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What if blacks talked about black-on-white murder the way whites talk about slavery or Trayvon?

White people kill their own!

Disclaimer: In no way am I excusing murder! Instead I am using its clear evilness to point out how morally broken white arguments about slavery are:

If blacks in America talked about black-on-white murder the way some whites talk about the much greater interracial crime of white-on-black slavery and racism, it would go something like this:

  • Go back to Europe! Europe has a lower murder rate. Go back to Europe if you do not like it here.
  • Whites kill their own. And in far greater numbers: for every white person a black person kills, whites kill at least six. If white people do it, it must be all right. Or at least not all that bad.
  • Arabs kill white people too! All the hijackers in 9/11 were Arabs. Fact! They killed at least 2,000 whites. Fact! Proof that blacks are not uniquely evil!
  • No one in my family has ever murdered a white person. So why are you blaming me? Over 99.9% of blacks in the South have never killed a white person. So why blame blacks? Most blacks have nothing to do with it.
  • You have never personally experienced it, so get over it! Neither you nor anyone in your family, most likely, has ever been murdered by a black person. Unless it affects you personally, you have no right to be upset or express an opinion. Stop whining. Get on with your life!
  • Murder is universal. Murder is part of human nature. It is seen in all human societies. Even in ancient times the Romans practised murder. “Et tu, Brute?” It is completely natural. So there is nothing wrong with black people who murder.
  • It was the times! Blacks kill each other at an even higher rate than they kill whites. Proof that it is part of their culture, that they do not know any better. It is unfair to judge them by white moral standards.

And while we are at it, here are a few more, not modelled on slavery arguments, but on some of those made by whites in the wake of the Trayvon Martin case:

  • White American culture glorifies violence. Like all those Hollywood films about mobsters, cowboys and Dirty Harry. “Make my day!” Their history books too. Proof that violence and murder are acceptable in the white community. So why is black-on-white murder held up as this terrible thing in the white media? Why are blacks painted as the ones who are pathologically violent by nature? Whites need to look at themselves!
  • Whites do not protest white-on-white murder. So why the big deal about black-on-white murder?
  • Whites need to do something about their criminal element - if they want others to kill them less. They need to face up to the pathologies in their own community before they can expect others to see their worth as human beings.
  • Many black murderers are not pure black. So you cannot blame blacks for that!

See also:

803 Responses

  1. Too funny! This is a good one. The fake conservative outrage is too much to take. No one ever talks about “white-on-white” crime.


  2. Abagond, you are always really good at turning the tables to illustrate double standards in racial conversations/perceptions. I love posts like this. Thank you!


  3. Again you make your point(s) POIGNANTLY clear. Unfortunately, that won’t stop the “superior” racists from missing these truths altogether. If truth was a real weapon, white-supremacy would have ceased to exist long ago. At the rate *truth* works, we’ll have another couple of thousand years of this nonsense. It’s going to take more than getting the truth out to change things for the better.

    Nonetheless, well done.


  4. @ Matari:

    That’s just it. Racists don’t want to admit the truth even if it’s staring in the face. It’s so obvious the truth hurts because they’re trying their darndest to shift blame. And then they have the nerve to say black people whine and complain. *smh*


  5. Abagond

    Another great post!
    Have you ever wondered why movies like Saw, Hostel, I Spit on your Grave etc, and tv legends like John Wayne become immortalized in America? Ever wonder why tv shows like Dexter, Breaking Bad, NYPD Blue all have/had a great cult following, primarily by whites?

    Ever wonder why Serial killers like Gacy, Dahmer, Manson are made into classroom discussions in psychology class? Ever wonder why
    video games for children and teens are becoming more and more sadistic? And the “M” rating on the box guarantees high sales…need I say more?

    Ever wonder why the highest sales of the grittiest, grimiest, dirtiest, most ruthless rap songs are purchased by white suburban teens?
    Ever wonder why with Japanese anime / hentai where the molestation of women by animals and aliens are loved primarily by white middle class boys?

    Ever wonder why when you see the face of a teacher/student romance, the involving parties are primarily white?
    Ever wonder why MOST pederests are white males? When money is introduced, such as Roman polanski and Jerry Sandusky, this abuse mysteriously disappears or goes on for decades?

    But coloureds are born and bred criminals, don’tcha know?


  6. this post was a riot lol

    “Go back to Europe! Europe has a lower murder rate. Go back to Europe if you do not like it here”

    Most European countries are if not well diverse of ethnics and cultures, there is more countries in the European Countries than there is America, and some countries have restricted gun laws that is way more restricted than America, which would leave to less of an easier chance to kill someone (may be wrong but this is a debate)

    “Whites kill their own. And in far great numbers: for every white person a black person kills, whites kill at least six. If white people do it, it must be all right. Or at least not all that bad.”

    Well of course! because weather people like it or not, Whites are a majority. If we kill anyone else but black people it would be all over the news! it is no lie that white Americans are just as evil minded and black americans, we just have more chances simple enough.

    “Arabs kill white people too! All the hijackers in 9/11 were Arabs. Fact! They killed at least 2,000 whites. Fact! Proof that blacks are not uniquely evil!”

    We all know that 9/11 was an inside job by the federal government.

    “No one in my family has ever murdered a white person. So why are you blaming me? Over 99.9% of blacks in the South have never killed a white person. So why blame blacks? Most blacks have nothing to do with it”

    I’m not sure about that percentage.. but no one in my family has ever murdered a black person, so why are you blaming me? 99.9% of Washington state has never killed a black person, so why blame white people? Most whites have nothing to do with it.

    “Murder is universal. Murder is part of human nature. It is seen in all human societies. Even in ancient times the Romans practised murder. “Et tu, Brute?” It is completely natural. So there is nothing wrong with black people who murder.”

    No Debate on that one.

    “White American culture glorifies violence. Like all those Hollywood films about mobsters, cowboys and Dirty Harry. “Make my day!” Their history books too. Proof that violence and murder are acceptable in the white community. So why is black-on-white murder held up as this terrible thing in the white media? Why are blacks painted as the ones who are pathologically violent by nature? They need to look at themselves!”

    This one cracked me up! why he is actually saying is that there has never been a movie that was written and directed by a black person who does not have murder, gunfire, death and or rape. because they apparently know better than to make such an evil film? I mean if I were to bring up Black Gangster movies such as I don’t know Boys in the Hood?
    http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0101507/
    or Menace to society? http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0107554/
    or even dead presidents? http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0112819/
    and the list goes on

    “Whites do not protest white-on-white murder. So why the big deal about black-on-white murder?”

    Im not sure about that.. I live in a state where you can get a credit in college for Non-violent protest.

    not sure how to answer the second to last, but the last is halarious

    Black people who murders arent really black.. wtf are they? purple?


  7. I have been the victim of violent crimes by both white and black perpetrators. They need to go back to Europe and Africa and take their crime rate with them, esp if they are more than 70% one or the other. I never got attacked by Latinos or Asians or Native Americans or by biracials.


  8. on Thu 19 Apr 2012 at 15:54:41 mashiara4life

    @ Abagond

    You never disappoint. Keep on doing your thing. Love, love, love this blog space (I just skip over the trolls comments and head right to my favorite posters :-) )


  9. Another charade misrepresentation of whites by Abagond.

    Here’s a truer view of white people and their view on crime:

    1. When blacks complain about racism, history of oppression, their current social status, etc whites will point to black crime and say “This is what you should be working on ”

    2. When blacks complain of the violence committed against them in the past by slavery, the KKK, etc, white people will say “It’s not like that anymore. Blacks commit more crimes against themselves than whites do anymore, and commit more crimes against whites than vice versa”. White concern with black crime in this instance is more about getting the blacks to stop whinning about past violence.

    3. Whites know we have crime ourselves. We just send our criminals to jail. We don’t support our criminals due to “past injustices”. Maybe some have become cultural legends, but that’s Hollywood, and has nothing to do with the criminal justice system.

    So,

    Go back to Europe! Cute sarcasm, but won’t happen over crime. We just send our criminals to jail.

    Whites kill their own. Yes, we do. Just like other peoples in other cultures. All cultures punish their criminals. Nobody ever said blacks kill more whites than whites do. Just more Abagond hyperbole. No one would argue this point, so, so what?

    Arabs kill white people too! Yes, they do, and we went after them, and decimated Al Queda. And?

    No one in my family has ever murdered a white person. So why are you blaming me? We’re not blaming these blacks, this is just another Agabond strawman argument. Like I said above, we only point to black crime when blacks are complaining about past, not current, violence against them. No one would argue this point, so, so what?

    You have never personally experienced it, so get over it! Unless it affects you personally, you have no right to be upset or express an opinion. Stop whining. Get on with your life! We do ! No white spends any appreciable amount of time whining about black crime against them. It’s the blacks, as in the Treyvon case, that are wailing about how their ‘young men are being hunted down by whites’.

    Murder is universal. Yes it is. It’s one of those things that societies have to constantly be vigilant against. No one would argue this point, so, so what?

    It was the times! Blacks kill each other at an even higher rate than they kill whites Yes, they do, so work on that instead of complaining about racism.

    White American culture glorifies violence. The entertainment industry does. And blacks are into this glorification as much as whites are (see hip hop culture), so there is no black-white difference. So what’s your point??

    Whites need to do something about their criminal element We do, we send them to prison. Ever hear about the increasing prison population? At least half are whites.

    Many black murderers are not pure black. We blame their partial black heritage.

    Whites do not protest white-on-white murder. I remember demonstrations and memorial services after Columbine and other shootings like this. Whites, since the 1960 draft protests, just don’t protest as much as blacks do. We prefer to do things.


  10. But you should know, of course, that logic only works in the right …. err, white direction


  11. ..”on Thu 19 Apr 2012 at 16:01:32Bliff
    Another charade misrepresentation of whites by Abagond.

    Here’s a truer view of white people and their view on crime:

    1. When blacks complain about racism, history of oppression, their current social status, etc whites will point to black crime and say “This is what you should be working on ”

    2. When blacks complain of the violence committed against them in the past by slavery, the KKK, etc, white people will say “It’s not like that anymore. Blacks commit more crimes against themselves than whites do anymore, and commit more crimes against whites than vice versa”. White concern with black crime in this instance is more about getting the blacks to stop whinning about past violence.

    3. Whites know we have crime ourselves. We just send our criminals to jail. We don’t support our criminals due to “past injustices”. Maybe some have become cultural legends, but that’s Hollywood, and has nothing to do with the criminal justice system.
    So,
    Go back to Europe! Cute sarcasm, but won’t happen over crime. We just send our criminals to jail.

    Whites kill their own. Yes, we do. Just like other peoples in other cultures. All cultures punish their criminals. Nobody ever said blacks kill more whites than whites do. Just more Abagond hyperbole. No one would argue this point, so, so what?….”
    ———————————————————————-

    I see what you did Abagond!!!!! That’s pretty good lol!


  12. WOW @Steve Haws and Bliff.

    abagond couldn’t have been MORE explicit about this post being sarcastic. and yet you really DID take these tongue in cheek arguments point for point and argue them as if they were real arguments. and you still don’t grasp the connection between this post and the similar silly arguments whites make about white on black crime, ie. the REAL point of this post?

    I’m starting to wonder if race realism is tied to damage to the prefrontal cortex of the brain. people with such damage have tremendous difficulty with empathy and understanding sarcasm, et al.

    http://www.seattlepi.com/national/article/Complex-thinking-required-to-understand-sarcasm-1174111.php


  13. There is no “big deal” about black on white murder Abagond – that’s the whole point. Black on white murder is not talked about – did you hear much about the Taco Bell shooting on CNN?


  14. @Jane Laplain

    I am just simply stating that its the same all the way around so what exactly is the point of beating a dead horse? if we posted a sarcastic rant such as this, would people look at it to be sarcastic? opening up rational thinking for everyone to unite under one thought it what is what I believe we should be doing, instead we drive a wedge between races… Sarcasm is the tool of a racist as been shown time and time again.


  15. “Whites need to do something about their criminal element – if they want others to kill them less. They need to face up to the pathologies in their own community before they can be expecting others to see their worth as human beings.”

    I hear so many versions of this argument all the time. If blacks would clean up their communities and be better people there wouldn’t be any racism and they would be respected. It’s a bunch of crap. It doesn’t matter how good a black person you are, to a racist you’re always going to be a n*gg*r unworthy of respect. History has shown that. Like all these other arguments/excuses its so disingenuous. Quite frankly, it’s just BS.


  16. I’m not understanding the premise of this post maybe. It seems to be based on the worn out excuse of “blacks murder whites because of slavery” – is that it?
    Slavery no longer exists and racism is minimal (and it goes both ways); black on white violent crime does exist/white on black does not – ergo, the premise for your post is childish and flawed.


  17. @Steve Haws

    *blink*. Okay… i believe that YOU believe what you’re saying. And I accept that that’s your position. It’s just hard for me to wrap my head around all the unintentional ironies you pose in one short reply. But…you have a nice day.


  18. Poetess

    ” It doesn’t matter how good a black person you are, to a racist you’re always going to be a n*gg*r unworthy of respect.”

    You are delusional – is this how most blacks think?


  19. poetess

    What percentage of whites are racist?


  20. Great post as usual Abagond. Of course the White racist defenders DON’T GET IT.

    Abagond you have the patience of Job. I couldn’t deal with the those guys.


  21. @brahms

    why exactly do you think it’s delusional for a black person to believe a white supremacist/racist isn’t willing to give a black person respect, no matter how upstanding the individual black person in question?

    I have a question tho. Up until the civil rights movement, open White Supremacy was the norm. That is to say, it was the default assumption that to be white was superior in most all respects to other “races.” That is to say it was thought that whites were superior in beauty, intelligence, cultural achievement etc. You name it, it was not taboo to say such a thing openly. Furthermore anyone transgressing the norms of white supremacy (for example, saying that ‘all men were created equal’ applied to non-white people too) was considered some kind of radical extremist. The turmoil of the civil rights era and its impact on mainstream culture brought an end to open statements of White Supremacy… but these times just beforehand are still within the living memories of our parents and grandparents.

    So my question is… what do you personally think about the era of open White Supremacy. Do you see no connection to what happened back then (not at all long ago) and the state of race relations today?

    Just curious.


  22. I don’t think people are being sarcastic just to be sarcastic. I am sure most readers get the point of the original post. I think posters just want to experiment with their own sarcastic rants.


  23. Jane Laplain

    Yeah, I mispoke there. A white racist would behave that way, the problem is that I’ve met one true racist in my life – they just aren’t out there. It seems ridiculous to talk about white racists – where are they? Sure, there are some in the small towns but blacks mainly live in the cities. If a rural black wants to complain about racism, I’m all ears.

    To your question – “Do you see no connection to what happened back then (not at all long ago) and the state of race relations today?”

    Yes, I see a connection. For there to be a connection however, the parents would have to be instilling racist values in their children – how long will that go on? If you consider two or three generations acceptable then you can at least mention that it is not contemporary whites who are to blame for black rebelliousness against whites.

    I’m white, I know how whites talk – they are fobidden to speak negatively about blacks. I also know how blacks speak about whites in their homes – if any black here denies this, they are lying.


  24. Clarification: it is black parents who instill racism in their children while white parents have been programmed to teach egalitarian principles.


  25. @Bliff

    “I’m white, I know how whites talk – they are fobidden to speak negatively about blacks. I also know how blacks speak about whites in their homes – if any black here denies this, they are lying.”

    I have never been called cracker so much until I went to Job Corps in Edison Jersey, I asked a friend of mine what he thought of white people, he said that they were crackers rofl, I don’t hate him, in fact he e-mails me with tech support questions.

    this is derailing my post, but when I went to NJ Job Corps, there was 5 white folks in the whole center lol, a few other minorities such as Cuban and other Latinos but primarily white.

    but im a racist for being intimidated for being there. long story short I stayed too get my Microsoft XP Professional Test passed, and I ended up leaving because I got tiered of being called Wonder Bread, and got into a fist fight.


  26. @ Brahms

    Are there any racist commenters on this blog? If you do not want to name names, what % of black commenters and what % of white commenters do you think are racist?


  27. Man, you just cannot make this stuff up!!!!


  28. @brahms

    So openly speaking negative things about blacks is now forbidden. I will believe you on that. But do you honestly think that openly speaking negative things are the only way to transmit negative beliefs? Do you think it is possible to believe one way (ie. whites are better than blacks), and behave another way (never openly saying the words whites are better than blacks). Do you not believe it is entirely possible to translate fear/disgust/apprehension without actually saying the words “Wow, that’s scary/disgusting/suspicious!”?

    And furthermore do you not believe it is possible for a generation of white persons who were raised in a tim,e of open white supremacy but are now forbidden from saying openly white supremacist things, to nonetheless impart their white supremacist beliefs and way of life to their own offspring without actually having to say anything overtly white supremacist? And that such raised white children would in turn instill similar values in their own children?

    I know how blacks about whites in their own homes… a variety of ways. In my own family there are blacks who believe that black people are our only worst enemy. and there are people in my family who believe that white people are the devil. and across generations i have black family who experienced Jim Crow segregation first hand and black family members who have never heard a white person say the N word to them or to anyone else. there is more than ONE way black people think about things… and to get into a discussion about what percentage believe this or that or the other is to waste time.

    If the problem with racism is that people say racist things, then by your standards the country is mostly “cured.” as most people aren’t willing to say racist things openly. But I personally understand racism to be about more than what comes out of somebody’s mouth, rather its a set of cultural attitudes and beliefs that white people are superior and blacks are inferior. But precious few WHITE people are willing to have a conversation about the VALUES and BELIEFS behind white supremacist thought and action.

    What say you?


  29. @my self

    i’m battin’ 100 today, I meant to say primarily black lol


  30. @Jane Laplain

    abagond couldn’t have been MORE explicit about this post being sarcastic. and yet you really DID take these tongue in cheek arguments point for point and argue them as if they were real arguments.

    Tongue in cheek, my a$$. Maybe on this particular post, but these arguments have been used on this blog before as serious arguments. I have had to post many of my points before. Most blacks believe Abagond’s points in this post to be real, and, most blacks will believe any racist thing said about whites.


  31. Great post – I was going to say ‘cue the trolls’, but I can see that they’ve already jumped in with both feet! Typical knee-jerk reactionaries… :cool:


  32. @Sepultura13 and your not trolling? ROFL


  33. I think I’ve seen one truly racist comment here – something about black people’s hair and I think that was in jest. So I’d say none of them are truly racist. Pointing out black on white crime problems and even the disparity of IQs (no, the dumbest white person is not smarter than the smartest black person) is not racism. Or if it is racism, then racism is ok – it is probably better if we use the word prejudice.

    However, any person who prefers to marry someone of their own race is racist – that would include the majority of all people.


  34. Jane

    If your definition is ” its a set of cultural attitudes and beliefs that white people are superior and blacks are inferior.”

    Then I think there is very little racism among whites. What about whites preferring to marry whites? What about whites being afraid of blacks when out on the town? Or, believing that blacks don’t tip well? Or that blacks don’t raise their children well? These stereotypes are true for the majority of blacks. If the majority of black babies are born to single mothers then I can say that they are not being raised well. I know that the percent of black parents who read to their kids is something like 30%.

    There may be some racism in how whites view black professionals -why?

    I know that IQ is hereditary- does that mean that whites are smarter? In the aggragate yes. If you look at IQs above 120, the percentage of blacks to reach that level is less than the percentage of whites (I posit that black IQs have fallen since 1940 – its a guess and has to do with dysgenics which abagond doesn’t like to talk about). Doesn’t mean there can’t be a black nuclear physicist with a 150 IQ though or black families which have been very intelligent and successful generationally. A black girl tutored me in math – she was smarter than me. Answer – If we didn’t have affirmative action and other nonsense like “test bias” then a black lawyer is a lawyer not a black lawyer; he will be judged on his merit alone and any group IQ issues would be moot. Wouldn’t that be a better world? (not for those who use racism to rationalize their sorry state in life). Of course, it takes assimilation and acting white, something frowned upon by blacks – there’s some racism for you.

    Almost all racism among whites will be found in the underclass – these people have no power over blacks. They aren’t out playing the knock-out game on unsuspecting blacks either; these low-lifes don’t hurt you. Adeen is dealing with these rurual people right now it seems – she should transfer schools if possible, just as I transferred schools to get away from violent anti-white blacks. Its funny, I was completely accepted by the blacks in gradeschool – got to highschool with new blacks and here comes the racism.


  35. @abagond: Great!! :D


  36. on Thu 19 Apr 2012 at 20:29:43 the world we live in

    aba-great post!


  37. @Sepultura13 and your not trolling? ROFL

    Actually, I’m not – for one thing, I don’t derail topics; I can stick to the subject and am able to elucidate my opinion in a succinct manner, without needing to attack or insult others (and if I do attack or insult, it’s generally in response to one on me, since I will defend myself). Two, you don’t seem to be objective, seeing as how you went after my innocuous comment with both barrels blazing in a pathetic attempt to use me as a derailment tactic. This is why I usually don’t engage with the likes of you, because I don’t want to be the person blamed for going off-topic, but since you decided to jump up I figured I’d smack you right back down.
    Finally, ‘lurking’ is different from ‘trolling’. I am a ‘lurker’ and proudly admit it, since ‘lurking’ is generally harmless. I pass through, read mostly, comment little, and keep on going. You, on the other hand, were just WAITING to make a snide remark about me when I decided to make a general comment.

    You don’t seem to understand the definition of trolling, but that isn’t surprising…comprehension, grammar, and spelling are your obvious weaknesses. I’m quite certain they’re not the only ones! :grin:


  38. on Thu 19 Apr 2012 at 21:15:56 the world we live in

    Brahms,Bliff, and those of like-mind do not understand the structural components of racism, thus they will never truly be able to intellectually grasp Abagond’s work nor the excellent responses given by so many. I pity them.


  39. @ Bliff, Brahms,

    Another reason to dismiss your claims about the superiority of white intelligence:

    http://news.sciencemag.org/sciencenow/2011/04/what-does-iq-really-measure.html


  40. Go Back to Europe!:

    Probably about as legitimate, actually factoring in slavery and invasion probably more so, an argument as when used against African-Americans.

    Whites Kill their Own!:

    True, whites do kill their own but they don’t complain about it, they don’t complain by and large when black people kill white people either.

    Its usually used as a counter-example more than a general conversation. That and it ignores the purportion/ratio aspect of killing as well.

    Arabs kill White People Too!:

    Actually; there are probably more people who are blatantly racist against Arabs and Islamophobic both in the media and general population today than there are blatant racists against African-Americans.

    No-One in my family has ever murdered a white person!:

    This would actually be a good argument, it would be pretty racist to blame one person or most of an ethnic group of a crime that less than 1% of it actually does.

    Now if you wanted to argue that they were wary of that race due to not being able to tell who would murder them and who wouldn’t than I guess that could work but anybody who literally has a hate on for the whole race/whatever would be pretty racist.

    You haven’t experienced it!:

    Almost a good argument? It would be strange to have a focus on something that no one in your family, your personally, friends or associates have ever had even the slightest connection too.

    It was the times!:

    Blacks are killers as part of their culture, I guess the irony here is it would almost be more racist of someone to literally believe this and at the same time, probably the strangest moral structure I’ve ever seen in a person if it was a true belief.

    Though it is an argument you see when judging cultures from the past, that we judge them from our perspective and culture and that might not be the most accurate thing to do.

    Not that I agree with that but I’ve seen it raised as a point before.

    Though it misses one problem, if the last time black people had been murdering white people at a greater rate than white people murder black people was 150 yrs ago and white people were still bringing it up as a crime against white people…..

    White America Glorifies Violence!:

    Thats true; bizarrely enough compared to other cultures that might have more violent tv shows, more nudity and sexuality, or more extreme tentacle rape we are still more violent, criminal, raping etc….than most non-third world countries.

    Whites don’t protest White on White Murder/Deal with their own criminal pathologies:

    Its true; as pointed out we don’t complain about our criminals, we do something about it, make more laws, hire more police etc…..

    Doing something about their own criminal element is less worth as human beings and more hypocrisy, looking at white people as being brutally racist or wanting to kill/hurt black people when the crimes of their own are almost not cared about at all.

    And this is true both by numbers and most especially by purportions.

    Many Murders called black aren’t!:

    That would be a legitimate point, if people were confusing negritos, aborigines etc…with black people and lumping them in with their murder rates, that would be a good point to bring up.

    And if many of the murders were mixed race and didn’t view themselves as black or were say a dark skinned guy from India and white people/the media were still referring to him as black that would also be a pretty good point.


  41. @Brahms:

    Were you on vacation? Rested up now or only starting?

    im Not Understanding The Premise Of This Post Maybe. It Seems To Be Based On The Worn Out Excuse Of Blacks Murder Whites Because Of Slavery Is That It?

    I Think You Should Go Back On Vacation Dear!

    slavery No Longer Exists And Racism Is Minimal (And It Goes Both Ways); Black On White Violent Crime Does Exist/white On Black Does Not Ergo, The Premise For Your Post Is Childish And Flawed.

    No Brahmsy, The premise of your reply is flawed because you couldn’t be further off. Perhaps another vacation is in order!

    you Are Delusional Is This How Most Blacks Think?

    No, We Are Too Busy Thinking About The Next White Person We Are Going To Kill. Let Me Ask You This Brahmsy; Do Most White Men Diddle Children Or Just Half Of Them?

    what Percentage Of Whites Are Racist?

    I’d Say About 98% Give Or Take A Percentage Point.

    it Seems Ridiculous To Talk About White Racists

    You Are Right That Is A Given. You Should Be Talking Of The White Anti-racist. Now That Is A Rare Bird!, Where Are They In Real Life?

    if A Rural Black Wants To Complain About Racism, Im All Ears.

    I’m From Moose Crotch Ontario. Got A Couple Of Decades?

    i Also Know How Blacks Speak About Whites In Their Homes If Any Black Here Denies This, They Are Lying.

    I Deny It!

    man, You Just Cannot Make This Stuff Up!!!!

    That Is The Hilarious Part!

    @Bliff:

    I see you are back with a vengeance. How’s the Chardonnay or is it Ripple?

    i Think Ive Seen One Truly Racist Comment Here

    Are You Daft?

    i Know That Iq Is Hereditary

    Why Yes You Are. Har Har Hoo! Here’s A ‘Race Realist Convention. The Tall Chubby Guy Is Bliff, The Short One Randy And The Wabbit Is Brahms:


  42. Whites do not protest white-on-white murder. So why the big deal about black-on-white murder?

    Whites need to do something about their criminal element – if they want others to kill them less. They need to face up to the pathologies in their own community before they can expect others to see their worth as human beings.

    I say the first point all the time. White people murdering each other doesn’t seem to be as bad to white folks unless the murderer was a black person. It’s like the killer has to be black in order for whites to start worrying about the existence of the white race. I’ve yet to hear whites reeling over white serial killings of other whites, white mass murderers of other whites, white sexual assaults and rape or other whites, white pedophilia of younger whites, and so on.

    Sometimes the usual excuse is that white-on-white murders don’t happen too often. Still, that basically is another way of saying that white lives are not important unless it was taken by a black man.

    The same does not apply to blacks as that seems to be the counterargument. There are black people within their communities that are doing something about the violence, and they have been for years now. Latinos, Asians and Native Americans are doing what they can in their own communities as well.

    And you know what’s messed up is that some whites have the nerve to grade us on our progress taking on a needed task they won’t do themselves.

    As for the second point part of the matrix of whiteness is to believe that white people as a whole are not prone to crime, violence or murder no matter what historical, statistical and social facts that present themselves. Some who refer to themselves as race realist believe it in their minds. That kind of race realism is nothing but race fiction. Period. It’s insane to think that you or the group you belong to is superior above everyone else, but yet are unable to take any accountability for any sins or mistakes, past or present. Unable to learn beyond one’s boundaries and use the best sources in the world to find out about a group of people which are the group of people themselves instead of letting numbers, outdated, refuted data, news reports from a liberal-based media that they hate, and consider all disagreements part of an agenda which is basically the move to close the mind, and not ask questions. What the hell kind of superiority is that?

    I’m rambling here. I just had to get that off of my chest.


  43. Brahms, Bliff,

    For those that believe that argue that white people are superior at every turn, you really appear to be living rebuttals of your own argument. If you can not understand the gist of this post, you may not be as supreme as you think you are.


  44. Yes, apparently some people don’t get sarcasm, that much is obvious.

    As a white person I am interested in perhaps the difference, if any between prejudice and racism. I mean, to define people in terms of skin tone is an objective categorization, to some degree, and from there, it just goes on if that makes any sense.

    And yes, I did cable TV installs for a couple years and I am guilty of trying to guess what the tip would be, if any, based on the ethnicity of the customer.

    So I guess prejudice comes in from nurture ie parents’ beliefs and acquired experience, but going above and beyond is racism? idk.

    -tc


  45. For those that believe that argue that white people are superior at every turn, you really appear to be living rebuttals of your own argument. If you can not understand the gist of this post, you may not be as supreme as you think you are


    @ Brothawolf

    Thank you! Co-signed.


  46. @ Brahms

    “ If a rural black wants to complain about racism, I’m all ears.”

    Okay let’s see how all ears you are. I’m from Alabama, a small, college, rural town in Alabama. I am a senior in college, no kids, two parent home, no criminal record, work full time, and live alone. I have had dirty looks from old white people on a daily basis. I was called a welfare queen by three white guys at the grocery store; three guys that I actually attend college with but they were so racist they didn’t even realize I sit in front of them in class. I overheard a nice white lady tell her friend that she thinks black people hair look like carpet. I have had someone hold the door open for a white couple I was walking behind but closed the door on my face at a local restaurant. At an intern interview I was told that I could not work at the front desk because the nice white people would not take kindly to my afro. I was babysitting my neighbors daughter and took her to the park. A policeman came up to me and called her parents on his cell phone to make sure I hadn’t kidnapped her (she fell down while skating and skinned her knee). We have two schools in the same country, both public but one in a white neighborhood and the other in the black neighborhood. Both schools are clean, but one gets new equipment and books every 5 years and the other gets the old equipment taken from the other school. Which is which? This is just the sh*t that happened this year.

    Just hush because we all know you don’t give a crap about black people or their problem except where it interrupts your lily white world. You don’t even know you are white until you are in a room full of black people. The very fact that you can stroll into a black blog and not have everyone blast you with the most disgusting racist vile is indication of your awesome white privilege. If you are so concerned about black people fixing the problems in their community, lead by example dude. Go over to stormfront and tell them to fix their crap. What do you think would happen if I went in there spewing the crap you spew in here? I wouldn’t get such a respectable reception now would I? It even pains me to have to put this blog in the same category as stromfront because it is clearly not. You are the worst kind of person because you are so blind you can’t even see it if it was surgically placed in your cornea. You come in here backing up your racist view with racist research from a racist scientist and expect to get a positive outcome; sir, you are insane. (The definition of insanity is repeating the same behavior and expecting a different result.) Abagond has the patience of a rock because I would have deleted to the point of destroying your keyboard from a laser beam from outer space if it was at all possible. You are the sickest kind of human and people like you make me wish that whoever that mofo that so-called “discovered America” would have hit the iceberg long before the Titanic was ever thought of. I know the millions of indigenous people who lost their lives would be excited!

    And you know what else, I wouldn’t mind going “back to Africa” except I would still have to come into more human beings just like you so I might as well stay here and stick it out. As I hear it, Africa wasn’t all that bad until white people showed up. Slavery is over everywhere else but you mofos still couldn’t let it go! Everyone has been slaves and held slaves before but black people get the extra added benefit of Jim Crow, so-called civil rights and institutional racism. Irish people were enslaved sure enough but they still don’t have to put up with all the ish we do. Let’s be honest for a minute, it all boils down to the fact that you don’t want to lose your privilege of being white. That is the scariest thing in the world for you to be the minority in this country. I bet you see any advance in the black community as a loss for the white community. Good luck on making it to that white heaven with the coloreds-only section, because honestly I think anybody who makes it is going to be bumping robes with all races.


  47. @ Cleonette:

    WOW! Reading your comment made me want to stand up and cheer. Everything you mentioned was spot on! I applaud you on your excellent post!


  48. Bliff & Brahms tie themselves up in logical knots, arguing that they aren’t racist by saying racist (and ignorant) stuff like “most blacks will believe any racist thing said about whites.” It’s easy to see through them, but it’s more complicated when it comes to the mainstream narrative, and your post does a terrific job demonstrating the racism and lack of logic in the way that slavery and Trayvon are all-too-frequently discussed.


  49. Cleonette -

    THANK YOU!!! : )))


  50. I`m a white guy and I find most of these arguments legitimate… Where’s your point abagond?


  51. Its a parody of previous comments made on this blog…


  52. Cleonette,

    Chica, that was poetic.

    but wasted on our resident white realist trolls, they only want a platform to be heard…they are not hear to listen.


  53. @silentreturn

    Oh, ok. Thanks for the info… Nevertheless I do not really understand why anybody would make a parody of valid arguments.


  54. Thanks @ Leigh204
    You are welcome @ Matari

    I don’t usually comment, just observe. However I just could not stay quiet today.

    What gets to me is the fact that they even think that what they are saying is important to the people reading this blog. The truly intelligent people, all skin tones, shake their heads in disbelief. It’s not just websites like stromfront either. Go to yahoo comments; it’s like an online Klan meeting. Abagond never cease to impress me with this blog. His examples, sarcasms, plays on words; all of it, is so simplistic that a child can understand it yet these trolls act like it’s written in Aramaic. It’s disgusting! My grandmother has this saying, “An empty wagon makes a lot of noise!” I think this applies to these people. (If you don’t get the analogy, I feel even worst for you.) Everything Abagond said, even though it is sarcasm, are the exact arguments in reverse that they use. Telling someone to go back to Europe is just as idiotic as telling someone to go back to Africa, yet they still refuse to get it!

    How convenient for you to label the person pointing out an example of racism as racist. It is very telling about your character to become defensive when a black person takes about race relations. You talk about media being in favor of black people and we in turn look at you and wonder exactly which channel you are watching. I can name 5 pretty blond missing girls off the top of my head because it had been drilled into my head by every news network but I have to go to a special website or do a Google search for 5 pretty, missing black girls. You are the same people to call they website showcasing the website featuring racist because it only feature missing blacks, then in the same breath say that blacks need to concern themselves with their own community problems. But I don’t fault you for all of that because I would become confused trying to hate something that hasn’t personally effected me either.

    You say it’s because of the way we dress, they way we speak, the level of education; you and I both know it’s a lie. In your ugly little world a black man in a Brooks Brother suit equals a well dressed ni66er. In your world a black college professors is accused of looking like a drug dealer on national news. In your world a black politician get arrested for trying to enter his own home and we both know they weren’t wearing “saggin” pants. Well guess what, black people don’t like “saggin” pants either. No one in my family does that because my grandfather’s voice reminded them what “saggin” is spelled backwards…. Unfortunately, a lot of people don’t even realize this and we were quite surprised when he picked up on it. (You do know it was the media that coined the term “saggin”, right?) It’s your whining that the rest of the world is sick of. Tell me this: with all of the white privilege that is afforded people with white skin, how is it that you still have dirt poor whites in your community? I wonder that. I wonder what you think of them. I wonder what their “excuse” is.


  55. Kindly explain your reasoning.


  56. Cleonette,

    I’m an agnostic, but I must give you an Amen on your comment! lol


  57. on Fri 20 Apr 2012 at 02:22:46 Black Narcissus

    Cleonette,

    *standing ovation*

    As my grandmother says, “Let ‘em know why you mad!”


  58. And another thing,

    These folks that cry and mourn endlessly over black-on-white murders that have become so popular in the liberal media which, as they say, ignore such crimes, must really be saying that white lives are not precious unless it was taken by black people. That’s when shit hits the fan. Other than that, there’s no real outcry to stop the violence in white communities let alone address the crime problem in general committed by whites.

    Why is there no outcry from the white community if we hear about a white female teacher and her sexcapades with her students?

    Why is there no outcry from the white community if we hear about a white religious official and his sexcapades with young white boys?

    Why is there no outcry from the white community if we hear about a white serial killer targeting white women?

    Why is there no outcry from the white community if we hear about white mob and mafia criminal activities which include violence and murder?

    Why is there no outcry from the white community if we hear about white biker gang violence against each other?

    Why is there no outcry from the white community if we hear about the drug problem in their communities concerning cocaine and meth, among other drugs.

    Why is there no outcry from the white community if we hear about school shootings by white youth?

    Why? Because just like their white privilege prevents them from being judged collectively based on the actions of a small group, it also prevents them from seeing their own dysfunctions no matter how frequent or many there are. It’s not because they’re bad people. It’s because they are programmed. Some are too programmed to know that they are programmed to begin with.


  59. Nice post Cleonette, I can identify fully.


  60. on Fri 20 Apr 2012 at 02:51:41 the world we live in

    W.O.W. The cognitive dissonance, the great abandonment of reason and one’s own words…my friends, and you know who you are, this ish is a ‘sickness’.


  61. on Fri 20 Apr 2012 at 03:11:48 the world we live in

    @Cleonette
    You spoke for so many, warm big hugs!


  62. Thanks @ the world we live in. I am just speaking truth.


  63. Sorry for the grammatical errors but passion often takes a back seat to grammar at times…


  64. @brothawolf:

    Now heres two examples that speks in volumes about all this:

    Among the biggest criminal organisations in the world are japanese yakuza and the chinese triads. Both have tens of thousands of members in several clans/groups and operate all over the world in all legal and illegal businesses. Both are extremely violent and HC organised crime in every sense of the word. And yet…

    Why we never hear these so-called race realists claim that all japanese or chinese are prone to crime or natural born criminals? Why that is never a subject on any “race debate”? How come these guys exclude every other race from their rantings and ravings?

    Well, we know why.

    As for the white OC, it simply vanishes into the air in their minds.


  65. From what I can see, there are four positions here.

    1) Whites and blacks are the same, except that whites are racist and therefore deserve censure. Blacks are persecuted by the justice system; more criminal behavior has nothing to do with it. There is no pattern except the pattern of racism. Add some version of marxist politics or clasa analysis. Slavery was terrible (people were treated meanly).
    2) Blacks are my people, or are victims, and I am black, so I support the Black Side. Whites be damned. You’re all a bunch of zombies or mindless crackers. Racists, too. But not me.

    3) I am white, so I support white peopole. Blacks back to Africa! Call me raicst and see how much i care, it’s all justified. Bunch of sociopathic criminals.
    4) There may be lots of racism, but it doesn’t matter: I don’t care why blacks are more dangerous, I just don’t want them near me or my kids. Call me racist if you want, I call it like I see it. Slavery was unfortunate (it means there’s lots of black people here as a result)

    Pretty much all the comments on every post on crime at this blog, and in most others, for that matter, falls into one of these caterogies. At Chuck’s blog, GLP, the bulk fall in 3 and 4. Here, the same pattern replicates itself, but it’s 1 and 2.

    The fact that the positions are so similar, with different flags, doesn’t seem to disturb anyone.


  66. And for some, see this. It’s not right wing, unless you consider all non-left-wing commentary right-wing.

    http://frontpagemag.com/2012/04/19/decrying-imaginary-racism/?utm_source=FrontPage+Magazine&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=d6f923fb6b-Mailchimp_FrontPageMag

    a new ABC poll finds that 84% of blacks feel that the justice system—from the police to the courtroom to the penitentiary—treats them inequitably.

    While it is virtually impossible to overstate the implications of this core belief which has so firmly embedded itself in the worldview of black Americans, one vital question begs for an answer: Is it true? Let us briefly survey the mountain of empirical evidence that the champions of “civil rights”—like Jackson and Sharpton—have so carefully avoided mentioning amid their incessant, thundering denunciations of the U.S. and its justice system.

    Like all things writtne on this csubject that are done with any attempt at accuracy or fairness, once again – no anti-black bias is found in the court system. Almost every major study has found the same thing, which is why there are never any recommendations as to how to fix it – because there’s no problem.

    And on some perspective on Trayvon:

    Of course, one could never learn any of this from the “civil rights leaders” who were apparently struck mute in the aftermath of an April 3rd shooting that occurred outside a south Phoenix Taco Bell restaurant, where a 22-year-old black motorist at the drive-through window got into an altercation with Daniel Adkins, a 29-year-old, mentally disabled “white Hispanic” pedestrian. The argument grew heated, and the driver shot and killed Adkins. When police arrived at the scene, the gunman reported that Adkins had swung a bat or metal pipe at him. Though no such items were ever found at the scene, an independent witness reported that Adkins had swung his fists in the driver’s direction several times. Arizona, like Florida, has a “Stand Your Ground” law that allows a person to use deadly force when faced with a life-or-death confrontation. The gunman accordingly claimed that he had acted in self-defense, and thus he was not arrested.

    While Daniel Adkins’ death was undeniably a human tragedy, it is quite conceivable that from a legal standpoint, the gunman, if in fact he felt that his life was in danger, acted within the bounds of the law. What is noteworthy, however, is that few Americans have ever heard of Daniel Adkins. Jackson and Sharpton have said nothing about him. Famous athletes and entertainers have not “tweeted” about him. And President Obama has felt no compulsion to exhort his countrymen, as he did in the wake of the Trayvon Martin killing, “to do some soul-searching to figure out how does something like this happen.” Now, why do you suppose that is?

    And people wonder why whites are angry at the mainstream media? Can you say bias?

    You don’t see it because you’re black. If lots of white people are saying this, consistently, then there — just might – be some truth to it.

    Exactly the same way that if lots of black people talk about the consuming toll of daily racism on their lives, then it – just might – be true.

    Neither side can hear or see the other.


  67. And finally, for the Left, some murder is okay. Especially if the ones doing it are black. In other words, racism is fine – so long as it’s a Designated Victim doing it.

    The hypocrisy is stunning.

    http://frontpagemag.com/2012/04/19/mob-based-justice/?utm_source=FrontPage+Magazine&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=d6f923fb6b-Mailchimp_FrontPageMag


  68. And, finally, to illustrate how focusing on supposed epidemic levels of white racism serves no-one but racist political hustlers and tribalist notions of vengeance, I give you this.

    http://frontpagemag.com/2012/04/10/media-dishonesty-and-race-hustlers/

    Here’s the most important bit.

    None of those black-on-white atrocities made anywhere near the news that the Trayvon Martin case made, and it’s deliberate. Editors for the Los Angeles Times, The New York Times and the Chicago Tribune admitted to deliberately censoring information about black crime for political reasons, in an effort to “guard against subjecting an entire group of people to suspicion.”

    In other words – Blacks get a pass because of slavery or whatever convenient excuse is dredged up. That is, individual black criminals get a pass because os a sense that their grandparents had it the other way. So that’s fair, right? Blacks it hard up till the 1950′s, so black criminals should get a pass now, and we should onyl be angry or worried about non-black criminals, … right?

    There’s no pattern here. If you see *any* pattern, you’re a white racist. Uh-huh.

    Oh, and if you argue with me, you’re *also* a white racist. And if you decide to act without talking about it, then you’re just a cowardly white racist.

    To white guy: You’re *not allowed to see social patterns*. Stop looking.

    This is the message we’re fed intravenously all day. But being black, … you can’t see it. You just see Your Trube being persecuted, because for you, the tribe is everything. And as a result, I ask: why should white people ever do anythign but for tribalistic reasons, either?

    No side can speak honestly about race and crime in America. There are as many delusions, lies and false narratives on the left and among blacks as among whites.

    When NBC’s “Today” show played the audio of George Zimmerman’s call to a Sanford, Fla., police dispatcher about Trayvon Martin, the editors made him appear to be a racist who says: “This guy looks like he’s up to no good. He looks black.” What Zimmerman actually said was: “This guy looks like he’s up to no good or he’s on drugs or something. It’s raining, and he’s just walking around, looking about.” The 911 officer responded by asking, “OK, and this guy — is he black, white or Hispanic?” Zimmerman replied, “He looks black.” NBC says it’s investigating the doctoring of the audio, but there’s nothing to investigate; its objective was to inflame passions.

    In his Associated Press article titled “Old photos may be deceptive in Fla. shooting case,” Matt Sedensky pointed out that the photos carried by the major media were several years old and showed Zimmerman looking fat and mean and Martin looking like a sweet young kid.

    Jesse Jackson told the Los Angeles Times that “blacks are under attack” and that “targeting, arresting, convicting blacks and ultimately killing us is big business,” adding that Martin is “a martyr.” President Barack Obama chimed in by saying, “If I had a son, he’d look like Trayvon.”

    Let’s look at some non-news cases. On March 14 in Tulsa, Okla., a white couple suffered a home invasion by Tyrone Woodfork, a 20-year-old black man. Ninety-year-old Bob Strait suffered a broken jaw and broken ribs in the attack. His 85-year-old wife, Nancy, was sexually assaulted and battered to death, ending their 65-year marriage.

    On March 4, two black Kansas City, Mo., youths doused a 13-year-old boy in gasoline and set him on fire, telling him, “You get what you deserve, white boy.” Last summer, Chicago Mayor Rahm Emanuel ordered an emergency shutdown of the beaches in Chicago because mobs of blacks were terrorizing white families.

    Incidentally, there have been hundreds of incidents of mobs of young black men and women terrorizing cities across America for the past few summers. The liberal mainstream press says nothing about this; everyone screams white racist at anyone who even notices the pattern. The very disturbing pattern.


    Several years ago, in Knoxville, Tenn., a young white couple was kidnapped by four blacks.

    The girl was forced to witness her boyfriend’s rape, torture and subsequent murder before she was raped, tortured and murdered. Before disposing of her body, the three men and one woman poured bleach or some other cleaning agent down her throat in an effort to destroy DNA evidence. A jury found the four guilty, and they were sentenced, but because of the judge’s drug use, a retrial is being considered.

    None of those black-on-white atrocities made anywhere near the news that the Trayvon Martin case made, and it’s deliberate. Editors for the Los Angeles Times, The New York Times and the Chicago Tribune admitted to deliberately censoring information about black crime for political reasons, in an effort to “guard against subjecting an entire group of people to suspicion.”

    One doesn’t have to be a liberal, conservative, Democrat or Republican to see the danger posed by America’s race hustlers, who are stacking up piles of combustible racial kindling and ready for a racial arsonist to set it ablaze. Recruiters for white hate groups must love President Obama’s demagoguery in saying that a son of his would look like Trayvon but not saying that Melissa Coon’s 13-year-old son, who was set on fire, could have looked like a son of his. After all, the president is just as much white as he is black.

    Even if the president and his liberal allies in the media and assorted civil rights hustlers don’t care much about blacks murdering whites, what about blacks murdering blacks? During a mid-March weekend in Chicago, 49 people were shot, 10 fatally, including a 6-year-old black girl, making for more than 100 murders this year. Philadelphia isn’t far behind, with murder clipping along at one a day since the beginning of 2012. Have we heard Obama make a statement about this carnage or that most homicide victims are black and that their murderers are black? No, and we won’t, because black-on-black crime, like black-on-white crime, does not fit the liberal narrative of the continuing problem of white racism.


  69. The only point I agree with is the last one. “Many black murderers are not pure black.” That is very true. However, they identified themselves as black. This is different than Zimmerman or whats his name in Tulsa, who never identified themselves as white in the first place. It was the media that labeled them as white.

    The other talking points are weak. Pick one and I’ll rip it apart for you.


  70. Gorbachev is simply factually wrong that studies don’t show a discriminatory anti-black justice system. For just one source, look up the research done by Lawrence Bobo.

    I also don’t agree with him speaking on behalf of all white people. Some of my best friends are white and I happen to be white as well, and most of us are well aware that we are put in a privileged position simply by being white.

    On the whole, mainstream media is run by whites for whites, and that’s pretty obvious whether you examine who owns the corporate media, who manages the corporate media, and who is allowed to speak in the corporate media.


  71. “The very fact that you can stroll into a black blog and not have everyone blast you with the most disgusting racist vile is indication of your awesome white privilege.”

    Guys like Bliff and Brahms want to stroll in, lay down their proclamations on the black community (whether it’s “setting the record straight” or just straight-up chastisement) and stroll out feeling superior about themselves. These are the white guys who are destined to “save” the blog and by extension, the black community.

    We can either ridicule these people or simply shrug off their equivocating tactics as “no big deal”. For example, when a Bliff-type starts using FBI stats to justify his position, simply shrug it off as being “no big deal” and ask him why he’s getting so worked up about it.

    As for Gorbachev, if Daniel Adkins had been a black male, I strongly doubt he’d have any interest in his death. Notice how he hasn’t wondered where the outcry for Rekia Boyd or Kenneth Chamberlain Jr. was. Asking why black Americans haven’t poured out equal grief over Adkins’ passing is designed to shut down the outcry and grief for Trayvon Martin, as though blacks didn’t have the required permission to do so.

    Having tactic permission to do, say or behave a certain way from white Americans tends be an overriding theme.


  72. Matthew wrote re Gorby:

    “… don’t agree with him speaking on behalf of all white people. Some of my best friends are white and I happen to be white as well, and most of us are well aware that we are put in a privileged position simply by being white.

    On the whole, mainstream media is run by whites for whites, and that’s pretty obvious whether you examine who owns the corporate media, who manages the corporate media, and who is allowed to speak in the corporate media.”

    ****************

    Gorbachev

    IS ANOTHER WHITE RACIST TROLL who peddles his craft (BS) under the ambiguous (misleading) umbrella of fairness and objectivity. He is anything but fair.

    Gorby, why are YOU here??
    Stormfront/Chimpout getting a little too boring/slow for you?


  73. @ Gorbachev

    “And people wonder why whites are angry at the mainstream media? Can you say bias?You don’t see it because you’re black. If lots of white people are saying this, consistently, then there — just might – be some truth to it. Exactly the same way that if lots of black people talk about the consuming toll of daily racism on their lives, then it – just might – be true. Neither side can hear or see the other.”

    You come here and speak as if black people actually have a bearing on what is reported in the media. NEWS FLASH: We hate the media too! Before you get all outraged about Trayvon, how many other instances similar to this child have been plastered across the media? How dare you compare the sensationalism of this child’s murder in the media as a bias against white people? In fact it was the media that tried it best to assassinate this kid’s character. Believe me; whites win a lot more than they lose when it comes to the media. When is the last time you heard the media laud feel good or human interest stories that show black people in a positive light? Black men? Not often I bet; so for you to come to this particular website and complain about how whites are portrayed in the media is almost laughable. Then to say racist experiences “might be true” as if we wait around on street corners begging to be disrespected, put down, beaten, shot, profiled, etc. to prove some magical occurrence of racism is testament to your blindness.. And guess what, we can see the f’ed up crap that white people deal with. Believe me, we pay plenty attention, because if sh*t is bad for you, that means it’s quite f’ed up for us. All the crap that you are complaining about we have been dealing with for years.

    “Almost every major study has found the same thing, which is why there are never any recommendations as to how to fix it – because there’s no problem.”

    Once again a why would racist mofo do a study to prove they are racist? Answer that for me. Your pseudoscience; you can take it and put it in a tight dark place below your waist from whence it came. That is your problem. How the hell can you do a study on the experiences of black people when you don’t even believe or talk to actual black people? That is like asking a cat how to be a dog. Do you really think black people read and study the science of white people who claim to be experts on black people and take it as truth? You can’t truly believe that! I’m done. Forget the war in the Middle East; the war on ignorance is a much tougher fight…


  74. ————— sam

    @brothawolf:

    Now heres two examples that speks in volumes about all this:

    Among the biggest criminal organisations in the world are japanese yakuza and the chinese triads. Both have tens of thousands of members in several clans/groups and operate all over the world in all legal and illegal businesses. Both are extremely violent and HC organised crime in every sense of the word. And yet…

    Why we never hear these so-called race realists claim that all japanese or chinese are prone to crime or natural born criminals? Why that is never a subject on any “race debate”? How come these guys exclude every other race from their rantings and ravings?

    Well, we know why.

    Good point Sam!

    THEY SIMPLY DO IT BECAUSE BLACKS ARE EASY PREY.

    They’re so intimidated by our presence because of their low self-esteem and most of them are despicable and worthless; and their primary aim is to disintegrate and dissever us.
    That’s why we must always stick together! I hate it, when blacks split up .
    People who join together as a group are much harder to defeat than they would be separately!

    They refuse to accept or even acknowledge the idea (fact) of being wrong, having a defect, being considered ugly, unintelligent, criminal, etc. It’s their way of dodging emotional disorders such as:
    Anxiety, Dissociative Disorder, Impulse-Control,Bipolar disorder , etc And above all, depression which can even lead to suicide.
    They usually utilise those negativity they attribute to blacks, as a whole, like saying (believing) that; blacks have more criminal tendencies, whites are superior, all whites are intelligent, classy, well-mannered, etc, etc and all blacks are so and so…..
    For whites, all of those beliefs are like medicines or therapies that cure or relieve them (in that part of their mind where psychic activity takes place).
    It is usually based in self-survival, and that’s why they reject any imperfection about themselves and attribute it to other races, especially black.
    And that’s why they (most of them) easily fall into depression, detest and feel unwarranted hatred, jealousy for any black they come across in life who contradicts their delusive beliefs.


  75. on Fri 20 Apr 2012 at 11:28:21 mashiara4life

    Okay, I got a new favorite poster “CLEONETTE”—YOU GO!!!

    *back to lurking* :-)


  76. “Why we never hear these so-called race realists claim that all japanese or chinese are prone to crime or natural born criminals? Why that is never a subject on any “race debate”? How come these guys exclude every other race from their rantings and ravings?

    Well, we know why.”

    @sam

    Actually, It’s mainly do to them mostly being active in secrecy (triad) or in the case of the Yazuka being both good and bad at the same time (different branches have different ethics but one moral standard, never harm innocent citizens) you must not have heard that when Japan was struck by that earthquake and tsunami that some branches of the Yakuza actually provided shelter for foreigners(even though they dislike foreigners)? I doubt you’d ever see any mainly “black” criminal gangs doing that anywhere.

    Plus, you must factor in the fact most times anyone argues about black criminals it isn’t gang-based anyway, just individual blacks causing problems for everyone.

    But I digress, I really couldn’t care about the subject anyhow.


  77. @ Cleonette

    Your posts are magnificent!!!

    @ everyone

    For a group of people who claim they are superior, why are their reading comprehension skills so poor? I’ve never seen such a group of people so blinded and so willfully ignorant.
    To all the white commenters: You’re missing the crux of this debate, I suspect on purpose. To those who mentioned the Japanese/Chinese gangs:

    So as long as you don’t HEAR about crime in a community/race of people, it must not exist? Do I have that correct?????

    Then why in bloody hell are you so quick to believe the media on black crime? Are you so daft? The media reports what it wants you to believe and you buy into it, hook, line and sinker.

    You believe the media for one simple reason:
    You are a racist and need supporting evidence.


  78. @ Bell

    Funny that you should mention anxiety, depression, suicide in white America. You’d think with all that money and power, you’d be happy and relaxed, no?

    I learned with more control comes a need for…more control.
    Always worrying that someone is gaining on you will cause you many sleepless nights.


  79. “To all the white commenters: You’re missing the crux of this debate, I suspect on purpose. To those who mentioned the Japanese/Chinese gangs:

    So as long as you don’t HEAR about crime in a community/race of people, it must not exist? Do I have that correct?????

    Then why in bloody hell are you so quick to believe the media on black crime? Are you so daft? The media reports what it wants you to believe and you buy into it, hook, line and sinker.

    You believe the media for one simple reason:
    You are a racist and need supporting evidence.”

    First off I do not see the Yakuza, or the Triads here in NA causing massive gang-wars, you’d think someone anywhere would have acknowledged something, they havn’t .. hence they are not bothersome to us. They are not drive-by shooting random people on the streets daily as some gangs are.

    “So as long as you don’t HEAR about crime in a community/race of people, it must not exist? Do I have that correct?????”

    No, you just assumed that. We know crime happens in communities and by people of a magnatude of races, so I don’t know what you’re proving here.

    “You believe the media for one simple reason:
    You are a racist and need supporting evidence.””

    Nothing but typical dribble from you, anything to validate your own prejudice against us.

    But I guess you are as racist as we are anyway, I mean how did you ever hear about the whole situation about T.Martin if it wasn’t for the media itself?

    Ahh, I see those double standards are in work for your viewpoint.


  80. Just want to say, great points by the people who know and ackowledge the racism against black Americans, and black people all over the world who face racism.

    Its really important to hear the great arguments by the various people as they stand up to the same old tired cliches and rationalisations. Its an education for all of us as the wonderful individual knowledge and experiance is shared to fortify a firm responce to what we all know is all too prevailing in this world.


  81. @ Bliff

    If you want to talk at length about black intelligence do it on the Open Thread or here:

    https://abagond.wordpress.com/2008/07/09/black-iq/


  82. @Sepultura13

    In Internet slang, a troll is someone who posts inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum, chat room, or blog, with the primary intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion

    And or

    an internet user who sends inflammatory or provocative messages designed to elicit negative responses or start a flame-war. (As a fisherman trolls for an unsuspecting fish.) : Don’t answer those silly messages. Some troll is just looking for an argument.

    Simply put you post had nothing what so ever to do with the topic besides categorizing people who believes that they have legitimate points, weather you want to believe or not. as Trolls, too incite a response that not ontopic.. you sir… have not left anything worth reading about.. thank you.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_(Internet)
    http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/troll


  83. @ Yawn said “First off I do not see the Yakuza, or the Triads here in NA causing massive gang-wars, you’d think someone anywhere would have acknowledged something, they havn’t .. hence they are not bothersome to us. They are not drive-by shooting random people on the streets daily as some gangs are.”

    Yawn, once again you’ve proven my many valid points about white intentional blindness. Gangs affect everyone. The most dangerous gangs/crime bosses are the ones you don’t necessarily see. Need I bring up Wall Street? And yes, dear Yawn, they ARE quite bothersome to the thousands if not millions of people terrorized by them. Drive-by shootings kill many innocent people. No excuses. But white collar crime, (which is pure nonsense. Crime is crime), affects hundreds of millions on a much grander scale.

    White americans don’t seem to mind other whites being killed off, sold, cheated, vexed, thrown out of their homes, violated, taken and lied to…as long as the perpetrator is another white man.

    When blacks do it, it’s an abomination.
    Stew on that!


  84. @ Yawn

    I don’t need validation for my prejudices against white America.
    Your whiteness is validation enough.


  85. @ Gorbachev

    “a new ABC poll finds that 84% of blacks feel that the justice system—from the police to the courtroom to the penitentiary—treats them inequitably.

    Like all things writtne on this csubject that are done with any attempt at accuracy or fairness, once again – no anti-black bias is found in the court system. Almost every major study has found the same thing, which is why there are never any recommendations as to how to fix it – because there’s no problem.”

    You should read what Hume wrote about miracles.

    You are asking us to believe that:

    1. Over 30 million blacks are imagining things.

    2. That a court system with a long racist past and which has made it next to impossible to prove in court that it is in fact racist, making it unaccountable, has magically cured itself of racism. Unlike any other white-run institution.

    The courts and police were barely touched by the civil rights reforms of the 1950s and 1960s. They remain the most racist institutions in American society.

    Far more probable:

    1. Said studies were carried out by those who either did not want to find racism or did not know what they were looking for. Most white people are blind to racism because it does not affect them directly and, at the same time, try to maintain this image of not being racist. So, for example, most whites saw nothing racist in in the government’s handling of Katrina.

