Black sock puppets are commenters who pretend to be black. Most are white racist trolls.
Red flags:
- Conspicuous Blackness:
- Use of Mock Ebonics. This is pretty much a dead giveaway. Most Black Americans use Standard English in a public, written medium like a blog. Meanwhile, few whites can use Ebonics properly.
- Act to stereotype. They do this to “seem black”, if only to themselves.
- Use a name that seems “black” or “African”, like “Trinidad African” or “Naija Girl”.
- Say they are black in their first comment. You might think this is pretty common among black commenters, but at least on this blog it is not. Most make their race implicit in what they say, not explicit. Presumably because, unlike black sock puppets, they do not feel the need to point out their race or expect it to be doubted.
- Have a stereotyped view of blacks. Particularly one that never seems to go beyond the misrepresentation shown on American television. Most blacks have a broader, more fleshed-out, subtle, ordinary-life view of blacks.
- Push whitewashed opinions. Either by word or by acting to stereotype. There is little point in being a black sock puppet otherwise.
- Trolling. At least on this blog, nearly all trolls have been white. They create disagreements for their own amusement and then make it about winning the argument – because deep down they do not take the subject seriously.
In short, black sock puppets tend to be trolls who are Conspicuously Black yet whitewashed!
These behaviours flow from the nature of being a black sock puppet yet are things most black commenters do not do. Any one of them in itself might mean nothing, but two or more together is a bad sign.
It is possible for a black person to do everything on the list, of course. Some blacks are Conspicuously Black. Some blacks are whitewashed. Some are trolls. Yet it is far more likely that these qualities will come together in a white troll than a black person.
That said, there are two things to watch out for:
- Judging blackness based on ideology. There are 40 million blacks in America, a billion worldwide. They cover the full range of opinion, from Clarence Thomas to Angela Davis to beyond. There is no ideological purity test.
- Ad hominem fallacy: Arguments stand or fall in the end based on fact and reason, not on who makes them. Even black sock puppets can be right.
The trouble with black sock puppets is not that they are wrong – sometimes they are right – but that they are arguing in bad faith.
Commenters and race: Generally speaking, I try not to concern myself with a commenter’s race, particularly since it is nearly impossible to prove over the Internet (and, in any case, letting people self-identify however they want is probably the best policy, online and off). Instead I try to concern myself with their arguments. White racism is wrong no matter whose mouth it comes out of.
See also:
I kind of imagined the Assplund sock puppet as chubbier and paler… long, greasy dark blond hair with a parting down the centre, and a goatee…
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@ Bulanik & Kiwi: LoL! If this is this Asplund person he is so sad and pathetic.
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Sometimes they use a name that sounds like the person is likely black like “Tyrone Washington”.
I always knew Asplund was off, but I never thought he was as extreme as he was in his final comments, or so I’ve heard.
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I am sick of trolls like this trolling this blog and other Black websites.
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Good list; I hadn’t identified such a pattern as yet, although I do get suspicious when an unfamiliar poster immediately begins posting controversial posts, (which are usually insults disguised as wide-eyed-brain-storming-sessions-and/or-online-open-hearted-anonymous-opinions). It prompts greater suspicious when these posts seem to have the intent of sowing discord.
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Honestly I am still a bit shocked that Asplund was considered a serious commenter at some point. Is it possible that someone who was banned simply took over his name? or was he always just a dumb azz?
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@Sharina: He was always just a donkey.
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i am black even though my profile picture is of a white guy.
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seriously though, until about halfway through the article i thought this was about some kind of modern minstrel show using puppets on youtube because the picture of the sock. since i’m white, i don’t realize other whites around me are racist until they do something to someone else or talk about someone else, since i’m not the target.
i go to this blog to find out what other whites are doing because honestly i don’t hear about most of this stuff. i first heard of the ‘knockout game’ on this blog, and then found out there were other whites making up this story about ‘gangs of young blacks roaming the streets’ looking for knockout victims. this s#!t is messed up and i’m glad this blog is here to point out the stuff that is going on.
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I forget who brought up this debacle via Open Thread, but it’s another great example of a black sock puppet —>http://www.forharriet.com/2013/12/dear-ani-difranco-supporters-you-cannot.html
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Although a lot of this should go without saying, I’m really glad you put a name on the behavior, Abagond. A douchebag is a douchebag no matter who they pretend to be, online or in real life.
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@ Daniel Bryant
I’m also glad this blog is here to point out what’s going on.
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The key is that they argue in bad faith. Thanks for posting this. Now they know that you know. Maybe they will find so we here else to play.
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lol careful abagond u may unknowingly be giving these people tips on how to perfect their little act. Don’t give away all the secrets now or else we may not be able to figure out whose who.
But rofl when they say i’m black and then state their bs argument defending racist white people. Like i’m a black person and I approve this message here ye here ye I now declare that u cannot call out white supremacy or racism, because I am black so I can speak on these things and u will listen. and they say I am black and I am not offended by this racist we need to get over it. oh or they say they are neither black nor white and then go on to say some racist bs that is funny too.
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@ lifelearner
yep that is a perfect example of a black sock puppet. I mean the lengths people will go to just to cosign their own bs, creating an account, jacking somebody’s picture , creating a name, trying to sound black. smh. what’s next? are they going to put on black face and start preaching to black people on what we should do. They are like oh I know if a black person won’t come in here and cosign the bs I will just have to do it myself if u want something done right u gotta do it urself. smh
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I find that on the site newsone.com that trolls are rampant. Very rampant! Why waste your time and energy patrolling sitea like this to spread nonesense… I just dont get it.
Abagond… Just wanted to tell you how appreciative I am of this site. I’ve been browsing for a few months now and every post I read of yours never disappoints. Looking forward to see what you have in mind to write and discuss about in 2014.
