The white club is the white race seen as a club. Like a club it has members, it has rules about who can join and who cannot, it has duties and privileges. Those who fail to carry out their duties can be kicked out.
To join:
- Be born white or look enough like a white person to pass as one: light skin with a pink undertone, nose, lips and eyes of a European shape and hair with a European degree of straightness and smoothness.
- Honorary membership is sometimes extended to those who do not look white if they are rich or willing to carry out all of the duties (see below). However not all privileges will necessarily be granted. Honorary membership is more likely to be extended to Asians than to blacks.
Duties:
- Accept White American culture as your guide to life. Practise it and do not question it. Your aim is to speak, dress and act like a middle-class White American with a good education. If you do not look white, this is a must. If you look white then a certain degree of freedom is allowed (hippies, goths and hillbillies but not, say, Muslims).
- Speak English and speak it with one of the accepted club accents.
- Do not seriously question or challenge white racism.
- Do not make common cause with blacks or other people of colour.
- Have mostly white friends.
- Marry a white person. Back in the 1940s breaking this rule would get you kicked out, no questions asked. Even now it is still a strike against you. Not so for white men who marry Asian women.
Privileges:
- Living in better neighbourhoods with better schools and safer streets.
- Lower unemployment.
- Higher pay.
- Longer life.
- Not being seen as a threat by the police or security guards.
- Being seen as more fully human.
- Having whites take your ideas and experiences seriously (at least for males).
- Listening to racist jokes (does not seem like a privilege, but it functions as one).
Michelle Malkin, who runs a well-known right-wing blog, is an excellent example of an honorary white: both her parents came from the Philippines so she looks unmistakably Asian – but by culture she is White American, she married a white person and, best of all, she defended the American government’s right to send Japanese Americans to prison camps during the Second World War, proving her loyalty to the white club.
When the Irish, Italians and Jews came to America they were not seen as white at first even though they pretty much looked it. Only when they showed themselves willing to carry out club duties were they admitted and were able to enjoy its privileges. Had they kept their culture, married blacks or made common cause with them, they would have stayed at the bottom and would be regarded much as Latinos are now.
It is the threat of losing club privileges or even membership that keeps those in the club from rocking the boat, from standing up to its racism.
– Abagond, 2009.
See also:
- How to become white – Thandeka’s take on this phenomenon
- growing up white
- growing up Asian American
- acceptable blackness
- white privilege
- passing
- covering
- How racism helps and hurts whites
- White American culture
Great post.
It’s true — privilege has its memberships.
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Michelle Malkin, who runs a well-known right-wing blog, is an excellent example of an honorary white: both her parents came from the Philippines so she looks unmistakably Asian – but by culture she is White American, she married a white person and, best of all, she defended the American government’s right to send Japanese Americans to prison camps during the Second World War, proving her loyalty to the white club over her suspected loyalty to Asians (because of how she looks).
Thank you for this post, abagond! Although I cannot speak for other Asian people, from what I’ve heard among others within the Asian community, she is considered the Asian version of an Uncle Tom. She is, what’s referred to among Asians, a coconut. Brown on the outside and white on the inside. She is the minority spokesperson, I prefer to call her lapdog, for the white establishment. Whatever she espouses is an affront to people of color.
My Filipino mother commented one time that Michelle Malkin is walang hiya. A term used by Filipinos to mean “without shame”. And as a Filipino, that’s considered a BIG deal to be thought of that way. Also, my gentle mother suggested Michelle Malkin needed to have some sense beaten into her.
I cannot stand Michelle Malkin. She is truly an embarrassment. She sold her soul to the devil. She’s a suck up and deserves to be ridiculed. She disgusts me.
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And another thing, that pic of Miley Cyrus and her friends slanting their eyes behind the token Asian is very telling. You can try with all your might to be one of them, but you’ll never be accepted as one.
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Excellent post, Abagond!
Leigh204,
You are so right! You can try all you want, you’ll never be a true member of the “white club.” It’s interesting, I’ve seen many non-black minorities who really lobbied hard to put in an application into this (not so) “exclusive club.” Of course, there were many blacks who tried as well, but they almost always got indirectly kicked out somewhere down the line.
From what I’ve seen of Malkin, I did get the perception that she is a “coconut” (Many Pacific Islanders also use this term). Amy Holmes is her black counterpart. There’s a reason the mainstream television media has no problem displaying them. With their white thinking process and white husbands, they’ve tried very hard to be inducted into the club.
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Michelle Malkin may be the mouthpiece for the “white club”, but should she ever question this club, they’ll turn on her. And I hope this happens. She was never one of them in the first place. She thumbed her nose to too many people…burned so many bridges. If I could say something to her, I’d say, “Don’t even bother crawling back with your tail between your legs. You’re not welcome.”
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Being seen as fully human.
I get your point, but that’s not *necessarily* true. Lots of people are white but get treated as sub-human for other reasons (poverty, disability, old age, speaking the “wrong” language to name but a few)
I say this without trying to deny that PoC are treated as sub-human, or that, say, a poor white person is still more likely to be treated as human than a poor black/brown person.
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The white club is real and there are plenty of POC sellouts, Clarence Thomas, Ward Connerly, Star Parker, and Michelle Malkin. Not to mention Juan Williams and Linda Chavez until recently. White club members trot them out to prove that they’re not racists, which is not true. If you not racist, then why trot out minority conservatives? Is it to cover up their inherent racist bigotry.
As for marriage, white club members must marry whites, with the only exception for Asian women/White men matches. Any white woman marrying a person of Color are expelled immediately, no exceptions. Any white man marrying a non-Asian woman of Color is expelled as well.
Any white person who defy white supremacy, i.e., Tim Wise, are not members of the White club.
Any white person who genuinely love Black culture, i.e., Teena Marie, isn’t eligible for membership.
Any questions?
La Reyna
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I think it is no accident that Clarence Thomas, Michelle Malkin and Amy Holmes all married white.
I agree with La Reyna that marrying an Asian woman would not get you kicked out or even be a strike against you. And that it is more important for women to marry white than for men.
On the other hand I would not say that George Lucas, Roger Ebert or David Bowie have been kicked out of the white club despite their black wives. Being cultural contributors (and rich) helps to make up for it. If they, say, lived in a trailer park their membership would be in grave doubt.
So it is a strike against them, but by itself it is not enough to get them kicked out.
Good point about Teena Marie.
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Sanabitur Anima:
“Lots of people are white but get treated as sub-human for other reasons (poverty, disability, old age, speaking the “wrong” language to name but a few)”
Good point. I changed the wording to “Seen as more fully human”, adding the “more”.
Note that speaking the “wrong” language would mean you are not in the white club. To be in the white club you must speak English, preferably with Standard English grammar and what club members call “without an accent” – meaning THEIR accents.
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i cant stand clarence thomas, he lives through the eyes of the privileged, not so much white but upper class privileged.
some people of color mistake reality simply because they have the means to do so…and the fact that they painstakingly want to be part of the white world and will sell their souls and the souls of others to do so.
people like henry louis gates has the means to do that but he never forgot where he came from and is racially aware unlike people like holmes and thomas.
and also, i despise malkin…but i never heard of the coconut comparison…is it like the term Oreo? I thought people used twinkie to describe asians who are “yellow on the outside and white on the inside”…well i got that from Harold and Kumar Go to White Castle…
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@alwaysright101:
and also, i despise malkin…but i never heard of the coconut comparison…is it like the term Oreo?
Yes, it is. The term “coconut” is used to refer to the Southeast Asians with brown complexions who have sold out. At least, where I’m from anyway.
I thought people used twinkie to describe asians who are “yellow on the outside and white on the inside”…well i got that from Harold and Kumar Go to White Castle…
That’s correct. Also, besides twinkie, the term “banana” is another description for white-washed Asians mostly of East Asian descent (Chinese, Japanese, and Korean).
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Abagond,
I completely agree with your two previous comments.
There’s a reason why Teena Marie (as well as Robin Thicke and Jon B) never crossed over to the white pop audience. Incidentally, they married/procated black.
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I was never one for clubs anyway. I’ll pass on this one. Besides, it sounds as if much soul-selling is required in order to qualify.
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this sums up perfectly what i’ve been trying to tell certain jewish friends of mine, as well as older family members who say things along the lines of, “well, we (jews) started from nothing and became successful, productive members of american society” and you know the rest…
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Wow, I thought the only people who still equated the white race with the middle class were my poor white trash cousins in Manteca, California. How completely ignorant it is to do this. This means of course that middle and upper class blacks are somehow not “black” and are sell-outs. What is clear is that you cannot have the racist meme of white = middle class without implying that black = ghetto.
