Juror B37 was one of the six jurors in the George Zimmerman murder trial. She was one of the white women who was a mother. She gave an interview to CNN. We also have what she said during jury selection.
After the interview four jurors said she speaks only for herself.
She had a book deal, but that fell through after Twitter went nuts over her profiting from another’s death.
Background: B37 has lived for 18 years in Seminole County, the Florida county where the murder took place. She is married to a lawyer in the space industry. She has two daughters but talks more about her animals: three dogs, four cats, a ferret, a couple lizards, a parrot and a crow with a broken wing. Her great passion is saving birds.
She gets all her news from the “Today” show, a morning television news show. She does not trust Internet news. Newspapers are for lining her parrot’s cage.
She knew little about the case. She thought there were riots. She called Trayvon Martin a “boy of colour“.
She said:
You never get all the information. How do you form an opinion if you don’t have all the information?
During the trial, she:
- Thought one of George Zimmerman’s friends was the medical examiner!
- Thought it was a Stand Your Ground case!
- Used testimony the judge told her to disregard.
- Was extremely confused by the laws she had to apply.
She believed the police: The testimony she was supposed to disregard was when Chris Serino, the lead detective, said he pretty much believed Zimmerman. She said as a policeman Serino has “a knack to pick out who’s lying and who’s not lying.” So she believed Zimmerman too.
She did not believe Rachel Jeantel, who heard the beginning of the fight, whose testimony is the closest thing we have to Martin’s side of the story. She did however believe Jeantel when she said Martin called Zimmerman a “creepy-ass cracker”. B37:
I don’t think it’s really racial. I think it’s just everyday life, the type of life that they live, and how they’re living, in the environment that they’re living in.
B37 believed:
- Zimmerman was not a wannabe cop, just “overeager to help people”.
- Zimmerman’s heart was in the right place, but he did not use good judgement and got in over his head.
- Zimmerman is Spanish or Puerto Rican.
- Zimmerman did not racially profile Martin.
- Martin started the fight
- Both Martin and Zimmerman could have walked away, therefore:
- Martin caused his death.
- Zimmerman was the one screaming for his life on the 911 tape, therefore:
- Zimmerman feared for his life when he shot the gun.
Therefore Zimmerman acted in self-defence, making him not guilty.
After coming to a verdict she says the jurors cried: they felt something terrible had been done when Zimmerman killed Martin but the law left them no way to make it right.
She felt just as sorry for Zimmerman (alive, wins murder trial) as Martin (dead at 17).
See also:
- CNN interview
- Zimmerman Murder Trial, Day 6
- George Zimmerman is found not guilty
- What did race have to do with the George Zimmerman case? – written before her CNN interview
- The Five Rules of Racial Standing – that thing where whites believe other whites but only believe blacks when they badmouth other blacks.
- racial profiling
The ignorance, on so many levels, way too much to tackle here, but I would note that what sounded out to me the loudest was how she devalued Trayvon Martin’s life. That’s another way in which race factored into this matter. If Trayvon losing his life is not a significant matter, then Zimmerman’s culpabilty is somehow lower.
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I wasn’t especially surprised by the verdict but the interview with this woman has left me in despair for our judicial system and the growing racial divide in this country. She all but came out and said “I’m glad George killed that little n*****.” Beyond the attitude, it’s scary that she had no idea what she was saying. Not about race? No, ma’am, it’s all about race, and the more you deny it, the worse it gets.
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Yeah, if you hear her answering questions during Voir Dire, you really get a sense that she’s not the sharpest tool in the shed. She really sounds crazy talking about playing board games, feeding her lizard, and ignoring the news on every level
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3.Zimmerman is Spanish or Puerto Rican. & 4.Zimmerman did not racially profile Martin.
She probably thought somewhere in her head that this is NOT racial as both people involved are PoC so to her mind, how could it be?
6.Both Martin and Zimmerman could have walked away, therefore:
7.Martin caused his death.
I would be interested to know what percentage of teens would understand the legalities involved in a situation like this to the extent where they would make that informed decision at that time. The only time this would really hit home is if the police apprehended you, the thought behind this being they are the law!
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Wow, just wow. This juror is a great example of white privilege. Not surprising why she was picked to be in this trial. So glad the book fell through. B37 has blood on her hands along with the other 5 jurors. I truly believe in the adage “what comes around goes around” sowing and reaping. They will all pay various consequences for their actions.
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“You never get all the information. How do you form an opinion if you don’t get all the information? ”
I think I know what to say the next time I’m trying to get thrown off jury duty. Honestly. So this woman has basically spent her whole life never forming an opinion about anything?! I don’t buy it. She had to have formed an opinion about her husband in order to decide whether or not to marry him. What about the house where she is living? People form opinions all the time for just the mundane decisions of life without “all the information. ” She should have been kicked off the jury just based off that statement alone. If one truly believes that, then one wouldn’t be able to decide on a verdict for either the prosecutor or the defense. And the Today show is your main source of information about the world?! Really? I’m not the world’s most intellectual woman, but I do know you should try to get information from more than one source. You watch the Today Show for news about popular culture. No wonder the other jurors made a rush to distance to separate themselves from this dolt. She makes Homer Simpson look like a member of Mensa.
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For the prosecution.
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See kids. A mind really IS a terrible thing to waste!
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She made a huge mistake to go on the air. It did not make her look good. I wonder how much she got paid to go on CNN and lose her book deal.
Too bad she doesn’t pay attention the internet. She could have gauged public opinion a bit better. And she should now realize that tt is powerful enough to kill her book deal.
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To distance themselves from this dolt.
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lifelearner says…
>Wow, just wow. This juror is a great example of white privilege.<
No, it is a great example of white *people*.
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From what I have been told or read, Zimmerman’s father is a retired Judge. Juror 37 husband is a Lawyer here in the same community, which they have lived in the community 18 plus years. In my mind something is starting to become clear on what really happened or how the verdict happened.
Folks, Next will be Zimmerman taken over and having this book wrote and he will profit from the murder he committed! Why not, Zimmerman is now suing the parents of Trayvon.
RIP Trayvon
May Trayvon mother and father find some type of peace.
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IMO this juror is the PERSONIFICATION of the White Racial Frame/White Gaze/Looking Thru White Lens … 5 rules of racial standing — AMPLIFIED!
In other words, boys and girls, she’s just another typical white person looking at the world, life (and black people) through typical white eyes.. She not only represents herself, but millions upon millions of TYPICAL whites in Amerikkka.
Why is anyone surprised regarding her views, or the outcome of this theatrical performance called a trial????
Boys and girls, can you say P_R_I_V_I_L_E_G_E ?
{fade in chorus singing: “It’s a beautiful day in the neighborhood ….”}
signed,
MR. ROGERS
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She also believed George Zimmerman exaggerated and fabricated his story.
Why would he lie? Because even he knew he had no reason to reasonably fear for his life.
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@Abagond…I reached exactly the same conclusions about this opportunist, dim bulb and had to include it in my post as well!
@Mochasister…“No wonder the other jurors made a rush to distance to separate themselves from this dolt. She makes Homer Simpson look like a member of Mensa.”
I know that’s right! They made sure, with the quickness, that the public knew she wasn’t speaking for them — and rightfully so!
@Jefe…“She made a huge mistake to go on the air.”
You ain’t never lied! She needs to be charged — with some-damned-thing!
@Matari…“IMO this juror is the PERSONIFICATION of the White Racial Frame/White Gaze/Looking Thru White Lens … 5 rules of racial standing — AMPLIFIED!”
Yes, indeed!
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It’s not that we went “nuts” over her innate greed and desire to capitalize off of this child’s death, she didn’t have the courage to indict Zimmerman and she certainly doesn’t have the right to attempt to line her pockets with Trayvon’s blood money. She’s a despicable human-being and she showed no moral character or compassion.
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@Mochasister:
No wonder the other jurors made a rush to distance to separate themselves from this dolt. She makes Homer Simpson look like a member of Mensa.”
Meanwhile, they all came to the same conclusion didn’t they? At the end of the day, they weren’t distancing themselves so much from her as they were the fullest exposition of their own frame of mind.
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@GoldFire…You’ve got a point there.
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Yep, Juror B37 said three of them took an opposing view. Then they changed their mind to agree on the verdict. They can’t get away from distancing themselves too much after the fact.
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i´m disgusted, really disgusted. Is this America? black people should never forget this…the message is very clear.
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This is exactly how they will find this bitch and her family through the animal rescue organizations someone will roll on this thing not only for the decision she made but for money.
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I doubt the other jurors were much better. You would have to be pretty clueless not to know much about this case and therefore qualify for the jury.
