Micah Xavier Johnson (1991-2016) is the man the police in Dallas, Texas suspect of killing five police officers, injuring seven others and two protesters. That was on July 7th 2016 at a Black Lives Matter protest:
- 24.0 hours after Philando Castile was killed by police in Minnesota,
- 68.5 hours after Alton Sterling was killed by police in Louisiana.
At this point nearly everything we know about Johnson comes from the Dallas police. Some of it does not ring true. Maybe I will do a proper post when the picture becomes clearer.
In any case, we should wait for all the facts to come in. We should not rush to judgement. And, just to be completely fair, Johnson’s friends should be put in charge of the investigation and present their findings in secret before a grand jury where there is no cross examination of witnesses. The parts most in Johnson’s favour should be leaked to news reporters who have their brains set to off (the standard setting). Let the process work!
Oh, wait. Johnson is dead, so none of this will even reach a secret grand jury, much less a public trial.
Well, if he is the killer, his actions were almost certainly “objectively reasonable” if not “justifiable”: he saw a gun, way more than one, that the Dallas police officers had – and not just BB guns either, like Tamir Rice or John Crawford. No doubt he feared for his life, like Darren Wilson. As I am sure the New York Times will be careful to point out, the Dallas police are “no angels”, like they said of Michael Brown
The Dallas police are thugs, even if they never burned down a CVS Pharmacy: only two other big-city police departments in the US kill its citizens at a higher rate: Phoenix and Philadelphia. That is no mean achievement in a country like the US. That makes them worse/better than the NYPD, the Klan in Blue, the gold standard.
Even though Dallas is 25% Black, 57% of those the Dallas police killed from 2002 to 2013 were Black. Since 1973 they have killed an estimated 125 Black people – and not a single killer cop has been so much as charged with a crime, much less sent to prison. Our heroes.
Complaints of “systemic police misconduct” have been brought before the Department of Justice – and it has seen fit to do nothing.
Not all cops are bad. Oh no. They just turn a blind eye to murder, that’s all.
Live by the summary execution, die by the summary execution.
Maybe I could work up some feelings for the Dallas police officers if I saw their dead or dying bodies on Viral Videos. Did I miss it?
I am being sarcastic. Kind of.
Yesterday afternoon, before the Dallas shootings, a part of me wanted to see some cops killed. You know, a taste of their own medicine. But now that it has come true, I fear how this will play into the hands of the racists who run this country.
– Abagond, 2016.
Sources: BBC, Texas Observer.
See also:
- Whitespeak – how White people live with the blood on their hands.
- Philando Castile
- Alton Sterling
- The police
- grand jury
- Tamir Rice
- John Crawford
- Darren Wilson
- Michael Brown
- #CVSmatters
It is time for Militant hip hop to end this Trap music bullshit. Militant is the way to go, mabey now they fear us instead of the other way around. With a raised fist I will resist.
LikeLike
The Police have just discovered that bullets fly in both directions.
LikeLiked by 2 people
@Abagond
Sometimes over the past months that I’ve been commenting, I’ve noted the tremendous effort and restraint you’ve shown riding herd on unruly commenters and surly trolls. Wrangling threads containing comments that range from sublime to downright silly.
Sometimes I lose sight of the passion and insight that drew me to this blog years ago. This “rant in 500 words or less” is one of your finest.
I identify with the swirling mix of emotions: outrage, sadness, resignation, determination, fear and the internal fight against a desire for vengence.
Thank you for all of that effort and thank you for this post.
LikeLiked by 11 people
I am not at all convinced that this “event” happened the way it has been portrayed. Not because I think it’s impossible but the timing of it makes me reconsider all the many, many “false flags” that have been concocted by the people in power to sway public opinion in their favor — usually meaning tighter gun control and the continued erosion of constitutional rights.
I find it highly suspect that right on the heels of the two murders of black people over a 48-hour period where it was undeniable (due to video evidence) that the white policemen were acting criminally, less than twenty-four hours after that , the tables have once again been turned and now the white police are suddenly the VICTIMS and blacks are once again, the criminals.
Not saying it couldn’t be true (the shootings), but I always consider the source and so far, the source has been far from credible or ethical.
I say, take everything you read and hear from mainstream media with a barrel of salt–and add a few gallons of water to wash the foul taste down.
LikeLiked by 10 people
correction
“…one murder and one heinous wounding by a handgun-wielding homicidal sociopath….”
LikeLike
Abagond,
“Yesterday afternoon, before the Dallas shootings, a part of me wanted to see some cops killed. You know, a taste of their own medicine. But now that it has come true, I fear how this will play into the hands of the racists who run this country”
My sentiments as well.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Trojan Pam
My sentiments exactly, but I know they said two snipers so where is this other sniper. How can a confusion so big take place. Two snipers now turn into one man with an assault rifle? Okay.
LikeLiked by 3 people
This story is just very confusing. They are masters at confusion. I say if it doesn’t make sense, it’s probably not true. Or not completely true. They can omit or glorify whatever points they wish.
Awesome post.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Trojan Pam:Yeah, this had occurred to me, too.
LikeLike
Reblogged this on The Militant Negro™.
LikeLike
I can’t even watch CNN ect. The dead police are hero’s their lives shown as exemplified human beings whose lives were cut short serving the public as peaceful, caring public servants. I just want to puke.
But if your life is taken by the police rest assured it will be examined with a microscope and every flaw magnified for all to see.
I’m sorry but i cant find empathy. I’m a flawed human being.
LikeLiked by 4 people
@Michael Jon Barker
Yeah. TV news resembles something out of the Soviet Union circa 1953. You half expect them to cue up a male chorus singing patriotic songs while they gush on about the police “victims”.
That is in stark contrast to the sensationalistic violence pornography images that accompany reporting of Black people (and some Latinos) murdered in the streets by police.
LikeLiked by 6 people
Kiwi
I thought you were a smart enlightened commenter!!! The fact that you have already decided that the white media is accurate and that this black male shot these officers and made that comment about wanting to kill white people does surprise me. Then I look at your comment as a whole and realise you using it to further your own agenda . Every post I have read of yours in recent months is full of rage and bitterness. I can’t work out whether you are resentful of being the race you are or envious that you are not a white male with all the privileges you feel this holds. At some stages you have been given a hard time but in ‘fighting back’ your responses degenerate and become that of a young adoloscent, a kind if tit for tat and it actually is not good reading. That’s my 2 pence worth from a commenter that generally lurks intermittently. I expect you will come back with some asinine comment. More than anything, you should concern yourself with how you may come across to white commenter who you seem to love and loathe in equal measures. Are you sure that forevermore you want these latest posts of yours to stay on this site for posterity as a GENUINE and TRUE reflection of who you REALLY are and what you represent?
LikeLiked by 5 people
Look at how Yahoo reported on the two incidents. The bias they show.
https://qph.ec.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-0dd8a07abc208d499d4467864286d3fd-c?convert_to_webp=true
But no surprise.
So they exploded the black suspect that they were negotiating for surrender? Is it that because he was black and the officers were afraid of his super powers ?
That black people are so powerful with thick skin and no pain receptors that we must be shot on sight. Couldn’t the robot be loaded with tear gas ?
The police negotiate with suspects all the time and they don’t explode them. The Bundy’s were on federal land, and the previous Bundy siege resulted in the death of two police officers, but they never sent in the bomb robot.
This wasn’t some $20 RC car with a bomb strapped to it, rather it was an Explosive Ordinance Disposal Robot.
USA gives the police the money to buy those to DISARM bombs, not deliver & DETONATE them against other people.
Also who exactly is on the hook for a new EOD robot here ? After all it’s not likely the robot survived the detonation of the bomb, so who has to pay for a replacement ? Did the police simply use this as an excuse to get rid of their old robot so they could force the purchase of a new one?
USA hardly even needs a court system in the anymore. Justice is carried out on the streets without trials. The American social experiment of “guns for all” has failed and now costs 30,000+ lives every year. Maybe they should rewrite or repeal the 2nd Amendment. It did NOT go from god’s lips to anyone’s ears.
USA must emulate Australia’s successful program to buy back guns in private hands. It is working. Nothing they are doing is working at ALL
You can call these black men loons or crazy. I don’t. What other avenue is open to people who realize that nothing they can do will prevent their murder by cops?
So what is one to do? Meekly obey every screamed, insane demand by a white cop and still get killed? Or fight back?
LikeLiked by 5 people
Blame the cops in these recent killings in Baton Rouge and St. Paul and all the other cops before them that killed black people for no just reason and then no justice, thereafter! These cops that didn’t find their way into prison, should be stripped of their jobs and left to feel the weight of their actions with every cop that was killed thereafter! Sick of this!
LikeLiked by 1 person
“Kiwi
I thought you were a smart enlightened commenter!!!”
@Omnipresent
He never seemed smart or enlightened on the reparations (and other older) threads. He’s been obvious to some since then! Plug “reparations” into this site’s search feature and look for his comments.
Is being smart (or enlightened) supposed to be an indication of an individual’s character and personal moral integrity?
Lucifer was the brightest of all the angels. Look at where that got him!
Don’t confuse “smart” for correctness or being right. Or being full of merit.
LikeLike
Fan
I did say that I am an intermittent lurker so I am only going on things I have picked up recently.
To me, it follows that if you are enlightened, you must be smart and therefore intelligent and open to other ways of thinking. That on certain subjects individuals may ‘chose’ to be less open is a flaw in people that can arise to more or less of a degree depending on the individual
LikeLike
Clicked too soon but no, being enlightened doesn’t necessarily mean being correct but in the case of Kiwi I had thought that his past commentary was full of merit and correct so I was surprised at the decline in the quality know the commentary
LikeLike
Abagond
The so called whitepeople are liars. Every time there’s an undeniable fact that black ppl are being treated unfairly…they try to divert people’s attention away from it and now show these police officers …they are actually Policy Enforcers.
It’s funny how they want people tofollow the law, but they DON’T teach people the law.
It seems that people are afraid to call a spade a spade!
These people spread out from those Caucasus Mountains and caused untold miseries to everybody, to every landmass they have come into contact with! People …don’t sit there and say it’s just police….c’mon, we should know better by now. It’s deeper than that.
They’re doing this be dude these are the same people who have been planning since the Spanish Inquistion to destroy the descendants of the people the Moors were run out of Spain. Many of these people (Moors) came over here. So they know what they’re doing.
Now back to these so called white people?
Why do you think the Great Wall of China was built? All of these gigantic walls stretching from Europe to Asia? Who were these people trying to keep away from?
Now we see that there has been NO benefit from coming into contact with these people. A snake is a snake. Why stick your hand in a bucket of snakes and try to figure which one is poisonous or not? A snake is a snake.
These are lying, murderous, history distorting, genocidal, sadistic, eat mongeri you people.
Something is WRONG with them.
Am I the only one who sees this???
Am I?
Does something seem wrong to y’all? Everywhere these people have gone Chaos has broke out. If we weren’t on the planet….these white folks would have destroyed each other and blew this planet up a Loooooong time ago!
Go star wars for the past 200+ years. These are not people to live in peace with. We are NOT the same.
Peace everybody. Something is very wrong with these people. This kind-of-a-Man.
LikeLiked by 5 people
They let LA burn for a couple days then sent the cops in almostcas an afterthought.
LikeLike
eat mongeri* War-mongering
Go star wars* Starting wars
Excuse me.
LikeLike
@HipHopRecords
Australia’s “SUCCESSFUL” gun buy back program (GBBP)? How was that program successful? Violent crime rates went up in Australia after the GBBP. The GBBP has had no observable effect on the homicide rate in Australia. And there are more guns in Australia today then there was before the GBBP. And guess what, even though there are more registered guns now, gun crimes have still been on a downward trend.
LikeLike
The claymore mine is directional and basically shoots out over a thousand soft lead pellets to saturate a 6′ tall volume of space out to about 50 yards. It probably didnt hurt the robot.
LikeLiked by 1 person
“These people spread out from those Caucasus Mountains and caused untold miseries to everybody, to every landmass they have come into contact with! People …don’t sit there and say it’s just police….c’mon, we should know better by now. It’s deeper than that. They’re doing this be dude these are the same people who have been planning since the Spanish Inquistion to destroy the descendants of the people the Moors were run out of Spain. Many of these people (Moors) came over here. So they know what they’re doing.”
