Archive for the ‘IR’ Category

ClaudiaLynxOkCupid, an Internet dating website, put out their numbers on race and dating last week. Some of the main findings that I pull from it (OkCupid had a somewhat different take):

  1. Women: Middle Eastern women  are hot! Black women are not. White women are second-to-last (despite all that free marketing from Hollywood).
  2. Men: white men are on top, Asian Indian men dead last, black men second-to-last.
  3. Black women like white men more than they are liked back – even though men are dogs!
  4. Only some people prefer to date within their own race, like white women and Asian Indian men. Most do not given the chance.
  5. Race affects dating for both men and women and it is not just a matter of looks or stated preferences either.

“Hot”, “liked” and “prefer” are based on reply rates to messages between those whom OkCupid matched based on stated preferences and some other stuff. They also controlled for looks and male height, so this is not a tale of supposedly short Asian men or ugly black women.

While the reply rates were wildly different based on the race of the sender, there was little difference based on, say, Zodiac sign.

The advantage of the OkCupid study is that it looks at almost a million people and looks at their actions not their fine words. (They did throw in some opinion polls, but I am basing nothing on that.)

The disadvantage of the study is that their users are “better-educated, younger, and far more progressive” than most, that online dating can only be part of the picture and that their study gives the what but not the why.

Even so, their numbers generally do match what one New York dating service (whose name escapes me) found: that black men avoid dating black women and that American women avoid Asian men, particularly Asian Indian men.

But, unlike OkCupid, the owner of that dating service asked his customers why: black men told him they do not need a dating service to meet black women while American women said they do not want to date foreign men – which apparently they had stereotyped Asian men as being (the perpetual foreigner stereotype).

The OkCupid post got over 500 comments. I did not read them all, but most of the ones I saw kept making the point that having certain preferences is  not the same as being racist. That misses the point that the study made: race still mattered even after taking that stuff into account.

Women listed in order of reply rates to their messages:

  1. 49.5 Middle Eastern
  2. 46.0 Pacific Islander
  3. 44.4 Other
  4. 43.7 Asian
  5. 42.7 Indian
  6. 42.5 Hispanic/Latin
  7. 42.3 Native American
  8. 42.1 White
  9. 34.3 Black

Men listed in order of reply rates to their messages:

  1. 29.2 White
  2. 27.8 Native American
  3. 26.8 Other
  4. 25.7 Middle Eastern
  5. 24.6 Pacific Islander
  6. 23.1 Hispanic/Latin
  7. 22.2 Asian
  8. 21.7 Black
  9. 20.8 Indian

Who replies to black women (by reply rate):

  • 41: Native American, Other
  • 40: Middle Eastern
  • 39:
  • 38:
  • 37: Black, Indian
  • 36: Hispanic/Latin
  • 35:
  • 34: (the mean)
  • 33:
  • 32: Pacific Islander, White
  • 31: Asian

Who replies to black men (by reply rate):

  • 28: Black
  • 27: Native American
  • 26:
  • 25: Pacific Islander
  • 24: Other
  • 23:
  • 22:
  • 21: Indian, Middle Eastern, White (the mean)
  • 20:
  • 19: Hispanic/Latin
  • 18:
  • 17: Asian

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PeterNortonAccording to commenter Black & German, a black woman married to a white man, here is the sort of white men who go for black women and will seriously date and marry them:

  1. Style: The complete absence of swagger. White men call this “game”. Guys with swagger are trying to project an image. That means that they care too much about what other people think. Avoid them like the plague.
  2. Line of work: He is an engineer, systems analyst, lab technician, middle-manager, mechanic, union worker, researcher, graphic designer, college professor, accountant or something else that involves well-paid drone status. Avoid any man with a glamorous career like lawyer, doctor, corporate executive, etc. Self-employed men are “iffy” and have to be evaluated case-by-case.
  3. Looks: He is good-looking but your girlfriends would describe him as “cute” rather than “sexy” or “hot”. He may actually be completely gorgeous but without the swagger nobody notices.
  4. Dating life: He does not “date around” and is looking for a serious relationship. He has not been on a date in a while (maybe a long while, maybe even years), not because he “can’t get any” but because he is picky and the behaviour of most women turns him off. He is usually too reserved or shy to ask women out.
  5. What he likes about you: He is attracted to your intelligence and personality and spends hours talking to you.
  6. What he likes to do in his free time: He is into computers or computer games. He likes to read or watch non-fiction and science fiction. Trekkies and guys into Japanese animation are a good bet. He has a geeky hobby like programming robots or remodelling old cars. He has circuit boards on his desk at home.
  7. His manner: He is a bit socially awkward. He is not very good at hiding his emotions and his face is pretty much an open book. He does not brag and his rare compliments are spontaneous and almost involuntary, but sincere.
  8. Religion: He believes in God but is not very religious. He will attend church with you but probably would not go regularly on his own.
  9. Intelligence: He is highly intelligent. Some of these guys are have an IQ above 125 – although their scores tend to be skewed towards the non-verbal end which is probably one of their problems in developing “game”.

Basically, he is one of those guys you passed over in high school because he was not cool enough.

They are independent minded and do not care what others think of them. They want a woman who is  interesting, intelligent, healthy, and pretty, and do not care much about race, ethnicity or hair colour. That is why you see these men with Asian women.

They do not chase you – at first. These are the more reserved men. You have to take the first – and sometimes the second and, frustratingly, the third – step. Once you have their complete and utter attention the chase begins. Some of these guys are very slow to catch on, though.

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Here are some racist things that commenter Black&German and her friends have heard white men say to them as black women:

  1. The best thing about black women is their asses. Is it true you like anal?
  2. I prefer black women because white women are such prudes.
  3. I like black women. Just not the ghetto ones.
  4. Hey, you’re pretty! You look just like Halle Berry. (Or whatever famous black woman you can think of. They all look alike, right?)
  5. You know you want it! Everybody knows black women can’t get enough.
  6. What do you mean you don’t want to date me? You should be happy I even asked!
  7. How about we get to know each other a little better? You know, go to my place. No? What if I pay you?
  8. I’ve always wanted to know what it’s like to do it with a black girl.
  9. My friend over there just came back from [some overseas country] and he’s looking for some female company. You’re very pretty. How much?
  10. I don’t usually like black women but you’re different. You’ve got class.
  11. I heard your boyfriend is white. So, you like white dick? Want some of mine?
  12. [If they refuse to go out with you, slam them against the wall and scream in their face.] You think you’re too good for me?
  13. So, if black men have such big dicks doesn’t that mean black women… ?
  14. Don’t go acting all uppity.
  15. Oh, God. My dad would totally kill me if he knew I was talking to you.
  16. You know, if I knocked you up our babies would look white.

Her remarks:

The last one (about babies) was actually after dating him for a few weeks, sitting in a nice restaurant. I nearly choked to death on my pasta. What the hell was he thinking? I didn’t stay to find out.

I’d heard that some white men think that black women are whores but I thought that just meant “easy”. I didn’t know that they assumed we were actually prostitutes. And that the “nice” looking ones are just expensive prostitutes. The first time I was propositioned I just stared like a deer in the headlights. I thought it was a bad joke, or something.

I once had a drunk guy in a bar stick ten dollars in my pants and ask me to dance for him. Umm… Sure, honey. Just let me find that pole I always carry with me…

I do have to say that the guy who slammed me against the wall was hyped up on something. Crystal, probably. That stuff makes people crazy. And horny. Baaaaaad combination.

Although I must admit I’ve had black men make some similarly – ahem – inappropriate comments, as well.

The most amazing thing is where some of these comments were made. Like in the hallway outside of a database management seminar or at the company Christmas party. Some men have no shame.

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Pretty-in-Pink-movie-03I never thought I would be writing a part three so soon, but when a post gets more than 300 comments, then it is time.