It is so sad that white racists like the author of this post still exist. How do I know the author is white? Well it is obvious; all the verb tenses in this post are grammatically correct. That’s what’s called “speaking white”. Of course a black person would have immediately seen the hypocrisy of, on the one hand defining white as speaking correct English and having a good education, and then on the other hand writing an entire blog post in perfect English about how blacks cannot be black if they speak correct English.
It is paradoxically because of America’s legacy of racism that a sizable black race still exists at all in America. Just as a drop of food colouring pretty quickly disappears into a larger quantity of liquid, if it were not for racism blacks would have long ago been absorbed into the much large white gene pool in America during the 300+ years they have been in America. In the end this is what will happen eventually.
How much better things are in Europe. My black colleagues there are defined by their social-economic class. The professional blacks I work with speak the exact same French as my white colleagues. They have the same concerns and some hopes and ambitions for a better future for their children. The only difference is that they don’t have a bunch of underclass blacks calling them sell-outs and not being “black” enough.
Of course people in America are also defined by their social economic class – but high-achieving blacks pay a particularly painful price for success. I remember a very upper class black guy during university. He liked hanging out with me, a working class white guy, because he was curious about the working classes and I operated as his “informer”. Anyway our group (mostly Asian guys) would sometimes go and play basketball at a local court. All was fine, my upper class black friend was not so good but he was enjoying himself. But then some local brothas came and joined us (they wern’t actually that great either but certainly better than us). Anyway they almost immediately started mocking the way my friend played and then when they heard him speak they fell all over themselves laughing at his “white” speech patterns. My friend had tears in his eyes as he turned away and headed back to the dorms all alone.
He never again came with us to shoot hoops – and I can’t say that I blame him.
Defining race as belonging to a certain economic is just as wrong when done by blacks as it is when whites do it.
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^^^
Reading while white.
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Mack said:
“Of course a black person would have immediately seen the hypocrisy of, on the one hand defining white as speaking correct English and having a good education, and then on the other hand writing an entire blog post in perfect English about how blacks cannot be black if they speak correct English.”
Where did I ever say that blacks cannot be black if they speak correct English? I have never said that and never will. I even wrote a post against that point of view:
And how come a white person, you, noticed the supposed hypocrisy and none of the black commenters who came before you? Because they read what I wrote instead of assuming what I was going to say and hearing that in their heads instead.
Further, I did not say that middle-class blacks are sell-outs. Nor does it follow from my post. I said:
“Honorary membership is sometimes extended to those who do not look white”
Notice the SOMETIMES. Not ALWAYS, not MOST OF THE TIME but SOMETIMES.
In America most middle-class blacks are a million miles away from ever being part of the white club, much less being sell-outs.
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I see the Roissy sydrome is in full effect LOL
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Where did I ever say that blacks cannot be black if they speak correct English?
Here:
“Your aim is to speak, dress and act like a middle-class White American with a good education. If you do not look white, this is a must.”
And Here:
“Speak English and speak it with one of the accepted club accents”
The implication being that if you are black and speaking standard American English then the reason you are doing so is that undoubtedly you are motivated by the vain hope of joining this mythical “White Club”. I mean why else would you be positing this “White Club” except as a shaming tactic to get blacks not to try to join it?
And this shaming tactic can be effective because in the end there is no real thing that you can touch, feel, or objectively describe or discuss that is an actual “White Club”. The whole concept is just a play of shadows cast on a wall within your head. No one can independently confirm or deny its existence.
In the end anyone who bases their analysis of America, or any society for that matter, primarily on race is on a fool’s errand. Race may play a part but socio-economic class is the deciding factor. White and black middle class Americans have much more in common with each other than they do with people of their own races either in the underclass or overclass.
And the fact that some commentators may agree with you is not actual proof of anything. There are several racist sites where commentators unanimously agree on the stupidest of notions but all I would say is that echo chambers have never really impressed me all that much. The fact that people are not questioning your statements should however ring alarm bells.
By the way should Clarence Thomas feel shame for being a proud member of your “White Club”?
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Wanting to join the white club is A reason to speak correct English but it does not follow that it is the ONLY reason.
There are other reasons to speak Standard English: getting and holding a job; getting an education, geting good grades; because you were brought up that way by your BLACK parents; because you believe that that is the right way to speak. Or, as in the case of this blog, wanting to reach as many people as possible.
Nelson Mandela speaks correct English. Malcolm X spoke correct English. Did they do it because they wanted to be white? I think not.
I did not write this post to shame black people out of “acting white” or something. Instead it is like many of my other posts on this blog: an attempt to understand race in America.
Most white Americans do not think race is important because it does not affect them; because they want to think their society is fair and just, etc.
But you cannot make good sense of America without race. I tried. It does not work. Not if you are honest, not if you see with your own two eyes and think with your own brain.
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Mack said:
“White and black middle class Americans have much more in common with each other than they do with people of their own races either in the underclass or overclass.”
Wrong. Poor whites live longer and have higher reading scores than middle-class blacks. Race in America matters more than class. It is part of how the rich have ruled America since the 1600s.
I used to live in a part of New York that was black and middle-class – and extremely violent. Because the police were more interested in protecting white life than black life. It had absolutely nothing to do with class and everything to do with race: because in the eyes of the police black life is not as valuable as white life.
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Wow, I thought the only people who still equated the white race with the middle class were my poor white trash cousins in Manteca, California. How completely ignorant it is to do this. This means of course that middle and upper class blacks are somehow not “black” and are sell-outs. What is clear is that you cannot have the racist meme of white = middle class without implying that black = ghetto.
The post’s author is not equating socio-economic status with being in the ‘white club’. The writer does not claim that all middle to upper class blacks aspire to being in the ‘white club’. He is referring to those racialized people who do, often to the detriment of other racialized people.
It is so sad that white racists like the author of this post still exist.
Do you have ‘white radar’? Can you see through your monitor? As far as I know the blog owner is black. Should my supposition be wrong, at least, if he is ‘white’, he has far more insight into racism and it’s machinations than 95% of white people do.
Well it is obvious; all the verb tenses in this post are grammatically correct. That’s what’s called “speaking white”. Of course a black person would have immediately seen the hypocrisy of, on the one hand defining white as speaking correct English and having a good education, and then on the other hand writing an entire blog post in perfect English about how blacks cannot be black if they speak correct English.
He does not say this. He is saying that those racialized persons aspiring to the ‘white club’ do this as a requirement for ‘joining’ this club. Most blacks in the middle to upper class do not wish to be in the white club, and they still speak ‘proper’ English. Many may be able to switch to their particular dialect such as ‘patois’ or ‘ebonics’, it all depends on what situation they are in. Some black people aren’t familiar with dialects because, as the author says, is how they were raised and they do-not want to be in the white club either. Those fluent in various dialects can switch at will, this does not denote anything except that the person is fluent in language and dialect. It may or may not have something to do with their ‘economic’ class.
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if it were not for racism blacks would have long ago been absorbed into the much large white gene pool in America during the 300+ years they have been in America. In the end this is what will happen eventually.
And this is a good thing? Everyone will eventually become white? Black Americans will disappear? Descendants of African Americans will by ‘default’ join the white club? This sounds like a wish on your part to eradicate black Americans, but instead of doing it by genocidal means, it will be done by ‘assimilation’. Then everyone will be one big ‘happy family’, white! Eradicate your race problems through everyone becoming ‘white’ eventually, I guess that is one solution, however skewed.
How much better things are in Europe. My black colleagues there are defined by their social-economic class.
Yes and there is no racial problems in France. France is a racial ‘paradise’. It may have been when there was little or no racialized populace there or when black entertainers and writers went to live there in times past. However, that is not so today. This is evinced in the riots that occurred there in 2007. Google ‘riots in France’ and and you will get 3,900,000 hits. Google ‘Racism in France’, and you will get 7,330,000 hits. No, there is no racism in France. Perhaps your black colleagues aspire to be members of the ‘white club’ so are espousing a ‘white’ view? Maybe in order to keep the ‘peace’ they steer away from questions of race. Or, perhaps they are just deluded? Who knows? But, to coin a phrase. ‘Something aint right in the land of Denmark’, but in this instance it is France. But the writer is talking of America, not France, why veer from the topic. And it isn’t ‘contextual comparisons’ as this post isn’t about comparisons between racism in America versus Europe. If it was, then these comparisons would be apt.
Of course people in America are also defined by their social economic class – but high-achieving blacks pay a particularly painful price for success.
What high price? Racism? In that respect you are correct. But then black people pay a price in general. The difference being, that a middle to upper class black person may suffer in more ‘comfortable surroundings’ than a poor black person.
Defining race as belonging to a certain economic is just as wrong when done by blacks as it is when whites do it.
It is you, through your miscomprehension of this post who is ‘defining’ race as belonging to a certain economic class. But then again it is probably easier for you to define this post this way than by examining racist issues in America.
By the way should Clarence Thomas feel shame for being a proud member of your “White Club”?
