Cassius Clay (1942-2016), a Black American boxer better known since 1964 as Muhammad Ali, won the world heavyweight boxing championship three times: in 1964, 1974 and 1978. He was not just one of the greatest boxers of all time, he had charm, good looks, a poetic wit and was not afraid to stand up for what he believed in – even if it meant losing his medals or titles.
He passed away Friday June 3rd 2016 after a long battle with Parkinson’s disease.
He got into boxing at age 12, wanting to learn how to fight after someone took the bicycle he got for Christmas. Six years later, in 1960, he won an Olympic gold medal in boxing. But when he found that White-only restaurants still would not serve him, he threw his medal into the Ohio River.
In 1964, still named Cassius Clay, he fought Sonny Liston, the world’s heavyweight boxing champion. Few expected Clay to win: Liston easily knocked out his challengers and was bigger than Clay. But after six rounds, Liston gave up!
Two days later Clay shocked the nation again when he changed his slave name to Muhammad Ali. Malcolm X himself had converted him to the Black nationalist Nation of Islam. The New York Times continued to call Ali by his slave name till the 1970s.
In 1966 he was drafted into the Vietnam War. He refused to go:
“My conscience won’t let me go shoot my brother, or some darker people, or some poor hungry people in the mud for big powerful America. And shoot them for what? They never called me nigger, they never lynched me, they didn’t put no dogs on me, they didn’t rob me of my nationality, rape and kill my mother and father…. Shoot them for what? How can I shoot them poor people? Just take me to jail.”
This is commonly shortened to:
“No Viet Cong ever called me nigger.”
This was back when most Americans still supported the war.
The US government took away his title and his boxing licence. He fought the decision all the way to the Supreme Court and, after three and a half years, won.
By 1970 he was back in the boxing ring to reclaim his title.
His most famous fights of the 1970s:
- 1971: Fight of the Century: New York City, USA: lost to Joe Frazier.
- 1974: Rumble in the Jungle: Kinshasa, Zaire (D.R. Congo): defeated George Foreman, becomes world champion again.
- 1975: Thrilla in Manila: Quezon City, Philippines: defeats Joe
Frazier after 14 rounds.
Before the Foreman fight he said he would:
“Float like a butterfly, sting like a bee.”
His rope-a-dope trick helped him to win.
In 1981 he retired, having won 56 fights and lost five. In retirement he used his fame and fortune to further good causes.
In 1984 he learned he had Parkinson’s disease. He was slowly losing control of his muscles. His quick-witted mind was slowing down too.
In 1996, on the 100th anniversary of the Olympic games, with arms made unsteady by Parkinson’s, he lit the Olympic torch.
– Abagond, 2016.
See also:
- Olympics
- Jesse Owens – compare and contrast
- Malcolm X
- Black Power
- IQ – his IQ is 78, which shows you that whatever IQ tests measure, it is not intelligence as commonly understood.
- N-word
- Martin Luther King on the Vietnam War
540
Reblogged this on The Militant Negro™.
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A great man who refuted the silly theories that Blacks are robots under the total control of “white supremacy”. He and his mentors, Elijah Muhammad, and Malcolm X chose to live as free men and paid the price such choice entailed in a racist nation, jail, financial ruin and death.
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Ditto, gro jo. And he had insight. He knew that when a black man was allowed to be president, it would mean America was on the verge of collapse.
(https://youtu.be/Ba23hxCDrM4)
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He was conscious before the phrase stay woke became a thing. He knew what was going on and was not afraid to express himself and didn’t care who it offended.
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@ Abagond
Mohammed Ali was on my mind this morning and I had some kind of intuition. I noticed I even wrote about him in the past tense. My friend had phoned me to tell me that he had passed away a few moments after I had asked you to write a post about Mohammed Ali.
Feeling very sad and tearful and have not felt like this since Nelson Mandela’ s passing.
He was one of a kind, a larger than life colossus, who was hard to put into any category. The GREATEST will shine into eternity, just like his admirer, Nelson Mandela and ‘Blood Brother , Malcolm X.
He transcended race, religion, and country. We loved him and admired him so much. Sorry, I am feeling very sad now and can’t hold back the tears. Thank you very much for this post, Abagond.
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A true legend. That’s all I can say for now. May his soul rest in eternal peace.
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The words hubris and arrogant and unapologetic might have described him. On anybody else it would be unappealing but with him that is what made him fascinating and iconic. Even then to the chagrin of white America they too knew he was great even if they didn’t want to admit it.
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Not much can be said. Too many deaths back to back. This news on the heel of the death of two of my family members is just heartbreaking. Just feels like we are losing people who were outspoken and challenging to white supremacy.
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“He was not just one of the greatest boxers of all time, he had charm, good looks, a poetic wit and was not afraid to stand up for what he believed in — even if it meant losing his medals or titles.”
Would that we had more men of such strength and character today!!! My heart, like many of us here, is heavy with this loss. But my soul is jubilant, celebrating a life well-lived with intention and purpose, as well as the release of his wonderful spirit from that shell of a body that had finished serving him.
Rest in power, Sir…
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My Filipino dad is a boxing fan and throughout my childhood, my dad talked about his deep respect for Mr. Ali. He said Mr. Ali’s stance was a true measure of what a courageous person he was in life.
And my dad was visiting his home country when the “Thrilla from Manila” fight happened. He said it was the best boxing match he witnessed. And it was my dad who told me Mr. Ali had passed. He was sad. He said Muhammad Ali was the greatest boxer who ever lived and we will never see the likes of him ever again. RIP Mr. Ali. 😦
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2016 has been a beast we are losing all our icons and legends at an alarming rate. But Parkinson’s enveloped Ali to the point he was just a shell of himself. So I am not too engulfed in sadness but I feel he is now released from his suffering and floating like a butterfly eternally.
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Rest in Power!
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1V2nUG5GXys)
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The Parkinsons was caused by all the boxing blows to his head.
I remember being a kid in 6th grade and we had a teacher who made us write about something that we loved or cared about. This kid wrote a poem about Mohammad Ali, but he was still called Casious Clay back then. It was a powerful moment when that kid got up in front of the class, especially because it was the first time we had seen this student so alive with a passion. A moment I will never forget.
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@vanishingpoint…“It was a powerful moment when that kid got up in front of the class, especially because it was the first time we had seen this student so alive with a passion. A moment I will never forget.”
And THAT is what his “resting in power” will continue to mean for so many Black folk still here.
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@Mary Burrell
Ah Mary, So. Very. Eloquent!
Thanks.
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@gro jo
Some consequences are worth it, aren’t they?
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@Afrofem…“Ah Mary, So. Very. Eloquent!”
Ditto — to both of you, my Sisters!!
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@Afrofem &Deb: Thank You kindly 😍😍😍
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Great read!
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“I know I got it made while the masses of black people are catchin’ hell, but as long as they ain’t free, I ain’t free.” – Muhammad Ali
Rest in Peace!
