This is partly in answer to Macon D’s post on Stuff White People Do: “fail to see how racism harms white people”. Here is my take:
Racism both helps and hurts white Americans. I cannot prove all of the following statements with studies, charts and figures, but this is the truth as best I know it:
How it helps:
- They are way richer than they would have been:
- They live on land taken from the American Indians.
- They benefit directly or indirectly from the free labour of black slaves and, later, from the cheap labour of blacks and other people of colour.
- They get paid more for a given level of education.
- Lower unemployment: they are less likely to fired and more likely to be hired – even with a prison record.
- They get to live in nicer, safer neighbourhoods with better schools.
- They live longer: even poor whites live longer than middle-class blacks.
- It helps to keep them from falling to the very bottom of society.
How it hurts:
- They become morally blind. Since they do not see the evil they do they are surprised by 9/11, race riots, failures in foreign policy, poverty at home, etc.
- They harden their hearts.
- They become partly deluded: they believe lies – about themselves, their history, their society. They do not take the truth seriously when it comes from a person of colour.
- They have a limited idea of what it means to be human. At root, racism is the idea that being “different” means there is something wrong with you. That means many whites hide or slowly kill their true selves in order to fit in, making them into plastic people.
- They become small-minded:
- Because they feel good about themselves by looking down on others.
- Because they narrow their minds by not taking other people and their cultures seriously.
- They are not true to themselves and their belief that all men are created equal – and so they live with guilt.
- Crime is higher than in other rich countries – and so they live with fear.
- By hurting people of colour they are hurting their own country. At the very least they are wasting a part of its human capital.
- Many whites vote against their class interests in part because of race.
That is what comes to me off the top of my head. I might be forgetting some big ones. Commenters can kindly point them out.
In short, whites are not true to themselves – to their morals, their beliefs, their heart, their soul. They are sell-outs to an idea that is beneath them.
If I still have any white readers left I know they will strongly disagree. Perhaps they will think I hate them, that I am trying to put them down. Wrong: I am trying to be honest.
Whites signed up for racism to create America and they continue to hold on to racism to hold on to its advantages. They made a deal with the devil and we know how that ends.
See also:
- Stuff White People Do: fail to see how racism harms white people
- Restructure!: How does racism hurt white people? – Restructure’s answer to the same post
- white people
- white privilege – more on how racism helps
- white guilt – a way racism hurts
- How to argue like a white racist – some of the twisted thinking required to be a white racist
- bell hooks on loving blackness – talks a bit about racism hurting whites
- how to end racism – stuff anyone can do
reading that, it looks like the benefits greatly outweigh the disadvantages, and that is why whites will not change. because they benefit physically. the disadvantages for the most part are all within one’s heart and soul…there are plenty of people out there who are willing to throw someone under a bus if they could get some kind of material value for it. in a majority society one gets afforded the ability to not have to care about other people and their plights. their response is “who needs them anyways?”.
of course the 9/11 one sticks out the most to me, its because of their behavior that events like 9/11 will continue to happen…but what annoys me most is that America is okay plummeting this country into economic turmoil fighting Middle easterners because of terrorism, but this country will not do anything about its domestic terrorism that comes from the KKK and neo nazi and other white supremacist groups…it seems like whites are less willing to fight a terrorist group if it consists of their own…simply because they probably benefit from the likes of them.
The kkk and other white supremist ‘fringe’ groups, provide comfort to most white people in that they can be used as a comparison to their own racism. These are extreme proponents of white supremacy. The normal white person uses this as a barometer as to their own racism. Of course most white don’t suscribe to kkk or neo-nazi babblings, this is why they are invaluable!
In their mind they are nothing like these ‘fringe lunatics’. It makes them feel good about themselves since they are not so extreme. However, and more dangerously, they are oblivious to institutional and social racism and it’s deleterious effects on racialized people.
I prefer the blatant racist as I don’t have to waste my precious time and energy finding this out down the road. I also prefer the white person who acknowledges their biases and racism and works to rid themselves of their views.
Thank you for fleshing this out, abagond. I’m a white reader who does not “strongly disagree.”
Herneith wrote,
I prefer the blatant racist as I don’t have to waste my precious time and energy finding this out down the road.
Yes, the blatant racists are easier for me too, that way at least. “Beware the moderates,” as I think MLK said (or rather wrote, in a certain famous letter).
I also like the point you make about a certain mode of relational white identity formation.