Clarence Thomas probably revels in his honorary membership in the ‘white club’, as do may other racialized people who subscribe to this mode of thinking such as the example given here of Michelle Malkin to name a few.
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Why is it O.K. for white men to marry Asian women? Why are there no consequences? I live and go to school in Boston. These couples are everywhere. LITERALLY. Both individuals in the relationship are usually prejudiced/racist.
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Herneith,
It is a simple fact that the only reason there still exists a sizable black population in America is because of racism; particularly that white Americans created barriers for mating with blacks. In a society where racism only exists at a low level, a very small racial group will be absorbed by the much larger group every time. Look at the German settlers in Latin America. There are very few racially German people left there, their very small gene pool was absorbed into the larger gene pool. This is what would have happened in South Africa to the white settlers if the strong walls of racism they built had not forbidden it. Now if you want to throw you hat in with historic racism in America and celebrate the fact that the racist won and there is still a substantial group (12%) of blacks then fine. If it would have been genocidal for America to not have been racist all those years then you better sit down and have a think for a while about the implications of that.
The riots in France were religious in nature, very few blacks took part in them. Ninety percent of the rioters were Caucasian and Islamic. The fact remains that until very recently there has not been a distinct black culture in most European countries and the blacks that entered teh countries were qucikly absorbed into the much larger native gene pool. Have a look at the current Prime Minister of Sweden; he has a few drops in him from his great gandfather. Whether we should be condemning the Europeans for not being historically more racist and thus ensuring the survival of a distinctly black population is a question I will let you grapple with.
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@Lavander
I think that it is because sometimes Asians are considered honarary whites and that may have something to do with the model minority sterotype.
So because they are seen as honarary whites they make the same racist comments to other people of colour so those Asian are part of “the white club” that’s my take on it
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Mack:
About 37% of the French have a university degree, but among blacks it is 55%. Yet while 34% of the French are working class, 45% of blacks are.
I did a post on blacks in France:
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Abagond,
How in the hell does anyone know what percentage of black people have university degrees or are working class in a country that does not allow any records to be kept based on race? They don’t even know how many black people they have in France let alone how many are working class.
One thing we do know however is that they do have one super hot black minster in the government!
http://images.google.be/images?hl=en&source=hp&q=rama+yade+photos&um=1&ie=UTF-8&ei=C-AKS4nBJ52RjAelmp33AQ&sa=X&oi=image_result_group&ct=title&resnum=1&ved=0CBQQsAQwAA
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The government in France does not count people according to race, but that does not stop others from doing their own surveys.
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It is a simple fact that the only reason there still exists a sizable black population in America is because of racism; particularly that white Americans created barriers for mating with blacks.
And the fact that there still exists a sizeable black populations is bad? By your own admission, this is due to white racism. The if and what could or ‘should’ have been according to your druthers mean nothing as racism still exists. I get the sense, according to what you write, that if everyone were one colour, then racism would go away, and the colour is preferably white. I take umbrage to this notion. Speculation as to what would have been if whites weren’t racist on a historical continuum does not speak as to what is going on today. Speculation is just that, speculation. This is not a Harry Turtledove speculative historical fiction novel we are discussing of.
Now if you want to throw you hat in with historic racism in America and celebrate the fact that the racist won and there is still a substantial group (12%) of blacks then fine
This is bizarrely racist. I’m not ‘celebrating’ anything, I am responding to your comments. Nor am I throwing my hat in with historic racism due to the fact that this is how history turned out, it is what it is. Yes there is still a ‘sizeable black population, so what.
If it would have been genocidal for America to not have been racist all those years then you better sit down and have a think for a while about the implications of that.
Yes, I’ll go and sit down and pull out one of my speculative fiction books and reread them. I will admit that I read them years ago but they are along the same lines that you are speaking of. I didn’t say genocidal, I said through assimilation. Nothing to ponder on a massive scale, the fact of the matter is that America was racist and here we are today.
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The riots in France were religious in nature, very few blacks took part in them. Ninety percent of the rioters were Caucasian and Islamic.
Since when did Muslim become a race?
Whether we should be condemning the Europeans for not being historically more racist and thus ensuring the survival of a distinctly black population is a question I will let you grapple with.
Who’s condemning anything? The author of the post is talking about America, not Europe. He is writing about his current observations, not what would have been if whites weren’t racist 400 years ago. Yet you are expounding on speculations as to what would have happened if white Americans had not been historically racist. You are suggesting that I ponder the speculative implications. Well here’s my speculations; If the white European had not been racist 400 or so years ago, if they had not brought slaves from Africa to America, then we would not be having this ‘conversation, as there would be no black people here in North America, indeed, there would be no Europeans here. Everyone would have remained on their respective contents; If the European had not gone into any of these countries and colonized or appropriated them, we would not be having this ‘conversation’ as everyone would have remained on their respective continents. In fact, according to your speculations, I shouldn’t be here as well as millions of other blacks in North America. Right now, the only thing I am going to ‘grapple with’ and yes, speculate on, is what to have for lunch. Have a nice day.
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I do not see how this stuff about Europe or American would-have-beens has anything to do with the white club. This post is about America as it is now and particularly about the relation between race and privilege and more particularly about the white club.
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I think in some ways the jews are still seen as “less than.” remember in the 1960s they were very much so aligned with blacks, and whenever a jew “steps out of place” a white person is not afraid to remind them of it. i would also trust a jewish person before i’d trust an italian or irish person–tbh, i still don’t get why italians are seen as “white.” they look like a lot of middle eastern, arab, and southeast asian people i know.
in re: the white club, i’ll never fit. i was almost in it at the beginning of my freshman year of college (aka this year lol) but when a white girl thought she could say something totally racist and offensive to me and NOT have me say anything…it was revoked. i was proven a threatening nigra.
however, life does have some of its perks. one of the good things about “talking proper”, having knowledge of a lot of things seen as “white” (ie bob dylan and actually having read on the road by kerouac–which is funny, bc he’d hate most of the people who idolize him), and being intelligent gets you places. for instance, while i am unmistakably black (my features, my dark skin, my hair, etc) they are always nice to me and actually seem to listen to me about things. and they hate that they have to do, and the fact that i demand respect and to be treated like an equal. they hate me for it.
i also know a few blacks with membership to “the white club.” they’re the shufflin’ negros who let white people use “n—a” in front of them and make stupid remarks about, “on your fake ID you have to have a really black name” they don’t do that around me because i’m “oversensitive” (aka not for their bull) and while they watch what they say, it also means i can never be apart of the club.
and in re: asians–yeah, they have lifetime honorary white status AS LONG as they don’t get “mouthy” and call them on their racism (like black folks!!) you’d be surprised (well, probably not) by all the racism asians experience but are taught from an early age to ignore. and there are many who love that honorary status, and will treat other POC like crap to keep it.
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i have also noticed that some people who are “unapologetically black” gain entrance into the white clubs. what these people all have in common is that they are biracial and/or attractive by white standards. famous examples are (two very awesome people) president obama and angela davis. angela davis was the very definition of revolutionary and militant–with her ‘fro and love of everything black. yet she was also light-skinned with narrow features–we cannot ignore her history and why she ignited a nation in the first place. white people rallied for her like no other, and she has many close white allies. we can’t do it without white folks, but they ARE more welcoming to black people when we look less like “us” and more like them. same for barack.
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anonygrl: Excellent comments!
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@Lavender:
this is a reply to your second comment. i think it has a lot to do with the fetishization of asian women amongst white men. in the 1960s when the Vietnam War was going on an first-wave femnism had just started to be covered by the mainstream media, white men thought white women were getting, “too uppity.” they saw that the Vietnamese women (prostitutes, mostly) we nice, accommodating, and submissive. a lot of them married vietnamese women and brought them over to the u.s.
this resulted in asian women becoming “acceptable.” you see, when white men deem something good/ok do it en masse the stigma around it completely disappears. if white men ran out marrying black women in DROVES it would suddenly become OK because they set the standards of society. but like the other commenter said, they don’t want black children.
doing WWII anyone of asian descent was seen as a threat, and even before that they were treated like crap. but once white men decided they like them, all of sudden there were so many positive stereotypes were attributed to them. and while, yes, many asian women chase white men (i think over 50% of american born asians marry out) white men also chase them–heavily. there are MANY white men who will take a woman of asian descent (not southeast asian) over a white woman ANY day. and because of the positive stereotypes they helped to saturate the media with, it’s OK to have children who look more asian than white.
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I wanted to insert a comment about the difference between being white and middle class vs. black and middle class in America. One poster started to aim that Black middle class would have more in common with White middle class than Black lower class. This is where I would like to share my view as a Black middle class female.
