How to read this blog like many White Americans seem to:
- “Whites”: Imagine the word “all” before each use of the word “whites”. This is a special rule of White American English that does not appear in any grammar book.
- “Evil”: If “whites” and “evil” appear in the same sentence, imagine the word “uniquely” before the word “evil”. Or even “pure”. Or both.
- “Racist”: If the words “whites” and “racist” are in the same sentence, then do not even trouble yourself with reading the rest of the post – just jump down to the comments and start acting offended. Try it! Remember, only white nationalists and those who use the n-word can possibly be racist. All other whites are Well Meaning, Basically Good and Would Know If They Were Racist. Blacks would have no idea because they cannot read minds.
- General statements about whites: these are racist and therefore false. Because whites are individuals, because to see colour in the first place is racist, because to make general statements about a race is stereotyping, a part of racism.
- White is right: so Abagond must be wrong. Even if you cannot say why.
- Abagond hates whites: This follows from #5 because what other reason could there be for him to say bad stuff about whites?
- This is a Bash Whitey blog: which follows from #6. Abagond hates whites so much that he wants to make them to look bad or feel bad. Clearly that is his whole reason for blogging.
- Stereotype his position.Here are some of the choices:
- Playing the race card
- Whining
- Advanced Whining
- Whites are pure evil (white devils)
- Living in the past
If he sounds kind of like he saying one of these then he is. After all, Black America is capable of maybe six different opinions at once. If that.
- He is an Ungrateful Darkie: He does not seem to know that Progress Has Been Made and that blacks in America have it so much better than in Africa. Point this out to him!
- When he tells about a personal experience:
- If you or any white person you know has had the same experience then say, “It happens to whites too!” Even if you have to stretch it.
- Otherwise he must be making it up just to make whites look bad. What else could it be?
- If he says something bad about whites, get upset. Take it personally. Clearly he does not know how to talk to white people, so there is no reason to take him seriously.
- Your feelings are more important than anything in the post, even the stuff he talks about that affects 40 million Americans – if not the whole country. Or much of the English-speaking world. But what is that compared to your feelings?
- The most important rule of all: Never ever try to understand what he is saying from his point of view. Why would you? What is the point? White is right, remember?
See also:
- More in this series:
- Reading Abagond – for those who truly want to understand me
- How to argue like a white racist – for those want to argue against what I say. These will take me completely by surprise.
- How to tell if a commenter is white – the things that white commenters most commonly say
- More on some of the stuff in the post:
- whites are individuals
- The “not all whites” argument
- “racist”
- The feelings of white people
- Abagond hates white people
- whining
- darkies – ungrateful and otherwise
- How to talk to white people*
- What this blog has taught me about white people
So what are you trying to say abagond? *winks* 😉
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Abagond
I wouldn’t be here if I didn’t want to know your side of the story, I would have left weeks ago. I’m still here so it must say something. I would like to hear more about your personal relationships with white folks though.
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If he says something bad about whites, get upset. Take it personally.
This is so true. On this blog when I say something whites dislike, white people have actually accused me of being worse than the kkk. I me excuse me but comparing a little internet blogger to the kkk is ridiculous.
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Going to ‘disagree’ on #1. I don’t even think that applies to the ‘whites’ thing, although it seems to be exclusive to white people.
i’e – say kids are immature, and white kids throw a fit that obviously, they are very mature. How can you dare stereotype them?
White people tend to be *prime* for indignant rage over including them in anything negative. You can include number two in that, too. I think that is a small part of why they usually fall back onto the Arab slave trader argument.
I also think there is a general whitewashing of racism. I had no idea that my grandfather was racist, until he passed on and my father admitted a problem with it as well. People fail to notice things that are right under their nose, most especially when they don’t realise the racist patterns in their thoughts. It hurts when reality hits.
@9 – I don’t quite understand that line of reasoning. Everyone always wants more; how many people have you seen complaining about not affording useless stuff? It’s not suddenly bad when rightly, someone wants to move closer to equality. Maybe they just don’t like a dose of the truth, hm.
Hope that made sense, is 1am here. <<
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I, for one, am simply going to semi-repost what I did on “How to talk to white people” because this is a new post and a new opportunity.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Ó Dochartaigh,
…I’m hardly freaked out because someone disagrees with me.
Methinks you doth protest too much. Again – Abagond writes about negative experiences with whites, which many POC can co-sign. The point of such a post, of course, was to discuss why white people behave in such a manner or if/when/how the rest of us on here POC have experienced the same with white people.
Your response, however, was to go on obsessively about white pride.
