Here are the black women that English-speaking white people think are the most beautiful (with the number of lists of beautiful women each one made in my survey):
Halle Berry (9 lists) – American film actress, the first black woman to win an Oscar for Best Actress. She was Storm in the X-Men films (2000-2006) and the Bond girl in “Die Another Day” (2002). She won the Oscar for “Monster’s Ball” (2001). Her mother is white, her father is black.
Beyonce Knowles (8 lists) – American singer. She was in Destiny’s Child and then on her own. Her father is black, her mother is Creole.
Tyra Banks (4 lists) – American supermodel. She is the first black woman to make the cover of GQ magazine and, more importantly for this list, Sports Illustrated Swimsuit Issue (1997). More.
Mariah Carey (3 lists) – American singer. She sings like a black girl but looks like a white girl. Her mother is Irish white, her father is Venezuelan black.
Thandie Newton (3 lists) – British film actress. She starred opposite Tom Cruise in “Mission Impossible 2″ (2000). Born in Africa to a white father and a black mother, she grew up in England and later came to Hollywood. She was shocked at how much her skin colour mattered there – more than in Africa or England. Tom Cruise had to fight for her to star opposite him.
Vanessa Williams (2 lists) – an American beauty queen, singer and actress. She was the first black Miss America (1983). You can see her on American television in “Ugly Betty”. She is so light her eyes are green.
Iman (2 lists) – a supermodel from Somalia married to rock star David Bowie.
Angela Bassett (2 lists) – American film actress. Although she is a beautiful and wonderful actress, I am surprised she made this list: I did not think she was that well known among white people.
Alicia Keys (2 lists) – American singer. White mother, black father.
Half of these women have a white or near-white mother.
This list has the only three black women who have ever made the cover of Maxim magazine in America: Beyonce Knowles, Halle Berry and Mariah Carey.
How I made the list: I put “the most beautiful women” into Google and went through the first 100 websites. If a website had a list of beautiful women that was nearly all white, then I recorded any black women it might have.
As I went through the lists I soon understood that they were made by people with more than just a passing interest in white women. So I think it is safe to say that nearly all the list makers were white themselves.
Because of how I made my list, it necessarily concerns only English-speaking whites. There were lists from Britain and Australia, but most seemed to be American. There were also a few lists from the Middle East and India too, but they did not affect the outcome because they only dealt with women from their part of the world.
See also:
- The most beautiful black women:
- black women that white men like – the kind you see them go out with and marry
- race and beauty
- One Drop Rule
- Is That Really Beyonce: Black Women and Beauty
- The black women of Covarrubias – a Mexican who liked black women not for their whiteness but for their own black beauty
- Creoles
- The women:
Mon 3 Mar 2008 at 12:37:58
Your survey has good analysis.
Here’s some other women who could have made the list:
http://www.fashionestore.net/fashion-models.html
Mon 3 Mar 2008 at 17:51:59
Abagond,
Thanks for the list. Notice that the mainstream media tendency to pick Black women with at least 50%white ancestry as oppose to ones with partial Asian, Latino, and American Indian Ancestry, let alone the ones with more than 50% Black. Mainstream media are more comfortable with Black women who conformed to the Euro beauty standard. What if Tyra and Vanessa have a natural hairstyle? Would they be on the most beautiful list? It’s sad.
Stephanie B.
Mon 3 Mar 2008 at 18:51:31
This list confirms the fact that black women need to be very close to the white standard of beauty to be considered attractive in the mainstream. I do not look like any of these women but I am attractive. It would be nice to see beautiful women with afro features celebrated in the mainstream. It seems like a lot of black men(not all) follow these same standards when choosing women. When you question it they brush it off and call it a “preference”.
Tue 4 Mar 2008 at 04:01:52
What yaz said.
Wed 5 Mar 2008 at 00:54:14
Beyonce’s mother is a light skinned blk. Creole people are blk people mixed with French.
Wed 5 Mar 2008 at 16:55:53
Her mother is Creole:
http://creoleneworleans.typepad.com/photos/famous_creoles_of_today/beyonce_k.html
Wed 5 Mar 2008 at 17:06:50
The list is so white that it seems like something from 1958, not 2008.
Wed 5 Mar 2008 at 20:06:13
I agree.
Wed 5 Mar 2008 at 21:53:23
I understand abagond but creole is just a light skinned African-American. The mixing in LA is no diferent from being blk and Irish and from Boston in the larger picture.
Wed 5 Mar 2008 at 21:53:45
I forgot to add in my post yesterday that this is a good post.
Wed 5 Mar 2008 at 22:58:59
Thanks. Maybe these days being light-skinned Creole does not mean much, but it once did. Unlike the rest of the country, New Orleans did not follow the One Drop Rule, not until the 1890s. That is how I understand it. I will do a post on it next week. After I do one on Jody Watley.
http://abagond.wordpress.com/2008/03/15/creoles/
Thu 6 Mar 2008 at 06:12:40
Yes you are right. The French once owned LA and there are still small groups of French speaking people there. I have heard some white people talk about the beauty one of your favorties, Gabrielle Union.
Thu 6 Mar 2008 at 12:44:40
Gabrielle Union was on one of the lists in my survey. The ones shown above are those who made two or more lists.
Some of the other women who made only one list: Kelis, Ciara, Naomi Campbell, KD Aubert, Phylicia Rashad, Diahann Carroll.
I was surprised Naomi Campbell was not on more lists.
Sat 8 Mar 2008 at 16:27:20
Sure they’re nice but to me the most beautiful one is this woman(not black) that Michael Steep from REM introduces in this great video:
http://www.e-citizen.tv/wordpress/langswitch_lang/en/
Sun 9 Mar 2008 at 20:30:51
Oh please! These women are on the list because they are beautiful. Some blacks are never satisfied and this is coming from a black woman.
I get so sick of people especially black women complaining about lighter skin women. The last time I’ve checked they were black too. God didn’t make every black person dark or to have one common feature. Black women come in all beautiful shades, what do you want Whoopi Goldberg to be listed too?
Mixed women like halle, alicia, and thandie claim the black race. Who are you to tell them what they are and should be. Black women come in all features to be celebrated. Everybody don’t have to look like Alex Wek and don’t act like she should’ve been on that list.
I also get sick of blacks that have an inferiority complex toward whites. None of these women listed look nothing like white women. God didn’t insisted for straight hair, light eyes and light skin to be put on white women. Naturally women with darker colored eyes and darker skin are beautiful too. You people act like what white people says is the god right truth.
If you don’t like that list make your own, but these obviously beautiful black women that’s listed should be included.
Mon 10 Mar 2008 at 00:42:03
titi75: I did a post on her too a while back, one of the few living heroes of our time:
http://abagond.wordpress.com/2007/10/12/aung-san-suu-kyi/
Mon 10 Mar 2008 at 02:22:41
Unique: Yes, they are all beautiful and black. But the striking thing is how light-skinned most of them are. What that says to me is that to white people a black woman is only beautiful to the degree that she is white.
Sun 6 Apr 2008 at 20:19:11
I am Caucasian, and in my opinion THE MOST beautiful woman is Sanaa Lathan. Simply stunningly beautiful!
Sun 6 Apr 2008 at 22:05:24
She is beautiful. She is seventh on my own list:
http://abagond.wordpress.com/2007/06/09/the-ten-most-beautiful-women-in-the-world/
Sun 27 Apr 2008 at 09:44:01
what about Jennifer Beals. her mother is irish and her father is african american. So she’s black in the meaning of whithe people and she is so beautiful.
rgds
Sun 27 Apr 2008 at 22:42:30
These women are very mainstream so they become a very common reference to a beautiful black women.
Mon 28 Apr 2008 at 08:39:09
Jennifer Beals is beautiful but I think she only appeared on only one list in my survey.
Tue 29 Apr 2008 at 11:20:35
in which survey?
Tue 29 Apr 2008 at 11:20:56
i mean which list
Tue 29 Apr 2008 at 11:43:17
As the post says, I went through the first hundred websites that Google lists for “the most beautiful women” and went through their lists of beautiful women.
Wed 30 Apr 2008 at 11:57:19
i a white male think women of color are the most gorgeous women on earth and their diversity is endless. model beaulatasha is the most gorgeous in the world she is definitely an ethic mix of the races.
Thu 29 May 2008 at 10:15:08
Unique, see women like you are more of a worry as it doesn’t seem like you have educated yourself,yes light skinned women are black mixed but fundamentally we came from Africa and for that to change and to have lighter skin to occur it has to be mixed. Evolution was the reason for white skin Which happened in the colder regions and lighter eyes are a mutation that happened near the black sea region and people further to Europe as they moved towards places like Finland, Sweden etc saw it as a sign of beauty and wanted to breed so it was a majority thats why you will find these places are largely still blond hair and blue eyed people. To divide and conquer light skin was seen as more beautiful than black skin, black women and men where seen as objects treated like meat and not good enough to have jobs to have an education this happened through the caste system and colonialism and slavery, black people where made to hate themselves but excepted if they were lighter that is where the term “House Ni*&ger” comes in.Darker skin women were out in the sun working while lighter skin women where in the shade.
I am glad you mentioned Thandie Newton and others claiming her black side and the I don;t want to digress on that but that’s another point as a mixed race person myself I don’t have to claim black I am black it’s a part of me white genes are more recessive that’s why when a person is mixed with black and white they can never “claim” white as you would say. Yes and as black people we are letting ourselves down as we still perpetuate this image of beauty which is outside of ourselves. We need to embrace our own beauty.
Wed 4 Jun 2008 at 09:45:31
Let’s face it mixed women esp. mixed black women are hot!
Thu 19 Jun 2008 at 05:55:33
Unique = Uncle Ruckus
Mon 23 Jun 2008 at 15:28:13
To Tired- what revisionist gibberish, these women are not “black”, they are mixed race, no more black than white- as for white gene being more “recessive”, nonsense, I have a neighbour who is white with a black wife, and their son looks as white as if he had two white parents.
You are nothing more than a black racist with a chip on his/her shoulder
Good luck with that
Tue 24 Jun 2008 at 03:46:20
In America there is the One Drop Rule, which says if you look even part black you are considered to be black. So Halle Berry is black. etc. That may be changing with the push for biracial as something in between black and white, but that remains to be seen.
Wed 16 Jul 2008 at 14:07:37
im a white guy and i love black women.. but i would have put naomi campbell on this list
i think white guys in general are a bit bored of stickin to women of the same race as them so loads of my mates dont go out with girls based on race but on how confident and pretty and a good personality.
soon theres gna be loads of black women with white men
sorry black guys , wer stealing ur women
Sat 19 Jul 2008 at 05:18:37
I was surprised Naomi did not make it, but she only appeared in one list.
Sat 19 Jul 2008 at 19:43:04
Personally, I don’t think it has anything to do with white standards of beauty of light skinned. There are white women who never make anyones list, yet you don’t see white women complaining about the women on the list. When black women are gorgeous, whether light skinned or dark, they are appreciated. Funny thing is, a while back one of the most beautiful black women in the world, grace jones who is very dark although she has stunning chiseled features was/still is reveled as beautiful. However, blacks never embraced her because they said she was too dark, looked like a man, had short hair. Black women need to get real and make up their minds what their own standard of beauty is. By the way, I am black.
http://image.allmusic.com/56/amg/pic200/drP100/P139/P13936L068M.jpg
http://jasmynecannick.typepad.com/jasmynecannickcom/images/17861223.jpg
http://www.afrobella.com/wp-content/afrobella%20images/grace_jones_01.jpg
Sat 19 Jul 2008 at 20:03:14
“In America there is the One Drop Rule, which says if you look even part black you are considered to be black. So Halle Berry is black. etc. That may be changing with the push for biracial as something in between black and white, but that remains to be seen.”
Slavery ended a long time ago. Also, one drop theory was in essence repealed in the sixties with the loving case. The only people who perpetuate “one drop theory” are black people. It’s usually used to keep the lighter ones in their place. Most black people are quick to negate another person of color’s ancestry when it is spoken of publicly. If one claims to be American Indian, blacks will ridicule the person. If One claim to have any white blood that is not the result of one white and black parent, black people will say that it doesn’t count.
