Sgt Kizzy Adonis (c. 1977- ) is a Black American police officer with the New York Police Department (NYPD). She was one of two officers who oversaw the arrest of Eric Garner for selling untaxed cigarettes on July 17th 2014. Garner, who was Black, was put in a chokehold by a White police officer, Daniel Pantaleo. Garner died. The medical examiner ruled it a homicide.
After 18 months, Adonis is the only officer to be charged with any wrongdoing. She was also the only one who tried to help Garner, says Erica Garner, his daughter.
On January 8th 2016, she was charged by the NYPD’s internal affairs department with four counts of failure to supervise. The NYPD took her badge and gun and pulled her off the street. Note that she has not been charged with a crime – these are disciplinary charges. She could be fired or, more likely, lose vacation days.
Meanwhile Pantaleo, says Erica Garner, is back on the streets as terrible as he ever was. A grand jury in December 2014 refused to charge him with a crime. The NYPD could bring disciplinary charges – chokeholds are against its policies – but that is unlikely before the US Justice Department completes its investigation into whether Garner’s civil rights were violated.
Adonis, unlike Pantaleo, is not under criminal investigation by the Justice Department, so disciplinary charges had to be brought within 18 months, according to her labour contract.
The Justice Department investigation has been going on since December 2014, now over a year. The New York Civil Liberties Union (NYCLU) says it should not take so long: it is “not a tough call under the federal statute.”
Adonis joined the NYPD in 2002. On June 25th 2014, just weeks before the Garner killing, she made sergeant. She was not called to the scene of the arrest, but since she was nearby, she came to help.
Pantaleo put Garner in a chokehold and took him down. He and other officers held him down while they put on handcuffs. Eleven times Garner said “I Can’t Breathe!” They did not get off of him.
This took place in front of Bay Beauty Supply on Bay Street in Staten Island. According to the shopkeeper, Adonis said, “Let up, you got him already.” One officer looked up but did not let go.
In a police report on Garner’s death, Adonis said,
“the perpetrator’s condition did not seem serious and that he did not appear to get worse.”
The report said Adonis “believed she heard the perpetrator state that he was having difficulty breathing.”
While Adonis is being held accountable, kind of, no one above her in the chain of command is. Not the duty captain, not the zone commander, not the borough commander, not the police commissioner.
This does go all the way to the top of the NYPD: it was Commissioner Bratton who was cracking down the sale of untaxed cigarettes – while not cracking down on the use of chokeholds.
– Abagond, 2016.
See also:
- NYPD
- grand jury
- race baiter argument
- Black Lives Matter
531
Abagond. Can you do a story on this?
http://www.cnn.com/2016/01/07/us/florida-woman-removed-hospital-dies/
While looking for this story I found this also. God damn.
(https://youtu.be/a0jL9fk1qWw)
LikeLike
Zero sympathy for her, she was as responsible as Pantaleo. You state the following:
1)”The NYPD could bring disciplinary charges – chokeholds are against its policies – but that is unlikely before the US Justice Department completes its investigation into whether Garner’s civil rights were violated.”
2)”In a police report on Garner’s death, Adonis said, “the perpetrator’s condition did not seem serious and that he did not appear to get worse.””
3)”According to the shopkeeper, Adonis said, “Let up, you got him already.” One officer looked up but did not let go.”
If she was a “supervising officer” and she knew chokeholds are against NYPD policies she should have ordered Pantaleo to stop.
Your quote from her that Garner’s condition did not seem to get worse indicates she didn’t have a problem with what he did.
LikeLiked by 1 person
While I think it’s unfair that she’s being used as the scapegoat, I think this should serve as a very valuable lesson for Black people in the police force.
LikeLiked by 2 people
Is the valuable lesson.
“Don’t attempt to rescue another Black person whom the police are attacking?”
LikeLiked by 1 person
How did she attempt to “rescue” Eric Garner? Did she order Pantaleo to release him from the chokehold? No she did not, she didn’t think it was a problem. Nothing “unfair” about her treatment, she’s getting what she deserves for thinking she was “one of the boys”.
LikeLike
She is clearly being made to be both the scapegoat AND the sacrificial lamb.
Would this have happened to a white female sergeant?
A new Black sergeant would have to walk a very fine “supervisory” line when it comes to supervising white subordinates.
There could be endless politics (ways of making her life miserable for this and other reasons) and “who has your back, or NOT” involvement from your peers, your bosses and the union.
I don’t see the mayor nor the commissioner coming to her rescue in the immediate future, if ever.
Business as usual.
LikeLiked by 3 people
King @ Is the valuable lesson.
“Don’t attempt to rescue another Black person whom the police are attacking?”
Linda says,
no, the valuable lesson is
“CYA because your white co-workers do NOT have your back and they frequently will and do through you under the bus, to save their own butts”
LikeLiked by 3 people
This case is the just 1 of a series of Miscarriages of Justice that we’ve seen in the last 4 years
Kizzy going down for Eric Garner’s death, is a slap in the face to the family and everyone else who is witnessing this sorry excuse for justice.
When the white police officer, Pantaleo, who choked Eric Garner and the 5 other white officers who were riding Eric’s back, gets indicted or fired, then I will clap my hands.
There is no justice in watching this black woman get scapegoated, since she was the only one trying to “de-escalate” the situation that her white co-workers initiated.
