free reign in order to quickly lock in a perception of the environment and/or a relationship or relationships.
We can think of an easy example here:
• giving birth or seeing one’s child for the first time
In this situation you are quite happy to let all your loving emotions quickly lock in the idea that this is your child and you will love and protect it come what may, even giving up your own life for the child if the environment became that harsh at some point.
• falling in love (with a lover instead of a baby) is another easily understood example
^ An example of “the gift”.
——-
So yes the brain is, as Hüther puts it: a lifelong programmable structure but utilizing the brain’s inherent capacity of plasticity depends on:
• opportunity (your environment must provide you with enough autonomy to take up the project of changing yourself)
• sufficient motivation to continue along a new direction (the neural nets of the old direction are stronger for a time: “Lord lead me not into temptation …,” so to speak)
• some other stuff I am likely forgetting
—————————————————-
So the brain is plastic but depending on what you’re trying to change, the act of change might not be as simple as flipping a light switch.
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i think, in regards to the oedipus complex sub-thread, that it is perhaps invasive and somewhat unneccessary to view the issue from the perspective of the child ‘sexualizing’ his mother, i am sure this happens in abuse cases etc but i think the normal idk ‘force de rigeur’ or something like that is that the child is the object, not the subject, and is patterned by the interactions with the parent, and no i’m not going off into single mother territory or any other societal add-ons to the day-to-day interactions of a child with his mother, i think that through brute force we are tolerated to our parents attitudes and manner of dealing with the child, the child’s rearing, and society at large, so that perhaps we pick up on subtle clues when we meet someone as adults? and some type of way there is a connection in the brain, idk, my 2c.
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Legion’s cheating!
*tries to look casual*
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I don’t want to give the impression that it is “hard” to change. I just wanted to point out changing is not to be taken lightly. I’m on the verge of going in circles; best thing now for those who have an interest is to read Hüther’s book. It’s an easy read and the book itself is slim; what’s weighty about it are the implications one comes to about one’s own mode of being, in the world, after going over the concepts in the book.
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With regards to brain wiring and emotional reactions, I think the concept of “the male gaze” explains a lot of why women (as described in the opening post) are so concerned about their appearance, so ready to see themselves as “fat,” etc. This is not inherent to womanhood; it’s something so pervasive in our culture that most women can’t help but end up “wired” that way.
http://www.uvm.edu/~tstreete/powerpose/onview.html
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Legion
@ Bulanik
It should be the same with experiences — separate what does us good to hold onto and let go of what doesn’t.
Would Hüther advocate something like that?
Yes, he would. The basis of the book is that the brain is changable, the term many of you would have heard is the term: plastic. Our brains change, given the way in which they are used. So someone who busts out jazz chords at the piano for hours at a time will end up with neural connections that are different from someone who pulls the wings off of house flies for hours at a time. This adaptability of our brains is a gift or a curse.
—————————————————-
We have to be very cautious. Very cautious.
separate what does us good to hold onto and let go of what doesn’t.
It’s not that easy. Why is it not that easy? Because a lot of the neural wiring that we do has a significant emotional component to it. You can not just undo neural wiring at the drop of a hat, it takes time to undo wiring. It takes time to give up unhealthy emotional reactions. Because these things take time, one needs to have important motivating reasons to stay the course with undoing a set of emotional reactions, adopting new emotional reactions which simultaneously rewire the neural networks.
^ So some of that is kind of “the curse” part.
……………………………………………………………….
Believe it or not, there has been much research and discovery in the last few years regarding plasticity and how much we really are in the driver’s seat when it comes to our own minds. It takes just three months to rewire the brain, and only 21 days to begin or break a habit.
Through the gift of the frontal lobe, one can continuously live outside of themselves, monitoring their own thoughts, and consciously choosing what thoughts they will accept, and what thoughts they will reject. It takes practice, but it is success guaranteed.
Our emotions follow our thoughts . . . what separates the pessimist from the optimist, is the perspective, one see’s the glass as half full, while the other see’s the glass as half empty. There is a necessary period of coming to terms with areas of our pasts, but it is the way in which we choose to process these experiences, from the here and now, that will dictate the health of the mind.
For example, when attempting to gain closure on a disruptive, hurtful experience, purposely refusing to accept the train of though of “this happened to me because I deserved it because I am stupid, I am ugly, I am not as good as Mr X, or Miss Z,” one would replace this spider web for, “bad things happen to everyone, it is not a reflection of my worth. I am handsome/beautiful, I am able, I am intelligent, I can forgive, I’m moving forward, I’m going to get back on my feet and work ten times harder, be ten times better. I may not have X right now, but I have Y and Z.”
Even though the mind does not immediately believe it, with time, it does. Thought patterns, memory, emotions- all very much like rocks with the ability to contain (and reflect) sounds. It may all sound philosophical, but it is a matter of very tangible, practical quantum mechanics.
Now this is not some kind of self hypnosis, but rather, it is a matter of quantum physics and the porous nature and plasticity of the mind. Recently, an experiment was done to test the effects of words on materials. Two glasses of water were placed in a confinement for a prolonged period of time. One glass was told it was nothing, it was ugly, it was stupid, etc, multiple times a day, while the other glass was praised. The result was that the glass of water that was praised was perfectly preserved, while the glass that had been continually insulted, was molded and turned jet black.
Even writing words like “love,” in water, has recently been found to change the molecules in a different fashion to that of words like “hate,” “anger,” and “fear.”
When the brain falls into a system of habitual toxic thinking, it resembles a forest of rotting trees; this created system becomes a stronghold, and so we will have to consciously make the effort to think outside of that system, as that system is a pattern that becomes temporarily cemented, where all our thoughts become confined to that shape. This “rotting forest,” produces trouble “thinking outside of this shape” or “outside this box,” along with memory loss, problems with concentration, immune system compromisation.
It’s a remarkable thing.
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“oedipus complex,” thank-you . . . had no idea what it was called.
I agree with v8, I think much of it probably comes down to the fact that our parents shape so much of our understanding, and we in turn reflect them, and that is probably why our romantic choices reflect them. But . . . I have noticed that it seems as though our parents do not often reflect our choices in friendships as much as they do our romantic relationships. There definitely seems to be some evidence of a correlation between they way we relate to romantic relationships in general (through the example of our parents relationships), and the way we relate to the opposite sex, the added component of seeking out one who holds similar characteristics as the parent seems to be quite true, but obviously, not necessarily a rule set in stone.
I have noticed, for instance, examples where a son who was often neglected, seems to seek out (or to put it more plainly, only show interest) in women who reject him. Such a commonality would not be immediately identifiable, as the woman may not physically resemble the mother, or share any similarities in personality, but it is a singular, seemingly miniscule element that begins to show itself as being a pattern.
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Legion
Legion’s cheating!
*tries to look casual*
……………………………………………………
Stares for a long period of time until he’s visibly uncomfortable.
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v8driver
my list,
black, female, dark-complected
between 5’2″-5’8″
weighs less than 180 lbs
must not use hard narcotics excepting only occassionally
must not be a habitual drunkard
must have no glaring mental health issues
must have no violent felony convictions
must not message tom’s friends for intimate encounters during the relationship
must not be married
must not be separated
must be employed
must have some college education
should be able to operate a manual transmission
should have a southern accent (i passed on this one)
fb deleted this post, there were ancillary posts, ie my friends commented on this but mr facebook ate it!
i always loved that concept of ‘equally yoked’
DDC:
Good luck with that , I personally can’t see a woman like that wanting u but there r a lot of brain-washed black women out there who might consider u to be a “catch”..But then again.. It cracks me up how u white men r delusional enough to believe that black women are waiting for u to select them when u had all power and control over us during slavery we didn’t want u, what makes u think we want u know? White men r the least attractive least sexy men on earth, get real.
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This convo took a very different turn ???
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“It’s a remarkable thing.”
_ _ _
The above quote concluded a most excellent posting by you, Ebonymonroe. Thank you.
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@ krwordgazer
A main point of Hüther’s book is: the individual them self expanding their awareness of what influences act on them, what behavior patterns the individual demonstrates and going through a “cognitive appraisal” (psych 101 term) of those things and taking necessary action to rewire one’s ways of responding to the outer world.
It’s not a new message. (Old religions of the east have said the same thing in a different way for thousands of years.) Frankl in Man’s Search for Meaning says it too. Frankl does not say in his book that the “Nazi Gaze” is going to get ya; his book is richer than that.
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This convo took a very different turn ???
• There are commenters (it’s not many, count them on one hand) to whom I will speak to, not at all or little.
• I have no interest in the “feminist” element now introduced by krwordgazer.
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^ @ Ebony
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Legion said “You can not just undo neural wiring at the drop of a hat, it takes time to undo wiring. It takes time to give up unhealthy emotional reactions.”
Ebonymonroe said “I have noticed, for instance, examples where a son who was often neglected, seems to seek out (or to put it more plainly, only show interest) in women who reject him.”
My earlier relationships were like what Ebonymoroe states but I was able to move away from that. It was a “cognitive appraisal” moment when I realized that my life choices sucked and I went about developing a set of ethics and sticking to them.
The woman I am with today is the exact opposite of my mom.
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@ Ebonymonroe
“It’s a remarkable thing.”
Yes, indeed. I too thank you Ebony the comment that precedes that quote. I mostly agree with what you said.
——————————————
The water experiments go back further than 10 years, credited to a Japanese man named Emoto. Some people have posted results of their own experiments with moist rice in jars, the results are, as you say: remarkable.
I don’t think the brain becomes a “rotting forest” but one could say it sends signals to the body to function in a less than optimal manner, leading to a type of “rot”. Some metaphysical material would talk about the “rot” of the mind rather than the brain. Some quibbles.
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+ Yes, me too.
^^^
* . One see’s the glass as half full
* refusing to accept the train of though of
*correlation regarding the way we relate to romantic relationships in general (through the example of our parent’s relationships),
*the added component of seeking out one who holds similar characteristics as the parent,
(Excuse the OCD.)