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If there’s one thing a racist troll hates so much is a black person happy about being black.
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I agree that sock puppets (i.e. trolls) are soOo annoying, and not to mention tend to take away from an otherwise enriching and informative discussion, to boot! That being said, I would not give away too much info on how “real” POC generally behave, talk, speak, etc. as this might just be something that these idiots may attempt to take a “note” of..on the flip side though, I think that when someone is a fake (of anY kind), the truth more than not always, always, finds a way to shine through!
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What does “bad faith” mean? I’ve read a lot of the comments on some of the threads. You say that an argument should stand on its own merit, but the regular commenters here and you obviously want everyone to agree with you and when they don’t, you label them a troll and that’s the signal for the regular commenters to then gang up on that person and run them away. I know you can’t see that, but it happens here. You obviously only want one viewpoint expressed here, that being white is bad and black is good. I know this will probably get me labeled a troll, but that’s just how I see it.
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@ Jayis
That is pretty much human nature. A person’s viewpoint is “the truth” as they understand it. It is therefore natural to wish for the truth to prevail over it’s opposite. That is not to say that one must not also account for the fact that their understanding of truth may be flawed on some level.
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@Jayis
From what I gathered on this site, everyone is able to express their own points of view, opinions and ideologies about whatever topic is of discussion. Just because someone disagrees with the majority opinion does not label them a “troll”. For me, a troll is someone who is outright racist, wants to cause drama and mos def has tooooooo much time on their hands to come to sites where they don’t have any business being on in attempt to start shit with mainly POC. Someone who genuinely has a different opinion or critique than the moderator or the majority is accepted, as long as respect is kept intact. Everyone is entitled to their own thoughts and can share them constructively to shed a different light on the topics at hand…… Again this is what I gather while on this site.
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@Jayis
“I know this will probably get me labeled a troll, but that’s just how I see it.”—-You will get labelled a troll if you fit the definition of a troll. Not simply because you disagree. You will always be challenged on ideas that a person does not agree with. It is part of debating. Sometimes it maybe one person and other times it may be several. If a person runs away it is by choice because no one can make you do what you don’t want to do.
You have said some pretty naive things yourself and if you have not been labeled a troll yet then you have yet to present trollish behavior. I have gotten the sh*t end of the stick in here and I don’t find myself whining nearly as much as some white visitors who feel they deserve special treatment.
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Another thing I want to add in response to this “You say that an argument should stand on its own merit”—If your argument is solid then it does not matter how many people “gang up” as it won’t change the validity of it.
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@mstoogood4yall
Well said/ The reason I feel they do it is simply because they think they can get away with saying off the wall bs. Because in their mind blacks won’t challenge another black.
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There are different types of trolls, but this is often times one way the black sock puppets play.
“A concern troll is a false flag pseudonym created by a user whose actual point of view is opposed to the one that the user claims to hold. The concern troll posts in Web forums devoted to its declared point of view and attempts to sway the group’s actions or opinions while claiming to share their goals, but with professed “concerns”.”
Oddly enough this is also actions I have seen at one time in one of our current resident trolls. Of the 3 people that actually do hold the troll title they usually are found making off topic rants. There is 1 other I do consider a troll for my own reason.
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Daniel:
I am confused. First you said this
i am black even though my profile picture is of a white guy.
Then you said
seriously though, until about halfway through the article i thought this was about some kind of modern minstrel show using puppets on youtube because the picture of the sock. since i’m white, i don’t realize other whites around me are racist until they do something to someone else or talk about someone else, since i’m not the target.
Care to clarify?
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@Jayis,
Bad faith argument is another way of saying arguing just for the sake of arguing and/or arguing with intentional deception. A “classic” example would be engaging in negotiations with someone when you have no intention of changing your original stance.
In terms of here, Da Jokah is expert at it. He has no intention of changing his views, or more importantly really considering yours, no matter what you counter with. He just keeps on arguing until it becomes pointless.
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ks,
no matter what you counter with. He just keeps on arguing until it becomes pointless.
This sounds like you’re saying that if a another person won’t accept another’s opinion or another’s statistics, then they’re arguing in bad faith. Why does the person have to accept your viewpoint? Why can’t they have their own viewpoint and still not be a bad faith arguer? I agree with what King said. A person’s stance is usually based on their own conclusions, drawn from their own experiences. The “truth” is rarely objective.
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@Jaysis,
No. Bad faith argumentation is an actual tactic. It’s not something that Abagond and I are making up. You can easily look it up.
It’s not a question of a person “accepting” another’s opinion or statistics as it’s not about agreement, it’s about intent.
A person who argues in bad faith doesn’t have any intention of accepting or considering anything counter to their argument from the start and is, usually, just arguing as a front for a derailment tactic.
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@Legion
What is so funny? I want in. lol
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@ks
“A person who argues in bad faith doesn’t have any intention of accepting or considering anything counter to their argument from the start and is, usually, just arguing as a front for a derailment tactic.”—Agreed.
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@Sharina,
Now that I think about it some more, I can give everybody two good examples that illustrate the difference between good faith and bad faith arguments.
1. Good faith – Remember the epic back and forth between Ebonymonroe and Adonis? They both held to their core convictions but did consider the other’s arguments and even allowed some nuance from the other to inform their arguments.
2. Bad faith – Praetorious Xwhatever! Need more be said?. lol.
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@KS
I would say those are perfect examples. They clearly illustrate the differences between good and bad faith arguments. And he is still carrying out those same bad faith arguments on his blog while talking to himself. LOL
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It’s not a question of a person “accepting” another’s opinion or statistics as it’s not about agreement, it’s about intent.
But how can you actually know what a person’s “intent” is. Don’t you see that what you consider as “intent” is a conclusion you draw. That conclusion says more about you than about them. You can’t ever know a person’s “intent.”