Her biggest sin was trying to “have her co-workers back” by making that dumb statement.
“if they can talk, their breathing” is a very common saying/belief in the medical world and I guess it is with the police also.
Since Eric’s death, I’ve admonished quite a few people on my staff for making such statements when a patient is complaining about breathing issues.
This misguided thinking by medical personnel is what just killed that poor woman in north Florida.
LikeLiked by 1 person
@Gro Jo said: “According to the shopkeeper, Adonis said, “Let up, you got him already.” One officer looked up but did not let go. If she was a “supervising officer” and she knew chokeholds are against NYPD policies she should have ordered Pantaleo to stop.”
@LOM said: “I agree with Gro Jo. She could have done a lot more to help Garner but didn’t. That makes her at the very least an accessory to murder.
Oh, … you gotta love the irony here. Perhaps both of you jokers forgot to eat your daily bowl of Wheaties this morning. Wheaties are recommended for champions and both of you are NOT! Sgt. Adonis did her part as a supervising officer by commanding those thuggishly racist cops to lighten up their grip on Mr. Garner because he was successfully subdued in deadly asphyxiation or oxygen deficient position already. She did her job. She gave those cops an order to stop doing what they were doing.
Since Pantaleo or anyone else for that matter, wasn’t indicted and subsequently charged with the murder of Mr. Garner, he should’ve at least been charged with failure to follow departmental policies and a command given by a superior officer, Ms. Adonis that certainly resulted in the unnecessary death of an innocent man. The selective disciplinary proceeding here is killing me!
After all, Ms. Adonis’ command to the officers didn’t result in Garner’s death. NO, the intentional and illegal pressure of force against his neck after his barely audible, eleven pleas of : ”I can’t breathe“ were ignored. This is what killed him, not the command from Sgt. Adonis, for the perpetrators to stop.
Personally, I believe this situation is quite telling of the amount of respect, or lack thereof, white officers have for any black superior officer, even more so for a black female.
I surmise that Pantaleo and the rest of those thugs saw a n&gga b#tch as opposed to a supervising officer. Corruption! Corruption! Corruption!
LikeLiked by 4 people
@blacksage,
Correct. The only officer disciplined is a black woman who tried to use her authority. It was done for show so that people like LOM can claim justice without laying blame where it truly belongs.
LikeLiked by 4 people
Like I said on another comment board, I feel she is the “fall guy.”
LikeLiked by 3 people
Wow I can’t believe I actually have to spell this out.
The very valuable lesson(s):
a) don’t participate in the oppression of your people by becoming a cop.
b) you will never be “one of the boys”. This is evidence that they will throw your black a** under the bus in a heartbeat to save their own.
LikeLiked by 3 people
“Sgt. Adonis did her part as a supervising officer by commanding those thuggishly racist cops to lighten up their grip on Mr. Garner because he was successfully subdued in deadly asphyxiation or oxygen deficient position already. She did her job. She gave those cops an order to stop doing what they were doing.”
good old blakksage, always good for a laugh. K. Adonis’ comment was just that, a comment not an order. Being the serious champion I know you to be you’ll clear up her my confusion over her written statement where she claimed: “the perpetrator’s condition did not seem serious and that he did not appear to get worse.” You’ll no doubt want to explain why she didn’t cite Pantaleo for insubordination for ignoring her order. It seems you know the lady better than she knows herself.
LikeLike
@ Gro Jo
LikeLike
now you see policeman’s union
LikeLike
@Gro Jo: “Adonis’ comment was just that, a COMMENT not an order.”
AND THEN LATER in the same paragraph:
@Gro Jo: “You’ll no doubt want to explain why she didn’t cite Pantaleo for insubordination for ignoring her ORDER.”
You’re so funny! Make up your mind! Why would a supervisor merely comment on a subordinate of hers illegally choking an innocent man as opposed to giving him/her an order to stop doing what they were doing? You’re not making much sense, if any at all!
LikeLiked by 2 people
My dear Blakkage, the only thing not making sense is your confusion over the point that I was trying to make. Be that as it may, why did she fail to bring Pantaleo up on charges for insubordination? The result of his ignoring her was pretty tragic. I would have loved to see how Bratton would have tried to spin such development.
LikeLike
King wrote: “@ Gro Jo
Q: “How did she attempt to “rescue” Eric Garner? “
A: “She was also the only one who tried to help Garner, says Erica Garner, his daughter.””
Are you joking? Did you fail to read her statement?
“2)”In a police report on Garner’s death, Adonis said, “the perpetrator’s condition did not seem serious and that he did not appear to get worse.””
I’ll ask you the same question I asked Blakksage, why did she not bring insubordination charges against Pantaleo and any other cop who failed to heed her call to let up on E. Garner?
LikeLike
GroJo, stop defending the ridiculous… you already answered your own question .
GroJo to King
GroJo’s previous comment to King:
You know good and well this woman is nothing but a “scapegoat”, as were all the other black/Asian/non-white police officers that got indicted with the quickness last year– and their white counterparts got off scott-free.
She adhered to the “good ole boy/blue shield” rules by trying to cover for those a’sholes but she failed to learn in time, that those rules were never designed for her or any other black/brown person.
She got the Christopher Darner treatment–her union fees were wasted.
LikeLiked by 5 people
Gr Jo asked: “I’ll ask you the same question I asked Blakksage, why did she not bring insubordination charges against Pantaleo and any other cop who failed to heed her call to let up on E. Garner?”