Post regarding brain plasticity @Bulanik & Legion
@Pay it forward
I’m quite touched.
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Jon Barker is brave. I find myself following closely behind his lead yet again.
I did not wish to say it but this:
Ebonymonroe said “I have noticed, for instance, examples where a son who was often neglected, seems to seek out (or to put it more plainly, only show interest) in women who reject him.”
was me too.
It took me forever to break this pattern, it was a true lament in my life.
———————–
The woman I am with today is the exact opposite of my mom.
The women I form relationships with now are indeed opposite (as a quick, simple descriptor) my mom also.
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@MJB & Legion
You should be proud of yourself bruh. That takes pure will power.
My goodness Legion, you’re like an old wise man on a mountain who knows everything. You’d be impossible to brag to about “new information.”
When I say “rotting forest,” I don’t mean that the brain is literally in a physically rotting state, but rather that is resembles a rotting, withering forest. Pictures of a brain on a pattern of healthy thinking resembles a forest of trees with big, thick, flourishing stems and branches, whereas the opposite looks like bushes in the winter.
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“Jon Barker is brave. I find myself following closely behind his lead yet again.”
Now your embarrassing me lol I appreciate the compliment. I am in a good place today but looking back on my life is like a train wreck.
I tell my kids straight up how not to do the things I did.
I learn a lot from this blog. It confirms and expands my understanding of things and that’s in part from the quality of debate of those who post here.
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Kiwi,
” It sends the message that even the cruddiest of men should expect to be able to get the “best” of women. It’s the male entitlement complex conveyed by the “male gaze” that’s distasteful. I can tell the media always has a bias towards a predominantly male audience. It’s homogenizing and stifling.”
And the message has been received. “Nice guys” are always complaining about being “friend zoned” by their pretty woman friends because they are “nice”.
I can’t think of a movie/tv show where the reverse happens. I know there have been times where I didn’t find the actress attractive but she was still portrayed as being physically attractive.
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@ Legion: I thought you were slaying the ladies with your swagger. LOL!
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Kraordgazer,
“With regards to brain wiring and emotional reactions, I think the concept of “the male gaze” explains a lot of why women (as described in the opening post) are so concerned about their appearance, so ready to see themselves as “fat,” etc. This is not inherent to womanhood; it’s something so pervasive in our culture that most women can’t help but end up “wired” that way.”
So true. The universal thing about womanhood is not fashion but the experience of sexism and misogyny.
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Well Mary, now I make up for lost time. 😉
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Thanks Ebony.
—————–
Sorry Ebony, I am pedantic at times.
When I say “rotting forest,” I don’t mean that the brain is literally in a physically rotting state, but rather that is resembles a rotting, withering forest. Pictures of a brain on a pattern of healthy thinking resembles a forest of trees with big, thick, flourishing stems and branches, whereas the opposite looks like bushes in the winter.
^ Wonderful!
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^^^
* but rather that it resembles
* Pictures of a brain, on a pattern of healthy thinking, resemble
(Once again, please excuse the OCD.)
I do hope you’re not apologising for having such a wonderful wealth of knowledge.
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^ Now I’m getting embarrassed. There’s more that I don’t know than actually know and that’s not false modesty talking. The thing is to keep learning and implementing, learning and implementing…
—————–
(no, apologizing for being pedantic)
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Legion,
I agree with Ebonymonroe that you should not feel the need to apologize for your knowledge. It is a trait of yours which I very much admire, as I assume you’ve acquired knowledge through your own studies rather than having your cranium opened up and someone shoveling it in (if only it worked that way, huh?! 🙂 ).
Thank you also for the book recommendation. It sounds like something of which I’m in need, and I intend to check into purchasing it over the upcoming weekend.
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Ebonymonroe I must say that you yourself are quite knowledgeable, and I have learned from your comments as well.
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@ Everyone
To Legion, Pay It Forward (previously known as Fiamma) said this:
When Pay it Forward said: “…rather than having your cranium opened and someone shoveling {knowledge} it in”, who is she referring to?
Does she mean dyslexics, like me?
Does she mean people who were taught to read and write using teaching methods available at the time…like me?
Is she saying that people like that (ie: me) —
-can’t have really learned anything,
-can’t have really acquired knowledge through their own studies,
-can’t be educated or intelligent, and, can’t be anything?
So, if can’t people like me can not cease to exist, then we should be
1. ashamed, or 2) SILENT. Is that what Pay it Forward is alluding to?
I’d be interested to know, because it seems like Pay it Forward, (creepily) follows my comments and waits for opportunities to make disparaging remarks about what she believes could not possibly be the product of my mind.
Other than that, the unnecessary, irrational obsessiveness of it makes me think it could be just be envy. Yet, Pay it Forward will lecture others here, and warn them, that the internet is populated by some unpleasant or “crazy” individuals!
*
I have never hidden the fact that I am severely dyslexic. Now, I have to ask:
When since has a learning disability and one’s early learning been reasons to prod and poke at them? When did that become a reason to undermine commentary and degrade a commenter for the reasons of their learning issues? More to the point: what does it say about the commenter who would take it upon themselves to DO THAT?
What does this tell us about Pay it Forward?
I would like to know what is Pay it Forward’s entitlement.
Where does Pay it Forward assume this “authority” to latch on to Bulanik, or anyone, and stick a feeding tube in?
I have to ask how come Pay it Forward doesn’t save her attentions for the racists that frequent this site, instead. What a waste of time!
Why would she extend her hostilities horizontally — towards people who spend their lives on the receiving of white supremacy and and who, in turn, take no special interest in Pay it Forward?
Not only this.
Pay it Forward has even gone so far as to label Bulanik a sociopath / psychopath.
(Among other things.)
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@ Pay it Forward
A polite request: cease taking such an interest in me.
Thank you.
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@ Legion
Re Garald Huether’s theories/book:
Granted, I haven’t read the book, but, I would have my reservations about any thesis that appears to synthesize connections between quantum mechanics and human consciousness. I recall, during the mid 2000s discussions about the effects of neuropeptides on the breaking of addictions, and habits (it took 28 days at least, rather than 21 days, if I recall, although I felt 40 days and nights is a guideline), but this was all wrapped up in a New Age package, and even though I rather like some aspects of quantum mysticism, I can not subscribe to it fully.
Associations within our brain chemistry:
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6BkI8LD24y0)
The “water scene” from the same film:
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MMfCvdyaNGQ)
True.
When I said: “separate what does us good to hold onto and let go of what doesn’t” — naturally, it is NOT easy, and I realize that.
We are each our own primary care-givers and if we cannot contrive of ways to heal ourselves, then we can look outside ourselves for remedies:
I’ve seen this in the work of Naturopathic practitioners (who use homeopathic and Bach flower preparations, iridology, etc.), as well as through talking / thinking therapies such as the Cognitive ones.
Personally, I liked and enjoyed and benefitted from the self-help aspect of complementary health modalities, and, even though I qualified in a number of them, compared to the array of standard and allopathic alternatives, what complementary medicine offered, this older tradition of natural medicine has had to fight hard to be recognized as no more than “pseudo-science”.
The capacity of water to hold a memory, for example, has not yet been been proved and quantified under (existing and mainstream) scientific testing. This is not to say that I believe water lacks a capacity for “memory”, but merely that the mechanism under which it may do so has not yet been measured by instruments sensitive to nature.
Perhaps the onus should be on the inventing of those instruments?
As for the principle behind Cognitive therapies — this does not one that sits well with me because the symptoms are the cause. Yet, if these therapies have worked for someone, then so be it.
Yes, that’s what usually said, but I have to contrast that with the ideas about learning and unlearning, as expressed Jiddu Krishnamurti, an Indian philosopher from the 20th century. Mr Krishnamurti believed that thoughts are within our grasp to change, and change quickly. He believed that, yes, we have thought and we have knowledge, but as thought has its place, so does knowledge. Knowledge though necessary, was a mechanical thing, a thing that could “calcify” and become destructive memories and actions — the most damaging of effects — on our thoughts.
Here is talking about “Being Hurt and Hurting Others: (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I54SH0IbpzQ)
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“…you should not feel the need to apologize for your knowledge. It is a trait of yours which I very much admire, as I assume you’ve acquired knowledge through your own studies rather than having your cranium opened up and someone shoveling it in (if only it worked that way, huh?! 🙂 ). ”
I don’t know the actual context of this quote but as it stands alone it suggests to me the value of critical thinking as opposed to just accepting information on face value.
Everyday we absorb information whether its from co-workers, school, the media or from social networks. Most of that information is biased in one way or another. How we process that information in context to our own world view is what distils it into knowledge.
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Legion, excuse my many typos:
About the paragraph on water, I meant to say:
“…This is not to say that I believe water lacks a capacity for “memory”, but merely that the mechanism under which it may do so has not yet been measured by instruments sensitive to its nature.”
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MJB, you are certainly right about the way we ALL absorb info from around us all the time.
But, no, you certainly do not know the actual context of this quote. I wouldn’t expect some commenter to know or care, and Pay it Forward is counting on that to slip it in… 😀
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*some commenters
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Last but not least I love a man who is well read and well traveled, That is wise and wants to pass that wisdom on to the youth.
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@ Bulanik
B, the way I took Pay it Forward’s very kind compliment to me was as a genuine comment; no sneaky parallel snide implications. What I believe she was saying about “crammed craniums” was a reference to the accepted authoritarian and uncreative mode of learning of passive, callow students accepting the manna of knowledge from their exalted “teachers”. I do not think any attack was meant against you B.
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@ Bulanik
Granted, I haven’t read the book, but, I would have my reservations about any thesis that appears to synthesize connections between quantum mechanics and human consciousness.
The book does not do that at all. The QM was Ebony’s own analogy. The book is very, very down to earth. Recall: Hüther intends the book as a “user’s manual”. Sincerity of method would dictate that he render the concepts, discussed in the book, in a way that any average person can understand what he’s conveying; he achieves this.
I do believe that those of you who choose to read it will be quite taken, positively taken, with it.