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Here’s my white guy requiem, a requiem for an age as well as for a man:
‘I think of the line from the movie “Troy”, “Men rise and fall like the winter wheat, but these names will never die. Tell them I lived in the time of Hector, the tamer of horses. Tell them I lived in the time of Achilles.”
‘If you were a young guy in the 1970s, you remember the great names of the heavyweight division. Lyle. Shavers. Cooper. Norton. Young. Chuvalo. Bugner. Quarry. And the champions, Foreman, Frazier and Ali.
‘They were giants, there were giants in those days, but think of the terrible price these men paid for their glory. Ron Lyle suffered pugilistic dementia before his death at 70. Philadelphia Jimmy Young died young, destitute and suffering from dementia. Irish Jerry Quarry began to suffer from dementia in his mid-40s. and died ten years later. The fine British gentleman sportsman Henry Cooper died in his late 70s suffering from dementia. Ken Norton suffered a brain injury in a vehicle accident and died at 70 after a series of strokes. Joe Frazier died of liver cancer at the age of 64. The Greatest, as he was called and may have been, Muhammad Ali died this week after suffering from Parkinson’s disease for 32 years. Maybe you can say Ali, perhaps by grace, was allowed to keep his faculties, but if so then only at a price. Parkinson’s disease is a known possible consequence of a boxing career.
‘All of these men were same age as their young adult fans or only a little older, and of all of them, only the Brit Joe Bugner, Canadian George Chuvalo, and the Americans Earnie Shavers and George Foreman are still alive and apparently well. Apparently, because I’m not sure how well any of them are doing, other than Foreman.
‘Yes, it is true. Men do rise and fall like the winter wheat. And it is true, these names will live forever. So, if you were a young guy back then, it is true, they can say you lived in the time of Smokin’ Joe. They can say you lived in the time of The Greatest.
‘Just don’t forget the price these men paid for their glory. The price in the end is life itself. An age passes.’
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@Sharina
I’m so sorry to hear of your great loss. This has to be tough for you.
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@Anonymike
Well said.
You pointed out another side of boxing consequences that I did not think of before.
Dementia, disability and death. Are boxing (and football) worth the long term consequences after the lights are dimmed, the ring is empty and the doors locked?
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@Afrofem
It is tough only because you forget to appreciate what you have until it is gone. This is a great reminder of that. Family, friends, great and unapologetic icons. Qualities and characteristics that are so hard to find in today’s black entertainers. After the death of Prince, I thought…hoped it would be no more for the rest of the year, but…..
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@blakksage…“I know I got it made while the masses of black people are catching’ hell, but as long as they ain’t free, I ain’t free.” – Muhammad Ali”
Amen, and Amen again, Homegirl! While far from having it made, my life is such that I don’t have the same challenges as many of my people. But like Ali and Solomon Burke, I agree that, “None of us are free, until ALL of us are free.”
@Sharina…My condolences Darlin’, apologize for not telling you earlier. But Afrofem’s dear heart, in her inimitable awareness, made me see what I’d missed! Like Ali, their souls are free now as well.
@Mary Burrell…You are so welcome Lil Sis! I’m watchin’ you grow, with my chest all swole in pride and admiration for the woman you are now, and the one you’ll surely become! I’m so glad to have met you here at Abagond’s and I promise you, I’ll keep watching and listening for all that you bring to conversations here — and to the world!
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@Sharina: So sorry for your loss.
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Mary, Deb, Afrofem
Thanks. You guys are absolutely amazing.
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@Sharina…“Thanks. You guys are absolutely amazing.”
No, we are, who we need & should be for you, Sis! That’s all…
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@Deb: Thank you I learn so much on this blog. I learn a lot reading everyone’s post and just trying to learn about this thing called intersectionality in regards to race and gender and social injustices. Along with learning about old world civilizations. Abagond gives me a lot to learn.
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@Deb: Thank you for your kind words.
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“Abagond gives me a lot to learn.”
You and my old ass both!😄 Keep learning, Lil Sis — I count on folk like you to carry the truth forward, way after Abagond and I both are dead and gone…
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@May Burrell…Quiet as it’s kept — your Mama raised you right!😊 I see it, and I know what that means…
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@Deb: I am not a young person and I am right behind you sister I am just trying to play catch up. We don’t know what the future hold for us. But I certainly believe in the adage the day you stop learning is the day you die.
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“I am America. I am the part you won’t recognize. But get used to me. Black, confident, cocky, my name, not yours, my religion, not yours, my goals, my own, get used to me.” -Muhammad Ali.
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No words ring truer.
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@Leigh204
Like!
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“Before the Foreman fight he said he would:
“Float like a butterfly, sting like a bee.””
If he did he was quoting himself because he said it first in 1964 before fighting Sonny Liston.
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I’m a MASSIVE boxing. I’m on all the forums. So I can only start this by judging Ali as the boxer. He was the greatest in his era. He fought everyone. The butcher don’t care what’s on the table, he’s chopping it up, that was Ali’s motto. Current fighters should take note.
I do thing if he fought any fighter maybe, bar a prime Tyson it would be a brawling azz-wooping in Ali’s favour.
Last year (Or was it the year b4) we had Mayweather Vs Pac-Man. Manny was a sore loser and moaned about his shoulder.
Adrenaline is a mother. It’s why a mofo can get shot and still drive himself or walk himself to a hospital. Ali fought with a broken jaw for 15 rounds !!!!
Ali the Man ? Where to begin ? He spoke for his ppl that few black athletes today do. I’ve got to side eye all the whites slobbering over him now. He was not liked in his prime, like Mandela his status increased the older he got.
All in all. I can’t really put Ali into words and I’m probably doing a bad job. So much I want to say, but all I will say is that his legacy will live long after we are all gone.
RIP Champ
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@leigh204: You beat me to it. I was going to post that quote. Good looking out.👌🏾
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There are no words to describe his greatness. He was unapologetically black and proud!
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@Anonymike
But then again “Raging Bull” Jake La Motta is still going at 94. The average age of death is around 70 so all the people you pointed out (Ali included) died at a statistically a normal age.
Now you can argue that the quality of their life was affected by the blows they took ? I don’t doubt that.
Foreman is funny one, in his youth, he was this mean, no smiling, son-of-a-b*tch of few words. Now he’s this jovial larger than life character who has transformed himself and turned himself into a multi millionaire with his grilling machines and still does boxing commentaries.
Guess what ? I’m from Liverpool England and Earnie Shavers works the doors of a nightclub here as a greeter / doorman (I kid you not) he married a Liverpool woman I think.
Joe Bugner ? He lives in Australia now and has done so for over 30 years. George Chuvalo is still angry (I kinda like long running sporting grudges) about some of his losses and bad decisions he said he got.
Joe Frazier ? I think Ali over-stepped the line with Frazier calling him a gorilla and ugly and an uncle tom was uncalled for. Especially when Frazier was nothing off the sort and Frazier loaned Ali money when he was banned for three years at boxing.