Now…*chuckles* you can go on branding, say, men like Robert Jensen as self-haters, but at least they have some balls. They don’t have to deflect or cower or run crying to their secret supremacy stash to make themselves feel better.
Fashion tip from Moi: I dare you to discuss white dysfunction clearly and intelligently. Abagond – your choice of the topic, obviously.
And everybody, Mr. I-can-do-that-but-I-don’t-wanna’s homework is to fully, openly, intelligently, honestly, and seriously discuss whatever Abagond puts before him without deflecting, denying, employing un-funny humor, or deviating in any way. I’m taking bets on whether he can do it or not, by the way – which of you think he can pull it off? Personally, I don’t think he can or will. I think he’ll Bay out – sorry, bow out – before he finally does right by Abagond.
If he can, then I will write an honest, serious post which doesn’t focus on white dysfunction, but white virtue.
If he cannot, then Ó Dochartaigh becomes my tenth case study which, ironically, will allow me to reach my goal of turning Jensen’s Theory of White Fears into Jensen’s Law.
Lord knows he’s given me more than enough to work with.
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I am about as white as it gets, and I read Abagond without commenting, mostly.
Read, because it’s a different perspective than I have.
Without commenting, because if I get annoyed, maybe that is unconscious prejudice talking. And I’m doing this because l feel a need to see where my prejudice is. It’s not always a fun experience, but knowing is the first step to resolution.
I’m not perfect. But I am trying to get better. And I am not saying this because I expect to get praise for it; trying not to be an ass is just common human courtesy. I just wanted you to know that someone is trying, and thank you for doing it, even if I don’t say anything.
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Thank you for letting me know you are out there.
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It’s been said before, but the most important thing white readers (i.e. myself) need to do when reading about racism is quite simply SHUT UP AND LISTEN to a perspective that you have no right to devalue when it’s not yours. Everyone’s experience is equally valid and no one has any right to make the petty judgments that so many readers here are prone to making.
Which is why I too read this blog avidly, yet comment very little.
I imagine other white readers who are genuinely interested in what you have to say do the same.
Also, I remember you did a poll a while back, and I voted you did a post on racism in the Dominican Republic (where I happen to be living for the moment). I’d be really interested to read what you have to say about that.
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Go Alexandra and Dan! Nice to know you are reading.
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“Remember, only white nationalists and those who use the n-word can possibly be racist. All other whites are Well Meaning, Basically Good and Would Know If They Were Racist. Blacks would have no idea because they cannot read minds.”
Seen and heard examples of this many times in real life.
Even IF the N-word is used, they’ll still try to explain it away that she or he (insert white person) didn’t mean it. He/She was drunk, he/she is going through a lot right now…..blah blah blah.
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How is it that Alexandra, Dan, and a few other commenters like Kelly get it while many others don’t?
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I like reading your blog. You get in people’s faces without being belligerent and rude.
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Agabond this was on point! I just came back from an academic conference where whites told me they knew more about my culture that I do.
One white Bermudian(Bermuda is still a colony of England) Canadian presented on a dancehall singer named Yellowman from Jamaica. This man knew NOTHING about Jamaican culture, class, politics or complexion issues. He also did not know that Yellowman suffered because he was an albino not because he had white skin. He also did not know that prejudice against albino’s comes from Africa and how albino activists are trying to undo this stupid centuries old believe. When I pointed all this out he dismissed me. He said that he had an Antiguan dissertation supervisor and continued his clap trap.
I just got off the phone with his dissertation supervisor she was very responsive and indicated very politely that she was having problems with him. His arrogance will catch up with him because if he keeps this up he will not graduate. As a black scholar I really don’t want him and his ilk in the academy.
I also went to another panel on Uncle Tom’s Cabin, which is a vital part of my work. This woman never mentioned that this was a deep racist tome despite its abolitionist leanings. She then read from the book complete with the N-word. I walked out. I have calmed down enough after 3 days and just sent me an e-mail. If she does not respond I will contact the African American professors in her department also.
Whites need to learn to tolerate being that white supremacy and privileged is alive and well. They need to deal with the pain and guilt, and try to dismantle these practices.
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Great point , Eshowoman
Thanks for letting us in on that
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Id love it if you talked more about Uncle Tom’s Cabin, if that is a subject youve studied.
Where I would point to it as an example of abolishionist point of veiw at that time, I can understand that it still has this patronising look at black Ameicans and black American slaves.