Black people have a tendency to try and pull their numbers up by forcing everyone under the same black umbrella, whether one agrees or not. However, they have to realize that in other countries, it is not valid. In many African countries, black Americans are sometimes not considered identifiable black. In Europe, unless one has the black skin of an African, one is looked upon as a tanned ambiguous other.
And to Ray Davies,
“I have a neighbour who is white with a black wife, and their son looks as white as if he had two white parents.”
You probably want to stop assuming that your neighbor is pure black. The genetics of a pure black person would cause their child to be dark. However, if the mother carried recessive genes from a non-parent that combined with the genes of the father, then yes it is possible for the child to look almost white. Scientifically, if the mother were really a black person, the kid would have been brown skinned. Don’t throw stones at someone for being a racist, when you still have prejudice yourself. You prejudged your neighbor to be a pure black woman based on what you thought not on what you knew.
Sun 20 Jul 2008 at 08:03:50
I know what you are saying about black Americans hanging on to the One Drop Rule to increase their numbers, but they are hardly the only ones who apply it. White Americans do too.
Sun 20 Jul 2008 at 08:08:38
Good observation about Grace Jones.
Blacks and white Americans have different ideas of female beauty. That is why Grace Jones appeals more to whites than blacks.
Alek Wek seems to be another case like that: I think she is ugly but people who otherwise care little for black women think she is great. I know she is a supermodel but it is white people who put here there.
More here:
http://abagond.wordpress.com/2008/05/28/black-women-that-white-men-like/
Sun 20 Jul 2008 at 08:16:30
I am not saying that white Americans don’t. However, I am black and I have grown up around black people and have lived my adult life around whites. I can tell you that blacks would rather consider someone “light skinned”
and ostracize them for being an oreo or not being black enough rather than accept the individual ethnicity of that person. Most whites on the other hand tend to at least ask ones nationality. I am not giving any credit to either race in America because I find that most Americans are too racist for their own good.
Sun 20 Jul 2008 at 08:21:55
Blacks make a way bigger deal about being light-skinned. But part of the reason white Americans do not make such a big deal is because to them black is black.
Agreed about Americans being way too racist for their own good.
Sun 20 Jul 2008 at 08:29:12
Of course they have different ideals of beauty. However, for the most part Black Americans are always complaining about dark skinned women not being represented in modeling and the media. Yet, they have limitations on how dark a woman can be. For them, Alex is too dark and Grace was too dark. Mind you, Grace met the standard of European ice princess beauty regardless of her dark skin because her feutures were atypical and sculpted. Alek Wek on the other hand was a part of Europe’s inclusion of African diversity on the runway’s. Europe Acknowledged the beauty of these women, not America.
Black women in America seem to have the problem of accepting the wide array of beauty within their own race. An actual black African women should not be repulsive to a people who proclaim themselves African American.
Sun 20 Jul 2008 at 08:38:03
Well, the trouble is that black American ideas of beauty are not completely black. Because of white American ideas of beauty and, just as important, white ideas of what it means to be black, black American beauty gets hung up on skin colour and hair.
Sun 20 Jul 2008 at 08:39:25
“But part of the reason white Americans do not make such a big deal is because to them black is black.”
I beg to differ with you. It all depends on the area one lives. In New England, Cape Verdean’s are not considered black by most white people because they are light skinned. In the mid west, Ethiopians and Somalians are not considered Black by most whites which is ridiculous. In Georgia, both of these groups are considered black. In New York, most people could care less. In Louisiana, a creole is exactly what they are. Move that person to ohio and they become black.
Sun 20 Jul 2008 at 08:40:34
Interesting. I noticed that in Brazil what is considered “white” is different than in America. The line is drawn differently.
Sun 20 Jul 2008 at 08:43:37
However what you are talking about is how much of drop counts as one drop – where black starts. My point is that once you are on the black side of the line then it does not matter so much to whites how dark you are, not as much as it does to blacks.
Sun 20 Jul 2008 at 08:54:32
Well I can tell you that from my experience of being what I call a “historic” black American meaning that my lineage goes way back. Depending on where I lived, I drifted from side to side as to if I was considered black by both whites and other blacks. Now, I live in Italy where I am not black at all anymore. It is confusing but most black Americans need to wake up because all of that blood that they don’t acknowledge in America is noticeable in other countries. It may sting a little to have an African ask if you are a Mexican. Just in Case you are wondering. My heritage is Black, American Indian, and Irish.
Sun 20 Jul 2008 at 09:14:18
Wow. Very interesting. Do you have a blog?
Sun 20 Jul 2008 at 18:45:38
If it were possible to do a DNA survey of all US citizens, there would be heads exploding from coast to coast.
Sun 20 Jul 2008 at 19:16:30
You got that right!
Mon 21 Jul 2008 at 19:45:27
abagond Says:
Sun 20 Jul 2008 at 08:38:03
Well, the trouble is that black American ideas of beauty are not completely black. Because of white American ideas of beauty and, just as important, white ideas of what it means to be black, black American beauty gets hung up on skin colour and hair.
Also, White people created this light skinned vs. dark skinned thing and just made sure that black people perpetuated it (and black people have definitely done that) so much so that White people no longer care. Light skinned people were given much greater preference and better treatment and dark skinned people shunned and mistreated. So the inner hatred started but only Black people can stop it. I am light skinned but thought I would be prettier if I was lighter still (can you believe that?!) when I was a child. Now I love my skin color and get compliments all the time from people (mainly White people) but WM never hit on me or ask me out ONLY BM and even they are really slacking off.
Mon 21 Jul 2008 at 20:00:53
Right, that follows from what you said: you are a bigger prize to black American men because they have bought into the whole light-skinned-is-good thing. Deep in the country in Cameroon in Africa, for example, light skin is not seen that way.
Tue 22 Jul 2008 at 16:55:27
I agree w/ everyone about how fluid racial perception is. I also agree with the phantom poster who broke it down about the mixed messages many black Americans seem to send when it comes to perceptions of beauty.
I do disagree with how certain subgroups or nationalities of black folks are “seen” in different parts of the country. Cape Verdeans are DEFINTELY seen as black in New England. How do I know? Because I live in New England, know several C.V.s and trust me, white folks KNOW that they’re black, no matter what “complexion” they are. And more importantly, C.V.’s tend to say that they’re black.
Same with the Louisana “Creoles”, they defintely identify w/ African American culture, for the most part. Their individual culture is defintely a hallmark of Southern black American culture.
Ethiopians and Somalis not considered black ANYWHERE in the U.S.?!?!
Are you a comedian? Trust me, no one in the U.S. will be seeing those people as anything other than black.
Enough w/ this “one drop” business. The “one drop rule” is the reason most blacks outside of Africa are considered black. You just can’t cherry-pick black people from interracial parentages or of certain phenotypes, and discount them. That’s ignorant and impossible to do. Considering the fact these same black folks have relatives who fit you all’s “perceived” idea of what a ‘black’ person looks like.
It’s white folks who see black as black, not all this “light/dark/mixed/biracial” stuff. That’s black folks, who predicatably create these distinctions. These days, many black folks will acknowledge a black child from a black/white union as “mixed”, it’s white folks who remind that same black kid that they’re not white, no matter who one of their parents was.
Tue 22 Jul 2008 at 17:32:17
Also, to the anonymous poster, I don’t think most black Americans are trying to “claim” people who are also of significant/predominate African descent. Estentially, in the western world, if you’re of known/visible significant African descent, you’re considered black (to some degree). Despite a few individuals’ personal experiences that counter this, that’s just the way it is at the end of the day. Trust me.
The reason why blacks who attempt to claim “other” status are ridiculed or dismissed by other black folks, is because of history. There’s always been black folks who went out of their way to try to be something other than black. Anything than black …As if blackness was a curse that they’re were trying to escape. When you live in a culture that tells you that “black” is less than and inferior, what do you expect?
That’s why the vast majority of black folks, no matter their appearance or thier actual biological makeup, are defiantly black-indentified. It’s partly a pride thing and it’s partly, because well, in America and much of the world, that’s exactly what “race” they/we are.
Also, the reason why the general white person is oblivious to the whole “light/dark” concept when it comes to black people, is because as I stated here in another post, the terms “light skinned” and “dark skinned” are extremely subjective and very relative. What’s “light” to a lot of black people in a comparative sense, is still “dark” to most whites.
Wed 23 Jul 2008 at 07:38:02
mynameismyname: I agree with most of what you just said, but only in regard to North America. The One Drop Rule is an Anglo-American invention as far as I know. I get heat from Brazilians in some of my other posts, for example, when I apply it to them.
Mon 28 Jul 2008 at 09:31:47
In my opinion, Alicia Keys is the most beautiful women on earth; anyway, Beyonce Knowles is more sexy than her.
Mon 28 Jul 2008 at 16:36:41
“I do disagree with how certain subgroups or nationalities of black folks are “seen” in different parts of the country. Cape Verdeans are DEFINTELY seen as black in New England. How do I know? Because I live in New England, know several C.V.s and trust me, white folks KNOW that they’re black, no matter what “complexion” they are. And more importantly, C.V.’s tend to say that they’re blacK”
Ethiopians and Somalis not considered black ANYWHERE in the U.S.?!?!
You obviously don’t know white people too well. I lived in New England. In Rhode Island to be exact. Cape Verdeans claim to be Cape Verdeans and on the census count they are not counted with African-Americans.
As far as Ethiopians and Somalians are concerned, You are wrong there too and I will tell you why. I worked for a couple of years in Minneapolis/St. Paul and there is a large population of them there.
White people are really funny when it comes too new Immigrants and race. Because it is so ingrained in them that black people are ugly, not attractive, etc, they never look beyond skin color to even see if their distorted beliefs are accurate. Thus, when they see Ethiopians, Somalians, Cape Verdeans or anyone they are forced to look at because you have to admit, many of them are stunners. They rationalize the beauty and immediately separate them from Black Americans. They have a tendency to try to want to control anyone that is dark with which they can still identify. Trust me, I know how white America is from experience. Have you ever had white people compliment you and tell you how beautiful they think you are and then have them follow the compliment with, ” well what nationality are you, you couldn’t be black.” Have you ever started work as “the only black professional ” in a work environment and had white people tell you, “if I were you, I wouldn’t go to the black churches in town or hang around in that community because most of them are etc”
Light skinned people and high tech professionals get these comments all of the time. So do the new immigrants! However, it is up to the person to let the white people know where they draw the line. Sometimes, it is possible to draw a line but you risk your job security and being labeled as having an attitude. However, many times people play the “new doll” role and by right into the game. Like I have said, You obviously don’t know white Americans the way I do.
Tue 29 Jul 2008 at 16:36:17
Interesting. Can you point us to any pictures on the Internet of the sort of light-skinned look you are talking about? I have never met anyone from Cape Verde, not knowingly at least.
Thu 31 Jul 2008 at 18:01:48
Abagond, go on Myspace, for example, and look up one of the ‘groups’ they have there for Cape Verdeans.
The majority of these people look black.
There have been some Cape Verdeans who’ve been arrested here in New England. On the arrest sheet, their race was always listed as ‘Black’. No matter their appearance or the Latin surnames.
And please “MsDay”, don’t use your own PERSONAL EXPERIENCES to color a nationwide phenomeon. That’s beyond ignorant. Antidotal evidence, no offense, is a bullshit minefield. Everyone’s experiences are different so it’s hard to come to a conclusion on just one person’s tales.
I’m actually going by the wide picture. Trust me, most Horners (horn of East Africa) and Cape Verdeans are seen as black. (And usually identify as such). Are they not?
And you have no clue who I am and what my nationality is or what my experiences with white people have been (and naturally they will be different from yours, as would most people’s) ….so that’s just ignorant.
Thu 31 Jul 2008 at 18:09:08
Oh, MsDay, there’s the tragic story of a few Somali kids who got killed by some racist white street punks in Maine years ago. When asked why they attacked and fatally ended up killing the newly-arrived Somali youngsters, one of the white men responded “Because they f***in’ n*****s”.
And I have plenty more nationwide examples ….
Thu 31 Jul 2008 at 18:17:15
MsDay,
Since you throw out personal instances, I had a C.V. buddy who got arrested for ….I won’t say on the internet …here in New England as well. Guess what race he was listed as?