I feel that it goes beyond stereotypes of being well educated and speaking perfect English. Being Black in America puts you at a disadvantage and there will come a point in time where you are not competing par in par with your “white” counterpoint. It’s the hidden racism that’s still prevalent when it comes to renting an apartment, applying for a job, and even after getting such job- receiving just compensation. All too often the salary of a black man with a master degree = the salary of a white man with maybe a BA.
There was some skit with Chris Rock where he was pondering about his very wealthy neighborhood in NJ and how the only Black residents were him, Mary J. Blige, and Jay Z. Meanwhile, his next door neighbor was your “everyday” white dentist. He proceeds to question what a black dentist would have to do to live in such a neighborhood and it was something along the lines of inventing teeth. But honestly, this is the kind of reality that hold true. Apple to apple, seed to seed, it seems as though white people in America have an advantage to better paying jobs, better neighborhoods, and better schools. While to get the life of a white dentist, a black person has to literally be a superstar?
These struggles are what relate many Black Americans across social class lines. Plus, to even become an honorary white club member one must forgo any acknowledgement of said struggles or cultural identities. They must assimilate into the group which means ignoring racism and pretty much trying to blend in as much as possible. The cure to racism is not to force minorities to blend in but to be accepted regardless of our differences.
** Also, to note on the Chris Rock bit it is proven that realtors try to keep neighborhoods as “white” as possible for property values. Hence, the everyday black dentist was more likely shown houses on the other side of town in the more mixed neighborhoods. Chris, Mary, and Jay Z are exceptions because they are *hence* celebrities. **
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Anongyrl,
I don’t think Davis and Obama are part of the white club at all (or WANT to be part of it). Obama, for example, certainly had his share of liberal white support but he was/is hardly fully accepted by “the white club”.
Jeremiah Wright and Malcolm X were maybe lighter in complexion than both of the aforementioned figures. I think it’s safe to say that their chances of being accepted into the “white club” are slim to none.
Colorism and favoritism for whitness certainly exist, it’s one way black Americans are socalized yet the examples you pointed out weren’t proving that.
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E.M.M.,
Has it dawned on you that the black dentist doesn’t want to live in those particular enclaves???
Sure, many whites may be quicker to accept a black person who is famous because of their familiarity, but let’s not pretend that many of these same whites are so thrilled to have Jay-Z or Chris Rock as a neighbor.
I know plenty of black professionals (doctors; lawyers; business(wo)men, etc.) and they live very well. Posh living arrangments are not only reserved for black celebs (most of whom don’t even have the cash flow that the average civilian thinks they have, Chris Rock and Jay-Z included).
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Lavender,
What cave do you live in?
Just as many white men persue or salivate over Latinas (which isn’t a race BTW), South Asian and Middle Eastern wormen as they do East Asian women! It’s just that MEs and SAs tend to be very ethnocentric. This leads them to date and/or marry interracially far less than East Asian Americans do.
East Asian Americans, sometimes by their own admission, marry white in the U.S. for the same reason that any other non-white person do: they percieve it as a status symbol AND in their minds, it is a quicker means of assimilation.
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@mynameismyname
I’m not a white man. I wouldn’t know who they “salivate over.” I do notice who they date here in Boston.
This is why I ask.
I never said Latinas were a race. Did you notice I wrote the word “some” before Latinas?
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E.M.M said:
“** Also, to note on the Chris Rock bit it is proven that realtors try to keep neighborhoods as “white” as possible for property values. Hence, the everyday black dentist was more likely shown houses on the other side of town in the more mixed neighborhoods. Chris, Mary, and Jay Z are exceptions because they are *hence* celebrities. **”
Racial steering by real estate agents does go on. I have experienced it myself. More here:
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White men/Asian women:
I agree with anonygrl: white men have made it acceptable. They have the power to set club rules. Also Asiam women are stereotyped as submissive, as not being “angry” or “oversenstive” and so are not seen as a threat to club.
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I do not see Angela Davis being part of the white club.
Obama is an honorary white but only by virtue of being president. Whites are kind of forced to see him as an honorary white – or as a usurper like the Birthers – to fit him in their racist picture of the world.
But I do agree that the whiter you look the easier it is to become an honorary member.
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Abagond, are there some people seen as being in the white club, but who aren’t actually, but for some reason people think they are?
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I’m sorry but after seeing Mack add a new twist to the weird race-aversionists “maybe we can f-ck our way out of this” fantasy, I can focus on the topic at all. What’s striking to me is how common this strange consequence-avoidance fantasy is.
I’ll never forget one of George Will’s commentaries that engaged in this kind of racial orgy = race problem solved logic. I guess that was the first time I saw spelled out as clearly as Mack has laid out his melting-pot f-ck fantasy here. Of course it didn’t help when I had a long term debate on race issues over numerous threads with a professed Reagan Democrat turned Republican engaged it this same kind of fantasy.
From those encounters/observations and a number of other times I’ve seen people engage in the race orgy fantasy, what I’ve come to realize is: these are people who want WHITE SUPREMACY to die of natural causes. After living as long a life as possible.
If that’s not the case then I’d suggest they come up with another faux solution to the ‘race problem’ or otherwise grow the hell up.
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^^^
Who are you people and why is your view of the world so skewed??
“Latinas” (again NOT A RACE) and other non-black women date and marry white men regularly. For many non-black ‘minorities’, a white mate is a “score”.
MEs (who can count as white BTW) and SAs don’t marry/date white as much as East Asian Americans because they “stick to their own”, mainly for religious issues.
It’s interesting how Aba and a lot of the like-minded posters on this blog don’t ever consider that the non-white women’s attitudes and cultural background may be the reason why they aren’t with a white man.
Black women vastly desire black men (almost solely) and SAs, non-white MEs, etc. “stick to their own” mainly for religious issues as I noted above.
Stop giving white men so much power.
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@38. I can relate!!!
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Hey Abagond,
I’ve haven’t been as keen to lurk and read your blog lately (more of an on-looker than commenter) because of life’s demands, and now that I have the chance to happily read again, I do have a few comments:
Your entries are increasingly on the subject of white people and race/racial politics (leaning towards white people and the concept of whiteness). I understand that it’s your blog and you do state that it’s “500 words a day whatever you want,” but I miss the older days when you had more posts concerning ranking beautiful women, discussing history, biographies, lyrics (the simpler, “cheer-up” entries). I even appreciated most of your racial topics because they were “black-oriented,” not tending to point out faults of others (they did sometimes, but reasonably so) but being introspective enough to warrant thought.
I don’t know if the above came out right, but my main point is this – racism of the most disturbing kind (denial of humanity, genocide, slavery) might as well be found in other race. You might call this a lame argument as per your other entries, but take this as a leveler of sorts among all of mankind – we are all the same, we have bad and good characteristics, we all, subconsiously, know this. Instead of focusing on this sort of topic (annoyingly racist white people), making entries that will encourage humanity to be better (instead of dividing us) will do a lot more. There is so much good news out there, even bad news that serves as positive fodder for thought.
Janet.
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Lavender says,
(Caps mine for emphasis)
Asian women are CONSIDERED WHITE ENOUGH BY WM because they have straight soft hair, pale skin and THEY DON’T LOOK BLACK.
Japanese women ARE CONSIDERED a part of the “superior aryan race,” THEY always say so on STORMFRONT whenever they talk about who is “white and aryan.”
And WP THINK ASIANS ARE SUPERIOR JUST LIKE THEY ARE, so of course for whites its a match made in heaven.
laromana says,
Lavender,
Thanks for pointing out these very critical facts about the PRO-AW/ANTI-BW dynamic that exists (has historically existed) in the minds of MOST American WM.
From day one, MOST American WM MADE A DECISION to “CONSIDER AW WHITE” and “ACCEPTABLE” for SERIOUS DATING/MARRIAGE, and these same American WM DECIDED that BW are “NOT ACCEPTABLE” for SERIOUS DATING and/or MARRIAGE because they are BLACK.
This is why I have always rejected suggestions made to BW that they “imitate” AW in how they pursue IRR’s with WM in America. Of course these suggestions ignore the FACT that there is/has always been a FUNDAMENTAL DIFFERENCE in the way MOST American WM view AW and BW that revolves around historical PRO-AW ACCEPTANCE vs. historical ANTI-BW RACISM/HATE.
Until MOST American WM RID themselves of historical ANTI-BW RACISM/HATE and DECIDE to view BW as “ACCEPTABLE” to SERIOUSLY DATE and/or MARRY as they do AW (and OTHER NON-BW), BW will continue to be treated in a RACIST/ANTI-BW manner.
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White people have constructed East Asians as being the “model minority” to divide and conquer other people of color.
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^^
Someone who can see the truth.
Anyone who thinks that whites see East Asians as being completely equal to them is delusional. They look down on them as much as any other non-white ethnicity. It’s just in a different way.