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At this point, I think the trial was all one big game, one big show. As bad or worse than trials for such in the 1800s. The state, the judge, the lawyers (on both sides), the jurors, etc, were all putting on a show. They knew the outcome before it all started.
It really makes me sick seeing and hearing so many people so vehemently deny the realities of racism in our nation. We’re a very sick nation living in vast ignorance and inaccurate information.
Here’s one really good article about the case from a noted historian: http://www.counterpunch.org/2013/07/15/the-us-v-trayvon-martin/
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Yes they knew the outcome before, that is why they made psa’s directed toward us and had all them cops ready. They were hoping we would riot. They thought we would riot heavily, thus the police gets some money. The news hyped it up and we had that not guilty verdict, it was set up from the beginning.
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and what the he// is AL Sharpton talking about Trayvon day. My God these black leaders are bumbling imbeciles aren’t they. Trayvon day, for Christ’s sake? Rather than harnessing, directing and then using the frustration of people into the political will to demand real changes on the ground. WOW!! I don’t know whether to laugh or cry. I’m sick.
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Somebody talk me down.
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6.Both Martin and Zimmerman could have walked away, therefore:
7.Martin caused his death.
– – –
Well, as GZ could have walked away but did not and ended up killing Trayvon Martin because of this, George Zimmerman is responsible for causing Trayvon Martin death.
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Also anybody else notice her voice went up when Anderson asked if she thought the c word was racial and she said I don’t think it was racial. She said she didn’t find Rachel credible but she found her credible enough to believe trayvon said the c word. And notice when anderson asked her if she found it hard to understand Rachel and she said yes notice she said because a lot of the times she was using… and she paused I know she wanted to say ebonics but used code words and said she was using phrases I didn’t know.
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I agree with what has already been said about the 5 other jurors, that claimed to not have the same views as juror B37. It was nothing more than to protect their image, they have the same views as she does.
The other 5 jurors, just weren’t dumb enough to get on national TV and say what they were thinking, out loud.
Matari and other commentators said it best:
Juror B37 and the other 5 jurors, look at the world and black people, through a white lens and can’t see things, any other way. They drown in their white privilege, ignorant to everyone and everything else in the world.
For white people in America, it really is always, A BEAUTIFUL MORNING!
(http://youtu.be/eyooCErXdMI) : o l ) >
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Goldfire
The so called black leaders sold out. The ones that aren’t in the spotlight are the ones really beneficial to us. The black churches sold out too, we don’t need them we need ourselves and each other. Just look what that woman did with her twitter and having a hand in not allowing this womans book to be published. we are the ones with the real power the leaders have some of that only because we give them our ears. al should know trayvon day will not happen. common sense if there is no emit till day or Malcolm x day why would they care for a day that a black teen they though deserved to die have a day? it makes no sense which is how a lot of them are, make no sense and go after the wrong things.
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@pegodaaj…Thanks for that EXCELLENT link!
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pegodaaj:
Good read in that link, you posted. ^_^
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mstoogood4yall,
and that’s why we are the laughing stock of the country and the world. I don’t know if their ignorance is feigned or real, bought or owned but it’s really pathetic that this political capital, in the black community if no where else, should be wasted so willfully. WOW, imagine what the world thinks and has thought of Black American priorities with such deft-less leaders as these; and by the World I mean the darker regions of the world as well.
All I know is that black leadership is woefully lacking these days. Al Sharpton and his H I V positive lookin @ss isn’t cutting it anymore. We need some young blood, and Ben Jealous isn’t him. The black community needs people with ideas on not only how create change but how to garner the capital to effectively make those changes come to fruition. Enough with the finger wagging and memorializing tactics already…DO SOMETHING, pass the baton in to more able hands or step the phuck aside so the crème can rise to the top.
Anybody?
,
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Thanks, I think it was premeditated murder. He planned the whole event IE: law student (gets A’s), look at a couple of other SYG cases. I’ve never herd anybody say the 50 calls to 911 were to research response times. (Who calls 911 about a garage door open) Think he saw Trayvon on the street walking outside the complex(on his way to target)(really to find a target) and pulled back in, and other factors had to be right IE: raining (wash away evidence) raining (people would stay inside), darkness, teen that really couldn’t hurt him ( taking mma) I could take a punch to kill somebody, provoked or assaulted To get him to hit him (he let Trayvon hit him) GZ is a murderer and it’s in his eyes not at the trial with that puppy dog look on his face. In the hearing about the IT guy that got fired He looks over at the people testifying and look at how he looks at those people. There is murder in those eyes!
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@Deb @sondis et al Glad you liked it. Here’s one more “If Only Trayvon Had Freedom Papers”
http://hnn.us/articles/if-only-trayvon-had-freedom-papers#.UeaRBMS2m2E.facebook
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One more really good one 🙂
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@Goldfire,
I really think that what makes the USA the biggest laughing stock in the world is its attitudes towards guns as a “God given right”. The rest of the world does not understand the USA’s love affair and worship of guns. And after each incident like this, more and more people want guns.
Anyhow,
Al Sharpton is from a prior generation that grew up in the late 50s to early 70s. He did not grow up eating the colour-blind cotton candy fed to kids in the 80s and 90s..
As I suggested in a separate post, the current generation born post 80s is very silent and non-challenging. I guess white America has spooked them by threatening to throw them in jail (and in jail they will throw). But why is there not 100 million doing non-violent protest in the streets now after Trayvon Martin. Why has America, esp. black America, become so complacent? Are we waiting for another MLK, Jr. or even Malcolm X to emerge?
Or is it because we have the internet now? People would rather vent anonymously.
Just realized that we to have a posts on the Bernhard Goetz, Howard Beach, Bensonhurst and Crown Heights incidents from the 1980s and early 1990s. I remember all of those. Abagond — time to step up.
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I wish I saw this juror face to face so that I could give them a piece of my mind. Zimmerman’s fat ass should be in jail yet they let him roam free. What type of judicial system do we have? What type of country do we live in?
I wonder but I have summed it up. We live in a country where White life matters more than Black life. We live in a country that reinforces the belief that White is supreme race. We live in a country that believes that White women are prettier than Black women. We live in a country that has citizens cheering over a senseless death of a young boy. Most of all, we live in a country where some fat ass mestizo half Jewish half Peruvian can shoot a young Black boy and get away with it.
And anyone who doesn’t see anything wrong with this fat ass mestizo half Jew half Peruvian man shooting a Black boy, then you are insensitive!
And the jurors who ruled the verdict are just as insensitive as the people who sided with Zimmerman.
I swear karma is going to come back and haunt White America, whether they like it or not. They have been getting away with too much for too long.
And the Black Community: please learn to stick together and unite. And stay united. Honestly as a Black woman, I usually never feel like I can relate to my own people in this country. I don’t know maybe because my family and ancestry is Afro Caribbean or because I am not like them. But this trial really made me feel united with my people in a way. And that is a good thing.
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@ GoldFire
Yes al and the so called leaders are messing up stuff and not speaking on our more important issues. Yes we do need young competent ppl, but sadly alot of ppl in my generation have been subdued and whitewashed. And to have a huge responsibility like that to be passed down one has to earn it and prove they are worth it and want it,not just fresh blood. And also we as a people need to start within ourselves before we can tell other ppl in our community what to do. And its also good to try ideas and strategies on family members first that way u can see how it would work on a larger scale. If u can’t convince yourself or your own family to change some things, then there is no way u can convince or change the minds of a lot of people in the community. i do like umar johnson, but we will probably not see the black leaders invite him in, as they like alot of us have a crabs in a barrel mentality and see each other as competition instead of allies.
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Preach!
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@ adeen
“And the Black Community: please learn to stick together and unite. And stay united. Honestly as a Black woman, I usually never feel like I can relate to my own people in this country. I don’t know maybe because my family and ancestry is Afro Caribbean or because I am not like them. But this trial really made me feel united with my people in a way. And that is a good thing.”
Yes adeen we must unite, but to do that we must be willing to sacrifice. It seems we come together or tragedies like this then drift apart again. We owe it to each other the kids and the future generations to not let this or the upcoming cases such as Jordan davis and the current one of Darius simmons murders be in vain. We must avoid websites and shows that are damaging, and especially black entertainment and gossip sites. Most of the people on there will be saying justice for trayvon and we need to come together, then the next day the sold out website posts an article about who is dating who and that has more views than the important ones and ppl back on there attacking each other. Perfect example, I went to bossip to see the comments and the commenters were like lets get together and unite. THen literally a couple of days the website put up a post about halle berry and her white man . The sad thing is ppl took the bait and it had a lot more comments than the important articles. I know those same ppl saying unite and get justice were the same hypocrites on there attacking each other over some dumb ish.
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@pegodaaj…Thanks for that too! It’s a great analogy for what happened to young Mr. Martin and dead-on too! I’m from the Deep South and we all knew about the “paddy-rollers.”