To review:

  • In part one I said that it boiled down to racism on the part of white men: they do not want black children.
  • In part two I said it is not quite that simple: way before marriage it is women who apply race to dating decisions, not men. Men are dogs and will go for any halfway good-looking woman they think they have a chance with. A Columbia University study on speed dating supports this view.

Now for part three: A big thing that keeps coming up in the comments is how white men approach black women. Often they wait for a black woman to show some clear sign of interest before they ask her out! It seems like a cowardly excuse. Man up and just ask her!

Dalyn Montgomery, also known as brohammas, has an interesting take on this at his blog, Pages From My Notebook. He is a white American man who lives in Philadelphia. He dated in the 1990s and, in the end, married a black woman.

He says white men have three main ways of approaching women:

  1. The scuzz ball: He expresses his interest directly. No games. If he gets shot down, he moves on. What his approach lacks in quality he makes up in quantity. Sooner or later some woman will say yes. He wants sex, not a girlfriend.
  2. The “normal” guy: He plays a cat-and-mouse game with a woman to show his interest, but not too directly or strongly: he does not want to seem like a scuzz ball – or appear too desperate (even if he is). That is why in “Swingers” (1996) they wait three days before they call a girl back.
  3. The “friends” guy: He becomes your friend, but he hopes to take it to another level later on, hoping that by then he has gained your trust, etc. This is how Duckie failed to get Molly Ringwald in “Pretty in Pink” (1986).

Most white men try each of these at some point in their lives. Some white men follow none of them: Montgomery calls them the curve balls.

Now he adds to all this that white people are taught that black people hate them.

So with all that in mind, here is how each approach views black women:

  • The scuzz ball: Black women, especially young ones, are easy and I need to get laid.
  • The normal guy: If she is extremely hot or if I have something to prove, then I will go after her, otherwise going after white women is way more promising.
  • The friends guy: What? Me with a black woman? Come on. (They lack confidence even with women of their own race.)

How do black women see this? Scuzz balls have the wrong sort of interest, of course, while the other two, from what I can tell, come off as having too little interest.

See also:

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Denise Milani

White Goddess (2008- ), formerly known as White Meat, is a white woman worship blog  run by a black man who calls himself tnameat on WordPress and Professor Fenwick on YouTube.  His blog is full of pictures and videos of white women, particularly those with large naked breasts. He has posts about why white women are the best and argues that black women’s bottoms and their cooking are not as good as people think.

In a video called “European Features White Women are Fantastic Part 3”, Professor Fenwick plays Beethoven and shows us pictures of Bianca Holland, a beautiful Puerto Rican swimsuit model. He says she is living poetry, that her beauty nearly brings tears to his eyes, that he has been thinking about her all week. She looks like this:


He says she is beautiful because she has European green eyes and European hair.

One commenter advised:

lol if this is not self hating i don’t know what is get it together bro..

There are black men who prefer white women to black women. That is not news. There are black men who are fed up with how black women act and say white women are way nicer. That is not news either. But there is more than that going on here.

A post called “A Tribute to My Salvation” starts with these “beautiful words”:

There is no love that is equal to the love that a black man can have for a white woman. As black men we have been privileged to have a view of your eminence in a way that is unique only to the American experience.

You have a sense of confidence and self understanding that no other woman can share, because from your earliest experiences, you knew that you were special. While understanding what sets you apart from other women, your exceptional love and compassion forces you to dim your own light as not to burden them with your greatness.

You could argue that I am just so many bad dates away from creating a white goddess website myself, but I would never write something like that unless I had either lost my mind or meant it as a bitter, sarcastic joke.

At least two other things point to some kind of joke:

  1. His WordPress username, tnameat – tits-and-ass meat – also seems to be part of  a joke. Who calls himself that with a straight face?
  2. When he wanted to change the name of the blog from White Meat to something more respectable, one of the choices was “Bluest Eye”. That is the name of a Toni Morrison book about black self-hatred caused by white ideas of beauty!