“Now back to these so called white people? Why do you think the Great Wall of China was built? All of these gigantic walls stretching from Europe to Asia? Who were these people trying to keep away from?” – Kamutef
Well stated Sir! You are correct when you state, “It’s deeper than that.” If people would read the Bible and conduct some historical research on their own, they’ll quickly realize exactly who they’re dealing with. White people (biblically, they are considered to be red), are condemned from the very first book of the Bible, which is Genesis, until the last book, which is the Book of Revelation. So, nothing these people do and say surprises at all. It appears that this is their collective, standard of conduct by default.
.
Within the Bible, whites are referred to as Idumea, which means red or bloody, amongst other names. This was the land of Edom (Edomites), southeast of Jerusalem in today’s Jordan. The capital of Idumea was once referred to as Bozrah. These people are the beast the Bible speaks of. There is a reason why when the Most High returns, he’ll depart from Bozrah with his garment draped in blood (Isaiah 63:1-3) and in Isaiah 34:5 “For my sword shall be bathed in heaven: behold, it shall come down upon Idumea, and upon the people of my curse, to judgment.” And some people still have the audacity to say Yah loves everyone, LOL! These are the same people who lack a true understanding of the Bible.
In Obadiah 1:3 “The pride of thine heart hath deceived thee, thou that dwellest in the clefts of the rock, whose habitation is high; that saith in his heart, Who shall bring me down to the ground?”
Even today, aren’t these people fond of high rise buildings, skyscrapers, the space station or anything of high habitation much like the ruins of today’s Petra?
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Petra/@30.325203,35.447924,3a,75y,90t/data=!3m8!1e2!3m6!1s61428740!2e1!3e10!6s%2F%2Flh6.googleusercontent.com%2Fproxy%2FCIuhdWnttCuusKsHSQWLXW6PBli-xtdjQKYtCpPupYNqU4JR-sNsk22-jg4YDrLxpD0xyVX7J7B4bWIP30ubySD0YBNekQ%3Dw129-h86!7i1600!8i1062!4m5!3m4!1s0x0:0x199bf908679a2291!8m2!3d30.3284544!4d35.4443622!6m1!1e1
I apologize Abagond, I just wanted to share a little insight into who people are dealing with when they interact with white folks (red people). Therefore, don’t be so surprised that CNN, Fox News and other so-called news outlets speak of lies in order to avoid telling the truth. We as Black people shouldn’t expect the truth to reside within them to begin with!
LikeLiked by 2 people
Their are what 350 million guns in the U.S. They would be lucky to get a third of them back.
Their has always been a gun culture here but what has happened is the NRA has changed it from Hunting/self defense to white citizen soldier.
The NRA has yet to come out in support of Sterling and Castile even though they were both exercising their second admendment right.
The NRA was quick to tweet out that the Dallas police were hero’s and that prompted a twitter back lash about their silence over Johnson and Castile from NRA members.
LikeLiked by 1 person
“Should assaulting an officer of the state be a capital offense, rendered without trial, with the officer as judge and executioner? Is that what we wish civilization to be?”
― Ta-Nehisi Coates
LikeLiked by 1 person
@ blakksage,
The “Great Wall was built to keep out the “MONGOL” invaders, not Europeans.
It should also be noted that the majority (ruling class) of MOORS were ARABS who, like all the other invaders of Africa, found conscription of Africans into military service a way to divide and conquer our people by military and religious (Islam) means.
I find it particularly unwise to claim kinship with a people, ARABS, that conquered our African ancestors, raped and made harem whores of our women and castrated, with craven impunity, our strongest men to make them submissive “eunuchs” and military shock-troops against “AFRICAN” people.
While our history is full of subjugation to external races and religions, quoting the “fairy tales” of our conquerors seems rather self-destructive and only serves to perpetuate their dominance……..
LikeLiked by 1 person
@ All
I would suggest that POC devise a useful plan beyond armed rebellion.
Local police forces are now armed with the same weapons and tactics that have been battle tested in the Middle East to quell urban uprisings.
And, the police forces around the country are manned by the very troops that fought in the Middle East.
With all due respect to those who would elevate Micah X. Johnson to the heroic status of Nat Turner I would ask this question:
“Will the actions of Micah X. Johnson, like those of Nat Turner, lead to the ultimate freedom of POC?”
To me, the successful historic lessons of aggressive armed resistance are:
Go Big, or Stay Home…!!!
At this point in our history we are not capable of “Going Big”. And, we are further encumbered by a lack of unity. So, planning and patience are our only tools. Lone wolves only serve to justify further aggression by our tormentors. And, that aggression will focus on the weakest (poor, women and children) members of our society and serve to further erode our morale.
READ, LEARN, and LIVE and pass the lessons of wisdom along to our progeny.
But, don’t be suckers for the “weaponized” fairy tale propaganda of submission by the descendants of Greeks, Romans and Arabs.
The one thing you can control and have ownership over is…..YOUR MIND.
LikeLiked by 7 people
@Black Sci Fi
I concur. Armed resistance is not feasible for Black people at this moment in history. There are other means of resistance that are more effective and more feared than taking up arms, namely an African American BDS styled movement.
Many Black people are not clear about who the police are or who they “serve and protect”. Many of us don’t know that there are people they answer to, both locally and nationally. This level of analysis and action takes leadership. Potential Black leaders have been traditionally indentified early, seduced with money, prestige and limited power or if they resisted those blandishments, were/are discredited, imprisoned, exiled or murdered.
LikeLiked by 4 people
This rant seems to me more about how the media portrays the events.
But, I agree with that.
I am extremely angry that the US mainstream media, both left and right, immediately called the Dallas a sniper a “murderer”, whereas they do not call the killer cops in Minnesota and Baton Rouge, LA “murderers”. I hate this double standard.
LikeLike
I wasn’t even going to comment on these shootings because I’m so heart sick over all of it…. nothing gets done and talking doesn’t take away the sting
but the media gets to have their circus and white racist get to twist the narrative to down play this unjust system.
As far as this guy, Micah is concerned…If he really wanted to make an impact to show that justice needs to be served, then he should have taken out George Zimmerman first.
I don’t condone killing innocent people as “revenge” for other people’s actions…hopeful, this incident will wake up the politicians and white people who are determined to keep their heads down under the sand.
LikeLiked by 3 people
@Black Sci Fi
You hit on a point of complexity.
As a commmenter on this blog and others I often find myself defending Arabs/Muslims against ugly comments by European Christian Supremacists. I do this fully aware of the horrific treatment and deeply anti-African attitudes held by those same Arabs and Muslims worldwide. Complexity
In many Black urban communities, homegrown Black Muslims are often forces for good. They build businesses, schools and help drug addicts overcome their addiction. I tend to think of them when I defend Muslims. If I thought only of Arabs, those warm, fuzzy feelings would not be present. More Complexity
We live in a time and place of intense Islamophobia. Many “drive by” trolls on this blog roll in and make such far fetched historical claims against Muslims that I often reflexively highlight the positives of Muslim and Arab culture (which are many compared to European Christian culture). Yet, I am fully aware of the shadow sides of Islam that mainly affected Africans historically and still do.
Complexity & Contradictions
Black Sci Fi, I’m glad you pointed out some facts in what I consider a complex subject. Food for thought.
LikeLiked by 5 people
Black Sci-Fi
What can white people do to black people that they have not done already ?
Micah Johnson took one for the team. As Malcolm X said “I’d rather die on my feet, than live life on my knees”
I agree armed resistance for black people is an uphill struggle. The scripture says “How can you make war with the beast ?”
But David did beat Goliath.
LikeLike
Our best weapon is organized economic resistance, or financial boycotts.
LikeLiked by 2 people
@Black Sci Fi
It appears that you shoul’ve address Kamutef, not me. Besides, I never claimed kinship with Arabs, nor did I mention anything, regarding why the Great Wall was built.
LikeLike
@ Afrofem
We drink from the same cup. Thank you, again, for your thoughtful and measured response.
When I was young I felt the need to “embrace” cognitive dissonance rather than seek the ultimate truth in things. I am now in my 60th season and have grown to embrace both the ugly truth of our path to servitude and our deep well of potential to change our reality, for the better.
Within that context as a “human being” seeking the full realization of my potential to change my circumstances and by doing so enhance my lot from acorn to family tree, I am appalled at the embrace of “fairy tales” by our people.
Jesus said: “CHOOSE”
Mohammad said: “SUBMIT”
Our African ancestors prospered when “RECIPROCITY” was our guiding moral principal and the basis for “successful” interaction with other cultures.
I cringe when I hear our people embrace reparations based on the “cultural appropriation” of ..wait for it…HAIR STYLES..?? At it’s core this type of thinking is just silly. The opposite side of the coin is the truth of the cultural dominance of white hair styles before our great, great, great, great grandparents were born. I am baffled by the lack of a profitable end game to such foolishness.
To allow the press to turn our inter-family holiday gathering racial gripes into a “cause” is beyond foolish. We have sold our magazines and broadcast outlets to white businesses after showing them how to make money in our communities. And, don’t even get me started on our “Afro to Euro” hair product companies that sold-out to Revlon………
I must have missed the “cultural appropriation” demonstrations by Euro-Americans protesting the Euro hairstyles and chemical hair straightening products our people use religiously, both foreign and domestic, to pay submissive (tribute?) to our conquerors.
The “mis-education of the Negro”, both foreign and domestic, is alive and well and growing with each generation of our people devoted to following “fairy tales” rather than seeking RECIPROCITY in their dealings with other cultures.
There is another way and I think perhaps a better way. I seek to follow a road to freedom that demands “RECIPROCITY” as the foundation of inter-cultural relations.
The “complexity” you refer to, IMHO, is the work for OUR Ambassadors. But, first we have to have the political (FINANCIAL?) means to negotiate beyond trinkets and the guiding morality of our ancestors to enforce it.
I see a glimmer of hope in the form of our “entertainment class” using their capital to “slowly” uplift our people, both foreign and domestic. But, our mis-education must be replaced by a firm grasp of our plight through bottom-up education of who is responsible for our plight, both internal and external, and how “we” get back on the right path.
My apology to all for the length of my post. I just can’t go along with any more foolishness. That includes the most powerful man in the world “crying” at a funeral of our murdered people rather than finding a way to protect us from harm. And, I have no fucks left to give regarding his post-presidential home.
LikeLiked by 3 people
@ blakksage,
My sincere apology.
AND, FWIW,
@Kamutef….”Luuuucy, you got some splainin’ to do.”
LikeLike
@Fan
I disagree. Our best weapon against tyranny is (Pan African) education, self-organized FINANCIAL education and GROWTH and FINANCIAL patronage of Black Businesses, when possible. I would also include Pan-African business development. I applaud the recent announcement of Ghana forming a partnership with a failing bank on the south side of Chicago to offer $9M dollars in loans. Bravo…!!!
LikeLiked by 2 people
Yesterday in my workplace in the break room there is a flatscreen television mounted upon the wall and for some reason it says on CNN and FOX. I have learned you can tell a lot about what an individual subscribes to regarding social justice by their mainstream media consumption. I noticed that what happens to us in the Black community they don’t really care or have empathy. I was taking a short break to eat my breakfast and I was a little perturbed watching Wolf Blitzer go on and on about how the shooter “hated white people” I think it’s hypocritical when the dominant culture refuses to understand why we have movements like BLM because all Black people are asking the culture of law enforcement is too stop killing Black citizens. As long as people in Black bodies continually are snuffed out white people don’t care because it’s not them who are being killed. I truly hate mainstream media it’s purpose is to distort and shape the narrative the way they want to and to further exacerbate the fear and panic. The mainstream media like the those mirrors in the funhouse distorting and creating false images. Streching and distorting they never tell the truth.
LikeLiked by 5 people
@ HIPHOPRECORDS
General Powell said it best: ” Pick your battles and then apply overwhelming force”.
The only battle POC can wage is one of superior ideas and the morality of ideals brought to fore by the Pan-African education of our youth.
