Disclaimer: It is still early days. The facts presented here may change as we learn more.
James Holmes (1987- ) is an American mass murderer. He shot 70 people, killing 12 in Aurora, Colorado on July 20th 2012 at the opening midnight showing of the new Batman film, “The Dark Knight Rises”.
The crime: Holmes entered the packed cinema through a fire exit door that he left unlocked. He filled the place with gas making it hard for people to hide among the seats. He fired a shot in the air and then started firing at the audience. At first some thought it was part of the film, which features plenty of shooting. He would have killed far more if his gun did not jam.
The fire alarm went off and people called the police. It took the police seven minutes to arrest him from the moment he started shooting.
On Twitter iJesseWilliams observed:
So they were able to apprehend the armed shooter w/out shooting, beating, tazing, sodomizing and/or killing him? … So it can be done …
The police have yet to give a motive.
Holmes had been laying the groundwork for months: he bought ammunition back in winter, the guns in spring. He is a huge Batman fan who seems have arranged the mass murder for the opening night of the film.
The man: To understand Holmes properly you must view him through the white lens. Because white people see the world as it is, not as they wish it to be.
From my “White Racist Guide to Black Crime”:
When white people do something bad it is due to circumstances, a bad upbringing, a psychological disorder or something. Because, apart from a few bad apples, white people are Basically Good. Everyone knows it. But when black people do something bad it is because they were born that way. They try to put up this front of being good but given the right circumstances their true nature comes out. Sad but true.
There you go: Holmes is white and therefore is just some sort of bad apple, probably has some psychological disorder or a bad upbringing. A troubled soul, not some violent, heartless animal with no conscience. Whatever it is, it is strictly about him – it says absolutely nothing about the true nature of white men:
- Not even if the massacre takes place 30.8 km away from another massacre by white males (Columbine, 1999),
- Not even if it takes place during a violent Hollywood film,
- Not even if it takes place on Dead Indian Land.
And so the press has been heads-down dutifully combing through Holmes’s past and found that he has been seeing a psychiatrist! How great is that? High five! We are done here.
Chauncey DeVega:
Instead of a national conversation where we reflect on what has gone wrong with young white men in our society — a group which apparently possesses a high propensity for committing acts of mass violence — James Holmes will be framed as an outlier.
See also:
- We Are Respectable Negroes: What James Holmes and the Colorado Movie Massacre Tell Us About White (Male) Privilege – read the whole Chauncey DeVega post that I quote from here
- The White Racist Guide to Black Crime
- Basically Good
- The white lens
- Kenneth Chamberlain
- Ramarley Graham
- Alan Blueford
- Oscar Grant
- Sean Bell
- The Thuggification of Trayvon Martin
- How White America got rich
All the pics of James Holmes being circulated by the media seem to be of different people.
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The AR-15 clone that Holmes used was not military-grade. Had it been military-grade it would have self-fire capacity. That is, the ability to fire as an automatic weapon, not just semi-automatic. The S&W M&P-15 is simply a civilian, semi-automatic rifle, with military-style aesthetics. An hunting rifle would have fired a larger, more powerful round as quickly and probably more accurately, but wouldn’t have the same “military” styling.
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Thanks for the correction.
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@ Abagond
When I first heard about this story, in the very beginning, it stated:
1. There were 2 shooters
2. He was wearing a throat guard
3. The police had already been in his apartment
Then as the day progressed, the story changed. I said immediately to my family: It was staged. The government does this to push forth their agenda, which is gun control, and the use any measures to get their plan into motion.
Second, Warner brothers could have plotted this to draw more attention and money for their final installment of the Batman Trilogy. Christian Bale has stated many times that he and Chris Nolan will part ways after this is completed. So I did what my suspicions told me, I called a friend of mine who has family in the military and questioned about this “throat guard”.
He told me that that is a militia special equipment not accessible to the public. Like certain types of guns. Then he told me of Project Paperclip that was evolved into MK Ultra/The Monarch Brainwashing Project …all derived from Hitler’s Mind Kontrolle, and it all fell into place.
Now, am I saying that this was a conspiracy? In my honest opinion, yes. Could James be just another “lone wolf?” Possibly. We’ll never really know, right? But something about this entire shooting seems suspicious.
As for the white males being violent…
*sigh*
Abagond, black people have an issue with intra-criminal behaviour. I’m not even denying that. I’ve seen neighbourhoods destroyed by gang violence with the crack epidemic…
But…
White males will commit mass genocide, over and over again and it will be :
1. Excused
2. Explained
3. Researched
4. Studied
5. Rationalized
6. Discussed
7. Dismissed
8. Books and movies will be in the process of being told/written all for the purpose of denying that the race has a problem with aggression. Ever wonder why the DC Sniper was executed but The Unibomber, Charlie Manson and Jeffrey Dahmer were sent to jail and “studied?”
This is not a coincidence.
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The 2005 London bombings were carried out by university educated men from Leeds. Men who did outreach work, aided immigrant families and were active in their communities. Of course, they were also PoC (and identified as Muslim), so this information was irrelevant, and brown and black communities and faiths were demonized by whiteness, as always. The Leeds men certainly were not coddled and treated like a wayward child like Holmes is currently being.
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Makes me want to dress up like Luke Cage and go buck wild. Maybe I can get a sweet book deal afterwards. Satanforce can join me as David Xanatos. We’d be famous! Wheeee!
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@ Nah…..
Don’t do it! Blacks can’t get book deals, only lethal injections.
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^^^sorry, I meant that for someguy. see what happens when you stay up all night looking at the boring opening ceremony?