    2. This is yet another one of your half-truths.


  86. By the way, this post was not about crime. It was about the illogical and racist way some white people talk about slavery and Trayvon.

    Thank you to all white commenters who said these arguments were laughable and weak. It shows me that white people are fully capable of logical thought when they want to be. Their reading skills, though, are still in grave doubt.


  87. Abagond

    Your arguments are valid, as always.
    Racists come here because they can’t tear themselves from us. Our truth is like that splinter in their brain driving them mad, as Larry Fishburne said. They know they lie, but are unable to help and stop themselves.


  88. @ truthbetold

    “You’d think with all that money and power, you’d be happy and relaxed, no?
    “I learned with more control comes a need for…more control.

    I call it GREED!
    Unfortunately it is one of our biggest social problems and it is not just a white issue, but it applies to every race, gender and people from all walks of life.

    “Always worrying that someone is gaining on you will cause you many sleepless nights”.

    Of course yes. I agree with you! Who, on earth wouldn’t have sleepless nights for that?

    I also metioned:
    Anxiety because it makes you feel like danger and catastrophe are around every corner, you’re plagued by fears that you know are irrational, but can’t shake.,It affects our whole being, you’re always feeling apprehensive and worried (possibly without knowing why It affects how we feel), it also affect how we behave.

    Ok, that being said. When a white person was and is still constantly being instilled and impregnated consciously and unconsciously ( unconsciously; uummmmmm, perhaps I’m being a little bit childlike and gullible here!) every day, that every single Black is a menace.
    That person become vulnerable to ANXIETY whenever he/she comes in contact with one (Black person).

    Am not trying to say that Blacks don’t suffer Anxiety as well.

    And i also added:
    Depression WHICH CAN EVEN lead to suicide.

    Situations like: Emotional upset, poverty, terrible living conditions, abuse and neglect, poor health, prolonged life circumstances of extreme stress, , ,, especially with no apparent hope of change or improvement, feelings of hopelessness and frustration (things that most whites attribute to Black people alone; because you often hear them say blacks are poor, they have feelings of hopelessness and frustration etc)
    It is a known fact that whites are bestowed with privilege, yes but they forget that not all whites are rich; yes, i know there is a large difference compared to rich blacks but they also forget that all what i just listed above apply to them as well.

    All these can cause Anxiety and accumulating lots and lots of Anxiety lead to depression which can even lead to Suicide because they believe they can no longer fight it. Because they feel that they can relieve their ANXIETY by commiting suicide, although not always but often; luckily.
    I said luckily because I think it’s a tremendous thing to do regardless of your race, age, religion, sex, etc!

    As we all know, whites are prone to suicide.

    Sorry to say this, because it is a very delicate and serious issue but an article i recently read stated that white people commit the most suicide compared to non whites.

    In conclusion, I think life could get a little bit easier and better if we all, stop fearing people that are different from us, and start learning to know them more better. And above all, if we stop the antagonism and hostility toward each other .


  89. @ Cleonette:

    Excellent comments. Thank you.


  90. JT
    “Another reason to dismiss your claims about the superiority of white intelligence:”

    I don’t think I’d dismiss anything due to that study. However, I do like seeing studies like that which show the black-white IQ gap may not be as large as some say – it gives me hope; thanks for linking it.

    from the article
    “According to the researchers, that suggests that native intelligence does still play an important role in both IQ scores and academic achievement.”


  91. Cleonette

    That’s a pretty good example of the rural white racism I was talking about. Shall I give example of the racism I’ve faced by blacks (I’ve noticed none of your examples are even close to violent – mine are closer)? You can either suck it up or move – or complain, up to you.

    If you’re waiting for 100% of white people to become non-racist before you accept whites in general – keep waiting.


  92. sam

    “Why we never hear these so-called race realists claim that all japanese or chinese are prone to crime or natural born criminals? Why that is never a subject on any “race debate”? How come these guys exclude every other race from their rantings and ravings?”

    Because statistics (as well as personal experience) shows that Asians are not a violent group – at least in America.


  93. @ Cleonette

    Perhaps Brahms never heard of the KKK.


  94. Gorbachev

    Your posts are well balanced and I may be guilty of this one-sided thought. However, there is one looming difference between black and white real or perceived grievances. Assuming white racism is true and assuming black crime etc. is true – violence against another race is much worse than non-violent prejudice. Even if 100% of whites considered blacks no better than animals, blacks still do not have the moral authority to attack these whites. They have complete license to do the same to whites but no more.

    Thought – a black faces no barriers to entry into college then medical school, faces no barriers to opening his own clinic, and faces no barriers in attracting black patients (in fact he will be swamped) – but it doesn’t happen much – why?
    Because education is considered white – just as naming your kid Tim is considered white – there is engrained black thinking that makes doing things as whites do only sells one’s self out (does not keep it real); blacks would rather keep it real then succeed.


  95. Cleonette lurks for a while and then drops a couple of beauties. :-)

    Wonder how many of these lurkers are out there!

    Anyhow, sometimes more important things take your attention, like the 40 storey hotel across the street from me engulfed in flames at the moment, with burning objects raining from the upper floors and spewing out cinders. Can’t sleep wondering if my building is going to catch on fire. :-o


  96. @Cleonette Fri 20 Apr 2012 at 00:15:21
    I have had dirty looks from old white people on a daily basis.

    Dirty looks you say? If that’s a big complaint of yours, then you lead a pretty charmed life.

    I was called a welfare queen by three white guys at the grocery store; three guys that I actually attend college with but they were so racist they didn’t even realize I sit in front of them in class.

    Now answer me honestly, Cleonette. How many times were you in a similar situation with white guys, and they didn’t call you names? I’ll bet those situations way outnumber the bad situations. What we have here is selective memory. You only list the bad situations.

    I overheard a nice white lady tell her friend that she thinks black people hair look like carpet.

    That’s her opinion. How is criticizing your hair racist? I’ll bet you and your black girl friends criticize each other’s hair all the time.

    I have had someone hold the door open for a white couple I was walking behind but closed the door on my face at a local restaurant.

    And how many times did this happen and how many times did it not happen. I’ll bet the times it did not happen outnumber by far the times it did happen. More selective memory. I have seen many situation where whites hold the door for blacks, and vice versa. I have done it myself many times. I rarely, if ever, see any one slam the door in someone’s face over race.

    At an intern interview I was told that I could not work at the front desk because the nice white people would not take kindly to my afro.

    Prehaps you need to trim your afro back. Don’t complain; work within the system. Everybody who works in an office has dress and grooming codes to contend with.

    I was babysitting my neighbors daughter and took her to the park. A policeman came up to me and called her parents on his cell phone to make sure I hadn’t kidnapped her (she fell down while skating and skinned her knee).

    Apparently, the officer noticed the child had fallen. He may have just been calling the parents out of concern. How do you know he suspected you may have kidnapped the child? Was he black or white? Would your opinion of him changed if he was black? Be honest.

    We have two schools in the same country, both public but one in a white neighborhood and the other in the black neighborhood. Both schools are clean, but one gets new equipment and books every 5 years and the other gets the old equipment taken from the other school. Which is which?

    Don’t know what to say here. If you’re truly being treated unfairly, look into it.

    Just hush because we all know you don’t give a crap about black people or their problem except where it interrupts your lily white world.

    Since the 1960s blacks have received massive amounts of public money and they have Black Privilege as official victims – anti-discrimination laws, affirm action, set-asides, white people being cowed into not criticizing blacks publicly, etc

    You don’t even know you are white until you are in a room full of black people.

    Yes, we are the least racist people around. We rarely think about race. But then along comes a black and we are forced to start confronting the whole race thing.

    The very fact that you can stroll into a black blog and not have everyone blast you with the most disgusting racist vile is indication of your awesome white privilege.

    Ahhhh…you should do a search on Bliff on this blog and see how the Abagondites “blast you with the most disgusting racist vile”.

    If you are so concerned about black people fixing the problems in their community, lead by example dude. Go over to stormfront and tell them to fix their crap.

    Just like Abagond has an outrageous black blog, stormfront may have an outrageous white blog. I’ve only been there once, so I’m not really familiar with it. Who are you to tell other bloggers how to run their blog? If you don’t like the blog, stay away from it. Just because you don’t agree, it doesn’t mean they’re wrong.

    What do you think would happen if I went in there spewing the crap you spew in here? I wouldn’t get such a respectable reception now would I?

    About the same thing that happens to me on this blog. Total Disrespect.

    And you know what else, I wouldn’t mind going “back to Africa” except I would still have to come into more human beings just like you so I might as well stay here and stick it out.
    That’s a lie. You love here in America. Us whites treat you blacks too well. In Africa, you’d just be another black.

    As I hear it, Africa wasn’t all that bad until white people showed up.

    Not all bad if you don’t care about the comforts of modern civilization. Without whites, blacks would still be in grass huts.

    Let’s be honest for a minute, it all boils down to the fact that you don’t want to lose your privilege of being white.

    There is no such thing as white privilege. Blacks just don’t too as well in this country as whites, and haven’t earned the respect of others. It’s not that whites are held up so high, it’s just that blacks have worked themselves down lower.

    That is the scariest thing in the world for you to be the minority in this country.

    Yeah, it is discomforting to now that what we build America to be, could fall apart in the future. It’s sad, rather than scary, because I won’t be here then.

    I bet you see any advance in the black community as a loss for the white community.

    Nope, you just don’t understand how economics works. An advancing black community would mean blacks would start to pay their way for once in taxes, and public expenses for blacks may decrease.


  97. @ Bliff “There is no such thing as white privilege. Blacks just don’t too as well in this country as whites, and haven’t earned the respect of others. It’s not that whites are held up so high, it’s just that blacks have worked themselves down lower.”

    If your white then it will be hard to see your privilege. A child who grows up without a father will see a child who did as privileged. Having a father isn’t necessarily a privilege, but if you didn’t have one you will view the kid with a father as privileged. The kid with the father wont understand, to him having a father is normal. Having a country that was created by your race with your best interest at hand shouldn’t be a privilege, but it is. Can you explain how a people can work themselves down lower?

    “Nope, you just don’t understand how economics works. An advancing black community would mean blacks would start to pay their way for once in taxes, and public expenses for blacks may decrease.”

    Thats not what the government(elite whites) believe. Thats why men like Marcus Garvey had to go. The Black Panthers had their own welfare programs before the F.B.I destroyed them(they weren’t destroyed because they were communists, thats an excuse, Garvey wasn’t a communist but he had to go) After they destroyed the breakfast programs, the federal government replaced them. This made black people dependent on the system instead of themselves. Every successful independent black movement has been destroyed by whites. By elite whites(government), and average whites, like what happened in Tulsa Oklahoma(black wall street).

    The only logical explanation is that whites fear black independence and self sufficiency. What will happen if blacks are left alone to build up their race and gain real wealth? Will they conspire to to vengeance against whites? The Planet of The Apes come to mind. Its a real fear in white people. If not in the average white person, definitely in the white elite. People in power spend their time thinking about how they can stay in power.


  98. [...] What if blacks talked about black-on-white murder the way whites talked about slavery or Trayvon? [...]


  99. To me this issue reminds me when Ann Coulter told Donnie Duestch that “The Jews needed to be “perfected” when discussing Evangelical Christianity. Conservative/Race Realist Whites will always bring up a white eqivualent to Trayvon Martin or “blacks must “improve” ourselves ” before we can have a dialouge about the racist polices. Racist Whites on this board will never talk about white crime because they think that Whites are “humane”, “created civilizations” and most importantly “they are individuals” so when they get into trouble it does not affect 90 million of European descent.

    If you tell White Conservative/Race Realists “they must improve themselves to gain the trust of African- Americans for 392 years of defacto race polices you are a ‘BLACK RACIST’, divisive or all sorts of excuses like “I didn’t enslave your ancestors” or any sort of White victimhood rhetoric. My friends used to say that White People in this country didn’t know any better about their privilege and I always disagreed and always asserted that whites always knew about their racial privilege and they were “playing possum’ because they believe in their “racial innocence” while we as African- Americans always have to prove we are worthy of even being “Americans”.

    And that war will never end between Blacks and Whites, Trayvon Martin just illustrates that divide


  100. @ Newsoul

    Excellent and on point!!


  101. @ Brahms

    “That’s a pretty good example of the rural white racism I was talking about. Shall I give example of the racism I’ve faced by blacks (I’ve noticed none of your examples are even close to violent – mine are closer)? You can either suck it up or move – or complain, up to you. If you’re waiting for 100% of white people to become non-racist before you accept whites in general – keep waiting.”

    You are right Brahms thoses are good examples but not anywhere near everything I have experienced. And you are right, I did not have a lot of violent encounters because I have never been placed in a situation where I would be most like to face one. In rural areas, we are not out late and night and women are less likely to experience racial violence anyway. Then again, it could be the fact that I had two college educated parents who owned their own home is a neighborhood surrounded by black people that all acted as mentors, parents, and protectors. You know, the black middle class; we do exist. However, you would rather believe that all black people are criminal, non-educated thugs so stories like mine go against everything you were taught and conditioned to believe. But I refuse to get into a tit for tat battle with you about “MY RACIST IS BIGGER THAN YOUR RACIST!” It is stupid and infantile and much expected by someone of your mental caliber. And who said anything about me not accepting whites? I have no problem with whites except the ones that personally affect me in a negative way. The notion that whites will ever be non-racist has never crossed my mind because people like you remind me on a daily basis.

    Also, telling me to suck it up and move is evidence of your kind to blame the victim as if I am the problem and not the racist. Keep talking. Your racism is showing.


  102. @ Cleonette:

    You are SO good at whooping racist backsides! Keep it up! :D


  103. “Dirty looks you say? If that’s a big complaint of yours, then you lead a pretty charmed life.”

    No, that is not my biggest complaint, but the fact that you think a person, any person, should be “charmed” to get dirty looks from people they don’t know is insane. Maybe in “white world” this is normal and ok.

    “Now answer me honestly, Cleonette.How many times were you in a similar situation with white guys, and they didn’t call you names? I’ll bet those situations way outnumber the bad situations. What we have here is selective memory. You only list the bad situations.”

    I can say the same thing for you, buddy. I bet less black man have beat your ass than those who have beat it. And yes I am listing the bad situations. That is what you asked for remember? Example of racism from a rural black person? Now that is selective memory, my friend.

    “That’s her opinion. How is criticizing your hair racist? I’ll bet you and your black girl friends criticize each other’s hair all the time.”

    Actually all of my friends give each other hair advice but you can hardly call what this woman did friendly beauty advice from a friend. I understand that trivializing my experience is beneficial to your derailing tactics but you can come better than that.

    “And how many times did this happen and how many times did it not happen. I’ll bet the times it did not happen outnumber by far the times it did happen. More selective memory. I have seen many situation where whites hold the door for blacks, and vice versa. I have done it myself many times. I rarely, if ever, see any one slam the door in someone’s face over race.”

    How many times did you not get your ass beat by a black person? I’ll bet the times it did not happen outnumber by far the times it did happen. More selective memory. I have seen many situations where black men did not beat white men ass and vice versa. I have rarely, if ever, see a black man beat a white man ass. I love how you are bringing Abagond’s post to life! I just love it!

    “Prehaps you need to trim your afro back. Don’t complain; work within the system. Everybody who works in an office has dress and grooming codes to contend with.”

    First of all, my hair is always neat and clean. And I am sorry that the hair that grows out of my scalp from birth does not fit into your “system”. For you to assert that the natural state of my hair does not fit “a grooming code” says a lot about your character, sir. Keep digging that hole.

    “Apparently, the officer noticed the child had fallen. He may have just been calling the parents out of concern. How do you know he suspected you may have kidnapped the child? Was he black or white? Would your opinion of him changed if he was black? Be honest.”

    A child falling while skating is an automatic suspicion that the child has been kidnapped? Yes he was white. And I know he suspected the child was kidnapped because he called the parents on his personal cell phone right in front of me. That indicated he knew the child and the parents personally. He was white (duh). And if he had been black he wouldn’t have thought twice to see a black woman babysitting a white child because it is very common where I live. He asked for my name and asked the parents was I supposed to be keeping her as if me responding to a hurt child is somehow a danger even if I wasn’t responsible for her. I love how you are so supportive of your fellow racist. At least you are loyal.

    “Since the 1960s blacks have received massive amounts of public money and they have Black Privilege as official victims – anti-discrimination laws, affirm action, set-asides, white people being cowed into not criticizing blacks publicly, etc”

    There are no laws against you being a racist asshole right now however. I wasn’t born in the 1960 so miss me with that. Besides all the magical black people who are not on welfare realize that it was just a way for liberal whites to say “Hey! Look what we are doing for the helpless black people!” It’s funny that you say affirmative action as if black people study hard, go to college, and go to their first interview so they can get some of that good ole affirmative action. Funny how I never see any outrage on white women about affirmative action when they are included as benefactors too if any. In fact, there are more liable to benefit from it than a black person because white women make up a larger percentage of America than the entire black population. Funny huh? Black privilege is laughable. If your want to start a new white movement so that racist like you can be free to be as racist as possible without consequences, you are welcome to it. However, I advise you to stick with the nearly anonymous act of institutional racism. That is working wonders for your cause.

    “Yes, we are the least racist people around. We rarely think about race. But then along comes a black and we are forced to start confronting the whole race thing.”

    You just proved my point. You want to other us and remind us that we are black and lowly with your white privilege. We turn on the TV, walk out of the door, go shopping, go on the Internet, etc. and are constantly reminded of our blackness while you get the benefit of just being a person, an individual, an AMERICAN. When I hear the term “all-American family” who the hell comes to mind? Yeah, that’s what I thought. Your I-don’t-give-a-fuck attitude is even a privilege sir. But you can’t see it because you have those white glasses on.

    “Ahhhh…you should do a search on Bliff on this blog and see how the Abagondites “blast you with the most disgusting racist vile”. Just like Abagond has an outrageous black blog, stormfront may have an outrageous white blog. I’ve only been there once, so I’m not really familiar with it. Who are you to tell other bloggers how to run their blog? If you don’t like the blog, stay away from it. Just because you don’t agree, it doesn’t mean they’re wrong.”

    You are funny. You know damn well all I have to do is go on that blog and say “I am a black woman” and all racist hell will break loose. People don’t like you on this blog because of how you present yourself. It has nothing to do with you being white. And if you don’t like Abagond’s blog and his “Abagondites” why the hell do you keep coming back. Are you a sadist? No, you’re just racist. Next!

    “That’s a lie. You love here in America. Us whites treat you blacks too well. In Africa, you’d just be another black.”

    Just being another black sounds damn good to me. And yes sir, I just love having all you wonderful white people treat me like you do. Just wow. lol

    “Not all bad if you don’t care about the comforts of modern civilization. Without whites, blacks would still be in grass huts.”

    Grass huts are very comfortable I hear. It fit with the environment and the culture. Home is home no matter what it is made from. We don’t need a white savior, you just want to be a white savior. A HUGE difference my dear.

    “There is no such thing as white privilege. Blacks just don’t too as well in this country as whites, and haven’t earned the respect of others. It’s not that whites are held up so high, it’s just that blacks have worked themselves down lower.”

    White privilege allowed you to actually believe that all that shit you just said. I’m tired of you. Your ignorance is unlimited. Like I said before, the war on ignorance is much harder to fight than any physical war and you are willfully ignorant. You just proved why you can’t get any respect here. You don’t deserve it. You talk about the America that you built, well that is laughable. You are a waste of DNA.


  104. Daaamn! All hail Cleonette! *bows down*


  105. *BOOM!!!*
    And Cleonette delivers another head shot!


  106. What I find interesting is that black people are expected to view all white people as:

    1. Experts on black society, and see all white people as authority figures who have the “credentials” to dismiss and judge an entire race.
    2. “Scorekeepers” who can recall any black crime accurately and are allowed to pull up incidents from many years ago at whim, yet aren’t expected to show actual proof or real credentials.
    3. Arbitrators who can speak in regards to all black people everywhere, and are allowed to dismiss facts at their discretion.
    4. Parental figures who are prepared to discipline and “correct” all black people at any moment.
    5. someone to envy.
    6. Someone who can approve or deny a “white pass” to their minorities of choice, and therefore must always be placated.

    However, black people are supposed to be:

    1. Treated as children who have to be punished and educated at all times, who aren’t allowed to have any attention or focus unless it is negative.
    2. Forget all slights against them, no matter how vast or recent they are, even if it still directly affects them
    3. Be ready and wiling to kow tow to any white person who’s prepared to tell them what is wrong with them at all times, no matter how bad the logic or false the information.
    4. Never allowed to have a “bad day” or show any outward signs of grief or anger without being seen as an example of the “rule” and not the exception.
    5. Content and willing to accept being yelled at, harassed, insulted, having their IQ insulted, degraded and blamed, and they are never allowed to get belligerent or offended.
    6. Always willing to extend the olive branch so that white people do not have to acknowledged that they did anything wrong in the first place.


  107. Daaamn! All hail Cleonette! *bows down*

    I second that motion. Brillant post Cleonette. Brillant :).


  108. @ Cleonette,

    Wow. Amazing responses. Too bad certain people think being white and a racist protects them from having to exercise any reading comprehension or common sense.


  109. @ leigh204

    I don’t think I deserve bows. I’m just fed up. I don’t lump white people in one big glob because comparing him to the people in my life who happen to share a similar skin tone to him is an insult. He is an isolated idiot. There are many isolated idiots in all skin tones and they make me just as irritated.

    He is a walking contradiction. He comes in here with his racist assumptions that black people are ignorant yet he gives us concrete evidence of his ignorance daily. One minute he says racism doesn’t exit, then he turns right back around and say I can’t expect white people not to be racist. Does HE even believe what he is saying?

    This guy is a joke. I have met some intelligent racist in my lifetime but he is not one of them. I say intelligent because they have taken on racist literature, science, and other varying medias to support their racist views and they study and study well. EDUCATED FOOLS. In my research class, my teacher actually allowed my classmate to turn in a research paper where she actually attempted to prove interracial relationships was a sin! Really? This heffa actually cited the Bible as one of her “sources”. I also has a professor, in which I was the only black person in her class, ask me for the black perspective on something. I told her I could only give her my opinion because there is no one person who can give a black perspective on anything as if we have access to some collective, black, Akashic Records-type mind that we could tap into when we needed to think. The only A I made in her class was when I put my social security number instead of my name on my research. Her face crumpled like a paper bag when she found out it was me. Her displeasure was so obvious that everyone in the room got uncomfortable. So on that note, Brahms is like arguing with a preschooler compared to some of the other stuff.

    I see there is no topic left untouched: religion, science, government, courts, law enforcement, economics, education, media, politics, housing, healthcare, arts, and literature have been used to work against black people. Many of us rise above all this to succeed in life, but yet we still are the marginalized stain on America’s white table cloth. To speak on these things, we are accused of whining and even accused of being racist ourselves.

    That’s one of the main reason why I absolute respect and adore black men! I once read that if white America was subjected to the same kind of prejudices, racism, and bigotry that black men are subjected to, their crime rate would triple. I can’t remember where I read it but I certainly agree.


  110. Dr. Joy Degruy, author of “Post Traumatic Slave Syndrome” was interviewed by Michael Baisden about Trayvon’s murder. She dropped a lot of gems, and most of them reflect the mindset of people Doug, Brahms, Bliff, and the like. She makes important points connecting what was done in history to today. Yes, history plays a huge role in what’s happening today especially with the Trayvon case.

    (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4S0iFEBJZ1A)

    This was made before Zimmerman’s arrest i think.


  111. @ Ace and Cleonette

    Great points. Well spoken.


  112. @ Brothawolf

    Just listened to her agrument and she is spot on!
    If this slides and Zimmerman gets away, not only will unimaginable horrors begin but it WILL ultimately transend to the white community . And then and only then will America wake up.


  113. Oh my god!! Cleonette, you are a goddess!!! You deserve the entire internet. ,<3 <3 <3


  114. Great heavy lifting by the “Abagondites” !!


  115. @ Ace

    The list you made of what you find interesting about black people being expected to view all white people, as so and so really repleted me with sublime emotion! That was great!!!

    ________Cleonette

    @ leigh204

    “This guy is a joke. I have met some intelligent racist in my lifetime but he is not one of them. I say intelligent because they have taken on racist literature, science, and other varying medias to support their racist views and they study and study well. EDUCATED FOOLS. In my research class, my teacher actually allowed my classmate to turn in a research paper where she actually attempted to prove interracial relationships was a sin! Really? This heffa actually cited the Bible as one of her “sources”. I also has a professor, in which I was the only black person in her class, ask me for the black perspective on something. I told her I could only give her my opinion because there is no one person who can give a black perspective on anything as if we have access to some collective, black, Akashic Records-type mind that we could tap into when we needed to think. The only A I made in her class was when I put my social security number instead of my name on my research. Her face crumpled like a paper bag when she found out it was me. Her displeasure was so obvious that everyone in the room got uncomfortable. So on that note, Brahms is like arguing with a preschooler compared to some of the other stuff”

    That’s what they’re being taught because it’s convenient and well-disposed to their interests and above all, it suits their racist view of the world.

    I really like what you told that unknowledgeable and nescient teacher of yours; that’s what they believe: “that there is ONE PERSON who can give a black perspective on anything as if we have access to some collective, black, Akashic Records-type mind that we could tap into when we needed to think”.

    Excellent!

    For them, they are always individuals ESPECIALLY when it comes to awkward, and sticky facet. What a pity for them!

    @ brahms

    “Clarification: it is black parents who instill racism in their children while white parents have been programmed to teach egalitarian principles”

    Are you REALLY, REALLY sure about that?
    The things i see every single day prove you wrong, they prove that other than being a prevaricator, you’r also a Great storyteller!
    Maybe you meant;
    We: white parents and children have been PROGRAMMED right from their childhood to always be in competition for “who is the most racist!
    Sometimes i have that feeling.


  116. @ brahms

    “Clarification: it is black parents who instill racism in their children while white parents have been programmed to teach egalitarian principles”

    Are you REALLY, REALLY sure about that?
    The things i see every single day prove you wrong, they prove that other than being a prevaricator, you’r also a Great storyteller!
    Maybe you meant;
    We: white parents and children have been PROGRAMMED right from our childhood to always be in competition for “who is the most racist!
    Sometimes i have that feeling.


  117. @truthbebold

    “If this slides and Zimmerman gets away, not only will unimaginable horrors begin but it WILL ultimately transend to the white community . And then and only then will America wake up.”

    Only if they don’t respond with a smug resignation that they got away with it again, Like Gil Scott- Heron said in B- Movie there is “always someone in America racing to save the day”, in the 60′s it was Dr. King and their Preachers and since then his disciples whether you agree with their methods have always saved America from herself. White Conservatives /Race Realists can deal with riots or black bitterness or even the so-called ‘New Black Panthers” yapping their flap, but Sept 11 and to a lesser degree the Maryland sprees killing have changed that game.

    If Zimmerman gets off, it will show the stark reality and the ‘Dred Scott” law that “Black Men have no rights that White Americans are bound to respect and it will be codified into a Jury verdict. Rodney King was an ex-con so his innocence was always going to be in doubt even by African- Americans. Trayvon Martin was a young boy only going to get some tea and skittles and was killed by being ‘suspect’ a “not guilty verdict will be victory of race and crime by conservatives/ race realists who feel that these laws are needed because stats show that ‘Black Men are suspect in every way of life.

    I do not think there will be riots, or any Reginald Denny beatings,(that era has come to to an end) I think African- Americans have come to the realization that these acts only harden the conservatives /racial realists resolve to pass even harsher penalties and grab at political power. What will happen is once law- abiding.apolitical black people all over the country will get involved and form Armed Militias and racial guerrilla reprisals against those guilty of creating this environment will ensue, That’s the only logical conclusion I can come up with..

    Innocent Blood always creates these sorts of actions, just check around the world, America has lucky and very fortunate, but those days are coming to an end.


  118. Cleonette

    “However, you would rather believe that all black people are criminal, non-educated thugs so stories like mine go against everything you were taught and conditioned to believe.”

    Quit with the strawman tactics – I never said all blacks are criminals or thugs; I’ve said repeatedly that there is subpopulation who are this way. For the record – the majority of blacks are not criminals or thugs. Yet, 52% of ALL murders are commited by blacks; I am not going to let anyone tell me that this subpopulation of blacks are not a problem for my society. You would counter that its white racism that is the problem- great, but read that stat again.

    What you will never admit is that black on white racism is a much bigger problem. We’ll forever disagree – but if you like, please cite examples of gangs of whites targetting innocent blacks and hurting, raping, killling, and humiliating them. Of course, if you think this passive racism of rudeness is equivalent; continue in your delusions. Caveat – the examples need to be contemporary, no mentions of lynchings please – let’s live in the present.


  119. Bell

    “Are you REALLY, REALLY sure about that?”

    Yes. Things are different in white rural areas. I am also sure that in black homes, pointing out the racism of white society is standard. Any blacks here want to tell me how you were taught that whites are good and just like you; how society is not racist, etc.?


  120. @ Brahms,

    I highly doubt that black parents instill racism in their children, as we’ve seen recently (and are constantly reminded), it’s not wise to step up to the wrong “white person”, and people of color honestly do have to remember that in the end, they are not white and will not be treated as such. It’s not racist to acknowledge that.

    I mean yes, if your parents were alive during the time when they:

    1. Couldn’t vote,
    2. Could be blown up by KKK, firebombed, or dragged out of your car and shot and yet know those killers would never serve a day in jail.
    3. Could be sent to war to kill other brown people who’ve never done a thing to them and never called them a slur, and be labeled a coward for not seeing the fairness in that.
    4. Could be forced to live in perpetual squalor because you had to choose between prosperity and a lynching.
    5. Could read the constitution and the bill of rights and know this “sacred” document would never truly be for them.

    Sure if your parents had to be the ones who:

    1. Had to keep their head down
    2. Had to be sure to never look at a white woman in the eye unless your serving her,
    3. Had to be willing to move to the other street if a white person wanted the side walk.
    4. Had their grandfather’s called “boy” by men half their age,
    5, Had to see white people walking around pretending that stuff wasn’t happening because it isn’t “convenient”.
    6. Knew that their young age did not shield them from any of this.

    Then hell yes they’d have the right to be all manner of frustrated, seeing that a lot of that did not change between then and now. And if those same black parents had to be reminded every day that their children weren’t’ safe because in the end of the day, white people, who still control everything important, are the ones allowed to play judge, jury, and executioner just like in those “old days”, after all of that effort, after all of that outreach and hundreds of years of proving your worth a damn…then damn right, if anything black parents have earned the right to instill some truth into their kids, and you are not entitled to have it spare your feelings. White people have had their hands held long enough, and frankly I don’t blame black parents if they don’ feel like they should cater their experience around the feelings of people who have systematically shown they could care less how black people feel.

    You know what? If you don’t want black parents to tell their kids about your racism, DON’T BE A RACIST. You guys are so quick to whine about black people saying “racist” things, like you’re somehow proposing some “peaceful” solution of compromise and equality. Then you want to swell up and gloat over black youth who get hurt from expecting people to not be racist and to see them as people (like young people who think them being black won’t result in them being shot).


  121. @ Bell, Truthbetold,

    Thanks. I still don’t know why we’re having this same argument with yet another racist.


  122. Ace

    Labeling whites “racist” who point out the facts about black violence and black targetting of whites is the behavior of one who is losing the argument.

    What do you call blacks who identify the the same problems?


  123. @ Ace, Cleonette:
    Great points and responses! You two have been bringing some great arguments to the table, and they have been a joy to read – keep up the great work. :cool:

    @ Stephen Haws:

    [3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion

    You just proved my point, little girl – using another commentor to disrupt a topic is being a troll, just as much as citing phony statistics and pseudo-science. You are trolling by attempting to call me out for…absolutely nothing, which is so stupid I wonder how you manage to live without a permanent oxygen connection. It’s funny; out of all of these commenters here, you choose to attack me – I must have offended your delicate, racist sensitivities by merely existing. You aren’t the first and you won’t be the last; I’m so glad you decided to be my latest puppet on a string! Dance, little marionette, dance… :grin:


  124. @ Brahms
    “please cite examples of gangs of whites targetting innocent blacks and hurting, raping, killling, and humiliating them.”

    So you mean slavery and the KKK isn’t enough. Damn.


  125. @brahms

    …but if you like, please cite examples of gangs of whites targetting innocent blacks and hurting, raping, killling, and humiliating them

    ok…

    Michelle Riley Shot, Tortured and Enslaved Mentally Disabled Pregnant Mom for Months

    White Mississippi Teens May Have Attacked Homeless Blacks In Jackson

    Black man killed, dragged behind truck

    Page 5 Racial Hates Crimes in 2008 box (This is for Chicago)

    Any blacks here want to tell me how you were taught that whites are good and just like you; how society is not racist, etc.?

    *raises hand*. I was taught that everyone is the same and should be treated with respect by my parents. Even people who are vicious to me because maybe they are just having a bad day and need a smile or some kindness.


  126. You know Brahms, you need a new argument. You use the “strawman” derailing tactic too much. You need to re-up your argument. Go to derailingfordummies.com for some new material. I see you just won’t quit. You are like a weed that the other commentors keep killing and you just keep coming back. You might think its great, your resilience, that you keep coming back but to us you are still just a damn weed.

    You should really work on your reading comprehension skills. Don’t worry about the cost of an effective education. I always donate my change at General Dollar to the Literacy Fund. Good day!


  127. Heck, there was an incident recently in the south where some white boys upped and murdered a black guy, they ran over him with a car…and it was blatent racism, racist comments were made. Im too busy to google it up now , but,i know you all remember that


  128. @ Cleonette:

    @ leigh204

    I don’t think I deserve bows. I’m just fed up. I don’t lump white people in one big glob because comparing him to the people in my life who happen to share a similar skin tone to him is an insult. He is an isolated idiot. There are many isolated idiots in all skin tones and they make me just as irritated.

    I hear ya. What I’m saying is you put the awe in awesome in laying the smackdown on these fools. You’re so eloquent. The way you express yourself so clearly and powerfully, it stirs something inside me. I just wanted to say thank you. :)


  129. @ brahms

    “Are you REALLY, REALLY sure about that?”
    “Yes. Things are different in white rural areas blaah,bla,blaaah………………………

    You must be living in ” white rural areas” where you see things through rose-coloured glasses! Or perhaps that’s a way of putting your conscious mind to sleep.


  130. @ Guys

    Here’s what Brahms is saying:
    ” Black life doesn’t matter.”


  131. ” Black life doesn’t matter.”

    This is true only when blacks kill each other…no outrage, no marches, no demand for “justice”.

    In the very rare where the offender is non-black, a predictable chant of “no justice no peace” will ensue.


  132. @Truth

    http://hiphopandpolitics.wordpress.com/2012/03/23/editorial-to-those-who-keep-asking-why-yall-dont-care-when-black-folks-kill-black-folks/

    http://ceasefirechicago.org/

    There is outrage. There are marches. I know because I took part in a “Stop the Violence” march when I was in grammar school. We walked several miles to protest. I have to disagree with your comment but you not knowing what is going on is understandable. The marches/protests don’t get large news coverage.


  133. What Do You Call Blacks Who Identify The The Same Problems?

    Black on white crime? Kerchief heads. You sir are another insane racist who illicits mockery not ‘debate’ as you characterize it. It is a good thing I enjoy a good laugh at absurdities such as you! Stop posting your insane responses(in reality non-responses), you are only making a fool out of yourself and by extension the other white racist tools. Seeing as how you don’t get the gist of this post to start, why are you even bothering to respond? Oh, I know, you can’t stop it, you have Tourettes of the keyboards, in any case, something is wrong with you!


  134. “There is outrage. There are marches.”

    LOLOL Oh please. I read the local papers, black-on-black murders are daily, followed by…silence. Then more murders…

    In the meantime, your “stop the violence” march doesn’t seem to be lowering the black-on-black murder rate. What a surprise…


  135. @Truth

    Surprisingly enough the homicide rate across the nation has lowered so I’m not sure what you mean. Local papers do not indicate a current trend. Can you show proof of no decrease in black-on-black? I’m sure you are not here for serious debate, I just want to see where you are coming from because your “arguments” are weak and flawed, imo.


  136. “Surprisingly enough the homicide rate across the nation has lowered so I’m not sure what you mean.”

    The black-on-black murder rate in black inner cities…Detroit, Atlanta, Baltimore, etc…is astronomical.

    As it is in Haiti, Jamaica, South Africa, and virtually every place that blacks live…

    If it makes you feel better to tell yourself otherwise, then carry on.


  137. “Can you show proof of no decrease in black-on-black?”

    LOL If you are of the impression that I’m trying to “prove” something to you, then you are confused.

    Frankly, I don’t care what you believe, and have no interest in changing your mind about anything.

    Please feel free to dismiss or ignore anything that I post.


  138. @Truth

    FBI statistics show crime down significantly over the past 20 years, homicides by 51 percent, property thefts 64 percent.

    Crime rates in US Decline (FBI)

    This is as reported by the fbi. It is fact.

    What I was asking was physical numbers that compared previous years of black-on-black crime. You still haven’t shown me. I am from Chicago and I understand what you mention about high homicide rates in the inner city. It is almost always in Chicago news. But I want exact numbers rather than just what may just be opinion (as far as a upward trend is concerned).


  139. http://www.fbi.gov/news/stories/2011/september/crime_091911/crime_091911&lt;.
    Oh don't worry I am not offended and I mentioned above that i knew you weren't trying to debate. @Truth. My feelings are not =into this conversation so no worries. :)


  140. “FBI statistics show crime down significantly over the past 20 years, homicides by 51 percent, property thefts 64 percent.”

    Yes, overall violent crime rates have dropped with the application of “3 strikes and you’re out” legislation…opposed by blacks…combined with building more prisons…also opposed by blacks.

    So if your point is that overall violent crime has dropped in spite of blacks, then we agree.

    Considering current black violent crime rates, it is frightening to imagine what they would be otherwise…


  141. @Truth

    http://www.unodc.org/documents/data-and-analysis/statistics/Homicide/Globa_study_on_homicide_2011_web.pdf

    i’m reading this now and it is intense so far. I wanted trends and I got them. Countries mostly populated by Black people have scary high homicide rates but I appreciate this study because it tries to figure out the “why” rather than just placing blame.

    Also, I can understand why the “3 strikes” law would recieve protest. I don’t know it fully but I am under the impression that no matter how petty the crime then a person can get life after 3 offenses. Taxpayers wasting money on criminals isn’t something I would support either. Better program to support rehabilitation would probably be better.

    I also feel that more prisons won’t fix the problem because it doesn’t address the reason why crime is being commited. It just baby sits criminals. Understand that I would prefer for the law to deal with criminals but through effective policies that will stop crime rather than temporarilt delay it.

    “Considering current black violent crime rates, it is frightening to imagine what they would be otherwise…”

    I wish there was data on when the crime rate decreased so that maybe that method could be used more. it is definitely a problem that needs a solution. Innocent people shouldn’t have to die.


  142. “I appreciate this study because it tries to figure out the “why” rather than just placing blame.”
    The “why” is complex, I don’t pretend to fully understand, but theories abound.

    “I am under the impression that no matter how petty the crime then a person can get life after 3 offenses.”
    Specifically, 3 FELONIES. Misdemeanors are not applicable.

    “I also feel that more prisons won’t fix the problem because it doesn’t address the reason why crime is being commited.”
    It depends on how you define the word “fix”. Prisons will not make crime disappear. However, as has already been noted, the practice of keeping habitual felons off the streets has reduced overall violent crime rates.


  143. @ Brahms,

    No because your not telling the “Truth” your telling information that caters to your biases regardless of whether or not it is actually factual information. It is not the “truth” that black people target whites, because there’s no common historical basis for that. There’s never been a single institution or group in this country that has made it their active mission to target white people alone, unlike the KKK, the Neo-Nazis, the entire government up to a certain date, etc. Any black-white crime was never never protected under the law. It seems like a snotty thing to do to claim that your racist views of blacks are the “truth” while ignoring the TRUE fact that black parents actually had a reason to warn their children of the fact that they would be persecuted due to their race, and therefore had to subdue their actions and be less cavalier about things. Because their kids could be shot, lynched or get their family hurt or intimidated and the law would support it, white kids never had that danger.

    @ Truth,

    Why don’t you do me a favor and actually find the crime statistics from every place black people live, since you name the usual redherrings and claim the statistics are all high. Your ignorance is astounding and your bias is telling.


  144. deedee said, “There is outrage. There are marches.”

    “truth” said, “LOLOL Oh please. I read the local papers, black-on-black murders are daily, followed by…silence. Then more murders…

    In the meantime, your “stop the violence” march doesn’t seem to be lowering the black-on-black murder rate. What a surprise…”

    Bro. Wolf says “Truth, don’t criticize others for doing a job you won’t do. That makes you a hypocrite. Black people are doing something about it whether you believe it or not. and they are making progress. Of course, crime is always going to happen in any society at any time, and don’t think the lily white communities are crime free for one second.”


  145. @ Brahms

    Race was not mentioned in my home as it was a non factor to me meeting and getting to know someone. My parents did not harp on it nor did any of my relatives, so you are wrong about what blacks are taught in their home and unless you are in my home I suggest you reframe from saying you have a clue what goes on.

    The first time anything was mention along the lines of race in my family was when my uncle told me how his leg got damaged. It was the result of 5 white guys beating him near death one night when he was riding home on his bike. Even with this happening to him, he has always judged whites on a person by person basis.


  146. @Brahms

    I also know how blacks speak about whites in their homes – if any black here denies this, they are lying.

    Now, according to some of your earlier comments you were ostracised by your black peers – how the hell do you know what was being spoken about in their homes? Your paranoia knows no bounds does it *SMH*

    …Clarification: it is black parents who instill racism in their children….

    This childhood of yours is really haunting you isnt it. Seriously, I suggest you get some therapy. This baggage is so unhealthy.

    Also, I thought you said there were some ‘decent’ black people out there – the way you have written this suggests that you cant even get your commentary straight, either that or your opinions about black people change from every few minutes, kinda schizoid really isnt it which, again lends to the fact that therapy might prove beneficial for you….

    ….while white parents have been programmed to teach egalitarian principles…

    Tell that to my friend who went out with this white guy who LOVED black women (and still does by all accounts…) when she went to his house and met his mother only to hear comments like ‘we better do some curry for this one’ or ‘is that your real hair?’.

    Of course, the absolute corker, that the step sister ‘kindly’ *rolls eyes* passed on to my friend. When one of his mates called for him the mum answered the phone and laughingly said he couldnt come to the phone as he was busy entertaining one of his black monkey girlfriends…. Of course, she was only kidding…..*SMH*

    Dont tell me about white parents practising egalitarian principles. This is only a tame example of what I have witnessed growing up.


  147. @ Demerera

    “….while white parents have been programmed to teach egalitarian principles…

    Tell that to my friend who went out with this white guy who LOVED black women (and still does by all accounts…) when she went to his house and met his mother only to hear comments like ‘we better do some curry for this one’ or ‘is that your real hair?’.

    Of course, the absolute corker, that the step sister ‘kindly’ *rolls eyes* passed on to my friend. When one of his mates called for him the mum answered the phone and laughingly said he couldnt come to the phone as he was busy entertaining one of his black monkey girlfriends…. Of course, she was only kidding…..*SMH*”

    I guess she said all those crap simple because she couldn’t digest the allurement of a beautiful black lady; like your friend.
    They often say that out of enviousness for black people who fail to meet their espectation of gawky and awkward prose style!


  148. The comments being made by the racist whites are so predictable, I want to laugh. From the black friend/lover to glossing over the crux of this post entirely.

    Thanks for a Sunday morning laugh.


  149. Cleonette

    “So you mean slavery and the KKK isn’t enough. Damn.”

    Thank you for summing up the illogical black-centrist argument. The most recent true oppression you can point to is the KKK or Jim Crow. Do you beleive the KKK is a contemporary problem for blacks?


  150. deedee

    Those examples all recieved national media coverage – James Byrd etc..

    There is no pattern.

    Do you not agree that black crowds targetting whites is a pattern? Out of the 370 million whites you can give these 5 – let’s look at them.

    Michelle Riley Shot, Tortured and Enslaved Mentally Disabled Pregnant Mom for Months

    * not an example of a racial mob attack. The highest incidence of spouse murder is that of a white woman married to a black man; the rape and murder of whites by blacks is prolific and thousands of local news stories can be found. I do not bring up these cases because they do not fit the category. The category is single race mob attack on innocent people of different race.

    White Mississippi Teens May Have Attacked Homeless Blacks In Jackson

    * this sounds legit

    Black man killed, dragged behind truck

    * no, this is not an example

    So one example – will you not admit that there is a problem of black groups of teens and adults targeting whites for violence?


  151. Ace

    ” and people of color honestly do have to remember that in the end, they are not white and will not be treated as such. It’s not racist to acknowledge that.”

    Is not?


  152. Herneith
    What Do You Call Blacks Who Identify The The Same Problems?

    “Black on white crime? Kerchief heads.”

    What? Walter Williams says almost the exact same thing I do – he’s a kerchief head? (whatever that means)


  153. @ Demerera,

    Well keep in mind, to people like Brahms, white racism is somehow the normal, “egalitarian” mindset.

    I feel you on your story though, being the only darker skinned girl in a group of white friends (of the geek variety, so extra social awkwardness to make things super-frustrating.) I usually had to be the one to hear those comments, namely being said about black people (I was the model minority, so I was supposed to agree). If I had a dime for every time one of my white friends thought they deserved a cookie for telling me how their parents thought I was there to “use” them (but they totally didn’t agree so they’re not racist, omg) I wouldn’t have student loans.

    @ Brahms,

    I’m not “black” but my family definitely would never be able to classify as white in this country. So we have to have that “talk” too. It basically consisted of:

    1. We don’t have the complexion protection to guarantee our safety and acceptance in this society, even with all of our education and success.

    2. I must be prepared rejection based on my lack of complexion protection. I was not white, and I had to deal with that.

    3. I would have to work ten times harder to get half as much of the recognition unless it was bad attention. So I must always watch what I say and do, I would be a representative of my perceived ethnicity at all times. .

    4. I couldn’t be cavalier or brash, it could get me in trouble. On the other hand, no one should get away with targeting me based on my race, and I should be sure to stand firm and tell my parents if they try.

    5. While I will be seen as different, I am not inferior and I should never let anyone tell me I am. The minute I do, they win.

    6. There will always be people out there who will want to take from me or set me back, and my race is just one weapon they will use to to do that.

    6. Just one bad encounter with one of those prejudiced people is enough to hurt me, cost me my prosperity, or get me killed, this is preparation for dealing with them and preventing that situation.

    7. White people are not all racist and they don’t all want to target me. Generalizing all white people is a bad thing to do and obsessing over race will give me gray hairs. But race has had too much of an impact on our society for me to assume I will be safe from any prejudice growing up. Our society just isn’t at the place where people of color can afford to be complacent and expect all people to treat us decently. This is for my safety and mental health, not some manifesto on why all white people are bad.

    On the subject of what parents teach their kids, you should consider that there are micro-aggressions. You don’t have to run around making your kids wear KKK robes and call black people slurs to have race affect your actions. If your singling out your kids black friends, saying mean things about their hair or skin, implying they’re poor or undernourished, or applying other stereotypes to them based off of their perceived ethnicity, then that’s still teaching racism. I remember that with my friends growing up, their parents had already started trying to put a degree of separation between me and their kids. They didn’t need to dredge up crime reports or racist language to remind me I wasn’t wanted around their kids because I wasn’t white.


  154. @ Brahms,

    Why don’t you look up Genore Guillory. And unless you are going to post every example of black-on-white attacks you shouldn’t expect anyone else to do the same for you. Everyone knows there aren’t roving bands of black people targeting white people to anywhere near the level where it’s been done in reverse, that’s just silly to try to justify anything by claiming that fact.

    Also, no. Acknowledging how racism will affect your children and telling them that is not the same as saying something racist like “Black people are dangerous.”


  155. I was not ‘taught racism’. As a matter of fact, I was angry with my mother, not warning me more about white’s and racism. I basically went into the world, somewhat defenseless;had to develop coping skills. I asked her why she hadn’t told us more, and she said she figured we would find out. huh? I told her that wasn’t wise. When I got older, I made sure to inform my younger siblings;what’s funny is that, when I would tell them some things, they would accuse me of being racist haha! My younger sis was shocked when she began going through some things, and was able to apologize to me.

    Black American parents, actually need to tell their children about racism, or tell them, and provide/suggest coping skills more. My family is from the south, so, I do recall some things that happened;grandmother talked about Emmett Till, she saw a lynched body when in grade school. The children were told to go the long way to school, which they did for a few days. Then someone learned why, so a couple of them went the short route, and saw the victim’s body still hanging from the tree. Another family elder told of how one of her friends (14 yr old) was making noise by some white persons house, and the male of the house came and almost beat and stomped him to death, (learly 50′s); several black men were nearby, but did nothing.

    I had relatives who had jobs as ‘The Help’, and talked about mistreatment and meaness from the white wives of the homes. One of my aunts said a lady threw cooked eggs in her face, because she didn’t like how they were scrambled. I heard about some of the issues my elders were having on their jobs with whites, but thought this was incidental, not systemic, and permanent as I later learned.

    My elders talked about MLK and the Civil Rights movement, the marches, but in my young mind, I thought all of that was over, and expected ‘things to erupt every now and then, until I went to college, and had an extremely rude awakening. Then, when I entered the job force, more rude awakenings, than as media became more pervasive, I began to learn about the various police brutality cases w/black men/people. Then I became more aware of ongoing injustices, in housing, education, employment, etc.
    I remember talking with a young white female acquaintance right after high school about my college plans,and she erupting in a fury about how all of her friends were denied acceptance to the colleges of their choice because of affirmative action.

    Then, when I got ‘online’, I saw that racist hell that my ancestor had experienced never left, and I was ‘reacquainted’ with all of those 18th and 19th century words and phrase used to demean and denigrate black Americans. No rabid racism never left, it was just lying in wait. I recommend black parents need to do more. Unless your family/parents are/were actively involved as activists, or unless something horrifically racial happened to you or a family member, you were misled to believe in white supremacy/rabid racism as something you could watch on PBS. Not something that was going to be a part of my daily reality.


  156. Sharina
    @ Brahms

    “Race was not mentioned in my home as it was a non factor to me meeting and getting to know someone.”

    I beleive you.
    So what is ” the talk”? How is the subject of white people treated in most black homes?


  157. Hi, I am new here! Just putting that out there,

    I love what this blog is all about but I would also like to add a piece of the puzzle that I think is being missed that can help explain alot of what black people experience from white people.

    I wonder if anyone has had the chance to research psychopaths. If you haven’t please see:

    The Sociopath Next Door – Martha Stout
    Women Who Love Psychopaths – Sandra Brown
    Snakes in Suits – Robert Hare and Paul Babiak
    Without Conscience – Robert Hare
    The Mask of Sanity – Hervey Cleckley
    Political Ponerology – Andrzej Lobaczewski

    Research has shown that society is hierarchical in nature and that socio/economic position filters for psychopathic qualities, which are:

    Glibness/superficial charm
    Grandiose sense of self-worth
    Pathological lying
    Cunning/manipulative
    Lack of remorse or guilt
    Shallow affect (genuine emotion is short-lived and egocentric)
    Callousness; lack of empathy
    Failure to accept responsibility for own actions

    Think about the type of people who rise up in corporations, what qualities are being selected for.

    The point of all this, is white people say and do what they do because psychopaths have infected society with pathology, white people are there main enablers. It isn’t that white people are racist(most are because of how they’ve been brought up but that is small potatoes), it is psychopaths have gained complete control to impose there worldview on the rest of everyone. And contrary to popular belief, the majority of psychopaths are not criminally insane. Just do google searches, read the research and see for yourself. The leading scientist in this field is Robert Hare – search him up and read his work.

    Psychopaths excel at creating an US vs THEM mentality. It both creates an environment that best suits them as they quickly rise to the top and at the same time it keeps their presence hidden. Everything in society is by design, e.g. the white lens this has been carefully crafted that white people become completely blind and so do black people in some instances. It is easier to hunker down, stand your ground, be militant towards the other side(white or black) but the right solution is to gain the right kind of knowledge that will enable you to understand better the kind of environment you are operating in.

    Btw, if you read the research, you’ll discover that the percentage of essential psychopaths, i.e. those who are born psychopaths and not made, is less than 10% and so you’ll think, that is very little to have such a huge effect on society. Well I urge you to think of the effect the rich top 1% has on society and factor in all their enablers. Psychopaths have enablers to, think of a time when you have had to surrender your humanity(empathy, conscience) and at that time you were an enabler. Think how Hitler got every German on a warpath with the rest of the world, not all Germans were bad or evil, they just had there free will hi-jacked by a very evil person/system.

    I know this is kind of long but reading over abagonds work, I was so impressed that I wanted to add this extra bit of information so that maybe he can check it out and decide to factor it in, in his writing and how he see’s the world.

    Here is an article:

    http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/snakes-in-suits-when-psychopaths-go-to-work/story-e6frg8no-1111112236244

    Finally, no doubt white people gain from this instilled psychopathic system. White is always right, white lens, being crafty at evading historical responsibility etc which all mostly translate into higher material wealth and false self-grandiose feelings of superiority, but those who fail to take into account that they are being used, lose there humanity in the end. Maybe in the end being human means nothing. I guess that is personal to each person.


  158. Ace

    “I’m not “black” but my family definitely would never be able to classify as white in this country. So we have to have that “talk” too. It basically consisted of:

    1. We don’t have the complexion protection to guarantee our safety and acceptance in this society, even with all of our education and success.”

    Your own example 1-7 shows perfectly how blacks (excuse me, POC) are perpetuating a racist society.

    Most whites are taught that even thinking that non-whites are different than them is a sick mindset that the only bad people hold. Its day and night compared to the talk in black homes.

    However, I will not be giving my kids the same talk as my parents gave me – it will be a little more realistic.


  159. @ Brahms

    Walter Williams is a kerchief head big-time. Newspapers like to print his columns because his black face makes it look like they have Diverse Perspectives, yet most of the time he always winds up agreeing with white people!

    Like Clarence Thomas, Larry Elder and Thomas Sowell, Williams is not only to the right of most black people, he is even to the right of most white people! They are far closer to mainstream white opinion in America than mainstream black opinion.


  160. Ace

    ” And unless you are going to post every example of black-on-white attacks you shouldn’t expect anyone else to do the same for you. Everyone knows there aren’t roving bands of black people targeting white people to anywhere near the level where it’s been done in reverse”

    “Done in the reverse” ? -so black on white mob violence is off-topic until it reaches the porportions of the 1920s race riots? I’ll hold my tongue here!

    http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/2011/0809/Flash-mob-attacks-Rising-concern-over-black-teen-involvement

    http://www.violentflashmobs.com/


  161. “Demerera to Brahms

    Now, according to some of your earlier comments you were ostracised by your black peers – how the hell do you know what was being spoken about in their homes? Your paranoia knows no bounds does it

    Dont tell me about white parents practising egalitarian principles. This is only a tame example of what I have witnessed growing up.”

    Linda says,

    Demerera, that’s sort of the difference between UK and USA. My observations,

    White Britians have almost no filters when it comes to them speaking their minds, no matter who is in the room. They are less PC but at least, everyone knows where they are standing and a coloured person (black, brown, Asian) can tell them to kiss off instead of having to be fake (like US)

    Whereas, the average American whites are afraid to speak their minds to black people (directly in their face). Instead, they hide behind the internet or only say how they feel to each other when no coloured people are around. They will smile in a black persons face and talk to their white peers behind that persons back.

    For whatever reason, white Americans have some sort of fear of black Americans and this is why they make up lies and stories to make themselves feel better and to make themselves appear to be socially better than black Americans, when in truth, they are just the same as their black countrymen.


  162. Linda
    “They will smile in a black persons face and talk to their white peers behind that persons back.”
    Liar

    “For whatever reason, white Americans have some sort of fear of black Americans and this is why they make up lies and stories to make themselves feel better and to make themselves appear to be socially better than black Americans, when in truth, they are just the same as their black countrymen.”

    The NCVS (2008) clearly shows that black criminals target whites.
    • Single-offender crimes: blacks committed 83% of the 520,000
    violent inter-racial crimes involving blacks and whites nationwide.
    • The victims of black violent crime are mostly white: black
    criminals chose white victims 54% of the time. White criminals
    chose black victims only 4.6% of the time.
    • Blacks were 32 times as likely to attack whites as whites were to
    attack blacks. For robbery, they were 67 times as likely.
    • There were over 19,000 black-on-white rapes/sexual assaults.
    That’s about 53 every day. However, the NCVS found zero cases
    of white-on-black rape or sexual assault.
    • Multiple-offender crimes: blacks committed 142,000 violent
    gang crimes against whites nationwide, including 89,000 assaults
    and 49,000 robberies. That leaves 4,000 gang rapes/sexual
    assaults, which is about 10 every day. The NCVS found zero
    cases of violent white-on-black gang crimes of any kind.
    • Gangs of black criminals chose white victims 55% of the time.
    As with single-offender crimes, blacks prefer to attack whites.


  163. @ Oyan

    I can relate.
    My family is the United Nations. I grew up with every colour, religion and ethnicity at our breakfast table. I also grew up overseas.
    My mom never gave us “the talk” either, til we came to America and got the rudest awakening possible.

    Being home-schooled, ( we’re rural farmers/fisherman/construction workers/sheep shearers ) going to school was shocking in the states.
    More shock came with employment.

    Whites, especially in the US, are molded, inside and out, by their own self-serving standards. That’s why un-learning their pathology is so difficult. How can you undo the damages that you create, live by and swear to?

    They feel deep down, of course they deny this, that intrinsically, they are the root cause of the problem. That’s why they spread lies, rumors, cheat, steal…anything to get away from having to see their true selves.


  164. @ Linda

    I agree 100%.
    Europeans have zero filter.
    Americans have to hold up to their morally good, Puritan image. Hence the hypocrisy.


  165. @ Wilson

    It’s because of the sociopathogical nature that they become the 1%.


  166. Oyan

    That’s some theory -who are these psychopaths again?

    “Finally, no doubt white people gain from this instilled psychopathic system. White is always right, white lens, being crafty at evading historical responsibility etc”

    You are so 100% wrong.

    http://www.blueagle.com/editorials/Lind_982.htm


  167. @ Linda,

    I don’t buy your description of racism in the UK. The british are heavily programmed to be polite. Stiff upper lip. To me racism in Britain is mainly underhanded and unspoken. When people are programmed to fit into a certain construct, then it follows that they will employ fakeness in order to fit into that construct.

    However regardless,

    From the synopsis of the book “Sociopath next door”

    “Who is the devil you know?

    Is it your lying, cheating ex-husband?
    Your sadistic high school gym teacher?
    Your boss who loves to humiliate people in meetings?
    The colleague who stole your idea and passed it off as her own?

    In the pages of The Sociopath Next Door, you will realize that your ex was not just misunderstood. He’s a sociopath. And your boss, teacher, and colleague? They may be sociopaths too.

