The following is based on “Modern Falsification of History”, chapter three of Cheikh Anta Diop’s “The African Origin of Civilization: Myth or Reality” (1974):
In ancient times it was widely believed that Egyptians came from the Ethiopians, but in the 1800s many European scholars began to distance Egypt from black Africa, from “Africa proper”. They looked to Asia or even North Africa for the seeds of Egyptian civilization. The black people found in Ancient Egypt were seen as slaves in a white civilization.
One of the more desperate attempts to do this was to say that Egyptian civilization came from the Libyans to the west. Libyans were light-skinned and possibly came from Europe. But the Egyptians regarded them as savages. Herodotus too:
Their women wear on each leg a ring made of bronze, they let their hair grow long, and when they catch vermin on their person, bite it and throw it away.
The Libyans did in fact take over and rule Egypt for a while, but that was thousands of years after the rise of Egyptian civilization. The same goes for all the light-skinned rulers of Egypt – the Persians, Greeks, Romans, Arabs and Turks. In fact, their settling in Egypt is proof not that Egypt was white, but that it used to be much blacker than it is today.
As it turns out Egyptians painted pictures of the different people of the known world and even gave each a different skin colour, putting them in this order:
- dark red or copper: Egyptians
- black: Africans
- tan or yellow: Asians
- white: Europeans
Whites were not only last, they were the only ones pictured as savages (as most were back then some 3,500 years ago).
European scholars jumped on this to show that the Egyptians did not regard themselves as black. Yet, as one of these very same scholars pointed out elsewhere, copper is part of the natural skin colour range of black Africa.
The Egyptians naturally saw themselves as being different and apart from everyone else. But they also saw themselves as being closest, in appearance and civilization, to “Africa proper” – and farthest from whites!
It was not just skin colour either, but even their features:
- nose short and fleshy
- mouth stretched a bit too far
- thick lips
- large eyes opened wide
and that in the words of a scholar who tried to prove the Egyptians were not black!
For comparison here is how Egyptians pictured white people (in the words of Champollion):
a white skin of the most delicate shade, a nose straight or slightly arched, blue eyes, blond or reddish beard, tall stature and very slender, clad in a hairy ox-skin, a veritable savage, tattooed on various parts of his body.
The Egyptians also painted their gods black. Isis, for example, always has the skin colour of a Nubian. If Egypt was a white civilization with black slaves then why the black gods? Most people paint gods in their own image, not that of their slaves.
See also:
Excellent Post!
Excellent Points!
Excellent Question! “If Egypt was a white civilization with black slaves then why the black gods?”
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The very idea of white Egypt was and is ridicilous beyond any reason. Also trying to tie acient Egypt to some weird Asiatic connection is very funny. The truth is and always was, that Egypt was an african civilization.
This being said, like the wall painting shows, I do not think Egypt was “racially pure” at all. I think, like the text says, they considered themselves as egyptians regardles of racial features. This would explain why some of the pictures and statues of the nobles show clearly “black features” and some do not. Racial purity did not matter in acient Egypt. You had black pharaos and so on, but main thing was being Egyptian in relation to the other neighbouring people and nations.
Egyptians saw themselves above others around them and just like the libyan barbarians, they set themselves apart from the black Nubia, civilization older than theirs. They looked the seafaring whiter people barbarians as well, just like the various people in the present day middle East and southern Turkey (the heetites).
One thing we often forget: from egyptian point of view, all the others were basically illiterate country red necks. Egypt did not need anything from them, other than tribute and some cash. It was the most powerful and wealthiest state around. Being egyptian was something else, pretty much like being a roman much later, or now a days: being american.
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What makes it impossible for many to see Ancient Egypt as Black civilization is the fact that there has been no Black Power that has emerged anytime in the recent or even very distant past. Even South America and Asia now have success stories. For most, the idea of an advanced Black civilization is impossible to believe.
I’m pretty much in agreement with Clarence Munford’s idea that only the rise of a powerful Black nation will begin to counter the world-wide belief in Black Inferiority.
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Never have I read more misrepresentations, elaborate falsifications, deliberate distortions. Has not one of you loons ever studies Egyptology? The only contribution made by Africans may have been physical labor and even that is doubtful. This entire blog reminds me of a snake swallowing its tail.
