I love thick black women. They are beautiful. They turn me on. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that. Nothing. It is the way God or Evolution or whatever made me as a man.
That is all there is to it.
I am only saying what I prefer in women. I am not setting myself up as a judge of all women. I simply do not have that kind of power. I am not even Hugh Hefner or Anna Wintour, who do have some power over what we see as beautiful in women.
All I have is my little blog. When you hear my name on television then you can start to complain. But you never will because my ideas about beauty are too black.
I cannot like all women equally. So no matter what I say some women will be upset. Mostly it has been thin black women, but this week fat women and even one white woman have shown up here.
But that is why I am not the only man on earth. I was made to love one kind of woman. Other men were made to love other kinds.
No matter what you look like there will be a man who likes you just the way you are. Women are way harder on themselves and how they look than men are.
Female beauty makes the world go round. If women were not beautiful we would not be here. It is a part of life.
In my experience, for a man to go after a woman, marry her and stay with her he has to be turned on by her, he has to love how she looks, he has to be kind of out of his mind about her. Is he making her into an object, just a piece of meat? Not in this case. It is how men fall in love. It is part of boy meets girl.
I did marry a thick black woman. She is fat now. Do I still love her? Of course. Does she still turn me on? Most certainly.
You know, I could just shut up and let Maybelline, Vogue, Hollywood and all the rest fill your mind with their white stick women. But I thought maybe the honest opinion of at least one man who has no money in this fight would be helpful. If only to let you know that not all men go for Hollywood beauty. That the world is broader and better than that.
All my life I have been told by the Hugh Hefners and Anna Wintours of the world that thin white women are the height of beauty. I am sick of it. They are not beautiful to me. In fact they are kind of ugly, most of them. To me black women are far more beautiful. So I am not going to be silent.
See also:
- Hey You Fatty – the post at Feministe that this is in answer to
- thick black women – my post that Feministe did not read very carefully and quoted bits of. They even got my name wrong: Qviloa.
- The Feministe reading of this blog - how Feministe misunderstood the post “thick black women”.
- white beauty: a brief history
- Black women are beautiful
I am the author of that little piece. It was written from womanist musings and cross posted at feministe. I apologise for incorrectly naming your blog but that is about all I got wrong.
As if women actually give a shit and live their lives according to what a whiny cheeto eating blogger living in mom’s basement who probably only has had sex with his left hand for five years finds attractive.
Speak truth to power, Abagond! Stick it to them! These organizations have no idea of what Black beauty really is like.
Steph
Dang, unmarrieddaughter! Hostile. Apparently you DO give a shit what Abadong finds attractive, otherwise you wouldn’t have commented.
I’m a skinny black woman, and I take no offense to Abagond’s posts. This is what he likes, and in my opinion the reasons why are both interesting and insightful.
Basement? Never had one myself, but I love Cheetos. I used to heat them up in the Microwave, until I found out how many grams of fat were in each serving. Then I found out they made baked Cheetos. Wait. What was this post about?
Ah Race, the quest for a definition. What is beauty?
-Stal
The reason I objected to your previous post (I assume I’m the “one white woman” you’re talking about) is that I misinterpreted your comments about white women having soulless eyes. I didn’t pick up on the diference between saying that someone LOOKS soulless and saying that someone geninely has no soul and is therefore not human.
I apologise for any offence this misunderstanding has caused.
I don’t see why anyone would object to someone listing what attributes they find physically attractive.
Abagond,
I’d be interested in where you stand on gay marriage. Also, if your son came home and told you he was marrying another man, would you be OK with that, seeing as how you think that beauty is truly in the eye of the beholder.
-Stal
Agabond, I’m smirking as I watch you get bludgeoned with another tired trope of the 1970′s — that a man’s subjective appreciation of female beauty is somehow wrong (usually expressed with highfalutin words like “dehumanizing” or “objectification” or such). Men are visual creatures whose attraction to women is, at least initially visual. Get over it. Be glad at least that all men aren’t attracted to exacty the same thing. Otherwise, fellas would all be fighting among themselves for a chance to hump one hapless breeder whilst the rest of the worlds’ women decried this behavior on their feminist blogs.
Thank you for appreciating the beauty of womyn that look like me. There are so few who actually appreciated and also acknowledge it. This does not go unnoticed.
By the way, Toccara Jones is fine. I don’t care what color you are or what your favorite flavor is, if you’re a fella and Toccara don’t make you at least look twice, you’re either dead, or gay, or both.