If, you are in the entertainment business, as I have been on a few different levels and skill sets, you know about the opportunity to teach, not preach.
Best of fortune to you and yours.
LikeLike
@Mary Burrell,
I somehow find it hard to believe that YOU, of all people, could be outraged and shocked by a very predictable response to a racially motivated mass murder by those who support and defend, once by law, racially motivated mass murder.
YOU are very well aware that TRUST is earned and RESPECT is still based on tribal power. Same as it ever was..!!
Keep educating your family and building for success in their lives that will spread to those around you…….
LikeLike
I don’t agree with what the brother did I don’t agree with retaliatory violence. I feel he was stressed out and driven to the breaking point of witnessing the social injustice of Black Americans just like the rest of us Black people. Especially after serving in the military and coming home to still being treated like a “n-word.” If mental illness in the Black community is not addressed there will be more of the same. I will not judge Micah Xavier Johnson nor will I laude him as a hero either. He is a symptom of social injustice in America. I do get angry with white people burying their stupid heads in the sand or them being obtuse and pretending that they don’t see they created this monster called racial injustice and they need to help destroy the monster they created.
LikeLiked by 3 people
@Black-Sci: You don’t get to tell me how the f*k how to think or feel or how I express what I feel. So you can loose me with your condescending tone. Go screw yourself. And leave me alone.
LikeLike
Dallas is my home and what has happened in in Baton and Minnesota has me in an emotional upheaval. Just commuting through the city and see what transpired the night before frightens me because I know it could turn into something worse I don’t want to see my community destroyed and things out of order and chaos. This frightens me.
LikeLiked by 3 people
@ Mary Burrell
This must be terrifying for you and everyone else in Dallas. Please stay safe.
LikeLiked by 1 person
it’s the ‘weekend of rage’ here in philly, nothing’s happening now, but everyone is talking about it.
LikeLike
@white people
How sweet, have you compiled the names and details of the 123 blacks killed by the cops within a year? Oh! They don’t matter right? Of course no one should pay for the sins of another but has any of the officers who committed such inhumane act ever been given what he deserved? Are you not protecting and covering up for one of your own? If I may ask, what do you expect after so much unjustified killings?because you are the law and their nightmares they should just sit back and wait their turn to be shot? Just saying though. Fix the police system, bring the wrong doers out to face justice, there won’t be black killings by white policemen anymore and some blacks won’t pick up arms to take judgement into their own hands anymore.
Does the white police think they can butcher black people as they want, without the blacks fighting back some day???
Now where white officers have their first victims, maybe they think twice to kill a black man again!
LikeLike
Don’t lay down your life all by itself, preserve your life, its the best thing you got and if you got to give it up….LET IT BE…EVEN STEVEN! ( 5 Dallas police officers are dead ) This is even Steven. Quote: Malcolm X 1963
They kill us unjustly , we kill them, justly!
LikeLiked by 2 people
amen
LikeLike
Until I get a completely full picture of the cops that were shot (past employment history, any disciplinary actions, past military history, past criminal history, past juvenile history, social media comments, etc. . . ) I’m not going to assume those cops were “innocent” or feel sorry for their deaths/injuries. All the media keeps saying is how targetted and purposeful Johnson’s shots were – maybe there was method to his supposed madness. Of course, we’ll never know because no one wants to put them in a “bad light” or what I’d like to call it – an accurate depiction.
I’ve been thinking for a long time that we should have privatized police forces that run things more transparently, engage in extensive background investigations for its officers (initial and ongoing), abide and subscribe by consistent procedures, and use independent community based committees to determine justifiable force, disciplinary actions, and other internal decisionmaking involving public rights vs. policing policies w/o relying on prosecutors and the criminal justice system. Ideally all local and state police should have some or all of these methods incorporated into its structure but we all know they prefer to circle the wagons and immediately protect their officers regardless of what they see or hear. What’s the point of having cops wear body cameras if they won’t show what’s on the film or you basically have to shame them into revealing it? The current structure can’t be relied upon – have to dismantle it and start again and not eliminate methods for them to hide behind to save their own necks. They should be directly serving the communities they police, not local governments and politicians.
LikeLike
*meant to say “and eliminate methods for them to hide behind . . .”
LikeLike
@ MaryBurrell
My family also lives in Dallas. I too am moved beyond platitudes to express my hope for a more productive outcome for our people.
My comments to you were based on my fondness for your otherwise frequent and thoughtful posts regarding your thoughts on cultural awareness.
I was clearly wrong in offering to you what “I thought” were words of encouragement. My intentions were not to cause you pain, but to remind you of your words of cultural awareness offered so often on this blog that have been a source of inspiration to me.
Again, my apology and kind thoughts to you and yours………
LikeLike
@ sharinalr
When I first heard the story, there were several snipers, and I can understand that in the heat of things, people get confused BUT we know the police and the media lie and so I do not take their ‘reporting’ as gospel anymore than I believe the black male found hanging from a tree in Atlanta was a “suicide.”
My associates and I have talked for years about the rising racism, and the increasing number of whites who will go back to the “old way” of doing things due to a collapsing economy and rising white fears and rage. The people in power are setting the stage for massive non-white scapegoating — “illegals, Muslims (brown Nigs), immigrants of color and black people , movies like the Purge, and black revisionist films showing the good ole days for white people when blacks knew and were kept in our place.
Why? Because they know it WORKS. They know the random white person out there would rather blame someone not white than face the BITTER TRUTH that it is their OWN PEOPLE who are doing them in. The lack of logic in this is astounding but it no longer amazes or surprises me. I accept it the way I accept that the sun will rise in the east and set in the west. It is built into their nature and there is nothing that will change that
(how much more evidence do the diehard among us need??)
That being said, without making this post too long, I would like to caution all not to fall for teary-eyed poem readings of white females all orchestrated by the media or by the whites marching beside us.
Many of them are plants and some are agents but the overall effect is one of orchestrated confusion for the black victims who now have the task of deciding if this is racism or not because of the presence of all the ‘good white people.’
It doesn’t matter to me one whit how many whites hold signs and march, the BOTTOM LINE is when they sit on a jury where a white policeman is on trial for killing a black person — no amount of video evidence, will make that white person vote to convict that white cop. If they won’t do that I could give a D about them marching beside me. In fact, I do not want to march with them (or anyone else for that matter since I don’t believe in it).
The police are seen as an EXTENSION of white power and privilege and whites zealously guard the sanctity of their (not our) police, regardless of wrongdoing when it comes to black people, because–I believe–the police are the barrier — not between whites and black criminals, but between whites and black RETRIBUTION.
Whites aren’t afraid of us, they’re afraid of having to face their crimes against us and us getting an opportunity to “even the score” and they feel the best way to avoid that situation is to keep a foot on our necks and a terroristic finger on that trigger . And I’ll end on that note.
LikeLiked by 5 people
@ lkeke35
How many lies can a liar tell? The number is endless.
LikeLike
@Black Sci-Fi: Please forgive my outburst but I am in a very fragile place emotionally and mentally right now. Please forgive my lashing out. I am just so upset from the events of the past week and what has occurred in the city that is my home. Peace and blessings to you Sir. Again I apologize.
LikeLike
@ Kamutef
who said, “Why do you think the Great Wall of China was built? All of these gigantic walls stretching from Europe to Asia? Who were these people trying to keep away from?”
I never thought about that!
LikeLike
@Trojan Pam: I have said it in previous post when a movie franchise creates a series like the Purge they are sending a message that this is what they would like to see happening in America. In the midst of this election campaign with Donald Trump and his hate regime and all the murders perpetrated by the police against Black Americans these things are the perfect storm to bring about the collapse of this country. We might as well be living in Nazi Germany.
LikeLiked by 1 person
@ Mary Burrell
As I read through your posts I was touched by your pain. I understand it is hard to understand how the murder of any human being does not resonate regardless of skin color. This is something that a lot of black people cannot wrap our heads around. I think we must force ourselves to see what is happening for what it is: racism/white supremacy
a people determined to dominate another group will do anything that will allow them to continue that domination. I won’t get into the psychological sickness of such a mindset, but I think it is time for us to face what and who we are dealing with.
I’m also saddened by the anxiety you must feel, it is like being in a war zone where no one has officially declared war but there are bodies on the ground. Be careful and please gently advise the younger males and females in your family when dealing with the police, their agenda must ALWAYS be to come home that night, and to not assert their rights or get into a verbal confrontation with the police. AFTER it is over (and hopefully, nothing major has taken place) THEN file a complaint when they are SAFELY HOME.
Another word of caution that I feel I must give. Black males who are consorting and cavorting with white females must be very, very careful about where and how they engage in this behavior. This is not about “denying” them their right to be with whoever they choose, this is about the increasing DANGERS in engaging in this activity.
Recently, there have been several suspicious deaths (hangings and in one case, a black male married to a white female was found with his throat slashed, one eye gouged out, and the police (I believe it was in Texas) claimed it was a “drug overdose.”
I asked a friend who lives near that area what he had heard and he said: “Everybody knew he had a white woman and wasn’t surprised.” In those other deaths, at least one was tied to some white female that apparently had a “crush” on a black male student and that this angered some of his white male classmates. The young black male was found rolled up in a gym mat with his face and skull caved in and the official explanation was “it was an accident.”
The old ways are returning. The only question now, is what will be our response? We will continue to be against each other, practicing anti-blackness like a religion? Will we stay in denial? Will we continue to seek white validation over black empowerment and love of our own people? We are the ones who will have to change and if we fail to do so we are complicit in our own demise.
And I agree with you about the Purge, it was pretty obvious from the first movie that this demonic form of non-entertainment was actually a white rallying cry that violence against whatever “targets” you select is acceptable.
LikeLike
A ROBOT WITH A BOMB to take him down tho? WTF???
LikeLiked by 3 people
And Mark Hughes was wrongly labeled as the sniper all because he was carrying his rifle. Texas is an open carry state so the brother was exercising his 2nd amendment rights so my next question since Alton and Philandor were carrying weapons in states that allow citizens to carry weapons where is the NRA? Why are they not speaking up in defense of these men? Just me venting I know that the NRA is comprised of racist whites I was foolish to think they would speak up in this instance especially since these were dead Black men. I hope Mark Hughes sues the h3ll out of the Dallas Police Department and the city of Dallas.
LikeLiked by 3 people
@ Mary
The NRA is very much pro cop and pro white.
http://fusion.net/story/323189/nra-members-ask-organization-philando-castile-alton-sterling/
LikeLike
@michaeljonbarker: Yes, I kind of figured that I should have known better than to think it was inclusive they look like they have an agenda. And to think Charleston Heston was apart of this.
LikeLike
The NRA showed its true colours.
LikeLiked by 2 people
I hope you don’t breed. This article is full of hate and ignorance in defense for a piece of shit murderer.
“Probably scared for his life”.
Oh get fucked. Kills 5 officers at a fucking protest. A protest that was to be peaceful.
You don’t stop violence with more violence! Wake the hell up people!
Stop playing the victim card! You’re an American, I’m an American. Our brothers and sisters from all walks of life have been murdered.
I don’t care what you think is just. You don’t kill people. And you certainly are not a normal person if you 100% agree with this mad mans actions. You are a coward. You are sick. You have issues.
I wouldn’t be surprised that the author of this article creates their very own brutal actions against those whom oppose him.
You’re a fucking nut jub. Please don’t breed.
LikeLiked by 1 person
@ Brian
Did you read the whole post?
The post is a bitter, sarcastic joke. I talked about Johnson the same way the police, government officials and the parrot press talk about police brutality. They are the ones who defend the murder of defenceless, innocent people. They are the ones who are sick and have issues.
I said “a part of me” wanted to see some cops killed. That means another part of me did not. Clearly if police brutality is wrong, then so is killing police officers at random. Two wrongs do not make a right. It just makes two wrongs.
LikeLiked by 2 people
@ jefe
If it were only the press.
Sadly, the press is just parroting the police and government officials. That is why I said their brains are set to off as the standard setting. They see it as being “objective”, as sticking to the facts. In practice it turns them into a mouthpiece for the state.