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@Bulanik
When I said: “separate what does us good to hold onto and let go of what doesn’t” — naturally, it is NOT easy, and I realize that.
Of course. I expect that you would know that without my help! My explicitness was more out of my respect for the subject matter and for the benefit of those who read our exchange now and in the future, particularly younger people who may be in the early stages of developing their worldliness as many of us once were.
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@ All
I am in a bit of comment debt, that is, there are a few other things I would like to say. But I’ll hold off for now; I’m suffering from the flu and it hurts like a motherfu@#er. Later.
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@ Pay it Forward
Do forgive my tone if it seems abrupt. Abruptness is not my aim but I do think it’s best to be concise and to point for the moment:
It occurred to me that Bulanik may be correct that your compliment to me was a simultaneous dig at her. It may also be that you intended no dig. If the former, then I ask that you never “compliment” me, at the expense of another, ever again. If the latter, I thank you for your kind and generous words. Will you please clarify your comment that we may move past what we Buddhists like to refer to as a “knot” in experience. I feel that a knot has developed in this online exchange.
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^ Goddamit! I knew I’d fuc up my wording somehow. What I meant to say and ought to have said was this:
* If the former, then I ask you, respectfully, never to “compliment” me, at the expense of another, ever again.
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@ddc: my social life is just fine, thanks
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@ Solesearch
Me: Your list sounds like you prefer a guy who is slightly more introverted, slightly less extroverted; correct interpretation by me?
Solesearch: Hmm, maybe so…I really just prefer my husband. [and an answer.]
Solesearch, I know exactly what you mean. I did not mean to be a cold reductionist about the man you love and are daily making a life with. To you, he is your awesome husband; I get it and it shouldn’t be any other way. To an outsider (me in this case) I saw a pattern in your description and was breaking it down, to learn and distill from. Thanks for your answer.
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@ anyone with an interest
The brain rewiring discussion has been tied to early childhood experience with one’s mother and later effects, therefore, it has been on topic. I may post some more on the topic in theScience thread, if it seems too far from being on topic for this thread.
But one possible last comment regarding all the rewiring stuff: you are not too young or too old to start rewiring, something you think you need to address. There will be people in your life or on the outskirts of your life who will disagree and tell you so; just refrain from telling them what you are doing and put them at a distance if necessary.
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* rewiring something
Abagond, please omit the comma that I placed between those two words. And then delete this comment.
Thank you.
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@ kiwi
“Correct. Entitlement causes men to think that they deserve to be “rewarded” for behavior/traits that should be expected of in the first place.”
That is true. I can’t think of how many males have said they feel they deserve a woman just because of them not having a record, having a job, making a certain amount of money,etc. but if a woman said she deserves a man because she went to a prestigious college those same ones will say well just because u went to college it don’t mean u should get a man we don’t care much about that, can u cook.
Then there are the ones that feel they are entitled to beautiful women yet they are not physically attractive themselves. It reminds me of the steve urkel episode where he found his equal, a nerdy goofy female just like him but he didn’t want her, no he wanted laura who didn’t want him and was way out of his league.
then there’s the whole saying of nice guys finish last, well there are nice females that finish last too. nice females don’t always get the guy and when they do sometimes its the guys that didn’t want them when they were chasing after the looser girls but when they’ve calmed down they expect that woman to be waiting for them.
Then there is the difference of how virgin men and women are treated. virgin men usually get the reaction of surprise and people thinking it is cute and wanting to be with them. virgin women are seen as a challenge and then some people will say they would never date them because its too much work.
I think society has turned into praising bad and either ignoring or attacking good.
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@ Legion
All respect for genuineness, Legion:
genuine “thanks yous”,
genuine apologies,
genuine modesty, and,
genuine compliments.
When Pay it Forward (aka Fiamma) first started to make her indirect and snide digs at Bulanik — I asked her to stop it. Here: https://abagond.wordpress.com/2013/07/29/the-black-on-black-crime-argument/#comment-184898
As Fiamma, Pay it Forward, didn’t expect I would tell her to stop. Abagond had praised her, and she was feeling over-confident.
But, Fiamma/Pay it Forward, said yes, it was time for her to get over that, apologized to Bulanik for the unpleasantness she had caused me.
She said she would stop, and even welcomed Bulanik back!
Later, Pay it Forward admitted she only did so because she wanted the “higher moral ground”. Not because she was genuine in her words.
Since then, common sense shows me Pay it Forward is not only insincere, but her motivations and mindset are more obvious.
Pay it Forward is INVESTED, or, overinterested in undermining my contribution and using it boost and re-create herself as this blog’s Truest Voice of Learning. She is very welcome to this, btw.
It is the methodology of her strivings which is ugly and bankrupt.
It is being done through the use of digs. Sometimes through apparent (and more and more confident and frequent) friendliness and compliment-giving to others (sincere and genuine, of course, of course).
Other times, through other methods…
Let’s have a little look-see, shall we? Here are a couple of recent examples:
***Halloween, 31 October 2013. I touched on Halloween customs, customs that originated in Ireland.
Pay it Forward felt it necessary to tell readers that:
Having lived in Ireland for a decade, I’d know a little about Irish customs.
But according to Pay it Forward, my comments have to sniffed at and chased down, checked and referenced by Google searchs to find the source of my knowledge.
Much in the way might know about the oud musical instrument, song lyrics, certain authors, etc, etc. All that I’ve written about could only come from Google because such things COULD NOT have played a part in my past experiences, my studies or relationships. As if knowledge itself does not pre-date the use of the internet!! Have a look:
___________________________________________
***Painting and painters. I couldn’t know anything about that.
According to Pay it Forward, my commentary is the sole product of my referencing Wikipedia and “trying” to sound learned, because, apparently I am “braggart” and a “thief”, in Fiamma/Pay it Forward’s mind:
18th October 2013: https://abagond.wordpress.com/2013/10/17/notes-towards-a-black-history-of-george-washington/#comment-197690
________________________________________________
Or, take this, from 14 December 2013:
***In a discussion about films and reference to Hindu gods, Pay it Forward, as usual, points out that my comment is from somewhere…
Surely, I couldn’t know anything. I haven’t even watched popular films. 😀
__________________________________________________
Pay it Forward is fond of interrogating my comments, isn’t she?
……All this you see, because she has me “pegged” as a sociopath and wants me to disappear from this blog.
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So, yes, Legion, those were pure, kind words directed to you.
If you don’t want to see the ugly sneakiness directed at my learning and dyslexia (which Pay it Forwarded has made the subject of “jokes” before — Abagond deleted that for their bad taste), then, okay.
And sure, those digs she aims in my directs are neutral kindnesses.
But, I trust my own mind and know what she is up to.
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correction: *direction
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Bulanik, I understand your frustration.
Respectfully, you are a little late with claiming I do not want to see the sneakiness or that my ego is playing sucker to flattery that has a side component of insult to it as well.
Don’t let your frustration keep you focused on one thing at the expense of another. I did also say this, and it is my most recent comment on this unpleasantness:
It occurred to me that Bulanik may be correct that your compliment to me was a simultaneous dig at her. It may also be that you intended no dig. If the former, then I ask that you never “compliment” me, at the expense of another, ever again. If the latter, I thank you for your kind and generous words. Will you please clarify your comment that we may move past what we Buddhists like to refer to as a “knot” in experience. I feel that a knot has developed in this online exchange.
So, that was directed at Pay it Forward. She can respond or not, that’s up to her.
——————————————–
I thought this thing was over. Bulanik, let it go, follow Linda’s advice from when this whole thing started in the first place.
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Legion, appreciated. 😀
For the record: I do NOT, not for a moment, believe ego — yours — has ANY bearing on this. None of it. I do not consider your online character as such.
Much gets misunderstood online, but that was not my interpretation at all!
*
But, wait a moment, my dear. I was the one who put Pay it Forward’s behaviour in the past. Or didn’t you notice?
Um, WHO is making the digs, month after month, thread after thread?
Yet, I am the one who should take advice….it’s time for Pay it Forward to stop?
It is quite tedious. Note the pattern of simply physics, action/reaction:
— I carry on commenting in the way I always have, about a variety of subjects.
— Pay it Forward follows me around, digging and poking.
— I say, stop, no, no, no and NO.
Yet…”Bulanik, let it go”.
Strange that the onus is not on Pay it Forward to drop it.
.
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Bulanik, I offered you an apology and you cussed me out for my troubles, even though I was willing to take full blame for the circumstances surrounding my uncovering of your plagiarism, hundreds of examples of which you had abagond to delete, and you then just recently had the gall to place blame on him for why you wanted them deleted. And, no, I never made “jokes” (you liar) about your dyslexia. That post you are referencing was a response to your multiple hateful comments to me where you admittedly went on the attack in response to the your deception having been revealed. The fact is I ASKED abagond in an email TO DELETE that particular comment precisely because I did not want to keep this feud going.
Even your response to that deleted comment of mine was deceitful as well. In tit you claimed that I had revealed your “name”, even though it was actually your old username, “Bulanik girl”, that I “revealed”. And that comment about your having been illiterate until age 13 was taken from your own comments under your old username.which you forgot to ask abagond to delete.
Your resorting to the use of plagiarism did not end after you had 2 years worth of your comments deleted as I copied and saved an example of blatant plagiarism on your part from one your so-called debates with Asplund. Your cussing me out (you also composed a nasty missive to Kiwi which abagond deleted for being “uncivil”) for apologizing to you, is when I silently declared all bets off with you.
The vast majority of your so-called “learning” comes from cruising online educational sites, blogs and Wikipedia articles. Yes, I have continued to cross-reference the info in your comments, since I know for a fact that nearly all of it is gained minutes to hours before you come back to abagond’s and try to wax scholarly.
Strangely enough it is a habit of yours to demand humility from others who have genuine knowledge and have gained it the hard way,.while you yourself proudly proclaim your own “knowledge and learning”, and even declare that (all these unknown) others are “stealing your mind” (when that is the very thing which you are doing by plagiarizing the works of others) is beyond disingenuous. That fact that you have charmed others into smooching your butt regardless of your obvious deceitfulness doesn’t change a thing. It is probably the way you have conducted your entire life.