Your insight would be welcome
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This is a very interesting observation and comments Eshowoman, leaving aside the funny observations on the
Reggae DJ Yellowman (aka Winston Foster) because it raises
1. The problem of academia
2. The problems of understanding culture/history from a cross-cultural perspective
3. The importance that Blacks need to write or tell their own stories (his/her story)
4. The problem that it is Whites who ‘control’ knowledge in the fields of research etc. Very rarely do Black academicians have access to ‘primary’ documents and/or artefacts that relates to ‘knowledge’ even in their own respective countries. Here, I am thinking about archaeologists
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“This is so true. On this blog when I say something whites dislike, white people have actually accused me of being worse than the kkk. I me excuse me but comparing a little internet blogger to the kkk is ridiculous.”
Co-sign! I have gotten into Affirmative Action debates and compared to White Nationalists and KKK. Its so typical and common that it doesn’t faze me anymore.
The reason (some) white people get so defensive when race and white skin privileged is discussed is because they know the truth. They may not let on, they will shout, deflect and ad hom but deep in their hearts they know what POC are saying is true. Despite knowing the truth they don’t care because they wrongly believe racism and privilege doesn’t affect them… 9 times out of 10 it works to their benefit but that 1 time it goes awry we get 9/11, Columbine shooting and all types of mayhem.
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j, you wrote:
4. The problem that it is Whites who ‘control’ knowledge in the fields of research etc. Very rarely do Black academicians have access to ‘primary’ documents and/or artefacts that relates to ‘knowledge’ even in their own respective countries. Here, I am thinking about archaeologists
Your comment is just plain silly.
Of course one of the fascinating aspects of archeology is the fact that very little has been undertaken by the academics in the countries where many antiquities were found.
Egyptians had no clue about deciphering the Rosetta Stone. It took the French and English to get the job done, but translation was done after the stone was taken from Egypt in 1800. Today it is in the British Museum and Egypt wants it returned. Too bad.
As for the history of blacks in Africa, well, there is virtually no written record. The links to the past are various items made by tribes.
One thing they did not make — sailing vessels. Rafts, perhaps. But no sail-boats.
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@ Leaveumthinking
“white people have actually accused me of being worse than the kkk”
The folly of such a statement proves that they truly do not know what they are talking about.
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Agabond, talking to you about race/racism brings to mind college days in the late ’70’s and early ’80’s, at University of Michigan, trying to talk to Andrea Dworkin/Catherine MacKinnon “feminists” about sex. When the person with whom one is trying to engage in discourse defines every occurrence of sex between a male and a female as an act of rape, discourse about intercourse becomes a fruitless exercise in frustration.
At some point, if one desires to engage in the latter, one learns to cease engaging in the former. And so it is with this white reader of your usually interesting, always well written, and clearly heart-felt blog.
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With regard to
j, you wrote:
4. The problem that it is Whites who ‘control’ knowledge in the fields of research etc. Very rarely do Black academicians have access to ‘primary’ documents and/or artefacts that relates to ‘knowledge’ even in their own respective countries. Here, I am thinking about archaeologists
Your comment is just plain silly (ha ha ha).
Of course one of the fascinating aspects of archeology is the fact that very little has been undertaken by the academics in the countries where many antiquities were found.
I am NOT quite sure why you think it is silly. Considering your perspective this is something I thought you would have agreed with it…I guess not.
If you tell me, what you thought I was thinking?
I will then go on to tell you my position?
Cheers!!
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No_slapps loves to slow his ignorance. There are written records in Geez, the written language of Ethiopia, Meroitic language in the Sudan and Arabic in the libraries of Timbuktu in Mali. Pictures of Nubians sailing vessels are found in Egyptian hieroglyphics.
The sad thing about white supremacists like no_slapps is that they cling to beliefs because they live in lower class, urban and rural neighborhoods, with meth problems and unemployment. Bashing people of color is the only way he can get a hard on.
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Eshowoman,
Damn. *blinks* Come chat with me some time. Something tells me we’d get along.
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eshowoman, you wrote:
There are written records in Geez, the written language of Ethiopia, Meroitic language in the Sudan and Arabic in the libraries of Timbuktu in Mali. Pictures of Nubians sailing vessels are found in Egyptian hieroglyphics.
Thank you for making my point. Clearly you do not understand that you have. But you have.
As for those “libraries” in Timbuktu, are you suggesting the printing press was actually invented in Africa then stolen by Gutenberg?
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j, you wrote:
Very rarely do Black academicians have access to ‘primary’ documents and/or artefacts that relates to ‘knowledge’ even in their own respective countries.
You are making the claim that black academics are barred from studying primary documents and artifacts simply because they are black.
Preposterous. You cannot provide a single example to support this statement.
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Bashing people of color is the only way he can get a hard on.
Hahahaha!!!!
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With regard to:
You are making the claim that black academics are barred from studying primary documents and artifacts simply because they are black.