Likewise, a person may seem to be swayed, but isn’t really. They may seem to be swayed because they’re just tired of arguing or because they don’t want to seem anti or hostile. They may just want to make new friends but disagree completely with the other person’s argument or they may not want to go against the majority, especially on a forum like this one.
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@Jayis,
How can you tell intent? Easily. Simply read what they post and how they respond to others. My conclusion about intent is based on evidence/patterns not mind reading. Most of the times such sock puppets will actually tell you what they’re doing as they are usually proud of the disruption they cause and they often are hit and run posters or multiples like Asplund. If they don’t out themselves, they normally get busted fairly quickly and disappear.
There’s no need to conflate such sock puppetry tactics with actual good debate (your latter point) as, imo, the differences are readily apparent.
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How can you tell intent? Easily. Simply read what they post and how they respond to others.
Ks, you can’t accurately read “intent.” Sometimes, you may be right and other times, you’re not. You can only draw your conclusions using your experiences as a frame of reference. It’s guesswork at best.
BTW, I haven’t read any of the comments from the commenters you mentioned.
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Reblogged this on Life in Anglo-America.
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@Jayis,
Reading the intent of such “sock puppet” posters, as evidenced by their posts, is pretty easy. To get an idea, you should read the comments from the posters I mentioned above. Particulalrly the good faith vs. bad faith difference Sharina and I talked about.
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@Jayis
“They may seem to be swayed because they’re just tired of arguing or because they don’t want to seem anti or hostile. They may just want to make new friends but disagree completely with the other person’s argument or they may not want to go against the majority, especially on a forum like this one.”—Then I have to see the person as weak in this situation. If you believe something to hold truth then hold it as true and simply say agree to disagree. On this blog I have usually seen where individuals will start spouting the most racist thing they can think of when cornered or worse yet. To add I don’t think a person is really arguing in good faith if they start off by calling everyone a name, or making some racist remark.
Here is something to help in the idea of bad faith arguments.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bad_faith
http://cboye.wordpress.com/2010/01/27/bad-faith-arguments/
So far as what I have gathered it is simply an argument that is made even though it is false or has contradictory evidence.
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Those are all white people, white people have a strange illness where they have to pretend to be black on the internet and weigh in on black message boards and discussions and try to foment divisiveness.
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Though the real point of this is that if you have to PRETEND to be a person of another race or ethnicity to get your point across then you have no intention of arguing in good faith at all.
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@ Sharina,
Though the real point of this is that if you have to PRETEND to be a person of another race or ethnicity to get your point across then you have no intention of arguing in good faith at all.”
Exactly.
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Then I have to see the person as weak in this situation.
There are much worse things than being “weak.” I don’t care if anyone thinks I’m weak. I would rather choose my battles. I think it’s weak to let others choose my battles. I don’t feel the need to win every argument. Sometimes, it’s just best to back off. That’s doesn’t mean I’ve been swayed. It’s just means that I’m not going to put more energy into that argument.
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Black Sock Puppets? You mean the accusation used by black racist and Afrocentrics to derail a losing argument or using it as an excuse to not have face hard truths. smh
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@deepdkchocolate
No most white people come to these boards and are in total awe of the ignorance displayed on blogs like these on others. It is only human nature to try to correct the ignorant.
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@Jayis
You misunderstand. I have no qualms with an individuals picking and choosing their battle, but I see it as weak when a person allows themselves to be swayed simply to avoid a disagreement. For example if you don’t agree with something then why sit there and not say I disagree? If it continues then you can simply say “agree to disagree.” It does not have to be ugly, but you don’t have to cave over at the sign of challenge.
There is no hard feelings in agreeing to disagree, but I have found myself more insulted when a person agrees with me on the basis of fear or not wanting to say different.
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@Christopher Columbus
Then why is it you have not corrected your ignorance yet? It is also human nature for certain individuals to think their sh*t don’t stink. How is that working out for you?
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oh and Christopher Columbus is what we consider a troll that argues in bad faith. by the way
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@ Christopher Columbus
Either you’re choosing to be obtuse or you have reading comprehension issues. If you can’t see the problem with someone misrepresenting themselves (using ethnic or racial stereotypes no less) in any discussion then you are beyond reason. It’s really just as simple as that. The rest of your comment is also bs.
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@Gen
I would personally take all his posts as a joke. He literally is stupid. The guy still believes in Santa claus. I would call him retarded but that would be an insult to those individuals who actually are with reason.
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@Melanie
“A douchebag is a douchebag no matter who they pretend to be, online or in real life.”—Exactly. Most of them don’t truly realize that the color of their skin does not matter. It is there argument in itself.
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Why does black sock puppet remind me of
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ST7BT_aBzzE)
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Okay, now back to the topic at hand. Sorry about the momentary detour. I saw the sock puppet and was reminded of Roosevelt Franklin from Sesame Street. I got a little nostalgic. I never realized they used a form of “mock ebonics” in those segments, until I watched the video just now. SMH at Sesame Street for doing that, but I still like the message of the video.
On this blog, it’s fairly easy to spot the sock puppets. They argue just for the sake of argument…without contributing to the discussion. Their “arguments” are often ad hominem attacks or recitations from the Broken Record Department. Their comments don’t vary as the topics vary, but instead they tend to make the same statements (almost verbatim) over and over and over. Abagond’s # 4 is them to a T — it’s not about seriously considering the discussion, but about having the last word at any and all costs. They don’t want to facilitate discussion; they want to shut it down. It’s one thing to disagree, and something else entirely to disrupt. Trolls are about the latter.
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I just had a fit of giggles thinking about Roosevelt Franklin from Sesame Street. LOL!