Or white: she has appeared on the cover of King magazine twice, Maxim never.I have seen women finer than her in New York pass white men who do not even seem to see them. As if they are blind to black women.
On being bludgeoned: there is a strange sameness to both bludgeonings.
Stal: I am against gay marriage and would be profoundly saddened if my son became part of such.
sanabituranima: Yes, you are the “one white woman” in the post. Very few white women come here.
I love Cheetos and that is just the point: some female readers make me into this false authority and then take their anger out on me. Please.
Renee: you got way more than just my name wrong. Way more. I will break it down for you later.
Sophia, RyanB and Steph: thank you for your kind words. They were a solace.
Wow. See now, against gay marriage, against your son being gay, that is something that is genetic. People are born that way. If they chose to live that way, what right do you have to oppose it? That is homophobia, the same as racism.
Very closed minded for someone who is against close minded people.
That is because I think homosexuality is a sin but being black is not.
Then you are just as bad as people who believe being black is somehow wrong. No person on this earth is any less than anyone else.
We should listen more often to our own interpretation of beauty and what pleases our eyes rather than have standards set by the media.
One should be able to have preferences and likes that one need not apologize for.
Abagond, that is very nice to hear that, I am thick myself, so was my mother, myself and so is my daughter. I like to see black women like Jennifer Hudson, personally I think the majority of men, do like curvy ladies, so regards of the brainwashing Hugh Hefners and Anna Wintours. Men are doing their own thing, today, I saw a lot of men with thick women. They seem very happy. If you travel to other parts of the countryside in UK, also West Indies, Africa, Spain, France, Greece, Italy, Eastern Europe, Middle East. Those men like curvy ladies and they say so to, so they like yourself don’t care much about the fashion magazines and what they say.
Stal: I never said that gays are less than human or that they should be discriminated against. We are all sinners. But even if they are “born that way”, and probably some are, that still does not make it right. If I followed my own natural feelings, I would cheat on my wife. Does that make it right? Of course not.
Jewaira, you said:
“One should be able to have preferences and likes that one need not apologize for.”
Thank you so much for that!
Felicity: I think “curvy ladies” is the default factory setting for both black men and white men. Thin only became in since the 1970s, starting in the fashion world and then moving on to Hollywood and then to white men in North America and Western Europe. While there have always been men who like thin women, and always will, I think it is “unnatural” for that many men to like thin women. That is why they seem brainwashed to me as I have said elsewhere.
I am glad the men in Eastern Europe and elsewhere are sticking to what they like.
I sometimes wonder if the men that like thin white women actually don’t like women, that there’s something else going on. Quite often, the abuse that’s hurled at women who are not thin is so full of hate, I wonder do they hate themselves, hate women in general, are like little children having a temper tantrum because they’re not getting what they want, or what? It’s so strange to read and hear how they verbally assault a woman if she’s not some (un-natural) ideal. To me, the essence of woman-hood is to be curvy and fleshy and all. Who cares what colour she is. I love Jennifer Hudson’s look…so very va-voom! It’s perfect! The thin-ness is too girly, too young, too not-woman, and men who prefer that are kind of perverted imo … they’re liking something that’s not womanly or not natural. I really think there’s something wrong with some white men, like a bizarre mental illness. Yeah, I’m a white woman and I mean, I’ve heard a lot of mean, spiteful, hateful, crap. It’s wierd.
It is strange. I do not understand why so many white men like thin women.
Renee:
Here is where I break it down:
http://abagond.wordpress.com/2008/06/30/the-feministe-reading-of-this-blog/
I don’t think ANY man would find this attractive.
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c330/farglefeezlebut/anorexia-1.jpg
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c330/farglefeezlebut/anorexicwoman.jpg
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c330/farglefeezlebut/deathbyanorexia.jpg
Since nobody has said anything about the fact that you think gay people are sinners -
Does that mean that you would discount everything James Baldwin wrote since he was gay? Perhaps the greatest writer of the last century.
Interesting that you can chose your side of what to discriminate against and what you don’t.
-Stal
Stal I think Abagond answered your question in his comment #23.
Well, the fact that he said being gay isn’t “right” is something I have a problem with.
Who are any of us to say what is right and what is wrong in terms of who we chose to love? Right? Love is Love.
Stal
The descison is not right for him he did not say he would disown his son but that he would be sadden by his decision. Everyone is entitled to their opinions and feelings. I am sure that Abagond and myself are not going to agree that everything you believe in is correct but that does not mean that you don’t have the right to feel the way you do.