I think the irony between the two is when Ali was lighting the Olympic torch in 96, Frazier was outside desperately trying to flog his auto-bio and do some sign in’s to make some money and I think even Ali admitted that he should not have said some of the things he said about Joe.
Ali was also a serious womaniser to the max but as they say a mans great deeds are out weighed by his personal weaknesses and Ali’s unbelievable generosity and great deeds was one the reasons why he left the ring not set-up for life. It was only in later years that the Ali estate grew to what it is now.
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@TheHipHopRecord You know your history, but I think when you have five out of eleven with pugilistic neurological diseases, you have a trend. I have left out that other pool of rivals, those of the 1960s, because I was a young adult fan in the 1970s. Ali was a womanizer, but almost all the boxers were, the white boxers of earlier eras not excepted. Tommy “The Duke” Morrison died of HIV which was by all evidence heterosexually acquired. Statistically, a man needs a huge number of female partners to have a likelihood of acquiring an HIV infection through female-to-male transmission.
I am looking at the great heavyweight division of the era 1970s and thinking about the price that was paid for the glory we got enjoy at no harm to ourselves. Not to mention all of the anonymous fighters with the same aspirations who never had a big payday or a contender ranking but ended up suffering the same ills. There were some old boxers around in downtown San Jose in the 1970s. One was a middleweight contender in the 1950s, a white guy. He owned a carry-out liquor store and seemed like a healthy and genial fellow. Others were frankly what was then called “punchy”.
I’d like to see a book about the heavyweight division of the 1970s, from the return of Ali through Jimmy Young’s decision over George Foreman and the other major bouts in 1977. I have to ability to write it, but I never will. My title for it is “There Were Giants”, from the Biblical “there were giants in those days.”. Anybody who wants to do it, they can take my template and work with it. As I see it, it would be about the origins of the fighters, the grim atmosphere of the 1970s in America, and what happened after. I have other literary fish to fry and not forever to do it.
After 1977, a new cohort of fighters began to take over the heavyweight division. I call the Young-Ken Norton elimination bout in November of that year the end of this epoch in boxing history.
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@leigh204
It is amazing how that quote can summarize the 3 pillars of American white supremacy into a single statement.
Talk about poetry.
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I’m glad someone brought up the Frazier incident. Forgot the name of the documentary about that fight but after I saw all that vileness Ali lodged at Frazier my respect for Ali dropped a bit. I don’t think a white racist could have said and done worse.
Respect dropped more when I found how quickly and effortlessly he threw Malcolm X under the bus when X was the one who brought him to Islam in the first place. Ali was a great boxer but a flawed individual. I hope it was the repeated hits to the head that contributed to his less admirable moments.
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@Kiwi,
I know you personally have no memory of the segregation era / civil rights movement pre-1968 and the desegregation / affirmative action era (around 1968-1982) or the Vietnam War (1963-1975) so you might see things from a different viewpoint. I would not say that pushing for desegregation was indicative of a desire to “join” the racist system, especially regarding public institutions, like schools, government, police, and even the military. Public money went to pay for those things, so “separate but equal” was a very real problem to contend with, and desegregation was seen as a way to fix some of those inequities.
I also remember some of the rhetoric from the Vietnam War era, and it was not a small matter that the Vietnam war overlapped with the civil rights / desegregation era at home. It helped to fuel the Black Power, American Indian Movement and Asian American and Chicano Activism back home. The Vietnam war was seen as a racist strategy just as much as much as segregation/voter disenfranchisement or dishonouring of treaties or erasure of tribal identities back home.
Blacks fought for decades against the “separate but equal” doctrine, so the repeal of segregation and the Homer v. Plessy legacy should still be seen as a victory. It is not right to say that pushing for desegregation was reflective of a desire to join or support the white supremacist system.
What happened in the early-mid 1980s was a roll back of affirmative action, the proliferation of the GOP Southern Strategy, the move to stifle organized labour, the “War on Drugs” and the pushing of stereotypes to control both blacks and Asians.
It disturbs me the most when I see any POC espouse the misinformation that they get from the mainstream media or the educational system that was designed to control them. Muhammad Ali saw immediately how the 3 pillars of white supremacy had been used throughout US history to maintain that system. Now the awareness of that seems to have been lost on the next generation.
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@Kiwi:
Seriously? Sometimes I just really wonder if you’re pulling stuff out of your ass. Even before the Vietnam War, there were Black soldiers during the Philippine-American War (1899-1902) who felt the war against their brown brothers fighting American imperialism was unjustified. Here’s a quote from a journalist from that time:
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And may I add some of these Black soldiers deserted and defected to fight on the Filipino side.
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“In a conflict with China, I bet the prevailing attitude among Black Americans will be to serve their country by “beating the ch#&ks” instead of Muhammad Ali’s high-mindedness.”
Yes, and?
More stupid, racist sh*t from the phony moralist. In a conflict with China, you will be drafted, forced to prove your patriotic bona fide, while the rest of your family is in an internment camp, just like the Japanese during WWII.
I’m still waiting to read how you got run over by a munitions train while trying to stop it because you oppose Obama’s killing of Arabs.
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To promote his book, “Healing; A Journal of Tolerance and Understanding,” Ali made a special visit to my old high school – Alain Leroy Locke (“Saint City”) High School in South-Central Los Angeles. It was 1996 and having been out of high school for six years I used a sick day from work just see the greatest in person. I’ve always cherished that special day.
Muhammad Ali – Rest in POWER!
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Muhammad Ali ⭐ ⭐ ⭐ ⭐ ⭐
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@leigh204: Thank you Leigh for your sober mind and not getting caught up in the insanity.
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I do think Ali has become too mainstream and with non black people I get the feeling that there admiration runs along the lines of “Yeah, Ali had a reason to complain, but today’s blacks have no reason”
Even in the UK. Ali’s death was the main news headline on the BBC and an extended slot at that. I think they forgot that Muhammad Ali was SAVAGE with white people.
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A4mtBYhCScM)
His mouth was reckless and I love it
They couldn’t even wait til his body was all the way cold to start lying when the evidence is out here, BEEN out here. “He was such a gentle giant! We loved him and this is what I shall tell my children.”
No chump, he lit into y’all asses, y’all hated it and you’re happy he is finally at rest so you can finally act un-bothered by all the old footage documenting the very Black Pride that y’all FEAR. They kill me with that mess
What I like EVEN MORE is he never took a single word of it back.
I don’t recall Ali ever back-pedalling with his words. He said it, he meant it, and he stood by it to the end.
He was before my time, but he transcended generations with his bravery. This is what I looked up to with Ali. I wasn’t around when he was THE fighter to beat, but the guts he had to defend our people was the bravest characteristic about him.
He was NOT afraid of these racist ass white boys.
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vd9aIamXjQI&feature=youtu.be&t=31)
This is why I’m going to refuse to watch the CNN and BBC coverage of him and all these other news outlets and their whitewashing of him. White folks didn’t give a f*ck about Ali until he started shaking.