Preposterous. You cannot provide a single example to support this statement.
he he he he
Cheers!!
Just to say this is not what I am suggesting, and you have made a false assertion.
Though I do understand why you might think like this, which is according to the way you look at things here.
I am saying that academia it is often a ‘closed shop’.
and many Black scholars do NOT have access to it.
Rather than being Black has prevented them accessing
primary sources etc.
Hope this has clarified??
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And because I am multi-tasking – not very good at – ha ha. I forgot to add that even you concur with my position, when you suggest:
“Of course one of the fascinating aspects of archeology is the fact that very little has been undertaken by the academics in the countries where many antiquities were found”
So you in essence have answered your own question, by citing the aforesaid, even though you attribute something else to me, by posing a different question.
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j, you repeated:
I am saying that academia it is often a ‘closed shop’.
and many Black scholars do NOT have access to it.
If you claim that academia is a “closed shop”, then you are saying some academics are allowed in, and other academics are not.
You then say black academics are kept out. By saying black academics are kept out, you are stating that non-black academics are allowed in. After all, somebody is in the shop.
If non-black academics are allowed in and black academics are barred, then you are saying it is because they are black that they are barred.
Again. Nonsense.
As far as archeological research goes, there’s no reason to think organizations that possess these rare antiquities should allow unaffiliated people access to them.
On the other hand, there’s nothing stopping these short-changed black academics from going out in the field and finding more. It’s doubtful every last artifact from every African tribe has been scooped up and sent to museums and universities on other continents.
Like I said, Egypt wants the British to return the Rosetta Stone. Not happening. Meanwhile, the stone itself was not needed for the cracking of its code.
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herneith,
I see you have been reading some of the posts at my blog.
I see you also left a few messages. But I have no idea why you left one message asking me if I am a homosexual.
Would you tell what made you ask that question?
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No_Slappz, it looks as if you have lapsed back into ‘poor reasoning’ skills again.
Not only that, you add the novel idea that you know what I am saying, then you choose a question to ‘de-construct’ or ‘falsify’, my words, so as to prove I am talking ‘nonsense’.
Lets go back to my original words:
“This is a very interesting observation and comments Eshowoman…because it raises:
1. The problem of academia
2. The problems of understanding culture/history from a cross-cultural perspective
3. The importance that Blacks need to write or tell their own stories (his/her story)
4. The problem that it is Whites who ‘control’ knowledge in the fields of research etc. Very rarely do Black academicians have access to ‘primary’ documents and/or artefacts that relates to ‘knowledge’ even in their own respective countries. Here, I am thinking about archaeologists.
So you are wrong to suggest:
“If non-black academics are allowed in and black academics are barred, then you are saying it is because they are black that they are barred”.
My point is that Blacks need access to ‘primary sources’.
Where you err is to infer that I am referring to ALL non-black scholars etc are allowed in to academic world of ‘primary sources’ , a contention I did not suggest.
I am sure you should be able to follow this line of reasoning.
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This topic goes along with my recent blog. I wrote down a list of things white people think, do or say when the issues of race, racism and reality present themselves to them on my blog. When any of you have the time, be sure to check them out.
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this is for Ankhesen,
i apologize for posting my comments here because i couldn’t do it on your blog. this is a response to: Comments Policy…Can’t Believe I Have to Write This….
to you…from Moi
I like your writing style. It makes me think and laugh at the same time! I have a question though. How come we as black people always have to defend someone else rights, when 90% (my own numbers here) don’t seem to return the favor? I’m saying this because of what happened during the whole prop 8 fiasco back in 08′. Most of the gays and lesbians turn into racist themselves by calling black people all types of names. And now we have the TEA F#$@^%@! and many other groups of POC are silent.
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j,
Try this. Give me an example of a “Primary Source.”
Then let me know of any academics who have examined it.
After that, let me know of any black academics who have been denied the opportunity to examine the Primary Source.
If possible, let me know what Henry Louis Gates has to say on this topic.
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A good example would be the ‘Dead Sea Scrolls’. This is what I would regard to as ‘primary source’ of information, for those who wish to study the origins and understanding of the bible, religion etc.
For many years the Israeli establishment were reluctant to reveal these documents, and withheld the information
to the world.
Then other primary sources would be like aretfacts NOT on public display to the public at the British Museum, in London.
Another example would be archaeologist who are from the Western world and conduct digs on ancient African civilisations on that continent whereas the ‘locals’ do not – This is the one point that we have agreed upon a concensus thus far
What I am trying to say is if Blacks are going to write their own story. Then it is important they have access to ‘primary sources’ rather than relying on one or the odd scholars who have been priviliged and have access, so as to give an interpretation of the primary sources, which others in Africa have NOT viewed themselves.