I don’t know why you asked such elementary questions. In any event, allow me to quench your apparent thirst for an answer.
Now, back to Eric Garner, who was supposedly selling loose cigarettes. Damn, I didn’t selling loose cigarettes was such a dangerous thing to the fine citizens of New York. It is clear that Sgt. Adonis didn’t pursue an insubordination report to the precinct regarding Pantaleo’s actions, due to her not wanting to subsequently appear to fit the description of being a snitch. That’s a dangerous status to have attached to someone on the police force. Furthermore, it is obvious that he is one of the good old white boys with the right connections within the police administration. This explains why he is still working and it doesn’t seem as if he was even disciplined for at least a violation of departmental policies.
Gro jo, you know as well as I do that all police department’s work under a code of silence. If Sgt. Adonis had reported this incident, she may as well kiss her career good bye in the process.
Look no further than what happened to Officer Frank Serpico of the NYPD in the 60’s and 70’s when he attempted to expose the corruption within the police department.
Do you have any more silly questions???
LikeLiked by 2 people
Blakksage and Linda, I’ve read your comments and agree with the reasons you give for her reticence to do her job and save a man’s life. I disagree with your claims that she was obliged to take the path she did because she was their superior officer, not their buddy.
I will not give her a pass for failing to do her job, and rationalizing her inaction with the nonsense that “…he did not appear to get worse.”
After she was ignored, she could have repeated her order to release E. Garner from the chokehold, if she was ignored a second time, she could have used her taser to force compliance. Granted, she wouldn’t have been popular, but at least she would have saved a life and shown that she was “a n&gga b#tch” with sharp teeth and not afraid to bite.
Linda wrote: “GroJo, stop defending the ridiculous… you already answered your own question .”
The only thing that’s ridiculous is the defense of a person who doesn’t deserve to be defended. My attitude toward Ms. Adonis is if you lie with dogs, enjoy the fleas you wake up with. Blacks are way too understanding toward people like her, they get promoted and are too scared to use the power they have, either you’re a boss or you’re not. Blakkage, when will you get around to cleaning up the corruption you decry, or is that another silly question?
LikeLike
So, this is how The System works. No matter how dedicated you are to it – it will use yo as grist for its mill. It will feed on you to sustain itself – especially if your black, moreso if you’re a black woman.
Funny , right now I’m listening to the audiobook “The Third Reich in Power”. I’m at the start of the book, the year 1933, where the German Jews either flee , or stay, thinking the system will help them, because their businesses bring value to the Reich. See how that worked out. So black Americans, what will you do? Leave , or keep on struggling? That is question.
LikeLike
GroJo @ The only thing that’s ridiculous is the defense of a person who doesn’t deserve to be defended. My attitude toward Ms. Adonis is if you lie with dogs, enjoy the fleas you wake up with. Blacks are way too understanding toward people like her, they get promoted and are too scared to use the power they have, either you’re a boss or you’re not.
Linda says,
so according to you, justice is served because Kizzy issued an order, that was not followed by her white subordinates
and because she did not back it up by laying hands on said subordinates, she got what she deserved by losing her job
Because, it is so Typical for police officers to Taze or beat up their fellow officers who they see doing wrong.
OK
GroJo, even you know what you said is wrong
LikeLiked by 2 people
and by the way,
Kizzie was one of two supervisors that were on the scene that day
and the other Supervisor still has his Job!
Oh, what a glorious day it is to by white and male in America. You can do nothing or everything, even murder
and still keep your job if you are a policeman.
LikeLiked by 1 person
“On January 8th 2016, she was charged by the NYPD’s internal affairs department with four counts of failure to supervise. The NYPD took her badge and gun and pulled her off the street. Note that she has not been charged with a crime – these are disciplinary charges.”
She got what she deserved, she should have done her job. I have zero sympathy for people like her. You can cry poor little black woman mistreated by the system all you want, the fact is that she was incompetent and contributed to the killing of Mr. Garner, end of story.
“Linda says,
so according to you, justice is served because Kizzy issued an order, that was not followed by her white subordinates…and by the way,
Kizzie was one of two supervisors that were on the scene that day
and the other Supervisor still has his Job!”
Justice is seldom involved in these things, just power. What are you proposing, people should protest her unfair treatment because her colleague who was just as guilty as she was for not supervising may have been let off? Sorry, I won’t join you, I will not protest the fact that impunity wasn’t extended to her.
LikeLike
GroJo @
Justice is seldom involved in these things, just power. What are you proposing, people should protest her unfair treatment because her colleague who was just as guilty as she was for not supervising may have been let off? Sorry, I won’t join you, I will not protest the fact that impunity wasn’t extended to her.
Linda says,
No, I don’t think this is a protest moment but neither is it a win-win situation or a “job-well-done” moment by the NY police administration.
her white, male colleague should have, most definitely, received the Same punishment as her, since he was there and he also “failed to supervise”
There is no excuse for him getting off scott-free if the “failing to supervise” rose to level of being heinous enough to lose one’s job.
watching this black woman lose her career, while all the white perpetrators of the crime get to collect their pension and sleep well at nights…
is Not a moment to celebrate.
and since it’s about Power, then I won’t be jumping on the bandwagon to condemn this woman, who is nothing but a pawn, in a well-established game
LikeLiked by 4 people
While grossly misunderstanding and even underestimating the legacy, strength and sustained power of white supremacy in Amerika, Gro Jo foolishly made the following statement.