    We are accustomed to think of sociopaths as violent criminals, but in The Sociopath Next Door, Harvard psychologist Martha Stout reveals that a shocking 4 percent of ordinary people—one in twenty-five—has an often undetected mental disorder, the chief symptom of which is that that person possesses no conscience. He or she has no ability whatsoever to feel shame, guilt, or remorse. One in twenty-five everyday Americans, therefore, is secretly a sociopath. They could be your colleague, your neighbor, even family. And they can do literally anything at all and feel absolutely no guilt.

    How do we recognize the remorseless? One of their chief characteristics is a kind of glow or charisma that makes sociopaths more charming or interesting than the other people around them. They’re more spontaneous, more intense, more complex, or even sexier than everyone else, making them tricky to identify and leaving us easily seduced. Fundamentally, sociopaths are different because they cannot love. Sociopaths learn early on to show sham emotion, but underneath they are indifferent to others’ suffering. They live to dominate and thrill to win.

    The fact is, we all almost certainly know at least one or more sociopaths already. Part of the urgency in reading The Sociopath Next Door is the moment when we suddenly recognize that someone we know—someone we worked for, or were involved with, or voted for—is a sociopath. But what do we do with that knowledge? To arm us against the sociopath, Dr. Stout teaches us to question authority, suspect flattery, and beware the pity play. Above all, she writes, when a sociopath is beckoning, do not join the game. ”

    Maybe you have just had the misfortune of interacting with people who lack the ability to feel guilt, remorse or shame or someone who has been affected by such a person and thus adopted such techniques as a coping mechanism.


  168. truthbetold

    “It’s because of the sociopathogical nature that they become the 1%.”

    So that explains whites, great. Care to give any thought to the black murder rate – 52% of all murders are committed by blacks who make up 12% of the population. That’s astounding, don’t you think?
    Why?


  169. I am curious, being a black person living in europe, where is this thing about europeans having zero filter coming from?

    Most europeans are not OPENLY racist. Most employ a filter to hide there racist thoughts and worldview. Has anyone been following the trial of the crazy guy who went on a killing spree in Norway – Anders Behring Breivik? Well this past week he has been talking about his motives and one of the main reasons he did what he did is because he feels that Europeans need to take action and step outside their filters.


  170. @ Brahms

    “So that explains whites, great. Care to give any thought to the black murder rate – 52% of all murders are committed by blacks who make up 12% of the population. That’s astounding, don’t you think?
    Why?”

    In my experience it is mainly due to the drug trade and the police doing little to seriously stop it.


  171. I find it interesting that the people who are the least affected by the high black murder rate are the ones who make the biggest deal out of it. Why is that?


  172. @ Oyan

    “I was not ‘taught racism’. As a matter of fact, I was angry with my mother, not warning me more about white’s and racism. I basically went into the world, somewhat defenseless;had to develop coping skills. “

    The same here.


  173. abagond

    “In my experience it is mainly due to the drug trade and the police doing little to seriously stop it.”

    But I thought the War On Drugs was an example of white racism. Maybe you don’t feel that way but all I read hear is how racist courts and police fill prisons with blacks. Sounds like you want to crack down on crime – I’m with you on that.


  174. @ Wilson

    Thank you. I have been wondering about that sort of thing myself (the sociopathy of whites).


  175. Abagond

    “I find it interesting that the people who are the least affected by the high black murder rate are the ones who make the biggest deal out of it. Why is that?”

    Maybe we prefer a peaceful civilization.


  176. abagond

    “sociopathy of whites”

    I love it. Blacks, at 12 % of the population, murder 52% of the people in this country and you’re worried about the sociopathy of whites.


  177. @ Brahms

    Because in America it is way easier to avoid black murderers than white racism.


  178. @ Brahms

    If whites truly cared about the black murder rate they would do something serious about it. But they do nothing. Because they do not give a fuck about black people. That simple. But racists like yourself love to talk about it because it gives you a way to excuse your own racism.


  179. What? Walter Williams Says Almost The Exact Same Thing I Do Hes A Kerchief Head? (Whatever That Means)

    Are you really that dense? Just because a white appointed, or self-appointed, pundit/kerchief head babbles on as an expert on ‘blacks’ doesn’t mean he speaks for all blacks. His is but an opinion which are like arseholes which everyone has. That’s like me saying that everyone agrees with Hitler because he is white and made speeches extolling white folk. I don’t think so. Kerchief heads are in some cases more dangerous than whites. A kerchief head knows what he is saying and doing and will do anything to maintain his tenuous hold in the ‘white club’. Since many whites are clueless to their own racism, they may not be as dangerous because they are too stupid or oblivious to know what day it is. Then there are those like you who are stupid, clueless but is oblivious to both. An example? you don’t understand the gist of this post but choose to ramble on like a lunatic.


  180. @brahms

    “..-will you not admit that there is a problem of black groups of teens and adults targeting whites for violence?”

    I will not admit because that is not a true statement based on reality. It seems more like an exaggeration, imo.

    Also, you bring up the NCVS a lot but I don’t see the type of trends you mention. There are several things you need to consider about the NCVS:

    1) The estimations are based on crime reports regardless of when the crime occurred (so past years can be used for a more recent year, p. 3)

    2) The response rate has never been even in the high 90 percent range so it does not indicate all possible reports (p.2 of hyperlink above).

    3) “Interpret data with caution, based on 10 or fewer sample cases or the coefficient of variation is greater than 50%.” The reason to do so is because a very small sample size isn’t reliable. The actual population size should be 1,000 times larger than the sample size to be reliable.

    4)”Research based on interviews of victims obtained from police files indicates that assault is recalled with the least accuracy of any crime
    measured by the NCVS. This may be related to the tendency of victims to not report crimes committed by offenders who are not strangers, especially if they are relatives. In addition, among certain groups, crimes which contain elements of assault could be a part of everyday life, and are therefore forgotten or not considered important enough to mention to a survey interviewer. These recall problems may result in an understatement of the actual rate of assault.” (p. 6 of hyperlink in point 1).

    Consider these points before drawing conclusion on data that has sampling/non-sampling errors.

    And lastly if you use the NCVS analysis tool you can compare crimes with other years and see a definite pattern of decline.

    http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/index.cfm?ty=nvat <–link to the tool
    http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/nvat/resources/documents/nvat_user_guide.pdf <-user guide.


  181. In My Experience It Is Mainly Due To The Drug Trade And The Police Doing Little To Seriously Stop It.

    Right you are. It is one thing to read crap and stats in a book. It is quite another to actually observe these goings on first hand directly or as a third hand party. Most of the black criminals are in jail for crimes of economy( drug dealing for the most part). The perverts are overwhelmingly white(you do get the odd black or racialized pervert, but not in proportions to their numbers in the populace, it is rare). When you actually look into it, the distributors who are usually white, are rarely apprehended. Why? Because it is easier to profile and go after the street level racialized dealer. That’s why you have recidivism because the police keep picking up the same aresholes. A lot of the drug dealers are also drug addicts or drunkards. Why not set up numerous addiction facilities, or try to get to what ails society to the extent that these things abound? Now I am not speaking from books or stats. I will leave it at that.


  182. abagond

    I’m not a racist, I’m a realist. I want blacks in this country (its just as much their country as mine), I just want them to start acting right.

    “if whites truly cared about the black murder rate they would do something serious about it. But they do nothing.”

    Yet the War On Drugs is racist – how in the hell do you expect anything to be done about the crime and danger of black communities if you call arresting drug dealers and gang members racist?


  183. @deedee:

    I wouldn’t even bother to address this tool unless it is to make fun of his intellectual capacities, or in his case incapacities. It’s like farting in a wind tunnel. He isn’t interested in anything you, or any other person has to post unless he can use it as an excuse to throw in crime stats to show you how blacks are inherently ‘criminal’. He doesn’t even understand the focus of this post. Actually, he is hilarious in his obtuseness.


  184. deedee7789

    Arrrest statistics (as well as prison populations) reflect the NCVS. You must say that all statistics in the matter are wrong or distorted or whatever. Is that your position?


  185. @Bell

    I guess she said all those crap simple because she couldn’t digest the allurement of a beautiful black lady; like your friend.
    They often say that out of enviousness for black people who fail to meet their espectation of gawky and awkward prose style!

    Unfortunately Bell, the son was the same, clearly having learned this from his mother. He ardently pursues black women to the exclusion of any other race and of course, he has a few ‘black friends’ *rolls eyes* and feels this gives him carte blanche to participate in derogatory and ridiculous stereotypes. His mother must be so proud. …..

    @Ace
    I usually had to be the one to hear those comments, namely being said about black people (I was the model minority, so I was supposed to agree).

    Yes Ace. The old “my dad hates black people but you’re ok…” kind of comments *rolls eyes*. In my experience, those kids who assert this the most are usually also become the most curious as to ‘why’ this is and end up going out with and having children with black people…

    @Linda

    White Britians have almost no filters when it comes to them speaking their minds, no matter who is in the room. They are less PC but at least, everyone knows where they are standing and a coloured person (black, brown, Asian) can tell them to kiss off instead of having to be fake (like US)
    &

    @Wilson

    FAO Linda: I don’t buy your description of racism in the UK. The british are heavily programmed to be polite. Stiff upper lip. To me racism in Britain is mainly underhanded and unspoken. When people are programmed to fit into a certain construct, then it follows that they will employ fakeness in order to fit into that construct.

    Hi Linda and Wilson

    My opinion is that the British aspire to be ‘more’ PC than most, particularly their American cousins who they look down upon as being stupid, loud, ostentatious and lacking in intelligence. People like this will always ‘try’ to distance themselves though without realising that they too have similar same traits though they manifest themselves in different ways.

    In terms of crime, during the late 70′s early 80′s there was a spate of black people dying whilst in police custody. That and the dictatorship that was Thatcherism saw much unrest and rioting and I recall at the time, always seeing some black villain on the TV. I have to say now, on balance, it could be either or – I dont necessarily feel that there is any intention to depict BP alone as criminals – what do you guys think?

    I guess the fact remains that on the surface they certainly seem more tolerant but, over the last few years, there has been heavy conditioning to adopt a more politically correct attitude. Does this follow into the home/family life? Certainly not – unfortuntately the truth will ALWAYS out.


  186. “Brahms,
    The NCVS (2008) clearly shows that black criminals target whites.”

    Linda says,

    Brahms, who cares?!

    you talk about black Americans and crime as if white Americans don’t commit crime, which God knows they do… white Americans aren’t better people just because statistically, black Americans seem to commit more crime because there are less blacks than whites…blah, blah , blah

    a white criminal is still a criminal and every country has them.

    If you have too much crime in your city, why don’t you move or join a group to do something about it.

    You bring up crime statistics as if that really matters in the big scheme of things.

    Money runs this world and as long as you have people without it and people with it, you will have someone trying to take it…that’s why Wallstreet is an instittution that always bounces back.


  187. “Wilson
    @ Linda,

    I don’t buy your description of racism in the UK. The british are heavily programmed to be polite. Stiff upper lip. To me racism in Britain is mainly underhanded and unspoken. When people are programmed to fit into a certain construct, then it follows that they will employ fakeness in order to fit into that construct.”

    Linda says,

    I am a West Indian who has lived in UK and Europe. My experience with the British has been as I said–less fake than white Americans.

    As for “stiff upper lip”, yes they are polite people, but when it came to them saying how they felt about West Indians and other black/non-white people in Britian. I didn’t run into any shy types especially in south sides of London.

    As for continental Europeans, my experience with them is that they had no problems making stereotypical comments or asking questions based on ignorance such as, “are you cold? I know black people have a hard time with the cold due to your hot African blood.”

    Europeans might say and do ignorant things when it comes to black people, depending the country you’re in but

    I’ve found the Britians and Europeans to be more geniune than Americans.
    White America had purposely segregated itself away from black Americans but the hatred they historically feel is something that Europe does not have.


  188. Linda

    Blacks are 12% of the population.

    I’m not saying blacks commit MORE crime overall than whites – read that a few times.

    I am saying that blacks commit more (52%) of the murders. Its not that blacks SEEM to commmit more crime because they have fewer numbers – its that they DO commit more murders. Without blacks, the murder rate would be HALF!

    With other categories like rape, robbery, etc. blacks do not commit MOST of the crime but they are overrepresented. Overrepresented means that blacks represent a higher percentage of the perpetrator than their national population allows were they just commiting their fair share. Does that make sense?

    Why does it matter? Simple. Large population centers of blacks or large groups of blacks (males between 14 and 35 or so for the most part) are the most likely to commit violent crime. DO YOU CARE ABOUT VIOLENT CRIME? Rape? Gangs? Anything? Or will you close your mind to anything that points to race – unless, UNLESS, that pointing is directed at whites?


  189. @brahms

    “Arrrest statistics (as well as prison populations) reflect the NCVS. You must say that all statistics in the matter are wrong or distorted or whatever. Is that your position?”

    I did a quick check to test this out and found your above statement to not be accurate.

    For example:

    FBI estimated arrest 2010
    -Forcible rape 20,088
    -Robbery 112,300

    NCVS – 2010
    -rape 268,574
    -robbery 568,510

    Sources
    (http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2010/crime-in-the- u.s.-2010/tables/10tbl29.xls)
    NCVS Analysis Tool for 2010

    Without uniform methodologies and more reliable sources of information. (Victims memories can change during NCVS and under reporting can lead to less arrest that can be counted by FBI.law enforcement agencies) then no clear conclusions can be drawn.

    “Better data, deeper analysis, improved policies, less
    homicide.” -Global Study on Homicide by UNODC


  190. I’ve acknowledged that their is white racism in rural areas. No one here will acknowledge anything – not the lack of racism in government programs, the lack of racism in education, lack of racism among whites in cities, lack of racism in college and professional school acceptance, lack of racism in student loans and grants, home loans, government jobs, military. I ask for examples of real racism that is keeping you down and you tell me about some encounter at a grocery store. You tell me black drug criminals getting arrested is racism. Some joker talks about white psychopathic behavior. Its a delusional world you are living in. Nor will anyone admit the racism found in blacks – where is it? If I’m wrong, tell me about black racism. Tell me about white racism towards Asians and how they are kept down.

    Talk about a nation of cowards – Eric Holder needs to read this blog.


  191. “Brahms,
    Why does it matter? Simple. Large population centers of blacks or large groups of blacks (males between 14 and 35 or so for the most part) are the most likely to commit violent crime. DO YOU CARE ABOUT VIOLENT CRIME? Rape? Gangs? Anything? Or will you close your mind to anything that points to race – unless, UNLESS, that pointing is directed at whites?”

    Brahms, no I don’t care about “violent crime” based on your race statistics because white criminals are just as vile as any other race of criminals.

    crime is crime no matter who commits it.

    I care about the fact that when people commit crimes, they should be caught and persecuted for their crimes.

    as a foreigner living in your country, I’ve never had a problem with black American criminals or gangs, nor do I live in a crime-invested neighbor.

    As I said, I could care less about your black statistics because it really doesnt’ affect you..it’s the poor people who live in crime ridden neighborhoods that can’t afford to move, who need to worry about violent crime…they are typically the victims.

    Who cares if you are worried about black crime, that’s your problem…you aren’t doing anything to change crime in America…you’re just making noise.

    you should move if black crime is a problem for you or join an organization to do something about it…action not words makes “a boy into a man”


  192. @ Brahms

    If you want to see racism look in the mirror.


  193. “Brahms,
    I am saying that blacks commit more (52%) of the murders. Its not that blacks SEEM to commmit more crime because they have fewer numbers – its that they DO commit more murders. Without blacks, the murder rate would be HALF!”

    Linda,

    and I say again, so what?

    What does that have to do with you?


  194. @ Brahms

    What about white collar crime which has much bigger consequences? I suppose blacks are committing most of those aswell? All those wall street bankers who drove the economy to near collapse in 2008 were black, Bernie Maddof was black, the guys who ran Enron were black. The economy is suffering from record unemployment, homelessness rates, record number of people are suffering and dying from degenerative diseases because of poor food quality, carcinogenic chemicals, industrial malpractices in waste disposal amongst much much more because of black people. Yeah also, BP oil spill that has caused devastation in the gulf and surrounding population which was because of corporate cost cutting despite safety risks is due to blacks. It is blacks who are busy making all these decisions that lead to wide-spread suffering, poverty, homelessness, redundancies, increased crime rates, poor education, poor health care, decreased freedoms, planetary wide warfare etc.

    What about before the civil rights movement, during the times of lynching? Are you including those statistics? What about the crime perpetrated during slavery itself, what about those statistics? It was less than 200 years ago.

    I am sad to say this but you have your white lens firmly in place.


  195. “brahms
    Linda
    “They will smile in a black persons face and talk to their white peers behind that persons back.”
    Liar”

    Brahms, you are the biggest Liar on this board…white Americans and your racist attitudes have been documented for all to see and read…

    so you coming in here and talking about your rural “wonderland” is not the America that the world sees or the America the rest of us lives in.

    Travel much?


  196. @ Demerera,

    “I dont necessarily feel that there is any intention to depict BP alone as criminals – what do you guys think?”

    Yeah I agree, at least compared to the USA. But I still think despite all this racism translates into everyday real life decisions. Here is a real life example,

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/money/2009/oct/18/racism-discrimination-employment-undercover

    So it shows that British Society is far from perfect, there is still bias based solely on race.

    @ Linda,

    Well OK since it appears that you have had the chance to experience both sides of the atlantic. I haven’t really had the chance to interact with americans to such a degree as to form a comparison between the two.


  197. @ Wilson

    You got it all wrong! The only thing that matters when considering a Genetic or Cultural Propensity to Violence and Criminality are street crimes from the past few years. Nothing else matters! You do not even have to correct for the racism in the police and the courts. And, by the way, while you are at it feel free to misquote and misuse the NCVS! And if anyone disagrees just call them delusional.


  198. Wilson,
    So it shows that British Society is far from perfect, there is still bias based solely on race.”

    for sure, I agree with your statement.

    Being west indian, I have my own biases against the British ….I believe it’s the British racial attitude that has left lasting negative effects within the societies of their ex-colonies around the world but this is not the post for me to go into all that.


  199. Abagond, I think your reponses were meant for Brahms.


  200. @Wilson

    Yeah I agree, at least compared to the USA. But I still think despite all this racism translates into everyday real life decisions.

    Yes. The article that you posted is spot on and is something I raised only recently on another thread as I gave the example that an ex-colleague of mine ‘boasted’ that his dad used to ‘screen’ CV’s and blatantly excluded those people with Asian names.


  201. @ Linda

    “Abagond, I think your reponses were meant for Brahms.”

    No, it is Wilson whose white lens is not firmly in place. He is the one who needs help. Brahms has 400 years of White American culture on his side. How could he possibly be wrong?


  202. dee dee

    The quantities are not going to be the same – many more reports of rape than arrests.

    “Despite the differences in the amount of crime reported, comparisons of the UCR and NCVS data sets show there to be a high degree of correspondence between the two systems”.
    Holmes, Maahs & Vito (2007:39), Rand (2009:1)

    UCR arrests 2005 –

    Forcible rape white. 65.1% black 32.%
    Roberry white 42.2% black 56.3%

    http://www2.fbi.gov/ucr/05cius/data/table_43.html

    From NCVS, reports of rape

    Rape/Sexual assault 160,270 white 32.8% black 48.5%
    Robbery 343,980 white 27.7% black 41.2%

    http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/content/pub/pdf/cvus05.pdf
    table 40, 2005

    It doesn’t seem to match up too well for rape actually. It still shows that whether looking at victim testimony or actual arrests – blacks commit rape and robbery at a much higher rate than expected by their population while whites are underrepresented.


  203. Linda

    “crime is crime no matter who commits it.”

    Yes but it matters if you are tying to live safely. Do you walk around at 2 am downtown alone? Then you should care that blacks are repsonsible for 52% of the murders – you understand this I’m sure but if not, let’s leave it alone. I’m done.


  204. Wilson

    “What about white collar crime which has much bigger consequences?”

    Of course that’s a white crime but I do not consider insider trading on par with rape and murder. Do you?


  205. “Brahms,
    Yes but it matters if you are tying to live safely. Do you walk around at 2 am downtown alone? Then you should care that blacks are repsonsible for 52% of the murders – you understand this I’m sure but if not, let’s leave it alone. I’m done.”

    I live safely everyday, thank you.

    As I said, what does black crime have to do with you?

    I know the frat & college boys in my town go stumbling around at 2 am and other drunks…so yes, drunk drivers are a problem…but black criminals, nope, they don’t affect my neighborhood.

    So, yes, you should leave this topic alone….offshoring and global warming is still a huge problem for the world, you should find statistics on that and take it Congress.


  206. @ Wilson

    Please keep focus: it was black rapists and murderers who threw millions out of work and out of their homes.


  207. @abagond

    Thanks for the links.

    I was thinking Brahm should also read them but going through the comments I see he has… I see he firmly believes White is good and Black is bad, white people are doing all they can to try and help black people out but blacks are just like, I don’t know, being black I guess.


  208. @wilson:

    “Has anyone been following the trial of the crazy guy who went on a killing spree in Norway – Anders Behring Breivik? Well this past week he has been talking about his motives and one of the main reasons he did what he did is because he feels that Europeans need to take action and step outside their filters.”

    Breivik seems to be very typical european racist in his sickness. He started out by hanging with some asian immigrants and others BUT when he was beaten by one immigrant, he turned totally around and became a racist.

    A fatherless, propably closet gay, he created his fantasy world, taking pictures of himself dressed in fantasy uniforms of his own making (parade uniform, comabt divers gear etc.) and spending his time in Net. He was an avid reader of Gate of Wienna and other racist sites and created a new identity for himself as someone who is something.

    What is interesting is that Breivik, a selfclaimed race warrior, did not attack immigrants or people of other skin color, he attacked a social democratic youth camp and killed children and teenagers (ring a bell? Mr Zimmerman did the same!!!!). Many racists here, doug and brahms for example, seem to be similar vein. They both advocate racism, “race science”, call them self race realists just like Breivik, and both try to make excuses for killing children.

    The finnish school shooter couple years ago were pretty much the same kind, except they did not have racist agenda. Otherwise the psychological porfile fit to a tee.


  209. Sorry bout the typos, my computer plays tricks on me.


  210. Wilson – I agree that most of those things you listed are crimes. I am against all that you mentioned but right now I’m talking about violent crime. I’ll take the white role in much of what you mentioned, if not all.

    I will not excuse criminal behavior with historical injustice – it is an absurd concept that only rationalizes crimal behavior. Can whites look at rape statistics and start prowling for blacks – even that would be at least a contemporary rational – which I would condemn. You do not condemn black violence though, you rationalize it with slavery.


  211. Abagond,

    I really think that Wilsons was being sarcastic in his comments to Brahms.

    I don’t think Wilson was agreeing with Brahms.


  212. Sam

    Bring me some smelling salts – is this a typo?

    “he attacked a social democratic youth camp and killed children and teenagers (ring a bell? Mr Zimmerman did the same!!!!). “


  213. @ Linda

    Brahms is so right! Between the ages of 14 and 35 I used to go downtown at 2am and hide so that I could jump out and rape and kill innocent white people. That is just how it works! I could not help myself: I was born with a Greater Propensity to Criminality.


  214. Abagond

    I have no reason to think that you are a criminal. If you were in a group of 20 blacks loitering in the street, I would avoid you. Blame your “brothers” . Its interesting that blacks like to say “brothers and sisters” – a bit racist I would say; like a big family.
    My white brothers and I……sounds racist to me.


  215. Abagond,

    Brahms would be better off looking out for those big “muddin” trucks at 2 AM or the drunks who like to fight after the bar closes…that’s probably the biggest crime he needs to worrry about.


  216. @ Brahms,

    “Of course that’s a white crime but I do not consider insider trading on par with rape and murder. Do you?”

    So when a white person commits a crime that reverberates throughout the whole of society, it’s ok because it isn’t on par with the more animalistic crime of rape and murder(which according to you black people commit more of..).

    Really?

    What about if that insider trading leads to I don’t know, increased prices of commodities like food, that as a result some people in a developing country somewhere in the world can’t afford to feed themselves and end up dying en masse from starvation?

    I also like how you assumed white collar crimes are white crimes. Calling dibs on the more sophisticated form of crime are you?


  217. Linda

    “Linda
    Abagond,

    Brahms would be better off looking out for those big “muddin” trucks at 2 AM or the drunks who like to fight after the bar closes…that’s probably the biggest crime he needs to worrry about.

    Tell that to the multiple whtie victims of black mob attacks – or do you not care about white people?


  218. “Brahms,
    Tell that to the multiple whtie victims of black mob attacks – or do you not care about white people?”

    Brahms, blah,blah, blah

    answer my question, what does black crime have to do with you?

    Since you haven’t been attacked by black mobs, what does black crime have to do with you?


  219. Wilson
    “I also like how you assumed white collar crimes are white crimes. Calling dibs on the more sophisticated form of crime are you?”

    It was you Wilson ol’ chap who implied that white collar crime was white. You wrote a long paragraph about it remember? cuckoo cuckoo cuckoo

    “which according to you black people commit more ” No, no, no. Not “more of” – well, except murder, by a little. The word is “overrepresented”.

    I had hope for you.


  220. Linda
    “what does black crime have to do with you?”

    Doesn’t seem like a good idea to have a mobs of people attacking other innocent poeple – I’m silly like that.


  221. Brahms Is So Right! Between The Ages Of 14 And 35 I Used To Go Downtown At 2Am And Hide So That I Could Jump Out And Rape And Kill Innocent White People. That Is Just How It Works! I Could Not Help Myself: I Was Born With A Greater Propensity To Criminality.

    I was also inherently criminal until my back gave out. Before that I use to mug folks, rob stores(I could run and jump quite good back then), shoplift, I was even a she pimp for male whores for a couple of years! I had to give this up when I hurt my back though! Oh the happy memories!


  222. @ Brahms

    “Tell that to the multiple whtie victims of black mob attacks – or do you not care about white people?”

    You need to reread the post. I already gave all the reasons why it is not a big deal and why you need to get over it.


  223. Brahms, get over it!


  224. @ Herneith

    Oh right, whites are bad at running and jumping. It makes it so easy to take advantage of them!


  225. “brahms
    Linda
    “what does black crime have to do with you?”

    Doesn’t seem like a good idea to have a mobs of people attacking other innocent poeple – I’m silly like that.”

    and have any black mobs attacked you Brahms? if not, then again,

    what does black crime have to do with you?

    It’s great that you’re all concerned about poor, innocent people who live in crime-invested neighboorhoods.

    if you want to make a difference, Habitat for Humanity is looking for volunteers, your love for numbers would help greatly in keeping track of supplies.


  226. Linda

    “and have any black mobs attacked you Brahms? if not, then again,

    what does black crime have to do with you?”

    Ever been killed Linda? What do murderers have to do with you?


  227. Linda

    “It’s great that you’re all concerned about poor, innocent people who live in crime-invested neighboorhoods.”

    You still don’t get it. I do care about those people firstly, secondly, I care about the people who do not live in those areas but are subjected to their criminal element. So complicated, so disjointed, you got me all confused.


  228. @Brahms:

    Ever been pimped out Brahms? I have experience she-pimpimg out man whores, it’s inherent. Otherwise, GET OVER IT!!!! Hahahahahahaha!!!!


  229. “brahms
    Linda

    “and have any black mobs attacked you Brahms? if not, then again,

    what does black crime have to do with you?”

    Ever been killed Linda? What do murderers have to do with you?”

    Brahms, what does murder have to do with you.

    Don’t be childish.

    You’re the person who brought up the subject of black crime, a subject that has no impact on your life.


  230. My claim to fame? I have been on Crimewatch several times, though I was not happy with the ‘mugshot’ they put up of me on there, it made me look like a flippin criminal…. ;-)


  231. “Brahms,
    You still don’t get it. I do care about those people firstly, secondly, I care about the people who do not live in those areas but are subjected to their criminal element. So complicated, so disjointed, you got me all confused.”

    Brahms, that’s great, now run along and do something about it like join an organizations instead of boring us on Abagonds blog with your statistics.

    Most people on this blog don’t live in crime-invested neighborhoods, and some people have admitted to doing volunteer things to help people who are less fortunate than themselves.

    Your race realism brings no change to the table as far as real world solutions, you are just talk.


  232. Oh Right, Whites Are Bad At Running And Jumping. It Makes It So Easy To Take Advantage Of Them!

    That’s what I loved about she pimping, it didn’t require too much physical activities. The man whores just brought me the money!! I used to mug people for the exercise, especially the white ones. Oh for the good ol days!!!! Thank goodness for being inherently criminal it’s so much fun! Thanks for the memories!

    Oh and Brahms, Get over it!!!!


  233. @ Brahms,

    I think I understand where you are coming from.

    You create an environment that is to define the debate. You make sure to structure the whole conversation around an issue that you are sure black people are “over-represented.” You even side-step the issue of sheer number, no what we want is percentage representation, that way we get a clearer picture. All the while you ignore the rest of the forest.

    Can we talk about other crimes other than Rapes and Murders? NO!
    What about indirect murders – e.g. due to poor policies etc which lead to increased violence, crime and maybe even murder? NO!
    What about the hypersexualization of society that makes it more likely for women to get raped — who is doing that, black people? NO! Wait wait, I mean yes black people are mainly responsible for rapes but no we can’t talk about the underpinning dynamics.
    What about rapes that don’t get reported or recorded as rapes which might otherwise lead to wrong statistical figures? NO! Change topic!!! Just stick with the simplistic image of simple rape and murder, like that you see on the evening news, where black people are “over-represented”.

    You don’t even pick a whole tree, you zoom in to a specific leaf and base everything solely on that.

    You crack me up Brahms.


  234. abagond

    “Oh right, whites are bad at running and jumping. It makes it so easy to take advantage of them!”

    No, the advantage lies in the group attack – have you not heard about this?


  235. Hernieth

    “Ever been pimped out Brahms? I have experience she-pimpimg out man whores, it’s inherent. Otherwise, GET OVER IT!!!! Hahahahahahaha!!!!”

    Blacks and their fascination with pimps, sigh.


  236. Linda

    “Brahms, that’s great, now run along and do something about it like join an organizations instead of boring us”

    Oh yes, its so interesting to gripe in an echo chamber.

    I’d like to help – I’d like to increase police presence by 500% in black areas – but that would be racist right?


  237. Wilson

    @ Brahms,

    I think I understand where you are coming from.

    You create an environment that is to define the debate. You make sure to structure the whole conversation around an issue that you are sure black people are “over-represented.” You even side-step the issue of sheer number, no what we want is percentage representation, that way we get a clearer picture. All the while you ignore the rest of the forest.

    Can we talk about other crimes other than Rapes and Murders? NO!
    What about indirect murders – e.g. due to poor policies etc which lead to increased violence, crime and maybe even murder? NO!
    What about the hypersexualization of society that makes it more likely for women to get raped — who is doing that, black people? NO! Wait wait, I mean yes black people are mainly responsible for rapes but no we can’t talk about the underpinning dynamics.
    What about rapes that don’t get reported or recorded as rapes which might otherwise lead to wrong statistical figures? NO! Change topic!!! Just stick with the simplistic image of simple rape and murder, like that you see on the evening news, where black people are “over-represented”.

    You don’t even pick a whole tree, you zoom in to a specific leaf and base everything solely on that.

    You crack me up Brahms.”

    Pick one topic and I’ll discuss it. Its stupid to debate 14 points at once.


  238. “Brahms,
    I’d like to help – I’d like to increase police presence by 500% in black areas – but that would be racist right?”

    Linda says,

    Don’t know, I lost my copy of the “white American basic guide to what black America thinks”


  239. This has really deteriorated into nonsense, where’s dee dee?


  240. “Brahms
    This has really deteriorated into nonsense, where’s dee dee?”

    She’s busy getting together a group of black people so that they can jump some unexpected white person who is walking around at 2 am…

    these things take time to plan, it’s all about logistics you know….


  241. Pick One Topic And Ill Discuss It. Its Stupid To Debate 14 Points At Once.

    Being a superior white man with a super IQ, surely you can walk and chew gum at the same time! You should be able to answer multiple posts at once. Anywho, I’m off to a smash and grab sale downtown!


  242. @ Wilson

    You are clearly a Mathematical Imbecile. Absolute numbers mean nothing – only the relative rates!

    For example, if you are falling off a cliff but the person ahead of you is falling at a faster rate, then you have nothing to worry about. Because only the RELATIVE RATES matter.

    You see this in the way whites talk about out-of-wedlock births:

    In 1965 black illegitimacy rates were through the roof. The government came out with the Moynihan Report saying that blacks were screwed up not because of high unemployment but because of a Destructive Vein in Ghetto Culture which led to high rates of illegitimacy.

    When white illegitimacy rates went through the same roof a generation later in 1999 there was no government report about the Destructive Vein in White Suburban Culture. Because it was still lower than the black rate – so it was all right! Because only RELATIVE RATES matter.

    Because of structural racism (did you hear the whine in my voice?) all the bad social indices will always be higher among blacks and Latinos than among True White People. So no matter how bad it gets for whites they can always tell themselves that at least they are not black!

    Recommended reading:

    https://abagond.wordpress.com/2011/07/29/black-people-the-republican-users-guide/


  243. @ Brahms,

    Ok I shall pick a topic.

    Why do you choose to be racist?

    I say racist because you believe blacks are inherently biased towards criminal behaviour. You cherry pick statistics that prove this to you all the while ignoring statistics and facts that would disprove this. This is indicative of racism.

    An example of statistics that would disprove your stance is for example, white collar crime is over-represented by whites, the consequences are wider in scope, white people in positions of power callously make decisions that lead to wide spread suffering, poverty and criminal behaviour. I say white people in positions of power because the majority of people in positions of power are white.


  244. Inregards to the hypersexualization of women leading to more rape, that actually seems to be the opposite of true, the more sexualized women are in the media the less they are getting raped.

    You can even do the same with porn by and large, track the US rape rates from around 1985 and up along side the increasing amounts of porn into our society and rape drops an incredible amount in the same time period.

    Might be correllation vs causation but it still presents a pretty good argument against the idea of hypersexualization of women turning men into uncontrollable beasts that view females as nothing more than objects put her on earth to satisfy their desires and will.


  245. @ abagond, linda, & Herneith

    LOL :D . I really giggled for a few seconds.

    @Brahms

    Do you know the name of the articles you referenced [Holmes, Maahs & Vito (2007:39), Rand (2009:1)]? I want to give it a read but I have no idea where to find the articles.


  246. @ abagond,

    “You are clearly a Mathematical Imbecile. Absolute numbers mean nothing – only the relative rates!”

    Silly me!

    Duh…

    Is there like a guide on how to talk to white people about race?


  247. “Can we talk about other crimes other than Rapes and Murders? NO!
    What about indirect murders – e.g. due to poor policies etc which lead to increased violence, crime and maybe even murder? NO!”

    ************************

    Precisely!!!

    All types of white corporate/criminal malfeasance is routinely overlooked/forgiven/ignored/fixed. Not to mention many of the crimes young whites commit that are often swept under the rug (or downgraded) and aren’t entered into any crime statistics data bases because: the perp is just some momentarily misguided youth that’s really a good kid who comes from a good home, blah blah – or the perp whose uncle, dad, friend or associate makes a phone call … calls in a *favor* and gets the charge(s) dropped.

    Even Zimmerman was on the verge of getting away with murder – if the Sanford police/DA had gotten their way. Makes me wonder how many OTHER misreported/under-reported REALLY VIOLENT crimes by recipients of *the benefit of the doubt*. Then there’s *connected* or *wealthy* whites that magically fall into the “we’re not going to prosecute this offense because of extenuating circumstances” that is rarely, if ever, applied to black people.

    Black/white crime stats/data are ultimately biased and can’t be relied on because of major differences in how the two groups are handled and treated in an unequal law/criminal system.


  248. Wilson

    Why do you choose to be racist?

    * I don’t consider myself racist. I believe that characteristics are distributed through differing races at differing rates. I believe that black geniuses exist, for example, but at a lower frequency than among whites. Just as whites have a lower frequency than Ashkenazi Jews or Asians. This should have no bearing on the individual and its obvious that it doesn’t – Sylvester J. Gates. It will however affect aggregate incomes, positions, etc.. (often blamed on white racism).

    I say racist because you believe blacks are inherently biased towards criminal behaviour.

    * I say that blacks have a higher percentage of criminals than whites do. I do not say that criminality is inheritable but I don’t know for sure.

    You cherry pick statistics that prove this to you all the while ignoring statistics and facts that would disprove this. This is indicative of racism.

    * I am not aware of any deliberate cherry-picking.

    An example of statistics that would disprove your stance is for example, white collar crime is over-represented by whites, the consequences are wider in scope, white people in positions of power callously make decisions that lead to wide spread suffering, poverty and criminal behaviour. I say white people in positions of power because the majority of people in positions of power are white.

    * The percentage of whites who hold positions of power is minute simply due to the pyramidal hierarchical structure of business and government. The percentage of blacks who commit crimes end up in jail is fairly high. But yes, the people who decided to go to war in Iraq etc. were white; the people who decided to start Free Trade were white – I would argue that most are actually Jewish but we can skip that for now. So I do not dismiss this type of criminality – I debate the naysayers on other sites.
    Bernie Madoff was not white for example.

    However, it is unwise to dismiss black violent crime because of white white collar crime or vice versa.


  249. dee dee

    Criminology: Theory, Research And Policy Second Edition


  250. Matari

    “Black/white crime stats/data are ultimately biased and can’t be relied on because of major differences in how the two groups are handled and treated in an unequal law/criminal system.”

    Then what’s the use of talking about anything? Shall we just tell our little stories about grocery stores, playground bullies, and mean people? When you find some stat on white crime, I’ll just dismiss it and say its biased. Actually, I won’t; I’m reasonable.


  251. @ Brahms,

    ” I believe that black geniuses exist, for example, but at a lower frequency than among whites. Just as whites have a lower frequency than Ashkenazi Jews or Asians.”

    How do you know this is because of race?


  252. Hey Brahms,

    I’m not sure if I can get the book soon so if you have it could you verify this information.

    “..There are fundamental limitations of the UCR system, including:[10]

    Inaccuracy: UCR statistics do not represent the actual amount of criminal activity occurring in the United States. As it relies upon local law enforcement agency crime reports, the UCR program can only measure crime known to police and cannot provide an accurate representation of actual crime rates.[11]
    Misrepresentation: The UCR program is focused upon street crime, and does not record information on many other types of crime, such as organized crime, corporate crime or federal crime. Further, law enforcement agencies can provide inadvertently misleading data as a result of local policing practices. These factors can lead to misrepresentations regarding the nature and extent of criminal activity in the United States.[12]
    Manipulation: UCR data is capable of being manipulated by local law enforcement agencies. Information is supplied voluntarily to the UCR program, and manipulation of data can occur at the local level.[13]…

    10.For a detailed discussion of the limitations and weaknesses of the UCR program, see Mosher, Miethe & Phillips (2002).
    11. Holms, Maahs & Vito (2007:37). See also Myrdal (1988:88-89), Gabbidon & Greene (2005a:39), Free (2009:164).
    12. Holms, Maahs & Vito (2007:37). See also Mann (1993:27;34), Free (2009:164).
    13. Holms, Maahs & Vito (2007:37). See also Mann (1993:28-29).”

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_and_crime_in_the_United_States <-source

    The same book might not support NCVS and UCR provided by the FBI presenting the most accurate of information. I will try to get to read the book to verify but reviews mention that the book constantly contradicts itself so…


  253. Brahms,

    You said, “Then what’s the use of talking about anything? Shall we just tell our little stories about grocery stores, playground bullies, and mean people? When you find some stat on white crime, I’ll just dismiss it and say its biased. Actually, I won’t; I’m reasonable.”

    Yeah right. You will dismiss it faster than you do certain moments of history. But if there was any stat, real or fake, about black crime you will eat it up like a fat kid eating cake. So yes, what is the use?

    Stop lying to us especially when you contradict yourself in your responses. We’re not so dumb as to not recognize how you act in discussions like this. Quit hiding behind your lie of being reasonable and admit that you are biased. It would be easier on yourself if you do.


  254. _ truthbetold

    @ Oyan

    “I can relate.
    My family is the United Nations. I grew up with every colour, religion and ethnicity at our breakfast table. I also grew up overseas.
    My mom never gave us “the talk” either, til we came to America and got the rudest awakening possible.

    Being home-schooled, ( we’re rural farmers/fisherman/construction workers/sheep shearers ) going to school was shocking in the states.
    More shock came with employment.

    Whites, especially in the US, are molded, inside and out, by their own self-serving standards. That’s why un-learning their pathology is so difficult. How can you undo the damages that you create, live by and swear to?

    They feel deep down, of course they deny this, that intrinsically, they are the root cause of the problem. That’s why they spread lies, rumors, cheat, steal…anything to get away from having to see their true selves”

    YOU COULDN’T HAVE SAID IT BETTER!

    I moved out of the States at the age of 17 with my parents to my mum’s homeland which is England, although i usually go and visit my grandparents and relatives who still live in the States every now and then, and that was exactly what i observed!
    It is so sad! I know that racism is everywhere but in the States , it is …………
    well, right now i just can find the right adjectives to use!

    @ Demerera

    “Unfortunately Bell, the son was the same, clearly having learned this from his mother. He ardently pursues black women to the exclusion of any other race and of course, he has a few ‘black friends’ *rolls eyes* and feels this gives him carte blanche to participate in derogatory and ridiculous stereotypes. His mother must be so proud. ….. “.

    Well, I’m sorry about that…..

    One of my best wishes for him is to find a bird of the same feather just like him( white, of course), fall deeply in love with her and that she becomes he and his mom’s WORST NIGHTMARE!


  255. @ Brahms

    “Thank you for summing up the illogical black-centrist argument. The most recent true oppression you can point to is the KKK or Jim Crow. Do you beleive the KKK is a contemporary problem for blacks?”

    You are an idiot. Now that we have that out of the way, who the hell do you think the KKK consisted of. You act like the KKK is a well-paying, 401K getting, job. Since ancient history to you is maybe 50 years ago, what the hell do you think happened to the KKK. They continue to be teachers, politicians, police, garbage men, mailmen, pizza delivery guys, etc. just like the f*ck they were then, minus the sheet at night. You act like the KKK was some kind of racist disease that has been eliminated by a vaccine or some shit. Racism is not on a sliding scale dude; it either is or it isn’t. So I guess that guy that got ran over by a “pack” of whites didn’t happen? I guess the guy that got dragged behind a pickup truck by a “pack” of whites didn’t happen either. Just because they didn’t show it on FAUX News doesn’t mean it didn’t happen. I guess you think the news is supposed to cover 18,000 murders a year? Good luck with that. My very own brother in law was put in the hospital for two months after his car broke down in the wrong area of the state by 6 white men. (That was before he met and married my sister.) He didn’t even make the local paper. I guess it must have been all in our heads because we all know that if its not on the news it didn’t happen, right?


  256. Wilson

    “How do you know this is because of race?”

    IQ studies. Its not as if blacks, through certain breeding patterns, couldn’t overcome this deficit. IQ is inheritable.


  257. @ Brahms,

    Are you kidding me? How does my example show how black or POC parents perpetuate racism? You have a lot of nerve buddy. Since when have PoC not been systematically oppressed for very long periods of time in this country? How is it racist to tell your kids that they are being seen as different because some racist idiots think black and brown people are inferior beings and many of them are in positions to affect their lives? I love how, in your typical, cherry picking fashion, you decided to ignore the part about how “Not all whites are racist or want to target you”.

    See this is the thing that annoys me about this stuff. You whine about how blacks and PoC are being “racist” by even talking about the racism they experienced (or their kids will), but then you want to gloat and talk about how superior you are, or you try to justify when these kids are hurt by the racism that their parents warned them about. When kids avoid these conversations, they’re the ones who usually wind up really hurt and mentally scarred because they had to deal with the racist pricks who think their skin color is some personal affront.

    You act like the majority of these parents weren’t alive during the days when young black kids could be lynched or shot, or blown up because their parents wanted to vote, open a business, or share a lunch counter. You’ve proven how silly that logic of justifying racism on one end but dismissing it and just how much of a double standard that is. If you can bring up the few examples of “Flash mobs” (which don’t just consist of blacks but whatever), and black on white attacks as if it’s some sign of an empidemic, but you refuse to acknowledge the many examples of modern white on black violence, usually under the banner of the KKK or Aryan Brotherhood.

    And you seriously asked for people to list every example of racism they’ve experienced then you dismiss it and call them “cowards”? Why should they have to relive every rejection, situation of unfair treatment, etc. because you can’t take a hint?

    Your not being realistic, your being racist, that’s a fact. And you are far from reasonable. And don’t pull this “Oh I want blacks here, I want them to act right”, black people are NOT a monolith, the majority of them do NOT commit crimes, the majority of them just want to live their lives in a fair and successful manner, and you are not put in some position of authority to judge whether or not they’ve managed to “act right”.


  258. dee dee

    I don’t have the book. I’m sure there are problems with any crime reporting method but its all we have. We also have prison populations as a third vantage point. Do you not believe the statistics? If so, then there’s not much I can say further.


  259. @ Brahms

    “There were over 19,000 black-on-white rapes/sexual assaults.
    That’s about 53 every day. However, the NCVS found zero cases
    of white-on-black rape or sexual assault.”

    I guess the NCVS must have forgot about all the little, black boy loving from priest and the more recent Sandusky scandal.. How many people knew about this and didn’t tell? Just because you don’t know about it doesn’t mean its not happening. Tisk tisk.


  260. Brothawolf has been heavy lifting all over you Brahms, him and other posters have been leaving me in the dust at being able to decode and see through your stiff logic…I thank them for the logic and amunition


  261. I love that show “What Would You Do”. This episode reminded me a lot of the conversations that are taking place here.

    [youtube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XSkeIdFdifY&w=420&h=315%5D

    We just can’t win; sleeping while black…Just wow!


  262. I can not say for the majority, but I can speak for the blacks in the area where I live and was raised. We do not discuss whites on a race matter, but rather on them as a person. For example John (who is white) is crazy or funny or whatever other characteristics he has. Similar to the things I may say about my Asian friends. We focus on characteristics not skin color. The only thing I have ever heard that you may or may not consider derogatory was one of my acquaintances said and she stated “That white girl is crazy.” Not one time was it ever “Let’s hate white people” speech.


  263. @ Bell
    Thanks.
    Brahms, Doug, Bliff, Randy and the like, are all prime examples of the Puritanical Doctrine of Pathology. White America will never get past their own sickness. It would destroy them. They too are victims in this disease process. Even whites have hierarchy that they must adhere to.

    Conforming to the herd mindset means never speaking out of terms, never having an independent thought, never questioning their way of life. To do so would call unwanted attention to them and make them the victim of scrutiny. That’s why all the racist commenters here say the exact same things, almost verbatim.


  264. @ Cleonette:

    I’m sorry for what happened to your brother-in-law. The amount of outright denials and lies told by Brahms is astounding.


  265. @Cleonette

    Two Things. I’m happy your brother-in-law made it out alive. No one deserves to be attacked for just living and breathing. Also, that “What would you do” clip was not surprising. I just don’t get how anyone can be so oblivious to the inequality in America (which makes the US the least developed of developed countries). It is sort of like the “Black Like Me” book. A white man went in black face and his basic rights were immediately removed that he had as a white man. he didn’t realize that racism was real until he was in a “black” man’s shoes.


  266. @brahms

    The problem that I have with your argument is you are trying to argue that all blacks are the same. Are all whites the same? Each black person is as different as whites. You are constantly babbling about what blacks do in their home, but let me ask you….How many black homes have you been in and observed? You can pull out all the statistics you want but they are all biased in my opinion. Unless these supposed statistics are taken for everyone in the United states I don’t want to hear it. I took a class that dealt with statistics and one topic that stuck with me was how they are usually made up of a pool of certain people in a specific area which taints the level of accuracy. I would not base my whole argument on anything that could be biased in nature. Try actually getting to know black people. Not just a few but really just get to know them and make judgements on that because your majority black answers are based on caca as far as I am concern. Numbers on a paper nor do you know a majority of blacks.


  267. @ Leigh204

    Thanks a lot. It’s sad. He’s a firemen so he actually has to rescue some of the very people who would otherwise hate to see him coming. And Brahms is a lost cause. He will go to hell wearing gasoline pants. I think he is mentally/developmentally challenged. Perhaps he wasn’t hugged enough as a child. It’s hard to judge these things. Funny thing is, he would never say these things if we were all in an actual room together. He thinks the people on this blog are racist, I just so a video on youtube about this guy that said all white people need to be eliminated in order to save the world. Now that man was racist as hell. Anybody who wants to eliminate men, women, and children based on their race is insane.


  268. @ deedee

    Thanks and that book was awesome. It reminded me a little of Paul Mooney, “Everybody wants to be a n*gga but nobody wants to BE a n*gga.” His language is a bit strong for me but he drops some gems at times.


  269. All these studies and statistics about black people, have anyone black in this tread ever taken a survey actually asking them about any of this supposed data? Interviewed? Observed by a group of scientist or sociologist? I am a senior in college majoring in social science and minoring in sociology. You can find numbers and research that will help you to argue anything. I can write a 20 page paper with 10 sources about the differences in green boogers and white ones and how they effect the individuals that decide to taste test them. During my own research and the research I have observed from others, there are ALWAYS validity issues, internal and external. Not impressed by your numbers.


  270. You know what really pisses me off, is that whites feel they have the authority to tell blacks when to feel, how to feel, and what should be important to us. We can not simply live our lives without some white person, including the well-meaning ones, telling us we don’t have any reason to think what we think, say what we say, and feel what we feel. Then, they ask us or tell us to think, say and feel what they feel??? That’s white paternalism at it’s most insidious. It’s like saying you can’t handle your behavior patterns. So, let us handle them for you and be grateful that we’re doing it.


  271. Sharina, That’s a good response.

    Brahms, are all whites the same? Have you ever visited homes where black families lived? Have you ever talked to black people as human beings? Have you ever told black people the same stuff you tell them here, and observed their reactions and responses?

    Here’s the main flaw in your “research”, Brahms. You heavily rely on statistics, news reports, I.Q. numbers, probabilities, and anything else devised by mostly white people, and ignore and object any forms of information from the very people you rant about. What sense does it make to listen to a white person about how black people are as opposed to directing interacting with black people and treat them as people?

    Do you think that it’s a good idea for a man to get advice about women from another man without question? Why can’t they listen to women?

    In short what’s so wrong about learning about a marginalized group from the marginalized group themselves?

    You may think you’re an intellectual on black-white relations, but what you’ve said is nothing more than KKK hatred wrapped up in a dazzling paper of scientific methods.


  272. @ Brothawolf,

    No he’s like a sexist guy who only reads misogynist bloggers or Maxim for his opinions on how to view and approach women. Any woman who tells him “No, we don’t all act promiscuous and we don’t all want you.” gets blown off as being “feminazi” because in his mind, the only person who can truly talk about or know women is a man. The sort of guy who knows “all women” because he got rejected by one in high school.


  273. Cleonette says”, I just so a video on youtube about this guy that said all white people need to be eliminated in order to save the world. Now that man was racist as hell. Anybody who wants to eliminate men, women, and children based on their race is insane.” would post the video up? I think I may have an idea of who you are talking about. Was it that guy from the Nation of Islam?


  274. @ Cleonette,

    Wow…that’s just wrong.

    @ Nana,

    Which guy? The Nation of Islam doesn’t really propose things like that…


  275. @brothawolf

    “Here’s the main flaw in your “research”, Brahms. You heavily rely on statistics, news reports, I.Q. numbers, probabilities, and anything else devised by mostly white people, and ignore and object any forms of information from the very people you rant about. What sense does it make to listen to a white person about how black people are as opposed to directing interacting with black people and treat them as people? ”

    I call it psuedo intellectual claptrap. There’s a lot of it being directed towards POC these days.


  276. Cleonette says”, I just so a video on youtube about this guy that said all white people need to be eliminated in order to save the world. Now that man was racist as hell. Anybody who wants to eliminate men, women, and children based on their race is insane.”

    I don’t know, maybe that guy was coming from a place of hurt. I don’t condone genocide but let’s be real here, most of our people( and many others) have had countless of encounters with whites that have been extremely negative. I don’t think whites have the capability of living with others in peace, because they have a serious need to dominate others. I do believe they are naturally racist. They are a miserable people and they spread their misery to others( hence the constant need to bring our spirits down). You call the man in the video advocating the genocide(which I do believe is wrong) of the white race insane but What about whites who have done (and do) it with so much ease with SEVERAL others.. what do you call them?The majority of them are benefiting off of other people’s death and suffering and THEY KNOW IT. How long do we have to wait and see that there is something terribly wrong? How long must we suffer? I really want to believe that whites are not evil but I see way to much evidence around me that suggest otherwise.Everybody is capable of being evil but whites are something special, they are really extra with theirs. I am still young and I am still learning( thought I do feel like I have learned enough) But right now… I am starting to believe we need to completely separate ourselves from them. I mean COMPLETE separation. They are toxic to us. They’ve poisoned us and we are sick. The only cure is complete separation.


  277. At Ace
    Khalid Muhammad

    He explains why he said those things in this interview

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=56RcSbxuXjA ( I think you may have to watch the other parts for his explanation)


  278. @ nana

    I call them insane too. I believe in self-defense but not killing off innocent people in an act of genocide. Never, no matter what, will I say genocide is the answer for anything.


  279. @ Cleo, Nana,

    I can never dismiss an entire race as all falling under a negative trait. And I can never agree with the idea that an entire race needs to be disenfranchised or destroyed, no matter what they’ve done.

    I do feel that white people have collectively been lacking in any sort of real humility when it comes to race relations, so I feel they need do be the ones to start any real true reconciliation (as would anyone who’s hurt someone purposely or accidently), but I believe that complete separation would just screw over everyone, .


  280. Amazing, how reasonable you sound. (OK, this is coming from a country where the schools are classified in black and white by a system which would consider Trayvon as white and Zimmy as black.)


  281. As a white American, I honestly cant tell any black person living in America, but , especialy black Americans ( it seems Brahms, a confessed person of color , is directing his racism towards black Americans, almost as though it was cultural , as though black American culture and his perceived behaviour of it is what is bothering him, but , I really dont know) that you can trust white people , or people from other countries that come to America and fall into the white racist mind set.

    I cant blame any black American for making their own desician about how they want to deal with this fact of life they have to live with.

    I know their will always be people who gravitate towards the middle and that is where I will be


  282. @ B.R.,

    When did Brahms say he was a PoC? I must’ve missed that.

    Well, I think you have a very reasonable viewpoint. People can’t seem to figure out that it’s not the job of every white person in America to sit up on a pedestal and tell “lowly” people of color how to live, just as it isn’t the job of every rich slob to tell everyone else how to deal with the situations they’ve been put in.

    It be different if they didn’t only seem to pop up with these “statistics” and wonderful “tidbits of advice” when it was time to stick it to people of color, they seem to have no interest in the well being of the people they’re talking about otherwise.


  283. Ace, if im not mistaken, Brahms had a post about his parents sitting him down and telling him what to expect from white America and how he is suposed to act. I think he mentioned he had some Indian from India ancestry , but, I could be totaly mistaken about that

    Brahms, correct me if Im wrong

    For sure , Ace, no white person should be telling a black person how to act or what they should be feeling , especialy in this American society

    The “white racist creep” antenna has to be oiled and ready to be put in place at all times


  284. That has to be a big drag to always have to be wary and on the lookout for racism and discrimination on all its insidious levals

    especialy the subtile forms


  285. @ Ace, Cleo and Nana

    Separation doesn’t work.
    History has proved that. Under Jim Crow laws, coloureds had to use separate facilities, schooling, living quarters, etc.
    But whites still invaded our spaces to cause mayhem.

    Even on this blog, designed for us, by us, they still invade, tell us that we’re wrong, how to think and feel.
    Whites have been indoctrined from birth to believe their race is prime.
    You can pick any thread here and see the evidence of that principal.

    The need for control comes from a dark, twisted, lonely place. That’s why they latch themselves onto our food, customs, music, dress, men and women. I visited Harlem recently. It’s on its way to being gentrified.

    It’s been proven over and over again that for a race of people consumed with superiority, they are obsessed, ever lustful and strangely, wary of blacks. Makes you wonder if the gnawing need to connect with us comes from a place of malicious envy.


  286. @ brothawolf

    What pisses me off about the Father Knows Best mentality is they never offer any solutions to ANY problems, including their own! They just criticize gleefully and expect us to roll over and accept it.


  287. Ace said ” but I believe that complete separation would just screw over everyone, .”

    how so? I guess you forgot within the past 400 years ,in ‘ the time of assimilation’, it was (is) people of color that were (are) being screwed over . Do you prefer that?

    Truth” Separation doesn’t work.
    History has proved that. Under Jim Crow laws, coloureds had to use separate facilities, schooling, living quarters, etc.”

    Yea but that was under jim crow. I said COMPLETE separation. Where they have absolutely no say in ANY type of institution in our societies/ communities. Where they won’t be able to discriminate against us in ANY form. Where they won’t be able to bully us anymore. Where our destinies are shaped for us and BY us. Where there won’t be any limitations places solely based on the way we look. I know many people love their beloved whites and can’t fathom the idea of any separation from them, but if you want true happiness as a people, there needs to be separation. As you have seen countless of times, they have no desire to make peace with people of color. The only relationship whites can have with others is a relationship of domination (with them being at the top or else all hell will break lose).

    ” We must leave them and direct our energies toward the recreation of cultural alternatives informed by ancestral visions of a future that celebrates our ancient cultures and encourages the BEST of the human spirit. Each of the cultures historically victimized by Europe must reclaim its own image. As for those of us who are African, our salvation (redemption) lies in our ancientness and connectedness ; not in a romanticized glorification of the past, but a return to the center in which all contradictions are resolved and from which the spiral of development can continue with clarity.”- Dr. Marimba


  288. @abagond Sun 22 Apr 2012 at 16:38:18

    If whites truly cared about the black murder rate they would do something serious about it.

    We do, we put the black criminals in jail, just like we put the white criminals in jail. That has led to a decrease in crime rates over the past 20 yrs or so.

    Besides that, what are we to do. Blacks won’t listen to whites on anything. Whenever whites try to talk to blacks, like me on this blog, we get shouted down by cries of “racist, racist”, so what can we do?

    Young black gang-bangers and thugs aren’t going to listen any white guy.

    Besides that, when there is heavy policing in the high crime black communities, there is more support for the criminals than the police. We hear about the police disrepecting the black community, but what about the blacks disrepecting the police? Are you so naive to believe that most of the young blacks that are stopped by the police are respectful to the police? I don’t think so.

    The black community got its freedoms in the 1960s and have not done such a good job of living free and responsible. Probably part of the reason why the whites prior to that kept the blacks on a short chain.


  289. Nana

    You raise some interesting points worth serious contemplation. After 400 years, whites have shown no desire to remove their boot heels from our necks. Moreover, whites have *collectively* demonstrated that they don’t wish to live amongst us for various BS reasons – so WHY NOT separate altogether?

    How would you propose bringing about a permanent division of *willing* blacks and whites in America?


  290. ^^^ yikes, ignorance at its finest. Oh well, such is the way for whites. They get to be ignorant about everything. They shove their ish down your throat and get(or try) to convince everyone(even themselves) that you’re eating the finest chocolate. These type of people seriously disgust me.


  291. not you matari sorry. :)


  292. Matari said “How would you propose bringing about a permanent division of *willing* blacks and whites in America?”

    Now this is a GOOD question and I’ll get back to that later.