You are one nasty piece of work and deceitful beyond measure. You can blame all that on your dyslexia if you want to, but, be warned, you are giving all dyslexics a bad name when you do, though I doubt that you care the least bit about that.
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Liar, hateful, deceitful, nasty piece of work.
You forgot sociopath.
Let it out, Fiamma. Take the strait jacket off.
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Tell us really why you follow me around.
Tell us what really peeves you.
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Legion, it is entirely up to me as to whether I will give a compliment to another person. What’s up to you is whether or not you will accept the compliment.
That said, the compliment was genuine. I admire individuals who put in the time and effort it takes to acquire knowledge, and have myself long experienced the disdain of others who felt no need to go to the bother of learning much of anything but, yet, who show resentment of those who do.
I know that those people with learning disabilities will have to go to greater efforts to learn and acquire knowledge. I’m am one of them as I have had fibromyalgia since my teen years. It is a condition which not only causes widespread pain soreness and stiffness but as what’s referred to as ‘brain fog’, wherein memory and concentration are sometimes greatly affected. For my part I had to resort to using flash cards in several of my college classes in order to force myself through repetition to remember certain types of information.
This brain fog is the very reason why I am not fluent in any language other than English even though I have undertaken study of several different languages (one of which is Japanese) over the years. I recall mentioning that I have fibromyalgia on one of the past open threads, under the username “Fiamma.
One thing I know for sure is that learning disabilities are not a rational for lying and cheating. And I also doubt that I could ever feel good about receiving numerous pats on the back and copious compliments for what amounts to nothing more than a facility to tell whooping lies.
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Pay it Forward,
Could you tell me why you believe that I have no learning and have never studied anything in my life?
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Pay it Forward,
Now, could you also tell me how you know “for a fact” that I have gained everything I say here just a minute to hours before I come back to this site to “wax scholarly”?
How do you know for a fact?
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@ Kiwi and Solesearch and others who brought it up:
So do nerds/nice guys finish last?
Cause if that’s the case, that would mean that female nerds/geeks don’t get loving either, lol!
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Pay it Forward,
Tell me about how I have conducted myself in my life? Since you know — obviously for “a fact” — that I have spent it smooching my butt off.
I wonder how you spend your life, since cross referencing my comments, putting words into my mouth seems to be a big chunk of it…
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Pay it Forward,
Why so jealous? Can you break it down for us — in your own words?
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@phoebeprunelle
I actually read some where (don’t know how serious one can take the article) that nerds or geeky looking women are one of the top women over looked in choosing a mate. I will find it and post it.
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Dear Pay it Forward — you worry me slightly.
At the start I was offended, but now I have to say I am a little sad for you.
The bit that has me wondering the most is what you “know for a fact”! 😀
Are you in the same room as me, my dear?
Do you not only follow me around, kiss and lick all I say, but you use clairvoyance to check my Personal Computer, my movements and key strokes? Are you all there, Pay it Forward?
*
You say I “claimed that I had revealed your “name”, even though it was actually your old username, “Bulanik girl”, that I “revealed”.”
Inaccurate. I said nothing of the kind.
I think you were embarrassed by how far you went, because you cannot stop dogging me and because I answered you with sanity.
*
And nor did I compose a “nasty” missive to Kiwi. I used the the “F” word.
A lot of people here use that word. Why don’t you save your talk of “bowel opening” for them instead and LEAVE ME ALONE?
*
Next: Only the educationally naive believe that the internet is the primary source of knowledge. Knowledge and studies EXISTED BEFORE THE INTERNET and I have probably been around a little longer than YOU.
The internet, though, is not a safe place to disclose one’s identity or personal history in detail, with names, etc. Not wise, not safe.
Not in my view.
It is not a safe place to say what I have written or co-written, who I have known, and how. You, in your irrational and powerful desire to destroy and damage — find the scope of my life, unfathomable. I have led a full and quite interesting life, like a lot of people, so, so what? Get over it.
*
Regarding your faux apology.
You only apologized after you were caught out in another poor argument of yours. I saw that you were FEEDING off the “plagiarism” episode, because it was the first time you had a chance to “be in the sun” and make yourself look like had the Big Stick. Ok fine. You are the Big Stick and you so smart and you are an anthropologist and linguist and expert fantastic commenter about everything.
*
I demand humility from no one.
*
No one “cussed you out.” I was quite ladylike with you. I don’t “fear” you, though. And that’s a problem for you, clearly.
Regrettably, Pay it Forward you are, at best, brittle, and I am beginning to think that you had a breakdown on this blog.
I am no psychologist, but something doesn’t seem 100% about you.
You seemed so Unhappy that you are not a popular commenter.
That is silly! I always liked you, I was not alone in that.
But, you had to create dramas to get attention, like pretending “to leave the blog” in fits of “intellectual” outrage, and then…coming back a few days later! Jesus.
*
On the occasion that you attacked me, it was simply because the knowledge you provided in response was not quite there, and when I contradicted it, you fell apart and all your pent up unhappiness came flooding out.
It was only after I came to the blog after a break of several weeks, that I realized you might have gone over the top. You obviously cannot bear to be challenged, and lose control when you are.
*
Re my 1000s of deletions by Abagond.
You don’t know the facts. You don’t know the private conversations I had with Abagond about the deletions, do you?
It was his final decision to delete, not mine.
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Pay it Forward,
I am sorry to hear about your fibromyalgia. But how strange you are telling us about your painful affliction NOW??
As painful as it must be IF you are truly afflicted, it doesn’t excuse you from making up stories and attempting to bully others you don’t know because you were called out.
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Bulanik, after you asked abagond to delete all your comments, and you left in a self-righteous huff, I stated on the open thread that I would leave so that you might feel free to return to commenting on the blog. Some period of time passed and when it seemed that you had decided not to return, I myself returned to commenting here.
Some period after that, you did come back, still in a mad huff, and proceeded to telling folks off and pointing your finger at specific commenters for not upholding you in your deceit, in the way you thought they should,
And now You are claiming that I am trying to get you to leave this blog.
Seeing as how this blog means so much to you that you would spend, over a period of nearly 3 years, vast amounts of time searching the web into the wee hours of the morning ( I am perfectly aware that Britain is 5 hours ahead of EST here in the States), looking for erudite articles (and not so erudite articles — that comment where you posted a link to a “Circassian” woman wearing her hair in an afro was pure cr@p; that woman was a circus sideshow performer; she was only billed as being Circassian) to present here as knowledge gained over your lifetime, well, then you can stay here as long as the blog owner is willing to put up with you plagiaristic and back-stabbing self. You can keep your cherished spot here and I will cease commenting, for the time being, anyway. Be warned though, if I see another instance of your plagiarism, I will post it on the thread where it originates, as well as on the Open Thread.
[Bulanick, you might want to consider entering politics or starting your own religious cult. Your ability to manipulate and charm others, despite your obvious deceitfulness and lack of shame or remorse, is simply astounding, to say the least. Oh, and your avatar pic, that you’ve admitted isn’t actually a pic of yourself, but a pic you jacked off the web of some random Indian woman –that truly is improprietous on your part. Just take a sec and think about it. If that woman was to stop by this blog, she’d be greeted by the sight of her own pic accompanying the numerous, and often plagiarized, comments of some random stranger on the internet.]
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@Sharina,
Quite interesting!
I wonder if male nerds reject their female counterparts in an attempt to form relationships with more mainstream females…?
Do they (male nerds) then complain when the mainstream females reject them that nice guys like themselves finish last?
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@phoebeprunelle
Now that is a very interesting set of questions you have there,
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Oh, just this one last thing, Bulanik: in your future re-tellings of this event, please try and keep to actual remarks, rather than resorting to the last minute lies you make up in your head so as to gain sympathy from those commenters who may not be aware of your tendency to tell tallt tales as a means of self-defense..
Also, please do keep in mind that it was YOU who brought all this on yourself by making mention of my username, not once but several times, in your nasty accusations against me regarding a compliment I made to another commenter.
😉
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Pay if Forward.
Did you think because I paused to reply was reason for you to become overconfident in yourself again?
So, it seems keep a dossier on me.
The weaker your responses become, the more you revealed about yourself in this thread.
___________________________________________________
You say:
Pay it Forward, why do you want others to feel shame for reasons you invent? What role does your own personal shame in your own life play?
You have a thirst for it.
You want others to feel shame, but you have none after you were found following and digging. Why do you like stalking and digging at others?
You want me to feel “remorse”, because I am a psychopath ( 😀 ) but we don’t know what you are REALLY hiding, do we? You have not had the recognition and love and honour in life that you craved, I fear.
As I said before, you cut a sad and unhinged figure.
Instead of moving on, and commenting about interesting stuff in the world which you are part of and have lived fully, you instead, prefer to bully.
You like to threaten.
You create fictions.
You spread falsehoods.
You cry for sympathy.
You become desperate when called out.
You repeat yourself and are something of a broken record
*
Cue more drama:
….I will cease commenting, for the time being, anyway. Be warned though, if I see another instance of your plagiarism, I will post it on the thread where it originates, as well as on the Open Thread….
So, you ARE an internet stalker! This ^^ is quite a confession.
You are Abagond’s constable.
You are preparing your next pounce on the “charming” Bulanik because you are JEALOUS of her. Poor Pay it Forward.
You know what? I think you are going to withdraw because you fear that I will find you imitating my style of anecdote-writing more and more, and you, actually, dread being challenged when you ply your not quite up to scratch erudition. You always sound so sure of yourself.
The latest example was this one: https://abagond.wordpress.com/2014/01/13/mindy-kaling-on-the-cover-of-elle/#comment-209524
You just can’t admit when you don’t know a thing.
Conveniently, you seem to wash over the fact that I readily and frequently own up to what I don’t know — a great deal — and often ask if could someone enlighten me.
I did that in the last 24 hours in questions about the Persians of Central Asia.
Asking questions is how a lot of people learn.
