In general I like women in this order in terms of physical beauty:
- Black
- Latin American
- South Asian
- East Asian
- Polynesian
- White
I determined this by looking at pictures of models at modelcoast.com. The models are mostly Americans in their 20s, but they each say whether they are black, white or whatever.
I am only talking in general. There are white women, for example, who are better looking than most black women. And so on.
Some things I learned from this exercise:
- I like black women way more than other women. It is not even close. I like them twice as much as Latin women and seven times more than white women. It is that sharp of a difference.
- The thing that I like most in black women is not what I thought: black hair, high cheekbones and their figure. It is, in fact, their eyes. I have no idea what it is, but there is just something about their eyes that gets to me, that makes all the difference. It could be how the eyes look, it could be some inner quality that shows through them. Since no one talks about the eyes of black women, unlike their hair and their figure, it is hard to know what that something is. That will be for another post. Now I know why I hate it when black women wear sunglasses.
- After eyes, figure matters the most: thick thighs and a big bottom or at least an hourglass figure. No figure at all, like most thin women have, just does not do it for me. That is why Latin women did so much better than white women: they have better figures, more of a black woman’s body. In general.
- Next comes skin colour. It does not have to be dark, but it has to be at least light brown, maybe olive is enough. Something. Pale skin, like the English and Japanese have, just does not do it for me. That is why South Asian women did so well.
- As much as I love thick lips and high cheekbones, they are not enough by themselves. That is why Polynesian women did not do as well as I thought they would – second to last!
- In hair thickness matters most, darkness second. Length matters but only in that it makes hair seem thicker. Short and thick is better than long and thin.
What I do not like in the white idea of beauty that the American film and fashion industry push:
- The eyes to the degree that they are round and empty looking
- Being so thin they lose their figure
- Paleness of skin
Empty might be the wrong word for the eyes, but there is something like that about the eyes.
I do not know where all this comes from. Certainly not from American society. It seems to be inborn. When I watch an old show on television that I last saw when I was 13, I find myself liking the very same women for the very same reasons.
See also:
I like black women myself, after all I am one and my next favourite are mixed race. But I realise that we as black women are exciting to look and are alive. I thank God every morning for being a black woman. I am fearfully wonderfully made!
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I had a chance to peruse that model site you link to. Wow! What a resource!
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Do not take offense at this post. I am merely writing this in hopes of challenging your current beliefs, which I feel perpetuates sexism and exotification of women of color.
Growing up as a woman of mixed heritage, black american/white, I had to constantly battle media images of what a beautiful mixed girl looked like. Evaluating women by their physical attractiveness objectifies and commodifies women, by presenting women’s bodies solely for the male gaze. Toni Morrison writes that ‘the concept of beauty is one of the most destructive ideas in the history of human thought’ If women do not possess the right aesthetic look, then their self-esteem becomes damaged and they begin to feel powerless and lose their sense of agency and may seek other ways to feel validated, such as sleeping around with men or competing with other women for men’s attention.
Beauty has become an integral resource for women because society teaches us that beauty matters more than anything else and the pursuit of beauty becomes a capital investment for us. That is why much of the interaction among women of color over skin color and beauty is centered upon the perceived competition for the male gaze and male partners. This leads to a lack of trust or intimacy in some African American women’s relationships because of the perceived scarcity of African American men. As a result, some darker skinned women distrust and resent light skin women because light skinned women are considered by men to be more attractive than dark skinned women. However, that competition among women over skin color is a diversion from larger oppressive systems, such as racism and sexism and perpetuates them simultaneously.
I guess what I am asking you and my fellow sisters is to evaluate us not by our looks, but rather our intelligence and our personalities. That is what matters most. Although, social conditioning would have us believe otherwise.
-j
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Although I do talk about the beauty of women quite a bit in this blog, it is not the only way I see them or talk about them. For example, this:
or this:
Female beauty is a part of life. Without it we would not be here. Women are going to think about it no matter what. Men too. It is here to stay.
There is nothing wrong in appreciating a woman’s beauty – just in making it the only thing.
Further, in the case of women of colour, white beauty is used as a weapon against them. Should I be silent and let it go unchallenged? What I remember from that Morrison book is that big poster of Betty Grable staring down at the black girls.
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latin american is not a race u can be a black white asian latin american
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Well put, Abagond. Yes, society pushes one type of beauty/femininity, i.e. White women, at the expense of all other women, especially Black women.
What Abagond is doing is show Black women in all its beauty, intelligence, and glory because very few blogs are doing this at all.
He highlights issues affecting Black women such as sexism, jobs, family, racism/classism.
That’s why I truly love his website.
Stephanie B.
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For me(in this order);
Black
Latina
South-East Asian
Polynesian
Indian
White
Asian
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I am a 17 year old black girl, to me I think that Korean women and girls have such gorgeous eyes, well east asian eyes in general they just always have this…look on their face, I think they’re lovely women with their natural ‘asian’ eyes. I think we black women have nice eyes also.
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Abagond … I’ve been reading your blog for about two weeks now. Firstly, I want to say I am black nyc female. I’m medium brown, thin, young, with naturally long, artificially colored (lol) light hair. Well its a mixture of black and different browns, but anyway… reading your blog has truly opened up my mind. Which is one of the reasons I described myself, because I know what you prefer in females just from your blogs. I may be the opposite, but I am not in opposition 2 the topics of your blogs. That was my point ;). I love them. Though very controversial I think you do get your point across. I think you’re also very intelligent, very calm, which is nice, (I see how you handle ignorant comments) and just someone I find interesting. I also admire your loyalty to your wife. 😉 … and I admire your ability to admire. One thing I do not like is that you hide **you** “Abagond” Keep it up … I’m always reading by the way. I may just not comment very often. Sorry … I am shy. 😉
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It’s interesting that the above poster starts out her post with a physical description of herself. Her perception of her skin tone is her first descriptor. And she seems to emphasize the length and color of her hair. Very interesting stuff.