LikeLiked by 3 people
LOL @Afrofem and @Black Sci-Fi, in reference to the Bible being a fairy tale. If both of you truly believed that the Book is truly such a fairy tale, why spend so much time attempting to denounce it or those who believe in it? Judging merely from your posts, it’s very clear that neither one of you understand the Bible. In the alternative, you both put up a scaffold of a façade of being all knowing when in fact, neither of you know nothing! Your posts are thoroughly empty! Because if either one of you truly knew what the hell you are talking about, you’d proffer up some solutions.
If both of you are God hater like Nietzsche was, well then, go ahead and continue frolicking about his asinine essays. Just don’t think for one second that I’m going to reduce my faith to equate with or join the ranks of two mortal infidels.
Why are both of you so darn concerned about my beliefs and who I choose to worship? Both of you, SIT DOWN and be quiet!
I have a couple of Scriptures for you fellas: Proverbs 1:22 “How long, ye simple ones, will ye love simplicity? and the scorners delight in their scorning, and the fools hate knowledge?
Isaiah 44:25 That frustrateth the tokens of the liars, and maketh diviners mad; that turneth wise men backward, and maketh their knowledge foolish.
@Black Sci Fi, by the way, don’t you have a blog to manage at: wearerespectablenegroes? Are you here due to a lack of activity on your own blog?
LikeLike
Brian said: “This article is full of hate and ignorance in defense for a piece of shit murderer.”
Your’e so darn funny! Did you say the same thing about pieces of shit Officers Blane Salamoni and Howie Lake when they murdered Alton Sterling? Less than 48 hours later, did you say the same thing about piece of shit Officer Jeronimo Yanez when he murdered Philando Castile?
How hollow of a person are you Brian when a Black man is murdered?
LikeLiked by 1 person
I’m not sure what this guy did was right. He shot down a couple of innocent people but I say: what are people, and angry people at that to do when NO SOLUTIONS are being brought forth to deal with murderous police?
It’s funny how the white man, whose history is FULL of bloodshed comes to the black man today and says that violence isn’t the answer. Violence WAS the answer when it came to fighting the redcoats for independence. Violence WAS the answer to put a stop to Hitler’s machinations in Germany. But now that the black man is using violence to make a statement against the violence that is being used against him by corrupted police, it isn’t the answer.
This is the hate that hate produced. White people started this blood feud, so now they’re going to have to deal with it.
LikeLiked by 3 people
Any peace that is contingent on one side being comfortable with oppression is going to be fragile. Micah Johnson did exactly what black people don’t often do; he attacked agents of the state in retaliation for state sponsored violence. Isn’t that what the second amendment is about. The ability of armed citizens to combat tyranny? That’s what I’ve been hearing from white gun owners anyway.
LikeLiked by 4 people
@Mary Burrell
It frightens me, too. This country has been like an attic full of gasoline soaked rags for a long time. I kept hoping the spark would never connect with the rags…that maybe we would all luck out and no big flames or explosion. Now I don’t know.
Mary, you have a lot of integrity and honesty. You have a knack for saying what many of us think deep down.
I want you to know that many of us feel like we are living in Dallas…Baton Rouge…and St. Paul right now. We share the same destiny.
LikeLiked by 2 people
@blakksage,
Thank you for your well reasoned post steeped in your demonstrably illuminated understanding of Christianity.
LikeLike
I’ll also refrain from classifying police officers I don’t know as innocent. How do I know they haven’t lied to put an innocent person in jail, turned a blind eye to injustice, planted drugs on someone, beaten a compliant citizen to a pulp for “resisting” or shot someone for no reason? The media certainly hasn’t been exploring these possilibities. Perhaps Micah Johnson psychically sussed out the reprobates and cleaned up the Dallas PD. I really thought the press would have been on the ball given the good work they do when black people are killed. I mean, not even a dead pre-teen (Tamir Rice) was spared a thorough analysis of his upbringing and family circumstances so I’m sure they’ll eventually examine any blemishes in the backgrounds of dead people who walked around with guns all day. Then everyone who feels terrible right now can feel better knowing that they deserved to die after all.
LikeLiked by 2 people
Maybe it’s possible to be neutral in regards to the Dallas event. I dont support nor will I condem his actions. His actions were that of a soldier. If he was a racist murder that hated white people why not attack a soft target and maximize the kill count? Instead he took it to the oppressor.
I’m not saying he is a hero but I don’t think it’s necessary to take one side or the other. I see it as blow back no different then what happens because of American foreign policy around the world. The world is less of a safe place because of the actions of state agents both domestic and foreign.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Dave Winer: The war comes home:
http://scripting.com/2016/07/09/1364.html
LikeLiked by 4 people
The Bahamas issued a travel advisory about the US:
http://mofa.gov.bs/ministry-of-foreign-affairs-and-immigration-issues-travel-advisory-for-bahamians-traveling-to-united-states-of-america/
LikeLiked by 1 person
@abagond
I’d found that Bahamas story on the site of a Caribbean newspaper and most of the comments on it seemed to be from angry Americans. I doubt that they regularly read that site so I had to wonder how they found it and why they were so upset. I’m guessing a youtuber or blogger linked to it and their racist audience followed.
LikeLike
@ Origin
If you google “bahamas travel advisory” you will see that it is already in the White press: CNN, BBC, Washington Post, ABC, USA Today, etc.
LikeLike
@ Origin
Think Progress had the story even before the Gleaner in Jamaica.
LikeLike
@abagond
I see.
I guess the commenters were thinking that US racism, gun culture, and the resulting social dysfunction makes the country look peachy to everyone else? Like, “How dare this ‘third world country’ warn its citizens to be careful in the US”.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Funny how white people all over social media as crying for peace love and sympathy. Kumbaya they want after these cops got shot, but I have been drained and don’t have it to give.
LikeLiked by 4 people
I loved this from the comment section in the Washington Post story about the Bahamas Travel Advisory:
Posted by someone named John Lawson.
LikeLiked by 8 people
@ Afrofem
LMAO. Brilliant.
LikeLike
Our black people are waking up, so of course I am in a good mood.
LikeLiked by 1 person
LikeLiked by 2 people
obviously the races can´t live together in piece. Both sides accuse the other side to be violent and gruesome. Both sides accuse the other side of to not tell the truth about the basic facts. There are two groups in this senseless conflict: people of westafrican ancestry and people of non-westafrican ancestry (which includes Euro Americans, Asian Americans, Native Americans).
The relevant question is of course now: how can a peaceful separation of the two groups be achieved? Somehow people of westafrican ancestry should have their own place where they can make the rules themselfes, and among other things have a westafrican police. Non-westafricans should also have their own place. It should be a separation which takes a long time, no fast actions. It should be as just as possible, which will be very hard.
Above all it should be a friendly separation. After all those decades, centuries of a failed experiment of racial integration this could at least something to work on together in piece.
The number 1 rule should be no more non-westafrican immigration to westafrican countries (westafrican countries are countries in Westafrica as countries in the Americas with westafrican majority) and also no immigration from Westafrican countries to westafrican countries.
LikeLike
LOL, “You were fired from being slaves please go back to Africa now”.
Sorry, no friendly separation without reparation…
and it would have to be waay more than Israel gets each year.
LikeLiked by 2 people
We don’t need a thing from WHITES. That’s why I don’t like the concept of reparations. We can build for ourselves, whites will never give us reparations for slavery, ever. That’s a pipe dream but separation isn’t a pipe dream, it’s something we could eventually pull off. It’s sad how many brothers and sisters can’t see that white folks don’t want to be peaceful with us. I’d go so far as to say even that the so called good ones who protest with us are only doing it because they are coming from a place of power.
Imagine if the races were treated equally and white, black, yellow and brown were competing for the same jobs. Would whites be so willing to march with us then? Being their societal equal? No. Marching with us now is just another manifestation of the white Savior complex and so called enlightened blacks take the bait time and time again.
MLK marched with whites too, and look what we have today. History is repeating itself over and over and over. Integration isn’t working, it won’t ever work because white supremacy dictates that blacks must be labelled inferior. Black people are sadly the most idealistic people on the planet. They have humanities worst case of Stockholm syndrome and I’m not sure we will survive.
LikeLiked by 1 person
@[not so] nice guy
“After all those decades, centuries of a failed experiment of racial integration this could at least something to work on together in piece.”
I sure hope you were drunk or high when you wrote this. Slavery, Jim Crow, land theft and mass rape were not “experiments in racial integration”, they were crimes.
Euro-Americans who are obsessed with “separation of the races” should direct their fury to the people who decided to get closer to “the races”, namely their own ancestors. They made the world what it is today with their boundless greed and violence. Everyone else was living on their own lands and minding their own business when European
invadersstrangers showed up on their shores.Upset…annoyed…angry? Go to your nearest bone yard and yell away. I hear scream therapy is good for what ails you.
LikeLiked by 4 people
@jony
Our gracious blog host once wrote of reparations:
Those words are still just as true and potent today as the day they were written.
LikeLiked by 4 people
@jony
I was mostly humoring “nice guy”. Nonetheless, if white people don’t want us around I don’t see why they shouldn’t pay for the privilege.
LikeLiked by 1 person
@Afrofem
Touché. It has been awhile since I have read that post. When stated like that I can understand the reparations argument.
I suppose it would be the white collective finally snapping out of denial. The white press always talks about the “ugly past” as if the future isn’t just as ugly. They are aware of what they’ve done but they refuse to make amends in any meaningful way. It makes me think that maybe, just maybe there isn’t any hope for them and by extension us at all.
LikeLike
Found this interesting bit of news:
Fact: In the first 24 days of 2015, police in the US fatally shot more people than police did in England and Wales, combined, over the past 24 years.
http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2016/07/09/us-police-hold-world-record-for-murdering-civilians/
LikeLike
Where do the stats of black on white crimes come from? I see it flipped every which way and am just confused on the matter. I am pretty sure that black people do not just walk up and kill white folks. So where are those numbers coming from and how do we get a solid single source to report on the casualties of either side?
LikeLike
Some the pictures that you see of the police are crazy. Look at them
http://images.dailykos.com/images/272519/story_image/GettyImages-545751904.jpg?1468237349
That’s more gear than you get kitted up with in Afghanistan and I’m being 100% serious. Militarized police dressed like frickin’ idiots in huge amounts of military gear, with assault weapons and helmets and all that stupid sh*t sends the message that they are an occupying force
One thing I did notice (And you can even see it in the picture) when I was in the USA was number of completely out of shape cops I saw. It seems like if you’re out in the streets, you should have an expected level of physical fitness, and you should have to demonstrate it on a regular basis.
But being able to see the faces of the people you’re interacting with humanizes them. The whole idea of police as paramilitaries is so messed up and contrary to any idea of what policing should be.
LikeLiked by 3 people
@ TheHipHopRecords
That militarism comes from politicians’s “get tough on crime” rhetoric, which in turn is meant to appeal to racist working-class Whites to get their vote.
LikeLike
Jouelzy, who I follow on YouTube, was at the Dallas shooting:
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qrKEIBU7MkU)
LikeLike
@Durt
“…how do we get a solid single source to report on the casualties of either side?”
As far as I know, there is no “solid single source” for murders in this country. A lot of stats are dependent on reports from police and coroners. Both routinely falsify or minimize causes of death and numbers of people who die. This is magnified x10 if police are involved in the death of someone.
All I know is if a Black person injures or kills a White person they will suffer the harshest sentence the State provides for the crime. If a White person injures or kills a Black person they may or may not be held accountable at all.
LikeLike
President Obama will be in the city on Tuesday. to recognize the slain officers too bad he couldn’t see about the dead black men in Baton Rouge and Minnesota.
LikeLiked by 3 people
@ Mary
I hope President Obama changes his mind. Black lives matter too. He needs to appear in front of the Triple S Food Mart in Baton Rouge, preferably at the exact spot Alton Sterling was killed, just as President Bush needed to appear at Ground Zero.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Support over here in the UK in Manchester
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t9OuEI-0TCg)
LikeLike
How would a small-scale BDS movement go about for black Americans? The most immediate action I can see being taken is to stop patronizing the various liquor stores, beauty salons and handi-packs that are invariably under immigrant ownership, yet exist in our community. That’s one way of taking our dollars back.