As for Henry Louis Gates, I do not base my studies on
what he has to suggest, nor do I know what he says on this subject matter either.
Hope this has clarified.
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Quick question Aba….Was there a specific commentator that inspired this post.
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Speaking of Tea, Bags, & Conservatives – I thought this was an interesting article…
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/04/06/black-tea-party-activists-called-traitors/?test=latestnews
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@ mimi
How come we as black people always have to defend someone else rights, when 90% (my own numbers here) don’t seem to return the favor?
I think I answered your question on my blog but that was about POC in general so let me be more specific:
We have to because it’s what decent human beings do. Do what is right because it is right, not because it is profitable. The greatest work in the universe is also the most thankless.
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http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/04/06/black-tea-party-activists-called-traitors/?test=latestnews
This is what I find ridiculous about the whole “persecuted black conservatives” drama. Contradicting Obama does not make a black person an “Uncle Tom”. Siding with a predominantly white anti-Obama group who feels justified in using racist terms and imagery to support their arguments, however, is another story.
There is a reason people (white folks in particular) shy away from the so-called “scarlet label” of racism. Hatred and violence aside, racism simply stupid; once you get racial with someone in an argument, you lose all credibility (with the intelligent members of your audience anyway). Skintone really is a negligible factor when it come to arguing your side of a healthcare policy intelligently.
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*Darleen Click – sorry…wrong link for “Racist Terms and Imagery”
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Very insightful!!
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j,
This article is for you…
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601124&sid=aqFpdCaWxzl4
Nine-Year-Old Fossil Hunter Finds New Species of Human Ancestor
April 8 (Bloomberg) — A 9-year-old boy who wandered from his father’s side may have opened a new chapter in the evolutionary story of mankind when he found the fossilized collarbone of a child who lived almost 2 million years ago.
Matthew Berger was about 15 meters (49 feet) from his dad, Lee, a paleontologist working at the archeological dig in South Africa known as the Cradle of Humankind, when he called out, his father said during a briefing yesterday with reporters.
“Dad, I found a fossil,” the youngster said. The bone was just “sticking out of the rock,” the elder Berger said. Scientists now suspect Matthew discovered a new species of hominid, the name for humans and their extinct ancestors, that lived just prior to the historical development of modern man. Researchers reported finding partial skeletons of the male child and an adult female who lived 1.78 million to 1.95 million years ago in two papers published today in the journal Science.
The new species “might be a Rosetta Stone to defining just what the genus Homo is,” Berger, a professor at the University of the Witwatersrand, in Johannesburg, said in the call with reporters. “This is a good candidate for being the transitional species between the southern African ape-man” and later groups more closely related to modern humans.
The male child and the adult female would have been alive about 1 million years after “Lucy,” one of the best-known primitive human ancestors. The scientists said the species, named Australopithecus sediba, include a mix of characteristics belonging to more primitive and more advanced humans and may represent one of the most recent ancestors leading to those in the Homo genus, the group to which modern humans belong.
“We’re all brought up to think of our history as a slow, single-minded slog from primitiveness to perfection in some way, and clearly that was not the case,” he said. “We’re one of nature’s many experiments that seems to have succeeded.”
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j, you wrote:
Another example would be archaeologist who are from the Western world and conduct digs on ancient African civilisations on that continent whereas the ‘locals’ do not
Now you are claiming the black governments of the black nations where white(?) archeologists are digging are off-limits to local black archeologists.
Clearly — if this is true, which I doubt — it is due to the decisions of the of the black governments restricting the access of local black scholars. Speak to those governments.
The problem you have described is not a problem of academia.
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j, you wrote:
A good example would be the ‘Dead Sea Scrolls’. This is what I would regard to as ‘primary source’ of information, for those who wish to study the origins and understanding of the bible, religion etc.
The Bible is FICTION. If you read it you can tell it was written by a number of people long long long after any of the purported events occurred.
Moreover, it’s also obvious the Bible was written backwards. The stories linking descendants of Biblical figures to their ancestors were fabricated for the sake of making a good story.
For example, if the writers told a silly tale about some silly people who lived in the recent past, the writers wouild then fabricate a link to some distant predecessor whose character explained the silliness of the more contemporary group.
Writers have been playing this game since the first word was written.
Meanwhile, holding an original document is no better than looking at a photocopy. Frannkly, the photocopy is better because you can magnify it and experiment without damaging anything irreplaceable.
Anyway, there’s nothing earth-shaking in the Dead Sea Scrolls. You can be sure the cure for cancer or the plans for a fusion reactor are not in the text.