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Mynameismyname … you missed the point of my post. On his other blog I saw slender and fat women picking apart his “preference” as if he isn’t entitled to his own preference. While Abagond prefers thick women, I am one of those size 23 women. And if you had much of a sense of humor you would also get the “naturally” long, “artificially” colored part Lol, I laughed. Abagond clearly praises females with very dark hair. I don’t have dark hair, its highlighted different shades. I also described my skintone because that is the very first thing I see on a person. As well as the very first thing ppl see on me. My post was meant to be descriptive, to let Abagond know there are women who isn’t his particular “beautiful” type of female, but is not mad @ his posts because he is in fact entitled to his opinion. That is something a lot of ppl are just void of. I am also glad that u took the liberty to address my post as opposed to the topic @ hand. It proves that you actually do have a sense of humor after all. Please do me a very mild favor though, do not pick apart my comments. It was addressed to Abagond…. guess you missed that part. Good day =) … until next time Abagond …
Oh and you too, mynameismy name. =)
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mynameismyname: strangefruit was right to say how she looks in this case because I get angry comments from women whose beauty I do not go for. So it is nice to know when someone like her understands me.
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I wasn’t criticizing her at all though, that’s the thing. I just found it interesting that her take on her skin tone was the first thing she described about herself. And the emphasis on hair. It was just interesting from a certain standpoint. That’s all. …And yeah, Aba, angry feedback is just part of the process, you can’t please everyone.
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This is a really interesting website, I am white girl myself with red hair and very pale skin and have always found black and asian women far prettier than white girls (in general). I have always been more attracted to dark guys and most white guys just don’t do it for me. I agree with you on lots of your points and I hate the way so many women (myself included) try to fit the hollywood mould which is so bland and has little beauty. I find pale skin like my own really quite unattractive and think its sad that any darker girl would want to lighten her beautiful skin.
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I agree. Everyone is trying to copy this one idea of beauty and it does not even come close to fitting most people. Just because it looks good on some women doew not mean it looks good on all or even most women. And, besides, it gets tired seeing it over and over again.
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I disagree a little w/ jdick… i don’t think all men think light-skin women are more beautiful than dark-skinned ones, You Are very WRONG. Black women tend OVERRATE the significance or value of their skin colour, when it comes to beauty…Men look at more than the colour/tone of your skin trust me. Btw I think all women can be classified as beautiful in some way… I really do.
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^^
I agree, somewhat.
For many guys, body and even intelligence can override facial attractiveness. Just like money, status and/or sexual prowess can override the physical attractiveness for a man.
Hell, Larry King, Donald Trump and Jay-Z are all married, right? 😉
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“Men look at more than the colour/tone of your skin trust me.”
True.
In my experience, men tend to spend an inordinate amount of time checking out my figure. After about half an hour they notice my face. And then they get this look like, “Gee, she’s pretty, too!” :-p Men!
Funny story: I met my husband’s boss (older, white guy) last week for the first time. We stood talking for about 15 minutes and he seemed very nice. But he didn’t look me in the face THE ENTIRE TIME. Actually, he glanced up once or twice and then looked back down again. When we got to the car I looked at my husband and said, “You never said your boss was autistic.” And he just grimaced and said, “He’s not. I’ve never seen him act like that before.” I don’t think he even noticed that I’m black.
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Anyway, abagond, all of your beauty lists are for pot anyway.
Men tend to put women into 2 categories: Shag-able and Not Shag-able. If she’s generally pretty, has a curvy/slender figure, and is adequately intelligent and charming, she’s in the game. Or as an ex of mine so crudely put it: dick don’t discriminate. LOL!
Every single guy I’ve dated (even the non-white ones) was dating a tall, thin, long-haired blond before me. (strange, but true) I’m average height, curvy, short-haired (really short!), and black. I was nowhere near any of their “preference” lists but the truth is: if she’s pretty (or intelligent or sexy) enough, it doesn’t matter.
So whenever I see these types of lists I just roll my eyes and think: Whatever!
I guess what you guys are really saying is: “All else being equal, I’d prefer the one with…”
But if you, Abagond, were put into a room with a bunch of sort-of pretty black women and, say, a young Elizabeth Taylor I just know you’d be like, “Hey, Liz! Are you busy tonight?”
LOL!
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Black&German:
I posted your first comment, the one you tried to post seven times or so. You posts kept getting put thrown to my moderation queue because you used “dick”.
Using any of the following words will get your comment thrown to moderation:
fuck
shit
cunt
motherfucker
nigger
kaffir
cracker
whitey
pussy
dick
piss
cocksucker
tits
nazi
spic
gook
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Black&German:
If I was in a room with a young Liz Taylor and some sorta-pretty black girls, Liz Taylor would be the only one I would see. The rest would become like wallpaper.
My sister says men are “indiscriminate”. She says there is only one thing they care about. And so on. It is all true. Yet most men do not hit on just any woman. Most try to get the best-looking woman they can. Great-looking women are more desirable and men will go to greater lengths to get them.
What matters in a woman depends on how long the relationship lasts:
hours: her body
days: her looks
weeks: her personality
months: her intelligence
years: her character.
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I think black women are beautiful, but some black women are too over weight in america. Black women need to get rid of those fake looking weaves. It distact from their beauty. I wish more would try a more healthy diet.
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Abagond:
“My sister says men are “indiscriminate”.”
🙂 That’s the PG-version of what I said.
Staciejo:
“but some black women are too over weight in america”
Actually, it’s Americans in general who are too over-weight. In Germany I was considered “plump” and over here other women are constantly asking me “How do you keep your figure?” Umm… you’re kidding, right? I’m a size 10. That’s hardly “keeping my figure”.
My husband just spent 2 weeks in Madrid and he couldn’t get over how thin everybody was. His comment: “Even their fat people are thin!” LOL!
It’s quite shocking when you first move here. I’m still not used to it.
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This site is amazing, I love it! It is the very best on the web!!! i have seen nothing like it.
My question is; What do you think about Aishwarya Rai who is an indian alot of people say she is the most beautiful in the world. I do not think she is the most beautiful. What do you think?