For a while I thought the Professor was a black woman, but his taste in white women is too close to my own. Come to think of it, it is just the sort of blog I would do if I struck out with black women and tried to talk myself into making do with white women.

Thanks to Sweetme1993 for bringing this website to my attention.

Postscript: By comment #34 it was clear to me that the Professor is dead serious. His blog is not satire at all! As blaqueconscious put it, he is “a racist white man stuck in a biracial man’s body”. His mother is white.

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junot_diazHere is a part of it from The New Yorker, December 25th 1995. Think of Diaz as a teenager somewhere in Jersey in the 1980s:

Dinner will be tense. You are not good at talking to people you don’t know.

A halfie will tell you that her parents met in the Movement. Back then, she’ll say, people thought it was a radical thing to do. It will sound like something her parents made her memorize. Your brother heard that one, too, and said, Sounds like a whole lot of Uncle Tomming to me. Don’t repeat this.

Put down your hamburger and say, It must have been hard.

It was, she will say.

She’ll appreciate your interest. She’ll tell you more. Black people, she will say, treat me real bad. That’s why I don’t like them. You’ll wonder how she feels about Dominicans. Don’t ask. Let her speak on it and when you’ve finished eating, walk back through the neighborhood. The skies will be magnificent. Pollutants have made Jersey sunsets one of the wonders of the world. Point it out. Touch her shoulder and say, Isn’t that nice?

Get serious. Watch TV, but stay alert. Sip some of the Bermudez your father left in the cabinet, which nobody touches. She’ll drink enough to make her brave. A local girl will have hips and a nice ass but won’t be quick about letting you touch her. She has to live in the same neighborhood as you do. She might just chill with you and then go home. She might kiss you and then leave. Or she might, if she’s reckless, give it up, but that’s rare. Kissing will suffice. A white girl might give it up right then. Don’t stop her. She’ll take her gum out of her mouth, stick it to the plastic sofa covers, and then move close to you. You have nice eyes, she might say.

Tell her that you love her hair, her skin, her lips, because, in truth, you love them more than you love your own.

She’ll say, I like Spanish guys, and even though you’ve never been to Spain, say, I like you. You’ll sound smooth.

You’ll be with her until about eight-thirty, and then she’ll want to wash up. In the bathroom, she’ll hum a song from the radio and her waist will keep the beat against the lip of the sink. Think of her old lady coming to get her, and imagine what she would say if she knew that her daughter had just lain under you and blown your name into your ear. While she’s in the bathroom, you might call one of your boys and say, Ya lo hice, cabrón. Or sit back on the couch and smile.

But usually it won’t work this way. Be prepared. She will not want to kiss you. Just cool it, she’ll say. The halfie might lean back and push you away. She will cross her arms and say, I hate my tits. Pretend to watch the TV, and then turn to her to stroke her hair, even though you know she’ll pull away again…

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An Asian fetish, also known as yellow fever, is where a man mainly goes for East Asian women. For East Asian men this is considered to be natural and therefore it is not a fetish. But for white American men it is seen as an unnatural desire and therefore is a fetish.

In America by far the most common sort of mixed-race marriage is between white men and Asian women. So it seems like white men have a thing for Asian women.

babysan-speaksjapaneseBut it is more than just the numbers or even all the war brides and mail-order brides: Asian women report that some white men do have this strange hang-up on them: these men seem to date mainly Asian women, stereotype them by saying that Asian women are “exotic”, “hot” and are much more willing to serve and please their men. Some of these men even go so far as to learn all things Asian. It all comes off as kind of creepy.