Another would be to not make any investments that would hurt us financially more than it would help. That means no more payday loans, buy-here-pay-here car purchases or rent-to-own furniture purchases.
The next step would be to hold a general spending boycott on the busiest sales periods of the year. Let’s see how the rest of America fares when blacks decide to withhold their spending dollars during Thanksgiving and Christmas.
Those are the things that ordinary black folk can do. Here’s what I would like to see elsewhere:
1) Have every single black NBA and NFL player refuse to take to the field until further notice. Have every young black player in the NCAA and SEC do the same. No more negros running that ball for your entertainment, white America.
2) Have every black actor and actress step away from the Hollywood spotlight and invest in their own studios and distribution outlets. No more negros on the silver screen for your entertainment, white America.
3) Have every black singer and songwriter step away from the microphone and invest in their own studios and distribution outlets. No more negros on radio for your entertainment, white America.
4) Get involved in politics at the grassroots level. No more marching for yet another black person gunned down by angry whites. We’ll push as many of our people as we can into local office and make ourselves heard at the ballot box.
5) Procreate. Being 13% of this country’s population leaves us in a precarious situation. We should be breeding the bigoted white off the face of this earth.
It might be flawed and I might change this at another time, but it’s what I got and…well…there it is.
LikeLiked by 5 people
@Mack
This needs to be seen by those in those positions! This is genius! What would Ameriklan do without their entertainment on screen?
It’s amazing how many brilliant ideas we all have down here but we can never get them off the ground. What you’ve suggested WOULD work. No black actor or professional sports player has to go in to work tomorrow. That would send a LOUD AND CLEAR message.
God I wish we had a way to get some organization going and start pushing plans like these on a nationwide scale.
LikeLike
@ Mack
Some form of mass Black Collective resistance should have happened when Skip Gates was arrested and mistreated for disorderly conduct charges outside of his own residence at Harvard.
Obama said that the police behaved “stupidly.” Then he was forced to have a political “teachable moment” meeting at the white house with himself, the vice-president, Skip Gates and the policeman who arrested Gates.
Sadly, I’m of the mindset that celebrity entertainers/athletes won’t stop entertaining white people until one of their is murdered or killed. I’d love to be wrong about this..
It’s going to take some type of tipping point (critical mass) to get a significant number of Black people on ONE ACCORD regarding self-sacrifice to achieving a successful movement. Otherwise, they’ll keep taking us out, as usual, one by one.
LikeLiked by 1 person
correction
*until one of their own is murdered ….
LikeLike
So many informative and insightful coments I wish Ihad more to contribute than praise.
I do have a question though ,who originated this quote ”
This is why whites need to give reparations more than blacks need to receive it.”
Thank you
LikeLiked by 2 people
@Mbeti
Abagond wrote those words in this post:
LikeLike
Kiwi
Stop trying to pigeon hole me in to someone who can only empathise with issues related to a certain race of people.
I do sometimes think this forum is like an echo chamber and it can be intimidating to those who are not as well read or articulate as those day to day commenter but, if I have the time and depending on the topic, I will give it a go and respond to posts.
I did pause before i posted my comment to you and now, engaging with you I feel like I am having a conversation with a teenager who at the moment is so caught up in their own life that only what they need matters and are unable to empathise with others because they lack maturity. Maturity being the operative word. Your snippy responses are ridiculous from a grown man, hence I do question your maturity.
Your commentary at the moment is no better than the ridiculous fly by white commenters that post on forums like this to be divisive and inciteful. Yet, you still come back, even though clearly you dont feel any afilliation with many people on here – why is that? I can’t work out whether you are being a troll or if you just want some sort of validation. Either way, your commentary of late sucks and I hope the insightful, mature commenter that once posted re emerges
LikeLiked by 3 people
@kiwi
How do you know what Omnipresent is thinking when she read what you and I were discussing ? It seems you are trolling by bringing up a discussion that we had and assumig Omnipresent thinks a certain way or even read it originally.
Racial hierarchy is one way to look at how racism is structured but not the only way to view how racism affects society.
LikeLike
@Kiwi
Your also seem to have a problem with the lack of empathy I have stated I have for the fallen police officers and that my lack of empathy is because they are white.
I view the police as having a gangland culture that monopolizes force in their jurisdictions and maintains oppression in their communities. It would not have mattered to me if the fallen Dallas police officers had been Black, I still wouldn’t have had empathy for them.
An activist at the CNN town hall suggested that the police should be abolished in her community. That was met with much shock and pearl clutching. I concur with her and think society has been brainwashed into thinking that we *need* the police.(My apologies for not remembering her name)
Again you are jumping to conclusions about what I would think in the same way that you are questioning other contributors here by creating a strawman.
You have made it too much about winning an argument with others and that has led to unneeded toxicity.
LikeLiked by 2 people
Michael Jon Barker
Thanks for the support, one small detail, I am a man but it’s all good
LikeLiked by 2 people
Omnipresent.
My apologies for that, I meant to edit it differently.
LikeLike
So, one of the dallas cops may have been a white supremacist,
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jesse-benn/slain-dallas-cop-mightve_b_10953276.html
LikeLiked by 4 people
@michaeljonbarker
Because he thinks he is a mind reader and knows all things that people think. In reality he thinks like that which is why he constantly places the false belief on others. I forgot what it is called in technical terms, but he is projecting his inner feelings onto others.
LikeLike
@Glorp
Thanks for the article.
LikeLike
@Omnipresent
Most have taken to ignoring him. You rarely comment, but even I know from past comments that you are far from what he believes you to be. In his eyes you have to be that “monster” so he can feel better about the “monster” he has become.
LikeLiked by 1 person
“I forgot what it is called in technical terms, but he is projecting his inner feelings onto others.”
@Sharina
Yup, he’s projecting but he’s …
being DISINGENUOUS
giving in to his penchant for twisting things to create Strawmen
Moving goalposts
Mad/Insane/Nonsensical
Delusional – clutching at things that aren’t there
in Denial
Deliberately Obtuse
Sub-atomic *nick-picking*
… I could go on
LikeLiked by 2 people
Yesterday afternoon, before the Dallas shootings, a part of me wanted to see some cops killed. You know, a taste of their own medicine. But now that it has come true, I fear how this will play into the hands of the racists who run this country.
– Abagond, 2016.
—————————————————————————————————
Published on Jul 12, 2016
On Friday, former Illinois Congressman Joe Walsh went on CNN to defend a controversial tweet declaring “war” on President Obama and the Black Lives Matter movement.
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVjqaWpTFbo)
LikeLike
I am disappointed in President Obama in his lack of concern for what’s happening in the country concerning the police brutality and killings of Black citizens. The Black Chief of Police as well. The police chief made a very insulting statement in regards to the BLM protesters. “Get out the protest line and apply for a job as a police officer.” This is where I blank stare at the television screen 😠😳 President Obama says he agreed with the Police Chief and that we ask too much of the police, and we ask too little of ourselves.😡 I am too outdone and too through with these two Black men they are nothing but puppets. So much for thinking these men care about Black people.
LikeLiked by 5 people
Because i dont post often it makes easier for a post like Kiwis’ to discredit me so Thanks Sharina
LikeLiked by 1 person
@Glorp
Statistically, can you kill 5 police and don’t get at least one white supremacist? Sounds like an opportunity for researching “police force pathologies”.
LikeLiked by 2 people
@Origin
hell yes. not surprising at all
LikeLike
Whatever the truth turns out to be about what happened with Micah Johnson, the PTB, which includes Barama and other black puppets, is using it to flip the script. Look at this praise for the cops..
(https://youtu.be/KjYyqv9zokc?t=4m30s)
She is so thankful for the Dallas Police Department.
Redsilverjay describes how they are trying to paint BLM as terrorists. That’s the psyop. Love us some police and stop BLM.
(https://youtu.be/vuBgcYWL6sQ)
LikeLiked by 1 person
The reason I ask is the statement qoute seems similar in its profoundness to those of the famous,
However that bias (and many others) which the white dominated media promote is direct contradiction to my and indeed everyone’s experience.
You may (indeed its impossible) not ever be famous but beauty,profoundness and all the other glories said to reside in only the celebrities,the famous ,the 1 percent always have and always will be ours all of us.
LikeLike
Now that I have the time ,the reason for my praise is the balance ,fairness and consideration of many of the commenters here and of course the blog host.
@Mary Burrell
That’s why I didn’t vote for this superficial window dressing of a president the first or second time,indeed I can’t get past the illogic of how in a nation in excess of 150 million register voters my one vote matters or counts.
In regard to this whole issue of racist police violence
Until Enough African americans and european americans show some intelligence and integrity I have little sympathy for ethier side
I have assaulted and insulted as many aa’s as ea’s
The BLM Twitter slogan is reflexly unthought out which is why it was easily and immediately countered by the slogan all lives matter which is true – I have read stories of white and others being killed by the police unjustly and its just as disgusting.
Here is a reasonable slogan everyone could get behind – police accountability
You kill someone anyone ,your fried immediately pending possible prosecution
And every police chief must issue a statement to the public of concern and apology because they failed.
p.s really really lke the idea of abolishing the police as I rarly if ever need them ,they are more trouble that they are worth ,and it just aviods solving the real problems like proverty mental illness and racism.
LikeLiked by 4 people
“All lives matter” is true, in a naive sense, but it is rarely promoted in a genuine way by people who truly believe that and fight for it. It is brought up for the same reason “black on black” crime is brought up: as a deflection. Why do some people respond with “blue lives matter”. Aren’t police a specific group as well. Isn’t that dismissive of everyone else too (sarc)? If activists had chosen another slogan instead of “black lives matter” they may not have invited “all lives matter” as a response but we would have heard a lot of the same rthetoric referencing “black on black” crime and deifying the police.
In actuality, more white people than black people are killed by police annually and police are killed more often by white people. This is just a result of demographic realities. White people would also benefit from police reform. (Is this another case where whites may act against their own interests when an issue involves race?) However, black people are definitely killed by police extremely disproportionately relative to their percentage of the population and many studies have found evidence of racial profiling.
I agree that the “black lives matter” slogan started as an emotional response to the steady stream of killings and later evolved into a movement so the name choice was not necessarily strategic. However it is a rather humble plea that nowhere implies that other lives do not matter. Do “save the whales” campaigns mean “to hell with every other organism on earth”? The fact that black lives “mattering” is immediately taken to mean that white people don’t matter says a lot about the mindset we’re dealing with. White people automatically enter the discussion as an adversary even when they mask it in terms that sound neutral.
LikeLiked by 5 people
@ Origin
The irony is that “All lives matter”, from the way it is used, means “Black lives do NOT matter.”
LikeLike
@abagond
Exactly.
Context matters. AllLivesMatter is used as a repudiation of BLM not a spontaneous positive affirmation of everyone’s worth. It is saying that no specific attention should be given to a group’s issues even if they are specifically and disporportionately harmed. Mind you, this doctrine is not consistently followed as I keep getting calls about donating to veterans’ funds. However when a group “doesn’t matter” such callous unconcern suddenly becomes the epitome of egalitarianism. It’s whitespeak, color blind racism, the whole shebang.
LikeLiked by 1 person
@Origin
I see the term, Black Lives Matter very differently. To me, it is a brilliant and pithy slogan that zeros in with a clear analysis of the current reality of Black people in the US.
Since the 1970’s, the corporate class and their bosses in the One Percent have been in a frenzy of de-industrialization and destruction of global north and south societies. They have untethered themselves from national identification and sentiment. Their money and their bodies float around the globe like opportunistic viruses; searching for higher returns on investment (hosts), no matter who or what they destroy in the process.
That trend toward de-industrialization was coupled with the very real fear of how close the movements of the 1960s came to ushering substantial social, political and economic change to the US.
One highly desired side effect of de-industrialization for that group was massive job losses in the Black population. Those job losses had the desired effect of destabilizing Black communities. The War on Drugs, the Crack epidemic and the rise of Mass Black
ImprisonmentNeo-Slavery, were further blows to a community already reeling from the loss of steady factory jobs and the hope of upward mobility.The net result of these policies in high places was the economic reassignment of Black Americans. For decades, Black people had been an available labor pool of last resort. Black people had always been hired only after White workers were fully employed (and fired before any White worker was considered for lay-offs). With de-industrialization, Black people became a “surplus” population. Black lives literally stopped mattering to the top strata of US society. As far as they were concerned, Black people in the US could be eliminated with no consequence.