I agree with you Elizabeth Taylor was stunning in her younger days.
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What race are you may I ask?
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Sanaa Lathan is WAAAAY more beautiful than Ms. Rai.
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@Black and German
“In my experience, men tend to spend an inordinate amount of time checking out my figure. After about half an hour they notice my face. And then they get this look like, “Gee, she’s pretty, too!” :-p Men!”
I love how in almost every post you manage to be self congratulatory or complimentary on the D.L..lol 🙂 I wouldn’t have the nerve to do that.
Also, there is a saying that the most beautiful women are home alone on Friday night. It’s true. Beautiful women are not the ones who get approached consistantly. It’s women who men think they have a better chance with that are approached.
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^^^
Really good point, Islandgirl. As a male, I can say that is the reality.
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“I wouldn’t have the nerve to do that.”
You don’t have to have nerves. You just have to be very very vain. LOL. Hey, at least I’m aware of my faults. Modesty is not one of them. Neither is brevity. :-p My posts are usually WAY too long.
Beautiful women get stared at but they don’t get asked out. I’m not beautiful though, just really pretty, so I lucked out. :-p
Beautiful sucks, you get gawked at like a circus freak everywhere you go. I know it’s true because I usually join in the gawking. LOL! It’s like a car accident, everybody’s rubbernecking.
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@German & Black,
LOL, but don’t you think modesty portrays a certain level of confidence? I mean, if someone is reaally pretty, do they really announce it a lot of the time? I never see Alicia Keys’ or the Sanan Latans or Stacey Dashs’ talk it about it a lot if at all. Just a theory. But do your thang girl!
Beautiful doesn’t suck, it just may leave one dateless for a while. But once a man grows some, well should I say, gets the nerve to approach, then it’s good.
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Are you beauiful, Islandgirl?
Alicia Keys is not in the same category as Sanaa/Stacey. She’s almost ugly without makeup. But that’s another story.
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@mynameismyname
That’s a trick question, right?lol I’m not at liberty to say.
What I will say is that I was raised to be humble and that if you really have it going on, you don’t need to rant and rave about it. It just is.
That being said, I’m not the “hot girl”. I have a very innocent look, similar to Ashely Banks and would have fit into the group “Good Girls” perfectly. The type that white women try to set me up with their sons or brothers.
Not at all exotic, alluring and no sex appeal (at least I don’t think). Men treat me with kid gloves or like I am some kind of Disney princess. Though I’ve been in beauty industries (pageants, modeling, professional cheerleading) I am not the girl who walks by a group of guys and heads turn.
So to make a long story even longer – I’m beautiful on the inside.
Wow, I think Alicia Keys is one of the most beautiful women I’ve seen. Surprised you think that way.
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I think Alicia is beautiful too, but I have never seen her without make-up. Here is a picture of her I like:
http://blackbeautyoftheday.blogspot.com/2009/03/alicia-keys.html
Aishwarya Rai is beautiful too:
But I would hardly call her the most beautiful woman in the world, like Oprah did. For one thing, she does not have much of a figure. Her eyes are the best thing about her but I have seen women with more beautiful eyes than that on the bus. I would not even call her the most beautiful woman in India: I like Bipasha Basu much better:
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Hmm. Interesting but I must say that I don’t speak about my appearance IRL. As you say, if you’re attractive it’s obvious and it serves no purpose to bring it up. Here it is a different matter, as no one can see what I look like.
Although I do have a certain disdain for false modesty. If I think something is beautiful about a person, I will often mention it. It’s a complete turn-off if they respond with “Oh, I’m: fat, ugly, hideous, whatever.” How about just say, “Thanks!” and get over it? It’d be like Michael Jordan saying, “Oh, I’m not very good at sports. I have two left feet.” Funny as a joke, not funny as a denial.
I also tend to surround myself with attractive women so I don’t know if I’m vain, really. I don’t worry or even think very often of my own looks or compare myself to others in some sort of competition. But I’m not walking around in some sort of cloud of oblivion in which I pretend to see myself as unnattractive.
I just have a great appreciation for beauty, both in myself and in others. Obviously, or I would not be at this blog so much.
I have a very strong artistic streak so I enjoy looking at beautiful things, people, places, etc. The scientist in me likes to discuss beauty and attraction. What makes a person beautiful? How can beauty be measured? Is beauty universal? How is our view of beauty colored by our prejudices and experiences?
I am the type of woman that men drool over, follow down the street, etc. I’m not beautiful, though, IMO. I have relatives and friends who are much more beautiful than I am so I’m not fooling myself.
I think it’s also about the way you dress and carry yourself and the confidence you display. That’s what makes someone truly attractive, versus beautiful.
And the walk. The walk is key.
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And intelligence. Intelligence is ultra-sexy.
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Islandgirl,
From the way you described yourself, you’re a catch!
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Keys is very photogenic. But w/o makeup, she’s hardly beautiful. Many on this site take celebrity beauty seriously when in reality, 80% of these people look nothing like their media depictions. Seriously. I kid you not.
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Are you beautiful, mynameismyname? Or should I say handsome? We spend such an inordinate amount of time dissecting female beauty on this blog. What about the men ?
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Oooh, yes! More about the men! Hear, hear!
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Thanks!lol
Yeah, man! What about you? Arge jew guapo, senor?
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LOL!
I’ve been told that I’m handsome several times. I’ve rarely been called ugly. I say this because it would be biased for myself to talk about how great or how not-great I look. LOL.
I do agree w/ B&G though. Intelligence is the sexiest trait ever!
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“I do agree w/ B&G though. Intelligence is the sexiest trait ever!”
Am I right or am I right? LOL!
Remember that those same good-looks (and that infamous “sense of humor”) are actually just outward signals for what is really prized: health, power, fertility, and intelligence. If someone has the latter four they could probably make a good catch even if they weren’t particularly good-looking or humorous/charming.