Some argue that there is no such thing as an Asian fetish. Here are the three arguments I have heard:

  1. White women paint it as a fetish to shame white men out of dating Asian women. Because only Asian women present a serious threat to white women.  After all, when black men or Jewish men go after blondes, no one calls that a “blonde fetish”. Or when a white woman will date only black men, no one calls that a “black fetish”.
  2. Asian women are naturally more desirable than white or black women. Steve Sailer argues that they look more womanly because they have less muscle by weight than either white women or black women.
  3. Asian women are more open to dating outside their race than other women in America. A speed dating study done by Columbia University showed that it is women, not men, who make dating decisions based on race. Men are dogs and will go for any pretty woman regardless of race. Given that, many white men will naturally wind up with Asian women.

Asian women in America, much more so than black, white or Latina women, are way more likely grow up in a place where most males do not belong to their race, where most are in fact white. It is also more acceptable for Asian women and white men to marry each other than for either to marry black or Latino.

Asian men get screwed in this because white women are not equally open about dating outside their race. Also white stereotypes of Asian men as nerdy and unmanly do not help.

Samhita at Feministing put it well, speaking for many Asian women:

But for the rest of us, that are sick and tired of white men being into us because we are “exotic,” well this shit is just tired. I am not your fetish, I am not your fantasy and, yeah, I might be good in bed, but my race is not why.


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lauren-london-parentsLast year I wrote about why so few white men marry black women. I said that it came down to racism: white men do not want to have black children.

It has become one of my most commented-on posts. Over the past several nights it has got over a hundred comments from white men who object to me calling them racists – fair enough – but then fill their comments with the most rank stereotypes about black women and black people in general! Priceless.

But then in the meantime I read the Columbia study about race and dating. Also, some of the comments have made me think more about the whole thing. Now I am not so sure.

The comments pointed out two things wrong with the first post:

  1. I said that black women in America are more open to interracial marriage than white men because a greater percentage are, in fact, in interracial marriages. But Uncle Milton pointed out that that is because black women have more opportunity (at least on paper) to marry outside their race – because most men in America are from other races. I grant his point.
  2. I left out any account of what black women think of the whole thing! When I found out that only one white American man in 400 is married to a black woman, it seemed like a straightforward case of white racism. But then some black female commenters said that the ugly history that black women have had with white men in America – all the rapes back in slave days – is in the back of their minds and that works against such relationships. And, even apart from that, the ongoing racism in American society makes it hard to trust whites. True: marriage is an act of profound trust.

The Columbia study meanwhile found that while men are dogs and only care about looks, not race, women prefer men of their own race. Women, not men, apply race to dating.

Part of why Anglo-America has a One Drop Rule is because the English brought their own women. The white women would marry white men and have white children. Without that the One Drop Rule would have had little support among men, as it did in the old New Orleans under the French where white women were in short supply.

So then black women are to blame, right?

Well, it is not that simple. First, there were not enough black women in the Columbia study to draw any firm conclusions about them. But I grant that most black women would prefer to marry a black man.

Yet on the other hand I cannot shake from my mind the way white men, at least in New York, act as if black women are not living, breathing women. Like some of the white commenters, they see them as black first and women second – if at all.

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interracialdatingFrom 2002 to 2004 researchers at Columbia University ran something of a speed dating service in New York. Not so much to find dates for the 400 graduate students who signed up, though they did that, but to find out what goes into the decision to date someone. One thing they looked at was how and why race affects dating.

The beauty of speed dating is that you can find out who wants who in short order. And, if you ask enough survey questions and run enough numbers, you can start to find out why.

The study found that women prefer to date men of their own race, even when given plenty of opportunity to date outside their race. Men, however, do not care – they are far more interested in a woman’s looks than her race. Race also matters less to those who are older or better looking.

In the study white men and East Asian women often wound up picking each other. Not because white men have a thing for East Asian women or think they are better looking (they do not, not in this study), nor is it because East Asian women prefer white men. Instead it is because East Asian women are far more willing to date outside their race than other women.

While East Asian women do prefer men of their own race, they have nothing against white men. They do, however, have something against dating black and Hispanic men because of their race.