“‘Racism’? That’s THOSE people, over there!” (or rather, in many cases, “down south”)
of course the 9/11 one sticks out the most to me, its because of their behavior that events like 9/11 will continue to happen…but what annoys me most is that America is okay plummeting this country into economic turmoil fighting Middle easterners because of terrorism, but this country will not do anything about its domestic terrorism that comes from the KKK and neo nazi and other white supremacist groups…it seems like whites are less willing to fight a terrorist group if it consists of their own…simply because they probably benefit from the likes of them.”
Exactly, I was just talking about those fools.
All the delusional whites keep saying that racism is over!
IF I was mentally ill i would believe that.
If racism was over then the ADL, Hatewatch.org and the SPLC would not have to monitor the thousands of white supremacist groups that keep white hatred alive!
The KKK has a current website with members they have never changed they are just sociopaths waiting to attack from the shadows.
Good post – although I do believe that you are being a little too hard on Whites.
Yes, there are White racists, but what percentage of Whites do you really believe are racist?
If Whites were as racist as some of us Blacks believe, would we be around? Why didn’t they kill us off during colonialism or slavery or Jim Crow? Why are we still not in slavery? Why no more Jim Crow?
My question may be stupid, but considering the fact that there are some minorities who are no longer on the face of the earth (Tasmanian aboriginals, Arawaks, etc.), I just wonder if we don’t exaggerate the wickedness of Whites to cover some of our own failings.
Perhaps you could do a post on what Whites have done right – and yes, they must be doing something right or they would not dominate the world as they do.
Personally, I believe that there are lessons to be learned from Whites, from Blacks, from Asians, etc. We all have plusses and minuses in our backgrounds. White people are more powerful than others, but they are not any more evil than others.
As I come from a Black country, I know that Blacks can be as wicked as anyone else to their own kind. Ask Rwandans about this.
Just my 2 cents.
“If Whites were as racist as some of us Blacks believe, would we be around? Why didn’t they kill us off during colonialism or slavery or Jim Crow? Why are we still not in slavery? Why no more Jim Crow?
My question may be stupid…I just wonder if we don’t exaggerate the wickedness of Whites to cover some of our own failings.”
Actually you raise a good question in my opinion. A question that is nicely answered in an excellent sci-fi short story called, The Space Traders. It’s a free REVEALING read you can find on the web via a search engine. It was written by Derrick Bell, a university law professor who happens to be Black.
Candace:
1. Most racists are not genocidal skinheads. Very few are. These days in America most do not even seem to hate blacks – they just look down on them. Whites have made “racism” into this extreme thing so that they do not have to call what they do “racism” – as pointed out above on this very thread by Herneith!
2. I think 95% of whites are racist, but I could work with a figure of 60%. It is well over half in any case.
3. As a policy I mostly do not write good things about whites and bad things about blacks – American culture is already doing that coast-to-coast, 24/7.
“3. As a policy I mostly do not write good things about whites and bad things about blacks – American culture is already doing that coast-to-coast, 24/7.”
Thank you abagond, that’s called the everyday news and “statistics.”
Always showing blacks in a negative light and making whites look like angels on the news and every “statistic” there is.
You can tell where that comment is coming from, only a white person would expect you to show whites in a positive light while they always show non-whites in a bad light deliberately.
@macon:
(or rather, in many cases, “down south”)
Ironically I find most Southerners easier to get along with at least on the surface. Perhaps they think due to my accent I am not like other ‘blacks’(I’m Canadian). They appear for the most part to be pleasant inquisitive(sic) and polite. Since I am interacting with them on a superficial level, I have to wonder why this is. It would be interesting if their outlook would change upon closer acquaintance.
Herneith, I’ve gathered that a lot of white Southerners are more accustomed to interacting with POC — and that whites in the North tend to be more racially segregated.
Which is not to say that I think racism is any more or less severe in either The South (whatever that still is) or The North (whatever that still is).
On a very simplistic level for a few reasons but the most important one is because:
We, black people did not passively sit by and let them exterminate or eliminate us all
It is a shame that history our own proud history of resistance haas been soo supressed.
Secondly, We are too numerous and it they needed workers. if you eliminate all the people you don’t like, then who does your dirty work.
It’s much better to eliminate their pride, sense of self-worth, economic abilities, aspirations, e.t.c. Own the mind and you own the body completely and that body will do anything you tell it to do and believe anything you tell it, because you control the mind.
I don’t have much time today or I would have said a lot more.
Candace Says:
Mon 2 Nov 2009 at 23:37:34
Good post – although I do believe that you are being a little too hard on Whites.
Yes, there are White racists, but what percentage of Whites do you really believe are racist?
If Whites were as racist as some of us Blacks believe, would we be around? Why didn’t they kill us off during colonialism or slavery or Jim Crow? Why are we still not in slavery? Why no more Jim Crow?