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This was the trial that was never meant to be. They held the trial only because of protests. But then the prosecution pretty much rolled over and died and let the defence win – except for the last 47 minutes when it was too little, too late.
Angela Corey is the one who charged Zimmerman with second-degree murder. She is the one who led the prosecution, though she did not show her face in court. And SHE SMILED after the prosecution lost. She WANTED Zimmerman to get off.
The trial was just for show, a sop, something to add a patina of legitimacy to injustice as usual.
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@ pegodaaj
Great piece by Robin D.G. Kelley. Thank you.
Some of the best bits:
More:
http://www.counterpunch.org/2013/07/15/the-us-v-trayvon-martin/
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abagond:
should black people, begin an exodus out of America?
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This woman was the kind of juror that the so-called “trial” needed. She was sheltered and ignorant. The perfect juror.
Was I the only one who felt sick when she started crying during the interview? White woman tears strikes again.
In the end the trial was just for show. The court wanted Zimmerman to get off. They never considered this case as anything more than an annoyance because of the protests.
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@sondis, the only people who need to “leave” are all the people who refuse to recognize racism, sexism, classism, etc, and refuse to work toward true change
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Hey everyone, great post. Not much back and forth – almost no dissenting opinions, but I respect the fact that this issue is still too fresh, too hurtfull to argue about. I just want to bring up the fact that Zimmerman couldn’t walk away, he had a 17 year old man-child on his chest, beating his face.
The verdict doesn’t say to me that it’s “OK to kill black kids”, it says that assault and battery is still illegal, and that we all have the right to self-defense. I think many other people feel the same way.
I know alot of posters here want white’s to understand the black view point, to see the world through black eyes for a change. I don’t think you’ll be able to shame or brow-beat them into doing that. If you’re able to make your point coherently, you can convert some to your way of thinking, but if you simply appeal to emotion you won’t reach many.
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sondis
abagond:
should black people, begin an exodus out of America?
Yes please…
No black people in America- no more racism.
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@ Jefe,
Oh, I’m sorry, I’m not buying into the problem is not enough gun control meme that the left keeps on dusting off and touting. Yeah, I don’t personally think black people who’ve been historically, presently, and judging by the events in the Trayvon case, will continually be subject to atavistic violence, often gun related, from their lighter hued brethren have any business whatsoever aligning themselves with the left regarding the gun control issue. At the end of day, it’s the “economy stupid”, as illustrated aptly by Switzerland wherein citizens are required to keep personal weapons per their government while enjoying their stable economy.
Moving on:
He may not have grown up in it but he and his contemporaries were sure enough firmly and comfortably ensconced in it so as to have had to watch even the gains they made in their era slip away under their very noses, sadly. Meanwhile, they can simultaneously boast about having presided over an era wherein large swaths of black Americans as a group are in worse economic. social, and political shape than they’ve ever been since the Civil Rights Act was signed sealed and delivered. Al Sharpton and his ilk have been doing nothing but living off the fumes of the glory days and little else..
Yes, I appreciate that there needs to have counter balancing voices against the majority opinion when outrageous injustices happen as they did in the Trayvon case, however if J-Z can chew gum and talk at the same time, as he stated in his latest interview, why can’t Civil Rights leaders do the same. Even the blind can see that more practical effort needs to be focused on addressing issues that directly effect economic mobility and self sufficiency in the black community.
I’m not sure if I agree with your assessment about black people born after 1980 not willing to stand up to the system because of fear of ending up in jail. Theoretically, barring advocating violence there shouldn’t be a problem. My personal opinion is that things simply haven’t gotten bad enough so that black people like Al Sharpton who are enjoying a relatively comfortable lifestyle, as are those in his economic bracket and above, and who’re often times more educated, have no interest in equally shouldering the burdens of the black community to which they belong for the reasons politicians and governments worry more about the middleclass instead of the poor; the middle class never identifies with the poor until they feel the fiscal squeeze themselves, at which point they stop identifying with the elite and stop buffering them against the poor. As soon as the racial economics gets bad enough, trust me, the black bourgeois will run head long into the arms of the black proletariat, out of which perhaps some new leadership will arise. I think some are already coming up. Perhaps abagond can do a post on up and coming black leaders if he has the time, and we can all contribute.
Sidenote: You do realize the U.S has just over 300 million people right? That’s man woman and child. There isn’t one city with that amount of people in the U.S , and if the census is to be believed, there aren’t that many African Americans in the U,S. in total..
Other’s might have more to share…
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@Brothawolf…“Was I the only one who felt sick when she started crying during the interview? White woman tears strikes again.”
Nah, Brothawolf, I was right there with you. Ran perfectly parallel to that “frail white womanhood in need of protecting” meme too.
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It was unbelievable. Everytime I heard her voice, I wanted to throw something.
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@ kingswood,
I love this guy.
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by the by, dearest @kingswood (lol), I’ll have you know that African Americans have been in this country since the early 1500s; Surprised? Yeah, that’s right; that means black Americans have here longer then most European Americans. SO……..How about you take your Johnny come lately @ss and start and exodus back home instead.
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by the by dearest @kingswood (lol),
I’ll have you know that African Americans have been in this country since the early 1500s; Surprised? Yeah, that’s right; that means black Americans have been here longer then most European Americans. SO……..How about you take your Johnny come lately @ss and start your exodus back home instead.
Because it bears repeating……with corrections.
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@mrstoogood4yall:
Here’s an Awesome hour long documentary released in 2011 called “Africa Rising” which speaks to the very things we’re talking about. Watch it if you can and let me know what you think:
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@ GoldFire…“I’ll have you know that African Americans have been in this country since the early 1500s”
Thank you very much! I’m so tired of the “1619” story. I’m from SC and I do know that in the Winyah Bay area by 1526 — we were here (I think Abagond did a post on the Melungeons before)!
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Bill Cosby:
What part of Africa did this come from?
We are not Africans. Those people are not Africans; they don’t know a thing about Africa.
I say this all of the time. It would be like white people saying they are European-American. That is totally stupid.
I was born here, and so were my parents and grand parents and, very likely my great grandparents. I don’t have any connection to Africa, no more than white Americans have to Germany, Scotland, England, Ireland, or the Netherlands?. The same applies to 99 percent of all the black Americans as regards to Africa.
So stop, already! ! !
With names like Shaniqua, Taliqua and Mohammed and all of that crap …..
and all of them are in jail.
___________________________
Bill has it right. When American blacks start to call themselves simply American, and stop their own form of self-afflicted segregation, only then will Jim Crow be history; only then will the 13th Amendment become fully realized and blacks equal in their own minds.
Zimmerman’s actions had nothing to do with race and everything to do with a head being repeatedly smashed into the sidewalk and a firearm. A boy is dead, another must look over his shoulder for the rest of his life, and the only racist slur thrown about was that of Cracka.
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@ Deb,& Goldfire; In one of Abagond’s book references. Creating Black Americans, By Nell IrvinPainter, American History And It’s Meanings. Chapter 2,Captives Transported 1619. Reads In 1619 about twenty ethnic Ndongans from what is now Angola in West Central Africa landed in Jamestown. I bought this book, I like it. I am distressed to read your comments and see something different. Now I wil have to look this up. Looking to hear your response.
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rofl why do ppl always use mlk, religion, morgan freeman, white jesus, a preacher, and bill cosby to get us to listen. lmbao oh wait I know why because they know they not black and so they put another black face up there thinking we will cosign just because they look like us smh, There are comedians latino and black who have said that for them to be called simply American they had to travel outside of America. We can’t call ourselves simply americans that never works, we didn’t come up with the name African American anyway. So u hear that black ppl next time u go to the dmv or any other place where u have to fill out forms asking about race, just scratch it off and put American. stand back and watch the crazy stare u get. When blacks fought in pretty much every American war, they weren’t called American nor were they treated as such. in fact they called us ni@@r not American or even African American. Then there were incidents that whites attacked and killed black returning soldiers just for having a celebration. , there will always be African before the word American when used to describe us. I’m not ashamed nor will I apologize for it. If I have to straighten my hair, lighten my skin, wear contacts and things and still not be called just American then what sense does that make. They call it the melting pot because they want ppl to melt away their culture and their features to fit in. They want us to melt away our skin tone, to fit in. melt away our history to fit in. And in the end what is it all for? I still will not be called just American, heck even the ppl that were here before America was named America are not called just American. SO how can I expect to be called just American when those who have came before or are considered the model minority still are not called just American but always have something else attached in front of it.