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That may be true if you get your history from Stormfront and quack YouTube historians. But if you actually go to University, or even subscribe to magazines like… I don’t know… National Geographic, you will learn about Black Pharaohs as a matter of course, as well as many other high Egyptian officials… but then, you’d actually have to be educated, and we both know how hard that would be.
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/2008/01/20/2008-01-20_egypts_black_pharaohs_ignored.html
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http://wysinger.homestead.com/hair2.html Check out this web site too.
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And that snake is you John Acord. Its white folks like YOU that’s in denial and REFUSE to see the truth. Egypt (KMT) was black before the pharaohs. Hell they got their civilization from the people in the south. Pyramid(sp?) building started in the south. Why do you think there are so many pyramids in Sudan then in Egypt(KMT)?
Whether you people believe this or not (which I REALLY dont give a flying crap if you dont) Egypt was black FIRST. PERIOD.
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http://ikg-info.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=25<emid=65
I think I got it now. Aba.
Anyway, National Geo has Three falsehoods. After all Most of the time, anything white folks write something, its always FALSE.
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KeeKee:
Do not use [url] and [/url]. WordPress views them as a sign of spam.
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OK. Sorry aba. thanx.:)
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And for those white people on here saying blacks have no connection with Egypt…especailly american blacks….I say you’re wrong. There is proof that black africans who live in the west, south west and south of africa that can trace their roots back to the East of africa. You people are in denial. Euro and euro-decent people have screwed up history so freaking bad its quite obvious about your denial. Everytime black people mention egypt, the sh*t hit the fan. (exuse my language). But its true. Kemet (long BEFORE it was egypt) was black. sure there where others there but it was definitely BLACK. BLACKs ruled. There is also roof of white and arab people chipping off the black faces and putting white or arab faces which is a serious JOKE. Aint nothing white about those monuments. NOTHING!
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So I guess the racial aspect of amcient Egypt is important because it’s an example of BP running things in a powerful society. Also because whites in the past have tried to lessen the significance of the role black people played in Egyptian society and in the process robbed them of a much needed example of their own capabilities. I suppose the real tragedy is that it isn’t just taken for granted that blacks could have played a major role in the history of civilization, and so they must constantly defend their place in history. It might be worth noting that during this period of historic black achievement race didn’t exist as a concept. It might be the concept of race itself that is hindering such achievement today.
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Another great post, Abagond.
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@ jas0nburns
Yeah, it’s a problem because for so many years the White Academic authorities made out Egypt to be a place where white (or near-White) people achieved a great civilization where Blacks were just slaves — kind of like what synapse-challenged John has been parroting. But as you said, the modern idea of massive color-coded races did not exist at the time.
The “Blacks never developed a civilization” meme is one of the most stalwart and enduring mythologies among White supremacists.
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The “Blacks never developed a civilization” meme is one of the most stalwart and enduring mythologies among White supremacists.
Exactly. Some people are just willfully blind.
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Abagond:
Why do whites and other non-blacks continue to whitewash the real “black history” of ancient Egypt? The Holy Bible is the source of the problem. In my mind, It’s the genesis of modern-day white supremacy and racism. Egypt is mentioned in the bible a lot. In order for the white, blonde-haired, blue-eyed jesus to remain relevant in the minds of humankind, Egypt has to be portrayed as non-black, non-african, etc. Whites know they’re full of it, but they don’t care. They’ve gotten a lot of mileage out of lying about african history and people. Black people, always challenge conventional wisdom, popular opinion, and the status quo, Always!!!
Tyrone
Reality Mode
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Excellent post, Abagond.
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Bulangirl wrote: “How different is it from saying anyone with One Drop of African blood (in the US) is “Black”, no matter how light the skin colour. But when reporting ancient history, reverse the standard, by defining anyone with a drop of ‘white’ blood is enough to make them caucasian, no matter how dark the skin.”
I never quite understood how white teachers/professors, or (American) whites in general, could look in the faces of people such as myself (light honey complexion; curly/wavy, sandy brown hair; mixed race facial features, skewed moreso towards Native American) or my mother (fair-skinned, ash blonde hair wavy hair; green eyes; Caucasoid/light “mestizo” facial features) and automatically classify us and the rest of my family (multigenerational mixed for the most part) as “Black”, and then quickly switch gears in their brains so as to declare that the ancient Egyptians as mixed race, or even fully Caucasoid, rather than Black. Even Tut’s highly idealized golden burial mask looks far more like someone who could be a member of my family than it does any Caucasoid I’ve ever laid eyes on.