There were four races in the study: black, white, Hispanic (not a race, I know, but in this study it was) and East Asian. They wanted to do South Asians too but not enough signed up.

Too few blacks signed up to draw any firm conclusions about them. But of those in the study, the women preferred their own race the most strongly. The black men did not care – just like the men of other races.

So why do women prefer men of their own race? The study found that it was not because they thought their men were better looking or shared common interests or came from the same class or had the same level of education. It had to do with where the women grew up.

That surprised the researchers: where a woman lived when she was 11 told you more than anything else about the race of man she would date – even if she was at a top university in a big city far from home. Those who came from parts of the country or parts of the world that were more racist were more likely to stick to their own race when dating.

They also found that those who grew up in places where there were many people of another race were less likely to date that race! So, for example, whites who came from a place with many blacks were less likely to date blacks.

The study said that a person’s race did not affect one’s judgement about who was good-looking.

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exotic women

tarashaktiExotic women are women who look like they are from a different place, whose unfamiliar looks add to their beauty. Kerouac thought black women were exotic – as do quite a few commenters on this blog,

“Exotic”, at best, is a relative term: exotic for whom? It is like saying someone has an accent. There is something unstated that you are comparing it to. What might be exotic in White America would not be exotic in parts of New York, Lebanon or China.

When someone says  a woman looks “exotic”, the question that springs to mind is: Where do you live?  What kind of women are you used to?

The women in Thailand do not look exotic in Thailand, even if they look that way to you. The same goes for any other country you can name, even Madagascar.

And that gets to the second point: exotic women are not exotic. Not to themselves – just to you. Exotic is a point of view, a trick of the mind, it is not something in the women themselves.

That means that exotic women are the same as those boring, very unexotic women you know and run into all the time. Women are the same all over the world. Exotic women are not any easier to date or get into bed, they are not going to fall at your feet, despite the stories you have heard (but if they do, keep reading). If you have little luck with unexotic women, then you will have little luck with exotic ones.

Note: if they do fall at your feet when unexotic women do not, then that is a huge red flag. Most likely it is because you are from a rich country and they are from a poor one. It is not you that they like – they see you for the dork you are – but the chance to get into or stay in your country. Do not fool yourself.

Now from the other end:

If a man says you are “exotic”, then that is a huge red flag too. He is not seeing you but some picture he has cooked up in his head about women who look like you. There is a good chance that he is a loser or just wants you for sex.

If he seems to think you are exotic, then ask yourself these two questions:

  1. Does he often go out with women of his own kind?
  2. Have you met his mother?

“No” to either of these questions is a bad sign. If he avoids having you meet his mother, then he is using you. If he barely dates women of his own kind then there is a good chance he is dating not you but a stereotype.

Ask to meet his mother – or, better yet, grandmother. Ask him what he thinks about women who look like you and about women of his own kind. See what he says.

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Garcelle Beauvais (1966- ), also known as Garcelle Beauvais-Nilon, is an American television actress and former model. She is best remembered for playing Fancy on “The Jamie Foxx Show” in the late 1990s. She was also assistant district attorney Valerie Heywood in “NYPD Blue”. In 2007 she appeared in Playboy magazine and had twins – all at the age of 40!

She had her twin boys in October 2007: Jax and Jaid. She also has an older son, Oliver (1991), from her first marriage.

Some commenters at Bossip.com did not like how white her twins look. Since they are test tube babies, it is possible that they are not hers by blood. Assuming that they are, they might get darker as they get older.

They were delivered early because she started having headaches that would not go away. The doctors said she had pre-eclampsia, which could have killed either her or the babies. After they were born, she lost her baby fat almost right away. She says it is because her shoot for Playboy forced her to get into shape before she was expecting the twins.