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I wouldn’t disagree with that one bit. On the other hand I wish Blacks would focus on building their own nations. White mass murder don’t change the facts that Africa, and Black nations/neighbourhoods/communities/leaders etc.. are hideous and embarrassing. White neighbourhoods/nations is still 99% safer, cleaner, more productive in general. Period.
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@truthbetold – I cannot believe you are on here spouting those utterly ridiculous conspiracy theories! Paranoia and fear are the main reasons that people become angry and commit acts such as these shooting. Perhaps YOU should get some help to calm your nerves before you snap!
Anyway, back to Abagond’s points. I knew the minute when a White male was arrested for the shooting, it would be concluded that he was mentally ill. It didn’t come as a shock. I won’t hold out any hope that White America will sincerely examine why White males commit mass murders in this way. They’re too busy feeling superior to Blacks and Latinos! There’s no need to look at and change your behavior when you view others as having even worse behavior. Typical petulant child thinking.
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You Americans are obsessed with racism.
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@Anonymous
” White neighbourhoods/nations is still 99% safer, cleaner, more productive in general. Period.”
And that wouldn’t have aaaaanything at all to do with the way white nations deliberately funnel crime, poverty and violence into the black and brown communities and nations they exploit by pressing them into economic service for white nations and hijacking their resources, setting up puppet leadership, all while fiercely segregating black and brown peoples into pre-defined territories they aren’t allowed to leave. No nothing at aaaaall…
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Good to bring this up , Abagond…there are way too many things involved to sluff it off as a wayward sick boy…the ease he could get these weapons and amunition is something sick also..it all ties together
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@ saadiyah
I really don’t feel like a debate but research project paperclip and President Clinton’s apology. This does exist. And Holmes has followed the script beautifully.
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[…] James Holmes « Abagond This entry was posted in Uncategorized and tagged america, black, century, colorado, crime, holmes, indian, james-holmes, police, science, white by admin. Bookmark the permalink. […]
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One bullet from the cops and it could have saved a whole lot of taxpayer’s money.
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Some how conservatives can make the tragedy of a white murderer and his arbitrary victims about a Black president:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/28/idaho-billboard-compares-obama-to-aurora-shooting-suspect_n_1713895.html?utm_hp_ref=canada&ir=Canada
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@ SW6
I meant those two phrases sarcastically, which I am hoping is apparent from the post. I wrote the post in a bitter, sarcastic mood.
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@ Anomymous
You are deflecting.
White American neighbourhoods are not particularly safe by world standards. Even if you leave blacks out of the numbers, White Americans are still twice as likely to be murdered than someone in Britain, three times more likely than in Germany and six times more than in Japan.
Part of that has to do with gun laws, but part of it has to do with a culture of violence in the white community, particularly in some parts of the country, like Texas. The same culture of violence that produces Batman films. The same culture of violence that the wealth of the country was built on. The same culture of violence that produces the Aurora and Columbine massacres. Black people have NOTHING to do with that shit.
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I knew you would write a post on the Denver massacre Abagond, and I’m glad you did.
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@ JT
I agree with that billboard. The reason many people do not is because white lives are valued way more than brown ones. Holmes’s victims were perfect victims, Obama’s are not:
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“Black people have NOTHING to do with that shit.”
**********
Perhaps not in the way you just described it. But — when one considers that Black people make up a considerable percentage of the US’ armed forces that engage in violent foreign militaristic adventures that further enrich the rich and powerful western interests (white supremacy) that essentially controls much, if not all, of the planet, we are effectively enabling the system that seeks to control/destroy us as a viable community/people.
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The lives that were lost and the injuries sustained at the hands of James Holmes are disheartening, but, I must admit my first thought upon hearing of this tragedy was, “Another white man goes on a mass killing spree–and, it’s at a Batman movie premier! So, what else is new?”.
I didn’t even bother looking into the details….
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Rumor has it this poor chap was brain washed and thus forced to commit a horrendous crime “whilst not in a proper state of mind”. Also the video clips of him in court show that he was maybe drugged or suffering from lack of sleep. Clearly someone not in a proper state of mind.
Compared to the Norway killer who was fully cognizant of his actions, James Holmes looks like a shadow of a human being who seems to be sleep walking through a rather horrendous nightmare.
Some anomalies in the story:
– How did he unlock the fire exit? Did he enter, unlock and kept the door ajar, then exited, geared up, then re-entered through the door to commit his crime? Or did he have someone open it for him whilst he was outside?
– Why did he tell the police about his apartment? Go to all that trouble making it into a huge trap only to tip them off at the last second?
– Why did he not kill himself or get killed? Why did he not even attempt to escape?
– This story serves a political purpose with the gun treaty thing coming up. People think Obama will use it to get guns off the streets and thus as a reaction gun sales have been sky rocketing since but what few are considering is that, the aim of the whole thing is to get people buying guns. Now why would they want you all having guns??? Guess we’ll just have to wait and see.
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Who do you believe?
or
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It should be noted that around the same time, another shooting took place in Tuscaloosa, Alabama that was followed by arson. Both were committed by a white male who was hunting for a black man.
Nathan Wilkins walked started shooting into a bar at random. Then, he set fire to his former place of work and a fuel rig. And, it’s been suspected that he was involved with the shooting of two black men who said they didn’t even know Wilkins.
*Sighs!*
Abagond, be careful. Certain people will come in this post and call you a “black racist”. That’s because those with the white racist mindset (WRM) hate it when you question white people about their sense of morals and integrity. Both are flimsy because of white supremacy. And questioning them opens a can of worms they don’t want loose.