“Blacks are way too understanding toward people like her, they get promoted and are too scared to use the power they have, either you’re a boss or you’re not.”
This is exactly how white supremacy works. White folks constantly put in place neatly packaged illusions that give the appearance that black folks have some authority in this sh&t hole of a country referred to as Amerika, when in fact, we don’t. Black folks always have been and still are a powerless people in this country. This explains why those ignorantly thuggish white cops ignored Sgt. Adonis. A black sergeant, lieutenant or captain lacks the equalizing authority given to a white officer. She was and still is a paper sergeant in theory only, but in reality, not so much. This is the truth, whether you or Ms. Adonis realizes this or not.
Any more questions in defense of Amerikan white supremacy???
LikeLike
I see that we are, more or less, in agreement. I do not celebrate her victimization, but I’ll be damned before expressing sympathy for her. Cops are bureaucrats with guns, she might not even have had to taser anybody, telling them to get off the guy or face being written up for violation of department policy might have saved E. Garner’s life. She wasn’t just a pawn, she could have done her job but chose to go along to get along and now she will pay the price for it.
LikeLike
Blakksage wrote: “While grossly misunderstanding and even underestimating the legacy, strength and sustained power of white supremacy in Amerika, Gro Jo foolishly made the following statement…This is exactly how white supremacy works. White folks constantly put in place neatly packaged illusions that give the appearance that black folks have some authority in this sh&t hole of a country referred to as Amerika, when in fact, we don’t.”
What a load of bs, get the hell out of here! Your claim is too stupid to warrant any other type of answer.
She had an opportunity to do her job and decided not to do it, end of story. Try that crap about “white supremacy” on somebody else, not me.
Next, you’ll be blaming “white supremacy” for not taking a shower, or washing your hands after going to the toilet!
“Amerika” produced people like MLK Jr., Fred Hampton and others who fought the system and paid the ultimate price for doing the right thing. Stop spouting stupid crap.
LikeLike
Gro Jo said: “What a load of bs, get the hell out of here! Your claim is too stupid to warrant any other type of answer.”
Lol at gro jo, …ad hominem much! The truth hurts, eh, and why are you responding?
LikeLike
How is it ad hominem when I wrote that your claim, is too stupid the deserve a more thoughtful answer? It would have been ad hominem if I had claimed that you are too stupid, I did not. What truth are you babbling on about? Your transparent lie that she did all she could, and anyway, it’s all the fault of an abstraction called “white supremacy”? That dodge is crap. Nate Turner, Denmark Vesey and other fighters for Black rights never used it to stop them from doing what they felt was the right thing. So, your claim is indeed bs.
LikeLike
Oh Lord, more hell breaking loose in the NY police department. I grew up on Staten Island and the police are a rung above Fascist Nazis. The problem is, they don’t see how big the teeth are in the mouth of karma…
LikeLike
Carry on gro jo! When everything else has failed and you hear defeat knocking on your door, well then, resort to name calling and deflect the immediate topic with something meaningless. Get back to the topic. Ad hominem!
LikeLike
Blakksage, Break it down for me, what am I deflecting, how have I strayed from the topic at hand, i.e. the plight of K. Adonis? your understanding of what an ad hominem argument is is faulty. a trait you share with a certain lady who makes extensive use of that word to hide the barrenness of her thought. your “white supremacy” excuse for Ms. Adonis’ nonfeasance is stupid. As I pointed to you above, you could use the same excuse to justify failing to wash your hands after using the toilet. Your argument would have been just as invalid as the one you’re making now. Better luck next time.
LikeLike
She was the ranking office on site, i guess she wrote the report? Talk about being a lightning rod
LikeLike
@ nomad
I will be doing a post on Barbara Dawson.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Hang on, … allow me to don my edification cap. @Gro Jo, v8driver and @LOM, what is the definition of white supremacy?
I’ll then show both of you exactly how it fits into the Sgt. Adonis situation. I want answers now!
LikeLike
white supremacy is the ideology that white people are the natural lords of the earth, their needs and wishes come first. Ok, Blakksage you’ve got my definition, let’s see what you do with it.
LikeLike
I don’t see the mayor nor the commissioner coming to her rescue in the immediate future, if ever.
They surely won’t. To them, this woman is a godsend to a certain extent. They can claim that this incident was not as racially motivated as it is being portrayed. This argument will come in handy during a lawsuit.
“CYA because your white co-workers do NOT have your back and they frequently will and do through you under the bus, to save their own butts”“CYA because your white co-workers do NOT have your back and they frequently will and do through you under the bus, to save their own butts”
Truer words have never been spoken.
LikeLiked by 1 person
@Gro jo
Not to be funny, but he said what IS the definition not what is YOUR definition. ROFL!!!
LikeLike
@LOM
I know reading can be hard for you at times, but no one is defending her. They are basically stating the obvious. She is the scapegoat.
LikeLike
” on Thu 14 Jan 2016 at 19:49:56
sharinalr
@Gro jo
Not to be funny, but he said what IS the definition not what is YOUR definition. ROFL!!!”
My darling, if he wanted a definition, he should have consulted a dictionary. Since he asked me for the definition, I obliged him with my definition. What’s your definition of that concept?