ErzulieRedEyes Says:
“You can tell where that comment is coming from, only a white person would expect you to show whites in a positive light while they always show non-whites in a bad light deliberately.”
I AM NOT WHITE. I AM AS BLACK AS YOU AND ABAGOND.
@Abagond, I wasn’t saying that you should praise Whites and down Blacks. I was just saying that some of your posts could be a bit more positive by pointing out the good in all peoples.
There must be a way to highlight racists without demonizing all Whites.
Don’t you live among or work with Whites? I do (they’re also at my church). Cannot say that 60% are racist. I don’t understand why you believe that so many Whites look down on you because you are Black. Things are not so bleak!
Lighten up.
Candace said:
@Abagond, I wasn’t saying that you should praise Whites and down Blacks. I was just saying that some of your posts could be a bit more positive by pointing out the good in all peoples.
There must be a way to highlight racists without demonizing all Whites.
Don’t you live among or work with Whites? I do (they’re also at my church). Cannot say that 60% are racist. I don’t understand why you believe that so many Whites look down on you because you are Black. Things are not so bleak!
Lighten up.
You totally missed the point of this post. I don’t think he dislikes White people at all nor do I think he is being harsh on them. I think he strongly dislikes many of the attitudes that White people carry. There’s a difference on hating the person and hating the attitude. He lightens up on them even the ones who post the most vile shit about Black people on here lol. I’m sorry but I’m going to have to disagree with you though. Most White people are. Even the nicest White people I’ve met were very nice but were very ignorant on race relations because of them being blind to their priveledge. I hated their attitudes towards race, but liked them for many other things we shared in common. I don’t think Abagond hates White people so much that he can work with them, because I mean we can’t escape White people even if we tried. We are called minorites for a reason lol. He just disgut the evil racial social construct that plagues our society and its hard not to avoid White people in this discussion.
So he must be untrue to himself because it might be too heavy for some people? Come on. In his blog, he presents facts and also his experiences and deep, honest thoughts. Personally, I’m glad he doesn’t candy coat things.
Candace Says:
Wed 4 Nov 2009 at 01:26:58
ErzulieRedEyes Says:
“You can tell where that comment is coming from, only a white person would expect you to show whites in a positive light while they always show non-whites in a bad light deliberately.”
I AM NOT WHITE. I AM AS BLACK AS YOU AND ABAGOND.
@Abagond, I wasn’t saying that you should praise Whites and down Blacks. I was just saying that some of your posts could be a bit more positive by pointing out the good in all peoples.
There must be a way to highlight racists without demonizing all Whites.
Don’t you live among or work with Whites? I do (they’re also at my church). Cannot say that 60% are racist. I don’t understand why you believe that so many Whites look down on you because you are Black. Things are not so bleak!
Lighten up.”
And I ain’t stupid or gullible, I can see what you are saying.
Go to the white supremacists websites and see what they are talking about constamtly, you will see how nasty they are.
Abagond posts the truth that’s why the bigots don’t like his blog, cause he ain’t buttering up whites.
lol @Candace Says: I AM NOT WHITE. I AM AS BLACK AS YOU AND ABAGOND.
Since when did Abagond turn black? Did I miss something? LOL
“As a policy I mostly do not write good things about whites and bad things about blacks – American culture is already doing that coast-to-coast, 24/7.” You say you hate whites because they stereotype blacks, but don’t you and most of your bloggers do the same about whites on a daily basis.
It’s funny that you hate whites, while you’re using more white inventions (Computer, blogging) to put them down.
Gen, whaT FACTS does abagond display? You like because you’re a bigot just like him.
OMG . Here we go again with the shifting focus of the topic to talk about all the “white inventions” again….If it weren’t for whites inventing this that or the other thing you never would have been able to do this that or the other thing….
“sigh”
Hey Dani, explain to me the evil racial social construct that plagues our society? You don’t like white people’s opinions on race because they don’t coincide with your opinions.
What affirmative action? [editor: long off-topic comment that I deleted brought up affirmative action]
What are yuou guys talking about?
I have NEVER been just automatically given a job just because i am black.
I have always been ignored as a potential employee because i am black though.
Example, I attended the Culinary Training Center here in Vegas.
We had mostly latinos and asians and then 3 black people in our class.
The day we finished the class completely, the latino workers were sent to work at several strip casinos.
While me and the other 2 black students had to go to another classroom to apply for jobs at the casinos.
I applied at the Luxor and a MONTH later I was hired, while the latino students with the same training that we got were already working.
Where is the affirmative action?
Jack Says:
Thu 5 Nov 2009 at 22:42:07
Gen, whaT FACTS does abagond display? You like because you’re a bigot just like him.”