She started in film, not television. She was even in “Coming to America” (1988) as a rose bearer. I remember her in the water tower scene in “Wild, Wild West” (1999). But she has never had a lead in a film that made it big. Her success has come instead in television:

  • 2005: Nora Gage in “Eyes”
  • 2001-2004: assistant D.A. Valerie Heywood in “NYPD Blue”
  • 2000: Ms Maya Bradley in “Opposite Sex”
  • 1996-2001: Francesca “Fancy” Monroe in “The Jamie Foxx Show”
  • 1994-1995: Cynthia Nichols in “Models Inc”

Her break came with “Models Inc”, but she is best remembered as the female lead in “The Jamie Foxx Show”. In 2008 it is still on American television in endless reruns.

She was born in Haiti to a well-to-do family, the youngest of five sisters and two brothers. Her parents split up when she was young. At seven her mother brought her to America. Garcelle went to boarding school in Massachusetts while her mother studied to be a nurse in New York. At 16 the family moved to Miami where she acted in high school plays.

At 17 Beauvais came to New York to become a model, where she signed with Ford Models. You saw her in print ads for Avon, Mary Kay and Clairol and in catalogues for Nordstrom and Neiman Marcus. I remember her from those days: there are only so many black models in those catalogues. She has also done some fashion modelling for Calvin Klein and Isaac Mizrahi.

In the 1990s she was in television ads for Diet Coke and American Express.

Although she was born in Haiti, she has American Creole roots: her family came to Haiti from New Orleans after the civil war. They did not mix much with the Haitians.

She speaks French, Haitian Creole and English. She learned English at seven from watching “Sesame Street”.

She has married twice. Her first husband, of six years, was Daniel Saunders, a producer. In 2001 she married Mike Nilon, an agent.

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Note: This post comes mainly from “Roll, Jordan, Roll” (1974) by Eugene Genovese, a Brooklyn-born Marxist historian. He is a white man who argues that it was not as bad as black people think:

When you think of white men and black women back in slave days in the US, the thing that springs to mind is the rape of black slave women by white slave masters. It is an image so striking and terrible that it is hard to get it out of your mind. In fact, the Mammy stereotype was pushed by the South to counteract it.

It is a fact of history: we have accounts of just such rapes. But while true, it was not as common as you might think. During the civil war when the Union army got to the large estates in the low country of Georgia and South Carolina the northerners were surprised by how unmixed the blacks were.

In our time something like 75% of blacks are part white, but at the end of the civil war fewer than 25% were. Most of the mixing of the races took place after the civil war, after the slaves were freed.

The government used to count mulattoes separately, those who were part black, part white. So we know where they lived and where they came from. They mostly did not come from the big slave estates in the deep South but from the towns and cities of the upper South, in states like Arkansas and Tennessee. As it turns out, these were the places where there was an oversupply of both white men and black women.

And just as we have accounts of rapes and of black children of white slave masters, so we also have accounts of the opposite, of slave masters who did not permit such things – not just according to the slave masters themselves, but even according to their slaves after they were freed and had no reason to lie about it.

In fact, we even have the diary of one slave master, a 44-year-old virgin apparently, who complains about the lack of sex in his life – even though he owned slave women. When he thought about where to get it, he did not think about his black slave women but the white prostitutes in town.

Some slave women, called fancy girls, mostly light-skinned, were sold to work in the household with the understanding that they would provide special services.

While some white men did openly live with black women, most hid what was going on as something shameful. As late as the 1970s, more than a hundred years after the civil war,  we have court records where it is assumed that having sex with a black woman is so shameful for a white man that none would admit to it unless it was true.

In most cases slave masters who had sex with black slave women were just using them, but it was not always that simple. From court records we know that sometimes it led to divorce and contested wills. While most white men did nothing to try to free their black children and black lovers, some did.

– Abagond, 2008.

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White men with black women are not as common in America as you might expect. Even though an eighth of American women are black, fewer than one married white man in 400 has a black wife! That cannot be an accident. Compare that to how many have Asian wives: about one in 100 – even though there are way fewer Asian women.

Given the numbers of white, black and Asian women there are in America and looking at who white men marry, you can work out how much they like different kinds of women as wives:

  • 132: white women
  • 100: American women in general
  • 23: Asian women
  • 2: black women

So why do so few white men marry black women?