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@Omnipresent:
it was a joke, based off of the post. i’m saying it’s really obvious some of these people are white when they say they’re black. it would be like me claiming i’m black when my profile picture is obviously of a white person. btw, i am white.
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No matter how much I think about it being a sock puppet doesn’t make sense. If I thought of something as an ant why would I bother to get all up in its world. It would be insignificant to me. Yet, time after time everywhere you go where there are sights that cater to a more ethnic audience there they are, especially if the audience is black. It is like the high school stalker who never gets the hint. Are they so socially inept in their own ethnic group that they have to go to another one to try to feel superior? Or do they think because they are of another ethnic group that somehow talking like an idiot to another group will be over looked. Like they stupidity which would be glaringly obvious with their ethnic peers is somehow hidden when they traverse to another ethnic group?
When you are a sock puppet or muppet you still sound just a dumb as you really are. Better to work on walking and chewing gum at the same time. At least that is a skill you can improve on and not look like a total goof if you can perfect it. Being a sock puppet keeps you in a state of loser-hood your entire time. You will never move ahead as a sock puppet no matter how much you pat yourself on the back. It is just about the same degree of conceit as thinking changing your hair color will make people over look your bad personality.
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@ Sharina
Are you saying that anyone who does not consistently agree with everything and everyone on this blog is a troll? You’re a good debator and you seem to enjoy (good faith) debating, so surely I’ve interpreted your comments incorrectly in this case.
For example, Randy consistently disagrees with the posts on this blog but he doesn’t come across as trollish in my opinion.
Personally, I read this blog to learn from it. Sometimes I don’t agree with part of a post or I don’t agree with/understand something a commenter says. These are usually the only times I make a comment.
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Reblogged this on oogenhand and commented:
Very good article on corcern trolling in general.
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@wordynerdygirl
No. You don’t have to agree with everything to avoid the troll title. For example if a person says I disagree with this post for xyz reasons then I don’t see them as some troll. They have honest reasons for their disagreement, but when you have a person who comes in and states things of the nature of I see a bunch of idiots in here and shows they really never read the post to begin with then those I see as trolls.
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@wordynerdygirl
My comment went into moderation. I may have been a bit harsh in my wording of trolls. Though I will say that no, you don’t have to agree with everyone and everything to not be considered a troll. Randy is one I don’t see as a troll or dave for that matter.
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Black sock puppets, I love it. They’re everywhere and usually stick out but they don’t realize it.
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[…] any black sock puppets? (I’m sure we’ve all seen them).- via […]
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It is like they are obsessed with us. I cant understand why they frequent non white blogs if they feel we are inferior. Off topic a bit…i watched fox news for the first time in years today and sure enough they were talking about blacks and welfare. Do they even read the stats???
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King of Trouble:
“When you are a sock puppet or Muppet you still sound just a dumb as you really are. Better to work on walking and chewing gum at the same time.”
Wait wait…is a Muppet, the same as a black sock puppet? i dunno man….I grew up on the Muppets.
when i was a 8 year old little boy, i watched, “The Great Muppet Caper” back in 1981, i was rooting for Kermit, Mrs piggy and the gang to get to the Mallory Gallery! You’re giving a Muppet a bad name, man! @ : o O ) >
So yeah, you’re going too far with comparing a Muppet to a black sock puppet by a white person. I won’t stand for such, blasphemy! @ > : o O ) >
You take that back!, damn you! @> : o O ) >
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Christopher Columbus
@deepdkchocolate
No most white people come to these boards and are in total awe of the ignorance displayed on blogs like these on others. It is only human nature to try to correct the ignorant.
No most white people r the harbingers of ignorance that we all are subjected to. Noone needs ur input, ur race comes with nothing intelligent or productive. We don’t need u in forums like this , yet, here u r. u have a sad need to be around black people u cannot even rationalize it in ur own mind.
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BTW, that picture abagond choose is so funny, when i first saw it, i chuckled.
Even the sock puppets hair is ethnic with what it seems to be, dreads? lol
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If a commenter on a blog starts off their comment with, “I am black…” I assume that they are white until proven innocent.
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Sorry Sondis, I have to many European friends.
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King of Trouble
“Sorry Sondis, I have to many European friends.”
lol cool bro ^_^
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Interesting post, thanks.
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I’ve seen Black sock puppets on other sites and find them annoying but fun to mess with… Anytime someone has to start a thread with “I’m Black myself” and then proceed to denigrate Black people it’s clear there’s an agenda.
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Abagond said:
“White racism is wrong no matter whose mouth it comes out of.”
At this point I’ve started to think a bit differenly about white racism. Now when I hear ‘white racism’ I tend to think of ‘white (inter)nationalism’ which implies the eventual genocide of all other peoples. On the surface, pure racism should not necessarily lead to the phenomenon we’ve witnessed on this planet. Racism in the form of fanatical cultural committment (our way is absolutely best) could easily lead to isolationism instead of runaway imperialism and genocide. So there is an aspect of white behavior that goes beyond mere belief in superiority.
I think we often miss a subtlety here. White superiority is, in their cultural mind, NOT a fact established from the dawn of time but a COMMITMENT. A fact is static description whereas a commitment is a dynamic prescription. If they viewed white supremacy as an originally established fact they might have been isolationist. However, since it is an ideological commitment they pursued a vigorous course of wanton imperialism to seek the power demanded by the cultural psyche. If you listen carefully you’ll notice that their bravado masks deep-seated fears of disappearance through miscegenation among other things.
So what does that mean for black people and others under siege? IMO, it means a re-evaluation of our emotional and logical response to white supremacy. When we understand it as an instrument, tool, or weapon in an unfolding process that leads to our total destruction rather than a mere description of current realities then we’ll oppose it intelligently. Sometimes an individual will be proving to whites that s/he is equal to them in some particular endeavor. Anyone who’s doing this will understand white supremacy as a commitment because they’ll be opposed every step of the way.