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@ mynameismyname:
Where I am from (Toronto), many whites freely express their disdain for East Indians so you’re are absolutely right. I have noticed ironically, that many of their children who are born and bred here, aspire to be in the white club. I had one such ‘friend’ years ago who fits the description:Accept White American culture as your guide to life. Practise it and do not question it. Your aim is to speak, dress and act like a middle-class White American with a good education. If you do not look white, this is a must . He was constantly bemoaning the fact that he wasn’t ‘white’, and had utter disdain for his skin colour.
He sought to distance himself from others of his group and was hypercritical of their customs and habits. Of course he always sided with whites in every thing. Do not make common cause with blacks or other people of colour. Most of his friends were white, in fact I was surprised he befriended me, but we both had a love of shopping and gossip I suppose. Have mostly white friends. As for marrying a white person, I don’t know nor would I be surprised if he did. So he fit quite aptly into most of the definitions above.
I severed the relationship after he called me a particularly obscene name over something trivial. I will say I could have went to jail that day if I had followed my immediate reaction. It was a relief as he was constantly harping on how great whites were and how his own group was lower than ‘dirt’. The friendship was equally bizarre in hindsight, as I was the exact opposite. However at the time, I was young and foolish. Since then I have met many East Indians with this mindset in passing. After him, the defense mechanisms came up. What’s funny, is that whites still express disdain for East Indians and many East Indians who aspire to the white club are oblivious to this fact. They think they are a part of it until whites set them straight when they veer from the ‘club’. This is something I have seen frequently as well.
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Let’s keep it real. If many of you non-White folks on this board could get into the White club, you would do so with a quickness.
Check out the title of this documentary.
http://www.beige-world.com/2009/07/documentary-im-biracial-not-black-damn-it.html
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@dani:
White people have constructed East Asians as being the “model minority” to divide and conquer other people of color.
And perhaps the sad part is, the East Asians I know fall too easily into this false mindset believing they’re equals. It’s another way to be put in your place.
mynameismyname Says:
^^
Someone who can see the truth.
Anyone who thinks that whites see East Asians as being completely equal to them is delusional. They look down on them as much as any other non-white ethnicity. It’s just in a different way.
Agreed. Among Asians, there is this hierarchy. East Asians are placed at the top of the ladder while Southeast Asians and South Asians are on the bottom rung. Those people of East Asian descent or any Asian ethnicity who have joined this club thinking they fit in is seriously misguided. No matter what…white people will never welcome you fully. Why on earth would you want to be a part of that?
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I believe tokenism is a bigger part than the “White club”. As a black male I don’t know how many “White clubs” I’ve been kicked out because I DON’T “Act black”. Here is a quick list:
I can’t play basketball
I don’t know gangsters or relatives who’ll provided protection for my white “Friends”.
I’m not over aggressive with women(White girl thug fantasy)
I can’t provided anwsers to “Black” questions.
I don’t someone who sells drugs or illegal items at discount rates.
I don’t act like a clown around groups of white people.
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@Patricia Kayden:
Let’s keep it real. If many of you non-White folks on this board could get into the White club, you would do so with a quickness.
Check out the title of this documentary.
http://www.beige-world.com/2009/07/documentary-im-biracial-not-black-damn-it.html
I saw early on the harm the white club can do. I’d rather keep my head up high, thank you.
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Yeah, Leigh, I also never had any desire to gain membership in ANY club. From high school cliques to college fraternies, if they wanted me, they knew my number. LOL.
ERE can come across outlandish in many of her comments. I’m not knocking her but she’s either someone who’s been badly stung by anti-black prejudice on a personal level or she’s trying to get a rise out of fellow readers and posters. Figuring which one is which can be ambigious.
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i just now realized this but my sister (she is biracial also) is apart of the white club or as much as she can be as mulatto.
she has yet to date (because white guys even i oregon are not attracted to black girls)
but she is a bonafide conservative christian republican. and i never realized this but the things that come out of her mouth you would assume she is racist white person. in fact my sister really doesn’t care about the plight of blacks or biracials she is too busy pandering to white conservatism…
she doesn’t realize that she is never going to be one of them.
its irritating because me and her are soooo different. in political beliefs and how to life itself…
no wonder i rarely talk to her….
but she is like the “native informant” and “house negro” combined….
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wow i need to seriously proofread before i press “submit”.
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@ alwaysright101
Are you saying that conservative equals racist and/or pandering to whites?
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@ alwaysright101
Does your sister look more “white” in her appearance? Just out of curiosity because many of the bi-racials from Black/White unions that look more White in appearance, tend to try to assimilate far more easier and with more tenacity.
@ leigh204
I knew a girl back in high school who I thought was really nice, but I figured out quick she had self-hatred issues. We had a discussion about diversity in my English class because our teacher was Puerto Rican and she wanted to share insight in her culture. So I asked this girl, who is Asian, “what is your ethnicity?” “Because I know she your Asian but I want to know what is your ethnic group within the Asian race”. She told me, “I’m not Asian, I’m white”. She said it with such disdain. It was clear she is Asian from her last name and from her parents because I’ve seen them before. Someone told me eventually that she is Hawaiian and Korean. I was totally caught off guard and gasp when she said that. It hurt me that she would deny her ethnicity like that. However, she desperately wanted to be apart of the “white club”. I can tell from some of the people she hang around.
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actually her skin tone is a little bit darker than mine. but her hair is more like a white person’s hair, if that matters in the “white club”.
my skin tone is about similar to my avatar pic, although it gets darker periodically throughout the day.
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Herneith said:
“Abagond, are there some people seen as being in the white club, but who aren’t actually, but for some reason people think they are?”
More commonly people think they themselves are in the white club but in fact are not. Like probably Always Right’s sister.
Two of my friends were like that too, both Asian. Back then they would not believe me about racism, they thought I was “whining”, but now I do not even have to complete my sentences. They learned the hard way.
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@dani:
@ leigh204
I knew a girl back in high school who I thought was really nice, but I figured out quick she had self-hatred issues. We had a discussion about diversity in my English class because our teacher was Puerto Rican and she wanted to share insight in her culture. So I asked this girl, who is Asian, “what is your ethnicity?” “Because I know she your Asian but I want to know what is your ethnic group within the Asian race”. She told me, “I’m not Asian, I’m white”. She said it with such disdain. It was clear she is Asian from her last name and from her parents because I’ve seen them before. Someone told me eventually that she is Hawaiian and Korean. I was totally caught off guard and gasp when she said that. It hurt me that she would deny her ethnicity like that. However, she desperately wanted to be apart of the “white club”. I can tell from some of the people she hang around.
I hear you. I had a friend just like this one back in my high school days. Although, she didn’t proclaim she was white, she acted as if she was all high and mighty because she hung around a group of white people. I told her we should hang around more because there was a low population of Asians in our high school and that we should stick together. She always made negative remarks about our other Asian friends…that they weren’t cool enough or fun to hang around with like white people. I was getting tired of calling her out on her attitude that we parted ways.
One time, I saw her dismiss herself to the girls’ washroom, and I overheard one of her white “friends” say, “Who does that [expletive] (insert racial slur for Chinese) think she is? Can’t she find someone of her own kind? Stupid (insert racial term for Asian)!” Apparently, my now ex-friend was seeing this white guy. And that the white girl was jealous of her. The white girl’s friends nodded their heads in agreement. I just shook my head. Nice friends, huh?
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@Abagond:
When they find out the hard way, it isn’t pretty! I have witnessed this time and time again! Some of them were devastated! One woman I know(a work acquaintance) wwent through a horrendous time, but seems to be inchinching her way back into the club. Some people never learn!
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whats annoying is that when they do learn the hard way they come crawling back to the very people they dissed and hated on for not being white expecting them to be there for them with wide open arms.
its kind of like the whole high school popularity scenario. you know like the movie Can’t Buy Me Love (im a sucker for teen and college movies).
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There’s an old saying; ‘Be careful who you step on to the way to the top as these are the same people you’ll meet on the way down”(paraphrase). I forgot where the phrase originated from. But alot of these folks don’t realize this.
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There appears to be a certain dichotomy when it comes to race-membership for people of color, in that either you are subsuming your ethnic background to be the token of the white people or you are authentic to your ethnic background and therefore a more complete person.
I’m unsure where I myself am in this category. For most of my childhood, I pretty much was in the “white club” throughout my schooling years because my attitudes for the most part were in line with white people anyway (in general, not like being racist or anything). My attempts to connect with other Asians Americans were pretty much rebuffed repeatedly due to the fact I was a carrier of the “white club” card.
Depending on how one may judge it, I was blessed or cursed with my parents raising me in the most neutral way possible. I do not share most characteristics of a 2nd Generation Asian American of growing up with lots of extended family surrounding me, or the mandatory mother tongue spoken at home, to name a few aspects that sets me apart as a child from other AAs.