Black.
Remember Jim Mendes? C.V. Radio DJ in New England from years back. What did he call himself?
“The first black radio DJ in Rhode Island”.
I remember reading a book about Ethiopian Jews and their escape from their homeland. They immigrated mainly to the U.S. and Isreal. Damn near every individual story detailed their struggle to accuse to being BLACK in mostly “white” countries.
And Keyse Jama, he was the Somali deportee from Minnesota, a few years ago.
Guess what race he was classified as?!?1
….And I can go on and on and on ’till the break of dawn with many more examples but I won’t …
Thu 31 Jul 2008 at 18:27:30
I meant to type ‘adjust’ in the above message.
Sat 9 Aug 2008 at 00:59:01
I am Black, White, and East Asian….to me; I am Beautiful. I love the fact that my hair is thick and soft and at the same time nappy. I love that I can twist it, braid it, relax it, and if I feel like it wet it and twist it in little knots and when I unravel it the next day I have a headful of curls. If you feel beautiful,you are. All women are beautiful just because we are women; but Black women have some “Bite” to them; meaning that most of us have been thru hell and back too many times to put up with alot of BS. Sometimes I get mad when I see a black man with a white woman; but then I think “what am I mad about?” I have the bloodlines in me of Africans, Europeans, and East Asians….all races of some of the most erotic, beautiful, mysterious sensuous women on earth…why should I be upset? We must feel good about who and what we are….and trip this…if white people didnt think Black was beautiful, why do they lay in the sun and pay hundreds of dollars to get brown like us; and why do they shoot fat from their behinds to have plump, lusious lips like ours? White men love Black women but alot of them don;t know how to approach us. I have dated white men and find them to “soft” for my taste…I like my men with a little “Bite” in them. BlackEurasianQueen1
Wed 13 Aug 2008 at 06:40:41
When I see a beautiful woman, my only thought is “My God she’s beautiful!” Who cares if she’s white, black, light, dark, or any other catagory you can put on them? Am I the only person who thinks that the races are mixing at such a fast pace, thanks to technology and better means of travel, that the issue will be a moot point for our decendents?
I’m a white male raised in the redneck hotbed of the Appalachians. I would love to see the day when there wasn’t a soul in the world that cared what color you are.
By the way, where is Samantha Mumba on your list?? She’s simply amazing in my opinion. Oooh and Candace Parker! I’d love her even if I wasn’t a Vol fan.
Thu 14 Aug 2008 at 12:20:52
Samantha Mumba appeared in only one of the lists I surveyed, so she did not make the cut. Same as Naomi Campbell. She is not well-known in America, but she does seem to be someone who appeals to both blacks and whites.
Thu 14 Aug 2008 at 21:11:53
Naomi Campbell is very well known in America, but her off-the-runway troubles far outshadow her looks.
Fri 15 Aug 2008 at 02:25:44
Yeah, Naomi’s one of the most well known supermodels ever.
In fact, she’s the most successful and well known black model ever, in the U.S.
Fri 15 Aug 2008 at 11:44:40
I thought for sure Naomi would make this list, but she did not.
Sun 31 Aug 2008 at 17:24:51
A while ago, I skimmed a few “sexiest women alive” lists on the internet. All were recent and all, like you know, were obviously determined by all white editors. The vast majority of the women on these lists were white. When it came to non-white women, I saw that “mixed race” Latinas and East Asians either outnumbered or equaled the number of black women on the lists. But all women of color were minorities on the list.
One striking observation I made about the East Asian women on the lists: most of them were Eurasian or “mixed”. Only one or two were “purely” Asian. So, perhaps, for white people who strongly prefer their “own kind”, a woman of color is more likely to been as desirable if she has traces of European blood?
Sun 31 Aug 2008 at 18:03:19
Damn, I had recorded several lists a while ago (all from the US) and I can’t remember most of them at the moment, but lets contrast two lists, of “sexist women alive” decided by editors (not the public) of two very different sources. One, Maxim Hot 100(undeniably white). The other, TVOne’s 16 Sexiest Black Woman alive (voted by black producers).
Maxim Hot 100
Top Ten (in descending order): Marisa Miller, Scarlett Johansson, Jessica Biel, Eva Longoria Parker, Sarah Michelle Gellar, Elisha Cuthbert, Eva Mendes, Christina Aguilera, Lindsay Lohan, Ashley Tisdale.
Race of women:
79 white men (79%): 8 out of 10 of the top ten.
9 black women (9%): In descending order- Christina Milian, Alicia Keys, Gabrielle Union, Mariah Carey, Selita Eubanks, Zoe Saldana, Ashanti, Rihanna, Beyonce Knowles.
-Only two were spawned from interracial marriages (Keys, Carey) and ranked rather low (#77, #71 respectively).
-Four are of Carribean descent: Milian, Eubanks, Saldana, Rihanna, from Cuba, Cayman Islands, Dominican Republic and Barbados respectively.
11 “Latino/Hispanic” women (11%): America Ferrera, Susie Castillo, Roselyn Sanchez, Nadine Velazquez, Sofia Vergara, Jessica Alba, Eva Mendes, Eva Longoria. (Add Cameron Diaz and Christina Aguilera, for good measure, both have “Hispanic” fathers).
-Mostly “light skinned” mestizas or “mulattas”. Some would be described as “dark” by their origin countries’ standards.
-Most have dark hair and dark eyes and an ambigious quality, an altered Southern European look.
5 East Asian (5%): Tila Tequila, Olivia Munn, Cheryl Burke, Vanessa Minillo, Vanessa Anne Hudgens
-With the lone exception of Tequila, all the other four are Eurasian – all have East Asian mothers and white fathers. (it was like that on the multiple other lists I viewed as well).
Pussycat Dolls (various members): Lead singer is Eurasian.
Sun 31 Aug 2008 at 18:14:44
TVOne’s 16 Sexiest Black Women Alive:
Top ten (in ascending order): Halle Berry, Gabrielle Union, Beyonce Knowles, Naomi Campbell, Rihanna, Paula Patton, Lauren London, Angela Bassett, Iman, Vanessa Williams.
Janet Jackson (surprised she’s so low), Jada Pinkett Smith, Alicia Keys, Tyra Banks (ditto with Janet; perhaps their stock went down?), Beverly Johnson, Alek Wek close out the list.
Special mention went to Michelle Obama.
So, 7 actresses, 4 singers (Williams can join as list as well), 5 models …pretty good balance, IMO.
Racially speaking, only 3 come from interracial parentages (Keys, London, and #1 herself, Ms. Berry). Shade-wise and ethnically, (that’s everybody pays attention, I know!-LOL), there’s a decent range: from gray eyed Vanessa Williams to coal-black Dinka Alek Wek.
One list doesn’t justify everyone’s taste. Personally, I think yours was better than any mainstream TV station or magazine’s. My list of 10 sexiest black women in the media would probably be, in specific order: Gabrielle Union, Sanaa Lathan, Joy Bryant, Rosario Dawson, Salli Richardson, Keisha Knight Pulliam, Lauren London, Meagan Good, Christina Milian, Stacey Dash. They’re all actresses! LOL.
Intresting comments, from the website where I got the list from: http://blogs.orlandosentinel.com/entertainment_tv_tvblog/2008/07/halle-berry-cho.html.
The editors at the paper want Oprah (the #1 black women, or woman any race, in the media). A few of the posters question Halle’s blackness and a few ponder why there is a list for “sexiest black women” anyway. Ha! That’s white folks for you.
Aba, what do you make of all this, the Maxim and TV One lists and just the politics of it all?
Mon 1 Sep 2008 at 11:39:10
Interesting that even with Asian women whites prefer those who are part-white over those who are pure. Kind of sad, but not surprising.
Mon 1 Sep 2008 at 11:48:29
It seems Maxim made an effort to balance the list by race – the percentages are close to what you see in America as a whole. But they clearly applied a white idea of beauty to all women: the Asians are mostly part-white and the blacks are mostly light-skinned.
You can not completely blame Maxim for that: their formula is to feature women from the entertainment industry as opposed to no-name swimsuit models like, say, Smooth magazine does. So part of the blame goes to Hollywood. But only part: even within their formula they could have had a better mix, like TV One.
If Maxim put Toccara Jones in their list, then I would be very impressed. Toccara and Angel Lola Luv are by far the most popular women on this website.
Mon 1 Sep 2008 at 11:51:49
LOL: I am not surprised that people (meaning white people) question the need for a list of black women. I guess they think that is racist – while all their lists full of white women and half-white women are not!!!
If you type “the most beautiful white women” into Google, my list is the first one named! But that is only because I think of white women as white women and not as unraced women. Most people who type “white women” into Google seem to be black (see Google Insights).
Mon 1 Sep 2008 at 12:12:01
Thanks for your list and the one from TV One! It is interesting to compare.
The post I wanted to do was not “The most beautiful black women according to white people” but “The most beautiful white women according to black men”. I got the idea from watching Lupe Fiasco’s “Superstar”: I noticed all the women were white or Latino-looking, but it seemed like they were picked by a black man. So that is what I wanted to do, but there are just not enough lists online to allow me to do that. So I wound up with this post instead!
Mon 1 Sep 2008 at 12:27:01
What I find interesting about Maxim is that the white women in Maxim Para Hombres (the Hispanic American Maxim) are so much better looking than the white women in the Anglo Maxim.
Mon 1 Sep 2008 at 19:50:33
I agree w/ most of your commentary, Aba.
See that crazy term “light skinned”…so subjective! I would only classify maybe 3 or 4 of the 9 black women Maxim chose as “light” (Keys, Carey, Rihanna w/o a doubt; Beyonce-only because she’s perceived as such by much of the public). And remember only 2 of those women came from an interracial union.
When you look at the black women in the media, you see variety. In sizes, colors, personas, etc. So there’s no excuse to have only a solitary look when celebrating or acknowleding the beauty of the sistas because the variety is there.
The thing is that white folks don’t see themselves as “white”. They’re just people. They are raceless. There’s freedom in that. This hit home dramatically once when I was working as an intern at a local cable station:
My “supervisor” asked me to categorize some headshots of various females that they wanted to use for various commericals. He casually goes, “Ok, sort them out in two categories, alright: blondes and brunettes”. The only problem w/ that strategy is that there were many headshots of non-white women! So, I made a point to create my own categories!
Such an innocent incident just goes to show you that for many general white people, non-white women aren’t even in the running, when it comes to attraction.
Whitness isn’t a racial attribute, it’s the standard.
Mon 1 Sep 2008 at 20:03:00
So, you think black casting agents cast a lot of these non-black-women-ridden music videos? I’m not entirely sure.
I know that many times a casting director would pick the models and the rappers and the record company people will approve the ladies.
Few rappers have the pull to choose the women in their videos.
One thing I know is that whatever women are being used in music videos, they don’t reflect their real life at all. The vast majority of these rappers (similar to black pro athletes) are married/involved with BLACK WOMEN. Usually an obvious black women at that. And a lot of times these women aren’t anyone’s idea of “eye candy”. LOL.
Tue 2 Sep 2008 at 01:35:23
I just watched that Lupe video. You’re right, not a black woman in sight in that clip! LOL. In fairness though, that song was not targeted to the “urban” audience but more so the general pop one (like most mainstream rap) so that may explain the seemingly deliberate use of non-black women in that video.
Here’s a rap video that IS targeted to the “urban” audience (notice the differences), from a southern rapper named Rick Ross: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yRKtBgkn17U
Tue 2 Sep 2008 at 11:35:54
I do not know who does the casting in most rap videos. I wonder about that. But it just seemed like it was a black man in the case of “Superstar” even though all the women were white – but I do not know the facts even in that case. It is just how it seemed. They were not the sort of white women that most white American men would pick.
Tue 2 Sep 2008 at 11:41:57
I think Ne-Yo’s “Go On Girl” is a case where a white man picked the girls but a black man approved them or maybe vice versa. Not saying Ne-Yo himself necessarily had any input.
Tue 2 Sep 2008 at 11:48:47
Most of the women in that Rick Ross video (”Here I Am”) do fit sort of the black idea of beauty that I have been talking about: light skin, long black hair, near-white features. I think in this case the women were put there (by whoever) to appeal to black men.