Furthermore, when we mistakenly understand white supremacy as fact we accept the parameters by which whites have defined their supremacy and, in striving to ‘become equal’, we are remade in their image. Whites usually begin the process by colonization, cultural destruction then re-education in white truth, which results in the victimized people surrendering their residual power. Really, if you are denied access to the power source of your ancestral culture, then judged on the basis of your performance as an ‘imitation white’ then you are destined for inferiority since the facsimile can never completely match the nature of the original (for better or worse).
We see this playing out in many different ways. The idea of what is beautiful comes to mind. White culture is committed to the concept that they are the most beautiful people. If they just considered their beauty a fact among themselves relatively little harm would be done. However, because the psyche seeks power they must make everyone see that they are the most beautiful. Therefore they must conclude that others are ugly. Furthermore, they must educate the others about the ‘objectively’ and ‘scientifically’ discovered fact that they are really ugly. When the victimized people become convinced of this they’ll expend endless effort conforming to white ideals of beauty. Mission accomplished. Power surrendered.
The above example also reveals another ploy: the presentation of white particularities as ‘normal’, ‘best’, or ‘universal’ by some ‘objective’ or ‘scientific’ measure. Whites will have us believe that they can separate themselves from their culture, dispassionately compare aspects of themselves with others and conclude in an ‘unbiased’ manner that their way is superior. This makes the objectively superior ‘white things’ become ‘human things’ which in turn makes the non-whites subhuman. Thereafter it is the white duty, indeed the white man’s burden, to impose their way on others whether the ‘others’ want it or not! This is the ideological thrust behind christian-izing, democrat-izing, colon-zing, capital-izing and all the assorted zings. Everything they do as a collective ultimately supports their commitment to white supremacy.
Anyway, sorry for the wall of text guys (and it isn’t even completely related to ths topic…lol). But I think it is so important that the victims decolonize their minds since everything begins there. IMO, one way to begin doing that is by removing the veil from the PsyOp. Have a great day (and boooo to sock-puppets 😉 ).
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That wink came out wrong. I’m not a sock puppet…lol
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Outstanding.
thank you for collecting and collating this pathology into a nice easy to read package.
One thing it demonstrates is how hard white people are willing to work to maintain the system of racism white supremacy; they are the most pre-emptive people in the known universe. Back in the days of “dial up”, this is how they always got busted. No matter how good their “costume” was, their behavior ALWAYS eventually betrayed them. What do I mean by that?
For example, a white person would show up with a name like “Jamal Hotep”, with an avatar of a pyramid, and proceed to write about “the great kings and queens of Africa” with spelling and conjugation errors throughout…
So far so good right?
This white person has everyone fooled right?
The problem (which they never solved) is a white person pretending to be a black person is not racism; they need to BEHAVE in a non constructive manner; and in order to do that, they “look” like a white person. We had white people spend 3 months! building their “black resume” before they tried to subvert the board. Does anybody remember the “cloaking device” from Star Trek?
If so, you remember that despite its ability to make Romulan vessels invisible, its weakness was the necessity to come out of cloak in order to fire their weapons; and this is the problem the black sock puppets never solved, and thats why they eventually gave up. As soon as the black people started focusing on peoples BEHAVIOR instead of their “appearance” the white people gave up because the work of practicing racism became too hard, even for them.
As we became more comfortable using this BEHAVIOR based identification method (in contrast to the “visual”) not only could we “see” who the white people were, but we could determine males from females, old from young…
In computer anti virus code this type of logic is often described as heuristics because it looks for patterns of BEHAVIOR, instead of names, sizes, components…
“what is is DOING?”
“What is it TRYING to do?”
BTW, this is also how blind guys can tell when a girl is attractive. They listen; they listen to the way people interact with her, their BEHAVIOR in the form of WORDS provides all the necessary information.
To sum up, no matter how good a white person is at pretending to be black, at some point, at some point, they are going to have to BEHAVE in a non constructive/DESTRUCTIVE manner IF they are going to practice racism. And they ALWAYS do because otherwise, what is the purpose of a white person trying to gain your confidence by pretending to be black?
Truth has no color.
No, strike that. The truth is black; thats why most people don’t want it.
(((SHAKIN MY HEAD)))
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Ok so I have been on youtube for sometime. My goal was to determine how many people regularly engage in the act of sock puppets. I found that it was very common, but even more common was the act of pretending to be a minority.
Most pretended to be black. Those probably new to it or a little slow use excessive mock ebonics to try to pass as blacks. I consider those low level and likely joking around, but amazingly the more skilled in the matter use a more coy approach. Some don’t even bother to be coy, but just announce they are black.
One thing they all have in common is that they have blank profiles and create the other profiles as a means to group bully or high five each other in their stupidity. Oddly enough once caught most seem to happily announce that they have many profiles. Though on occasion there are those who will continue to hide behind the charade.
I have become quite curious on the mental capacity of these individuals and what drives such high level of delusions. I have attributed some of it to insecurities, but that does not explain it all.
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Sharinalr
I have become quite curious on the mental capacity of these individuals and what drives such high level of delusions. I have attributed some of it to insecurities, but that does not explain it all.
———————————————————————————————-
Yes, Sharinalr, I noticed that too on youtube and I suspect it also occurs in the comments sections of newspapers and blogs; white people who pretend to be black so they can have the pathologies they claim to opposed expressed and by doing so, justify their racism.
But remember, although you see it on the internet, it isn’t just happening here?
Out of all the white people, those who practice racism are the smartest and hardest working; that is why we exist in a system of racism white supremacy; don’t hate the players, hate the game. Give the white supremacists credit for their hard work, dedication, diligence… They are truly on the job 24 hours a day.