Lately, I’ve been doing my best to understand more about Asians and attitudes in general, but for the most part most of the stuff goes over my head, and I feel more like a cultural safari hunter than someone reconnecting with a heritage. For the most part, I’ve been content with just being myself, whatever background that may be.
So, to read people almost unanimously agreeing that PoC who are members of the white club are all hiding from their heritage and being race traitors insults me greatly. It opens up those doubts about my identity that I’ve wrestled with a lot in recent years, and I feel like I’m being pushed into categories that I have no reason to be in. Do I think I am a race traitor? Am I a race traitor?
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leigh204 said:
One time, I saw her dismiss herself to the girls’ washroom, and I overheard one of her white “friends” say, “Who does that [expletive] (insert racial slur for Chinese) think she is? Can’t she find someone of her own kind? Stupid (insert racial term for Asian)!” Apparently, my now ex-friend was seeing this white guy. And that the white girl was jealous of her. The white girl’s friends nodded their heads in agreement. I just shook my head. Nice friends, huh?
*gasp* White girls hating? really? lol I’m just kidding. Wow that’s sad but that’s what she get for trying so hard and treating White people like gods.
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Some Kind of Asian:
You should read these posts:
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From the post growing up Asian American:
“Unlike blacks, however, some Asian Americans can fool themselves into thinking of themselves as honorary whites, as raceless in a sense – like Tiger Woods, in fact, who is half Asian. So it might not be till their late 20s that they go through all these stages.”
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Some Kind of Asian:
You are in something of a bind: your native culture – the so-called “neutral” White American culture – is racist. That gives you nothing to fall back on when you start to experience racism. You are forming your identity on something that will reject you.
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abagond:
Sir, you presume I have yet to experience overt racism. I am fully aware that the American culture is still by nature a white culture that brings with it the baggage of racism. It is likely futile to seek to identify such a culture. That is acceptable.
What I can’t accept now is the 4th step of “Growing Up as a ….” you referenced earlier because I don’t see how one can understand and fully acknowledge a heritage that is as geographically removed as East Asia from North America. You know the saying “you have to be there” as a way to chide someone for making presumptions without understanding the context? I have the same feeling with regards to ethnic pride, in that one can only fully understand if they actually live in that culture. Although it is also likely unfeasible to simply take an extended sabbatical to fully immerse into the homeland.
The usual outlet for the 2nd Gen AA to reconnect with their heritage is usually amongst themselves, and as I’ve said before, I’ve burned by my alleged “compatriots” multiple times before, so I cannot trust them to be sympathetic much as you tell me not to trust white people either.
Even in college, the 2nd Gen crowd have been pretty hostile in general, even if it isn’t directly towards me, but in their behavior. One instance, was a Chinese New Year celebration hosted by an Asian student association that apparently appeared to be open to everyone, but apparently was not. The entire affair was conducted in Mandarin (the language of my parents). Maybe this was for expatriate students, but looking around, I can sense that most of the crowd there were 2nd Generation.
The same sense of exclusion was also apparent when I took an advanced Chinese course. All the students were clearly 2nd Generation and none were speaking English even when class was not in session, so I was one of the quietest students unless called on to read anything. I am what some call receptively bilingual, which means I can understand most of what someone is saying but cannot reply in the same language, but in my native tongue only. I swear, I think I was the only one in the class to be that way. The 2nd Generation uses Asian identity as a list of prerequisites that allows people to be inside or not, and since I have not fulfilled the qualities, I was not admitted.
So, I really can’t count on the 2nd Generation to find the connection needed to open my understanding of my heritage. Lately, I have had better rapport with 1st Generation Americans and actual Asians, who, unlike the 2nd Gen, tend not to care if you’re “in” on their ideas or not. This probably ties in with the “Growing Up Nezua” article, 1st Gen and Asian Asians likely do see me as just “one of the guys” and are not phased if I speak English to them or ask a bunch of questions. In fact, they’ve been more than happy to share their thoughts with me.
With these people I believe I could find the avenue to fulfill “Step 4” in a way that doesn’t necessitate me to uproot myself because I am surrounded by many primary sources by virtue of how the United States works.
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Cool. Excellent and interesting comment.
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I am not a member and I will never be a member of the white club.I was friends with a White guy during my freshman year of college. He was a preppy guy, he lived in the suburbs all his life and he has tons of money from daddy to waste. I thought he really cared for me. He pretended that he was so liberal and open-minded and that he cared for me and accepted me for who I was. I was such a fool. White girls would get mad because we were together and asked him why did he choose to be with a Black Latina.
One day he wanted to have sex with me. I told him no. He got pissed and said a couple of racial things and he had hit me. He abandoned me and decided that I wasn’t good enough because I was “too ethnic”. I later found out that he was just using me as a bet between him and his friends to see who can actually have sex with a black girl. Apparently, these White lacrosse players made a list and I was on top of the list of Black girls at my school that they wanted to fuck. He’s been spreading rumors about me and him saying that he had sex with me.
I’m a member of the one blood love club. Accepting people of all races and backgrounds and different political views as my friends and confidants. I think it’s pathethic that POC would actually degraded themselves to just be acceptable by Whites.
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To put it plain and simple: It’s stupid.
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Miss Caribbean:
You might be interested in this post:
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Wow! I’ve read each post to date, however, what I find most interesting is not so much the racism between black and whites but the racism amongst people of the same race. The racism that I deal with everyday within my own race. As an African American dark skinned woman, I’ve had to deal with racism from other AAs. This post is about becoming a member of the “White Club.” I would like to see a post about becoming a member of the “Black Club” and I’m. black!
More frequent than not, in the media, internet images, advertisements, television shows and videos, the standard of what is deemed beautiful and desirable looks closer to white than not! Currently living in Phoenix, AZ with a 5% black population, about 65% of the couples I encounter are interracial couples. Usually a black man with a white woman. There are some black women with white men, but it’s not as prevalent. Is this a back door entrance into the “White Club” I wonder?
What is most disturbing to me is that black people (not all) perpetuate prejudices amongst themselves within their own race. It’s the light skinned people vs the darker skinned people. If you have smaller more European or Caucasian facial features and lighter skin you are more accepted and desirable within the black culture.
Being criticized, overlooked, treated unfairly because of the color my skin is a given in this country when it comes to whites as well as any other race whom feel they are superior to blacks. It is something that I have come to expect therefore never aspired to be one of the chosen few in the mythical “White Club.”
However, being shunned and ridiculed within my own race is something that has always been very difficult to accept
I know people say it’s the media that makes us hate ourselves and aspire to be white. But to me that’s inferring that black people are inherently impressionable and ignorant therefore lacking an independent thought process aside from what they are told or shown….. Really???
I find this post interesting, however I would like for someone to address the issue “closer to home” in terms of how one becomes a member of the Black Club? Racism is alive and well in this country but to be prejudiced against people of the same ethnicity is hypocritical and appalling in my book. Maybe we should start there and stop worrying being accepted by races other than our own.
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I have not done any post on the “black club”, but I have done one on colourism and also internalized racism where some of the black-on-black issues you talk about come up:
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“I am not a member and I will never be a member of the white club.I was friends with a White guy during my freshman year of college. He was a preppy guy, he lived in the suburbs all his life and he has tons of money from daddy to waste. I thought he really cared for me. He pretended that he was so liberal and open-minded and that he cared for me and accepted me for who I was. I was such a fool. White girls would get mad because we were together and asked him why did he choose to be with a Black Latina.
One day he wanted to have sex with me. I told him no. He got pissed and said a couple of racial things and he had hit me. He abandoned me and decided that I wasn’t good enough because I was “too ethnic”. I later found out that he was just using me as a bet between him and his friends to see who can actually have sex with a black girl. Apparently, these White lacrosse players made a list and I was on top of the list of Black girls at my school that they wanted to fuck. He’s been spreading rumors about me and him saying that he had sex with me.
I’m a member of the one blood love club. Accepting people of all races and backgrounds and different political views as my friends and confidants. I think it’s pathethic that POC would actually degraded themselves to just be acceptable by Whites.”
————————–
This is why I was always raised to stick with your own. I can associate and enjoy people from all cultures but when I date I stay black!
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Miss Carribbean I’m so sadden that that had happened to you. I hope that bastard gets what he deserves.
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Co-sign with dani. I’m very sorry that you had to go through this, Miss Caribbean. His cowardly actions were vile and totally unnaceptable. I’m a firm believer in karma and may he get what’s coming to him. Thank you for sharing your story. You are very brave, and so courageous. Best of luck to you, Miss Caribbean.
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@All the ladies who read and contribute to this blog (especially to the pretty ones)
Never date a White “Liberal” or a “Conservative.” Believe me these guys always have an hidden motives and can change just like that!
It may seem racist but believe me I’ve been around white liberals for a long time.
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You are an AMERICAN!! You must conform to the american way of life..bottom line.
The majority sets the standard.