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since ppl love quoting black folks here’s one for ya
“I Ain’t Got No Quarrel With The VietCong…
No VietCong Ever Called Me Ni@@r” — Muhammad Ali,
Its ironic that the ppl he would’ve fought against would’ve seen him as an American soldier, while the ppl he was fighting for would’ve looked at him as a negro soldier. I’ve never heard of a black person or poc get upset that someone called them American, but I have heard some of them get upset that they are not seen or called American.
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@ mstoogood4yall
Ali cowardly hid behind his new found religion to dodge the draft while other less famous, both black and white, had no choice. Bad example.
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@Kingswoodroad… Not sure if that comment was for me, but let me just say I was born here as well — as were my parents, grandparents and great-grandparents (born into slavery). However, my great-great-great parents came here in the belly of a slave ship from West Africa (still trying to nail down the exact country) and my DNA proves it. Unlike you and Bill, I give self-loathing no quarter because I’m very proud of that cultural connection for reasons I’m certain you would not understand given your, “That is totally stupid” comment.
And, quiet as it’s kept, there are plenty of us who do know a thing about Africa and have actually set foot on the continent. I know I have, several times — and plan to return. I’m curious though, where do you think those of us with our black skin originally came from? Never mind, it was a rhetorical question — seems neither you, nor Bill have any interest at all in knowing anything about your history or ancestry, which explains your apparent unwavering fealty to a country which has without question, and despite social position or dollars in the bank, routinely saw/sees Black folk as property from which they can profit as well as less than — so much so they enshrined it in the alleged, ruling document of the land (that pesky Constitution).
Hate to break it to you, but you don’t get to decide what I call myself and no, I don’t suffer from self-afflicted segregation, on the contrary I’m quite “integrated” in this society. But, having been born with a birth certificate pre-printed with “Negro” on it and having lived it growing up in the Deep South, I certainly don’t suffer the illusion that Jim Crow will ever be history in this country. It’s merely put on a three-piece suit or a fancy new dress, called itself James or Jane Crow, Esq. and kept on stepping. Your 13th Amendment reference is pretty funny though, seeing as it reads: “The Thirteenth Amendment to the United States Constitution abolished slavery and involuntary servitude, except as punishment for a crime.” It has been fully realized and slavery is still very much with us — just take a look at our prisons.
I’m an American of African descent and proud of it. No need to worry about my mind, thank you very much — I’ve been equal up there for some time. It’s those who suffer from delusions of grandeur that seem to have a problem with that. I’ll stop right here because your last paragraph doesn’t even merit a response.
*(Abagond, apologize for taking up so much space.)
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Mary Burrell,
As far as I am aware, the first group of enslaved Africans arrived here in 1619 — actually they were a small group of ‘indentured servants’ rather than full-blown ‘slaves. Perhaps earlier African arrivals weren’t necessarily slaves or, if they were, maybe they had been brought in and held as slaves by Spanish explorers rather than by American colonists … just a guess.
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Or perhaps I should say *English colonists*.
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@mary burrell…“In 1619 about twenty ethnic Ndongans from what is now Angola in West Central Africa landed in Jamestown. I bought this book, I like it. I am distressed to read your comments and see something different.”
I’m not saying that isn’t true, I’m just saying there’s more to the story. Here’s a link on the Melungeons: http://historical-melungeons.com/beginning.html
@Flamma…You’re correct, they were slaves (until they revolted and escaped to live with local Indians) of Spanish explorers not American colonists — probably why they were more or less erased from history.
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Oops! I made the same mistake — should have been *English colonists* 🙂
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Deb,
I did not, nor would I ever say to anyone on Abagond’s, or any other-like blog for that matter, “that is totally stupid.” There is not a “stupid” person whom I have read within this blog’s content- only people I disagree with on some key points. I, as well as Bill Cosby and others, are not saying to denounce or, even worse, not educate yourselves on your family backgrounds. Were I black and learned that I descended from West African slaves I would, as you have, absolutely embrace and cherish my heritage. I too have been to Africa many times and I found that when Ali told the children of Zaire in the movie, Rumble in The Jungle, that they have more heart than American blacks, that this was in no way a slight to us here, but rather for the same reason that American Irish eat corn beef and cabbage on St. Patty’s Day and smash each other about the faces with beer mugs, that they are missing the point and are living the life of a cliched stereotype in this New World.
The 13th Amendment freed the slaves and yet we allowed Reconstruction, Reconstruction ended and we had the audacity to allow Jim Crow, but where are we now? American blacks are like the hyper sensitive Islamists around the world (no, I am not comparing anyone to terrorists) who, at the screeching call from that carpetbagger Al Sharpton and all other race baiters, take to the streets and protest the inequalities within our culture that no longer exists. Democrats treat you like ignorant children who know no better, and sadly, I sincerely believe that most American blacks only see the color of one’s skin.
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@ Deb; Thanks, Like Let’s Be Clear. It’s very cool.
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@ Fiamma: Thank you for your input as well.
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@mstoogood4yall…I DO co-sign your comments, Sister! Seems you were dead-on with this too: “oh wait I know why because they know they not black and so they put another black face up there thinking we will cosign just because they look like us smh”
Peace…
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I am glad the kibosh got put on her stupid book deal. Some people have no shame.
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Is it just me or is someone trying hard to start an argument on this thread? I would imagine that if you fail with the first post and the only type of responses you get are well worded kiss offs, you might want to stop posting.
Anyway, I loved GoldFire’s video so I will repost it here.
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ZOrAs80s02o&feature=youtu.be&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DZOrAs80s02o%26feature%3Dyoutu.be
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@Goldfire,
When I mentioned gun control, I was referring to perceptions from non-Americans overseas. It may be more difficult for them to relate to the problems traced to the racial history of the USA, but they do see the problem of walking around carrying guns. So, they might see the problem of people walking around carrying guns, shooting innocent people as weird or strange. They might not quite “get” the racist baggage of the USA if they have never lived there.
But, of course, it is not just about guns.
Yeah, maybe things still are not quite as bad as the 1950s. Is that what we need? to get that bad?
I know the population and size of the USA. When I said, say, 100 million march to the streets, I was not implying that they all need to be African-American. I did not mean that it was to be done in a single city. I was referring to people who were angry, upset, incensed or otherwise dissatisfied with the judicial outcome. Of those, I don’t think it is an exaggeration to suggest that 100 million in the USA (at least 30%) might be upset about it. That could translate to at least 2 million in New York City.
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Just wondering, does anyone have any information on exactly how this particular jury was selected – the process they used to accept or reject potential jurors?
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@ mstoogood4yall,
you can find the info everywhere, but here’s a well documented dairy (well, more like a letter he wrote to the NYT ) written on March 21, 2012 by samdiener titled, ” NYT: 1st Africans in New World >100 yrs B4 1619″.
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/03/21/1076513/-NYT-1st-Africans-in-New-World-gt-100-yrs-B4-1619
@ Deb, virtual high-five back at ya. 🙂 and I for one really enjoy reading your post so please keep on posting. 🙂
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@Kingswoosroad…“I did not, nor would I ever say to anyone on Abagond’s, or any other-like blog for that matter, “that is totally stupid.””
I went back and looked, seems I mistook your quotation from Bill as yours. I stand corrected. And since I’m a little slow on the uptake sometimes, can you break this down for me: “I found that when Ali told the children of Zaire in the movie, Rumble in The Jungle, that they have more heart than American blacks, that this was in no way a slight to us here, but rather…that they are missing the point and are living the life of a cliched stereotype in this New World. — because I kinda believe he meant what he said.
“American blacks are like the hyper sensitive Islamists around the world…who, at the screeching call from that carpetbagger Al Sharpton and all other race baiters, take to the streets and protest the inequalities within our culture that no longer exists.”
First of all, are YOU living here in Black skin? If not, I think it’s pretty presumptuous of you to speak on our being “hypersensitive.” Look, I live in this culture in my Black skin and I promise you, inequalities DEFINITELY still exist. Second of all, I’m no fan of Rev. Sharpton (particularly here lately), but taking to the streets has been a very effective way of not only showing the depravity of this inherently violent culture, hellbent on maintaining its “supremacy” here in these alleged United States, but also exposing the means, motives and machinations they employ to do so.
Democrats treat you like ignorant children who know no better, and sadly, I sincerely believe that most American blacks only see the color of one’s skin.
Nice sweeping generalization without knowing anything about my politics. No matter though, because as I see it — Democrats, Republicans, same thing, simply opposite sides of the white supremacist capitalist patriarchal coin. Again, another sweeping generalization about what we see. You don’t know us, trust me. But I will share this about me, anyone who steps to me with that, “I don’t see color” foolishness, let’s me know immediately, they have neither respect for, nor interest in, who I am.
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@mary burrell…You’re quite welcome and thank you! Stop over anytime!