  293. The problem is this: Honesty.

    People on both sides lie.

    Whites lie about the extent of racism. It’s quite pernicious and pervasive.

    Blacks are unconcerned that the accurate portrayal of social behavior doesn’t show black Americans in a very good light: a significant subsection of the black population is radically violent and “anti”: anti everything, including themselves.

    Whites say that they’re racist because blacks are very demonstrably not to be trusted. In the papers this week, three more cases of black kids going to town on random white people, one of which at least (finally) landed a hate charge; let’s see if it sticks.

    Blacks say there’s a wholly dysfunctional subclass (when they admit this is true) due to racism.

    The circle of hatred continues, and where it began is obvious – slaves should never have been brought here, and it should have been compensated properly after the Civil War. It wasn’t, and racism continued, and even now that whites of the liberal variety want to make amends, they do so in ass-backward ways, and in all honesty – blacks aren’t interested. What they want is a reversal of history, or modern attempts thereat.

    Needless to say, this cycle is obviously self-sustaining and self-generating. It’s unlikely to stop. Both whites and blacks have to simultaneously get off this train.

    Pollyanna libera whites think that by doing this first, they get brownie points and Hi Fives for their rabid anti-racism. What it gets is black sniggers when a white woman gets raped (to calls of “Stupid white chick what was she thinking / She had it coming, damned white people”), or grandfathers get the snot beaten out of them by young punks for no reason other than they’re qhite.

    Calling back to times when whites did this doesn’t help: Are we to expect 250 years of vengeance street justice? In that case, whites would be best advised to buy guns, and shoot young black men on sight, for proactive self-defence, and we can just get down and have our futile race war.

    Obviously this train has to stop: And calls from either side for the other side to stop first are justifiable to their supporters but just as futile.

    Perhaps what angry blacks and whites need is segregation. Clearly, there’s a vast number of black people who now distrust and hate whites – for good reason. And a lot of white people who hate and distrust blacks for good reason.

    Alas, segregation won’t work.

    So how to get off this train to mutual self destruction is beyond me.


  294. “The black community got its freedoms in the 1960s and have not done such a good job of living free and responsible. Probably part of the reason why the whites prior to that kept the blacks on a short chain.”

    *It’s incredibly amazing to witness how much stupidity/idiocy (and inability to reason from A to B) can exist in only one racist!*

    smh

    Whiteness is truly demonic!


  295. Gorbachav, sometimes, I think its just better if white people just kind of be quiet and listen, really try to step back and try to understand why there is so much anger and frustration…

    Somehow, your breakdown doesnt hit all the spots Id like to hear , to endorese it


  296. @Matari

    It’s incredibly amazing to witness how much stupidity/idiocy (and inability to reason from A to B) can exist in only one racist!

    Whiteness is truly demonic!

    Typical black response – chip-on-the-shoulder, “Oh, you’re so stupid”. No wonder there is no real dialogue between black and white even on this blog.

    So, Matari, are you trying to say that you don’t agree with my “The black community got its freedoms in the 1960s and have not done such a good job of living free and responsible. ” statement?

    Why don’t you try a real dialogue and state why you disagree. (I’ll bet your answer includes the r-word.)


  297. ( just between you and me , Matari, they would have to drag me off kicking and screaming to be sentanced to a life of fart lighting, mooning people in fast cars and nascar events)


  298. @Gorbachev

    I’m not sure if we can say a “significant” portion of african-americans are violent, yes I know 50% of murders are done by african-americans but once we factor for age, sex etc…..doesn’t that drop down to less than 2% of African-Americans?


  299. I personally believe until people experience the injustice, they will not understand the injustice. I was very impressed by the blue eyed brown eyed study in which a teacher subjected her blue eyed students to the same racial hatred that blacks experience. It brought up a massive about of dialogue between individuals of color and white that was basically necessary for the understand of what blacks go through, but also what whites have been ignorant of themselves. I know that type of study is unheard of on a large scale, but it would be a great start if it could be implemented. A better curriculm on black studies would a start in my book as it will show black contributions and not just blacks were slaves. People need to be aware that not all blacks came here as slaves. Some were actually here free.


  300. Abagond

    Whites are not gonna be honest about slavery, racism, crime, etc. Denial is the foundation of whiteness on this planet. Even so-called good white people are afraid to admit the truth. As a group, whites have put all of their cards on the table. They’re gonna stick together and maintain their grip on power, or, they’re gonna go down in a ball of flames…Bottomline! Doesn’t matter what part of the globe they hail from, the same mindset exist at all times…European, Arab, Persian, East-Indian, Australian, American, Canadian, Spanish, and so forth. Yes, a disproportionate number of blacks involve themselves in crime and violence in this country, but, who is the source of the problem…Whites! No matter how dysfunctional some blacks may be, we always have to point the finger of blame at the source…Always! All of the self-hatred and chaos that we see in our race is born out of the wickedness of white people on this planet. Whites may not like hearing the ugly truth about themselves, but they need to. Continuing to insult the intelligence of black folk is just digging a deeper hole for themselves. They think that blacks will seek retribution against them because of what their forefathers did in the past and are still doing today…Ditto! Black folk don’t want a damn’ thing from whites, all we want is to be left the hell alone when it’s all said and done. Whites can do whatever, but they gotta mind their own affairs. Knowing what we know, whites are not gonna do that. The Treyvon Martin tragedy has been a slap in the face for a lot of blacks in this country who assumed that white folk had really changed…Hell No! The civil-rights movement was a smokescreen, an illusion so to speak. I’m amazed at the number of us who fell for the lie, Seriously! Whites can’t survive on this planet without black people. All that whites have on this planet came out of the african slave trade, Everything! If black people cut whites off from our race and culture, they wouldn’t know what to do with themselves…Real Talk! It’s important that black people understand this truth about whites going forward. If they can’t exploit blackness…They Die!

    Tyrone
    MindScape


  301. @ Tyrone

    Well spoken and clear to the point!
    I agree that they can’t seem to live without us, in one way or the other. This blog is proof of that.

    Funny isn’t it?
    Whites think we want to be like them. We may envy their material goods, but not who they are. All we want is to be left the hell alone.


  302. Personally I refuse to believe in such concept as Race. I think if you accept that and begin to modify your behavior based on the idea of race, you are already IN the racist system. If you start to solve problems on racial lines, you are supporting the system.

    We should get rid of it. Refuse to accept anything else but one race, human race. We should refuse to define ourselves by any racial epithet. When ever someone says we are white or black or brown race, we should correct them by saying I am a humanbeing. There is only one race of humans on this planet biologically. That is all of us.

    Racists want us believe there are different human races. Their power depends on that idea. Their system is based on that belief. As long as people suscribe that very idea, they unwillingly or willingly support the ideology. We should refuse to do that, just flush it down where it belongs.

    I recognise different cultures, different languages. I recognise different colors of skin, hair, eyes. Some of us are tall, short, fat, slim, fit, big or small. But we are all humanbeings. Every last one of us.

    Racists want us to forget that. That is how they survive and rule. They divide us and make us believe in that division. They make you believe in their ideology very quietly, by brainwashing, by repetition of images and pictures, repetition of ideas, small bits in our cultural stream, here and there. sayings and words. Soon you repeat their message and think that it is sensible, that it is good idea. That it is sensible. That madness is reason.

    Racists survive only when we are divided. They survive only as long as we all live by their code, by their instructions and guidance. They want us to be divided because we are many and they are few. They want us to be blind so that we would not notice that. So that we would not understand that we are many and they are few. But one day we will see. One day we will be united as humanbeings.

    That is their biggest fear. That is their horror. They are scared of the day when so called Race does no longer define any of us. They depend on that and when that is finished, they are finished.

    When so called Race no longer stops the smallest and the weakest of us for doing what ever we want, when so called Race no longer stops any of us for going anywhere we want with whom ever we want, the racists are finished. And that day is coming. They can not stop it. It is in the numbers. They are few and we are many, and every day they get fewer, weaker. Every single day that day is closer.

    That is why they are here hysterically promoting their ideology. That is why they are here singing their songs for those who do not hear, who do not see. That is why they are here provoking and bullying, creating discord and division, falsifying and lying, trying to keep up the racist ideology. That is what they are here for: to make the belief in to so called Races stronger, to make us believe in their idea.

    I refuse that. I work my brain. I try to see and hear. I want to see the beast without the nice clothes, hear the beast hiss withouth the nice words, see its ugly face without the mask of reason. I want to see it as it is: the beast, eater of humanbeings, bringer of misery and chaos, violence and sorrow. That is the Beast of racism, the racist System.

    I know this is hippie shit but I do not care. I can choose and I choose the side of humanbeings, against the Beast that wants to consume us all in its jaws of hatred.

    Peace and sorry about the preaching again.


  303. @truthbetold

    Good lookin’ out my man. It’s common sense, that’s all it is. Envy is the word black people. If whiteness was so wonderful, they wouldn’t hate us as black people. Evidently, that’s not the case my brotha. We can’t make white folks happy, because, they’re never gonna be happy. Un-Blackness means what it says, Not Black! Black people can’t waste time with that foolishness, it has nothing to do with us. Yes, i sound like a broken record with some of my posts, but repetition is good. Brainwashing takes time, and detoxing takes even longer. Stay Alive…Stay Free…Stay Black!!!

    Tyrone
    Black Eros Movement…Black, Brown & Gold


  304. @Sharina

    A better curriculm on black studies would a start in my book as it will show black contributions and not just blacks were slaves.

    I think the best curriculm would be to cut out all talk about the former USA slavery in any discussions of race relations. Blacks are mentally stuck believing that their ancestors’ status as slaves somehow affects their status today. It doesn’t. It’s just a hangup and a scheme to manipulate whites by complaining about their long ago ancestors.

    Slavery should no longer be part of the black-white dialogue.


  305. @Tyrone

    Denial is the foundation of whiteness on this planet….All of the self-hatred and chaos that we see in our race is born out of the wickedness of white people on this planet…… Whites can’t survive on this planet without black people……If black people cut whites off from our race and culture, they wouldn’t know what to do with themselves… If whiteness was so wonderful, they wouldn’t hate us as black people.

    Would you say you’re a racist, Tyrone?? Just a little wack, don’t you think?? No wonder it’s hard to take what blacks say seriously without a lot of scrutiny.


  306. “Why don’t you try a real dialogue and state why you disagree.”

    ****************

    Why should I waste my time with you??
    The dialogue you’re wanting has been replicated hundreds if not thousands of times right HERE on this blog in countless posts and in the comment sections. Many here have painstakening attempted to break it all down into little bites that even a first grader could handle – yet it goes over your head or you simply dismiss it out of hand. Watching water evaporate would be more productive than dialoguing with people that think and act as you do.

    Perhaps if you would spend less time talking and more time reading you MIGHT learn some things. Yet, you’ve made it clear time after time, you not here to LEARN – you’re here to tell us your BS that no one, save RR, is buying. For some peculiar reason you believe that blacks should follow whiteness’ counsel/ways … as if we have no moral/spiritual compass or conscience/wisdom. The truth is that it is whiteness that suffers from that lack – only you’re really too deluded/too far gone to see it.


  307. @Matari

    Why should I waste my time with you??

    Thanks for validating my previous response:

    “Typical black response – chip-on-the-shoulder, “Oh, you’re so stupid”. No wonder there is no real dialogue between black and white even on this blog.”

    It’s know-it-all people like you, who have their minds closed, and are too good to converse with other people, that make real black-white dialogue impossible.

    You are part of the problem, not the solution.


  308. Bliff,

    If white racism is a sickness, you would be in critical condition.


  309. @ Nana,

    No. As one of those “people of color” your referring to I’d much rather not have the past 400 years happen as they have. I get your anger and honestly I can’t blame you for feeling that way. It’s not like white people have really done a good job of actually acting like they didn’t think slavery, oppression, and Jim Crow were good things. What I do mean is that I don’t think separation is something that would help as much as hurt, people worked too hard. I also think that’s true because so many black people and people of color are Americans, grew up as Americans, etc. They shouldn’t have to be uprooted again just because racists can’t grow up and get with the program.

    @ Bliff,

    Why do you get a say on what is part of the black’white dialogue. You need a correction: Black people are more focused on how their race affects their status today, like everyone else. Did you ever think, for once, that black people do n’t revolve their lives around white people, and maybe just want some semblance of equality that a law doesn’t need to enforce?

    Sadly, the history of slavery was a huge part of their history and was the basis for the many laws that disenfranchised blacks until the late sixties. In fact, unlike you, they don’t have the luxury of taking slavery “out of the narrative” if only because it’s so tied into their culture and family history, you can’t tell them to ignore that any more than you can tell Americans to phase out the American Revolution. And frankly, if white people didn’t want slavery as part of the narrative, they shouldn’t have kept it going for hundreds of years, no one put a gun to their heads and said, “You MUST keep these slaves in deplorable conditions for a minimum of 200 years, and then treat them like slaves once you can’t keep them officially anymore!.” Black people have only had any official rights since like the late sixties, but keep in mind, that’s within many people’s lifetimes. White people had hundreds of years to get themselves “together” and yet have high crime, drug use, and other societal ills plaguing them just as much as other races. If your going to claim that black people have somehow only themselves to blame for a racist institution, remnants of Jim Crow laws, and unfair stereotypes, why don’t you actually include the Irish, Polish, Russian, Italian, and British people into that equation, since they’ve had complexion protection for centuries and still can’t “get it together”,

    You don’t really get to decide after the fact that discussing those things are not convenient, especially when your intent on throwing in your own crime statistics and “perspective” and expect others to consider them. Doesn’t a dialogue only work if your willing to show some humility and actually consider the history and perspective of the people your talking to (and about)?


  310. Rev Sam

    Good message, but you’re preachin’ at the choir. The ones that need to hear it and take it *in* are those like Randy and his flock, Bluff, Dog and Braun-less. Can you see these guys changing?? Those like Randy far outnumber those like you/B.R./Matthew …As long as significant/overwhelming numbers of whites deem themselves “white” and the rest as “other,” this miserable system lives on – short of a revolution…


  311. @Bliff learn to read. I noticed how you picked out certain parts of what I said and did not actually read what I said. For one not all blacks came over as slaves and if education in the schools where correct then it would be reporting that. I never said anything about how we should go into slave talk to help with relations of groups. I also noted that we should be talking about black contributions. We always talk about white contributions in school but oh blacks did nothing right. Based on your messed up half reading skills you failed to notice what I actually typed, Even though you quoted me back word for word. Proving many of the points that others have mentioned in regards to people like you. Running that mouth and never listening.


  312. @ Bliff

    You are a troll. There is no such thing as having a real dialogue with you.


  313. Sharina, Matari, Ace, Sam , Brothawolf, Truthbetold, the ideas of others on here in that same vein, Im impressed with the leval of ideas coming from you all…Im always learning from you , and, from others on the other threads…


  314. I think white people dont understand, based on the real unbeleivibly violent past of slavery, and the horrendous violence from the Civil War and the jim crow / klan violence afterwards, how it translated into white flight in the north, totaly manipulated by the local governments and the realters, that we all have to deal with our racism and the racism that our institutions forged in place. And, how it plays out in everyday life in our society.

    We have to look inside to see the racist impulses that have been brainwashed into us about what to think and how to feel, and learn how to surpress that impulse. And , we have to be vigilant about it and never feel that we have arrived. Its a constant battle to be aware of racist impulses that are fears we have been led to beleive since we can understand the media and what other white people are saying around us


  315. “We” meaning collective white America


  316. @ B.R. The thing for me… this is about all people of color. I hate seeing people diminish who they are to fit into this idea of what white society sees as right and the more we try to fit into this mold the more I see people just not living up to the supposed expectations. I have asians friends and they are always trying to fit into white culture. I had an indian friend whose cousin would always treat him bad because he was not more white and much darker than him. I have met amazing muslims who are constantly being teased because they are not fitting into the white culture. I married into a Mexiacan family and I am constantly seeing them being mistreated just because they are Mexican. It hurts becaue it is not right. We all are different and we just wanted to be respected for who we are. Not torn down into nothing because we are not who White people want us to be. I have a ton of white friends and I love them and the reason we have that love is because they understand that I am who I am, but I realize not all whites are like that and those whites are the problem.


  317. why Dont You Try A Real Dialogue And State Why You Disagree.

    He doesn’t have to. ‘Dialoging’ with you is like farting in a wind tunnel, a colossal waste of time.

    http://herneithmyblog.com/2012/04/21/the-day-in-the-life-of-a-white-racist-troll/


  318. @ B.R.

    The fact that whites will not and cannot see that they too are affected by racism, their racism, is the very reason it continues.
    Every decision they make from jobs to housing to what schools to send their children is based, intentionally or unintentionally on us.


  319. know how blacks about whites in their own homes…

    There is nothing black people say about whites in their homes that they aren’t saying here in public forums.

    Contrast that with the DWRP–Drunken White Racist Phenomenon. In this situation, when white people become drunk, they become racist, and in some cases, dangerous. (It’s unique among whites). E.G. Mel Gibson. Granted, alcohol doesn’t make you say anything you didn’t already believe. It only makes you un-censor yourself.


  320. Sharina, thanks for your insights, and sharing your personal experiances. Trying to fit in a white system is a constant source of stress. I hear you too , Truthbetold. These white people just dont want to face it. They dont want to face and take responsibility for what white racism caused. They are on disconnect. They have no idea that is is all of our problem these problems in poor black American communities. And, as Ace has said, no one is looking for a handout, just even up the playing feild

    I just find it boggles the mind listening to white people on here hiding behind statistics about black American crime, most coming from ghettos , when pure unadaltered white racism created those ghettos.

    White racism created and white people have a big responsibility to fix it


  321. on Mon 23 Apr 2012 at 23:23:00 phoebeprunelle

    Why those who classify themselves as “white’ do what they do. . . you would have to seriously consider what Michael Bradley says.

    It’s not pretty, but it is the truth.

    Readings: “The Iceman’s Inheritance: Prehistoric Sources of Western Man’s Racism, Sexism and Aggression”

    The key word there is aggression–somehow those who settled in the colder, harsher climates of Eurasia tend to have an “edge” over others.

    Just sayin.


  322. on Mon 23 Apr 2012 at 23:30:21 phoebeprunelle

    I realized that what I said may be slightly off topic, but to answer the original question posed, in order for black people to point out the flaws of whites–they (whites) would have to be in a situation in which they dealt with us on our terms. So far, they (whites) have not had to.


  323. Why is it that white racists cannot distinguish between race/hate crime and interracial crimes?

    interracial crime DOES NOT = race/hate crime. Motive determines hate crime. Most crimes blacks commit against whites are driven by MONEY (e.g robbery).

    There are FAR MORE whites than blacks, so it makes sense that “white” victims are easier to come by than the other way around.


  324. Bliff,

    You said, “I think the best curriculm would be to cut out all talk about the former USA slavery in any discussions of race relations. Blacks are mentally stuck believing that their ancestors’ status as slaves somehow affects their status today. It doesn’t. It’s just a hangup and a scheme to manipulate whites by complaining about their long ago ancestors.Slavery should no longer be part of the black-white dialogue.” In fact that’s what you’ve always been saying.

    Like it or not, slavery is a HUGE part of this and all discussions of race relations. It’s a major factor as to the conditions blacks still face today–that and other moments of history’s black oppression up to this very second. You can not sit here with a straight face and say that slavery is not a significant contribution. Besides, if it wasn’t that major, why are you afraid of having it discussed?

    In the end that’s what it’s about. You’re afraid of bring up history that shows the evils of white people. That is something you can’t live with no matter what. You are more than willing to bury those dark moments just to ease your shame.

    Here’s the deal, the past–the uncensored, non-sweetened past is a part of the human existence whether it deals with historical, scientific, social and personal truths. One can not say that it doesn’t matter and still search for the truth. That is an example of cognitive dissonance, and you are loaded with it.


  325. @Mel

    Not really; most people commit crimes against the people they live on or near by.

    Its why black people mostly murder black people instead of mostly murdering white people and so on.

    Why most rapes are actually done by family members, friends etc….and not strangers.

    Though; considering the level of antagonism between black and white people, can you honestly say racism doesn’t have anything to do with who the targets are when they happen to be of another race?

    That and ratio-wise it exceeds how many white people there are by a little bit, what is it 83 or 87% of interracial crimes are black on white despite white people only being 67% of the population?

    At that point; thats more than just there being more white people.


  326. Thing is, when we talk about “whiteness” it’s not just the color of the skin, its the mindset that most whites posses. They need to identify being white because they believe that skin color is related to intelligence, behavior, etc.

    There is no law against claiming to be any particular race. Let me explain. I worked for the Census two years ago. We were told specifically not to assume the race of anyone and always ask, “What race do you identify with”, and mark whatever answer was given. I was surprised at some of the answers I got. I noticed that a lot of Mexicans, Hispanics, etc. hardly ever indicated that they were. They either chose black or white. I went to a house of what I would have thought all the 5 people there would have picked that they were white but they all chose black. It made me think about all the forms I have filled out and it asked for race. Some of them required a signature asking if all the information was accurate and some did not.

    In essence though, after extensive research I found there is no law requiring people to be any one race nor what they choose to identify with. It made me wonder, what if black people began to all identify with being white on every form, including birth certificates for their children, drivers licences, and applications? White people would be outraged! There would be no way for them to fight it unless they came up with laws that actually proved what race someone was. Thing is, there is really NO RACE, just the human race. So how could they prove who was black and who was white? Eye color? Skin tone? Blood test? None of these things are actually race specific. There is no test to determine “race” because race is a socialistic construct as it relates to America. Can you imagine if black people actually did this in record numbers? I bet the statistic-loving racist would have a fit!


  327. on Tue 24 Apr 2012 at 05:13:15 phoebeprunelle

    There is a such thing as “race”–and as many people have pointed out it is a social construct designed to keep those who classify themselves as “white” in control of paradigms, language, the telling of history etc.

    Hispanics and Latinos/Latinas for the most part classify themselves as “white” for two reasons:

    1. Their ancestors who were the indigenious peoples of south and central America were overtaken and colonized by the Spaniards and to a lesser degree the Portuguese. This accounts for their appearance in skin color (although some are very brown and could not pass), hair texture and language.
    2. They understand the benefits of being able to classify themselves as “whites” socially. Color passing if you will is not anything new among people of color who have the same oppressor in common and in recent history it has been the Europeans.

    The idea of “race” is not one that exists only in the U.S.–it is global. It is funny that many commentators on this blog speak as though colorism does not transcend geographic borders and effects the lives of not just the browns, blacks, and yellows of the world, but also the said whites.

    Anyone could identify themselves as “white”–but what are the implications of that? What does it say about how the weight of history effects every human being alive today? What does it say about our humanity? To answer these questions would take a really long and honest look at human history.


  328. @matari:

    I preach to other whites. Just like here my words are for those who happen to be here. Bliff and these guys, as we see right in this thread, are happy when they create chaos and happy to aggrivate everybody. That is their method. They are happy to speard the misery because they are terrified. They see tha sun of racism going down. And there is nothing they can do about it.

    And yes, we need a revolution, absolutely. We need to change the way people are thinkin, the way the system operates. Not just in one country, but all over.

    @herneith:
    :D you are right!

    @phoebeprunelle:

    Like you said, it is a social construction. It is an idea. Just like abagond showed in earlier post, race as concept we know did not excist before 1600′s. So historically it is quite recent phenomena. And because it is an idea, and very young too, I believe it can be destroyed. Just like it was created by men, it can be destroyed by men.

    Great ideologies and religions of the past were once seen as realities, things that would be forever. Egyptian religions lasted thousands of years. Thousands of years! And where are they now? Marxim-leninism lasted only few decades but look how it was seen in early 1980′s only ten years of its fall!

    We, who live under racism, who see it, who have been conditioned into it from our births, do not see how young it is. We do not see how artificial it is. That is because we were born into it, we were educated into it and we live in it. We have not seen times without racism. That is why we may fall in to the trap and think it is immovable, ancient truth, just like the racists want us to believe.

    But cracks are appearing. Today we know, for absolute scientific truth, that there is only one biological race on this planet. There is no doubt of that. Yet, only few decades ago it was given, that there are biological races. Very short time ago we were told by scientists that there are separate races of humans as a fact. And yet, now we know that is not true.

    Blogs like these are important too. These chip away the racist system. Like a water the anti-racist ideas seep into those cracks, erode it from with in, crumbling it slowly but surely. One day, when it has weaken enough, that wall will come tumbling down. Just like every other wall in huma history.

    We just have to work towards that goal. We have to keep up the fight. We must never surrender our minds. Those of us who see, must speak to those who are still blind. Just like abagond is doing here. And just like all the people in the history who have spoken the truth, he meets resistance, ridicule, attacks, scorn, everything possible from those who are scared or hate his voice. His message.

    But still, here it is and they can’t do nothing about it. The voice from this blog and others carry on, they are heard and seen. There is no stopping it anymore. It is out there. The end of racism as we know it is already here, it is already happening. Some do not know it yet but it has begun.

    That is why racists here react so violently, why they react like that everywhere. They see their world, tha racist world, shrinking and fast. There is no where to run anymore.


  329. @ Sam,

    Well thought! Racism has always been a crutch for people who are trying to cling to any control they can have over their existence, so they react violently when people want to challenge it. Sometimes very violently.

    I think that’s why we’re seeing a resurgence of the push to cut the contributions of people of color (especially indigenous people, Hispanics and people of African descent) and their oppression committed by white society out of the school books. A lot of unspoken rules on race, gender and sexuality are being broken constantly and people are clinging to any “lifeboat” they can find, so they think that reeducating young people can reestablish the caste system (if you can get a kid young enough to believe that his people have no place or contribution in society, you have a new underclass of kids who think they have nothing to be proud of). President Obama and people like Sotamayor just made them panic enough to start that in force. .

    I honestly think that’s why the need to constantly bring up black crime (and make up black-on-white attack numbers to fit whatever the racist publications publish that month) is so prevalent now. To counter the positive images of black people in society, there’s a rush to push the old stereotypes and racist entitlement to a level, combined with a need to suppress any talk of racism, white-on-people of color hate crimes, modern disenfranchisement and past acts of genocide (slavery, trail of tears, holocaust, etc.).

    I think that’s why you never hear about Tulsa, Rosewood, etc. but people are quick to remember black riots (or suspected riots).


  330. I don’t see “nowhere to run”. Whites have lots of places to run: right back to “our own”, into the native tribalism that comes so easily to everyone.

    We can easily teach our kids that blacks hate us, will rob us and steal from us whenever possible, dislike work and are generally culturally inclined not to perform, to loaf off, and to goof around while everyone else makes money and tries to keep their heads above water. We’ll point out the staggering success of Asians in the US and say: Emulate these people. Here’s a set of cultures that will end up owning everything. They’ll end up running society because their cultures are good at concentrating, developing and syncretizing ideas. They’re good at sacrificing now and planning for the future. When they commit crimes, they tend to be smart and organized about it, in a kind of forward-thinking confidence-man way. And they protect their own. And they don’t give a tiny fart for notions of political correctness that oblige others to feel guilty.

    To continue in the sarcasm, just in case you don’t pick up on it:

    Like Tyrone says, it must be because we need American Blackness and its powerful essence and that we’re envious. Right?

    Meanwhile, because we’re all born guilty and anyway being white (or, very soon, Asian, … anyway not Black) means we’re guilty and inferior, we can go into this shell and just tell our kids not to fraternize with blacks, on the off chance that–

    – you’ll be called racist for treating them the same way you’d treat anyone
    – You’ll be called racist for treating them specially
    – You’ll be called racist for not treating them specially
    – You’ll be called racist for worrying about wandering through any of the burnt-out shells of urban cores plagued with random, senseless crime, most of which, even many black people notice, is committed by black people of a certain class
    – You’ll be called racist for making the single straightforward conclusion that even the most liberal non-blacks make when picking schools for their kids: the larger the percentage of urban black kids, the higher the dangerous crime and drugs and general delinquency at the school, and the lower the standards as others flee (even liberals vote with their feet – duplicitous bastards)
    - you’ll be called racist for virtually everything you ever say. There’s no way to win. Don’t bother. BTW, ignore the absolutely Politically Correct media – they never report anything not Officially Approved.

    * Note: not wholly sarcastic: I worked in a news organization for many years. In the late 90′s and early 2000′s, there were explicit policies to underplay any crimes committed by black people, obfuscate and hide the identities of perpetrators and exaggerate any crimes committed by whites against blacks as if they were all evidence of a white-generated race war. As much as you may contend that the mainstream media is White-biased, on an operational level, most editors will say the opposite – they go out of their way to downplay even the most heinous crimes committed by blacks; they;ll also say that their fathers and grandfathers did the opposite: Exaggerated black crimes as much as possible. So it’s a bit like payback: Modern lies to compensate for past lies. Two wrongs make a right, right?

    So we’ll tell our kids not to even bother trying to address Black concerns. Let them march, stew, foment discord. When they riot over trivial or minor things, put it down to incomprehensible random rage and arm yourself. Retreat into the comfortable arms of your own Tribe and just hack away at your enemies, because they’re inscrutable and impossible to understand and dangerous.

    newsflash: two young kids pour gasoline on random white boy, shouting racial taunts, set him on fire; not a hate crime, downplay
    newsflash: mobs of black youth tear through dozens of public events, attacking white and asian people only, shouting racial taunts – not hate crimes, downplay and hide
    newsflash: admission standards at your college are paradoxically much lower for black students, though resultantly much higher for Asians and whites – complaining about this is racist and you’ll be silenced in the bastion of free speech that is the American college, no story here, downplay and “reframe”
    newsflash: When a black man rapes a white woman, he’s just acting out against your evil, you white person. It’s not really a crime. Accept it. If a white man is accused of raping a white woman, he’s automatically guilty all the time even if he’s found factually completely innocent and the rate of white on black rape is zero, policy: Always run a story about how white men used to rape black slave girls to remind whites how evil their ancestors were and therefore they are so noticing patterns today is racist
    newsflash: the innocence of guilt of a white person is dependent on whether or not black people are angry enough, justice being irrelevant, because white people are just so evil that the criminal justice system is nothing but a political tool and this is how it should be, engage in massive political manipulation

    Oh: And you’re all completely racist and evil and should die. Therefore, conclusion: In self-interest, don’t bother trying to understand, accomodate or change anything, because as white people, you’ll be guilty of the crimes of your ancestors forever. You should be made to pay for everything forever because of the sins of your ancestors.


  331. And then the white kids will learn these important lessons from their parents, like they do now, and learn that there’s nothing to do about it – leave the odd black people to their own devices, pay your taxes, and don’t say anything about the organization of your society lest you anger people. Most of all, …
    Don’t show concern over the collapse of urban America and the decay of an entire class of black Americans, because they’re not really your fellow citizens, they just have the same passports as you.

    Even if you attempt to break out of this racism, you’ll be sidelined by the now seething level of hate leveled in every direction. Lesson: Don’t bother.

    This is the sad lesson we get. And unfortunately, it’s an entirely rational response to the political and social situation as it is. It’s narrow, self-interested, simplistic, like all such things partly correct if not justified, but woefully incomplete.

    Alas, that the vast majority of blacks are hard-working, honest citizens with the same dreams and aspirations as you is irrelevant. That black Americans are sold a bill of goods with a revolutionary anti-authoritarian culture that deifies the worst human instincts is apparently irrelevant. That the black family is in a state of freefall and collapse, black men are dropping out of society, any society, at rates beyond reasonable calculation, and outsiders are standing on looking in shock and sniggering as the hole black America is in grows deeper is irrelevant. That this isn’t isolated to the black community is also irrelevant: it’s just much worse there, and it’s all about relative status.

    Let’s just retreat into our own personal hidey holes behind our own lines and throw rocks at other peoples’ greenhouses, and throw even more rocks when one of the others lands a rock on our own.


  332. And , when “white” people cloak themselves in their “whiteness”, they stop seeing the humanity in people who arnt “white”. They cant even look at their own blatent racist history with any kind of real perspective, witn no responsibility for unquestionalbe discrimination and obsticles thrown in a people’s path.

    They cant acknowledge a peoples indignation and rage at these blatent realities and they hunker down behind cold skewed statistics , and tired stereotypes about dress and culture , things their white youth end up copying.

    They just cant see past that and see and acknowledge the humanity in people of color, but, especialy in black Americans ( Im speaking of the American dynamic here, if we want to examine the Brazilian dynamic , for example , we all have to bring our lunch)

    Much of the white American racism seems to be directed right at the people that got brought over directly in slavery, racism directly at black Americans, against their perceived cultural identity (Im not talking of the real cultural contributions black Americans actualy made that are the building blocks of American culture, Im talking about a stereotyped “black American culture”, amped up in the media, with referances to how people dress and act that are totaly blown out of preportion)


  333. Why do people believe race is a social construct? I don’t think it is. I do believe we are different. Science doesn’t explain everything. Can it be an accident that the ONLY people who have built an entire culture based on the dominance of others are also the only ones who are white? It is not coincidental that only whites have based their culture on ‘dominance’. The European drive for superiority and supremacy is a pathological and that generally such ‘neurotic’ behavior is founded on a deep sense of inadequacy.


  334. @Ace

    Why do you get a say on what is part of the black’white dialogue.

    Gee, Ace, I guess I made the mistake in thinking that I am a person, even though I am white, and that people would be involved in a dialogue. Because I thought I would be involved in the dialogue, perhaps I could have a say, please? What did you have in mind? That blacks would be doing all the talking in the “dialogue” and we would be just sitting there shaking our heads yes?

    Did you ever think, for once, that black people do n’t revolve their lives around white people, and maybe just want some semblance of equality

    It would be hard to tell from this blog and most of the other black blogs that blacks do anything BUT talk about whites and race relations. I get absolutely no feeling from this blog that blacks know they can take control of their own lives and control their won destinies. It seems blacks just want to wait until whites have their Awakening and discover how racist they are before. Then the blacks will expect their lives to magically get better. Sorry, I and the other whites have nothing to give you. We can’t live your life and our lives, too.

    In fact, unlike you, they don’t have the luxury of taking slavery “out of the narrative” if only because it’s so tied into their culture and family history, you can’t tell them to ignore that any more than you can tell Americans to phase out the American Revolution.

    Slavery today only exists between your two ears. If I can get no other message across to the Abagondites, I’d like to get this message across. If slavery bothers you, don’t read/learn about it. Think about this – what if today’s blacks never learned, never heard about slavery? Would it help? I think so. Perhaps it would change the focus of the dialogue away from the pase, which no one can change, to the present and future, which we all have the power to change and mold to our wishes.

    Slavery is also used as a horrendous anti-white vehicle of revenge. The Abagondites use it all the time to blame the whites. What has that ever gotten you. Nothing.

    if white people didn’t want slavery as part of the narrative, they shouldn’t have kept it going for hundreds of years

    Irrelevant to today. Everybody, and i mean EVERYBODY, today wishes slavery never happened. That means your ancestors wouldn’t have been brought here to be slaves, and we wouldn’t have you blacks here to whine and complain endlessly.

    White people had hundreds of years to get themselves “together” and yet have high crime, drug use, and other societal ills plaguing them just as much as other races.

    Ace, let me give you a lesson on life. Every new born person has to go through the process of growing up, living, and finding their way in the world. Every person of every new generation will have to learn how to get themselves together. It has nothing to do with race, class, technology, or time period.

    Whites have problems too, as you pointed out. The difference between blacks and whites is that we are better suited to living in a modern world, which was largely developed by whites. Therefore, it is a white world. Everybody is moving towards it. The Chinese are successful why? Because they adopting the white/Western culture. Western culture is displacing most nearly all other cultures whY? Because whites are forcing it? NO. Because its a superior culture that everyone wants to live in.

    Blacks want the benefits of white culture, too. They’re just not not as suited to it as whites are. That causes conflict.

    If your going to claim that black people have somehow only themselves to blame for a racist institution

    Blacks don’t see the opportunities in the USA and other Western nations. Other immigrants can come here, can’t speak English, and work rings around blacks. Blacks just want sit on blogs like this, complain about whites, and wait for their entitlements.

    Doesn’t a dialogue only work if your willing to show some humility and actually consider the history and perspective of the people your talking to (and about)?

    A dialogue works if all parties agree to talk. So far on this blog, I only get insults when I express anything other than the black party line. When you’re ready to talk, we can talk. That means talk – not sit there and accuse me of being nothing but racist, etc


  335. @Sharina Mon 23 Apr 2012 at 21:08:31

    Bliff learn to read. I noticed how you picked out certain parts of what I said and did not actually read what I said.

    I am under no obligation to respond in a way that you demand. If I see some part of your comment that compels me to respond in a certain way of my choosing, that’s what I’ll do.

    Your mention of slavery prompted that.

    Abagond likes to play this same game of putting someone down if they respond to his “main point of the post”. Not only does his “main point” seem to to move, but I respond in any way I see fit, even to only part of the post.

    Not only do I know how to read, but I can read between the lines, too.


  336. @abagond

    Bliff, You are a troll. There is no such thing as having a real dialogue with you.

    Sure I am. A “troll” here is any white person who doesn’t see the Emperor’s New Clothes of Racism that I supposedly have. I don’t see it because I don’t wear it.

    The Abagondites need people like me, Randy, D-man, Inconvenient Truth, Doug, etc. Otherwise this post would have no balance; You People would never learn that what you want is never going to happen. Whites are NEVER going to just lie down and beg forgiveness for “racism”.

    My MISSION here will be accomplished when I can move at least some of you to my way of thinking. You’d all be better off for it.


  337. I dont see how anybody with any knowledge what so ever, of all the places slaves were brought in the Americas, north and south and the Caribean , could miss how slavery has deep far reaching lasting effects that with out any doubt , that affect the dynamic of those descendants of slaves dealing with todays day to day existance in the perspective countries we are talking about

    As a matter of fact, its a mute point, ridiculas to even argue about, people are only humoring the ever shrinking crowd of individuals who beleive that


  338. @B.R. Mon 23 Apr 2012 at 21:46:12

    We have to look inside to see the racist impulses that have been brainwashed into us about what to think and how to feel, and learn how to surpress that impulse.

    Has your thinking brain completely deteriorated from being around black people too much? What kind of crap is this? Whites have no uncontrollable impulses to be “racist”. We see differences between blacks and whites, we don’t really want to be around many of them, that’s all. It’s our preference.

    Maybe you and your black friends have the racist impulses towards us? Maybe you’ve been brainwashed. See, this is all part of the dialogue. You can’t have much of a dialogue if you insist the other party is brainwashed.


  339. Bliff, what part of the music from America that has affected the world from near and far , do you think didnt come off the backs of black Americans who innovated and invented it?


  340. Bliffism “We see differences between blacks and whites, we don’t really want to be around many of them, that’s all. It’s our preference.”

    I guess I was wrong about you, Bliff, you have no racist impulses what so ever


  341. @Bliff…I never said you needed to respond a certain way, but your half reading is what made you misinterpret everything I said. You got lost inbetween the lines instead of reading between the lines.


  342. @ Bliff

    It is not your opinions that make you a troll. It is your level of seriousness. You seem to regard all this like it was some kind of game for your amusement. You are not serious about understanding anything. Not even the post you claim to be balancing.


  343. @Sharina

    I never said you needed to respond a certain way, but your half reading is what made you misinterpret everything I said

    I didn’t even try to interpret anything you said. I simply used your mention of slavery as a jumping off point, so you misinterpreted what I said previously and what I said in my original post about slavery.

    And you did criticize how I decided to respond; that’s the reading in between the lines.


  344. @ abagond

    It is not your opinions that make you a troll. It is your level of seriousness.

    No, its my opinions. Just because I throw in a little humor on the side, doesn’t mean I’m not serious. That’s just another way of bashing my opinions – by claiming they’re so ridiculous, that they’re not “serious” opinions, so no commenter need take them seriously.


  345. @ Bliff a lot of things that Asian cultures have invented and created American Corporates done nothing more than steal it and claim it is white inventions. Chinese are thriving because of their own merits. To claim whites/western civilization is the reason for it only proves white/western culture willingness to steal things for others and claim it as their own. It makes me wonder what have whites really invented with out stealing? The superiority of whites hinges on nothing more than who it will kill and steal from is basically all I have taken from your post.

    Also in response to an earlier response of yours my life does not nor has it ever revolved around a white person or people for that matter. The reason I looked for a thread to talk out my concerns was when a white person decided to call me a race baiter simply because of a light hearted comment I made in regards to his constant babble about how he is not a racist.


  346. I must agree with Nana (except for the “race is genetic” tripe). Since the Civil Rights movement, my elders have done nothing but rage against the “White Power Structure”, but rarely considered building a power structure of their own. I suppose they honestly want White and Black America to simply be America, that’s what I get from Cornel West. It’s been some 50 odd years and we are no closer to that goal than we were in the 60′s. Our communities and our schools are just as segregated as ever.

    Anti-Racism, noble as it is, puts the ball in their court. All it involves is talking and more talking, hoping and more hoping that our words will make them accept and love us. That puts the onus on them to improve our condition in America, and renders us powerless. They can ignore us and half-ass progress as much as they like and never be held accountable. The Anti-racism movement is merely Slaves pining for a more benevolent Master.

    After the Civil Rights, there is absolutely nothing that White America can give us that we cannot give ourselves. If the racism that impedes us today is institutional, we only need to build and improve our own institutions. What we need is not love and acceptance from White America, but tangible power and control over the education, food, and finance that effects our lives. Without power we have no future and no leverage in America. If Whites want to integrate with us after achieving that power, that’s fine. But if they still want nothing to do with us, that’s fine also because we’d no longer need them. We could even have sovereignty if things go sour and it’s in our best interest.

    The rift between White and Black is not a curse, it is a godsend. We are two peoples on opposite sides of history, history that makes us two different nations. As a separate nation, we are not bound to their fate if we choose not to be, what is more free than that? It is high time we start acting like one, because our nation doesn’t even control the food on our plates.

    We need to stop caring about America living up to its “Ideals”. Our very freedom is contrary to the Founding Ideal; we are 3/5th a person in the Constitution. Our self described leaders have squandered 50 years chasing after some dream of inclusion and acceptance they’ve likely already lost faith in. Lets not waste another second. America is someone else’s dream, we can create our own.


  347. @ Bliff once again it is you getting lost in between the lines and because you are still lost in it let me guide you out. Your jump off point is wrong because I was not talking about putting more emphasis on slavery in the classroom. Sad that you seem to have gotten lost at the beginning of the post (now I am beginning to criticize; take note). I stated that we should talk more in regards of how not all blacks came over here as slaves, which they did not. Secondly I stated that we should talk about black contributions, which is not slavery. The fact that you brought up slavery each time only proves that you believe that blacks only contribution was slavery (if you can even call that a contribution).


  348. @B.R.

    I dont see how anybody with any knowledge what so ever, of all the places slaves were brought in the Americas, north and south and the Caribean , could miss how slavery has deep far reaching lasting effects

    Slavery ended a long time ago. The conflict between blacks and whites continues, not because the blacks were former slaves, but because the Differences between Blacks and Whites continues. We know how blacks are and, to a large degree, we stay separate. Blacks, apparently, don’t care much for whites (see this blog), and would stay away from whites if they could. However, they are dependent upon us, like adolescents, dependent financially upon their parents, but emotionally desiring to be independent, but unable to do so. So the blacks whine and cry like adolescents, claiming racism, etc.while the whites look on like bewildered parents.

    Slavery exists only in the heads of those who wish it to be alive – it is the Golden Age of Slavery, not so golden for the actual slaves, but the gift that keeps on giving for present day blacks. No one alive today has have the slightest concern with slavery to understand their lives today. It will take courage for the blacks to let go of their Magnificent Obsession of Slavery.


  349. @Sharina

    a lot of things that Asian cultures have invented and created American Corporates done nothing more than steal it and claim it is white inventions. Chinese are thriving because of their own merits. To claim whites/western civilization is the reason for it only proves white/western culture willingness to steal things for others and claim it as their own. It makes me wonder what have whites really invented with out stealing?

    You have absolutely NO idea what you’re talking about.

    I work for an engineering company that does business in the Far East, and believe me, we are implementing our technology over there, not theirs.

    There is also big current problem with the Chinese trying to infiltrate tech sites over here to steal technology.

    The West invented Science and developed the technology that others want. China has advanced since it opened itself up and is becoming Westernized. This is not technology they developed.

    Your statements of the West stealing Asian technology is simply lies you made on the spur of the moment to respond to my post.


  350. @ D. I really like your post and it rings true to many things I have been pondering lately. What if Black took Africa back and made it better? Soemthing to think on a little further in my case.


  351. The Chinese are successful why? Because they adopting the white/Western culture. Western culture is displacing most nearly all other cultures whY? Because whites are forcing it? NO. Because its a superior culture that everyone wants to live in.

    Please. The Chinese are still culturally distinct, and proud of it. I dare say, their culture is superior to yours, since America and Europe are in mountains of debt, and they aren’t. Personally, I think they’ll savage America in a second Cold War this century.


  352. @ Bliff it is not something I made up at the spur of the moment, but it is something that needs to be thought out. Compared to the Chinese; Americans are extremely behind in terms of education. As for most companies they do business in the east now as China is thriving. You may be implementing that technology, but that does not mean the Chinese has not created other technologies that has not been stolen and used by western civilization. Whites did not invent technology. If the Chinese are trying to make technology to steal from whites, then why is it so hard to believe that technology has not been used to steal from them. I believe ever race can take credit for technological advances and each has taken used and molded technology taken from others.


  353. @D

    The Chinese are still culturally distinct

    Sure, the Chinese retain their culture, but are rapidly adopting many Western ways. The trend is that they will adopt more Western ways, but as ancient as Chinese culture, they still be very “Chinese” for a long time.


  354. @ Sharina

    I fear that simply going back to Africa now in mass would just make us privileged colonists. For what little power we have, we’re still far more powerful than they are. They have enough problems with neo-colonialism as it is. Granted, there is a greater chance of integration with Continental Africans, and I do think there should be a partnership between the Continent and the Diaspora, but we shouldn’t be too hasty.

    I think that African countries would be better served renegotiating borders and trading with each other, since a lot of African poverty is due to the unbalanced trades between their countries and the West, Japan, and China.


  355. I can’t believe what I’m reading here.
    Maybe in some people’s minds things haven’t changed, but I’m old enough to know they have changed a LOT over the years – & for the better! Race relations up until the Trayvon incident have been improving greatly since I was a kid, and on both sides, as many people realize the need for fairness. All this tit-for-tat violence that started recently is liable to mess everything up. Why? For what? Sometimes people toss a cigarette out a car window…& it starts a forest-fire!

    If race violence gets to burning, it will sour all the good that’s been building up over the years, teach kids hate, & hurt lots of innocent people. I think all races need to start looking at others as if a different race, to see if they are being honest within ourselves. I’v edone that. I risked everything…for blacks, and I’m white. I’m living in a tent now. Al Sharpeton, Jesse Jackson, Quanell-X, Obama, NAACP, ACLU — none of them bothered to help at all when I asked. I asked to help justice after I was told to discriminate, refused, & lost my job & career. I’ve been living in a tent for over 3 years already, been run out of multiple courts ILLEGALLY, and even the best of people in govt have not cared to uphold the Law or the U.S. Constitution on it.

    If blacks – even black “leaders” – give no help at all when a white man says in sworn testimony that he’s been ordered to discriminate & shows documents to support that, then there’s a problem that cannot all be blamed on whites. Rather, it is a matter of the rich vs the poor. Contrary to what you might think, a lot of people of many races have grown up, now, being taught against racism, and it shows in society. If our “leaders” only give lip service to that, then we need to elect or gain new ones, to progress. Race-baiting isn’t progress. Being simply hateful isn’t progress. It will only make misery for thousands of people caught up in the trouble it makes. If America falls into chaos, it ruins the economy, what few jobs there are go out the window, & everyone suffers. BTW, it isn’t only blacks who suffer these hard times. That means the economy is putting pressure on everybody, & cool heads need to prevail. If people want to work together for good, fine, – I’d say a good idea would be to get more people to intermarry: that seems to have helped in some latin American countries, where the mixed marriages make the majority now, thus racism becomes useless if all one new “race”. If some people cannot quench their hate for the sake of the nation, maybe they should simply go somewhere else & leave everyone in peace. White, black, whatever race – if hate is too tough to conquer, pick a nation – any nation, where it can be better & go there, maybe; but, please don’t destroy everyone here with the hatred just when things were getting better.

    If you don’t know it’s gotten better, then I’d guess that you are young or hateful, or both – maybe whipped up into anger by people wanting your vote, your support or to be your “leader” somehow. Republicans are in trouble now because many in the party see the top “leaders” are simply selfish USERs. I think Democrats should do the same in their party, too, because there are lots of USERs in power that can be voted out. Like I said, I tried to get “leaders” to help, but none would. I had been hiring black students of Prairie View A&M for PT jobs near their college. I even had met with the officials to work on college work-study jobs where the govt would pay the salaries & had talked with the mayor of Prairie View, TX, who, BTW, also never responded to me when things fell out badly for me. If there is a problem, it is mostly among leadership, not the majority of people, and hating the majority who TRY to do right by others will only make ill will — same as if someone wrongly accuses you, right?

    – If you want to know more about my case, there seems to be a few websites with some info. One is Supremely UNjust, and the other is Raining Daylight.

    Pray, trust God, & don’t give up on everything.
    Peace!


  356. @D

    continuation of previous post

    culture is superior to yours

    I think you overstepped on this one. You made too broad of a statement. So far, they are more financially conservative than us , more like how we use to be. This is one smart aspect of Chinese culture they haven’t lost yet.

    In the West, we have a problem with the TYRANNY OF THE 99%, not with the 1%. The 99% control the government and they have managed to have the govt spend massive amounts on entitlements, which I’m sure that the ultra-liberal Abagondites think is just peachy. So much for Domination by the 1%; if they had any power, they would’ve prevented the 99% from picking their pockets.


  357. It should occur to someone that many blacks & whites are Christians.
    Some churches are starting to integrate on their own.
    If Christian Republicans & Christian democrats got together, that would be a big majority, with common views, common ideals about raising families right, etc. and maybe could be a launchpad for real change in the USA.


  358. @Bliff

    Technology is not “Western Ways”. “Western Ways” are the cultural and philosophical products of Europe’s particular history; they cannot be reproduced or simply adapted anywhere else. The Chinese have been particularly adamant against accepting Western thought, it’s why they’re thriving. Technology has existed long before Europe mattered on the world stage, and it will exist long after you regress for a second time. Exchange of knowledge and technology is nothing new.


  359. @BR

    what part of the music from America that has affected the world

    Br, you’re a one trick pony. All you ever talk about is music. That’s great, but a small part of the question of race relations.

    Along those lines, BR, don’t you think it interesting that blacks are so good at music, but can’t get in together in other aspects of their lives in white societies. Do you suspect this might indicate some innate differences between whites and blacks in these areas?


  360. @ William. I am sorry about your situation and if I had more power to help I would. I am not about kicking anyone down as that is not how I was raised and I don’t teach that type of hate for any human in my home. As I have stated in previous post all people are welcome in my life.

    I can’t say I have every seen it at it’s worse because I was not raised during slavery or the civil rights. I have also been blessed enough to live in an area where whites don’t judge people on skin color, but as of recently I have seen racial tempers flare and it has made me question everything I have ever known about people in general.

    A lady in church said something I would like to repeat.

    “I wish we were like kids becuase they can easily forgive and forget and they don’t see skin color.”


  361. @Bliff

    China is a 2nd World Country. What does that imply? This is a loaded question.


  362. @D

    Technology is not “Western Ways”. Western science and technology is one aspect of Western culture. I never made the quoted statement.

    The Chinese have been particularly adamant against accepting Western thought, it’s why they’re thriving.

    Not true. The Chinese are accepting more and more Western ways and particularly Western science and technology. THAT is why they are thriving economically. It’s not their Eastern philosophy that is thriving.

    Technology has existed long before Europe mattered on the world stage

    Mankind has always had technology, but ONLY the West developed Science and the Western (modern) technology that developed from it. The entire world is adopting Western science and technology.

    exist long after you regress for a second time.

    Yeah, you hope. Don’t bet on it. The world is going to be white for a very looooooong time.


  363. @Bliff Was China not thriving before Western Culture? What say you about India? Lets’ not forget Africa…..If Western Culture was doing so great, then they would have no need to venture to the other places for help……for their goods. Let’s say I believed the tail of Westerners bring technology to the poor uncivilized eastern world. Then why is the West not thriving?

    I tell you what. Go look up some Chinese inventions and technological advances and then thank the Chinese for what the Western culture has because you will be surprised how much you have because of them.


  364. @Bliff

    Yeah, you hope. Don’t bet on it. The world is going to be white for a very looooooong time.

    Pride goeth before the fall. All civilizations fail eventually, usually in a 1000 years tops for the strongest, even the White ones (it’s been 500 years, so at best you’re middle aged. The twilight years are usually pretty ugly too). Ask the Romans. BTW…

    Mankind has always had technology, but ONLY the West developed Science and the Western (modern) technology that developed from it. The entire world is adopting Western science and technology.

    … That’s a great contribution, just don’t expect the World to remember that after you’re gone. History is a fickle thing.


  365. @Sharina

    Was China not thriving before Western Culture?

    If you look at different time periods, you can get different answers. I’m only interested in the present or what directly affects the present. Compared to the modern West, China has een behind, and has only started to catch up after Nixon’s visit in 1971. Their Maoist Communism also held them back.

    What say you about India?

    Compared to the modern West, India is a joke, and is fairly early in its development. Though they now have a large middle class, India is so populous, that most of its people are still poor.

    If Western Culture was doing so great, then they would have no need to venture to the other places for help

    We don’t venture to other places for their help. Where did you get this idea?

    for their goods.

    Trade is not “looking for help”. Many of the goods we got from underdeveloped countries, like minerals from Africa, had no value, no use to the inhabitants until Westerns came there to get it. Furthermore, Westerns have created thriving economies in these places. The cocoa tree came from South America and was transplanted to the Ivory Coast of Africa, where the industry is now thriving. The Africans would never have developed this on their own.

    Let’s say I believed the tail of Westerners bring technology to the poor uncivilized eastern world. Then why is the West not thriving

    First of all its not a tale (not tail), it’s simply true. Just because you don’t know it, doesn’t make it untrue.

    The West is not thriving now because of the tyranny of the 99%. The 99% control the govt and have gotten entitlement programs inacted that are bankrupting the USA and Europe. In other words, the 99% is selfish and wants more than we can afford. It’s a disease of modern liberalism.

    Futhermore, we have an ultraliberal President who wants to continue govt spending, loading up the national debt at an ever increasing rate. He has no idea how to create true wealth. Corporations have cash on hand and are scared to spend it because of the liabilities of ObamaCare and what else may come down the pike from Washington.


  366. Right on D. :)


  367. Trade is not “looking for help”. Many of the goods we got from underdeveloped countries, like minerals from Africa, had no value, no use to the inhabitants until Westerns came there to get it.

    Right, I suppose the Salt, Gold, and Ivory that dominated the Trans-Saharan trade, and the bronze casts from The Walled City of Benin currently in the British museum, are just figments of our collective imaginations.


  368. @Nana Tue 24 Apr 2012 at 12:22:58

    The European drive for superiority and supremacy is a pathological and that generally such ‘neurotic’ behavior is founded on a deep sense of inadequacy.

    How funny! The blacks have such low self-esteem that they have to blast the whites with COMPLETELY fabricated accusations of neurosis. Apparently, just the because the whites have been successful, we are neurotic.

    This is wacko Black Logic. The low self-esteem that is behind this completely baseless accusation is completely transparent.


  369. Well *a* British Museum


  370. @ Bliff…Thanks for the correction of tale. Just because you make pretty words out of something does not make it true either. Western civilization has relied countlessly on other countries for help and resources. How many countries has the USA fought on its own with no help or involvement from any other country? That is a fact whether you accept it or not. Just because it is spreading technology today does not mean it invented it as you stated in an early post. Westerners are only spreading technology it originally took from someone else. Westerners can take credit for tweaking it but not inventing it.


  371. Furthermore, Westerns have created thriving economies in these places. The cocoa tree came from South America and was transplanted to the Ivory Coast of Africa, where the industry is now thriving. The Africans would never have developed this on their own.

    Pfft, this is a prime example of Dependancy Theory. The Cocoa industry isn’t thriving for the farmers and child laborers actually growing the stuff, due to the West’s considerable leverage over World Trade. And Western capitalists won’t simply let the Cocoa industry, and other industries like it, die w/o a fight. Africa is one large plantation, producing all the raw goods the West wants and needs for cheap.


  372. I have nothing to say to you bliff. You can continue with your useless babble. It means nothing to me.


  373. @Nana

    Sure, Nana. You babble about white neurosis, and you think my derision of that is babble. Of course.


  374. @ Nana

    Spliff is a troll. He wishes to add not one damn thing to this debate.
    He loves the attention of being on a black blog spewing vomitus. On stormfront, he’d disappear. Here, he gets noticed.
    I began to ignore him when he came on the Trayvon thread…
    Please do the same.
    Perhaps he’ll cross the line and get banned.


  375. ^^^ oh I know. I usually ignore him. He says nothing of value anyway.


  376. @nana:

    Bliff is not to be taken seriously, he is here just as an example of what a racist is like and how he thinks.

    As for your comment:

    “Why do people believe race is a social construct? I don’t think it is. I do believe we are different. Science doesn’t explain everything. Can it be an accident that the ONLY people who have built an entire culture based on the dominance of others are also the only ones who are white? It is not coincidental that only whites have based their culture on ‘dominance’.”

    Race as we know it is a social concept, an idea that was invented for certain purpose, such as slavery and conquest. It was created and perfected as an explanation for wider audience to explain why it was ok to slave other humanbeings and kill them and steal them and take what ever they had.

    We are different, true, but that does not come from any race. It comes from culture. A baby grows into the culture that surrounds it. A child learns the culture he/she lives in. Language is culture. Our thinking is based on our culture. In a racist culture we must get rid of the basics of that thinking, abandon the very core what makes it racist. And the very idea of separate human races is the key for all the rest. As long as you believe in races, you suscribe racism. You accept its fundamental idea, an idea from which everything else follows.

    As for the white dominance, that is also a racist BS. Up until about year 1500 white Europe was the butt hole of the world. It was filthy, dirt poor, disease ridden corner of the world where wars and plagues had devastated the lands and people. The chinese did not want anything from Europe, they did not need Europe. Nobody did. Before late 1400′s Europe did not dominate anything at all. On the contrary. It was almost run over by the turks.

    It was by coincidence that Europe got its chance. In 1424 the chinese emperor died and his follower stopped the great chinese expeditions and commercial fleet. That left the oceans free for europeans. China turned inwards and declined into a chaos in 1600′s. The last ming emperor was so ashamed that he hung himself. But still it was only in early 1800′s when whites could do anything for China and get any say so over anything in there. That was only some 200 years ago, few generations ago.

    White european dominance of the world is a racist myth. The so called Triumph of the west is history written to justify wars, just like the ones USA has mostly done since WW2 (We bring democracy and freedom! Really??), and shameless exploitation by big western business of the rest of the world. In reality white european dominance of the world is fairly young thing.

    Just think about USA. How old is it? When the “west was won”? 1860′s? 1880′s?? That was when my mothers grandmother was born!! It is actually that short time in history.