Love is love and depending on who you are talking with love will mean something entirely different
I Don’t agree. In fact, he said that gay people were sinners. That is just not true. That type of thinking has been what the church has been using to incorporate their racist agendas – by teaching that one type of person is somehow better than the other.
Stal:
I love James Baldwin, he is great. Reading only books written by saints is an interesting idea, but not one I ever tried.
Love is love, who are we to judge: Thank you for being so understanding. Now I can start dating your wife.
Jazzy is right: I would not disown my son.
Homosexuality is a sin. St Paul says so in the book of Romans. With all due respect, I think he knows about this better than either of us. Going by whatever American society says is right is a terrible moral guide. I have not taken any survey, but I think most black people know that.
How did the conversation go for talking about love of thick Black women to homosexuality?
Let’s us stay focused and on topic! It is bad enough that Sistas have to deal with media images that consistently scream out to them, “You are unattractive”.
But here we have a blog praising Sistas of all shapes and sizes, particularly thick Sistas and the thread turns into a conversation about homosexuality. WTF!!!!
Abagond you are better than that! Stay the course, do not let others determine the direction you will go.
I believe there are individuals that frequent your blog with the sole purpose to undermine your efforts to praise black woman and inform others about racism and injustice. Do not allow them to hijack the thread with conversations that are off topic and irrevelant to the specific blog posted.
Soulijah Story
I do not think Stal is like that. I think he is just curious.
How this got started: I said I like thick black women because that is how I was born. That reminded him of the argument gays make about being “born that way”.
At first I just gave him minimal answers but then as comments under this post seemed to be dying out I gave fuller answers.
I think Stal thinks I am upholding a double standard, that I am applying an argument to blacks where it helps me but denying it to homosexuals because I am “homophobic”. That I am letting my feelings get the best of me. That is not the case: I just do not think about it like he does.
I do not mind it – so far. But you are right, he has got way off topic. If I did not already know who he was I would have told him so at the beginning.
Some of his digressions would make good posts, ones I would like to do. But I do not intend to write about gay marriage any time soon unless it becomes an election issue. So I let him have his way.
Indeed. Life is not from point A to B to C…Sometimes conversations take different course. I enjoy this blog so much because it is free expression and people are not afraid to say what they truly feel.
It is only through the complete understanding of all that we can achieve Unity. I do not expect that unity to mean that we all have the same thoughts or believes. Far from it.
For me, the Unity I seek is for people to come together and argue their point so that all are understood, not agreed with.
No way we can all agree. Understanding and respecting each other, well, that’s a different thing.
Souljiah, ease up a bit and let me find my way in a conversation. After all, you wouldn’t tell Jon Coltrane to stop playing those funky notes so he could stay on the page of his sheet music, would you?
Hope not – the world would be a glenn miller song then instead of a Love Supreme…
-Stal
I don’t really have a problem with saying you like thick black women, what I have a problem with is comments like this:
“The thin-ness is too girly, too young, too not-woman, and men who prefer that are kind of perverted imo … they’re liking something that’s not womanly or not natural.”
That’s a disgusting thing to say, so thin women aren’t real women now, and men who are attracted to them are actually perverted? A lot of women are naturally thin (just like a lot of women aren’t), and saying shit like that about them is exactly the same as saying that men who like thick or fat women are perverted. How the hell do you not see how hypocritical that is? Women are women, we don’t need to be told which ones of us are “real women”
Isn’t it easy enough to just say some people think skinny women are hot but you prefer curvier women? Believe it or not, thin women are HUMAN TOO and really don’t need to be told that anyone who likes them is perverted.
abagond Says:
Fri 27 Jun 2008 at 22:12:07
Or white: she has appeared on the cover of King magazine twice, Maxim never.I have seen women finer than her in New York pass white men who do not even seem to see them. As if they are blind to black women.
They are blind to black women!! I can not tell you how many times that has happend to me with WM. I am invisible to them, worse they “seem” to make a concerted (sp?) effort to ignore me and other BW. Why? (not really asking you). My mentor (who is a WW) told me about a time going to a festival for BP and the BP “purposfully” ignoring her. She said that it was so painful to be ignored like that. I know how she feels.
BTW, I like your blog and love that you appreciate and value BW’s beauty (and I imagine other attributes as well); and I don’t feel objectified or dehumanized, but when I am ignored I do feel dehumanized.
Yes, other attributes too!