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@ jefe,
let me get back to you tomorrow if you don’t mind. It’s getting kinda of late here, and I have yet to respond to Origin’s post on the other thread. A thousand apologies 🙂
Till tomorrow then, Goodnight.
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Brothawolf
“It was unbelievable. Every time I heard her voice, I wanted to throw something.”
LMFAO! I actually couldn’t bare to listen to the interview, i caught bits and pieces. I know i was just get angry, so i refuse to watch the entire, interview.
What little i did hear, made me sick!
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Peanut
sorry sondis, my last comment as in response to this statement that you made:
“abagond:
should black people, begin an exodus out of America?”
Thank you, peanut. ^_^
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@GoldFire…Thank you so much. The feeling’s definitely mutual. I’ll keep posting for sure because Abagond’s one of my favorite places to drop in! Nite, and Peace…
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well some good news. darius simmons murder was found guilty but its not over yet his defense is trying to say he is mentally ill. http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-57594207-504083/darius-simmons-murder-john-henry-spooner-wis-man-76-guilty-in-fatal-shooting-of-13-year-old-teen-neighbor/
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@ Deb
Thanks sistah, I enjoy ur commentary as well.;)
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Peanut
who do u love?
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ooh sondis and peanut sitting in a ………..oh nevermind. lol
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mstoogood4yall:
No, the question is, who do you love? @ : o O ) >
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^ myself bahaha and this song http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=sam+cooke+change&view=detail&mid=A5036DF8F7BED169EC9FA5036DF8F7BED169EC9F&first=0&FORM=NVPFVR
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so sondis u asked me now its ur turn who do u love?
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@ abagond
look up George Stinnney. I think it will be a good on for y.ou.
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sorry. I’m on the low end of the gean pool(mine wise and spelling). I think you can give George Stinney or give his story justice. look him up.
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@ thinking better
wow I never heard of him before thanks for brining it to this blog., that is heartbreaking he was 14 and executed, without a good lawyer or any evidence smh. Him and emit till were the same age when their lives were taken from them all because people thought they done something to white females. Wow its amazing, the shocking blood soaked history of this country I’m learning. This is fkd up beyond words. Its like its something about black males that reach puberty that makes them crazy.smdh
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George Stinney, Jr. – another blank page in our history books. Can someone do a post on him?
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@ Jefe
I will! It will go up Monday, God and my Internet provider willing.
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@ sondis
That is a post. Big time! I will do a post for it, hopefully on Friday or soon thereafter.
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Great. 🙂
I love this filling the blank pages in our history books. It spurred me to think of so many other blank pages. I need to find the time to put words down for those pages.
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@ Jefe
I remember those too! A friend of mine was in the subway train behind the Goetz one!
I will probably not do those any time soon, but I will probably post on the Central Park Five and Eleanor Bumpurs.
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Yeah, those are great. I was in NY during the Central Park jogger incident.
But, we can take these only in doses. So much other information has been swept under the rug.
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My understanding of 1619 is that was the first RECORDED SHIPMENT of Africans to Virginia, to the English-speaking society that became America. There were already black people in Virginia at that point. We do not know how they got there. And there were blacks in the Carolinas in the 1500s when it was under Spanish rule. Puerto Rico too. And, as it is, even when Columbus first arrived in the Americas, the people there already knew about blacks (as traders).
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I read an article this morning based on an interview with the jury selection consultant hired by the Zimmerman team. B37 was one of his top picks. Interestingly, he wanted an all-female jury. At first glance that might seem counter-intuitive because of the risk that they will empathize with the loss of a son, but his sense is that women are less vindictive than men are, less likely to want an eye for an eye. Further, he got it that women who are white would be just as likely to empathize with Zimmerman.
Meanwhile, the prosecutor seems to have missed the fundamental racial element to this case. Among others, he dismissed a black man from the pool because the man was a self-identified conservative and owned a gun. If I were doing the choosing, I’d have kept him.
By the way, “choosing” is a misnomer. Jury voire dire is a “deselection” process. That is, the two sides are presented with a pool of about 18 candidates and each side gets an opportunity to flick six out of the pool. Whatever is left, that’s the jury.
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B37 is a crass, gullible fool who believed exactly what she was supposed to believe. Anyone who would go out and sign a book deal after serving on the jury in such a terrible case… I just don’t know what to say about a person like that.
Kingswoodroad said :
[…] “American blacks are like the hyper sensitive Islamists around the world…who, at the screeching call from that carpetbagger Al Sharpton and all other race baiters, take to the streets and protest the inequalities within our culture that no longer exists.”
Did I read that wrongly? “the inequalities within our culture that no longer exists.” THE INEQUALITIES THAT NO LONGER EXIST??
WTF.
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@ Blanc2
I think almost any white jury would have let Zimmerman off, in pretty much the same way as B37 did. First, because whites trust the police. Second, as Matari pointed out, because of the Rules of Racial Standing:
The way B37 believed the “creepy-ass cracker” part of Jeantel’s testimony but not the rest of it and instead trusted the words of a half-white killer is almost textbook. If Jeantel were a white girl and Zimmerman a black killer, I highly doubt she would have trusted Zimmerman over Jeantel.
My guess is that a black jury would have started from Jeantel’s testimony and the physical evidence, not from Zimmerman’s story – which they would have thrown out as the desperate lies of a man facing life in prison. Zimmerman would have got manslaughter at the least.
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How many blacks were in the original pool? If based on demographic %, should be about 2.
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Re. George Stinney. That is a terrifying and evil episode. He was just a kid who got NO real trial.
Capital punishment is an inexcusable tool of oppression. Basically, formalised murder that gets applied for political purposes. Even if Zimmerman had been convicted the odds are that he’d have been fine.
Check out this page.
(http://www.amnestyusa.org/our-work/issues/death-penalty/us-death-penalty-facts/death-penalty-and-race)
Convicts are many times more likely to be executed if the homicide victim was white. Talk about lives having different value based upon race – what clearer evidence could one find?
Unfortunately, the link to the full report is broken. 😦
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Sondis, Brother, I agree with you.
Blacks need to leave this shithole. All of us, or as many as possible, need to leave the West. Let this pinkskins fight themsselves instead of fighting us. I’m tired of these people. All of them.
I’m tired of white leaders. White lies in history. Blonde hair blue eyes. I’m tired of all of them. I’m beginning to hate them. Them and their lies.
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@mstoogood4yall…You’re welcome and thank you (and I’m with you on that Sam Cooke too)! 🙂
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Average Bee
“Sondis, Brother, I agree with you.
Blacks need to leave this shit hole. All of us, or as many as possible, need to leave the West. Let this pigskins fight themselves instead of fighting us. I’m tired of these people. All of them.
I’m tired of white leaders. White lies in history. Blonde hair blue eyes. I’m tired of all of them. I’m beginning to hate them. Them and their lies.”
Yeah, i think lots of black people are thinking about leaving America, after this verdict of not guilty.
Anyone want to come with?
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George Stinney reminds me of the Lena Baker execution. The black woman who was executed for murdering her white boss who was trying to rape her and keep her as a slave, then they pardoned her 60 years after her execution, aint that a beyotch. It takes them forever to see the mistake they made and its never in time to save their life. Georgia been executing ppl they thought was guilty, wouldn’t be surprised if years from now they realize they executed Troy Davis and got it wrong. smh
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sondis
u and peanut go ahead i’ll catch up. lol, do some recon and tell me how it is wherever u going. so what country are yall looking into?
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So, what I’ve learned from this article is that B37 is a friggin idiot…
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@ Jefe,
You Said: “Yeah, maybe things still are not quite as bad as the 1950s. Is that what we need? to get that bad?”
Looks like it, doesn’t it?; and it seems we’re heading there. I mean, if the Supreme Courts audacious decision to gut the VRA wasn’t a clarion call to black leadership and African Americans in general to wake the heck up, what else needs to happen, the repeal of the 14th amendment? My mother used to always say, “prevention is better than a cure”, but if black people don’t wake up and soon, to attend to their collective self interest, yup, we just might need things to get that bad.
You said: “I don’t think it is an exaggeration to suggest that 100 million in the USA (at least 30%) might be upset about it. That could translate to at least 2 million in New York City.”
Well, from what I’ve been able to gather, thousands were protesting Zimmerman’s acquittal nationwide; People were protesting even in places as unlikely as Akron, Ohio and Marshal, Texas. In any case not taking to the streets doesn’t necessary indicate apathy on the part of African Americans, particularly when considering that we have had to negotiate escalating racial tensions alongside our one-sided fidelity to the first sitting black POTUS.
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peanut
u forgot mary, oh and I’d like to bring nmatt, oh and truth as well. 🙂
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oh and I forgot man stealer torontogirl I guess she can come too just as long as she don’t bring drake.