The police have been used for decades to control Black people and others with extreme violence. That function is central to their mission. The “surplus” label tacked onto Black people makes us a target for more frequent and brutal attacks by the State. (The people at the top also consider low income White people as “useless eaters”. Think of Romney’s infamous “47%” remarks. They are willing to bide their time with the low income Whites—after all, they can still be useful in attacking Black people and others.)
To me, the term Black Lives Matter and the analysis behind it are very appropriate for the fledgling movement….and this moment in time.
LikeLiked by 3 people
@Afrofem
That was well said and I understand your point. I don’t dispute the reality of the devaluation of black life. I agree that the phrase “Black Lives Matter” succintly protests this.
However, does the BLM slogan (not necessarily the movement itself) represent a viable strategy to combat the disposability of black life? IOW, is it possible to change the minds of those to whom you don’t matter by affirming your own worth and making them pay attention? Apparently not, as they have struck back with retorts that make their position clear: you still don’t matter.
Often, I see black movements asking for intangibles that can’t be granted by any legal process even if they were heard. What would they say in law: dismissed for failure to state a claim? How does one establish that black people should now “matter”? IMO, a slogan that charges a particular wrong would keep the need for specific redress at the forefront. I just thought up “We charge genocide” as an example and looked it up to discover it had already existed. http://wechargegenocide.org/
But that’s where my thinking on the nature of slogans was going when I wrote the sentence you quoted.
LikeLiked by 2 people
@Origin
We are complete accord on the issue of specific demands. I agree that BLM has not gotten that far yet. I am loathe to come down too hard on them about that for these reasons:
❖They are organizing themselves and taking action. That has been not been done in a substantive way in the Black community for several decades.
❖Black protest has been put on a ‘ship to nowhere’ for a long time. Figures like Jackson and Sharpton have captained that vessel and their main job was to stifle and misdirect Black protests. The current crop of Black youth were smart enough to give them the heave ho from the start, but they are still learning how to navigate the vessel themselves—with a creaky engine and leaky hull. (Did I mention the constant submarine attacks?)
❖They are slowly reading, learning and making connections with movement veterans who can be trusted. That process takes time. This process continues in spite of the usual dirty government tricks, informants, disruptors and sellouts that any Black struggle attracts. We have to remember that this is real life, not a television show where everything is resolved in the course of an hour. In other words, we have to manage our expectations and provide guidance when appropriate.
I can only hope they are able to continue their work without being completely shut down before they get to the stage of making clear demands—-with a strategy and tactics that move them (and us) forward. It is a race against time.
LikeLiked by 4 people
Smells like a false flag.
(https://youtu.be/bVexZjbG5j4)
LikeLike
Afrofem said,
“I can only hope they are able to continue their work without being completely shut down before they get to the stage of making clear demands—-with a strategy and tactics that move them (and us) forward. It is a race against time.”
Campaign Zero makes it clear what BLM demands are. Part of the problem is that elected officials don’t have the politicale will to push it forward. But they do have lots of time to talk and engage and have discussions.
So lots of meetings are going on (majors and police chiefs from all across the country met in Washington this week) and calls for peace including from the son of Mr.Sterling which I have mixed feelings about as it seemed staged and I think the boy was put up too it.
The focus of the media isn’t on the BLM message but rather the drama caused by blocking roads and in the unlawful arrests of protesters down in Baton Rouge and other places. The media focuses on the agitation but never once has come out and said these are the positions that BLM represents. BLM is a leaderless movment which makes it harder to infiltrate and have the message high jacked. But the downside to that seems to be getting the message out.
http://www.joincampaignzero.org/#vision
LikeLike
“Part of the problem is that elected officials don’t have the politicale will to push it forward. But they do have lots of time to talk and engage and have discussions. ”
@michaeljonbarker
Watch how fast they’ll find and gather that political will IF masses of Black people not show up for work on Monday & Tuesday, stop buying their local newspapers, stop shopping at CVS, Walmart, Walgreen’s, Target and Home Depot … or cease buying Coca-Cola, Mountain Dew, Cheerios or any other questionable products Amerikan businesses produce or sell.
All it takes is some constructive organizing. And the will of the downtrodden.
LikeLiked by 1 person
@nomad
Actually it stinks to high heaven like a false flag operation!
Thanks for the link.
LikeLike
@michaeljonbarker
Good points. Thanks for the link.
LikeLike
@Fan
Reminds me of the Univeristy of Missouri situation.
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2015/11/09/mizzou-faculty-walks-out-student-association-calls-presidents-removal/75448392/
The guy on the hunger strike (Jonathan Butler) could have died without anything changing but as soon as the football players decided to strike the president and chancellor were out of there. Why? College sports is a huge money maker. You only matter to the extent that you can hurt them. Protest that’s meant to arouse their conscience by exposing them to your suffering is rendered ineffective by their lack of empathy.
LikeLiked by 2 people
@michaeljonbarker
“The NRA has yet to come out in support of Sterling and Castile even though they were both exercising their second admendment right. ”
That is so far out of the realm of possibilities that I never even thought about it. But you are absolutely right. If this were two white guys killed for exercising their right to carry guns the NRA would be up in arms. Literally. You would see a swarm of heavily armed patriots descending on the scene. And the police wouldn’t do shit. At least, not for weeks or months.
LikeLiked by 1 person
@Black Sci-Fi
” Lone wolves only serve to justify further aggression by our tormentorsmean…lone wolf..”
That’s the name of the psy-op. Dallas, Orlando, Sandy Hook. Memphis, Dallas again. Usually ends with the death of the patsy…I mean…”lone wolf”.
Here’s one wolf that balked at being a patsy.
http://getoffthebs.com/five-su…
“In summary, it appears that Howell was on his way to “hook up” with another conspirator (Dan) to set off explosives and shoot people at the gay pride parade in Hollywood California on Sunday.
Finding his contact missing when he got to LA and having heard that Omar Matteen had been killed by a FBI SWAT teem in Orlando, Howell determined he had been double crossed by the CIA and feared for his own life.”
LikeLike
“Finding his contact missing when he got to LA and having heard that Omar Matteen had been killed by a FBI SWAT teem in Orlando, Howell determined he had been double crossed by the CIA and feared for his own life.”
— Don’t be a patsy like Lee Harvey Oswald, He got, got! —
@ nomad
It’s just warmin’ up… Gonna be a looonng HOT summer in the US .
LikeLiked by 1 person
Kiwi
Just finished chuckling ay your comment. With every post they degenerate.
You should check out the black on black crime thread where you say to 2 bickering commenters something to the effect of “for two intelligent commenters you argue over silly things ‘. Now, I’m not quoting you verbatim but I’m just reminding you that you had a maturity about you…………….once.
It seems talk is cheap!!
LikeLiked by 1 person
“I held a mirror to your face and you didn’t like what you saw. It’s okay. I understand.”
.
Is that why you’re (in part) so upset Kiwi? That blood sucking vampires like yourself cannot see their own reflections in a mirror??
Did you enjoy your last deep sleep?
When are you going back into your coffin? The air around here smells much nicer when you’re gone!
LikeLiked by 2 people
Kiwi
You’re reaching……
..desperately.
LikeLiked by 1 person
@ Kiwi
Their is one overall racial hierarchy that society orders itself through. But their is also mico hierarchies within that construct like police departments, the military and politics where POC can rise within and become part of the oppressor group.
I’m interested in Rights and that they get applied equally in society.
I admit I had trouble with the perpetual foreigner stereo type.
Rewiring how the brain thinks, whether it’s internalized or externalized, isn’t easily undone.
The opions I give are mine and are not meant to gain favor but add different context to a topic. Some of them are controversial so not always “safe”.
Hillary says whatever she needs to in order to get elected. Her ideology is up for sale. Not a fair comparison.
You yourself added unique insights from time to time back before you worried yourself over Black racism.
LikeLiked by 1 person
@Fan…
Kiwi most certainly has looked in the mirror, but he does not like what he sees. Reading past comments, he will find flaw in everyone (even if he has to make it up) but never acknowledge flaws within himself.
He will trot out Jefe, but he does not even consider him Asian and has shown a distain for half Asian commenters.
LikeLike
Omnipresent
You can’t help but laugh at the nonsense. I liked to have died laughing when he used the same sorry technique on you that he had used on me.
LikeLike
michaeljonbarker
I personally am beginning to notice that pattern of Kiwi not wanting the flaws of Asians acknowledged. Several times you as well as others have acknowledged blacks working against other blacks in this system of white supremacy, but why his uproar over the fact that Asians and even hispanics work against blacks in this system as well?
At any rate I get what you are saying, as do many commenterst. I don’t think you should have to explain so much as to coddle kiwi’s anti-black attitudes.
LikeLike
@michaeljonbarker
To me, the vertical color-based hierarchy of this society is a rock solid social construct. It features White on the top, Black on the bottom and Yellow, Brown and Red in the middle.
That some non-European ethnic groups join police departments, the military and political parties as functionaries does not negate the existence of this vertical hierarchy. They function in the hierarchy as servants to powerful White interests. It is a safe bet that Jeronimo Yanez hasn’t even pulled a gun on any White people in his four years as a cop. He knows whose lives matter and whose lives don’t matter in this society.
The same goes for the Chinese American cops at the center of the San Francisco racist text scandal. According to the LA Times reporter, Joseph Serna, the texts were traded primarily among Chinese American cops who referred to other ethnic groups as:
“…barbarians,” “cockroaches” and other slurs […] the N-word to refer to black people, “rag heads” to refer to people of Middle Eastern descent and “beaners” to refer to Latinos.”
✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦
The current president is another case in point. He has spent nearly eight years serving the military/industrial/security/financial complex. He had plenty of chances to improve the lives of Black and Brown folks, but what has he done?
He turned his back on Black people, wagged disapproving fingers at Black people, talked down to Black people and valorized the very groups that attack Black people—most recently with an appearance in Dallas, TX.
What has he done for Brown people, in this case Latinos? He has vastly expanded the prison/industrial complex to warehouse Central American women and children fleeing extreme violence in Honduras and Guatemala. Another “Brown” group, Arabs, have suffered the indiscriminate murder of civilians with aerial attacks from robotic and human occupied craft.
Is he doing this on behalf of Black people? Latinos? Low income Whites?
No, he is singularly focused on the White males on the top terrace of our society. No other lives or interests matter to him.
✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦✦
Finally, I would argue that people who deny the existence of a racial hierarchy do so because they don’t want to discuss their own color privilege in a society that penalizes Black people for breathing. Perhaps they don’t want to acknowledge their comfortable position of not being on the bottom of society, subject to daily slurs and incredible amounts of violence.
The perpetual foreigner stereotype may be irritating, but it has no effect on the life prospects of non-Black people in the vital areas of health, educational opportunities, employment and housing.
LikeLiked by 3 people
@Afrofem
Very well said!!
LikeLike
Fan and Sharina
So, Kiwi held a mirror to my face and ‘understands’ because I don’t like what I see!!!
Oh, and my ‘childish ‘ talk lol. It sounds more and more like the least appealing aspects of my nieces personalities daily.
Over and out Kiwi. I’m a bloke and admit I can’t do these passive agressive things well. It looks like any balls you had have deserted you and instead of challenging trolls who come on here you prefer to behave in a bilous way to genuine commenters. I have no doubt you will continue on your mini meltdown on line, good luck to you mate!
By the way, you aren’t victorious, you are just not worth my time.
LikeLiked by 2 people
Kiwi
You are dishonest as the racists who troll this site. Cherry picking what I have said to misrepresent me and to suit your ridiculous agenda. Since when did referring to ‘genuine commenters’ mean that I align with racist commenters?
You have become a parody of yourself and you know it. And, you are STILL reaching..
Keep posting like a reca litrant child and give fodder for every drive by racist and troll who frequent this blog. I hope when you look back you will feel proud of the legacy you have left of yourself on line.
You da man…… (I think)??????