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“I say this because it would be biased for myself to talk about how great or how not-great I look. LOL”
Yeah, it’s a thin balance. You don’t want to sell yourself too short. But most people don’t want to come off as an egotistical, pompous, self-absorbed, conceited so and so either.lol
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I agree Islandgirl. It’s hard for me to talk about myself (referring to either looks, personality, or achievements) because I don’t want to come off as patting myself on the back.
Black & German,
I’m surprised you used that phrasing, “I’m the type of woman that men drool over.” I thought about it, and it’s true men “drool over” (Lol, interesting visual) me, but the droolers tend not to be the type of guys I’m interested in, so I don’t really pay them any mind. I’ve gotten to the point (and I’m only 20!) that certain attention doesn’t even phase me, meaning I don’t see it as a “plus” or an affirmation of my attractiveness, since it happens so often. Would you potentially be interested in the drooling men you attract? (I think you are married, so of course I’m asking hypothetically, if you were single.) The most vocal guys are never the type I would go out with. Does this make any sense? 🙂
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PS. 100% agree on the false modesty comment.
If someone (and it’s usually a female) makes an “I’m too fat” comment, if I’m feeling cynical I’ll respond, “Well that sucks for you” because I hate when people fish for compliments. Making people pity you doesn’t attract them, it repels (well, me at least).
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Thanks, Jasmin. Obviously I feel the same way.
I’ve gotten to the point (and I’m only 20!) that certain attention doesn’t even phase me, meaning I don’t see it as a “plus” or an affirmation of my attractiveness, since it happens so often.
You seem to be very secure and well adjusted. That’s really not a plus and yes, the men who do that usually aren’t about much. It does not affirm ones attractiveness, just shows they’re a lot of horny men out there.lol So it really shouldn’t be that much of an ego boost. Sometimes men don’t really have discriminating taste when it comes to women. They’ll approach whoever looks more available, receptive, ect. (which I’m sure is not the case with you).
False modesty is not good either or fishing or compliments. It would be ridiculous if MJ talked about how clumsy or untalented he is. But then again, you never see him in interviews reminding people of his accomplishments. “Remember that time in ’92 when I shot a 3 pointer from across the room and the crowd went wild?”lol
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@Abagond
You have great answers but I don’t think Oprah thought Aishwarya Rai was the most beautiful she was just following up on the claim 60 minutes made and she saw Aishwarya on that show before she had her on. Oprah has named Halle Berry the most beautiful woman on her show for years.
Do you think Halle Berry is the most beautiful woman?
What about Beyonce?
Do you think a black woman will ever be looked upon as the most beautiful in the world per say to get a title like Aishwarya Rai’s?
Bipasha Basu, Priyanka Chopra, Rani Mulkerji are all stunning indian woman!!!
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Bipasha Basu is so beautiful, you have got to she her in Jism (hindi Bollywood film)
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Islandgirl,
I agree–for some it’s an “odds” game. They know that for every 100 women they talk to, 99 might say no, but there’s always 1 who will say yes. I think some get a thrill out of flipping the coin, and the idea of the challenge is more appealing that the woman herself.
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Just wanted to clarify that when I said that men “drool over” me, I didn’t just mean the delinquents cat-calling on the street (roll eyes), I included the quality men in that.
Islandgirl:
Okay, maybe MJ wasn’t the best choice for an example.
“It does not affirm ones attractiveness, just shows they’re a lot of horny men out there.”
You’re right about the first part.
But don’t be fooled, the non-drooling ones are horny, too. They’re all horny. That’s just part of being male. It would be a shame if it weren’t so. Imagine if you wanted to have sex with your husband and he responded to your advances with, “Oh, honey, can we do that tomorrow? I’m just not in the mood. Didn’t we have sex last week, anyway?”
I don’t object to the horniness just to the corniness. The difference between the droolers and the non-droolers is self-control. They all notice the pretty girl walking by. They’re just better at keeping themselves to themselves.
Am I right about that, men?
Jasmine:
No, I never date guys who “drool over” me. It’s a complete turn-off, actually.
I knew my husband for 3 years before our first date. I didn’t even know he had a crush on me because he was so painfully shy. Even when he FINALLY called to ask me out he beat around the bush for 30 minutes and just before he hung up I shouted, “Ask me out already!” into the phone and he was like, “Oh, yeah. Umm… Want to go out for dinner?”. I almost reached into the phone to strangle him.
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Back to the original topic:
Abagond,
Why is it that men never add a discount for “future deterioration”? As in, shouldn’t pale-skinned WW be at the bottom of the beauty heap because they’re looks are so transitory? Those Scandinavian beauties might be well-preserved under the Swedish sun but aren’t so impressive at 40 years old in Arizona.
And what is up with the plastic surgery? Why doesn’t the idea that she has to change her breasts out for new ones every 15 years detract from her appearance? That’s just gross! And the face-lifts? Have you seen Nicole Kidman’s new look of “permanent surprise”? If a black actress had done that she’d be immediately unemployed and ridiculed. I hear a lot about black actresses having nose jobs but the truth is that a lot of white actresses do too. It’s just that nobody cares.
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@@@@ BlackandGerman
Who do you think is the most beautiful woman in the world?
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“They all notice the pretty girl walking by. They’re just better at keeping themselves to themselves.”
I’ll make this point and then move on. My point was that you don’t have to be pretty for a guy to notice. Sometimes it’s whoever looks more approachable, receptive. And it is a numbers game. I have seen the most beautiful, pretty women and men don’t even notice or look at her. I’ve seen a famous black actress walk down the street and thought for sure that men were going to drool and no one even looked at her.
You shouldn’t look to anyone to define your attractiveness. But if a woman thinks you’re beautiful or pretty, you must be. A woman (straight woman) has nothing to gain from thinking your pretty (other than a nice gesture). She’s not trying to get in bed with you.
Back to the topic. I think black, asian and indian women are beautiful. Hispanic too. Well really all women are.
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@ island girl
Do you think looks are in the eyes of the beholder?