I know Ali used to shake his head in disgust at today’s athletes and entertainers. They are a bunch of cowards with no substance even though they have more money and power than Ali and his fellow celebrities had at the time.
He actually went broke for standing up for what he believed in. He was truly the GOAT in more ways than one.
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@ Kiwi
“So what does his quote mean now that the draft is over? That those who serve in the military are now willing participants in American White supremacy’s racist wars of empire?”
To add to what Jefe and Leigh204 said, another point you’re overlooking is the economic situation that has led to many young people joining the military who forty or fifty years ago would have instead found work in the private sector. The dismantling of U.S. industry, the loss of good-paying blue collar jobs, and the exorbitant cost of college have all caused many lower-class and working-class Americans to see the military as their only real option. This may make them less “willing participants in American White supremacy’s racist wars of empire” and more reluctant participants who felt stuck between a rock and a hard place when it came to finding a decent career or a way to pay for college.
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The hip hop records
Seems that not everyone forgot that Ali was savage. What a gross comparison from Piers, full of intellectual dishonesty http://m.huffpost.com/uk/entry/uk_57541bc1e4b040e3e819a133?edition=uk
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@Solitaire
I agree. I was under the impression that Military was usually an option for those who were poor.
Click to access The%20Vietnam%20War%20and%20the%20Draft%20Reading.pdf
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@ Solitaire
The existence of the “poverty draft” seems to be one of those issues that is hotly debated between the political right and the political left.
The Right claims there is no poverty draft and puts out slickly produced corporate news bits to paint a happy face on the US military machine.
The Left maintains that there is a poverty draft that sucks in working class Americans with few options and increasingly foreign nationals hungry for a path to US citizenship.
This unabashedly left-leaning 2007 article in Alternet, by Jorge Mariscal speaks to motivation of those who join the military (with few hard numbers).
http://www.alternet.org/story/52233/the_making_of_an_american_soldier%3A_why_young_people_join_the_military
This passage is especially noteworthy:
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Ali was outspoken during a time when his militancy could have gotten him killed. He truly was not afraid of the consequences of his words and actions.
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@Mary
That is what I like about the older generation celebrities. They spoke it without fear of consequences. If he could do it during a time where his death could be a certain consequence, then this new generation of celebrities can most certainly speak up.
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@Sharina: Yes i agree because Ali didn’t seek the approval of whites.
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@ Afrofem
Whereas the video Kiwi linked to cited the Heritage Foundation as their source for that particular statistic. The Heritage Foundation is an unabashedly conservative organization which among other things is a denier of global warming. Having seen how the Heritage Foundation manipulates statistics to contend that global climate change is just a hoax, I am wary of any statistics they put out. I would need to see other data from less-biased sources before reconsidering my opinion on the current make-up of the U.S. military vis-a-vis the poverty draft.
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”
on Mon 6 Jun 2016 at 17:45:33
Sharina
@Mary
That is what I like about the older generation celebrities. They spoke it without fear of consequences. If he could do it during a time where his death could be a certain consequence, then this new generation of celebrities can most certainly speak up.”
Just, maybe, people weren’t as impressed with “celebrities” as they are today, where they are apotheosized.
You had mass social movements taking place like Civil Rights, anti-war and others. “Celebrities” did their bit along with everybody else.
Ali and NOI weren’t all that radical. If they had been white they would have been another right-wing eccentric bunch that the USA produces with regularity.
They were perceived as dangerous because they were Black.
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@gro jo: Thank you for your perspective it is something to consider. I am always enlightening by your post. I have learned much from many of them on many subjects.
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@ Mary Burrell
During the day, I listened to Wilson Pickett’s Greatest Hits. When I heard him sing Mustang Sally (one of my favorites of his), I also thought about what Black men were really like back in the 1960s. Sometimes we tend to romanticize them because of all of the current tension between Black men and Black women. From this distance, they seem more fearless, protective and heroic.
Many of them were fearless, protective and heroic. Those times brought out the best in many Black men, celebrity or not. There were also plenty of Black men who were less than heroic. If men of the 1960s seemed more “in charge”, it’s because they actually were in charge. Women of all ethnicities had a heck of a time getting jobs that could support a family, getting credit on their own or even buying a car without a man’s co-signature.
Men were very demanding of everything from when dinner hit the table to sex. I still remember a neighbor woman who would visit us on summer days all relaxed until 2pm, when she would bolt for the door to make sure that her husband, Mr. Leotis (yeah, that’s what she called her husband), got his dinner within 15 minutes of arriving home. Even on the hottest, steamiest Southern days, Mr. Leotis insisted on fresh, ovenbaked cornbread with his dinners. There was no ordering pizza or going through the drive-thru for chicken or burgers in those days in my neighborhood.
Most Black folk lived in segregated communities with lots of employed men around and some expectation of upward mobility. Segregation had many downsides, but the upsides were a strong sense of community and shared destiny. The affluent and the poor, the light-skinned and the dark-skinned, the highly educated and the functional illiterates all inhabited a shared space. There was not perfect harmony but, we were all clear about who we were.
A good portion of those men who share Muhammad Ali’s spirit are now locked away in America’s Prison Industrial Complex or have had their job prospects ruined because of selective law enforcement or they are dead. Black male warriors are carefully identified and funneled into the school to prison pipeline from their kindergarten days where they are labeled with such dubious maladies as oppositional defiant disorder.
http://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/oppositional-defiant-disorder/basics/symptoms/con-20024559
Sometimes I wonder how a young Muhamad Ali would fare today, given his bold spirit and brash mouth.
Those bold Black men still exist, but they have to navigate a ton of obstacles just to survive to adulthood. That has always been true, but the pressure is really intense these days.
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Thank you Mary, I’ve learned much from you.
” Black male warriors are carefully identified and funneled into the school to prison pipeline from their kindergarten days where they are labeled with such dubious maladies as oppositional defiant disorder.
http://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/oppositional-defiant-disorder/basics/symptoms/con-20024559
Sometimes I wonder how a young Muhamad Ali would fare today, given his bold spirit and brash mouth.”
Oppositional defiant disorder, the updated version of drapetomania?
Somebody should compile an encyclopedia of these dubious maladies.
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@Afrofem: That was a great read and yes you are right about “tending to romanticize them.” I too remember when women had their husbands dinner prepared and ready for them. Even Ali womanizer that he was probably was one of those men who felt women needed to stay in their places. Yes the prison industrial complex has claimed many of the young black men and lots of those do exist and yes they do have a whole host of obstacles to contend with. Back then the black community was intact but that was before crack invaded our communities.
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@gro jo: I think Abagond did a post on drapetomania a couple of years ago.
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@Sharina
I am sorry that you have suffered a great loss. Please accept my condolences.
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Abagond did a post on the “disease” of drapetomania.
You are right, gro jo. Black people wanting a measure of self determination is a sure sign of insanity.