LikeLike
@Kiwi
If you say so, but as the old saying goes….”A lie don’t care who tell it.”
LikeLike
@Omnipresent
I wouldn’t remotely let what he says bother you. He is told one lie after another about almost every commenter here, including Leigh and Mary. Now you know if he can factor a lie about two of the sweetest commenters in here then he can factor up one about anyone.
LikeLike
he has*
LikeLike
@Kiwi
If by proving you mean calling you the liar you are, but that speaks on you not me. 🙂
LikeLike
To Kiwi
<<<>>>
– Sing song voice ‘na na na naa na’ –
Sharina
I would caution you not to let the commenter formerly known @s Kiwi bother you 🙂 . I am not here commenting enough for it to bother me.
LikeLike
@Omnipresent
Oh no he does not bother me one bit. I honestly think the dude is comical. Out of all the comments I have on here not one of them screams racism. Besides, being a racist to him is anyone that does not agree with him.
LikeLike
@Kiwi
By shameless racist you mean someone who does not see you as the teller of truth but rather the liar of lies.
LikeLike
@ Afrofem
“The perpetual foreigner stereotype may be irritating, but it has no effect on the life prospects of non-Black people in the vital areas of health, educational opportunities, employment and housing.”
I didn’t see this statement at the time you posted it. With all due respect, it is an overstatement to say there is no effect at all.
Jefe has written several times over the years about how the perpetual foreigner stereotype made it difficult for him to find housing and adversely affected his job search in the U.S.
A few years ago, my spouse was not hired for a diversity-related position because the president of the college could not get his mind around the fact that my spouse is not a foreigner and the student populations he’s worked with are not international students. He tried repeatedly to correct the president’s misconception to no avail and was told to his face that was why he wasn’t hired, because he was “a foreigner who works with foreign students and this position is for American minorities.”
I have seen a few and heard of numerous cases where Hispanic/Latin@s and Asian Americans have received substandard health care or were denied treatment altogether due to the perpetual foreigner stereotype.
Same goes for discrimination in employment (both hiring and promotion), housing, and education.
Ironically, Native Americans sometimes get the same treatment when they are mistaken for Latin@s, Southeast Asians, Pacific Islanders, or Middle Easteners
The perpetual foreigner stereotype may not impact the life prospects of non-black people to the same degree that anti-black stereotypes affect African Americans, but it is more than just an irritant.
LikeLike
@ sharinalr:
Really? What lies did he make up about us? As for Kiwi, it’s pointless to have any dialogue with him without it being accusatory.
LikeLiked by 1 person
@Solitaire
You raise some interesting points and examples.
Could you please elaborate on your comment about Latino Americans and Asian Americans receiving substandard health care or denial of treatment due to the perpetual foreigner stereotype?
Were those negative health scenarios due to language barriers? Differing cultural expectations on the part of the providers and the patients? Race and ethnicity?
P.S. That must have been a pretty bizarre experience for your spouse.
LikeLike
@Leigh
I consider this summary he has here a blatant lie about you.
In the case of Mary he lied about her only caring about blacks and as I have seen on plenty of her comments she has shown empathy regardless of race. Even when he accused her of this she was showing empathy and he attacked her on a typo.
I fully agree that it is pointless, but funny none the less.
LikeLike
@ Sharinalr:
Oh, do you mean this precious gem? lol 😀
Thank you for refreshing my memory. I DID see that and briefly commented that I was entertained. 🙂 I knew what Kiwi was attempting to switch the script on me which failed miserably btw. And to think he has the gall to pick on Mary. She’s one of the most articulate, thoughtful and passionate commenters on this blog which goes to show you he’s acting like a jerk to anyone who disagrees with him. Clearly, it’s a role he performs so well. 😀
LikeLiked by 1 person
Sorry, I meant to write I knew Kiwi was attempting….
LikeLiked by 1 person
@ Afrofem
“That must have been a pretty bizarre experience for your spouse.”
It’s not unusual for him to run up against that misconception, but this particular experience was one of the more blatant and had a big impact. He really wanted that job for a number of reasons. The hiring committee wanted him for the position and recommended him far above the other finalists. Our understanding is some of the committee members also tried to talk sense into the president’s head, but no one could get through. What’s really bizarre is my spouse has extensive experience working with African American students and organizations, had a Black Culture Center reporting to him at one point, extensive experience with LGBT students and a fair amount with women’s centers, disability services, Title 9, etc. All of this was on his CV, all of this was pointed out to the college president, and all of it the president found some way to dismiss so that it didn’t disturb the perpetual foreigner preconception that was running in his head.
Which segues to this:
“Were those negative health scenarios due to language barriers?”
One of the very bizarre components of the perpetual foreigner stereotype is people hear foreign accents where there are none, they hear broken English when there is none. They will say things like, “I love your accent! It’s so exotic!” to native-born monolingual native-English speakers.
Language barriers can certainly be an issue when the person seeking medical treatment is an immigrant, but when it happens to their children and their grandchildren?
Case in point: I know an American-born Puerto Rican who had this experience in ER. The attending physician and other hospital personnel kept talking to him in very simple English, sometimes bordering on pidgeon. He happened to be a third-year medical student at the time. He kept asking them specific questions in proper medical terminology, and they would blink and then repeat the simplistic thing they had said before — ignoring his questions, not hearing his East Coast accent, not hearing his familiarity with medical terms. They only heard what their preconceived stereotype allowed them to hear.
That was the most outrageous example I’ve heard of, but I’ve seen that assumption about language competency before. Patients being talked down to, not being given comprehensive information, because of an assumption they don’t understand English very well.
Sometimes what happens is a Latino American or Asian American is made to sit in the waiting room for an inordinately long time without explanation, and then a translator shows up — a translator who is completely unnecessary. I know a couple of Native Americans who found themselves being talked to by Spanish-language translators in the ER and had to repeat, “I don’t understand Spanish” multiple times to multiple people before it finally got through.
But as far as receiving badly substandard health care or denial of treatment, I think in those cases it is typically a combination of the perpetual foreigner stereotype with other racist assumptions. With denial, generally it’s assumed that the person seeking treatment is an illegal immigrant and/or poor, unable to pay. Sometimes their proof of insurance (or other documents) are suspected of being forgeries.
These things happen to people who are immigrants, and it isn’t right then. But it’s really mind-blowing that it also happens to their American-born children and grandchildren. That definitely involves the perpetual foreigner stereotype, because they’re being seen as foreigners (and possibly as illegal immigrants) due solely to their racial or ethnic identity.
LikeLike
“American-born Puerto Rican” wasn’t the best wording on my part since Puerto Rico is a U.S. territory. Better to say he was born and raised in the continental U.S., first generation on one side and second generation on the other.
LikeLike
@Afrofem,
However, that is NOT AT ALL how US society is structured.
Abagond caught the concept better in his post on the Three pillars of American White Supremacy:
(https://abagond.wordpress.com/2013/11/02/the-three-pillars-of-american-white-supremacy/)
LikeLike
@ Solitaire
You certainly made compelling arguments. I’m glad you shared those examples.
I think in healthcare settings or any other highly bureaucratic settings, many of the workers go on autopilot and lose a sense of the individuals in front of them—-everyone becomes a number and a stereotype.
A few years back in a county health clinic, a worker insisted I had TB (the test was a false positive). She then said TB is common in people from Haiti (I have a French surname). She was looking at her paperwork the whole time. When I laughed and said “Haiti?——I was born in Illinois!”, then and only then did she look up and realize that I spoke standard unaccented English. Then and only then did she suggest I re-take the test. Up to that point I was being labeled a foreign health risk.
Thank you for reminding me of that incident. Your point that the perpetual foreigner stereotype is more than just an irritant is well taken.
That being said, as an African American my focus is on surviving a period of escalating state violence and the real possibility of White mob violence in the coming years. The perpetual foreigner stereotype pales in comparison to the “surplus-person-with-a-target-on her-back” designation. Perhaps it’s a matter of degree.
LikeLike
^ sorry for the mistaken bolding above.
@Solitaire,
I don’t want to get into all the cases where agents refused to show me housing (because they weren’t satisfied with what country I was from), where employers refused to call me in for an interview (because they wanted someone with native English), when police do passport checks or talk in simple baby talk, immigration officials pull me into interrogation rooms for carrying a fake passport or ID, etc.
My family experienced violent hate treatment when I was a child. “Go back to your country!” Still can never forget that.
I registered for a speech communication class (about 1/2 black, 1/2 white) at a local community college (Prince George’s) AFTER I graduated from university, and in the 3rd class, the lecturer asked me and me only to switch out of his class to a class geared for foreign students for whom English is a foreign language (which means I couldn’t take it as the time and location for that one class did not suit me). I had to insist NO.
On the last day of the class, he did publicly acknowledge in front of the class that he was sorry that he thought I was a foreigner and didn’t know English. But it took 12-13 classes to convince him of that.
I have had ancestors in the USA since before the Revolutionary war.
But, I found get the same thing overseas too. I have lived in HK over 20 years, but I still had police neglect to call me in because they thought I needed a Nepalese translator. Other countries accused me of carrying a fake US passport. Hospital triage is another matter that comes up.
My experience in the USA did help me psychologically to deal with the same stuff overseas.
LikeLike
@ Afrofem
“I was born in Illinois!”
Wow! Me, too!! 🙂
Yeah, that experience you shared about the health clinic is something that happens frequently to non-black minorities.
“That being said, as an African American my focus is on surviving a period of escalating state violence and the real possibility of White mob violence in the coming years. The perpetual foreigner stereotype pales in comparison to the “surplus-person-with-a-target-on her-back” designation. Perhaps it’s a matter of degree.”
From where I sit and the conversations I’m hearing, it’s seems like a matter of degree. Hispanic Americans in particular are increasingly scared of mob violence and mass deportation or extermination, and Muslims Americans, especially of Middle Eastern and South Asian descent, are right up there with them. Other groups may be somewhat less frightened but still generally feeling wary and worried. No one feels safe.
LikeLike
@ Jefe
Unfortunately, that is still happening in higher ed. Asian American students who are interested in fields and careers that involve a lot of writing and/or public speaking are often discouraged by academic advisers and professors due to perceived deficiencies in English skills where none actually exist. Those who persist and refuse to be shunted into more stereotypically “Asian” majors have to fight an uphill battle and work twice as hard to be seen as half as good.
It happens on the secondary level as well. For that matter, I still sometimes hear about Asian and Hispanic kids being put in remedial and ESL classes when they start primary school simply because of their names (not based on any type of assessments).
LikeLike
@Solitaire
Thanks for sharing some other phenomena you are witnessing, but it seems like some people still prefer to play oppression olympics games about who has the bigger target on his/her back.
My great-grandfather was murdered by white mob violence. I know what this country is capable of.
When I was a child, our house was repeatedly vandalized by the neighbours demanding that we leave their neighborhood. The police did nothing to help.
The same real estate agents who would not show me apartments because they could not determine what country I was from were also not showing apartments to blacks because they were under instruction from landlords not to rent to blacks. The result was the same. Why do we (and I mean the collective “we”, not just you & I) have to debate about who who got excluded/killed/exploited the most? It is not solving the problem.
LikeLike
@Solitaire
“Hispanic Americans in particular are increasingly scared of mob violence and mass deportation or extermination”—-I don’t know if I would lump the Hispanic population in general in regards to that. I have ran across quite a few who feel that them looking European will afford them a free pass. I also know some that believe that because they did the right thing that they have nothing to worry about at all.
However, I agree with you in full regarding Muslim Americans.
I wonder if the strong belief in responsibility politics keeps a lot of groups from fighting or speaking out.
LikeLike
@ Sharina
Sorry, I didn’t mean to imply “all” Hispanic Americans. Certainly there are some who aren’t terribly concerned for various reasons. There are some Muslim Americans who think much the same way: e.g., they’re white (Eastern European) so they think they won’t be targeted; if they don’t wear a head covering or flaunt their religion, no one will ever know. That sort of thing.
“I wonder if the strong belief in responsibility politics keeps a lot of groups from fighting or speaking out.”
I think it keeps individual members of groups from fighting or speaking out. There are people from all groups who do speak out and protest and fight. There’s a mix of both types wherever I look.