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Black & German,
LOL at your husband! 😛
Good point about plastic surgery. I’ve always thought those Swan-type shows were weird, because why would you want to date/marry someone who only looks the way they look because of science? Not that looks are the end-all-be-all, but it would be strange to me (sorry, but some of those women were hideous pre-surgery) to have plastic surgery and then get all kinds of compliments from people who only laughed at me before. Do compliments count if the complimented body part is the result of plastic surgery?
PS. My name is Jasmin without the “e”. People spell it wrong all the time, but I’m clarifying because there is another poster named Jasmine on this same blog.
Islandgirl,
Interesting point about getting a compliment from another woman. I’ve never thought of it that way, though I agree that men have all kinds of ulterior motives.
Rachel,
You didn’t ask me, but it seems like it’d be impossible to name the most beautiful woman–I think I’d have trouble answering that question. First you have to distinguish between beautiful and pretty, and so on. When you asked the question, the first person I thought of was Roselyn Sanchez, but I wouldn’t go out on a limb and say she’s the most beautiful (and I would say she fits in the “pretty” category too).
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Why do you guys always size up beauty with celebrities?
You guys don’t see beauty among everyday people?
Personally, I see tons and tons of beautiful women. It’s to the point that it’s nothing special for me.
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I use celebrities because everyone knows what they look like or can easily google them and find out.
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Black&German:
I agree with you about future deterioration, plastic surgery, etc.
Before I married my wife I looked at her older, fatter sister to see what I was getting into. If my wife got plastic surgery I would be highly upset even if she looked better to strangers. And if I was dating someone and found out part of them was fake I would feel uncomfortable about it (except for medically necessary changes and hair).
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I strongly disagree with this post… of course there are some features such as tightly curled black hair, pale blonde hair and blue eyes that are almost specific to some groups of people… but the other features that you’ve picked out can be found amongst people of any ethnic group.
There might be a larger proportion of one group that share a certain physical feature but no actual physical features are ever really confined to just one ethnic group. Black people are not the only ones with tightly curled hair. Non-white people can have blue and/or blonde hair. White and Asian women can be curvy (and I don’t mean obese, I mean a healthy balanced shape), Black women can be thin and slightly built. Not all East Asian and White women have pale skin, some have naturally olive or brown skin. You are squeezing people in boxes that are far too small and limiting. Yes I know, you *did* say “I am only talking in general.” but your generalisations are pretty insulting to all those beautiful women out there who are lower on your list. And Latino/a isn’t a race – but I know that you are already aware of that…
We are all the same and sometimes, features of our distant shared ancestors appear in people who are apparently vastly different in ethnicity.
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“But if a woman thinks you’re beautiful or pretty, you must be.”
Interesting theory. In that case, I’m beautiful.
It sounds weird to say that. But I do have women tell me regularly that I’m beautiful. Maybe… hmm… once or twice a month? It makes me uncomfortable, though. I never know what to say. Sometimes I just want to sink into the floor. Why do floors never open up and swallow me when it would be convenient?
I don’t think I am. I’m not tall or thin enough to be beautiful. And I break out and swell up like a balloon when I have my period (yuck!). And when I wake up in the morning my hair sticks up all over. And my boobs are too big. And after 2 kids I’m just too “worn out” to be beautiful. And I have stretch marks and cellulite and all of that wonderful stuff. I could go on but I don’t want to totally gross you out.
“Who do you think is the most beautiful woman in the world?”
If you mean celebrity-wise, I’d go with Sanaa Latham.
If you mean AT ALL, I’d say:
My mother is hands-down the most beautiful woman in the world. She reminds me of Juliette Binoche or Julia Ormond but prettier and with ice-blue eyes. Truly stunning. And she has a fantastic black-woman’s figure (it’s a Bavarian thing). And she’s REAL. She really wakes up looking like that. And she’s almost 55 but has no wrinkles at all.
I used to dread bringing guys home because they’d spend the evening staring at my mother. As if I was chopped-liver, or something. The first time my husband saw her I thought his eyes would fall out of his head. But he recovered quickly. Smooth.
Trust me, growing up with a woman like that around, you KNOW what beautiful is.
“Do compliments count if the complimented body part is the result of plastic surgery?”
No, they don’t. I had 2 surgeries on my jaw and wore braces for 5 years and a retainer for 2 more and whenever someone compliments me on my artificially-perfected smile I’m embarrassed.
Geez. I was just re-reading this post. It sounds like I have some sort of complex, or something.
Abagond, is this a soul-searching blog?
Let’s change the subject:
How about them Ravens? They’re in the newspaper every day here and they’re not even doing anything except practicing. What’s up with that?
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“But if a woman thinks you’re beautiful or pretty, you must be.”
Interesting theory. In that case, I’m beautiful.
It sounds weird to say that. But I do have women tell me regularly that I’m beautiful. Maybe… hmm… once or twice a month? It makes me uncomfortable, though. I never know what to say. Sometimes I just want to sink into the floor. Why do floors never open up and swallow me when it would be convenient?”
I KNEW IT! I knew you were going to say that! If I were to say if a martian thinks your beautiful, then you are, you would have said that martians tell you that often. Girl, you are too much. lol Is this satire or are you being serious? I guess I am facinated by your comments because I’ve never encountered a person with this way of thinking, unless you count Hillary Banks.:)
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Sorry if it seems that I’m singling you out, but arrogance is my biggest pet peeve. Guess that’s my problem, though. I mean, I worked around other models, actresses, cheerleaders and never encountered anyone who was conceited or talked about how beautiful people think that they are consistently. I don’t do that either. I worked with high level people and found that the CEO’s and millionaires were the most down to earth. You wouldn’t even know that they were so successful.
O.K., just had to get that off my chest. Good luck to you!
Rachel,
Yes beauty is in the eye of the beholder to a certain extent. Raw stripped-down beauty isn’t though. There are a lot of things that contribute to beauty and make people beautiful. Walk, style, confidence, ect.
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Most wealthy and powerful people I’ve know have not been “down to earth”. They’re driven and ambitious in a way I couldn’t imagine emulating. Except for the ones that inherited money or status; they were more laid-back.