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Thank you taotesan.
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And taotesan I miss your posts. Please comment more.
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@ Sharina
I skimmed through this thread earlier and missed what you wrote about your family. Although it is belated, I hope you will accept my condolences as well.
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I was a kid when Muhammad Ali was at his peak, and although I never was interested much in boxing, I always had great respect for him, which on reflection I realized came from my father. When I was growing up, my dad would talk about how great Ali was. He always pointed out to us kids that the rope-a-dope trick and “float like a butterfly, sting like a bee” were strategies, that Ali was using his intelligence in the ring, that he was fighting with his brain as much as (or even more than) his brawn, and that was what made him virtually invincible.
I don’t remember ever talking with my father about the more controversial aspects of Ali’s career, such as his critical statements about whites and the Vietnam War. I may bring it up the next time I talk to him, just to find out his opinion.
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Kiwi..
Your anti blackness is showing in every comment you make.. You are a C U Next Tuesday
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^ It’s clear. Crystal clear.
@Sharina:
Better late than never. My deepest sympathies love. *hugs*
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Solitaire and Leigh
Thank you ladies. One thing I did not mention is that both were early 30s young. That side of my family gets diabetes and for some reason dies within a year or two after diagnosis.
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“That side of my family gets diabetes and for some reason dies within a year or two after diagnosis.”
Sorry for your loss. Maybe a change of diet is called for.
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@ Sharina
That is tragic. I hope a cure will be found soon and that you and your family will be spared further loss.
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Yup. I can definitely get with a man like Ali. He’s like a super-Troll for the ages.
Joe Frazier helps you out financially during your ban , call the (dark-skinned, broad nosed) man, a “flat-nosed”, “ugly pug” gorilla. You can see how this is similar to later, more minor confrontations, like Tariq Nasheed calling Tommy Sotomayor “ashy”.
Joins the Nation of Islam, yet cheats on his wife, oh, sorry, his “Blackwoman” in front of the the president of a sovereign nation. Score one for the Black Family.
You get to present yourself as a representative of black people the world over, yet have no problem accepting 5 million dollars taken from the (very poor) Zairian people, shacking up for 5 weeks in Mobutu’s palace, never mind chilling with Idi Amin (is human meat halal?) You might find that last part crass, but he did tell Frasier “My African fiends will put you in a pot.” Remember, Malcolm X had already talked about Kennedy’s death being “the chicken’s coming home to roost ” for the death Mobutu’s predecessor Lumumba.
Another case of a horrible human being with sublime talent. Hand speed and footwork come from something that mus thave been the love child Arnold Schwarzenegger and Sonic the Hedgehog. But yeah. These are our heroes.
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@Gro Jo
Thanks. I most certainly agree it is time for a change in diet, but telling that to a southerner is not always so cut a dry. Even if they were eating vegetable, it was likely cooked with some type of meat.
@Solitaire
It is sad and I have a male cousin in the same situation that I don’t expect to live, but another year. Sometimes I doubt companies are really looking for cure to things that make them money. It is more lucrative to provide temporary fixes than actual cures.
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Also just found out Kimbo Slice died as well.
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“Pours liquor for Kimbo Slice”
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@satanforce
I have really missed your unique take on things. Glad you found time to write.
(LOL!)
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This link has a great video of Ali’s statement about the Vietnam War.
The National Museum of African American History & Culture will open in Washington, DC in September 2016, and will open with an exhibit devoted to Muhammad Ali. I plan to be in DC in Sept 2016, so it will go on my MUST DO list.
Muhammad Ali, Vietnam and the Asiatic Black Man
(http://smithsonianapa.org/recollections/muhammad-ali/)
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“Don’t count the days make the days count.”-Muhammad Ali
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@Jefe: Thank you for that link.
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Bill Clinton doing the eulogy ?
That surely wasn’t Ali’s idea but then again a lot of the people who were close to him from his entourage are all dead
Bundini Brown (His Hype Man)
Angelo Dundee (His Trainer)
Herbert Muhammad (His manager)
The only main ones that are still alive from the Ali entourage are Ferdy Pacheco (His Doctor) Gene Kilroy (His Business Manager)
Louis Farrakhan or maybe his friend Jim Brown or his wife (Lonnie) or one his kids that would be the best, not goddam Bill Clinton.
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@Kiwi… Nice try rationalising your racism. I use to love reading your comments, but see the Peter Liang article, your comments have become so anti black. Words really cant express how much I disdain you.
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Watching the funeral services of Muhammad Ali and it is quite a beautiful celebration. People of all races and generations and faiths are celebrating him.
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Yeah Mary, I’m sitting here alternately laughing and crying…
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@Deb: It’s a beautiful celebration isn’t it all the celebrities and dignitaries and all races, and faiths.
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@Mary…until Slick Willy got the hell up there, insinuating IMHO, that unlike Ali, some folk hadn’t yet managed how “to live with the consequences of what they believed.”
I don’t care about celebs or dignitaries — AT ALL. What moves me, is how Muhammad Ali made certain — his life would always and forever be — HIS. His impact was undeniable, and there’s no way in the world, anyone can take that away…
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@Mary Burrell:
I like having my wits about me. 😀 Someone has certainly lost a few marbles, that is, if this person had any to begin with.
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@Jefe:
Thank you so much for the link! I thoroughly enjoyed Mr. Ali telling it straight up to those white people that they were hypocrites. Mmmhmm.
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@Deb: You and me both sister i was really wanting Clinton to hurry up and have a seat. Too me it sounded like Clinton was tooting his own horn and i am thinking Man sit down this is not about you. Clinton is so full of himself.
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@leigh204: I agree 🤓
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@leigh204…Ditto!
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@Mary Burrell…“Too me it sounded like Clinton was tooting his own horn and i am thinking Man sit down this is not about you. Clinton is so full of himself.”
That’s EXACTLY what I was feeling! Full disclosure — while my colonized mind never saw him as “the first Black president” as Toni Morrison so boldly proclaimed — I NEVER felt that sh*t about him. However, financially, I was doing okay under his administration, so I never thought his getting “serviced” by Monica Lewinsky under the desk in the Oval Office was grounds for impeachment. And IMHO, it still wasn’t (can anybody say Kennedy??).
What I should have seen as impeachable though, and what I should have paid attention to — were his policies against Black folk (as Isaac Hayes said, “I Stand Accused” — blame my buying into respectability politics on that front!). Today, not only can I not STAND him — I can’t STAND his damned, “let me wear pantsuits and act like war-mongering men” wife either (though as a woman, I felt sorry for her having to tell that Monica Lewinsky story when she was running against the Changeling (voted for neither of them –Cynthia McKinney was my candidate )!
Clinton’s full of himself because he AND she were literally allowed to get away with murder — for a LOT of money, for a very long time.
All I can say is, “When you know better, you do better”…
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@Deb: I hear you I can say that when Clinton was president i feel the economy was better i never understood that first black president thing that was crazy. I don’t know who is going to be President and that is kind of scary to me. God only knows what is going to happen to this country.