    Somebody wants us to believe that there has been so called white dominance for ages, that it has a biological reason behind it, that is must be because of the races. And yet, when you look at it, white europeans have been dominating other cultures at most for the last 500 yrs. Americans have been big perhaps for hundred plus years.

    Egypt dominated a wide region for few thousand years. Just think about that. It is not an accident that somebody tells us that whites have been subjacating others for a long time, when they have not in reality.

    Somebody somewhere wants you and me to believe that whites are special. That whites are the exception. Good or bad, that does not matter. The only thing that matters is that whites are not like any other race. That is the key claim of the racists, the very nuclear of their ideology. And we all know that there is nothing special in being white. Nothing exceptional.


  377. “Bliff is not to be taken seriously, he is here just as an example of what a racist is like and how he thinks.”

    This is correct.


  378. Bliff, dont you think its interesting that whites stole black American’s ideas and disciminated against them and made all the money over the backs of black Americans ? Discrimination ? Does that mean anything to you? Music is my expertise, that is why I see up close the realities of it and can relate it to you who know nothing about it and wont acknowledge this. It carries over into many other aspects of our society also, and, people like you are just naive to the truth

    Bliff, your answers sound like the punch line in a Dave Chapell segmant on TV, like he is in white face, answering questions..


  379. @ abagond…I stop taking him seriously some time ago because it is not for me to educate him, but my children. I would have been just as lost as he is if I had not taken the time out to really educate myself and people like Bliff make the choice to believe whatever makes whites superior.

    It took me taking a women history course before I learned anything about blacks or any other person of color beyond the spectrum of slavery or being taken over by whites. Once that gate was open, I wanted to know everything about every color of people. I believe the hardest thing is change and the realization that change is coming can throw some people over the edge. Whites fear that if a minority of any color gets any type of control then they will start treating them the way they have treated blacks for years. Case in point : I overheard a white guy in a Mexican restaurant telling his friend that heaven forbid a Mexican gets into office because they will all run over hear from Mexico, then we will have no jobs.

    @ Bliff if you get the chance take a look at 1911 and see what Western civilization did in its effort to take and influence the Chinese. I am not sure if this is based on a true story but it is a good representation of the times.


  380. Bliff says, “In the West, we have a problem with the TYRANNY OF THE 99%, not with the 1%. The 99% control the government and they have managed to have the govt spend massive amounts on entitlements, which I’m sure that the ultra-liberal Abagondites think is just peachy. So much for Domination by the 1%; if they had any power, they would’ve prevented the 99% from picking their pockets.”

    Yea. We need to stop taking Bliff seriously. He is the prime example of how supremely racist white people think and act. He detests knowledge and truth. So, he uses emotions, myths, and lies as his crutch in any argument. He’s too angry at the fact that black people are not kissing his ass. He’s too far gone to realize his erroneous way of thinking, and he’s too sensitive, infantile, domineering and imbecilic to carry on a mature, civilized conversation without crying that no one takes him seriously and that “this blog needs him.”

    The truth is that he needs this blog way more than this blog needs him. Bliff needs blogs like this to spend his idle time on for his own amusement while seeking attention from the people he has disdain for. Any kind of attention will do it seems like.

    In short Bliff is the antithesis of the myth that white people are superior.


  381. @ Brothawolf,

    Yeah. I stopped taking his seriously the minute I read that. A guy who receives “entitlements” complaining about liberal programs and somehow making the whole 99% wanting to screw over the 1% thing sound even more stupid.


  382. @ Sam,

    You actually said what I wanted to.

    One nation dominating another has never been a white thing, it became a “white” thing when people wanted justification to do so and save themselves from critics and a depleting pocketbook.


  383. Race is real. Whether you want to believe it or not.

    Sam said “White european dominance of the world is a racist myth.”

    Sorry I stopped reading there. Are you serious? Racist myth? What do you think dominance is? How do you explain the race relations going on here in the Americas, Europe, Africa, Australia, and Asia between the whites and other people of color then? Ever heard of the Monroe doctrine( that’s just one example out of thousands of White European dominance over others). There is a pattern and I don’t think you are seeing it.


  384. LOL

    I’m not sure why any troll with an agenda and a name like “Bliff” would ever be taken seriously by anyone here. : )))


  385. @ Gorbachev…Maybe the corrupt media in your area works that way but that is one thing I am sure of does not fall here.The media in my area has always disclosed every single detail of a black criminal on the news here. if it was a white criminal then certain aspects of the crime were left out including his/her name or age or anything. It was only recently that that began to change in my area and they stared disclose information on all criminals instead of pandering to white criminals.

    Secondly, just because you do not agree with me does not make you racist. What makes you racist is when you start belittling or down playing a whole group of people instead of judging on an individual basis. As i have stated in earlier post, Chinese has contributed much to society and it was funny how I was told Asian’s did not contribute to society because Whites gave them technology and science that is why they are thriving.

    Why is it that when any other race of people (in this case blacks) bring up any matter to a white person for a discussion then you try to throw in how blacks hate other ethnic groups as if you are trying to throw the heat elsewhere. How does it feel to know as a black person I have Asian friends and we accept each other? What you fail to understand is race is not so much a factor in whether a person is going to commit a crime or not. Also you mentioned the blacks that set a white boy on fire (tragedy indeed), but did you forget the white kids that ran over a black guy or the white man that dragged a black guy behind his truck both still tragedies none the less. Hate crimes can go both ways.


  386. @ Gorbachev another example to prove my point of media reporting. When I worked in the solicitors office , we got a case a white woman who had been raped by her father. This went on for years until she was old enough to leave on her own and I believe it hit rock bottom when he started doing it to he daughter. I felt so bad for her situation because her whole family turned against her in support of her rapist father. He was found guilty (thank goodness) and as we walked out of he court room her family immediately tried to beat her up. I helped walk her to the car and had to call for police assistance because of the situation. Prior to the case this was not in one news report. After the case not in one news report or paper. Not mentioned. That tells me just because it is not mentioned does not mean it did not happen This case could reflect a lot more of lack of media reporting, so I wouldn’t get high and mighty on statistical black crime reporting. Atleast black crime is reported ( do not agree crime is ok). How many white crimes are not?


  387. Sharina,

    That’s what I always suspected. If whites are the majority of the U.S. population, and if most crimes are committed by them, why is it that most of the crime reported in the evening news and newspapers centers about black crime?

    It’s been documented that blacks are overrepresented as suspects and criminals while whites are overrepresented as victims. Plus, crime has gone down over the years, but reports on crime has skyrocketed. Finally, and most importantly, the news overrepresent black males in crime reports as opposed to positive, lifestyle-based news.

    If these so-called race realists are truly against the liberal-based media, why do they use them as resources to support their racist ideals about black people? It makes no sense in my opinion, but then again, racism never makes sense.


  388. @all Bliff fans

    Bliff is not to be taken seriously, he is here just as an example of what a racist is like and how he thinks.

    You people are hilarious! I don’t buy your crap for one minute. You just want your little POC lovefest where you can all complain about whites and not face up to your own shortcomings.


  389. @Bliff

    Why are you here, anyway? You must have an agenda, what do you hope to achieve through talking with us?


  390. @ Bliff…What short coming do I have? Do you personally know me to speak of your ideas of my short comings? I have 2 degree graduated top of my class in high school and in college. Have a successful hard working husband who has given me the benefit of being a stay at home mom. Two beautiful children who I am currently teaching Spanish. I have not committed any crimes and neither has anyone in my family, so once again Bliff. What are my short comings?

    The reason I am not taking you seriously is because you are not taking anyone else seriously. It is funny how you were so quick to laugh up on everyone else expense but as soon as it was a what every stance you are not upset that you are not taken serious. Secondly I am not taking you seriously because you are stuck on your white is right stance. If that is the way you are going to be an not have an open mind to other things as I have had an open mind towards you then why should either of us care one way or another or take each other seriously any further.


  391. @sam

    Race as we know it is a social concept, an idea that was invented for certain purpose, such as slavery and conquest.

    For God’s sake, Sam, don’t be so dense. Race was NOT invented just so people, white people I suppose, could conquer others. You don’t need a theory of race to conquer….you just go out and do it!! People conquering other people happened all over history, over all peoples, over all cultures. Race was such a small part of that.

    As for the white dominance, that is also a racist BS.

    Never heard of the British empire, European conquest of the entire Western Hemisphere, the dominance of the US since WWII. Obviously, you don’t want to. Come on Sam! You’re not that stupid, you just act that stupid. It’s your goofy ideas on race that make you say stupid things.

    Up until about year 1500 white Europe was the butt hole of the world. It was filthy, dirt poor, disease ridden corner of the world where wars and plagues had devastated the lands and people.

    You need a good education in history, Sam. You seem to be excessively anti-European, though you’re from Findland. Strange bird, you are.

    Up to 1500, EVERY city of every culture was filthy, etc. not just the European cities!! The germ theory of disease (invented by whites, for the world, ahem) was not conclusively accepted until the 1860s when Pasteur demonstrated it. So NO culture had the Western ideas of hygiene that we have today. IF European cities were any worse, its only because they were more crowded, and crowded because, after the Mercantile Revolution of the 1200s, trade and European cities grew rapidly. The growth of the cities did set the stage for the Black Death of 1347-48 when the Mongols started the spread of the plague that eventually came to Italy.

    There is no basis for your statement that “white Europe was the butt hole ofthe world” except for your own personal bias, which seems be against your own culture.

    In 1424 the chinese emperor died and his follower stopped the great chinese expeditions and commercial fleet. That left the oceans free for europeans.

    Sam, you’re just don’t know what you’re taking about. That plus the fact that you’re vehemently anti-European for some reason, makes you a non-credible person.

    The Europeans got a few inventions from the Chinese, like the compass, but the rest of their sea-faring was all European based. The mercantile European economy provided the incentive for Columbus to enter on his epic journey.

    There were no Chinese around the Atlantic to interfere or affect the European Age of Discovery. America was in the way…get yourself a globe and look at it next time for writing your goof posts.

    The so called Triumph of the west is history written to justify wars, just like the ones USA has mostly done since WW2

    Sam, you do fit in well on this blog. Here, anyone can write anything and be heralded for it , as long as its anti-white. The stupidest of statements are accepted by the Abagonites as long as its anti-white.

    If you don’t know about Western culture and its dominance everywhere it’s introduced, you have no idea of the world you live in. And your statement that the “Triumph of the west is history written to justify wars” is just pure dumba$$, absolute dumba$$ in all its glory.

    And yet, when you look at it, white europeans have been dominating other cultures at most for the last 500 yrs. Americans have been big perhaps for hundred plus years.

    Finally, you managed to say something that is true. Is this simply by accident? Whoever has said anything different?


  392. @Sharina

    What short coming do I have?

    If you correctly read my post, you will see that I am addressing it to the post in general. If you think it was addressed to you personally, then obviously you have a guilty conscience.

    The “shortcomings” are the Abagondites complete trashing of white people, in general, and me on this blog, in particular. They are so smug in their anti-white racism, that they absolutely don’t want to take any responsibility for their present condition, when Black Pathologies are well documented. In their closed minds, white somehow are supposed to live their lives, as well as their own. They even talk about Slavery – 150 yrs ago as somehow responsible for their present condition!!

    The reason I am not taking you seriously is because you are not taking anyone else seriously.

    This “seriously” business is way off. It has nothing to do with being serious – it has to do with what is being posted – is it correct? is it valid?

    you are stuck on your white is right stance

    Unfortunately, it only seems that way because white people are continually being maligned on this site. I have to correct Black Racist comments, so it seems that I only believe in “white is right”.

    you are going to be an not have an open mind

    You have some nerve lecturing me about having an “open mind”. THIS ENTIIRE BLOG IS ABOUT NOT HAVING AN OPEN MIND. It’s a POC lovefest where non-whites can come and whine about their lives not being perfect because of whites. Look above at my response to Sam. He writes anti-white garbage and everybody here thinks its just fine. I wrote a long response correcting him. I wrote responses earlier today correcting YOU. Do you still think I’m not serious. Do you still think I have a closed mind? MAYBE YOU HAVE A CLOSED MIND, SHARINA.


  393. @Ace

    Yeah. I stopped taking his seriously the minute I read that. A guy who receives “entitlements” complaining about liberal programs

    And what are those entitlements that I receive, Ace, can you name them? If you mean White Privilege, then you can stop right there. There is no such thing as White Privilege. We whites have created what we have; you blacks have not. It’s just your underachievement that makes it look like we have some sort of privilege.

    Do you have an intelligent counter argument? Or are you just going to say “Bliff is not to be taken seriously” which means you CAN’T come up with a counter argument.

    If you don’t like my idea of the Tyranny of the 99%, do you have a counter argument? Where did I go wrong?


  394. @ Bliff I first and foremost have stated not all whites are like you, so that is not mangling whites that is mangling you. Check some of my earlier post. Secondly you have only managed to correct me on one thing and that is the spelling of tail over tale in usage. As far as the other things you have yet to convince me that whites did not steal technology from other races. My post have been on open minded towards all and my statements of whites must be clarified constantly to say racist whites. My goodness are we in the third grade to not realize what whites are being referred to here. You have constantly been referring to all blacks since you begin and now because you are getting some mud slung in your face you are trying to switch it to mean certain complaining blacks. Is it throwing you off that not all blacks are fitting into the mold you think they should? Is that confusing you?

    You have no consistent posts. All your post switch back and forth on topics to suit your stance on what is right. One minute the Chinese have contributed nothing and then next….Oh they did a few things.

    Once again what makes what you say more correct than what anyone else has said? Nothing. You have proved nothing and have yet to prove it. You are not better than the people you are constantly putting down. The problem and the reason you are starting to get made is because you are not able to break people in here down like you intended to.

    Oh yea and Bliff…I have nothing to be guilty about because as I have stated and all my friends know…what you see is what you get with me. I say what I want and when I want….I make no excuses for anyone and I don’t expect them to make excuses for me. I respect you if you respect me. pure and simple race has nothing to do with it.


  395. mad*


  396. If you don’t like my idea of the Tyranny of the 99%, do you have a counter argument? Where did I go wrong?

    You just have to admire the conservative propaganda sphere.

    “Tyranny of the 99%, how awful! It smells like democracy!”

    I wish I were that convincing. . .


  397. @ Bliff I forgot to mention why I think you have a closed mind…..I know that there is a difference in color and I know that there are racist on each sides of the fence. I never once teach my kids about color. I teach my kids to treat people how they treat you (this is open minded no). I don’t talk shit about whites in my home, I don’t talk shit about Asians in my home, I don’t talk shit about Hispanics in my home, and I don’t talk shits about blacks in my home. When I look at statistics I ignore them because I can determine what the world is like based on my own research through experience. I see myself as equal to the next man or woman not subservient because of skin color.

    Your mind is closed because you have countlessly come in here stating how blacks have accomplished nothing. How worthless blacks are; how blacks are this and that and so on….yet you are mad when others throw that same lousy mentality towards whites. You mind is closed to the idea that people of color are more…much more than what you perceive them to be or have been taught they are.

    Everything anyone has said to you is automatically wrong instead of you contemplating what they are saying. I have taken in everything everyone has said and while I do not agree with it all. I have still listened. I have not automatically said “Hey you are wrong!” and then start bashing their race. Bash the person not their race. You bash the people race when you have not true or real counter for what they said. If you bash the race I will automatically jump in to counter your stance simply because I know who I am and your generalization does not hold true to me and I aim to disprove you on the every black stance.


  398. Bliff,

    Let me ask you a few questions:

    What makes you think slavery didn’t have an impact on later and present generations of blacks? You said it had no effect, but you never explained how that’s so.

    What makes you bring up slavery as the ONLY thing we supposedly complain about?

    What about other factors that came after slavery up until today?

    Why is being anti-racist the same as being anti-white to you?

    Why can’t we go to a place where we can talk about whiteness in peace without someone like you cracking not-so-funny jokes, derailing topics, and being an overall racist jerk?

    What makes you think white privilege doesn’t exist?

    -Have you ever been stopped by the police for a random case of suspicion even when you haven’t done anything?

    -Are media representations of white people limited to a few distasteful images all the time?

    -Have you ever been suspected of being a shoplifter or robber the moment you’ve stepped inside a store even though you didn’t plan on doing either?

    I know you seem to be avoiding my responses to you for some reason. You may have had me blocked somehow, or you’re just afraid that what I’m saying is true to a degree. But I want you to sincerely answer these questions without some pseudo-scientific fiction that race exist spread all over it. I don’t want to read how it’s proven by science. I don’t want to read the usual stats people like you always paste to prove your case of black inferiority. And I don’t want you to side-step the issue by telling us the great feats the white race has done.

    Just answer those questions with short, straight-to-the-point answers.


  399. @ Bliff,

    The ability to think that way about yourself when you’ve done absolutely nothing to deserve it? To cling to the coattails of your betters? The only thing you have in common with the white people you use as your example of “superiority” is your skin tone . Your abilities and talent, however, are not related.

    1.Try talking when you earn less because your not white or a man.
    2.Try talking when you can go outside and not feel like the outsider because your the only one with the dark skin.
    3. Try talking when your opinion and feelings are automatically dismissed because the idiot next to you has whiter skin and people think that’s something to defer to.
    4. Try talking when people don’t automatically assume you don’t deserve piece of mind because you dared to do well in a white neighborhood.
    5. Try talking when you’re history is expendable in favor of a version of history that pretended the only people important were people who couldn’t even plant and build their own country without bringing people clamped in chains to do the work for them.
    6. Try talking when your skin or ethnicity is not used as a “qualification”.

    You know nothing of what black people have earned,because you made no effort to learn. You only assume “black underachievement” because its convenient. How else can you justify getting crap you don’t earn? Have some self-esteem and earn your pride, not act like your entitled to it because your *gasp* white. You have not earned the right to even claim you deserve crap because of your skin. God, you make me freaking sick.

    Get it through your head, cause I”m sure people of tired of wasting time trying to “debate” with you:

    1. Those weren’t YOUR achievements, they were just the achievements of people who shared your complexion and didn’t have to have nasty little laws to keep people like them from openly contributing. Heck, the man who created the blood transfusion DIED because racists didn’t think a black man should get white blood.

    2. There are soldiers, police, hard working men and women all over the world who have sacrificed themselves to make a life for their families and you think your better than them because you happen to have white skin? Yeah you and everyone else without crap to their name.

    3. Great. Your white . So what ? You can’t even fathom a basic argument without resorting to your typical brand of low-effort thinking, why are you superior to anyone else? If your so much better, own up and prove it, stop deflecting with copy-and paste crap any person with a laptop can find on Stormfront.

    Second…”you blacks”? Really? You can’t even think rationally about race, you decide anyone who’s racist is white (and therefore reasonable) and anyone who dislikes racism is black (and ready to be insulted), and you apply positive qualities to only those who share your complexion. That is just plain STUPID. It’s “low-effort thinking”.

    You and “intelligent argument” is a damn oxymoron. Same with every racist with an ego. Again, you demonstrate exactly the point people make about racists.

    There is no “tyranny of the 99%”, unless democracy is “tyranny”. But wait, I suppose you have to have privilege over someone. God forbid people want the same opportunities without income, color, or gender being used to decide who “deserves” it. God forbid people find something wrong with a billionaire who inherited his life paying less in taxes than a hard working secretary with mouths to feed.


  400. Yeah, Brothawolf, Id like to know what Bliff describes, Jim Crow, Klu Klux Klan, lynchings, government and realters colaborations to create white flight, new articles every year that say minorities get lower pay, and poor minority neighborhoods and schools are proven neglected compared to white neighborhoods , etc etc

    Sam isnt against Europe, he was just giving an acurate picture of the way it was back in that time


  401. @ everyone

    Just ignore him. I do.


  402. Very interesting turn-around on some things, but it still smacks of hate & racism a bit; and, that’s really what all the problems are about – not justice, not someone getting harmed, not who did it or what race they were. Rather, the problem you are missing is the motive, and that’s the difference.

    You see, racism prevents many from seeing that Zimmerman being called “white” while Obama is called “black” is racist pride. If Zimmerman is white, then so is Obama. If Obama is black, then Zimmerman is hispanic. Ahh, but that won’t allow the hate to fester to gain black support for those wanting it – the same ones who didn’t care to even try to help or say a word when I have fought a lawsuit alone, w/o a lawyer, against an employer whom I gave evidence & sworn testimony about having ordered me (a white) to discriminate against blacks & men. I was apparently too white to be allowed to do right by EVERYONE or to merit black “leaders” help. You wanna see more? There’s a site or two out there – Supremely Unjust… & Raining Daylight.

    Back to this: the hatred is the motivational difference. Whites despise racist murder just as blacks do, whether you want to believe it or not. For so many blacks & their “leaders” to openly support racist hate murder & brutality is heinous to most of us – I suspect it is true for many blacks with sound thinking, too.

    Would you be pleased if all whites simply rushed to judgment on the Trayvon thing simply becuase of race? Wouldn’t that be directly opposite what all blacks had wanted for over a hundred years? Just because we want to hear all the info before deciding, why do you hate that? Simple: Racism. Hatred of whites: you are polluted by it, apparently, if you take that line of thinking.

    What you need to realize is that this is all more than about race. It is about people in positions of authority & about respect for authority. The two are clashing, and rightly so in some instances – my own for example (as above). As more previously poor people (and most wealth in the USA seems to be among whites due to education & family pasts, this will change. Hopefully we will all get the crooks & cronies out of office, together, and this won’t onlty be whites. Power & wealth tends to corrupt a lot of people, regardless of color, race, ethnicity. In fact, the matter of blacks voting for their race over integrity, morals & character so often does not help the racist image of blacks in many white people’s minds, does it? To bring about mutual respect, we must all show respect, act with integrity, and avoid racist hatreds & unfairness.

    We probably all know by now that the media edited the 911 calls to falsely make Zimmerman’s words appear racist, and that black “leaders” pushed for a formal “lynching” of Zimmerman, stirred up hate, and refused to urge people to insist on getting all the facts before drawing conclusions. That has made blacks look outrageously led about by hate-mongerers like ignorant children: it needs to stop. It promotes racism. Lots of whites were offended by the incident of Trayvon being killed, but simply wanted to know more. We’ve all seen many stories where things turned out a bit different than it first appeared. Who cannot recall at least 1 or 2 crying women on TV sobbing over their poor missing children, tons of sympathy come pouring in, then it all turn out to be the woman murdeed her own & tried to cover it up all in a desperate act. — Can you blame people for not wanting to be played again & wanting the facts?

    Fairness is a two-way street. Blacks need to recognize this & whites need to recognize it. To wish ANYONE to join a modern lynch-mob & cast aside reason is not good. To require it & to hijack peace, holding national peace at ransom for a conditional lynching, is abhorrent & shameful, and to continue in that manner cannot possibly lead to good. Sound reason, not mere hate, is best.


  403. @ William Noack

    Valid points.

    “Fairness is a two-way street.”

    For your example you have picked extreme cases. The mother crying for help who in the end turns out to be the one responsible is an extreme case. Most mothers crying out for their missing kids havent secretly killed them or something like that.

    Racism is not an extreme case, it is the general rule.

    That is where your argument falls apart.

    You Noack are not the general rule, you are an extreme case. Most white people in your position would do what their boss tells them to do, i.e. discriminate.

    But you make a fair point about the system a.k.a authority. People aren’t born racist. Racism is by design. Undo the design then racism will eventually die out, but racism is an important part of authority, it is important because it keeps those in power, in power.


  404. @ William

    Good points.
    William, racism will never die due to the fact that the beneficiaries, whites, will hold on to that privilege for dear life. You bring up points, good points, about the media twisting the phone call.

    William, how many instances have you read about the media twisting a black man’s story to justify killing him? Where was the outrage for him??? Where was the media outrage for Susan Smith when she blamed a phantom black man for the drowning of her kids?

    This case is loaded with racial under and overtones.
    Not one person can truly deny that. Just like OJ Simpson, who is clearly guilty, but the media lynched him before they saw, read, heard ANY evidence.The Zimmerman/ Martin case is a painful reminder that black life is worthless and to be discarded like trash. Because we are trash in the eyes of white America.

    Did you ever read or hear anyone looking into WHY Elizabeth Smart never thought to escape? Did anyone blame her? No. She was just an innocent, perfect, white woman victim. Trayvon was painted as a thug who somehow deserved his fate.

    I desperately want to believe you on the “whites despise racist murders” claim but sadly I cannot. Not when the overwhelming evidence proves the contrary.


  405. You both are clinging to what you THINK “most” whites are thinking or are like within themselves. Truth is, you don’t know. Right? Truth is, you only know what you see & hear in the media – TV, radio, some talks shows maybe. Sorry, fellas, but that is not going to pass for what most white people think anymore than it will pass fo what most black people are like.

    Back to the authority & power thing again: the person I proved had lied – committed perjury – in my court case….was a black coworker. She did that in a part of the case regarding anti-male discrimination. It was kept from her by others that blacks were also being discriminated against. All the while, both she & another black coworker went & reported thing on me that helped the higher up people keep tabs on me as they apparently spied on me during my last months or days at the job there. The woman was a single, black mom w/foster kids – somewhat of a friend of mine, actually, but likely caught in tough situation. She had more senority & more to lose, potentially. I don’t blame her as racist for it. I see it as she probably felt she would be ruined if they retaliated, got scared, & caved in.

    That is what happens in power/authority situations. Who is going to lose their job, their prestige, their fine position, etc. Since most higher positions were held by whites since the times of slavery, it would stand to reason that the wealth & influence is concentrated among whites due to that. Things have been slow to change, but in a performance-oriented society, change comes with difficulty…and with capable, educated people who know what they are doing. I, a white, do not consider myself to be presidential material, nor able to run a large corporation, at present. Stockholders would not, either. The powers that be won’t hand everything over to just anyone, and they will change only as necessary, sadly. When faced with trouble by someone making a claim – whether regarding race discrimination or whatever – they resist the threat to their superior situation, finery, way of life, nice income, etc. This is what your target really is, not “most” white Americans.

    If the USA had low unemployment, the nation runing like a well-oiled machine, etc. right now, Obama would go into a 2nd term almost uncontested, except for maybe the ones who dislike his stance on some issues like abortion & homosexuality. Performance matters, and that is the avenue for changes in hierarchy. Meanwhile, hierarchy fights for itself. Sure, it is mostly white,…now. I can tell you, if it were mostly black,…it would do the same thing. It does that way, worldwide. Even the bible talks about how the rich oppress the poor. The images produced in your minds of what others think of your race…are projections. Most whites do not have the time or money to affect what those projections are, why they are, or who they come from. You have heard the line, “Follow the money”? Well, it’s sort of like that, but influence, power, etc. also come into play. People with all that….are not “most” whites, honestly.


  406. BTW, I am not saying there is no discrimnation at all, and since most businesses & “authorities” in the USA tend to be “white”, then in a sense, such things tend to directly involve “mostly” whites, although not “most” whites. There is a meaningful difference, there. (Minorities in positions of authority are not exempt from behaving in self-serving ways, either.)


  407. @ William

    Very true no one knows what another person is really thinking.

    But we can infer what they are thinking by how they act.

    Racism exists it is real, it is not an illusion. MLK didn’t die for an illusion. All those lynchings didnt happen because of an illusion. It was normal everyday whites carrying out the crimes. It wasn’t an abstract faceless system. It was real flesh and blood people en masse not a few minority but the vast majority.

    For black people experiencing reality everyday, it is white people making it clear to them that it is the colour of their skins which makes us not eligible to white privileges.

    In my opinion you are deflecting responsibility not even acknowledging that these crimes are done by whites, rich poor clever stupid and everything in-between. You are defending “most” white americans. Not even acknowledging the responsibility they bear, the atrocities they played a hand in. Black people have to eat the BS about them not taking opportunities, not working hard enough etc. when it comes to black people, it is black peoples fault but when it comes to white people, let us find different avenues to explain the situation. Any avenue that doesn’t lead the finger of responsibility being pointed at them.


  408. @ William,

    “Minorities in positions of authority are not exempt from behaving in self-serving ways, either.)”

    True. But it isn’t minorities responsible for the vast scale of discrimination and racism.

    It isn’t minority white power brokers either. They exercise their power through other people and the vast majority of this “other” people is “most” white americans or white europeans.

    Abagond has written in multiple articles that white people can’t take responsibility for what they have done in history. They will take responsibility for the inventions and all the nice stuff, but when it comes to the bad stuff, they look for other avenues to shed responsibility.

    Do you think it is the white power brokers also who were responsible for the majority of inventions that have come to define modern civilisation like the light bulb? or do you think it is just normal “mostly” white people?


  409. @ William

    Your privilege makes you unable to see that Wilson and I are telling the truth. Power does corrupt, no doubt, in all races. The issues at hand are, whites don’t want to accept any responsiblity or blame for the very system that they created. This country was founded on evil, blood and oppression and still operates under that principle.

    Wilson is correct about the deflection. Many whites do it on purpose or subconsciously not wanting to be apart of the blame. You cannot honestly say that the past has no bearing on the present and the future. The reason why Whites in this country are so far ahead is because they benefit from the skin colour privilege. ALL whites do. Law enforcement, courts, jobs, schools…the list goes on and on.

    William, do you believe that over 40 million blacks are “just making this stuff up?”

    Abagond’s blog attracts everyone all over the globe…
    We’ve all shared painful, hard experiences about this from childhood til now. Are most blacks that “oversensitive” or is something truly lurking under the surface?


  410. Sorry, computer & my finger not working so well today: real bad typos up in the last stuff.


  411. @William Noack

    You see, racism prevents many from seeing that Zimmerman being called “white” while Obama is called “black” is racist pride.

    *Sigh*, Obama is “Black” because White People wouldn’t accept Mixed People as White. In truth he’s mixed, but he’s suffered enough racial scorn in his youth to identify with Black. OTOH, Black People have always excepted mixed race people as Black.

    And before you say “we should mix like the Latinos”, they have racism to. In fact, the Mixed population act as a buffer to protect the White Latinos, and snuff out the Black Latinos.

    In fact, the matter of blacks voting for their race over integrity, morals & character so often does not help the racist image of blacks in many white people’s minds, does it?

    That’s why Herman Cain had unanimous support from Black America <__<

    I suppose what you're actually criticizing is our bulk voting. A split Black vote would evaporate all of our democratic power. OTOH, Democrats take our vote for granted, so we have little influence over them, while Republicans could win over us, if they wanted to they would have.

    On Trayvon

    I don’t think Trayvon was some kind of angel (most teens are dicks, I was one fairly recently), but from what I’ve heard he’d done nothing to warrant a 911 call that evening. Whether Trayvon overpowered Zimmerman and spat some cheesy straight-from-a-comic book one-liners is neither here nor there. Were it not for Zimmerman’s paranoia, he’d still be alive. Were it not for police nepotism, he’d have been arrested long ago and we never would have known about it.

    As for the modern-lynching Black “Leaders”, shame on them. It’s not like we elect them though.

    On the Rest

    Do you have a solution, Mr. Noack? Forgive me if you had offered one and I overlooked it, but it seems you are only giving us a message of Peace & Love. P&L does not change the world; power does, and power only yields to power. You and I agree in that the systems of power are corrupt, as are those within that system, but you cannot simply wait for others to become mutually enlightened while the world drives itself to hell. Such systems must be abandoned, replaced, and/or destroyed.


  412. As for some white guy making racist or untrue talk somewhere, that again is not “most” whites. There are millions of white Americans & many whites who get on our internet from overseas. Still, among millions of Americans, I can bet you could fill many pages of blogs with racist rants. You could also fill many pages of racist blogs with rants by blacks, too. That doesn’t mean “most” of either race are racists.

    I do consider that some things may be worse in some places than in others, too. Still, it is far from “most”, either way, IMO, and the only way to deal with it is to give no opportunity to the devil. Instead, it is to do good to your enemies so that it becomes like a burning coal on their head, as the bible also says. Our indiviual behaviors can work wonders. If we want to have friends, we have to show ourselves to be friendly. Evil will resist, but God can overcome. The authority of evil around the earth seeks to divide Chistians to cause harm to them & to other innocent people via chaos, oppression, ill-will, etc. When people do bad things, you can bet some good person is likely to get hurt. Then it becomes an excuse for more evil, and trouble, as the spiritual foe of mankind seeks to “kill, steal, & destroy”, as Jesus Christ said. That’s the kind of stuff that happens in parts of the world where you get the ingrained culture of revenge kilings & more severe racism. That’s what is was with famous grudges like the Hatfields & McCoys (all whites, btw).

    Agabond’s blog probably does invite trouble from all over the world. I also know the new black panthers placing a bounty on Zimmerman’s head probably also got a lot of world-attention…since it got attention all over America – not good attention, either. Rather, it made it easier for people to think hatefully – both blacks & whites. – Not good. How did Hitler arise to power? Hate. Why give fuel for what could ruin everyone? I have been reading a book full of things people wrote during WWII – soldiers in it, mostly. One story told about how angry – at Hitler – the German citizens were as allied troops entered their town. Ah, but once in power, what could they do? Once the hate had been manipulated to gain the desired results of the power-brokers & manipulators, it was too late to regain control from the Nazis & Hitler. We don’t need to act by emotions in such a way that brings another madman into power to hurt & ruin everyone. We have to act wisely, doing good without causing evil.


  413. @ William

    While I appreciate your need for peace, I do not find it very practical.
    The bible speaks of evil, yes. It also speaks of Christ as a “Servant Master” whose duties include educating the masses of God’s prophecy. I believe that “most” whites are indeed racist. Life experience has taught me that time and time again.

    William, you have the fortune of saying that “most” whites don’t adhere to this racist principle because of your privilege. As a black woman, I have 2 strikes against me, maybe 3 due to the fact that I am foreign born living in America. I deal with sexism, racism AND xenophobia. My experiences are indeed real. Are there black blogs that incite hatred? YES.

    Is this one of them?
    NO.
    Abagond’s blog, like many other blogs, are to be used as tools to uncover the problem that lies beneath. Offense is noted by whites by the very nature of spreading the truth. A hard truth that their past is filled with hate, lies, deception and violence. William, whites defend the past because of the shame it causes them. They skirt around the issues at hand because they don’t want to be blamed for the atrocities they created in society. Are blacks apart of that? Yes.

    I’ve met many blacks in my travels who have given up on life. They fight, steal, take drugs, end up in jail over and over…
    Ask yourself why? Why would someone give up on trying?
    Because the system sets them up for failure.
    I’m not making excuses for bad behaviour but to understand the problem, you have to get to the root of the problem.


  414. @ William…While I am still not convinced in the matter of whether or not Zimmerman is racist; I still say he is guilty of manslaughter. I understand people wanting facts, but truth be told that is what Martin’s parents wanted and had to go to extremes just to get it. Also I think those that are convinced he is innocent did not want facts. Even when the facts came out and a lot of the lies were debunked about Martin, they still wanted to believe that Zimmerman was justified. Why I ask? Because it is easier to say because he was wearing a hoodie then he must be a thug and a thug is definitely up to no good. That type of sorry thinking is why Zimmerman is in the position he is in now and a young Martin lost his life.

    In December my sister brought around her boyfriend, who was wearing baggy jeans and a hoodie and dreads. My family initially did not have good things to say about him and perceived him as a thug. After my husband decided to talk up a conversation with him, everyone was surprised to find that not only was this guy extremely intelligent, but he was working to help his mother with bills and was going to graduate with honors.

    If Zimmerman supporters really wanted to know facts then they will start to look for them instead of accepting that Martin is was up to no good. All the speculations and you have fools running around talking like it is facts. Classic “blame the victim” America.


  415. @D., Ace, BrothaWolf

    There is no unless democracy is “tyranny”

    Just because we have, loosely speaking, a democracy in which the people vote, does not mean we can’t have a tyranny. How about a white majority voting in some measures against the black minority? Ever hear about that? I believe I’ve made my point.

    My point about the “tyranny of the 99%” is that is easy for the majority to push their representatives to vote in measures that take money from someone else and give it to them. Though the 1% may be financially powerful, they cannot stop the majority from using the govt to get at their wealth. Actually, it’s worse than that. The US is spending borrowed and printed money for its expenditures, much of it going to Medicare and SS, which are going broke.


  416. @Sharina Wed 25 Apr 2012 at 03:55:27

    As far as the other things you have yet to convince me that whites did not steal technology from other races.

    That’s not how a logical statement is supposed to work. You don’t make a statement and then wait for the evidence to come in. If you don’t have any evidence now for whites stealing technology from other races, then you shouldn’t say that they do. From our conversations, it doesn’t seem like you have any evidence.

    You have no consistent posts. All your post switch back and forth on topics to suit your stance on what is right. One minute the Chinese have contributed nothing and then next….Oh they did a few things.

    I think you’re referring to my comments to other commenters. My answers have to refer to their comments; therefore, if may seem I’m jumping around. I’m not inconsistent with the Chinese. One comment is about the Chinese NOW and the other was about the Chinese circa 1400. Big difference in context. Currently, the Chinese import Western technology in abundance. Back about 1400, we got the compass from the Chinese, which assisted in the European Age of Discovery.

    Once again what makes what you say more correct than what anyone else has said? Nothing. ….The problem and the reason you are starting to get mad is because you are not able to break people in here down like you intended to.

    What makes me correct than any one else? Sharina, when someone states their opinion, doesn’t that mean that individual thinks they’re right? When I state something, I think its right. When you state something, youI think its right. That’s all it is.

    I’m not trying to break anyone down. I see a lot of white-bashing going on here. In addition, the only truth that any one here wants to accept about race relations is that whites are hopelessly racist, and the proof they offer are events that happened decades ago. That’s what I rail against here.

    Your mind is closed because you have countlessly come in here stating how blacks have accomplished nothing. How worthless blacks are; how blacks are this and that and so on

    I mostly rail about anti-white comments. I never said blacks have accomplished nothing – I’ve said they have a hard time in white society because they are less suited for it, and are somewhat less intelligent. it’s not an absolute “nothing”. I never said blacks are worthless. You and others here keep changing my words, usually to make it some like more hyperbole than I originally stated.

    The proposition that blacks are different than whites is worth considering on this blog. However, the Abagondites only want to bash whites.

    If you bash the race I will automatically jump in to counter your stance


  417. @Bliff

    Just because we have, loosely speaking, a democracy in which the people vote, does not mean we can’t have a tyranny. How about a white majority voting in some measures against the black minority? Ever hear about that? I believe I’ve made my point.

    You are correct. Democracy is tyranny of the majority, in practice. Like it, leave it, or kill to change it.


  418. @ Bliff here we are with the throw the ball in the other court game. Did you not state ” Whites invented technology?” You did in a post so it would stand to reason that since you have made such a claim you would be giving some type of example of what technology they invented. From my understanding technology has been around for a while so we would need to take a look at the past to refute that or make that claim. When I did mention to you that the Chinese did make contributions, then you were quick to dismiss it and change it to the present to suit what you currently knew about. If you check in history whites can take little or no claim to the invention of technology. The wheel was the first invention of technology and not one soul can sit in here and say that the race of the inventor were because it has been stated by many scientist that none of the people of the past can fit into our idea of race today.

    Let’s not sit here and try to play each other for a fool. You have made some pretty hateful comments towards blacks. Just as hateful as what you believe some of the blacks have said in here. You generalized to make matters worse. You should go back and read your other posts and then re-post. You will find you have very little to act holier than thou about.

    As Far as you believing what you believe is right. Well that is your right, but ignorance is bliss. If you lived on an island that was guarded by a dreaded monster and the only way it would not kill the people of the island is to sacrifice one child a month for it to eat. You have been told all your life this is right. Would you just sit and let countless children die with the “its not me attitude” or would you be trying to figure out a way to get rid of the monster.


  419. Bliff,

    Please answer my questions.


  420. @brothawolf

    What makes you think slavery didn’t have an impact on later and present generations of blacks?

    Slavery was involuntary servitude. That is the distinguishing characteristic of slavery. Once the slaves were freed, they were no longer bound. Granted they had few opportunities, but not bound. Many former slaves moved on. Certainly their former position of slaves had some affect on them. But what about the generation born free and later generations; there certainly was no affect from slavery.

    Once the slaves were freed, the whites didn’t want to live around them and wanted to be separate. Why? Because even then they knew there was differences between the blacks and whites. I’ll bet the blacks were happy to live apart from the whites, also.

    Now you come to the present day. How does slavery affect you? If there was some affect on the former slaves after slavery, thisy has to have dissipated by now. Since the 1960s even the South has had to recognize the blacks were here to stay and their former legal segregation has to end. Since the 1960s, racial attitudes have changed, especially with whites. Most whites are too cowed to say anything about blacks.

    How does a grown man like you claim that slavery still affects you? What if you had never heard of American slavery? Wouldn’t you be better off mentally? You would not have slavery to complain about.

    What makes you bring up slavery as the ONLY thing we supposedly complain about?

    I DON’T think slavery is the only thing you complain about. It’s just the most ridiculous because slavery took place so long ago.

    What about other factors that came after slavery up until today?

    You will have to list these factors. The potential list could be long.

    Why is being anti-racist the same as being anti-white to you?

    Someone can be anti-white against black racism without running whites down. This blog is about anti-racism, but there is way too much anti-white rhetoric. For example, there’s no reason to cut down Western civilization when all Americans, and increasingly the entire world, is living it and benefiting from it. Why does Abagond and his Abagondites have to run down what white civilization has developed, just to try to show that whites are somehow inherently racist? It’s not necessary, and it’s one of the primary reasons I post here.

    Why can’t we go to a place where we can talk about whiteness in peace without someone like you cracking not-so-funny jokes, derailing topics, and being an overall racist jerk?

    You can always ignore me. Look at all the people who unfairly, IMO, run me down as a troll, when all I really do is post alternative opinions. I just ignore them, or really laugh at them. The commenters on this blog, and Abagond himself, would be absolutely laughed off at any other truly serious blog. I don’t mean a white racist blog. I mean any blog where people with brains actually post there.

    What makes you think white privilege doesn’t exist?

    It may seem that we have privilege from a black person’s pOV. Look at it this way. If there were no blacks in USA, we whites would be acting the same as we are now. We don’t act different just because blacks are here. We are not purposely denying you anything, in 2012. Before 1he 1960s, the idea was that blacks and whites were to be living separately, so yes, the blacks were denied legally full participation in the main society, because they were supposed to living in their own society. That changed in the 1960s. To partcipate in the main society, blacks have to be capable. There is too much anti-whiteism in the black community. Futhermore, as I’ve said before, blacks are less adapted to white society ie, less intelligent, more impulsive, less planning ability. In addition, differences (different mannerism, music,etc you might think this is trite but this is how ALL humans are – we all discriminate against outsiders) that makes whites less wanting to deal with blacks.

    So the apparent privilege is just apparent from the black POV. Blacks don’t have the things we have because of the differences above.

    Also, look at it this way. I’m a white male engineer. When I’m on the job market, I am just one of many white (and Asian) male engineers. So where is my white advantage? There is none. Nobody has ever said to me “Wow a white man, come on in”, because I am one of many.

    It may sound like an old saw, but when blacks make themselves in demand, they will be in demand. It really is just that simple. Don’t make it complicated with outlandish theories of white privilege or white supremacy.

    -Have you ever been stopped by the police for a random case of suspicion even when you haven’t done anything?

    Nope, But I have been disrespected by cops when stopped for traffic violations. Blacks will get stopped more when they live in, near high crime areas. Beyond that, I don’t know why blacks get stopped more oftern. I am against harrassement by the cops of anyone. But I can’t explain it. NYC has a strong stop and frisk policy which Mayor Bloomberg recently defended. He seems to be a standup guy. I don’t know why he would defend it if he thought it was wrong.

    I don’t know why cops would have to be racists in their arrests. You would think that there are plenty of legit black arrests to make if the cop just wanted some action in arresting blacks.

    It seems that the anti-drug policies lead to black arrests. I would be for being less stringent on our anti-drug policies because it has been a failure in affecting anybody’s drug use.

    -Are media representations of white people limited to a few distasteful images all the time?

    Media representations of blacks are on balance more favorable than reality. Blacks are shown in middle class situations more than in real life. “Cops” has a policy of showing few black criminals. The arrest of blacks on the news shows are not made up – they really happened. Here in Pittsburgh I see blacks and whites being shown arrrested. When there are more blacks, its because more blacks are committing the murders, etc that land them on TV. It’s just that simple. Blacks don’t want to accept it.

    -Have you ever been suspected of being a shoplifter or robber the moment you’ve stepped inside a store even though you didn’t plan on doing either?

    When I was young long-haired hippie, I did notice some shop people following me around. Many times they were just standing by to see if I had any questions or were trying to push a sale. If you have been followed around, count that as among the least of your problems. I know of many accounts of stores being subject to frequent shoplifting by young blacks. Nowadays, they do in in swarms. Doesn’t exactly make shop owners happy about seeing blacks in their stores.


  421. @ Bliff,

    “Just because we have, loosely speaking, a democracy in which the people vote, does not mean we can’t have a tyranny. How about a white majority voting in some measures against the black minority? Ever hear about that? I believe I’ve made my point.”

    Something which you would think was a good idea, going by what you usually say. You defend that “tyranny” all of the time. Also, why are we considering the wealthy a minority group? They are a group with an unfair amount of power, they are hardly the victims of any “majority”.


    My point about the “tyranny of the 99%” is that is easy for the majority to push their representatives to vote in measures that take money from someone else and give it to them. Though the 1% may be financially powerful, they cannot stop the majority from using the govt to get at their wealth. Actually, it’s worse than that. The US is spending borrowed and printed money for its expenditures, much of it going to Medicare and SS, which are going broke.”

    Yeah fair enough. I agree that its wrong for people to take the money from some people and give it to others. But when those people have all of the wealth, all of the privilege, and yet do not pay their fair share, as does everyone else, it’s justified to want some fairness. If the “welfare mothers” can pay taxes and still have people looking for every excuse to cut any program that might help them, the wealthy should be put under the same scrutiny. People are not against “wealth”, they’re against the wealthy abusing everyone else or using their resources as an excuse to have all of the influence.


  422. @ Bliff As I have stated before you are in no way better than any of the other bloggers. You have not come in here and given an alternative to anything. All your posts are about my way is right and you are all wrong. From other blogs I have been to (not the racist ones) you would be considered a joke. You are quick to make claims on things then you can’t even back it up, but you are quick to tell someone else they should back it up. If this site is a big joke to you why even type here anymore. Why even bother to be here? This is probably the only site that really even would consider listening to you is what I speculate. You laugh at peoples claims. Well then I guess you do not need to put caps on statements when you are laughing right?

    I could go all the way to this beginning of the blog and list your I am right you are wrong rhetoric, but what is the point when you are going to do nothing more than complain about what someone else said and ignore the responsibility for what you said. Who cares what such and such said that you have to defend? The bottom line is you are deflecting your own wrong doings. Pretty words and long paragraphs do not change that in the slightest. You have been wrong on several things and in response the first things you want to do is make a long paragraph that does not even remotely address what has been said. I have tried to give you the benefit of the doubt but you do nothing more than prove other posters correct about you. The bigger person would have said that is your opinion or given some type of proof to back up claims, but you have done nothing but go on to how you are right. Right and wrong changes with the wind and it depends on who you are talking to.

    Oh and in the 1960′s even though blacks were free and there was no longer any segregation, the injustice still continued. Blacks could be killed for anything at that time. Looking at a white person. Speaking to a white person the wrong way…etc. If a person is old enough to deal with that time frame then yes I do understand the anger in this chat room. This is why I have urged you to do research before you spout things out without fully knowing what is going on (another reason you would be a joke in a serious chat room).


  423. @ Bliff read this a tell me that it is still only black people who feel this way or see this. Just read and give your opinion. http://academic.udayton.edu/race/01race/white09.htm


  424. and*


  425. Bliff,

    It’s just as I thought. You couldn’t give me straight and simple answers, and you couldn’t avoid not delving into your scientific racist thinking. You’ve just took a nosedive into that trap and crashed head first.

    Let’s get something straight, after slavery there were the black codes which limited basic human rights and civil liberties against blacks after the civil war. Then came Jim Crow where segregation and discrimination became legal and overt. Finally, you have the War on Drugs, which targeted black men for suspicion of drugs which blew up the prison population tenfold. Let’s not forget the horrible imprisonments, violent murders and rapes, KKK terrorism and lynchings that were celebrated by whites. Oh yea. They love to see black bodies hanging from a tree especially if they were on fire.

    The point is that after slavery, whites tried to come up with new ways to keep black people down at every level, violent and nonviolent. And, it continues right now as I type this. This is no exaggeration. This is no hallucination. This is what is known as FACT.

    And as expected you try to brush it aside as if they were nothing. That just shows where your heart is if you had one.

    How can I say slavery affected me. It’s simple. My ancestors’ names, cultures, past, and identities were mercilessly stripped in a gruesome plan to render them docile to the white man. Today, I am reminded of that horror because I’ve yet to know my past prior to slavery. I’ve yet to know my true self. The proof that it lives on is in my surname. Who were the culprits? Your ancestors probably.

    Oh sure. You can tell me to go to ancestry.com or some other solution that would take a half of a second to come up with, but that doesn’t, for one moment, take away the fact that the trauma experienced by my ancestors has been generational as described in the book Post Traumatic Slave Syndrome.

    And just for the record, we don’t complain about slavery as often as you think. Still, we are fully aware that it had a significant effect on us black people in America. We don’t go around crying about it, but we do cry at the fact that to people like you, we are a living joke you want to laugh at. People like you who refuse to recognize our humanity and respect us to simply exist. We know slavery’s in the past, but we also know that this country is still heavily racist. Always has been and mostly likely always will, and you are part of the problem, Bliffy.

    Everyone,

    This may be the longest response I ever written to a troll that doesn’t seek wisdom, but is lusting for cheap laughs. I’ll respond more soon (if I feel like it). I have a lot to say not just for him, but any other racist basket case.


  426. @bliff:

    Seriously, you really need to go back to school, Start from the history, Or rather, try learn calendar first. That helps when you try to learn history. You will learn how long is a year and how many years there are etc. It gives you a great tool to learn history. You will understand a bit longer trends.

    As for the hygiene, a racist BS again. When the first europeans arrived in Japan, the japanese were horrified to learn that educated and vcivilized europeans went to proper bath about once a year. The japanese took hot baths regularly and for pleasure too.

    In Europe proper, particulary in those countries were catholic church ruled, nudity and bathing was considered to be a sin. So more pious you were, less you washed yourself.

    During the 30 years war finns were considered to be extremely filthy by their european counter parts because they had a habbit to take a swims in rivers and lakes, and that was something only animals did. They were also taken as heathens because they did this naked.

    Actually at Versailles palace there was not a single toilet. The whole parfume industry was born to cover the stench of the royal court. Pigs were taking care of the waste which was dumped on the streets in most european cities up untill 1800′s century.

    One reason why Black Death was spreading so quickly was because the filthy conditions in Europe. Black Death was also not brought to Europe by mongols but by italian merchants who had their base on the shores of the Black Sea.

    As for the medical achievements, Indian veda texts explain the procedure of waxination. That was about 2000 years before any european had even heard about anything like that. Indian doctors were also practising plastic surgery some 1500 years ago. That was well before Pamela Anderson, whom you might know from your history.

    So it could be good thing for you to go back to school, at least for history lessons.

    As for me being anti-european, that is pretty thick coming from a xenophobic racist american. And that shows too, how little you know even about white europeans. See, I am very proud to be who I am but I don’t have to invent a history to be proud, like you have to. White americans have very little to be proud of their history, excluding WW2 or such incidents. Other than those, you guys have to make up stuff to be proud. We europeans do not. We just look at history as it is.


  427. @sam

    Wow, Bliff was burned by a European. That’s gotta hurt.

    *Note to self: Learn Indian History*


  428. Bliff, in the north, Brothawolf or his relatives , if they migrated there, would be pushed into ghettos, that were created by white politions and white realters, who created white flight.White racism blatently created the ghettos in our urban cities and all the problems that go along with that.

    Based on factual studies of white people who go out looking for jobs, housing etc, white people are accepted more than black people..this is a proven fact many times over…that means Brothawolf would have to face that reality every time he goes to look for a job or a place to rent.

    Bliff, take it from me, who is now living in South America, I can see blatently how slavery leaves its horrible imprint on todays society, and, it is the same thing in the USA

    You really have a hang up on culture, at least you sure dont want to recognise the immense contribution black Americans from slavery have made to making American culture everything that it is

    “one trick pony” my poopoo….man, get some real perspective on the culture of the country you were born in


  429. @brothawolf..Thank you very much for your comment as it speaks in leaps and bounds. I was reading it on my cell as I was strapping my daughter in the car and I wanted to cheer. LOL.

    I actually have found that I feel sorry for Bliff and people like him. Mainly because it is no excuse for people not to know history. To me that is just pure laziness. In an internet search any fool can find that it was put in law books for segregation to end in the 1960′s but anyone with common sense knows that it took time before it actually changed. On another message board that I was on in 2008 maybe even 2009 a white man blatantly said that white on black crime will be on the rise. In comparing him to bliff I realize that that man was a home grown racist who, while violent was honest. In bliff’s case he is just refusing to see the actual truth in things. Society is racist in nature. I gave him a link from a White European author who stated many of the same things many of the other posters have put in here. I was floored because I thought this was something that was new, but I am amazed that someone saw this long before I saw this board. It is one things for bliff to want to defend his race, but it is just insane to rewrite parts of history to make them somehow better. With all that talk he could make a great argument if he actually used facts LOL.


  430. @Sam

    Black Death was also not brought to Europe by mongols but by italian merchants who had their base on the shores of the Black Sea.

    The Mongols brought the plague to the Crimean city of Caffa in 1347 when they were attacking it. The Mongols catapulted some plague infected corpses into the city and the plague spread in the city. Sailors did then bring the plague from Caffa to Italy. This is essentially what I said before, with more detail.

    You still didn’t show that nonEuropean cities were any cleaner than European cities circa 1500. You just provided more detail on how dirty the European cities were, which I didn’t disagree in in the first place.

    So the Indians had the practice of plastic surgery and waxination (? – I can’t find a clear defintion of what this is). So what ?? Not excatly equivalent to Harvey’s discovery of blood circulation and modern medicine.


  431. @B. R.

    that were created by white politions and white realters, who created white flight.White racism blatently created the ghettos in our urban cities

    You are a one-trick pony. White flight was created by whites who didn’t want to live around blacks because of the crime, bad schools, etc that blacks bring.

    White racism did not create the ghettos. The blacks created their own ghettos. The Abagondites just don’t want to admit that.


  432. @brothawolf

    It’s just as I thought. You couldn’t give me straight and simple answers

    What are you talking about? I wrote my little heart out.

    after slavery ….. black …..Jim Crow …. KKK terrorism …..lynchings

    Sorry, all done. Not here anymore. Stop whining, and start living. You’ll get no sympathy from me. And you’re a PIMP. You want to pimp off of the plight of your ancestors and complain to ME, who had nothing to do with any of this. Grow up. Be a man.

    Finally, you have the War on Drugs, which targeted black men for suspicion of drugs which blew up the prison population tenfold.

    The War of Drugs does not target black men, it targets drugs. Blacks are just too stupid to stay away from the drugs and get arrested. Again, grow up, take responsibility.

    forget the horrible imprisonments, violent murders and rapes

    Yep, black crime does affect whites pretty bad TODAY, which is all I really care about.

    Today, I am reminded of that horror because I’ve yet to know my past prior to slavery. Brothwolf, seriously, screw off with your whining about you not knowing your past. YOU DON’T NEED TO KNOW YOUR STUPID PAST TO LIVE TODAY. I can’t go back further in my past beyond about 1890 because my ancestors came from Eastern Europe about then. I don’t even make that much effort to find out, because I really don’t care. My past does not define me, and it does not define YOU either.

    People like you who refuse to recognize our humanity and respect us to simply exist.

    You are an immature whiner. People I meet don’t always respect me.

    I wasted my time responding to you, because all you want to do is whine about your past. Give up on your f-ing past. I don’t want to hear about it.


  433. @sam

    white europeans. See, I am very proud to be who I am

    It doesn’t seem like you are. You seem to run down whites every chance you get.

    White americans have very little to be proud of their history, excluding WW2 or such incidents. Other than those, you guys have to make up stuff to be proud.

    We have little to be proud about, sure, Sam. Obviously, you don’t know American history, or you just study the racial aspects of it to run us down. You should be very aware that white Americans are very proud of themselves and their history. This is just an obvious cheap shot at white Americans, so it’s hard to take this comment seriously.


  434. Bliff….what? So that is your answer to me about white flight? oh ha ha ho ho…admit it, you are Dave Chapell coming in here messing with us…right?


  435. 1. murder is always wrong, regardless of the race(s) of the people involved
    2. people picketed against casey anthony, not too long ago
    3. there’s no such thing as being pure white or black, don’t get into that nonsense

    other than that, I generally agree with you


  436. Sharina & truthbetold,

    I appreciate your honesty. This thread seems to evolve into more reasonable discussion & less hate when people are willing to discuss rather than rant. Respect begets respect & helps fight racism, I think.

    @truthbetold,
    Terms like “they” seem racist to me, as I come from minority “white” Europeans who fled to the USA to escape persecution & discrimination on them. They didn’t own slaves – didn’t believe in it. Many whites didn’t.

    @Sharina,
    You wrote,…”In December my sister brought around her boyfriend, who was wearing baggy jeans and a hoodie and dreads. My family initially did not have good things to say about him and perceived him as a thug.”

    While that may be a form of prejudice, that is not racism. It is a reaction due to his habits, not color, it seems. Big difference there. I’m white. If I find myself in a place alone with some “shady-looking” whites dudes with lots of tats, scruffy-looking, and maybe eyes darting when they look about, I will find myself being cautious, also. I know people can change, and sometimes people’s eyes dart around due to having lived in a tough area so they have to stay vigilent. Still, people react to things. It can save their lives, sometimes. Sometimes, it hurts people. Do you think that in any way possibly be the case when blacks wear baggy pants, hoodies, etc.?

    What if a black officer or civilians encounters another blacks that “looks the part” of so many people they see in tough situations? Sure, judging people by what they wear & general behavior can be both bad & good: it sometimes saves lives & sometimes harms people, too. Race isn’t the only factor, then, if other things are involved. Do people want to “fit in” & sometimes wear what is popular or finds acceptance among peers? Sure. Is it always wise? No. What people wear sends signals to others due to associations. Hoodies, while benign to some, also are used to hide the face of criminals, also, as well as possibly being a sign of nonconformity. It can be tragic & unfair, but clothing tells stories to people that sometimes don’t fit the facts or the perceived facts.

    ————————————————————————–
    To other matters:

    No, whites are not intellectually superior to blacks. Consider George Washington Carver & others. It all depends on what people apply themselves to and in some part to personal abilities, likes, dislikes.