In my opinion the original population of KMT consisted of black-skinned, wooly-haired “Negroes”. As the nation’s fame/reputation/wealth grew more and more outsiders (with very few being of the Germanic/Northern European type) gradually took up residence (along with frequent invasions) until the nation gradually took on a facade of basically being mixed race (e.g. much like Latin America is now) or multiracial (e.g. much like New York City is now). KMT/Egypt never was (and still isn’t) mainly white, Caucasoid or European.
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Folks, give these books a read for starters. The ‘proof’ is in the discoveries being made in the desert. When the Sahara, which was once verdant thousands of years ago, dried up, the populace either went further into the ‘interior, or settled along the Nile. There were constant forays into the interior as Egyptians interacted with these countries. Stelae have been found in the desert from various reigns throughout early Egyptian history.
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My apologies to Bulanikgirl for misspelling your username in my post above.
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Thanks bulanik, I’ve worked out a logical axiom for racists when classifying groups, first you must have at least a drop of both groups in your blood line, but it boils down to this:
Get indicted for a criminal offense you’re black, get credit for a mathematical/scientific theory you’re white
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I agree with Louie Jacuzzi. It is what lies at the heart of this whole thing about Egypt. And it is not just Egypt. In the 1800s and early 1900s, White Americans looked down on Greeks and Jews as lower beings, as not fully white, and yet at the very same time they saw Plato and Jesus as lily white. Jesus was painted as a northern European and the Ancient Greeks were shown in all their white marbly goodness. The past is whitened as required by white self-esteem.
That is STILL going on. Like in the Texas School Board mandated accounts of the Battle of the Alamo. Or Hollywood casting of Alexander the Great and Cleopatra. All the good guys of history look suspiciously like White Americans. It is one of the supports of white racism.
Jesus:
Plato:
Cleopatra:
Alexander the Great:
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North africans are 15% black african, but they formulated a lot of modern algebra and trigonometry – they’re considered white, in the US you can be 12 percent (one grand parent) and be considered solidly black
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… unless of course you invent a new branch of mathematics. Or become president. Or become a golf champion.
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@abagond: During the italian mass immigration to US in late 1800’s and early 1900’s they were considered “black” (semiafrican/not white) and also stupid, ignorant and suitable only for manual labour. Which is funny considering that at the same time the romans where touted in american universities as somekind of model beings.
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@ Sam,
That’s only because the Romans were much better people than the Italians… Oh wait… that doesn’t quite work out does it?
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Why are the Nebamun fresco dancers (the banner atop Abagond’s website) topless, and in ancient G-strings?
What kind of establishment were these Egyptians running?
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sam:
Many Italians still view Sicilians in this manner.
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Mediterraneans don’t look much different than Northern Europeans to me. All of the Italians I know visually fit right in with all of the other white Americans I see. Still don’t see why ppl with ancestry in the north claim Greece and Rome tho…
@louie
12% is about about an eighth black. That’s one great grandparent. One grandparent would be 25% or a fourth.
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From memory (college art history), the banner depicts a banquet/party and the topless dancers are servant girls. The first four figures in the banner are daughters of high ranking officials. They, as well as other guests of the banquet, are adorned with perfumed wax cones atop their heads. As the banquet progresses, body heat melts the wax, the wearer is coated in wax and the room is permeated with the scent of the perfume….
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@ Cynic
I think most people are thinking something like this (as the difference)
Northern European (Scandinavian)
Southern European (Italiano)
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The high school I attended was situated in a majority working-class Italian American neighborhood of Queens, NY. Many (but not all) of the Italian American students who attended had the hirsute olive skin; large, round, dark eyes; dark wavy hair and aquiline noses (e.g. Al Pacino or Danny DeVito types) which often easily distinquished them from the non-Southern European whites who attended the school.