“I KNEW IT! I knew you were going to say that! If I were to say if a martian thinks your beautiful, then you are, you would have said that martians tell you that often. Girl, you are too much.”
LOL! I had to laugh at that because it was genuinely funny.
Am I being singled out? Hmm… yes. Does that bother me? Hmm… no. Blogs aren’t real-life, you know. They’re just forums for discussion.
This is the last time I’m going to address this as my children would like to play with me now:
Like I said before, I DON’T actually walk around talking about my own appearance. That would just be strange. This is a post about beauty so it seemed appropriate here.
I find it confusing that it’s okay to mention my race on a post about race, or my age on a post about age, even my weight on a post about body types, but NOT alright to mention my appearance on a post about beauty.
Is beauty in a separate category? Is it something we can’t mention in polite company like diarrhea or STDs? Is it only to be discussed vaguely in the third person or by using celebrities as proxies? Are most people really oblivious to what they look like to others? Or do they just pretend to be so that they appear modest? This is something that I’ve genuinely wondered.
Even Abagond gets jumped on for discussing what he finds beautiful. What’s up with that?
I’m not really sure if you’re upset because you think I’m lying or if you think I’m telling the truth but should be lying.
The funny thing was that I never said I thought I was beautiful, only that other people said that I was and that that happened regularly. My view of beauty doesn’t include myself: flawless skin, tall and slender, full, but not large, breasts and behind, delicate feet with high arches, large eyes. That certainly doesn’t describe me.
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On another note:
I enjoy coming here because the rest of my day is filled with rather mundane (albeit enjoyable) housewifely tasks like cooking, baking, washing laundry, driving around to activities, canning produce (we have tomatoes and zucchini coming out of our ears right now), and watching my preschoolers and my brain needs some extra verbal stimulation. I read a lot but it’s nice to join an active discussion. I especially enjoy the mixed audience Abagond has as it’s particularly agreeable to discuss with people who think differently than I.
It’s wonderful that there’s a new topic everyday and that I can use words like “albeit” and people will understand. That’s so refreshing. Most conversation is very dumbed-down. Even reading the newspaper is mind-numbing sometimes, which is why I subscribe to the Economist. I find most people dull and enjoy reading and conversing with people of equal or greater experience and intellect.
Or is that me being arrogant again? If so, then yes: I am arrogant. And proud of it. Does it make me more arrogant if I take pride in my arrogance?
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Good enough. I hope that I never become that arrogant. It’s not a good look.
Like I said, good luck!
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Hello there my name is Vindicator. I am an Afro latin/caribbean guy living in the U.K. (and no I don’t know The Queen but she did come to my school a long time ago.)
Anyway just here to say I love this blog and say what I think what race and beauty mean to me.
My preference for women are light skinned black chicks especially afro latinas. To tell you the truth though, there are fine women in all races and the majority of the women I’ve dated have been white women ( and they were hot.)
Just an ugly black guys two cents.
Take care.
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Why would you call yourself an ugly black guy?
That makes you immediately unattractive.
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Just telling the truth. Ugly and Proud. It’s never stopped me from getting laid
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@Jasmin
Do you think Aishwarya Rai is the most beautiful woman in the world?
Why do you think people say that about her?
What about Halle Berry?
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Rachel,
I think she’s gorgeous, but I don’t know if I’d call her most beautiful. Partly because I think of older women when I think of beautiful (of course, “older” is relative). People probably call her that because she’s famous–statistically, it’s more likely for the “true” most beautiful woman in the world (if we were ever able to objectively define the title) to be a private citizen, but celebrities are more accessible.
I think Halle Berry is pretty, but I wouldn’t call her most beautiful either. If I compare the 2, I think Halle is prettier than Aishwarya though.
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Black&German:
I love The Economist too! But I think I told you that before. If I did, then this was an update.
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Vindicator said:
Just telling the truth. Ugly and Proud. It’s never stopped me from getting laid
LOL.
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@ abagond
Who do you think is the most beautiful woman in the world?
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@@@@ Jasmin
Thanks Jasmin you are very pretty if that is your picture on the post.
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I concur. You’re very pretty Jasmin.
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Thanks Rachel and Leigh 🙂
That picture is from last Christmas Eve–my hair is longer now, but I basically look the same. I went to a mini grade-school reunion party at the beginning of August, and everyone said I looked the same since they last saw me, which was 6 years ago when I was 14!
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abagond: “I love The Economist too!”
I know!
Isn’t it absolutely marvelous? Just this week I was reading an article about health care in there and thought: I wonder if abagond saw this one? But health care isn’t really your topic du jour, is it?
Totally off-topic: Just read “Jacob’s Ladder” and have moved onto the sequel, “Canaan”. Fabulous! I love how the characters are never pigeon-holed by race; they defy stereotypes.
I hardly have time to even read posts this week as school starts tomorrow.
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@ Jasmin
you are most welcome.
Who is the most beautiful woman in the World? Do you think she exists?
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The most beautiful woman in the world is elusive because everyone has varied opinions as to what is beautiful.
Admitedly, there are some women who are more universal and have a higher percentage of admirers. But, still, not everyone will think she’s beautiful
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@ island girl
Good answer thanks.
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@ island girl
you are very pretty.
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Here’s what race and beauty mean to me:
http://neckback.blogspot.com/2009/08/my-racialethnic-preferances-for-women.html
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Thank you Rachel! I’m sure you are as well. It is good to get love and support from other girls. Guys don’t seem to think I am.
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islandgirl Says:
Thank you Rachel! I’m sure you are as well. It is good to get love and support from other girls. Guys don’t seem to think I am.
Join the club. I hardly ever get compliments from the opposite sex as well. Well here’s a compliment from me. You’re pretty cute (assuming that it is a photo of you as your avatar.)
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Lynette Says:
Islandgirl,
The guys are just intimidated by your beauty.
Can you blame guys that are intimidated by fine women in today’s world.
If we compliment a woman, she never believes us or gets offended.