LikeLike
“What’s your definition of that concept?”—-Same one that can be found in the dictionary. Give or take a few modifications.
LikeLike
Since when was stating the obvious something to brag about?
LikeLike
How has my definition deviated from the dictionary one? Please state what your modifications to the dictionary version are.
LikeLike
@Gro Jo
“Since when was stating the obvious something to brag about?”—-Probably about the same time it was popular to ask dumb questions. When you can answer that then I guess you might have an answer to your questions.
“How has my definition deviated from the dictionary one?”—The definition you gave is one that lacks any real idea of what it actually is. It is not simply the idea that “white people are the natural lords of the earth, their needs and wishes come first.” It is the acts that take place to secure that idea. It is the belief that whiteness is the ultimate achievement of human nature and so forth.
LikeLiked by 1 person
@blakksage obviously what led to this situation (mostly) white ‘behind the scenes’ basically subversive network inside a paramilitary force
LikeLike
Which is not what it was in 1865, 1912, nor 1949
LikeLiked by 1 person
” on Thu 14 Jan 2016 at 20:45:20
sharinalr
@Gro Jo
“Since when was stating the obvious something to brag about?”—-Probably about the same time it was popular to ask dumb questions. When you can answer that then I guess you might have an answer to your questions.
“How has my definition deviated from the dictionary one?”—The definition you gave is one that lacks any real idea of what it actually is. It is not simply the idea that “white people are the natural lords of the earth, their needs and wishes come first.” It is the acts that take place to secure that idea. It is the belief that whiteness is the ultimate achievement of human nature and so forth.”
Combative as ever. My darling, I’m having trouble seeing how your definition differs from mine.
What’s the difference between: “white supremacy is the ideology that white people are the natural lords of the earth, their needs and wishes come first.” and
“It is the acts that take place to secure that idea. It is the belief that whiteness is the ultimate achievement of human nature and so forth.” The last part of your statement says the same thing, with the addition of “so forth” and your “…acts that take place to secure that idea.” I left these bits out of my statement because I hate stating the obvious.
Confess, Blakksage is one of your sock puppets, isn’t he? I love our back and forths, but I want to hear from Blakksage, not you. I want him to keep his word and “I’ll then show both of you exactly how it fits into the Sgt. Adonis situation. I want answers now!” I gave him/you an answer and I can’t wait to be “enlightened”.
LikeLike
@gro jo
“I’m having trouble seeing how your definition differs from mine.”—You are also having trouble reading. 1) I never stated or made a claim that they were different. I said “The definition you gave is one that lacks any real idea of what it actually is.” Which it does. So reeling up for the old straw man as always I see. 2) The definition you gave constraints it to a belief. It is not just a belief alone.
“What’s the difference between: “white supremacy is the ideology that white people are the natural lords of the earth, their needs and wishes come first.” and
“It is the acts that take place to secure that idea. It is the belief that whiteness is the ultimate achievement of human nature and so forth.””—-Simple action. Example….A man can believe he is God’s gift to the world, but when a man puts in place the actions to secure this idea then that is a different story altogether.
“Confess, Blakksage is one of your sock puppets, isn’t he?”—Why? I know you are desperate but geez.
“I love our back and forths, but I want to hear from Blakksage, not you. I want him to keep his word and “I’ll then show both of you exactly how it fits into the Sgt. Adonis situation. I want answers now!” I gave him/you an answer and I can’t wait to be “enlightened”.”—–Then if you did not want to hear from me, you could try this thing called ignore. 🙂
LikeLike
“Then if you did not want to hear from me, you could try this thing called ignore. ”
You little coquette, you know I’d never put you on ignore.:)
I just want you to hold off until I hear from Blakksage, after that I’m all yours.:)
LikeLike
@Gro JO, @LOM and @v8driver,
Sorry about the long delay in responding. However, some of us black folks do have a career, huh!
Some white folks kill me with their know-it-all-funky-attitude. My response is from the perspective of the black experience in Amerika. I’m quite certain that neither one of you know nothing about this. Because the only manner in which this life experience is transferrable even on a small level, is to walk in any black man’s shoes for at least day or so.
In any event, when the slaves were brought here against their will by the Arabs and white Europeans, they were continually beaten into submission to always obey their slave master. When they disobeyed, the repercussions were swift. They either got flogged, amputation of a hand or foot, defecation by Europeans directly into the slave’s mouth, castration of men, women were raped by whites in front of their husband, the children of slaves were intentionally separated and placed on different plantations or a myriad of other demonic practices, simply for compliance. In short, physical slavery of black people in Amerika has cease, but this form of brutality been supplanted by mental slavery. The vast majority of black folks have been left in an irreparable, psychologically scarred state. You may deny these things all you want, but oral history passed down between black folks and other documented facts say otherwise. Psyche pain is real and is developed due to prolonged troublesome environments. Amerika isn’t utopia for most black folks, you know.
In Psychology, getting someone or an animal to respond on queue is referred to as conditioning. Conditioning is where a stimulus is repeatedly provided to the subject. Once the correct response from the subject is repeated a few times, the subject then learns through the stimuli how they are supposed to respond in order to reap the benefit or the reward. That is: do as your told and don’t even contemplate telling a white man what to do.