Also, Europeans in general don’t stay put, and, consequently, you’ll find Nordic-appearing northern Italians, Brits who have a distinct Mediterranean appearance, Irish folks with black hair, pale skin and
blue eyes; and brown-haired/light-skinned Alpine typed Greeks along side their curly-haired/swarthy-skinned compatriots (there were plenty of them in the college I attended).
[Posting my comment in Internet Explorer in hopes that it doesn’t go straight into moderation as per usual…hint, hint]
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Also, I was raised by elderly relatives from the Deep South who most definitely did not view Jews or Italians as being white. Whenever they’d relate a story from their pasts concerning some off-handed ‘stuff’ someone said or did to them, if I asked if the person who did it /said it was white, they’d sometimes say, “No. He was a Jew!” or “No. He was one of those “Eye-talians!”
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It was a typo cynic, I saw it after I wrote it, thanks though
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Get indicted for a criminal offense you’re black, get credit for a mathematical/scientific theory you’re white
Just ask James Watson!
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/science/article3022190.ece
Haven’t heard from the sucker since!
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Lol, he was white up to that point!
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@King
I still don’t see it…
Like I said before, I really don’t see much of a difference. If some Robert De niro lookin dude told me his family was from England and Germany, I would believe him.
Those two pictures of those European guys look pretty similar to me.
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@cynic: I am 100% finn, my fathers’ family has been tracked down at least into the 1500’s as finns living in present day Finland. My mother is a refugee from Carelia and her family has been tracked down to 1700’s and they are 100% carelian finns. But lo behold, I have almost black hair (now turning grey), brown eyes and not so pale skin!! WTF!!??
When I was in NYC back in the 80’s nobody noticed me as a foreigner because of this. And even the Feds took me once as an native (ok, it was dark at night but still)! So much so of the mythical blonde northeners.
Besides, the saami, natives of these regions, have plenty of black haired brown eyed people among them and they have been here at least since the last ice age. Now what are we to think about that? Darn.
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@randy: True, northern italians say often that Africa begins somewhere south of Rome. To which the napolitanos say: when you guys were still living on the hills and humpin sheep, we had university, mandatory italian language officially, hospitals, medical university, thriving cultural life etc. And sicilians can point to any old building and say: oh, do you mean the greeks? Arabs? Norrmen?
In the court of the norman king of Sicily in 1100’s, arabic scientist al Idris wrote a book of the geography of Europe. In the Baltic region he mentioned two cities, both of which were in Finland. He did not mention any german town, any swedish, danish, polish, any other towns at all. Now how the heck an arab living in the court of norman king of Sicily knew that??
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I’m sorry I’m late here.
Once again, the question whether Ancient Egyptians were black or white, or any other race we know today is anachronistic: races didn’t exist back then.
That being said, there’s no proof that Ancient Egyptians were “white” in today’s sense of the word. It has nothing to do with how they portrayed themselves (more about it later). Nothing we found about the inhabitants of Ancient Egypt proves they were “white”.
But that doesn’t mean Ancient Egyptians were an uniform group. Ancient Egypt followed Nile, and its inhabitants were both people from the north (delta) and south (to the today’s Sudan, even deep in it in some periods). It’s quite possible people on the south were a bit different in phenotype than those on the north.
If it means something for this discussion, btw, the strongest and most powerful dynasties in all the Egyptian history came from south. (Also, if it means something for this discussion, south probably conquered the north at the beginning, but that’s another story). None of it had any racial meaning for them; it can only have for us.
And it’s sure, without no doubt, that Ancient Egyptians weren’t “white”.
But I don’t like the proof Diop uses. You can’t prove much by looking at the Egyptian paintings and the way they represented people, because they didn’t use realistic representation of people. They used the canon of proportions. A Greek person might be represented the identical way as the Egyptian one. Also, Egyptian women were often represented as light skinned. It proves nothing. (Plus, I am not sure what “large eyes opened wide” means. The canon of proportions requires that head is to be shown from profile view, but the eye must be shown en face).
Now, in all honesty, Egyptians regarded as savages most of the people who weren’t Egyptian. But, once again, it has nothing with the race discussion.
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In fact in the tomb of Ramses III Egyptians were depicted as nearly identical to Nubians to the South in the “mural of the races.” despite recent attempts to discredit this. http://manuampim.com/ramesesIII.htm
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