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@ mary burrell
You said: “Deb,& Goldfire; In one of Abagond’s book references. Creating Black Americans, By Nell IrvinPainter, American History And It’s Meanings. Chapter 2,Captives Transported 1619. Reads In 1619 about twenty ethnic Ndongans from what is now Angola in West Central Africa landed in Jamestown. I bought this book, I like it. I am distressed to read your comments and see something different. Now I wil have to look this up. Looking to hear your response.”
I was so tired last night I mistook you for @mstoogood4yall. 🙂 I’m not sure if you realized that where able to get the information I posted but just to make sure here it is:
you can find the info everywhere, but here’s a well documented dairy (well, more like a letter he wrote to the NYT ) written on March 21, 2012 by samdiener titled, ” NYT: 1st Africans in New World >100 yrs B4 1619″.
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/03/21/1076513/-NYT-1st-Africans-in-New-World-gt-100-yrs-B4-1619
Sorry abagond, if it won’t be to much trouble for you, can delete my repeat posts if you want. 🙂
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“Trayvon Martin’s Unpunished Shooting Death Among 100+ Extrajudicial Killings of Unarmed Blacks”
WOW!!
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@ Kingswoodroad
Yet another racist statement (the Emotional Negro Thinking trope) that says racism is dead. Cool trick. Where do you guys learn this stuff? Is there a “talk” white(washed) parents give their children at age 11? Is there an Unconscious Irony course you take? Or was it on Fox News?
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@Goldfire,
I never thought not taking to the streets mean apathy. But I think thousands is not many at all, a tiny miniscule drop in the bucket. Should be in the tens of millions AT LEAST. I suppose the outrage is not that strong.
After the Tian An Men incident in 1989, 1 million (out of a population of 5.7 million) people in HK took to the streets in nonviolent protest, an area and population smaller than New York City. That is a lot of people. I am only watching from outside, people in the US seem to be overwhelmingly unreacting. It looks that way from here.
I am not being snarky here but DEAD SERIOUS.
So, what you are saying, we need it to get as bad again as the 1950s. That is sad.
Please people, do not let things get that bad. We do not want to repeat the 1950s.
200,000 to 300,000 people went to the March on Washington on August 28, 1963. The metro population of DC and the population of the USA has doubled since then. We should see 500,000 on the 50th anniversary, 1 million in New York city, and tens of millions of others in cities across the nation. The message, however, needs to be very very clear and focused.
We need a post on the 1963 March on Washington ASAP.
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@ Jefe
No, we need a post on the 2013 March on Washington!
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/06/24/march-on-washington-anniversary-events-planned_n_3492678.html
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Well, we need both. We need to know about the original one and also the one this year.
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@Abagond
Got that right! Plus that juror should be in jail right now for letting fat ass half Jew half Pervuian murderer roam free! That juror is horrible!!!!!!
Race relations are getting worse and they will continue to regress.
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@All
I wish the juror went to jail! They deserve it for letting fatass Zimmerman roam free.
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@abagond…Please do! I’d be interested in hearing your take on it. It’s something I’ve been thinking about ever since my first trip to West Africa but I’m conflicted. On one hand, I want to go back home to SC, to the ‘hood where I was born and try to do something purposeful for my community there which slowly but surely is being erased (“bleached,” as Jefe said on another post). I’ve been thinking about this a lot lately and it’s something I should’ve done long ago to be honest with you. I think that’s part of the reason for our failing communities. First chance we get, a lot of us leave for arguably “greener pastures” and we don’t go back and share what we’ve learned with those that couldn’t or didn’t.
OTOH, my experiences in Africa have taught my old behind the value of living a way of life different, and much richer than the one I live now where, surrounded mostly by people who look like me, I can learn about “from whence I came” as Baldwin wrote. Slavery was an intentional attempt to sever us from our culture and separate us from each other worldwide — the ultimate “divide and conquer” if you will. And it worked, beautifully, keeping us from uniting to fight off their brazen attacks on every aspect of our lives, both here and abroad. Can you imagine what a united Black, global force of people could do? They can, and it frightens them.
Who knows? I’m old, but I’m not dead! — maybe I can work out a way to do both, bridging that “distance deliberately created” with some kind of exchange program, so we can get to know each other again. Just my 2 cents.
Looking forward to the post…
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@GoldFire…“In any case not taking to the streets doesn’t necessary indicate apathy on the part of African Americans, particularly when considering that we have had to negotiate escalating racial tensions alongside our one-sided fidelity to the first sitting black POTUS.”
You ain’t never lied!
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http://newsone.com/2635789/darius-simmons-john-henry-spooner/
Darius simmons taken too soon. vid of the child not doing anything but bringing in the trash and his neighbor killed him. In the vid he does not fight back so ppl can’t say he attacked him and that is why he is dead.
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@ Deb,
Excellent Post!!!! 🙂 🙂 🙂
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OK, point noted.
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@ Ms Good & Sondis
Like James Holmes, the Batman shooter, Simmons’s killer is pleading insanity. Surely there are no racial disparities in the use and success of such pleas….
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@ mstoogood4yall and @ Sondis,
Yup the Darius Simmons story is horrific, especially the vid that was up showing the 13 year old boy running for his while being shot to death. You should really watch the vid I posted titled;
“Trayvon Martin’s Unpunished Shooting Death Among 100+ Extrajudicial Killings of Unarmed Blacks”
apparently 1 African American male is killed every 28 hours in this country, and that’s a low estimate.
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That sounds low – about 300 per year. Are you sure it is not one every 28 minutes?
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@ GoldFire…Thanks, just re-assessing my journey to-date, trying to “do my first works over” as Baldwin suggests we all do periodically over the course of our existence on this planet (and yes, James Baldwin is one of my favorite writers! :-))
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@GoldFire
Yea I saw that vid. I just wonder what the jury will look like for the Jordan Davis murder trial, if they will have a black person on there or not. With all this stuff going on idk they may think oh they are not race neutral. Also in that vid the woman said a man was not put on the jury because he was upset by the trayvon verdict, that man was white, and yet somehow they turned away black jurors ,all but one, saying they were not race neutral. So hmm they say the white guy was upset over the verdict but the black ppl who were are called not being race neutral interesting…
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@ Deb, I agree that once you made it to a certain level you leave. Many an old timer use to say before we had to stick together because there were precious few places you could go but here. Now, we leave we don’t live in the same neighborhoods all of this new opportunity split the unity.
It has taken me a long to understand that because I have always advocated that once you got your degree. Get out of the country for a little, check the peace corps out or become an ESL teacher, take some school in another country. Get out for a while and see something different. Now that I have a few more years on me I would say that it would be better if we could start to connect with as many of African decent people as we can. I recently eat dinner with a steel pan band from Trinidad and Tobago and it was a blast. I was asked why our students didn’t have an exchange program with a country that isn’t too far away.
I haven’t given up yet but I just had a project fall through. We were supposed to make an African American Lullaby CD and the person who took over when I came back to America seems to have let all the artist go. There had already been too much infighting as it was, but I thought we would get some of the songs done. Now I am back a square one, getting a composer and trying to find some good scores. While I won’t quit with this project it seems like a heavy trailer weighing heavily on the other projects I have pushed aside for this one.
On this juror. I guess I expected this much from the trail because of how it was set-up. Then I expected there to least be one juror to try to turn profit from it. The worst part of this, the juror, is that I don’t think she has done all of this stuff in malice. She is horribly naïve about many things in other words she make a perfect juror or the perfect type of woman that Edie McClurg usually plays.
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abagond
“@ Ms Good & Sondis
Like James Holmes, the Batman shooter, Simmons’s killer is pleading insanity. Surely there are no racial disparities in the use and success of such pleas….”
Yeah, blacks can never plead, insanity. Despite black people living in a hostile environment every single day of our lives from work to play and at work to home, which results in post traumatic syndrome, we are ones, that are denied such claims of insanity. Double standard at its worst. -_-
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Peanut :
“some of the most racist people I’ve known have been extremist advocates for animal rights. it’s like animals are more valuable than the lives of Black people. I read on SPLC that the wife of one of the top white supremacist in this country worked at an animal shelter….”
French bad actress, Brigitte Bardot. during a debate on TV, she asked why we do not want to ban fur babies seal when we have abolished slavery of Negroes.
Today, she approves the national front with Marine Le Pen. And she attacks regularly muslim peoples.
Brigitte Bardot is a beauty icon in France.