Yet, that gives an important indication that is part of the human experience. People get anxious when you ask questions that dig deep into parts of themselves they hate, and then they get hyper-defensive. Question someone with the WRM about their morality, and you will get attacked.
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I am new here and having discovered your blog by accident, decided to return. Again and again. I see you’ve picked up on the fact that no matter how horrible the crime a white person comments, he/she is always accorded the right(priviledge) to keep his/her humanity as opposed to calling Black people animals, chimps, apes, wiggers and other assorted slurs.
As the great Venus Flytrap once remarked: “This is white folks business.”
Glenn
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@ brothawolf
I read about that. Idid not know that the crime was committed by a white man. Thanks.
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“….this poor chap was brain washed and thus forced to commit a horrendous crime “whilst not in a proper state of mind.””
I could say the same thing about every single South Asian, Arab or Muslim “terrorist” Western governments have arrested, tortured or killed on sight. Every single one. But since these men and women are PoC, non-Christian, immigrants or from the “developing world,” their lives and perceptions could not possibly be as layered, multi-faceted or worth understanding as terrorist Holmes’ life clearly is.
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Not only can he retain his humanity he can be seen as a somewhat sympathetic figure. Even black victims have a difficult time achieving this feat! It’s an unfortunate reality but it is what it is.
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[…] "So they were able to apprehend the armed shooter w/out shooting, beating, tazing, sodomizing and/or killing him? … So it can be done …" – @iJesseWilliams […]
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Not only does Holmes get to keep his humanity AND his LIFE but none of his victims are dragged through the mud and lied about like Trayvon was. That would seem cruel and heartless. For some reason.
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It is an undeniable fact… If the guy was black, his crime would have reflected on the whole black race. But since he is white, it is an isolated issue.
For example watch this video of a black flash mob in Florida and read the comments:
as a result of that, multiple youtube videos of black people come up “DEFENDING” our race, trying to “PROVE” our worth, because god forbid they think we are ALL like that.
I also read stories of a black teenager saving a woman and her daughter in the colorado incident, again this doesn’t reflect on the black race, the media hasn’t really concentrated on his heroism. However, if he was white, am sure we’d never hear the end of it.
Sadly the underlying truth about all this is: Whites are human and the rest of us are slightly below human.Thus whatever negative thing we do is reflective of our true nature whilst whatever positive thing we do is some kind of anomaly or masking our true intent which is obviously negative.
However, from this story, it is becoming clear that White Males have a penchant for going “Serial” in there murderous rampages if and when they lose the plot.
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This man really is a heartless animal who is truly broken inside.
He was not crazy, he knew full well what he was doing/planning. I hate it when people us the “he is mentally ill/sick” or “bad upbringing”. There are plenty of people how are born into, raised, and continue to live in less than ideal circumstances that do not lash out in such a selfish way. There are people that have see 20x worse than anything he has experienced and do not take it upon themselves to massacre innocent people to get back at the world. We need to call a spade a spade.
The is man is “damaged beyond repair” if I ever saw it.
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@ Abagond,
Holmes and others like him pull the trigger. President Obama does not. President Obama serves 7 billion people, give or take. Mass murders serve themselves. In Afghanistan/Pakistan, President Obama has two options: stay and lose lives, but provide some measure of security or leave, lose lives, and allow for chaos, brutal tribal regimes, or Pakistani/Iranian influence to extend into to Afghanistan. Both anti-American, and arguably, anti-democratic regimes.
While Obama’s decision to extend the war in Afghanistan may be deeply flawed (as a pacifist this is my first instinct), there is an argument to be made for it when it comes to national (US) interests, Afghani lives, and global security. Just saying.
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@wilson
I wanted more information on that “Flash Mob” story so I did a web search.
Massive ‘Flash Mob’ of 300 Terrorizes, Robs Florida Walmart After Local Party Broken Up by Police
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/massive-flash-mob-of-300-terrorizes-robs-florida-walmart-after-local-party-broken-up-by-police/
Ah, that didn’t take long: the ‘T-word’! A word conspicuously missing from most coverage of the Aurora mass murderer and his explosive apartment.
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Again.
When I heard the story I knew it was a white man because generally black men don’t go on shooting rampages. Black men who commit murder kill for money, drugs or disagreements.
The thing is black murders need to be studied too like the white man. The fact is a person who kills at all, unless he is defending his/her life or kills accidently, is troubled or deeply troubled
What people are asking the American population to answer is why are white criminals treated so nicely compared to their black conterparts? Why are innocent black men and women treated like criminals while guilty white men and women are treated as misunderstood law abiding citizens. Why are white people so blind to their own racism?
Better yet, aside from racism, what about justice (especially for the families of the victims)?
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Andre Breverik , George Zimmerman , Dylan Klebold ,Eric Harris Jarold Laughner and James Holmes …All Jewish.
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@truthbetold
Can’t really argue your other examples… But Charles Manson WAS sentenced to death. When the US Supreme court ruled the death penalty unconstitutional in 1972, that sentence was redacted to life imprisonment.
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everyone
Please read this link about James Holmes’ Dad and tell me that this wasn’t planned:
http://jhaines6.wordpress.com/2012/07/29/7282012-colorado-shooter-father-is-senior-scientist-w-fico-to-testify-libor/
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“Instead of a national conversation where we reflect on what has gone wrong with young white men in our society — a group which apparently possesses a high propensity for committing acts of mass violence — James Holmes will be framed as an outlier.”
A high propensity? What is the rate? 1 in 50 million per year?
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This myth that everything wrong with the Black community/race,nations is White folks is really sad. Most of the issues affecting Blacks has nothing to do with Racism.