Tue 2 Sep 2008 at 15:39:49
About music videos:
I have a strong lurking feel that a white, or at least, non-black person cast that “Superstar” clip. I mean, that song was targeted to a certain audience and I think they intentionally used people who reflect that demographic.
Were we watching the same Rick Ross video?
I saw VARIETY in that clip. That’s what made me know that it was intended for an “urban” audience. The lead girl is not ‘light skinned’ and has a short hairdo, that deviates from that idea that you say they push. There were a number of OBVIOUS black women along with a few racially ambigious/Latin American types.
Eh …I doubt black men are the intended demo for rap videos or any videos, in all honesty. The majority of purchasers of rap music are WHITE. The second highest consumers of “urban” music are BLACK WOMEN. So, their aim for these videos and songs, has to have that in consideration. It wouldn’t make sense for them to attempt to pander to what they think black men will like because they’re not the main consumers, you see what I mean?
(Case in point: The vast majority of Ne-Yo’s fanbase is (BLACK) FEMALE, so that video or any video of his is not for black men.)
Tue 2 Sep 2008 at 16:44:35
I agree about the intended audiences of hip hop videos and Ne-Yo, but I think we have a different idea of what counts as light skin, which, as you have pointed out elsewhere, is pretty subjective.
Note that I did not say all the women in the Rick Ross video were all light-skinned and so on, just most. The leading woman is certainly “blacker” than most of the others.
Going just by memory:
Light: Rihanna, Melyssa Ford, Beyonce, Alicia Keys, Lauren London, Amy Holmes, Angel Lola Luv, Meagan Good.
Not light: Kelly Rowland, Gabrielle Union, Buffie the Body, Ki Toy Johnson, Tyra Banks, Naomi Campbell, Estelle, Toccara Jones.
Tue 2 Sep 2008 at 19:16:45
See, the term “light” is REALLY TOO SUBJECTIVE.
Meagan, Angel, and Lauren are not light to me, at all. That’s the first time I’ve seen Meagan and Angel described as “light”. Lauren is more caramel-complexioned, which to me is medium-brown.
It’s funny, I’ve seen Tyra described as “light skinned” several times online. Sometimes by non-blacks.
It’s all such a matter of individual perspective.
For me, when it comes to a “shade scale” for people of African descent, I think it goes like this:
FAIR= pale, depigmentated (ex. Lena Horne, Alicia Keys, Harold Ford,Jr.)
LIGHT BROWN= tannish/beige-toned/yellow-tinted (ex. Rihanna, Amy Holmes, Paula Patton)
MEDIUM BROWN= caramel/solid mid-range brown tones (ex. most of the black women in the media ranging from Meagen Good to Gabrielle Union to Sanaa Lathan to Toccarra to Condoleeza)
DARK BROWN= darker shades of brown (ex. Estelle, Bria Myles, India.Arie)
VERY DARK BROWN= very dark shades of brown (ex. Alek Wek, Akon, Michael Jordan, Wesley Snipes)
The overwhelming majority of black folks, in the US, from my observations, would easily fit into the Medium Brown and Dark Brown categories. Light Brown would be a visible minority, as well as Very Dark Brown types.
The majority of the black women in the media (TV, film, ads, music, politics, etc.) would fall comfortably into the Medium Brown category. Alot of Light Brown and Dark Brown types are also visible.
Do you agree with the scale and the assessment?
Tue 2 Sep 2008 at 20:17:49
I agree with everything you just said except that Angel and Meagan Good still seem light to me.
Meagan Good: In Google Images, she is more often medium than light, so I can see why you would disagree, but sometimes she does look light. It might just be a matter of which pictures of her stick in our heads. I mainly remember her from “You Got Served”:
http://content8.flixster.com/question/51/64/73/5164730_std.jpg
In that picture she does not look any darker than Omarion, who I have never seen as particularly light, so maybe her hair affects my judgement too. And Hollywood lighting.
Angel Lola Luv: I mainly remember Angel from King magazine and there she is light:
http://www.sandrarose.com/images/angellolaluvbigass.jpg
Again, in Google Images she looks both light and medium – to me. It might be that her lightness comes more from Photoshop than God.
Tue 2 Sep 2008 at 20:26:46
When judging someone’s skin tone (or any facet of their physical appearance overall), it’s important to keep in mind how lighting can be a big part of that.
Meagan and Angel probably, like any black person, look “lighter” in certain pics and clips because of LIGHTING, as well as makeup. I’ve seen several pics of both ladies in CANDID settings, and there’s nothing pale, yellow-ish tinted, beige-ish or tannish about their color at all. They’re all solidly brown, they’re in normal range as most other black folks.
But then again, it’s all a matter of subjectivity. They may very well be “light and bright” to you, based on your perspective of color and what you’ve seen before.
Tue 2 Sep 2008 at 20:39:11
I can grant that they are probably medium keeping in mind all the tricks Hollywood and magazines can play with how a person looks.
But I also think each person and each part of the country draws the line a bit differently.
Wed 3 Sep 2008 at 01:38:12
Exactly. That’s what I’ve been trying to emphasize all this time about that matter.
To show how much of an individual opinion an assessment of someone’s physical appearance is:
The Bollywood actress, Bipasha Basu, talks about the racial abuse she has endured from whites as well as the discrimination she’s faced in her home country of India as a woman who is “dark skinned” in this article-
http://www.gobollywood.com/interview/2007/12/racial-abuse-bipasha.html
I have heavy doubts that Basu would be considered “dark skinned” by any black person. It just goes to show you, that there is no definitive answer at all. It’s fluid and individual. It’s all about personal perception and locality.
Thu 4 Sep 2008 at 00:17:25
Wow. I never once thought of Bipasha Basu as dark-skinned! I even put her at #8 in my list of the most beautiful white women:
http://abagond.wordpress.com/2007/06/16/the-most-beautiful-white-women/
Thu 4 Sep 2008 at 02:37:27
LOL. You’re the reverse of the editors of these white-women-ridden “sexy women” lists, huh? Just like they put non-white women on their list to fufill a sense of false sense of “diversity”, a large portion of the ‘white’ ladies on your list would never be classified or perceived as such in the U.S.!
Thu 4 Sep 2008 at 11:39:36
LOL. I know, I have to work on those lists
Sun 7 Sep 2008 at 18:28:49
Dear Unique says,
I had to respond to your comment because 1 i sense some anger or hurt directed towards darker skinned black women and also because I think you misunderstand some of the views on this topic generally. Nobody is saying that at least one dark skinned wome should be put on this list because she is dark skinned.
I believe the view many are trying to put across is that dark skinned beauty is not appreciated by the wider society in spite of the fact that many of these women have dark skinned ancestors.
Of course these women are beautiful no one doublts that at least generally. But it begs the question in some minds that is so it difficult to find dark skinned women’ beauty en par with the majority of the women .
No one some pity number to be on every list but what i suspect we want is that our features who we are what you see in the flesh everyday to be appreciated.
to you it may boil down to lack of self esteem or self hate but no one is born tis way we are conditioned this way based on particular practices in our culture and media.
yes the bold and brave thing to do would be to get over it and love yourself, and there are some who manage to do that and I applaud them. but i believe for the majority of us its not you find yourself wanting to straighten your hair and all sorts of ridiculous things that would be too exhausting to mention.
The point is when a whole group in a society or culture are voicing similar complaints something has to be going wrong in respect of ho0w they are treated (apartheid). The aforementioned does not automatically exclude the fact that we ought to take responsibility for own well being but ultimately to accomplish any thing or progress you need two hands to clap and its more efficient in that way anyway
Tue 16 Sep 2008 at 06:16:03
Where’s Rihanna?
Tue 16 Sep 2008 at 23:08:46
Rihanna did not make enough lists. Sorry.
Mon 22 Sep 2008 at 18:46:50
Theres no question that the women on the ten most beautiful black women list, are beautiful that is undeniable and is not the issue.
Where most black people would object to, is not neccessarily to do with those women being light skinned or having almost European features, but its that its always been those kind of women who are chosen from day one, white people have never accepted our differences the very dark skin tone and typical negroe features they’ve only ever shown attractive black women in their TV shows and Movies who look light skin and have almost European features, whilst the unattractive and obese roles are given to dark skin women with typical black features.
Someone mentioned that some white women didn’t make a most beautiful women in the World list and yet you don’t get white people or white women complaining,but I bet they weren’t left out cause they looked too Causcian or that their skin was too pale.
Try Imagining a world where the only attractive white women shown in the media were those who have almost negroid features( not just the lips) and who had very dark skinned how would white people feel then.
Mon 22 Sep 2008 at 18:53:09
They’ve “only” shown “light skinned” black women with “European” features?
You sure about that?
The reality may be the opposite. You’re right, there’s never been that many EXTREMELY DARK black women, but to say that the only or that ‘most’ of the black women who are attractive and presented as such in the industry all look white is an untruth.
Wed 24 Sep 2008 at 00:35:49
What I meant to have said was that the American media has only shown attractive black women who are “either” light skinned “or” have almost European features,you just can’t in their eyes be dark skinned with typical black features and be attractive.
The black media, black Rap and R&B artist, as well the so called civil rights groups are just as responsible, for you don’t hear them objecting to this practice or standing up for dark skin black women with typical black features, infact when have you ever heard any black church the so called moral voice for the black community speak out against this, even the Nation of Islam and all their rants about black impowerment stand silent on this one.
I believe that model Alek Wek and Grace Jones were chosen cause they look different even amongst dark skin women with negroid features, not cause they were beautiful, I don’t believe that those two black women are the best that dark skin women have to offer, I’ve seen better looking, black people need to feel more proud about how they look and their features, something we never have since white people came along, who for their part have endevoured to make us feel insecure about ourselves.
Wed 24 Sep 2008 at 01:50:56
Hmm …interesting angle, Ryon.
What do you make of Oluchi? She’s one of the top black runway models out now. Nigerian woman. She’s gotten some big deal deals. She might appeal to your tastes, as she is a “typical black girl”, by your standards.
Check out the last issue of Ebony, with Michelle Obama (a beautiful, high-achieving sister who’s VERY representative of everyday black women, physically). There’s a great spread with a Native African model within. Also check out the current issue of Essence with Mo’Nique (ditto w/ Michelle). Another great spread within with beautiful black women of ALL TYPES. You might like it. If you can’t find both magazines at a local newstand or book store, try a local library. The images are defintely out there. You can’t expect to read Seventeen or Glamour and except to see non-white women represented properly.
Grace Jones and Alek Wek are not exceptions. They’re just among the most well known. There’s more black women who might appeal to your tastes, but they are more known among high fashion industry circles than the mainstream entertainment press (which covers mostly white individuals). If you want, I can refer you to some of them (because there’s many).
You can’t rely on the mainstream media to make you feel good. They are there to make money. And even if you do put a bunch of “extremely dark skinned” black women with “typical black features” (which are???; what if you’re a full blooded African who has a narrow nose or slim lips???) on a slew of US covers and whatnot, the segment of people who have negative feelings about such a look will have their outlook unchanged. It’s less about the media and more about an overall societal attitude that deems blackness as “less than”.
Wed 24 Sep 2008 at 16:56:34
I have to agree with Ryon: the true range of beauty of black women is largely missing from the mainstream media in America. There is mainly just:
1. Kind of white looking (Halle Berry, Beyonce and most of those listed above)
2. Cutesy pie (Gabrielle Union, Sanaa Lathan, Vivica Fox)
3. “Exotic” (Alek Wek, Grace Jones, Iman)
And most of them are thin too.
But you can see way more than that just walking down the street.
Wed 24 Sep 2008 at 21:34:44
I agree Abagond,
But why do so many blacks look to the mainstream media to represent them in their full scope? I mean, it’s obvious where “they” feel that blacks ’stand’. The white-ran media wil never elevate black beauty to the same level as white beauty because they would promote equality and how does this country function without the racial divide???
Also, like I said, even if they did show the true range of black beauty, the same people, white and non-white, will still have their aversions to it. It’s less about ’standards of beauty’ (although that plays a part) and more about the overall attitude about blackness. Don’t you agree?