Orry for my english
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@abagond
“Yet another racist statement (the Emotional Negro Thinking trope) that says racism is dead. Cool trick. Where do you guys learn this stuff? Is there a “talk” white(washed) parents give their children at age 11? Is there an Unconscious Irony course you take? Or was it on Fox News?
https://abagond.wordpress.com/2012/04/11/ent-emotional-negro-thinking/”
Ha, ha, excellent! This site is like a repository of all the racist reasonings. It is by identifying the methods that they’re denied their power. The ’emotional negro’ debasing stereotype is the mindset from which the white mouth generates the words ‘get over it’. What is the ‘it’? Haven’t they themselves acknowledged there is an ‘it’ about which one could get upset? They’re caught acknowledging the existence of an ‘it’ they just assert that the “POC” is supposed to take ‘it’ stoically. (Is this the white dream of ‘model minority’…but I digress) Of course, we know what that nameless ‘it’ is. Obviously, if one is told they’re less human for merely feeling bad about ‘it’ (while it’s actually very human to ‘feel’) then one will never get to the point of doing anything about ‘it’.
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http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2013/07/tim-mcnabb/black-man-shoots-white-teen-jury-says-self-defense-and-nobody-cares/?fb_source=pubv1
Double Standard? Absolutely
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@Riverside_Rob…Please! Trayvon Martin was minding his business, going home to his Dad’s house, not breaking into any damned cars.
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Seriously, how is this this the same as what happened to Trayvon Martin? Martin was walking down the street, not breaking into cars. Use your head ffs.
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what double standard? They both were found not guilty and there are some ppl that don’t agree with the verdicts.
The double standard is that for this white teen to be killed he was doing something, he was up to something[breaking into cars], trayvon wasn’t up to anything and wasn’t doing anything. So the double standard is a white person HAS to be caught doing something to be considered a criminal or suspicious, whereas a black person DOESN’t have to be caught doing anything to be considered a criminal, suspicious, or up to no good. So basically ur are innocent until proven guilty if u are white, but guilty or suspicious until proven otherwise if u are black.
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Riverside_Rob, this case does appear to demonstrate a double-standard. Where’s the protests and national soul searching?
Deb, Gen, and mstoogood4yall, a claim of self-defense has nothing to do with what prior activities the person was doing in the events leading up to the physical altercation. You may wish to educate yourselves on this point.
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I lost my patience with this site. It’s obviously just a bunch of racist drivel and no one wants to discuss anything.
It doesn’t matter if you think so and so was racist. These are emotional concepts that have no place in law. It doesn’t matter if the jury was white and you automatically disagree with what they think. LAW IS THE LAW. Get it straight.
They can’t change the law to be politically correct and soothe the black professors.
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Hello Sublime, as with any tool that man makes he surely can manipulate. There are a ton of examples when the law was bent, screwed, and made to do things that would almost seem against its own nature. Law is neither blind or always right. Laws have been change to soothe white events and sometimes poc the nature of humans change and so do their laws. However it is ok to lose patience with a site and if we do not see you again please enjoy the next thing you are doing.
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Thanks Randy, you’re exactly right, there are no protests, no demands for civil suits and civil rights investigations. No reverends and no threats of rioting. A young white boy was killed, he did something stupid and the wrong time and paid a stiff price. His parents are devastated, but his death is a lesson to all of his peers, don’t be stupid.
More to the point Deb and Gen, Trayvon was minding his business up until he starting beating Mr. Zimmerman. How have you completely discounted that event? Trayvon Martin was committing BATTERY on George Zimmerman – you can’t ignore that fact any longer, it is part of the testimony, part of the transcript, and Ms. Rachel has even attested to that fact in subsequent interviews. TRAYVON MARTIN was committing BATTERY on George Zimmerman – he was beating him because Zimmerman had the audacity to ask what he was doing in the neighborhood. HE WAS BEATING ZIMMERMAN – get it, not minding his business, not being innocent, he was beating the man – that is why he was shot, and why Zimmerman was exonerated.
Deb – I love they way you write, I respect your intelligence and I think we could get along well together. In this case, you’ve removed a major element from your narrative and it is disingenuous.
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King of trouble – that was cool.
Miss to good for yall
The white boy wasn’t killed for breaking into cars, I think you know this but it doesn’t fit with your argument about the double standards, but OK, I’ll take the bait –
Very simply the white boy was shot for charging the black man – not hitting him, not beating his head on the ground but for moving towards the black man in a threatening manner. I could argue the black man shot the white kid because he wanted to make for all the injustices that blacks have suffered at the hands of whites since the 1500’s, but I won’t – I will believe the black man’s word on the events and since I staunchly defend our (yours and mine) individual right to self defense, I see his acquittal as a victory for my rights. Why you will pour you energies into defending a street thug is beyond me.
Where is justice, and more important -where is your compassion for the best and brightest black youth gunned down by other blacks for “acting white” How can you cry for Trayvon but not for Hadiya Pendleton? 260 kids killed in Chicago in 3 years – nary a peep, but you’ll march for Trayvon? Educated blacks, the very people that can break through color barriers are caught up in this and that is very confusing to me and a lot of my white acquaintances. To us it seems your community would rather go down fighting for a loser, than propel your kids to their full potential. Your community will live and die as you wish, but from the outside, it looks like you don’t miss any opportunity to miss an opportunity.
http://www.alternet.org/news-amp-politics/260-school-children-killed-chicago-3-years-where-are-tears-them
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it was quite a lively discussion at the pub this morning in sw phl i was put back a square no question but you know i said that gun has a body on it if this guy gets it back from evidence thats effed up the way hes been acting is unbelievable it was understood what everyone was talkin about
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How is trayvon a loser and a thug. George had on his myspace saying racist things about Mexicans, had a restraining order against him and resisting an officer and is accused of molesting his cousin and another woman.If he didn’t have that judge father he’d be having all that sheit on his record.
“How can you cry for Trayvon but not for Hadiya Pendleton?”
I do care about what happened to Hadiya Pendleton, Ahlittia North,he mother who lost all her kids to gun violence,and others. There have been protests against gun violence in Chicago but it isn’t publicized all the time. The media controls what is put out there and focuses on certain things, I don’t see them talking much on the news about those black teens that saved that kidnapped girl. or the black 14 yr old girl that graduated from college with a bachelor degree in psychology.
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@King of Trouble…“It has taken me a long to understand that because I have always advocated that once you got your degree. Get out of the country for a little, check the peace corps out or become an ESL teacher, take some school in another country. Get out for a while and see something different.
Me too, and none of those are bad things. As a matter of fact, they’d all make a person that much more well-rounded. The problem, in my mind is, never bringing any of it back where you came from so there’s none of that, “each one, teach one.”
Now that I have a few more years on me I would say that it would be better if we could start to connect with as many of African decent people as we can.
I’m definitely with you there, and for the most part, as I’ve done that over many years, I’ve found that most certainly, “WE are more alike than we are different” and I don’t just mean the melanin we share. As a Gullah child of a SC Sea Island community, there are cultural beliefs and practices, and even linguistic similarities I recognize in the GA Geechees, West Africans, Jamaicans, Bahamians, Haitians, Panamanians, Afro-Guyanese,Trinidadians and Afro-Cubans I’ve met, lived among and call “friend.” That knowledge has been so very powerful for me to know, particularly as I grew older. But it would have informed my life in invaluable ways hd I known of it when I was a child — which is why the exchange program idea continues to resonate.
Don’t give up on the Lullaby CD project. It’s much too important for the generations to come. Not too long ago, it was a Sierra Leonean Mende song that reunited a family from my hometown with their descendants in Africa. You can read about it here: http://www.yale.edu/glc/priscilla/opala.htm
Peace…
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@Riverside_rob…“Deb – I love they way you write, I respect your intelligence and I think we could get along well together. In this case, you’ve removed a major element from your narrative and it is disingenuous.“
Thanks for the compliment part, but do you realize how incongruent the italicized portions of those two sentences are? Respecting my intelligence and then calling me disingenuous just because you don’t agree with how I express my opinion doesn’t match up! Either you do or you don’t and trust me, neither will keep me awake at night. I can’t remember who said it, but this quote comes to mind when I consider your observation above:
“Civility, in the face of such intellectual dishonesty, is counterproductive in the defense of liberty … for it grants the dishonesty the false appearance of legitimacy”
And no, particularly given the false-equivalence example you used of the Scott case, coupled with your ECT (https://abagond.wordpress.com/2012/04/11/ent-emotional-negro-thinking/) regarding the “facts” of the Zimmerman case — I seriously doubt we’d get along well together.
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@sondis “Like James Holmes, the Batman shooter, Simmons’s killer is pleading insanity. Surely there are no racial disparities in the use and success of such pleas….”
“Yeah, blacks can never plead, insanity. Despite black people living in a hostile environment every single day of our lives from work to play and at work to home, which results in post traumatic syndrome, we are ones, that are denied such claims of insanity. Double standard at its worst. “-_-
Not to mention since Whites ALWAYS claim our “low IQ’s” make us retards, insanity or being mentally challenged should exempt of from prosecution!!!