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@ Anomymous
Still deflecting, I see.
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Wow, just wow! Though I have always been painfully aware of the injustices people of color have/still face in this country, it still never ceases to amaze me that is much, much, more for me to learn about our nation! I have always felt this, but now I am also “witnessing” such ignorant/hateful behavior(s) a lot more in these past few years. SMH
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Anonymous,
Only someone living in a bubble would make that conclusion.
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I think it’s amazing that certain people believe that white people are not capable of horrible acts against other people, and the white people who do are once-in-a-lifetime occurrences like seeing a comet.
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^^^ Yup.
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“wilson@
I also read stories of a black teenager saving a woman and her daughter in the colorado incident, again this doesn’t reflect on the black race, the media hasn’t really concentrated on his heroism. However, if he was white, am sure we’d never hear the end of it”
You are so right. Instead, the media focused on the Coward boyfriend who left his girlfriend and 2 kids in the theater…to add insult to injury, he drove away and left. The girlfriend had to call him to come back for them.
then he turned around and asked her to marry him and she Accepted…what a Loser.
The girlfriend, Patricia Legarreta, and her boyfriend were on the TV shows talking and not one of them mentioned that this teenager, Jarell Brooks, was the the one who rescued her and he got shot for his efforts…saving a strange woman and kids he didn’t even know.
Someone who witnessed Jarell helping this woman brought it to the attention of the media –maybe Patricia was still in shock and forgot.
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@ Steve
That is pretty rich coming from you.
When it comes to black crime or white inventions you are all about relative rates, not absolute rates. Why is that? If the relative rate is so terribly important in those two cases, why not here too?
You on black crime:
You on white invention:
I am pretty sure the “propensity” there is less than 1 in 50 million per year.
You are judging whites in a different way than blacks.
More:
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@ Linda
Thanks for the video about that.
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^ Again, that is the case of
– if viewed as a positive thing, then for white people, it is a credit for all white people or western culture, or people of European descent; if for black people, it is seen as an outlying aberration.
– if viewed as a negative thing, then for white people, it is an outlying aberration, but for black people, it is a general statement reflective of the entire subset of the population population.
UNLESS, it is a negative thing which is highly rampant (ie, has a “high propensity”) in the white population — then it is viewed as something inconsequential or not important.
I am sure time am time again you have seen posters doing this very sort of commenting.
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@ Jefe:
Right: white inventors prove how whites are naturally more intelligent, but white mass murderers prove nothing about how whites are naturally more violent. You cannot have it both ways.
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I don’t think it was planned and I’m not into conspiracy theories. The man is sick and needs to be buried under the jail.
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@ abag
You told Steve: “You are judging whites in a different way than blacks. ”
No, he’s not. You are. An equal comparison would be to compare the relative rate of white mass murderers to black mass murderers and the relative rate of white inventors to black inventors.
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duck,
It’s amazing how you justify your double standards and ignorance. To you talking about whites as capable of crime and sin is just plain unacceptable to you, but talking about white achievements is A-okay. At the same time talking about blacks as capable of crime and sin should be discussed because to you it’s true while talking about black achievements is not as important.
And yet, you come off as a person that don’t understand why blacks are racist against whites and that whites are not racist against blacks. Never have been.
Either you’re sheltered beyond help or reason, or you are just a pathetic troll.
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@ Brotherwolf Lol at the “comet” comment! I couldn’t help but giggle at the image of one’s eyes opening wide while viewing Haley’s Comet-a look of wonder, amazement n’ awe..much like when one is “shocked” to hear about the “rare violent occurences” in the Privileged community! ; ) @Abagond
Great, insightful article-once again!! : )
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@ bro “It’s amazing how you justify your double standards and ignorance.”
What I find amazing is how you think insults and straw men are a substitute for a reasoned argument based on evidence. No one has said whites weren’t capable of “capable of crime and sin”. But the evidence doesn’t support your argument that whites are particularly violent. Which is why I said to compare the relative rates of mass murder committed by whites and blacks. That doesn’t sound like a double standard to me. That’s a fair comparison.
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yaaaaaawwwwwnnnnn – zzzzzzzzzzzz – Bored with this one now.
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Relative rates are subject to cognitive bias.
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Compare rates of mass murder ? Hitler, Stalin and Mao win hands down for the last century
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@ Somehow
How so?
>>>
@ BR
Which do you think says more about the nature of a population — 1 person killing a million people or a million people killing 1 person each?
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@ duck
It depends who is choosing the relations and what that individual considers “relative”.
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To Someguy:
DDG said:
An equal comparison would be to compare the relative rate of white mass murderers to black mass murderers and the relative rate of white inventors to black inventors.
Someguy
Relative rates are subject to cognitive bias.
I can see this, if I understand you correctly, applying to inventors… but
why would cognitive bias apply to black and white mass murderers..?
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@ truthbetold So I did what my suspicions told me, I called a friend of mine who has family in the military and questioned about this “throat guard”.
He told me that that is a militia special equipment not accessible to the public. Like certain types of guns. Then he told me of Project Paperclip that was evolved into MK Ultra/The Monarch Brainwashing Project …all derived from Hitler’s Mind Kontrolle, and it all fell into place.
I am in the military and it is not that hard to get military gear. Soldiers Sale their gear all the time to pawn shops, even the gear that they have to turn in later on. Soldier debt is big in the Army, and if a Soldier needs money they will sale there gear thinking that the army will give them a new one for free, but it usually backfires and they end up paying their entire check to reimburse the Army for that lost piece of equipment.