    Do blacks suffer AT ALL due to slavery of the past?
    Probably so. I grew up poor, and I have suffered lack in matters like access to education &, therefore, advancement & possibilities, because of that. Poor white people suffer from poverty just as poor black people do, for whatever reasons causing it. Slavery days & even the 1960′s are pretty far away by now, but poverty does hinder people, yes. Still, to attack the rich for being rich is also unfair. The bible says to not let judgment be blinded by favoring either the rich for their wealth or the poor due to their poverty. God blesses some & some God has not blessed as much (yet). Also, people DO committ wrongs that hinder others, and God is also, well, GOD, and able to help people, just as He turned what was meant for evil (in Joseph’s life) into good for his family and all of them & their descendents, even though that meant them suffering slavery in the hands of the Egyptians for some years. Then, GOD intervened Himself & blessed them, just as He had been doing so even in captivity & multiplying them all those years. It does not excuse wrong, but it is reason for hope & faith to stay righteous…and how I have avoided doing something terrible at times, too. (You can see my situation at http://www.SupremelyUNjust.weebly.com.)

    Are whites the evil scourge of the earth over all others? By no means. SImply one of many races who have, as a race, done many bad things. Hey, blacks ended slavery after whites and were the ones who largely caught & sold other blacks to whites slavers, historically. In recent years, black muslims have killed black Christians in Africa, stolen their children to force them to become muslims & cut the breasts off of black Christian women to keep them from rearing more black Christians.


  437. About race & violence:
    Various whites in Europe have historically done violence to other Europeans/whites…long before they had contact with blacks, so yeah, whites have a history of violence.

    News flash,….so do blacks, Asians, Arabs, etc. etc.
    It is all historical fact. People have done lots of wrong to other people — all races have.

    Another fact? When people are a minority, they usually are less violent. It doesn’t take a scientist to figure out why, right? Peace has sometimes resulted by elliminating the racial issue. In So. America, that has sometimes happened by intermarriage, as it sometimes did in other places when ancient when kings exchanged daughters for marriages that ended warring between nations. Nothing like being related & habing kids & grandkids partly of another race…to help stop the hate.

    The other choice would be to simply have it out, hate and all, on one another, but WWI, WWII, etc. shows that can really mess people up – and not just one side, too! So, people need to think & choose…carefully as to what is smart or stupid….and as to what will leave our kids & grandkids hating us all & cursing us when it’s done.


  438. @bliff:

    I seem to run down whites? Well, that is your mistake. As an american racist you believe that we whites are One. As an european I know we are not. That is why former yugoslavians could kill 300 000 of each other i few years in 1990′s. That is why WW2 made some 30 million europeans to be killed.

    We europeans know that all whites are not on the same side. You americans just think so because for you the color of the skin is The Thing. For you the world is divided between races. For us it is not. It is all about the nationality.

    Sure, we may be racist to our minorities and blacks, but lo behold if a guy from another country, white or purple, makes bad comments about our black guy! From that moment on, that black guy is one of us and you are not.

    That is the difference you seem to be not able to understand.


  439. @William

    Peace has sometimes resulted by elliminating the racial issue. In So. America, that has sometimes happened by intermarriage, as it sometimes did in other places when ancient when kings exchanged daughters for marriages that ended warring between nations.

    Didn’t I just tell you that interracial marriage did NOT solve S. America’s race problem. All it did was make the Black Minority an even smaller minority that is unable to muster even the smallest amount of agency. They are almost completely destitute; as I said the rift between Black & White is a godsend for us. Look up Race Whitening.

    Kings exchanged daughters for marriage not for peace, but for acquisition of more power. The daughters were high profile prisoners, or the union was forged to defeat a common foe.

    Sorry my idealistic friend, but short of an Extraterrestrial conquest, groups of humans will always war in competition for resources and influence. Hate is just a tool used to rally the masses. 5000 years of recorded history is not on your side.


  440. http://academic.udayton.edu/race/01race/white09.htm

    Sharina

    Real Racists comments re the above URL:

    {{{ crickets }}}

    Thanks for sharing …

    Speaking of crickets – Hey Randy, I’m still waiting on your answer to the question I asked you on another thread, “Were black slaves deemed racists?”


  441. @Sam
    Man, you been smoking something? You got some wild notions there. You also seem to think you got all American whites pegged by some kind of stereotype, plus another blanket to cover all Yugoslavs. (BTW, my own heritage is Wendish – slavic.)

    @D.
    Where in South America did intermarriage make blacks a smaller minority? I was talking basically about Spaniards & native americans, there, – race-mixing in general, as an idea. No offense, but not sure blacks can say they’ve tried it down there with bad results. Curious – I’d like to know where, if so.

    You wrote, ” *Sigh*, Obama is “Black” because White People wouldn’t accept Mixed People as White. In truth he’s mixed, but he’s suffered enough racial scorn in his youth to identify with Black. OTOH, Black People have always excepted mixed race people as Black.”

    I’m not sure anyone knows much about what Obama did or did not suffer, really – just assuming something I think. He also was raised in part outside the USA, so that plays into his life & how he is perceived, too. It could be possible, especially depending on what part of America you live in, how you act or respond to people, etc. (not to be combative, just sayin: it all figures in)


  442. – Herman Cain? Lol, he didn’t have a chance, because blacks don’t allow blacks to think outside THE parameters, so often. He was discriminated on by his own for the greater “good” of an anti-white racist voting block and all the sellout to the liberals who only use blacks. Cain knew that whites are not so racist as blacks paint us to be, that there was good sense in the GOP principles, and he switched. If blacks want to increase in power in the USA, they should see the GOP as the party more likely to enable them to succeed, – not succeed only as far as getting help but rather in LIFE. When blacks become the majority, soon, will you want everyone taking your hard-earned $$ to give away for vote-buying through govt handouts? Will you wish to succeed in business? Well, while there is a need to help people, there is also a need to not rob those who succeed by working hard & ingenuity in business. Otherwise, it takes away all incentive to succeed & makes people rot with complacency. Before you say something racist against the GOP or Tea Party, lol,…have you ever asked them if they’d like to have you or other blacks involved? Maybe you could add some good ideas & perspectives!

    A split Black vote would evaporate all of your democratic power? So move to the GOP. Did it occur that the GOP might have given up on seeking more black voters due to the animosity blacks have toward even other blacks who move over – the “voting block” casting them out? If blacks moved over, why should anyone mind, as long as the good principles stay & good moral values? In fact, the Tea Party people & moral conservatives in the GOP are already making waves. The fatcats in the GOP don’t like it, but they are losing influence as more get voted out. That would make a great deal for black Christians to throw in with, as so many blacks are against bad things, too. Lots of blacks don’t want their kids to grow up as hoodlums, and lots go to church & have Christian teaching. It makes more sense for all such good-minded people to take over the GOP or combine for a good 3rd party than to stay in the Democrat party, if you want good to happen – real good. You get a lot of black conservatives, you get changes that help the nation & help individual responsibility, respect for making something of ourselves, & having incentives for doing well, not just biterly robbing people who do succeed. It will be a plus for business for all races & for morality in America again. Democrats in power positions buy votes telling whatever people want to hear & stand for immorality – do as you please stuff. I don’t think blacks stand for the GLBT movement, honestly, and I do think they want to succeed in business. I know, I have worked with many and have mentored them also when I was hiring so many young black college students.

    On Trayvon

    Trayvon was no angel. Zimmerman acted stupidly & wrecklessly, and will probably be found guilty on something due to it all. His bad. His parents sought help, and yes, you hit it on the head with the “nepotism” comment, or whatever. That is, power protects power & such. Police, corporate, politics: they watch out for themselves, true. Still gotta play the game, and instead of race-baiting and calls of violence, I think it would have gotten lots better if blacks had called for truth, not revenge. Whites woulda stood up for a call for truth, but not for revenge on whites in such a racist, hateful way as it went down…or seemed in the media to have gone down. I only found out about the Trayvon case after it turned to hateful outrage. That’s the media’s fault, just like maybe why none of them have reported on my own case – a white man losing everything due to being ordered to do discrimination & unpaid OT, being discriminated against by women, & refusing to go along with it. I personally think all of this, if contained to peaceful actions & dialogue, will do good for America, as we are not the nation we were in the 1960s, 1860s, etc.


  443. @ William

    Obama being “black” has nothing to do with scorn.
    Obama is black due to America’s invention called The One Drop Rule.


  444. Where in South America did intermarriage make blacks a smaller minority? I was talking basically about Spaniards & native americans, there, – race-mixing in general, as an idea. No offense, but not sure blacks can say they’ve tried it down there with bad results. Curious – I’d like to know where, if so.

    In Brazil, Afro-Brazilians suffer massive inequalities in education, healthcare, and employment. They don’t have the numbers to argue.

    I’m not sure anyone knows much about what Obama did or did not suffer, really – just assuming something I think. He also was raised in part outside the USA, so that plays into his life & how he is perceived, too. It could be possible, especially depending on what part of America you live in, how you act or respond to people, etc. (not to be combative, just sayin: it all figures in)

    He mentions just as much in his book.


  445. @Truthbetold

    The One Drop Rule, of course, resulted in that scorn.


  446. ” If blacks want to increase in power in the USA, they should see the GOP as the party more likely to enable them to succeed, – not succeed only as far as getting help but rather in LIFE. ”

    Sorry William. You have it wrong. I stopped reading your post.


  447. @ Matari.Thanks. I personally am really enjoying the perspective of many individuals in here. I know for one thing it is good to actually see what some whites may really think of black people. I may not be able to say all just yet, but based on some other message boards I have been on it is hard to say that the majority of whites are not racist. I think the non-racist whites are actually the minority.


  448. William

    You wrote:

    “When blacks become the majority, soon…?”

    I’m very curious as to what *soon* looks like to you?
    Would you care to expound on that?


  449. @truthbetold
    Where have you been all these years? Things have changed, just like all the various boxes & “other” indications now available on census & other data cards when asked about race or ethnicity. To live in the past with hate when things are passing you buy is little help, now.

    @D.
    Don’t know too much about Brazil, honestly. I do know that it is poor, starting to get wealthier, and lots of things are happening there. Last I heard is they are working on cleaning up the barrios, there, to help against the problem situations. Maybe all the growth & vitality will help make prosperity available to more people. There are other countries though that have succeeded in blending various ethnicities in So. America. Honestly, though, anywhere there is a vast difference in color, there is more difficulty with race issues, just like with the nepotism thing, but racism, yeah, to some extent, and sometimes cultural, too – what people consider acceptable in culture or not. Have you ever noticed whether there is racism against non-blacks in parts of Africa…or jealousy over jobs in a racial way, there? Just wondering. Sure, it is something we have to work on, and hate is counter-productive. Intermarriage is not. All it would take is people “walking on the same side of the street” instead of trying to be so different in pride. Morality is something many blacks & whites can agree on, and so is success in business, support of a party that wants to uphold the U.S. Constitution, etc. There are roads of agreement, and that’s where we need NEW, REAL leaders who have the guts to do that. You ever hear anyone – including Obama – tell us all that if the USA will committ to a great deal of intermarriage, we could wipe out racial issues & everybody win in it all…in a generation or two? I doubt it. We need some fresh thinkers in D.C.


  450. “but based on some other message boards I have been on it is hard to say that the majority of whites are not racist. I think the non-racist whites are actually the minority.”

    ************

    Yes Ma’am. I would say that non racist whites are the *tiny* minority.

    Abagond has written a plethora of posts here that sheds much light on why/how American whites are largely racist.

    Guess who has the most issues with his posts??


  451. @ William…Your post started out wrong. You don’t know who or what blacks would have voted for. Mr. World Peace shows his true colors. I am a moderate and I am not going to ever label myself with any political group. I never have and I am not going to start. Just because a republican gets into office does not mean he is some how going to do a better job. News flash…we are still running on things put into place by Bush and for the little that has managed to be changed it is at the tweaking of the republican party. Only thing Obama has been doing is negotiating with the the republicans getting their way on a majority of things.

    As for Herman Cain I still believe to this day that his own party set him up to fail. The fact that even he is too dumb to see it is not my problem. If he had won he would not have gotten my support simply because I was backing Ron Paul this year….Same as I did the election year before.

    Stop pushing that sorry political pitch. I am so sick of hearing what the GOP can do for us as the people let along us as the Black people. What has it done so far? What has any politician done for anyone so far?


  452. @truthbetold,
    You said, “Sorry William. You have it wrong. I stopped reading your post.”

    Lol,…so you ARE closed-minded. (grinning)
    When Herman Cain suggested a straight set of numbers for income tax – something that would knock out all the loopholes for rich people to avoid taxes by – why did blacks only disregard him for being GOP? Sounds like a good idea? I’m talking about giving ear to someone who values good ideas for LIFE success, not just telling people what they want to hear to get a block vote from the black community.

    @Shirina
    Most blacks commenting often seem to have an attitude, too. That doesn’t mean they speak for all blacks. Same thing. Of course hotheads will be the first to shoot off at the mouth – or keyboard, in this case. Those do not equal “all” of their race. Probably most of their race got better things to do or more pressing things to do than fight with people on the internet, lol. Keep that in mind, okay?

    @Matari
    From what I’ve heard, the three major ethnic groups – blacks, whites, latinos – seem to be very close in numbers in the USA, presently. Blacks & latinos have a higher birthrate. Whites in the USA, as in Europe, tend to have lower birthrates. Some of this is due to thinking about the expenses & hassles of raising kids, cultural ideals about how many kids parents would like, plus things like the costs of contraception, entertainment, travel, etc., etc. Whites tending to have more $, due to education & inheritances, can afford things to keep them busy in lots of ways, IMO. I also know that people with $$ don’t like to part with it, get hooked on it like dope, and so that becomes a bigger factor in decisions. When you lack $$, you honestly do what you do have for pleasure; hence, more kids, IMO – nothing racial at all. Lots of poor whites have lots of kids, but whites with more $$ tend to have fewer of them.

    All of that means that the major minority groups should probably pass whites in numbers, soon. I don’t know what the most curren stats are – I don’t care so much about it, and is just something I heard in news some while back already. I would tend to guess, if it is that close, that it would be before 2050, possibly before 2030, when whites become THE main MINORITY, second to both blacks & latinos. I may be wrong, but that’s my guess, if not even sooner.

    When that happens, will blacks & latinos want to succeed in business…or simply want to block vote away all their success-$$ …to whoever will vote to get promises of something for free. Again, we all need help at times, but logic means helping people to succeed in business and we need America to not fall into a moral toilet, also.


  453. @William
    Before you say something racist against the GOP or Tea Party, lol,…have you ever asked them if they’d like to have you or other blacks involved? Maybe you could add some good ideas & perspectives!

    Indeed I have! They want us to take care of ourselves; we might as well become our own country under GOP logic. Not that I have a problem with that, sovereignty would be great. We’d have the power to allocate our resources to fight poverty, improve education, train people for business and labor skills, and become pioneers in new technology. We’d have control over the laws of our land, farmland, and a place in global trade. Best of all, depending on how thing go, we’d be immune to the Neo-colonialism that has hindered most Southern and Eastern countries. GOP values are great when we apply them to our context, but such values would make being Americans more of a hindrance than anything. Being a minority in politics, a self-sufficient Black America has no reason to remain in America. That is the ultimate conclusion of a Black-capital-B Conservative.

    Democrats have only diminished our agency, and made us ripe for the slaughter. We had forgotten our own ability to organize, and so we become dependent on the structure that already is. And we agree that the system is corrupt, so why not make our own as a replacement?

    If I must name my grievances with the GOP, it’s that they are more invested in protecting the wealth that already is, than they are in facilitating the success of those with less wealth. Granted, both parties are like that. Take, for instance, the neglect of education. Upward mobility in America is dead.

    We have to invest in our communities. Neither Liberal nor Conservative Whites actually want to live in our communities, crime riddled or not, so neither are fully invested in solving our problems. We need to become entrepreneurs in industries that produce tangible goods and services for us, employ and educate ourselves, and stop expecting a country that remains segregated in schools and communities 50 years after the Civil Rights to drop its issues. We need to behave like a nation-within-a-nation that is self-sufficient.


  454. @ William:

    Yes sah, tell is negroes how to think and behave!


  455. @Shirina
    Sorry, but you are wrong.
    Polling shows how blacks & others voted.
    Lots of whites voted for Obama, but almost ALL blacks did – they voted as a block, mostly. Facts proved it.

    As for the GOP, I only say about them because there is no viable 3rd party at present. Yeah, they got some problems, and I like Ron Paul; but w/out an alternative, I will have to chose the GOP over Democrats due to my beliefs, in general. More fall the GOP than the other way. That said, it’s funny that the GOP is so racist when you got someone talking & DOING as reasonably as myself in there & working on more. The website I mentioned above shows documented proof that I stood against my former employer, alone, living in a freaking tent, after taking a stand against commands to practice discrimination. So, I guess people just shouldn’t buy the hype that Republicans & conservatives are a bunch of racists, lol. — That’s another media manipulation that goes on.


  456. @William Noack

    People don’t think republicans are racist because of the media; they think they are racist from interacting with them.

    To put it this way; why do the vast majority of minorities vote democratic? How come they almost automatically recognize Republicans as being their enemy and seeking to hurt their “people” regardless of which group they happen to belong to?

    Why is it your blatant racist types are almost always republican?

    To put it this way; maybe all Republicans aren’t racist, maybe even most of them aren’t but how come people who are, people who want to actively work against the interests of minorities, how come they almost always are Republican?

    Even if thats not the interest of most Republicans, it would seem like that would cause some inner contemplation to realize their interests coincide with the racists.


  457. GOP does have an elitist problem,…and if they have bought their way past all comers in the primaries, we reformists will kick their tails little by little ’til they are forced to change – the more help the merrier. You got some valid complaints about them! BTW, as for violence & such. Mexico could be rolling in dough in tourism, business, etc, if they drove out the drugs & violence. I know myself & lots of Americans would go there if not for all the dangers. Add racial hate into a mix like that, and see how it goes, right? Just sayin. – Regards.

    @Hernieth
    Sorry, but you don’t know what you’re talking about in that.


  458. Bliff,

    Here’s part two:

    Most of these questions that I asked only require a simple ‘yes’ or ‘no’. The fact that you rambled in paragraphs means you’re running away from examining yourself beyond your positive qualities, actual or imagined.

    You are not so slow as to not recognize that you don’t offer anything constructive to this blog. Everything you’ve said has been done ad nauseum. There were those before you with the same statements as if you all have a hive mind. That doesn’t make it more true. That just means you have a hard time thinking cognitively.

    You so-called race realists are nothing more than living contradictions of your own beliefs.

    The fact that you don’t believe in white privilege means you’re either in denial or you, again, have a difficulty in thinking along those lines. White privilege, as the term suggests, means you have social, economic, and even political advantages based on your skin color. You can be a poor white man, and still have privileges over rich black men.

    For example, Prof. Henry Louis Gates, a black man, was arrested for trying to enter his own house. A white person called the cops on him thinking he was an intruder. Would that white person called the police if it was a white man in the same clothing?

    Plus, on ABC’s “What Would You Do?” There was an experiment that helped solidify that white privilege is up and running. Some white youths vandalized a car out in the middle of the park one day. White people were walking around and none of them thought anymore about it. They didn’t think they were doing anything wrong.

    However, people did call the police to report a car full of black people who were just sleeping! As a side note this shows the tendency for white society to pathologize anything and everything black people do no matter how harmless it is and no matter if white people do the same thing.

    On top of that, the experiment was repeated only with black youths. In no time at all, white people were going frantic and burned the phone lines to call the cops.

    And so you still don’t believe in white privilege? There are countless examples of white people getting a one-up on black people because white people are not burden with this nation’s overall association with black skin. It’s the same kind of association you have every time you make a comment here.

    But you know what? That sill doesn’t matter to you because as with the rest of your “race realist” brethren, you ask for examples, but reject them. What’s the flipping point? Why ask for proof if you won’t accept it? What would you accept that would be reasonable enough to still disagree with you? If there is nothing that can be proven to back up counter-arguments to you, then stop asking for proof or evidence when you know you will reject them spontaneously. Plain and simple.

    This is why people won’t take you seriously, Bliff. The point of this blog is not for you to tell us who we are. It was not designed for Bliff and all your racist (‘m going to stop using the term “race-realist”) buddies. You are a visitor here. You’ve stepped into our world. Maybe you should take your head out of your ass and listen to what we’re saying instead of telling us how and why we’re wrong every chance you get. That is not bring in a different opinion to a balanced view. That is just overbearing arrogance.

    Maybe it’s time you took on a different view, one that brings you outside your sheltered lifestyle that you enjoy so much. As long as you believe that you are better than certain people, you are doing nothing but hold yourself back. And if you keep doing that, you’re only going to end up left behind.

    Besides, despite it all, black people are strong survivors. My people have gone through hell and we’re still here, strong and proud. No matter how often you try to put us down, we still stand up. And we all know that if you’ve gone through a fraction of what black people overall have went through, you would implode into a black hole of despair and distraught so intense you’d go mad.

    As proof, your disagreements come with insults against black people. You demean them at every turn. You’ve saw reality outside your bubble and you can’t stand it. So, you attack to defend yourself, trying to remain in your space

    So, continue living in your own world where you are ruler of truth and knowledge. Know this, like all reigns, yours has a time-limit. If you continue on your anti-black attacks, then it will be a matter of time before you end up exiled.

    Peace.


  459. @ William..You may have me confused with another commenter or perhaps you are reading my comments wrong…Don’t know and don’t care, so that me break things down for you on what I said.

    I for one never said GOP were racist. What I said is Id on’t trust them. Much like my post stated I don’t too much trust politicians in general, but I do actually like Ron Paul.

    Secondly when I actually have an attitude you will know and so far I have yet to have one so once again do not assume you know what I am feeling at this moment as we are on the internet and not in face. If me stating how I feel about politics is all of a sudden fighting then you are wacked out.

    Don’t assume you know me based on some statistical reports or polls either. I for one never took not one political poll so how is that to tell anyone what the majority thinks.

    Thirdly My name is spelled S-h-a-r-i-n-a.


  460. “From what I’ve heard, the three major ethnic groups – blacks, whites, latinos – seem to be very close in numbers in the USA, presently.”

    **************

    William

    Do you know (approximately) how many blacks there are CURRENTLY residing in the US?

    How many whites presently live in the USA?


  461. @ William…To clarify on my Mr. World Peace shows his true color comment….You are jumping in here with your vote GOP paragraphs…AS I may have stated pushing some kind of political agenda. I don’t need anyone to tell me who I should be voting for. I will vote who I feel is right just as I am sure everyone in this board will do the same. None of the parties are right and for you to be sitting here telling me how I should feel and the right way to go. The right way for who???? Not me.

    You sound just as bad as those idiots running around telling blacks that they should not have voted for Obama just because he is black and should have instead voted for McCain.

    At the end of the day I will be voting for Ron Paul, but the difference is I am not going to give you a paragraph stating who you should be voting for.


  462. Uhmm William,

    Republicans are on the right of the political spectrum. Right means racist. Left means liberal. GOP are way more right that means way more racist. These are the facts.

    I think I understand though why you like the right. You are christian, heavily so from what I can gather. So you like the right. I am sorry if this is a huge assumption but am going to burst a bubble. The right doesn’t represent God either. They just use God to get votes…. You’ve been lied to. Sorry to be the one to tell you this.


  463. @V-4

    “Why is it your blatant racist types are almost always republican?

    To put it this way; maybe all Republicans aren’t racist, maybe even most of them aren’t but how come people who are, people who want to actively work against the interests of minorities, how come they almost always are Republican?”

    Good questions. Really! You should ask the GOP (politely, for best results & to make them think). My take on it is that the GOP is diverse, just like the Democrats. However, the diversity has some similar values in some ways. Most conservatives or Republicans – sometimes not the same things – believe strongly in issues like freedom to bear arms, to self-defense, to support the rights guaranteed by the U.S. Constitution, etc.

    This brings in with it people like some radicals who ARE racists. I’m sorry, but I have no power to kick them out & say they cannot vote Republican or self-identify with the GOP. Right?

    Another problem is the elitists who fear change. That is what I also was just talking about, changing the GOP from within, as is going on now. If you listen to talk radio, you will find, surprisingly, that some radio hosts are openly talking about this. It makes us angry that the elites want to run roughshod over everyone else & used $$ to force the primary outcomes this year. Without all that money, Romney would not be the candidate for GOP now, probably. He outspent the others many times over. Of course, Obama has used lots of money, too, just as Clinton did. It is all elitism, and IMO more that than racism, as lots of Americans are sick of race problems, but poor people don’t have the money it takes to buy elections. So, we will force things little by little, whether they accept it or not.

    There is also a problem with the GLBT agenda. It affects ALL ethnicities, and conservatives staunchly oppose immoral perversions as an acceptable way for our families. I bewilders white conservatives to see blacks sticking with the Democrats when so many blacks are Christians, too. BTW, in my area, I heard a band playing live music last evening while at a Lowe’s. i went over to listen: it was at a Chick-filet. The parking lots was filled with kids & families, mostly whites. Honestly, I could not afford to buy food there, lol, as the place is a bit pricey for me. The occasion? They were rasing $$ for Lutheran mission work against malaria in Africa…and to help raise funds for a couple who was trying to adopt two African orphans. These are some of the many white conservatives that blacks are deceived into hating as racists, no doubt, if you know what I mean.


  464. And Bliff,

    I’m not looking for sympathy from someone who as morally handicapped as you. I gave you answers to your questions about why bring up slavery, and–as expected–you brushed them off as whining and proceeded to call me a pimp?! You really are a sick man.

    If you really think that the War on Drugs doesn’t target black men, you seriously do live in a bubble. “The New Jim Crow” by Michelle Alexander documented the history to a ‘T’. Police targeted black males because of the campaign that black males are the biggest and most violent drug dealers and users in this nation, and that crack cocaine was perceived as “more dangerous” than powdered cocaine, a form of cocaine mostly used by whites.

    In the first place, black people do not have the power to import drugs into this nation. Second, most drugs are found in white communities, but the police hardly think to look in there for drugs. (For all I know, you could be on drugs yourself the way you’ve been acting.) Again, the image of the drug dealer is always a young black male in the streets with a gun.

    If you care about black crimes so much, fine, but don’t think for one single, solitary moment that white crimes are not as or more harmful, and that white people don’t target their own.

    You say that I don’t need to learn about my past to get through the day. Okay. If that’s the case, it doesn’t matter when people are born. That’s in the past. So, it doesn’t matter. If a woman was harmed yesterday, it shouldn’t matter because it’s in the past. That’s how you think, Bliff. So, in conclusion based on your rationale, it shouldn’t matter when you were born. So, your birthday is meaningless since it happened in the past.

    And before you call me an amateur whiner, maybe you need to take a good hard look in the mirror before you call someone else a whiner. You are the king of whine here in this blog. You get upset if anyone disagrees you. You get agitated when someone calls you out even though 9 times out of 10 you started beef. And you moan about how this blog needs you. This blog can get alone fine without you. Like I said, you bring nothing constructive or exclusive to the conversation. Everything you’ve said was done to death by other so-called race realists. So, why the devil would we need another clone?

    After all, you need us WAAAAAAAAAAAAY more than we need you. That’s the bottom line, son.


  465. Considering the nature of this post inregards to black on white murder.

    Black People kill twice as many white people as white people kill black people.

    The population of non-mestizo white people is as of 2010 anyways, 63.7% the total population as of 2011 is 311,591,917.

    63.7% of 311,591,917 is 198,484,051.129
    Black people are 12.6% of 311,591,917 at 39260581.542

    So thats:

    White: 198,484,051.129
    Black: 39,260,581.542

    And if I remember right; the amount black women have children is higher but barely higher, so I don’t see this changing any time soon. I know the stereotype is black women have tons of kids but by and large on a national level white and black women have children at almost the same rate.


  466. It’s the old “divide & conquer” bit – elites using lies to stay in power in both major parties.


  467. Ha, Forgot what I was going for originally in that post; which was of the people killed by Black people how many of those numbers are actually mestizo and not actually white?


  468. @v-4. That is an interesting take on things.


  469. @ William

    You know; its kind of bewildering that Republicans and conservatives are confused with Black people vote democrat because so many of them are christian.

    The fact is; the vast majority of Democracts are christian as well its not something the Republicans have a strangelhold on or the only ones who are christian.

    Its like they spent so long trumpeting the fact they are good christians that it never occured to them they live in a nation that is majority christian so even their opposition is obviously going to have christian values and beliefs.


  470. @V-4
    Like I said, I didn’t know the more recent stats, but I did think it was much closer on the numbers though.

    BTW, how many blacks would there be if not for abortions?
    You know, the ones the liberal democrats always push for?

    That’s another matter of difference between the major parties or at least between conservatives & liberal Democrats. I know there are some conservative democrats (few) and some RINOs (Republican in Name ONLY). It the RINOs that are the elites, and they are targeted by that monicker, now, when they are found out….and political “hunting season” is now. Do you realize that the conservative stance is against abortion – believe it or not, against even the abortion of black unborn babies, too. I know, hard to believe from all the liberal race-baiting, huh? Sorry, but liberals are promoting the support of abortion for unborn black children, as “alternative” & “choice”. how many black mothers consider their babies as throw-aways…as an alternative? Yet, lots of “racist” white conservatives value LIFE and do not see that as good. Just so you know, not trying to be rude.


  471. @V-4
    Do you realize indeed that on those stats about race & killings, they clump hispanics in as white, don’t they?


  472. Now 16.3% of the population is mestizo; that adds up to 50,789,482.471; the entire amount of white people murdered by black people was what only a few thousand?

    Actually; they also count arabs and people from central asia as white as well don’t they? The federal goverment I mean in population count.

    What does that mean; well:

    A.) The Mestizo’s alone could easily throw off the number of how many people are getting killed being counted as white, none the less, arabs or ameri-indians.

    B.) And when white people kill these people they get counted as “white on white” crime.

    So ultimately:

    C.) Do black people kill twice as many white people number wise or at a rate of 14x as a many white people kill black?

    Well yes and no; we have no way of knowing how many of those people killed by black people are actually white but it still gives us some general numbers to go by as of black people compared to a composite group as compared to what they kill black people.


  473. @V-4
    Gotta go soon, but I guess we got the board to ourselves, lately. haha.
    Christian is an interesting term for some liberal Democrats, as some of their party beliefs stand opposite to sound Christian doctrine.

    – help for killing babies in the womb
    – support for perverse behaviors: pushing GLBT matters
    – trying to force everything about God out of public view in a nation founded on trust in God
    – dishonesty in trying to ignore the founding fathers’ documents’ of govt authority, such as the U.S. Constitution by which out system got started & ensures fairness. Without it, we are prey for dictators.

    When gays talk about being “Christians”, they have gone directly contrary to biblical teaching and gather “pastors” who teach it’s okay to be gay & that it’s all okay by God. It isn’t, and it messes up the children & other people and hinders the nation from having more favor with God. Biblically, God has made mention of problems where there was a national issue between Him & Israel over what was allowed to happen there. It is no different today. That includes evils of discrimination, violence, abortion, rebelliousness against authority, etc., too.


  474. I did hear that, %-wise, almost all racial violence is same-race: white on white or black on black. upper 80s % to low or mid 90s % I think.


  475. By the way, good pickup on the stats there!


  476. @ Brothawolf

    Bliff’s name calling is more telling than anything else he’s said.
    Calling the black man a “pimp” gives me a peek into his mind.
    Perhaps Bliff comes up…ahem…..short?


  477. @William

    The abortion rate for blacks is about five times the rate for whites I believe.

    So essentially somewhere around 40,000 more black babies would be born every year or 400,000 every decade post abortions becoming more common whenever that was.

    So basically no; no real difference there numberwise in population, at most what a few million more or less?

    As for why black christians would side with pro-choicers if they themselve are pro-life, I could theorize its because they are tired of rich white people telling them what to do with their bodies and claiming a sort of ownership of them even still today.

    But I honestly don’t know.

    Besides; cynically I could see racist conservatives going at it from another angle.

    Among the black population currently the ones making the most gains are black women, they start havinging babies that can do a lot to keep them out of the game or at least hold them back briefly, additional economic costs etc….

    Basically it attacks what is currently turning into the most successful part of the black population.

    Part of me can’t look at that as coincidental.


  478. @William

    Inregards to gay christians etc….regardless of the sin, all christians are sinners it varies depending on the christian but at the end of the day they are still christians.

    Being gays a sin but so too is valuing wealth and earthly ambitions.

    Lets be honest; biblically speaking, a homeless travelling street preacher is a lot closer to how christians are supposed to live than the majority of current christians.

    Or to put it this way; people focus a lot more on the “gay” aspect of the bible and not the anti-sea food aspect of the bible. Both are considered abominations in the eyes of the Lord.

    And sure God was part of many of the beliefs of the founding father; but they also wanted to keep Religion and government seperated so as to protect any religion that wasn’t considered Mainstream, whether pagan or just different christian sects.

    And Republicans haven’t been that great at keeping the constitution safe or protecting the rights of the civilians, neither have the democracts really.

    Both when in office operate a lot more similarily than you would think, neither done as good a job at getting their voters desires carried out as they could.

    And a lot of why we have god on the dollar bills etc…is because a communist recommended it to make the american population more malleable because they would be more likely to construe the government/religion/god as being one and less likely to oppose it.


  479. D is right about Brazil, they did try a “whitening policy” a bunch of decades back, that is one reason they are differant from the USA dynamic, but, what happened is it created a lot of mixed people who are left out of the prosperity.If you look at things like airline travel, universities, media , congress, anything elite, it is majority phenotype white, remember, its a tropical country and everyone gets a lot of sun.

    They just now, today, passed 10 to 0 in the courts, quotas for universities, I support that, without quotas in Brazil, they would never give it up


  480. There is also a problem with the GLBT agenda. It affects ALL ethnicities, and conservatives staunchly oppose immoral perversions as an acceptable way for our families. I bewilders white conservatives to see blacks sticking with the Democrats when so many blacks are Christians, too.

    Because at the end of the day, what people do in their beds ain’t my business. Railing against GLBTs won’t but food on the table, or pay student debts, so Christian Blacks don’t have the luxury to pursue such frivolous goals.


  481. @William

    Yes; most crime is on people’s own kind so to speak, its as much about opportunity as anything else I suspect.

    Excepting for Native Women, 87% of their rapes are by non-native men, the majority of that being white men I believe.

    Considering how minimal most interracial rape is, that is an insane percentage there.

    I think Native women have the highest rape rates of all women, something like 3 times higher than their racial group nearest to them I believe.


  482. @William

    You ever hear anyone – including Obama – tell us all that if the USA will committ to a great deal of intermarriage, we could wipe out racial issues & everybody win in it all…in a generation or two?

    Yeah, everyone wins. . . . except those at the darker end of the spectrum (like myself). We’d be screwed, as we are in Brazil, but that’s acceptable to you I guess.


  483. @William You quoted @Shirina
    Most blacks commenting often seem to have an attitude, too. That doesn’t mean they speak for all blacks. Same thing. Of course hotheads will be the first to shoot off at the mouth – or keyboard, in this case. Those do not equal “all” of their race. Probably most of their race got better things to do or more pressing things to do than fight with people on the internet, lol. Keep that in mind, okay?”

    I am waiting for you to tell me from my earlier statement what things I said that made me seem as if I had an attitude or seem as if I was internet fighting. I stated my feelings towards politics, but that does not mean I am any of those things. Did I post in caps? Oh I know I called Herman Cain an idiot, but that in no way insulted you. You believe I have an attitude or am fighting on the internet yet not once did I insult you. I just pointed out while you originally was harping on world peace your real agenda seems to be preaching for the GOP choir. Based on your response seems as more you are trying to fight with me. LOL. Maybe you should take your own advice. I will wait for that apology, but I doubt I get it.


  484. Truthbetold,

    Another thing about Bliff is that he convicts himself by his own words. He constantly says that history doesn’t matter which explains why his dissertations on the past are outrageously flawed. Yet, he concerns himself with accomplishments of whites present and past and latch on to them as to say since they’re great, he’s great. Bliff is trying to mask the fact that he has many shortcomings, especially in a certain department like you said lol.


  485. What is it with these race-obsessed trolls? They see us venting our frustrations with other people who feel the same way and say “We can’t have that?”


  486. @ Brothawolf,

    That’s what they do. They need to feel like they have something over you, so they act like playground bullies who need to come here and stomp on your sandcastles. They have the same level of maturity too.


  487. @ Brothawolf

    Because the control they seek is akin to the most potent aphrodisiac.


  488. Absolutly, Brothawolf, about Bliff…You tell him facts and realities of history and he just sluffs it off like it doesnt matter…this is the logic of white people like him who dont want to really see humanity in people…its really pretty cold

    By the way, he mentions about all these great inventions by white men, is he going to take credit for all these inventions that are absolutly killing the planet ? Western man is now destroying a lot more than he is saving.Polution , diseases like skin cancer and diabetes, huge garbage debries in the ocean, damage to natural water by fracking, ozone depleation, space junk, obesity from food inventions , junk after junk after junk of thrown out electronics devises, plastics plasitics plastics, this is the legacy of the white man now….


  489. @ BR

    The legacy of the white man has always been: Accept a mountain of praise for any deeds worthwhile and ignore/deflect/ blame others whenever possible. This mindset allows the disease to spread, for centuries.
    I see no end in sight.


  490. We europeans know that all whites are not on the same side. You americans just think so because for you the color of the skin is The Thing. For you the world is divided between races. For us it is not. It is all about the nationality.

    QFE.


  491. @all:

    william:

    “Christian is an interesting term for some liberal Democrats, as some of their party beliefs stand opposite to sound Christian doctrine.

    – help for killing babies in the womb
    – support for perverse behaviors: pushing GLBT matters
    – trying to force everything about God out of public view in a nation founded on trust in God
    – dishonesty in trying to ignore the founding fathers’ documents’ of govt authority, such as the U.S. Constitution by which out system got started & ensures fairness. Without it, we are prey for dictators.

    When gays talk about being “Christians”, they have gone directly contrary to biblical teaching and gather “pastors” who teach it’s okay to be gay & that it’s all okay by God. It isn’t, and it messes up the children & other people and hinders the nation from having more favor with God. Biblically, God has made mention of problems where there was a national issue between Him & Israel over what was allowed to happen there. It is no different today. That includes evils of discrimination, violence, abortion, rebelliousness against authority, etc., too.”

    I guess here we can all see what is William N’s political stance: religious conservative republican.

    @william:

    You, like many ultra conservative christians, seem to forget one very essential christian concept: forgiveness. You do know that according to the very basic teachings of Paul, Jesus died for all our sins? So they are forgiven, not by you, but by God.

    Another thing: who is the One to judge people for their sins? You? Are you God? If you are not, then you can not make that judgement. It sasy so in the bible, in many places. It is also one of the key teachings of christianity. Only God has the power to judge and forgive. But hey, like I said, you are not the only conservative christian who thinks he has godlike authority on these matters.

    “help for killing babies in the womb”

    If I am right, the anti abortionists defend life and oppose abortion because of the ten commandments: Thou shall not kill? Funny thing, most anti abortionists also support death penalty? How that intellectual flip flop is done?

    “support for perverse behaviors: pushing GLBT matters”.

    I assume yoy refer to the gay rights. If I am not mistaken, God created us all as his/hers own image? So if some one is gay, wouldn’t that mean that God is also gay?? I mean, nobody creates gays in some secret laboratory. There are gays even places where there is no so called “gay culture” no where near or other gay to teach how to be gay for kids. How that is possible unless God created some gays?

    “trying to force everything about God out of public view in a nation founded on trust in God”

    If I am not totally wrong, they did not say which god, did they? So, why not Allah and Vishnu too?

    “dishonesty in trying to ignore the founding fathers’ documents’ of govt authority, such as the U.S. Constitution”

    Isn’t that what Bush Jr’s government did more than once? Oh, wait, so did Bush Sr’s government too? And come to think of it, so did Reagans government!! Strange liberal democrats those guys, aren’t they? I always thoughed they were republicans…


  492. “Christian is an interesting term for some liberal Democrats, as some of their party beliefs stand opposite to sound Christian doctrine.”

    I’m a centrist, a Christian, and my family usually votes Independent. I honestly see the party that’s doing more to treat people as living beings worthy of compassion more in line with “sound Christian doctrine” than a party that condemns anyone who doesn’t think, love, or look the same as them.

    “– help for killing babies in the womb”

    So let’s make policies that help kill them after they come out of it. Maybe they should focus on treating living children with as much care as they do unborn fetuses?

    – support for perverse behaviors: pushing GLBT matters

    And yet support infidelity and divorce. Also, I could’ve sworn decade ago it was interracial marriage they were freaking out about. Is that also a “perverse behavior”? I doubt that two people who’ve loved each other for decades are any more perverse than two straight people who can’t stand each other.

    – trying to force everything about God out of public view in a nation founded on trust in God

    The point of Separation is to ensure that people don’t use religion to corrupt or influence the system.

    “– dishonesty in trying to ignore the founding fathers’ documents’ of govt authority, such as the U.S. Constitution by which out system got started & ensures fairness. Without it, we are prey for dictators.”

    But it’s okay to ignore the constitution as long as it doesn’t agree with your personal dogma? Even the Constitution didn’t start off fair, it needed to be added on to and changed along with the times.

    “When gays talk about being “Christians”, they have gone directly contrary to biblical teaching and gather “pastors” who teach it’s okay to be gay & that it’s all okay by God. It isn’t, and it messes up the children & other people and hinders the nation from having more favor with God. Biblically, God has made mention of problems where there was a national issue between Him & Israel over what was allowed to happen there. It is no different today. That includes evils of discrimination, violence, abortion, rebelliousness against authority, etc., too.”

    So what about the people who preach hatred of gays and people of color? I think Jesus would be more cross with people who think it’s their job to judge others and loudly toss about their religious devotion than people who happen to love the same gender. God also said that a rich man had little to no chance of getting into Heaven and an obsession with worldly things like riches is not Christian. Neither of those points seem to stop conservative, Christian republicans from making a wealthy status quo an important part of their platforms. If anything I think He’d take more issue with greed and hatred than gay people.

    Also, many conservative, republican Christians also support viewpoints that lead to the dehumanization and unfair treatment of the poor, people of color (especially black people), and homosexuals.


  493. @V-4
    You said,…
    “So essentially somewhere around 40,000 more black babies would be born every year or 400,000 every decade post abortions becoming more common whenever that was.

    So basically no; no real difference there numberwise in population, at most what a few million more or less?”

    – Not so. Those aborted babies would have grown to be adults, having kids & grandkids, which would more greatly increase the black polulation than simple addition.

    You also said,
    “As for why black christians would side with pro-choicers if they themselve are pro-life, I could theorize its because they are tired of rich white people telling them what to do with their bodies and claiming a sort of ownership of them even still today.”

    And
    “Among the black population currently the ones making the most gains are black women, they start havinging babies that can do a lot to keep them out of the game or at least hold them back briefly, additional economic costs etc….

    Basically it attacks what is currently turning into the most successful part of the black population.”

    Your cynicism needs to be questioned, seriously, as you seem to be saying it’s better to kill hundreds of thousands of black babies so that black women can have an easier go of it. My, my, my!!! What are you saying?!? See how the liberals get people all twisted in their thinking?

    As for seafood, the bible doesn’t call seafood an abomination, but it does call homosexuality/sodomy an abomination – far worse than more “missing the mark”. We should not be condoning that as being taught to our nations’ familes, people, children …as okay & an fine option & a “right”. It brings trouble with God & messes people up physically, emotionally, & spiritually. Can you imagine that ANY young boy, on his own, would say it isn’t disgusting to think of someone sticking thie weenie into where people’s “poopie” is & getting it all covered in poo — as if that is a fine alternative to what is actuially, by both nature & God, normal & natural for men & women? When will blacks decide to stand against the lifestyle that includes men lingering around places hoping to entice kids & men into gay, unnatural, abnormal sexual behavior?


  494. @V-4

    Again, you also said,
    “And sure God was part of many of the beliefs of the founding father; but they also wanted to keep Religion and government seperated so as to protect any religion that wasn’t considered Mainstream, whether pagan or just different christian sects.”

    Again, historically, that is not true.
    Historically, the founding fathers lived in colonies that each had somewhat differing denominational majorities. Those were Christian denominations, so they each wanted to make sure no denomination got preferred over the other, like if the govt had said only Quakers could become president, etc. That is the historical truth about the so-called “separation” of church & state. It was to prevent the federal govt from imposing religion & denominational preferences. It was not at all meant to prevent the govt from having anything to do with schools & public matters. In fact, almost all public schools of the time were inside churches. Also, govt figures commonly prayed in govt meetings & such. George Washington himself gave great credit to “Divine Providence” and the actions of God in amazingly gaining victory against the British & saving America in it’s infancy.

    On another note, you mentioned communists. You know, last night I was listening to someone tell how that Barak Obama, himself, in his book, mentioned that he was an avowed Marxist at the age of 18. He associated with men who were involved with domestic terrorism. Now, I somehow like Obama – he seems real nice and all, but I dislike his political beliefs and wish he’d change. The man, as nice as he seems to be, however, was brought up with father-figures who were not American – men with far different beliefs than the common American, then he got deeply into the Marxist things. That’s somewhat scary. That’s not like most American’s beliefs, regardless of race.


  495. “Because at the end of the day, what people do in their beds ain’t my business. Railing against GLBTs won’t but food on the table, or pay student debts, so Christian Blacks don’t have the luxury to pursue such frivolous goals.”

    Due to my Christian beliefs, I think it does matter. The bible indicates that God cares what people allow to happen among them & hold them accountable for it.

    @Sharina
    I said nothing wrong, but am sorry if you took it that way. No, you have not been fighting with me, just responding – nice coversation. I was talking about how there are many blacks, just as there are many whites, who fight or post ugly things on the internet. That was the topic, at the time, right? We had talked about things like blanket accusations when people say “most” & act like all or most whites (or whichever race/s) think, act…a certain way. That’s all. I didn’t mean anything toward you directly, so please don’t take it that way.


  496. @ William..Thank you for apologizing I greatly appreciate it.


  497. @sam
    I guess here we can all see what is William N’s political stance: religious conservative republican.

    – Lol, trying to label me to excuse prejudicial hate?? I am conservative on my general stance but have lots of beliefs that Democrats like, too. I grew up conservative Democrat, before they changed for the worse so much. Republicans might not like some of my views, but it I have to vote, more of their “official” views fit my beliefs, & many Republicans are RINOs, IMO.

    About “forgiveness”, Jesus Christ preached repentance for forgiveness of sins, not do as you please for the forgiveness of sins. When people repent, it means they turn from the wrong & do the right way. Even if they mess up many times, the dedication to trying shows their heart to be with God. It’s sort of like a baseball player being told to “always run it out”, even if it looks like you might be out, or like a child trying to please his father: a child trying to please his daddy & messing up…is a far cry from a child that hates his father constantly, right?

    Jesus Christ also told the apostle Peter that whomever’s sins he forgave would be forgiven & whomever’s he retained would be retained. (No, I am not counting myself as good as Peter.) The apostle Paul, when he heard that at one church a man had been having sex with his own mother, he reprimanded that church for not dealing with him & doing something. Paul talked about them judging (fallen) angels in the future (in Heaven) and that they should have “judged” that man who could bring disrepute to the church (and they did something about it). Authority is for doing good, and the result of ostricizing that fellow seemed to later be that he repented. That was Paul’s intent, so his soul would not be lost – truthful love.

    – About the death penalty? That’s a tough one. The bible says back as far as Noah’s time, that God ordained men who murder/kill men would have their own blood shed, but I would hate to have to do it, especially these days, when there is such difficulty in getting past the judicial corruption in many cases. It’s hard to know who is truly guilty or not. God did authorize killing people, ordering it in many places of the Bible, but also God is a God of truth & justice (& mercy, as appropriate). In one place, God said that what He required was that people do justice, love mercy, & walk humbly with Him.

    “support for perverse behaviors: pushing GLBT matters”.

    – You mention “gay rights”. God created us in His image, but God is not “gay”. Rather, He said it was “abominable”, “unnatural” affection. Try also a read of what God told Noah just before the flood. The people had started to think about doing bad stuff constantly. There are probably various factors in why people become “gay”, but at some point in it all, people must choose, just like with any other temptation. If a man is tempted often to commit adultery, does that make it okay? No.

    “trying to force everything about God out of public view in a nation founded on trust in God”

    – Sir, if you read many documents from the early days of the USA, you will see, as I mentioned above, that they were indeed talking about the God of the Bible.

    – As for Bush & the constitution, Bush brought the idea of going to war before Congress for approval, but Obama didn’t ask – just told them after the fact. There are probably problems on both sides, though.


  498. Even as a Mormon I would not vote for Mitt simply because I don’t think the guy seriously has a clue and because Mitt changes with each interview. You really never know what Mitt you are going to get.

    None of the GOP really have much along the lines of a solution only the continuous ” let’s bash Obama rhetoric.” I personally feel that the republican party sees Americans as fools. Mitt does a tell the people what they want to hear and Bash Obama routine and people eat it up. Bush did the wizard of oz routine on us (pay not attention to the man behind the curtain). He gave us lower taxes which we were blinded by and paid little or not attention to how much he was spending on a war we did not have the money for. When we became wise he was out of office and it was somebody else mess to clean up.

    It was republicans who stated that they were going to do what they can to make Obama a one term president. That alone tells me that their motive is to ensure he fails. They are not even remotely trying to meet a middle ground with him. They don’t even care about the people who are suffering as a result of this, because they should be working together. That should tell everyone how much the GOP cares about the American people.


  499. This thread has gone way, way off track. Please continue this discussion on the Open Thread. From this point on I am deleting anything not about the original post.


  500. Okay, only stuff about racism, now, here, right? Was just repsonding to show respect.


  501. Now I have a question for those that have pretty much made themselves known as racist. Why do you hate black people so much? I mean what have they actually done to you personally that makes you hate them.


  502. @ Sharina

    Hatred of your fellow man comes from hatred of oneself.


  503. @ Gorbachev…You still have avoided answering the question. Not all blacks are that way, so you as assuming a person has a certain way of acting or train of thought based solely on skin color.


  504. Sharina,

    Absolutely not. I have black friends (racist trope), but my sister married a black man, I’ve worked with plenty of black people, most of whom were competent and smart, and I’ve managed departments with large numbers of black people.

    My sister’s two kids are great, smart and half black – and I don’t think there’s any genetic mistake there. Her husband is truly a mensch. A great guy. We hang out.

    In my experience, all of these people have been exactly like white people or Asian people – they’re highly competent.

    I strongly believe in treating people based on the content of their character. Full stop.

    However, reality has to be explained. The simplest explanation that fits the evidence is this:

    The average (not the absolute) skill level for blacks and other races is different.

    It means that racism is not justified. But it does explain some of the patterns. It means we need special programs to stop things like urban poverty.

    In other words, the cognitive elite of the black community essentially cast off their inferiors – leaving shiftless, hopeless people with no leg in the modern technocracy to fend for themselves.

    Blacks in the cognitive elite do’t have any obligation to other blacks – of course, that’s racist.

    However, it does mean on a pragmatic end that you end up with genetic and social castoffs. How to help them becomes the biggest potential social issue.

    I’d guess that almost all of the crime in black communities comes from a dysfunctional tiny minority on an extreme end of the spectrum.

    BTW, I also don’t think genes are immutable. Humans have the ability to domesticate themselves. This causes a positive loop between social influences.

    Vikings can breed nasty, violent vikings and have it be in the genes. A different social order can take the same population and breed peacenik nice guys.

    The statistical shift you need in genes is tiny.

    I think, from the science standpoint, that we are observing real effects. The only thing that matters is how we deal with these things.

    Being a race realist doesn’t necessarily mean you hate anyone, or want big fences, or pogroms, or violence. Or even segregation.

    The science of human genetics just doesnt support the liberal position.

    Where we go from here depends on how much we genuinely care about our fellow citizens.


  505. @Gorbachev

    Careful sir, I broke the last race realist I spoke to. I shattered her world into a million fragments, if only I could have seen her face. I still laugh about it. . . .


  506. @Gorbachev

    You should send your post to your brother in law and your sisters children. Have an honest communication with them on how though you don’t see THEM as inferior, the stock that they come from is. Be as honest with them as you are with us with your feelings. Let them know exactly what you think. Use all the “facts” and “statistics” when you do.


  507. @Gorbachev

    It’s such a shame that you and yours never think thing through to conclusion. As much respect as I have for the institution, science breeds an arrogance into her students, wouldn’t you say? You forget the most important implication of the Scientific Method: the only truth is that there is no truth, only what we can see. Only the illusions we cling to.

    I urge you to review all the data on hand, because quite frankly your theory has a few. glaring. holes.


  508. @Gorbachev…..The thing about race realist or people who claim to be is that they are no different from the basement skinhead that teaches white superiority. No race is superior to another. The only differences in the races is skin color. If you are brainwashed to believe that you are superior then it does not matter how much evidence you have to the contrary you will continue to believe what you want. A scientist could come out today and say whites and blacks have the same Brain size and you will still believe you are superior. European blacks are smarter than the average White american.

    Your superiority is a frame of mind it is not being realistic.


  509. @ Gorbachev,

    How can you NOT be racist and yet believe race realism is somehow separate from racism? You do realize, that “race realism” is just a kinder word for a philosophy that attempts to justify discrimination by applying twisted statistics or made up facts to different groups of people?


  510. Ace,

    Some people like to refer to shovels as spades. I see “race realism” as just another word for a racist.


  511. @Gorbachev If want to talk about genetics with black americans , you could argue that most are descendants of slaves who were survivors and that means not only physical strength, but mental strength……….only the strong mined survived even the trip over here. So they could be mentally superior to the average white person.

    But that is race realism in reverse and I don’t believe that either. Because of the collection of white immigrants from all over europe was part of why humans walked on the moon.


  512. @ Dave,

    So what is your point? That white people are likely to be truly superior because a small tiny minority of them helped to develop space travel? Or are you saying that every race has accomplishments and they should not be used to depreciate other ones ? Can you clarify your meaning?

    Beyond that, I actually can kinda agree with what your saying. So I wonder what the point is in arguing over whether or not race realism is appropriate, since you’ve just made the point that it can be used in the opposite direction just as readily (in a way they wouldn’t readily defend).


  513. “you could argue that most are descendants of slaves who were survivors and that means not only physical strength, but mental strength……….only the strong mined survived even the trip over here. So they could be mentally superior to the average white ”

    I think I would substiture “could” with “should”…and modify the “mental superior” as to not cross into “race realism in reverse”

    Dave , I commend you for acknowledging ( even with your caveatt) something that is worth noting from every American , and, I have always admired my black American colleagues , men and women, for showing so much strength, determination, and resiliance in the face of so many obsticles and discrimination and downright violent racism


  514. @ Abagond

    It’s amazing reading all the white comments on how blacks are so inferior yet we built this god-forsaken country, by hand.
    Without the help and teachings of the Native man, whites who landed here would starve and die.

    Yet, we’re savages, inferior and need to be saved from ourselves.
    Whites are good a one thing though…taking.
    They take, take, take til they are fat.
    Then they exterminate.

    There is an organism that follows that same concept.
    In my medical training it’s called cancer.


  515. Hmm, I don’t think whites had anything much more than the native americans had going, as far as violence is concerned. Aztec, Maya, and many northen peoples in the current USA as well…very very violent & killed their neighbors with great tenacity & vengeance on their own kind. It was the difference in technology that happened to favor Europeans at that point in world history which really enabled one people to succeed over the other, plus the state of economics & society that happened to favor the Europeans at that point – more people could be devoted to things besides war & food-aquisition. People are people, and people tend to take advantage of their advantages.


  516. TO PUT IT ALL IN PERSPECTIVE WHEN THEY SAY ITS A BAD NEIGHBORHOOD IS IT EVER AN ALL WHITE NEIGHBORHOOD ? HOW CAN GARY INDIANA BE UP THERE IN CRIME ? LOL THERE IS MORE POORER NEIGHBORHOODS IN MOROCCO AND YET THERE CRIME RATE IS REAL LOW ? WHY ? HMMM CAUSE THEY HAVE BOTH PARENTS TO TEACH AND THEY HAVE A STRONG RELGION ?? HMMMMMMM UH HELLO AND F YOU LAJADA EMERSON


  517. What would Black people have to talk about if it weren’t for White enslaving them? I sometimes wonder. In fact who would they constantly blame for their shitty neighbourhood, communities, countries, leaders etc…?

    The Asians must be really glad they did not enslave Blacks or else it would be a never ending “cry baby….” storyline


  518. @ Anomymous

    You have no FUCKING idea what you are talking about. None.


  519. @ Anomymous

    Sorry but the broken record department is currently closed. Please come back when you educate yourself on black neighborhoods and black people. If you feel it is an emergency. Search Asian blogs sites so that they can remind you that they can remind you that “Whites are never ending cry babies, that continue to believe that we like them more than what we actual do.”


  520. excuse me They*


  521. @ William Noack

    I am guessing technology would favor anyone that would freely steal it and claim it as their own. I will ask you this. How much technology are you aware of that blacks have created and have been peddled as being invented by white inventors? How much do you believe whites have invented?


  522. “People are people, and people tend to take advantage of their advantages.”—It was very easy for whites to take advantage of things that other races invented and claimed it as their own. Especially in a society in which they dominated.


  523. @ CORY

    Having two parents in the home is speculation to what makes a good child. Best example is me and my husband. My husband parents divorced when he was 3 years of age and he never was arrested, never sold drugs, always had good grades, etc. My parents divorced when I was 12 and I again never was in trouble etc. Religion was very fickle in my family so it was not something that was solid. I know several other black families that are the same or with more issues that have the child turn out just fine and in many cases better than fine. It comes down to parenting style and how that individual chooses to raise that kid. Each kid is different and sometimes you have to adjust to better teach and discipline that child.

    I have found a lot of parents (mainly whites) do not want to see the bad in their children and are quick to brush it off or make it someone else fault or that their kid is not bad. Those are the main parents that wake up and find their child has been hitting their medicine cabinet and having sex with random boys at the after school sex party.


  524. (sigh) — @Sharina,
    I’ve been trying to forget about this racist site, as some here seemed to want whites, including myself, whether racist or not, to simply go away. I’ve done that.

    However, I will say this. I don’t know why you are going at me, as I never once have spoken ill of blacks or made a fuss about what you stated to me. I will say this: there have been inventions by many & various races, including blacks. George Washington Carver was an absolutely brilliant man & african American (& I think a former slave even)!!! He wanted to help & do good, and his dedication resulted in many inventions. There of course have been others, too. Around the globe & throughout history, cultures borrow from other cultures, and people advance on the ideas of others before them — we don’t all go back & reinvent the wheel or computers.

    Do some people get ripped off? Yes. It happens to various races, including whites against whites, too. The people who turned on me were mostly whites, at my former employer (& again, I’m white). Power protects power. Greed motivates. The “haves” try to protect what they have (already). There are many sad stories where people with wealth, power, &/or ability to corrupt…used such to manipulate, steal patent rights, etc. Right now, I can probe by documented evidence, that I was illegally put out of court & denied a jury trial in total violation of the 7th Amendment. I can show emails that basically prove my boss gave an illegal excuse for “allegedly” ordering me to discrimninate against blacks & men. (See emails page on Supremely Unjust – http://www.supremelyunjust.weebly.com .)