Thu 25 Sep 2008 at 01:33:56
Excuse me for my ignorance mynameismyname I can’t say I have heard of Oluchi, and I will try to look out for those magazine issues.
I have to say that of late I have avoided black American beauty magazines, cause in the past I have found them trying to judge black beauty by white standards like trying to fit square pegs into round holes and I’ve found the same with modelling industry.
It is hard to delve deeper and try to find decent images of attractive dark skin women with typical black features I wouldn’t know where to look, I’ve “googled” attractive black women and all I get is the light skinned or those with almost European features perphaps you(mynameismyname) could give me some black models and I could look them up on google.
Your right some races in Africa like certain tribes in Ethopia and the somalians have very narrow noses and some of them have comparatively small lips.
Someone once posted a picture of some Nigerian models on a blog page but even though they were mostly dark skinned and had black features, I hope I’m not being picky but most West Africans I’ve met don’t have oval faces and to be fair it doesn’t suit you if you have certain features, they should have been true to themselves.
Thu 25 Sep 2008 at 07:46:59
[This comment is from mynameismyname. For some reason he had trouble posting it, so I am posting it for him]
Ryon C,
You are picky! LOL. I kid.
One site that I can refer you to is http://gorgeousblackwomen.blogspot.com/. There’s defintely a variety of women on there as well as some examples of the black look that you are looking for.
Tell me what you think about Oluchi.
As far as some examples of the look that you’re talking about, perhaps: Ajuma, Rachael Williams, Januel McKenzie, Honorie Uwera, Valery Prince, Tomiko Fraser, Abgani Darego, Nina Keita, Kiara Kabukuru. There’s more even though those are the ones that I can remember off the top of my head. I can refer you to more if you want, of various beauty queens and models as the such.
Thu 25 Sep 2008 at 21:38:57
Wow, I remember Kiara!
Thu 25 Sep 2008 at 21:59:00
“Also, like I said, even if they did show the true range of black beauty, the same people, white and non-white, will still have their aversions to it. It’s less about ’standards of beauty’ (although that plays a part) and more about the overall attitude about blackness. Don’t you agree?”
Yes, I think it is partly standards of beauty, partly feelings about blackness but, in the case of whites, I wonder how much of it is just inborn:
http://abagond.wordpress.com/2008/05/27/is-beauty-hard-wired/
Mon 29 Sep 2008 at 17:58:12
I have some beautiful dark skin black women you could do a image search on, using google and they are cleo higgins, michelle gayle and nia jai
Tue 30 Sep 2008 at 04:31:25
Thanks for the suggestions! I like how Cleo looks.
Wed 1 Oct 2008 at 23:48:40
I am of Jamaican origin but find that they can be unapologetically predjucial towards dark skin black women in their beauty contest and media productions, I see them as being one of the worst culprits amongst black people when it comes to this, and for a island of 90 odd per cent black people and where most are dark skin there behaviour I find is quite backwards .
For those who are unaware of Jamaica’s colonial past, when the British ruled they used have a caste system whereby people were classed or socially graded according to the colour of their skin, thus the lighter you were, the better you were treated, the higher positions you were given, and the more you were paid.
But that still makes no excuses.
Thu 2 Oct 2008 at 01:48:20
I’m aware of Jamaica’s particular history of colorism. Their beauty paegants used to be infamous examples of such discrimination. The women who would win were always very racially ambigious or sometimes, white-looking. Very unrepresenative of a country thats 90% black African-derived. (Thanks to the slave revolt that occurred on the island, black Jamaicans are far less “mixed” than black Americans).
Yet, the tide seems to be changing, perhaps. Zahra Redwood, a very pretty Rastafarian lady, won Miss Jamaica last year. Defintely a breakthrough. A positive one, and hopefully, a step in a better, more represenative (and unbiased) direction.
Here’s the contestants of this year’s Miss Jamaica World: http://www.missjamaicaworld.com/content/home/
Brittany Lyon won.
Ryon, is the color caste system weakened nowdays in Jamaica or is it still present?
Tue 7 Oct 2008 at 18:19:23
It is still present though not as bad as it used to be, though their beauty shows still have some way to go.
Sun 12 Oct 2008 at 17:15:10
i feel like halle,beyonce,tyra,mariah,and thandie are overrated.dont get me wrong they are pretty but they are so overrated it aint even funny.like if you saw halle berry in the street or beyonce in the street and they were not famous you would not be calling them the most beautiful black women alive.you would say oh shes really pretty.vanessa williams,alicia keys,iman,and angela bassett are so underrated they should be in the top 4 spots.iman vanessa and angela just because they look so good to be so old.also someone on here said something about rihanna being lighter than lauren london.that is complete bs.also skin color dont mean shit to genetics.
Sun 12 Oct 2008 at 23:10:50
DCnot240,
You must be fairly young! “So good to be so old”?! What are you trying to say?
Black don’t crack! That’s why so many black women (and other women of color) remain so physically youthful and stunning in their mature years.
As far as your opinion of the various female celebs looks, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Personally w/ the exception of Angela, Iman, and maybe Vanessa back in the bay, I don’t think that any of the other women listed above are anything special. Far from ugly but I wouldn’t look twice if I saw them in the street. Neither would many of their civilian admirers.
Mon 13 Oct 2008 at 12:54:36
I agree with both of you: Beyonce and Halle are good looking, but they are hardly the best looking black women out there. Of the women on this list, I think Angela Bassett is by far the most beautiful.
Wed 29 Oct 2008 at 06:02:39
Oh, these women are really ugly and only considered beautiful because they have white blood in them.
ARE YOU FUCKING STUPID????!!!!!!!! I don’t care if you’re black, white, grey, brown, yellow, red or blotchy splotchy. These women are gorgeous.
Fag.
Thu 11 Dec 2008 at 07:08:48
left out gabrielle union….she is too pretty.
Thu 11 Dec 2008 at 13:50:36
Jerome: no one, black or white, said any of these women were ugly.
Thu 11 Dec 2008 at 13:55:04
ebz: Gabrielle Union is beautiful and even in a way that I think white people like, but she is mainly in “black” films, those where most of the cast is black, so she is not as well known to whites as the women above. The same goes for Nia Long.
Wed 17 Dec 2008 at 13:27:34
Why do you care what white people think? It’s about time black people told whites where to go.
Wed 17 Dec 2008 at 15:36:16
I agree, Black Brazillian!
Who gives a crap what whites think? We already know how they roll. Although, I think these lists are interesting from a social standpoint, I wouldn’t use them as the indicator of what a whole segment of people think about beauty. Remember, a small group of editors created these lists referenced above, not the general public. Those editors, for better or worse, do not represent general white taste. They represent a specific publication/website that doesn’t want to deviate too far from their aesthetic.
About Gabby Union: She’s been in several “white” films (Bring It On, Ten Things I Hate About You, etc.). She’s also made People’s 50 Most Beautiful People In The World this year as well as the Maxim 100 and other mostly-white vanity lists. So, they know who she is.
Wed 17 Dec 2008 at 17:44:45
Oh, cool (about Gabby).
On caring what white people think:
On one level, yes, who cares. Instead of complaining, for example, that Vogue does not care for black beauty or fashion, blacks should create their own Vogue and their own fashion industry. I know it is easier said than done, but Black America has more money than all of Brazil, which has its own fashion industry and supermodels.
On another level, though, white America has the power to affect how the whole world thinks through their huge media machine. So what they think does matter, unfortunately.
Wed 17 Dec 2008 at 18:23:12
You’re right, what white America thinks does color worldwide attitude.
However, black Americans DO have their own venues for fashion and beauty. It’s just since blacks are in the minority in the U.S., you wouldn’t be bombarded with these images as you would with the white mainstream ones.
Mon 5 Jan 2009 at 04:48:58
I’m sorry but your statistics are incorrect and your last statement of “half these women have a white or near white mother” is also incorrect. Irregardless of the mixture of these women, it is their black features that stand out and makes them considered beautiful amongst white America. And I truly hope that you are not implying that if one is mixed, then they are better and seemingly more attractive!
Mon 5 Jan 2009 at 05:20:59
There are nine women. Four have white mothers: Halle, Thandie, Mariah and Alicia. A fifth has a near-white mother: Beyonce. Yes, Beyonce’s mother is black, no question about it, but her look is what I am counting as near-white in this case. Here is a picture of Beyonce with her mother, Tina Knowles:
http://www.origo.hu/i/0511/20051121beyoncekn.jpg
So that is five out of nine: 56%. Over half.
Yes, I do think that their being mixed is what helped to get them on the list. That is the most straightforward conclusion.
The way Beyonce, Mariah and Halle have all become whiter looking as time goes by supports the idea that it is their whiteness, not their blackness, that white America likes in their looks.
Mon 5 Jan 2009 at 06:19:23
I agree 100% with your comment above, Aba. The only correction I have to make is about Thandie Newton. Her mother is black (a Shona princess), it’s her father who is white.
Just to play the devil’s advocate, what’s particularly racist about people who have an Eurocentric standard of beauty liking black women who look whiter? If you’re into white women, that’s all you’ve seen and therefore, what you base beauty on, then wouldn’t the non-white who look closest to that be the ones that’ll appeal to you?
I think the whitewashing that has occurred over time with the majority of the women listed above is pathetic. But I can understand it.
I mean, Kim Kadashian, Angelina Jolie and Jennifer Lopez are thfdd non-black American women that many black American males liked. They liked the “black”-associated features in those women. Notice that Kim and Angelina don’t look like typical Anglo white women.
Even with you, your list of “beautiful white women”, was filled with mixed race women. What’s the difference betweeen your list and several of the white-made ones? You like the non-white in those women, no? Because your racial perceptions of beauty isn’t Eurocentric.
Is that really racist? Or are people just more inclined to find people outside their race more attractive if they have features that they’re more familiar with?
Again, I’m just playing the devil’s advocate here! (I actually agree with your premise).
Mon 5 Jan 2009 at 09:21:37
Sorry, my mistake about Thandie. I had it right in the post, but wrong in my comment: it is her father, not her mother, who is white.
Mon 5 Jan 2009 at 09:32:00
mynameismyname: Right, my list of beautiful white women is a good analogue of this list. Especially before I kicked off Ann Curry, Bipasha Basu and Yasmeen Ghauri (sniff) because commenters informed me they were not white enough. What I like most in white women are things that show up more strongly in black women.
Mon 5 Jan 2009 at 09:42:09
Racism and beauty:
Some of what men prefer in women in inborn. For example, I think that most white men (not all, of course) have an inborn desire for light-skinned women. If so, then it is only natural, not racist.
On the other hand, there is in America, among many blacks and whites, this feeling that anything black is not as good as something white. That plays itself out in many ways and one of them is in a profound underappreciation of the beauty of dark-skinned women. That is racist.
Mon 5 Jan 2009 at 19:18:42
I agree 100% Abagond.
That idea that black is inherently subordinate to white is also the reason behind the dismal marriage/dating rates between black women and white (and non-black) men as well as the general underappreciation of black female beauty.
At least I believe it to be.
Sun 25 Jan 2009 at 02:44:27
To Abagond
Just out of curiosity, how did you conduct this survey? Did you poll random white people, and ask whom they found to be the most attractive black women or did you have a list already prepared for them in which all they had to do is select the women from “your” already drawn-out list of black women? I ask because I conducted a similar survey amongst white males in Texas (Austin, Dallas/Ft. Worth, Houston) and found the opposite to be true. While it is simple to say that whites are drawn to black women with euro-centric features, women such as Kerry Washington, Meagan Good, Jill-Marie Jones, and Zoe Saldana (who is of Puerto Rican and Domincan descent…still black!) where preferred and considered beautiful black women. Also light skin is not synonymous with euro centric “features”, you can be light yet have coarse hair, full lips, and a wide nose. By the way Ethiopians, Burundians, and Egyptians and many other African countries have what you would call euro-centric features and they are not white nor are they mixed with it. Therefore, I remain with my orginal statement that it is not the euro-centric features in these women that make them beautiful it is their black—African features that make them beautiful, in what shallowness would say is their “exoticism” Like your statistics on half those black women having “white mothers”, your statistics on attractive black women according to white people is also incorrect. If anything beauty should be attributed to the African features in women, you give whiteness too much credit.