*
You pronounce this priceless sentence:
And this is YOUR entitlement? Well, that’s mighty of you. 😀
For someone who claims to be shy, you are quite up yourself about putting words into my mouth though, right? Pointing the finger and calling me things like “smoocher”, “psychopath”, “back stabber”, “liar”, “thief” and “plagiarist”, “plagiarist”, “plagiarist” and “plagiarist”. You are very sure of yourself. You know everything for a FACT. Right.
*
Pay it Forward. Sorry sweetie, Ireland isn’t in Britain!
How could you make such a simple mistake? If you have actually read any of my comments PROPERLY, you’d notice that there is a difference there.
May I suggest that you scribble down “I must learn a little Geography”
Scribble it down in your dossier! 😀
It stands to reason that if you’re going to MONITOR and TAG me, because you have no job, or avocations, then my schedules are your fascination.
So, whilst you kiss and lick my every typed word, at least get the country I live in right for goodness sake!
*
Excuse me, but what do you know about the people of “Circassia”?
I have been searching for a nice photo of a Circassian beauty, something that is on the internet, not in a book. Why? Because EVERYONE I talk with about the subject (Caucasus peoples) seems to draw a blank at that circus performer photo. It’s an open secret, Pay it Forward. Try and relax about it.
You don’t have a clincher with that one, I’m afraid.
*
Am I the only one who has ever used a famous person’s photo for their gravatar picture? Yes, she is famous! Not a random Indian woman!
Are you going to report me to internet police or the FBI for using it?
Did you want to see a photo of me instead to to make a dolly for your pins?
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Yet…”Bulanik, let it go”.
Strange that the onus is not on Pay it Forward to drop it.
Yes Bulanik, let it go. And follow Linda’s past advice.
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Comment in moderation
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Legion?
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Aaah. I see it now.
Thank you.
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I should say, I also understand Pay it Forward’s frustration.
I too respect knowledge and learning; the degree of it, that I have, has not come easily to me, either.
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@ Abagond
Please could you delete my comments on this thread after this one:
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Yes, of course.
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… and I mean that I understand her frustration, without her mentioning anything about having fibromyalgia.
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“I wonder if male nerds reject their female counterparts in an attempt to form relationships with more mainstream females…?
Do they (male nerds) then complain when the mainstream females reject them that nice guys like themselves finish last?”
I think they do, I see plenty of blog posts and vids where some men complain about being rejected and saying oh women want the bad guys or thug. But if these guys are going after women that are a 10 there is a high possibility they will be rejected if the guy is less than a 10 just like there is a high possibility a woman that is less than a 10 will be rejected by a guy that is a 10.
I think a lot of those guys are sore losers they feel entitled to beautiful women even though they are not themselves and will turn their nose up at a woman that is the same level of attractiveness as them. Then they complain about women not giving them attention because they are a nerd and only give them attention when they get rich. when really it is the attractive woman they were chasing after that didn’t want them now trying to get with them. They forget about the not as attractive woman that was trying to get their attention and act as if all women are like the gold digging woman that didn’t want them before.
Then there are the ones that just see how some women chase after bad guys but can’t see that guys chase after bad women too, bridezillas was full of men marrying crazy women. then there are men that get with wild partying women yet say they want a woman they can bring home to momma. people that say one thing yet do another are usually the ones that act like this and choose the wrong people continuously.
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Legion, wow. Thank you very, very much.
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Then there is the double standard with beauty, a man can be somewhat overweight and be looked at as cute and still get roles in Hollywood.but a woman gets treated different from that.
Then the other double standard when it comes to self hate I find it interesting that when women style our hair a certain way it is self hate but men can style their hair any way they want and never get told they have self hate. men can perm, wave, cut their hair and not be told they have self hate but a woman does and its omg self hate.
a man dates out its oh well he’s expanding his options a woman does and its omg self hate look at the history.
a man is a stay at home dad and the response is oh wow that is awesome or u should man up, a stay at home mom is told she is lazy or is told her work is not as important as somebody going off to work. anyway I respect the stay at home moms and dads as their job does not end and they always have to get things done and don’t get to clock out and how well they do their job impacts a child’s life. then men that are single fathers get praised and asked if they need help whereas single mothers are made to feel dumb and are attacked and judged.
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Legion, this is such a sad and disagreeable revelation from you.
You say you understand my frustration, but I wonder about this.
You are not alone in respecting knowledge….I don’t know of anyone who has come by knowledge easily. Do you?
Is it ever without struggle or sacrifice, failure, more struggle, bloody hard work and then more bloody hard work? Year after year after year of investment tiredness, EFFORT, more failure and more grafting — and still not feeling one knows anything. That’s what keeps a learner going.
That was my personal experience (plus ridicule for being the unmentionables).
So, no, I do not find it pleasing that Pay it Forward does her carry on and makes it her job to disrespect me and make up ugly stories about me, call me liar, thief, psychopath — and all the rest.
It is repugnant.
I’ve met LOTS of people who put in the hours and years of it, too — night school, distance learning, and so on and so on, trying to get some kind of education.
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Legion,
“Solesearch, I know exactly what you mean. I did not mean to be a cold reductionist about the man you love and are daily making a life with. To you, he is your awesome husband; I get it and it shouldn’t be any other way. To an outsider (me in this case) I saw a pattern in your description and was breaking it down, to learn and distill from. Thanks for your answer.”
No problem, I didn’t take your comment negatively. I am wondering what about my list makes you exclude extroverts?
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phoebe, mstoogood4yall, sharina, kiwi,
“I wonder if male nerds reject their female counterparts in an attempt to form relationships with more mainstream females…?
Do they (male nerds) then complain when the mainstream females reject them that nice guys like themselves finish last?”
Definitely. The irony…
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@Mstoogood:
Why i am not surprised about male nerds?
But, the part about beauty–that gets really murky for me as that is always subjective (who or what is beautiful)…and i can’t speak for other girls, but i was never a chubby chaser–i prefer my man slim with a man arse (flat as a board)…i have mostly only been attracted to males who wear glasses, or maybe that is all i seem to attract, i’m not quite sure (but i am a female who wears glasses).
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“i was never a chubby chaser”
In this regard I am extremely superficial. I just can’t see myself with a chubby man. I might even be consider prejudice against fat men by some standards.
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Lol @Solesearch…
I figured it was something like that. Most of my life people have labeled me a geek, and i didn’t find my male geek companion until i met my husband though it seemed after him, male geeks were popping up all over the place asking if i were single.
I guess when you become older than 25–the deck of cards may be stacked against you and one needs to go ahead and make a decision that one can live with. :-).
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@Bulanik
The 21 day rule could not apply to addictions because addiction is just a symptom of a problem. Nor could it be applied to habits where they’ve been formed from trauma. You’d have to come to terms with the trauma first. The 21 day rule works for a something like the following . . .
You’ve had a rough few years in your childhood, you’ve gotten over the things that took place but you’ve grownbto develope toxic thought patterns because of it, but you didn’t even realise it until recently. This toxic thinking about your self and life in general will lead to bouts of depression if it’s not addressed, and quite possibly addiction, in order to cope. It’s not that you wallow in the pains of your childhood, but rather that life experiences often do shape our outlook, and whether we are optimistic or pessimistic. So you consciously make the decision to moniter your thought life and cut out habits of thinking that are toxic, such as the patterns I mentioned above. In 3 months time, this new habit would be locked in your memory. Although it would only take 21 days to revert back.
The 21 day rule works for developing patterns in your life.
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“and i can’t speak for other girls, but i was never a chubby chaser–i prefer my man slim with a man arse (flat as a board)…”
rofl and i’m the opposite I’m not into very overweight men but I don’t mind a guy with some chubbiness, maybe because i’m a bit chubby myself, I’ve never been into really skinny guys, I like some muscle but not body builder muscle on muscle kind of men either. As for a man arse I like a man with an arse whether it is that muscular arse or a somewhat plump one lol as I don’t really have an arse myself. a man with glasses is attractive to me I wear glasses sometimes although I probably should wear them more. and a nice chest with broad shoulders lol I think this guy is attractive http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-xhVlWYmbZrs/Tt6l3B-uCDI/AAAAAAAAAEM/R7e4zJTtuK4/s1600/small_hosea_chanchez_shirtless.jpg
so basically my dream man has the body of
I think who people are attracted to has to do with either wanting someone that looks like them or wanting someone that has certain features they don’t have.
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Ah ha…I found the article.
http://www.examiner.com/article/10-single-women-black-men-overlook-and-why-you-should-date-them
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Personally I think there is something sexy about a nerd or the geeky types. Perhaps with an athletic build and taller than me. Not super tall
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@ Ebonymonroe
…I see what you mean.
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!
Hmm, well, a man with a soft roundy-bum is not how I likes it at all. LOL.
It’s too much when The Man is the one with the womanly curves!!!
Muscular buttocks though, are another subject all together.
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Lol!
I’ve never understand why some of my girlfriends find a cushiony arse on a man attractive.
No. Thanks.
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@phoebeprunelle
I know this might seem odd, but you are in to vintage right? Attire and dress etc.
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I prefer my woman as a woman, what ever she is, as long as we get along and it feels good. Tall, short, skinny, fat, big boobs, small boobs, dark, blonde, black, white, athletic or not, just as long as she is who she is. And it feels good. Rich, poor, educated or not, just as long as she laughs and is ok with herself.
I do not care how many men she has been with, what she has done in the past, if she’s ok with me. I don’t mind if she has kids or scars, tattoos, or has been a porn model. I don’t care if she’s a stripper or nurse, a nun or an executive of a biggest bank in the world. All she needs to be is herself, just as she is. If that works, I’m fine with that. Well, if she is a nun there might be some difficulties later on…
And yes, I have been married and yes, I have kids, and yes, I have had numerous relationships, not by dozens, but I am a one woman man. Three is a crowd in a relationship, absolutely. No exceptions. I am a stone cold monogamist.
And yes, I have a beard, long hair and tattoos. No, I do not drink, never have, nor I do drugs. Sober mind is better for me. But if a woman wants to have a drink, I don’t mind. Just as long she does not fall on her face or barf on my face.