    I also can prove — not claim, but prove — that my employer lied to the labor board, the labor board then closed the case without questioning any witnesses, AND that the employer lied in court-submitted affidavit testimony, withheld evidence, etc. Almost nobody, — not the govt., not the NAACP, not the ACLU, not Jesse Jackson, not Quanell-X, not Al Sharpeton, not the Republicans nor the Democrats — has taken action against the corruption up ’til this day (to my knowledge). A white man is making a movie about judicial corruption & is wanting to place an interview of me in that to show my problems, as well as showing other cases of corruption. The lack of any effort by politically-involved figures, however, tells me those other people are posers. They are not so interested in blacks, whites or anyone as they are in themselves. To ignore my case full of illegal, unconstitutional acts while some of them are under sworn oath of office to act to uphold the Law & Constitution…is a sign o futter self-interest.

    There-in lies our common problem: users & posers. I could care less what color the govt or business is run by as long as it is done fairly, rightly, wisely, etc., and I think a lot of Americans are starting to feel the same way these days. The problem is those in power who simply use race, power, cronyism, etc. to gain wealth, influence & keep it, no matter who they step on. That makes it so hard for others, especially the poor. I invented a skincare item that healed an inflamed growth on a relative (likely a cancer). I could not produce it cheaply enough by hand. I contacted a pharmaceutical co. about contracting to produce it for me. I read the contract closely & saw in the fine print that they were stating they would have the right to make & sell their own version in about 3 – 4 years (if I signed). — No thanks. They could have then made my production price high, later undersold me, & stolen my idea as if it were their own. BTW, I recently had a cancerous-looking growth on one arm, so prayed & concocted something else to apply to it. The growth went away in less than two weeks, yet I’m still living in a tent, too poor to do anything with the knowledge, (unless I wish to simply make some crooked rich person richer off of it).

    I expect that with the amount of college education many minorities are gaining these days, things will even up in society. Then, as bright POC’s apply themselves to various fields, it will further help equity among races in the workplace, business, etc. BTW, when that happens, all the successful POC won’t be wanting all their earnings to go into fed taxes, either, but that;s another political matter entirely (& I see both sides of that, too). Good grief, I got a lot to say sometimes; so, unless you all like these long posts, I will again lay off of this page. — Regards, and be nice.


  525. @ Aba

    Please ignore Anonymous. He badgers everyone, including me.


  526. @ William

    You had the right not to respond and if you have not noticed the comment was in regards to something you said earlier. I am confused how my post even remotely point to you speaking ill of black people because not once in my post have I stated you did. I challenged one or two particular thing you said and I never made the claim that you were racist or hated black people. Sure it was a late response but hey I am entitled to respond to who I see fit and not who you tell me I should.


  527. @ William

    And another thing. Just because someone says something to you or challenges what you say does not mean they are doing it because they believe you are speaking ill of black people. People regardless of color get challenged here all the time and they either debunk show proof etc. or they run away and claim things to be racist or unfair. I have seen it several times and people just have different points of views. If I ever decide to attack you then you will know it and my post was far from that.


  528. @Sharina,
    Hey, no problem – no need to be defensive.
    Just sounded like you were saying I had somehow indicated blacks had no inventions. That’s all.


  529. @ William

    I am not being defensive. I simply explained things to you with hopes that you understand. I know reading words can come off defensive though so I understand how you might see that as well.


  530. Words in print can easily seem very unlike they are meant to, lol, depending on how people read them, personal mood at the time, recent events, etc. That’s both a tragic & funny thing at times and is why we all sometimes need to think of that possibility more I suppose. Miscommunication is a common cause of unnecessary troubles in life.


  531. @ William

    That is very true.


  532. on Fri 31 Aug 2012 at 08:11:01 ConcernedCitizen

    Wow, I’m really disgusted with ANY kind of racism, but this is first of all non-factual opinion. Second its extreme racial opinion. Third, next time you have some racial slurring in mind look at US crime rates by demographic (if you have access to those records) and your jaw will drop, I’ll refrain from telling you what demographic that is. Fourth, instead writing this stuff, i your brain capacity is little better then rock, do something useful that benefit all humanity so we actually concentrate on whats really important; to make use of our life in a good way with mere 90 or less years we have to live.


  533. “Wow, I’m really disgusted with ANY kind of racism. .. Third, next time you have some racial slurring in mind look at US crime rates by demographic (if you have access to those records) and your jaw will drop, I’ll refrain from telling you what demographic that is.”

    ***************

    @ Concerned Citizen. I haven’t had a good jaw dropping (factual or otherwise) event in a good while. I could use one … While you seem to completely miss the point of this post, we’re mostly all forward thinking/progressive people here… so there’s absolutely no need to refrain yourself.

    (Or you can simply pass GO and directly enter the “Broken Record” zone.)

    Oh, and by the way.. *some* of us think that there’s truly ONLY ONE KIND of racism. Guess what that might be!

    Hint: It begins with a “W.”


  534. @ ConcernedCitizen

    You are disgusted by racism, yet you quoted the most biased amount of racial information ever. Hmmm.


  535. @ Matari

    You want to bet he does not come back.


  536. @ Concernedcitizen…First of all it is a well-known fact that Blacks are arrested and incarcerated for the same crimes whites are not arrested or incarcerated for.. Get real..


  537. @William

    The abortion rate for blacks is about five times the rate for whites I believe.

    So essentially somewhere around 40,000 more black babies would be born every year or 400,000 every decade post abortions becoming more common whenever that was.

    So basically no; no real difference there numberwise in population, at most what a few million more or less?

    DDC:
    Do u believe all of the misinformation and blatant lies generated by the white racist media? Because if u do, ur a bigger fool than anyone could’ve anticipated.


  538. Bliff:We do, we put the black criminals in jail, just like we put the white criminals in jail. That has led to a decrease in crime rates over the past 20 yrs or so.

    Besides that, what are we to do. Blacks won’t listen to whites on anything. Whenever whites try to talk to blacks, like me on this blog, we get shouted down by cries of “racist, racist”, so what can we do?

    DDC: But it is so funny how noone discusses the various and very serious crimes of white supremacist groups who have even infiltrated law enforcement(LAPD) and get to commit crimes like murder, robbery and racketeering with no fear of reprisal..They have even infiltrated the U.S. Military..Can some white person speak up on that? Or is it the usual, “If it doesn’t affect me personally, why should I care” sentiment.


  539. @Bliff

    China is a 2nd World Country. What does that imply? This is a loaded question

    And America is a 3rd World Country in case ur confused.


  540. Clarification: it is black parents who instill racism in their children while white parents have been programmed to teach egalitarian principles.

    Potentially the most erroneous and stupid comment I have read ..I have two children and we live in a community that is mostly white and hispanic.. Many white children will not even acknowldge my kids because we r black.. Are children like this naturally? Nope, it is a learned behavior. Just like when I was in H.S. in Manhattan and when u stepped out of the school there was an invisible line.. Whites on one side, blacks on the other. Whites pass racism on their kids also their delusions of their alleged “superiority” U proved that with that stupid post above.


  541. ” It doesn’t matter how good a black person you are, to a racist you’re always going to be a n*gg*r unworthy of respect.”

    You are delusional – is this how most blacks think?

    @ Brahms… No, that is how most whites think..lol..


  542. @”deep”
    That is not how most white people think — unless that is how it is in Manhattan.
    I know that isn’t the way it is where I live.
    If some people look down on blacks as ignorant, I think it is due to poor education or poor grammar & spoken English skills. Blacks can take that bull by the horns by encouraging better in their families in that area. BTW, whites make fun of other whites if they talk like country hicks or hillbillies, too, lol.
    – It is hard to change the way we talk after growing up in it. Sure, people can get offended by it all, but that won’t help the matter. Talking ghetto slang or hillbilly-like is not conducive to advancing in the workplace. Employers want well-spoken people who can connect with a variety of clients & customers & who seem intelligent & educated — maybe who seem to have initiative. Better skills in speaking go a long way in succeeding in interrelations with others & in business, jobs, etc. It does not mean a person with poor grammar & English it dumb or stupid, but it hurts how they are perceived by others at times.


  543. BTW, if any of you hate discrimination, why not sign my petition for a govt investigation. The courts were really crooked in my legal case involving things like me being ordered to discriminate against blacks & men. They illegally put me out without a jury. A govt investigation could toss it all back into court & make them face the music a bit. I already gave proof the famous employer committed perjury – it’s on court records. This is a chance you can maybe make something happen.
    The petition link is at
    http://www.change.org/petitions/u-s-congressional-judiciary-committees-dept-of-justice-the-fbi-investigate-judicial-corruption-in-lawsuit-of-noack-vs-ymca#


  544. @ William

    If some people look down on blacks as ignorant, I think it is due to poor education or poor grammar & spoken English skills. Blacks can take that bull by the horns by encouraging better in their families in that area. BTW, whites make fun of other whites if they talk like country hicks or hillbillies, too, lol.

    I wish it were that easy William, but in order to understand more fully you’d have to talk to educated Black professionals who speak better english than the majority of White people in the United States, and ask them whether prejudice has disappeared in their lives. I think that you would be surprised by how many people are still making certain assumptions based solely on skin color.

    Don’t get me wrong, I believe that very real progress has been made, but there is probably more work to be done than most people would guess.


  545. I’m sure there still is prejudice at times. That’s why I’m doing a petition. I was hiring black PV A&M students for afterschool programs and was told to not hire too many blacks & to keep them separated (twice). I was also told to do the same regarding men. It happened at one of the biggest YM_A’s in the USA, which is located in an affluent neighborhood. So, yeah, I know it happens. I guess they thought they could get my white self to go along with it, as I was told to not tell my 2 black coworkers what was said. (sigh)

    Yeah, things have come a long way & there is room for improvement. Still, I do think that language skills will help for many people, as employers want people who seem “professional” and intelligent. Poor English skills don’t show that, no matter how smart a person really is. Some in my own family have had to work on our own speaking ability in certain ways, too, when we realized we had some problem areas. I also do think sometimes things vary from region to region in attitudes. Here, most ordinary citizens seem to be glad for blacks succeeding, for the most part, and they are applauded for taking initiative, doing hard work to succeed, being professional, etc.


  546. “You want to bet he does not come back.”

    ********

    Sharina

    I’ll bet he (or she) hasn’t really left but is quietly lurking – for now. Having stuck a toe in the water and finding it somewhat warm, it might be too hot here for our “concerned” guest – so regrouping and being silent … until that *concerned* {{{ eye roll }}} attitude takes over again, waiting hushed in the wings might be the prudent thing to do..

    We’ll see.


  547. Are you for real? I like it how you said nobody in your family has murdered a white person so obviously someone has murdered a black person. Secondly whites killed by blacks often get hidden by the media and as for saying we complain Al Sharpton hasn’t had any crime by a white person to a black person he’s even saying Latino’s are white! You’re whole argument is a total fair, blacks commit 50%+ of all murders mainly against other blacks but when blacks only make up 11% of the population somethings seriously wrong. Also a black invention of gang rape is ONLY commited by blacks and Asian’s with blacks even using it as some sick initiation of females into their gang! You really are animals


  548. Mark Thorpe
    Sometimes I wonder if the racist whites who come here decide to skip the whole “being informed” or “actually thinking” steps in trying to create an argument. You just pull things out of your ass and expect people to accept it as truth immediately, and the entire time you seem to delude yourselves into thinking you are being fair and just while you spew hateful nonsense. Really, why do any of you waste your time coming here? If you aren’t here to learn from or add to the discussion in a meaningful way, then you really shouldn’t bother saying anything.


  549. @ Mark Thorpe

    “I like it how you said nobody in your family has murdered a white person so obviously someone has murdered a black person”—I think he is just simply saying no one in his family has murdered a white person.

    “Secondly whites killed by blacks often get hidden by the media and”–Then how is it you know about it. Or how does anyone who is not personally there know about it?

    “as for saying we complain Al Sharpton hasn’t had any crime by a white person to a black person he’s even saying Latino’s are white!”—Last I checked it was the race tracking systems put in place that conclude Latinos as either black Hispanic or white Hispanic.

    ” blacks commit 50%+ of all murders mainly against other blacks but when blacks only make up 11% of the population somethings seriously wrong”–I agree something is completely wrong. Makes you wonder how accurate they really are doesn’t it?

    “Also a black invention of gang rape is ONLY commited by blacks and Asian’s with blacks even using it as some sick initiation of females into their gang! You really are animals”—So blacks and Asians invented gang rape. Tell that to the poor white teen females that have been viciously raped by white males. Or to the blacks slaves who were raped by a group of white males. I guess we can say white men invented raping underage kids. Gender not an issue.


  550. @ Legion

    I wonder if he does birthday parties. LMFAO


  551. @Sharina

    Well; yes there is an extremely high rate of intra-racial violence among black people.

    And there is something wrong.

    That being said; if I remember right, statistically speaking once you start factoring for age and gender, that comes down to less than 2% of the african-american population.

    @Deepdkchocolate

    Is there any reason to not believe those specfici statistics?


  552. It’s frightening that every new troll says the same thing other trolls have said. These people do have a “hive mind”.

    In the first place why on Earth would a media system owned and operated mostly by whites want to hide any story involving black-on-white crime? That makes no sense.

    In the second place since when was gang rape a “black invention”?

    In the third place, and I hope someone can help me out with this, if there is a small segment of the total national population, then wouldn’t it sound crazy to conclude that they commit a large segment of all murders?

    Lastly, why is it always Al Sharpton and/or Jesse Jackson?

    I said it before and I’ll say it again: White people have problems when it comes to people of color.

    Look out ya’ll, if you’ve watched Star Trek, you know that Borg drones appear one right after another. Get ready for more invaders.


  553. @ V-4

    The way I see it at this point. It is what it is. I just know that I don’t fit into those statistics. Heck I don’t know anyone that does.


  554. @ V-4

    And don’t take it the wrong way but I just don’t agree with any statistics. I don’t trust anything I have not done myself.


  555. @ Brothawolf

    Be careful. Eco might be hiding in the shadows waiting to tell you that you are illogical and immoral. LOL!!


  556. Sharina.

    LOL Good advice.


  557. on Wed 26 Dec 2012 at 18:53:35 William Noack

    I think the comment was simply about not murdering a white person, not about whether someone has murdered a black person.

    As to whether “whites killed by blacks often get hidden by the media”, I tend to agree to some extent, as I have noticed incidents shown in alternative media that I never heard about much via major news outlets. I think they are trying to cool things down & keep the peace between races by not saying much and downplaying things at times. Yes, major news media is run mostly by whites I suppose, but it benefits them to not have an America too convoluted by racial strife. Notice it works both ways. After it got really hot on the Travon Martin thing, that too has died down in the news media quite a lot. Potential anarchy in the USA likely won’t benefit anyone much. Anarchy tends to cause investors to flee and jobs to plummet.

    The percentage of murders committed within a group does not necessarily result from the race of that group, as there are other factors, such as degree of poverty, joblessness, etc. Economics is a huge factor with crime. What nation or race on earth, if considering the poor or lower spectrums of economic status, will show a different result or pattern? Poor and less educated persons of each race will likely prove to be more likely to be involved in violent crimes among that people-group, right? So, with high unemployment and poverty and lower educational levels, the crime will be higher, regardless of race. If unemployment is higher among blacks in the USA, then it would naturally tend to correlate to the crime spectrum, unfortunately.

    On whether blacks invented rape, well, that seems ignorant. People everywhere do wrong it seems, and I don’t think Russians or white Europeans or Asians have a utopia without rape or crime. In various places, some people and “micro-cultures” develop which start to include more crime, and the thinking among those groups needs to be helped, but “profiling” on the matter will only deepen resentment. For example, consider the spector of mass gun crimes. Those seem mainly committed by upper-middle-class white males with nonexistent or poor relations with their fathers. Shall we say that whites should all be considered to be mass murderers of the same sort? No, as that is the same thing as racial profiling that America has decided is so bad against minorities by police stops among our cities & highways.

    Truth is, MOST people of all races have little desire to do violent crimes. Then, some come along, do some messed up stuff, and it makes troubles for lots of others. Happy New Year, folks.


  558. a whole lot lately with my father so hopefully this will get him to see my point of view. Fingers crossed! mortgage banker new york


  559. Since Lucy the oldest human walked on the African continent, blacks have been enslaving , raping and destroying everything they touch. That is also the time when the single parent family began! Black intellectuals have always known this, but it is never talked about because of slavery! Why don’t they give the Jews and North African Arabs reparations for enslaving them in Egypt or why don’t people of Nubian desent pay all the bordering tribes they killed and enslaved. You better hope the American whites keep you safe from Muslim who will kill you as fast as the white American .one more question for you anti white morons ? Why didn’t your great great grand parents go back to great Africa with Marcus garvey? I know you are asking who is Marcus Garvey, well read a book and find out!!!!


  560. Mike:

    one more question for you anti white morons ? Why didn’t your great great grand parents go back to great Africa with Marcus garvey?

    The same rhetorical question could be asked of you and why did your great great grandparents did not eventually go back to where they came from. After all, we all know who the indiginous people of America really are, and they aint white.


  561. @ Mike

    I guess it is safe to assume you were walking the continent with Lucy too. That would be the only real way you know what was going on then or what family life for blacks was like. Oh goody so you know what black intellectuals talk about too. I guess you are certainly aware that slavery is on a back burner in those conversations? Did you know that there are actually black Muslims? In the United States no less. Maybe you might want to be hoping that some blacks care to protect you.

    ” Why don’t they give the Jews and North African Arabs reparations for enslaving them in Egypt or why don’t people of Nubian desent pay all the bordering tribes they killed and enslaved.”—Considering Arabs are enslaving blacks now I doubt it.


  562. I think some have let Mike “get your goat”. First of all, while a lot of what he says falls without favor, something he said does have some interesting point; that is, about blacks who didn’t go back to Africa. You see, after slavery was ended in the U.S., many did return to Africa. There was a sort of repatriation and a lot of former slaves returned to western Africa at that time. If some stayed, Mike is hinting (IMO) that they stayed for a reason, perhaps that they considered their futures to be brighter, potentially, in America. That seems to be his question, as well as, “if they chose to stay, why complain?”


  563. I think he doesn’t really know much about ancient life in Africa, so his arguments get rather derailed by what looks so prejudiced that others cannot regard it. Yet, that happens the other way, too.

    Argueing there are black muslims does not erase the other historical facts about blacks enslaving people in Africa of whatever race/s and no reparations in that. It also does not account for black muslims who multilated black Christian mothers in Africa in a not-so-distant past, stole their children & forced the kids to grow up muslim. Nor does is annul the facts of the black African muslims who butchered that innocent man in the UK recently, in public. They tried to tell onlookers it was somehow legitimate, but that’s crazy. The young man, although a soldier, technically,….was a drummer — played the drums in the military. He was necer in Afirca killing black people: he was simply killed for the “crime” of being white! Is that not racism as bad or worse than slavery? Racism practiced by blacks is not magically good.


  564. Consider the black community’s almost blanket support for all African-Americans, and you will see the potential instigator and harbinger of modern & future racism against African-Americans in the U.S., IMHO. The corrupt mayors of D.C. & New Orleans and the black Congressman – Rangle is it (?) – despie being corrupt were strongly supported by black Americans. Now, many whites voted for Barak Obama, so that would seem to show a lessor disposition toward favoritism by race among whites, overall.

    President Obama as a Senator, 3 times supported allowing doctors who, if trying to perform abortions and the baby was accidentally born alive, could simply leave the live baby to die without medical care & walk away, cold-hearted. You know, a great many aborted babies are black children.


  565. The present scandals involving Obama (possibly) and Eric Holder (certainly) again seem to show outrageous behavior which, if a white man had done it, would have been the ruin of the person right away. How black americans behave in all this WILL impact race-relations whether anyone wants to admit that or not. Will — CAN — blacks hold onto moral integrity and credibility in th eminds of their fellow Americans? DO black Americans want a separate set of morals & values — one which is based on prejudicial standards? That is the question that , like it or not, will reverberate in the minds of many non-black Americans and possibly is already echoing in the minds of numerous black Americans by now, too.


  566. We have arrived at 2013, the past largely behind us…all. We are not the same, and so many U.S. citizens cannot remember & do not know the details of the past – even segregation & the 1960s riots & marches – nor do many take thought going back many years to decipher what all happened. Most are younger. Some might actually recall, instead, society trying to mandate giving African-Americans what seemed to be (to some) an unfair advantage via “affirmative action”, whereby some non-blacks did not get positions solely due to their not being black, despite better overall qualifications.

    Now, they see something similar in that reverse-racism pervades society in various other ways, like politics and social morals & ethics — blacks getting away with real bad stuff due to being black and sort of “untouchable” unless you want to be labelled a “racist”, “hater” or “bigot”. That’s unfair. It does not help poor blacks and it makes those striving to do well despite racism face a tougher time of it all. In my opinion, if blacks want to see greater equality now, they must come down on the side of “equal morality” & “equal ethics”, call what is wrong “wrong” no matter who it is, and stop basing their votes & politics almost solely on color — whether someone is “black enough” or not. When America sees that, things will step up a notch yet. MANY POC are getting more educated now, so that is helping the black image already, as people see more POC looking educated & professional, so the moral equality is now the next step. It will show black integrity and that we are ALL playing by the same rules. That will impress whites & other minorities. That will make whites less prejudiced & more unafraid to vote for blacks seeking political office, too. The black community does have some problems, and as said before, I think much of it is largely economic — poor people are more tempted to do crimes, and so forth. Deal with that, and go forward in this other stuff: that will further erase racism like we’ve never seen before. Nothing causes racism like suspicion, and nothing causes suspicion like people seeing there are differetn standards of treatment and accountability. Blacks cannot force whites and others to change more in deed without it touching to their hearts, and to reach their hearts – even to the hearts of the new generations of the U.S. – the POC must take a strong moral stance and demand of themselves the same ethics & character in politics, etc. as Americans expect from others. — IMO.


  567. One last word on the last item. I once read a sory about Christians in Chile (the nation). A factory began hiring lots of them. These were people serious about God. Well, the factory official indicated he hired so many of them because they were much better workers, as they watched themselves due to feeling God was ware of what they were always doing. It made a good reputation such that they were prejudicially hired over others.due to their hard work & integrity. What if a “revival” among POC resulted in their becoming THE choice for being hired? Not impossible, if the black community chooses this path. Black athletes have risen to the top in multiple sports — (which are) work-places. Ethics, morals, professionalism, good language skills, honesty, hard work — if all that can be honed as a hallmark of most black workers, it can be done, but it has to be set forth as the standard for the black community and “errant souls” being “redirected” about what is good for all black Americans.


  568. @ William

    Contrary to what you think you are not schooling anyone in here. Many of us know blacks did go back to Africa, but not you and not even mike know why those that stayed chose to. Like I said to him and am now saying to you…there could be a variety of reasons. Not all of them center around they thought it was better here.

    “Argueing there are black muslims does not erase the other historical facts about blacks enslaving people in Africa of whatever race/s and no reparations in that. It also does not account for black muslims who multilated black Christian mothers in Africa in a not-so-distant past, stole their children & forced the kids to grow up muslim. Nor does is annul the facts of the black African muslims who butchered that innocent man in the UK recently, in public.”—The point of black Muslims was not to erase or ignore anything. It was to point out that Muslims are black too. Because as he stated that us blacks should only hope the white man protects us from them. Thus my following comment of he should hope blacks protect him from them. You read more into than what it was.

    “Racism practiced by blacks is not magically good.”—Who said it was? I think you are implying or trying to imply what we believe and or think which so far you are wrong. Considering each black is different how can you say what we all believe. What politicians we support and do not support etc.?

    While you tried to take the more logical road in your explanations, you in turn still are as ignorant as mike. Because here you are trying to conclude or tell us what most blacks think or believe or how they behave. Do you by chance know most blacks? Do you know what most blacks achieve and don’t achieve? Can you say with certainty that most blacks do that work hard? Can you say that racism or prejudice is not part of a black mans hiring process?


  569. Sharina, I think you just as easily read too much into what I said. I am not Mike or anyone else, so if someone cops an attitude, try not to embed that into what I write as well. Just trying to be fair & helpful. As for what most blacks think or believe, some of that is shown in what the black community as a whole does & doesn’t do, which in turn also is shown in the percentage actions of black voters in voting data.


  570. BTW, Sharina, maybe you and some blacks know that many blacks went back to Africa, but lots of black kids, youth, young people probably don’t know it, just like a lot of white people are ignorant of even “white” history facts.


  571. Hey William, I got news for you:

    White people can go back to Europe if they don’t like what’s happening in America…you all can get up and go “Home” too because

    white people are not NATIVE to north America…you are not indigenous people of the North American continent… you are invading immigrants just like everyone one else who are not Native Indians.

    if you have problems with black Americans, then go back to your ancestors indigenous homeland…EUROPE

    but of course, we all know that you can’t because the Europeans don’t Want you and Won’t let you

    the rich Europeans shipped your white ancestors here as slaves and workers

    just like your black American countrymen, your white ancestors arrived here voluntary and involuntary —

    Neither Africa or Europe wants back the hybrids that have now become “Americans” — so get off your “white” horse and deal with the fact that black Americans are just as “American” as you are — always have and will continue to be — and that they have just as much “rights” in their country as you do.

    none of your “educated” babble changes that fact


  572. @ William

    “I am not Mike or anyone else, so if someone cops an attitude, try not to embed that into what I write as well.”—Did i say you were mike? What i said is that even though you took a different approach you are no different so please get that tidbit straight.

    “Just trying to be fair & helpful”—Really? Fair and helpful or assuming people in here do not know this? This is not a room with kids but a room with adults. Many of which know far more than you or I.

    “As for what most blacks think or believe, some of that is shown in what the black community as a whole does & doesn’t do, which in turn also is shown in the percentage actions of black voters in voting data.”—So how many black communities have you been in or lived in to assume what they all do as a whole or do not do as a whole? Stats can not tell you what people think or believe contrary to the many people who want to believe this.

    “but lots of black kids, youth, young people probably don’t know it, just like a lot of white people are ignorant of even “white” history facts.”—It is easier to ask what they don’t know than to assume.


  573. Wow. Linda & Sharina, you two are mind-boggling. I was totally NOT trying top pick a fight in anything, but unless I’m reading too much between the line snow, you both seem really agitated – esp. Linda. FYI, I got driven from my career when, after repeatedly hiring black students of a major black university, I was ordered to practice discrimination and refused to do so. I have spent years fighting alone against the FELONS in the court crimes. Yes, the crooks, including multiple judges, committed felonies, and not a single black advocacy group or black leader, NAACP ACLU, Obama, Eric Holder or anyone seems to care about the fact I have proof of the crimes. So, while white, I apparently am too white to do what’s right against discrimination on blacks, whereas no blacks cared a spit about it all. LMAO. BTW, proof documents from court are at http://stillsupremelyunjust.yolasite.com and another site linked to that one.


  574. Look, I never said blacks were any less U.S. citizens than whites nor that they should return to Africa. Americans are Americans, and yes, that’s the point: if we all hold to certain ideals, then we should do so across the board, indiscriminately, without prejudice. Otherwise, we are practicing some form of favoritism, and I think that is what we all should wish to avoid the appearance of. I don’t think the two of you and myself are in much disagreement, really, except that you have taken my comments the wrong way after being upset by someone else’s words.
    Linda, if you ever want to get real difference from whites, you need to think about whether you have an attitude that is provoking others in what they might say, as I can honestly say I never showed any animosity nor made any of the kinds of comments you projected onto me (as if I had). So, maybe you are on a “hair-trigger” that others might perceive — and perception if 1/2 the battle in these things, right?


  575. William,

    I am not black American – I came into your country with almost no preconceived ideas and got to see both black and white Americans for “who they are” and “who they introduced themselves to me as”

    I have Absolutely NO problems with white people — I get along with both black and white Americans in the real world just fine…. just because I won’t let you “sugar-coat” your history and deceive yourself — doesn’t mean I am agitated….

    I enjoyed learning your history and came away realizing that most of you are Ignorant of your own country and behaviors…just because Americans choose to walk around blind and misinformed, doesn’t mean I have to indulge you.

    You all don’t realize that the rest of world is watching you, your TV shows, your media…they see you based on How you “present” yourselves via your media, the internet, when you visit our countries…you let it all hang out…but we still don’t get the “full monty” until we actually come and live in the USA

    see, that’s the problem with white America — you assume that anyone on the Internet who disagrees with your racial outlook — must be black.

    I honestly think both black and white American cultures are similar and intertwined — after all, back in day, many black and white children shared the same Daddy — only the white one was in denial — as is most of white American when it comes to how you all behave towards non-white people.

    See, white American likes to marginalize anyone who doesn’t “fit” into your ideology of what is “right”

    Whites treat us brown people in the same dismissive and prejudiced way you treat your fellow black countrymen…the only ones who don’t see the “problem” are you all.


  576. and if you say that I am being unfair to you, and you were not supporting Mikes views, then I will go back and read you’re words again and

    I’ll admit I starting skimming once you started talking about Obama and Eric Holder…it became too “Fox Newsy” for me


  577. Linda, I’m loving you. William, you got served.


  578. OK, William

    I’ve re-read your post and I will apologize to you for the 1st post since you did not advocate that black people return to Africa.

    I’ll address your posts and it’s actual content — which to me, comes off as very “paternal” but you definitely said some interesting things.

    but let me see if I can summarize based on your words


  579. William, when enslaved Africans were freed, white people were colonizing Africa, so it’s not like going to Africa was going to save them from dealing with white supremacy.


  580. “Williams,
    they see something similar in that reverse-racism pervades society in various other ways, like politics and social morals & ethics — blacks getting away with real bad stuff due to being black and sort of “untouchable” unless you want to be labelled a “racist”, “hater” or “bigot”. That’s unfair

    In my opinion, if blacks want to see greater equality now, they must come down on the side of “equal morality” & “equal ethics”, call what is wrong “wrong” no matter who it is, and stop basing their votes & politics almost solely on color — whether someone is “black enough” or not.

    as people see more POC looking educated & professional, so the moral equality is now the next step. It will show black integrity and that we are ALL playing by the same rules. That will impress whites & other minorities”

    Linda says,

    Wow, You’ve actually said Quite a mouthful — I gather that you believe that there:

    (1) is a double-standard currently in America with how society “treats” black people – with white people coming up with the short end of the stick.

    (2) black people are being treated with kid-gloves based on government mandates and white-societies collective feelings of “white guilt”

    (3) black people are living by a separate code of ethics and morals than the rest of America and that this separate ideology is what is keeping black “as a whole” from being accepted by American society at large ie white America.

    I’m not being mean or facetious in this question: “are you really Serious about what you wrote?

    because on one hand, you seem to grasp the problem that racism does affect blacks in America but then you turn around and put the onus on black Americans…kind of saying “its their own fault”

    and you view the problem as something black Americans can fix — all by themselves– while absolving white America of it’s role in this “never-ending” soap opera.

    By the way, who are the arbiters and judges of what is ” moral and ethical” ? Based on your post, that would be white America right now.

    so you are saying “black Americans have to rise above their colour and become “white” in their ideology and behavior — in order to be accepted as equals by white Americans because then everyone will be on the same page and white people would no longer view blacks as a threat?”


  581. Yeah; if William isn’t a troll, than its kind of sad.

    His answer to cure racism in america?

    Black people need to stop being lazy, shiftless, unmoral and get a job.

    Oh yeah; they also need to become christians because black people aren’t very religious as far as folk go.


  582. “Absolving” is your word, not mine, Linda, and all your blaket accusations & implications against me are far worse than anything I said. Paternal? Yes, credit my age and the fact that many of the (often) black employees I hired over the years were young, either just out of high school or in college, attending a black university — well, about 98% black, anyway. If you read many of my former posts, you will se that I am rather paternal and despite my race (which I ususally do not allude to), I try rather to be even-handed & a problem-solving kind of person. That happens in business and working with kids and young adults, families, schools, etc.

    However, I did not “sugar-coat” any history. When you say “most of you are Ignorant of your own country and behaviors…just because Americans choose to walk around blind and misinformed”, how is that not the very same blanket prejudice you accused me of? Lol. Yes, and the rest of the world IS watching the USA, and I am quite aware of that.


  583. Linda, as for the “1, 2, 3′s” mentioned? It will make you angry to hear the truth because you like feeling justified in hating “whites” it seems, as your launching into attack-mode on me right away seems to show. However, there is partial merit & truth in each of the enumerated things you mentioned, esp. the latter ones.
    (1)&(2) — There IS a double-standard, but it cuts both ways. There is some racism: I would know, as I was ORDERED to discriminate against men & blacks, at work, but refused to do so. Yet, there is a feeling among many that reverse-racism, “affirmative action” & special provisions to help blacks due to what some whites did over 150 years ago to no-one currently alive…is totally fair & right. It is right in the eyes of blacks to use blanket-condemnation of all whites. which feels somehow satisfying I must guess, but is still wrong.

    (3) True & partially true. There is absolutely a separate code of ethics & morals for black society in America — at least for many, especially in leadership positions. I’m not saying no whites are crooked. Yet, most whites despise crooked white leaders when found to be corrupt, but crooked black leaders keep getting reelected despite their corruption — in general.


  584. “William,
    “Absolving” is your word, not mine, Linda, and all your blaket accusations & implications against me are far worse than anything I said.”

    Linda says,

    I trying to take your viewpoint seriously, William, without casting judgment (as you have asked me to) so please answer my question:

    are you saying that “black Americans have to rise above their colour and become “white” in their ideology and behavior — in order to be accepted as equals by white Americans because then everyone will be on the same page and white people would no longer view blacks as a threat?”

    and 2nd question:

    if “absolving” is the wrong word to use – then “what is the correct word to describe how you’ve removed white America’s involvement and participation in the racial problems that America is dealing with today?


  585. “William,
    Linda, as for the “1, 2, 3′s” mentioned? It will make you angry to hear the truth because you like feeling justified in hating “whites” it seems, as your launching into attack-mode on me right away seems to show.”

    Linda says,

    Did you not see my apology or read the part where I said, I don’t hold any negative feelings against white people —

    do you wish to continue having an attitude or do you want to talk?


  586. (3) continued……
    More? Abortions & gay marriage. White Christians do most of the lifting on those matters and many absolutely will not vote for any politician who supports such things based on moral principles. Look at how many black Christians there are — lots! So, why have they voted for Democrats (Obama included) who espouse such things that are strongly against Christian doctrine & principles to vote in an almost overwhelmingly block vote FOR those who support such things Why toss “God” aside…to vote “black” rather than for whomever does what’s right, good and best for all? Ahh, that word “all” riled you, huh? Is it because, despite being Christian, most black Christian even cannot believe anyone who is not black could be better for all black people than, say, another black? If I heard a white say that about whites, I’d have to confess he/she were a racist, but I do know data shows many whites voted for Obama — misguided liberals (lol).

    Data doesn’t lie, unless it is impure data or tainted facts. Convince me that almost all POC did not vote for Obama, and I will confess that reverse-discrimination by blacks does not exist. In turn, that all has a bearing on how most whites perceive blacks, in general — not that all blacks are necessarilly prejudiced, but that if you want to make a difference BETTER, POC can do that by helping whites see they (POC) refuse to practice prejudice. That would IMPACT whites — it would impress them as being fair, impartial, and as realizing the need for good leaders for ALL Americans without favoritism. Sure, there are likely some stupid whites who vote for whites & won’t vote for a black no matter what — it’s a shame either way.


  587. “William,
    However, I did not “sugar-coat” any history. When you say “most of you are Ignorant of your own country and behaviors…just because Americans choose to walk around blind and misinformed”, how is that not the very same blanket prejudice you accused me of?”

    Linda says,

    Because most Americans don’t know this countries history …as an educated man, you know that yourself — – ask anyone in your local bar “what is Manifest Destiny” — those answers would be interesting –let’s not play games with each other.

    I am more interested in your theory that black people in America can overcome white American prejudice by appearing to be non-judgmental, moral and ethnical as per _____________whose ideas of morality and ethical behavior?

    Right now, who is deciding what is moral and ethical and how did they become the arbiter of truth and righteousness?


  588. Consider the defeat of Allen West, FL, in the last elections. He’s blacker than Obama….but the “wrong” political party. He was defeated not based on his qualifications but rather because he was a black man not in sync with black reverse-racism that compels POC to block-vote. Despite being black, he had huge support from many whites. Why? They cared about what he stood for rather than his skin-color. BTW, how many black senators are there among Dems? None. The Senate is where the elitists are, btw. whites had no problem trying to send West into the Senate where the only other black man is also a Republican…from the South. Odd, huh?

    @poetess — speaking rashly or harshly is not being “served”. Winning a debate is not based on who can talk trash the most but rather in who has the best answers & reason.


  589. I also never said POC were shiftless, lazy or tha they were not Christians. I also never said there was a shortage of whites who should do something different or try a different tactic in life. Is someone going to debate me & vouch for how wonderful they think it is to murder millions of black babies in the womb now? Taking the opposing view on everything I say just because I’m white isn’t a good thing. It is prejudice. Now, if aborting millions of black babies IS a problem, then what’s the solution if not politcs? What’s the solution for solving the unemployment & family problems among POC when their lives are falling apart in so may of their homes? Yup, whites got problems too, I know that, and I address them, too…with whites.


  590. Maybe I’m just kidding myself. I think perhaps all the hostility is coming from POC who got raised in an environment where they didn’t see much even-handedness or who live where people are so prejudiced they can’t hire someone simply based on their quality of work. If so, my bad, as I did not realize it was like that in so many other places in America. I have travelled some, but maybe just not to all those places — not to say they don’t exist: they possibly do, or some would not be so adamantly anti-white here. In that case, I apologize for the ignorance of such unfair treatment by whites where you live. Just know that all are not like that, and there are places different from what you’ve experienced, though I dread that could be falling apart. Why? Because if any ethnic niche of people falls into a dreadful state, it cannot go unrecognized….and possibly result in unfortunate consequences, as people are imperfect. All the more reason to help all Americans, including the “black community” to do well & to heal, to prevent undue & wrongful discrimnation from finding a place inside more people. It only leads to hurt, strife & bitterness, and all Americans will do better without such things.


  591. @ William

    Didn’t take you long to play the race card did it?

    “s someone going to debate me & vouch for how wonderful they think it is to murder millions of black babies in the womb now?”—It is not just black babies but you keep wanting to make it a black thing instead of addressing the American problem. Blacks are not the only one getting abortions. Heck I know very few that would consider it because of religious beliefs. Considering the large amount of black single parents I am confused on how much abortions they are actually getting.

    This is cute. now you are asking us questions and our thoughts. When you can address Linda and her questions then I will address yours. Until then deviating from the issues you brought up….wow.


  592. Okay Linda, I see your comment & willingness to ease up. Thanks. I will try to respond to your questions posed there.

    YOU ASKED: “are you saying that “black Americans have to rise above their colour and become “white” in their ideology and behavior — in order to be accepted as equals by white Americans because then everyone will be on the same page and white people would no longer view blacks as a threat?”

    No. Simple true equality & fairness should do. I know this is tough when hurt, but it is needed. Others often cannot see all the wrongs — whether real or perceived. That means there must be total fairness & honesty of talk & actions to maintain the perception of right behavior among regarded as the wrongdoers. Bitterness & returning any slant of unfairness is like the kid at school who returns a blow to someone picking on him/her. The teacher inevitably turns around only in time to see the other kid doing something to the person who started it all — it makes the person look like the culprit.

    That is not to say whites views are not worthy of change at times. Challenging thought with good reason will do more to affect that than bitterness and anger, however. SInce many POC hold to biblical views, bringing whites back to what the bible says could be a useful tool, since so many whites claim to be Christians. (Psst, secret is, I know lots of whites – like people everywhere – do not hold to Christian bible teachings all that well, either. This could be useful then.)


  593. Western govt also was strongly influenced by the Greeks & Romans. That is something that could also be a target — what is truly justice & fairness. Those societies and the biblical lands had much to say on those things with large written histories know to us. Further south, in Africa, there were likely of course rules for just living, too. Most people can see fairness if properly presented & related effectively, reasoningly. It might not feel good, but that is so, and sometimes people will think aboutit awhile & reach the proper conclusions — hopefully (even white people).


  594. and 2nd question:

    YOU SAID,
    “if ‘absolving’ is the wrong word to use – then ‘what is the correct word to describe how you’ve removed white America’s involvement and participation in the racial problems that America is dealing with today?”

    I never removed “white America’s” involvement & paticipation in the racial problems America is dealing with now. As someone said, we are ALL Americans, so it is an AMERICAN problem, …or does what affects POC somehow not affect the rest of America? — Of course it affects us all, our children, & grandkids & relatives & all society. It has to be regarded as that, and America has to see it that way. To regard it as only a black problem is an injustice against everyone in America if we view it that way & allow it to be viewed like that. There has to be “buy-in”, just like in business, where people have to see how it affects everyone to get eveyone to see how important it all is. To classify it too much by race lessens it for the whole of society. I don’t mean to say it is not important for blacks or whomever is directly affected – just that it needs to be related and “sold” on how important it is to all America.


  595. Continued…..
    Look, many blacks live in concentrated areas, as do many whites, as our cultures are somewhat different — same for latinos and orientals. What big city does not have it’s ethnic areas, like “Chinatown”, for example? We tend to feel more comfortable in our own culture and similar people and gravitate towards that. Problem is, it isolates us from seeing others’ problems as our own. Why do you think so many Americans feel unrepresented by political leaders in D.C.? No matter their color, most D.C. politicians — probably all — are NOT poor and they are NOT common folk. They live in “glass houses” — in a bubble. There are enclaves like that around the USA — even around the world and in every nation. THEY…have to see how it all affects “the bottom line”.
    Now, as an example, let me mention another thing I find amazing — that while black & native American unemployment is sky-high, Democrats in Congress are so strongly FOR amnesty & a pathway to citizenship for illegal immigrants, increased immigration, etc. This also affects many latino citizens who are already having to compete for work with millions of illegal immigrants (which, btw, are not all latino). How can it be that those most adversely-affected in the USA are allowing this by their own party? Yet, this is one thing that black & other minority Americans could be helped by if more jobs were left for U.S. citizens. Due to politics, there are places where illegal aliens also get lower college tuition rates than U.S. citizens — how outrageous, and it does not help POC legally here one bit and does not dispel the high unemployment they suffer in America. I think it stands to reason that we should not put foreign non-citizens ahead of our own people — Americans (of all colors). If the USA gets into another bad war someday, it will be citizens with something to lose who will be shedding their blood together — blood that is all red, despite skintones. IMO, I think many foreigners with nothing to lose who can discreetly duck out of the country …will do so.


  596. “William:
    Western govt also was strongly influenced by the Greeks & Romans. That is something that could also be a target — what is truly justice & fairness. Those societies and the biblical lands had much to say on those things with large written histories know to us. Further south, in Africa, there were likely of course rules for just living, too.”

    Linda says,

    It’s interesting you said that, since the foundations of Greek and Roman philosopy, etc.. came from Africa….

    Most of the “greats” in Greek times travelled to Africa to study and they acknowledge that their knowledge came from the Africans.

    http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Greek+philosophers+who+came+to+Africa+to+study.-a0187012521

    Socrates: (469-399 BC): travelled to Africa for his early education and was the most spiritually bent amongst the Greek philosophers that came to Africa. He stayed for over 10 years in Africa, according to his own biography.

    While awaiting condemnation in prison, he admitted to his pupils that he plagiarised the work of the African philosopher, Aesop, the Ethiopian (560BC).

    Said Socrates: “I availed myself of some of Aesop’s fables which were ready to hand and familiar to me and I versified the first of them that suggested themselves.” He is credited with the axiom: “Man know thyself” (in Greek Hellenic language, “qnothi seauton”). The truth is that the original glory of these words were already written by ancient Africans on the outside walls of temples some 2,000 years before Socrates came to learn its spiritual import.”

    (I wonder if most people even know that Aesop was Not white?)

    So, in essence, you’re advocating that by black American people becoming acquainted with their African roots, they then will be better able to understand
    the core basics of what is “moral and ethical” — since this core came to Europe by way of Africa.


  597. You are right,….as long as it can be tolerated that it came from northern Africa where there were some lighter-skined people. Not sure what temples he refers to — could have been in subsahran Africa or simply from Egypt. Hey, that’s still Africa though, so go for it! I won’t complain about it. It is the reason that is what is needed — sound reasoning & whatever teaching tools work well.


  598. — sorry about all the typos.


  599. Gotta go — been nice chatting.


  600. @ Linda

    You are amazing.


  601. “William,
    You are right,….as long as it can be tolerated that it came from northern Africa where there were some lighter-skined people.”

    Linda says,

    “Tolerated” by whom? White people?

    if factual information is presented and all acknowledge it’s “truth”, what difference should it make to white people if the skin-colour of the people who created it is black and brown…why should the acceptance of truth be done “grudging” by the people receiving the information.

    you picked a good word because “Tolerance” is what is in short supply in America today (we could even say the world)

    I believe you want good things for your country but the pathway out of the racial discord is not as simple as you want to believe — because it involves breaking down “long imposed” barriers that have been built by both sides.

    Your analogy of the ’2 kids fighting, with the government being the teacher’ is a good one…but the problem is that each side believes they are right and the teacher is controlled by the kids with the most money.

    “to the victor, gets the spoils” and they also write (and re-write) history in their own image.

    white people can accept other people, as long as the tone, colour, and behavior is “right” in their eyes.


  602. why “Thank You”, Sharina … you’re going to make me blush.


  603. Oh, William, I just realized that you are saying that ancient North Africans were not “black” … and that black Americans would have a problem with that…

    I don’t think there is anything to worry about — I’ve noticed that those same Greek philosophers “described” the north Africans who lived there, since this was “pre-Arab” invasion:

    “Aristotle, one of the greatest of Greek philosophers, wrote in Physiognomonica that “the Ethiopians and Egyptians are very black”. Herodotus (also a Greek historian) adds that the ancient Egyptians had “black skin and wooly hair.”

    so, don’t worry…black Americans will probably be very open to learning about the ancient philosophers who look like them in skin colour.


  604. @Linda

    Work it, WORK IT!! :D *thunderous applause*


  605. @ Linda and Sharina; Slaying these fools. “Git em”.


  606. @ William Noack

    Your comments were long and many so I am going by memory of what you said:

    1. You say that blacks blindly vote for black politicians regardless of their record. Yet when they vote against West you still turn that against them. Whites voting for West shows they are not racist. Blacks voting against him, against supposed blind race loyalties, proves nothing about their racism.

    2. Many blacks vote against Republicans not because of lack of Christian beliefs but because Republicans are racist and only care about rich people. They use appeals to white racism and religion to get ordinary whites to vote against their class interests. They have done little of substance about abortion over the past 30 years yet have given away most of the economic growth during that time to the rich.

    3, Plenty of blacks are unhappy with Obama but voted for him anyway because Romney was worse. Romney made it crystal clear he did not care about blacks AT ALL. As far as I know he only visited white neighborhoods never black or Latino ones.

    4. You seem to have little idea how racism and stereotyped thinking works. The Jews in Europe pulled themselves up by their bootstraps – and then were sent by the millions to be gassed. Racists will FIND a reason to hate you or look down on you – ESPECIALLY if you are more successful. They LOVE it when blacks screw up or act like fools. They TWIST statistics to hold on to their treasured beliefs. They do not respect facts. Nothing blacks can do is going to change their closed minds.

    5. Affirmative action is not meant to make up for slavery 150 years ago. It is meant as a corrective adjustment against present-day discrimination – which it does not even begin to cancel out, though it is better than nothing.


  607. @ Abagond; Excellent examples. But You can’t change racist individuals mindsets. I know this is not some new revelation. I am saying this for my own benefit when it comes to commentary like this. Again, excellent reply.


  608. @ Abagond,

    you told him! Some people just want to believe whatever they want to believe. If they had to walk a day in a Black person’s shoes, they’d see what foolish existence they’d lived. White privilege creates a safe bubble where some white people just can’t see any reality, but their own reality, which is warped by racist stereotypes.


  609. abagond, you’re awesome! u always know just what to say…ur my hero unc!


  610. Darn! I came late to the party. Maybe William will come back.


  611. @Brotha Wolf; You can still read him. I’m sure he’s probably lurking. But Abagond and Linda and Sharina got him.


  612. If some of you could read your comments…as if you were white, you’d be amazed at how racist you sound. I’m back. Linda has some good things to say, although I do think she tended to misinterpret my words & intentions. However, she’s realized that a few times, too, which shows some open-mindedness — appreciated.
    @Linda — Yes, I was talking about whether lighter-skined north Africans could be accepted by POC as representative of their heritage. It was due not to the Arab invasion, but the prior influx of Jews, the skin-tones of the pre-Hebrew Egyptians & the Greeks who had migrated to the SE Mediterraean, etc. — probably even some Phoenician influences as well. Remember, while Egyptians were darker, that influence was sometimes stronger, sometimes weaker long before the Arabs came in. The ancient hieroglyphics from Egypt do not show all “black”-skinned people, some were much lighhter, yet surely darker than of course northern Europeans.


  613. Whether the word translated more precisely meant “black” or “dark”, I cannot tell, not knowing the ancient language used. There are times when ancient Egypt was dominated by lighter-complected (yet still darker than Europeans) people and sometimes very dominated by the darker-skinned Africans from further south. Either way, their culture was great, so yes, POC should be able to regard them as well-representing ancient black culture. Fact is, when the Nubians controlled Egypt, I think the capitol was down south, in Nubia, so then that definitely became a kingdom or empire that was definitely “black” African.


  614. @ abagond,
    YOU SAID,
    “Many blacks vote against Republicans not because of lack of Christian beliefs but because Republicans are racist and only care about rich people. They use appeals to white racism and religion to get ordinary whites to vote against their class interests.”

    I think you might be drinking too much liberal news media koolaide. lol. That is a stereotype like the idea that all Republicans are out to destroy the environment, which also is not true. It is simple propaganda used by liberal whites so they can keep using POC to keep mostly themselves in power. Where are all the black Democrat Senators? — Not one…in the elitist branch of Congress. Yet, there are huge numbers of black voters in the old South. Hmm.


  615. Abagond, the problem in the GOP is mostly not one of racism, although some bizarro elements exist, just as in the Democrats. The “problem” is that POC perceive it that way because that’s what you are told …by people with a reason for getting POC to think that way. The GOP, just as ANY party, tends to craft it’s politics based on its constituent’s desires — what they deem important. Since there are lots of whites in the GOP and they know the DNC gets the black vote, there is less reason to craft their platform based on what’s in it for blacks. There also is a feeling that everything should be Constitutional, equal, and based on individual merit. Those are worthy ideals. IF more blacks were to become Republicans, I think the GOP would welcome them and be glad to have them. The GOP however won’t necessarily bend over to change their ideals to suit them just to get black voters, IMO.


  616. Yeah, I do think racism runs a block vote for POC, for perceived self-interest, otherwise there would be more free-thinkers allowed, less block voting & less animosity against any black who decides to go with conservative, non-Democrat views and party-leanings.

    As far as I know, I have never seen any conservative get so bent out of shape on anyone who honestly decides they believe in Democrat Party ideals rather than Republican ideals — they are free to chose without animosity. There might be some friendly ribbing, but respect. If a black person decides they believe the GOP way more , however, they face a hailstorm like they’ve betrayed every POC. Yet, it was Republicans who freed the slaves.


  617. It was Republicans who helped blacks during the civil rights era, too, and Democrats were the ones pushing Jim Crow laws down South.

    It is also Democrats pushing abortion, which kills millions of black babies and pushing the LGBT agenda which also flies in the face of Christian beliefs about morality. When the Hebrew midwives in ancient Egypt were told to kill every baby Jew-boy born, the midwives feared God & wouldn’t do it — made an excuse to not kill them and honored God more than Pharaoh. Will POC honor God more than being afraid of what will possibly happen to them? Tough decision, after all the hate-hype against whites & the GOP by so many looking to hang onto the black block vote.

    It is a GOP ideal to help people help themselves, and of course the GOP has a lot of business people among them, but many of these are also small businessmen & entrepreneurs.


  618. @ William

    “f some of you could read your comments…as if you were white, you’d be amazed at how racist you sound. I’m back. “—If anything that was said was considered racist then I must ask your own racist views. I think part of your harping at black people simply comes from the fact that more did not support your petition and has little or nothing to do with the supposed knowledge you wish to impose on people. Again you are not schooling anyone, but rather just being a douche out of some anger or resentment filled rant.

    The problem with the republican party is the fact that it is heavily divided. Those that show their asses are racist and if they are not some of the things they say show it as hard to be perceived otherwise. This is what people see with their own eyes and not what is made up lies by dems. Even the republicans for Obama stated just that about the failing party that is GOP.


  619. “Yet, there are huge numbers of black voters in the old South. Hmm.”—Funny you say this considering southern states always go read in elections. I think it is best you stick to what you know about you and your area and leave the general statements about all or most until you know all or most.


  620. Abagond, you do have something right about what some of us call RINO Republicans. We are in the process of weeding them out, lol. Back to the other matter, what does it do for a business to have a lot of americans in poverty — follow the money, right? It is no benefit to have lots of poor people in the USA, regardless of color. So, why should a business-oriented party NOT want POC to do well? So, there is no logic to the false idea that Republicans hate blacks…or latinos….etc. It is a mere scare-tactic of Democrats in the DNC hierarchy.
    (1) If Americans propser, that is good for business.
    (2) That, in turn, is also good for the economy, which also is good fo business.
    (3) If there is a poor economy & economic hardship, then it tends to result in higher crime, less consumer spending, less economic investment, less tourism from abroad, etc. — things that POC know all too well in certain parts of the USA. This is like some foreign nations, too, where due to poverty, crime, dangers, etc. there is little stability, investment, and so forth.

    Therefore, why would business-minded people willing want such things to exist here. — They don’t. However, in such places — as in oppressive foreign nations — fear and division is used to keep the hierarchy in power: think rich white Democrats now. Top white Democrats…are not poor. They do not know what poor black people suffer or experience. Mrs. Clinton can change her accent all she wants, but she is not nor ever has been…poor.


  621. BTW, contrary to what someone mentioned, here, I can — I have been poor and probably poorer than most blacks in America on multiple occasions. I have even been homeless before due to refusing to cooperate with fake repairs done on new autos (so the shop crew could get more work hours). I refused to go along with that and lost my job, became homeless. It was hard to get resettled, and I had multiple situations of being oppressed by cops, hearing people’s auto-doorlocks go down when they passed by, run out of the area,etc. Yet, I had been to a bible college a bit as a student, prior to that, had good – excellent — grades, top 1/2 of 1% in the USA, and never been in jail in my life. At one town, where a cop wanted me to spend the night in a locked jail cell — “for his protection” — I decided I’d take the other choice & be dropped out in the desert to hitch-hike from there. Another cop then decided to let me stay in a certain spot, and then a local gang leader met me & gave me his protection while I stayed in the area. So, yeah, I know what it is like. I later on, after getting into my career at one of the largest YMCAs in America, was ordered to do discrimination, refused, and was run out of that job, too. I’ve lived in a tent for several years now due to it — no black leaders or Democrats helping, despite documented proof that felonies were committed against me in court and that the EEOC rubber-stamped my case, the YMCA lied to labor officials, etc. Some of that documented proof is now on sites like http://stillsupremelyunjust.yolasite.com and http://supremelyunjust.weebly.com. I’ve “paid the price” for being christian, having integrity, taking a stand against racism, etc…..and I haven’t killed anyone. (lol)
    After the Sandy Hook massacre, how many Democrats have fought as hard to help POC in Chicago & other cities concerning all the black-on-black violence? You know, far more blacks have been murdered in Chicago, then add those other cities, then add all those aborted black babies — a lot of POC Democrats don’t seem to care about.


  622. Maybe more POC should take a listen to Dr Benjamin Carson, that black man who lectured at President Obama’s prayer breakfast awhile back. Maybe he would have something beneficial to listen to.


  623. Sharina, you are not helping your argument by trying to paint me as a racist. I have not harped on blacks — where did you get that idea from? I know – what other commentors posted – not me. If you want people to not be prejudiced, isn’t it good to not show prejudice? I am not those other commentors, and without looking at them all — having seen SOME — I can imagine a pro-POC-site like this will draw some racists onboard just to spew hate (from both sides, actually). I simply am trying to mediate some of that and offer sound reasoning. It helps the communication, and who knows, it might get even some white haters posting to rethink some of their own attitudes to see things differently, as anyone reading my posts must surely be able to see I was trying to find a bit of common ground and build on that.


  624. Sharina, you are right also about that the GOP is divided, and that is something I think is good, as it is changing for the better. What we call RINOs (Republicans In Name Only)…are the “old guard”, rich, elitist GOP people trying to maintain control over the party despite the majority views of GOP voters. The RINOs are the kind some of you dislike. They tend to become proxies for big business too easily. Sure, they have lots of money, and they used that to influence the party the last few elections & are resisting change, trying to hold onto power.
    The Old South voting red? Sure, tends to. Why, if lots of POC are there? Maybe they think different than block-voting POC accustomed to feeling as if prejudicially hated in the big cities elsewhere. Still, why not one black Democrat Senator from the party that almost always gets a huge block vote from POC? Seems very odd to me.


  625. BTW, yeah, I caught the dig at me about that petition. Yeah, it flopped, lol. Still, regardless, the fact remains that while Democrats & the media gets everyone worked up about things like the sad Travon Martin incident, those other sad deaths of PO & babies gets little or nothing. Plus, my case does have documented proof — online even — with court records absolutely proving multiple felonies were committed, judges breaking their oaths of office, etc. in a case involving sworn claims of orders to practice race-discrimination, backed up by email evidence and proof of other crimes; yet, where is even one Democrat or black leader decrying these crimes or asking for prosecution or even an investigation? The only people to so much as try to help have been those “nasty GOP ‘racists’ “, lol — people who know this would cause them to face a sh_t-storm for going against multiple federal judges, possibly a huge lawfirm & a huge, popular nonprofit org. Why? It involves a matter of conservative principles, regardless of color. The DNC peeps have not once risked their necks to touch this one bit — felony crimes, proven, and involving POC.


  626. – POC, that is.


  627. @ William

    I am not trying to paint you as anything. Read some of the assumptions you have been making (same one many racist make). You are painting yourself in that light. Racist do come and go, but we have had other white individuals who seek to offer a sound voice and frankly I have been more open to them because their sound voice didn’t include a load of telling you what it is like with a mix of assumptions. This is all you have been doing. Blacks in here know the history, even the democrats and Republican thing yet here you are going on long rants about it trying to tell us all what it is. That alone has lead to many in here closing off to you instead of even trying to listen to you. Who wants to hear someone tell them what is what? No one. In your mind you are breaking common ground but after reading many of your post most black posters are thinking “what a racist ignorant sob.”


  628. @ William

    First of all did you even know I signed your petition and passed it around to my friends and family? So no it is not a dig at the petition but more a dig at the fact that you come off as bitter that it did not go well. I feel for your situation, but it is wrong for you to go on rants about what you believe blacks don’t do or won’t do or what you think they do because you are upset with the lack of black support.


  629. Sharina, thanks then for signing the petition and such. You must visit this site a lot, as you seem to speak for everyone rather freely. When I do so even regarding whites, the GOP, etc. I am told I know nothing no matter what the facts are it seems. Sorry, but I did not wish to assume everyone knew anything in particular — just my way. My bad I guess. I am disappointed with various things, but I dislike basing any logical discussion on emotions. That’s also how I am. If I sound emotional, perhaps you are accustomed to discussing things with emotional people. My situation will get better, regardless, because my trust is in God rather than merely being based on people. “The heart of the king is in His hands, and He turns it whichever way He wills.” I can be disappointed, but people are simply people, and they are not God — God has the final say in things, just like in the story of Joseph.