Besides you can google it and find it at any surplust store.
http://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/acu-iba-throat-protector-by-point-blank
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The statement does chiefly apply to inventors, but it can be applied to criminal stats as well.
First, I would like to say that – no, stats are not racist. However, those that use these stats can do so in such a way as to bend the truth to their bias.
If you take the case of Black and White mass murderers, initially you would have to define mass murder and it is defined as four or more murders typically at the same time or over a “relatively” short period of time. There is a lot of room in there to play with things a bit. Keep in mind, I’m not taking any sides in this issues. But let’s take a look see.
Four or more murders, eh? Well, legally, what is a murder? Murder is the unlawful killing, with malice aforethought, of another human. Well, say one day I lose my temper, pull out the “jammy” and flat blast four “cats”. Trial comes, and my Jewish lawyer gets one of the murders down to manslaughter. I’m no longer a mass murderer. Why? Because of the legal posturing of my attorney. You may say that I still a mass murderer, however, STATISTICALLY this will not appear “related”. And since nearly all stats use information recorded in the context of it’s supposed resolution, inaccurate or not, it becomes static data.
Secondly, what is a “short period of time”? Is that seconds? Minutes? Hours? If I stretch a few murders out over a few days, am I a mass murderer? If I can sway popular opinion out of the mass murderer range, am i still one? And all of this will be reflected in statistics, or more importantly NOT reflected.
But all of this still isn’t cognitive bias. We have all of these legal and social biases before we even touch cognitive bias.
Now, when people actively search for information, they’re using information which can have a host of problems to begin with and most don’t even realize the errors. Couple that with people who do the following:
I want to prove Whites are more prone to STDs than Blacks. OK. Let’s take two cities of similar size and compare the data. We’ll use the same age range, the same economic and scholastic levels and so forth. Then we’ll crunch the numbers. Seems unbiased, yes? No.
Just because two cities are similar on the surface, says nothing to a myriad of different variables within each area. There can be factors I’m completely unaware of and I wouldn’t know to filter them. More importantly, what two cities I chose is relative to me. In other words, another person can chose differently, but I chose a city with high STD rates among Whites and a city with low STD rates among Blacks. This can all be done on a subconscious level, with me believing that I am completely unbiased in the matter. It can also be done purposely, but that’s another issue entirely.
No one can have every piece of relevant information on heinous crimes and be able to process this information in an unbiased manner. Patterns will start to emerge and the patterns one sees often begins in one’s own mind. That is why statistics make very poor measuring sticks for reality. Not only can you make mistakes on your own, but you can internalize the mistakes of others.
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duck
You said, “What I find amazing is how you think insults and straw men are a substitute for a reasoned argument based on evidence. No one has said whites weren’t capable of “capable of crime and sin”. But the evidence doesn’t support your argument that whites are particularly violent. Which is why I said to compare the relative rates of mass murder committed by whites and blacks. That doesn’t sound like a double standard to me. That’s a fair comparison.”
The only thing about you that’s insulted is your ego.
You constantly dismiss any and all forms of evidence that helps show that whites are not less violent than blacks. Yet, if there was anything that shows you that blacks are more violent than whites – biased, subjective, or not – it would be attained and presented as proof that most or all blacks are more violent for whites. And of course, there are no explanations that answer the question why that you would agree with because to you it points the finger at white people which is not necessarily true in many cases. Also, you hardly ever explain why whites are not particularly violent, just as violent, or more violent than blacks.
Historical and political information is also left out. The slave trade, the holocaust, most major wars, along with the regular mass murderers, violent rapists, and serial killers are left out of the loop.
You may call out every single fallacy in arguments against you, but you are guilty of one fallacy in particular, derailing. But you don’t see it. You see it as a form of censorship by a black racist who doesn’t like what you have to say as if you’re some kind of special guest of something who can say whatever he wants any anytime no matter what. That is ego tripping.
So, for every time you claim that there’s evidence that support that blacks are their own problem or whatever, we can come back and do the same whenever we point out white racism and pathology. This is where we are as a stalemate. In other words like you said in another post, if you can defend whites, we can defend blacks whether you like it or not.
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And duck,
Just because you have a notion to point out every single fallacy within any and all arguments that disagree with you, real or thrown in, doesn’t take away any facts. You can not argue that which is objective, my friend.
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I was just waiting for this post
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The most sickening part is how many people in numerous social media sites totally fangirl about him. Double standards, everywhere
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I just don’t understand what makes someone feel they have the right to take away another’s life
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Melody,
I WOULD NOT be surprised if Hollywood makes a made-for-TV movie about him.
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@ Someguy
I’m aware that no study is 100% accurate. There’s a margin of error. There are even a few studies I disagree with. But I don’t claim research statistics as a whole are flawed. That sounds like an excuse to arbitrarily dismiss results one doesn’t like.
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@ bro “The only thing about you that’s insulted is your ego. “
My “ego” is fine. I was just pointing it out.
“You constantly dismiss any and all forms of evidence…”
What evidence?
Yet, if there was anything that shows you that blacks are more violent than whites – biased, subjective, or not – it would be attained and presented as proof
I’m careful not to use bogus claims. Fortunately, I don’t need to.
“Also, you hardly ever explain why whites are not particularly violent, just as violent, or more violent than blacks. “
I wasn’t aware I needed to explain “why”. Though I do have my own personal hypothesis involving evolutionary psychology. But I figure anyone who thinks statistics are racist wouldn’t have much confidence in evolution either.
“Historical and political information is also left out. The slave trade, the holocaust, most major wars, along with the regular mass murderers, violent rapists, and serial killers are left out of the loop.”