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Anti-American, Unpatriotic, Draft-Dodging piece of …. then, Anti-American, Unpatriotic, Draft-Dodging piece of …. now. Rot in Hell!
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“Ali’s celebrity status bolstered his ego, enhancing his ability to speak his own mind in public, rather than to perform the traditionally accepted second-class status that most whites at that time expected of African Americans.
Ali used his persona as a wealthy sports figure to make the connection between his payment of federal taxes and his disagreement with how the U.S. government was disbursing those considerable funds, saying, “I buy a lot of bullets, at least three jet bombers a year, and pay the salary of fifty thousand fighting men with the money they take from me after my fights.”
https://www.natcom.org/CommCurrentsArticle.aspx?id=1023
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Are you drunk already Bobby M?
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@Herneith
Is he ever not drunk?
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@Herneith @Sharina
LOL!
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@Herneith, @Sharina, @Afrofem – I only occasionally get drunk in real life, and am never drunk when I comment on this site…
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@Bobby
If you say so. I just don’t believe so.
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@Sharina – why, because you can’t believe someone would disagree with your crazy anti-American, anti-White views?
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@Bobby M
I rarely share my views, especially with you so you gather they are crazy anti-American, anti-white how? Statements like that is exactly why I believe you come here drunk. It is not based on reality. Nothing you say is.
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To me, a draft dodger is someone who quietly figured out a way to avoid going to Vietnam such as getting a medical exemption for a minor physical problem, staying in college an inordinate amount of time, or going to grad school in Europe.
Muhammad Ali didn’t dodge the draft. He publicly opposed it. He stood up for his beliefs and was willing to go to jail for them. He proclaimed his objections to the Vietnam War for the world to hear. That’s not dodging — that’s confronting head on.
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@Solitaire
Well said!
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America has a right to do whatever it wants to some dirty little natives. They don’t matter half as much as we do.
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@Bobby M
We are all “dirty little natives” to someone in this world…and we are all human and deserving of the same respect.
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@ Bobby M
Who is “we”?
Who is “them”?
Who gets to decide that one group matters half as much as the other? Using what criteria?
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Herneith, @Sharina, @Afrofem – I only occasionally get drunk in real life, and am never drunk when I comment on this site…
If so you are scary but on the positive side comical. How can you espouse such lunacy when sober? Either that, you can hold copious amounts of liquor well!
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@Afrofem, @Solitaire – I am no dirty little native – rather the descendent of industrious intelligent Westerners.
We is America
Them is the Vietnamese Commies
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@ Bobby M
So you’re drunk on delusions of white supremacy.
You have a little mind, and it is dirty with foul racism.
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Solitaire and Afrofem
See now why we write him off as the drunk?
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@ Sharina
Yes. Lesson learned.
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@Solataire, @Sharina, @Afrofem – You just can’t handle the truth.
I am the descendant of the greatest most civilized people ever.
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@Bobby M
On the contrary. YOU can’t handle the truth.
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Sharina, whose comments have been a disaster since day one, gets other commenters on the blog to gang up on me. Pathetic!
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@ Bobby M
“Sharina, whose comments have been a disaster since day one, gets other commenters on the blog to gang up on me.”
How did you know??? Sharina called me up right away on the special Batphone.
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@Solitaire, who probably has an IQ of 69 or lower, tells me I have a little mind, when in fact I have a very good brain. NOT NICE!
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@ Bobby M
“Solitaire, who probably has an IQ of 69 or lower”
Where did you get that from?
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Where did you get that from?>/em>
He pulled it out of his arse!
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Warning, don’t type and laugh!
Where did you get that from?
He pulled it out of his arse!
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@Bobby M
You’re right. You aren’t drunk. You are having a psychotic break.
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@Sharina, who believes strange things about race and society, accuses ME of having a psychotic breakdown. Maybe she should look in the mirror!
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Bobby M
Who believes they know what a person believes other than drunks and crazies?
*looks in mirror, and returns it back to Bobby so he can see what crazy looks like*
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And psychics. I forgot about psychics.
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Bobby M,
The only way you can feel good about yourself as a white person is if, and only if you put down everyone else who isn’t white. I’m willing to bet you have nothing going for you. That’s why you constantly hate on others. Your sense of pride is false. And deep down inside, you know that to be true.
Muhammad Ali was a hero. A true hero. He was something you would be, but instead, you prefer to be an ignorant white racist troll instead. I’ll sit back and wait until your inevitable banishment into internet obscurity.
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No one with a name like Muhammad Ali can ever be a true American hero.
Case closed.
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That’s it Bobby, continue to prove everyone’s points.
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Muhammad Ali is not an American name.
Real Americans have names like Benjamin Franklin and George Washington, not Juan Taco Burrito Garcia Hernandez Lopez or Obungawunga Jambula Efewayomama or Mohammad Durka Jehad Durka Sherpa Jehad Allah Alii!
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Here’s an American name for ya:
President Barack Hussein Obama.
That must really stick in Bobby M’s craw.
It’s going to be in U.S. history books for as long as the nation endures. Better get used to it, Bobby!
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@Solitaire – It’s not an American name – it is exactly the same name that his Kenyan tribal father had.
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@ Bobby M
It’s a new day. Get use to it. How many Whites do you know personally that have the last name “Washington” or “Jefferson” or “Franklin”? In fact, there are more Blacks (and that’s because of American slavery) with those dead presidents’ last name than White folks. Does that make Blacks MORE American than Whites?
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@ Kiwi
Japan bombed the US, Vietnam did not.
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@Booby M:
Personally, I like the names Billy Bob, Joe Bob, Bob Jimmy, Willy Joe, the permutations are endless and comical! You can’t get any more American than that, eh Bobby?
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I see kiwi is being the disingenuous colonel … as usual! Any thing to put Black people in an unfavorable light, right kiwi?
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” on Thu 16 Jun 2016 at 09:13:57
abagond
@ Kiwi
Japan bombed the US, Vietnam did not.
Liked by 1 person”
Wrong, Japan bombed a naval base on a US colony called Hawaii.
“Hawaii, a U.S. state, is an isolated volcanic archipelago in the Central Pacific. Its islands are renowned for their rugged landscapes of cliffs, waterfalls, tropical foliage and beaches with gold, red, black and even green sands. Of the 6 main islands, Oahu has Hawaii’s only big city, Honolulu, home to crescent Waikiki Beach and the Pearl Harbor memorials.
Capital: Honolulu
Statehood granted: August 21, 1959
State flower: Yellow hibiscus
State bird: Nene
Population: 1.42 million (2014)”
Japan had as much right to take Hawaii, The Philippines and other Asian colonies of the USA as the USA had in depriving these peoples of their rights to nationhood. Let’s not get confused about what we are dealing with when speaking of the USA. It is an empire not a nation. It expanded by military aggression and racism. Bobby M is the prototypical USAer.