Thanks for confirming their blindness. I always thought of it as indifference not as being outright wilful. Wow.
i think the only reason why skinny women do have a problem with the way you love curvy women is because you think as if skinny women are not as attactive or have that “figure” that men, especially black men, like. i have nothing against your preferences because you like what you like but i don’t agree with some of your post about women that are thin looking like a ruler when not all women look like that. i’m skinny and i don’t look like some stick figure. women can’t help what they we’re born with because god made them who they are. for diane, for you to say that women being skinny is too girly, not woman looking and for guys liking women like that are perverted is the dumbest, ignorant thing to say. a woman is A WOMAN, REGARDLESS OF WHAT SHAPE YOU ARE!
Well, yes, there is more than just stick-thin, thick and fat. I reduced it to those three to make it easier to talk about. We all know there is everything in between and even things that do not fall along that line.
I just read the rest of these comments
The arguement about homosexuality and racisim doesnt track. The bible doesnt have an specific prohibition against races marring as long as you remain true to christianity. IT does say you should not convert to the spouses religion (if different from christianity).
It does specifically call out homosexuality as a sin.
The Bible is very clear about homosexuality.
As to race, the only thing I can remember is that Jews were not allowed to marry Moabites. Not a day-to-day concern for most of us.
It does say that marrying outside of your religion is a bad idea since it tends to make you fall away, like with Solomon.
exactly
all i can say is this is a cool blog shows a VARIETY of types of beauty that are normally hard to find or come across.
Thick is not a must for me but i think i enjoy it.
Keep up the good work.
Thanks for the encouragement!
Diane’s comment truely disgusts me. See, this is the type of hate that I always speak of against thin women.
For her to imply that because men who like thin women, there has to be something wrong with them?! Maybe thin women are their preference.
She also says the essence of womanhood is curvy, fleshy. No, the essence of womanhood is being a good woman who is considerate, kind and who has integrity. The essence of womanhood is being the woman GOD intended you to be – no matter what size you are.
You said that you’ve heard a lot of spiteful, hateful and mean-spirited things being a larger woman. But then you turn around and display the sam spite, hateful and mean-spirited attitude toward thin woman and men who like them. Double standard, heh? You’re just like the girls who used to torture me in high school who would try to “level” me.
Larger women who are secure in themselves not to put thin women down, I have all the respect in the world for.
and i agree with mariella and anon. it’s very ignorant of someone who constantly complains about how curvy women are looked as being beautiful so they fill the need to put down thin women to make themselves feel better. i could let some ignorant people on this board to tell me that i need to have a big butt or curves to be beautiful and being skinny is not woman enough but i refuse because i am a woman. that’s what GOD created me and many other women that’s thin to be. i respect the ones that don’t put down other women to make themselves feel better because it shows that they’re insecure.
I’m 13. I’m female. I’m black. I’m about 5’5″ and according to abagond’s post, I’m thick. This is what I know:
1. I was pretty much the only black kid in my middle school, in my grade at least, and nobody really looked at me. That didn’t matter. But although I was at least one or two years younger than just about everyone else in my grade, I had the biggest breasts (I was a large D or small DD cup at the time). For this reason, I was teased sometimes, and a couple of times people asked me if I’d had plastic surgery.
2. I’m going into 10th grade now, and although my breasts have gotten bigger, I’m still a DD. My thighs are a bit full, and so is my butt. Guys do look at me, but guess what? They’re never white, and almost always black. Sometimes, when I’m in the mall with my little brother and sister, and a group of black guys passes by, my little siblings will say, “one (or some) of them were looking at you.” This never happens when a group of white boys passes by, and most of the time, they’re with girls who are around the same height as me, but thinner, blonder, and wear more makeup.
3. When people ask me how old I am, and I say “13.” , a lot of the time, their eyes go right to my breasts.
I think that Abagond is right. A lot of white guys, or at least the ones that I’ve seen, go for girls that are skinnier, and thin definitely qualifies. And while my breasts are large enough for most guys, my thighs, waist, and butt aren’t small enough. You can say all kinds of snarky things about my post (and believe me, there are way too many of them in the feministe column), but these are my experiences, and I’m sticking with them.
But there is one other thing I have to say related to the same-sex marriage semi-subject: Abagond, when you fell in love with your wife, you were following your “natural urges”. And you followed them when you married her. So why is a man falling in love with a man so different? There are good natural ugres and bad ones, but to me, homosexuality isn’t one of the latter.