You must be a joke.
The only bigots i see are you white people with the THOUSANDS of hate groups you have all over the USA that the ADL, SPLC, have to monitor constantly.
Lol just ignore them. The “victimized overlord” bit they pull is just so old. You can’t argue with people who love the smell of their own flatulence.
LOL . smell of their own flatulence. Nice one Gen
@Gen:
Eww. Yet it’s hilarious! And true!! lol!
Antonella:
Your long comment on “hate facts” showed no sign of having read the post or any of the comments. It was not even on-topic, so I deleted it.
‘Abagond posts the truth that’s why the bigots don’t like his blog, cause he ain’t buttering up whites.’
I hope he keeps doing this.
‘You can’t argue with people who love the smell of their own flatulence.’
‘
Yes it’s like farting in a windstorm!
Herneith Says:
Fri 6 Nov 2009 at 14:35:54
‘Abagond posts the truth that’s why the bigots don’t like his blog, cause he ain’t buttering up whites.’
I hope he keeps doing this.
‘You can’t argue with people who love the smell of their own flatulence.’
‘
Yes it’s like farting in a windstorm!”
Well, as you can see most whites expect you to treat them like they are gods to be worshipped.
But no amount of delusional force is going to make somebody with sense kiss the white people’s behinds.
They can call themselves “white” “superior” or whatever they want, cause they ain’t nothing but dust and can’t change that.
It’s funny that you hate whites, while you’re using more white inventions (Computer, blogging) to put them down.
What’s that got to do with the topic at hand? Did you invent the computer? No. So why make such a statement? It seems to me that those who subscribe to white supremacy always bring up inventions for which you had no hand in! You and your ilk do this to divert attention to topics being discussed. Are you taking credit for these inventions? I suppose you have also accrued credit for the myriad other inventions, like Einsteins theories?
Gen, whaT FACTS does abagond display? You like because you’re a bigot just like him.
Yes everyone who questions white supremacy in all its’ complexities is a bigot. If so I am proud to be a ‘bigot’ and make no bones about it!
Hey Dani, explain to me the evil racial social construct that plagues our society? You don’t like white people’s opinions on race because they don’t coincide with your opinions.
No, she doesn’t like white supremacists opinions period. She has a right to voice her opinions without being denigrated by the likes of you.
But no amount of delusional force is going to make somebody with sense kiss the white people’s behinds.
Yes Erzulie, unless one is a kerchief head kissing their behinds and being ‘good culluds’, they are uppity and must be put in their place. They must be reminded of who the ‘master’ is.
Jack, go fart in a windstorm, your opinions will be more viable in that setting.
Right: inventions have nothing to do with this post. It is a cheap diversion.
Don’t you live among or work with Whites? I do (they’re also at my church). Cannot say that 60% are racist. I don’t understand why you believe that so many Whites look down on you because you are Black. Things are not so bleak!
I work in a predominately white environment and, based upon my experiences, would hazard a guess and say that 90% of the whites harbour some racist animus towards racialized peoples. Is it overt such as blatant name calling? No. It is much more insidious and therefore more dangerous. More dangerous for the racialized person who does not recognize the insidiousness of this racism. I’ve seen the fallout from this on numerous occasions when they do. It is nice to go through life with blinkers on, but do so at your own peril. One must be conscious of and recognize the subtle behaviours and phrases employed by many whites in order to recognize racism when it occurs. I think that many racialized people are not cognizant in this regards.
There must be a way to highlight racists without demonizing all Whites.
Abagond is just pointing out modes of behaviour that racialized people should be aware of. On a level playing field this would be applicable. However, this isn’t the case. Abagond is also writing from a black perspective not a white one. Elucidating these many behaviours is invaluable for many of his readers. It provides them with validation in that modes of speech and behaviour they may have experienced from whites, is not in their ‘heads’. Abagond puts a name to many of these subtle racist behaviours. I am grateful he does so without fear of alienating readers. In short, he is only putting on paper common themes that other racialized people have experienced at one time or another in their lives.
As for racism hurting whites, the pros outweigh the cons for them to recognize and give it up currently. When it is no longer profitable, they may do so.
Right: inventions have nothing to do with this post. It is a cheap diversion.
What I take umbrage to is the fact that they appear to take credit for something they had no hand in but are benefiting from like everyone else is. Individuals invent, not groups. If he wasn’t using this example, he would be throwing in some other cockamamie argument which has nothing to do with the topic at hand. This is highly insulting to say the least, especially to the inventors themselves. To impute a few inventor’s achievements to a group based upon race, makes for a bogus argument.