If I was living in africa I would have no problem adapting to their culture to fit in..bottom line.
Oh and a White man can bring anyone he wants into this “mythical” club.
When I bring a black chick to a party or any social function..just let some other white dude say something ignorant…. He will be knocked the fuck out..bottom line.
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Great White Man Says:
If I was living in africa I would have no problem adapting to their culture to fit in..bottom line.
Somehow, I highly doubt it!
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Vindicator said:
@All the ladies who read and contribute to this blog (especially to the pretty ones)
Never date a White “Liberal” or a “Conservative.” Believe me these guys always have an hidden motives and can change just like that!
It may seem racist but believe me I’ve been around white liberals for a long time.
Merrimay:
Would you care to expand on that please, what have you been privy to that we haven’t already, pls do enlighten us, am very curious about your statement!
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Great White Man said:
‘If I was living in africa I would have no problem adapting to their culture to fit in..bottom line.’
Yeah right man, have you actually been to Africa and spoken to your fellow whites, see how they’re supposedly adopting to the culture? Since when do white people want to fit in with anyone?? And which countries would you be talking about?? I was born in South Africa, also know Botswana, and Namibia very well, all countries heavily colonized by Whites.And we alll know what that’s code for, assimilation it aint!
You’re off your tree!
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@ Great White Man:
I agree with MerriMay: in Africa whites have a very bad record of pushing their culture on others and sticking to their own kind rather than adapting to the African culture to fit in.
I am not saying that you personally would not adapt to fit in. But it is so rare that if you did you could probably write a book about it. So rare that when you say it it does not sound believable.
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@MerriMay
I used to be a liberal and hang with various lefties. I can say that they are some of the most passive aggressive people on the planet! Conservatives are little better!
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Vindicator,
You’re still not answering the question here , I too work with ‘liberals’ and live amongst ‘conservatives’ and your point is what exactly??
Perhaps your statement would have greater gravitas if you gave exmaples to support your profound statement.Of course I’ve observed the same, but am curious what a white/black(which are you?)guy may have some more insight as you’re warning us about some locker-room chat you boys may have had about us dusky ladies.
Do spill….
A former leftie huh? lol you couldn’t make it up.
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Great White Man Says:
If I was living in africa I would have no problem adapting to their culture to fit in..bottom line.
You mean like the Aparthheid in South Africa?
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When the Irish, Italians and Jews came to America they were not seen as white at first even though they pretty much looked it. Only when they showed themselves willing to carry out club duties were they admitted and were able to enjoy its privileges. Had they kept their culture, married blacks or made common cause with them, they would have stayed at the bottom and would be regarded much as Latinos are now.
Dunno about the Irish and Italians, but a word about the Jews. Almost no other ethnic or racial group in America — and certainly no other white sub-group — has shown more benevolence towards the blacks than the Jews.
And what is their reward? Blacks are the third most antisemitic ethnoracial group in America, after Muslims and foreign-born Hispanics. I have a theory about the reasons, but wouldn’t be averse to reading others’ opinions first.
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I look back growing up. I was cool with (just about) everyone. I did have a couple of white girls that berate me for no apparent reason. However, I was cool with the white boys…until the 8th grade.
When the 8th grade rolled around, it was like a “club” has been established especially after this one new student arrived who was a white male. This dude was a class clown, but was rude to women, non-blacks, and other white dudes who didn’t want to hang with him. He was especially rude towards me even though I never done anything to him. I was his personal punchline. What was really messed up was the white boys whom I was cool with followed him around forming a little clique and started being like him. What’s really sad, and I hate to admit this, but I wanted them to like me as well. Looking back, I had no idea why I wanted it.
By high school, he moved, but the damage was done. I never realized until I was older how screwed up it was. I thought it was just a teen thing to hang around people you’re familiar with, but there was much more to it as white kids hung around together and black kids did the same even before and after that kid came into the picture.
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“This dude was a class clown.”
That dude was alpha…or at least had alpha traits since it seems like he was their leader and had a lot of influence.
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Serpentus, he was a like the Pied Piper without the flute.
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If you look at the supremacist views of Koreans, Japanese, and the Han Chinese, it’s no wonder they fit more into the white club in America. If you introduced a few million blacks into any of these East Asian countries you’d see the same levels of segregation you see here–maybe even higher.
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cough,cough.clearing my throught from all this dust flying around.
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My sister is a member of this “White club” even though our father is Metis, and our mother is Mexican-american, she somehow got all the white genes they had between them, and came out pale skinned, green eyed, and brown haired. no one at school believed brown little me was her brother, and that was just how she liked it.
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[…] the black sellouts like CliffyT, Jesus wore FUBU and Michael Broadhurst cheering along with the white racists ignoring the fact that during World War blacks where lynched, jim […]
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The time as has come to counter the White Club with a brown club. I wonder if Michelle Malkin has yet heard that darked skinned Arabs enslaved Filipino’s as their Maids when they built Dubai. Not to mention Iran (another advanced Middle East country but gets racist economic sanctions by whites) is getting economic ties with Bolivia. (A Country that has been taken back by Native Americans recently also hated by the white club).
http://www.presstv.ir/detail/148527.html
http://indiancountrytodaymedianetwork.com/article/alekson-native-american-enterprises-promotes-energy-technologies-dubai-exhibition-146596
http://www.gmanetwork.com/news/story/276146/pinoyabroad/news/many-pinay-maids-in-dubai-still-getting-lower-than-minimum-wage-report
The Brown Club is just getting started.
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One if the biggest exploiter’s of the White Club on Youtube is ShimmyCoCoPuffs.
He sure follows the club rules listed at the top of this web page.
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I am back with another “Brown Club” footage (Middle East and Native American)
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I see this white club dynamic all the time here in Maryland in suburban Montgomery County. The DC area can be very segregated. Most of Prince Georges County bordering Northeast and Southeast DC is very black with many towns in PG county being 90%+ black. On the other side of the beltway in Montgomery County, towns like Bethesda, Chevy Chase, Kensington are 80%+ white and under 5% black.
But in Montgomery County, token minorities must adhere to the white club script or they are completely outcasted. The whitewashed minorities out here are rather insufferable. Only college educated “professional” minority men working in high paying status careers like finance are respected by the typical snobby pretentious preppy closet racist DC area white people. It’s so bad out here that even high income earning blacks rather live in nearly all-black affluent towns in PG County as opposed to living amongst soulless waspy racist white people in Montgomery County. Most of the black people in Montgomery County aren’t even the descendants of American slaves but African immigrants or their sons and daughters. Even many minorities in Montgomery County were adopted and raised by white families since infancy. I see the “professional” whitewashed black, Latino and Asian men lusting after basic looking white women. The whitewashed Asian and East Indian guys never get the white girl predictably and they watch the corniest white guys run through Asian women at whim and make stereotypical Asian jokes and they just take it in stride.
It’s funny that if a generic middle to upper class suburban white person can tell that you embrace nonwhite culture, particularly black urban culture, on any level, they completely change the way the speak to you. For example, if you are black, Latino, Asian or look like you might be mixed and you grew up in urban environment, these suburban white people might start talking to you in a faux “blaccent”, call you “brotha”, use outdated urban slang improperly and give you dap-hug handshakes every five minutes. It’s truly annoying. It reminds me of this:
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hmArsj0j4-0)
It’s truly odd and feels extremely condescending. It’s like these people feel the need to dumb themselves down to talk to minorities who aren’t whitewashed. The worst is when you are riding in a car with one of these said suburban white people and they turn the radio to the local Rap/R&B station when you know for a fact that they don’t like Rap music. I am not even a fan of current mainstream Rap music. I prefer good underground Rap music as mainstream Rap fell off sometime after Kanye went off the deep end and Jay-Z retired the first time over ten years ago with the exception of Kendrick Lamar. But I have never seen a POC talk to a white person in a faux country accent after learning that a white person was a huge Country music fan.
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I think the white club only applies to PC liberal whites living in major metro areas because rural whites, whites living in segregated ghetto all white ghetto areas (i.e. Hampden in Baltimore, areas in Buffalo, NY) and ethnic whites living in segregated ethnic enclaves (i.e. Italians in Bensonhurst in Brooklyn and Staten Island) are NEVER accepting of non-whites. One of my friends who is an ethnic Indian from Guyana got lost in North Carolina while stationed there in the military and had the cops stop him and say “we don’t like your kind around these parts”.
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To add to my last comment, there are no privileges from trying to assimilate with lower class to middle class rural whites, ghetto whites and ethnic whites. These whites do not yield social status and are not gatekeepers to good jobs and a better quality of life. This is probably the reason why all white stereotypes in America are disparaging to rednecks, “wiggers” and white trash. It’s as if minorities don’t want to throw stones at the snooty upper middle class white collar closet racist faux-liberal whites who make up what Abagond calls the white club.