When we approach a woman, most guys get shot down faster than a B-17 Flying Fortress on a bombing run over Germany.
Finally when we’ve got a date we have to go through so many obstacles to even get couple of minutes (if that) of sex.
If it came to complimenting, approaching and dating a fine looking woman or having to spar with one of my martial arts masters. I’ll pick the latter 9 times out of 10.
(As you guys can tell from what I’ve just written, I’m single and miss sex.)
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I agree, Lynette.
Although Vin does have a point. The typical guy doesn’t have it easy with women. I think part of it has to do with the lack of respect that a lot of men have for women, even on a less conscious level.
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Vin,
I read your blog entry. Interesting. I have a few questions.
You differentiate between “Afro Latinas” and “light skinned black women”. How come? Are the “black women” you refer to black Americans? Can the “Afro Latinas” be darker-complexioned but the “black women” (?) can’t be?
How about South Asian women? You seem the least pickiest with South Asian women. So, can they be dark?
I’m just curious.
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@Lynette:
I know realistically I won’t be getting any on the first date (although if I was some long haired, skinny pretty boy, a muscle bound thug. My chances would be alot higher.)
@mynameismyname:
Thanks for reading my blog. I can’t explain my attractions and my preferences. I’m just like what I like.
Stay tuned on on my blog there’s alot more to come.
http://neckback.blogspot.com/
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@Lynette and mynameismyname:
I’m sorry that you the blog has confused you guys. As you see I’m not a very good writer or blogger. When I’ve got the time I will re-write it and also answer any questions as well.
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Lynette,
I would loove to believe that.lol But I really don’t think that’s it. Maybe a lack of sex appeal. Oh well. Thanks for that though, means a lot from someone who looks like you! I’m sure you don’t have any problems either way.
Vidicator, sorry you don’t get complimented by women. As a general rule, Lynette is right, women find beauty in more than just the physical. Your blog is pretty interesting.I thought maybe you liked Asian women, just by judging a couple of the comments you’ve made on here.
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Oh, also the comment you made on that actresses’ post, pretty much sums up your state of mind right now.lol
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Island girl, I can’t believe guys don’t talk to you–you are gorgeous! I know you mentioned that your picture is way lighter than your true complexion, so I don’t have the best mental image of what you look like, but you have great features. 🙂
I think we are around the same age, and a lot of guys in our age group are more interested in quantity than quality. Plus, I feel like our promiscuous culture has conditioned a lot of guys to go for what’s easiest to get. So many girls don’t have standards, and guys take advantage of that rather than actually “chase” a good girl.
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Vin,
I’m with Lynette. I found your blog entry very interesting. I just wanted to get a more thorough idea of your thoughts. That’s all.
Islandgirl,
Perhaps your beauty intimidates men. That’s very possible. They may think that they don’t have a chance with you so they just don’t try. As a man, I can tell you that guys aren’t as confident as you’d believe.
Jasmin,
I agree 100%.
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Thanks Jasmin! I don’t know what your situation is, but from your pic, even though you are very pretty, you have a wholesome look, classic look. Sometimes, I think guys like someone more erotic. So because I think you’re pretty or vice-versa, we appreciate beauty differently from men. We look with our eyes and not “something else”. Like I said, support from your “sisters” feels good.
Also, what you said about our promiscious culture and guys chasing what is easiest is right on point! It takes more work to obtain someone like you, a student with clear purpose, or Lynette, someone accomplished in her field with an advanced degree. It’s ashamed, because men should want more, not who they think is easier to get to bed. But, I will never understand men so there’s no sense trying.lol
Mynameis..
Thanks, I appreciate it. But I think it’s what Jasmin pointed out. That doesn’t just happen with me, but I’m sure so many other women. Also, I was always under the impression that most men are very confident. That’s new insight.
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Thanks Island Girl! I agree that the “Girl Next Door” look isn’t very popular with guys–they seem to uphold the sexpot thing, which I definitely am not lol. Even when I go out, I don’t have enough “attitude” to give off a sultry vibe. (Plus I’m short.)
It’s unfortunate, but for every 1 girl who has high standards there are 9 others who will take whatever attention they can get from men. The guys who go after those kinds of girls because they are easy never actually want to date them, but when they finally grow up and express interest in a quality woman it’s too late. I don’t want to be the prize at the end of the tunnel after a guy is done “sowing his wild oats” *rolls eyes*.
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“I don’t want to be the prize at the end of the tunnel after a guy is done “sowing his wild oats” ”
So true! Great point!
Sounds like we have a lot in common. This reminds me of a “Fresh Prince” episode where Ashley enters high school and is overlooked by guys for the sexpots. Guess we’re the real life Ashely Banks.lol
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Lynette Says:
Islandgirl and Jasmin,
It is really nice to see young women with high moral values. I’m glad the two of you have not compromised your standards for the young men of today. I see this happen too often among young ladies in the public school system. Continue with your positive paths in life and I am sure you will one day reap your rewards.
I agree with what Lynette wrote. Just stay true to yourselves and the right guys will come.
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Lynette & Vindicator,
The high number of people I know who already have multiple kids out of wedlock, are headed for divorce, or have to drop out of school to deal with relationship drama is enough to scare me straight, lol.
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Lynette & Vindicator,
Thanks for the encouragement! I’ll keep your words in mind when feeling discouraged.
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Abagond, I respect your opinion. but it is rather biased. You obviously think the blacker the better judging by your topics, you also say most beautiful women come from the Congo. If that is the case why are most Miss Worlds from South America/India? I personally think that any ethnicity can be beautiful.
It does seem that black women are generally regarded less attractive but I have seen some really beautiful black women and their beauty stands out more than the average pretty white woman. But to me the most beautiful people come from countries such as Trinidad and Tobago, Brazil and Cuba, countries where the diversity is beautiful.
I also have to admit I think the average person from Sweden or Holland is more attractive than the average person from the Congo or Uganda. That is just my opinion. I personally find Caribbean or Ethopian (in particular the women) black people more attractive.