Meanwhile, if access of this nature bothers you, then you should focus more on Islam.
Ever visted Mecca? There’s no chance I’ll ever get inside the city limits.
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ColorOfLuv, Ankhesen
I even though I am bleeding heart progressive womanist, I can respect black republicans who are fiscal conservatives. Even though they want to take away the “personal freedom” of gays to marry and when or if I want to be a mother. I can understand their fear. Black conservatives and republicans refuse to criticize their party’s support of white supremacy since the civil rights movement. How do you support a party whose members advocate Confederate Heritage Month w/o mentioning slavery because it wasn’t significant. How do you excuse the “blacks are culturally deficient” platform of the party and not see it as a continuation of all the excuses to use in the past to justifywhite supremacy?
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With regard to what I wrote No_Slappz, it is clear you do not know anything about the Dead Sea Scrolls and its significance, or you are just tryingto be difficult?/
Let me guess which ‘one’…
Oh it could be ‘both’ ha ha ha ha ha
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Again with regard to the issue of ‘primary sources’.
The fact remains that a lot of the archaeological research in Africa is being undertaken by those from the ‘Western nations’.
Perhaps this article may help you to have an understnding of what I am trying to say, that is if you are not being obstinately difficult
Polish Archaeologists In the Worlds Forefront of Explorers in Egypt and Sudan
http://www.naukawpolsce.pap.pl/palio/html.run?_Instance=cms_naukapl.pap.pl&_PageID=1&s=szablon.depesza&dz=szablon.depesza&dep=369668&data=&lang=EN&_CheckSum=-1432485342
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Abagond, I’m disappointed you went the moderation route.
I guess to silence the truth is a better way to keep these racist arguements afloat..smh
It will also keep the Afronazis here and free to post their drivel.
Good day sir…
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Great White:
Your trouble is not that you express uncomfortable truths but that you talk like a jerk.
After careful study I found out which words trolls use that most commenters do not. I set it up so that when those words appear in a comment it goes straight to moderation. It has nothing to do with the truth of your comment.
If you want a hearing for the truth, then learn how to express it in a civil manner.
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Great White:
Go to the top of any page and click on the Commenting tab. There you will see my comment policy laid out in all its glory.
I am not requiring anyone to sugarcoat their thoughts – just to act like they have some manners.
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It’s funny how trolls like The Great White Man, Incog Man, Peter Lerman, No slappz, etc
Love to chat their crap and show their intellectual bankruptcy!
Very funny!
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j,
A few days ago in South Africa the bones of a new form of ancient human were found by a wandering 9-uear-old boy.
In other words, your claims that blacks are excluded from archeology remain as silly as ever.
No doubt there are archeological sites in African countries (and almost every other country) to which access is restricted for the protection of the site.
Meanwhile, it is unlikely the British Museum controls access to anything other than the artifacts in its possession. However, based on the links to the British Museum included in the article you suggested I read, it is clear the museum is open to getting help finding artifacts.
Based on the following, it appears the British Museum would gladly accept your input:
British Museum Studies in Ancient Egypt and Sudan (BMSAES)
Presenting scholarly research online
The British Museum Studies in Ancient Egypt and Sudan (BMSAES) is a peer-reviewed academic journal, dedicated to presenting research on all aspects of ancient Egypt and Sudan and the presentation of these cultures in modern times. The articles do not need to concern British Museum objects or projects.
This journal offers scholars the opportunity to include a large number of colour images, and other multimedia content, where appropriate to the article. Accepted papers will be published as soon as possible: there is no defined publication schedule or deadlines, as with print journals.
To submit an article, or to find out more about BMSAES, please contact the editors:
bmsaes@britishmuseum.org
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Thanks for the links No_Slappz,
I had heard of teh new finds, I will wait till further more evidence is obtained before I begin to accept the ‘missing link argument’.
With regard to:
“In other words, your claims that blacks are excluded from archeology remain as silly as ever.
What I find strange No_Slappz is if we back track you would find where you said the following:
“Of course one of the fascinating aspects of archeology is the fact that very little has been undertaken by the academics in the countries where many antiquities were found.
Egyptians had no clue about deciphering the Rosetta Stone. It took the French and English to get the job done, but translation was done after the stone was taken from Egypt in 1800. Today it is in the British Museum and Egypt wants it returned. Too bad”
Hmmm!!
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I had heard of teh new finds, I will wait till further more evidence is obtained before I begin to accept the ‘missing link argument’.
Please note that the idea of “the missing link” is not valid anymore and most of the academics oppose it. In other words, there is no such thing as a missing link. Or, to say it better: there are many missing links and there are plenty of evidence for them. The newly found hominid might have been our ancestor, but we still don’t know. In any case, it is irrelevant in the missing link debate since, like I said, the whole argument is no more considered valid.