LikeLiked by 1 person
“In short, you’re more likely one of those Asians who thinks they’re totally down with Blacks but decides they don’t like Blacks after one negative real life encounter with one.”
Is that what happened to you? You poor thing!
LikeLiked by 2 people
“Nah. But that’s what’s about to happen to leigh204 as soon as you reveal to her that you think of her as a submissive, dog-eating Manila sweatshop worker.”
Nah. She’s too smart and I’m too much of a hypocrite for us to come to such point. Note how we managed to converse with good humor above. You might learn from that. Nah.
LikeLike
Hey, Kiwi —
How are things going in real life? I don’t know if you’re on campus this summer or not until fall, but I hope you’ve had or will have a chance to look for some social justice student groups.
There are groups where activists of all races, orientations, dis/abilities, etc., work together cooperatively, listen to each other fully and respectfully, help each other to learn and grow, support each other’s battles, and refuse to allow their interaction to deteriorate into petty sniping. I think you could really benefit from a space like that right now if you can find it.
Everyone is at a different place at their learning. Some people get stuck for awhile, then break through their blocks and move ahead. Some get stuck in one place forever, whether through willful ignorance, bitterness, or despair.
Sometimes you have to concentrate on your own journey instead of other people’s.
LikeLike
“Yah, I know. She’s such a credit to her race. Not like those other Asian women. Maybe you should ask her out. She might squeal with joy at your fetishistic fantasies about her race.”
I’m too old for her, that would be cradle robbery. She is cute and has a sense of humor, why don’t you step up to her? What am I saying? You hate Asian women. Why is that?
LikeLike
@ Kiwi
Good luck on your project.
“The actual planning and organization of the murals had little/no student involvement. It is decided solely by the school administration,…”
Unfortunately, this is not unusual when it comes to any project that students fought for, regardless of what it is or which students wanted it. There are different theories (yes, actual academic theories) concerning the various ways administrators deal with student requests/demands.
Some administrators favor more student participation, authority, and autonomy in projects like the murals than what happened on your campus. However, this can backfire spectacularly if students are not given the amount of back-up support and guidance they may require to successfully complete a project that may be beyond anything they’ve tackled before. Another phenomenon to consider is the cohort of students who pushed for the mural may have been graduated and gone by the time the machinery actually began to move, and the new student cohort may not have been interested or as involved.
There may also be certain regulations in place for how the university goes about contracting bids, handling union requirements, soliciting entries from artists, etc., that may simply preclude much student involvement.
“… which tells me that these decisions are likely the work of White liberals.”
That may well have something to do with it, but also ref. above.
“Since there’s no Asian mural (yet?), this confirms to me that Asian American activism is being subverted by Whites in way that other races are not.”
Yes, but someone needs to push for it or it isn’t going to happen. Have you been able to find out yet if anyone is doing so or has done so? Because that seems to me the next step. (When you get that research project done, that is.)
LikeLike
Kiwi
“No, by “shameless racist”, I meant only a racist like you would say “Very well said!!” to a disgusting and racist comment like”—Oh you mean how you make things racist that aren’t. I get it now. Kinda like how you believe me liking Chinese food is racist.
LikeLike
@ Kiwi
Unfortunately, this is what Asian Americans are up against. The Model Minority stereotype in particular is used to downplay Asian American concerns and deny that racism exists against Asian Americans.
The specific stereotypes used are unique to Asian Americans. The larger strategy, though, is not. All disadvantaged and under-represented groups find that stereotypes about them are used against them in their struggles for equal rights.
“even he personally didn’t think Asians’ concerns are that important”
Are there any Asian Americans on the staff of the diversity center? If so, talk to them. If not, I think you said there’s an Asian American Studies department on campus. Start talking to some of the professors. Get in touch with the Asian American student organizations and the faculty/staff who advise them. Don’t let one individual discourage you from pursuing this.
LikeLike
@ Kiwi
I had it right the first three or four times I said it. “shameless racist” it is just a name you throw out to try and make something seem racist that is not. But feel free to repeat yourself as if what you say will be true in about 20 more posts.
LikeLike
Oh and kiwi, you can stop throwing out Vincent Chin as ypur lone example. Because this conversation is not about single examples but in general and in general there is no effect on health, educational opportunities, employment and housings due to that stereotype.
I don’t need to read abagond’said post to know you are farting in the wind in regards to reality. You want to make the Asian struggle seem equal to the black one, but it is not.
LikeLiked by 1 person
@Sharina
“You want to make the Asian struggle seem equal to the black one, but it is not.”
Not even close.
Very well said!
LikeLiked by 2 people
@Kiwi
Unlike you I don’t need abagond to agree with me to know what I said is correct.
LikeLike
@Kiwi
Yet all you spew is ad hominems because you can’t show it as wrong. So far the research I found proves you as wrong, so get over it. You regard a lot of stupid things as right because you agree with it. Interesting how you use abagond as a prop similar to how whites use blacks as props to support there asinine stances.
LikeLike
@kiwi
Don’t pull a straw man dear. My argument was ” in general there is no effect on health, educational opportunities, employment and housings due to that (Perpetual Foreigner) stereotype.” And while research does present disparaging numbers for Asians in those areas, it is not the result of the perpetual foreigner stereotype.
LikeLike
@Kiwi
How is it shifting goal post when that was exactly my claim here:
Just becasue you decided to reword it in hopes of actually shifting goal posts is not my concern. Nice try though
LikeLike
@Kiwi
No dear, you asked for research on discrimination, but my research is not on discrimination. It is on how the perpetual foreigner stereotype affects Asians in those areas. You are free to reword and twist the situation to make it seem like you have an ah ha moment, but these are the games you play.
LikeLike
If you want to have a real discussion then we can have it based on what I actually said. IF you want it to be based on the straw man argument that you want to concoct then do so yourself.
LikeLike
@Kiwi
Well here is research on Asian Americans and health care. Of the things that disparage none of it has to do with the perpetual foreigner stereotype. I will return with more links for the other things.Though I am sure none of them will be sufficient for you who believes you know better.
https://www.umhs-sk.org/blog/doctors-and-diversity-health-care-for-asian-americans-pacific-islanders/Caribbean-Medical-Schools
LikeLike
@Kiwi
Chalk it up to whatever you want, because at the end of the day my other articles are going to come from google and they will speak on the disparages that Asians face and of those they will list none of them are going to be the result of the perpetual foreigner stereotype.
LikeLike
@Kiwi
tsk tsk. Here comes the twist.
“The article doesn’t contain any research or even talk about how the Perpetual Foreigner stereotype affects Asians.”—This is what I said….Well here is research on Asian Americans and health care. Of the things that disparage none of it has to do with the perpetual foreigner stereotype.
You are a master of trickery. 🙂
LikeLike
@Kiwi
Here are articles on employment, housing, and education rates among Asians. The rate of these areas does not indicate that they are being discriminated on the basis of the perpetual foreigner stereotype. Asian unemployment rate is the lowest indicating those white folks are not fearful of giving them jobs, even if they are not quick to give them jobs that are above them.
http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/michael-w-chapman/asian-unemployment-lowest-4-black-unemployment-highest-83
Admittedly Asians face housing discrimination, but nothing indicates it is a fear of the perpetual foreigner stereotype so much as whites being how whites are about their whites only neighborhoods.
http://www.nationalcapacd.org/press-room/asian-americans-face-significant-housing-discrimination-according-study-us-department-hou
Asians are getting into colleges at high rates. Yeah I know this is not the case for many of them, but their education is not being cut down by the perpetual foreigner stereotype. If it was then they would not be allowed in schools and highly discriminated from entering certain programs because of this fear.
http://blogs.voanews.com/all-about-america/2016/04/11/why-asian-americans-are-the-most-educated-group-in-america/
As much as you want to argue that Asians are treated the same as blacks, it will never be true because white supremacy is set up to treat each group different. If all groups had the exact same struggle then they would have been rose up against it, but with different struggles each can be used accordingly, while keeping each group at each other’s throats. If you don’t get that then you don’t get white supremacy.
LikeLike
Kiwi
My comment is still in moderation and I never said the link proves anything about the other categories.
LikeLike
@Kiwi
A) my comment is still in moderation.
B) the first link isn’t bogus, but I knew you would not accept it just like I said you wouldn’t. Just like you will find an excuse to dismiss the others.
LikeLike
@Kiwi
Based on what the stereotypes means, there is nothing in the link that indicates that health care disparities has anything to do with it. It simply does not affect them in the realm of healthcare.
LikeLike
Kiwi
And Again…
Based on what the stereotypes means, there is nothing in the link that indicates that health care disparities has anything to do with it. It simply does not affect them in the realm of healthcare.
LikeLike
Micah Xavier Johnson is regarded as hero and a martyr in Black consciousness circles in South Africa.
LikeLiked by 2 people
@Kiwi
Here we go with the twisting game again as you try to reroute everything back to a point you want to make versus what I said. For starters researching anything does not require that the article say explicitly “Perpetual Foreigner stereotype”. You can infer things from reading those articles without it requiring that.
If the those employers saw them as some foreign individual that did not belong there then it would be reasonable to believe that they would not be willing to give them jobs period over other races out of fear of them picking up and moving back or not being long term workers. Those numbers do not indicate that and more often than not shows and indication of willingness towards Asians because of the model minority stereotype. So you are wrong.
As to housing, they are not being denied of housing no more than any other group. That denial does not indicate that it is because of a fear of the foreigner. It indicates that white like their lily white neighborhoods.
Asians are getting into school regardless of their quota at top schools. They are not being denied education or redirected to certain programs for fear of them being a perpetual foreigner. If that were the case then they would deny them programs that require security or confidential information. However, that again is not the case.
“you had no studies proving anything about the stereotype either way. “—I never said I had studies. This is where you start creating what I said to try to dismiss it. It’s called a straw man. If you are confused on what I said please click link below to remind yourself.
LikeLiked by 2 people
“concluded that it means Asians aren’t affected at all. “—No, that is what you concluded I said. I clearly stated that based on the data there is no sign that they are being discriminated based on the perpetual foreigner stereotype. So my sources still stand whether you like it or not. Perhaps you need to pick up another hobby that is not mind reading because you suck at it.
LikeLike
@ Sharina
@ Kiwi
Go to scholar.google.com and search “perpetual foreigner syndrome.” I have only skimmed the titles of the resulting articles, so I have no idea whose side they come down on, if either. Many seem to be about psychological health and identity development, but at least one appears to touch on workplace discrimination (“The Model Minority Thesis and Workplace Discrimination of Asian Americans” has at least one reference to the perpetual foreigner syndrome showing up in the thumbnail quote).
LikeLike
The study linked to below found that Asian Americans and Latino/as are negatively impacted psychologically by the perpetual foreigner stereotype but that African Americans are similarly affected by “a sense of exclusion and marginalization [that] may come in subtle forms, such as implying that African Americans are not typical Americans (even if most of them are not seen as foreigners in the common meaning of the term).”
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3092701/
LikeLike
Solitaire
Psychologically I find that they are affected by both stereotypes.
LikeLike
Thanks for the references to look over.
LikeLike
@Kiwi
Those are some pretty interesting allegations, Kiwi. Do you have any statistics, articles or links to reputable sources to back those statements up?
LikeLiked by 1 person
“You are a master of trickery.”
@Sharina
Master?? He’s more like a little junior apprentice if you ask me. Nonetheless, being a disingenuous manipulator is his strength. He can’t be real or honest if his life depended on it.
@Afrofem
On the reparations thread Kiwi stated that if Blacks received any financial reparations it would cause a rift between Blacks and other people of color.
He never produced any statistics, articles or links to reputable sources to back that assertion up – so don’t hold your breath waiting for him to vindicate his BS. He pulls this stuff straight out of his azz, that’s why we can smell the stink swirling around his comments.
LikeLiked by 1 person
@Afrofem
Nice catch. I did read a source on long term Asian unemployment and I will try to find the sourcemail, so he is right in that regard.
@Fan…
Ando that is why no one can take him seriously. It is just a gain of manipulation, but let someone do that to him and he cries about it several posts over.
LikeLike