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Deb, I do respect your intelligence. What I mean is that you’re smart enough to know exactly what happened, yet you chose to excise the beating of Zimmerman from your story and that is disingenuous. There are some people who don’t know what occurred in the trial and are therefore ignorant of the facts, but I’m fairly certain you are well informed. there are others who can’t form a coherent thought and are unable to follow logic or reason, they’re stupid. You are neither of those, so, smart as you are, you lie to yourself and others to be able to maintain your indignation at events – disingenuous.
You still haven’t addressed the beating of Zimmerman, you can’t even acknowledge that it occurred, what strange pathology is that?
I still think we could have good conversations, but you’re probably right, maybe we wouldn’t get along. I think I challenge you a little more than you’re used to. I’m not certain what you mean by emotional negro thinking, but it seems like some type of “deflecto” shield your trying to employ, as if a cliche’ is not true because it’s cliché. the intellectual dishonesty on this thread is yours Deb.
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Rob, please.
No one is condoning violence against Zimmerman, but it happened and it is no one but George’s fault. He killed a kid because he wanted to, not because he had to. He didn’t even have to follow him but profiled him and did so anyway. Martin was doing nothing wrong. He was railroaded in this trial from the start. By people like you. A person gets tailed in the night as he’s minding his own business but hasn’t a right to “stand his ground”. What a fucking joke.
So yeah, the murderer’s family got it and got it good. So what. His mother or whoever the fuck she was was rushing a relative to the hospital.
At least she got a chance to. I don’t see anyone of your opinion bitching about Trayvon getting shot for no reason.
He brought that on them. So stop fucking acting like this happened out of nowhere.
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@Riverside_rob…Part 1: “What I mean is that you’re smart enough to know exactly what happened, yet you chose to excise the beating of Zimmerman from your story and that is disingenuous…you lie to yourself and others to be able to maintain your indignation at events – disingenuous.”
Look, none of us know exactly what happened and never will, because Trayvon is dead and can’t give his side — thanks to the man who made sure we wouldn’t hear it. I neither excised, nor lied to myself and others about anything. I just choose not to believe the one-sided story of the grown man, who killed a teen-aged boy as fact, because you see, I believe there’s ALWAYS, TWO SIDES TO EVERY STORY and then the truth. You, and others who share your opinion, afforded Zimmerman the presumption of innocence immediately, while not affording the same to Trayvon. Welcome to your own world of “racial profiling.”
My beliefs are informed by more than 55 years of living in this country (mostly in the South — SC, AL, MD, FL) in my Black skin and raising two now-grown, similarly pigmented sons, coupled with the personal knowledge that both this society and this alleged “justice” system, not only routinely fails to protect people of color, but classifies them as criminals by default, even if they’re the victims of violent crime.
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@Riverside_rob…Part 2: “You still haven’t addressed the beating of Zimmerman, you can’t even acknowledge that it occurred, what strange pathology is that?”
Yes, I have. But let me be clear for you, and then I won’t beat this dead horse of an obsession of yours again. I believe Trayvon was minding his own business, walking home to his father’s house, and Zimmerman racially profiled him; followed him for no reason; Trayvon, with good reason, spun around on him and asked him why he was following him; an altercation ensued (instigated by I don’t know who) in which Trayvon punched him in the face, he fell to the ground, they scuffled and George murdered him with one clean shot to the heart.
Make of it what you will, but a bloody nose and some scratches on the back of the head, do not a “beating” make in my book. And were it me, I’d have punched him in the face my-damned-self if I couldn’t get to my mace first.
“I think I challenge you a little more than you’re used to. I’m not certain what you mean by emotional negro thinking,”
You give yourself wa-a-ay too much credit my friend. You don’t know me, nor anything about the many people with whom I’ve come into contact. I said “ECT” not “ENT” in my comment to you. Since you’re obviously not Negro, I thought you’d read the entire link to see what I meant. Obviously you didn’t, so here it is:
“4. Whites suffer from ECT and yet assume they are being objective, making it seem like blacks suffer from ENT.”
Mkay?
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Average Bee…..
You lost me there guy – are you okay?
your thread meandered around between a couple of stories I think.
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OK Deb – thanks for the clarification of ECT – it’s not something there’s a lot of support for, you can tell by the absence of marches and threats to riot – I suppose that is one of Abagond’s tropes. Now your willingness to “punch him in the face your damned self” is ECT – isn’t it?
You address the beating issue thusly – Trayvon doesn’t like to be followed or spoken to, so Trayvon is going to punch someone out – is that acceptable behavior in your neighborhood? Who instigated the fight – don’t be simple, your suggesting George let himself get his azz kicked so he could shoot the boy? Why not shoot him without calling the cops? Why not stand off and 20 feet and 2 into the back of that hoodie? Just another dead black kid, not a big deal right? Your story is a stretch but l won’t argue hypotheticals with you.
If he (trayvon) were in my neighborhood – I’d say what’s up to him. I would not goad the lad into fighting me – even a “F-off” from him tells me he knows someone is watching – he may not like it, but he gets attention. If he wanted to take a swing at me, we’d fight. Maybe he’d live, maybe not – I am usually armed, and not prey for feral kids -I won’t be a victim. Hey – is that an example of emotional Caucasian thinking?
I’m willing to call it quits on this topic. I agree that we don’t know what happened from the time Trayvon and George came face to face and the beginning of the fight. George may have given Trayvon the idea that he had to fight or die right there – If that is your point, I concede it. I don’t agree with it but you’re entitled to it. What bothers me is that you won’t concede that Roderick Scott, a black man, killed a white teenager in much of the same circumstances, and was exonerated by a jury, just like Zimmerman. The black man got the same justice, the black man exercised the same rights as any other American and they were upheld by a jury, white America didn’t march, doesn’t riot, doesn’t beg the AG to file additional charges, and we damn sure don’t piss and moan that the whole country is against us because we’re white and. The double standard for these cases is at your feet. Do you still deny?
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@Riverside_rob…Like I said earlier, “I won’t beat this dead horse of an obsession of yours again.” I meant it. Do with it what you will.
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Juror B37, bought into a many myths assigned to black males that lead to them getting killed. She is just an ignorant women who could use some educating in race relations. Or maybe she is just a dim bulb,and educaton of any kind wouldn’t help her. Her and Paula Deen are in the same class of ignorant racist white women.
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It was a stupid cow like Juror B37,that got poor Emmitt Till murdered. Ignorant women like her are dangerous to the Black man.
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Well I agree with a lot of things she said though about Zimmerman. I don’t really know how much of a wannabe cop he is. But this was a case of bad judgement
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Guys there was no evidence to lock up Zimmerman. I know you all wanted to see him locked but there was no evidence for 2nd degree murder. Did any of you watch the trial? Insulting the Juror reflects badly on you guys. It’s done, let it go. All the protesting and the racial stuff is just sad. I work with blacks but I cannot help but wonder when talking to black people if they hate me or not. White people do a lot for everyone, aid to Africa, alllowing forgeigners, taking in abandoned minority children in Australia, Google it. Aborigines in Australia are abandoning their children and white families take them because it’s wrong. Whites helped stop slavery, whites marched alongside the civil rights movement and railed against apartheid. Were there some who were scared and protested against it, yeah but all in all whites did the right thing. Denigrating whites is not really helping your case at all. This whole color nonsense is just beginning to grate now. When OJ got of white people weren’t rioting and breaking and smashing stuff. When whites can’t form their own student union or criticize a black for being an idiot without been called a racist you know we have a problem. As Voltaire said and I paraphrase: You know who has power over you by who you are not allowed to criticize
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@Charles
Your back? That is good. There is no dissenting views on here and it is nice to have different viewpoints on this blog. However I do think he was a wannabe cop. And Zimmerman was really trigger happy in my opinion.
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“White people do a lot for everyone, aid to Africa, alllowing forgeigners…”
You have to be fuking kidding me…every single bit of aid going out from the USA to any other country , has a huge amount of black American tax dollars attached to it as well as the other minorities tax dollars …and, black Americans have a stake at any desician involving foreigners in the States also…
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Just saw this video where the set up a group of white teens and then black teens vandalizing a car to gauge any difference in response. No surprise that after hours of wrecking the car the white teens generate 1 call to 91 while the blacks generate 10. But something surprising also happens that they didn’t plan.
The link below takes you to the time in the video where they discuss this:
( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eLXCCcqnY-I&t=5m26s )
It’s the same mindset that caused Zimmerman to see Martin as a threat when he was only walking home.
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The Puerto Rican juror has spoken up. She thinks Zimmerman got away with murder.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/07/25/george-zimmerman-trial-juror-b29_n_3654183.html?utm_hp_ref=mostpopular
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