I’m perfectly willing to consider any and all of those. You want to consider those in isolation in order to claim whites are more violent. But if you’re going to make a comparison then you have to actually compare the behavior of their behavior to others. Otherwise, there’s no basis for making the claim.
You may call out every single fallacy in arguments against you, but you are guilty of one fallacy in particular, derailing.”
You consider anyone disagreeing with you to be “derailing”.
So, for every time you claim that there’s evidence that support that blacks are their own problem or whatever, we can come back and do the same whenever we point out white racism and pathology. This is where we are as a stalemate.
Yeah, you can make the claim. You just can’t support it. But there’s no stalemate. You’re claiming one doesn’t make it so.
You can not argue that which is objective, my friend.
That’s rich coming from a guy who claims statistics are racist.
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Abagond
“White Denial” is mind-blowing in every sense of the word. The media is treating this inhumane act as if it’s just like any other violent shooting that takes place in this country. There is no sense of disgust about the shooter, and the evil he visited upon moviegoers that night…Amazing! In the minds of white media, he’s just another spoiled white kid who had a temper tantrum. If he had been a black male, white media would be discussing why black males are so violent and so forth. I’ve always assumed that white folk were delusional to a certain extent, but, this episode validates what and others on this blog have believed for a long time…White Folks Are Crazy! This is how whitemen see it…violence and white manhood go hand in hand. All of the power and wealth that we have was “Founded In Blood.” The blood of africans, south asians, and native americans to be specific. Again, white males have never loved themselves, so, how can they love others? They view whiteness as a curse, which explains their insanity with regard to black people…tighten up colored folk?
Tyrone
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It can be used for that purpose, yes. It can also be used as propaganda. That’s why people on both sides of an argument should avoid quoting statistics and get to the actual heart of the matter; instead of browbeating their opponent to death with stats.
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I love how this guy was instantly made a genius because of the school he was in, if he was a POC he would have been named Thug. Turns out this guy wasn’t that smart after all, but he still not labeled a thug or a terrorist.
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duck,
You said,
The way I see it, that’s what you love to focus on. So, those who read your comments would want to know why you think so.
And no one has ever said or implied that statistics are racist. I and other people say that statistics are used by racist people to support their racism.
I doubt that you would because that would consider it because that’s hard to look at since it shows whites in a not-so-descent light.
Anyway, if you want to talk about comparison you need to know that the two groups have dissimilar circumstances based on numerous factors. That would mean looking at all the facts possible including the less-than-pleasant ones. Once you look at that, then you can observe, compare and draw conclusions.
No. If they bring up a topic like say black-on-white interracial crime in a forum about why whites look down on blacks, then it’s a derailment to shift the conversation in favor of the person responsible. And you have a record for derailing conversations to support your “black people are a violent people” campaign you’re obsessed on.
Oh yes we can, but as usual, you won’t take it as support. That is what narrow-mindedness does.
In conclusion you are deeply obsessed with demonizing black people at every chance you get while defending the white group, and you do so on a blog clearly not designed for that. So, it’s obvious that you have a lot of time on your hands to be a troll around here if you think people are going to listen to you. Either that, of your white racist mindset has made you into white paternal drone and telling us people of color what to think and feel according to you because apparently you know what’s best for us.
SMH. Do us and yourself a favor and let it go.
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Could James Holmes be considered to be a “terrorist”? If he were of Middle Eastern descent, wouldn’t the media describe him as a terrorist? I believe the man who shot up Fort Hood was labeled as such.
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I was horrified by what happened in Colorado. I really don’t care what color this Holmes guys is and all this talk of if he is crazy or whatever seems irrelevant to me…is he guilty? Yes? Then he should be punished. Do I think he should be sentenced to death? No. I value human life and do not think humans have the right to kill other humans… period. I don’t know if public and media opinion would be different if Holmes was black…I know it would be if he were Middle Eastern.
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This was a senseless act. As brothawolf and others don’t like the crimes of a few black men put on most of the good, I get angry at the opposite but equal judgement on all white men, when some commit crimes.
Abagond you try to justify doing such because some whites do that to you. You will never justify angry finger pointing no matter how eloquent you put it. Don’t you want to be better than them? or do you want your own crowd of angry rock throwers? Watch this whole video.
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If you don’t get it , which I’m sure Abagond does, but for those who do not, “Sunday bloody Sunday” was an attack on Irish Catholics in Northern Ireland, which was had some retaliation by the IRA which Bono from U2 condemns in the video above. “Two wrongs DO NOT make a right”
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Notice the video is in Black and White. dave’s well thought out response.
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Bulanik no they did not for the most part. The point I am making is that Abagond seemed to use this horrible tragedy to say that white men have problems. Furthermore that most white people will argue “no” because they see whites as individuals. I used this example of the video because the IRA became just as evil as their oppressors by bombing innocent people. You need to read between the lines.
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If you don’t want to watch the whole video fast forward to the 3:45
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woah there bulanik. I never called anyone here evil. I meant that if you do exactly what makes you the most mad in an equal opposite you are putting that evil possibly back in the wrong direction.
I know Irish Americans as Bono has mentioned in the video that sing “Irish Anthems” about the IRA, yet have never suffered as they have, and don’t realize that the good Irish do not condone that sort of retaliation.
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By the way Bulanik I don’t have ill feelings towards brothawolf or abagond. I wouldn’t be here if I did. In fact I agree with them more than you think. At the same time to take this tragedy and turn it into a racial divide is just sad. Hence my well thought out response.
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So you don’t want me to use the same old arguments, but when I come up with an original one you TRY to derail it. NICE TRY.