I did a post on the white inventor argument, so those who want to comment on it can go here:
http://abagond.wordpress.com/2009/11/06/the-white-inventor-argument/
I must mention I see the blond-haired, pointy-nose, fair-skinned plastic head of the white chic at the top of this blog page a stereotypical image(An image that is idealized in the media to the detriment of too many girls/women). I assume it is meant to symbolize a sort of ‘June Cleaver’ version of whiteness: the aryan-esque woman cloistered in a stepfordish atmosphere.I think it goes hand in hand with some of the generlizations about ‘white’ people I have thus far read here. I’m white. But I betcha dollars to doughnuts I got ‘kinkier’ hair than some blacks on here (in other words I am no ‘typical’ white gal).what I’m trying to point out with my hair is that generlizations are always wrong. I experiance discrimination on a nearly daily basis because of a disablity I have. I’ve been denied job oppurtunities, shut out of groups, etc by those of all races, creeds, and socioeconomic status’.trust me, I don’t get preferential treatment unless somebody’s feeling sorry for me (which I can’t stand). What I got from the blog and comments is a feeling that ya’ll think all whites have benfited from racism and we are all evil and inherently blind to this fact. I just feel that those generlizations are counterproductive to any change in the status-quo. I understand that TV and such is white-centered, but by operating in the same manner you are in fact guilty of the same thing. Perhaps you see this as a case of “what’s good for the goose is good for the gander,” but to whites it seems hypocritical and therefore nothing to be taken seriously. BUT if this blog is only here “to preach to the choir,” and not influence whites in the least- then by all means take no regard to what I have written.
I must mention I see the blond-haired, pointy-nose, fair-skinned plastic head of the white chic at the top of this blog page a stereotypical image(An image that is idealized in the media to the detriment of too many girls/women). I assume it is meant to symbolize a sort of ‘June Cleaver’ version of whiteness: the aryan-esque woman cloistered in a stepfordish atmosphere
The impression I got was that the picture was put there in a tongue and cheek manner, not to denote any negative stereotypes of white women. What about the white male doll, what’s your take on him? What I would ask, should my impressions prove to be wrong as to why this picture was chosen is; Who created these stereotypes you mention because it wasn’t black or other racialized people that’s for sure. Perhaps you should be critiquing the originators and perpetrators of these stereotypes you mention.
I’m white. But I betcha dollars to doughnuts I got ‘kinkier’ hair than some blacks on here
Maybe you have some black blood coursing through your veins but are unaware of this. Maybe one or both parents lied to you about your antecedents.
I understand that TV and such is white-centered, but by operating in the same manner you are in fact guilty of the same thing.
What thing?
Perhaps you see this as a case of “what’s good for the goose is good for the gander,” but to whites it seems hypocritical and therefore nothing to be taken seriously.
Most white don’t take racism seriously if the finger is pointing at them anyway.
BUT if this blog is only here “to preach to the choir,” and not influence whites in the least- then by all means take no regard to what I have written
This blog is not written to ‘influence’ whites or anyone for that matter. Rather, it is the writings of one man’s views on a wide variety of issues and topics. As with most things one can agree or disagree with what is written, comment or not comment. As for ‘preaching to the choir, as previously iterated, people can choose to read, comment or not. If many happen to have similar views, what of it? What is baffling, is your take on this blog as one whose sole purpose is to ‘influence’ the thinking processes of whites or anyone else for that matter.
Marian:
Thank you for your feedback. I do not have a live audience, so it is only through comments that I can tell if I am hitting the mark – or not.
About the white woman pictured at the top:
The man and woman are heads from Old Navy mannequins – almost certainly created by white people, like Herneith pointed out. I chose them because one of the points made in the post was that racism has limited the humanity of white people.
I did not choose the woman because she has blonde hair and blue eyes – that is Old Navy’s doing. On my main post about white people the woman is black-haired and brown-eyed:
http://abagond.wordpress.com/2008/07/05/white-people/
About influencing white people:
As a writer my duty is to present the truth as clearly as I can. More on my model of writing here:
http://abagond.wordpress.com/2008/05/21/classic-prose-style/
If white people like what I write, great. If they do not, I am not going to lose sleep over it.
Marian:
The only people in this thread who have used the phrase “all whites” are you and Candace. It is a straw man argument.
The post is about how racism affects whites. It never said that all whites are racist. If I wrote a post “How drugs affect teens” would that mean I think all teens are doing drugs?
I think white people don’t realize this. They don’t see that racism hurts them, so they can’t do anything about it. Many think racism doesn’t even exist anymore. Others think it’s not such a big deal, perhaps.
The point is: racism doesn’t affect them and their group, so most of them are not trying to do anything to stop it.