Sun 25 Jan 2009 at 03:29:37
I put “the most beautiful women” into Google and then counted how many times each black woman appeared in the first 100 websites. That is what the numbers stand for. Read the post if you want to know more about how I did it and how I knew which websites were done by white people and so on.
I pointed out that so many of them had white parents because it was an extremely high number. I mean, how many ordinary black people have a white parent? A few do, but not close to half of them. Nothing like it is on this list.
Sun 25 Jan 2009 at 03:44:11
beautiful brown:
Halle Berry – white mother
Beyonce – near-white mother
Tyra Banks -
Mariah Carey – white mother
Thandie Newton – white father
Vanessa Williams –
Iman –
Angela Bassett -
Alicia Keys – white mother
Sun 25 Jan 2009 at 04:59:12
beautiful brown said: it is not the euro-centric features in these women that make them beautiful it is their black—African features that make them beautiful, in what shallowness would say is their “exoticism”………….
If anything beauty should be attributed to the African features in women, you give whiteness too much credit.
*******************
I agree with this.
Sun 25 Jan 2009 at 16:03:20
I agree 100% with Beautiful Brown. You said it perfectly.
Sun 25 Jan 2009 at 16:11:50
To correspond with Beautiful Brown, I remember looking at a lengthy thread at a very white, very “mainstream” website that saw the obviously, all-white posters discussing “the most beautiful famous black women”. Most of the women posted above were barely mentioned.
Hollywood and the general public’s idea of a beautiful black woman seems to be more in the Kerry W./Gabby U/Sanaa L. mode. (All three ladies came up heavily in that aforementioned mentioned list and they also make many “most beautiful” list complied by white editors- at least Gabby does). As someone who dabbles in the industry, I can back this up.
And I’ve also tried to explain to Aba that “light skinned” does not equate whitness, considering the fact that most black Americans who could be described as “lightly complexioned” have the same diluted West African features that supposedly “non-light skinned” people have. Most of these people DO NOT look “near white”. Not in a million years. The white/ambigious types are a smaller minority, more prevalent in certain parts of the country (Louisiana, Virginia, Maryland, D.C.) but not in general.
Again, Beautiful Brown’s comment was very on-point!
Mon 26 Jan 2009 at 01:38:23
Two questions:
1. If white people are so into black or Afrocentric beauty (cough) then why is it that Gabrielle Union did not appear more often in websites listing beautiful women? And why have Beyonce, Halle and Mariah made the cover of American Maxim but she has not if she is so good looking to white people?
2. Gabrielle, Sanaa and Kerry all have what I call a cutsie-pie face, which Hollywood (but certainly not the fashion industry!) prefer in its women, white or black. Would you say these women have a Eurocentric face or an Afrocentric face or neither?
Mon 26 Jan 2009 at 03:59:38
How can you even define what Afrocentric and Euro centric looks like? Aren’t people way too diverse for that?
Mon 26 Jan 2009 at 19:58:12
Aba,
A few months back I listed a few findings about UPDATED (your list are older since your entry is from some time back) lists that selected white editors comprised of “hot” famous women. Gabby and Kerry showed up several times. Zoe Saldana and Joy Bryant- to my surpise, considering that they are not tabloid darlings- also appeared several times as well.
And why do you use irrelevant lists made by a few EDITORS as indicators of what “White America” likes????
That’s like a white person reading a few back issues of Black Enterprise and Jet and concluding afterwards, “This is what black businessmen do” or “This is what black people think”.
You’ll never know what white Americans(because of course they are all the same, right?) find attractive in black women. It’s impossible to get a comprehensive overview. The world just doesn’t work like that. You should know that.
What me and Beautiful Brown are realistically suggesting is that: EVERYTHING IS NOT AS CUT AND DRY AS YOU AND MANY OTHERS MAKE IT OUT TO BE.
It’s complex and not rigid.
You can lazily say “Oh, white people like light skinned black chicks because they’re not real black women anyway” but you have to explain why Tajaru Henson and Viola Davis are the only black women who received Oscar nomations this season. Neither are those women “look white”. This is merely an example, of course.
And Serendipity is correct, what is Afrocentric? Eurocentric? So, Somalis, Ethiopians and Eritreans have “Eurocentric” features even tho they have no trace of Euro blood??? Same with many West Africans? Irishmen have Afrocentric features because they tend to have kinky, tight hair? East Asians have “Afrocentric” features because many have broad noses??
What is a true “Afrocentric” woman? Jet black complexion, extremely tightly curled Afro, broad nose, thick, wide lips and big eyes???? Everything else is “Eurocentric”?
Somebody else help me out here.
Mon 26 Jan 2009 at 20:52:00
It seems that Afrocentric and Eurocentric are not useful terms since they are so hard to pin down.
Mon 26 Jan 2009 at 20:59:11
AskMen.com just came out with their list of the 99 top women. Here are the black and Hispanic women who made the list (according to the blog Gorgeous Black Women):
8. Rihanna
13. Halle Berry
17. Selita Ebanks
43. Zoe Saldana
50. Beyonce Knowles
63. Dania Ramirez
77. Cassie Ventura
88. Leona Lewis
92. Alicia Keys
This comes from an online vote that ten million people took part in.
See their pictures of these nine women here:
http://gorgeousblackwomen.blogspot.com/2009/01/askmencom-top-99-women-of-2009.html
See the whole list starting with #99:
http://www.askmen.com/specials/2009_top_99/kate-winslet-99.html
Tue 27 Jan 2009 at 00:15:36
Yeah, the terms “Afrocentric” and “Eurocentric” are extremely useless.
Askmen.com poll: OK, it seems like you missed the whole gist of what I was saying above.
You’ll never get a real view of what “white America” thinks of “black beauty”, no matter how many useless internet lists one comes up with.
So, usually when white men are romantically involved with a black woman, they don’t look near-white. We’ve discussed this several times.
On the mainstream media front, Queen Latifah, Miss Union, Zoe Saldana, Mary J. Blige and Angela Bassett all made People Magazine’s 50 Most Beautiful Women recently. Michelle Obama won some white fashion ‘zine’s “Most Stylish Woman Of The Year” award. Jennifer Hudson’s made the cover of Vogue, Beyonce Knowles has not.
….I could go on.
What does this prove?
Cut and dry? Or a bit more complex???
Tue 27 Jan 2009 at 01:43:33
Ha, I didn’t know Irishmen had kinky hair. And yes I think what “white America” thinks of “black beauty” is too complicated to put into words
Tue 27 Jan 2009 at 03:35:14
I agree with that. Otherwise this post would not stretch into over a hundred comments!
Tue 27 Jan 2009 at 03:42:43
mynameismyname said:
Askmen.com poll: OK, it seems like you missed the whole gist of what I was saying above.
No, I read about it last night and was going to throw it in here regardless.
I know that going by what white editors of magazines and websites is of limited use and can only suggest rather than prove. But the thing is, it is part of what little we have to go by – in addition to Hollywood, the fashion industry and who we see white men go out with. The trouble is that each of those four things gives a different sort of answer.
Tue 27 Jan 2009 at 03:47:17
mynameismyname said:
So, usually when white men are romantically involved with a black woman, they don’t look near-white. We’ve discussed this several times.
Not only that but I wrote a post on it where I said pretty much that:
http://abagond.wordpress.com/2008/05/28/black-women-that-white-men-like/
But you said there is no one “type” and thought I was overly struck by the fact that the women were not near-white.
Tue 27 Jan 2009 at 04:15:26
“The trouble is that each of those four things gives a different sort of answer.”
Exactly. What I’ve been trying to say all this time.
Do you think it’s weird, on some level, that you seem extremely fixated on what you think white people think of black beauty? (and black people, in general) In a socialogical way, it’s interesting, sure. But damn. I mean, you’ll never get a clear answer, as we all can agree on. Why not try to explore how actual black women think of their beauty? Who are the most beautiful famous black women according to black Americans, per se? That means more, in my opinion. Like a poster before me said, you give whites way too much credit. They are not the standard and their (perceived) opinion does not hold more weight. Hell, did the majority of them vote from Obama? No. But did Obama still make it to the White House? Yes.
And yes, there really is no ONE “type” of women that ANY man goes for. It’s all individual. And yes, you admitted that it fascinated you that near-white looking women weren’t the ones with white men. To you, they’re the obvious choice to the
general person. To me, they are not. They do not represent the great majority of black women, anywhere in the world. And they are not seen as the height of beauty to everyone either. Not matter what random internet lists, disgrunted anonymous internet posters or anyone else tells says.
Tue 27 Jan 2009 at 04:24:12
I’m sorry Abagond, but correct me if I am wrong but Askmen.com is not solely for white men and a plethora of men from various ethnicities are allowed to poll aside from the white male…which would conclude what? That the list mentioned above is inconclusive to what white men find attractive. Faulty data and poor research but that is neither here nor there. I am assuming that you do not agree with the research that you found because your personal list was drastically different from this one, but you seem to insinuate that white people find only, as you would say, women with a white parent or near white look attractive. I concur immensely with Mynameismyname “It’s impossible to get a comprehensive overview. The world just doesn’t work like that.” and to further expound on this concept why is it that we place these aspects of beauty upon black women?
It is sad that society places black women in a box and even worst when other black Americans try to place confines on black beauty…I never have to argue the case that Morris Chestnut, Denzel Washington, Will Smith, Shemar Moore and etc. are handsome black men and even more surprising I never have to break down their attractiveness according to western societal ideals. They are handsome and society finds them handsome because they just are! They are good looking men but when it comes to the beauty of our women, we dissect and separate those aspects of what should be merely an attractive black woman into “oh she’s attractive FOR a black woman and why is this?, ‘O cause she looks white and has those Eurocentric feautres!” That is insulting and degrading. Afrocentric or Euro-centric, if these terms are too broad to define then how about this Abagond, these woman amongst many other beautiful black sistas are beautiful, there is something that is attractive about them and that either stands out to some and not to others, that is appealing to most but not to all; eliminate euro-centricism and come to the conclusion that people find them attractive because They Just Are! But I thank you for your post it has enlightened me greatly and given me the desire to pursue further studies African-American Culture and black-women in western society. God-bless!
Tue 27 Jan 2009 at 06:34:18
Beautiful Brown said it best.
For what it’s worth:
I’m currently watching the E! channel. They’re reviewing celebrity red carpet appearal. They (all white panel) were raving over some new black actress who has a very nice rich, even dark brown complexion. They were raving about how beautiful she is and how the eveness of her skin made her yellow ensemble even more beautiful. Then they went on to fawn over Taraji Henson. They were the only two black women who’ve appeared on this specific show.
Like I was saying, not so cut and dry.
Mon 16 Feb 2009 at 15:34:19
I think there is a confusion with race and ethnicity. As a Cape Verdean, i know i am of black african decent, but if someone asks me what I am, I say cape verdean, because why would anyone ask you what race you are? why would i ask a frenchman if he is white? my culture is that of the republic of cape verde. It’s unique and different from other black cultures. just like the African American culture is different from the Nigerian etc…
Africans come from all walks of life,cultures, religions, etc. As far as the lightskinned thing, it’s just stupidity. Cape Verde was one of the points of the slave trade so people from all over the world would stop there, West Africans, Arabs, Indians and European etc. and there was definately alot of mixing so genetically 80% of the country is mixed. And this thing about “afro features” can get really confusing fast, for example there are people in west africa who have many different types of features who are pure africans. Features vary from region to region.
Mon 16 Feb 2009 at 17:08:33
I agree with loli and I loved when he/she said, “why would I ask a frenchman if he is white?”
I also don’t like just calling myself black because there is so much variety in everyone’s racial background and because there is so much variety in the places that black people come from. I also get so tired of all the many arguments over who is this and who is that. And then the different terms for blacks in American (black, African American, Black American), and the whole Tiger Woods argument. Just looking at him I would guess he was Filipino, or something, anyway, so in the end, what does it all matter.
Depending on who’s asking or where I am, I would call myself American, or Liberian, or Liberian American. I noticed that when I was in Europe (specifically Prague)the shopkeeper wasn’t satisfied when I told him that I was from American. “But where are you really from?” he’d asked me again, and so I just told him I was Liberian.