Now, … let us turn to Sgt. Adonis. It is quite obvious that Adonis didn’t report this incident to the administration or attempted to discipline Pantaleo or the other rogue cops for fear of jeopardizing her chances of being promoted to the next level or any other benefits that were contingent upon her playing her role as a paper sergeant, absent real authority to give orders to white men as I stated in an earlier post. Even further, she may have even pondered: why bother with paperwork, they aren’t going to discipline a white guy(s) simply because I wrote a report.
On the other hand, those thuggishly racist European cops played the role of slave masters to the hilt. After all, a white skinned male as a subordinate to a black female, literally means to the average white guy on the police force. This is why they ignored her order to lighten up on Mr. Garner. And after he died, she is the only one disciplined in connection with his death and she didn’t even have her hands around his neck. It is clear that they resent the fact that a black sergeant is their superior, even more so, a black female. This is the generational, sustaining power of white supremacy.
Now that I’ve put this situation into full context, I hope you get my drift; I also hope you feel me. But if not, perhaps this level of thinking isn’t for you or maybe you’re not only out of bounds, but you’re out of your league as well!
LikeLiked by 3 people
“I just want you to hold off until I hear from Blakksage, after that I’m all yours.”—-then it is imperative that I go drink as to enhance my laughter at your responses.
LikeLiked by 2 people
“Some white folks kill me with their know-it-all-funky-attitude. My response is from the perspective of the black experience in Amerika.” Such modesty, you speak for the entire race in all its diversity! Forgive me if I dismiss your claim as nonsense. You seem to labor under the delusion that I’m white, I don’t need you or anybody else to tell me what it’s like to be black, you are no more an expert in this matter than I am. Each of us can only speak from his own personal experience.
The history of Blacks in the Americas give the lie to your claim that the only thing that Blacks have experienced is degradation and humiliation. I was born in a country created by Blacks who fought all slavers and won. Your loser mentality doesn’t sit well with me. My black heroes are Zumbi ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zumbi), Toussaint Louverture (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toussaint_Louverture), Jean-Jacques Dessalines (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean-Jacques_Dessalines) and women such as Beatriz Kimpa Vita (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kimpa_Vita). People who kept their backs straight and their heads high despite the persecutions they endured. The same trait was demonstrated in the USA by people like Nat Turner (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nat_Turner) and Denmark Vesey (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denmark_Vesey).
So much for your claim to speak for all blacks.
“Now, … let us turn to Sgt. Adonis. It is quite obvious that Adonis didn’t report this incident to the administration or attempted to discipline Pantaleo or the other rogue cops for fear of jeopardizing her chances of being promoted to the next level or any other benefits that were contingent upon her playing her role as a paper sergeant, absent real authority to give orders to white men as I stated in an earlier post. Even further, she may have even pondered: why bother with paperwork, they aren’t going to discipline a white guy(s) simply because I wrote a report.”
This is pure speculation on your part, and nonsense, I feel no obligation to deal with it. As for your comments about why she was disciplined, I don’t see the big mystery here. She failed to keep her troops in line, and allowed them to flagrantly flaunt her authority. The charge of failure to supervise is just. the only injustice I see is that she is the only one held accountable for this incident.
“Now that I’ve put this situation into full context, I hope you get my drift; I also hope you feel me. But if not, perhaps this level of thinking isn’t for you or maybe you’re not only out of bounds, but you’re out of your league as well!”
I got your drift and “felt” you from your first comment. I see no reason to revise anything I wrote about your claims. Your dragging into this conversation the bugbear of “white supremacy” as a Deus ex machina to explain away the incompetence of Sgt. Adonis leaves me cold.
LikeLike
Weren’t the only cops on trial for murdering Freddie Gray black? Even though there were three white cops with them?
LikeLike
Is it me or is Gro jo’s straw man arguments getting tired? Must he place “all” in every response that someone makes and pretend to be arguing against their claims. Geez….*sips wine*
LikeLike
@ Sharina
It is not just you. I noticed that too.
LikeLiked by 2 people
” on Fri 15 Jan 2016 at 06:25:36
sharinalr
Is it me or is Gro jo’s straw man arguments getting tired? Must he place “all” in every response that someone makes and pretend to be arguing against their claims. Geez….*sips wine*”
My darling, is that the best you’ve got? Very disappointing. Feel free to expand your criticism. I find you a tad terse here. At the very least, list my “straw man” arguments an clearly show why they are so, otherwise, I might suspect that you are engaging in destructive criticism. Where’s good old Kiwi, I’m sure he’d like to take a stab at what I wrote?
Now a word from our genial host: ” on Fri 15 Jan 2016 at 06:38:04
abagond
@ Sharina
It is not just you. I noticed that too.”
The challenge to Sharinalr extends to you as well.
Apparently, you two don’t have a problem with Blakksage’s imbecilic claim to speak for, wait, here it comes: All blacks.
Nor do you seem to be troubled by this delirious bit of nonsense: “Now, … let us turn to Sgt. Adonis. It is quite obvious that Adonis didn’t report this incident to the administration or attempted to discipline Pantaleo or the other rogue cops for fear of jeopardizing her chances of being promoted to the next level or any other benefits that were contingent upon her playing her role as a paper sergeant, absent real authority to give orders to white men as I stated in an earlier post. Even further, she may have even pondered: why bother with paperwork, they aren’t going to discipline a white guy(s) simply because I wrote a report.”