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Ok well what did you mean exactly by your comment “White men do have problems” I know you aren’t talking about my brothers or my son or my dad or my Pop or my best friend……..get my drift?
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See as black people get mad at that SO DO I!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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*my Pop isn’t with us anymore but I love him like he is.
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If Abagond would have said “This crazy white dude should be dealt with” I would have agreed and said nothing. But he took it way further then he should have………..bottom line.
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Truth beats bs no matter how. I don’t care if I am arguing with Ernest Hemingway.
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@ bro The way I see it, that’s what you love to focus on. So, those who read your comments would want to know why you think so.
What you mean is that you want to know. But, like they say, cast not your pearls before swine. So I think I’ll keep it to myself for now.
In conclusion you are deeply obsessed with demonizing black people at every chance you get while defending the white group, and you do so on a blog clearly not designed for that.
Yes, it would appear that instead this blog was designed for people who are deeply obsessed with demonizing white people at every chance while defending the black group.
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As the writer Anne Lamott once tweeted:
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@ abag
So what you’re saying is that blacks should behave better? I agree.
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@ Dave
Trayvon Martin was demonized and he was not even the killer! He was the victim! Holmes guns down 70 people, killing 12, which is some kind of record, and – nothing. There is something seriously sick and wrong there. I have every right to point it out.
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I don’t think so. 😛
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“Trayvon Martin was demonized and he was not even the killer! He was the victim!”
Whoah! Hang on there, buckaroo. Killer and victim aren’t necessarily mutually exclusive. I was once a “killer” AFTER someone shot me in the face. I was both the “killer” and the “victim”.
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Who did Trayvon Martin kill? That’s what I thought; another totally irrelevant and diversionary post. If you’re going to troll at least try not to look foolish. Then you might be taken seriously and get the angry responses you desire rather than a collective LOL. 😀
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@ Abagond
I’ve noticed a knee-jerk reaction on this thread and with the media.
Not to derail this thread but James is being given sympathy for his crimes. They are trying to make excuses and reasons why he did it. He, being white, is given the benefit of the doubt just by calling him “the suspect.”
Something I’ve learned about whites, especially in this country, is their play on words. Whites will use their mastery of the English language to convey a message that will resonate fear, sympathy, joy and hatred amongst their brethren. And if you’re not aware of how they play on words, you’ll fall for it.
Second thing.
I gave a link about James’ dad, who he is and how this is all interconnected. Why hasn’t the media also come forward about this information? Because James, being a white man, must be protected from his crimes. No conversation is being made about the would be nature of young white men. It’s like AmeriKlan is happy with their “idea” that this poor boy couldn’t handle the stress and flipped out. Perhaps this is why the violent genocidal tendencies never gets rectified with them because of their inability to have these discussions.
Third thing.
On the Zimmerman thread, Zimmerman was and still is being given the benefit of the doubt. Why? Because the dead boy is a black boy. In this case, the perpetrator is white, so therefore they rush to his defense.
Are you truly shocked that I’ve cut off communication with white people? They are so far gone it’s almost funny…but it not. It’s just sad,
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@abagond,
Yes you do have the right, but the way you did it could be questioned. Look this monster should be given justice with the fullest extent of the law. If anyone deserves the death penalty it’s him. Then we had to look at his ridiculous red hair and his blank stare in court. I could only imagine what the victims families are feeling looking at this sicko.
My thing is that no one said , that I heard of, after the Virginia Tech massacre that Asian males in general need to be looked at as having these murderous tendencies because of race. (as you know that shooter was Asian)
I know it happens to black men all of the time. If a black man cheats on his wife it becomes “See how these men are, they are all dogs” or when a couple of black males beat and rob a man in a wheel chair (as happened recently close to where I live) then you hear “These black men are animals”…….. If you don’t like it, then why point the same blind finger in the opposite direction towards white people? Which many black people do. Because as you say white people see whites as individuals so you think you have to make a concerted effort to do the opposite. By pointing fingers at a whole race over this horrible tragedy.
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@ Dave
The main point of my post was how black and white violence are judged differently. That difference has real-world effects. Like unarmed black men getting shot down like dogs by the police. Or how Colorado, say, has no laws to stop psychiatric patients from buying guns. Or how Colorado has become the scene of not one but two massacres. To make it all about Holmes is not helpful.
I am not saying that white men have some genetic propensity for violence. I highly doubt that. But I do believe their culture is screwed up enough that the White American sense of humanity is badly damaged and their tolerance and use of violence way too high. From the Batman films to the drones in Pakistan violence is seen as the the answer.
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@ Diary
I find it odd how we can talk about black violence till the cows come home, how commenters will derail threads to talk about it even, but white violence is suddenly off the table. The media avoids it, like you said, and whitewashed commenters here want to keep me from talking about it too. Deep down they all know what a can of worms it is. Given how most stereotypes work, the obsession with black violence is almost certainly white projection. I mean, it is not as if black crime is a greater physical threat to whites than white crime is.
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The threat might be in the future as whites become minorities if these “Serial Killer” “Child Molester” stereotypes are left unchecked, it could stop people from getting jobs, or loans, or housing, etc. These views have spread from the black community to others. Especially young asians.
I get what you are saying abagond , that you should be able to point it out the other way around, but the other way around can sometimes have a strong system in place of checks and balances. If a white kid made a racial stereotype against a black kid in school he is often dealt with very harshly because of the sins of the past and strong backlash from organizations and public opinion. But I bet if a black kid does the same to a white kid it’s like it’s no big deal (that recently has balanced a little, black people are starting to get in more trouble for racist acts and views).