The only perk I can see for assimilating with rural whites, ghetto whites and ethnic whites would be to mate with their women. The whole premise of Spike Lee’s Jungle Fever was a black man from Harlem having an affair with an Italian woman from Bensonhurst. Both friends and family of both characters were disgusted by their union.
But getting in with upper middle class and rich whites to “make it” and forgetting who you are as a POC is a common theme in our society. Ice Cube addressed the issue on “Be True to the Game” on 1991’s scathing Death Certificate album. The song addressed so-called Uncle Toms who moved out of the hood and married white women once becoming yuppies. Similarly, Los Angeles Rap collective Overdoz came out with a song recently called “Rich White Friends” which expressed a desire for these young black males from the hood to gain rich white friends for a better life of economic prosperity in the suburbs leaving the ghetto behind for good but stomaching all the racism from said whites at the same time.
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“Wanting to join the white club is A reason to speak correct English but it does not follow that it is the ONLY reason.
There are other reasons to speak Standard English: getting and holding a job; getting an education, geting good grades; because you were brought up that way by your BLACK parents; because you believe that that is the right way to speak. Or, as in the case of this blog, wanting to reach as many people as possible.
Nelson Mandela speaks correct English. Malcolm X spoke correct English. Did they do it because they wanted to be white? I think not.”
How about because it scares the sh*t out of white people to have someone from an ethnic group they dehumanize as stupid, Other, subhuman call them out on their ignorance and racism in perfect native-speaker normative accent college educated English? Someone who sees them for exactly what they are? I’ve done this to white people and it’s somewhat entertaining to see the ashamed and guilty expressions they get, unable to look me in the eye and staring off into space. It’s scary for them to have someone who could have easily joined the “white club” (except that my personality wasn’t right for it) turn out to be a “bad” person of color. I’ve done this to judges in court and the people of color watching (jail inmates forced to watch, Mexican American bailiffs) supported me. They didn’t give a damn about how I talk but about what I said.
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@SanFranpsycho415
I always refer to those people as “white liberal hypocrites” in my mind. I’ve known a lot of them, right now I’m living in a wealthy white flight suburb full of them. They want to think of themselves as good people but their lack of true integrity comes out quite easily. When you haven’t lived a disciplined life of consistently trying to live with integrity you’ll often choose to handle unfamiliar situations with people of color by immediately resorting to tactics of abuse and oppression.
These people don’t treat me “Black” like you mentioned but they definitely trot out all their “Latina” stereotypes on me: pronouncing my name the Spanish way instead of the English way, telling me the Spanish version of their name, having loud conversations with other white people in my presence about their Mexican or Latin American relatives who married in, insisting on showing me pictures of their brown half white nephews, constantly mentioning in my presence how they’re from a Latin American country (although they’re apparently WASPs who were just born there for colonial reasons), treating me like their unpaid Spanish tutor, being obviously disappointed whenever the reality of who I am doesn’t match up with their fantasy of who they wanted me to be.
I get that white people (especially middle aged white women) really want me to be their friend so that they can have one person of color friend and tell themselves and others that they’re not racist, but have they ever thought that the same isn’t true for me? That if a person of color has too much integrity to choose their friends for personal gain, they’ll probably prefer friends of color who understand that racism exists and tend to say less offensive things and dehumanize me less?
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“Confessions of a #FormerBlackFriend: An attempt at accountability…”
View at Medium.com
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I thought I had included the link for the article above? Here it is:
View at Medium.com
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Ok it doesn’t show up.
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I’d like to add that in order to get in good with whites as a token person of color, you’d better play up to stereotypes to benefit white people to gain respect. People of color are expected to be stereotypical representatives of their race for white people. For example, a big 6’4″ 250 pound token black male friend is often expected to act as a bouncer for a group of drunk average sized white folks at a club, party or concert. I’ve seen this play out so many times in real life. That big black man is expected to drop everything and fight if said drunken white people start a fight they can’t win or the white girls they are with are being harassed by a drunk “creepy” guy. Nevermind that assault often carries the same legal penalties as murder in many jurisdictions (especially areas where white people feel comfortable residing) and the American legal system isn’t exactly easy on black men. He is expected to be the comic relief making them laugh as hard as Dave Chappelle or Chris Rock. He is expected to be first pick in Sunday basketball games and help the otherwise all white team win and be able to do gravity defying Michael Jordan dunks. A token black male friend is expected to be streetwise, be able to decipher Rap and Reggae lyrics for white people and put them up on the latest street slang as well as having an impressive collection of the latest $300 basketball shoes in near mint condition at all times. He is expected to know where to get drugs, namely weed and cocaine, at a moment’s notice when said white people have no connections because they are out of their element. He is expected to be the ghetto pass allowing suburban-bred whites to walk through majority black city neighborhoods without being harmed.
The problem with all of this is that these beliefs are all rooted in stereotypes. A black person who hangs around mostly white people is likely not to possess any of these attributes. But the truth is that white people only want to hang around people of color if it benefits them in some way. White people view all minorities as having uniform traits, so as a token you better deliver.
It is similar with the token black female friend. The token black female friend is expected to throw a loud intimidating fit when hospitality treats the otherwise all white group badly at a restaurant, bar or club. The token black female friend is expected to teach white girls the latest dance and how to “twerk” correctly. The token black friend ultimately proves that a whole group of white people aren’t racist.
http://madamenoire.com/252831/10-signs-youre-the-token-not-actually-a-part-of-the-team/
It works the same way for any non-white token. I remember when I was in college, I studied graphic design. Nearly everyone in my classes was white. After classes some days, we would head to the local bar on campus. I was hanging out with them because they were classmates and would never hang out with them outside of school because of all the blatant microagressions. They all hailed from the very upper middle class nearly all white areas in Montgomery County, MD from towns like Chevy Chase, Kensington and Bethesda. I remember one day at the bar, one of my white male classmates seriously said “you should hook us up with some Asian girls” just because I’m half-Asian. I had no idea what to say to him. It was like saying that I owed them something for spending any free time with me as a non-white person.
On another occasion, an attractive white girl at the bar who was an ex-Ravens cheerleader was talking to our group. She was clearly interested in me the most out of the bunch of otherwise all white guys, but a white male classmate chimed in that I was “half-Asian” out of nowhere as if that would ruin my chances of getting her number. I wasn’t even interested in her anyway and she didn’t care.
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Thoughts?
“[UPDATEDx2 w/response videos] “Redneck’s” viral video calls for “white racial responsibility” videos”
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/04/10/1376881/–Redneck-s-viral-video-calls-for-other-whites-to-post-their-own-white-racial-responsility-videos?detail=email#
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@ Speak Out
To be honest, I keep waiting for the other foot to drop on this one. He looks like a redneck, and he sounds like we think that a redneck would sound. Yet he has managed to inexplicably escape the gravity of his own pervasive worldview and settled instead upon the standard anti-racist narrative. Hmmm…can such things really happen? Maybe, but they are so rare (and so easy to believe in) that I hesitate to accept it at face value. I hope I’m being overly cautious.
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@Speak Out,
Wow, a redneck Tim Wise!
Indeed, I think he is just trying to be an internet sensation, acting out of character. But if he really believes in what he is saying, he could become a sensation for real.
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^ or become dead.
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@ King
“settled instead upon the standard anti-racist narrative”
That is what makes me to not believe that video most. A racist that realizes his racism, sure, that might happen. But than he uses the specific languague used by anti-racist theory? He sounds like he is reading a student’s committees press release.
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“For example, a big 6’4″ 250 pound token black male friend is often expected to act as a bouncer for a group of drunk average sized white folks at a club, party or concert. I’ve seen this play out so many times in real life. That big black man is expected to drop everything and fight if said drunken white people start a fight they can’t win or the white girls they are with are being harassed by a drunk “creepy” guy.”
>>>>>>>>>
@SanFran
Excellent points throughout your post..
This (in my experience) is very true! Large Black male friends are expected to protect and ward off any and all physical threats against white people.
It’s disgusting, and part of the reasons (you’ve aptly illustrated) I put space between myself and white people!
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@ Kartoffel
That’s exactly it… It’s just too neat!
It’s as if some womanizing frat boy suddenly starting pontificating about the “Three Waves” of Feminism, and started quoting suffragette pamphlets from the turn of last century. Would anyone believe him? Not without some serious explanation.
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Of course it could be that after his realization he read up on racism for an extended period of time. Than he probably would have adopted the language used there at some point, especially if he was discussing the matter online. But that would hardly be a rednack who just came to his racial epiphany. And that is what the video implies.
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Yeah but its a small minority of people who even know where to go to access the kind of information he’s parroting. We take it for granted because we’ve been digging in that world for years. It still may be genuine. But I keep wondering if the clip is really of a Cal State Berkeley Theater Arts major.
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