“…It is quite obvious that Adonis didn’t report this incident to the administration or attempted to discipline Pantaleo or the other rogue cops…”
No sh*t Sherlock, after a civilian died she would have had a choice in filing a report! Why do you encourage such stupidity? Your blog is starting to read like xPraetorious’ blog.
LikeLike
@Gro jo
“At the very least, list my “straw man” arguments an clearly show why they are so, otherwise, I might suspect that you are engaging in destructive criticism.”—–My comment made it clear what your straw man is, but since you want to play clueless….
You stated:So much for your claim to speak for all blacks.
Please point to where blakksage claimed to be speaking for all blacks or said all blacks? If you can find it (and I do not mean you perceived ides of it) then you are engaging in a straw man, because you are claiming he said something he did not. If he did not say all then you can not just claim all for him and start arguing it and then claim you are refuting his claim. It really is your claim.
*sips wine
LikeLike
Correction- If you can find it (and I do not mean you perceived ides of it) then you are go9d, but if you can’t then you are engaging in a straw man, because you are claiming he said something he did not.
LikeLike
My darling, before we jump in our usual verbal rabbit hole I’d like you to define a word you used that’s not in my vocabulary. what does “ides” mean?
LikeLike
The phrase ” Because the only manner in which this life experience is transferrable even on a small level, is to walk in Any BLACK MAN’s shoes for at least day or so.” implies all black man would agree with him.
I’ve been and continue to be a black man for several decades and I find his claim absurd. “any” implies “all” in the given context. You’ll no doubt disagree, but that’s your problem not mine.
LikeLike
Kiwi my boy, welcome. I knew you wouldn’t disappoint. Let the fun begin!
LikeLike
@gro jo
1) Any black man does not equal all blacks, which is what your areservation claiming he said. Unless of course you want to claim all black people are male.
2) Looking at the comment in context he is referring to life as a black male and experiences that only a black male would understand. From rich to poor.
In short you still engaged on a straw man. Flip it how you like, but it comes up the same.
LikeLike
Correction—you are claiming…
LikeLike
My dear, it’s past your bedtime, you are not making sense:
“1) Any black man does not equal all blacks, which is what your are claiming he said. Unless of course you want to claim all black people are male.”
“2) Looking at the comment in context he is referring to life as a black male and experiences that only a black male would understand. From rich to poor.”
meaning experiences all black males would understand. I rest my case.
LikeLike
gro jo
“meaning experiences all black males would understand. I rest my case.”—-Actually any does not translate to All. You trying to make it is just typical desperate gro jo. Either way you claimed he said all black people. Which he did not. Goal post shifting. Smh…
LikeLike
Oh and as an added bonus. Definition of Any http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/any
Has several, but you assuming all just means you engaged in a good old straw man. ROFL
LikeLike
Yawn, you really should go to bed now because you missed definition #4.
“every; all:
Any schoolboy would know that. Read any books you find on the subject.”
Sleep tight and don’t let the bedbugs bite my foolish darling.
LikeLike
Is gro jo black?
LikeLike
@aja i think so, pretty sure
LikeLike
@blakksage “if wishes were fishes we’d have something to eat”
white supremacy is just a notion without the wherewithal to make it happen.
and my somewhat cryptic statement is just referring to what seems to me the new modality of it in the guise of ableism (omg that exchange here b/t solitaire and mjb made me cringe) and gay rights and political correctness, within all those exteriors, it’s still there
LikeLike
gro jo
I didn’t miss definition #4. Which is why I said “Has several, but you assuming all”.
He could have meant any of those definitions, but because you decided to apply one YOU thought he meant you still managed to pull a straw man. Based on the quote of his it is obvious that…
1) He was not talking about All blacks as you claimed. Just black males.
2) Based on his quote his any was likely the #2 definition.
Sad part is you used a straw man. Tried to twist the argument and still ended up using a straw man. Your argument is just plain weak.
LikeLiked by 1 person
“1) He was not talking about All blacks as you claimed. Just black males.”
Not just black males but all black males.
“2) Based on his quote his any was likely the #2 definition.”
Do yourself a favor and quit embarrassing yourself. rewrite your sock puppet’s sentence using the examples given for definitions #2 and 4.
I’ll do it for you:
definition #2- ” Because the only manner in which this life experience is transferrable even on a small level, is to walk in Any(whichever) BLACK MAN’s shoes for at least day or so.”
definition #4- ” Because the only manner in which this life experience is transferrable even on a small level, is to walk in Any(every) BLACK MAN’s shoes for at least day or so.”
I see no difference between the two. Definition #2 says it doesn’t matter who the black man is and #4 says his claim is true for all black man, same difference. What you have here are two ways of conveying the same thought. If you can’t see that, that’s your problem, not mine.
LikeLike
.”all black man” should have been “all black men”
LikeLike
@gro jo
“Do yourself a favor and quit embarrassing yourself.”—-But it is not me that is embarrassing themselves now is it? It simply is YOU.
First you claimed he said All blacks. Twice. Comment can be found here:
And Here:
These are straw man claims. Instead of admitting to using them here you later try to take a quote and claim he is talking about all black men. A position that is goal post shifting
“I see no difference between the two”—-People with no common sense rarely do. These are definitions that do not carry an amount with the exception of #4. The key thing is you chose to apply YOUR definition of Any ignoring the others and pigeon holing/assuming the meanings behind what was said. Thus again creating a fancy little straw man.