I think certain features are more attractive in certain races. I think that black men and women and mixed-race or Latino people tend to have better bodies, eyes and skin colour and I once heard a saying that a black woman can wear a simple T-shirt and jeans and still have heads turning. That’s because black women still have more confidence and stance than other women no matter how much they are put down.
But if there is one thing I think white and Asian women have beat is hair. Straight silky hair is just more attractive and men say they can run their hands through it more easily.
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Melissa:
A post like this one is going to be utterly biased because it is all about just that: my biases! You have your taste in women, the judges at the Miss World pageants have their taste and I have mine. Vive la difference!
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Sorry to be pernicktyagain he he he
With regard to:
1. Black
2. Latin American
3. South Asian
4. East Asian
5. Polynesian – Not sure about this looks like a S.E Asian
6. White
Follow the connundrum:
There are:
Blacks Black, Black Latin Americans, Black South Asian, Black East Asian, Black Polynesian
Then again
there are
1 White Latin American, White Polynesians and White/Caucasoid South Asians
I think the aforesaid categories have somewhat of an overlap…and is somewhat reminiscent of the race classification of: Black, White, Mongoloid and Browns
he he…Sorry!!!
Back to the topic concerned…
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@J:
I think you’re right. The “Polynesian” woman looks SE Asian to me, too.
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Melissa,
If Abagond’s opinion is biased, then so is yours. Isn’t that what opinions are for? When does a pageant determine which country has the most beautiful women? As far as the hair thing, it depends on how you look at it, if you think straight hair that you can run your fingers through is better, then so be it, but there are some people who think natural, kinky hair that defies gravity is better. And also kinky hair can be made straight with the use of a flat iron. A beautiful black women with a big fluffy hair will stand out compared to a non black woman with straight hair. Even white people admitted this. Now I don’t think one type of hair is better than the other because I am not God and I didn’t create anybody so who am I to judge other people for what God gave them. But we as women tend to get childish with this hair thing when being compared to other races of women.
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@ Rachel Aishwarya Rai is natural beauty and is most beautiful along with Adriana Lima close behind her.
Aishwarya Rai(Indian beauty)
Adriana Lima(Brazilian beauty)
Don’t hate on these gorgeous women,they are beautiful in and out.Never seen more beauty anywhere else.DAMN!
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^Neither of those are “natural” beauties, unless you mean in the sense that even plastic polymers are made of natural materials.
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It is said Aishwarya Rai and Adriana Lima had plastic surgery of some kind. If that’s the case then they had their monies worth. I wonder what they had done. They look gorgeous.
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Personally, I would give Adriana the #1 spot, but Aishwarya Rai is in the same league.
I doubt that either had plastic surgery. Those sorts of accusations are always hurled at the most beautiful people, regardless of whether there is any real evidence for it.
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They had plastic surgery. Google will tell you this.
People want to believe that celebrities arrived out of the womb looking like perfect, for some reason. Maybe it gives them something to strive towards, but one of my best friends is a plastic surgeon and he will tell you that the vast majority of celebrities have had plastic surgery. It’s something many do to break into the industry.
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Well Wikipedia says that “…at the age of 15, [Adriana Lima] entered and finished in first place in Ford’s “Supermodel of Brazil” model search. She subsequently entered the 1996 Ford “Supermodel of the World” contest and finished in second place.
So the reported surgeries presumably must have taken place in her early teens.
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What does entering a beauty contest have to do with plastic surgery? Halle Berry was a beauty queen before her nose job.
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I googled Adriama Lima and supposedly she has breast implants. I’d never have guessed.
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I think Adriana had them done. She had good results.
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…and nose job, and lip injection in the top lip. Brazil isn’t called the plastic surgery capital of the world for no reason.
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@Natasha W:
It always amazes how practically perfect looking these celebrities appear. I was surprised to learn the most beautiful white women in the world had something done, say, Charlize Theron’s nosejob and Catherine Zeta-Jones’ boob job.
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That doesn’t seem at all credible to me.
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Which one? Charlize Theron’s nosejob? Or Catherine Zeta-Jones’ boob job? Maybe both?
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FG, it’s because you don’t want to believe it is credible; it shatters your previous ideas of them. It’s okay. We can all dream… Dare to believe! 🙂
leigh, I’m not surprised at all. I know non-celebrities that have plastic surgery. It does help one go from average to extraordinary.
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I was responding to Natasha’s post. Here’s a video which includes pictures of Adriana at age 13. Her lips and nose appear to be of similar shape to what they now are:
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Where’s the picture of her at 13? The one with the crown on? You don’t think her nose looks more rounded then than upturned like it is now?
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“ou don’t think her nose looks more rounded then than upturned like it is now?”
Nope, don’t see it.
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Okay.
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Here’s my female beauty ranking:
1. Persian
2. “Latina”
3. Indochinese
4. Mediterranean
5. Scandinavian
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Here’s my female beauty rating:
1. Two X chromosomes.
2. An X and a Y chromosome, with surgical work.
3. An X and a Y chromosome without surgical work, but decent clothes.
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Leigh and Natasha,
I always wonder about the scars. The chances of someone getting cut open with no markings afterward are slim to none, so what do these people look like naked? My cousin used to watch Discovery Health all the time, and once I saw all of the markings on women who got boob jobs, chin lifts, and saddlebags cut off I was sooo grossed out. And I saw a website alleging Beyonce got a boob job because she has armpit scars that look like the ones people have when they get the silicone inserted that way.
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@Jasmin:
I don’t know about scars from boob jobs and such, but I had one relative who had a non-invasive, non-surgical nosejob. She had some kind of fillers put in her nose. I knew her appearance changed, but I couldn’t put my finger on it until she revealed she had her nose “done.”
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“Here’s my female beauty rating:
1. Two X chromosomes.
2. An X and a Y chromosome, with surgical work.
3. An X and a Y chromosome without surgical work, but decent clothes.”
Oh, Thad, that is so “transphobic!” 😉
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Naw, I’m not scared of them, I just got my own personal preferences. 😀
As for race, it would definitely be “human” in first place.
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