We could learn a thing or two from them.
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thwack
I have no qualms with those who do it as I find it quite amusing the efforts and time they take into doing this. I think it makes them mad that I find the act funny.
At any rate I think some serious mental issues are still in order.
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We are talking about people who not only make several sock puppets, but take the time to switch from one to the other when engaged. People who are giving themselves thumb ups etc.
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As an example of the white supremacists dedication to their craft; I remember finding Dr. Welsings book “The Isis Papers” on Amazon. There were over 100 reviews there so I decided to read some. To my surprise most were negative even though they never DIRECTLY address The Cress Theory of Color Confrontation; then it dawned on me?
Most of the reviews were written by white people; now everything made sense.
I had incorrectly ASSumed most of the people buying, reading and especially REVIEWING her book were black people. But thats not how things work in a system of racism white supremacy. The white people who practice racism are constantly “monitoring” the thought speech and/or actions of nonwhite people to detect and hopefully DIVERT any counter racist thought, speech and/or actions by non white people.
They work hard. Their reviews were lengthy and diversionary; while the ones written in support by black people were rather short and obtuse. For example, a white person would write 400 words starting with ” In 1492, bla bla, bla, black people, bla bla bla, black people, bla bla bla, black people…”
* in order to try and take the focus off white people*
But then a black person would write: “It was a very good book I liked it.”
(And thats it; they don’t even mention the title)
(((shakin my head)))
To sum up, while you are out “partying”; the white people who PRACTICE racism are hard at work PRACTICING racism.
Then when THEY go out “partying” they are still hard at work PRACTICING racism. They have combined their work and play into a singular activity. They have made racism economical because they figured out a way to make their work (racism) fun and entertaining.
Thats why they never get tired of practicing it.
Non white people should figure out a way to incorporate the same dynamics in counter racist thought, speech and/or action.
Non white people can do this. I know because Im one of them.
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@ Thwack
You are pretty good at one liners type insults etc. I want to seriously ask your advice on how to handle a certain situation.
On youtube I have been engaged in a bit of a back and forth with two white guys. One guy is claiming to be black, but after close study of what he is saying I can tell he is not black.
At any rate both particularly made themselves look pretty darn dumb recently and they are high-fiving each other as if they accomplished some great thing. Stroking each others egos so to speak. How do you deal with those type situation? Do you ignore them? or perhaps hit with a harder insult? I tried logic but it goes right over these guys head. So advice please?
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and they are high-fiving each other as if they accomplished some great thing.
—————————————————————————————-
They both might be the same person?
I think the key is to ask yourself: “What am I trying to do?”
And list the questions:
1. Am I trying to get racists to agree with me?
2. Am I trying to get a racists to be silent?
3. Am I trying to get other people to attack the racists?
No matter what your answer is, focus on doing it 1000% no matter what it is; and doing better than anyone else on the planet.
In time such a program will “self correct” and automatically refine the answer to your question “what am I trying to do?”
As you keep doing this the question and answer form a feed back loop whose refinement process produces dense lethal direct hits the white supremacists cannot stand.
Once the white supremacists can no longer harm you with words, they only have three options left:
1. Shut up.
2. Make true statements.
3. Try to kill you.
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George Ryder
i never thought i’d see Sharina asking thwack for advice. i can’t wait to see his response.
————————————————————————————————-
*see how the white people are “on the job?”
They never sleep; they are like vampires.
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@George
I never thought you would have something constructive to say and I am still right.
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@Thwack
While there seems to be things I don’t agree with you on, I have to admit you were on point on this thread.
Thanks for the advice.
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@George
I am not always right, but I will take the patronizing comment of yours.
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@Sharina:
You can do two things; ignore them or mock them. Whatever you do don’t engage them seriously. In reality, they want you to validate their sense of superiority by ‘debating’ them. They will disdain you regardless of your erudition or knowledge. Thwack’s right, they practice white supremacy 24-7. This is one of the ploys they use. They will try to elicit responses from you to effect your silence, show how ‘dumb’ you are, or to babble like a brook whilst actually saying nothing.. It p#sses them off to no end when you mock or ignore them. They will either get progressively angrier(especially to those that seriously engage them and do so intelligently), or, they will ignore you. Preferably they will ignore you. However, that doesn’t preclude you from making snide remarks or deriding them. I find it entertaining personally.
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Those racist trolls love to see chaos upon us. Unity and Joy scare them. They hover around topix,youtube and many sites of blackness. One woman told us a story in google hangout. She went to a Blacklove type dating site. She discovered the man(she really enjoy talking to him on the phone and site) catfish her. He was a divorce man with four children. She remember him. He approach her with his real picture with his original profile. He made a new account to get close to her. Google image help out,too.
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“They never sleep; they are like vampires.”
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
And, like roaches, you can’t eradicate them (they’ll never stay away)!
They just keep coming back — to distract, divert, divide, dilute and deny!
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And when something really tragic happens in the black community especially if it is racially motivated they do come out like roaches. Examples the Trayvon Martin tragedy or the past summers crisis in Ferguson Missouri. The racist trolls are like salivating dogs they troll all the black blog sites.
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Sometimes I wonder if some commenters on Abagond think I’m someone else other than Asian or a Filipina. I mean, do I come across differently online? While I have displayed my face on my gravatar throughout the years, do I seem “authentic” in a sense I’m actually the person I say I am?
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^You’ve never come across as fake in any way to me.
The people who lie about there race always, always, always give something away at some point. It’s hard to fake being of a race or certain culture. It’s super hard when you’re at the same time trying to demonize that same culture one is pretending to be a part of. I think it just becomes too difficult to imitate the psychology of such a thing, most things about life have to be lived.