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The vietnam war became overt over a naval conflict in international waters.
http://m.usni.org/magazines/navalhistory/2008-02/truth-about-tonkin
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Those little brown people wouldn’t have known what to do with independence anyway.
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@ Bobby M
Were you asleep during history class? Those little brown people won that war. The U.S. lost. So did the former French colonial masters of Vietnam.
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Dave Zirin, primary writer of the Edge of Sports posted a full transcript of Malcolm X’s daughter Ambassador Attallah Shabazz’ eulogy at Muhammad Ali’s funeral.
Her words were deeply emotional and full of meaning to the global audience present at the mosque and beyond. Zirin explains the bond between Attallah Shabazz and Muhammad Ali with a quote from Johnny Smith, co-author of the book Blood Brothers: The Fatal Friendship Between Muhammad Ali and Malcolm X:
Read the full transcript here:
http://www.edgeofsports.com/2016-06-17-1152/index.html
Ambassador Attallah Shabazz also shared a beautiful quote from her father, Malcolm X Shabazz,
Zirin shared a link to the ten minute video of Ambassador Attallah Shabazz’ eulogy posted on YouTube:
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QeqYfHmFFCc)
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“In America’s War on Terror, which has already been led by a Black man longer than it has been led by a White man, Black Americans have been the oppressors, not the victims of US imperialism.”
No sh*t Sherlock! I knew you were stupid, but this comment is monumentally stupid. Keep up the good work.
Being the racist hypocrite you are, you make nary a mention of your boy John Yoo, who came up with the ‘legal’ justification for Bush and Obama’s crimes.
Say, why do you keep silent about your other fellow Asian American’s crime in Florida, against nonwhite gays?
Admit it, you’re just jealous that one of your Asian Americans didn’t get the chance to massacre these people like Bush and Obama.
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Mass murder envy is a mortal sin.
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Being innumerate and an inveterate liar, Our childish Asian fascist gets the length of the US sanction and wars wrong. The sanctions lasted from 1991-2003 and killed hundreds of thousands. The second gulf war and occupation lasted from 2003 to 2011. The length of the sanction regime alone is longer than Obama’s presidency by five years, add on another five years of occupation before the election of Obama, I get seventeen years of white led torment as opposed to Obama’s eight years of the same.
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@Kiwi
Hmmm. Yes, “oppressors” are always shot down in the streets like wild animals with utter impunity by armed civil servants.
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@Kiwi
Unfettered state violence against Black “oppressors” is the domestic front of US imperialism.
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@Afrofem
As an “oppressor” I will go oppress me some Chinese food tomorrow. Perhaps it will protest in my stomach once consumed.
On a serious note, I have noticed with some non-white people that they resent blacks for fighting for better. They feel that blacks should just accept the way things are because they do.Which later turns into more resentment when they see even small advancements for blacks. The attitude becomes “we are honorary whites. We are good. Why do we not get more?” It is misplaced anger. I think that is the reason why not many Asian’s protest things. They have the idea that if they stay “good” that one day whites will see them as equals. just my thoughts.
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@Deb
There is something you should read from taotesan:
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@Sharina
Yes, some (certainly not all) non-Black people resent attempts by Black people to achieve self-determination or unity. I think a lot of people depend on the current social order for their group security and personal advancement. With White people on top and Black people on the bottom, if you are neither, you can inhabit a comfortable middle.
In that middle, you may have to deal with stereotypes and micro-aggressions, but you may not have to deal with state or vigilante violence, mass imprisonment or having your city water supply poisoned by the state you support with your tax dollars.
I agree it is “misplaced anger”. It is far easier to kick Black people than it is to stand up to White people. Not to mention that handy side effect of White approval when you join them in the fight against the dreaded “negro”.
How far that White approval will carry the people in the middle is an open question. They never think of the consequences of success—–if Black people were no longer a part of the body politic, what would happen to the people in the middle? Would they all become one big White happy family or would the middle drop to the bottom? Who would become the replacement out group—who would be the new “negroes”?
Thankfully, some people “in the middle” understand that greater rights for Black people translate into greater rights for them, too. They understand that Black people can be worthy allies. Cooperation can be more beneficial than competition.
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@ Kiwi
Obama is a Black face on White power. He has done little for Black people. He represents their interests only as an afterthought, at best. It is both sad and embarrassing.
Most Blacks opposed the Iraq War, Obama among them. Once in power he changed:
Muhammad Ali stood up for what he believed in. Obama caved into the powers that be.
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@ Kiwi:
Just stop it already. You need to sit down.
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“Muhammad Ali had to dodge the draft in order to protest the racist system.”
He didn’t dodge anything, he stood up for what he believed and took the consequences of his action. What a contrast to a whiny Asian keyboard warrior who doesn’t have the courage to practice what he preaches.
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@Afrofem:
As someone “in the middle”, I learned from my parents that I shouldn’t drink the Kool-Aid and curry favour with White people. Why? Kissing white people’s behinds was never beneficial. You’re still kissing ass. I’m so grateful my family knew early on what the real deal was. I wish more “in the middle” people realized this.
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@Leigh:
It’s almost comical when they get their wake up call! I’ve seen this time and again. Within the white supremacist power structure, they will be thrown crumbs to make them think they have ‘arrived’. Eventually, they get a wake-up call when they reach a glass ceiling. I’ve seen this amongst kerchief heads. t
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The only thing I want from them is my pay checque!
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@Afrofem
Yes Yes three times Yes.
@Leigh
From my experience Filipinos have always been in the know. That is part of the reason why I admire them. They know what time it is with white people and they are not afraid to speak on it either.
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@Afrofem…Dear-heart, thank you for alerting me to taotesan’s comment!
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@ leigh204
I agree with Sharina. The Filipino/a community in my city has always exhibited a strong sense of justice and a willingness to fight. What made the Filipino community different was the their deep collaboration with other groups in the area. I have talked to older activists, read articles and heard local radio shows where Native Americans, Black people and other Asian American individuals talked about their great respect for Filipinos who would join with them in:
❖struggles over labor rights with the Chinese in the early 20th century salmon canneries.
❖struggles over land rights with the Native Americans in the early 1970s.
❖struggles over union organizing and labor rights in the building trades with Black people in the mid to late 1970s.
The local Filipino Community center sometimes hosts mini town meetings where all are welcome to attend and speak.
Of course, the annual Pista Sa Nayon is a great cultural festival that people of all ethnicities attend and enjoy.
http://www.pista.org/about/about.htm
There are a range of racial attitudes among the Filipinos I’ve me personally. Some Filipinos are very White identifying; they marry Whites and brag about their children’s blond hair, blue eyes and thin noses. Others are proud of their own looks and culture. Some are bigoted against Black people, some marry Black people.
In short, Filipinos are human and still dealing with their own trauma from centuries of colonial occupation and brutality. I admire the Filipino culture of graciousness coupled with a strong sense of social justice.