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@Sharina,
Yes girlfriend! I dress in 1940s style–usually reproduction as that is the most practical. I have started looking into actual vintage peices from that decade again though…problem is the “girls” are not going down and many old things have to be altered for that particular accomedation.
🙂
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@phoebeprunelle
I have found some vintage attire that I love, but I don’t know where to begin. Where to actually get this. Special places online or what not. I have been going natural and I thought the natural coupled with the vintage would really set off my personal style.
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The thing about authentic vintage dresses (in my experience) is the lack of stretch in the textile. Sure, you can let out a bit here and there, but when the “girls” move on up and out on, especially on inhalation and quick movement….it pulls in an unsightly way and too-revealing way — know what I mean?
(And, what if a button goes flying under the strain!)
I love that these clothes account for having bust, waist and hip, but as time has gone on I think the wraparound dress is the best compromise.
The material has some “give”, but you get some “structure”.
I wish though that more of them had little flowers and the cute collars that the vintage dresses often had…so pretty.
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@ Phoebeprunelle
On another thread, you said something about certain people conveying that, “black women don’t dress vintage.” It’s a white girl thing just like Yoga! *vomit*
Phoebe did you mean that actual staff in clothing stores would say this kind of garbage to you!??
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if you can go 21 days without drinking or getting high, that is real good, and you will have the ‘habit’ of constant use pretty well contained, 30 days is pretty good for any addiction
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@v8
I can honestly say I have never really found myself addicted to anything. Yes in the past I have tried weed, drank a little, and even smoked, but all of which I could quite at a drop of the dime.
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I have found some vintage attire that I love, but I don’t know where to begin. Where to actually get this. Special places online or what not. I have been going natural and I thought the natural coupled with the vintage would really set off my personal style.
@Sharina,
The best advice i can give (that is if you are asking for advice 🙂 ) is to really decide which time era or decade you want to recreate in your wardrobe. That will save you a lot of money, and time when shopping. It took me a little over a year with experimenting with different looks before i knew i was a 40’s girl. You can start small at thrift stores in your area and take your time and look for vintage like pieces until you are comfortable enough with buying from websites.
Now, the tricky thing about vintage clothes is that you need to decide whether or not you want reproduction (pieces made today that mimic the era) or actual vintage–with that, you really need to know your measurements. I learned that the hard way :(. But with all that–i have found that the key to making any retro look come to life is the right undergarments (hosiery, shaping panties and bullet bras)…and if you are adventuresome, corsets or bustiers :). Trust me–they are your friend.
And, i’m sure your hair looks lovely! So excited to hear you are going retro!
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@Legion,
Unfortunately–this has been the case–for me at least. I have come across people who sell vintage clothes be downright rude to me or refuse to sell me items. Not all, but many. I was in a vintage closet one day just browsing and the owner asked was i in a play since i was there. When i told her that no this is my personal style of choice–she just said–“well i didn’t African American girls liked retro.”
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Refuse to sell you items? Because you can’t like retro?
So, what style of clothing are you “supposed” to like, then? Something less feminine or elegant or delicate or modest: something more “urban-ugly” or more “butch”?
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@ Bulanik–yep–you nailed it sweetie :).
All of those above.
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@phoebeprunelle
Just took a look at the 1940s vintage and I can see why you like it.
http://www.stopstaringclothing.com/sunshop/1940s-clothing-25-3.html
These designs might not be authentic 1940s though
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@Sharina…yes!
But i have to save for a piece at a time though, lol…
my latest lust is shoes. I can’t decide on Miss L Fire or Remix shoes–not to mention vintage perfumes…
smh
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30 days is pretty good for any addiction
Thanks v8. Something tangible to put into practice, now.
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@ Phoebe
Damn, I’m sorry to hear all that. You need to search for a place that deserves to get your business and mind their damn tact. I’m going through something similar. Hang in there!
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@ Sharina
I can honestly say I have never really found myself addicted to anything.
We are addicted to emotional patterns too Sharina, something to think about.
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@Legion
“We are addicted to emotional patterns too Sharina, something to think about.”—Definitely something to think about. I have been presented with this times before and yet I still find myself overlooking it as an addiction. I would how you see those that are afflicted with sexual addictions. Is it a legitimate claim or just a hoax?
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Bulanik, I received my man made language book last weekend. I’ve only made it to chapter 2 but the semantic derogation and the idea of women as minus male have been enlightening thus far.
I’ve been reading the book with black people in mind as well.
Pretty good so far.
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I prefer reproduction, I’ve had a bad experience with a 20’s dress that fell to pieces. I’m also a 40’s girl, used to be strictly 50’s and 60’s. I’m getting into bullet bras now, you’re absolutely right, undergarments are everything. Even with many 50’s dresses, you really need 2 or 3 underskirts, and maybe even a corset to make for completely smooth lines. The pin curls of the 20’s-50’s are perfect for natural hair, the curls that come from curls pinned when wet smoth the hair after the come out, so it reduces the time it would take to only rocka Pam Grier.
I was never into fat men, but then I came across “House party 1” again and saw the peeping Tom scene. It looked like it would feel soft and squigy riding on a fat man, so I told my old man if he wants to get fat when we’re old, I could get into it. Although I may not be able to breathe during man on top.
IDK
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Corsets…the thing about the corsets is the ties at the back are tricky. When you tie up at the front first and then twist the whole thing around, it’s not a good feeling. You get used to it, though, and practice is key. Even short-term wearing can really have an impact. It’s amazing how quickly the body adjusts.
But I can’t get into the bullet bra thing though.
I like the ones the push you “up” and “together”. This gives the illusion of a narrower torso.
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Solesearch, it’s a long time since I read the book. I hope you enjoy it.
I still remember the sections on norm and deviation when she is laying out the argument. Her thoughts on women’s speech being drowned out and mis-named “strident” and such, made me think a lot and resonate to this day.
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I think they call those bras (that push up and together) Gossard bras.
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Ebony, yah, they probably make some of the nicest ones, but the other manufacturers have versions.
Rigby and Peller have some lovely (but expensive, because of the Swiss lace) too, but they no longer measure you in the old way so you know what you’re going to get, you just have to be “seen” for the fit, so it’s a bit luck of the draw if you have a particular style in mind.
The ones in Agent Provacteur look are fantastic, but never tried any…
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Agent provocateur . . . my fave lingerie line. I find it hard to find the right size, narrow back, large cups. Awkward.
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32 is often an issue above E.
I’ve gotten lazy over the years because that kind of shopping expedition can only happen in London. I find myself “settling” with the best from Marks over here.. 😦
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Sorry ladies. A lot of this is new to me so been doing a huge amount of research.
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Try a 28 back. It’s impossible. I get fed up and go to Marks and Spencers too, and settle for sports bras lately. Hey if the look worked for Anna Kornicova (sp?)
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@Sharina,
Also try http://www.jitterbuggin.com. It is reproduction, but i think budget friendly if you invest one piece at a time. I have had great success with them! Some girls complain because well, her sizes only accomodate waist 28-34.
Also try Miss L Fire shoes (they have sales), and Re-mix Shoes…these are the stores i trust State side.
For purses, bakelite jewelry and hair flowers i rummage around on Etsy–and have found great deals (most of my 40’s purses and earrings– i haven’t paid over 30 dollars for), and with your hair being natural–you can easily go on youtube to look up retro style tutorials…
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@ Sharina
I have been presented with this times before and yet I still find myself overlooking it as an addiction. I would how you see those that are afflicted with sexual addictions. Is it a legitimate claim or just a hoax?
Tell you what, my dove. I shall dig something up interest for you*, and then you can answer whether you think sex addiction is fake or real.
———————————
* give me a little time.
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@phoebeprunelle
Thank you. While I am not worried about my waist, I am a bit worried about the “girls” situation.
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@Legion
No worries. Take your time. I finally caught up and saw that you were sick. Not sure if you still are but get better soon.
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@ Ebonymonroe, a 28 back? Never thought of that.
It sounds “tight” but shall try that tip next time I go over
Nor have I thought that the sports ones were the thing either, but since you mention it, I might give it go. I am always daunted by the underwear section in shop. I was under the impression that those types of ones flatten you down outwards and sideways: I want to look “narrow” and not “wide” on top.
I take it sports bras have push at the sides, then. Thanks, Ebony.
@ Legion, Sharina mentions that you have been unwell. I second her wishes and hope you get better soon. A lot gets lost, misinterpreted or misunderstood on discussion boards, but I hope a get well wish won’t be! lol. 😀
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@Sharina–oh no–i didn’t mean to imply that you were! Sorry, i should’ve been more clear–i was just saying that the clothing company only carry small to average sizes for women.
As for the “girls” well, they are not going anywhere and lucky for us, the babies and the men would prefer it that way so…
No worries, the clothing sold on that site has real ladies in mind (those of us with “girls” and other grab worthy parts, lol)
I’m sure you’d look adorable in anything from that site.
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So Abagond,
How do you prefer your lady dress?
🙂
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@Bulanik
Oh, no, no, no sweetheart, I meant I have a 26-28 back (bra band), but very large cups, which makes it impossible for me to find bras that I don’t have to have custom made, so I often just settle for sports bras.
Why yes mrs phoebe, Abagond has conveniently skipped this list. Naughty, naughty.
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@ Ebony, I mean the right under the cup ribcage measurement.
To tell you the truth, shopping for such items are a source of sweaty and discontented episodes. I avoid, avoid, avoid, as a result, and am not sure what the personal solution is. I think manufacturers cater more for a different kind of body shape. Is custom-made the way to go?
The Gossard brand (which is the best of it’s kind, imo) does not go high enough in cupsizes for 30 or 32 undercup, ribcage measurement. The sizes that do fit that ribcage and ARE available just “spread” out the cup — and the wide look is the result.
If I stick to the Gossard range what does fit the cup is simply too big around the ribcage.