  630. That was great satire.im still a little confused on the sarcasm ends and the sincerity begins. It reminded me of the time I went to Florida to protest the Kasey Anthony trial. I went with my god mom Martha. A beautiful sweet and patient lovely black women and her cousin. They were some of the most peaceful protesters there.There was a ton of white people behind us trying to figure out how to murder miss Anthony. they scared the crap out of me. Martha in her brilliance just laughted and said that’s why crazy white people shouldn’t protest.She was never showed on the news though just the violent people.


  631. “William,
    Linda has some good things to say, although I do think she tended to misinterpret my words & intentions. However, she’s realized that a few times, too, which shows some open-mindedness — appreciated.

    @Linda — Yes, I was talking about whether lighter-skined north Africans could be accepted by POC as representative of their heritage. It was due not to the Arab invasion, but the prior influx of Jews, the skin-tones of the pre-Hebrew Egyptians & the Greeks who had migrated to the SE Mediterraean, etc. — probably even some Phoenician influences as well.”

    Linda says,

    William, you give me too much credit.

    and I think it’s very ignorant of you to think that black Americans would have a problem learning about people who share the same African bloodline as they do.

    Black Africans lived and ruled the Entire continent

    and by the way- “Nubia” is, and always has been, a part of Egypt — this was done way before the Nubians even dreamed of ruling Egypt — so the racist concept of “sub-Sahara” doesn’t even apply here.

    Africans have the most diverse genes in the world and their skin tones have always ranged from black to light brown — without any assistance from Europe.

    Race is a man-made concept created by your white ancestors and Imposed onto darker people…Africans (and that includes N. Africans) never labeled themselves — your European ancestors did that.

    As for the skin-color of the Egyptians, they’ve always been dark (even the modern day mixed-race ones) — the ancient Egyptians would be labeled “black” by you Americans, using your one-drop rule

    The “black” Egyptians already had their culture, pyramids, science, philosophy in place prior to the people you call “light-skin” — they were already a strong dynasty before any Jews, Persian, or Greeks set foot on their soil.

    the Greeks wrote it as they saw it… if they were calling the Egyptians “black with wooly hair” — then that means the Egyptian’s skin color was brown-dark brown and their hair was “wooly” and not silky

    Considering that the Greeks were “dark-skinned” compared to the west and north European tribes — if the Greeks were calling people “black” then most likely they were “darker” than the “dark-skinned” Greeks .. and that kind of “dark” is what you white people call “black”

    so it’s not necessary for you to try and Re-Interpret a phrase that is pretty clear — if you want to call the ancient Egyptians “people of colour”, then you should call your black American countrymen “people of colour”

    I’m not sure why you’re having trouble accepting the ancient Egyptians for who they were —

    I also don’t understand the necessity of white people to co-opt and steal the African Egyptian’s history as though it belongs to Europe. Europe was a 2-minute bit-player in a very long movie.


  632. @ William

    This is what you keep overlooking. It is not a matter of you know nothing. It is a matter of you only know those you interact with and have known. Your experiences are not the experience of the world. It is not all knowing and encompassing. Neither are mine or anyone else. Perhaps i could have been more blunt in having you realize this and perhaps you could have just overlooked it in your rants. I deal with emotional people but I judge by each interaction. Not past interactions.

    In regards to your situation, if you are going to go to war then you have to fight hard. You have got to get more people involved and more people knowing about your situation. Not just a petition but emails, phone calls, etc. Corruption is something people have been fighting since forever and it requires a lot of work. Heartache at times but you have to dust yourself off and prepare for the long haul.


  633. @ William

    1. This idea that Republicans are racist does not come from the liberal media or Democratic propaganda. It comes from listening to Fox News, Rush Limbaugh, etc. It comes from how Bush handled Katrina. It comes from Republican race-baiting that is part of its Southern strategy. It is coming right out of their own mouths.

    2. The Republican Party in its current form does not care about ordinary people in America – not any more than it cares about the ordinary people of Costa Rica. They only care about the rich. Full fucking stop. The Democrats are only somewhat less bad, not great.

    3. I doubt very much that it escaped the notice of most black people that gun control only became an issue for Obama once WHITE children were slaughtered.

    4. Black people are not children for you to talk down to. They are not mindless robots of the Democratic leadership. They do not have to be told what to think, by you, by the Democrats, by the liberal media, by anyone. They have brains and eyes and ears of their own. They can even read. They have mature judgement as much as any one else. Just because they disagree with whites does not mean they are wrong or stupid or “ungrateful” (a paternalistic expectation).


  634. How did this post turn into a campaign to get us to vote for republicans? I don’t like either party and am tired of both. The democrat party is not acknowledging us only when it’s time for votes and the republican party doesn’t acknowledge us at all. I say f both of them i’m either not voting anymore or am voting independent.


  635. @ mstoogood4yall

    I hear you. It feels like no matter where go on the net to have a conversation about anything race, class, medicine…whites have to frame it in terms of politics…it’s like they can’t see anything any other way these days.

    The FOX and CNNs are doing there job.


  636. @ Linda (or whomever was posting for her),
    The reason I posted that some might have a difficulty with lighter-skinned African heritage as representative of POC is that, well, the past has shown some tend to think certain black people are not black enough to represent them, not because I personally have any thoughts of it not representing black cultural achievements. However, truth be known, despite claiming how black all ancient Egypt was (it would seem), when they go into those ancient pyramids, they don’t show all black people in those pictures on the walls. That goes back a long ways. Surely you know – not to sound teachy to those who already know – that long before the white, arabs, etc., lighter-skinned Egyptians existed. Biblically, there were also invasions from a variety of lighter-skinned peoples into Egypt and the Egyptian people recovered. Sometimes the influences come into Egypt from darker-skinned people in Africa, too.
    Egypt was next to the crossroads of the known world back then, so how could it avoid influxes & influences from various peoples? No shame in that. Also, Africans indeed have various shades of brown/black in skintones and are yet African. Unless humans all began from different colored people in various corners of the planet, there is genetic variance and influences. No problem, regardless. It takes nothing away from African heritage.


  637. BTW – it was said,
    “the Greeks wrote it as they saw it… if they were calling the Egyptians “black with wooly hair” — then that means the Egyptian’s skin color was brown-dark brown and their hair was “wooly” and not silky”
    ….and….
    “I’m not sure why you’re having trouble accepting the ancient Egyptians for who they were —”

    I have seen mixed race children, and know that they commonly have kinky or wooly hair, even if light-complected. One such kid had rather blonde hair & blue eyes, awesome brassy skintones like in the old “Doc Savage” comics character. Yet, his hair was like an afro, naturally. It is a genetically dominant trait, apparently, and I have never seen a mixed race (half black) child with silky hair — not to say it isn’t possible nor am I saying this in any disrespect. That’s simply the facts of what my experience is, and I worked with hundreds of kid


  638. Sharina,
    I have not been ranting here. I have been longwinded, lol, and in doing so do not intend to sound demeaning nor talking down on anyone, as that would be disrespectful. It is no ill-intent when I speak informatively or as if so. Rather it is like to bring something to rememberance — like an “Oh yeah, I remember that, too” kind of moment when people talk about something — but also informative so as not to be rude to any who may not know. I would, IMO, seem very rude if I somehow did start “talking over someone’s head” in a conversation they didn’t perhaps understand – that would seem snotty, and so I am caught between the two, not kowing all who are posting or reading here.

    As for my situation, I agree that it is a sort of war. The petition got “timed out” and I also have no phone — been out of work & too broke for one. Still, don’t assume I have not fought hard with what has been at my disposal nor without any results at all. I have “battled” with what I could, and at least two Congressmen have made inquiries on my behalf. Literally thousands of people now know about what has happened, and it won’t stay hidden forever: it is only a matter of time, IMO. Hearsay, rumors, and simple allegations are things more easily tossed aside, but I have documented proof of felony crimes and law-breaking in a case about illegal discrimination….using court-coded documents that cannot be faked. This cannot be denied as mere accusations. Also, the FBI, DOJ, Texas Rangers, etc. know about this stuff. They could be investigating now for all I know – maybe even tapping lines — and a judge from that court recently got the “kibosh”. It will all come out and it will vindicate myself and the fact that all cases are not what some call “race-baiting”.


  639. BTW — some govt officials now also have detailed information about what exact laws were broken & how and by whom (persons & entities). That includes both State & Federal felonies by multiple persons.


  640. Also, relating to my own matter, Lawless America is making a movie about corruption done in courts & govt across the USA, and I have been filmed giving a short testimony to Congress and in an interview for the movie (not paid of course). DVDs of the testimonies of all these people have been presented to every member of Congress & the testimonies also posted online.


  641. “William,
    and I have never seen a mixed race (half black) child with silky hair — not to say it isn’t possible nor am I saying this in any disrespect. That’s simply the facts of what my experience is, and I worked with hundreds of kid”

    Linda says,

    Don’t worry, William, it’s really me..

    Come to my country in central America and you’ll see plenty of half-black mixed race children with curly wooly to curly silky hair — you Americans currently call us “Hispanics”

    I’ve seen plenty of half-black mixed people with silky hair — one of them is called Slash, a guitar player from Guns ‘n Roses — (mother black from Nigeria, daddy white from England)

    http://www.fanpop.com/clubs/guns-n-roses/images/16653320/title/slash-photo

    and we know that the European white gene is the weaker, so image the skin tones and hair texture when you mix black with with Asian, or Middle Eastern — you get modern day mixed-race North Africans.


  642. @ William

    You still don’t get it do you. In your mind you believe you are saying or doing one thing but you are actually doing the complete opposite. I would not be repeating this if you had stopped or if you were not. Instead you write a post excusing it. Ranting on and on and on and not really grasping that you are.

    As for your situation I assumed nothing. My words were words of encouragement. I think if you stopped trying to think for me then you would have seen that, but you can’t take your head out of your azz long enough to do just that. Your judgement seems highly clouded and you just need to step back.


  643. Linda,
    I guess we are influenced by different definitions of terms. It is confusing. Most people in the USA don’t consider native Americans as being the same thing as “blacks” – African-Americans. Maybe “hispanics” in parts of the western hemisphere are thought of as “blacks”, too — that is, apart from those hispanics with African blood. As for “Slash”, hmm, another variance in terms — pretty silky but also seems rather wooly, lol. Plus, (snicker) you might be judging wooliness by what white people’s sheep look like. Remember, the reference was regarding sheep in the Eastern Meidterranean area, right? Sheep over in Egypt, palestine, etc. look quite like the hair “Slash” has. :)


  644. “William,
    However, truth be known, despite claiming how black all ancient Egypt was (it would seem), when they go into those ancient pyramids, they don’t show all black people in those pictures on the walls.

    Surely you know – not to sound teachy to those who already know – that long before the white, arabs, etc., lighter-skinned Egyptians existed. Biblically, there were also invasions from a variety of lighter-skinned peoples into Egypt and the Egyptian people recovered. Sometimes the influences come into Egypt from darker-skinned people in Africa, too.”

    Linda says,

    Nope – never said ancient Egypt was “all black” – said that black Africans were indigenous to the North – the Nubians didn’t bring the “black” to Egypt, the black was already there.

    There was also light-brown Africans living there (as you mentioned) well before any foreign invasion from other light-brown people but

    What you call “light-skinned” is still shades of Brown. If you saw those “light-skinned” people today — based on white western/European views on race — those “light-skinned” people would still be classifed as “black” or “brown” but not white….that was my point.

    those pictures are depicting “brown-skinned” people and Africans also had brown-skin just that light…like the Khoisan — If the Egyptians were to paint a picture of a Khoisan standing next to a Sudanese, the painting would probably look just like the ones on the Temples.

    The Egyptians wore head-dresses, so it’s not possible to tell from the pictures on the Pyramid what their hair texture looked like; and it’s been said that the Egyptians more often than not, drew themselves in a neutral way (like the Japanese, Abagond just did a post on it)

    Here is picture of a Punt woman (modern day Somalis) — dark to light brown-skinned people with curly long hair but in this picture she is drawn with neutral skin color and facial features

    http://encyclopedia.thefreedictionary.com/Land+of+Punt

    I am aware that different brown-skinned Semitic groups came into to Egypt but it was the indigenous Africans who ruled and built the Pyramids, not the foreigners. (as the pictures show)

    I think you misunderstand the current issue of dark-skin vs light-skin going on in the black American community; black people have no problems with light-skinned people representing them…who do you think the early leaders in the black community were – like Thurgood Marshall or Malcolm X, light-skinned (mixed-race) people.


  645. “William,
    Most people in the USA don’t consider native Americans as being the same thing as “blacks” – African-Americans. Maybe “hispanics” in parts of the western hemisphere are thought of as “blacks”, too — that is, apart from those hispanics with African blood.

    Remember, the reference was regarding sheep in the Eastern Meidterranean area, right? Sheep over in Egypt, palestine, etc. look quite like the hair “Slash” has”

    Linda says,

    Only in your world, William….what you just said is a load of BS and you know it –please stop acting niave and unaware right now..

    because if you are trying to say that you didn’t realize that some Hispanics are mixed with Native and African, then you are either lying or stupid.

    Egyptians are not white, never been white … point blank…all of a sudden Egyptian/African wool is different than European/Mediterranean wool — so therefore …are you serious … GTFOH with that ridiculousness

    if you choose to take this route that white people have a different reference point and “take on things”… then I stand by my statement that white Americans are ignorant.


  646. “William,
    As for “Slash”, hmm, another variance in terms — pretty silky but also seems rather wooly, lol. Plus, (snicker) you might be judging wooliness by what white people’s sheep look like. Remember, the reference was regarding sheep in the Eastern Meidterranean area, right? Sheep over in Egypt, palestine, etc. look quite like the hair “Slash” has.”

    Linda say,

    but I know that most white Americans are not that “dumb” because what you are trying to refer to as “wooly” is what you white people call “frizzy”

    Frizzy is the term that would be applied to Slashes hair but never “wooly” — I have yet to hear any white American call hair like Slashes “wooly” — they say “Frizzy”

    Why is it so important for white people to change and Mis-interpret the Greeks description of the Egyptians –the Greeks saw what they saw and described it –

    — Accept it…”black skin with wooly hair” does NOT look like Slash.

    Let’s say that the Greeks version of “wooly” was what modern day people call “Frizzy” — then that means they look like modern day Ethiopians — would that make you feel better.

    why is it so hard for you to accept that the Ancient Africans who taught your European ancestors were actually dark black-brown people — white people can’t have everything.


  647. @ William

    There you go again. Stop playing the race card because this rant is not about whether you are white, black, or the purple people eater from space.

    First of all you started to rant on this history spill. I told you several times over people on the blog was aware of this. Not because I know their thoughts but because they have commented on this same history on other posts to great lengths, yet you continued on (which in the minds of many meant you were saying that they have no clue on it and you had to tell them all about it).

    Secondly, you went on to assume a lot about the black community and black people. Ranting on what you think they believe and how you think they feel about politics etc. Yet to apologize about that assumption by the way but have been sure to assume that we should be open-minded to you.

    Thirdly you are trying to take everything I say as an insult to you. I am not insulting you but enlightening you on what you are doing vs what you think in your mind you are doing. Your head is so far up your azz (as an individual and not as a white person) that you fail to see that and once you get called on it your default response is to play the race card instead of reading your post and seeing what it is I am talking about. You rather simply deflect than address.

    What you fail to realize there have been better posters with better ideas and better challenges than you of all races (White posters since these are the ones you seem to think are singled out). Not one of them have played the race card to get their ideas accepted and many times I agreed with them, but you….point one flaw in you out and you pull the “It’s because I am white.”


  648. Yes, William, you are ranting…and you are the one who brought in the changing appearances of sheep…not me

    That’s why I said you’re being ridiculous talking about how sheep look different from one region to the next and trying to compare “actual” sheep hair to black people’s hair.

    White people are the ones who came up with term “wooly” and every other term used to describe black and brown people — so,…. not sure how you can apply “reverse prejudice” into this conversion


  649. “William,
    I really don’t care how black Egypt was or not — didn’t I already say so?
    That was not a probelm to me, so I don’t know why POC are offended if they are or are not as black as other Africans or whether they had any “dilution”. Ah, that’s the stinky hole I stepped into — do POC really think “dilution” of “blackness” by another race is denigrating or offensive? Sounds like the same kind of racism some white people have had in past times.”

    Linda says,

    yes, you did say — so I’ll let it go.

    but you’re way off base if you truly believe that it is black people who have a problem accepting “how black or brown Egypt was” and that non-white Semetic people added to the gene pool — white people are the ones with this problem of Denial when it comes to acknowledging mixed-race gene pools

    If white Americans are so accepting of various dilutions of blackness or brown, then why do white Americans call mixed-race people in America “black”

    and white Americans act all surprised and shocked when a light-skinned “black” person says they have a white parent…it’s like white Americans all missed the genetics portion of their Biology classes

    anyway, you’re right, this conversation has run it’s course.


  650. Sheep are off topic here, way off topic.


  651. There was a black man at WalMart that shot 5 white man. He walked passed several blacks to do so. They called that random if a white man did that it would have been racist . I don’t understand that. Blacks can have NAACP,black panters,and rallies . If the whites did we be call racist .


  652. @ William

    I deleted your comment for its use of racial slurs. I have a comment policy.


  653. Oops, sorry about that. Of course it was in jest and regarding whites. Lol, consistency is a jewel. I only mentioned something about the color white, descriptive, and I know I have seen rather angry posts here from people using slurs about the color pink as descriptive of caucasions — an actual angry & vehement term. I guess it managed to just slip by: censorship is not always perfect. ;)


  654. You forgot: 99$ of all serial killers are White.


  655. @loveroflife — I will assume you meant “%”. That sounds correct, actually. Another fact is that most people shooting up schools tend to also be white males. I have no problem with the facts. You missed what my comment was that got deleted. It really was not bad, just got deleted due to the rules, which I felt were not being equally enforced, but….technically, I suppose such a subtle infringement upon the rules can be legitimized. I just think it should be more consistent, if so.


  656. I talk about white-on-white crime every chance I get, and boy do the racists hate it. Nothing works like going on the offense.


  657. “If the whites did we be call racist.”

    - – -

    So what?! Is being called ‘racist’ something like kryptonite for white people?!


  658. @ Fiamma: You know the R-word is wounding. That’s why we have so many trolls on this blog. It hurts their feelings, but my thought is, if this doesn’t apply then why take offense. I had no idea that the word racist, caused so much butt hurt feelings.


  659. Funny how some think it is good to troll here in the name of “equality” while showing themselves to be racist haters — just from the opposite side of the fence. Why is it somehow “good” to provoke white people intentionally? Part of the reason blacks have gotten so far in U.S. society is due to a lot of whites standing up for them, too. Sort of seems rather bad to backstab them, then. What if whites looked at all the black muslims in Africa and started stereo-typing due to them butchering Christians, bombing markets in Kenya, hacking black Christian women in Sudan & stealing their kids, etc.?
    Like MLK said, it will be a better future when people are judged by what’s inside rather than the color of their skin, and that goes both ways. Hate is hate.


  660. @ William

    ” Why is it somehow “good” to provoke white people intentionally?”—I would like to ask who is provoking whites? Any of this stuff is only really provoking if a) it generalizes or b) it is something you feel applies to you.

    ” Sort of seems rather bad to backstab them, then”–It would only be sad if one was backstabbing those that stood up. Not those that pretended nothing was wrong and just sat by watching the wrong occur.

    “What if whites looked at all the black muslims in Africa and started stereo-typing due to them butchering Christians, bombing markets in Kenya, hacking black Christian women in Sudan & stealing their kids, etc.?”—I am sure there are those that do, but what I get from you is all whites should get a free pass on wrongs because some very noble whites help get blacks freedoms?

    “Like MLK said, it will be a better future when people are judged by what’s inside rather than the color of their skin, and that goes both ways. Hate is hate.”—Then you have no problem looking at crime and wrong doing as acts of a criminal rather than acts of a [insert skin color] person?


  661. Like MLK said, it will be a better future when people are judged by what’s inside rather than the color of their skin…

    William,

    Sorry, but I need to stop you right there.

    You see, whenever white people use that one quote from ALL of MLK’s speeches and writings, they use it as a defense against accusing white people of racism. But they never use that quote to argue against racism against blacks.

    The quote is used as a vision of hope that racism against nonwhites would someday end. It is not used as a shield against reactionary thoughts and feelings from nonwhites when they express their frustrations regarding white racism.

    I’m curious, what else did MLK say?

    Exactly.


  662. @Sharina,
    (1) Pamela wrote,”I talk about white-on-white crime every chance I get, and boy do the racists hate it. Nothing works like going on the offense.” — Seems like she is getting a kick out of provoking whites for fun rather than simply reasoning with people. That is antagonism & gets little but hard feelings, is unproductive, so is rather useless but for self-pride.

    (2) Well-said.
    (3) You did well up ’til,”…but what I get from you is all whites should get a free pass on wrongs because some very noble whites help get blacks freedoms.”
    What you got from me was nothing like that, or at least that is not at all what I said. Sorry if you misunderstood. However, consider this: back then, blacks AND women were not allowed to vote. Therefore, it actually quite a lot of white men acting on behalf of blacks to enact good for black freedom to begin with. Later, with women voters & mostly white male members of Congress, it again took a big amount of white male support to get civil rights measures passed. So, those who mislead & incite to use black hate willfully forget to mention such things — that very many white people, including white men….rallied to the cause of blacks’ rights & equalities. Of course, however, there were some as in all things who were & are backwards. This can be found in almost any movement or political party.

    (4) Absolutely agree. :-)


  663. @Brothawolf,
    You said,…
    “Sorry, but I need to stop you right there.
    You see, whenever white people………”

    – Sounds like a very blanket statement, to me. Isn’t that what you’d call “racist” if a white person did it? Thought so. Just be fair is all I say. You seem unwilling to adhere to MLK’s words unless they can be used to bash whites. That was NOT MLK’s intent. Sorry, but he did not espouse hating & bashing non-blacks. Oh, and he did of course say other things, too,….including about being the best that you can be, even if its a street-sweeper, right?
    – Thought so.
    Insinuating that I am merely reactionary in a pro-racism kind of way — if that’s what you implied — is also false and out of character with MLK. He welcomed honest open thought & didn’t mind whites & blacks being honest about the issues, IMO. Honesty does not mean hating, bashing & casting insinuations at another race or person without any evidence or in mere generalizations. Why, that’s exactly what he was against, so he would surely not have wanted to appear to be a hypocrite, would he? No.
    So please, just because MLK was black, do not suppose that nobody but black people can quote his words or value what he said. Thank you.


  664. @ William

    “Seems like she is getting a kick out of provoking whites for fun rather than simply reasoning with people. That is antagonism & gets little but hard feelings, is unproductive, so is rather useless but for self-pride.”—I don’t know if that is a matter of provoking so much as it is how she might feel.

    “What you got from me was nothing like that, or at least that is not at all what I said.”—You don’t have a right to tell me what I got or interpreted from your statements. I never said you said those things…just that is what I got from your statement. Thanks for clarifying. I do wonder what percentage of white men actually helped in the movement.


  665. @Sharina,

    Lol. Maybe so – maybe just how she feels.
    I bet you look cute when you get your hackles up like that. (Mreowr!)(JK)

    Hmm, consider how many whites it would have taken to pass anything all the way through Congress, plus signed into Law by the President,…and that would show something about how many whites had to show support. Considering all the troubles in Congress trying to do ANYthing these days, there must have been quite a lot of support by white folks to get it all through. Hmmm.

    Then, think of all the constituents of the Congressmen back then.
    If so many were hateful, racist whites, how would they have passed anything? They’d have been scared to do it out of fear of being voted out of office. If whites had voluminously opposed such Congressional actions and rang the phones off the hook, their Congressmen would have reacted to that, as well, ….but maybe not to a rather much smaller percentage of white haters — a minority of the population, such as KKK members & other extreme individuals.
    So you see, it was a lot of whites in support of helping blacks, but the hurt of the relative few haters gets all the attention & is used to foment animosity for political reasons for some, IMO.


  666. @ William

    “I bet you look cute when you get your hackles up like that.”—lol

    “it was a lot of whites in support of helping blacks”—This may have been true at one time or another but I have to worry about its truth today. I will sit back and observe for now.


  667. @ William

    Now I can respond in a manner more appropriate.

    “Hmm, consider how many whites it would have taken to pass anything all the way through Congress, plus signed into Law by the President,…and that would show something about how many whites had to show support”—Not necessarily and as we all know the government has a habit of doing something the majority may not want.

    “Then, think of all the constituents of the Congressmen back then.
    If so many were hateful, racist whites, how would they have passed anything? “—See comment above but I will add that it only really takes a compassionate handful with connections or those who can support a majority vote to pass a law.

    “maybe not to a rather much smaller percentage of white haters — a minority of the population, such as KKK members & other extreme individuals.”—I think the kkk and racist extreme groups as the only types of white haters is a fantasy that some individuals like to relish on. It was not just them who had racial hateful tendency although they get the blame for it. Of all the civil rights pictures I have seen maybe a handful of whites were present.

    On top of that if they were such a small minority then how do you explain the rise in racial tensions? How do you explain blacks still not getting a job as easy as whites? etc. These are not actions of a minority racism that increased over time. besides…kkk members did have children.


  668. William

    – Sounds like a very blanket statement, to me. Isn’t that what you’d call “racist” if a white person did it? Thought so. Just be fair is all I say. You seem unwilling to adhere to MLK’s words unless they can be used to bash whites. That was NOT MLK’s intent. Sorry, but he did not espouse hating & bashing non-blacks. Oh, and he did of course say other things, too,….including about being the best that you can be, even if its a street-sweeper, right?
    – Thought so.

    1. If you think I was referring to all white people, that’s on you.

    2. I am adhering to MLK’s words, but not just that one singluarl line that you know.

    3. I was not bashing, I was correcting. If it is offensive to you, again, that’s on you.

    4. He also said a lot of other things, things that may surprise. I humbly suggest you check them out.

    Insinuating that I am merely reactionary in a pro-racism kind of way — if that’s what you implied — is also false and out of character with MLK. He welcomed honest open thought & didn’t mind whites & blacks being honest about the issues, IMO. Honesty does not mean hating, bashing & casting insinuations at another race or person without any evidence or in mere generalizations. Why, that’s exactly what he was against, so he would surely not have wanted to appear to be a hypocrite, would he? No.
    So please, just because MLK was black, do not suppose that nobody but black people can quote his words or value what he said. Thank you.

    1. If that’s what you think, that I was insinuating that you are reacting in a racist way, that’s what you think.

    2. I was being open and honest, but it was you that not only took some offense to my response, you also took them completely out of context in a need to defend yourself and your white supremacist comment:

    Part of the reason blacks have gotten so far in U.S. society is due to a lot of whites standing up for them, too. Sort of seems rather bad to backstab them, then. What if whites looked at all the black muslims in Africa and started stereo-typing due to them butchering Christians, bombing markets in Kenya, hacking black Christian women in Sudan & stealing their kids, etc.?
    Like MLK said, it will be a better future when people are judged by what’s inside rather than the color of their skin, and that goes both ways. Hate is hate.

    3. You’re right. Honesty isn’t hating. I was being honest, but I wasn’t hating. I merely wanted to explain how what you did was wrong. I also agree with the rest of that statement. So, why not teach that to other whites who do engage in such hate?

    4. I never said that no one other than black people can quote MLK. I said:

    The quote is used as a vision of hope that racism against nonwhites would someday end. It is not used as a shield against reactionary thoughts and feelings from nonwhites when they express their frustrations regarding white racism.

    It’s clear that you didn’t read my comment past a certain point. Why not read it again.


  669. I fear talking about MLK is diverting away from the topic. But, using his one quote to justify a white supremacist comment, which is similar to how whites typically explain black pathologies, is a realistic counter-theme to this post. William’s comments and reactions are clear examples of the problem.


  670. on Sat 28 Sep 2013 at 22:31:33 LightBulbInADarkRoom

    My family moved from a diverse small town to a predominately African American city because my husbands job transfered. My children now attend schools where they are at times the ONLY white children in the class and they are tortured by the African American children in their classes enduring comments such as “black people are christians and white people are devil worshippers” ,”you ain’t no master anymore you the slave now”, “You a cracker you don’t belong here ” . The predominantly African American staff offers no relief to my children what so ever and the ONLY time they get involved is if my children try to stand up for themselves . My children are forced to do reports on books that refer to white people as “the white devil ” and sit through off topic class discussions with no educational value that are intended to encourage hatred towards white people. You want to mention double standards well how’s this for double standards ? If my children were black children in a white school we would be able to file a lawsuit against the school district and my children would be coming home from school in a Mercedes wearing name brand clothes instead of on the school bus wearing black eye’s and bruises, or maybe if that 13yr old boy who was attacked on the school bus was black and his attackers were white instead of the other way around the incident would have gotten the recognition it deserved , or what about that young man who lost his life after being attacked by 3 black men who did it in honor of Trayvon Martin he would still be alive if he were black so yes I agree there is certainly a double standard but its definitely NOT in favor of white people and if you want to know why racism is alive and well just ask my 3rd , 4th and 6th grade daughters ! Oh and just to make this clear my ancestors never even stepped foot on American soil till the 1920′s and they were just as poor if not more so then most immigrants so sorry to bust your bubble not all white people owned slaves and some were slaves themselves.


  671. on Sun 29 Sep 2013 at 01:30:20 LightBulbInADarkRoom

    People who live by the past have no future ! When this country erupts we will all suffer.


  672. @ LightBulbInADarkRoom

    This sounds made up. Not only that but your IP address comes from a city that is 2% black in a state and county that are both less than 10% black. As far as I know your state does not even have a “predominately African American city”, anywhere.

    Also, just curious:

    1. What job would require your husband to move to such a city?

    2. What books exactly did your children do reports on that that refer to white people as “the white devil ”?


  673. I knew that sounded fishy. Even the username is an attempt to throw shade.


  674. @ abagond

    EPIC OWNAGE


  675. ” If my children were black children in a white school we would be able to file a lawsuit against the school district and my children would be coming home from school in a Mercedes wearing name brand clothes instead of on the school bus wearing black eye’s and bruises,…”

    *********

    Lightbulb-

    Let me see if I’m understanding this correctly.

    If your WHITE children were, say, BLACK kids they would have a Mercedes and name brand clothing… but because they’re white and attending a primarily black school they aren’t allowed a Mercedes and any name brand clothing???

    Does your white kids’ (black) school somehow prohibit you as a parent from providing materially for your children?

    Also, was a law passed in your state, county, town that disallows you as a WHITE person/parent from seeking judicial remedy (filing a law suit) for actions that are oppressive against your children?


  676. @Matari

    “Also, was a law passed in your state, county, town that disallows you as a WHITE person/parent from seeking judicial remedy (filing a law suit) for actions that are oppressive against your children?”—Thank you! What parent in their right mind would allow their kids to endure harsh treatment and not try to do something? That is why nothing she said was realistic to me.

    And this comment here “People who live by the past have no future ! When this country erupts we will all suffer.” is nothing more than a white woman trying to guilty black people into feeling shame or as if they are in the wrong for something. As if they fear blacks are going to do something to them and must guilt them into not doing it.


  677. Sharina,

    “And this comment here “People who live by the past have no future ! When this country erupts we will all suffer.” is nothing more than a white woman trying to guilty black people into feeling shame or as if they are in the wrong for something.”

    **********

    (“People who live by the past have no future !”)

    Interesting how they never tell this crap to Jewish people who remember, and discuss (and receive REPARATIONS for) their holocaust!

    Yep. It has that familiar *WE’RE ALL IN THIS TOGETHER* noise that some whites like to make NOW that more than a few of them are beginning to feel a little of the oppression black folks have endured since we were kidnapped, forced here in chains and made to work for free.

    (“When this country erupts we will all suffer.”)

    Just smh… apparently, suffering only counts when whites suffer. Black folks have always suffered, vis-a-vis with whites.

    Where was this all this concern for our MUTUAL suffering and mistreatment when the common white person had a humongous racial advantage over the common black person?

    Now that their advantages are dwindling … just slightly … we should ally ourselves with them so they can continue to maintain their skin color privilege and identify themselves with the WHITE super-elite …. They should have allied themselves with us a long time ago, before they swallowed that lie created 400 years ago about them being WHITE.

    Let them cease being WHITE, first. Then we’ll see how we might unite.
    (I won’t be holding my breath!)


  678. on Mon 30 Sep 2013 at 06:38:53 LightBulbInADarkRoom

    Ok so let me get this straight since I’m white I must be lying but since your black I’m supposed to believe your telling the truth ? Well that’s not racist at all ….. This is the very closed-minded thought process that you accuse white people of and until EVERYONE white & black alike realizes hate is a circle not a straight line then we will be in a endless game of shifting responsibility and its our children who will suffer for it.
    @Abagond I’m not sure where you got your info on the black white ratio of where you think I live but I have to assume you either ran across statistics that are from 20 yrs ago , entered the wrong ip address or simply made up false info to discredit me to hide the fact that it’s not always black people who are the victims of racism and that these days white people suffer at the hands of black racists so don’t you see you and your people have became the very thing you hate white people for being.
    As for the book title that was requested I don’t have the one I was referring to in my earlier post but the 1 my kids are supposed to read now is just as bad “Things fall apart “by Chinua Achebe . I looked up the different race ratios (on multiple school search websites) for the schools my children attend and any school within the school district in a 10-20mi radius. The average ratio I found is 80% African American but my children attend a school that is 89% African American. Unfortunately your refusal to believe me does not change the torment my children have to endure or the pain and gut wrenching helplessness I feel seeing them in pain but knowing there’s nothing I can do to make it stop . This is no fairytale this is my children’s lives I’m talking about !
    I have seen the phrase” privileged white” over and over again in the comments here could someone explain what that is supposed to mean because it sounds like I’m missing out on something ! As a matter of fact my life has always been quite the opposite of privileged ! My mother was a bright young women who seemed to have a promising future ahead of her until she met the man whom she believed was the love of her life . This man whom she thought loved her was a African American man that was 20 year’s older than her introduced her to crack and when she became addicted he put her to work on the street . My point in telling this is I could have blamed every terrible thing that happened in my life on the African American community but the actions of 1 man are not the actions of a entire community and that 1 man did not make my bad choices for me he just made it easier for me to make bad choices because I had no mother looking after me.
    Ye who is without sin cast the first stone……


  679. @ Ms Bulb

    It has nothing to do with you being white. It has to do with how your account falls suspiciously close to white stereotypes about black people – just as if it were made up. Add to that your IP address, which is nowhere near a predominantly African American city as of the 2010 census. Add to that that you avoided or could not answer my two questions.

    As to Achebe, that book is assigned at schools and universities throughout the English-speaking world, not just at predominantly black ones.

    Achebe is telling a story of Nigeria under British rule from a Nigerian point of view. It is not going to be a book full of gum drops and puppy dogs. Apparently you want to live in a world where white people can do whatever the hell they want and everyone else is supposed to just smile and say nice things about them. Slaves HAD to do that. Apparently your clock is still stuck in 1865.


  680. @LightBulbInADarkRoom

    First of all if you ask people a question is it common sense to wait for a response. Not respond to it.

    Secondly, you could be green and I probably would not believe you without proof.


  681. LightBulbInADarkRoom,
    Since the reference to where someone thought you could not be living…had to do with an IP address, maybe the IP address is one you got from your old place of residency (if that is possible). (Like cell phone #’s?)

    Aside from that, you are wasting your time with most of this bunch: it seems to be a black version of a KKK-type of site — reverse hatred all the way. Somebody must have ingrained anti-white racism into them from early on, so only God can help them — and then, only if they stop refusing to see.

    There are some who do show reason, but Brotha Wolf calling any word I’ve said anything remotely akin to “white supremacist”, etc. is just way out in space & without merit, IMHO. BTW, I did have a nice response to him & Sharina all prepared, but before I finished it, the computer froze and “ate it”. Then I got involved in matters of a funeral for a relative, getting somewhat sick after that (maybe from someone at the funeral) & feeling poorly since, so I will probably just skip it & not waste my time redoing it all — why bother? Sharina might at least appreciate the sentiment, but this site is simply another hate site — one for POCs to vent. (Psst, POC means People of Color.) Trying to talk sensibly against reverse-racism on here is like trying to reason with your spouse when the peron’s mind is made up AND they are in a grumpy mood. (Yikes)


  682. @ William

    I think your comparison to kkk sites is off base. Although I notice a common theme with some whites on the blog to compare anything that remotely criticizes whites as kkk or some type of extreme hate group. I would say maybe a total of 5 posters could account for the extreme.


  683. MrSatan

    So do whites, but hey…what’s a life right. 9nly matters is the color of skin that does it.


  684. It’s amazing. Racist trolls come here telling us that it’s wrong to criticize white people, but will come in here and tell us all how bad black people are.


  685. @Brothawolf

    I am no longer amazed. They are recycling old mess.


  686. William

    There are some who do show reason, but Brotha Wolf calling any word I’ve said anything remotely akin to “white supremacist”, etc. is just way out in space & without merit, IMHO. BTW, I did have a nice response to him & Sharina all prepared, but before I finished it, the computer froze and “ate it”. Then I got involved in matters of a funeral for a relative, getting somewhat sick after that (maybe from someone at the funeral) & feeling poorly since, so I will probably just skip it & not waste my time redoing it all — why bother? Sharina might at least appreciate the sentiment, but this site is simply another hate site — one for POCs to vent. (Psst, POC means People of Color.) Trying to talk sensibly against reverse-racism on here is like trying to reason with your spouse when the peron’s mind is made up AND they are in a grumpy mood. (Yikes)

    There is a lot of research that backs up my response to your responses hat clearly show what kind of mindset you have. Like it or not – deny it all you want, but you clearly show cases of a white racist mindframe. Instead of getting whiny about it, why not do some actual research and a genuine introspection?

    I’m afraid that I have a strong feeling that your response will be typical. I suspect that what you will say will be no different than what we’ve heard a million times already. That’s what’s so amazing about people like you, you all have the same mindset that, to some varying degree, are similar throughout. It’s as if all of you are saying, “WE ARE THE BORG! RESISTANCE IS FUTILE!”

    Indeed, why bother when you know what you will say will be no different than the ones before you have said in almost the exact same words.

    Blog sites like this, are not hate sites. Nowhere has there been even a hint of hatred against whites. What you see here are reactions that have been the result of your people’s hatred against us for a few centuries up to the very second and counting. Do you honestly think we are docile enough to love white people, or rather love you, unconditionally when you’ve said some of the usual offensive crap we’ve heard ad nauseum?

    I’m going to be straight with you. You are part of the problem, William. You can be offended and hurt all you want, but it shows how wrecked your morality truly is if you hurt others and cry when they defend themselves accordingly.

    There is no such thing as reverse racism. Wanda Sykes gave her own version of what reverse racism would be. That would mean racists would do the opposite, love instead of hate. That would mean you would show us respect instead of making us feel sorry for ourselves. You would see us as human beings, as individuals and not as one sick monolith who should be kissing your feet no matter how many times you beat us down. Does that make sense?

    You don’t fear “black racism”. What you fear, as I’ve always said, is karma. Deal with it.


  687. @ Brothawolf

    Thank you. I knew I was not losing my mind when I took from his post the idea of being grateful to all whites…including the losers who are racist. Also this fantasy that kkk and other hate groups are a small amount. Laughable.


  688. sharina,

    In all honesty, I think the KKK and their inbred kin of today are shadows of themselves in their former glory. Yet, their genocidal and conquering spirit of white domination has taken a more monstrous form at corporate and political levels. They’re are more lethal because they not only hate blackness, but will use whiteness to satisfy their twisted agendas, and racist trolls you see pop up fall for it everytime.

    And William, you said:

    Somebody must have ingrained anti-white racism into them from early on, so only God can help them — and then, only if they stop refusing to see.

    That somebody is WHITE PEOPLE from day one. It was YOUR people’s actions that have resulted in us being against whiteness.

    We don’t need your god’s help, and if you think for one single moment we should get on our knees and kiss your feet for all the BS your people have done to mine since the day you brutally invaded our ancestral homelands and kidnapped our ancestors to build your “whites first” world, you are out of your mind.


  689. @Brothawolf,

    QUOTE:
    “That’s what’s so amazing about people like you, you all have the same mindset that, to some varying degree, are similar throughout. It’s as if all of you are saying, “WE ARE THE BORG! RESISTANCE IS FUTILE!….
    …… Nowhere has there been even a hint of hatred against whites. What you see here are reactions …… your people’s hatred against us……”

    You have no research that backs up my having said anything racist, but you seem to want to say everyone white who disagrees with you is racist and even use discriminatory terms in doing so — lots of things like “you all” and “whites” and “your people’s”. Imagine how that would sound if turned around and someone started blasting accusations against African-Ameicans that way, with general rants about skin-color, race, etc. — all lumping people together that way without any distinction for people’s individual actions? See what I mean?

    I know there are whites who are goofed up in the attitudes, and there are blacks that way, too; but not all are from either group.
    Also, when there is talk about reverse-discrimination, doesn’t it have to do commonly with discrimination against whites or against men (as opposed to that done against POC or women)? That is a common usage, including in the media, so that’s why I used it. If you wish to ignore common usage in the English language, that is up to you, but that is why I used the similar term “reverse racism”, for identifying racism going the opposite direction from what is normally thought of in society. Only seems to make sense.

    You also mentioned something else.
    QUOTE: “We don’t need your god’s help, and if you think for one single moment we should get on our knees and kiss your feet for all the BS your people have done to mine since the day you brutally invaded our ancestral homelands and kidnapped our ancestors to build your “whites first” world, you are out of your mind.”

    First of all, it is not a matter of “our” God, since Christianity is not a white religion but rather began among Jews, who are semitic & middle eastern. That being so, it would be like saying it is a “black religion”, too, as it no more began with whites than it did with blacks. However, since Philip the Evangelist preached to an Ethiopian right away in the early church, it is as much a black religion as it is a white one. Aside from that, who invaded whom for black slaves? Was it not the black Africans who captured their own fellow Africans, enslaved them, then sold them to the white slavers? Yes, it was. So, it was blacks who first enslaved blacks. Then, after the whites ended it, it was STILL more blacks — black muslims — who continued the slave trade of black Africans.


  690. @Sharina,
    QUOTE:
    “….I knew I was not losing my mind when I took from his post the idea of being grateful to all whites…including the losers who are racist. Also this fantasy that kkk and other hate groups are a small amount. Laughable.”

    If it makes you feel better to cave to peer pressure for unity among POCs, that is up to you, but you & I know I said nothing like all that. That is hogwash.
    However, a LOT of white people contributed to reversing the discriminations and harms done to blacks, whether you care to admit it or not. Of course not all white people did. I know that. Are POC so racist & proud that they cannot even appreciate what WAS done for them, due to being too blinded by hate, animosity & racism against whites to admit it? Instead of “laughable” it is SAD….
    That non-white Christian religion had a story about the lepers whom Jesus (a Jew) healed. While ten got healed, only one came back and said a Thank You to Him for it. Maybe blacks would get farther with more white people if, despite all the hurts, they could somehow acknowledge what many whites DID do to help them rather than hatefully ranting and biting at ALL whites, lumped together as if evil villains.

    Also, I never defend racist whites who come on here as if their racism is okay. I never defend the KKK as if okay, either. Not sure where you come up with such things, except maybe wanting to feel a part of the POC crowd by going along with the shenanigans of white-bashing. If I should so much as dare to do some similar generalizations, maybe I would wonder why all the blacks killing each other in Chicago didn’t learn better. Was it because they could not say “No” to going along with the peer pressure to join a gang or such? That would not make them look good if they are getting killed up there because they all fall victim to peer pressure and wanting to hate whites so much they’ll cling to gangs & hoodlums rather than walk a straighter, better life that doesn’t hurt so many people. Ahh, but I would not wish to lump them all together like a stereotype or bigotry. I will leave that for Brothawulf and this website to do. It’s a shame, though. If it were me, I might be thinking about asking for help from whites even if I had to humble myself to do it if they are the only ones with the money or willingness to do anything, possibly. I haven’t seen all those “black leaders” step in to help, and Obama’s done little. Holder, too. Holder has the power to enforce guns crime Laws that would get the thugs doing gun violence off the streets and out of the region if he would only allow & help enforce those laws; but he doesn’t. I guess that means a lot more hurting Moma’s & kids up there, meanwhile.


  691. @William

    “If it makes you feel better to cave to peer pressure for unity among POCs, that is up to you, but you & I know I said nothing like all that. That is hogwash.”—Do explain how it is caving to peer pressure when I thought you said this to begin with? Do you remember the conversation above or was this a quick little jab you thought you could make?

    “However, a LOT of white people contributed to reversing the discriminations and harms done to blacks, whether you care to admit it or not.”—So quote where I said whites did not? I was clear on those that did, but I am not going to jump on the band wagon on the majority hype you keep trying to peddle. Another thing I made clear.

    ” Are POC so racist & proud that they cannot even appreciate what WAS done for them, due to being too blinded by hate, animosity & racism against whites to admit it?”—This proves your blinded hate, animosity, and racism. I stated clearly How I felt about those that contributed versus the racist. So I must ask….if that has been clearly stated why are you still upset and arguing for peace among whites that contributed when no one has a problem with those whites that did? The mere fact that you are tells me either you don’t understand that or that you feel this should be a let by gones be by gones to the racist as well.

    Ok so the rest of your post is a failed attempt at reading my mind. Please quote where I said I believe all whites are evil or something to the nature of hatred towards all whites? Then explain to me why blacks should be grateful to whites for being human or deciding to be human? That is ignorant. Whether they had helped or not God would have sorted it out and I doubt whites would be happy with what he would have done to remedy the situation.

    “Also, I never defend racist whites who come on here as if their racism is okay. I never defend the KKK as if okay, either. Not sure where you come up with such things, except maybe wanting to feel a part of the POC crowd by going along with the shenanigans of white-bashing”—Where did I say you did? Point to one time I said you did any of this. When you fail to find it I think it is not unreasonable to ask for an apology as I do not like to be accused of something I did not do.


  692. @William

    If blacks are American citizens then I would think people would help American citizens if they are in the position to do so. It should not be a special line of asking and humbling or pleading to do so. For example if a white crime neighborhood is taking place then the citizens would then call the police and the police would step in and fix the problem. So what delusional type of thinking is it that when a black crime neighborhood calls the police then they must humble themselves and ask the whites to help them. Sounds dumb doesn’t it. Both American citizens but only the blacks must humble and beg.

    That is the kind of stupid logic that has many of the blacks in here giving YOU hell.

    Hey generalize if it makes you feel better. I know me and I don’t need to continue to defend myself against ignorant thinking. S

    So here is a going away challenge for you. 1. Quote where this post said ALL whites? 2. Quote where I said ALL whites?

    If you can’t find where I said ALL whites then I would like an apology and I think you need to consider your guilty conscience.


  693. Wow, now I have heard everything, so according to William, black people should be on our knees being humble and thankful to said whites for helping us. When it was his ancestors who perpetrated the evil against black people here in America. We should be thankful for the rights that belonged to us as Americans in the first place. Black people helped bulid this country with blood, sweat and tears. but William thinks we should be on our knees bowing and scraping.


  694. @ William: You are full of horse manure.


  695. @Mary

    I agree with you. Trolls like Williams get on my nerves. I come on blogs like this to get away from White people and discuss the issues that matter to me among my own Black people. It seems like these people don’t ever leave us alone yet they hate us.


  696. I agree that yes, there were whites who helped African Americans when they were being denied their civil rights. I am greatful for that, but commenter William’s tone is most offensive, talking down to black commenters on this blog. I take umbrage with that. His who screed on this thread is racist to me, in my opinion. So he needs to get off this thread with his foolishness.


  697. *His racist screed is offensive* ^^^ forgive typos in up top comments.


  698. @ Adeen: I agree as well.


  699. @Mary

    Most White Americans(80%) are racist either unconsciously or subconsciously. I don’t trust an average White American because of the way their ancestors enslaved, lynched, exploited, marginalized and oppressed and the things they still continue to do against Blacks, Latinos and Native Americans.

    Are there some good White people out there?

    Yes.

    Can they be trusted?
    No.

    You can’t trust anyone of any race unless they are proven trustworthy however White people are, by nature, our enemies. We shouldn’t ever try to live among or even integrate with those who hate us. We should live apart from them and stay away from them. I wish I can take my own advice but Whites are everywhere in this country.


  700. QUOTE:
    “That’s what’s so amazing about people like you, you all have the same mindset that, to some varying degree, are similar throughout. It’s as if all of you are saying, “WE ARE THE BORG! RESISTANCE IS FUTILE!….
    …… Nowhere has there been even a hint of hatred against whites. What you see here are reactions …… your people’s hatred against us……”

    You have no research that backs up my having said anything racist, but you seem to want to say everyone white who disagrees with you is racist and even use discriminatory terms in doing so — lots of things like “you all” and “whites” and “your people’s”. Imagine how that would sound if turned around and someone started blasting accusations against African-Ameicans that way, with general rants about skin-color, race, etc. — all lumping people together that way without any distinction for people’s individual actions? See what I mean?

    If you think this is all about a simple case of agreeing and disagreeing, you are very mistaken. Yes, I disagree with you, but with good reasons, reasons that I’ve addressed which you chose to overlook.

    This is also not a simple case of plural pronouns as being racist, especially when it comes to discussing white racism while ignore it. There are white people who use those collective words to mean ‘most’ or ‘all’ black people, and they don’t wear white robes.

    I know there are whites who are goofed up in the attitudes, and there are blacks that way, too; but not all are from either group.
    Also, when there is talk about reverse-discrimination, doesn’t it have to do commonly with discrimination against whites or against men (as opposed to that done against POC or women)? That is a common usage, including in the media, so that’s why I used it. If you wish to ignore common usage in the English language, that is up to you, but that is why I used the similar term “reverse racism”, for identifying racism going the opposite direction from what is normally thought of in society. Only seems to make sense.

    But YOUR problem is us blacks. That’s why you’re here apparently, to put us in our place.

    I can’t speak for everyone, and I caution myself using the pronoun ‘we’, but the majority of those who visit this blog, including its creator, are tired of the “goofed up attitudes” of white people, and this is one of many outlets for us to vent our frustrations.

    But, you’re basically saying that it’s wrong because its racist. In other words we should turn the other cheek and not let white racism get to us. We should be quiet about it and just let the foolishness continue unchallenged.

    What I’m saying is NO. We are tired of it, and we are tired of whitesplaining trolls who are supposedly against racism, but blame us for our frustrations while advocating against reverse racism against whites.

    White people are still on top of many arenas of society. Most of them occupy a lot of what you see and don’t see. So, relax. There is no threat of reverse racism against you that would undermine Western society.

    You also mentioned something else.
    QUOTE: “We don’t need your god’s help, and if you think for one single moment we should get on our knees and kiss your feet for all the BS your people have done to mine since the day you brutally invaded our ancestral homelands and kidnapped our ancestors to build your “whites first” world, you are out of your mind.”

    First of all, it is not a matter of “our” God, since Christianity is not a white religion but rather began among Jews, who are semitic & middle eastern. That being so, it would be like saying it is a “black religion”, too, as it no more began with whites than it did with blacks. However, since Philip the Evangelist preached to an Ethiopian right away in the early church, it is as much a black religion as it is a white one. Aside from that, who invaded whom for black slaves? Was it not the black Africans who captured their own fellow Africans, enslaved them, then sold them to the white slavers? Yes, it was. So, it was blacks who first enslaved blacks. Then, after the whites ended it, it was STILL more blacks — black muslims — who continued the slave trade of black Africans.

    Well, second of all, what is your image of God? If he is a white hetero male, then he is YOUR God. Period.

    Third of all, read these as a start:

    https://abagond.wordpress.com/2010/09/22/africans-sold-their-own-people-as-slaves/
    https://abagond.wordpress.com/2009/10/03/the-arab-trader-argument/
    https://abagond.wordpress.com/2009/10/15/go-back-to-africa/

    Fourth of all, re-read your last statement. You’re excusing the past of your people by pointing out the faults in others. And your assertion about blacks enslaving blacks is full of so many holes, it’s groundless.


  701. William,

    My comment to you is in moderation, and I was right. Your response is typical.


  702. @ mary burrell

    That is exactly what threw me off. That we should be humble and ask?! I am trying my best to look at it as a mistake in wording.


  703. on Sun 6 Oct 2013 at 03:57:59 grin and bear it

    I’m curious, William. What exactly do *reverse racists* do? How exactly do they demonstrate, implement, enforce, etc. their *reverse racism*? Please provide concrete examples, links, and names and corresponding dates to whatever anecdotal evidence you have.


  704. @Grin and Bear It

    There is no such thing as reverse racism because Blacks and other minorities don’t have the power to oppress the ruling class-White people.

    oppressors-Whites
    oppressed-Blacks, Latinos, Asians and Native Americans

    The oppressed can’t oppress the oppressor because it doesn’t go that way. In order to Blacks to be racist, they must have the power to oppress Whites and others they hate. They just don’t have the power. The oppressed in this country ie Blacks, Latinos, Asians and Native Americans, are marginalized, oppressed and exploited and kept downtrodden by the system and by their own situations in their life.

    And if any Black, Latino, Asian and Native American person dislikes White people, then they are prejudiced and biased not racist. They don’t have the power to act on their hatred.

    BTW William is full of shit. Don’t believe a word he says


  705. @ Adeen: Comment deleted for using a racial slur.

    https://abagond.wordpress.com/comment-policy/


  706. @Abagond

    What comment?


  707. William’s condescending tone is a perfect example of white paternalism, he comes to this thread talking down to us as if we are naughty children, and we need the big daddy white man to scold us. That is very insulting. William, like most trolls, has a problem with black people.


  708. @William;

    I for one am thankful for all you whites have done for us negroes! Thank you sah!!! I absolutely enjoy being stereotyped, making lesser pay, not getting housing where I want, feeling disempowered, having the usual micro and macro assaults perpetrated on me on a persistent basis etc., etc. Yep, I just love it. Being a masochist helps as well! I do not understand why these other negroes are so ungrateful! Perhaps you in your infinite wisdom and you perspicacity can tell us William?

    Just ignore the ungrateful negroes! Seriously, heard your arguments ad- nauseum on the internet and in the ‘real world’. Please, at least come up with something original. I am getting bored with these lame-brained posts such as yours. The only thing I would be grateful to you for is if you don’t bother post. If you decide to continue to ‘grace’ us with your presence, do so in the broken records page, that is where you would fit in better. As a bonus, most posters can put you on blast or ignore, unless they need a good laugh that is.


  709. Mary, most Whites in AmeriKKKlan think like William, believe it or not. I know this because of the way they talk and act around minorities and the comments they post online. And I live around Whites too. Most White Americans are racist subconsciously or unconsciously and think that they are better than Black people.

    Many White Americans subconsciously think they are better than us in their actions. Don’t trust one when they give you that funny smile and wave at you. A lot of times they are thinking inside, finally this n word should be happy that I am giving them the time of day. Or they let their children hang out with their Black or other minority friends at school and act nice to their minority parents but are thinking deep down, I rather my children have White friends. I can list many incidents but most of them think that they are better than us, deep down.

    And some White Americans think that they are better than us and not even realize it. Some of them may have Black friends and hang around us Blacks but they, unknowingly believe the stereotypes about Black people and not even realize it. They have stereotypical ideas about us without realizing it or even self analyzing their beliefs on race and in a way, they believe that they are better than Blacks too.

    At the end of the day, we can’t trust White people even if they are nice or against White supremacy. They are our enemies and oppressors. They are the ones who benefit from the system and NOT our allies. Thus we need to separate from White people and rely on ourselves.


  710. um, one I missed ,wonder where I was and what I was doing,will now will follow and be updated.

    “Most White Americans are racist subconsciously or unconsciously and think that they are better than Black people.”
    Or they need to think that to avoid some very painful truths.

    “Many White Americans subconsciously think they are better than us in their actions. ”
    And they may be correct if – there is no such thing as justice ,truth and justice are in no way related, whichever person or group of people is able to kill,assault,rape,steal and lie the most is the winner and superior.

    And of course peaceful ,kind ,truthful and fair people are weakling fools who deserve what they get.
    This is Also related to beauty somehow – at least in my warped mind where the most beautiful people are invariably black and brown.


  711. @MBeti

    I agree with you completely. White supremacy is basically prejudice plus the power to oppress those you hate. White Americans as the ruling class and oppressors have that power to oppress Blacks and other minorities. They have been oppressing us and other minorities for centuries and they still continue to do so to this very day. In other words, they benefit from slavery, genocide of the Native Americans, Jim Crow etc all the things that their ancestors have put in place for them to succeed and for us to remain downtrodden.

    White Americans have built their lives and actions on the lie of White supremacy and it’s ideas whether they realize it or not. So they have a false sense of self and ego that they are the best things to walk on two legs. They don’t want to face the wrongs that their ancestors did to us, Native Americans, Mexicans, Indians etc. Remember what type of people you are dealing with when you are around them.

    Most of all, based on my observations and living around Whites for a good part of my childhood, I have came up with a theory. There is no such thing as a good White person. They are all the same to me even if they appear nice and mean well. And even these so called ”good” White people will mess up and accidentally say something racist without even knowing it. Thus White people should not be trusted


  712. ”This is Also related to beauty somehow – at least in my warped mind where the most beautiful people are invariably black and brown.”

    In my own mind, Blacks are the most beautiful and then mixed Blacks, Latinas, East Indian women and Arab women. Black and brown people are the most beautiful to me as well.

    I find Whites and Asians like Chinese, Japanese, Korean the least attractive. I am simply not attracted to them.


  713. The conversation about black-on-white crime that needs to be had is that it’s not being sufficiently portrayed in the media. If you believe it has been, you’re living in a delusion. While the media was in a year-long frenzy over Trayvon Martin, blacks murdered dozens of white across the country, some in grisly, brutal manners, often with the rape of our women. Some black-on-white crimes are reported in local news, but usually covered up — often the race of the perpetrator is HIDDEN, not just avoided, but obfuscated. Then, these local stories never make it to national news. So there is a false perception that they don’t exist, or that these crimes are more rare than they are. But if you study the crime statistics, black crime is horrifically rampant, and it’s not just “they prey on themselves” like some people like to say. Add to that the White Genocide in South Africa and Zimbabwe, and the White Genocide in Europe, and your so-called “turn about with giggles” isn’t really very funny.

    The media, television and Hollywood films included, are trying to stir up outrage in blacks toward whites, but the statistics show that it is whites who should be outraged. If they truth gets out — it would take a while for white people to reconcile the cognitive dissonance that the truth is the opposite of what they’ve been told for the last few decades — they would come to see what the leaders of Europe — Merkel, Cameron, and Sarkozy — have admitted: multiculturalism is a dismal failure. We simply cannot live together peacefully in the long term.


  714. @Daniel

    The real question is when has the media ever really portrayed anything sufficiently? In fact the news has been talking about black crime in large sum and not the covering up you imagine. Don Lemon rings a bell. Bill O’Riley.

    “blacks murdered dozens of white across the country, some in grisly, brutal manners, often with the rape of our women”—Do you mind providing those dozen grisly deaths done by blacks as I would like to provide the outrage you seek.

    “Some black-on-white crimes are reported in local news, but usually cove