He was from Algeria and he thought that I would be Sudanese, which is completely off the mark.
Fri 20 Feb 2009 at 08:05:00
I’ve already commented enough on this thread (LOL) but …
Thanks Loli for setting the record straight about Cape Verdeans.
For perspective, some famous black women I’ve heard actual white people cite as beautiful:
The safe, “black-but-not-too-black” trio of Berry/Knowles/Williams (of course); Lauryn Hill, Gabrielle Union, Queen Latifah, Ashanti, Diana Ross, Kelly Rowland, Michael Michelle, Stacey Dash (in the case of the last two, the individuals didn’t know their names but referred to them).
Overall, I can say that whites as a whole, expectedly, find white women as vastly more attractive than other race BUT don’t hesitate to complement an East Asian, South Asian (no matter how dark they were), non-black Hispanic, or any other women of color EXCEPT …
a black woman. It seemed that it was taboo for most whites to compliment a black woman’s beauty. Yet not so much for any other non-white woman.
Have your real-time observations proved similar, Aba or any other poster?
Fri 20 Feb 2009 at 16:14:39
i can only speak for myself – but I compliment black womens beauty all the time.
I sat getting my nail done and I look up to see a women walk in. Deep coco colored skin with that amazing golden undertone. She had on no make up. She was wearing a floral print dress, the colors in the flowers highlighting her skin tone even more. High cheek bones, a large full mouth and almonde shaped eyes, so dark I couldnt see the pupils. Her hair was was worn pulled back in a braid. As she sat next to me I asked her if she was a model. She laughs, she is US Army on leave. I tell her that she is very beautiful. That was over a year ago and I still remember her. Mostly because she was so stunning, yet it was natural. No makeup, no jewerly, nothing artificial.
she is not the only one, I make it a habit to compliment anyones beauty when I see it (race is not a determining factor). People should not limit their ability to experience beauty in this life. we have enough ugly things to deal with – beauty should be welcomed.
Sat 21 Feb 2009 at 04:22:02
In my experience, white men praising the beauty of black women, apart from the usual suspects (Halle, Rihanna, etc), is very rare. Like if I heard a white man talking about the beauty of, say, Chaka Khan my mouth would drop open in amazement. Even Phylicia Rashad. I would expect some of them to say that Sade is beautiful because she is half white, but I have never heard it.
What I do hear sometimes is that so-and-so is “pretty for a black girl”.
What I have noticed is that an amazing looking black woman can walk right by a white man and he does not even give her a first look, much less a second look.
Wed 4 Mar 2009 at 14:18:11
Correction…THESE ARE NOT BLACK WOMEN. THEY ARE WOMEN OF MIXED RACE! JUST AS IT IS STUPID TO CALL JAPANESE BLACK BECAUSE THEY DO NOT HAVE WHITE BLOOD…IT IS STUPID TO CALL THESE WOMEN BLACK! THANK YOU!
Thu 5 Mar 2009 at 08:59:51
Hello, I don’t usually engage in blog conversation, let alone about race(I’m a black East African in England in case you’re wondering) but this blog sparked my interest when I started to wonder how much time this ‘blogger’ has on his/her hands to conduct research, break down statistics, compile lists and scour the vast internet for scattered, random (predominantly)white male opinions.
If I may ask the blogger ‘abagond’, are you are a white man, woman, black, mixed, what? I don’t see any mention of your ethnicity anywhere and thus where you are coming from with these lists. I have gathered that you are married to a black woman but you seem to want people to think, or simply leave them to think that, you are a white man. Well, are you?
Thu 5 Mar 2009 at 09:15:21
On another note, why are there seemingly more white men(globally) who fawn over Naomi Campbell as opposed to Tyra Banks; especially in comparison to black men?
Are they clouded by her immense international model status(thus conditioned) or do they truly prefer her skin tone to that of Tyra Banks, just as most white men in real life do of black women?
A bit of both perhaps?
Thu 5 Mar 2009 at 09:27:42
It seemed that it was taboo for most whites to compliment a black woman’s beauty. Yet not so much for any other non-white woman.
———————————————
Hi ‘mynameismyname’. I particularly love your posts, you don’t seem to take things just how they are presented to you(if you know what I mean).
Hmm…why would it be taboo? Is it because of America’s violent racial history? What harm would a compliment cause?
I have never thought about all this but you and others are making me delve deeper. In England this is not so. A beautiful woman is a beautiful woman. Whether they are in the media or not.
Media here is dominated by blond buxom women. Most women here sport blonde anyways.
But many white men here still like the exotic black woman from Caribs or Africa, unless they are a white nationalist(but even so…)
Thu 5 Mar 2009 at 23:00:46
Thanks Melissa in UK,
Your posts are very insightful. America has a DEEPLY harsh racial history, one that still resonates quite strongly (under the surface, of course). This effects every aspect of American perception, right down to simple ideas of beauty. This explains why many white Americans seem to find it taboo to simply acknowledge the beauty of a black woman.
Because of the nasty, ingrained concept of “black” and white”, ‘white’ is beauty, privilege, wealth and purity. ‘Black’, of course, is meant to be the opposite: ugly, disavantaged, poor and impure. By contradicting these ideals, Americans are throwing off the deeply ingrained racial heirachy.
At least that’s how I see it.
Naomi is a far bigger commidity than Tyra globally. However, I don’t find Naomi and Tyra to be that different in skin shade. Naomi actually appeared on Tyra’s show during its first season, there wasn’t a dramatic color contrast between either women. They are both known for having light eyes (Naomi- contacts; Tyra- hers) and long weaves and falls. I don’t think they look that different from each other. Other than Naomi being a world class beauty by any standard while Tyra has a look that’s more unique than beautiful. In my opinion, of course.
The question of Abagond’s “race” has been pondered before by multiple posters, including myself, but he’s yet to divulge that information. His biographical page does mention being a West Indian immigrant. But that doesn’t answer the question of his actual race, since a West Indian could be of any ethnic concoction.
Fri 6 Mar 2009 at 05:41:47
Because of the nasty, ingrained concept of “black” and white”, ‘white’ is beauty, privilege, wealth and purity. ‘Black’, of course, is meant to be the opposite: ugly, disavantaged, poor and impure. By contradicting these ideals, Americans are throwing off the deeply ingrained racial heirachy.
———————————————-
Hmm…interesting. And by throwing off these racial heirarchies, they might lose the virtue that comes with being white i.e. economic, social and political status.
However…when someone knows the truth and they see a beautiful woman, no conditioning will be able to alter that truth. I have a feeling they know it at the backs of their minds but have succeeded in putting up a front so to speak. As long as they are in America anyways.
You will be surprised at the number of white(especially american, italian) male expatriates who are hired out by american companies to go work in oil refineries in West Africa. These men almost always end up never leaving Nigeria long after their contracts have expired, having gotten used to the black women there, if you know what I mean. It is a debated issue in Africa, these thousands of white expatriates with black girlfriends half their age.
Has this ever been reported in America, as widespread as it is?
Or will it be indicating that the white male will forever crave the black body?
These black girls get their education paid for and end up becoming basically the expatriate’s wife, even if he has abandoned his family back in the western world.
In east africa, where I am from it is mostly(but not only) the Italians and Germans who do this pseudo sex tourism which is being combatted by our governments.
Fri 6 Mar 2009 at 05:49:25
The british men in Zimbabwe and portuguese men in Angola is another issue altogether. They will continue to exploit the poor black women there and since this is not reported as much as the asia sex tourism is reported, it only increases year by year because no one does a damn thing about it.
It leads to spread of diseases, unwanted pregnancy(getting a half-caste kid by a 50 year old white guy?!!!), jealousy murder etc…
Fri 13 Mar 2009 at 20:35:57
Our kenyan government is so lenient to these so-called tourists it is not even funny…
Italians and their sex-capades in East Africa
http://www.eturbonews.com/7126/italians-and-their-sexcapades-east-africa
Fri 13 Mar 2009 at 21:04:33
dedabets Says:
Fri 20 Feb 2009 at 16:14:39
“i can only speak for myself – but I compliment black womens beauty all the time.
I sat getting my nail done and I look up to see a women walk in. Deep coco colored skin with that amazing golden undertone. She had on no make up. She was wearing a floral print dress, the colors in the flowers highlighting her skin tone even more. High cheek bones, a large full mouth and almonde shaped eyes, so dark I couldnt see the pupils. Her hair was was worn pulled back in a braid. As she sat next to me I asked her if she was a model. She laughs, she is US Army on leave. I tell her that she is very beautiful. That was over a year ago and I still remember her. Mostly because she was so stunning, yet it was natural. No makeup, no jewerly, nothing artificial.
she is not the only one, I make it a habit to compliment anyones beauty when I see it (race is not a determining factor). People should not limit their ability to experience beauty in this life. we have enough ugly things to deal with – beauty should be welcomed.”
I am not shy about complimenting a lady on her appearance. The compliments are usually well received, because I am very respectful about it.
Sat 11 Apr 2009 at 06:17:13
beautiful brown Says:
“To Abagond
Just out of curiosity, how did you conduct this survey? Did you poll random white people, and ask whom they found to be the most attractive black women or did you have a list already prepared for them in which all they had to do is select the women from “your” already drawn-out list of black women? I ask because I conducted a similar survey amongst white males in Texas (Austin, Dallas/Ft. Worth, Houston) and found the opposite to be true. While it is simple to say that whites are drawn to black women with euro-centric features, women such as Kerry Washington, Meagan Good, Jill-Marie Jones, and Zoe Saldana (who is of Puerto Rican and Domincan descent…still black!) where preferred and considered beautiful black women. Also light skin is not synonymous with euro centric “features”, you can be light yet have coarse hair, full lips, and a wide nose. By the way Ethiopians, Burundians, and Egyptians and many other African countries have what you would call euro-centric features and they are not white nor are they mixed with it. Therefore, I remain with my original statement that it is not the euro-centric features in these women that make them beautiful it is their black—African features that make them beautiful, in what shallowness would say is their “exoticism” Like your statistics on half those black women having “white mothers”, your statistics on attractive black women according to white people is also incorrect. If anything beauty should be attributed to the African features in women, you give whiteness too much credit.”
Beautiful Brown, the only thing I disagree with is your statement “beauty should be attributed to the African features” in these women. That sounds too exclusionary, just as it would to say “beauty should be attributed to the European features” in women. I think we should be more inclusive of the wide varieties of beauty.
But I agree with everything else you said. I am not surprised by the results of your own survey among white men. Your findings contradict the mythology that all white people are supposed to think alike or think a certain way. That is total nonsense; we are all individuals. Thanks for sharing that.
Sat 11 Apr 2009 at 06:21:02
Mynameismyname Says:
“I’ve also tried to explain to Aba that “light skinned” does not equate whiteness, considering the fact that most black Americans who could be described as “lightly complexioned” have the same diluted West African features that supposedly “non-light skinned” people have. Most of these people DO NOT look “near white”. Not in a million years.”
Mynameismyname, that is true. Tyra Banks, Vanessa Williams and Rihanna are all light skinned women of predominantly African descent. But few people would mistake them for Caucasian as they have “diluted West African features” as you described.
Sat 11 Apr 2009 at 08:50:53
Right, A White Guy except:
Tyra Banks isn’t light skinned in the least.
Why do people call her that?! Shadewise, she’s just an ordinary shade of medium brown. If she’s “light skinned” then so are Janet Jackson, Toni Braxton, Nia Long and Queen Latifah.
I know that perceptions of physical appearance are extremely subjective but let’s be real. Calling her “light” is describing a 5 foot 10 guy as being “tall”.
Sat 11 Apr 2009 at 10:02:00
mynameisnyname Says:
“Right, A White Guy except:
Tyra Banks isn’t light skinned in the least.”
This reminds me of someone blogging about Beyonce some months ago, suggesting that her skin was being deliberately lightened, even though she is naturally light. Yes, it is subjective and sometimes lighting in the photos can affect perceptions. She may not be as light as Rihanna or Vanessa Williams, but even if all these women had snow white skin, would you think they were caucasian women?