I am wondering whether the best thing is the sports bra that you mention worn UNDER a bodyshaper/corset that have 1) a high back and 2) are over-arm (like this http://www.hotcorsets.co.uk/corsets/underbust-corsets/purdy-black-pinstriped-underbust-corset.html), so that the bust gets pushed forward.
I’ve been thinking about trying that style (for a smooth back) for a while now, since I find the bone in some of these articles too much.
That particular style (in the link) might not be worn for every day(haha), but I think it might be the right combo to achieve the look of showing a narrow torso whilst having a full bust.
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There’s a company that caters to small bands with large cups online. I’ll have a look for their name and post it here today. I would recommend you go get measured first however, as they’re an online company so you’ll need to know your measurements. As for Gossard, I must admit, I’m not particularly knowledgeable about their bras, just that they were once famed for the “push up and together look.” There is a sports bra called “The genie bra” that is said to produce perfect lines, fit and projection, without flattening or creating a “double breasted appearance.” I have considered purchasing a bra from them before; they advertise on the late night commercial segments and the shopping channels. The good thing about them is that they go by dress size, not the traditional band and cup measuring system, which greatly simplifies the whole process.
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Bra sizes–stockings, and push-ups!
Oh my!
Sorry fellas ;)…
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phoebeprunelle
Oh no I should have been more clear. I did not mean to imply that you were saying that. Lol
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Abagond wears a lady dress???!!!
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@King,
Uhmm no sir, lol–that is not what i meant!
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@phoebeprunelle
“As for the “girls” well, they are not going anywhere and lucky for us, the babies and the men would prefer it that way so…”—True. I have finally learned to accept them.
“I’m sure you’d look adorable in anything from that site.”—Thank you. Oddly enough I use to be a major tomboy. It is odd how age made me want to be more girlie. 🙂
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@Sharina
i never tried quaaludes, other than that…
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@legion not sure if this is sarcastic, but 30 days is a good milestone, cigs are worse than heroin to kick, trust and believe
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@Bulanik
The bra company is called Ewa Michalak; they’re a Polish bra company who make band sizes right down to 28. I don’t know if they have attractive offerings however as I’ve only ever skimmed their site. But they do operate by cm not inches so you’d have to convert before ordering if you so choose.
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@ Ebony — fantastic, fantastic info! I should’ve the guessed it’d be the trusty Poles who’d save the day (lol). I checked some of the styles available ( CH Miętus) — they do balconettes! plunges! bright colours! see-thru lace!
Thank you.
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Aww, you’re more than welcome sweetheart.
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@ Sharina
Re: Sex addiction. Real or false?
I thought of providing some text from a book showing examples of sex addiction and how they develop, but it will take too long. I’ll direct you to the book instead:
The Brain that Changes Itself by Norman Doidge, M.D.
(chapter 4 “Acquiring Tastes and Loves” discusses sex addiction and some other topics. There is a fascinating example of a man whose brain literally rewired pain sensations with the sex centers of his brain. He was an enthusiastic and willing participant in very extreme S&M that his girlfriend would carry out on him. The roots of the man’s rewiring of pain messages working with his sex centers go back to when he suffered from Polio as a child and various ways he dealt with the pain and helplessness of his condition, along with, external environmental factors that impacted him in ways that no one would have guessed.)
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@Legion
I will find this book immediately. I am and have been curious on the idea of whether or not sex is an addiction or simply an excuse by some people to indulge in sex with multi-partners. I will respond more once I get the change to up my knowledge on it.
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Ginger!
http://everydayayurveda.org/herbs/study-shows-that-ginger-stops-menstrual-pain-as-effectively-as-drugs
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@Legion
If you ever get the time, I really wouldn’t mind hearing more about this.
How can this happen?
I didn’t think rewiring could be so extreme.
Did he manage to rewire his brain away from associating pain with §-xual pleasure?
That sounds remarkable.
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@Ebony
Did he manage to rewire his brain away from associating pain with §-xual pleasure?
No, he did not. His demise was actually very unpleasant (a hidden message of the importance of Love in romantic relationships is implicit in the way that he met his end).
The man’s name is Bob Flanagan. So, as I said, he was in a very extreme and consensual S&M relationship with his girlfriend. From the account that I read of Flanagan, he was uninterested in undoing the wiring that had taken place. He was very interested in finding a partner that would be as extreme as he needed her to be; funny how life works but he found such a partner. What might have been better was a partner who could have helped to normalize his sex responses but that’s not what happened.
A documentary was made about Flanagan’s life, I’ve never watched it. His life, as presented in the book, was enough for me.
A brief portrait of Flanagan:
“When he was thirty-one, he fell in love with Sheree Rose, who came from a very troubled family. In the film we see Sheree’s mother openly belittle her husband, Sheree’s father, who, Sheree claims was passive and never showed her affection. Sheree describes herself as being bossy since childhood. She is Bob’s sadist.
In the film Sheree uses Bob, with his consent, as her slave. She humiliates him, cuts into the skin near his nipples with an X-Acto knife, puts clamps on his nipples, force feeds him, chokes him with a cord till he turns blue, forces a large steel ball–as big as a billiard ball–into his anus, and puts needles in his erogenous zones. His mouth and lips are sutured shut with stitches. He writes of drinking Sheree’s urine from a baby bottle. We see him with feces on his penis. His every orifice is invaded or defiled. These activities give Bob erections and lead to great orgasms in the sex that often follows.
[…]
In one of the final scenes a naked Bob Flanagan takes a hammer and nails his penis, right through its center, to a board. He then matter of factly removes the nail so that blood spurts all over the camera lens, like a fountain, from the deep hole through his penis.” Source: The Brain That Changes Itself by Doidge ch. 4.
Ebony, dear, I shall not have time for more. The book is a great read. Get a copy and just read ch 4, if you wish, extremely interesting material.
How can this happen?
I didn’t think rewiring could be so extreme.
(First, a mea culpa: Flanagan had cystic fibrosis, not polio.)
Well, it goes back to doctors and nurses putting him through regimens that were strange (to a child) and painful. Also, he noticed that masturbation would take him away from his health difficulties. Mix all of that up with other experiences and the inadequate coping mechanisms of a child and you get Flanagan’s incredibly potent fusing of pain and sex response. The book presents how the wiring most likely happened in a fuller and more satisfying way than I have time to do.
There you are, my dear. 🙂
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Pay It Forward, a humble and belated -thank you- for the compliment you paid me.
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Pay it Forward, I was also saddened to hear about your fibromyalgia (yes, I think you did mention it another time too). I will remember you in my prayer time, just as mary burrell did for me (and I think you did too) last year when I announced a difficulty I was having.
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@ Bulanik
I second her [Sharina] wishes and hope you get better soon.
Thank you. I’m almost back at 100%!
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Thanks Legion
Be well boo boo
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I’d agree that addiction is everywhere and in everyone, no one is exempt and simply can’t be avoided.
Natural Medicine takes the view, or used to, that the brain chemical / neurotransmitter Dopamine was the thing that made humans WANT and EXPECT and do things they didn’t even want to, but could not stop themselves from doing. This was the same for other hominids, and something inherited from Humankind’s earliest ancestors.
In a discussion about brain physiology, the idea about Dopamine-bias was laid out like this:
probably EVERY thing and ANY one does — including AND especially anything irrational — boiled down to triggering or protecting that Dopamine flow in the human brain. Dopamine controls, manipulates and is responsible for self-deception. It is, and was always, part of the human survival mechanism — all of it Dopamine-induced. This was explained through Abraham Maslow’s model called the “Hierarchy of Needs”.
http://www.businessballs.com/maslow.htm
To restore all-important balance, the approach being taught to Herbal and Nutritional practitioners at the time was that powerful and destructive obsessiveness and cravings were perceived (in part, I stress) to be due to mineral deficiency — especially of folate (folic acid).
One mainstream treatment for Parkinson’s Disease is to imiitate the effects of Dopamine, and what a medical study has found is that because it influences “how we see the world and respond to it”, some takers of the Dopamine-like drugs will develop severe addictions or related compulsions.
In this case, addictive gambling:
http://www.boston.com/news/globe/ideas/articles/2007/08/19/your_brain_on_gambling/
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It almost sounds hopeless. Self control seems so expansive and evades the hardwired human condition. What a tangled web we weave.
That Bob Flanagan guy, how sad, man. Poor guy.
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The older i get–reaching thirties–the more connected i feel to felines?
I swear cats literally will surround my porch, or front yard. I dream about healthy, huggable kittens often too.
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@ Ebony
It almost sounds hopeless. (careful, adopting pessimism, as a habit, will rewire your brain)
You’re affected by Flanagan’s dark story. Not every story turns out darkly.
“This is not a dark ride”, my dear. 🙂
Tunnel of Love
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@phoebeprunelle
Any kitten or a particular breed?
@ Legion
After reading over your response to Ebony it reminded me of a tv show I used to watch called Satisfaction. My favorite character was Natalie. She struggled with her strange sense of pleasure and isolated herself often to avoid being found out about her latex desires. What was interesting in her need to determine what exactly made her find pleasure in her type of kink.
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Sharina!
I want to know more about this. If possible.
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Dearie me! I do believe I made some white people uncomfortable yesterday. I was on a date with a black woman. We talked about many things with great ease, racism even came up. I used the phrase “white people blah” when talking about a few things from the 20’s and 30’s. I did this in my usual conversational voice, unwise perhaps. On leaving the venue, my charming self turned to thank the staff as I usually do. They completely avoided eye contact and simply murmured back in barely audible sounds that I suppose were English words. Dearie me!
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No!! Don’t do it phoebeprunelle!!!
Don’t become a… CAT LADY!
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Bulanik,
“I’d agree that addiction is everywhere and in everyone, no one is exempt and simply can’t be avoided.
Natural Medicine takes the view, or used to, that the brain chemical / neurotransmitter Dopamine was the thing that made humans WANT and EXPECT and do things they didn’t even want to, but could not stop themselves from doing. This was the same for other hominids, and something inherited from Humankind’s earliest ancestors.”.”