Just a sidenote.
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j,
When it comes to finding archeological remnants in African nations, it is obvious that the African nations themselves are taking little interest in performing the necessary tasks. But I have no doubt that organizations from other countries conducting the actual work are PAYING for the privilege.
In 1800 Egyptians had no interest in deciphering the Rosetta Stone. They had other things on their minds.
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Mira,
With regard to the missing link debate.
I thought the ‘missing link’ is based on the premise that ‘humans’ and ‘apes’ share the same ‘common ancestor’. However, as of yet, the remains of the ‘common ancestor’ has not been found.
This article from a London paper appears to be suggesting and alluding to the point I had mentioned earlier
Fossil Skeletons May Belong To An Unknown Human Ancestor: The fossil remains found in a cave in South Africa could represent an evolutionary link between tree-dwelling apes and our earliest human ancestors to walk upright
http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2010/apr/08/fossil-skeletons-unknown-human-ancestor
Would you like to elaborate further on your position??
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J,
The problem is: how to define a human? What is considered to be “a human”? Us? We are only one species of humans, Homo Sapiens Sapiens. There are plenty hominids found between apes and Homo Sapiens Sapiens. Some of them are believed to be our ancestors, while others weren’t.
But “human” doesn’t equal “Homo Sapiens Sapiens”. By “humans”, it is usually meant on genus “Homo”. Species in this genus evolved from the earlier hominids, Australopithecus. Australopithecus are not apes, and they were bipedal (though perhaps not completely), so they can be seen as missing links to. What makes genus homo different is larger cranial capacity and the use of tools. Basically, material culture (and archaeology) start with them (namely, the oldest human, Homo Habilis), but the use of tools is not completely ruled out for the earlier forms (Australopithecus).
Also, please note that the newly found hominid (Australopithecus sediba) is not the oldest found nor the most primitive (in lack of a better word) of the ancestors: Australopithecus africanus is still an older, more primitive form. So the newly found hominid might represent a member of another evolutionary step, the one that got closer to bipedalism. Its importance, as it seems to be, is to show the evolution towards the genus Homo. In that sense, it is one of the missing links, but it’s not any more key hominid than the previously found ones.
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Also, walking on two legs (bipedalism) is a very old trait, and it’s not unique to humans (genus homo)- Australopithecus’ had it too. Their cranial capacity was more or less the same as the apes, but unlike them, they were bipedal.
This goes against early theories, which assumed that larger brains (and intelligence) was first trait that separated apes from human ancestors, and that other traits, like bipedalism, came later. It proved to be wrong: bipedalism came first, larger brains (and intelligence) came second. But this fact was really unsettling to some (who desperately wanted to found a hominid with developed brain but primitive, ape lake body), that they made a hoax known as the Piltdown Man.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piltdown
One note: larger cranial capacity doesn’t necessarily mean more intelligence (Homo Sapiens Sapiens has a smaller brain than the Neanderthal, but is believed to be more intelligent). However, it can, and it is, an indicator of evolving and intelligence of the species. (Needles to say, this can’t be used on individual modern humans: people with larger brains are not necessarily smarter than those with smaller brains).
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No Slappz:
Plagiarism is against my comment policy. Please do not cut and paste stuff from someone else and pass it off as your own.
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I am white, and I just wanted to add my two cents. I feel really uncomfortable being white sometimes, knowing how the majority (and yes this is true – of my own experience) of white people look at/treat black/colored people and knowing that what you’re saying is, for the most part, true (like I said, anecdotal…). I come from a middle-class suburbian background in NY (outside the city) and it’s just sad knowing that people have such a superficial belief in equality. I mean, I’ve met so many people who claim to not be racist, but their comments don’t match up to those beliefs…but you can’t question it. I dunno. I wish things weren’t the way they were or that white people as a whole didn’t deserve to be mistrusted — but the masses affirm that. It’s just sad for the individual who isn’t like that.
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@Cassie
Can you trust a black man more than a white man or how about a Chinese man or Indian man?
SMH
All judgements need to be based on personal deeds, not color of skin.
And stop with the self-hate. Be proud to be white!!! The History, contributions, inventions, humanity( I could go on and on)of white people is unmatched in the history of mankind!!
take care!!
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@ Cassie:
Thank you.
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@Cassie:
Definitely. Their actions belie their words. It’s not uncommon to hear many whites say the “I’m not a racist BUT” line.