Here are some reasons that you hear:

  1. Lack of opportunity: Most white men live in a nearly all-white world. Most know only a few black women.
  2. Lack of education in black women: White men look for women with the same level of education. That limits the number of black women they might date and marry even further.
  3. Lack of good looks in black women: Most white men think black women are not all that good looking when compared to white women. That comes across in their phrase “good-looking for a black girl”. And you see it in their lists of beautiful women on the Internet: they have few if any black women and those they do have tend to be light-skinned. An amazing-looking black woman can walk right by a white man without him batting an eye.
  4. Lack of friendliness of black women: White men tend to see black women as being hard to get along with – the Sapphire stereotype. It is just not worth the trouble.
  5. Lack of acceptance among white friends and family: White men are afraid of what their friends or family will say. Whites are less accepting of mixed relationships, especially mixed marriages, than blacks are.
  6. Lack of desire among black women: Among Americans, black women are the least likely to marry outside their race.

That last one is dead wrong. Look at the percentage of married Americans in 2006 who were married outside their race:

  • 19.5 Asian women
  • 8.4 black men
  • 7.2 Asian men
  • 3.6 black women
  • 2.2 white men
  • 1.9 white women

It is white people who stick most to their own kind, not black women – or even Asian men.

The other reasons have some truth to them, but notice how they never seem to blame white men.

They all avoid the simplest reason of all, the one that you hardly ever hear:

  1. White men are racist: They do not want their sons and daughters to be black. Not because their parents are against it, not because their friends are against it, not because white society is against it – because they themselves are against it!

As white people put it, “What about the children?” As if it was some terrible thing to be black! Well, to a white racist it is.

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White American men seem to go for certain kinds of black women and not for others. The same is true for black men and white women, but that is another post.

I have not done any grand survey nor am I setting forth any iron rules – I know all white men are not alike. These are  just some notes and observations of what I have noticed in New York.

If any black women or white men want to add their own general observations that would be great. If I have it all wrong, please tell me. I have some examples at the end. You can weigh in on them.

If you ask white men to name a beautiful black woman, most will name someone who is light-skinned, like Beyonce or Halle Berry. So you would think that among black women they would mainly go after light-skinned women. But the strange thing is they do not.

And yet they do prize whiteness in women, even in black women, but the whiteness they want is not as simple as skin colour. It is more in the general shape of her body – thin, maybe with large breasts, but not too big of a bottom. The features of her face can be black, but not too black. Hair, surprisingly, does not seem to matter that much. So it is not uncommon to see a white man with a dark-skinned black woman with natural hair.

Both black men and white men in America are affected by white ideas of female beauty, but they apply them to black women differently:

Black men apply it to skin colour (light) and hair (long and straight), but not so much to the shape of the body (still thick, though that seems to be changing).

White men are almost the opposite of that: they do not care so much about skin colour or hair – those who do apparently stick to white women – but they do care about the shape of the body and the features of the face.

Some examples:

Many white men would date these women: Iman, Jourdan Dunn, Gabrielle Union, Sanaa Lathan, Garcelle Beauvais, Lela Rochon, YaYa Da Costa, Angela Bassett, Kerry Washington, Aisha Tyler, any young black woman in an ad, in Playboy, any black weather girl or supermodel.


Most of these women have what I call a cutsie-pie face, like Gabrielle and Garcelle.

Way fewer white men would date these: Phylicia Rashad, Toccara Jones, Bria Myles, Estelle, Brandy Norwood, Adriana Bombom, Elise Neal, Latavia Roberson, Jill Marie Jones, Sade, Omotola, Liris Crosse, Angell Conwell, Heather Headley.


By dating I do not mean sex. I mean someone they would seriously show to their mother as their girlfriend.

Heather Headley and Sade, by the way, are married to white men. But, like I said, not all white men are alike.

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