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*their race
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most things about life have to be lived.
Which, I guess, is why we call it living. 🙂
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I’m sorry Sharina, looks like you can’t get rid of me. 🙂
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@Leigh
It is hard to fake for long. That is why that commenter “Brad” was so obvious. Many Black sock puppets have come here. Any “Asian” ones?
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I never understood these black sock puppet people. It takes too much time and effort. Get a life, will ya?
@ Jefe:
I don’t recall “Asian” ones on here with the exception of this Bran fellow on “The future of racial stratification in the US” thread. I still don’t believe he’s Chinese as he claims.
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Sorry, I meant Bran, not Brad.
There was a ton of stuff which betrayed his white male background. Since you know he is a sock puppet, his credibility gets totally shot.
Does anyone recall any black or Asian sock puppet that was actually able to fool the audience (even for an extended period)?
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@ jefe:
Brad or Bran. It’s the same thing, I think. No self-respecting Asian would use that as a moniker. It sounds too…Idk…white!
A white person, heck, any person who goes to that length to try and impersonate somebody else for the purpose of causing drama loses integrity.
That’s a good question. I admit I haven’t kept up-to-date on reading comments on Abagond’s blog. Anyone know?
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Legion
I am glad I haven’t. 🙂
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@Herneith
Poking fun at them was how it began until one started whining about me not debating them. So I did and low and behold he started simple name calling and high-fiving. So I went back to the poking fun. I guess theyou are a little embarrassed because the anger/failed reading comprehension stage kicked in and they started to stalk my profile looking for dirt and quoting things they said (most of which made them look stupid) and claiming I said it. *shrug*
I guess today I will tell them I am bored with them.
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@Leigh
I agree with legion. You have never come off as fake to me. The thing with black/minority sock puppets is they can only hide who they are for so long. That is why getting them to talk as much or as long as possible leaves them vulnerable to exposure.
For example this recent situation threw me off because the guy defended his position against a white guy who called blacks “spooks”, but he said nothing to the white guy who was saying the n-word, or the s-word. Despite the guy claiming to be married to an afro-latina. He went so far as to co-sign everything he said. Though following what he said it was clear he was not black at all. The argument with the other white guy was more likely a means to solidify to on lookers he was black. They try very hard and I am still in shock people take such time and attention to detail to do that.
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I have ran into a few Asian sock puppets, though not on this blog. They can’t hold it very long though. I think 1 or 2 comments and they come out of character. Same experience with the Hispanic sock puppets.
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@Kiwi
Don’t feel too bad because black Nihilist fooled me too.
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@Biff
Read the comment policy section and then you will know why.
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As to everyone else in the room, I greatly apologize for my use of language as it was greatly unnecessary.
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Oh and abagond you are free to leave or delete any of my comments with the b*tch word that may be considered too insulting. I am ok with that.
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“Use of Mock Ebonics. This is pretty much a dead giveaway. Most Black Americans use Standard English in a public, written medium like a blog. Meanwhile, few whites can use Ebonics properly.”
At least these recent comments were related to the topic in a way…
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I deleted 30-some comments between Sharina and George where they trade insults and call each other names.
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@Leigh,
Trying to imagine how a white person could use a black or Asian sock puppet and keep it up for a long time. Maybe a white person adopted into and raised by a black or Asian family?
But seeing how much effort they go into creating such a character and how it still doesn’t work convinces me that it is very difficult to know what it is like to stand in someone else’s shoes.
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George Ryder
You can’t pretend to be the same race for several years and get caught plagerizing. I think it is just you desperately trying to slam her and assume what type of relationship her and I had. You pretend to be pro-black everyday and you got caught sometime ago. Doesn’t mean anyone believes you when you start your pro-black bs.
Again talking without knowing…..she never pretended to know polish.
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anything she said to give me hell means nothing
That’s the problem that comes with being discredited in a major way: one is totally or mostly disregarded, as a matter of course.
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I don’t know you, but I know what you say, do, and display on this blog.
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Good bye.
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*looks at George’s comment and scrolls past*
@Thwack
You mentioned we can learn from white people in regards to this. Do you mean putting time and energy into creating sock puppets or something on a more deeper level?
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“You mentioned we can learn from white people in regards to this.”
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Sharina,
We have/had some CLASSIC case studies living HERE among us… Randy, Biff, Churchschicken, George, Laura and assorted drive-byes, Some are pure distractions, like GR. As Herneith says, I tend to ignore or MOCK him.
White people practice their RELIGION (racism/white supremacy) 24/7/365.. so should we too as we practice counter racism… by always telling the truth!
However, you’re never going to convince or convert a hard, stone-cold racist to stop being such with truth, facts, or argument. If that were possible there would be no more racism!
The way I see it, you fight for truth and justice because it’s worth fighting for. You’re fighting for the minds of those yet unborn. Yet, it’s an uphill spiritual/psychological battle that is largely won, or lost within oneself.
This (my) explanation about fighting racism might seem senseless as I read it over. Perhaps Origin or Thwack can put better words to what I’m trying to convey.
Finally, as far as black sock puppets goes, remember this:
White people have always been the MASTERS of TRICKERY and LIES!
So watch out and act (guard yourself) accordingly.
Use your talents constructively… try not to let the idiots and dumb azzes waste your time or energy.
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George, stay away from the liquor and spliffs, please!
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@Herneith
LOL 😛
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sharinalr
@Thwack
You mentioned we can learn from white people in regards to this. Do you mean putting time and energy into creating sock puppets or something on a more deeper level?
———————————————————————————————-
Something deeper.
Starting with language and ending with your work and play being indistinguishable from one another. You know how white people sometimes say or do something racist and don’t even realize it?
Your counter racism should present in a similar manner; you shouldn’t even have to think about practicing it.