This makes me think of this from Romans 7:15:
“15 I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. 16 And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. 17 As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. 18 For I know that good itself does not dwell in me, that is, in my sinful nature.[a] For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. 19 For I do not do the good I want to do, but the evil I do not want to do—this I keep on doing. 20 Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.
21 So I find this law at work: Although I want to do good, evil is right there with me. 22 For in my inner being I delight in God’s law; 23 but I see another law at work in me, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within me. 24 What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body that is subject to death?”
Dopamine is sin!
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@ soulsearch….ahh, thank you.
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@Bulanik
Certainly! I will find as much information on it as possible as I have always been curious in regards to those with sexual fetishes. Is there anything particular you would like me to elaborate on?
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@ Sharina
Never seen or heard of this tv series — the only thing I see is that it was about a brothel, and nothing more.
So Natalie is a sex worker, then? Does she do this work because it’s what she wants to do? How does she express her interest in latex, and what is it seen like, is it the smell or the feel? Is she ambivalent about it? Is it a private pleasure, like masturabation? Is it a long standing thing, or something she acquired, or was it introduced to her by a client?
Does she say she is aroused or doesn’t she acknowledge it?
Do we get to see her dressed in something shiny and tight?
When you say “people with fetishes”, I follow your meaning, because this word has associations with incomprehensible “perversions” and mental disorders. But, a fetish is probably any object that triggers arousal. Like the way some heterosexual men love women’s breasts, or buttocks almost in a disembodied way, or, are turned on by seeing a woman in certain pieces of underwear, or, a fascination with pictures of sexual activity. That’s enjoyment of erotica or pornography.. Voyeurism is another one that comes to mind. Footwear, too.
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I giggled thinking of this thread a little while back. We challenged some of Abagond’s opening points about women but soon turned the conversation into the topic of retro wardrobes and bras. Lol
Legion said
“@ Ebony
It almost sounds hopeless. (careful, adopting pessimism, as a habit, will rewire your brain)
You’re affected by Flanagan’s dark story. Not every story turns out darkly.
“This is not a dark ride”, my dear. 🙂
Tunnel of Love”
………………………………………………….
You’re absolutely right. Bad train of thought gone. It’s just that guy’s story is so sad.
I agree @soulsearch
The topic of addictions always makes me think of that passage. I believe in the biblical fall of man, so I tend to look at it from that context, anyway.
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@Bulanik
Natalie is the owner of the brothel. She seems to have always had a desire for latex and S&M, but she suppressed it because she felt it was unnatural. At some point it becomes overwhelming and she ends up engaging in it with a client that also has an obsessive need of latex and S&M.
She expresses her desire of it through the feel. She often times comes off as a drug addict who has to get a fix. In order to feel calm she must touch it. In stressful situations she is often times seen touching a piece of latex she has hidden or to the side. Most of the time it appears to be her own private pleasure, but once she starts dating someone she attempts to bring him in to it. Unfortunately I can’t tell you if it was long standing or something she acquired because the series ended just when she was attempting to discover why she had this desire for latex.
The show is a bit graphic so it does show her is pleasure over this, but she is quite reserved in regards to her pleasure. She is usually seen as reserve in her dress as well, but usually something fitting to her form. Here are two links to check out a bit more information.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satisfaction_%28TV_series%29
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1129029/
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@ Sharina
Thank you for explaining, as the links aren’t that revealing.
Like you, I am curious about this, (very) but I don’t think I’ve seen anything about sexuality + latex that is ALSO integrated into a good drama narrative.
The explanations I have heard (and read) about fetishes are plausible enough, but I haven’t reached the point where it feels right emotionally.
I just don’t understand the satisfaction or “release” aspect of it.
It can look fabulous (tight and shiny corsets, tight leather trousers, thigh high boots), and looking fabulous* and make the wearer feel powerful, but I don’t know what comes next that is “irresistible” about it.
I wear boots most of the time, and once, I was on a near-empty train, and as I stood at the doors waiting for them to open at the next stop, something I shall never forget — and fail to understand — happened.
Suddently, as I stood there, I felt light pressure on my foot, and when I looked down, I saw a man crouching down licking and fingering my boots.
It was unbelievable. I think I was paralysed in that moment of shock.
Where could I go on a moving train?
I saw his gratified and wet lower-face when I flung myself out of the door when it opened, and ran.
I think the fright I felt at the time turned into confusion and ambivalence and incomprehension, because I wanted to know why and could not understand why. When I told anyone, it was met with incredulity and laughter.
This man’s compulsion to have that unwanted intimate contact with skin-over-skin — in public, with a stranger — just overrode all else for him. Why?
What was this pull so powerful to make him go to such lengths and risk?
What if I’d kicked him instead with those spikey-heeled boots?
(*http://www.obgmode.com/Fetiwear.html)
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Correction– *looking fabulous can make the wearer feel fabulous…
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They completely avoided eye contact and simply murmured back in barely audible sounds that I suppose were English words. Dearie me!
That would have been worth the price of the meal to have heard that. By the way, did you get lucky?
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^Haha! She liked me enough to sing a version of “Summertime” for me, which was kind of an amazing thing, really. But we didn’t quite seal the deal, there’s always next time. 😉
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^Haha! She liked me enough to sing a version of “Summertime” for me, which was kind of an amazing thing, really. But we didn’t quite seal the deal, there’s always next time. 😉
Next stop the almighty leg-over. ‘Summertime and the living is easy, fish are jumping and the cotton is high. Your daddy’s rich and you mamma’s good looking, so hush baby Legion don’t you cry!’
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^ I liked it better when we were both amused by the discomfort of the staff.
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@Bulanik
I am truly sorry it has taken me so long to respond to your post. upon first reading it I was taken over by such a roar of laughter that I could not control myself and later I was not sure how to respond to it. I then later sat down and thought…what is it that makes a person loose so much control that they would even fathom licking and fingering a strangers boot? These type of uncontrollable impulses are things that I can’t truly imagine feeling myself, so I have a hard time imagining another having them.
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Marion Woodman
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@ Sharina
😀
You see the problem I have trying to understand and find answers to this…!
It happened in a matter of seconds, but years later I still can’t fathom it.
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Even if you are not a Christian and don’t believe the Genesis creation story, it is still a useful tool for helping men understand why they must always be in charge and lead women and avoid the reverse.
Im not a Nuwabian, but Malichi York’s interpretation is very interesting. Some people try to dismiss him as a “nutcase” but he is clearly a knowledgeable theologian, speaks several languages including Hebrew and amharic, and most importantly, understand that words are VERY important and HOW they function as TOOLS.
Discussion and study of religion is one of those activities dark skinned people seem to be drawn to without prompting.
I know I am.
Here Dr. York is giving a presentation called “The woman and the Devil”
he has a very interesting perspective.
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MILhbx8lMVg)
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peanut
men are stupid
————————————————————————-
Obviously the comment of a woman who doesn’t have one nor any chance of getting one.
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@Bulanik
I think the book legion recommended is a good start. I have not myself been able to research it the way I wished, but I am still on the look out for something that will be beneficial to this topic.
@phoebeprunelle
Took a look at some vintage shoes a couple of weeks ago and fell in love.
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@ phoebeprunelle
Phoebe, I think you will like this quite a bit.
http://www.prettyeccentric.co.uk/
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A certain way, among others, of being feminine:
She always seems to radiate a message of femininity and strength, and all without a sense of pettiness, like she’s a generous spirit.
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=”http://www.jukebo.com/prince/music-clip,forever-in-my-life,q03mrx.html”> “Forever in my Life” into “It”
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Forever in my Life into It
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Yeah I have finally returned to this thread!!!
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I just tried to tell an old friend that I miss her. I couldn’t pull the trigger though…
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^^^^^Why not?
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It feels like bad timing. I feel like delaying it. damn.
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^ I have now. 🙂
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@Legion
It is always hard to say goodbye, but it is especially hard if you have feelings for said person on a different level. So do you have deeper feelings?
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@ Sharina
I am not romantically in love with her, if that is what you were wondering. I do have strong affection for her though, we suffered through a natural disaster together, we helped each other cope. This is where the affection stems from.
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@Legion
Yes, that is what I was wondering. So have you been able to say goodbye since your post?
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@ Sharina
“Goodbye” is not what I want(ed) to say to her. “I miss you” (another form of “hello”) is what I’ve been wanting to say to her. And no, I haven’t done so yet. I keep opening my email to do it, and then I don’t send the email. (Yeah, I’m being lame…)
*sigh*…
———————————-
Yes, that is what I was wondering.
I know you were, you horny toad! 😀
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“I know you were, you horny toad!”—haha that and the fact that I was hoping you had found “The One.” 🙂
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Wow!
I just met this woman at a coffee shop. We were getting along awesome, she’s super interesting and kind of a sexy nerd. Then, by horrid coincidence two of her friends show up. They grill me like they “love the smell of napalm in the morning.”
More on the horrid coincidence thing: one of her friends is a chick I always see in the neighborhood who always gives me bad vibes. Why?–You ask. Uhh, well she caught me staring at her once trying to decide if I should make a move or not, so, she hates me for being a punk-ass b!tch who didn’t step when he should have. She totally tried to crush my hit on her friend. Of all the rotten coincidences, Jesus!!! They weren’t lying when they said “it’s a small world,” goddammit!
The moral of the story is what? When you’re attracted to a woman, act on that shit. She’ll throw you off a cliff as punishment for not doing so if she ever gets the chance.
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Moderation!!! Why? There isn’t one curse word in the whole post.
Hi King. 🙂
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oh wait… I said “sh!t”
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“my wife has made it a point never to give our boys play guns”
No offense, but this is silly. Our society is far too afraid of violence, and far too accepting of sexuality. I do not have children quite yet, but I’d much rather they play with guns (play or [unloaded] real) than watch pornographic content online.
Part of the reason so many young males are leftist, feminist soy boys is because their mommies (and it’s almost always the mommy not the father) try to keep them away from play and fictional violence, and fill their defenseless little minds with nonsense like “affirmative consent” and “don’t hit a girl”.
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