Dad part is that is all you have. You can only create an argument through the use of a straw man.
@Abagond
Please enlighten Gro Jo that blakksage is not my sock puppet. His desperation needs to be highlighted a tad bit more.
LikeLike
*sad not dad
LikeLike
Lord of Mirkwood
If YOU decide to make the substitution of all then you are engaging in a straw man no matter how true or false the statement is.
Because you and gro jo share a common need to argue in such fashion, it is no surprise that you would attempt to defend it.
LikeLike
Lord of Mirkwood
If you are presenting an argument that someone did not claim then it is a straw man.
Prime example. When people say Irish in here you equate it to all Irish and argue it. That is a straw man. What did not have an amount or value, you are putting in one. Any does not have an amount or value, but when you put all you are giving it one.
LikeLike
Here is a source for your clarity http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/straw-man.html
And I will be happy to provide examples to illustrate the magnitude of how often and when you and Gro jo use such arguments. 🙂
LikeLike
Context, my darling, con-text. Your habit of pulling a single word or phrase out of its context had led you astray once more.
Comment 306418 was a reply to the sock puppet’s claim that his comment reflected “…the black experience in Amerika.” Does the black experience in Amerika exclude any(some) blacks? If yes, who are they? the same applies to comment 306397.
You’ve accused me of goal post shifting and straw man arguments, when are you going to add the ad hominem one to my sins?
LikeLike
“Dad part is that is all you have. ” A freudian slip?
Freud·i·an slip
noun
noun: Freudian slip; plural noun: Freudian slips
an unintentional error regarded as revealing subconscious feelings.
LikeLike
@Gro Jo
See here is where your problem is. I asked you to show where he claimed ALL blacks. Question found here: https://abagond.wordpress.com/2016/01/13/kizzy-adonis/#comment-306420
When presented with that you then tried to argue how he was talking about ALL black males. But never was able to present where he was talking about ALL black people. So you can save your excuse of context because you made an argument against his claim based on something he did not say. Based on what you created. It really is a shame for someone to claim to be so intelligent, yet relies so heavily on fallacies in arguments.
“an unintentional error regarded as revealing subconscious feelings.”—Not unless the auto-correct on the phone has subconscious feelings. LOL
LikeLiked by 1 person
Sharinalr said in response to the TIRED one (gro jo): ““an unintentional error regarded as revealing subconscious feelings.”—Not unless the auto-correct on the phone has subconscious feelings. LOL
Hahaha, don’t hurt him Sharina, he has proven to everyone that he’s unlearned! Hell, … Pavlo’s dog learned quicker than gro jo. He is certainly a waste of precious energy and time.
LikeLiked by 1 person
My sweet, where have I ever claimed to be “…so intelligent…” My intelligence has never been part of the conversation. I fear you are making a straw man argument and goal post shifting and even, surreptitiously, an ad hominem argument by putting my intelligence in play here.
I love Sharinalr, but your Alice in Wonderland logic is exhausting. I think that will be all for now, until I’ve recovered. Bye, and stay foolish.
LikeLike
My dear Blakksage, I don’t usually correct people’s spelling but I’ll make an exception for you.
Pavlo’s dog should be Pavlov’s dog.
“In Psychology, getting someone or an animal to respond on queue is referred to as conditioning. ” My dear friend queue (tail, in French) is wrong here you meant cue.
No need to thank me, just one black man helping another one out.
LikeLike
@gro jo
” I fear you are making a straw man argument and goal post shifting and even, surreptitiously, an ad hominem argument by putting my intelligence in play here.”—–Interesting you say that after several post of you doing it, but thanks again for being an example of my point. Always a pleasure. 🙂
LikeLike
@ v8driver
I’m not sure I’m following you. Are you saying ableism, gay rights, etc. are forms of white supremacy?
LikeLike
@solitaire, no am i not, I am saying that instead of hitler’s massive rallys, there is a more ‘internalized’ and i would think more insidious methodology to white supremacy as it has to work within this kumbaya culture that seems to be accepting so much more than back in the 60’s
LikeLike
@ v8driver
Thanks, that helps me to understand better.
What did I say that made you cringe?
LikeLike
ah i was just thinking that as you popped up here on screen right, it was the nomenclature of the parsing of you and mjb’s idea of ableism omg
LikeLike
@ v8driver
I guess I’m still not following you. Idea of ableism?
LikeLike
my wife is telling me this sounds stupid well i’ve been struggling with the thematic or overarching or 20000 feet view is the gay rights, and now ‘ableism’ is things that stand on the shoulders of the black civil right movements
LikeLiked by 1 person
i’m like sayin i’m not even irish right now anyway
LikeLike
tres apropos
LikeLike
life do go on
LikeLike
this is as my wife is saying i’m black and i’m here right now as i’m typing this literally anyway time to go
LikeLike
@ v8driver
Ok, I understand now, thanks. You’re definitely not the only person to hold that view.
My opinion has always been that it’s possible to work against discrimination of all types at the same time. I know that not everyone feels this way, and I respect that.
LikeLike
respect.
LikeLike
ok well all that came from
“Adonis, unlike Pantaleo, is not under criminal investigation by the Justice Department, so disciplinary charges had to be brought within 18 months, according to her labour contract.”
ie it seems to contravene written statutes for ‘civilians’
call it the long way home or whatever
LikeLike
Gro jo seems very whitewash in his views to be black
LikeLike