Sat 11 Apr 2009 at 12:00:03
A White Guy,
Hell no, Knowles, Williams and Rihanna would never ever be mistaken for European/white women. Ever. In their dreams. LOL. Like you and I both know, all three are easily of predominate West/Central African descent.
Believe it or not, tannish or yellow-ish skin isn’t exactly rare with West Africans. (Many of my WA relatives fit in this range).
Many Americans can’t seem to get it through their head but black Africans naturally have the vastest range of phenotypes. There is no dominant phenotype when it comes to black people, from pure blooded Native Africans to the moderately admixed Western blacks. It shouldn’t be a shock to see a black person with different color eyes or various shades of skin colors. To automatically attribute such things to European admixture is ignorant.
So, if you see a plump-lipped, curly haired, dark skinned “white” person (i.e. many Irishmen, Southern Europeans, etc.), you’d automatically question any possible blackness? I think not. LOL.
Yes, Beyonce’s skin was lightened in that Vanity Fair spread and in the Revlon ad. Vanity Fair admitted to this. Some find her “light skinned” in constrast to other black people. That’s relative and based primarily on perception, as we both know. But she’s still black and therefore dark skinned. Just like a swarthy Italian or Greek is dark compared to other “whites” but probably “light” in comparison to black folks.
That being said, ain’t a damn thing “light” or “white” about Miss Banks. She’s hardly “light skinned” in comparison to the rest of black Americans. She looks like a run-of-a-mill black American woman. And again, if she’s “light”, then so are Oprah, Janet Jackson, Queen Latifah and Jennifer Hudson.
Sat 11 Apr 2009 at 21:29:00
Since mutations are rare, most of the genes that make up white people come from Africa. Those genes are still in Africa, just not as common. In Jamaica I once saw a man as black as coal who had blue eyes. Maybe there was some white in his family tree, but it did not seem likely.
Sun 12 Apr 2009 at 02:57:08
mynameisnyname Says:
“Hell no, Knowles, Williams and Rihanna would never ever be mistaken for European/white women. Ever. In their dreams. LOL. Like you and I both know, all three are easily of predominate West/Central African descent.”
Mynameisnyname, my question was really rhetorical, LOL. I have to admit your ‘diluted West African’ description of Tyra, Vanessa, Beyonce and Rihanna is appropriate, but I almost never hear anyone else describe them that way. On the contrary, they are more frequently described as more European-looking. Why do you think there is such a large disparity between your perception and theirs? These women are practically universally regarded as beautiful. Do you think there is resistance in the mainstream media to acknowledge the ‘African influence’ in their beauty, as Beautiful Brown was advocating before?
Sun 12 Apr 2009 at 04:32:19
A White Guy,
Maybe as Sedmeiler was saying on another page, it’s a psychological thing with many non-blacks. They have to acknowledge an obviously black woman as being “mixed” or “white” or at least something other than black and attribute her beauty to something non-African. Look up my example from Spike Lee’s “Do The Right Thing” on the “why few white men marry black women” page, I believe.
Remember, “black” is the opposite of “white”. So if “white” is beautiful, then “black” HAS to be ugly. Turning the tables and leveling out the inequalities of such racist thinking would threaten the virtues of being white. And how would this society function without the racist divide that it was built on?
Also, as I asked on the Beyonce/L’Oreal page, why must black female beauty be so politicized? How come say, East Indian or East Asian or non-black Latinas, don’t get their looks picked apart with the same intensity by the general US society? Why? What do you think the wide disparity between black women and non-black and the way their beauty is perceived is about?
Sun 12 Apr 2009 at 06:38:01
Mynameisnyname, as far as ‘politicizing black female beauty’ I don’t perceive that happening in general US society. I almost never even hear the subject being raised at all among average day-to-day people I encounter or associate with. I mostly see it being discussed in blogs like this. I hardly ever hear a white person talk about it, except for the fringe group web sites, like stormfront. They are in the minority. I totally understand what you are saying in regard to the perception of some people finding it hard to accept an African descended woman being beautiful without attributing a non-African influence in her ancestry. I don’t feel that way, but that attitude would be prevalent among the stormfront types. You may find it interesting that many of them consider Vanessa Williams to be beautiful, but they perceive her as being predominantly Caucasian-looking, which is the opposite of your description. Isn’t that ironic?
Regarding the black and white dichotomy, being at opposition, such as beautiful versus ugly, I think it is more hype than reality. We are all individuals. I would prefer to drop the black and white labels, which are largely meaningless anyway.
Sun 12 Apr 2009 at 09:40:35
Tired says: quote: like Finland, Sweden etc saw it as a sign of beauty and wanted to breed so it was a majority thats why you will find these places are largely still blond hair and blue eyed people. To divide and conquer light skin was seen as more beautiful than black skin, black women and men where seen as objects , black people where made to hate themselves but excepted if they were lighter that is where the term “House Ni*&ger” comes in.Darker skin women were out in the sun working while lighter skin women where in the shade.”:quote.
Are you saying black people were treated like meat in Sweden & Finland too??..the only blacl people living in Sweden & Finland ( in North Europe incl Denmark, Norway, and Iceland ) are refugees, adoptees and immigrants from Africa. Africans have been here since about the early 1970`s ).. (we havent had any slave or caste-systems here, if thats what you mean).
P.S Sorry for my grammar, but english is not my first language D.S
Sun 12 Apr 2009 at 19:42:52
Why is this even a topic…so what if white people think black women who have similar features to them are prettier. As an African woman I do not care anymore if other races think I’m attractive or not…who gives damn what anyone beauty standards are. Apply it like you would in real life. If a man tells you he finds you unattractive would really try sit there discuss it with him and convince him that you are cute. MOVE ON! And if you really want get technical half of those so called light skinned women on your list have features that many full blooded Africans have.
Sun 12 Apr 2009 at 20:38:57
Stop Worrying About what White People Think Says:
“Why is this even a topic…so what if white people think black women who have similar features to them are prettier. As an African woman I do not care anymore if other races think I’m attractive or not…who gives damn what anyone beauty standards are. Apply it like you would in real life. If a man tells you he finds you unattractive would really try sit there discuss it with him and convince him that you are cute. MOVE ON! And if you really want get technical half of those so called light skinned women on your list have features that many full blooded Africans have.”
We are all individuals and taste in beauty, just as taste in food, is an individual preference. But I agree with you otherwise.
Sun 12 Apr 2009 at 20:50:58
If you are answering the previous comment you do not have to quote it in full.
Sun 12 Apr 2009 at 21:05:36
Stop Worrying:
Why I did this post:
The post I wanted to do was the opposite of this: “The most beaiutiful white women according to black people”. I have certain ideas about that but had no way of making the list in a way that was independent of those ideas. When I tried to do it, there just was not enough data – but in looking for it I found plenty for doing this list. So I did.
As to why this post got 172 comments and counting while many of my posts get none, that is another question….
Sun 12 Apr 2009 at 21:37:41
Abagond, I think you got a lot of feedback on this topic, because it has some provocative and controversial aspects to it. I was motivated to comment on this topic for a few reasons. For one, I wanted to dispel the mythology that all or most white people think alike. Statements such as “The most beautiful black women according to white people” is a generalization and a grandiose assumption. Also, I wanted to challenge the misconception that white men are only attracted to African descended women who appear ‘Euro-centric.’
Sun 12 Apr 2009 at 23:29:04
Race is not only a controversial issue, it is the basis on how our society is ran so of course, you’d get the most comments on posts dealing with racially related topics than you would on non-racial topics.
Remember, the internet gives many people the anonymity that gives them the freedom to tell it like they see it without being chastised. This also contributes with the popularity of your race-based posts.
Mon 13 Apr 2009 at 01:51:55
I know that that not all whites have a Eurocentric idea of beauty. In fact, most white men who seriously black women do not (or at least not in the way you would expect):
http://abagond.wordpress.com/2008/05/28/black-women-that-white-men-like/
Mon 13 Apr 2009 at 01:59:09
I am glad you acknowledge that, but I think too many people are not aware of it.
Tue 21 Apr 2009 at 03:14:55
I am a medium toned (described as golden-brown)black woman. One white male said I was ‘light’ for a black woman. A white lady said I was ‘dark’. Years ago, I dated a very dark skinned West African who said he ‘couln’t tell whether I was ‘dark’ or ‘light’– that in certain lights I was light in other lighted atmospheres ‘I was ‘dark.’ I laugh! I’d flunk the paper brown bag test in the summer (’cause of my tan) & in the winter I’d pass the test!!!! P. Diddy’s ex- model-actress Kim Porter is a very beautiful dark skinned woman. & Kimora Lee-Simmons is an exotically, beautiful ‘blasian.’ Plus, someone at the top of these replys said ‘Native American’ looks wasn’t included w/the ‘top’ beautiful black actresses. But, I think Angela Bassett has gorgeous high cheek bones & slanted or almond shaped eyes. There’s Amerindian in her, I think!
Tue 21 Apr 2009 at 09:26:59
Angela Bassett’s beautiful cheek bones and almond shaped eyes are very common among West African women, namely Nigerians.
That there are still people out there comparing themselves to paper bags shows that the more things change, the more they stay the same.
All of this color consciousness is just part of the western black pysche. I just have to accept this.
Fri 24 Apr 2009 at 01:35:36
Look, this isn’t a debate that have can one absolute answer. My opinion, is that the women on the list ARE Black women and they are GORGEOUS!! I would also add Garcelle B., Lauren Hill, Gabrielle Union, Lena Horne and Dorothy Dandride. I personally do not care what shade your skin has. To me, it’s your features that make a beautiful face.
Focus on the simple question of the poll. Is there anyone who feels that those women are NOT beautiful?
The people answering the poll simply did just that. That’s it. They answered the question. I would have picked the same women if I was asked the same question.
Why do you care who people feel is beautiful? There are beautiful and ugly people of all origins.
If black people were given a similar pole to pick pretty white women, would the results favor blondes over brunettes? Would the dominate choice have come from Sweden as opposed to Poland?
If so, would a huge debate begin?
Everyone needs to stop with this light/dark mess.
And if you are black, how can you write what a white person feels? Would you appreciate a white person expressing what they think that you feel?
The world is full of ugly & beautiful people. Just worry about whether or not you are stable, positive, resilient, strong, smart, successful, loving.
Just live your life! If you’re beautiful.. good for you. We need more beauty in this world.
If you’re ugly.. well.. um… there’s always independence (people cannot knock you for that)!
Wed 29 Apr 2009 at 00:41:46
Like I said Nice list, but it sucks without Raven-Symone on it. Make A New list with Raven, and Monique Coleman on it they are both Hot! White folks love them too.
Wed 29 Apr 2009 at 03:14:22
I do not remember them making any lists of any white person’s most beautiful women.
Sat 6 Jun 2009 at 00:48:13
Comment no 116… I concur.
Sun 7 Jun 2009 at 15:34:17
MSDAY, QUERCIANELLAM ITALIA that is the most biased post on this entire page. where the fuck do you get off thinking all white people don’t find black people beautiful? i don’t know where you grew up but i’m a white girl from dc and here it’s embarrassing to be too pale or too “white”. you must have grown up in the most racist city in the united states because i know absolutely NOBODY who would assume someone beautiful couldn’t be black. shut up and get over yourself. that was the most racist thing i’ve ever heard.
Tue 9 Jun 2009 at 21:14:41
Here is my type of women that I’d worship the ground she walks on..;-) Carolina Indriago, the 1st Venezuelan Woman of African Descent to represent in the 1999 Miss Universe and placed in top 5 although I thought she should have won hands down. Oh, well, at least she lost to another Black womean from Botswana, Africa that year..;-) Carolina, considered Black by Venezuelans, also has heritage from Indigeonous and Spaniard as well. This is my standard of Beauty so I guess I see why I’m still single ..lol One pic is back in 1999 and the other is in today’s present. sincerely, The HotBlooded Panamanian
http://img34.imageshack.us/img34/1328/3344066...
http://img32.imageshack.us/img32/9227/1999ven...
http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/4333/caro07.jpg
Tue 9 Jun 2009 at 21:16:42
Here it is again to open..;-)
http://img32.imageshack.us/img32/9227/1999venezuelas.jpg
http://img34.imageshack.us/img34/1328/33440660ca5b07e570o.jpg