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@ Kiwi
That is a pretty big straw man you’ve been constructing about Black “oppressors” and faux concern about Middle Eastern drone victims.
Are you hosting a Burning Man Festival later this summer? Your straw sculpture will make quite a bonfire. Got tickets?
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Correction:
*I’ve met personally*
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@Afrofem
ROFL.
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Afrofem
Nice link to the festival. We have one similar here. My only complaint is that it does not show case enough traditional dances.
http://www.artsintheheartofaugusta.com
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@ Kiwi:
You know what, Kiwi? I used to think you were alright, but it’s clearly evident you have deep-seated issues that go way beyond Black “oppressors” and Asian women dating/marrying White men. I see what you’ve been doing to other people on Abagond’s blog trying to turn it around on them. You don’t think your sh*t doesn’t stink? Talk about rank. So why don’t you find some other person to engage with because I’m sure as hell not going to play your games. So please carry on. Embarrass yourself.
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@ Afrofem:
Thank you for your comment. It was always tiring to hear White people insist that “All Asians are alike” when it couldn’t be further from the truth. Most Asians do not get along with each other and have warred with each other. As someone of Southeast Asian descent, I have always empathized and identified with black people from a young age. In my personal experience, I have felt East Asians (the ones I came across) thought they were better and they acted as if they were Whites looking down on others. And no doubt about it, anti-blackness is rife in the various Asian communities. This is why I wanted Abagond to do a post on Black and Asian relations because we should have unity, but we are being pitted against each other by who else? White people.
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@ Leigh204
Do you have any thoughts on what measures could help to achieve that unity?
(It’s ok if you don’t or would rather not say; I don’t mean to put you on the spot. Just curious as to what ideas you might have, if any.)
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“I wanted Abagond to do a post on Black and Asian relations because we should have unity, but we are being pitted against each other by who else? White people.”
AND KIWI !!!
Throw that inglorious/disingenuous bum outta here!
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@leigh204
I have seen evidence of disrespectful attitudes toward Filipinos in various online forums where N.E. Asians gather. I have also read some Vietnamese put down Filipinos too.
You are right about traditional enemies and past conflicts as a source. There could be other factors at play here too:
◆the colonial history of the Philipines by Spain and the USA, not to mention the Japanese Occupation during WWII.
◆the Catholic majority?
◆the sane values of the Filipino American community.
The Filipino Americans, I’ve come across tend to value family, community and collaboration both within and without their own community. There are plenty of Filipino professionals and civil servants, but not a big showy Filipino business district like Vietnamese Americans or Korean Americans built in this area.
While I understand and admire the enterprising spirit of some Asian American groups, building businesses and accumulating wealth are not by themselves shields against White Supremacy and bigotry. The Filipino-Americans I’ve met seem to understand that sometimes you have to be willing to fight for your rights and building bridges with other struggling groups can be a productive strategy.
You would know more as an actual Filipino Canadian. Any thoughts you care to share?
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I note that you left out your Chinese kinsmen among those who collaborated with whites against their own, why is that? Is this another example of your double standard?
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In Italy,Vietnam, etc, Asian and White soldiers bonded together as they fought against a common enemy: the “g**ks”.
Rather than fight the racist system, Asians in the military pushed for equal treatment. But nobody calls it for what it was: Asians demanding the equal right to kill Asians for Whites.
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How entertaining. 😀
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@ Solitaire:
Where I’m from, we do a lot of cultural exchanges (traditions, food, beliefs, etc.) In my Filipino community. We always invite people from other communities to join us. I can’t think of a better way to get to know someone than to enjoy oneself over food and dance. Sharing is a big part of my culture. As a result, I’ve seen non-Filipinos and Filipinos opening up to each other where there was no communication before. Do you recall that huge typhoon that hit the Philippines a few years ago? The local non-Filipino communities were so quick to help out with donations. Filipinos here were overcome by the support. I think inviting others would be a great start to unity. I don’t have all the answers. I just know what I know.
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Afrofem
I have seen evidence of disrespectful attitudes toward Filipinos in various online forums where N.E. Asians gather. I have also read some Vietnamese put down Filipinos too.
I have been on some forums when Filipinos are blasted for not being “real” Asians or that Filipinos are the “blacks of Asia” and worthy of contempt. The disrespectful attitude runs deep. I dated one Korean guy years ago and his mother was very upset he was dating me because I was a Filipina. She told him that I might as well have been a black woman (horrible, right?) and never made any effort to be nice even though I was more than civil with her.
From my understanding, Filipino Canadians as well as Filipino Americans tend to fit in and blend in wherever they go. It hasn’t been much of an issue. When I was growing up, there were hardly any Filipinos, well, hardly any Asians. That has changed. The majority of Asians here are Filipinos. We have a bigger voice here and take a stand. Case in point.
http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/special/ourcityourworld/philippines/rallying-cry-141281163.html
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My apologies Afrofrem. The article is a few years old, but it’s actually referring to a situation that happened years earlier.
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@Kiwi Applied physicist turned UFO researcher repeatedly has said that an advanced civilization from another world would see as “a primitive species whose major preoccupation is tribal warfare.”
Hard to argue and impossible to the put the blame on any one entity.
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If you “liked” Blacks so much, you would have moved into a Black neighborhood, not a White one. You don’t think your sh*t doesn’t stink?
I believe Leigh is from Winnipeg (brrrr). The Black population is very small so I doubt there are many ‘Black’ neighbourhoods for Leigh to ‘move to’.
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@Kiwi
Does the ticket to your Burning Man Festival include liquor or do we have to bring our own cases?
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@Leigh204
Sounds like you felt the sharp end of Korean chauvinism, ouch!
Thanks for the link. What an inspiring story and totally in character.
I agree with Herneith: Winnipeg (brrrr).
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@ Leigh204
Thank you for the reply. That’s actually a good suggestion. A lot of times people begin to question stereotypes only when they get to know individuals from the other group. That type of cultural exchange is a great way for all involved to meet on common ground in a relaxed and fun atmosphere.
It’s also a good way to create bonds among those individuals who aren’t activists. I don’t know the percentages, but I would guess that at any given time there’s only a small part of each racial or ethnic group who are heavily engaged in anti-racist activist work and coalition building — yet all the members of each group are concerned about these issues because of the effect on their daily lives. Everyone can make a small impact in their daily conversations and actions, whether in real life or on the internet. So I can see how cultural exchanges and get-togethers could help communities build connections that would counteract some of the current divisions.
I think multicultural education is a real help, too, but at the moment it’s still a struggle to get any kind of true history into the classrooms, at least in the U.S. There’s more coverage than in the past, but it’s still very white-washed when it comes to teaching about the atrocities each group suffered and the various movements for justice.
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@Kiwi
“You will always disgust me.”
Gales of laughter!!!!!
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Cassius Clay is a beautiful name. Muhammad Ali sounds like an ISIS fighter.
You may hate me, but I tell the truth.
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^^^Here’s a person with some free time
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