I know a woman who has done this with her health; diet and exercise wise.
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Not bad for a negro guy, eh?
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Common courtesy should be extended to anyone who hasn’t clearly shown they don’t merit it. Real respect needs to be earned. Abagond has my respect for his sense of fairness. He makes reasonable rules for his blog and tries to enforce them fairly.
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Real respect needs to be earned.
Especially if you are a negro guy.
He makes reasonable rules for his blog and tries to enforce them fairly.
Like I said, not bad for a negro guy eh?
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@ Biff
The comment policy thread is not all of it:
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@Legion
Do you mind me asking something? I was hesitant on doing it for a while, but if you say yes I will put it in comment policy. I saw you were upset from the situation so that is the reason why I did not want to ask you anything on it.
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Thanks, Legion. Highly entertaining.
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I don’t really understand sockpuppetting, but I have noticed that there have been several self0-described Black commentators whose posts are rife with anti-Black rhetoric.
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@ Sharina
dang! If I say yes before seeing the question I might end up regretting my willingness to go along, huh? 🙂 Alas…
Do you mind me asking something?
Ok, go ahead.
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@ Biff
Thanks, Legion. Highly entertaining.
You know what they say: “All the world’s a stage…” 😉
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@Legion
Question left in comment policy.
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@Just me
Thanks for the detailed response.
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Sharina, half the answer is there and half is in moderation (i broke the comment up) Hopefully my answer makes sense in a while, if the other part comes out of moderation.
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Kiwi:
Saying a dramatic conversation was “entertaining” (earlier I had said it was “deep”, so I wanted to try a different adjective) vs. calling a whole webpage a “minstrel show” is pretty different. You’re desperate to try to score points against me every time I make any comment. That desperation is apparent to anyone reading the comments.
Even though I let you get in the last word most of the time (because I don’t have time to respond to you endlessly), it’s you other commenters feel sorry for and worried about. You’re in college, man. Get out and do some activities. Enjoy the nice Cali weather.
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Kiwi said, “…….it’s not a stretch of imagination to see that the reason you’re here is also to stalk, sneer, and spit at a race you hold contempt for, as you clearly left the US because of them.”
This is complete bs and unsubstantiated slander. You might say I was thinking about dating attractive, slightly less domineering, Asian ladies when I decided to come to Asia. That was a factor. However, I can assure you that black people were not in the calculation at all. If they were, why would my best non-Asian friend here be black (as I have previously noted)? It doesn’t make any sense.
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Kiwi:
Ah, by that measure, all your black friends at your UC are “tokens”. I can say that I worked at a McDonalds around Detroit for a while, where I was the only non-black person and I got a crash course in ebonics. I got along with my boss and everyone else pretty well, and I took care of myself walking to work on the night-shift and hopping fences. I doubt you even have any comparable life experience, as you’ve never left beautiful CA and probably haven’t spent much time in Compton. You are a hypocrite who will choose to live in a mostly White/Asian area given the choice, just like everyone with a choice. Even, upwardly mobile blacks generally don’t want to live in all black areas.
“…Or we can go to the slums
Where killers get hung
Shorty I could take you there…
Baby girl I know it’s rough but come with me
We can take a trip to the hood
It’s no problem girl it’s my city
I could take you there
Little kid with guns only 15
Roam in the streets up to no good
When gun shots just watch us, run quickly
I could show you where
As long you’re with me
Baby you’ll be alright
I’m known in the ghetto
Girl just stay by my side
Or we can leave the slums go to paradise
Baby it’s up to you
It’s whatever you like”.
Tough call.
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Actually, I personally have lived in white, black, Hispanic and Asian neighborhoods in the USA, and witnessed their transformations as well.
You really should try living in the East Coast.
Queens, NY, has a broad mix of whites, blacks, Hispanics and Asians. Although blacks are somewhat more segregated than the rest there, it still ranks as the most racially, ethnically, religiously, and linguistically diverse county in the USA.
If you like some place more suburban, but very mixed, a place like College Park or Silver Spring MD, or Alexandria, VA, all near Washington, DC might be good. You are certain to encounter a mix of blacks (including middle class slave descendant, West Indian and African immigrants), whites (including some Jews and “southern” whites), and a very diverse Hispanic (Caribbean, Mexican, and Central American origin) and Asian population (mix of brain drain, economic migrant, old school,muslim and refugees all living near each other).
DC and NYC metro areas as a whole are less than 50% non-Hispanic white. Maryland will be the next minority-majority state, maybe by the next Census.
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I have stayed in them for periods at a time (eg, Chinatown, Flushing, Jersey city, etc.). Where I lived in Queens, my neighborhood was about 1/3 Asian (not majority) just before I left. When I go back to the USA, and stay with friends or relatives, some of them live in majority Asian neighborhoods.
I did not grow up in neighborhoods that had many Asians.
But of course, for the past 20 years, I have been living in neighborhoods that are 98-99% Asian.
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Kiwi said: “I have an Asian friend who lived in white, black, Hispanic, and Asian neighborhoods – basically tasting the rainbow”
lol. You got me beat in terms of personal experience right there.
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I spent 4 yrs in LA, it dont get much more mixed than that, but i was mostly in mexican neighborhoods, , grew up in and came back to get married in central jersey, which is very mixed since the 90s, reading pa which is pretty much black, white, and boricua, and now philly which is , well, a black town
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@ Biff
Ahh, okay. Appreciated, I see your full viewpoint now.
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Sad.
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The sock puppet kind of resembles Whoopi Goldberg, though better looking.
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@Yogibreeze
Thanks for outing yourself, now I know you are not Black.
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I think it should be added that black sock puppets will recite what they consider typical black experiences. Yet they display no real connection to it other than a superficial one.
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