Cassie, one thing you can do is to call them out on it. Don’t let them get away with their racist remarks. Btw, pay no mind to The Great White Man. He’s a major embarrassment for great white people everywhere.
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abagond, you wrote:
No Slappz: Plagiarism is against my comment policy. Please do not cut and paste stuff from someone else and pass it off as your own.
I did not. Perhaps somewhere the italic typeface failed, but I am not aware of that happening.
On the other hand, it looks like J copied my stuff without attribution and after his post I reposted my own comments. Maybe you thought my comments actually originated with him.
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No Slappz:
You were cutting and pasting the Wikipedia without telling us you were doing that.
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Mira
Well said, it is a shame but most Americans do not know, or do not care to know anything about Evolution. The “missing link” was a term used in Darwin’s time, before all the hominid fossils have been found. With every new hominid fossil found, creationist will point to a new gap in the fossil record, it is a vicious cycle that will never end.
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@Cassie
The truth hurts racist and revisionist, doesn’t it?
Let me as you a question…….is it ok for blacks to be proud to be black?
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Abagond, your posts make laugh. I appreciate your honesty.
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I find it interesting to read other peoples point of view but you do seem to stereotype whites
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Mississippigirl,
There’s a reason for that.
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@ The Great White Man
Be proud to be white!!! The History, contributions, inventions, humanity( I could go on and on)of white people is unmatched in the history of mankind!!
Such delightful delusion. You could make an excellent case file.
Please keep talking.
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I’m also white, and I agree with @Cassie. I’ve seen racism perpetuated, glorified, and ignored with my own eyes, and I’ve seen the deflections, the well-if-history-hadn’t-happeneds (newsflash, it did) and you-must-hate-whites.
Worse, I’ve been there, in my early teens, on the wrong side of an argument about racism. Good things came of that, however: I started questioning my own beliefs, and now do what I can to understand and actively help the advancement of equality for PoC – people who think they can make racist remarks, racist jokes, or racist arguments in my presence quickly learn how far it will get them.
I always hope my learning to call my own bullshit will help provide a model for others, because while a depressingly large amount of European-Americans are racist and self-aggrandizing, like The Great White Man up there, most of them genuinely don’t have to be. White people are soaking up attitudes, but I believe every rational being has the ability to change, and I believe even more strongly that equality should include soul-searching and individual-and-group change on the part of the oppressors, not constant justifications on the part of the oppressed. Nothing will ever change if whites don’t give PoC the respect all of us deserve as human beings, which includes sitting and listening when we’ve done something wrong, at the very least, and trying to change it, at the very best.
It’s interesting to see the negative reactions or denials centered on me when I stonewall a bigoted statement, and it’s sad to recognize myself in some of them. Which is why I wanted to thank you for this post, Abagond. Reality checks like this are helpful, and I’ll read more of your blog tonight. If you or anyone on this blog would like to correct my thinking or my language, point me to specific articles on the blog, or give me advice, please go ahead!
Sorry this is so long.
Thanks,
Sekah.
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@Sekah:
This reply is a little late, but better late than never, right? It’s good to know there are white people such as yourself who acknowledge there IS racism towards blacks and other POC. That it’s very real and not something made up. Keep on doing what you’re doing to help others (other whites) see the error of their ways. It’s not an easy thing to do, mind you, because you will have a fight on your hands because racism has been ingrained in them for so long. Please bear in mind, blacks and POC have been trying to get whites to listen/understand what the deal is for the longest time, but most of the time, the message falls on deaf ears.These whites seem to not want to change, but they CAN change. It’s up to them. Keep your head up, Sekah.
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I co-sign with Leigh.
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I’ve noticed the Whites in Canada seem different, in a good way. I felt very comfortable being around the Canadian Whites, at the movie theatres and restaurants that I visited while in Canada.
I didn’t get the “racist” vibes that I usually get from living in the South East USA.
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Just came across this 2010 article from the UK’s Guardian about Bush’s memoir, that the lowest point was when Kanye West said “George Bush doesn’t care about black people.” To that comment Bush heard, “‘This man’s a racist.’, I resent it. It’s not true.”
The article’s author, Gary Younge notes that “Bush is more upset by the claim that he didn’t care about black people than the fact that a disproportionate number of black people died during Katrina unnecessarily because his administration did not care enough to save them.”
Lots of good observations from this author from ‘across the pond’.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/cifamerica/2010/nov/21/white-americans-race-obama
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I think I did not spent enough time in us to perceive this at this level; I am a white anyway… but from Canada, to my discharge. Your blog made me feel a bit uneasy but thanks for that.
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Makes sense why many white people read this without reflecting and really thinking about social injustice and instead just choose to get angry and call the blogger of this site racist.
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