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@ Abagond:
That is what’s keeping this country from growing as one nation. The denial whites have for the past and present perversions they harbour. I’ve never seen such justification…ever, in any race of peoples.
I read somewhere, probably from Dr. Robert Jensen, that whites know they’re sick. History doesn’t lie. And they’re scared out of their wits that they will forever be seen as monsters. Also the rage they stew comes from the denial that life is “easier” for them for the simple fact of having white skin.
We struggle ferociously, yet we are fulfilled. We are whole. Our strength comes from being denied basic rights. Is it a wonder why our connection with The Most High is so strong? In fact, I believe that the reason why they provoke us so much is the need for us to retaliate, to prove to them that we can be a sick as they are.
But we don’t. And this destroys them. Ask Randy. He’ll tell ya. That’s why he comes here every day with “statistics and quotes” to “intellectualize” everything.
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Hey guys – I’m pretty sure this is just a fake, but some people are saying that
this youtube video was made by JAMES HOLMES – the crazy wanna-be Batman Joker Aurora cinema Shooter.
There were apparently some screen captures circulating of his myspace account, where this
youtube account name – THINKTILLDEATH – was listed. Sure it could all be
a fake – there are plenty of wierdos trying to make something out of
this tragedy… but the myspace account is closed down now…..
The video was posted weeks before the shooting in Aurora, so it’s not some newbie wanna be fake…. It’s
pretty wierd, i’ll give it that much – it seems to be trying to explain
why he’s so angry, and how maybe the shooting was a way for him to
fight the actual source of his rage by externalising it… doesn’t make much sense to me, maybe some psychiatrist out there can explain its convoluted meaning –
but it’s definately…. interesting. Here’s the link anyway
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Another shooting spree performed by a single, white male in suburban Milwaukee, Wisconsin.
So many incidences of solitary, deranged individuals who clearly not well. Nothing is wrong with society at large, for sure. 😛
These incidents are getting so commonplace (these aberrative incidences) that soon the news will not even report on it any more.
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And apparently someone else wanted to carry out another theater massacre in Ohio but was foiled by an attentive employee who got suspicious and had security search his bag. He was found with knives and guns.
http://news.yahoo.com/police-ohio-man-carried-gun-ammo-knives-dark-145946792.html
So yeah..pretty commonplace.
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Im not trying to derail anytjing, but I do think this man was being controlled. we pass it off as him being mentally ill, but think about it, columbine massacre, 9/11, and this. all contreversial events. all staged.
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In societies were the power drifts further away from grasp of the average people and were the common feeling is helplessness, unability to really make a difference in ones own life, were money is The measure of everything and violence is tolerated, or even glorified culturally, these things happen.
When the gap between the reality and propaganda has grown so wide that even the most HC believers begin to see the difference, results are like these.
When there is great availability of fire arms, where gun culture is hailed as a Holy Right, these things happen.
Where there is a constant bombardment of Fear in news media, in popular media and in the culture itself, fear takes a form of violence. In cultures were fear is less prominent, these things very seldomly happen at all, if at all. In cultures were fear is constant and ever present, these things do happen.
When competition is everything, where the very idea of human community has been eroded purposely as a vehicle to control people and make them powerless, where everything is left to the individual in theory but not in practise, results are like these.
From the days of the so-called pilgrims, the culture has been one of Fear. Fear of outside threats (natives, foreigners), fear of insurrection, fear of neighbors, fera of ones relatives, own family, children, even one self. Add to that the gun culture and this is it.
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@ Sam
Have you ever seen Bowling for Columbine by Michael Moore? You’ll like that movie.
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sam,
I agree with many points in your comment, but I’d suggest that the average person doesn’t lack an ability to pursue their goals, rather what they desire is often superficial and ultimately unsatisfying.
As for the gun issue, consider the following: Mexico has strict gun control while Switzerland does not. Mexico has a murder rate of 22.7 per 100,000 vs. Switzerland’s .7 per 100,000, a difference of over 3000%.
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Personally, I think since most Black people and most White people are not criminals, someone like James Holmes is “one in a million” White douchebag just like those Washington snipers were two in a million Black douchebags.
Randy, the reason isn’t gun control. Mexico has a thriving drug trade based on terror and murder, while Switzerland dabbles in hiding Nazi goods in their banks. No need for gun violence there.
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Another one:
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/gunman-opens-fire-texas-a-m-university-injuring-including-police-officer-gunman-custody-article-1.1135410
Not really the purpose of the thread but it’s really crazy. What is the context?
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[…] James Holmes […]
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[…] James Holmes – compare and contrast: Holmes shoots 70 people, is armed to the teeth, yet police arrested him without firing a shot. Holmes is White and still alive. This was in Colorado, another open-carry state, the scene of the Columbine high school shooting. […]
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James holmes gets life in Prison.
I knew it….white supremacy has struck once again. White racist jurors have proven, that they will not kill one of their own.
This proves that the death penalty, was made by white people for black people!
I’ll also say this….They will NOT give D Roof the death penalty for killing 9 black people! He will get life in prison, too!
Hell, they gave Homles life in prison and he killed only white people, what makes you think they will kill Roof for killing black people?
Remember, you heard it here!
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I feel James Holmes should have got the death penalty too. I know they will not give Dylan Roof the death penalty he will join a white supremacy gang in prison and they will take him in as their own.
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You know they didn’t want to let the “troubled, yet so bright” James Holmes get the death penalty… We KNOW Dylan won’t get the death penalty. Heck when they arrested him, they gave him a life vest and some Burger King… Meanwhile, our folks are dying over minor traffic stops.
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